Resilient Together

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:05):
Multiple people in my family clean my father, are veterans.

Speaker 2 (00:08):
Troops that have been to war and now they're back.

Speaker 3 (00:10):
And think and be grateful for their service.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
Sacrifice, love for their country, just unselfishness, all that they
do for us.

Speaker 3 (00:18):
There are some people in this country who take extraordinary
steps to provide for the freedom and security. We forget
that those people exist.

Speaker 1 (00:27):
We know them as the Army, Navy, Air Force, Marines,
and Coast Guard. They call themselves soldiers, seals, rangers, airmen, sailors.

Speaker 3 (00:38):
Devil dogs, and so much more.

Speaker 1 (00:41):
We call them fathers, brothers, sons and husbands, mothers, daughters,
sisters and wives. We call them friend and neighbor. These
veterans answered the call, now we answer Theirs are the
best our country has to offer, and we love them

(01:04):
for today we honor them and we serve them. David
Malsby is your host, and he welcomes you to this
community of veterans. As together we are building the road to.

Speaker 3 (01:21):
Hope, and indeed we are glad to have you along.
On a Sunday afternoon on the KPRC the nine to
five O on the A and dial here in Houston, Texas.
Thank you for joining us. And those of you who
are listening by the magic of podcast thank you for
doing so. Wherever you listen to podcasts, just look for
Road to Hope Radio and you will find it. Like

(01:41):
everything we do with the PTSD Foundation of America, it
is absolutely zero cost, all free. Everything we do is free.
Our fundraisers are free. It's really kind of the weirdest thing. People,
How do you do that? I can't explain it. Don't
ask me to explain. It just works out. But grateful
for all of you who hit the little subscribe button

(02:02):
and that podcast will download each and every week as
the new one comes out on Sunday afternoon. So appreciate
you doing that. Really appreciate it when you share that
podcast with your network. Appreciate it very very much. We
cannot afford to be the best kept secret in town.
We talk about that from time to time. But you
are how we are able to overcome that. There's a

(02:24):
veteran out there somewhere that could use a little encouragement.
There's a family member that's watching their loved one really
really struggle and they are not really sure what to do.
Share this podcast. You never know whose life might be
dramatically changed. Even saved because they hear about the work
and what's available at the PTSD Foundation of America and

(02:46):
Camp Hope where we bring veterans in from all across
the country every era of war. Let's see, it's a
six to nine month program. Some take up to two years,
and that's okay. We want to make life trajectory change
and that's what we do all day, every day at

(03:07):
Camp Hope peer to peer program and again it's all
at zero cost. PTSDUSA dot org is the website for
our foundation and all the programs that we offer. We
also offer Warrior Groups. We run those across the city
of Houston, across the state and a few cities across
the country. Also run one that is done virtually so

(03:27):
you can be literally anywhere connected to the Algore created Internet.
Thank you al Gore, appreciate it. But anyway, it's all free.
You can join in anywhere, and we truly do a
hope that you will. It can be very helpful. Also,
not only the Warrior group, of family support groups. So
if you're struggling, you're trying to understand what's going on,

(03:48):
check out the family support groups. Again, all that information
is available at PTSDUSA dot org. Big thank you to
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combat that's in the studio of US one. We could
spend the whole hour talking about where he just got

(05:17):
back from, because my goodness, welcome back to anyone to
reintroduce yourself to the world.

Speaker 4 (05:21):
Absolutely, thank you. David Brandon Hartsburg. I'm a combat vet
work at Camp Hope. I was in the United States
Army for ten and a half years and I've been
working at Camp Hope now for four years.

Speaker 3 (05:31):
All right, And Kevin, when I introduce.

Speaker 2 (05:34):
Yourself, Yeah, Kevin Stein, US Army Artillery boy, do i
Iraq in Afghanistan. This is my second time through Camp Hope.
And you're from I am from Michigan originally. Now I
live in Spring Lake.

