Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
And we do have our phone lines open to you
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(00:20):
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(00:41):
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that initial get to know you appointment at COSS Financial.
It's going to be complementary too. You telephone number six
(01:01):
oh eight four four two five, six three seven and
joining us this morning from Klass Financial R CJ class
and Eric Schwartz CJ. How you doing this week? I'm
doing great.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
How are you, Sean?
Speaker 1 (01:11):
I'm doing absolutely fantastic. Eric, how have you been?
Speaker 3 (01:16):
You know, Sean, I'm doing all right. I'm a little
cold today. I just have to complain a little bit.
Speaker 1 (01:21):
I think you're I think you're I think you're well
supported in that because I'm the same way and i'm
and I'm a thicker guy, and even I get chilly
in this stuff. I can't imagine for you guys, get that,
get that little little chill and it just doesn't go away.
So nice thing is about we talk about retirement planning.
If you don't like this type of weather, you've got options,
(01:42):
And it's all about the importance of planning. And speaking
of the importance of planning and kind of understanding retirement planning,
We're going to talk this week about something called r mds,
Retired required minimum distributions, What exactly they are, why they
are something you need to be aware of, and the
effect that they can have. Will get to that conversation
with Cjen Eric in just a moment in the meantime,
(02:03):
if you've got a question, love to get you on
the air six eight three two one thirteen ten. That's
six eight three two one thirteen ten. Now the really
cool feature of the program, it's the Class Quiz Question
the week your chance to win a fantastic prize from
our friends at Class Financial. This week got a great
opportunity to win a twenty five dollars gift card to
Jersey Mike's. Little tip listen closely to the program because
just about every show, the question answer comes up during
(02:25):
the program, and we'll tell you a little bit later
on in the program in detail how you can win
that twenty five dollars gift card to Jersey mar Mike's.
And before we start this week's topic and conversation, let's
actually go back to last week's show, actually two weeks
ago show a couple of weeks back. I guess be
the better way to say it. Let's get the question
and answer there as well.
Speaker 3 (02:43):
Eric, Absolutely, it's it's been a little while, but we
covered Medicare in long term care coverage. So our question
from a couple of weeks ago was true or false,
Medicare will cover all associated expenses with long term care.
The answer was false, and our winner last week was
(03:04):
Olivia from Wanakee. So thank you for listening.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
A lot of vowels and Olivia from Wanakey of wan
Key as well. Just an observation and that congratulations Olivia
and you two can be like Olivia. I just listened
closely to the program. We'll tell you how you can
win a little bit later on in the show. Speaking
of the show from a couple of weeks ago, it
was an in depth, fantastic conversation donever. You can always
(03:27):
listen back at class financial dot com. That's Closs Klaas
Financial dot com checking the calendar. Yeah, we're are about
a month, four weeks away from twenty twenty six. We've
just got a couple of weeks, a few weeks left
here in twenty twenty five. CJ. What should we know
about our mds and what needs to be needs to
(03:48):
be understood here?
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Well, Sean, I'm still laughing about the there's a lot
of vowels and Olivia from Wanakee. But that's an interesting observation,
I nerdy observation.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Actually, yeah, that's all I get paid.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
Okay, got it?
Speaker 1 (04:04):
Got it all right?
Speaker 2 (04:06):
Well, yes, So we are talking about rmds today, and
we're definitely in the final stretch of the year, and
if you're someone who's required to take an RMD, chances
are you've either done it already or you should be
reviewing it to make sure that you've withdrawn or will
have withdrawn the calculated amount by the end of the year.
Remember that rmds, or required minimum distributions, are the minimum
(04:30):
amounts you're required to withdraw each year from certain retirement accounts.
These include traditional irays, SEP irays, simple irays, and employer
sponsored plans like four oh one k's and four H
three b's. Now, a little bit later, we'll talk about
some exceptions to that, where if you're still working and
you're you're over the RMD age, but you're still working
and contributing, there's certain circumstances under which you don't have
(04:53):
to pull an RMD. But generally speaking, again, this is
the age at which you must take minimum distributions from
these retirement accounts. Now, often people will say, well, why
do these things exist? This seems silly, And the answer
is because the irs doesn't let you defer taxes on
retirement savings forever. They want their share of the tax
burden eventually. That's where rmds come in. So think of
(05:16):
it this way, everybody. When you earn income from your employer,
there's payroll taxes, there's income taxes, there's all kinds of
things that happen. You then put that into your checking account.
You go out and buy something, and you pay a
sales tax, and then the person who receives that pays
a salary to somebody who pays income tax, and they
go out and buy something and pay sales tax. You
(05:38):
get the idea. This is the rotation of dollars. So
if you leave dollars inside of the ecosystem of post tax,
one dollar might get taxed a thousand times in a year,
which is good for federal government and state and local agencies. If, however,
you remove that out of the ecosystem and you put
(05:59):
it into retirement account for the next thirty forty fifty years,
well that if too much money gets outside of the ecosystem,
then the federal government's state and local agencies literally cannot operate.
So they have to put a cap on that, and
that is where these minimum distribution caps come in. Now,
many people are going, what are you talking about? I'm
(06:20):
going to have to live off of that touche. Most
people have to pull money out of their retirement accounts,
not because they're required to, but rather because they need
it to live off of.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
But that's not true for everybody.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Eric, and I probably work with. I don't know, no,
Eric fifty sixty seventy combined households that do not need
their required distributions, and if they weren't required to pull them,
they wouldn't pull them. They just leave it alone and
leave it to their beneficiaries. Now, this concept of rmds
dates back to the Tax Reform Act of nineteen eighty six,
which originally set the start age at seventy and a half.
(06:56):
Some of you listening remember this quite vividly. It's like, wait,
I thought rmds were seventy and a half. And that
has changed a few times, and most recently, thanks to
the Secure Act, that changed again. And here's the current
breakdown by birth year. If you were born in nineteen
sixty or later, rmds begin at age seventy five. If
(07:17):
you were born between nineteen fifty one and nineteen fifty nine,
rmds begin at age seventy three. If you were before
if you were born in nineteen fifty or before July
first of nineteen forty nine, rmds begin at age seventy two.
