October 25, 2022 • 17 mins
Attracting top talents in the procurement space has always been a challenge. And in this post-covid world, where things like work-life balance or the flexibility to work from home have become more important to candidates than a hefty paycheck or a steep rise in the corporate ladder, filling up positions in the procurement space has become even more critical than ever. Against this backdrop,
HR departments are embracing new tools to address recruitment needs for procurement professionals. But HR's efforts need to be complemented by a change in the leadership mindset to foster an environment of empathy and connection in the workplace.
So, how to attract top talents to the procurement space amid all these? What can be better than hearing it from an Indirect procurement leader who has known this space for 17 years and is a keen observer of the recruitment trends in this sector? Join Nina Bomberg, Global Indirect procurement Director at Dormakaba as she shares her perspective on how HR and procurement can team up to attract the right talent.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Hello and welcome to the procurement game changers podcast brought to you by Consulting Quest ever wondered how the
leaders get it done what differentiates them from the rest of us let's tune in and learn from the
best leaders in the procurement space let's do it and now over to your host Helen Lafitte
(00:32):
welcome to the procurement game changers the podcast for leaders that make a difference today
we'll be talking about how HR and procurement can team up to attract the right Talent
and to discuss this topic I have the pleasure to receive Nina bonberg Global indirect procurement
director at domakaba a global leader in the access solution Market Nina has more than 16
(00:55):
years of working experience mostly in indirect procurement on goods and services she has an
extensive industrial experience ranging from chemical to equipments welcome to the show Nina
thank you very much Helens great to be here Selena could you tell us what led you to procurement
um like with so many of my colleagues I have to say it was pure coincidence um at University this
(01:20):
was nothing that um you could study I think the very closest when I studied you could get
to procurement was probably supply chain and Logistics and that maybe touched a very little
bit on the fringes of procurement um but but by and large um you could go into finance and you
could go into Marketing in HR and those were all very known and very prestigious places to go if
(01:41):
you study business studies but procurement wasn't um so and I ended up by chance my first employment
was by a randstadt so it was a temp labor agency and I ended up with Mars who needed support in
their purchasing organization and that's how I got there and then I think like with most of them
um you hate it or you love it and I loved it in their state and that's how 17 years went by
(02:06):
yeah I I can get that so today we're going to talk about uh procurement talent and we know that
it is in short supply in today's market and HR departments on Newport and partner for procurement
leaders when recruiting new employees so they provide a way to identify and assess potential
candidates and to find the best match for your needs however they have not always adapted their
(02:31):
recruiting tools to the recent changes in the labor market so this can lead to several problems
um including a lack of qualified candidates a difficulty in attracting top talents and an
inability to keep up with the changing demand and lengthy processes so as the labor market continues
to evolve it's essential that HR department adapt their recruiting tools accordingly otherwise they
(02:56):
will continue to fail to meet the needs of their internal clients including the
procurement group so let's hear the perspective of a procurement leader on this challenge so
Nina what have changed in the competition for talents for procurement or for indirect mechanics
well I really think that the the competition for talent was always big in that space we
(03:20):
always have those discussions does procurement have an image problem I actually don't think
becoma has an image problem procurement has an awareness problem I think if you go back to many
universities today and look at the business study courses they will still not include procurement
as one of the potential fields that you can go into um so that is actually for me the hardest
(03:41):
part and then adding the war for Talent on top right now we see less potential candidates out
there in the market we get hit even harder and the problem gets even bigger because then people are
drawn to the big things that are out there and that are known and um and it's hard to adjust
to them and I think that not every HR department has really adapted and embraced the fact that at
(04:04):
the moment it's an employee's Market they have the absolute choice of where they want to work
um as long as they have decent capabilities which are definitely the people we're looking for so we
have not really adjusted our processes to the fact that employees probably have five six different
employers that they can choose from if they're looking for a new job so if we take three months
(04:29):
to get back to them odds are somebody else only took two and if they don't really really really
want to work with us then they will have taken someone else's opportunity and that's why we
need to just be be a lot faster indeed I mean we also need to be you know we need to be more
aware and we need to make people more aware of the profession and and we try to work on that
(04:51):
continuously you know we go to universities we present our jobs we show people what we do and