Speaker 3 (05:51):
Okay, got you? Wise choice wise choice.

Speaker 5 (05:58):
Very nice.

Speaker 3 (05:59):
Okay, so we'll talk a little bit about that. Uh,
but you deployed when oh three? All right?

Speaker 5 (06:06):
The wow wow West.

Speaker 3 (06:08):
Yeah, you know, it's funny to kind of it's not
funny if that's the wrong word, it's interesting. I'd say
nothing funny about it. But when you talk to guys
who were there like early, even the change I think
from three to six or seven, there's a lot of
difference in the stories. Huge what was the difference when

(06:30):
you were in two different countries. So that's part of it.
But what else up? Armored vehicles there you go, Yeah,
because everybody's getting blown up. Yeah, yeah, we weren't protected
from the IDs, right.

Speaker 5 (06:38):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:39):
We were taking sane bags and put them on the floorboard,
o hombies, getting any steel that we could find, just
to try and emulate some type of armored.

Speaker 3 (06:46):
Yes, it's always good to be prepared the changes in
war and how it's conducted. We're going to share a
little bit of your story, what's transpired, what's brought you back,
what you're working on. We're gonna have a little bit
of a conversation with Brennon, just because he's here and

(07:06):
we want to hear a little bit about a really
exciting opportunity that he recently got to enjoy. It took
a little while getting just ready for it, a lot
of training, and it was funny to kind of watch
some of the stuff he was doing. But you will
be inspired by what he's been able to do. And
I think that's what's great about the show. You see
guys that were in such a dark place and now
you see them doing such awesome things. So stick with

(07:29):
us for Road to Hope Radio. We're going to take
a break here in just a second. Reminder eight seven
seven seven one seven seventy eight seventy three. If you
don't have that in your phone, please put it in
there a combat that will answer the phone or Combat
Trauma Crisis Line. Eight seven seven seven one seven seventy
eight seventy three. We're back with just a moment and

(08:04):
we welcome back Road to Hope Radio. Reminder, you can
follow us on social media for the show, it's Road
to Hope Radio on Facebook, and for the PTSD Foundation
of America Camp Hope it's PTSD USA PTSD post Traumatic
Stress Disorder PTSD USA. That is our Facebook, it is

(08:25):
x and it is YouTube, all three of those social
media channels PTSD USA, and then for Instagram it's PTSD
Foundation of America. Again, it's a great way to kind
of stay up with what's going on. So many different
things happening, not only around the Houston area and our
work at Camp Hope and our outreach programs, but also

(08:48):
across the country. Sometimes it's what's going on in one
of our chapters, for instance Atlanta and Tampa, some of
our staff there and the great work they're doing. Sometimes
it's about fundraisers. We were up in New York a
couple of weeks ago for a major fundraiser up there,
so you kind of follow along with what's happening. Last
week we mentioned the Gale is coming up October eleventh.

(09:12):
That information is available on the Road to Hope Radio
Facebook page. You just go to Road to Hope Radio.
You'll see the link there for the Gale. Before the
show's over, we'll talk about one more event, but I
want to just remind you PTSDUSA dot org for all
things related to the PTSD Foundation of America. All right,

(09:35):
so Brandon, let's touch on what you've recently done real quick,
because I want to make sure we get that in
and then we'll kind of cross back over to Kevin.
But pretty pretty I mean not easy, not everybody's doing
it like it was easy everybody to be doing it,
but there was quite an accomplish and tell us about it,

(09:56):
tell us what it was, and then we can kind
of backtrack, Why you did it?

Speaker 6 (09:58):
Sure, Yeah, it was a It's another nonprofit.

Speaker 4 (10:02):
They do a venture therapy and we had some veterans
and first responders. We had eight of us and it's
called Project Zero. They paid for the majority of it.
We went to Africa to hike a mountain. It's called
Mount Kilimanjarro. It's almost twenty thousand feet and it's a
pretty big accomplishment for that nonprofit and also the eight

(10:23):
of us. We summoned it on nine to eleven for
suicide awareness in honor of nine to eleven in that
special holiday.

