April 22, 2024 • 27 mins
Welcome to The Gagliardi Scott Real Estate Podcast brought to you by two of our directors, Gerald Sabri and Rocky Gagliardi.
On this show, we look forward to bringing you informative real estate information, special guests, hot topics, and much more!
In this week's episode of the GSRE Podcast, we feature Tori from Broker House and Joel from Westpac.
On today's show, we cover…
An insightful discussion on real estate financing, current market trends, schemes for first-time homebuyers, and the implications of the high-rate market. Find invaluable tips on navigating credit checks, understanding the significance of Lender's Mortgage Insurance (LMI), and the relevance of pre-approvals in the context of both buyers and real estate agents.
The episode further delves into the various grants and schemes set up by the government to aid potential homebuyers. Each scheme, from the first home buyers' grants to the family home guarantee, is thoroughly explained to provide a robust understanding of their benefits and prerequisites. The conversation caters not only to first-time buyers but also to seasoned investors, making this episode a comprehensive guide through the intricate world of real estate finance.
Besides the regular topics, the discussion also explores practical problems around loan applications and approvals, insurance coverage for properties affected by natural disasters, client borrowing capacities, and the value of a steady income stream in the current financial situation. The experts unwrap the concept of bridging loans and venture into possible alternatives. The show wraps with the panel's forecast on future interest rates and throws light on the recent patterns with construction loans.
Thanks for listening!
* Disclaimer - The information provided in this podcast is reliable but may be subject to change. Please consult your trusted legal and property representatives before taking action.*
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:03):
Welcome to Gagliardi's Got Real Estate podcast, hosted by myself,
Gerald Sabry and Rocky Gagliardi.
We look forward to bringing you more informative information.
We've got special guests, hot topics. Make sure you follow on your preferred
podcast platform, GSRE Socials. We hope you enjoy this episode.
Music.
(00:26):
Good morning, guys. Guys, welcome to another podcast episode from Gagliardi Scott Real Estate.
My name is Gerald Sudbury and with me is Sean Reedy from our office.
Today's episode 11 and we're touching on finance today with two special guests,
Tori Fiford from the Broker House in Shepparton and Joel Aitken from the Westpac branch in Shepparton.
(00:49):
So welcome guys to our podcast.
Thanks for having me. Thanks for having me. Guys, just for the viewers,
just to introduce yourselves and your role at the bank and as a broker, Tori.
Yep. So, Tori Fiford from Broker House. Been at the company for about four years now.
So, I am a residential broker. So, just helping with all things residential,
home loans, purchasing and refinancing. Yep.
(01:12):
And yeah, Joel Aiken. I've been Westpac for 15 years now. Home finance manager for nine of those.
And same as Tori, just specializing in residential space.
Residential. And what are you guys seeing at the moment? What are you seeing
in the market with clients?
So I'm seeing a lot of first-time buyers flocking back into the market.
Did see a bit of a lull for a while there just because of the RBA or the Reserve
(01:34):
Bank and all their increases with interest rates.
They've paused them now since about November. So I feel like the confidence is back a fair bit.
So a lot of first-time buyers and even a lot of construction coming back, which is exciting.
Good to see. Similar to Tori, a lot of stability now. so customers are a lot
more confident with with the market and they are starting to flow back in and
(01:54):
it is a real bit of a blend their purchases builds even refinances and people
restructuring their current debts as well.
In the current high-rate market, of course. Yeah, definitely.
And what would be the difference between using a broker compared to going directly
to the bank, like yourself, Joel?
I'll let you start with this one, sorry. As a broker, I'd like to think that
(02:18):
we can sort of nurture the clients a little bit better without saying anything
bad about the branches or the banks directly.
We really take the time to sit down with clients. A point that I would sort
of like to speak about is maybe even credit scores.
A lot of branches or banks directly might just auto decline a deal because of your credit score.
(02:38):
So with credit checks, we can do that first up with the client and just double check what it is.
And even if we can't do anything right now, even with second or third tier lenders,
we can sort of look into it for you, see what steps you might need to take.
I'm not saying that branches might not do that as well, but that's just something
I think is a really good thing with brokers.
And how many lenders would you typically look through? So we have 35 to 40 different
(03:02):
lenders that we can deal with.
Every bank's very, very different with what they will lend and why.
So yeah, credit scores, it might be the type of income you have.
So you might be casual or you might have Centrelink income. Some banks like it, some banks don't.
Sorry's right there's no denying that obviously a broker is going to have more
flexibility in where they can take a client i suppose
(03:23):
when you go directly through the bank especially if you're someone with
more experience they know the bank inside out so we
know all the bells and whistles and how to make things work and what
doesn't doesn't work so it's more probably about relationship with
the person as much as anything so there's always going to
be good brokers good bankers bad brokers bad bankers yeah
yeah and would other banks
(03:44):
like for yourself joel offer you know
things exclusively compared to you know what
a broker might not be able to offer you offered the client
not really like yeah
i can't speak for sorry but i'd assume
that they would have access to the same sort of products as that we do yeah
rate wise i think we end up going to the same pricing team at the end of the
(04:07):
day so the the rate should be relatively similar it's just a matter of how much
you push for your client so myself always pushes as i can for the client to
get the best possible, right? Yeah. I'm sure Tori does the same.
Yeah. Just for the viewers, just explain or elaborate further on credit check,
especially dealing with a lot more first-time buyers.
That'd be a good point to touch on. What's some of the pitfalls that you come
(04:29):
across with credit checks?
Well, it's important to be upfront and honest from the start as a customer because
it's so common that they don't disclose things like credit cards,
buy now, pay later things.
And a lot of those things now are visible with comprehensive credit reporting.
So, it's important the customer is upfront on us to begin with,
if there's any red flags upfront that we address them and we're all over them to begin with.
(04:54):
So, things like credit cards, we assess based on the limit, not based on the balance.
I pay this off every month, it's not a debt for us. If you've got access to credit, it is a debt.
And it's important for people to understand how your credit score works.
Is formulated it's based on stability employment
stability and location as well not moving around
(05:16):
different addresses as well not applying for
too much credit as well over a short period of time especially it's not a bad
thing to have a credit card or maybe even a personal loan here or there but
if you've got multiple facilities or multiple buy now pay laters they're going
to come back to buy you when it comes to applying for finance yeah that's important
(05:36):
thing to to point out is the credit inquiries.
