The "Palmetto Prediction" Edition

Swanny is joined by several guests, including Tim Bourret, Will Vandervort, Tommy Bowden, and Chad Morris ahead of Clemson's matchup with South Carolina.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Each time or Clipson Sports Talk with Lawton Swan.

Speaker 2 (00:42):
Finally, Clemson Sports Talk has come back to drive time. Hell, everybody,
Low and Swan back in the saddle once again. It
is the show that shakes the South Yan Clemson Sports
Talk for you each and every afternoon as you make
your way around the great state of South Carolin and beyond,
listening to us on incredible radio stations like Fox Sports

(01:03):
Radio fourteen hundred and the Midlands, heard around the world
on the iHeartRadio app and of course, brought to you
in part by our good friends over at mets Plumbing
mets plumber dot com two six seven one o eight.
That's mets Plumbing two two six seven one eight mets
plumber dot com. All right, loaded show today, timb Ray,
Chad Morris. We'll also taught what will be indow what

(01:24):
we hope to get caught up with Tommy Bowden. We
start though, Timbray here on a Friday afternoon. Tim, these
two teams entering with different, much different expectations than pre
then what was expected in the preseason.

Speaker 3 (01:38):
Yeah, you're right, and you know we kind of thought
this might have a bearing on the Heisman Trophy. Also, uh,
Sellers and Lomnick. Uh, So that just hasn't worked out either.
So it's been kind of a surprising season to be uh,
to be honest with your relatives of the expectations that

(02:00):
we've had. So I really can't think of another year
to compare to it, quite frankly, you know.

Speaker 2 (02:08):
One of the things that any season can certainly be
turned around on is a victory in this game. I remember,
back when I was in college, I hate to admit it,
Clemson was I think what two and eight going into
this matchup. South Carolina was I think one and nine,
and Clemson won and was three and eight, and you
thought we'd won the Super Bowl because that left South
Carolina at one in ten. So regardless of the record,

(02:30):
this one was always special.

Speaker 3 (02:31):
Yeah, it is. You know, even in that game, it
was because both teams that had struggled had much to
tier about. Whoever's gonna win that game was gonna have
a lot to tier about. That was Tommy West's last game,
and players carried them off the field. And yeah, there
was even that game with two teams really having bad seasons,

(02:52):
there was some juice to it. And I'm sure we'll
have some juice to it tomorrow and because both teams
wanted to finish on a high note. Of South Carolina
were to win, they would you know, they had a
terrific statistical game against Coastal last week, but then the
beach Clemson, this would be their biggest win of the season.

(03:12):
And and Cleinson wants, you know, if if clemsond wins
to give a four game winning streak going into a
bowl game. We've di the Clemson postseason streak of winning
a postseason game fourteen years in a row, which is
already the national record, a chance to extend that. Both teams,
you know, still have something to play for, not what
they thought they were gonna have to play for in

(03:33):
the beginning of the year, but still all out to
play for Tomorrow.

Speaker 2 (03:36):
Clemson quarterback k Klubnick has a chance, I would say,
in the minds, I have a lot of people to
finish his career, especially in the regular season with a
in a big way. If he could find the you know,
can manage to navigate South Carolina's defense and win the
game for Clemson. You take a look at it, Dabos
when he said, hey, you can cut the narrative like
you want. If you want to say they won two
out of three, that's fine, but we've won, We've won

(03:57):
two out of four and then we've won eight ten.
How significant is this game? Maybe four K club Nick,
just in the sense of maybe how fans view his tenure.

Speaker 3 (04:08):
Yeah, no, I think I think you're right about that,
although it's not the end all. I mean, Clemson people
still look at Taj Boyd is having a terrific career.
But he did go her to three against South Carolina
as a as a starter. But we still look at
him as a as as an all time Clemson great quarterback.
Kate's got a chance to get to twenty six wins

(04:29):
with a victory, So that would put him all alone
in fifth place in Clemson history. Only four pretty good
quarterbacks ahead of him, Rodney Williams to Sean and Taje
and uh and Trevor in terms of victories as a
starting quarterback. If the Tigers win this game, or of
course can win a bowl game, and he's you know,
he still had a chance. Again, the ten thousand passing yards,

(04:50):
I don't think he can do it in this game,
but two games combined, the two solid games combined, he
can so all that is still on the on the table.

Speaker 2 (04:58):
He's timber Ray. You can hear him tomorrow on the
call alongside Don Munson and Reggie Meryweather as Clemson kicks
off in Williams. Brice Stadium, a venue that's been very
friendly to Clemson over the years. Kind of surprising given
the fact that most times you talk about, you know,
home field advantage, but man, it's really been anything but
that for the game cockses. Clemson has come in and

(05:20):
just consistently won right there in the heart of Columbia.

Speaker 3 (05:23):
Yeah. One five in a row in Colombia. Last time
South combinas in Colombia was two thousand and thirteen. And
Clemson's played well on the road this year. In previous
we're three and one on the road. Only lost was
on a fifty five yard field going the last played
the game at Georgia Tech, had a good win over
a ranked team at Louisville. So Clemson's played well on

(05:45):
the road and played well on the road in Colombia.
I think actually a winning percentage in history is better
than Colombia in this series than it is in Clemson.
Oh wow, wow, it is kind of crazy the way
that's worked out.

Speaker 2 (05:57):
Yeah, what a weird stat And then again Tim ray
Hey out with this delivering the goods ahead of Clemson
in South Carolina tomorrow. Tim, I think when you talk
about the fans right in this series, there have been
some incredible moments, memorable moments. One of those took place,
what back in the sixties when a fraternity dressed up
like some Clemson players and went out on the field.

(06:19):
For people that don't know that story, maybe give them
the refresher.

Speaker 3 (06:22):
Yeah, I think it was in sixty one. There was
a South Carolina fraternity that got high school uniforms from
a local high school that had orange and white as
their uniform, and they knew what the pregame schedule was
gonna be is to win Clemson was supposed to come
on the field for pregame warmups, and so they came
out ahead of the real Clemson team and went through

(06:47):
calisthenics and you know it, took dives and flopped around
and and went through you know, war simulated plays in
which they fumbled the ball, they threw incomplete passes. So
finally I guess some plemps of maraternity guys figured out

(07:07):
what was going on, and I get I've never seen
video of it, but I guess they had a brawl
on the field between the two fraternities before the game,
and then it was another game. I don't know if
it was that game, and it was a different game
where they brought a where they were supposed to bring
a cow out on the field with a sign on
it Flimpson Homecoming Queen, but the cow died underneath the

(07:33):
stands before they brought it out on the field.

Speaker 2 (07:38):
I'll tell you what. One of the reasons it's one
of the great rivalries in college football clipses in South Carolina,
and I'm glad that fans can't get on the field
as easily as they once could. But I'd be lying
to you, Tim if I told you I don't think
those kind of antics, you know, just kind of good
humored antics back in the day were probably well worth

(07:58):
the price of admission to see Yeah, I guess.

Speaker 3 (08:00):
So you talk about getting on the field the sideline
forty six or forty eight, he guess forty.

Speaker 2 (08:06):
Six, counterfeit ticket games forty six.

Speaker 3 (08:08):
The counterfeit ticket, Yeah, yeah, the counterfeit tickets, and so
all kinds of fans had these tickets, so they stormed
the gate down in Columbia and uh and I have
seen pictures in the files where there's when the balls
at won end of the field, there literally were fans
standing on the field so they could see because there's
so many fans that were standing on the sidelines. Coach

(08:30):
howerd of course told the story where there was a
Clemson fan right behind him on the sideline trying to
tell him what play to send in. So I guess
that was a real wild scene in forty six.

Speaker 2 (08:40):
Tim Beray is on Twitter at tim Beray, and I
texted you earlier this week. AI recreation of Jerry Butler's
touchdown reception known as the Catch back in nineteen seventy seven,
the year before you got to Clemson, the Tigers led
twenty four to nothing. South Carolina storms back. It's sort
of the reverse of what happened to him out and
they take a twenty seven to twenty four lead. But

(09:02):
Clipson comes down and has that incredible touchdown reception by
Jerry Butler late in the game to give the Tigers
the victory. And the only reason I recreated that with Ai,
Tim is that there aren't any good quality photos of
that moment that I could find, and I hate that
because there's so many maybe recognize how many moments in
sports aren't preserved behind the lens. I mean, that's a

(09:25):
real change that we've seen. I would argue probably in
the last thirty five years or so.

Speaker 3 (09:30):
Yeah, I've actually seen two catches. There is a sideline
view of that catch that I've seen, and then a
picture taken from up top. Can't remember the name of
the photographer who shot it, but of course you know
the quality in nineteen seventy seven. Is it going to
be what it is with the digital era of photography today?
But you can still see what's going on pretty well

(09:50):
that it is one of the more famous pictures in
Clemson history.

Speaker 2 (09:54):
Now before you arrive, you came the next year? Was that?
I mean all the talk going into the nineteen seventy
eight season about that incredible grab. How long did that
play kind of exist in the minesia of fans or
was it just quickly turn the page?

Speaker 4 (10:10):
Oh?

Speaker 3 (10:10):
I think it still exists today because you got to
remember the situation. So Clemson didn't go to a bowl
game between nineteen sixty and nineteen seventy six. There weren't
as many bowl games in those days. You know, to
get in a bowl game was quite an accomplishment that
nineteen seventy seven game, Clintchon Gator Bowl bid for Clemson.

(10:31):
I don't know if Clemson would have gone to a
bowl game if they had lost the game. You know,
that was a very important catch and the nature of
the game just you know, the double comebacks, so to speak,
where South colnine scored twenty seven in a row to
take the lead and then Clemson scored with I think
thirty one seconds left to get the game winner. So
I think you tell them most long time Glemson fans

(10:52):
that game, that's play and that game is still up there.