Speaker 3 (10:32):
Yeah, I've climbed a hill on a diamond of a
baseball field once.

Speaker 6 (10:39):
Take the elevator here, climb the stairs here today in this.

Speaker 3 (10:42):
Spill today, And I saw you not take the stairs either.

Speaker 6 (10:46):
I didn't about a valid point, but I would have
if I was.

Speaker 3 (10:51):
Training, if you were training.

Speaker 4 (10:53):
Yeah, the thing that's hard is like we're zero elevation here,
we're sea level.

Speaker 6 (11:00):
You can't.

Speaker 4 (11:00):
It's hard to train in Texas for something like The
altitude is the challenging part.

Speaker 3 (11:04):
Right, Yeah, yeah, good luck with that.

Speaker 6 (11:08):
I'll tell you though. It was triggering.

Speaker 4 (11:10):
So I love Africa. The people are amazing but it
is a third world country. So the streets, the roads,
the vehicles, the motorcycles, the shops, everything looks like Iraq.
It smells like Iraq. The people like the shops, the
way they sell their food, it's the same style. So
the whole environment. To me, I'm in hyper vigilance. I'm

(11:31):
triggered the whole time we were out in the market,
or when we were driving with the guides to different locations,
or when we went out and stopped in the market.

Speaker 5 (11:38):
To me, it was.

Speaker 4 (11:41):
Very stressful, and a couple of the other people on
the team hadn't had the same type of deployments. They
didn't quite understand. They were having fun. They're like, oh,
this is exciting, and I'm like, I want my M four.
I want to lock and load right now. I don't
feel safe.

Speaker 3 (11:55):
Yeah, no kidding, What was the driving force behind you
in that choice?

Speaker 4 (12:02):
Okay, so I didn't have a pot to piss in
second time going through Camp Hope. I'm setting in an
AA meeting and one of the sponsors, Joe Es, was
talking about he comes up there. He's not a VET,
but he comes up to sponsors for alcoholics anonymous. He
was talking about in the beginning of sobriety. His sponsor
had him to stop trying to get a woman and

(12:23):
just focus on helping people in AA. And then he
found a group of guys and they went hiking. He
had his own business, of course, so they did some
cool hiking trips. They had the money for it. But
they went to Colorado, they went to a couple of
different states, and they had this group of men that
just got together a couple times a year and went
and hiked. And that seems so far away to me.
I just got out of prison, you know, after my

(12:43):
army career. My life just got destroyed. So the fact
that like, just like man, I wonder if I could
do that, that was the start of the idea.

Speaker 6 (12:51):
I was like, oh, man, get a group of men
and go hiking.

Speaker 3 (12:54):
Yeah. But that's what I think is so inspiring coming
from you know, prison, whatever degree sense of hopelessness, and
what's the point. And I mean that, you know, it's
a literal and a metaphorical mountain that you climbed, and
a major one. I mean it's as major as it gets,

(13:16):
both again literally and metaphorically. But it's not just that
it's what you do on a day to day basis,
so you could kind of look at where you were
and what was going on again, what you lost. And
it's more than just you know, we talk about this
a lot, but it's more than just you lost the uniform.
You lost the sense of that purpose. There's so many
other things that you lose along that way too, the

(13:36):
sense of you know, the whole moral injury, right and
wrong and all those things that come along with it.
There's a lot of loss there. And to be able
to take the time to assess where am I now
and how did I get here, so that you can

(13:57):
begin to develop that plan of I don't want to stay,
I want to climb that mountain. Like that's about a
great of a story as I can imagine.

