The Rod and Greg Show: Should Third Graders Be Held Back If They Can't Read?

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Breaking news every single day. I keep hearing polls that
you know that the enthusiasm about Trump or is going
is going down, or that the public's tired of the
Republican so called rhetoric. All I'm seeing is movement. I'm
seeing this president act and accomplished things that we voted for,
and it seems like the momentum has maintained a high,

(00:21):
high pace.

Speaker 2 (00:21):
Yeah, yeah, it's been well. Like like we've said many
a time before on the show, we planned the show
at about eight thirty in the morning, and by four
o'clock in the afternoon, it is a completely different show.

Speaker 1 (00:33):
We should just start those morning calls like this is
what the show won't be. It's just this is what
we know. We won't be able to.

Speaker 2 (00:39):
Discuss plenty on doing, but we don't think we'll ever.

Speaker 1 (00:41):
It's just our best effort as of the am hour.
But we know by four pm our audience will have
a lot more they want to hear about.

Speaker 2 (00:48):
Well, we've got a lot to tell you. The admiral
in charge of the attack on the Narco boats, right yep,
appeared before Congress today. Yeah, in a closed door meeting.
We didn't hear what he had to say. But a
lot of people are coming out of that with kind
of a different attitude, saying, maybe this whole you know,

(01:09):
Narco Bolk attack and the second shot, maybe it's not
that big of a deal. That's what they're trying to
make it that way, but that that second shot maybe not.

Speaker 1 (01:19):
Yeah, I think that. I think every again, going back
to the constant narrative and and strategy of the Democrats
and the left that everything that Donald Trump does and
his administration does is illegal. That's just that's just that's that.
You just start the day with that, and then you
go find out what he's done so that you can
frame it as illegal. Well, that's what we saw with this,

(01:40):
this double tap or hitting this boat. Heaven forbid them
just once and as the details emerge, even under behind
closed doors, and Congress comes out and explains what they
saw with their own eyes and how it was described
and narrated to them, it isn't what you know the
left has wanted us to believe as a war crime
and everything else.

Speaker 2 (01:58):
Yeah, well you'll hear what the video shows, will tell
you that here in just a minute, there is such
a thing as Trump derangement syndrome. You know, we often
laugh about it, but apparently there's a psychotherapist who now
says it's real, folks, And they'll explain what he means
by that a little bit later on. We'll talk about
parents reading to children. The governor said yesterday he's willing
to hold back third graders if they aren't proficient and reading.

(02:21):
That's a controversial step, but unfortunately it may be necessary.

Speaker 3 (02:25):
Now.

Speaker 1 (02:25):
Yeah, this is probably a topic that just in our
interviews that we've had this week, and the way that
some of the statistics nationally but even here in the
state of Utah have emerged just this week. I probably
want to stay on this issue because I think that
the illiteracy in our schools and how rampant it is.
And I was I was education chair for two terms.
I've been well involved during my time as a public servant.

(02:47):
These are scary. These are scenarios that we never dreamt
would be possible for our state. Only forty eight percent
of for our third grade students are proficient or at
grade level reading. That's a disaster we can Anyways, I
think that's an ongoing story that I don't want to
let go. This isn't a this isn't a news cycle
story for me. This is a big, big deal and

(03:08):
so well, we're gonna stay on top of this.

Speaker 2 (03:10):
Gew Yeah, we're on talking about it with you a
little bit later on Steve Moore Economist Extraordinaire. He's wound
up today. I mean we talked to him earlier today
before the interview and he's just wound up on things.
We'll get into that. So we've got a lot to
get to today. As always, we invite you to be
a part of the program. Join Greg and I in
our discussion today eight eight eight five seven oh eight
zero one zero on your cell phone, dial pound two

(03:32):
fifty and say hey Rod, or download the iHeartRadio app
search for kN r S and you'll have a chance
to leave us a talkback message as well. All right,
I think this this whole kill order smear thing Greg,
in my opinion of Pete Haig Seth, was a classic
deep state bid to topple Donald Trump, and again it
has backfired.

Speaker 1 (03:53):
Yep. Well, I think that I think THEOS six coming
out with these this bizarre recording of you know, video
and social media that you're not supposed to follow illegal orders,
and people asked them what illegal orders are you talking about? Well,
they're really talking about everything that Trump does, but they
didn't have anything specific to speak about. And then this
video was released, and then the narrative started after they

(04:15):
had said this, where they then accused him of war crimes.
Secretary of War, heg Seth of war crimes, everyone else.
And so you can see it now in hindsight when
you look at it, the seditious six looks like they
were setting the table for this sideswipe. And I don't
think that. I don't think that it's going to work
as they thought it would. But remember even Vidman, when

(04:37):
he was doing the transcribing of the conversation between Trump
and Selensky, he tried to say that it was all
impeachable and that what he said was wrong. And then
they weren't expecting Trump to release the recording of his
discussion with Skin and he did and everybody listened to
it and said, what that that's what you're saying is
such a bad thing. He said, get your act together.

(04:58):
You're getting you're getting us fun. You got to you
gotta run a right shift. You got to clean the
clean the clean the place up.

Speaker 2 (05:05):
Well today before the US Senate Admiral Bradley went before
them in a closed door meeting to explain what happened
and answer any questions they would have. They've all come
out and talked about it, including Arkansaunder. Senator Tom cottonell
listen to his explanation of what he saw on that
video today.

Speaker 4 (05:20):
I saw two survivors trying to clip the boat loaded
with drugs down the United States back over so they
could stay in the fight and potentially given all the
contacts we heard of other narco terrorist boats in the
area coming to their aid to recover their carro and
recover those Narco terrorists. And just like you would blow

(05:42):
up a boat off of the Somali coast for the
Mini coast, and you come back and strike it again
if it still have terrorists and it still had explosives
or missiles. Adware Bradley sac Carry had said exactly what
we'd expect them to do.

Speaker 2 (05:55):
Okay, So you have two survivors trying to call crawl
back into whatever is left of the boat, trying to
recapture some of the drugs they were carrying, obviously reaching
out to other Narco boats to come get them. And
you don't do a second tap.

Speaker 1 (06:08):
Yeah, and I think what's explains it doesn't. Yeah. I
think what's so fundamentally unfair what the left is trying
to do is that they'll they'll take a slice of
history or a slice of a video in a moment
that the American people have no expertise and no understanding
of no context in which what they're watching they can
compare to anything else, and they say war crime. But
then you find out, well, off the coast of Somali,

(06:29):
we've we've hit boats more than once, we've he gave
the Senator gave multiple examples of where the military actions
have happened similar to the one that they saw behind
closed doors. This is the same effort, the same type
of so we don't know, we don't have anything to
compare it to. But now that they're going to go
as far as they are, and now we're going to
hear that this you can actually shoot to take out

(06:50):
a boat, that's a that's you know that it's a target.
You can shoot more than once.

Speaker 2 (06:54):
Well, Martisa on Fox News and others are now pointing
out Barack Obama twenty of these twenty second tap But
guess what, we never saw that video did we know
now with the narrative of change if we saw that video.
So I think, Greg, this goes back to what you
and I and a lot of people talk about every day.
Is Trump derangement syndrome. People that see Trump and they

(07:16):
just lose it. Well, there was a psychotherapist who was
on Fox News this morning talking about He's written an
op ed piece about Trump derangement syndrome. It is a
real thing, according to him, And listen as he explains
how he spots who people come in for treatment are
actually being affected by Trump derangement syndrome.

Speaker 5 (07:34):
People are obsessed with Trump, They're fixated, They're hyper fixated
on Trump, and they talk about some of the features
of this disorder. They can't sleep, they feel traumatized by
mister Trump, they feel restless. I had one patient who
said she couldn't enjoy a vacation because anytime she saw

(07:55):
Trump and the news or on her.

Speaker 2 (07:57):
Device, she felt triggered. So this is a pro.

Speaker 5 (08:00):
Found pathology, and I wouldn't even go so far as
to call it the defining pathology of.

Speaker 2 (08:05):
Our time, the defining pathology of our time. They can't sleep,
they can't enjoy vacation, folks get hold for it.

Speaker 1 (08:14):
Come on, it's just not reasonable. I mean, I mean,
there's just there's he in fact, especially when you see
a lot of indicators that we've all been talking about.
And I think nationally you're seeing gas prices fall precipitously
more so than the Utah. Everyone knows how I feel
about that. But you're seeing it even here, falling to
about little under three dollars a gallon. But you're seeing

(08:35):
gas prices go down, You're seeing interest rates come down,
You're seeing that we saw record receipts and of retail
sales on Black Friday. We're seeing some signs. I'm not
saying it's all rosy out there. What I am saying
is that compared to the Biden years and digging out
from the Biden years, this president is doing his job.
And I think that I don't know how you can't

(08:55):
people can't observe and see the difference. That there's just
a contrast in terms of movement and good that are
going on.

Speaker 2 (09:00):
Yeah there is. Oh, we got a lot to get
to today, so we invite you to stay with us.
It is the Roden Gregg Show right here on Utah's
Talk Radio one o five nine kN R s live
everywhere on the iHeartRadio app and just about fifteen minutes
here on the Rod and Gregg Show, we'll be talking
about the need for parents and reading to their kids.
Real concern about reading proficiency here in the state of Utah.

(09:21):
As a matter of fact, the governor is getting involved
in that. We'll talk about that coming up, but right
now we want to talk during the next guest. Had
him on the show before, Always great to chat with.
We're talking about Frank Meeley. He is a columnist with
Real Clear Politics, wrote an article about no Kings, no Queens,
No blind loyalty. Welcome to the show, Frank, It's always
great to have you on. What do you mean by that, Frank?