Speaker 2 (10:55):
Tim Bray hanging out with us yere a day before
Clemson in South Carolina kick off. It's the al Meadow Bowl,
the Palmeadow State rivalry game. Clemson aware orange bridges, and
the Tigers wore orange bridges against South Carolina. What back
in nineteen eighty I think when George Rogers was the
running back there at South Carolina who would go on

(11:15):
to win the Heisman Trophy, and Clemson had their fair
share of success against Heisman Trophy running running backs back
in the early.

Speaker 3 (11:23):
Eighties, yes, absolutely, Yeah, hershel Walker and George Rogers both
never scored a touchdown against Clemson. They had good games,
I want to say, George Rodgers in that nineteen eighty
game still at one hundred and sixty eight yards, but
they only scored six points and didn't and he didn't
score on of course, hershel Walker in three games against
Clemson never scored it a touchdown either, So to back

(11:48):
to back to back Heisman Trophy winners. But yeah, that
twenty seven to six game in nineteen eighty was was
very memorable. If you talk about a game that really
set the stage for Clemson the national championship season, that
was That was it. We were five and five coming
into the game, needed to win the game for a
winning season. Obviously, the game before, I believe we'd lost

(12:11):
thirty four to seven to Maryland up in Maryland. So
that was a pivotal game in Clemson history. Willie Underwood
had seventeen tackles in that game. He had never had
an interception in forty six previous games for the Tigers
and then had two in that game for one hundred
and one return yards. Is still the only game in

(12:32):
Clubson history a Clemson players had over one hundred yards
and interception returns in one game.

Speaker 2 (12:39):
Wow. And when they came out in the orange pants,
because I can remember in the early nineties, maybe ninety
three ish, ninety two to ninety three, I think it
was maybe they came out in purple tops. He had
warmed up and then they switched tops before maybe the
NC State game. But what was the what was the
buzz like in nineteen eighty when they came out wearing
those orange bridge in the stadium.

Speaker 3 (13:01):
Yes, yeah, no, it was. It was pretty It was
pretty major because they did, you know, they did warm
up and in their normal white pant It was kind
of a surprise. It brought back memories to me, and
I sure coach kind of got the concept because you
remember the Notre Dame did that with green jerseys in
nineteen seventy seven, my last year at Notre Dame. They

(13:23):
warmed up in their blue jerseys and then came out
in the green jerseys. And Clemson did basically the same thing,
warming up in the white pants and then came out
to run down the hill in the orange. It was
kind of a throwback for me to see the same
type of concept the same way of doing it now.

Speaker 2 (13:41):
I was at and I actually posted a photo from
the game back in nineteen eighty six, the twenty one tie.
We don't talk about ties anymore in college football, thankfully.
What I remember about that day I was only nine
years old. My dad took me. We were sitting in
the upper deck, and what I recall about it was
is just how kind of eerily silent things were after

(14:04):
that game. And I can't imagine not only that Clipson
had tied and you know this very well. Clinson had
tied what Maryland I think the week before. So the
end of the season with back to back ties.

Speaker 3 (14:14):
Yes, but the reaction between those two games was totally
different because Clemson knew that if we tied Maryland we
would clinch the ACC championship. That was okay, that ending
in a tie. Nobody had an issue with will Liver
The next week going against going against South Carolina, you know,
there was just an empty feeling by everybody in the stadium.

(14:37):
And that game actually holds an unusual distinction as we
hit into this game, so in nineteen eighty since nineteen
sixty five, in games in which Clemson had a winning
record going into the South Carolina game and South Carolina
had a losing record. Clemson has not lost in those games,

(14:58):
but it's had one tie and that was the game
in nineteen eighty eighty six. Oh wow, that's the only
blemish on Clempson's record against South Carolina since nineteen sixty five,
when the Tigers have a winning record in South Carolina
as a losing record going into the game, and of
course that's the situation this year.

Speaker 2 (15:17):
Well, and that also for people my age, I'm forty eight.
Up until the five game winning streak, was the only
time where there was a span of more than I
guess three hundred and seventy someidd days, whatever it would be,
because sometimes maybe the game's played at a different time
of the month where Clemson didn't win at some point

(15:38):
during that span because they had a tie, and then
they lost down in Williams Brice Stadium the following year.
Up until that five game streak that started back in
nine that ended in twenty thirteen, the game you mentioned
earlier when you talked about the last time South Carolina
won at home. I mean, Clips had just really dominated
this rivalry and dominated it under Dabos Winny the run

(15:58):
they went on non including not playing the game in
twenty twenty, which the way Clemson was shaped up that
year likely would have gone the Tiger's way as well.
I mean, Dabosweeney really has turned it around from where
it was at the beginning of his tenure, the way
things went for him early on.

Speaker 3 (16:12):
Yeah, one of the first one in two thousand and
eight that basically.

Speaker 5 (16:15):
Got him the job, and then lost five in a
row right.

Speaker 3 (16:18):
From that standpoint.

Speaker 5 (16:19):
Yeah, early in the ten year. He started out one in.

Speaker 2 (16:21):
Fine well, and then of course all of those victories Clemson,
many of them ranked inside the top five over the
span from twenty fourteen through twenty twenty one, and then
he had the game at twenty twenty two. Just a
few short years ago back in Death Valley, where the Tigers,
you know, it feels like they're in control. They have
a special teams blunder a couple of them. Actually, they

(16:42):
ended up costing them a fumble on a little I
don't even know what you would call it, tim where
they kind of faked a hand off after they had
gotten a safety against South Carolina. And then of course
you had the local product right here out of dutch
Fork High School Antonio Williams fumble a punt late in
that game where Clemson would have had the ball with
the opportunity to maybe kick a game winning field goal.

Speaker 3 (17:03):
Yeah, you're absolutely right.

Speaker 2 (17:05):
Yeah, that game, that was a tough one. And then
last season, let's talk about the game tomorrow. Lenora Sellers Tim,
I mean, he's as versatile as you know any quarterback
in the country, but they've really had trouble this season
protecting him, and he's taken some bad sacks on his
own court. I think, I mean in some regards just
sort of the decision making that he's made. But last
season for Clemson, especially in the fourth quarter, they just

(17:27):
couldn't get him to the ground. They couldn't get him
off the field.

Speaker 3 (17:29):
Well, you know, that was an overall problem with Clemson
last year. It was probably its worst in a South
Carolina game, but fourth quarter rushing defense, and it's also
probably the most improved area this year. So in last year,
Clemson was one hundred and thirty first in the country
and yards per rush all out in the fourth quarter.
Clempson gave up five point nine to one yards per

(17:51):
rush in the.

Speaker 5 (17:51):
Fourth quarter last year, and of course a lot of
them were Leonora sellers. Now this year, so far, we've
only given up two point two yards per carry in
the fourth quarter, and that's fifth best in the country.
So I want to give it up one hundred and
ninety eight yards on ninety eight rushes in the fourth quarter,
none over fifteen yards. And last year we gave up

(18:13):
nine runs of over fifteen yards in the fourth quarter.

Speaker 3 (18:16):
So that has been an area of improvement this year
and it's gonna be an important thing to watch for tomorrow.

Speaker 2 (18:22):
Yeah, final thing, tim the past two ballgames against South
Carolina Clympson is combined for just thirty points sixteen in
a win in Columbia back int twenty twenty three, just
fourteen a year ago. I mean, in your mind, how
important is it that Clemson puts some legitimate points on
the board. I'm talking, you know, twenty four plus points

(18:44):
in this ballgame, or do you think they can win
a low scoring game?

Speaker 3 (18:47):
You know, we've had some low scoring games the last
two games. No neither team has scored twenty points, so
South Carolina has has scored. In fact, though, what is
it the last three games in Colombia, they've only scored
ten points total. I think against Linson, So it's kind
of been a little bit defensive. I'm not expecting that tomorrow.
I'm expecting it to be a bit more high scoring

(19:10):
and and so I think, you know, the red zone
statistics are going to be very important for this game tomorrow.

Speaker 2 (19:19):
Again, foll him on Twitter at Tim Bray. He'll be
on the call with Don Munson and Reggie Merriweather. Tom
have a great, great weekend and enjoy the game tomorrow.

Speaker 3 (19:27):
Sounds good.

Speaker 2 (19:28):
So there you go. That's Tim Bray hanging out with
us here on the program. All right, with a quick break,
we'll come back. The remaining portions of our Number one
will be joined by former Clemson offensive coordinator Chad Morris,
so it'll be a busy day again. Will fan of
Ward coming up an hour number two and Tommy Balden

(19:49):
also going to be a part of the program here
on a Friday afternoon Rivalry Week well underway. Games going
on right now across the country. Stay with us. It
is a Friday afternoon Rivalry Week is upon us, and
not only in the Palmetto State. Well. The Tigers and
the game Cocks face off at noon, but at seven
o'clock tomorrow we'll see the Virginia Cavaliers hosting Virginia Tech.

(20:13):
The father of Virginia's quarterback Chandler Morse, Chad Morris, former
clubs and offensive coordinator, former head coach at SMU and Arkansas,
joins us as he has throughout the college football season. Coach,
welcome in hope you had a great Thanksgiving with your
family and thanks for being a part of the show.

Speaker 6 (20:30):
Well, I hope everybody had a I appreciate that long
and I hope everybody had a great and got plenty
full and doing their Black Friday shopping.

Speaker 4 (20:41):
So I'm sure a lot of excitement as there is
up here in Charlottesville. And so yeah, just excited about
a great weekend of football.