and really actually think procurement is is a perfect example of a good job especially in
these crisis times because I've never seen people letting organizations letting procurement go in
times of Crisis because that's when you need them the most in terms of no crisis you're not going
(05:15):
to let people go yeah so it's actually a quite stable job compared to other things it's not
going your way right so have you seen though the role of HR evolved over the last few years I think
to a certain degree yes um I think there is a bigger understanding that we will need to recruit
(05:35):
um in a different way we will need to head hunt a lot earlier we don't tend to wait as long anymore
I mean when I started to work the job AdWords they were still in a newspaper on Saturdays and Sundays
um that even big jobs um and that I didn't relate to that yeah and that has definitely changed that
doesn't exist anymore and and and now we're talking about you know is it worthwhile to put
(05:58):
a job in stepstone is that something we still want to do is that something deep is the look
um personally I say I don't I I haven't been to the stepstone website
probably in a decade to be honest um which is why we're becoming more active internal recruiting
organizations within your own company um they become more active and they start searching out so
(06:21):
um even if I look at who's contacting me you know you get suddenly get contacted via LinkedIn
by recruiters of certain companies because that's the path they follow
yeah absolutely so what tactics do you use to attract top talents for your procurement group
um I think the most important thing is to actually just overall be an attractive employer
(06:41):
you know to have interesting tasks um that's what people care about most um together with
I want to say a likable company culture and likable is a very relative term because it
depends a lot on the type of personality you are you know if you work in an American or a French
or a German company they come with certain company cultures some more than others um and some might
(07:07):
might have changed over time but I also think that the company culture is extremely important
so you know what's the best company for me might not be the best company for you and I think it's
very very important to talk to candidates upfront about finding that right match between you and the
company versus um yeah we always joke about you know finding the perfect company which is just not
(07:28):
going to cut the deal anymore we discussed during the preparation about purpose and how talents now
on the market are looking for purpose in their jobs but I was thinking about what you just said
we remember when when you had your interviews and people were asking you what can you bring to our
company well maybe we're on the other side what your company but he can bring me as a candidate
(07:51):
we cannot reverse the definitely definitely that is something people people talk about and it's
not just I mean home office being one of them which is not which is not even a point that's
negotiable anymore but it's a given I mean you would have to have very good reasons as a company
to deny it if you are looking for good candidates but the same goes for having uh you know having
(08:13):
whatever is important to the candidate one one discussion I recently had was with a Consulting
agency who said that they really struggled because what used to be they're very strong
um selling point you know of your career progression and you earn lots of money
is a lot harder to sell to the generations to come because their Saturday is not for sale no
(08:33):
matter what price it just isn't nor is there 3 A.M in the morning it just isn't period which
means that Industries like those will struggle a lot and I hope that that is something where
we can then pull some of the talent out of those Industries and pull them towards our end
(08:53):
our staffing you know and how much um occupy they are achieve something different because
that's not going to cut it anymore you're right so going back to German leaders how do they need
to evolve do you think they need to evolve in their role in order to attract those top talents
I I do agree um definitely because you just in my opinion you need to really work with
(09:19):
each and every person as an individual and I really think that as a leader you have to
adapt to the people you're working with in a hybrid model even more because we've had lots
of discussions about you know how much leadership do people need how much connection do people need
and that varies a lot from person to person so I have people in my team who I speak to
(09:40):
at least four days a week and I have people in my team who after two months I call them up to
see if they're still alive I know their job is running fine because I haven't heard from them
so it's running fine but just to reconnect and say hey um I'm still here you're still
here how is life what's going on but to have this level of balance and to then also be able to have
(10:02):
this level of trust in your people to say okay there are people who don't need this very close
connection because they don't that's not what they're here for to then be able to trust them
and just let them go and let them do their job yes I I agree with you I think that the pandemics
has forced us to work remotely and to let go a little bit of that control that we might have on
(10:26):
our teams that the fight of being so close sometimes was easier even though for international
companies the remote part was already there you were not in the same building or in the
same country even but I think that it forced us to be a little more adaptive in the way we
