Cincy 360 -- Austin Elmore with Joe Danneman

Austin talks Bengals with Joe Danneman from FOX19 on ESPN 1530!

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Sir, Sincy three sixty about Cincinnati from Cincinnati, sponsored in
part by Cinci Shirts. Cincy Shirts all sincey all day.
This is ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.

Speaker 2 (00:14):
Hi, Hello, welcome in our number two of Sincy three sixty.

Speaker 3 (00:19):
Already on a Tuesday.

Speaker 2 (00:21):
Our two brought to you by our friends at Cincy Shirts.
I'm ast to know Moore, know Tony today, tone back tomorrow,
but we do have are regularly scheduled Tuesday at one pm. Guest,
and it's our guy from Fox nineteen, Joey d Joe
Daniman joins us.

Speaker 3 (00:40):
Hi, Joe, how are you.

Speaker 4 (00:42):
Austin?

Speaker 5 (00:43):
Would you say that the vibes around the Bengals in
the last twenty four hours have gone from optimistic to
atrociously low.

Speaker 4 (00:54):
Oh?

Speaker 3 (00:54):
Yes, that is a perfect way to describe it.

Speaker 4 (00:59):
Well, crociously low.

Speaker 3 (01:01):
What the heck happened?

Speaker 4 (01:05):
I don't know.

Speaker 5 (01:06):
So I go back to yesterday and let's start with Trey,
and I know we'll talk about Trey and Shamar because
that's what we went to yesterday's free training camp Coaches
Front Office Media Day armed with questions about the two
big talkers in Cincinnati that had become two really big
talkers across the entire league, and with Trey Hendrickson, the

(01:27):
optimistic language that we heard from Duke Tobin and we
heard from Mike Brown, and some of the words and
some of the phrases we heard them say were soon
or the sooner the better, or we want to give
him a raise, if we want to give him an extension.
I wonder if some of that optimism just came from

(01:49):
the fact that they've been here before with Trey. They
know it's an emotional negotiation. Mike Brown talked about that yesterday.
He said it can be difficult negotiate with Tray because
he's emotional, but also it always comes back to a
place of they find a.

Speaker 4 (02:06):
Way to get him on the field.

Speaker 5 (02:09):
And so maybe us in the media, the people that
were there or the people that are reading the comments
and follow this team maybe misconstrued a little bit some
of the optimism that it felt like it was close,
and we heard the language of soon or sooner than later,
that it might be something that could get done and
get him here in time for the start of training camp,

(02:30):
where maybe in the back of the mind with the
Bengals is listen, this might take a couple more weeks.

Speaker 4 (02:36):
It might take several more weeks, but we always.

Speaker 5 (02:38):
Know we get Trey back on the field when it counts.
And I wonder if that's you know, institutional knowledge of
knowing that they're going to get there because they've gotten
there in the past when Tray was driving some of
that optimism yesterday.

Speaker 2 (02:53):
When it comes to guaranteed money, which this seems to
be the sticking point, we're not unfamiliar with that being
a sticking point. Why shouldn't the Bengals from their perspective,
why shouldn't they give Trey Hendrickson guaranteed money beyond year one?

Speaker 4 (03:11):
Well, I think they should.

Speaker 5 (03:12):
And Duke Tobn talked yesterday about the evolution of contracts,
not just you knowing Cincinnati, but across the league, and
he talked about the evolution of guaranteed money and how
things have trickled down in the draft that now goes
sometimes deeper into the second round, and there have been
positive evolutions for players, but he also said there have

(03:34):
to be positive evolutions for clubs. And I get what
he's saying, but.

Speaker 4 (03:39):
In this case, it feels like the Bengals hands are
tied because they don't know what else they have at
that position.