Speaker 4 (14:07):
It's super cool, and you know, you think about getting
up the mountain and overcoming all that's against you when
you're a combat vet and when you struggle with what
guys at Camp Hope do, and it's really the daily
grind they don't know about. It's the dark nights when
it's it's the times when you're in silence and you're
struggling with thoughts and nightmares and you're not sleeping and

(14:29):
it's those daily grinds of doing the right thing and
trying to get sober and trying to do the counseling
and crying, and you know, they don't see that that's
that's the work. And that's kind of like going up
the mountain. That's that's sometimes being in the valley. And
it's it's kind of interesting to think about because people
don't know how bad you struggle getting there, getting up
that mountain. It's recovery from PTSD or you know, the

(14:51):
other elements drug addiction, depression, suicide, you know that go
along with it. It's it's it's it's like unspoken, but
there's a lot we go through people don't know about.

Speaker 6 (15:02):
Even the staff that work at Camp Hope. Now we
still struggle a lot.

Speaker 3 (15:06):
Yes, well, and you know when we talk about what
happens at Camp Hope. And it's not unlike I mean,
in some ways it's very unique. There's really literally nothing
like it in the world. But in other ways it's
not unlike just about anything else. So and what I
mean by that is our greatest strength is also our

(15:28):
greatest weakness. And that's true just about it anywhere you go.
But our greatest strength and I don't think. I mean,
there may be somebody out there around our organization that
might argue this a little bit, but our greatest strength
is the peer to peer model. It just is undergirded
foundation of it's a crist centered program and you don't

(15:52):
have to believe anything that we believe or you know,
sign some sort of creed, but that's what we use,
and that peer to peer model works. That's a great
strength when you watch it take place. I always refer
to I think when we pulled out of Afghanistan, some
of Afghanistan e bits were so angry, so angry.

Speaker 4 (16:13):
Campus was fired up. I was on at work that day.
There was a lot of guys in the program that
were pissed.

Speaker 3 (16:18):
Yeah, but then they're sitting next to a Vietnam vet
who just says, oh, I've seen this movie before. Would
you like to talk about it?

Speaker 5 (16:30):
Like?

Speaker 3 (16:30):
Man, that's powerful because I mean, I can give them
here's some biblical principles, or here's you know, here's some
grounding to you know, whatever may happen to be. But
when somebody that's gone through all that, actually lived it
and felt like everything I did over there was a
complete waste. I mean, that's just the instant emotional reaction, right,

(16:53):
and somebody that can walk them through. You know, I've
been there, done that, and it ate me up for
fifty years. I'm pretty sure you don't want to let
that eat you up for the next fifty years. So
let's talk about it. It's the power peer to here.

Speaker 4 (17:08):
We're talking about this the other day. So Alex kind
of started this new thing. Our director and I call
it Camp Hope Cigar Shenanigans.

Speaker 6 (17:14):
But we've been smoking cigar.

Speaker 3 (17:16):
We talked about that today.

Speaker 6 (17:17):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely, I love it.

Speaker 3 (17:20):
Very casual conversation staff and vets. I love it.

Speaker 4 (17:24):
It's great and it's bringing that back. So we were
talking to some new guys.

Speaker 3 (17:28):
We're gonna have to run the breaks. I'll hang on
a second, but if you if you own a cigar
shop where you would just like to donate some, they're
they're going through them at Camp Hope right now, just
say saying uh. And it has I think it's already
had some very positive effects. All Right, We got to
quick a quick news break for those of them in
the nine to five OHO. We'll be right back with
more of Road Hope Radio and we welcome you back

(18:04):
Road to Hope. Ray last week mentioned the gala coming
up here in the scenario October eleven. Today, I'd like
to mention to you Monday October twenty, because not everybody
likes galis Monday, October the twentieth, the Braden Bayless twentieth
Annual Memorial Golf Tournament. Doug Bayless and his wife put
this tournament on each and every year, made a very

(18:24):
substantial donation through this golf event last year and they
have for years now. But it's in memory of their
son United States Marine that they lost twenty two years ago,
I believe now. But this is the twentieth Annual Memorial
Golf Tournament. I will have information again on the Road