We have a lot of younger clients that they would have no idea that their credit
score might be low purely for the fact that they've done 17 credit inquiries
in the last six months and their score might be 300.
The banks really like your score to be over 700 ideally and with credit inquiries
it's really hard to sort of fix your credit score without just waiting for the
(06:00):
time to pass for them to drop off.
So it's just a good idea as well for anyone looking at that applying for finance
for a home loan or whatnot, that they're not inquiring for a million different
after pay, zip pay, wallet wizard, all these different things.
Even if you don't proceed with them, it still put a marks on your file.
Yeah, okay. There you go.
And separate to your credit score, just even general behavior in your account
(06:22):
conduct because some after pay or after pay in particular, that's not on your credit file.
But if you're riddled in after pay or riddled in TAB or anything like that,
those things are really going to hurt you when it comes to applying for finance. Yeah, yeah.
And those afterpay and certain other, I don't know what you call them,
but they're more prominent now.
(06:42):
I mean... Oh, they're everywhere. I mean, last year, previous to that,
you just, you wouldn't hear about it.
That's a reflection and a change of, I suppose, of market, of clientele and,
you know, cost of living, isn't it?
100%. Yeah. But it's also not a good look if you can't afford to pay for a pair of jeans up front.
Aren't in probably not a good look to go yeah definitely yeah yeah
(07:05):
and on the floor of that with with credit checks
and things like that with the first home buyers what are the type of grants
and schemes available as you touched on tory you
and joel you've noticed an influx of
first home buyers coming into the fold so in the
market in the last three months so what sort of grants are
available at the moment it's a few
(07:25):
different ones i mean there's that i'll start with the old school first homebuyers
grant it's still out there yeah there's the newer grants which are probably
the more popular yeah but still the the first homebuyers grant ten thousand
dollars that's primarily for building or brand new properties yeah so ten thousand
dollars you need to live in the property,
in the first 12 months. So, that's very attractive.
(07:48):
Otherwise, it's their first home bias game. Do you want to touch on that?
Yeah. So, there's a few of them now. So, they've got the first home guarantee,
the regional first home guarantee, new home guarantee, and the family home guarantee.
So, the first three of those all have a 5% deposit. So, you can get into the
market with a lesser deposit.
That deposit does need to be genuine though. So, So it needs to be saved over three months.
(08:13):
So then you have the family guarantee. So that'll allow single parents to save a 2% deposit.
So it just allows them that bit more leniency with a smaller deposit and you
won't have to pay any lender's mortgage insurance, which is a really good benefit.
So they're saving on not only stamp duty. So as first-time buyers,
you don't have to pay any stamp duty up to a purchase price of $600,000.
(08:36):
Between $600,000 and $750,000, you get a concession. after $750,
you pay full stamp duty no matter if you're a first-time buyer or not.
But yeah, those schemes are really, really good. They'll have no lender's mortgage
insurance and you do get a better interest rate with most of the lenders that offer it.
They'll give you the interest rate as if you had a 20% deposit. Yeah.
Great incentive, isn't it? For sure. Certainly stimulate our market and we've
(08:59):
certainly noticed that as agents. So it should be a very good talking point.
Saves you thousands. Lender's mortgage insurance is just an expense to the customer.
It only only protects the bank at the end of the day so if you can avoid it
with one of these schemes and happy days yeah
there has been a couple of changes with those schemes as well
in the last year i believe so you can now
(09:20):
be a permanent resident as well as an australian citizen
yeah and you can also get the scheme if you have owned a property over 10 years
ago and haven't owned the property since so it must be over 10 years ago and
you're still eligible they still would pay stamp duty in that instance yes yep
yep so just to touch on lmi a little bit more so how.
(09:41):
Greatly effective will that be with that lmi versus no lmi within.
Going for a loan in terms of repayments and from a
cost perspective it's huge it's some it depends on your
lvr your lending percentage but you're looking at five to
twenty grand in mortgage insurance in some instances and also
higher interest rate westpac does have a point three loading um other banks
(10:02):
may differ a little bit from there but just those two things in particular yeah
they you want to avoid them yeah you can that's for sure because not many not
many first home buyers would even know what lmi is or and what the implications
are further down with the the interest rate and how that affects their loan long-term.
Yeah, spot on because they think that some of them have the understanding that,
(10:23):
oh, maybe it protects me.
It's like a life insurance protection for their loan, but it's not.
It's just a risk for the bank and that covers them pretty much.
It's just a risk assessment based on how far above that 80% mark you go.
So it becomes more and more expensive. Yeah.
Tori, anything to touch on LMI? mile. With LMI, just one thing to note would
(10:44):
be regardless of the first-time buyer or not, if you have a higher deposit,
so you're not in lender's mortgage insurance territory,
you may have more options with banks depending on your employment as well.
So if you come to a broker and you've only been in your job for one month,
some banks want you to be there for a minimum of three months.
If you've got a big deposit, we can go to certain banks that go, no, we're not in LMI.
(11:08):
That's fine. We're happy that you've got two pay slips. We can proceed.
Whereas some banks, we know that, yeah, definitely minimum three months,
we can't do anything until then. So a lot of the lenders mortgage insurance plans,
deals would have a minimum whereas if you
have a bigger deposit you have more yeah freedom and the
percentage there the threshold of lmi at 80 percent
length is that still yeah 80 cents
(11:31):
i'm pretty sure that's the same for all banks 80 most
banks will go up to say 95 sometimes higher yeah but yeah it just becomes more
and more expensive the closer you get to that peak yeah there are other ways
to avoid it you could look at parental guarantees pretty popular as well that's
instead of having the government as a guarantor. You can have your parents.
It's probably a little bit more flexible.
(11:51):
Again, you avoid mortgage insurance. Or there are some different professions
which banks may also waive mortgage insurance, medical professions being the main one.
Most banks will look at 90% or 95% in some cases.
Yeah, dealing with the doctors and medical professions, I've noticed that now
they're going through certain types of lenders is because they get some good
(12:15):
incentives being in the medical field.
Yeah, definitely. It's not just first-time buyers. At the end of the day,
the banks do offer different things with Medeco and with I think there's some
for like accountants and things like that or lawyers, solicitors, that kind of thing.