(09:45):
Whoop's my fault? I need to bunch a button. I'm sorry, Frank,
my fault there, push the wrong button. Yeah. What do
you mean by that? No Kings, no queens, no blind loyalty?

Speaker 6 (09:54):
Yeah, I mean I don't really want to be associated
with the people who created.

Speaker 3 (09:58):
No Kings day.

Speaker 6 (10:00):
But I've had a really uncomfortable feeling about Trump being
He's becoming unaccountable and it seems like he feels like
he can do anything anytime and say anything anyway, and

(10:20):
he doesn't feel like he can be held responsible for
what he's what he's saying and doing. And it started
for me. It started with the East wing. You know,
he said, oh, we're going to you know, put a
ballroom in, but it won't affect the rest of the Whitehouse.
And then he tore down the East wing with it,
you know, in a couple of days. And you know,

(10:41):
I didn't have to go through any process, no comments, no,
not anything. And I'm like, well, that's really weird because
I can't do anything to my house without a permit,
you know, and I don't really feel comfortable with somebody
making that kind of decision about a historic structure. So
that was the beginning. And then I just started listening
to him, and you know, the whole thing with Marjorie

(11:01):
Taylor Green came up, where she was saying really common
sense things about the Epstein files, and Trump was just,
you know, he was getting down and dirty and you know,
calling her all kinds of names because she wanted those
files out, you know, and it just seemed like he
was going too far. Yeah, right, I decided to challenge

(11:25):
him a little bit.

Speaker 1 (11:26):
Well, I think you should. And but I would argue
that I think that that I think that's what's lost
on the public if they see people that support Trump.
I think that Trump's supporters are very quick to disagree
with the president. I think when he was campaigning after
twenty twenty and he tried to brag about Operation Warp
speed in the vaccines, he got loudly booed. You didn't
hear him keep with that narrative very long. I think

(11:47):
he's taken some real flak over at the Epstein files,
and I think it's why you see them being released.
And also I think the visas, what he said about
we need we need student visas. We're gonna let China
bring in a lot of students in here. That's going
to be fine. We need h one b one visas
for work. I think there was considerable pushback from people
when they heard him say those things. Do you do

(12:09):
you do you.

Speaker 6 (12:10):
Think that there is pushback, But the question is is
it getting through to mister Trump and is he you know,
people occasionally say something that indicates that he's you know,
he gets it, you know, like he finally went along
with releasing the Epstein files when he had no choice.
But you know, he also called Marjorie Taylor Green a

(12:32):
trader to the country. I mean, that kind of language
is just too far. And when he when he was
meeting with the Crown Prince of Saudi Arabia and he
was they were both asked about the fact that the
Crown Prince was associated with the murder of a Washington
Post columnist, and Trump just said, things happen as if that,

(12:54):
you know, as if you could just overlook that. I mean,
you don't have to necessarily take it and say, oh yeah,
proven or anything, but you don't just say things happen about.

Speaker 7 (13:03):
The murder of somebody.

Speaker 6 (13:06):
All those types of things me crazy a little bit.

Speaker 2 (13:09):
Well, let me ask you, though, Frank, isn't this Trump
just being Trump? I mean, is he different from what
he was a year ago, two years ago?

Speaker 6 (13:17):
It is Trump being Trump, which I pointed out in
my column al though. But but you know, at some
point there has to be a limit to how much
the public, even public like me that voted for him
three times, how much we feel is appropriate.

Speaker 3 (13:33):
I mean, if my kid.

Speaker 6 (13:34):
Talked that way, I would, you know, I would have
a good talking to them. And you know, I feel
like Trump. Trump really gets away with a lot because
people know, on both the left and the right that
if they challenge him, they're going to be squashed, and
you know, they're going to be publicly humiliated. You know.

(13:55):
But at some point there is something going on, and
I'm concerned learned about what's going to happen in these
mid term elections, because he is losing support right and left,
and it down, you know, in his popularity of favorability
ratings in the high thirties. It's bad. And if you

(14:16):
really believe that his policies are good, something needs to
change about the way he presents himself so people can't
use him as an excuse to vote for Democrats and
the policies that are going to damage the country.

Speaker 1 (14:29):
See. Now here's my contrarian view. I think that if
I were to criticize Trump, it would be for maybe
his ready fire aim. I would say, look look at
how he wanted to renegotiate the old global world trade agreements.
And he came out with that big press conference and
you saw the big chart, and in that chart was
also coffee and bananas, things that the United States doesn't make.
And people are scratching their head, and then eventually he

(14:51):
took off those tariffs because he realized that it was
increasing the cost of those things. And someone could say, look,
how he Hey, he's not very thoughtful about how he changes.
That's very different than what you're saying. You're saying that
when he gets something in his mind, there's no lot
he's just very he's so heavy handed. Some people will
say he's too pliable, that he or that he changes
his mind too often. Can you how do we reconcile

(15:13):
those two? Because I do think that that if he
gets new information, he's not afraid to pivot with that information,
which people true to.

Speaker 6 (15:22):
Some extent I did. I did write a column a
couple of weeks ago that about the fact that change
is the greatest stressor that when people are experiencing changes
in jobs, marriage, you know, relationships moving, you know, it
puts a lot of stress on them. And in the

(15:43):
case of Trump's nine months in the lighthouse, there's been
more change happening than than we've seen probably in the
last four presidents. Even even Obama, with his plan to
transform the country didn't do anything anywhere near like what
Trump has done. And I think people are just afraid

(16:06):
that things are happening too fast, too much change, and
they're going to say they're going to put their foot down,
and they're going to say, you know, let's give the
Democrats a chance again. You know, we can't have Trump
going crazy and pushing too far, so we'll go back
the other direction. Well, if they go back to the
other direction, if in twenty six Democratic Congress is elected,

(16:29):
we know the first thing they're going to do is
find a way to impeach them. So that's going to
tear the country apart.

Speaker 3 (16:35):
And then you know, jd.

Speaker 6 (16:36):
Vance I feel like he'd be a really good president.
Marco Rubio too, and they're probably going to have a
really uphill battle the way things are going. That Tennessee
congressional race was very scary. I mean, the guy won
by nine, but Trump won by twenty two. So we're
losing where, you know, a lot of support over things

(16:58):
that aren't policy related. I really believe it's related to
the fact that Trump has an arrogance and feel almost
like he feels like he can get away with anything,
and he wants to push that a little bit and
test the waters to see how much he can get
away with In terms of decorum and just you know,

(17:19):
just how he treats people.

Speaker 2 (17:21):
Frank is always we appreciate your perspective. Thanks for joining
us this afternoon.

Speaker 6 (17:25):
All right. I hope I'm not drummed out of it.

Speaker 2 (17:28):
We wouldn't do that, do you, Frank. Thank you Frank
Meeley joining us. Talking about Trump, I think you and
I disagree probably with a lot of what he was saying.
I mean, I think Trump is being Trump. I think change.
I mean, let's be honest, you have never seen so
much change take place during his second first second term
in office then with any president in this country. So

(17:50):
it probably is rattling a few people out there. But
the good, it's all.

Speaker 1 (17:55):
For the good, having zero immigration problems now and all
those other things. I just think I think you, I
think and I actually think he's tempered in terms of
the social media from the first term to the second.

Speaker 2 (18:04):
Yeah, all right, Moore, coming up the Rod and Greg
Show and Talk radio one oh five nine knrs. And
you were talking about your favorite book growing up as.

Speaker 1 (18:11):
A kid, The Monster at the end of this book
starring the lovable furry old Grover Grover. Yeah, Sesame Street Book.
I remember this book distinctly and I read it to
my kids as a young parent, and I loved being
read to by my mother, and I think that was
just something that I guess I took it for granted.
I thought that parents did this and it was fun.

(18:33):
The book is fun. It's a great book. If you
haven't seen, it's one of the most sold books. The
monster at the end of this book, it's one of
the it's a very popular one.

Speaker 2 (18:40):
Well, joining us on our Newsmaker line to talk more
about that right now is Jessica Harkey. She is a
staff reporter at the seventy four. Jessica, thanks for joining
us tonight. Why is it so important that parents read
to their children.

Speaker 8 (18:51):
Yeah, well, first just want to start with thanks so
much for having me. But yeah, the importance of reading
to early children really starts the foundation literacy for kids.

Speaker 9 (19:01):
When they enter the school system. And so when I
put together.

Speaker 8 (19:04):
This piece, I was kind of going just off the
casual observation of all the time when we're on the subway,
when we're at restaurants, now we see kids on smartphones,
and I was just curious. I was thinking back to
when I was a child, of when I was out
at restaurants, my mom was always bringing books with us,
and so I kind of wanted to dig deep into

(19:24):
what does this mean for literacy as we are seeing
some declining literacy rates across the country, especially among that
third grade level or so. And so, one of the
big things that researchers did tell me in this piece
is that reading to children exposes them to more vocabulary.
There was a study that I had quoted where a

(19:45):
child who has read to daily or frequently will have
over three hundred thousand more word exposure and vocabulary by
the time that they entered the public school system.

Speaker 9 (19:55):
So that is one element is.

Speaker 8 (19:57):
Just being exposed to more vocabulary, which sets up to
the beginning and foundation of literacy. It's hard to read
books or want to read books when you don't understand
what they're talking about, what those words mean.

Speaker 9 (20:09):
And then there was a social emotional element.

Speaker 8 (20:11):
Of it too, of that it opens a world that
they may not be exposed to, different dialogues, different characters,
things that they can relate to, ways to develop relationships
with their peers or their families.