Speaker 5 (03:46):
And this isn't just a position, this is a premium
position in the NFL. And we all know that finding
guys who can rush to quarterback and disrupt offenses is hard,
and we seen the Bengals try to do it, and
they've taken swings at it in recent years and they've
whipped outside of bringing in a guy that they didn't

(04:08):
draft in Trey Hendrickson. You know, I still think there's
upside for Joseph Osai. I don't know anybody's giving up
on Miles Murphy, but I don't think we can count
on him right now to be a star player or
developed into that. And certainly we have no idea what's
going to happen with Shamar Stewart as the seasons now
what six seven weeks away, So I feel like the

(04:29):
Bengals don't have a choice but to give Trey Hendrickson
an extension.

Speaker 4 (04:35):
And that's the thing.

Speaker 5 (04:36):
And you know, Duke was asked by several people, including
myself yesterday that you know, considering what TJ. Watt's gotten
and what now Miles Garrett's being paid, does Trey deserve
a raise? And maybe that's not the right language from us,
because this has never been about just a raise for Trey.
This has been about extension, the security the years, and

(04:59):
guarantee money after year one for a guy like Trey
Henderson is a must because what's the contract extension without
a guarantee. It's just it's just a It's just a
piece of paper. So I think they kind of go
hand in hand that if they're going to give him
an extension and more money and the raids that Duke

(05:19):
Tobin and Mike Brown both said that he deserves yesterday,
it's got to come with a guarantee. Now, how much
of that percentage is guaranteed? I think maybe we're we're
getting stuck right here between the two sides. But until
this thing is resolved, I'm not sure we're going to
know what actually was the sticking point. Was it the
percentage of guaranteed money or was it a third year

(05:43):
that Trey Henderson wanted on top of it? Because I
certainly think the Bengals understand they should and have to
pay him more, But the question is how many more
years and how much of that are they going to guarantee?

Speaker 2 (05:54):
But at what point does it get to the to
them realizing, Okay, we're going to have to get if
we want this guy on our roster and he's going
to help us win football games because the other guys
are question marks, like how much longer does it have
to go for them to get to that point?

Speaker 5 (06:12):
You're right, and and they I don't know if the
right word is caving here, but they did so with
Joe Burrow, they did so with Jamar Chase, they did
so with these new contracts. Demetrius Knights got guaranteed money
after year one. And we've known that the Bengals are
one of the teams certainly, it's it's kind of been uh,
it's been written about a lot, be talked about a

(06:32):
lot that the Bengals just don't give a lot of
guarantees past year one.

Speaker 4 (06:35):
But that's changed. And again it goes back.

Speaker 5 (06:37):
To Duke Tobin talking about the evolving contracts and the
Bengals maybe evolving with it. So why stop here? Is
Is it Tray's age, is it his production against the run?
Whatever it is? For some reason, the Bengals have a
bit of a hold up. But to your point, now,
it feels like at some point, yes, the Bengals do

(06:58):
have to give in and even know and we all
remember what Schamar Stewart said about winning negotiations, Maybe this
isn't about winning the negotiation. Maybe it's about getting a
guy into camp as soon as possible so this team
can have one of its star players available to practice

(07:18):
and start slotting guys in roles, because that's a big
part of this. And we can break down what the
word distraction means, because that'll be talked about so much
here the next couple of weeks with Trey Hendrickson at
dis drags On with Shamar Stewart, if dis drags on
and what distraction means, But there is a domino effect
that comes with a star player not being out on

(07:41):
the field. Guys don't know exactly what the roles are
going to be, Coaches don't know what a depth chart's
going to look like, what player you can use in
this situation. And everything goes back to right what we've
talked about so much and this team getting off to
a fast start, and that was a big part of
Congress yesterday.

Speaker 4 (08:01):
Listen. I asked Zach Taylor.

Speaker 5 (08:02):
Point blank, what are the tangible differences that we're going
to see that are going to help this team get
off to a fast start, and he pointed to two
in one. I agree with what one is this team
playing its starters in the preseason. I don't know what
necessarily if I agree with they should, but I agree
that can be a difference maker, and then getting off

(08:24):
to a fast started. The other thing was him saying
practicing in the morning, and he tried to explain why
that would be a difference maker, and al Golden tried
to explain why that would be a difference maker and
getting off to a fast start. I don't know if
I buy moving practice to the morning is going to
help this team win in Cleveland or beat Jacksonville or
beat Minnesota the first three weeks of the season. But

(08:45):
what can help this team win games is having a
star player in camp, having a good camp, and being
football ready in week one, because guess what happened last
year was a star player who held in in camp
and wasn't fully ready for Week one. The end of
Benglas lost that game to the New England Patriots.