Speaker 2 (20:49):
So you've traveled around all season to watch Chandler play,
and it's been an incredible year. Virginia wins tonight or
excuse me, tomorrow night, they'll go to the ACC Championship game,
and you so thinking about just the year that it
has been for Tony Elliott and that team. I mean,
how fun has it been and how amazing, maybe more
than anything, has it been for you and your wife.

Speaker 4 (21:10):
It's been incredible. I mean, you know, I just you
couldn't have scripted it any better to be able to
step back this year from coaching something I truly love,
but yet you know, and then have Tony still let
me help those guys and and help game plan with
those guys and be a part through the course of
the year and be able to go and watch Chandler

(21:32):
and see this team come together and really just just
just a belief they've had and and know that you know,
you know, one went away from going to Charlotte. It's
a it's it's it's a storybook, is what it is.
It's just you know, and you know, and I'll get
back into coaching next year, but this will be a
year that I'll I'll never forget, and I know Chandler
will never forget as well, with me being able to

(21:54):
be a part of every every week with him.

Speaker 2 (21:57):
Yeah, so cool. And let me ask you from a
person standpoint, I mean, do you have I guess it's aminemity?
Is that the word to looking for, like when you're
out and about do people recognize who you are? Are
you just kind of able to be just a guy
in the crowd when you've gone to these games, especially
maybe on the road.

Speaker 4 (22:14):
Well, you know, it's been. It's been a good mixture.
I mean, you know, there's a lot of times that
you know, you'll get there and then people recognize who
you are and and uh, both Virginia people and the opponents,
and so that's you know, it's but for the most part,
we don't wear anything that has number four on it,

(22:35):
nothing that represents you know, it says anything about Channeler
on us. And it's because again it's just that's kind
of who we are. We've never done that and and
and so we just we kind of set to ourselves.
And but there are there's people that don't recognize you,
and they'll come up to you and talk and you know,
tell you, you know, tell you how excited they are
for for Chandler in Virginia and and then or followed

(22:59):
your career the little bit. And it's it's been, it's been.
It's been a lot of fun this year. I really
I couldn't have written a better script.

Speaker 2 (23:08):
Well, and I mentioned it's Rivalry week. By the way,
coach Chad Moore is hanging out with this around the program.
You've been involved in rivalry games throughout your career, depending
on where you've been I mean Clemson in South Carolina.
Obviously you were at Auburn, Auburn and Alabama. I mean
you've got you've you've done the gamut. What are they
like these rivalry games from a standpoint of just being

(23:30):
a coach.

Speaker 4 (23:32):
Well, you can take the records and throw them out,
doesn't matter. You know, one could be eleven and oh
and going in to make a twelve and oh and
you could be oh and eleven and that game comes
down to you know, you know, it just comes down
to that at sixty minutes or ever long as it takes.
You know, just the so much, so much as at stake.

(23:55):
And I remember we would always talk at Clemson. It's
it's you know, it affects every TV household in that state.
Every dinner table in that state is going to talk
about that game and then the implications that and the
bragging rights for for a year, and same way in
Alabama and and when we were there and Arkansas LSU.

(24:16):
I mean, all those things are just it's just a
great week. You push everything to the side and and
know that this is this one's gonna this one's gonna
have some bragging rights all year long.

Speaker 2 (24:29):
So when you think about like games and coaching. I
can't remember if I'd asked you this, coach, but can
you kind of walk through a game sort of like
I might around of golf, you know what I mean,
where I can kind of think it through, like Okay,
I was you know, I was here, I was short
of the green on into Like can you do you
kind of go back through games like that? How do

(24:51):
you go back through a ballgame? Outside obviously film? But
I mean, can you kind of walk your way through them?
Like I've seen these coaches that can notory so you
can say, hey, uh, display call dispositioning, do you know
what you ran? And they're like, yeah, I ran trips
right thirty eight? You know ye utah, whatever did you
do that?

Speaker 4 (25:11):
I mean, yep, oh absolutely yeah. And and the rivalry
games stick out even more. I mean I remember, you know,
because we were a part of that zero and five
run and then flipped it, you know against against Carolina then,
so we were a part of that, and I remember
on one it might have been the year before we

(25:33):
flipped it or two years for so, I can't remember. Anyways,
I remember that you can walk show through those games,
and and you're always like, well, Okay, I had I
had five major shots that I wanted to take in
that game. And I remember coming out of a game
like that and going, man, I didn't get to them.

(25:53):
And and it makes you it's a sick feeling because
you go into games like that going, Okay, when I
come out of this game, win, loser, draw, I gotta
make sure I've I've emptied it out. And but yeah,
you can, you can walk through and you can think, Okay,
in the first quarter, man, I wish I would have taken,
you know, two more shots. I wish I would have

(26:14):
I would have been a little bit more creative coming
into halftime, the four minutes right before half. Wish I
could have run, you know, a little bit more of
the speed motion or some yo yo motion or something
that's gonna add a little creativity to make the linebackers
freeze a little bit more, to give me a placks
and shot over the top, you know, and going in
third quarter, you know, you you think about those things,

(26:34):
and you know, I remember going down to Carolina. We
were moving the ball, having great success, and I remember
like it was yesterday, and I remember.

Speaker 2 (26:44):
A double pass okay.

Speaker 4 (26:48):
And it was just like one of those things you
just and then we threw a double pass, had Sammy
wide open, and we loft at the ball, put too
much air underneath it in the back. So I say
that comes in interception. You know, it's the things like that
you remember. But yeah, there's no doubt you can walk
through just like you're playing around the golf all the
way through it.

Speaker 2 (27:04):
That's unbelievable, Coach, that's unbelievable stuff. And I know Clemson
fans certainly remember that as well. One of the more
memorable moments I would say for Tiger fans in recent years,
and a loss there in Williams. Brice Stadium for sure.
All right, well, hit a quick break. We'll come back
with more from former Climpson Tiger offensive coordinator Chad Moore's
here on a football Friday afternoon. Those rivalry games are

(27:26):
taking place all across the country. With a quick break,
Clemson Carolina tomorrow at noon. We'll be right back with
more of the show that Shakes the South lamd Lawton
Swan Clympsones sports Dot Chad Morris on the guest line.
Don't forget about our friends at Alumni Hall on the
corner of campus on College Avenue, downtown Clemson for all
your officially licensed Clemson merchandise, hats, T shirts, Tailgate, Gary Moore,
go check them out to day or online to Alumni

(27:46):
Hall dot com. All right, coach, we were talking about
that play down in Williams Brice Stadium where Sammy Watkins
makes the double pass. Walk us through that. What did
you see there?

Speaker 4 (27:57):
Yeah, I do. I remember it like it was yesterday.
I mean, we're we're moving the ball down and we
hit we hit our landmark, which was around the thirty
thirty five right hash or right middle, and and I like,
here it is. This is this is the time they
got the single high look that we're looking for as
a safety, and we did. We threw it out to
Sammy and Sammy floats it. We're throwing it to Adam

(28:17):
Humphreys and and he floats it, and I mean he's
he's wide open. If we drive it on him, we
score a touchdown. Here we go, but we float it
and the backside safety comes over, it makes a great play,
comes over and picks it off. But yeah, no, it was.
It was a part of our our You know, you
get on those landmarks and you think, okay, I want
to I want to this is I want to make

(28:37):
sure that we can hit this. Everybody's gonna be biting
up on Sammy and we think we can get a
ball over the top with him and them condentioning on Sammy.

Speaker 2 (28:46):
And you think about you guys during that time, sort
of the rise that you were on with playmakers like
Sammy Watkins. While we're on the topic of Sammy, we
hadn't talked too much about him while you've been here
with us over the past uh several months. I mean,
what kind a playmaker was he? You know, I don't
know that he gets the credit from a lot of
people in Tigertown of being the elite wide out because

(29:08):
he kind of came before Clemson won national titles. But
what did you see in him? And man, what kind
of playmaker was he?

Speaker 4 (29:15):
Well, you know, I know I've probably told you this,
but he was one of the main guys that I
so when I got to Clemson. That was the first
recruit that I had to go go see. And I
remember telling him, listen, if you if you, if you
come here and stay committed to us, I promise you
you're going to touch the ball as much as you

(29:36):
want to touch it. Sammy was so good about turning
speed to power and power to speed so he could
he could lower his shoulder like he did against Georgia
that night. We throw a little slants, a little little glance,
and the safety comes down on him and he lowers
his shoulder and the next thing, you know, Boomy, he
knocks the safety off and then he accelerates his speed.

(29:59):
He was so wrong. And the thing about Sammy that
you loved was when he caught a ball out of
the air, you could literally hear him pluck it out
of the air with his hands. I mean he would
just grab it and you could you could just you
could just hear it, much like much like DeAndre, like Nuke.
I mean, Nuke was so so good at contorting his body,
but Sammy was. You know, Sammy had power, he had speed,

(30:21):
he had explosion, and you could just you could just
see him dig the grass up when he put his
foot in the ground, I mean that grass was peeling up.
And so uh one of one of if not, I mean,
he's definitely one of the all time greats that's ever
that's ever played there. But I would I would rivel
and argue with anybody over that.

Speaker 2 (30:41):
Well, and you guys, you know, entered those matchups against
South Carolina a couple of years. I think you're what
ten and one, only losing to Florida State, and you
guys had to lead on the road that Florida State.
I think maybe in the twenty twelve season, I can't remember,
but just thinking about what might have been had you
beaten South Carolina those years. I mean, those are some
really good game Cock teams. What made them so difficult

(31:02):
to deal with, Well.