Speaker 1 (20:23):
So you also point out that it looks like this,
I lived through this. My mother read to me, and
I've read to my kids when they were yet very young.
But it looks like that might not be happening as
much with young parents and with their children. Talk about that,
what does what does the survey show? Where the study
show about new parents or younger parents and how often

(20:43):
they read to their children.

Speaker 8 (20:45):
Yeah, so one interesting element from this Harpercollin survey was
that especially.

Speaker 9 (20:50):
Gen Z parents, which are some.

Speaker 8 (20:52):
Of our youngest parents now, are most likely to view
reading as a subject to learn rather than a fun activity.
They said that they didn't enjoy it, They didn't find
it enjoyable to read to their children. So there's one
element there, and a few of the researchers in this
piece had mentioned that there was really a shift in
the early two thousands towards more heavy testing, where reading,

(21:15):
instead of being seen as something to do for fun,
was instead seen as something that we were tested for.
But the other element that goes hand in hand hand
in this is that these parents are the first generation
of digital natives. So we really started to see this
shift towards technology and that became the new dopamine hit, right,

(21:36):
So it's something that's been more engaging.

Speaker 9 (21:39):
For parents that grew up during this era where they
enjoy being on.

Speaker 8 (21:44):
Their phone, and they pass on those different types of
habits as well.

Speaker 2 (21:48):
What about the illiteracy rate in this country? To begin with,
I know you noted that there are a lot of
experts who suspect the decline in early literacy reading is
likely much higher than we really think. Is it higher?
Do you feel is much more widespread than we'd like
to believe?

Speaker 10 (22:09):
Yeah?

Speaker 8 (22:09):
I actually wrote a story earlier this year looking at
how our new generation of young adults, especially between the
ages of sixteen to twenty four with high school diplomas,
are seeing some of the lowest literacy skills ever. And
again there's a big part of technology playing a hand
in this, of kids don't need to read and dissect

(22:32):
the information the way that they used to. Now you
can google information, now there's AI rather than you know,
having to pull out a book and synthesize and predict
and do all of those other things that build into literacy.
So we are seeing higher rates of functional literacy where
someone can read a sentence, can read basic texts, but

(22:52):
they aren't getting to that's the higher end of the
spectrum where they are able to synthesize reading.

Speaker 1 (22:58):
So we found out recently that the National what is it,
the Assessment of Educational Progress, the NAPE scores a shocking
sixty nine percent of fourth graders we're not reading at
grade level. And then we just had a recent op
ed that was published in the local paper here in
Utah identifying that only forty eight percent of third graders

(23:19):
here in Utah can read at a grade level. Can
you draw a line or correlate that with young people
that are not reading being read to very often when
they're young, and how that's becoming less of a it's
more work, as you said, than it is a joy
or something that's more of a pastime for young ones.

Speaker 8 (23:38):
Now, yeah, absolutely, I think when we're seeing these decreases
in what's happening before children are entering the school system
that also plays a part in those declining literacy rates.
As I had mentioned, a big predictor for future literacy
rates is a child's vocabulary when they are entering the
public school system.

Speaker 1 (23:57):
So if you're entering with.

Speaker 8 (23:59):
I think again that study said, do you'll have three
one hundred thousand more words.

Speaker 9 (24:03):
By the age of five if your parent is reading.

Speaker 8 (24:06):
Tea regularly, that's where you start to see those declines
and that shift in literacy. That a big part of
literacy is we adopt what our parents expose us to.
So if we're not seeing our parents.

Speaker 9 (24:19):
Doing it, we're not establishing this.

Speaker 8 (24:21):
Joy of reading. Children are entering classrooms not wanting to
do it again, viewing it as something as a subject,
something they have to do in school, something and they
have to work on, rather than something that they develop
through time as a skill.

Speaker 2 (24:35):
Let me ask you this, Jessica, you mentioned this, how
do we introduce or excite kids to feel the joy
of reading? Greg and I have been readers all our lives.
How do we reintroduce that that you don't read just
for the subject matter, but there is a certain amount
of joy in reading. And how do we get parents
to express that to their children, teachers to express that

(24:57):
to their students. I mean, how do we do this?

Speaker 11 (25:00):
Yeah, it really starts young.

Speaker 8 (25:02):
I mean I started this story with a young mother
in Kentucky who had described when she was in school
she didn't enjoy it. She always saw reading as a
school assignment. So when she had her child, she didn't
really understand the value of reading until she was working
at a family literacy program and an Adult Education Center,
and from there she learned the benefits of reading, how

(25:24):
it can improve school readiness, develop language skills, promote social
emotional growth. And from her getting that knowledge understanding the benefits,
then she realized, Yeah, this is something I want to
pass on to my child. So I think it first
starts on that parent level, having parents educated on the benefit.

Speaker 9 (25:42):
And something that was really interesting that I.

Speaker 8 (25:44):
Learned from these researchers is it doesn't have to be
chapter books. It doesn't have to be long books. You
don't even need to finish the book. But it's just
establishing that positive association before a student enters the school system.
If a child when they enter kindergarten and they pull
out a book, remembers.

Speaker 9 (26:02):
Oh, you know, I do that with mom all the time,
and it's a good time with mom.

Speaker 8 (26:06):
That positive association is what will develop those reading skills
later where they enjoy it and they don't necessarily only
view it as work.

Speaker 9 (26:15):
So I think that's where it really starts.

Speaker 8 (26:17):
Is at home parents being educated in the importance of reading,
being able to develop that positive association for a student
so when they do enter the public school system, they
can see reading as more than just something that you
have to do to pass class.

Speaker 2 (26:32):
Jessica, thank you for joining us. Greg and I want
to dig into this a little bit more in the
coming hour and we'll talk about what the governor is
proposing when it comes to third grade readers and the
level they should be at. We'll talk about that coming up.
Jessica Harkey, she is a staff reporter for a website
called The seventy four about the importance of reading to
your children, and that number has dropped significantly over the years.

(26:55):
You've shared stories with me about your mom reading to
you and all the books that you enjoy. I mentioned
the books that I love taking out of the library
and reading when I was a kid. The governor is
aware of this as well. Greg. As a matter of fact,
this op ed piece that was written for the DEAs
Red News share some numbers that are interesting. One out
of two children in the state of Utah cannot read proficiently.

(27:19):
One out of two.

Speaker 1 (27:20):
According to this op ed, that's a Utah number, not
a national number. And that's disturbing because if you aren't
reading at grade level at third grade, this is the
big crossroads. We were told. Third grade is your big crossroads.
If you're not reading at grade level at third grade,
will you should be in an individual education plan or
be in special education curriculum for the rest of your time.

(27:41):
Most of the kids that enter in third grade never
really escape it, and they throughout their whole K through
three through twelve experience, they're there because it makes sense.
You read to learn from third grade on all curriculums
kind of geared towards reading comprehension and what you're able
to comprehend through reading in the future grade. So if
you can't read a grade level, you are behind the

(28:03):
eight ball. And most kids that are in special ed
at third grade don't really get it. Statistically speaking, don't
get out when I see that statistic that only forty
eight percent of third graders are reading at a grade level,
I do not believe that fifty two percent are in
special ed. So that means they are. That you have
a significant number of Utah students who are falling between
the cracks, that are not being identified as not being

(28:25):
reading for fishing, are not being helped directly, and are
in big trouble. They're going to be in big trouble
going forward because there's no there's nothing in life that's
going to get better. If you can't read, if you're
not literate and you don't have the skill of reading comprehension,
you've got to have that. I never thought in my
days here in Utah that we would see numbers that bad.

Speaker 2 (28:47):
Yeah, neither near. I mean, here's some more. Starting in numbers,
there are what Utah has eight hundred and fifty two
public schools. Okay, the Utah State Board celebrated only sixty
schools that have chieved a reading rate of seventy percent,
So only sixty out of eight hundred and fifty two,
Greg reached a level of seventy percent of his students

(29:09):
reading proficiently.

Speaker 1 (29:11):
You know, I remember I went through the years where
we wanted to put grades on schools. We wanted to
grade them, and we wanted to say, look, you know
the number of kids that graduate, but to your point
of this reading proficiency, what's the percentage? Give these? And
I got so much political grief. You're it's a Scarlettle
letter on the school. You're going to stigmatize the school.
You're going to stigmatize people. How can you improve what

(29:31):
you don't measure? And that was the whole point with
school grading is that we wanted to be able to
understand as lawmakers. Just if you told me they're a
D in reading proficiency or a B or an A,
I would want to know what the ones that are
getting the good grade is a school? Well, how was
your best practice?

Speaker 2 (29:47):
What are they doing?

Speaker 1 (29:48):
And so we could be more more prescriptive in how
we could fund public education to address needs of kids.
There's no point, in my opinion, of going to school
if you're not learning how to read and comprehend what
you're reading. There's math or science, there's a lot of
the important criceuts.

Speaker 2 (30:03):
Those are important where they're not add them.

Speaker 1 (30:06):
We can't get to a lot of math, but most
science you can't get to if you can't read a textbook.
So I just I don't know how we can be
okay with this. And I think this is, you know,
public schools have really got to ramp it up, because
I believe that you're not seeing those those numbers get
better in the younger grades. I think there's something wrong
here in terms of how we're delivering education. And I

(30:28):
love that the governor doesn't want to socially promote kids
to the next grade just for breathing air. If they
can't read a third grade you stay in third grade
till you can, and then you keep going.