So if you have a question, just give us a call and ask if that's something that
would be beneficial to you.
(12:36):
Yeah, certainly some pretty important options there for clients until they really
walk in and have a good chat.
They'll understand it a bit better and that's probably the key for any first-home
buyer or any client looking at funding.
There's certainly some options out there, so make sure you pop in and see one
of these two guys in the future.
Pre-approvals, I just want to touch on the pre-approval process.
(12:56):
It's obviously important for not so much as much the buyer, but us as agents
as well when dealing with clients and negotiations and sales as such.
A standard pre-approval timeframe,
guys, what's it sort of, how long is it taken for a pre-approval?
For us, the standard's 90 days.
And then, yeah, if it does tick over that 90-day period,
(13:19):
we suggest that we refresh it as well, especially when the
rates were moving rapidly it was crucial to have a
pre-approval in place still is it very important in a
more but it's a more stable sort of market stable market
and stable with bank policy as well because the way
that it works is we'll chuck a 3% buffer on top of
their their interest rates of the interest rate now 6% we
(13:40):
have to say they can afford at 9% but through that period
where rates were moving quite rapidly your borrowing capacity
was shrinking yeah by the month yeah so but very
important to have your your credit check done and an income
assessment done it's then really just subject to valuing
the property and then fingers crossed you've had no changes to
your situation as well because that will
(14:00):
have to all be revalidated too yeah yeah
and it's not taking very long to get that pre-approval like westpac are really
great at the moment to be honest a couple of days and we get the pre-approval
issued as long as like you said the clients told us everything up front we know
exactly what's on their credit report they've disclosed all their debts we've
done their assessment we We know that we're good to go. We should get that in a couple of days.
(14:22):
So we've got multiple lenders that are a lot quicker on their turnaround times at the moment. Yeah.
And what would be the timeline for formal approvals? Like are you still saying sort of 14, 21 days?
I mean, me personally, a few transactions, it's taken maybe a little bit longer now.
What's the sort of timeline you guys are seeing at the moment?
Well, for us, 14 days is usually fine.
(14:42):
21 can't hurt because you usually got a bit of time up your sleeve.
But from our perspective, since the floods, Shepparton, Clowes and Marooten,
our policy is pretty much we need to do a full valuation of every single property.
There's no electronic valuation.
So, the two or three-day approvals are out the window at the moment.
But usually a week to two weeks is still usually pretty comfortable as long
(15:03):
as customers haven't had any major changes in the situation between their pre-approval
and their formal approval.
Yeah, I'd agree with that. We do have lenders that are pretty quick,
but at the end of the day, majority of this area all need the full valuation.
So some of the valuers are taking a little bit longer at the moment.
For whatever reason, we are seeing some higher risk ratings on some of our valuations for.
(15:25):
Location and for market risk or market direction with some comments saying that
the market is sort of stabilized and things like that.
The valuers have to cover everything in there.
So that can cause some issues sometimes with lenders mortgage insurance deals.
Deals we're not seeing any or many at all falling over or anything like that
but it's just more commentary more risk assessment that the valuers are doing
(15:49):
that may take a bit longer to get the formal approval yeah,
Yeah, that's been probably a big one the last 12 months, definitely.
Certainly noticed that.
Especially with, you know, now you're seeing a lot more flooded homes getting renovated.
You know, it's obviously been sort of, you know, a bit over 12 months now.
You're seeing a lot of those getting sold.
So, yeah, definitely noticed that period taking a little bit longer there.
(16:11):
Have you noticed any properties that actually haven't been flooded but have
been in a flood overlay been an issue that's popped up with renovations?
I've found issues being with insurance.
Yeah. So, in order to settle on the purchase application or refinance,
whatever it might be, is that the bank will always want to see the certificate
of currency for their insurance.
(16:31):
And we have to be able to prove that they have their flood insurance or even
bushfire coverage if they've got bushfire overlay or whatnot.
So, especially if the property is advertised that it was flooded or something
like that, we always make sure that that's a question they ask you guys as agents
or that they actually inquire with insurance.
Insurance broker or someone like that prior to purchasing the property to make
(16:54):
sure they definitely can insure that house yeah and with pre-approvals obviously
numbers of those you mentioned at the start have come up sort of numbers are
coming up a bit more stability,
what roughly what would be the average sort of loan amount given these times
like are you seeing a barely influx or a difference in loan amounts or they
(17:16):
sort of been fairly similar well people Well, probably lost a good 30% of their borrowing capacity.
So you borrow a million bucks 18 months ago, you do have 700,000.
And it's very tough to do it on your own. Joint applicants have got a massive,
still got decent borrowing capacity.
But as an individual, you've really got to be on a decent wicket to make it work yourself. Yeah.
(17:36):
Yeah, sizes do vary. We've still got a very diverse, I suppose, diverse set of...
Per market. and diverse market different
clients how there's lower mid and there's higher and there's a lot,
it's still probably for you guys it still turns over
quite a lot maybe in that three to five hundred mark but yeah
(17:58):
it's maybe sitting on the market a bit longer when it's six seven eight
hundred yeah yeah it's a little bit in in all
spaces still yeah okay well that 600's a real threshold for a lot of people
as you guys would be aware and we see that firsthand from a stamp duty point
of view people trying to buy under 600 just for that incentive yep but probably
(18:18):
be not understanding the full extent if they're paying between $6,000 and $6,300
or something. It's only pro rata.
Yeah. It's really not a huge amount more. Oh, it's only marginal. It's marginal.
Yeah. So, it's good to hear it from the banks and brokers more so than just
agents because some people will miss out on property due to it.
It just doesn't make sense and we try and explain that.
But that is a threshold and we see that around that $600,000 mark a fair bit.
(18:43):
For that government scheme though, there is the cap. Is it $650,000? $650,000. $650.
So for them to have that government scheme, they do need to keep it under $650.
If clients want to look on Broker House website, we have calculators.
So there's stamp duty calculators, loan repayment, stamp duty,
all those kinds of things.
(19:04):
So if you have a look on there, I think for a $650 purchase price,
because you're still getting a discount, I think it's about $12,000 for stamp
duty compared to if you bought for $600 at zero.
So if they just play around with that, they can see when they're looking at
making offers on properties that, okay, if I do offer 630, it's only going to
be 10,000 or whatever it might be. Yeah. Yeah.