And finally, if you were before born before July first
(07:38):
of nineteen forty nine, rmds began at age seventy and
a half. So just know everybody, if you're thinking to yourself,
what I already started rmds and they began, they began
at age seventy and a half. For me, it's not fair. Well,
these are the different ages, and if you actually go
back and look at the legislation of how and why
(07:59):
they implnt to these ages, it's just simply acknowledging that
people are living longer. This is actually a good thing.
The more those ages get pushed back, the more you
can leave money inside of these accounts to grow tax deferred.
This this is a win win. Now, your very first
rm D is actually due by April first of the
year after you reach your required age. After that, you
(08:24):
will need to take your rm ds by December thirty
first annually.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
So here's the kicker.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
Under most circumstances, you should just take your first RMD
in the age in which you're required to, don't push
it off to the following year. Every once in a
while there can be a unique circumstance where deferring your
first rm D to the following year and then taking
two rmds in that year could make sense, but it's
only under very unique circumstances. So most of the time,
(08:53):
when you turn RMDA, just make sure you pull the
rm D by the end of the year, and then
every December thirty first thereafter. Now here's another thing that
changed recently through the Secure Act. If you missed your RMD,
the penalty used to be pretty stiff at about fifty percent,
and there weren't many exceptions to that, and now through
the Secure Act, that penalty is twenty five percent even
(09:14):
lower as long as you fix that within a certain timeframe.
So what the IRS was realizing is that the i'm
the reason somebody missed an RMD was by mistake, not
by neglect, And so they just said, hey, let's let's
you know, lessen this a little bit to acknowledge what's happening.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
And acknowledging right now that the IRS sounding reasonable there, Hey, listen,
next to prime.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
I know that of me is turning over a new lead.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Talking this morning with CJ. Claus and Eric Schwortz our
retirement planning professionals from Claus Financial online Class Financial dot com.
That's Claus k l a as Financial dot com. They're
TOEP number six, So eight four four, two, five, six
three seven, no charge. That initial gets no appoyment at
Class Financial. It will be complimentary to you. So CJ,
let's let's kind of break this stuff down. Of course,
(10:01):
RMD those each of those letters very important, aren't they. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:06):
So again we've talked about this on the show quite
a bit, but our industry loves its acronyms, and RMD
is another example of that. So R stands for required
and then the M and D is minimum distribution. Now,
every once in a while you'll see those letters kind
of like mixed up and it's MRD and this freaks
people out. They go, it's an MRD. Well, that's just
(10:27):
a minimum required distribution.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
I mean, you get the idea.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
MRD RMD at all means the same thing. Now, R
is required, so you must take at least that minimum
amount annually. You can always choose to take out more,
and I'll be frank with you, most of the people,
not the Yeah, yeah, most of the people that we
work with are already pulling enough out of their retirement
(10:51):
accounts by the time they reach these ages to be
meeting their minimum distribution requirements. Right, So think of it.
I get into retirement, I'm sixty five years old, I
start pulling five percent per year out of my IRA.
I then, you know, eight years later, turned seventy three,
when my rmds kick on, I'm already pulling enough to
meet that minimum distribution. So you get the idea. For
(11:13):
many people, this is like a non issue because they're
already living off of that money. But if you're not,
then you have to start taking it at that time.
And just remember rmds now also can apply to different
types of certain WROTH accounts if well, well, they don't
generally apply if it's your wrath account, unless it's an
inherited wroth account. But this gets really confusing, not to
(11:35):
mention you can actually have post tax money inside of
a pre tax retirement account. So I don't even want
to get into the complexity of how this all works out.
But what you should know again is that you're going
to want to talk to your financial advisor if you're
not certain about needing to pull an RMD, because you
want to get this taken care of before the end
of the year.
Speaker 1 (11:55):
But it's it's it seems very complicated, and obviously there's
a lot to it. I'm always thankful CJ are good
at breaking this stuff down to kind of give it,
give it something they kind of tangibly understand, because as
we as I kind of look over the notes, I'm like,
oh my goodness, this is this is just bonkers and
what a great what a great explanation. And by the way,
one of the things that I want to mention is
(12:16):
if you miss part of the show. But the other
thing too is with the holiday season and maybe visiting
with family and friends, let them know about the show.
Let them know about Class Financial and the podcast as well.
This stuff it's free information. You can share it with them.
They can listen at their leisure as well. Just have
them head on over to class financial dot com. That's
coss k l a A s financial dot com, subscribe
and listen to the podcast. I know some of my
(12:37):
in laws up in Spooner our regular listeners to the
program as they're getting ready to retire and they just
love the great information again that available to you right
at class financial dot com. We'll talk about how the
r md that number is actually calculated. Also some of
the other areas that you need to know, as far
as subtleties about rmds, we'll get those details next as
(12:59):
Money in Motion with Lost Financial continues right here on
thirteen ten. WU I B I talking this week with CJ.
Closs and Eric Schwartz. Of course they are our retirement
planning professionals from Class Financial the website class financial dot com.
That's COSS k l a A S Financial dot com.
Tell forh number six oh eight four four two five
six three seven. No charge for that initial get to
know your appointment tech COSS Financial. It will be complimentary
(13:21):
to you.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Again.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
They're number six oh eight four four two five six
three seven talking this week about our mds and all
about all about r m d's everything that we need
to know. And CJ did a fantastic job explaining kind
of the basics of the history and what they are
and why they are. Eric will bring you in on
this conversation. And I think a lot of people are
(13:43):
wondering then okay, we understand what they are and why
they are, but how are they like calculated? Where's that
number coming from.
Speaker 3 (13:50):
That's a great question, and in many cases the million
dollar question for clients. The amount that you have to
withdraw is it's calculated by dividing the balance of your
account as of December thirty first of the previous year
by a life expectancy factor that the IRS gives us.