Speaker 2 (09:03):
I know that we're supposed to hear from Joe and
Jamar this week. Joe's already called this a distraction once
a couple of months ago. Do you think he could
turn up the heat when he talks to the media
about this this week?

Speaker 3 (09:19):
Good That certainly could.

Speaker 4 (09:21):
He's done it before.

Speaker 5 (09:23):
And it was funny because you know, Joe always when
he went to the Super Bowl, he always lumped in
Trey as far as that core group. But it didn't
feel like it came with the same kind of energy
that he came with when he was talking about keeping

(09:43):
t Higgins and certainly getting a contract extension for Jamar Chase.
But certainly Joe has a platform and has a microphone
tomorrow after noon, right after practice when he speaks for
the first time at training camp, and he'll certainly be
asked about this. And Joe's done a good jo of
understanding that this is part of it. That a distraction

(10:06):
is real. He talked about that during the offseason workouts
when he had a couple of media sessions.

Speaker 4 (10:13):
But the idea again, of a.

Speaker 5 (10:14):
Distraction, and I think a lot of times Austin people
think that a guy like Trey Henderson not being here,
the idea distraction is, Oh, it's just teammates having to
answer a couple of annoying questions about a teammate who's
not here after practice. It's not just that, it's it's
wondering if one of your best players is going to

(10:35):
play Week one. It's wondering what what is my future
negotiation look like with this organization.

Speaker 4 (10:42):
It's coaches trying to.

Speaker 5 (10:43):
Find roles and finding where a player slots in a
depth chart for snaps, and there's that butterfly effect when
a star is missing. It's coaches trying to game plan
and wondering if they'll have that player for that game.

Speaker 4 (10:54):
And again, Jamar.

Speaker 5 (10:56):
Chase, that distraction linked into Week one last season. This
isn't just cameras pointing at somebody who's not practicing or
answering a few questions.

Speaker 4 (11:07):
It's all of it.

Speaker 5 (11:08):
All of that adds up to kind of a negative
energy that seeped into that room last year. And I
will stand by that that that was a big factor
the BANG was not playing well in Week one against
New England. Now this might be mitigated because Trey Hendrickson
is if we believe he's in Florida from his Instagram posts,

(11:30):
he might be outside, out of mind, and that might
be helpful for this not to have him here, because
it won't dominate the attention the way Jamar Chase dominated
last year, with every single reporter starting every single live
shot talking about.

Speaker 4 (11:46):
What Jamar was doing.

Speaker 5 (11:47):
That day, or what Jamar was wearing, or what the
body language was like, and who stopped and practices to
talk to Jamar Chase. So the idea of distraction is
more than just annoying questions the teammates. It's all of it,
and the Bengals can't afford to have that right now
with the best defensive.

Speaker 2 (12:05):
Player circling back to Zach Taylor in the fast start,
do you think the Shamar Stewart and Trey Hendrickson contract
disputes takes a little bit of heat off of Zach
because it's kind of not his problem and not his
fault and he's the one who has to deal with
the repercussions of the team actually on the field.

Speaker 5 (12:28):
Interesting thought, but I don't think people will give him
that pass. That's just I don't think that's how it
works with the head coach. I get the point you're saying,
but you know, going back to last year, and was
it Zach's fault that this team missfield goals? And was
it Zach's fault that this team didn't have a defense

(12:49):
competitive enough for them to win games. So how are
we describing Zach's current situation. There's certainly some urgency this
year for the Bengals head coach, So you know, and
everybody talks about a temperature on a seat. Is is
it warm?

Speaker 4 (13:09):
Is it? Is it more than luke warm? Is it?
Is it a point where.

Speaker 5 (13:13):
You know he and this goes back to him putting
a lot of pressure on Al Golden. And there's a
lot of pressure.