(19:26):
Bridging loans, I think we're probably bridging finance and bridging loans as such.
It's probably a little bit more prevalent. I've probably noticed in the last
five months probably a change of market.
Are you guys obviously be seeing a lot of that through both offices?
Yeah, it has picked up a bit probably due to serviceability issues in a lot of cases.
People wanting to buy before they sell as well, not be reliant on obviously
(19:49):
sales are turning over so quickly.
They're not probably moving as fast, but they still want to buy.
So it can be a very expensive exercise.
You're looking at 9% to 10% usually, plus a lot more fees attached to them.
Sometimes they're unavoidable. But, yeah, they are an option and they are becoming
more popular, probably more suited sometimes for retirees.
(20:11):
That's what I'll probably do more of when it comes to bridging.
There is another option that we do use, and I'm not sure if every bank does
it. Most of the big banks would. It would be substituting of securities.
We call it a portability. so same sort of thing
buy and sell but you try and line the settlement dates up together and
then you don't have to apply for a new loan you can retain the
(20:31):
existing loan you've got that's only really works so
if you don't need additional funding but that's again good for self-employed
that don't have maybe haven't been self-employed for long enough people that
aren't in employment at the moment or retired because there's no credit check
or serviceability check for that straight swap over spot on yeah yeah i haven't
(20:52):
really heard much about that that's,
that's um portability yeah portability or
substitute security somebody's caught so yeah yeah it's
it's becoming more and more popular it's a lot cheaper than going down the bridging
track but then you've got to line up your settlements to be same day a bit harder
to yeah sometimes not possible but it's if we can maneuver it that way it's
ideal they might be able to get into the new property under a lease agreement
(21:13):
or stay in their property agreement so So a few dominoes need to line up,
but it can be a good option and a lot cheaper option than a bridging line.
With the bridging loan, is there a timeframe that the banks allow that bridge
loan to be open for until you've paid it off, sold that asset to pay it off
or how does that sort of sit?
(21:34):
For us, it's 12 months, but also you have a 1% increase on your interest rate after three months.
So you want to get them wrapped up as soon as you can, ideally,
because your nine and a half turns into 10 and a half and then that can maybe
be higher at other banks as well. So, yeah, a bridging loan is ideally not a long-term play.
It might be worth shaving a little bit off your price and waiting another six
(21:56):
months to sell it sometimes.
And would that be – would that 10.5 or 9 to 10.5? Would that be for both loans?
So, say, for example, you've got $300 on your current loan and you've purchased
$600 or – so, you've got a $900,000 loan.
Just on the bridging portion. Just on the bridging portion, yeah.
The residual debt, that's where you need to meet your serviceability on that.
(22:16):
That would just be on your standard loan, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
And a majority of the cases that bridging loan, the interest is capitalized.
So you don't have to make repayments on that bridging loan.
So you just watch the interest capitalize until that property is sold.
So you get a fair hit at the end. Yes. It can be painful, but it is definitely an option.
If like you said, I know we've had discussions before about the properties staying
(22:37):
on the market longer that are obviously worth a bit more.
So it gives you the opportunity to be able to get into the market or upgrade
your home potentially, but also giving you the 12 months to sell the other property.
You may not have negotiation with the current vendor to be able to say subject
to the sale of my house if they may already have that in there.
(22:58):
So they're trying to sell their house to buy another one and it just gets way too messy.
So it's definitely an option, but yes, it is expensive. Yeah,
definitely these days we don't do too.
Subject to sales in the market because yeah as i said
days on market it's a lot you know
more than four to five weeks sometimes so yeah it's
definitely a better option if the client wants the property you know enough
(23:21):
to do that make that risk so yeah it is an option and we do see from time to
time and that's probably again change of landscape and and if it's a deal there
to be done well both vendor and purchaser and everyone's happy we'll we'll We'll
certainly put it to the table for consideration,
to make something happen. Yeah.
Interest rates, quickly, you know, thoughts, opinions.
(23:43):
One, where we sit now for lenders, obviously it's around 6%,
and where you forecast 2024 for interest rates. Guys? Joe?
Well, off the trust of us tax economists, I suppose.
Most economists sort of expect there to be a drop before the end of the year, hopefully multiple.
Possible but yeah i mean realistically we're probably
(24:04):
looking at between two and four drops in the next 18 months touch
wood so see how we go we'll believe it when we see
it though yeah correct yeah fingers crossed for that i know trying not to forecast
too much or give any guarantees because obviously we have a lot of clients we're
giving borrowing capacity calculations now and saying but potentially if they're
(24:24):
not where they are need to be right now that maybe Maybe we'll be getting rate
cuts and that could change your capacity,
but there's just, yeah, no guarantees. Yeah, no.
Is there anything else, any important topics that you think is relevant now
for our viewers to touch on that we haven't discussed?
Not particularly that I can think of, sorry. No, I don't think there's anything.
I think it's just a good idea to be, even if you're not ready to be purchasing
(24:48):
right now, just having a discussion, whether it be with your broker or your
banker, just so they can help you with a plan.
Because it's really hard to know by just Googling or looking online to find the right information.
So if you contact a professional, they can help you as best they can. Great advice.
Yes, that's correct. I think if you look online, it will just confuse you more. Yeah, definitely.
It will just get even more confused. It's good to sit down and see someone face-to-face,
(25:10):
whether that's a bank or broker, just go get some personal advice.
Yeah, especially if you look online, they might say you can borrow up to $700,000,
set your hopes up on your dream home, and then you go to the bank or broker
and get a bit of a reality check sometimes so yeah definitely agree on that yeah.
Lastly, construction loans. We haven't touched on that, but obviously,
(25:33):
again, it's changed a fair bit, dropped off a little bit, started to pick up again.
Now, you are seeing more. We touched on it earlier, construction loans across the board.
Yeah, having a few contracts start to flow through, which is great.
Obviously, construction prices have sort of had a bit of a jump because of obviously
what's happened with supply issues, COVID, et cetera.
(25:54):
But, yeah, luckily, we've been more stable as a region Obviously,
there's a lot of builders going bust around the country, but locally it's looking
pretty good. So, yeah, it's starting to flow through.
Yeah, we're seeing a lot of the land that our clients might have purchased a
couple of years ago that are now titled.