So the hard part is we can't actually tell people
before the end of the year how much their RMD
(14:12):
will be. We can, we can estimate it, but we
need to know that December thirty first balance before we
can fully calculate it. So, just to give an example here,
I think it helps folks a little bit. For those
people taking their first RMD at seventy three that CJ
was talking about earlier, their life expectancy factor that the
IRS provides is twenty six point five. Okay, so their
(14:34):
December thirty first balance gets divided by twenty six point
five to come up with their RMD. So that works
out to about three point eight percent of your account
balance in your first year, and then each year going
forward that life expectancy factor drops, so the percentage that
you actually draw out. It increases a little bit, ever
(14:55):
so slowly each each year going forward. Now, if you
are married in your spouse is your soul beneficiary and
they're more than ten years younger than you, there is
a separate table just for you. We won't get into
the details of that, but that is just sort of
a one off of the calculation for your RMD. Most
custodians will send you a reminder in generally in January
(15:17):
or February letting you know what your RMD amount is
for the for the year. Not to toot our own
horns as advisors, but if you work with a good
financial advisor, they are they will be paying attention to
this for you. I think CJ and I understand, especially
as we get close to the end of the year,
(15:38):
ourselves and our advisory team are reviewing all of the
clients that we work with to make sure that they've
actually addressed their their RMD. So make sure that you
are are either paying really close attention to this yourself
or you're working with somebody who can help you do that. Now,
keep in mind, once you take that required minimum distribution
(15:59):
and hey, the taxes, the rs doesn't care what you
do with the funds after that. You can reinvest that
into an investment account, you can spend it, you can
put it in the bank. They just want to make
sure that it goes through, goes or well comes out
of your account and goes into the tax system. As
CJ was referencing earlier, one really important factor here that
(16:20):
we get asked a lot. You are not able to
take your r m D funds and convert them into
a roth ira. Okay, so that is the one thing
that the IRS says you cannot do. When you take
those those rm D funds out of your pre tax
retirement account, you cannot turn around and convert those into
a roth ira. And if you want to get an
(16:40):
estimate for future rm ds, I know I did a
quick calculation there. You can go over to investor dot gov.
It has a help really helpful calculator and a I
think they called the look up your rm D worksheet
that's at IRS dot gov as well. That's a little
bit more of a DIY approach, but that'll give you
more information as well.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
Worksheets are always fun, Eric, nothing more fun. Shana talking
this morning with Eric Swartz and CJ. Closs every retirement
planning professionals from Class Financial online, Class Financial dot com.
That's Closs k l AA S Financial dot Com. They're
telephone number six so eight four four two five six
three seven. So Eric, what do rmds have to do
(17:20):
with as we look at this time of year, especially
charitable giving, and this is something folks should should be
thinking about.
Speaker 3 (17:27):
Yeah, this has become really popular since the standard deduction
was increased so much back in twenty eighteen. It made
it difficult for people to actually itemize on their income
taxes and actually get tax credit so to speak, for
those charitable gifts they're doing. So what's become really popular
is something called a QCD or a qualified charitable distribution.
(17:50):
And as a reminder, we we always make this disclaimer
we are not tax professionals, so make sure you check
in with your accountant to see if this makes sense
for your situation. We're going to talk through how qcds
work and how people use them in conjunction with their
their requirementium distributions. So qcds are available to you when
you are at least seventy and a half or older.
(18:13):
So remember cj I said earlier that rmds used to
start at seventy and a half. Now they are up
to either seventy three or seventy five. And qcds were
originally meant to work with your RMD at age seventy
and a half. When they've changed the laws multiple times
in recent years, they did not move the QCD eligibility age,
(18:34):
so it stay at it's stayed at seventy and a
half in basically to be able to qualify for a QCD.
What this does is it allows you to transfer up
to one hundred and eight thousand dollars directly from your
IRA to a qualified charity. Okay, and that's per person.
So if you have a married couple, you can potentially
transfer up to two hundred and sixteen thousand dollars tax
(18:58):
free to a charitable organization. And that number can change
a little bit each year. Those are our twenty twenty
five numbers. Now, a QCD will actually count towards your
rm D for the year. Okay, So let's say your
rm D is twenty thousand dollars. If you do five
thousand dollars of qcds, you only need to take out
fifteen thousand dollars taxable from your RMD, and the amount
(19:23):
that you give to the charitable organization does not get
included in your taxable income, so you are reducing your
overall tax bill and you're helping a good cause. In
many cases, maybe just the same giving you've been doing
for years, but now you're doing it in a little
bit more tax efficient way. To count for the current year, though,
you need to make sure that your QCD is completed
(19:46):
by December thirty first. And one other really important part
in terms of timing I said earlier, you have to
be seventy and a half. That is a very hard
and fast date. So it's not the year you reach
age seventy and a half. It is the day you
reach age seventy and a half. So if you turn
seventy and a half in June and you do a
QCD in April, it does not count. It will be
(20:10):
it'll be a taxable distribution, So make sure you are
paying really close attention to that date. The donation has
to go directly to a qualified five oh one C
three charity or a house of worship or you know,
making sure that these are actually charitable organizations. They cannot
be sent to donor advised funds or private foundations. So
(20:34):
we've talked about especially donor advised funds on the on
the show before. Those are not even though they are
considered charities, they are not able to receive qcds from
an IRA. And as we've mentioned before, we'll say it
a million times over, your kids do not count as
a charity, so we cannot do qcds directly to your children.
(20:56):
And just keep in mind here, when you do a QCD,
your not getting an additional charitable deduction that you're actually
you know, reporting on for your itemized deductions, but instead
it's actually excluded from your income altogether. Okay, So it's
just rather than deducting it off your income for the year,
(21:16):
you're just not adding it to your income for the year.