Speaker 4 (31:05):
They had a defensive front that was they may still
have guys well I'm still playing in the league. I mean,
they had so many guys up front and in their secondary.
Their secondary was so elite as well when you when
you look at what they had back there, and so
that they they were, they were extremely talented and and

(31:26):
I mean they they and I can't remember, I'm trying
to think some of the DB's that they had. They're
still in the.

Speaker 2 (31:31):
League, yes, yes, yes, there you go.

Speaker 4 (31:36):
Well, as a matter of fact, funny story, we're we're
we're playing we're playing Carolina and we're at home and
that was and they beat us at home that that
that year, and I remember we're warming up so Todd,
we're out in pregame warm up. I got the quarterbacks out,
we're warming up and about that time, so so Taz

(31:59):
is throwing act and forth with Cole and they're they're
getting loose from warming up. I'm just kind of standing around. Well,
the DB's from Carolina come out, and you know how
they come out, and the quarterbacks usually warm up on
the on the on the side of Carolina to start with,
and their DD's run right through the middle of us
warming up the quarterbacks and Taz through the ball and

(32:20):
he was throwing it the warm up and Gilmore steps
in front and picks it off. He actually catches it
and he jogs and he tosses it back to Taj
and he goes, hey, get used to it, because that's
gonna happen to night. And so you knew, I mean
it was. I mean, you're talking about rivalry week, and yeah,
of course I'm trying to keep Taj back and Taz
is I mean, it's it's like, okay, it's game on now,

(32:42):
and uh but yeah, you know, those are the those
are the memories you have in those games. But you know,
you got guys like Sammy and DeAndre and and you know, Martavis,
I mean we we we you know, some really good guys.
And you know, thankfully we were able to flip right there,
right right right there before we left.

Speaker 2 (33:02):
Well and speaking of that game where you flipped it, obviously,
Deshaun Watson out there playing with his knee wrapped up.
I mean, it was unbelievable from a standpoint of a
coach being there for that decision. I'm assuming he made
it to play. You don't see that all that often.

Speaker 4 (33:22):
What was that like, Well, you know, no one, no
one through the course of that week knew knew knew
about it. And it was me, it was coach Twainey,
it was DeShawn, and it was family. And so we
go in and we all, you know, we meet with
the doctors and everything, and and of course, Dashawn, if
you remember when when we when we signed to Shawn,

(33:42):
DeShawn says, I'm never going to lose to Carolina, and
that was his staple. He's like, I'm not losing to him.
And so when when when he goes in, he's got
a torn a c l and everybody met with the doctors.
The doctors looked at everything and said, look, we can
we can brace you up. You're not gonna it's you're
gonna have to have surgery. You're not gonna damage it anymore.

(34:04):
And so at that point now it was up to
me to game plan to where we didn't put to
Shawn in a bad situation. If you noticed in that game,
I would actually motion to Sean out and stand him
on the sidelines and we would run run our savious
at quarterback. So we would do some of that. And
I remember one time, you know, DeShawn motions out and

(34:27):
when he plans to stop, he falls because you couldn't
have his support and he falls, and but or third
down I would pull him out and Cole would go in.
And so but it was that it was just a
gritty performance and it was a decision that he made
and was was the whole family made and was assured that, hey,
look you're gonna be just fine if we get through

(34:48):
this game. You'll have surgery and a way you'll go
and start your rehab process.

Speaker 2 (34:52):
And coach, let me tell you what, we got a
hard time break coming up. I want to come back
and finish that story with you though, So with a break,
we'll come back. Hear more about the performance that Deshaun
Watson had in twenty fourteen. According to Chad Morris, when
we returned right here on the show of the Shakes,
the south Land final segment, our number one coming up
in our number two will Van Dervart, Tommy Bowden hopefully
going to be able to join the program as well.

(35:14):
We got Chad Morris on the guest line coach. We
were talked about the legendary Deshaun Watson game at twenty
fourteen where he plays on a torn acl and even
though you guys had put in some precautions he could,
he just kind of played maybe larger than expectations.

Speaker 4 (35:28):
There was a time in that game where he actually
took off and ran and scored. And again it just
it just shows you what that game means to to
Clemson and to those players, and and it was so
important that we got that that zero to five off
our off our resume and and started a new, a

(35:51):
new run. And but yeah, that was that was probably,
if not one of the most gutsy performances I've ever
been a part of, with with with a player and
with multiple players, because ar Tavia Scott had an unbelievable
night that.

Speaker 2 (36:05):
Night Chad Morris with this year on the program talking
about Clemson snapping South Carolina's five game winning streaking the series,
and that was your final game as Clemson's offensive coordinator.
I don't remember. I mean, did you already know that
you were leaving at that point when you were coaching
that game, or did that come up in between that
game and the bowl game. I really don't recall now

(36:27):
that that.

Speaker 4 (36:28):
Was It was right there at that that week. SMU
had actually i'd had I had had several schools, but
i'd accepted the SMU job, or was in final discussions
what I should say, gotcha? And and then you know,
and it gets the wind gets you know, word gets
out and and I just remember, you know, I was

(36:48):
having a deal with that that morning and going into
and talking to coach Sweeney, and he and I had
been communicating to this whole deal, and I wasn't going
to make a decision untill after the game. And but
reports were out that I was taking the job already,
and which was not true. I was in heavy talks
with them, but I hadn't completely accepted, so uh, trying

(37:10):
to get you know, we stood in front of our
I remember stand in front of our offense on that
Thursday and just saying, you know, hey, look, you know,
yes I've been talking to them, but there's no final
decision and I'm not about to do that, you know,
prior to this game. And so we got we got
business that we got to take care of. And uh so,
you know, while it it was, it wasn't it wasn't

(37:33):
a distraction, but it was an opportunity for me to
address those guys and say, look, let's let's go do
this together, Let's make something special, let's turn let's let's
let's let the worms start turning right now. And but yeah,
it was, it was right there that week and in
that that game.

Speaker 2 (37:48):
Now it's a it's a different era now than it
was then. Obviously, did you have the option to stay
and coach that Russell Athletic ball against Oklahoma?

Speaker 4 (37:57):
I did, absolutely, I did. And but talking with Koch
Sweeney and you know, and then the way the recruiting
process is work and I had to get on the
road and start recruiting for sm Ye at that time,
and so I had to get there and needed to
get there. And the great thing about it was in
Koschweene was he was great with it because he was

(38:18):
just like, you know, you've done such a tremendous job
for us, and you've done a great job getting Tony
and Jeff ready. This will be a great opportunity for them,
a great practice session going into next year. So if
you we want you, if you want to stay in
COASA Bowl game, we'd love to have you. But we
also understand what you have to do. From a recruiting standpoint.
These guys will be ready to go. And so so

(38:41):
I just made the decision that it was best to
I had to get on the road and start recruiting.
And it's baff together.

Speaker 2 (38:47):
And so Tony and Jeff call that game and they
beat the breaks off of Oklahoma. They score on the
first play, they went forty to six. And I'm sure
you were probably watching from Mount in Dallas or wherever
you were located at that time. I mean, were you
surprised at how much juice they got out of Cole
stout in that game? I mean, I think it shocked everybody.

Speaker 4 (39:06):
Well, I think what it did was, you know, Cole
Cole had had all all the bull practice to get ready,
and of course, the way the season had unfolded, that
year with Cole and DeShawn. I think it was an
opportunity for Cole to just say, you know what, this
is going to be my last ride. I'm fixing that.
You know, he had an edge about him, He had
a chip on his shoulder, and and you know, Tony

(39:28):
and Jeff did a great job putting together a game
plan that that were that that benefited that that that
that that you know, worked the Cole strengths well.

Speaker 2 (39:37):
And if if you go back right to say the
opener that season, we we've not really talked about this.
That game in Sanford Stadium against Georgia. Who makes the
call on who's starting in that game? I mean, is
that just priority? Because Cole was a veteran versus a
freshman in Deshaun, and everybody remembers the touchdown throw, the

(39:57):
Sean peak that one lives in the memories of Tiger
fans forever.

Speaker 4 (40:01):
YEA, well, it it works as coach Winny and I
obviously do a lot of discuss, you know, discussion through
the through the course of fall camp, we knew DeShawn
was gonna was gonna be the future, and but we
also knew that, you know, let's get into Georgia. Let's
let's build it in so you know, we can bring

(40:21):
DeShawn in. And so all through fall camp, cole knew
that on the third series of the game, Deshawn's going
in and and and DeShawn knew it, and so we
were going to start cold. Deshaun was gonna play. We
were gonna start getting him some reps and getting him ready.
And sure enough he gets in and his first his
first series, they bring I can see it's right now.

(40:45):
They bring a sam linebacker and a strong safety off
the edge. DeShawn looks up, he checks the protection to
what we called it max protection. He checked to pro
max protection and send Sean right down the middle of
the field and there is and you know, and then
I look over and I'm like, okay, wow, okay, here's
gonna be special.

Speaker 2 (41:05):
Yeah, so can throw one of them? I thought that
string being can throw it.

Speaker 4 (41:12):
Yep, yep, that's right, Yeah, that's right. So but again
that's the way that worked. And then, you know, and
then we we didn't want to because the worst thing
you can do is put a kid out there that's
not ready. You can actually set a kid back if
you put him out there and he's not ready and
you because then you deal with confidence issues, so you
have to it's a fine line. Again. I've coached quarterbacks

(41:33):
my whole life. My son's a quarterback, so I've been
around it forever, and there's a fine line. You've got
to make sure that confidence level and you've got to
put the right time to do it. And and I
thought we did a really good job with it.

Speaker 2 (41:46):
Well, coach, thanks for sharing your memories of the rivalry game,
so many great moments for Clemson Tiger fans. Best of
luck to you guys with Virginia this weekend coming up
tomorrow night against Virginia Tech. And appreciate you taking time
out during Thanksgiving seeking to be a part of the show.