Speaker 12 (30:37):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (30:37):
Well, the governor yesterday as he unveiled his budget, talked
about the Mississippi miracle. Now here's the state. You think
of Mississippi and you go, okay. You know, they went
greg They were at the bottom year after year of
reading proficiency. The last several years, they've been ten or
above top ten in the past decade. That's pretty impressive. Now,

(30:58):
what did they do? They really emphasize reading. But one
thing they did very controversy, and that's what we want
to talk to our listeners about today. They had a
and the governor has admit that's not a popular idea,
but a retention policy basically that made students repeat the
third grade if they didn't pass a reading comprehension test. Yes,

(31:20):
I think is that the only way to solve this.

Speaker 1 (31:22):
I think that would create such a motivation with those kids,
because kids want to move on with their peers. They
don't want to be I remember fourth grade. Two kids
were held back in my class in fourth grade because
they weren't ready. They weren't ready for fifth grade. And
I think that when you see that as a kid,
you don't want to get held back. I mean, you
want to stay with your friends. I think you need

(31:43):
some sort of motivation for everybody involved, the parents, the students,
the teachers, the system to really move along. And the
way you motivate, I would say, is if you can't
just socially promote by doing nothing, if you're not ready,
it's actually unfair to those students to put them in
a more a fifth grade, a fourth grade, fifth grade
curricula level curriculum when they can't read, they can't write. Yeah,

(32:07):
you've just set them up for failure. You really have.
And so I and I don't believe that fifty two
percent of our Utah kids in third grade because for
only forty eight percent of reading at grade level. Again,
I don't believe fifty two percent of all these kids
are in special ed, don't. I don't believe it. So
that means some kids are being helped, others are falling
through the cracks, And I don't know how they're getting

(32:28):
their raise, but they're not they're not they're not there.

Speaker 2 (32:30):
Well, Mike, you know the thus I have on this,
Greg is there is a social stigma about staying behind right.
I mean, I don't know about you, but I wouldn't
want to have to stay back a year when my
buddies are all now in fifth grade because I can't
comprehend that's right. You know, that's there, so there, But
I don't know another way around it. I don't know, Greg,

(32:53):
And we've got great listeners. I know we have a
lot of teachers who listen to us questions I have.
Is there enough effort being put in the classroom today
in those critical grades one through three? About reading the
role of parents? How many of you moms and dads
out there are reading to your children at least two
or three times a week, if not every day. You
mentioned your mom, you you just had fun with your

(33:17):
mom because she would bring the book alive.

Speaker 1 (33:19):
She would you know, her voice, she would make the
animated voice and it sounds I'm telling you and to
our young moms and dads out there that are listening,
if you don't read to your kids, you get the
Sesame Street book. It's called Little Golden Book is a
publisher of it, but it's the Sesame Street Book. The
monster at the end of this book, starring lovable furry Olgrover.
It is a hilarious book. I'm telling you it's a

(33:42):
The book is a riot. It is fun to read.
I remember it as a little kid. I've read it
to my children. This is the book. If you don't
do it, you start with the monster at the end
of this book.

Speaker 2 (33:51):
Well, it's beautiful. This whole retention policy third grade is critical.
You've brought it up. We've had who was it State
Center in Miller Milner Milner Milner or Milner who said
on this air and you repeated it. One to three,
you learn to read, three and on you read to
learn correct And if you haven't got that down, you're
going to be held back. You will struggle.

Speaker 1 (34:12):
Yeah, and you want to and the grand scheme of
things you want to hold kids back that don't because
you don't want them to suffer through and not be
and be bluffing their way through it all. And the
social promotion. How do you fail someone and let them
move forward so they can't fail them? So they're giving
them grades that they haven't earned just to make sure
that they can move on. You're just robbing these kids

(34:34):
of basic life skills. So they've you've got to have
that standard.

Speaker 2 (34:38):
Well, and I wonder what methods are being used in
those early grades to teach kids how to read? I mean,
I was taught by phonics. My guess is you are
topt by phonics. Does phonics even exist in the schools anymore?
That was a real basic There has been a push
to bring phonics back to those levels. We to teach
kids to read.

Speaker 1 (34:55):
We have to. And I think that some of the
new curriculum not new, the curriculum that changed to the
Obama era and going forward, the critical math theory, all
this there's just different. It's some people call it Singapore math,
but it was kids were not learning their times tables
any longer. They never got to had to learn them.
I I don't I'm going to tell you I don't.

(35:16):
I think that has failed. I think that's why you
see these colleges, and we've covered this story at the
University of what California, San Diego. Their their college remedial
math courses are elementary and middle grade middle school grade
level curriculum because the kids are that far behind. I
think some of that you can attribute to the new

(35:36):
style of math that they try to teach, where they
were not having kids learn their time times tables and
things like that.

Speaker 2 (35:42):
Yeah. Well, the Wall Street Journal opinion they had not
bed peace today on this about how shameful it is
for this country that we've got kids going to college
like they do at UC San Diego and they have
to be given a remedial math what back to middle
school and even elementary even elementary school now. So there's
some challenges, but we want to open up the phones
to you tonight. The governor is suggesting maybe we follow

(36:04):
one of the tenants of the Mississippi Miracle that they
talk about and requiring kids to stay behind take another
year of third grade if they cannot pass a reading
comprehension test. Would you be supportive of that? I'm for it.
I don't know about you, Greg. I think both of
us are for it, are we not?

Speaker 1 (36:21):
Yeah? I I do. I think it's I think it's
a little tough love. But I'm telling you these numbers
should should be. I mean, I don't care how many
jobs the economy wants to bring to bear. If you're
not if you can't read at a at a if
you're not literate and you can't read at a certain level,
you're not going to be eligible for jobs in the future.
Our emerging workforce is completely crippled. If there's if they're
not reading proficient, they're not. I mean, it's just it

(36:43):
has to happen.

Speaker 12 (36:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (36:44):
Well, and over the years, Greg the emphasis on stale education. Yes,
but does that include reading that I think.

Speaker 1 (36:50):
They assume I say you, I think the science, technology, engineering, math, whatever.
I really think they assume the kids feel to read.
I mean it was such a it's such a found
day yep skill that you have to have that. I
don't think that was they thought they had to add
it to the acronym reading extream.

Speaker 2 (37:09):
That's stream there we go. All right, we want to
hear from you tonight on this idea that the governor
says Mississippi is used very successfully. Should we do it
here in the state of Utah eight eight eight five
seven o eight zero one zero triple eight five seven
o eight zero one zero on your cell phone dial
pound two fifteen and say hey Rod or leave us
a message on our talkback line by downloading the iHeartRadio app.

(37:30):
Are they ready took to read to learn? That's a question,
and that's what we're asking you. The governor says, maybe
we should follow the example of Mississippi. And hold kids
back in the third grade if they don't read professionally.
Let's get your thoughts on this. We go to the phones.
We begin in West Point with Merrily Merrilee. How are
you Welcome to the Rod and Gregg Show.

Speaker 13 (37:50):
Hi, Rod and Greg love your show.

Speaker 2 (37:52):
Thank you, thank you.

Speaker 11 (37:54):
Hey.

Speaker 13 (37:55):
I have a four year old grandson who is in
Challenger School. He goes twice a week week to preschool.
He's already reading entire books. Wow, how come they are
so successful with their program with phonics and our public
school system is failing so.

Speaker 2 (38:11):
Terribly good point.

Speaker 1 (38:13):
It really is a wonder Yeah, yeah, thank you for
sharing those those statistics. I think that's important for us
to contrast as we talked about this. Let's keep going.
Let's go to you want to go to ann As
Springville and thank you for holding Welcome to the Rod
and Greg Show.

Speaker 14 (38:29):
Hi, thank you, thanks for taking my call. I actually
was learning to read in third grade because I was
in a head Start program. However, when I got to
the third grade, we had a program where the fourth
graders came in to help the third graders, and then
when I got to fourth grade, I got to help
with the third graders. And it was incredibly successful. Helped
the fourth graders learn leadership, and there's just a whole

(38:52):
lot of things that went with that. And then the
third graders felt inspired and wanted to you know, that
peer connection that comrade read it was amazing and I
think that that was This is the East Coast that
I was on when I went to school, and I
mean our our schools went in. I mean, they're just
great programs, and I think that's a huge help. I'd

(39:13):
love to see a program like that happen in Utah
these kids.

Speaker 2 (39:17):
That's a great idea learning. That's a great idea, and
I've never heard of that, but that is a terrific idea, brilliant.

Speaker 1 (39:22):
The fourth graders get to be mentors to those third graders,
and and and everything that she just described sounds sounded
like a sense of urgency. It sounded like you got
we got to get this right, Like this isn't something
you could just blow off. I love that. That was
a great example. Let's go now to Sarah in American Fork. Sarah,
welcome to the Rod and Greg Show.

Speaker 11 (39:43):
Hi there, thanks for taking the call. So I'm a
teacher at a middle school and I'm seeing the result
of kids who've been socially progressed. I have middle schoolers
who cannot read. They cannot read, they can't not read
a basic text. There's zero comprehension. So one hundred percent,

(40:06):
we need to be keeping kids at a level where
they can accomplish the education that they need, whether it's reading,
whether it is those mass facts completely agree. The other
thing that I wanted to mention is we have such
an abundance of extra flus happening in schools right now

(40:28):
that there's no time to actually educate my children. For example,
we have a Grandparents' Day where we have to stop
educating so that grandparents can come in and sit with
their class in middle school and play a game in
or we have to yeah, dude, it's terrible. Or we

(40:51):
have to you know, send them down to have a
donut with their dad, or you know, a thirty minute assembly.
Every single week, we have two door decorating contests that
we're expected to participate in where we have to stop
educating so the kids can decorate the door for Christmas.