And lastly here this is really really important. When you
get your ten ninety nine R form in late January
early February from your IRA custodian, where it shows you
know how much you took out for the year, how
much federal tax you withheld, how much state tax, it
(21:38):
is not going to break out your qcds from your
total distributions, okay, So it's not going to say, well,
you took out twenty thousand, but five thousand were qcds,
so you know there's no tax due on that. You
have to actually keep documentation of how much went to
a charitable organization and actually share that with your tax
prepare so they can make sure that they exclude that
(21:59):
that QCD amount from your income for the year, so
you do not end up paying taxes that you don't
actually own.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
Really important information there from Eric Schwartz, of course, joined
this morning by Eric Schwartz and CJ. Closs. They are
our retirement planning professionals from Class Financial online Class Financial
dot com. That's Coss k l a A S Financial
dot com and they're telephone number six oh eight four
four two five six three seven. We'll get to the
class quiz question the week. We'll talk about some of
the more subtle things to know about when it comes
(22:27):
to rm ds. We'll get to that next as Money
in Motion with Class Financial continues right here on thirteen
ten Double u IBI talking with our retirement planning professionals CJ.
Closs and Eric Schwartz. They come to us from Closs Financial,
the website Class Financial dot Com telephone number six O
eight four four two five, six, three seven talking this
week about our mds, and I feel like we always
(22:48):
with a lot of this stuff kind of scratch the surface.
There's so much more to this.
Speaker 2 (22:52):
I know.
Speaker 1 (22:52):
There's also some important subtleties when it comes to rm
ds that folks should know about, aren't there? CJ.
Speaker 2 (22:59):
Yeah, there are, Sean and Eric did a great job there,
just kind of almost hinting at the complexity of all
that's involved here. I mean rm ds. Really, the only
way to not have to pay income tax on those rmds,
at least in a significant way or in an easy way,
is through those qualified charitable distributions that Eric was talking about.
(23:20):
But then you get into the weeds and you go, well,
how do I do a qualified charitable distribution? Do I
write a check? Do I have my financial advisor or
my custodian do it? And then and then I'm assuming
they put it on a different ten ninety nine, right,
and then they just and it's like no, no, It's
just it's so complex. So listen, there's a reason why
(23:41):
people like Eric and myself have jobs because we do
this all day every day. We can do it in
our sleep. But I will admit to you hearing Eric
talk that through, it just makes my mind, you know,
kind of go all over the place thinking how difficult
this is for the average consumer. So I know this
(24:01):
sounds like I'm trying to drive you towards us everybody,
and that's really not my intent. My comment would just
be find somebody that you know and trust who stays
on top of these rules and rags and how this
all works, because the tax benefits can be substantial. I'll
give a hinting of this. Eric was just talking about qcds.
If you're over seventy and a half, you can do
(24:23):
qualify charitable distributions, which are direct to distributions from your
IRA to a qualified charity. Well, listen, if you didn't
do it that way, and you just paid the RMD
to yourself and then gave to those charities, you'd probably
have to be given over twenty grand a year, if
not thirty grand a year to get any tax benefit
from that due to the high standard deduction amounts. So
(24:43):
that little piece of advice right there where you just say, hey,
let's just change the way in which you give to
your charities could be the difference of saving twenty percent
on twenty or thirty thousand dollars of gifts you give
to your church. This is not like small stuff you
Actually there are huge tax benefits associated with just knowing
(25:05):
how the rules or what the rules are, and how
to function within them. Okay, now a couple of other things,
just to be aware of a common question that we
get is, well, what about if I have multiple irays? Well,
if you have multiple iras, the RMD amount can be
met from any one or combination of all of those iras.
(25:26):
So think I have three iras that on December thirty
first all had a million dollars combined. I could just
pull the required minimum distribution from one of those iras.
I don't have to pull equally from all of them.
An exception to this rule is if I have three
irays and then one old four to oh one K
plan that I'm no longer eligible to contribute to the iras,
(25:47):
I can pull all of my distributions from one of them,
but I cannot aggregate my old four oh one K
as part of that that amount as well, the four
oh one K or four h three B that sits
at my old employer has its own own RMD that
must be met by a distribution from that account. So listen, everybody,
you know. Long story short, just I can't suggest enough
(26:09):
when it gets into these retirement distribution patterns and taxes
and charitable distributions, this is really where firms like us
and others can shine and help you dramatically. So you
might want to consider reaching out to a firm eventually
to help you through some of these complexities.
Speaker 1 (26:25):
A really great tool and a really great opportunity. Just
got to make sure everything's executed properly, and as we
talk each week with our retirement planning professionals professionals from
Class Financial, don't forget. If you ever miss part of
the show or you want to share the podcast, you
can always head it over to classfinancial dot com. That's
coss Klaas financial dot com. You can also get to
know CJ Eric and the whole team at COSS Financial
(26:47):
as well as I mentioned, listen to the podcast and
subscribe as well. Beret Telfue number six oh eight four
four two five six three seven. No charge for that
initial get to know your appointment at Loss Financial. It
will be complementary to you. Again, they're number six so
eight four four two five six three seven. Gonna hold
on to that telephon number, because it's time now for
the closs quiz question in the week. It works like this,
In just a moment, I'll ask you the closs quiz
(27:08):
question the week. You will then have thirty minutes from
the end today's program to call the Class Financial Office
right here in Madison at six oh eight four four
two five six three seven. If you are the first
caller with the correct dancer, you'll win this week's prize,
which is a twenty five dollars gift card to Jersey Mikes.
This week's closs quiz question week is this. What does
the letter R stand for in the acronym R M
(27:30):
D Telephone number six oh eight four four two five
six three seven. First got correct anser win this week's
prize at twenty five dollars gift card to Jersey Mike's.
And don't forget that's Class Financials Office here in Madison
as well, telephone number six oh eight four four two
five six three seven C J.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
Eric.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
It's always informative, it's always great chatting with you. I'll
be at a great Thanksgiving and we'll do it all
again real soon. Thanks Sean, see you guys, doctor Marty Greer.
She is back from Pennsylvania. We'll check in with her
next year on thirteen ten Wi
And we do have our phone lines open to you
right now at six oh eight three two one thirteen ten.
That's six soh eight three two one thirteen ten. If
you have questions for our retirement finding professionals from Class Financial,
we'd love to have you join us. Anything retirement related,
get you right on the air. Maybe you had a
question or conversation pop up over the Thanksgiving holiday and
(00:20):
say like, hey, I heard something, Well you want to
get the right answer, give us a call. We'll get
you on the air. Six soh eight three two one
thirteen ten. That's six soh eight three two one thirteen ten.