Speaker 4 (42:01):
Well. Always a great time visiting with you, Lowton, And
like I said, love our Tiger fans and go Tigers
and go Wahoos and hopefully, hopefully we can take care
of business tomorrow night, and I bet you'll be a
lot of Tiger fans and Charlotte helping support to not
just Tony and Chandler, but the whole Virginia Cavaliers.

Speaker 2 (42:20):
No doubt about it, no doubt it is our number two.
That's drivetime right here on the show. The shakespare South Aday, Clemson,
the sports, salt lot and swineing you know with you
on a Friday afternoon rivalry week well underway, Will Van
Derwort coming up in just a few minutes again your
Clemson Tigers facing off of South Carolina tomorrow at noon
overt WILLIAMS. Brice Stadium, and of course the show that

(42:40):
Shakespeare south Land, brought to you in part by our
good friends over at Mets Plumbing mets Plumbing dot Com
two two six seven one oh eight. That's Mets Plumbing
two two six seven one zero eight. All right, Will
Van Dervort on the guest line, Will I know you
love being impartial when you cover Clemson, but I think
when it comes down to this Clubs of South Carolina game,

(43:02):
you would certainly say to me, Swanee, there's a lot
of bad blood over the years for you in this one.

Speaker 7 (43:07):
There is this one is where I I mean, I
will still do my job and I will be as
objective as anybody can be, but in my heart I
am pulling for the Tigers to win this one. My
disdain for South Carolina team in that program in fan
Base has always been there. It will never go away.

(43:28):
It's rooted in me from you know, where I grew up.
Why that's the case. It's just it's a little personal
more so than anything else. And yeah, so this is
always fun. I'm a fan of the rivalry. I don't
think there's anybody that's more of a fan than me
for this game. Every year, I get stoked up for it.
It's like the Super Bowl to me. Since of just

(43:48):
to hear some some fans out there say, you know,
they should lose for whatever stupid reason, just to this game,
I'm just like, what's wrong with you? This is South Carolina.
You don't want to lose this game. I don't care
how mad you are or what, just the game. You know,
you just got to stuck it up, rout for the
Tigers and try to get them, try to get them
a win, right, I mean, you know that's what makes
this game great. Growing up in the state of South

(44:10):
Carolina and just you know, getting to watch this game
and what it meant to the Palmetto State and what
it means to each program and each fan base. Man,
it doesn't get any better than that. I think it's
the most underrated rivalry in the country. It doesn't get
the respect it deserves. And at least we got it right.
And so it's fun each each each year when this

(44:30):
game comes around.

Speaker 2 (44:31):
Well here here's what's funny. I thought about that too,
like everything pretty much in the world comes around once
a year. But then I was looking at Oregon State
and Washington State will are playing twice a year. And
I'm not I'm not suggesting. I'm not suggesting Clemson to
South Carolina play twice a year, but I am suggesting
the fact that you know, what would you think if

(44:52):
it were a game that you played like the opener
and the closer? What if it was the bookend? You
opened it in Death Valley one Sea, you closed it in
Williams Bryce the day or not in the next, but
you know later in the year. Excuse me, I don't.

Speaker 7 (45:05):
Know, man. Can you imagine the level of and I
know that robbery after is called the Civil War, but
can you imagine the like the fan bases for the
season opener and then closed the season? And then can
you imagine the two teams? Because I mean, there's this
I'm gonna tell you, man, it's gonna be chippy tomorrow.

(45:25):
And this rivalry, it gets chippy at times, and I
think the mar is probably gonna be the most chippiest
it's been in a long time because of the season
most teams have had, right, And I think the worst
the season each team has, the more the chippiness seems
to be if you really kind of pay attention right
from the history of this rivalry. And so I think
it's gonna be chippy tomorrow. Yeah, And like, do you

(45:46):
want to have that twice in the same year? I
don't know, Man, do you want your pleasure to go
like that twice a year? I don't know. I think
keep it till one just because it makes it special.
Now I'm all about, like we talked about a few
weeks ago, I'm all about moving the game to Big
Thursday again, and that third Thursday in October. And of
course you keep the home at home. You don't do

(46:08):
like in the past what it was, but you still
call it Big Thursday, and the game would be by
itself on ESPN. And and you know, a major college
football game on a Thursday night, you know, you know
people in the South are going to watch that over NFL.
You and I both know that, And I just think
it would be That's the thing. If they're gonna move
this game, and I think eventually it will be because

(46:30):
of the nine game schedule. Move it to big Thursday.
Don't open it up the season with it, you know.
I think moving it to Thursday, get ESPN and ABC
to try to figure out, you know, what they can
do to help the two conferences get this game on
a Thursday, because I think it'd be great for ESPN
because they'll get what they want, right and then I

(46:50):
think Clinton South Carolina both get what they want. And
I know some fans out there like, but well we
got to work on Friday, what are you doing? And
then you know, get over that, you know, because it'll
make Clemson South Carolina stand out that nobody else in
the country does with her. They would be doing from
a rivalry standpoint, and it would just it would be fun.

(47:13):
It would be nostalgic at the same time, especially when
they play the games in Columbia. And then the state
could make it a nash A State holiday like they
did back in the day, and that means what that
means the banks and stuff like that closed, so a
lot of people can go to the game.

Speaker 2 (47:28):
If you do that again. Will Vanderwore hanging out with
us here on the program. He is on Twitter at
Steeler Will. He covers the Clemson Tigers for the Clemson
Insider dot com. Will. So, you mentioned the rivalry and
what it means to you is a kid that grew
up in Bamberg. What was your first Clemson South Carolina game?
What's your first memory maybe of this rivalry?

Speaker 7 (47:52):
My first memory is the catch with Jerry Butler in
nineteen seventy seven. This is my first memory. I really
didn't know what was going on, to be honest with you,
because I'm five years old. You know that, you know
you're not getting you know, you're really just kind of
starting to know what football is at that point. And
so I was sitting down on the ground just playing

(48:13):
with my toys in the living room in the den,
and I remember my my mom and my stepdad and
my brother and my other brother watching the game and
just the elation when Jared Butler made the catch. And
I'm sitting there looking at everybody as or celebrating, like
letting the crap are they doing?

Speaker 3 (48:35):
Like?

Speaker 7 (48:35):
You know, like why is everybody going so crazy right now?
You know? And and of course I looked at the
TV and of course to catch up that and coincidentally,
that was the first Punsy Carolina game ever to be
on TV, was that nineteen seventy seven game, and it
turned out to be a classic. What better game to
get on TV first than that one, right for that

(48:55):
for a rivalry, and you know, to have that Indean
Clinton with the twenty four to nothing league South Carolina
comes back, take the lead, has a sit, has the
shirts where it says, you know, no cigars today, you know,
and they're holding it up in front of the cameras,
and then Jerry Butler makes a catch where Steve Fuller
admitted to me a few years ago and when I
wrote the book The Hidden History of Clinton Football, he

(49:18):
admitted to me that he was throwing the ball away.
He said, Butler goes up and makes that catch, and
he's like, holy prap, he caught it. Couldn't believe it,
and so you know, it was, uh, that's my first memory,
so kind of was I kind of was like, oh, okay,
this is uh, this is pretty interesting. Still didn't really

(49:38):
know what it was, and I knew my family was happy.

Speaker 2 (49:41):
You know, It's funny. Our age difference isn't that much.
Will But I have no recollection of football on television
before cable, Like I remember when we just had a
few channels, but I don't. I was too young two
appreciate like a game being on, if that makes sense,

(50:03):
Like I just I mean, I remember like Sesame Street
being on, but I don't remember sports on television before
cable came around in the mid eighties.

Speaker 7 (50:13):
And then I would say probably you know my second
memory that and then from this point on, I've remembered
every Carolina Clempson game. It would have been the eighty
one season that was. That game was on ESPN, I
believe that year, and the oranges being thrown on the
fields there in Columbia. I remember that like yesterday, and
just that was a fun memory. And and you know,

(50:34):
just watching Clempson, you know, wrap up an undefeated season.
That was pretty special. And I remember I had just
had excitement. I was nine years old that year and
really was kind of just knew kind of what football was,
started playing it, and you know, it was it was fun, man,
it was that was a I remember everything about that
eighty one season and uh, that game in particular, you know,

(50:58):
with them throwing the oranges on the was was pretty
fun to watch, and for them to be doing it
in Columbia was even better.

Speaker 1 (51:06):
Uh.

Speaker 7 (51:06):
I think that's what made it special was that Clempson
went there and wrapped up their regular, undefeated regular season
that year, and and the and the fans just tossing
the oranges on the onto the South Carolina Turfs and
their fans had to watch it.

Speaker 3 (51:18):
It was great.

Speaker 2 (51:19):
What's the first Well, what's the first one? Will that
you attended? You know that? I mean, I know the
first one I went to was the twenty one to
twenty one tie in eighty six when I was nine
years old. But what about you?

Speaker 7 (51:30):
Yours is a little bit better than mine. My first
one I attended was the eighty seven game. That's the
Rodney game. Oh yeah, so uh so.

Speaker 2 (51:40):
Uh that was uh, you know, was it seven? Maybe?
Was that the final score twenty nine to seven? Was
that Brad Edwards interception return.

Speaker 7 (51:49):
Brad Edwards twenty to seven? Crimpson's trying to drive there
late in the game to try to take the lead,
and Edwards intercepts the pass and takes it I think
seventy something yard for a touchdown and they win twenty
to seven, that seal they with victory for him, that
was a It was a really good physical football game.
That was the you know, that was one of South
Carolina's better teams under Morrison and and of course Pumpson

(52:13):
was I think in the top ten that going into
that game was nine and one, and you know, I
was looking I think regardless they were going to Sitres
Bowl because of the the way the Accalian was Sitres
Bowl that year those years. But yeah, that was my
first one going to in person, and uh yeah, that

(52:34):
kind of kind of kind of sucked. There's a lot
there's another thing that happened to me in the game
that I that I won't talk about, but it made
my disdain for Gamecark fans even more.