(18:47):
to Hope Radio facebook page, and we would love to
see you there. If you'd like to come out and
support what's going on in working with our veterans and
their families dealing with combat related post traumatic stress. Would
really encourage you. This is a great opportunity. Golf's a
lot of fun, it's great event. It's gonna be at
the Champions Golf Club, so anybody that plays golf knows

(19:07):
what that means. It's gonna be nice. Not everybody gets
a chance to play the Champions Golf Club. So if
that's something you would like to do, this is the time.
If you don't see it on Facebook page, just look
for braidon Bayless Memorial Golf Tournament and you do the
Google search or whatever search engine you use. You will
find a braidon Bayless. This again, it's Monday, October twentieth.
Then it's gonna be a lot of fun. All right,

(19:28):
Brandon will slap that up. You were talking about there's
a car deal?

Speaker 4 (19:32):
Yeah, real quick. So we were talking about we were
telling the new guys. They asked about Camp Hope and
a couple of us were talking about back in the day.
Because there's a guy there right now, Murphy, Josh Murphy
was there with me. I probablyhouldn't say his full name,
but I apologize. In twenty sixteen and we started talking
about old Camp Hope. So Camp Hope has grown a lot,
and you people are going to get insider into Camp

(19:54):
Hope and PTSD Foundation. Back then, we didn't have much
of a program. It was the here to peer in
the ctagym. We didn't have the class schedule, we didn't
have all this great awesome, you know, organized professional program
like we have now and it's fantastic.

Speaker 6 (20:10):
But it worked back then too because it was the.

Speaker 5 (20:13):
Peer to peer.

Speaker 4 (20:14):
It was pretty much hang out, don't do drugs or drink.
We had counselors and we went to the gym and
we hung out with each other.

Speaker 3 (20:21):
I smoked.

Speaker 6 (20:22):
Peer to peer. We didn't do a lot of classes,
we didn't do a lot of anything else. And it worked.

Speaker 3 (20:26):
Yeah, but that peer to peer because people was we
didn't want the VFW do well, they sit around talk
but have you ever heard of fish stories? So not
really sure that it's profitable talk.

Speaker 5 (20:39):
But.

Speaker 3 (20:41):
Yeah, and it's funny to me just you know, interacting
with guys who've come through at different periods of time.
So for you, twenty sixteen is the early years. Yeah, yeah,
well that was probably phase three of the early years.

(21:05):
I could go back to twenty twelve and tell you
there wasn't mm hmmm, yeah, and that's all it was.
It was literally it was pierd of peer.

Speaker 4 (21:13):
We talked about a lot of like how the rules
got created. Oh yes, we talked about Zach Alexander a lot.

Speaker 3 (21:20):
I love that marine. But yes, he uh he challenged
this many many times. Uh, And through the years a
lot of guys have added to the rule book for us.
We're very very appreciative them doing so. I've always hated that.
It's like the more that's in there, the more you
find a reason to, you know, to do whatever you
want to do. You know, at some point you just

(21:40):
got okay, the Ten Commandments pretty much. Yeah, yeah, let's
just pull it all back. We're gonna go by the
ten Commandments. You all can figure that one out. Kevin,
you mentioned right off the bat that this is your

(22:01):
second time to camp. Obviously, combat trauma brought you the
first time. When you look back on it now and
the time in between between your first visit and second
visit that you're in currently right now, when you look

(22:22):
back on that that first trip through, knowing what you
know and you know the program quite well, but knowing
what you know of that and knowing what because you're
the only one that one knows what has been going
on in your brain? What is it you think, Uh,

(22:45):
we didn't cover, you didn't deal with or you did,
but at some point you just you just gave up
on it.

Speaker 2 (22:53):
What happened, Well, it's nothing that camp hope I'm not
trying to anywhere. Yeah, I just yeah, what happened, you know,
coming back the first time, in coming on staff and
stuff like that, I was really able to address my
combat trauma and really really be able to reframe it,
look at it differently, and be able to deal with it.