You can learn more about Class Financial on their website.
It's Cossfinancial dot com. That's colss klaas financial dot com.
Fantastic resource to learn more about Class Financial their separate divisions.
(00:41):
You can also sign up for the weekly Market Pulse newsletter.
You can schedule a complementary conversation and so much more
all online at Cossfinancial dot com. Telephone number for the
office right here in Madison six oh eight four four
two five, six three seven. Don't forget no charge for
that initial get to know you appointment at COSS Financial.
It's going to be complementary too. You telephone number six
(01:01):
oh eight four four two five, six three seven and
joining us this morning from Klass Financial R CJ class
and Eric Schwartz CJ. How you doing this week? I'm
doing great.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
How are you, Sean?
Speaker 1 (01:11):
I'm doing absolutely fantastic. Eric, how have you been?
Speaker 3 (01:16):
You know, Sean, I'm doing all right. I'm a little
cold today. I just have to complain a little bit.
Speaker 1 (01:21):
I think you're I think you're I think you're well
supported in that because I'm the same way and i'm
and I'm a thicker guy, and even I get chilly
in this stuff. I can't imagine for you guys, get that,
get that little little chill and it just doesn't go away.
So nice thing is about we talk about retirement planning.
If you don't like this type of weather, you've got options,
(01:42):
And it's all about the importance of planning. And speaking
of the importance of planning and kind of understanding retirement planning,
We're going to talk this week about something called r mds,
Retired required minimum distributions, What exactly they are, why they
are something you need to be aware of, and the
effect that they can have. Will get to that conversation
with Cjen Eric in just a moment in the meantime,
(02:03):
if you've got a question, love to get you on
the air six eight three two one thirteen ten. That's
six eight three two one thirteen ten. Now the really
cool feature of the program, it's the Class Quiz Question
the week your chance to win a fantastic prize from
our friends at Class Financial. This week got a great
opportunity to win a twenty five dollars gift card to
Jersey Mike's. Little tip listen closely to the program because
just about every show, the question answer comes up during
(02:25):
the program, and we'll tell you a little bit later
on in the program in detail how you can win
that twenty five dollars gift card to Jersey mar Mike's.
And before we start this week's topic and conversation, let's
actually go back to last week's show, actually two weeks
ago show a couple of weeks back. I guess be
the better way to say it. Let's get the question
and answer there as well.
Speaker 3 (02:43):
Eric, Absolutely, it's it's been a little while, but we
covered Medicare in long term care coverage. So our question
from a couple of weeks ago was true or false,
Medicare will cover all associated expenses with long term care.
The answer was false, and our winner last week was
(03:04):
Olivia from Wanakee. So thank you for listening.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
A lot of vowels and Olivia from Wanakey of wan
Key as well. Just an observation and that congratulations Olivia
and you two can be like Olivia. I just listened
closely to the program. We'll tell you how you can
win a little bit later on in the show. Speaking
of the show from a couple of weeks ago, it
was an in depth, fantastic conversation donever. You can always
(03:27):
listen back at class financial dot com. That's Closs Klaas
Financial dot com checking the calendar. Yeah, we're are about
a month, four weeks away from twenty twenty six. We've
just got a couple of weeks, a few weeks left
here in twenty twenty five. CJ. What should we know
about our mds and what needs to be needs to
(03:48):
be understood here?
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Well, Sean, I'm still laughing about the there's a lot
of vowels and Olivia from Wanakee. But that's an interesting observation,
I nerdy observation.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Actually, yeah, that's all I get paid.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
Okay, got it?
Speaker 1 (04:04):
Got it all right?
Speaker 2 (04:06):
Well, yes, So we are talking about rmds today, and
we're definitely in the final stretch of the year, and
if you're someone who's required to take an RMD, chances
are you've either done it already or you should be
reviewing it to make sure that you've withdrawn or will
have withdrawn the calculated amount by the end of the year.
Remember that rmds, or required minimum distributions, are the minimum
(04:30):
amounts you're required to withdraw each year from certain retirement accounts.
These include traditional irays, SEP irays, simple irays, and employer
sponsored plans like four oh one k's and four H
three b's. Now, a little bit later, we'll talk about
some exceptions to that, where if you're still working and
you're you're over the RMD age, but you're still working
and contributing, there's certain circumstances under which you don't have
(04:53):
to pull an RMD. But generally speaking, again, this is
the age at which you must take minimum distributions from
these retirement accounts. Now, often people will say, well, why
do these things exist? This seems silly, And the answer
is because the irs doesn't let you defer taxes on
retirement savings forever. They want their share of the tax
burden eventually. That's where rmds come in. So think of
(05:16):
it this way, everybody. When you earn income from your employer,
there's payroll taxes, there's income taxes, there's all kinds of
things that happen. You then put that into your checking account.
You go out and buy something, and you pay a
sales tax, and then the person who receives that pays
a salary to somebody who pays income tax, and they
go out and buy something and pay sales tax. You
(05:38):
get the idea. This is the rotation of dollars. So
if you leave dollars inside of the ecosystem of post tax,
one dollar might get taxed a thousand times in a year,
which is good for federal government and state and local agencies. If, however,
you remove that out of the ecosystem and you put
(05:59):
it into retirement account for the next thirty forty fifty years,
well that if too much money gets outside of the ecosystem,
then the federal government's state and local agencies literally cannot operate.
So they have to put a cap on that, and
that is where these minimum distribution caps come in. Now,
many people are going, what are you talking about? I'm
(06:20):
going to have to live off of that touche. Most
people have to pull money out of their retirement accounts,
not because they're required to, but rather because they need
it to live off of.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
But that's not true for everybody.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Eric, and I probably work with. I don't know, no,
Eric fifty sixty seventy combined households that do not need
their required distributions, and if they weren't required to pull them,
they wouldn't pull them. They just leave it alone and
leave it to their beneficiaries. Now, this concept of rmds
dates back to the Tax Reform Act of nineteen eighty six,
which originally set the start age at seventy and a half.