Speaker 1 (41:13):
I'm so sorry. This sounds torture to me.

Speaker 3 (41:15):
Sara.

Speaker 1 (41:16):
I asked you a question of those students that you
that you have that aren't able to read a grade level?
Do they have individual education plans? Are they on special ed?
The ones that you see that have fallen behind.

Speaker 11 (41:28):
So some of them do, but not all of them.

Speaker 1 (41:32):
That's what I always worried about. Lot don't.

Speaker 11 (41:36):
Yeah, so a lot of them don't. But I have
worked in a school where eighty percent of our population
had i EPs, and that's become a challenge too, because
when you have to, when you're making these accommodations, I
feel like for a lot of people, they tend to

(41:59):
try to over accommodate, which just prevents the kids from
actually achieving. They just keep building these little supports so
that the kids don't ever actually have to warn it.

Speaker 2 (42:15):
Yeah, yeah, I can see what you're saying. By the
way you pointed a finger at me when she brought
up grandparents.

Speaker 1 (42:20):
Because you're grandparents that you go to like seventy years.

Speaker 2 (42:23):
No, we do this in grade school, not in middle school,
so and maybe we don't need to do it in
grade school anymore either. All Right, we've got a lot
of calls, a lot of people lining up want a
weigh in on this. Please stay on the line or
call in We've got some lines open as well as
we talk about reading in Utah among our grade school kids.
Eight eight eight five seven o eight zero one zero
on your cell phone dial pound two fifty and say

(42:45):
hey Rod, or leave us a message on our talkback
line by downloading the iHeartRadio app. More coming up on
the Rod and Greg Show. Holding kids back in the
third grade if they don't read proficiently, and we're getting
your thoughts and calls on it. It's an idea. I think
you do too great.

Speaker 1 (43:01):
I do. I think you can. Actually, I think you
can motivate kids, parents and the whole system to really
step it up so they don't get held back. It
could be it can be a carrot, not just it's
not necessarily a stick. Let's go to uh. Let's go
to Steve, who's in West Valley. Steve, thank you for
holding Welcome to the Rotten Grig Show.

Speaker 15 (43:22):
Thanks brought our kid and citizen Hughes.

Speaker 2 (43:27):
Thank you.

Speaker 15 (43:28):
You're this is patriot Steve, All.

Speaker 1 (43:33):
Right, patriots.

Speaker 2 (43:38):
In on this man.

Speaker 15 (43:41):
So the no kid left behind, it's kind of like
that school system they had where they changed all the
stuff to get the programs. The government did it right.

Speaker 1 (43:54):
No child left behind? Yes, yep, yeah, and.

Speaker 15 (43:58):
Then they had program to not how their kids being jails.
What was that called.

Speaker 1 (44:07):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (44:08):
I don't know what that one was, Steve. You've got
us down Florida.

Speaker 15 (44:11):
Maybe they'd changed the laws and some other states Obama
did and so they could get the numbers up. Yeah,
but the no, the No Child Left Behind was a
government program design for their program, and the left us
all behind. I'm older, I'm the same age as you, Rob.

Speaker 1 (44:39):
I don't don't sell yourself short, patriot, Steve, You're not
that old, you you you didn't drive in a horse
and buggy. Don't say that. I'm just kidding.

Speaker 15 (44:47):
Sorry, Yeah, yeah, no, that's good. But I look at
it and I think No Kid Left Behind was just
a program to push push it a cross. But I
have a hard time with uh, I know kids, and
I know me. I I wasn't good at Matt.

Speaker 2 (45:12):
Yeah yeah, well you he enjoyed the crowd of Greg
and I. But we do love reading. We have loved reading. Yeah, yeah,
we like to read.

Speaker 1 (45:21):
And I think as far as getting held back, you know,
there's other options too, like summer school. You know, if
you can get you can get caught up for the
next grade by summer school. And then what kid wants
to lose their summer?

Speaker 14 (45:30):
Not me.

Speaker 1 (45:31):
They were both a huge incentives to, you know, to
get my act raight. Let's go to uh, let's go
to Terry and Harriman. Terry, welcome to the Riding Greg Show.

Speaker 7 (45:42):
Thanks for taking my call.

Speaker 16 (45:44):
So I have a son. He's fifteen. He's in the
ninth grade. He's been on an i EP since he started.
We held him back and didn't let him go to kindergarten.
A year he went to a special preschool for an
I e P. And he's still struggling. I think it's
all due to funding. They just want to use him

(46:04):
as a pond to get funding.

Speaker 1 (46:07):
You know, you're not the only one struggle, Terry, You're
not alone. I just want you to know that there
are a lot of kids that are on these IEPs
and kind of like the middle school teacher that called where,
some of those accommodations don't actually progress you out. They
actually make such accommodations it's almost a barrier. Yeah, we're
going to read it to you because you don't know
how to read, and they read the test to them
instead of letting them read because that's their accommodation. There's

(46:28):
just some some of those individual education plans I think
can be self limited.

Speaker 2 (46:35):
Yeah, back to the phones would go. Let's go to
Andy in Centerville tonight here on the Roding Greg Show.

Speaker 17 (46:39):
Hi Andy, Hi, thank you compliment brought our cat. You
address yourself so well and so professional. The best compliment
I can tell you is that families can listen to
your show, and I don't think there's other conservative shows
that is good at George because they could listen and dialogue. Opinion.

(47:01):
My opinion on the children is that it's all right
to hold them back maybe a year, but there could
be a social problem here because some of these children
are based in complete families or have that help.

Speaker 16 (47:15):
Now.

Speaker 17 (47:15):
I know there's other ways, and there have been a
lot of compliments and a lot of ideas here, but
we have to look at the social order too, not
just embarrassment or humiliation. Will that hold them back? That's
my opinion?

Speaker 2 (47:29):
Thanks well, thank you very much, Andy, and thank you
for the compliment. But there's a social stigma to that, Greg.

Speaker 1 (47:35):
Yeah, and I think that's what that could be, the carot,
not the stick. In other words, Yeah, it is daunting,
and you don't want to see the social consequence. You
have friends in your own grade, and so I think
the summer school option as well, could be one where
kids are really worried about families. Parents are really worried
about that, and it puts some I think, better emphasis

(47:55):
on our focus. Certainly we'd want that versus kids falling
through the cracks and not have these issues addressed at all.
And because social promotion can just be well, then why
work any harder? You know they're going to get moved
to the next grade. Why would you put the extra
effort in. I think that that consequence could hopefully avoid
any kind of those social stigmas, because I don't think

(48:15):
the social stigmas get easier if you are falling out
between the cracks and you're not up to up to
grade level with other kids.

Speaker 2 (48:22):
Are you more in favor of holding them back or
making them take summer school?

Speaker 1 (48:25):
Right, Well, if you can get it done in summer
school and you can test out, then in summer school.
If you can't and you're still behind you back.

Speaker 2 (48:32):
All right, Well, we got a lot of calls coming
in on this, so we invite you to join us
in our conversation tonight about reading in Utah eight eight
eight five seven eight zero one zero your cell phone
dial pound two fifty, or leave us a message on
our talk back line by downloading the iHeartRadio app. Of
holding kids back to the third grade if they don't
read proficiently an idea that I support. I think Greg

(48:54):
does as well. Either that or maybe some sort of
summer school program. I'm not sure which one would be better.

Speaker 1 (49:00):
I don't think it's I don't think it's either or.
I think you go summer school and if you can
get if you can test out and you're proficient by
the end of summer school, movie, you can move to
the next grade. But I think I do think it's
I do think that's better than being socially promoted but
not being able to read the curriculum that everyone that
others are what you're expected to read.

Speaker 2 (49:17):
Yeah, let's go to Jacob in Springville. He has some
thoughts on this tonight. Jacob, how are you welcome to
the Roden Gregg Show.

Speaker 18 (49:26):
Thanks for having me on, Guys. I think the problem
is bigger than this. I think the problem is that
education is socialized. I think if we privatize education, that
these problems would go away. We in socialized education, it's
all about equality. It's one size fits all and every kid,

(49:50):
every kid who struggles to read. The problems are. There
are thousands of variables, thousands of reasons why kids kids struggle,
and it needs to be indivi dualized. And socialism says
that everything needs to be equal, everything needs to be
the same, and it's it's it just needs to be

(50:10):
individualized rather than socialized.

Speaker 2 (50:13):
Well, Jacob Blin hasn't always been that way in education
for quite a long time. That you don't want kids
who are better achievers to get ahead of kids who
maybe struggle a little bit, they're all the same, hasn't
been going on for quite some time, Jacob.

Speaker 18 (50:24):
Well, yes, and that's the issue is we're also it's
the same thing. We are holding back our brilliant students
because we're giving them the same and we're not individualizing
their education either. It goes both ways on that.

Speaker 2 (50:42):
Yeah, it's not challenging to them all right, thank you.

Speaker 1 (50:45):
Jacob's point. One of our colors has a child or
grandchild that's going to Challenger, which is a private school,
and saying they're ahead, they're above grade level. So there's
there is a good argument for that. Okay, let's go
to Bobby and Harriman. Bobby, thank you for calling the
Rodd and Gregg show.

Speaker 19 (51:02):
I I one hundred percent agree with Jacob or Jake
whatever his name was, Cruise Color. I have a grandson
who's seventh grade now. Four years ago, his mom pulled
him out of public school for a couple different reasons,
but he was really struggling. Turns out we discovered through

(51:23):
the homeschooling process that he's dyslexic, and so we were
trying to deal with that. And then just this last year,
I took him to a hockey game last year and
asked him to read me something on the overhead screen
and he's like, I can't read it. And I was like,
you can't read it, And so I asked his mom,
you need to go have his eyes checked. And you know,

(51:43):
because he also squints was watching when he was watching television,
and his eyes are perfect, except that because his dyslexia
is so severe, screens are pixelated to him. And so
part of the problem with public education is everything on
screens anymore. Yeah, and so they you know, if you

(52:04):
have a problem like that, there's nothing, there's no options
for them.