Speaker 5 (23:15):
But with trauma.

Speaker 2 (23:17):
And this doesn't apply to everybody, but for me, my
PTSD really started in my childhood, and coming through Camp
Hope it got that camaraderie again, that that period of
peer okay, focus on combat. I completely denied and was
not vulnerable enough for my childhood trauma.

Speaker 3 (23:39):
So you chose not to. I chose to keep going.

Speaker 5 (23:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (23:42):
And that's the beautiful thing about Camp Hope right now,
is because coming to Camp Hope dealing with my combat trauma,
the best thing that I got out of Camp Hope was.

Speaker 5 (23:55):
The family that I have now.

Speaker 2 (23:57):
The mentors, this staff, these guys have my back and
they have saved my life twice since I graduated last time.
And I don't have that support anywhere else. So the
peer to peer support at camp you will not find

(24:18):
anywhere else. I've said this before. You know, we go
to combat, you know, you your band of brothers, you've
got each other's back. But when it comes to feelings
and emotions, nothing's ever said at camp.

Speaker 5 (24:34):
That's what we talk about. That's what we address because your.

Speaker 3 (24:38):
Artillery but in your battle, and it's I don't even
I don't even know if it can be adequately and
fully expressed to whether it's someone who's just driving around
Loop sixteen at the moment, or its maybe some veteran

(25:01):
that's kind of checking us out and like, what's going
on here and what's this all about? The coming back
after you know, coming through the program doing great, doing
a lot of great things, and then it just gets
real dark, real fast. And because here's the thing. While

(25:22):
that was going on, you know a number of us
were aware and constantly in contact with each other like
what's the status today? What can we do today? If anything,
we just give it time. But there's a lot of
those conversations going on out of nothing but pure concern

(25:46):
and love for your well being, because at some point,
you know, and you could list this about any number
of guys, at some point there's this concern for their
safety that you know, are they going to live through
the day? Right? And what do you got to do
to get there and make sure or you've done everything
you can to make sure that doesn't happen. There's a
it's I just want to say, put it against up

(26:10):
any anything. I don't know of anything else in the
world that has that to the degree that we have it,
because our guys will go fight for you, and that's
got that's got to mean something like even though I mean,
I don't know how much you can logically think through

(26:30):
when you're you know, uh, going back into your addiction,
but at some point that's got a click, like there
is somebody out there that's trying to help me and
not just keep kicking them in the teeth and I'll
letting them do it.

Speaker 2 (26:45):
There is a point where right before I came to
camp where I did not care for my safety. I
did not care for my life, and it was the
care of others from camp Alex Oliver yourself logan. I mean,

(27:07):
these guys were there every night, texting me, talking to me,
coming to see me, and I could not I could
see the pain on their face because I couldn't see
the value in myself at that time, but they could.
And I love them so much. I knew that they
loved me. That you know, Okay, I don't want to

(27:29):
hurt these guys anymore. I'm gonna go back to camp.
And coming back to camp, I've started to gain some
of that self respect, that value, that worth back.

Speaker 5 (27:40):
And it's just it.

Speaker 2 (27:41):
It's amazing because you even spoke about it Sunday in
church and you said, when somebody's there willing to walk
through the fire with you, it's it's an indescribable feeling
to me because I would do it, but for somebody
to do it for me is just is amazing.

Speaker 3 (28:03):
Well, you know, it can a lot of what we
do a lot of things we talk about can become cliche.
The whole you are not alone thing. Some say it
but don't always live it. And we're not perfect by
any stretch of the magication. I'm not trying to set
us up as what we are, but I will promise
you there's somebody in the organization that wants to make

(28:26):
sure you're not alone. Ptsd USA dot org. Ptsd usa
dot org. Again, it's not just Camp Hope. We also
have outreach programs all across the country and virtually so
you can be literally anywhere and join up ptsd USA
dot org. All of it's free. We write back with
more road Hoop Radium and were welcome back to Road

(29:06):
to Hope Radio. Glad to have you along. Got Brandon
uh In here with US United States Marine Army. I
did that again?