(06:56):
Some of you listening remember this quite vividly. It's like, wait,
I thought rmds were seventy and a half. And that
has changed a few times, and most recently, thanks to
the Secure Act, that changed again. And here's the current
breakdown by birth year. If you were born in nineteen
sixty or later, rmds begin at age seventy five. If
(07:17):
you were born between nineteen fifty one and nineteen fifty nine,
rmds begin at age seventy three. If you were before
if you were born in nineteen fifty or before July
first of nineteen forty nine, rmds begin at age seventy two.
And finally, if you were before born before July first
(07:38):
of nineteen forty nine, rmds began at age seventy and
a half. So just know everybody, if you're thinking to yourself,
what I already started rmds and they began, they began
at age seventy and a half. For me, it's not fair. Well,
these are the different ages, and if you actually go
back and look at the legislation of how and why
(07:59):
they implnt to these ages, it's just simply acknowledging that
people are living longer. This is actually a good thing.
The more those ages get pushed back, the more you
can leave money inside of these accounts to grow tax deferred.
This this is a win win. Now, your very first
rm D is actually due by April first of the
year after you reach your required age. After that, you
(08:24):
will need to take your rm ds by December thirty
first annually.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
So here's the kicker.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
Under most circumstances, you should just take your first RMD
in the age in which you're required to, don't push
it off to the following year. Every once in a
while there can be a unique circumstance where deferring your
first rm D to the following year and then taking
two rmds in that year could make sense, but it's
only under very unique circumstances. So most of the time,
(08:53):
when you turn RMDA, just make sure you pull the
rm D by the end of the year, and then
every December thirty first thereafter. Now here's another thing that
changed recently through the Secure Act. If you missed your RMD,
the penalty used to be pretty stiff at about fifty percent,
and there weren't many exceptions to that, and now through
the Secure Act, that penalty is twenty five percent even
(09:14):
lower as long as you fix that within a certain timeframe.
So what the IRS was realizing is that the i'm
the reason somebody missed an RMD was by mistake, not
by neglect, And so they just said, hey, let's let's
you know, lessen this a little bit to acknowledge what's happening.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
And acknowledging right now that the IRS sounding reasonable there, Hey, listen,
next to prime.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
I know that of me is turning over a new lead.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Talking this morning with CJ. Claus and Eric Schwortz our
retirement planning professionals from Claus Financial online Class Financial dot com.
That's Claus k l a as Financial dot com. They're
TOEP number six, So eight four four, two, five, six
three seven, no charge. That initial gets no appoyment at
Class Financial. It will be complimentary to you. So CJ,
let's let's kind of break this stuff down. Of course,
(10:01):
RMD those each of those letters very important, aren't they. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:06):
So again we've talked about this on the show quite
a bit, but our industry loves its acronyms, and RMD
is another example of that. So R stands for required
and then the M and D is minimum distribution. Now,
every once in a while you'll see those letters kind
of like mixed up and it's MRD and this freaks
people out. They go, it's an MRD. Well, that's just
(10:27):
a minimum required distribution.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
I mean, you get the idea.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
MRD RMD at all means the same thing. Now, R
is required, so you must take at least that minimum
amount annually. You can always choose to take out more,
and I'll be frank with you, most of the people,
not the Yeah, yeah, most of the people that we
work with are already pulling enough out of their retirement
(10:51):
accounts by the time they reach these ages to be
meeting their minimum distribution requirements. Right, So think of it.
I get into retirement, I'm sixty five years old, I
start pulling five percent per year out of my IRA.
I then, you know, eight years later, turned seventy three,
when my rmds kick on, I'm already pulling enough to
meet that minimum distribution. So you get the idea. For
(11:13):
many people, this is like a non issue because they're
already living off of that money. But if you're not,
then you have to start taking it at that time.
And just remember rmds now also can apply to different
types of certain WROTH accounts if well, well, they don't
generally apply if it's your wrath account, unless it's an
inherited wroth account. But this gets really confusing, not to
(11:35):
mention you can actually have post tax money inside of
a pre tax retirement account. So I don't even want
to get into the complexity of how this all works out.
But what you should know again is that you're going
to want to talk to your financial advisor if you're
not certain about needing to pull an RMD, because you
want to get this taken care of before the end
of the year.
Speaker 1 (11:55):
But it's it's it seems very complicated, and obviously there's
a lot to it. I'm always thankful CJ are good
at breaking this stuff down to kind of give it,
give it something they kind of tangibly understand, because as
we as I kind of look over the notes, I'm like,
oh my goodness, this is this is just bonkers and
what a great what a great explanation. And by the way,
one of the things that I want to mention is
(12:16):
if you miss part of the show. But the other
thing too is with the holiday season and maybe visiting
with family and friends, let them know about the show.
Let them know about Class Financial and the podcast as well.
This stuff it's free information. You can share it with them.
They can listen at their leisure as well. Just have
them head on over to class financial dot com. That's
coss k l a A s financial dot com, subscribe
and listen to the podcast. I know some of my
(12:37):
in laws up in Spooner our regular listeners to the
program as they're getting ready to retire and they just
love the great information again that available to you right
at class financial dot com. We'll talk about how the
r md that number is actually calculated. Also some of
the other areas that you need to know, as far
as subtleties about rmds, we'll get those details next as
(12:59):
Money in Motion with Lost Financial continues right here on
thirteen ten. WU I B I talking this week with CJ.
Closs and Eric Schwartz. Of course they are our retirement
planning professionals from Class Financial the website class financial dot com.
That's COSS k l a A S Financial dot com.
Tell forh number six oh eight four four two five
six three seven. No charge for that initial get to
know your appointment tech COSS Financial. It will be complimentary
(13:21):
to you.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Again.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
They're number six oh eight four four two five six
three seven talking this week about our mds and all
about all about r m d's everything that we need
to know. And CJ did a fantastic job explaining kind
of the basics of the history and what they are
and why they are. Eric will bring you in on
this conversation. And I think a lot of people are
(13:43):
wondering then okay, we understand what they are and why
they are, but how are they like calculated? Where's that
number coming from.