Speaker 2 (52:09):
Yeah, I didn't know that. I hadn't heard that.

Speaker 1 (52:12):
I will tell you that's where the that's where the
U tough. It's all scholarship and the students. That where
you can get individualized education backpack funding. Uh, that's that's
going to be a bigger and bigger deal for for
reasons that we just heard described for that studient.

Speaker 2 (52:26):
All right, we've got a lot more to get to.
We do have some calls and we will get to
those after we get your news update. If you'd like
to hang on, Plus, we'd like to share some of
our talkback comments coming up with well stay with us,
hit in the Rod and great shows on talk radio
one oh five nine an r s. Okay, that didn't
come out quite right. You guys there, you're a bunch

(52:50):
of kids. We would you like to carry.

Speaker 1 (52:54):
On the preset like we'd like the number two be
the podcast. We don't want you to make number two
Rod does, but I don't. Oh my goodness, that.

Speaker 2 (53:06):
Shore we go to the phones if we can, If
we can.

Speaker 19 (53:11):
We shouldn't have to put up with this kind of stuff.

Speaker 1 (53:13):
Yeah, this is a serious topic. We don't need your sophomore.

Speaker 2 (53:16):
So I make I make one mistake in fifty five
years of broadcast, and you're going to rub it in
my face.

Speaker 1 (53:21):
I want to talk to Robert, Robert trying to bring
us some Let's go to Robert some truth.

Speaker 2 (53:26):
Robert bail us out on this one.

Speaker 7 (53:27):
Things for joining us, Robert, Yeah, I just wanted to
bring up the point that I can't hadn't really occurred
it yet. But my mom taught me to read. You know,
I would never claim in a million years that I
learned to read at school. My mom did it all
the work, She spent the time with me, She did
all the reading with me. And then in my case,

(53:49):
my wife has taught my kids to read, and so
I almost think it's an indictment of the parents more
than anything.

Speaker 2 (53:59):
Robert, did she teach you to just sound out the words,
sound out the the the alphabet, and apply that when
you read. Is that how she taught you? Do you remember?

Speaker 3 (54:08):
Yeah?

Speaker 7 (54:09):
Yeah, just the you know, learning account, learning the letters
and then learning the sounds. And then you know, she's
the one that spent all the hours with me with
the book. It wasn't it wasn't teachers or teachers aides.
It was it was my parents. Yeah, well specifically my mom.

Speaker 1 (54:25):
Yeah all right, but you know what that that that
absolutely comports with our interview in the first hour where
the story that they she said, is that the parents
were reading to their children less now than before. And
I am telling you that that the reading to children
is part of reading comprehension. Children that can recognize letters, numbers,
you know, colors those are that's that that's called the

(54:46):
Peabody Picture Vocabulary Test, and that that informs their literacy.
Loom forward. How many of those letters, colors, numbers they
can recognize and how do you recognize it reading to
your kids? Okay, let's go to Clayton and Orum Clayton,
thank you for holding. Welcome the Running Greg Show.

Speaker 7 (55:02):
Hey love your show.

Speaker 12 (55:05):
I think the system is a little bit out of whack,
and I think kids need to have the opportunity to learn,
and then once they've learned it, then they progress and
it doesn't matter what grade they're in per se. And
what will happen is kids who aren't learning will all

(55:26):
of a sudden be staying in the first grade for
a year or more, and their friends will be moving
on and they'll go wait a minute. I have to learn,
and then they'll be incentivized to learn and move forward
so that they can stay with their friends.

Speaker 1 (55:44):
Clayton, I tell you I totally agree. I so my
mother read to me. But I tell you that I
I avoided f's because I didn't want to fail, and
what failing meant was I was going to get stuck
back in. So now I was not going to fail.
There was no way.

Speaker 2 (55:56):
Yeah, you don't want to get stuck back the way.

Speaker 1 (55:58):
We had a collar that was way, I guess, way
too long. But you wanted to point out that attendance
in school. Know the challenge right now. And I've heard
this from lawmakers too, that we've got an absenteeism amongst
our students that is becoming a bigger problem too. That's
growing for reasons I'm not sure, but absenteeism seems to
be one of those bigger issues.

Speaker 2 (56:17):
Well, I want to go to We've got some calls,
but I want to go to our talkback line because
we've had we have had a number of listeners leave
a comment on our talkback line. Let's listen in.

Speaker 20 (56:27):
My wife is an elementary school teacher with over twenty
years of experience. Three years ago, the state took away
the reading specialists who provided one on one time with
challenged students. English is a second language. Students are increasing
in number. Parents need to get their children to school.
Absenteeism is out of hand. Schools need to return conduct,

(56:50):
discipline enforcement to the classroom. Yes, and parents need to
step up to accountability.

Speaker 2 (56:57):
Interesting comments. I think he he hit a home run
on every one of those, didn't he, Greg? I mean,
they're all very, very important, and you brought up and
as you know, absenteeism is up. Since the pandemic, absentee
levels have remained relatively high.

Speaker 1 (57:11):
Yeah. So someone just sent one of our smart listeners
sent a graph they had access to the data. We're
looking at about fittrom twenty fifteen to twenty nineteen. It's
in the eleven, twelve, thirteen, fourteen percent. Actually right before
COVID nine percent, twenty four percent now wow post COVID really, yeah,
twenty four percent twenty three point eight percent. Absenteeism got

(57:33):
to get them to school.

Speaker 12 (57:33):
Guess what?

Speaker 1 (57:34):
Graduation rates don't change? In fact, graduation rates went up.

Speaker 2 (57:37):
How's that happen?

Speaker 1 (57:38):
How's graduation rates going up with absenteeism going up at
the same time. That's that social promotion. I'm afraid. But
I think the English is the second language students and
the number of them, and it's not all the same language,
that's a different language that is posing an incredible challenge
I think inside the classrooms as well.

Speaker 2 (57:53):
All over the country, not only here in Utah. We
go to Orum and listen into his see what Jeremy
has to say tonight on the routing Gregg Showy, Jeremy.

Speaker 15 (58:02):
Hi Rod and Greg.

Speaker 21 (58:03):
The point I wanted to make is that we have
a government monopoly here and the government monopoly is failing
at its job. If this is a private sector, the
schools would be fired and we'd fire somebody else to
do their jobs. But we don't have real school choice
here in Utah. But what's worse than that is the
schools and the teachers that are represented by the UEA,
which is literally one of the most radical left wing

(58:25):
organizations in all of Utah, pushing DEI anti I. I mean,
we have all these issues.

Speaker 15 (58:33):
I'm in.

Speaker 21 (58:35):
The schools around us all the time. Shelley Elementary told
one of the parents, Hey, yeah, we talked about kids
transitioning in your class today, it's your kids. Make sure
they're using the proper pronouns. At Lehigh, they had the
teacher telling the people, oh, you know more than your
parents who support Trump and don't believe in climate change,
Like why are we supporting this?

Speaker 2 (58:55):
Good question, Jeremy. If it's going on in schools, you
as parents have a right to speak out and say
stop it. And I hope Greg with changes as they
take away the Education Department and they're trying to just
get rid of it more control coming back to the States,
I hope Utah wakes up and takes advantage of that.

Speaker 1 (59:12):
Yes, that I think that the waivers that you would
ask for, federal waivers, that's a traditional way to get
out from underneath these mandates that don't fit our schools
or our communities. But then I think that the block
granting would be a great thing because I have a
lot more faith in the people on the ground than
I think. You're a Washington do it. But the school
choice are you tough fits all scholarship? That is a

(59:33):
growing scholarship. That is school choice that I would like
to see grow as well. And I think the demand
is skyhein. And I think it's going to grow, especially
with these these tough numbers coming out of schools about
rereading proficiency. This is a big alarm.

Speaker 2 (59:46):
It's an issue. All right, let's go back to our
talk back line here another comment.

Speaker 22 (59:50):
The grade school system is antiquated. Why don't we just
have a group of eight of similarly aged people, kids
moved through their education process together. And if someone needs
a focus on math, someone needs to focus on spelling.

Speaker 18 (01:00:11):
Okay, that's handled.

Speaker 1 (01:00:14):
But there's no stigma involved. Yeah makes a point, Yeah, yeah,
it does. I remember the one that going back, you know,
go back to the future. Remember the one school, one
room schoolhouse. Those weren't all the same kids as we grade.
They weren't.

Speaker 2 (01:00:30):
They weren't. But you don't one one thing, Grey. I
was thinking of this when I worked at another broadcast company.
We were given days to go in a couple hours
a day to go into a school and help kids read.
And I like that idea. I mean, it's a great
service you can provide to your community. And I love
that idea. It was fun.

Speaker 1 (01:00:48):
So you have that, you have you have our caller
that called earlier, that said the fourth when she was
in fourth grade, they could go and help teach the
third graders. That teaches leadership with the fourth graders helps
the third graders. I think that's a great a solution.
The Mississippi Miracle includes reading coaches, yes, who go to
the schools and make sure that there are children that
are falling behind that they can coach those students as well.

(01:01:10):
So and they do hold them back if they're not
reading proficient, but they had Mississippi put money for reading
coaches for schools to help those identify those students and
really get them up to green grade level so they
weren't held back.