Speaker 5 (29:12):
Whoa, sir?

Speaker 3 (29:14):
I did that again?

Speaker 1 (29:14):
I know that.

Speaker 3 (29:19):
Yeah, I did that once before. I'm not doing that again.

Speaker 4 (29:21):
You know, if you call a marine army, they might
not ever talk to you again.

Speaker 3 (29:25):
This is true.

Speaker 6 (29:25):
I mean, I'm I'm pretty passionate.

Speaker 3 (29:27):
I may never be able to talk again.

Speaker 4 (29:29):
It's offensive to an army vet that you call marine.
We're offended because we're a lot smarter than marine vetts.

Speaker 3 (29:37):
I'm just saying I've.

Speaker 2 (29:41):
Got a lot of marine friends that are really respected. Love,
So I'm going to try and keep that. There's a
good there's a good battle camaraderie.

Speaker 5 (29:56):
I mean, it's it's all fun. Love.

Speaker 3 (29:58):
How long have you been back at camp.

Speaker 5 (30:00):
I've been back in three months?

Speaker 3 (30:01):
Okay, so three months in. Obviously you got the at
least that long of sobriety. A little bit more because
I think you had to do a little program for
you got those right. So much sobriety you have right.

Speaker 5 (30:16):
Now, I have just under four months.

Speaker 3 (30:19):
Okay, Brandon, where are you.

Speaker 6 (30:21):
At six years and three months?

Speaker 3 (30:28):
I when I do that, So I do that sometimes
Sunday morning, like they just you know, what's your number today?
And it's it's I think some of the there aren't
a lot, but there's a few of us. So he's
in the room. I think for some of them, the
first couple of times they heard it, they probably didn't
really understand it. It's like, this isn't to bring shame
at all.

Speaker 4 (30:47):
That's the only place you get credit for doing something
you should do anyways. Yeah, it's like you probably shouldn't
do drugs anyway, get a celebration for ustance.

Speaker 5 (31:00):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (31:00):
The point of the you know, sharing that is not,
you know, to shame. I like to talk about it
in terms of if you're just shy of four months,
if you go back four and a half months to

(31:21):
where you are mentally, spiritually, physically, if you just go
back to that time, if you can do that in
your mind, just kind of time travel back there and
to today. You know, part of that is what's changed.
But also part of that is if you go back

(31:45):
to the four and a half month mark, would you
have believed you could have gotten to where you are today.
If you go back to the six years four months ago,
would you have believed you would have been on staff
for this long, you would have conquered Kilimanjaro, you know,
all the things, having your son back in your life,

(32:05):
all these things that have happened. Would you have believed
that at that point in time?

Speaker 4 (32:10):
No way.

Speaker 3 (32:10):
Now, there was no hope.

Speaker 6 (32:13):
It was a dark reality. You couldn't give It was
like a prison.

Speaker 5 (32:17):
It was bad.

Speaker 4 (32:18):
I didn't think I could get better. I thought I
was screwed for life. That's that's why I kind of
accepted it. And the drugs and alcohol numb it so well,
we're trying to numb our feelings in our past. So
it's just one of those things like I can't get better.
I got a TBI, I'm a drug addict. I'm an
ex vet, I'm a combat vet. I'm not in the
army anymore.

Speaker 5 (32:33):
What do I got?

Speaker 6 (32:34):
Who cares? Let me just go to the bar and fight.

Speaker 3 (32:36):
It's kind of where I was at.

Speaker 6 (32:37):
It was awful.

Speaker 5 (32:39):
It was dark. Yeah, it's hopeless, especially.

Speaker 6 (32:41):
When you accept it. You know, I don't know, Yeah,
where I was, it's hopeless, And that's why.