Speaker 2 (52:43):
Well, my first one, yeah, my first one in Colombia
was two years later. That was forty five. Nothing. That
was a good one to be at.

Speaker 7 (52:50):
So see, you had a good one. See I didn't
get to go to that one.

Speaker 2 (52:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (52:54):
You know, that's the game where our good friend Lavon
Kirkland always says that's the game where Clinson started collecting
rent when they went to Columbia.

Speaker 2 (53:03):
Man, Well it's you know, it really has been a
place over at Williams Brice Stadium. The Clemson has played
well over the years, especially really since that that game
back in nineteen eighty nine. But you know, you look
at these two teams, Will and I said this, I said.
You may have seen my post on social media. I said, look,

(53:25):
if you hit me the script, you know, and you
just have Team A and Team B and the script
says Team A punches Team B in the face for
three and a half hours. I don't see a way
that that's Clemson. I don't think Clempson is going into
Williams Brice Stadium, will and just taking control of this game.
Based off of the way they've played this year, I
think I'd have to lean in on that. That must

(53:47):
be South Carolina. This is doing the punching. Do you
see any way that Clemson goes in there tomorrow and
finds a way to take control of that ball game.

Speaker 7 (53:57):
I mean, it's Clemson capable, sure. I mean if you
look at the Florida State game, that's a game where
Clemsy came out punched and from the beginning and never
let up. And you know, I think Clemson is capable
of playing that way. And I think if they do,
if they play like they did against Florida State, then
they win the game, and they will win it by

(54:18):
you know, double digits. I believe, because you know, I
do think Clemson has an advantage on one side of
the ball. That's clear advantage, and that's when Carolina has
the football. And what I mean by that is Carolina's
offensive line. As bad as Clemson's offensive line has been

(54:38):
this year, and it has been, Carolina's is worse. And
that's what's crazy. But when you look at the numbers,
numbers don't lie, you know, and they've given up thirty
eight sacks. Now, some of those are on Lenora Sellers,
which is he's trying to extend plays to make plays, right, Yeah,
but still thirty eight sacks. I think that's worse than

(54:59):
the SEC. And then they've given up eighty two tackles
for a loss, which is next to last in the ACC.
When you look and flip it and compare it to
Clinton's offensive line, Clemson's given up only sixteen sacks, which
is like number four in the ACC. And they've only
allowed fifty four tackles for a loss, which is, you know,

(55:21):
in the top five of the ACC. And tackles for
a loss allowed. So and then when you look at okay,
but you look at the straight matchup Clemson's defensive line
against their offensive line, Carolina has given up about eight
tackles for a loss per game, Clemson's averaging right around
seven that the defensive line is getting the defensive front

(55:42):
is getting. So Clinton's got seventy three tackles for a
loss on the season and twenty eight sacks. So that
tells me Clinton has a chance to go and win
that died off the line of scrimmage. Now on the
flip side, I think South Carolina can win Clemson be
Clemson's offensive line obviously. I think South Orln's defensive line
is very good and will give Clemson some fits too,

(56:03):
but they haven't been as dominant. Twenty one sacks, sixty
tackles for a loss. You think that defensive line, you know,
especially considering they got Dylan Stewart over there, who might
be the best player on the field when Clemson has
the ball, right, you know, they only got sixty tackles
for a loss on the season and only twenty one sacks,
so they really haven't been getting after the quarterback other

(56:25):
than the Alabama game. They did a good job against Alabama.
So my whole point in all this is if I
think if Clemson, I think Clemson's offense is good enough
to go win the game, if Clemson's defense is controlling
things on the other side, and listen, Lowton, I'm gonna
tell you man, there's no way and Tom Allen are

(56:47):
letting number sixteen beat him with his legs. It's not
gonna happen tomorrow. There's one thing I can say going
into the Mars game that's not gonna happen. If Lenora
Steller's beating them with their legs, he's gonna have to
beat them with the arm. I think CLK is going
to do everything they can to keep him bottle up
and not allow him to get outside where he can
be Leonora Sellers and be Superman. You know. So that's

(57:09):
gonna be a nice little matchup to watch as you
watch this game. Tomar in my opinion, well.

Speaker 2 (57:14):
And I'll throw something else into kind of that fire too.
You think about the criticism that you know, TJ. Parker
and Peter Woods have had, like it's one thing to say, oh, yeah,
you know, these guys, they're great teams. Are focused on them.
But you and I both watched great defensive linemen that

(57:36):
teams were focused on, like Christian Wilkins and Dexeter Lawrence
dominate games and show up and you saw them pop
off the screen. And these two guys are still considered
in the minds eye of some as being you know,
first round draft picks in the NFL. Nothing would help
their calls in the mind's eye of Clemson fans right
then to go out and be dominant this weekend against

(57:58):
the game Cocks.

Speaker 7 (58:00):
Look, you know I wrote, I wrote a column yesterday
on Kate Klemnek and his legacy at Clemson, and this
game me was gonna play a big role in that
for him, right And granted that when we look back
ten years from now, we're not really going to say, oh, Woods,
and you know it was their legacy, you know what

(58:22):
they did in this game, but people are gonna remember, Like, so,
if they go out there and just get handed to
them and they look like they have at times this
year where they don't look like first round draft picks, yeah,
then I think Clemson fans are going to remember that,
and there are going to be kind of, you know, hard,
a little bit hard on them. So, but if they
go out there and play the way they're supposed to
and they dominate like you mentioned, like those other guys did,

(58:44):
like Cleveland Ferrell and and and and Dexter Lawrence and
you know Pushtian Wilkins and Ben Boulware. You know, those
guys dominated South Carolina when they had their opportunities. That's
what That's what these guys have to do. I think
for their legacy, you know, and they would have a

(59:05):
winning they would have the same record that you know,
Kate Klemmick would have. They would get, you know, winning
record against the Game Cars. I think for their legacy. Yeah,
I think for them, they really need to win this
game tomorrow. They really do, in my opinion, because they've
been a disappointment. I think any fan will tell you that.
And they can really make up for that if they
go out there and ball tomorrow against the Game Cars
and really and the key is shutting down South Carolina's

(59:27):
run game and make make Lenor Sales have to be
them with the pass, and that's the key to the game.
So it's going to be up to those guys because
South Carolina they're only averaging one hundred and what is it,
one hundred and one hundred and seventeen yards a game rushing.
I think they're like next to last or last or
last in the SBS of the FBS in in rushing

(59:49):
the football and running the football. So they're averaging only
three point three yards per carry. If you close this front,
defensive front, you gotta shut that down, and you got
to make no sellers be the only guy on the
field that's gonna give them a chance to win, and
he has to do it with his arm. That's what
you got to do tomorrow, and I think it's up
to those guys to make sure they do it.

Speaker 2 (01:00:09):
Final thing, will I guess South Carolina? You know they're
not going bowling, so this is their bowl game. And
for Clemson, they secured a bull berth last week with
their victory over Furman. How big of an impact could
that have potentially for South Carolina? Sort of knowing because
I think if the shoe were on the other foot,
we would both say, well, this is Clemson's ball game,

(01:00:30):
so they're going to be locked in and focused. I mean,
could that be a factor at all?

Speaker 7 (01:00:35):
It can be. But here's an interesting stat for you.
I went back and looked when Clemson has been average
right in this rivalry since nineteen seventy seven, Okay, regardless
of location and South Carolina has been bad. Clemson is
eighteen and six in these games. So twenty four other

(01:00:56):
times Clinton has gone into this game with this kind
of scenario talking about right now, and they've won eighteen times.
So history kills me. Clinton is gonna win the game, right,
And so it doesn't mean I mean, there are six
times when they didn't, but eighteen out of twenty four
is a pretty good ratio. And then there's another stat
for you, since that nineteen seventy seven in Colombia, a

(01:01:20):
couple of numbers for you. So since nineteen seventy seven
in Colombia, Clinton is eighteen and six in Colombia in
those twenty four games, which that's amazing, and you know
you're you're eighteen and six in Colombia. And uh yes,
since nineteen seventy six, uh Clinson is they've won five
straight as we know going into this one in Colombia.

(01:01:43):
And then in day games games kicked them off at
noon or one o'clock. Since nineteen eighty one, Clinton's nine
and two in those games. The numbers. I'll say, you
take your money and put put it on clinchon. So
that's what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna put my money
on clunches.

Speaker 2 (01:01:57):
There you go.

Speaker 7 (01:01:58):
I'm gonna go.

Speaker 2 (01:01:59):
Van Dervoord Will Man appreciate your tim again. You can
follow his coverage on the Clempson Insider dot com and
he's on Twitter at Steeler Will Will Thanks for joining us. Man,
Hope you had a great Thanksgiving and we'll talk to
you next week.

Speaker 7 (01:02:11):
All right, Thanks so much, buddy. Always fun talk to.

Speaker 2 (01:02:13):
You, buddy. They go quick. Great, We'll come back with
more here on a Friday afternoon. Rivalry week in the
state of South Carolina and across the country. Stay with
us on a Friday afternoon. Tommy Ballden, former Clemson Tiger
head coach, joins us ahead of Clemson to South Carolina. Coach.
Hope you had a great Thanksgiving and welcome in.

Speaker 1 (01:02:31):
Yeah. Should be a great that you will get two
Saturdays in a row more or less with the games
on today and tomorrow. So should be a great fourty
eight hours next two days.