(26:15):
So that might be why we're seeing an influx coming through.
We are having a few clients shopping around for builders, so they may have had
their heart set on a certain builder, but their price had just gone up so much
that they've had to readjust what they think they're going to be able to build
now according to their new capacity.
But it's good to see they're definitely still getting built and we're getting
applications approved. Yeah.
(26:37):
Excellent. All right. Well, guys, thank you. We'll wrap it up to meet you both.
Great to have you on our podcast.
Hope you viewers all enjoyed Episode 11 on all things finance.
Make sure you watch us on your preferred podcast platform and we'll see you
again soon for episode 12.
(26:58):
Thanks for listening. Please subscribe on your favourite podcast platform so
you don't miss upcoming episodes.
We would love you to share this podcast with your network and if you have any
questions or feedback, please connect with us via our social networks.
Music.
Welcome to Gagliardi's Got Real Estate podcast, hosted by myself,
Gerald Sabry and Rocky Gagliardi.
We look forward to bringing you more informative information.
We've got special guests, hot topics. Make sure you follow on your preferred
podcast platform, GSRE Socials. We hope you enjoy this episode.
Music.
(00:26):
Good morning, guys. Guys, welcome to another podcast episode from Gagliardi Scott Real Estate.
My name is Gerald Sudbury and with me is Sean Reedy from our office.
Today's episode 11 and we're touching on finance today with two special guests,
Tori Fiford from the Broker House in Shepparton and Joel Aitken from the Westpac branch in Shepparton.
(00:49):
So welcome guys to our podcast.
Thanks for having me. Thanks for having me. Guys, just for the viewers,
just to introduce yourselves and your role at the bank and as a broker, Tori.
Yep. So, Tori Fiford from Broker House. Been at the company for about four years now.
So, I am a residential broker. So, just helping with all things residential,
home loans, purchasing and refinancing. Yep.
(01:12):
And yeah, Joel Aiken. I've been Westpac for 15 years now. Home finance manager for nine of those.
And same as Tori, just specializing in residential space.
Residential. And what are you guys seeing at the moment? What are you seeing
in the market with clients?
So I'm seeing a lot of first-time buyers flocking back into the market.
Did see a bit of a lull for a while there just because of the RBA or the Reserve
(01:34):
Bank and all their increases with interest rates.
They've paused them now since about November. So I feel like the confidence is back a fair bit.
So a lot of first-time buyers and even a lot of construction coming back, which is exciting.
Good to see. Similar to Tori, a lot of stability now. so customers are a lot
more confident with with the market and they are starting to flow back in and
(01:54):
it is a real bit of a blend their purchases builds even refinances and people
restructuring their current debts as well.
In the current high-rate market, of course. Yeah, definitely.
And what would be the difference between using a broker compared to going directly
to the bank, like yourself, Joel?
I'll let you start with this one, sorry. As a broker, I'd like to think that
(02:18):
we can sort of nurture the clients a little bit better without saying anything
bad about the branches or the banks directly.
We really take the time to sit down with clients. A point that I would sort
of like to speak about is maybe even credit scores.
A lot of branches or banks directly might just auto decline a deal because of your credit score.
(02:38):
So with credit checks, we can do that first up with the client and just double check what it is.
And even if we can't do anything right now, even with second or third tier lenders,
we can sort of look into it for you, see what steps you might need to take.
I'm not saying that branches might not do that as well, but that's just something
I think is a really good thing with brokers.
And how many lenders would you typically look through? So we have 35 to 40 different
(03:02):
lenders that we can deal with.
Every bank's very, very different with what they will lend and why.
So yeah, credit scores, it might be the type of income you have.
So you might be casual or you might have Centrelink income. Some banks like it, some banks don't.
Sorry's right there's no denying that obviously a broker is going to have more
flexibility in where they can take a client i suppose
(03:23):
when you go directly through the bank especially if you're someone with
more experience they know the bank inside out so we
know all the bells and whistles and how to make things work and what
doesn't doesn't work so it's more probably about relationship with
the person as much as anything so there's always going to
be good brokers good bankers bad brokers bad bankers yeah
yeah and would other banks
(03:44):
like for yourself joel offer you know
things exclusively compared to you know what
a broker might not be able to offer you offered the client
not really like yeah
i can't speak for sorry but i'd assume
that they would have access to the same sort of products as that we do yeah
rate wise i think we end up going to the same pricing team at the end of the
(04:07):
day so the the rate should be relatively similar it's just a matter of how much
you push for your client so myself always pushes as i can for the client to
get the best possible, right? Yeah. I'm sure Tori does the same.
Yeah. Just for the viewers, just explain or elaborate further on credit check,
especially dealing with a lot more first-time buyers.
That'd be a good point to touch on. What's some of the pitfalls that you come
(04:29):
across with credit checks?
Well, it's important to be upfront and honest from the start as a customer because
it's so common that they don't disclose things like credit cards,
buy now, pay later things.
And a lot of those things now are visible with comprehensive credit reporting.
So, it's important the customer is upfront on us to begin with,
if there's any red flags upfront that we address them and we're all over them to begin with.
(04:54):
So, things like credit cards, we assess based on the limit, not based on the balance.
I pay this off every month, it's not a debt for us. If you've got access to credit, it is a debt.
And it's important for people to understand how your credit score works.
Is formulated it's based on stability employment
stability and location as well not moving around
(05:16):
different addresses as well not applying for
too much credit as well over a short period of time especially it's not a bad
thing to have a credit card or maybe even a personal loan here or there but
if you've got multiple facilities or multiple buy now pay laters they're going
to come back to buy you when it comes to applying for finance yeah that's important
(05:36):
thing to to point out is the credit inquiries.
We have a lot of younger clients that they would have no idea that their credit
score might be low purely for the fact that they've done 17 credit inquiries
in the last six months and their score might be 300.
The banks really like your score to be over 700 ideally and with credit inquiries
it's really hard to sort of fix your credit score without just waiting for the
(06:00):
time to pass for them to drop off.
So it's just a good idea as well for anyone looking at that applying for finance
for a home loan or whatnot, that they're not inquiring for a million different
after pay, zip pay, wallet wizard, all these different things.
Even if you don't proceed with them, it still put a marks on your file.
Yeah, okay. There you go.