Speaker 5 (32:48):
You know, alcoholic drugs is just a quick solution to the.

Speaker 2 (32:52):
Problem, and the whole time you're drinking or drugging, you're
hating it, but you don't have the willpower at that
moment to stop. So when you give your sobriety days,
you hear people at church on Sunday seven days, nine days,
thirty six days, like, there's pride in that because there's growth,

(33:14):
there's strength in not letting that be your solution anymore
and taking ownership and taking the next right step in
the walk to become a better man.

Speaker 3 (33:28):
Yeah. And I'm not an AA or in a person.
I'm not against it. I just I've never found part
of that. So I know I don't use the right
vocabulary when we go through those things. But to me,
it's just like, yes, not quite four months, Yes, that
should be a moment of accomplishment and gratitude from where
I was then today every single day, so whether it's

(33:50):
day number seven or day number eighteen twenty six, every
single one of those days is a celebration, right.

Speaker 5 (33:58):
Absolutely, So.

Speaker 3 (34:03):
Almost four months sober, roughly three months in the program.
What are you hoping to accomplish? Because you talked about
some of the childhood trauma that you didn't address the
first time. Before you get that coin and piece of
paper and whatever, two, three, five, whatever length of time

(34:28):
it is months from now. What do you want to
be different? What do you want to have accomplished?

Speaker 2 (34:36):
I want to regain the strength that I have with God.
There's many other things, but that's the key, because what
I want most of all is just inner peace, inner piece.

Speaker 5 (34:56):
I don't want chaos anymore.

Speaker 2 (34:58):
I want to love people that love me and not
drain from them, not be a burden on them. I'm
a very likable guy. I'm a very lovable guy. But
you know, I tend to dwell on the negative aspects,
and all of my fears are always there. When I

(35:25):
leave God out of the equation. When I bring God
into the equation, their strength and there's ability to conquer
those fears.

Speaker 3 (35:38):
We talked a little bit about peace less on things.
There's one way to find it, lasting peace and eternal peace,
and we just touched on that. A lot of people
search to the bottom of an awful lot of bottles
looking for it and never could find it. It's not

(36:00):
where it's up. No, So you mentioned your faith and
you want to rebuild that. What are you doing right
now to work on that? Even while you're in the
midst of this program. You're dealing with a lot right now,
while you're coming through the program.

Speaker 2 (36:14):
I'm letting go of my pride. I'm being vulnerable enough
with God to say, you know what, I don't got
this figured out.

Speaker 5 (36:26):
I can't do this on my own.

Speaker 2 (36:30):
What steps do I have to take to become the
man that I want to be, that you want me
to be. That's morning devotional, that's our baby. We weave
proverbs every morning, sit around and talk about what we
just heard from the Proverbs. You know, that's action steps
daily that make me a better man, that build my

(36:53):
relationship and my understanding of God. Because when I was young,
my dad was not around trauma for my So my
struggle to form the relationship with Christ has been difficult
for me because I don't know what a father figure is.
I don't understand that type of relationship. I was harmed

(37:15):
by my father, so it has been really difficult. But
just getting them daily steps, reading Proverbs, I mean there's
thirty one books Proverbs. I don't find that coincidental, you know,
and you're reading it. It talks about gaining wisdom and
becoming a man and all the things in simple terms,
and you just follow those simple terms. You find people

(37:39):
that you respect and you see that are walking with
God and.

Speaker 5 (37:44):
Talk to them. Don't be afraid to ask.

Speaker 3 (37:47):
Questions and will said. I pray you continue to do
the work. Yes, sir, finish what has been begun. Don't
let anything divertue or stop you. And there's always plenty
who squirrel, There's always plenty of things to draw our attention,

(38:09):
So get down what needs to be done, Brandon, thanks
for being with us again today. Always spend a little
time with you again. PTSDUSA dot org is the organization's website.
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Road to Hope Radio. Hit that subscribe button. It'll download
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(38:30):
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you again with more of Road to Hope radio