work with them and that's true for procurement leaders and that's true for for leaders anywhere
(10:48):
I can tell even in my very small company so indeed you have to change your ways you have to adapt to
whoever you work with you have to build a trust and then uh make sure that the way you connect
with your teams is uh the most effective or for them for you and for you for for the organization
(11:10):
but then you have to work with HR at some point before that so how do you see the future of HR and
procurement working together so I have to say um having moved to a new company four weeks ago um I
have experienced something that that seems um that seems pretty close already to be honest and it was
(11:31):
a big big step forward for me when I experienced it but um the HR business partner for example
takes part in strategic meetings they take part in um leadership workshops they are part of all
of this happening so they really understand the department they understand what the Department's
going what the needs in the future are and what kind of people we will need to support this
(11:55):
um they actually know who the people are who work in that department you know they have
faces two names and capabilities to names and faces which is something that really really is
a valuable point because if you then have a topic that you need to discuss with them you don't have
to start at square one and you know explain them the entire background the entire story
(12:16):
and everything that's been going on but they have been very close during the entire process
um so they are very much aligned with with the needs that we have and they also understand
they understand the market You know despite the fact that they are not buyers they have
a basic understanding of buying and of the skills you need to be successful in that
profession so they know that what we're looking for if I say I need a global category manager
(12:41):
um they actually have a picture in mind the next question is not okay then send me the requirements
of that person but they actually have an idea of what kind of person it is I'm looking for
that's funny I had a discussion with a procurement leader who is building from scratch an indirect
procurement group and he was telling me that the first step was to connect with different
(13:02):
decision makers in the company in order to explain what they do and and understand what
are the pain points and and so it seems like you know the the work of HR in that particular angle
and the work of an indirect procurement leader is quite similar like get to know your internal
stakeholders connect with them know what they do know what their challenge are and when they
(13:26):
need you be there and be useful and that's how you can really build a successful relationship
I I couldn't agree more I mean purchasing just like HR we are internal service departments
um so it's our job to make sure that the rest of the company functions and like we have internal
stakeholders HR has internal stakeholders holders and indeed how the way that we try to help our
(13:50):
internal stakeholders while at the same time you know maintaining our um cost leadership
and compliance and so on HR does the same thing they provide an internal service to the rest of
the company while at the same time following their process processes compliance same thing um costs
Etc um but the concept is exactly the same yes now it's time to the takeaway um let's imagine that we
(14:18):
have a few of our listeners that want to improve the way they recruit Talent what advice would
you give them you know really to get started what is the thing that they should look for
so to me if you really want to attract the right people the first question I would I always ask
myself is if my best friend was looking for a job would I recommend this job to them
(14:44):
um that to me is a really important question because if your answer is no then you have
to change something in your department before you can attract the right talent because if you don't
feel comfortable offering this job to your friends really it's probably not attractive to many people
out there absolutely and then you mentioned before that there are ways to increase the awareness even
(15:05):
internally of what is procurement and how they contribute to the company because it's it goes
both ways I mean you need a good culture but you also need your internal stakeholder to
recognize your your group and if you're not then to to be on the way to do it being work towards
(15:26):
them being aware of you so that's kind of the the idea definitely I mean they need to see the value
and it's usually when you've handled the first claim for some Department um when they really
start understanding the value of procurement when they don't have to deal with a small print in the
contract and don't have to figure out why this went wrong and how this could be fixed that's
(15:47):
usually when you can win their hearts um to then gain the trust that next time you would
be included in in an RFQ earlier or they would ask for your advice up front before they do something
where they know they should have involved you but they thought it was faster if they didn't
well wonderful thank you Nina for sharing your perspective on how to attract talents in the
(16:10):
procurement space thank you a lot thank you alien it was great being here so now it's your turn to
tell us about your experience and your challenges when working with HR to recruit the right people
for a procurement group in the comments section don't forget to subscribe if you want to be
notified when a new episode is out thank you for listening and I hope you enjoy this episode and