And separate to your credit score, just even general behavior in your account
(06:22):
conduct because some after pay or after pay in particular, that's not on your credit file.
But if you're riddled in after pay or riddled in TAB or anything like that,
those things are really going to hurt you when it comes to applying for finance. Yeah, yeah.
And those afterpay and certain other, I don't know what you call them,
but they're more prominent now.
(06:42):
I mean... Oh, they're everywhere. I mean, last year, previous to that,
you just, you wouldn't hear about it.
That's a reflection and a change of, I suppose, of market, of clientele and,
you know, cost of living, isn't it?
100%. Yeah. But it's also not a good look if you can't afford to pay for a pair of jeans up front.
Aren't in probably not a good look to go yeah definitely yeah yeah
(07:05):
and on the floor of that with with credit checks
and things like that with the first home buyers what are the type of grants
and schemes available as you touched on tory you
and joel you've noticed an influx of
first home buyers coming into the fold so in the
market in the last three months so what sort of grants are
available at the moment it's a few
(07:25):
different ones i mean there's that i'll start with the old school first homebuyers
grant it's still out there yeah there's the newer grants which are probably
the more popular yeah but still the the first homebuyers grant ten thousand
dollars that's primarily for building or brand new properties yeah so ten thousand
dollars you need to live in the property,
in the first 12 months. So, that's very attractive.
(07:48):
Otherwise, it's their first home bias game. Do you want to touch on that?
Yeah. So, there's a few of them now. So, they've got the first home guarantee,
the regional first home guarantee, new home guarantee, and the family home guarantee.
So, the first three of those all have a 5% deposit. So, you can get into the
market with a lesser deposit.
That deposit does need to be genuine though. So, So it needs to be saved over three months.
(08:13):
So then you have the family guarantee. So that'll allow single parents to save a 2% deposit.
So it just allows them that bit more leniency with a smaller deposit and you
won't have to pay any lender's mortgage insurance, which is a really good benefit.
So they're saving on not only stamp duty. So as first-time buyers,
you don't have to pay any stamp duty up to a purchase price of $600,000.
(08:36):
Between $600,000 and $750,000, you get a concession. after $750,
you pay full stamp duty no matter if you're a first-time buyer or not.
But yeah, those schemes are really, really good. They'll have no lender's mortgage
insurance and you do get a better interest rate with most of the lenders that offer it.
They'll give you the interest rate as if you had a 20% deposit. Yeah.
Great incentive, isn't it? For sure. Certainly stimulate our market and we've
(08:59):
certainly noticed that as agents. So it should be a very good talking point.
Saves you thousands. Lender's mortgage insurance is just an expense to the customer.
It only only protects the bank at the end of the day so if you can avoid it
with one of these schemes and happy days yeah
there has been a couple of changes with those schemes as well
in the last year i believe so you can now
(09:20):
be a permanent resident as well as an australian citizen
yeah and you can also get the scheme if you have owned a property over 10 years
ago and haven't owned the property since so it must be over 10 years ago and
you're still eligible they still would pay stamp duty in that instance yes yep
yep so just to touch on lmi a little bit more so how.
(09:41):
Greatly effective will that be with that lmi versus no lmi within.
Going for a loan in terms of repayments and from a
cost perspective it's huge it's some it depends on your
lvr your lending percentage but you're looking at five to
twenty grand in mortgage insurance in some instances and also
higher interest rate westpac does have a point three loading um other banks
(10:02):
may differ a little bit from there but just those two things in particular yeah
they you want to avoid them yeah you can that's for sure because not many not
many first home buyers would even know what lmi is or and what the implications
are further down with the the interest rate and how that affects their loan long-term.
Yeah, spot on because they think that some of them have the understanding that,
(10:23):
oh, maybe it protects me.
It's like a life insurance protection for their loan, but it's not.
It's just a risk for the bank and that covers them pretty much.
It's just a risk assessment based on how far above that 80% mark you go.
So it becomes more and more expensive. Yeah.
Tori, anything to touch on LMI? mile. With LMI, just one thing to note would
(10:44):
be regardless of the first-time buyer or not, if you have a higher deposit,
so you're not in lender's mortgage insurance territory,
you may have more options with banks depending on your employment as well.
So if you come to a broker and you've only been in your job for one month,
some banks want you to be there for a minimum of three months.
If you've got a big deposit, we can go to certain banks that go, no, we're not in LMI.
(11:08):
That's fine. We're happy that you've got two pay slips. We can proceed.
Whereas some banks, we know that, yeah, definitely minimum three months,
we can't do anything until then. So a lot of the lenders mortgage insurance plans,
deals would have a minimum whereas if you
have a bigger deposit you have more yeah freedom and the
percentage there the threshold of lmi at 80 percent
length is that still yeah 80 cents
(11:31):
i'm pretty sure that's the same for all banks 80 most
banks will go up to say 95 sometimes higher yeah but yeah it just becomes more
and more expensive the closer you get to that peak yeah there are other ways
to avoid it you could look at parental guarantees pretty popular as well that's
instead of having the government as a guarantor. You can have your parents.
It's probably a little bit more flexible.
(11:51):
Again, you avoid mortgage insurance. Or there are some different professions
which banks may also waive mortgage insurance, medical professions being the main one.
Most banks will look at 90% or 95% in some cases.
Yeah, dealing with the doctors and medical professions, I've noticed that now
they're going through certain types of lenders is because they get some good
(12:15):
incentives being in the medical field.
Yeah, definitely. It's not just first-time buyers. At the end of the day,
the banks do offer different things with Medeco and with I think there's some
for like accountants and things like that or lawyers, solicitors, that kind of thing.
So if you have a question, just give us a call and ask if that's something that
would be beneficial to you.
(12:36):
Yeah, certainly some pretty important options there for clients until they really
walk in and have a good chat.
They'll understand it a bit better and that's probably the key for any first-home
buyer or any client looking at funding.
There's certainly some options out there, so make sure you pop in and see one
of these two guys in the future.
Pre-approvals, I just want to touch on the pre-approval process.
(12:56):
It's obviously important for not so much as much the buyer, but us as agents
as well when dealing with clients and negotiations and sales as such.
A standard pre-approval timeframe,
guys, what's it sort of, how long is it taken for a pre-approval?