Speaker 2 (01:01:23):
How gratifying would that be if you're a if you're
a teaching coach or a reading coach, go in and
work with a kid who's struggling and then one day
they get it, they passed that test. The comprehention is there.
How gratifying must that be?

Speaker 10 (01:01:36):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:01:36):
And I you know it can't be a cost prohibitive
because in all the years that I served, when you
did the fifty state ranking, Utah always came low because
we have so many kids with the taxpayer, but Mississippi
was always lower. We were always the forty ninth, not
the fiftieth or the forty eighth, not the fiftieth because
Mississippi was behind us. So their funding has always been
a challenge in Mississippi. But look at what they've done

(01:01:57):
with the resources they have. They've really done something spectacular.
And that is life in public policy. Look finding best
practices and trying to do them all.

Speaker 2 (01:02:05):
Right, Well, Steve Moore has agreed to hold off. He's
going to join us after this break as we talk
about the economy and the question of affordability. That's all
coming up on the Rowden greg Show and Talk Radio
one oh five, Die Kay and Arrests. We appreciate Steve
he's agreed to push back our interview because we want
to get more your thoughts on reading here in the
state of Utah. Steve Great, have you back on the show.

(01:02:26):
The White House announced today that the President is about
to go on an affordability tour. He'll begin in Pennsylvania
in the coming day. Steve Great, have you back on
As I mentioned, what would you like to hear the president?
What do you think he should tell the American people
about this issue of affordability.

Speaker 3 (01:02:42):
Well, first of all, I mean, I don't know if
the President is to say this, but I'm going to
say it. I think a lot of this affordability crisis
is just a mess. I mean, if you look at
the official statistics, people's incomes are up already this year
by twelve hundred dollars above inflation. So that doesn't In
other words, things are more affordable today. Now some things
are less affordable. Housing is less affordable, healthcare is less affordable.

(01:03:05):
But look at gas prices, look at uh you know,
the prices of uh of you know, apartment I mean
like you know, rental and things like that. So I
think that uh, Trump should basically be emphasizing the things
that are falling in price. You know, normally we look
at when we measure affordability, we look at the gas price.

(01:03:25):
But they're not doing that. The media isn't doing that
now why because the gas price is low. So uh
So that's the main thing.

Speaker 11 (01:03:32):
I mean.

Speaker 3 (01:03:32):
Look, Trump is, as we learn from from uh Bill Clinton,
sometimes the best thing to do is say I feel
your pain, right, and so we will we will see
whether Trump can pull that off. But oh, one other thing,
if I mean about this, you know, if you looked
at the numbers of the spending numbers, the consumer spending numbers.

Speaker 2 (01:03:53):
Yeah, yeah, they're spending off the charge we have.

Speaker 3 (01:03:57):
Yeah, way up, way up. I mean the best uh
you know, Black Friday ever in terms of retail sales
and online sales. So does that sound to you like
people have an affordability crisis when they're spending that much money?

Speaker 1 (01:04:08):
Okay, So, Steve, I'm with you, right, brother, I really am.
But here's here's my There's two you real, I am.
I'm just for having a moment. I'm going to share
with you my hesitation. But first, first, I just remember,
I just I requote just a little bit because I
remember when Thomas Friedman was telling every telling all of

(01:04:29):
America that every economic indicator showed how great the Bidenomics
was and we were just not smart enough to appreciate it.
And I'd never want to fall into that rhetoric. Okay,
that's the first one.

Speaker 18 (01:04:38):
I agree with you.

Speaker 3 (01:04:39):
There's one difference between hold on. Yeah, there's one difference
when Friedman was doing it and now that I'm doing it.
And the difference is Tom Friedman was lying and I'm not.

Speaker 2 (01:04:51):
Pretty good.

Speaker 1 (01:04:52):
Okay, But that brings me to my second point. So
Queen Bee, my wife, if she's telling me that she
is sick and tired of paying for groceries, and she
takes her to Hi.

Speaker 14 (01:05:00):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:05:00):
I don't have the guts to say, you know what,
my pal Steven says, you're full of it. You have
no idea what you're talking about. I can't say that, Steve.
What do I say?

Speaker 14 (01:05:08):
You know this?

Speaker 3 (01:05:09):
You know who says that to me? My wife?

Speaker 11 (01:05:12):
Like, what are you talking about?

Speaker 3 (01:05:14):
You bought a stake lightly. Look and this is it
is true that, you know, coffee prices are up, beef
prices are up. But when you look at all of
the things that people buy, the official you know, consumer
price index numbers are still you know, close to two
and a half to three percent. Now that's still a
little too high. Here's the I think I made this

(01:05:36):
point last week on your show, but I want to
make it again. If you're angry like your wife is
and my wife is, about the high price of groceries
and other things that you buy, don't blame Donald Trump.
I mean, almost ninety percent of that increase in price
happened under Joe Biden. So that's this is the lingering
effect of Joe Biden in his four trillion dollar spending spree, Steve.

Speaker 2 (01:05:59):
Let me ask you this question. Question. You know, we
have praised the president for doing an excellent job on
controlling the border. I mean, the changes that have been
made on the border have been amazing. And is what
ten or eleven months in office, is it harder to
change and get the economy going than it is to
shutting down the border. My guess is your answer is
going to be yes, And if so, why.

Speaker 3 (01:06:20):
Well, first of all, I think the I mean, I
just want to say this loud and clear. We have
a very healthy economy right now. I mean, we have
seven million job openings, We've got capital from the rest
of the world, and the trillions of dollars flowing in
the United States. Gas prices are now nationally below three
dollars a gallon. You've got the NASDAK, the S and

(01:06:40):
P five hundred, and the Dow Jones a record highs.
I mean, does that.

Speaker 1 (01:06:44):
Sound like an alien economy to you?

Speaker 3 (01:06:47):
So I just reject this idea. And in fact, I'm
super bullish, as I said last week on your show,
but I'll say it again, I'm super bullish. Twenty twenty
six people come up to me and say, well, where's
that beautiful tax cut I was supposed to get, and
I said, well, you haven't gotten there yet. You're going
to start getting it in January when you in your
when you have less money with help from your paycheck

(01:07:08):
thanks to the Donald J. Trump.

Speaker 1 (01:07:10):
Uh, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:07:11):
And by the way, people are going to start to
see the effects of the no tax on tips, the
no tax on overtime, all that stuff kicks in next year.

Speaker 1 (01:07:18):
So I have to go and you're you're I have
to tell you that the Unleashed Prosperity hotline, of which
I am a subscriber and I like to read every day.
Number one here, No, there's no, but nobody, no.

Speaker 3 (01:07:29):
I want.

Speaker 1 (01:07:30):
I want to highlight the number one point, and that
is the rebates of tariffs, even when they come, should
go by way of a payroll tax. You make the
est observation that if you're going to rebate anything, it
is not the supply side, it's the demand side. Put
the money in the consumer's pockets. Maybe share with our
listeners what you mean by that, because I think it's
I love this, I love this well.

Speaker 3 (01:07:52):
You know who My co author on that piece was
right Orser Laugher, Arthur B. Laffer you know, the best
economists in the world. So uh, I'm more to thrill
that is, to be able to co author a piece
with Laffer. But our idea was, we don't like the
idea of the government just sending checks to people that
never works and the fact that we're just making inflation worse.
Much better thing to do is provide a temporary reduction

(01:08:15):
in the payroll tax two and a half percent less
paid by the employer and two and a half percent
less paid by the employee. People would see that in
their paycheck and employers would now be able to hire
more workers because the cost of hiring a worker would
be less. So that's our idea. And boy, you know,
Trump heard about this and he likes it, so we'll

(01:08:35):
see if he puts it in place. But it's never
a good idea for the government to just write checks
to people and instantly, did you see the other thing
in our hotline was the fraud in these programs. It's unbelievable.
I mean, there's twenty one states that refuse to comply
with the federal government's foods to say, did the people
get who are getting food stamps? Are they eligible for it?

(01:08:57):
Twenty one states won't. And guess what, they're all Blue
states refused to comply with the federal mandates. So they're
letting all these people get free food from the federal government.
It's a dumb program. The federal government pays one hundred
percent of the cost. So a lot of these blue
states say, oh, let's just sign up every for for
free food because the federal taxpayer is going to pay
for it. So and the same thing with Obamacare. I mean,

(01:09:19):
look at how many you know, ultimple people are getting Obamacare.

Speaker 2 (01:09:23):
Yeah crazy, Steve that the President during his cabinet meeting
the other day floated this idea of someday getting away
with the income tax. Tell me that's not a pipe dream, Steve.

Speaker 3 (01:09:34):
You know, I love That's one thing I love about
Trump is he's a big thinker and he loves big ideas,
you know. And I just say, I mean, I really
mean that. I mean it's really cool. I mean, I've
spent half my life arguing for getting rid of the
income tax, and then the President says he's going to
wants to do it. And I will just remind I'm
going to give you guys and your listeners a little
history lesson here, which you know, for the first one

(01:09:56):
hundred and twenty five years or so of our country,
we did not have an income tax.

Speaker 12 (01:10:00):
Did you know that?

Speaker 2 (01:10:01):
Yes, we knew that, and we.

Speaker 3 (01:10:03):
Were able to pay the bills and uh. And you
know where we got a lot of the revenues from.

Speaker 2 (01:10:08):
Well, no where, tariffs, teriffs.

Speaker 1 (01:10:12):
There we go. War is in an advocate for teriffs.

Speaker 3 (01:10:18):
Here we go.

Speaker 6 (01:10:18):
I know around.

Speaker 15 (01:10:20):
I just learned it.