Speaker 2 (01:02:40):
Yeah, no question about it. And I know this game
for you means so much after being the head coach
at Clemson in the success I think you guys had.
As a matter of fact, the other day, I'm sure
I wasn't the only person that threw on that sixty
three seventeen matchup in Williams Brice Stadium. I even watched
the low Holtz post game show. I mean, he was
so sad head coach, it was. That was a big one.

Speaker 1 (01:03:05):
Yeah, that was you know. Uh, I can remember specifly
the week before Coach Holds had taken over the secondaries
and was watching foul and they played a lot of
certain covers of too deep, too deep safeties then, and uh,
we just had so many ways, who discovered so many
ways to beat that coverage, and we're gonna We're gonna
do it until they came out of it. And it
never came out of it. We just kept attacking middle

(01:03:28):
throws down the deep middle, and they got kind of
stubborn and he cost him well.

Speaker 2 (01:03:34):
I saw an interview with Charlie Whitehurst a couple of
days ago, and uh, he was asked about his unlimited
bar tab that he now has in Clemson because of
that game and his performance against South Carolina. He said,
but the funny thing is he said, it's always guys
that are buying me drinks. He says, never, never girls guys.

Speaker 1 (01:03:54):
Yeah, that's a that's a that's the heckful problem to have.

Speaker 2 (01:03:57):
And oh man, well, well let's talk about this game
in particular. I was on the radio in Atlanta earlier
and they asked me my thoughts on it. My biggest
concern is this coach. I don't know about what these
two teams measure up like head to head, but I
know South Carolina has you know, we talked about iron

(01:04:18):
sharpens iron. They have played much tougher competition than Clemson,
in my opinion, and they have played better against that competition,
and that concerns me. Is there anything to that that
the damos when he always says, it's not who you play,
it's how you play, And I get that. But South
Carolina has played some really good teams and they've played

(01:04:40):
really well against several of them.

Speaker 1 (01:04:42):
All those points you mentioned are valid, and I think
their Accurates schedule is a little bit tougher. They've probably
played a little bit better. They had some really tough
fourth quarter games against you know, top ten, top twenty,
top fifteen competition, and the only thing is is an
a rivalry. Sometimes in the gates advantages like that because
it is a live But if both teams revert back

(01:05:05):
to the consistency they've shown all year, then like you said,
I think the favorite the advantage is going to go
to South Carolina, especially playing at home.

Speaker 2 (01:05:14):
Yeah again South Carolina and Clemson tomorrow at noon? Coaches,
is that better for Clemson that it's not a night game?
I mean that sixty three seventeen was a night game.
And Clemson has played great in Williams. Brice Stadium in
my life I'm forty eight. They've been spectacular in Columbia.
But does it matter? I mean the game day, night game?

(01:05:34):
I mean, does it matter?

Speaker 1 (01:05:35):
No, it really does, especially in a library game, because
once the game kicks off, this occurrence is on the field,
the swing momentum, you know, big plays and kickoff return.
I think one year had to be a Clemson but
we opened the game with a big hit on their
kickoff return. They phone ball, We got the ball scored early.
It's things like that that happened back in the game.

(01:05:58):
More so is it night is as who won their
last games, whose records which I think once of kicks off.
It's the plays that happened that determine momentum swings and
then that's so he's turnovers and things like that, they
determined the game.

Speaker 2 (01:06:13):
Again, Tommy Bowden hanging out with us here on the
program as we get you ready for Clemson in South
Carolina tomorrow at noon. We'll have Coach on four a
couple of segments Coach. When Clemson was led by guys
like Christian Wilkins and Dexter Lawrence on the defensive line,
it felt like those guys showed up every single week.

(01:06:33):
And then this year you got Peter Woods and TJ.
Parker and I'm not seeing them flash and jump off
the screen, but yet they're still projected to be first
round NFL draft picks. Are you surprised that those guys
haven't had a bigger impact for Clemson And is there
any reason in particular that you would say one group

(01:06:54):
of guys shows up even when everybody knows they are
the guys that they have to stop, and then another
group doesn't really jump off the page when everybody knows
they're the group that you have to stop. Because I'm
surprised that we haven't seen more from both of those
guys this season.

Speaker 1 (01:07:09):
You know there are there are tangibles that you have
to take into consideration, and I think sometimes either enhance
or decrease them the performance, especially in defensive line. For example,
I give you an example number one. Those guys get
in the gap or get on the shoulder and office line,
and their job is to penetrate upfield, create a new
line of scrimmage two yards on the other side of

(01:07:29):
line scrimmage and knock anything pulling, knock anything off its path,
but create have it in their backfield. The other thing
is for the defensive tackle to be a little more
squared in his stance and read the hat of the
offensive lineman, go inside outside, play with your hands, gap protects,
and then play football. So that termines a lot of

(01:07:51):
times the productivity of especially defensive lineman. Defensive then on
what kind of style of talk I might show with
Tom Allen is teaching and whether revenables. It seems like
might know more of a penetrating create chaos kind of
philosophy which allowed those guys to shine and co create
a single box more more man box than I just

(01:08:12):
I don't know Tom Allen's background and how those defensive
guys are taught now as far as technique and reading skills.

Speaker 2 (01:08:18):
Well, and based off of what you've seen coach with
Lenora Sellers, South Carolina's quarterback and what he did against
close in a year ago. Uh, we have about a
minute and a half until the break. What would be
your game plan to make him beat you? And what'd
your game plan be to make him beat you throwing
the ball?

Speaker 1 (01:08:35):
Yeah, well number one, I think you've got to contain
and don't let it get still in the place. Most
passing plays a long are two point eight seconds. That's
a play actually pass two point eight seconds. So in
defensive mind, in practice, defensive players are trained to cover
their guys for a little over two seconds. Didn't they
get lazy and Cyany gets bad gets bad, They look

(01:08:56):
back in the backfield, and his ability to make the
play last score in two point eight three seconds really
puts the defense at an uncomfortable position from a skill standpoint.
So I think containing him and then when he runs
you really have to rally. It has to be a
team effort on him. Enough, he's he can make most
linebackers miss one on one in the open field, so

(01:09:19):
he has to have great pursuit. So I say number
one keeping him contained, and then number two is is
be able to rally and tackling. I don't think you can.
You know, if you confuse him and he doesn't know
where to go to the ball, then it makes him run.
I don't know where where the head and throwing they
doesn't run the ball.

Speaker 2 (01:09:38):
That's a great point. That's a great point. Tommy Bowden
with us here on the program today with a quick break.
We'll come back with more from coach, some of his
memories from the rivalry and maybe what he would plan
to do offensively with a guy like kay Clubnick hetting
into this matchup. Keep it a lot right here on
Fox Sports Radio fourteen hundred. Back at It, the Show
that shakes the south Land. Clemsones Sports saw Tommy Bowden

(01:09:59):
with us here for a few more minutes. Coach, we
talked before the break about the strategies that Clemps's defense
might implore in this game to kind of slow down
the North Sellers. Well, Clympson has got a veteran quarterback
in Kate Clumnick, and yeah, he hasn't played great throughout
this season. He's been a little bit banged up, but
nonetheless he is a veteran at this point in his career,

(01:10:19):
his final game in this rivalry. Uh, if you were
the head coach at Clympson, if you were Dablos Sweeney,
or maybe you were the offensive coordinator Garrett Riley, I mean,
what would you want to do with Kate Clumnick in
this ball game to maybe present yourself with a chance
to win in Williams Brice Stadium.

Speaker 1 (01:10:37):
You know, yes, South John has to go to put
some pressure on you. I think, Lord, if I was
going to in his dropback game, I think o a
game behind this way. In the drop back game, let's
walk on some five to seven yard out slants stitches
that takes about one point one second one point two
and then go to a bit deeper five step drop
at your ten yard hooks, your ouse, your deep balls,

(01:11:00):
throw them off a five step drop which is about
two point three two point five seconds, and work on
most cycle routes getting the ball off quick in the
pocket and then at times move the pockets, flashing pass boots, waggles, neckads,
things like that. They'll move the pocket. They won't let
them front four hone in and do a bunch of

(01:11:20):
stunning and twisting, move the pocket and make those guys
contain them. Now, when you do that, you widen the end,
which creates some pretty good running opportunities off tackle when
those guys have to widen the outside conscious about him
breaking containment, you know, with certain pass calls. So I
think the three step drop, five step drop routs a
compliment that hanging and then move the pocket with some

(01:11:43):
boots and waggles and neckids, you know, things like that
for the make it difficult for defensive corey to hone
in with a certain call.

Speaker 2 (01:11:52):
Coach taking a look at the fact too, that South
Carolina doesn't have a bowl game after this, I mean,
this is this is their ball game essentially. I don't
know about focus and YadA YadA, Like you say it's
a rivalry game, but I mean does that matter at
all that this is it for them? I mean, if
you flip the strip right and you put it say Clemson,

(01:12:13):
this is it for you, I would imagine my thought
would be, Man, they're going to be locked in, They're
going to be dialed into this game. What do you
what do you think about that?

Speaker 1 (01:12:21):
No, Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up. That is
a big reason. If you heard Brittvinalls talk about beating
Alabama in Alabama in Testelation, what a great challenge, what
a great history maker for Oklahoma. And it's kind of
the same thing in the South Counts game. South Chount
conn not go to bowl game, and you got to
think the bowl game that Counts won't go to is

(01:12:41):
not the one that they anticipated. And now you've got
the transfer port where players getting paid regards to whether
they win or lose, or whether the kind of bowl
game they go to. The incentives the hidden sentate. I
think they're definitely a South Coune favored because this is
their championship game, this is their bowl game and their
biggest rivalry can really put a black mark on their

(01:13:02):
season with.