For us, the standard's 90 days.
And then, yeah, if it does tick over that 90-day period,
(13:19):
we suggest that we refresh it as well, especially when the
rates were moving rapidly it was crucial to have a
pre-approval in place still is it very important in a
more but it's a more stable sort of market stable market
and stable with bank policy as well because the way
that it works is we'll chuck a 3% buffer on top of
their their interest rates of the interest rate now 6% we
(13:40):
have to say they can afford at 9% but through that period
where rates were moving quite rapidly your borrowing capacity
was shrinking yeah by the month yeah so but very
important to have your your credit check done and an income
assessment done it's then really just subject to valuing
the property and then fingers crossed you've had no changes to
your situation as well because that will
(14:00):
have to all be revalidated too yeah yeah
and it's not taking very long to get that pre-approval like westpac are really
great at the moment to be honest a couple of days and we get the pre-approval
issued as long as like you said the clients told us everything up front we know
exactly what's on their credit report they've disclosed all their debts we've
done their assessment we We know that we're good to go. We should get that in a couple of days.
(14:22):
So we've got multiple lenders that are a lot quicker on their turnaround times at the moment. Yeah.
And what would be the timeline for formal approvals? Like are you still saying sort of 14, 21 days?
I mean, me personally, a few transactions, it's taken maybe a little bit longer now.
What's the sort of timeline you guys are seeing at the moment?
Well, for us, 14 days is usually fine.
(14:42):
21 can't hurt because you usually got a bit of time up your sleeve.
But from our perspective, since the floods, Shepparton, Clowes and Marooten,
our policy is pretty much we need to do a full valuation of every single property.
There's no electronic valuation.
So, the two or three-day approvals are out the window at the moment.
But usually a week to two weeks is still usually pretty comfortable as long
(15:03):
as customers haven't had any major changes in the situation between their pre-approval
and their formal approval.
Yeah, I'd agree with that. We do have lenders that are pretty quick,
but at the end of the day, majority of this area all need the full valuation.
So some of the valuers are taking a little bit longer at the moment.
For whatever reason, we are seeing some higher risk ratings on some of our valuations for.
(15:25):
Location and for market risk or market direction with some comments saying that
the market is sort of stabilized and things like that.
The valuers have to cover everything in there.
So that can cause some issues sometimes with lenders mortgage insurance deals.
Deals we're not seeing any or many at all falling over or anything like that
but it's just more commentary more risk assessment that the valuers are doing
(15:49):
that may take a bit longer to get the formal approval yeah,
Yeah, that's been probably a big one the last 12 months, definitely.
Certainly noticed that.
Especially with, you know, now you're seeing a lot more flooded homes getting renovated.
You know, it's obviously been sort of, you know, a bit over 12 months now.
You're seeing a lot of those getting sold.
So, yeah, definitely noticed that period taking a little bit longer there.
(16:11):
Have you noticed any properties that actually haven't been flooded but have
been in a flood overlay been an issue that's popped up with renovations?
I've found issues being with insurance.
Yeah. So, in order to settle on the purchase application or refinance,
whatever it might be, is that the bank will always want to see the certificate
of currency for their insurance.
(16:31):
And we have to be able to prove that they have their flood insurance or even
bushfire coverage if they've got bushfire overlay or whatnot.
So, especially if the property is advertised that it was flooded or something
like that, we always make sure that that's a question they ask you guys as agents
or that they actually inquire with insurance.
Insurance broker or someone like that prior to purchasing the property to make
(16:54):
sure they definitely can insure that house yeah and with pre-approvals obviously
numbers of those you mentioned at the start have come up sort of numbers are
coming up a bit more stability,
what roughly what would be the average sort of loan amount given these times
like are you seeing a barely influx or a difference in loan amounts or they
(17:16):
sort of been fairly similar well people Well, probably lost a good 30% of their borrowing capacity.
So you borrow a million bucks 18 months ago, you do have 700,000.
And it's very tough to do it on your own. Joint applicants have got a massive,
still got decent borrowing capacity.
But as an individual, you've really got to be on a decent wicket to make it work yourself. Yeah.
(17:36):
Yeah, sizes do vary. We've still got a very diverse, I suppose, diverse set of...
Per market. and diverse market different
clients how there's lower mid and there's higher and there's a lot,
it's still probably for you guys it still turns over
quite a lot maybe in that three to five hundred mark but yeah
(17:58):
it's maybe sitting on the market a bit longer when it's six seven eight
hundred yeah yeah it's a little bit in in all
spaces still yeah okay well that 600's a real threshold for a lot of people
as you guys would be aware and we see that firsthand from a stamp duty point
of view people trying to buy under 600 just for that incentive yep but probably
(18:18):
be not understanding the full extent if they're paying between $6,000 and $6,300
or something. It's only pro rata.
Yeah. It's really not a huge amount more. Oh, it's only marginal. It's marginal.
Yeah. So, it's good to hear it from the banks and brokers more so than just
agents because some people will miss out on property due to it.
It just doesn't make sense and we try and explain that.
But that is a threshold and we see that around that $600,000 mark a fair bit.
(18:43):
For that government scheme though, there is the cap. Is it $650,000? $650,000. $650.
So for them to have that government scheme, they do need to keep it under $650.
If clients want to look on Broker House website, we have calculators.
So there's stamp duty calculators, loan repayment, stamp duty,
all those kinds of things.
(19:04):
So if you have a look on there, I think for a $650 purchase price,
because you're still getting a discount, I think it's about $12,000 for stamp
duty compared to if you bought for $600 at zero.
So if they just play around with that, they can see when they're looking at
making offers on properties that, okay, if I do offer 630, it's only going to
be 10,000 or whatever it might be. Yeah. Yeah.
(19:26):
Bridging loans, I think we're probably bridging finance and bridging loans as such.
It's probably a little bit more prevalent. I've probably noticed in the last
five months probably a change of market.
Are you guys obviously be seeing a lot of that through both offices?
Yeah, it has picked up a bit probably due to serviceability issues in a lot of cases.
People wanting to buy before they sell as well, not be reliant on obviously
(19:49):
sales are turning over so quickly.
They're not probably moving as fast, but they still want to buy.
So it can be a very expensive exercise.
You're looking at 9% to 10% usually, plus a lot more fees attached to them.