Speaker 3 (13:50):
That's a great question, and in many cases the million
dollar question for clients. The amount that you have to
withdraw is it's calculated by dividing the balance of your
account as of December thirty first of the previous year
by a life expectancy factor that the IRS gives us.
So the hard part is we can't actually tell people
before the end of the year how much their RMD
(14:12):
will be. We can, we can estimate it, but we
need to know that December thirty first balance before we
can fully calculate it. So, just to give an example here,
I think it helps folks a little bit. For those
people taking their first RMD at seventy three that CJ
was talking about earlier, their life expectancy factor that the
IRS provides is twenty six point five. Okay, so their
(14:34):
December thirty first balance gets divided by twenty six point
five to come up with their RMD. So that works
out to about three point eight percent of your account
balance in your first year, and then each year going
forward that life expectancy factor drops, so the percentage that
you actually draw out. It increases a little bit, ever
(14:55):
so slowly each each year going forward. Now, if you
are married in your spouse is your soul beneficiary and
they're more than ten years younger than you, there is
a separate table just for you. We won't get into
the details of that, but that is just sort of
a one off of the calculation for your RMD. Most
custodians will send you a reminder in generally in January
(15:17):
or February letting you know what your RMD amount is
for the for the year. Not to toot our own
horns as advisors, but if you work with a good
financial advisor, they are they will be paying attention to
this for you. I think CJ and I understand, especially
as we get close to the end of the year,
(15:38):
ourselves and our advisory team are reviewing all of the
clients that we work with to make sure that they've
actually addressed their their RMD. So make sure that you
are are either paying really close attention to this yourself
or you're working with somebody who can help you do that. Now,
keep in mind, once you take that required minimum distribution
(15:59):
and hey, the taxes, the rs doesn't care what you
do with the funds after that. You can reinvest that
into an investment account, you can spend it, you can
put it in the bank. They just want to make
sure that it goes through, goes or well comes out
of your account and goes into the tax system. As
CJ was referencing earlier, one really important factor here that
(16:20):
we get asked a lot. You are not able to
take your r m D funds and convert them into
a roth ira. Okay, so that is the one thing
that the IRS says you cannot do. When you take
those those rm D funds out of your pre tax
retirement account, you cannot turn around and convert those into
a roth ira. And if you want to get an
(16:40):
estimate for future rm ds, I know I did a
quick calculation there. You can go over to investor dot gov.
It has a help really helpful calculator and a I
think they called the look up your rm D worksheet
that's at IRS dot gov as well. That's a little
bit more of a DIY approach, but that'll give you
more information as well.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
Worksheets are always fun, Eric, nothing more fun. Shana talking
this morning with Eric Swartz and CJ. Closs every retirement
planning professionals from Class Financial online, Class Financial dot com.
That's Closs k l AA S Financial dot Com. They're
telephone number six so eight four four two five six
three seven. So Eric, what do rmds have to do
(17:20):
with as we look at this time of year, especially
charitable giving, and this is something folks should should be
thinking about.
Speaker 3 (17:27):
Yeah, this has become really popular since the standard deduction
was increased so much back in twenty eighteen. It made
it difficult for people to actually itemize on their income
taxes and actually get tax credit so to speak, for
those charitable gifts they're doing. So what's become really popular
is something called a QCD or a qualified charitable distribution.
(17:50):
And as a reminder, we we always make this disclaimer
we are not tax professionals, so make sure you check
in with your accountant to see if this makes sense
for your situation. We're going to talk through how qcds
work and how people use them in conjunction with their
their requirementium distributions. So qcds are available to you when
you are at least seventy and a half or older.
(18:13):
So remember cj I said earlier that rmds used to
start at seventy and a half. Now they are up
to either seventy three or seventy five. And qcds were
originally meant to work with your RMD at age seventy
and a half. When they've changed the laws multiple times
in recent years, they did not move the QCD eligibility age,
(18:34):
so it stay at it's stayed at seventy and a
half in basically to be able to qualify for a QCD.
What this does is it allows you to transfer up
to one hundred and eight thousand dollars directly from your
IRA to a qualified charity. Okay, and that's per person.
So if you have a married couple, you can potentially
transfer up to two hundred and sixteen thousand dollars tax
(18:58):
free to a charitable organization. And that number can change
a little bit each year. Those are our twenty twenty
five numbers. Now, a QCD will actually count towards your
rm D for the year. Okay, So let's say your
rm D is twenty thousand dollars. If you do five
thousand dollars of qcds, you only need to take out
fifteen thousand dollars taxable from your RMD, and the amount
(19:23):
that you give to the charitable organization does not get
included in your taxable income, so you are reducing your
overall tax bill and you're helping a good cause. In
many cases, maybe just the same giving you've been doing
for years, but now you're doing it in a little
bit more tax efficient way. To count for the current year, though,
you need to make sure that your QCD is completed
(19:46):
by December thirty first. And one other really important part
in terms of timing I said earlier, you have to
be seventy and a half. That is a very hard
and fast date. So it's not the year you reach
age seventy and a half. It is the day you
reach age seventy and a half. So if you turn
seventy and a half in June and you do a
QCD in April, it does not count. It will be
(20:10):
it'll be a taxable distribution, So make sure you are
paying really close attention to that date. The donation has
to go directly to a qualified five oh one C
three charity or a house of worship or you know,
making sure that these are actually charitable organizations. They cannot
be sent to donor advised funds or private foundations. So
(20:34):
we've talked about especially donor advised funds on the on
the show before. Those are not even though they are
considered charities, they are not able to receive qcds from
an IRA. And as we've mentioned before, we'll say it
a million times over, your kids do not count as
a charity, so we cannot do qcds directly to your children.
(20:56):
And just keep in mind here, when you do a QCD,
your not getting an additional charitable deduction that you're actually
you know, reporting on for your itemized deductions, but instead
it's actually excluded from your income altogether. Okay, So it's
just rather than deducting it off your income for the year,
(21:16):
you're just not adding it to your income for the year.