Speaker 3 (01:10:21):
If we could use I'm saying, if we could use
the tariff revenue to eliminate the income text, I don't know.
I think you're going to have to beat the pide
breaking road on this one. I say, let's do it.

Speaker 2 (01:10:33):
Let's just do it. That's right. Steve Moore joined us
on our news Maker line talking about the economy. He
was wound up today, man, Yeah, he was good. He
was waiting for you to drop a bomb on him.

Speaker 1 (01:10:42):
Well, he thought I was gonna when I said, but
I agree with him. I think the economic signs are
looking good. But again, I don't tell my wife that
things are going in the street out here because she's
still upset at the grocery stores.

Speaker 2 (01:10:55):
So we're still paying all right, final half hour the
Rod and Greg Show coming your way on Talk Radio
one oh five nine kN rs. Well, what about the
the Trump coalition? He has done some amazing things in
the Republican Party. But I guess the question is, Greg overall,
what is the future of the new GOP with that coalition?

Speaker 1 (01:11:15):
Yeah, let's I think this is an interesting discussion. I'm
looking forward to having it because if you're a big ten,
you can't no no party or candidates going to win
with just their base alone. You have you have to
have a crossing heal as they say, it takes addition.
So what does that look like in twenty twenty five
going into twenty six.

Speaker 2 (01:11:32):
Well, director of polling for the Manhattan Institute, Jesse arm
has just done a survey on that. Jesse, thanks for
joining us tonight. What have you found out about this
new GOP coalition?

Speaker 10 (01:11:42):
Yeah, so a lot of people have been talking about
this in recent weeks. What is the American Right, what
is MAGA and what are the fractures within today's GOP
and will President Trump's coalition remain cohesive once he egs
the stage. So in order to answer that, we went
ahead at the manhatt Institute and conducted one of the
most exhaustive surveys to date of emerging multi ethnic working

(01:12:06):
class GOP. We asked something like three thousand voters, including
large over samples of black and Hispanic Republicans who are
new to the Trump coalition in twenty twenty four about yes,
a wide range of policy issues, but also how they
feel about identity politics, populism, a lot of so called
conspiracy theories, and even kind of going there on questions

(01:12:28):
relating to anti Semitism and other forms of racial bias.
And what we found are two diverging camps with a
distinct ideology. In each You've got a majority group of
what we call core Republicans, people who have backed the
party for years, are consistently conservative on questions of economics,
form policy, social issues, and they take a more favorable

(01:12:52):
view of places like Israel and are much more hawkish
on China and on transgender and dei issues. There is
this sizable minorities which now constitutes almost close to a
third of the party, and their new entrance, they look
markedly different. They're younger, they're more racially diverse, they're more
likely to have voted for Democratic candidates in the very

(01:13:15):
recent past, and they are much more likely, often substantially
more likely to hold progressive views across nearly every policy domain.
That includes economic policies, being more favorable towards China, more
critical of Israel, and they're even more liberal on everything
from migration to DEI initiatives. So there's a significant chunk

(01:13:36):
also within that group that report openly racist or anti
Semitic views or expressed a pensions for or an openness
toward political violence, and yet they overwhelmingly identify as Republicans
today and voted for Donald Trump in twenty twenty four.

Speaker 1 (01:13:51):
Hey, is that the gen X crowd that you're talking
about in terms of that young, that emerging maybe new
group supporting Trump, is that it can we categorize that
by age?

Speaker 10 (01:14:02):
I think it's a mix. I think the group that
we saw and kind of brought together was both this
younger group, meaning Okay, so you've got first time GOP
presidential voters, but that also includes those who supported Democrats
in twenty sixteen or twenty twenty, or who were too
young to vote in cycles before twenty twenty, So you've
got a little bit of a mix of each. When

(01:14:23):
you're thinking about the two instant group to the UOP.

Speaker 1 (01:14:26):
So then my question is, if they're more progressive maybe
on social issues and things, what was the lynchpin did
you identify that made them come across and vote for
Donald Trump.

Speaker 10 (01:14:37):
I think they're different ones for all of them, right,
So in some cases it's the conspiratorial factor. These are
people who are a lot more likely to believe kind
of out their ideas about I don't know, the Holocaust,
nine to eleven, vaccines, a whole host of issues which
you have often been called conspiracy series or a so

(01:14:59):
called conspiracy theories people in your audience. By myself, you know,
I might have different perspectives on things like this, but
a general kind of pension for ideas that are on
the outer streams of both political movements is what attracts
some of these people into the fold. People who don't
sit cleanly into any given ideological box, people who are

(01:15:22):
hard to pin down on the traditional political map, sound
a home in the Republican Party under Donald Trump when
they were stacked against Kamala Harris as their other choice
in twenty twenty four. Will that remain true with a JD.
Vance or Ted Cruise or a Marco Rubio on the
top of the Republican ticket in twenty twenty eight. I

(01:15:42):
think it's way too soon to tell, but I think
we also have a decent amount of evidence that that's
probably not.

Speaker 2 (01:15:47):
The case, Jesse. Was it Donald Trump who attracted this
new generation of Republicans or was it Donald Trump's policies
that attracted them? Any idea.

Speaker 10 (01:16:00):
My guess is that it is Donald Trump in that
Donald Trump brings with him a certain flexibility around policies.
Trump is creative in terms of who he's willing to
bring into his coalition, and he isn't afraid to change
his mind on a given policy endeavor. He is hard charging,

(01:16:21):
in a hardcore on the crime and policing issue this
time around. But in his first term, one of his
signature legislative achievements with Congress was the First Step Back,
which was a pretty substantial piece of criminal justice reform.
The politics of the Trump coalition changed over the course
of the last eight years, and the issues in which
he emphasizes have changed too. Donald Trump ran for the

(01:16:45):
presidency on more than one occasion on what could be
articulated as a more isolationist platform with respect to foreign policy.
But now that Trump is in the Oval office. It's
unfair to call him an isolationist. He's somebody who is
very whether it's to the Mullahs in Tehran or the
drug boats off the coast of Venezuela in the United States,

(01:17:07):
that if you screw around with America, you're going to
find out. So I think that to some extent, Trump's
flexibility in maintaining his coalition has been an attractive factor
for a lot of these voters.

Speaker 1 (01:17:18):
Now I would have said before looking at your survey,
what Donald Trump's attraction was, because no one can win
an election without crossing. You have to have yet, you
can't win with just a base. You have to have
a cross appeal. Reagan, they called them Reagan Democrats. They
didn't call them Republicans because they voted for Reagan. They
called them Reagan Democrats. I would categorize them as the
everyday working class. I would think that that Donald Trump

(01:17:39):
did the same. I think there was a unique draw
to Americans who may not like politics and not trust politicians,
who found the brand of Donald Trump to be different.
And I compare that to the Reagan Democrats when Reagan
won forty nine and fifty states. Is that a real
demographic or is that just a figment of my imagination
because I would have said, that's your big coalition? Are

(01:18:01):
the everyday Americans that don't really fit into a political
party's platform.

Speaker 10 (01:18:06):
Yeah, that's a really sharp point of analysis. So I
think to some extent, you could make the argument that
the MAGA Coalition meant saying goodbye to some Reagan Democrats.
It meant saying goodbye to some of the suburban, college
educated soccer moms who may be loaded for the GOP

(01:18:27):
for Mitt Romney or John McCain. But Trump brought his
with his political program a new coalition, the MAGA Coalition,
which did prove potent and successful. But I think what
we're beginning to see in mis polling data and in
others that have come to the floor is that it

(01:18:48):
may not be a coalition that is easily portable to
the next standard bearer for the party, which is ultimately
what we saw with Ronald Reagan and George Bush.

Speaker 2 (01:18:59):
Senior arm from the Manhattan Institute. Right here on the
Rod and Greg Show and Talk Radio one oh five nine,
kayn ter s, I have got a mic drop moment
for you. Okay, this is from Treasury Secretary Besson. Kay,
he was on the New York Times Forum yesterday and
he went right after the Besson for what he called
missing the biggest scandal ever.

Speaker 23 (01:19:19):
You had what was the greatest, one of the greatest
scandals of all time, that the coverage of the Biden administration,
Joe Biden's diminished capacity and the cover up. And that's
why there to raise these questions, where was the New
York Times. We just had a three hour cabinet meeting yesterday, Andrew,
for ten months the Biden administration did not have a

(01:19:41):
cabinet meeting. How are you going to invoke the twenty
fifth Amendment if the cabinet secretaries never see the president,
which they didn't that I hear from people in the
Treasury Building, then I see President Trump more in a day.
Then my predecessor saw Joe Biden and.

Speaker 2 (01:20:00):
He said this at the New York Times book event,
looking right at him and saying, you guys, drop the
ball on this one. And now you're raising questions about
Donald Trump. You know what kind of credibility is.

Speaker 1 (01:20:10):
Terry Besson has to be probably one of the most
dangerous for the Democrats and the leftists because he has
such a hand on the you know, as Treasury secretary.
There's so much good he can do that the leftists hate,
but his demeanor, his his knowledge and then his demeanor.
It's just so hard. They can't. They can't, they can't
demonize him like they do hegsas or others.

Speaker 2 (01:20:28):
He said one thing I think he taught at Yale,
and he says, my students bring the opinions. I bring
them facts kind of like me, kind of I don't
have opinions. I just know you just have facts. Yeah, right,
all right, that does for us tonight, head up, shoulders back. Hey, God,
bless you and your family in this great country of ours.
It is thank Rondin Gray gets Friday. Join us tomorrow,

(01:20:50):
starting it for it. We'll talk to you then

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