Sometimes they're unavoidable. But, yeah, they are an option and they are becoming
more popular, probably more suited sometimes for retirees.
(20:11):
That's what I'll probably do more of when it comes to bridging.
There is another option that we do use, and I'm not sure if every bank does
it. Most of the big banks would. It would be substituting of securities.
We call it a portability. so same sort of thing
buy and sell but you try and line the settlement dates up together and
then you don't have to apply for a new loan you can retain the
(20:31):
existing loan you've got that's only really works so
if you don't need additional funding but that's again good for self-employed
that don't have maybe haven't been self-employed for long enough people that
aren't in employment at the moment or retired because there's no credit check
or serviceability check for that straight swap over spot on yeah yeah i haven't
(20:52):
really heard much about that that's,
that's um portability yeah portability or
substitute security somebody's caught so yeah yeah it's
it's becoming more and more popular it's a lot cheaper than going down the bridging
track but then you've got to line up your settlements to be same day a bit harder
to yeah sometimes not possible but it's if we can maneuver it that way it's
ideal they might be able to get into the new property under a lease agreement
(21:13):
or stay in their property agreement so So a few dominoes need to line up,
but it can be a good option and a lot cheaper option than a bridging line.
With the bridging loan, is there a timeframe that the banks allow that bridge
loan to be open for until you've paid it off, sold that asset to pay it off
or how does that sort of sit?
(21:34):
For us, it's 12 months, but also you have a 1% increase on your interest rate after three months.
So you want to get them wrapped up as soon as you can, ideally,
because your nine and a half turns into 10 and a half and then that can maybe
be higher at other banks as well. So, yeah, a bridging loan is ideally not a long-term play.
It might be worth shaving a little bit off your price and waiting another six
(21:56):
months to sell it sometimes.
And would that be – would that 10.5 or 9 to 10.5? Would that be for both loans?
So, say, for example, you've got $300 on your current loan and you've purchased
$600 or – so, you've got a $900,000 loan.
Just on the bridging portion. Just on the bridging portion, yeah.
The residual debt, that's where you need to meet your serviceability on that.
(22:16):
That would just be on your standard loan, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
And a majority of the cases that bridging loan, the interest is capitalized.
So you don't have to make repayments on that bridging loan.
So you just watch the interest capitalize until that property is sold.
So you get a fair hit at the end. Yes. It can be painful, but it is definitely an option.
If like you said, I know we've had discussions before about the properties staying
(22:37):
on the market longer that are obviously worth a bit more.
So it gives you the opportunity to be able to get into the market or upgrade
your home potentially, but also giving you the 12 months to sell the other property.
You may not have negotiation with the current vendor to be able to say subject
to the sale of my house if they may already have that in there.
(22:58):
So they're trying to sell their house to buy another one and it just gets way too messy.
So it's definitely an option, but yes, it is expensive. Yeah,
definitely these days we don't do too.
Subject to sales in the market because yeah as i said
days on market it's a lot you know
more than four to five weeks sometimes so yeah it's
definitely a better option if the client wants the property you know enough
(23:21):
to do that make that risk so yeah it is an option and we do see from time to
time and that's probably again change of landscape and and if it's a deal there
to be done well both vendor and purchaser and everyone's happy we'll we'll We'll
certainly put it to the table for consideration,
to make something happen. Yeah.
Interest rates, quickly, you know, thoughts, opinions.
(23:43):
One, where we sit now for lenders, obviously it's around 6%,
and where you forecast 2024 for interest rates. Guys? Joe?
Well, off the trust of us tax economists, I suppose.
Most economists sort of expect there to be a drop before the end of the year, hopefully multiple.
Possible but yeah i mean realistically we're probably
(24:04):
looking at between two and four drops in the next 18 months touch
wood so see how we go we'll believe it when we see
it though yeah correct yeah fingers crossed for that i know trying not to forecast
too much or give any guarantees because obviously we have a lot of clients we're
giving borrowing capacity calculations now and saying but potentially if they're
(24:24):
not where they are need to be right now that maybe Maybe we'll be getting rate
cuts and that could change your capacity,
but there's just, yeah, no guarantees. Yeah, no.
Is there anything else, any important topics that you think is relevant now
for our viewers to touch on that we haven't discussed?
Not particularly that I can think of, sorry. No, I don't think there's anything.
I think it's just a good idea to be, even if you're not ready to be purchasing
(24:48):
right now, just having a discussion, whether it be with your broker or your
banker, just so they can help you with a plan.
Because it's really hard to know by just Googling or looking online to find the right information.
So if you contact a professional, they can help you as best they can. Great advice.
Yes, that's correct. I think if you look online, it will just confuse you more. Yeah, definitely.
It will just get even more confused. It's good to sit down and see someone face-to-face,
(25:10):
whether that's a bank or broker, just go get some personal advice.
Yeah, especially if you look online, they might say you can borrow up to $700,000,
set your hopes up on your dream home, and then you go to the bank or broker
and get a bit of a reality check sometimes so yeah definitely agree on that yeah.
Lastly, construction loans. We haven't touched on that, but obviously,
(25:33):
again, it's changed a fair bit, dropped off a little bit, started to pick up again.
Now, you are seeing more. We touched on it earlier, construction loans across the board.
Yeah, having a few contracts start to flow through, which is great.
Obviously, construction prices have sort of had a bit of a jump because of obviously
what's happened with supply issues, COVID, et cetera.
(25:54):
But, yeah, luckily, we've been more stable as a region Obviously,
there's a lot of builders going bust around the country, but locally it's looking
pretty good. So, yeah, it's starting to flow through.
Yeah, we're seeing a lot of the land that our clients might have purchased a
couple of years ago that are now titled.
(26:15):
So that might be why we're seeing an influx coming through.
We are having a few clients shopping around for builders, so they may have had
their heart set on a certain builder, but their price had just gone up so much
that they've had to readjust what they think they're going to be able to build
now according to their new capacity.
But it's good to see they're definitely still getting built and we're getting
applications approved. Yeah.
(26:37):
Excellent. All right. Well, guys, thank you. We'll wrap it up to meet you both.
Great to have you on our podcast.
Hope you viewers all enjoyed Episode 11 on all things finance.
Make sure you watch us on your preferred podcast platform and we'll see you
again soon for episode 12.
(26:58):
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