Speaker 3 (01:13:03):
A win today.

Speaker 1 (01:13:04):
So yeah, I think they're important. I think the coaches
talk about them, the players are rare them, and I
do think it's it's a definitely an extra incentive.

Speaker 2 (01:13:13):
Well, South Carolina, they already came out, by the way,
Tommy Ballten hanging out with us here on the program
and said that they're standing behind Shane Beemer even though
it's been a down season for them. Do you I
mean I don't know what it's like to be an
administrator at you know, the college football level. And I
don't want to diminish the South Carolina job. Certainly the
Clemson fans will say, Swane, diminish it, diminish it. But

(01:13:35):
when you got openings at LSU, and you got openings
at Florida and potentially an opening coming up at Old
Miss and all the different spots, like, are there just
years where a coach, maybe this is the wrong way
to put it, is afforded a bad season because having
an opening isn't an optimal situation for your for your program.

(01:13:55):
Does that make sense?

Speaker 1 (01:13:56):
Oh yeah, oh yeah, I think you're definitely right, because
I heard it now in you this morning. There's more
you paid musical chairs, there's more chairs, and there's players.
There's more opening than right now that would seem qualified
coaches for that type of job. And who are you
going to place with Shane Peener with? I think in

(01:14:17):
Florida State struggle with the same thing. They look at
what was available and say, hey, probably going to do
better this year. This sets out when we are I
think South Time made a wise decision. So I think
what you're talking about definitely winning consideration. The available talent
for that job is not as plentiful as it would see.

(01:14:39):
Maybe the fan base thanks they hasn't and administration looks.

Speaker 2 (01:14:42):
At all of that, and there's probably guys coach I
would imagine that would look at South Carolina as a
stepping stone job too. If I can go to South Carolina,
then maybe I can build my profile and go to
I don't know, Michigan. We'll pick a bigger program. But
I'm not sure Shane Biemer feels that way. Like I
think Shane Beemer is plenty happy where he is, and

(01:15:06):
I really don't foresee him really wanting to go anywhere.
He said he doesn't want to go anywhere, and so
I think you would also have to look at it
in that respect too, that some guys view that job
as a stepping stone job, and I think Shane Biemer
se says the spot he would stay as long as
he could.

Speaker 1 (01:15:22):
I think you're right, and I think I look at
Dabbler in a very summlar situation. You know, not a
not a not a coordinator offensive defense with an impressive
resume to dabb will build up carry on. Phillips took
a chance took the leap of faith and it paid off.
I think Shane Shane was never a coordinator. He didn't
have a resumet y. When Ancoln, Riley, Brent Bibles, even

(01:15:43):
Neil Brown, some of these coordinators that bounced around to
consistently do well at big programs, he didn't have that.
So I think he senses the stuff really went on
a little bit of a limb to get him that job.
And I know he wants to do it. He wants
to prove them that they made the right to say,
but I don't think he would. I think because of that,

(01:16:04):
he sees South Carolina in his career, his professional path,
a gym job, a stopping point for him finishing his career.
So I do think he has that kind of respect
and admiration for the South Carolina job.

Speaker 2 (01:16:18):
Final question with Tommy Bowden coach, just about a minute
left here in the segment. What do you think this
game comes down to tomorrow at Williams Brice Stadium.

Speaker 1 (01:16:26):
I think it's gonna be which scene can make big plays,
and especially from the quarterback position, either paid with a
big scramble or a big throw type. To Lauris, it
would be more of a big scramble. I mean, you
can say things like turnover, whoever runs the ball. Those
are patented answers, but I think the game likes this.
It comes down to the person that's taking the ball

(01:16:48):
under arms the boasts, and that's the quarterback, even in
match teams. So the quarterback, I think here you look
at the Super Bowl Hens, Brady Mahomes and Jana Hurt.
It's the quarterback that they plays in the big games.
So I think the games will come down to one
of those two guys playing right now above what they
have played the season. And if they do that, I

(01:17:09):
think that bad team's gonna win.

Speaker 2 (01:17:11):
Certainly feels like Clemson if they get their hands on
the Norse Sellers the guy getting to the ground tomorrow, coach,
thank you again, enjoy your Thanksgiving the rest of your
Thanksgiving holiday, and we'll talk to you real soon.

Speaker 1 (01:17:23):
Enjoy game.

Speaker 2 (01:17:24):
There you go. That's Tommy Bouden here on a Friday afternoon.
All right, well we come back our prediction on Clemson
in South Carolina. Stay with us.

Speaker 8 (01:17:32):
What have you done for me lately? It's a fair question.
Just don't lose sight of the bigger picture. Don't forget history.
Lucky for us at Clemson, the answer to the questions
what have you done for me lately? And what have
you done? Always are the same. We win.

Speaker 2 (01:18:44):
Final segment on a Friday Man rivalry week Clemson South Carolina. Well,
this is the one you've been waiting for. This is
the one you've been waiting for. It again. Thanks to
our friends at Alumni Hall right there on the corner
of Campus College Avenue downtown Clemson for supporting us throughout
the college football campaign. And don't forget hey man, they're
open touring basketball season as well and online at Alumni

(01:19:04):
Hall dot com. Go check them out today. Next time
you're up in Tigertown, it's Alumni Hall where Tiger fans shop.
All right, whoo? This one man I saw. I was
on the radio with Heath Climb, who was a local
radio show host here in Columbia for years. He was
he's in Atlanta filling in over the weekend, and one

(01:19:25):
of the questions he was asking me about, you know
what do I think about the game. This is earlier today.
This is before the conversations with will Van Dervoard, before
the conversations with Tommy Bowden. You know what do I
think about, you know, how I see this game, and
I said, you know, I really, for the first time
in a long time, South Carolina's favored twelve seasons, and

(01:19:48):
I think it's rightfully so. And this is what I
said to Heath. I said, Look, if Clemson and South
Carolina had played up to the expectations that people had
for them preseason college Football playoff implications, both teams may
be destined to be in. I still think South Carolina

(01:20:09):
would be favored at this point, even though Clemson was
favored at the beginning of the season. I think if
both teams had played as good as they could play,
South Carolina at home would be favored because I think
that the competition that they would have played up until
this point would have boosted their resume more so than
had Clemson mowed down SMU or Duke or whoever. And

(01:20:35):
that's just not the case. Clemson didn't do that, and
South Carolina didn't live up to their expectations either. But
I don't think it's wrong that the game Cocks are
currently favored even though they are a team with just
four wins. So how does Clemson win this game? I
think that is the sixty four thousand dollars question, because

(01:20:57):
what you haven't seen from Clemson is consistence. And as
I said earlier in the week, if you hand me
the script, and the script is team A punches, team
be in the face for three and a half hours,
I think it's South Carolina wins this game. But if
it's a battle, and if it's a slugfest, I think
Clemson can win that. Now, I think Clemson fans would

(01:21:18):
prefer to go in there in sixty three seventeen, this
thing right, and put up twenty one points so fast
that game cut fans are leaving before you sit down.
But you haven't seen that from Clemson this year to
make you believe that that's even possible. That would be
a way to win this game. Though. For Clemson, come
out and sort of stun South Carolina, stun them to

(01:21:41):
the point of where the four and seven begins to
ring in their ears, the resignation of the fact that
they're not going to a bowl game rings in their ears,
and just get some playing off kilter because they're facing
it's like they're facing the end. You're facing the end
of the season, and now you're down fourteen. Can you
muster up the fire to get back in that game.

(01:22:02):
I don't think Clemson. I don't think that would be Clemson,
like pounding them in the face for three and a
half hours if something like that happened. But that's a
way for Clemson to win this game. Come out, steal
the momentum and put South Carolina in a position where
in betwixt their ears, all they can think about is
this is it? And how do we get back? Then
that flips the pressure onto them to perform. That makes

(01:22:23):
leonor Sellers try to make plays that maybe he shouldn't
try to make, and then maybe that leads to some
turnovers that eventually helps Clemson. But if you listen to
me on the radio in Atlanta, I said this, and
until listening to Tommy about nine minute, it's tough for
me to see Clemson coming out of this game with
a victory because South Carolina the old adage, as I mentioned,

(01:22:49):
with coach iron sharpens iron, and Clemson hasn't faced the
type of iron that South Carolina has. But I do
think from a talent standpoint, top to bottom, Clemson is better.
I think Will Van Dervoort made some good points about
South Carolina's offensive line struggling, and that's where I'm gonna

(01:23:13):
lean in on TJ. Parker. Peter Woods will help to
mant take a part Clemson's defensive line even without Losson
jam Lawson being out, even without Losson, I think Clemson's
defensive line has to take over. And if they do,

(01:23:34):
and if they can get Lenora Sellis to the ground,
Clemson wins this game. But that's gotta happen. So I'm
making my projection, my prediction, my my hypothesis, or whatever
comes down to believing that those guys on the defensive
line are going to play better against the South Carolina

(01:23:59):
game Cocks in the head against anybody else. I would
argue South Carolina's offensive line probably mid tier versus what
Clemson's face may be on the bottom side of that
given their stats, But I think their stats are what
they are because of who they played. Clemson's defense shows
up the Tigers win. I think it'll be a good win.
I'll take Clemson, probably against my better judgment based off

(01:24:23):
of what I've seen this year, but I'm gonna lean
in on the trust that the offensive line for Carolina
will not hold up and will force the Norse Sellers
to make some mistakes. Clemson survives WILLIAMS. Brice Stadium twenty
seven twenty one final score. Clemson wins it. All right,
we'll see if we're right on Monday. Until then, as always,
you'll take care now and go Tigers