And lastly here this is really really important. When you
get your ten ninety nine R form in late January
early February from your IRA custodian, where it shows you
know how much you took out for the year, how
much federal tax you withheld, how much state tax, it
(21:38):
is not going to break out your qcds from your
total distributions, okay, So it's not going to say, well,
you took out twenty thousand, but five thousand were qcds,
so you know there's no tax due on that. You
have to actually keep documentation of how much went to
a charitable organization and actually share that with your tax
prepare so they can make sure that they exclude that
(21:59):
that QCD amount from your income for the year, so
you do not end up paying taxes that you don't
actually own.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
Really important information there from Eric Schwartz, of course, joined
this morning by Eric Schwartz and CJ. Closs. They are
our retirement planning professionals from Class Financial online Class Financial
dot com. That's Coss k l a A S Financial
dot com and they're telephone number six oh eight four
four two five six three seven. We'll get to the
class quiz question the week. We'll talk about some of
the more subtle things to know about when it comes
(22:27):
to rm ds. We'll get to that next as Money
in Motion with Class Financial continues right here on thirteen
ten Double u IBI talking with our retirement planning professionals CJ.
Closs and Eric Schwartz. They come to us from Closs Financial,
the website Class Financial dot Com telephone number six O
eight four four two five, six, three seven talking this
week about our mds, and I feel like we always
(22:48):
with a lot of this stuff kind of scratch the surface.
There's so much more to this.
Speaker 2 (22:52):
I know.
Speaker 1 (22:52):
There's also some important subtleties when it comes to rm
ds that folks should know about, aren't there? CJ.
Speaker 2 (22:59):
Yeah, there are, Sean and Eric did a great job there,
just kind of almost hinting at the complexity of all
that's involved here. I mean rm ds. Really, the only
way to not have to pay income tax on those rmds,
at least in a significant way or in an easy way,
is through those qualified charitable distributions that Eric was talking about.
(23:20):
But then you get into the weeds and you go, well,
how do I do a qualified charitable distribution? Do I
write a check? Do I have my financial advisor or
my custodian do it? And then and then I'm assuming
they put it on a different ten ninety nine, right,
and then they just and it's like no, no, It's
just it's so complex. So listen, there's a reason why
(23:41):
people like Eric and myself have jobs because we do
this all day every day. We can do it in
our sleep. But I will admit to you hearing Eric
talk that through, it just makes my mind, you know,
kind of go all over the place thinking how difficult
this is for the average consumer. So I know this
(24:01):
sounds like I'm trying to drive you towards us everybody,
and that's really not my intent. My comment would just
be find somebody that you know and trust who stays
on top of these rules and rags and how this
all works, because the tax benefits can be substantial. I'll
give a hinting of this. Eric was just talking about qcds.
If you're over seventy and a half, you can do
(24:23):
qualify charitable distributions, which are direct to distributions from your
IRA to a qualified charity. Well, listen, if you didn't
do it that way, and you just paid the RMD
to yourself and then gave to those charities, you'd probably
have to be given over twenty grand a year, if
not thirty grand a year to get any tax benefit
from that due to the high standard deduction amounts. So
(24:43):
that little piece of advice right there where you just say, hey,
let's just change the way in which you give to
your charities could be the difference of saving twenty percent
on twenty or thirty thousand dollars of gifts you give
to your church. This is not like small stuff you
Actually there are huge tax benefits associated with just knowing
(25:05):
how the rules or what the rules are, and how
to function within them. Okay, now a couple of other things,
just to be aware of a common question that we
get is, well, what about if I have multiple irays? Well,
if you have multiple iras, the RMD amount can be
met from any one or combination of all of those iras.
(25:26):
So think I have three iras that on December thirty
first all had a million dollars combined. I could just
pull the required minimum distribution from one of those iras.
I don't have to pull equally from all of them.
An exception to this rule is if I have three
irays and then one old four to oh one K
plan that I'm no longer eligible to contribute to the iras,
(25:47):
I can pull all of my distributions from one of them,
but I cannot aggregate my old four oh one K
as part of that that amount as well, the four
oh one K or four h three B that sits
at my old employer has its own own RMD that
must be met by a distribution from that account. So listen, everybody,
you know. Long story short, just I can't suggest enough
(26:09):
when it gets into these retirement distribution patterns and taxes
and charitable distributions, this is really where firms like us
and others can shine and help you dramatically. So you
might want to consider reaching out to a firm eventually
to help you through some of these complexities.
Speaker 1 (26:25):
A really great tool and a really great opportunity. Just
got to make sure everything's executed properly, and as we
talk each week with our retirement planning professionals professionals from
Class Financial, don't forget. If you ever miss part of
the show or you want to share the podcast, you
can always head it over to classfinancial dot com. That's
coss Klaas financial dot com. You can also get to
know CJ Eric and the whole team at COSS Financial
(26:47):
as well as I mentioned, listen to the podcast and
subscribe as well. Beret Telfue number six oh eight four
four two five six three seven. No charge for that
initial get to know your appointment at Loss Financial. It
will be complementary to you. Again, they're number six so
eight four four two five six three seven. Gonna hold
on to that telephon number, because it's time now for
the closs quiz question in the week. It works like this,
In just a moment, I'll ask you the closs quiz
(27:08):
question the week. You will then have thirty minutes from
the end today's program to call the Class Financial Office
right here in Madison at six oh eight four four
two five six three seven. If you are the first
caller with the correct dancer, you'll win this week's prize,
which is a twenty five dollars gift card to Jersey Mikes.
This week's closs quiz question week is this. What does
the letter R stand for in the acronym R M
(27:30):
D Telephone number six oh eight four four two five
six three seven. First got correct anser win this week's
prize at twenty five dollars gift card to Jersey Mike's.
And don't forget that's Class Financials Office here in Madison
as well, telephone number six oh eight four four two
five six three seven C J.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
Eric.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
It's always informative, it's always great chatting with you. I'll
be at a great Thanksgiving and we'll do it all
again real soon. Thanks Sean, see you guys, doctor Marty Greer.
She is back from Pennsylvania. We'll check in with her
next year on thirteen ten Wi
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