(16:34):
if that's the case don't forget to give this a thumbs up so happy sourcing to you Allah
and that's a wrap for this episode of our procurement game changers series but we'll
soon be back with yet another exciting session with one of the movers and shakers from the
(16:57):
procurement space meanwhile remember to visit our website at consultingquest.com
for more Consulting updates and procurement know-how and join us on Twitter Facebook or
LinkedIn until then goodbye from the entire Consulting Quest family have a great day
Hello and welcome to the procurement game changers podcast brought to you by Consulting Quest ever wondered how the
leaders get it done what differentiates them from the rest of us let's tune in and learn from the
best leaders in the procurement space let's do it and now over to your host Helen Lafitte
(00:32):
welcome to the procurement game changers the podcast for leaders that make a difference today
we'll be talking about how HR and procurement can team up to attract the right Talent
and to discuss this topic I have the pleasure to receive Nina bonberg Global indirect procurement
director at domakaba a global leader in the access solution Market Nina has more than 16
(00:55):
years of working experience mostly in indirect procurement on goods and services she has an
extensive industrial experience ranging from chemical to equipments welcome to the show Nina
thank you very much Helens great to be here Selena could you tell us what led you to procurement
um like with so many of my colleagues I have to say it was pure coincidence um at University this
(01:20):
was nothing that um you could study I think the very closest when I studied you could get
to procurement was probably supply chain and Logistics and that maybe touched a very little
bit on the fringes of procurement um but but by and large um you could go into finance and you
could go into Marketing in HR and those were all very known and very prestigious places to go if
(01:41):
you study business studies but procurement wasn't um so and I ended up by chance my first employment
was by a randstadt so it was a temp labor agency and I ended up with Mars who needed support in
their purchasing organization and that's how I got there and then I think like with most of them
um you hate it or you love it and I loved it in their state and that's how 17 years went by
(02:06):
yeah I I can get that so today we're going to talk about uh procurement talent and we know that
it is in short supply in today's market and HR departments on Newport and partner for procurement
leaders when recruiting new employees so they provide a way to identify and assess potential
candidates and to find the best match for your needs however they have not always adapted their
(02:31):
recruiting tools to the recent changes in the labor market so this can lead to several problems
um including a lack of qualified candidates a difficulty in attracting top talents and an
inability to keep up with the changing demand and lengthy processes so as the labor market continues
to evolve it's essential that HR department adapt their recruiting tools accordingly otherwise they
(02:56):
will continue to fail to meet the needs of their internal clients including the
procurement group so let's hear the perspective of a procurement leader on this challenge so
Nina what have changed in the competition for talents for procurement or for indirect mechanics
well I really think that the the competition for talent was always big in that space we
(03:20):
always have those discussions does procurement have an image problem I actually don't think
becoma has an image problem procurement has an awareness problem I think if you go back to many
universities today and look at the business study courses they will still not include procurement
as one of the potential fields that you can go into um so that is actually for me the hardest
(03:41):
part and then adding the war for Talent on top right now we see less potential candidates out
there in the market we get hit even harder and the problem gets even bigger because then people are
drawn to the big things that are out there and that are known and um and it's hard to adjust
to them and I think that not every HR department has really adapted and embraced the fact that at
(04:04):
the moment it's an employee's Market they have the absolute choice of where they want to work
um as long as they have decent capabilities which are definitely the people we're looking for so we
have not really adjusted our processes to the fact that employees probably have five six different
employers that they can choose from if they're looking for a new job so if we take three months
(04:29):
to get back to them odds are somebody else only took two and if they don't really really really
want to work with us then they will have taken someone else's opportunity and that's why we
need to just be be a lot faster indeed I mean we also need to be you know we need to be more
aware and we need to make people more aware of the profession and and we try to work on that
(04:51):
continuously you know we go to universities we present our jobs we show people what we do and
and really actually think procurement is is a perfect example of a good job especially in
these crisis times because I've never seen people letting organizations letting procurement go in
times of Crisis because that's when you need them the most in terms of no crisis you're not going
(05:15):
to let people go yeah so it's actually a quite stable job compared to other things it's not
going your way right so have you seen though the role of HR evolved over the last few years I think
to a certain degree yes um I think there is a bigger understanding that we will need to recruit
(05:35):
um in a different way we will need to head hunt a lot earlier we don't tend to wait as long anymore
I mean when I started to work the job AdWords they were still in a newspaper on Saturdays and Sundays
um that even big jobs um and that I didn't relate to that yeah and that has definitely changed that
doesn't exist anymore and and and now we're talking about you know is it worthwhile to put
(05:58):
a job in stepstone is that something we still want to do is that something deep is the look
um personally I say I don't I I haven't been to the stepstone website
probably in a decade to be honest um which is why we're becoming more active internal recruiting
organizations within your own company um they become more active and they start searching out so
(06:21):
um even if I look at who's contacting me you know you get suddenly get contacted via LinkedIn
by recruiters of certain companies because that's the path they follow
yeah absolutely so what tactics do you use to attract top talents for your procurement group
um I think the most important thing is to actually just overall be an attractive employer
(06:41):
you know to have interesting tasks um that's what people care about most um together with
I want to say a likable company culture and likable is a very relative term because it
depends a lot on the type of personality you are you know if you work in an American or a French
or a German company they come with certain company cultures some more than others um and some might
(07:07):
might have changed over time but I also think that the company culture is extremely important
so you know what's the best company for me might not be the best company for you and I think it's
very very important to talk to candidates upfront about finding that right match between you and the
company versus um yeah we always joke about you know finding the perfect company which is just not
(07:28):
going to cut the deal anymore we discussed during the preparation about purpose and how talents now
on the market are looking for purpose in their jobs but I was thinking about what you just said
we remember when when you had your interviews and people were asking you what can you bring to our
company well maybe we're on the other side what your company but he can bring me as a candidate
(07:51):
we cannot reverse the definitely definitely that is something people people talk about and it's
not just I mean home office being one of them which is not which is not even a point that's
negotiable anymore but it's a given I mean you would have to have very good reasons as a company
to deny it if you are looking for good candidates but the same goes for having uh you know having
(08:13):
whatever is important to the candidate one one discussion I recently had was with a Consulting
agency who said that they really struggled because what used to be they're very strong
um selling point you know of your career progression and you earn lots of money
is a lot harder to sell to the generations to come because their Saturday is not for sale no
(08:33):
matter what price it just isn't nor is there 3 A.M in the morning it just isn't period which
means that Industries like those will struggle a lot and I hope that that is something where
we can then pull some of the talent out of those Industries and pull them towards our end
(08:53):
our staffing you know and how much um occupy they are achieve something different because
that's not going to cut it anymore you're right so going back to German leaders how do they need
to evolve do you think they need to evolve in their role in order to attract those top talents
I I do agree um definitely because you just in my opinion you need to really work with
(09:19):
each and every person as an individual and I really think that as a leader you have to
adapt to the people you're working with in a hybrid model even more because we've had lots
of discussions about you know how much leadership do people need how much connection do people need
and that varies a lot from person to person so I have people in my team who I speak to
(09:40):
at least four days a week and I have people in my team who after two months I call them up to
see if they're still alive I know their job is running fine because I haven't heard from them
so it's running fine but just to reconnect and say hey um I'm still here you're still
here how is life what's going on but to have this level of balance and to then also be able to have
(10:02):
this level of trust in your people to say okay there are people who don't need this very close
connection because they don't that's not what they're here for to then be able to trust them
and just let them go and let them do their job yes I I agree with you I think that the pandemics
has forced us to work remotely and to let go a little bit of that control that we might have on
(10:26):
our teams that the fight of being so close sometimes was easier even though for international
companies the remote part was already there you were not in the same building or in the
same country even but I think that it forced us to be a little more adaptive in the way we
work with them and that's true for procurement leaders and that's true for for leaders anywhere
(10:48):
I can tell even in my very small company so indeed you have to change your ways you have to adapt to
whoever you work with you have to build a trust and then uh make sure that the way you connect
with your teams is uh the most effective or for them for you and for you for for the organization
(11:10):
but then you have to work with HR at some point before that so how do you see the future of HR and
procurement working together so I have to say um having moved to a new company four weeks ago um I
have experienced something that that seems um that seems pretty close already to be honest and it was
(11:31):
a big big step forward for me when I experienced it but um the HR business partner for example
takes part in strategic meetings they take part in um leadership workshops they are part of all
of this happening so they really understand the department they understand what the Department's
going what the needs in the future are and what kind of people we will need to support this
(11:55):
um they actually know who the people are who work in that department you know they have
faces two names and capabilities to names and faces which is something that really really is
a valuable point because if you then have a topic that you need to discuss with them you don't have
to start at square one and you know explain them the entire background the entire story
(12:16):
and everything that's been going on but they have been very close during the entire process
um so they are very much aligned with with the needs that we have and they also understand
they understand the market You know despite the fact that they are not buyers they have
a basic understanding of buying and of the skills you need to be successful in that
profession so they know that what we're looking for if I say I need a global category manager
(12:41):
um they actually have a picture in mind the next question is not okay then send me the requirements
of that person but they actually have an idea of what kind of person it is I'm looking for
that's funny I had a discussion with a procurement leader who is building from scratch an indirect
procurement group and he was telling me that the first step was to connect with different
(13:02):
decision makers in the company in order to explain what they do and and understand what
are the pain points and and so it seems like you know the the work of HR in that particular angle
and the work of an indirect procurement leader is quite similar like get to know your internal
stakeholders connect with them know what they do know what their challenge are and when they
(13:26):
need you be there and be useful and that's how you can really build a successful relationship
I I couldn't agree more I mean purchasing just like HR we are internal service departments
um so it's our job to make sure that the rest of the company functions and like we have internal
stakeholders HR has internal stakeholders holders and indeed how the way that we try to help our
(13:50):
internal stakeholders while at the same time you know maintaining our um cost leadership
and compliance and so on HR does the same thing they provide an internal service to the rest of
the company while at the same time following their process processes compliance same thing um costs
Etc um but the concept is exactly the same yes now it's time to the takeaway um let's imagine that we
(14:18):
have a few of our listeners that want to improve the way they recruit Talent what advice would
you give them you know really to get started what is the thing that they should look for
so to me if you really want to attract the right people the first question I would I always ask
myself is if my best friend was looking for a job would I recommend this job to them
(14:44):
um that to me is a really important question because if your answer is no then you have
to change something in your department before you can attract the right talent because if you don't
feel comfortable offering this job to your friends really it's probably not attractive to many people
out there absolutely and then you mentioned before that there are ways to increase the awareness even
(15:05):
internally of what is procurement and how they contribute to the company because it's it goes
both ways I mean you need a good culture but you also need your internal stakeholder to
recognize your your group and if you're not then to to be on the way to do it being work towards
(15:26):
them being aware of you so that's kind of the the idea definitely I mean they need to see the value
and it's usually when you've handled the first claim for some Department um when they really
start understanding the value of procurement when they don't have to deal with a small print in the
contract and don't have to figure out why this went wrong and how this could be fixed that's
(15:47):
usually when you can win their hearts um to then gain the trust that next time you would
be included in in an RFQ earlier or they would ask for your advice up front before they do something
where they know they should have involved you but they thought it was faster if they didn't
well wonderful thank you Nina for sharing your perspective on how to attract talents in the
(16:10):
procurement space thank you a lot thank you alien it was great being here so now it's your turn to
tell us about your experience and your challenges when working with HR to recruit the right people
for a procurement group in the comments section don't forget to subscribe if you want to be
notified when a new episode is out thank you for listening and I hope you enjoy this episode and
(16:34):
if that's the case don't forget to give this a thumbs up so happy sourcing to you Allah
and that's a wrap for this episode of our procurement game changers series but we'll
soon be back with yet another exciting session with one of the movers and shakers from the
(16:57):
procurement space meanwhile remember to visit our website at consultingquest.com
for more Consulting updates and procurement know-how and join us on Twitter Facebook or
LinkedIn until then goodbye from the entire Consulting Quest family have a great day
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