Speaker 4 (13:19):
On Al Golden.

Speaker 5 (13:20):
Now, now Al Golden was brought in this this is Zach's,
you know, one big chance at a reset right here
to bring in a new defensive coordinator and try to
get that six to pair with an offense that is
championship ready, we all think. And now Al Golden is
forced to coach a defense that he doesn't have his
best player, and he doesn't have his first round pick

(13:41):
and doesn't know when he's going to get those guys,
And that's now a lot of pressure on him to
develop players that position that didn't perform well last year.
And certainly a lot of eyes are on the secondary.
And Al Golden talked about the secondary yesterday. He believes
the secondary is talented, but the secondary going to be
exposed if this team doesn't have guys who can pressure

(14:05):
a quarterback and speed up an offense. Even a good
secondary would struggle in a situation where a team can't
get pressure on a quarterback. So imagine the secondary that
wasn't good enough last year right now is facing a
situation and a reality where two difference makers, including an

(14:26):
elite pass rusher, we don't know their status going forward.
So the trickle down effect from Zach Taylor to Al
Golden and the pressure on both now is real, and
I think it's magnified by the fact that the Bengals
don't have those players on the field.

Speaker 2 (14:42):
The way I see it is if you ever ridden
in the car with somebody who's got a really nice car,
and you can press the button to put the seat
warmer on, and there's two levels and the first light
will come on and then the second light will come on.
A month ago, I thought we were going into this
training camp and Zach had the first light on, and
now I feel like you've pressed the button twice to

(15:03):
turn it off, and it's it's cooling down, but you
can still feel it. That's how I feel like Zach
is at the temperature of his seat at least push
Sjamar Stewart. Have you ever seen an agent act like this?

Speaker 4 (15:18):
No, what's going on?

Speaker 5 (15:24):
It's nuts, because you know, I was talking to people
yesterday at work, and I think it's good perspective sometimes
to step out of our sports bubble and talk about,
you know, the idea of employers and employees and the
idea that a guy wouldn't be paid if he's breaking
the law in jail, doing something that would jeopardize his

(15:48):
employment and still expecting to be paid for whatever it is.
And I think most of us and I understand that
athletes and professional sports teams live in a different reality
to the rest of.

Speaker 4 (16:01):
Human human beings.

Speaker 5 (16:03):
But the idea that there would be a fight about
guaranteed money if if you were you're not living right
is nonsense to me.

Speaker 4 (16:13):
It's it's something that there.

Speaker 5 (16:17):
Are clauses and contracts that that can jeopardize someone getting
their guaranteed money based on performance or things that might
be out of their control.

Speaker 4 (16:27):
You're in control of this if.

Speaker 5 (16:30):
You signed this contract and you're his agent, and you
tell him, listen, man, sign the contract, live right, do
it the right way you get all your guaranteed money,
every single dollar that that you want. So that would
be the advice I'd be giving Shamar Stewart, and the
advice that also be giving him if I were his agent,
would be, Hey, listen, man, you need coaching.

Speaker 4 (16:51):
You need to develop. You're talented. Everybody sees it.

Speaker 5 (16:55):
You've got physical freakish ability that that made you a
top twenty pick in the NFL draft, but the production
hasn't matched it. So you need to get on the
field and earn snaps and start your clock and start
working your way towards that massive second deal that you're
now seeing all these guys across the league at your

(17:17):
position is getting. So get in camp, get coached up,
get it figured out, start to earn your spot, because
right now I don't know how to separate him from
Joseph o'cai and Miles Murphy and Cedric Johnson and Cam Sample,
all of these guys who are hungry to prove that
they can play. And how hungry should Joseph ocieb this

(17:38):
year and a prove it deal? A one year deal.
So you're coming against guys who are grown men who
have been in this league, who people have criticized who
people have put microscopes under, who have motivation to go
out there and earn it and prove it, and.

Speaker 4 (17:54):
You've done none of it.

Speaker 5 (17:56):
And I think the tone yesterday was very interesting coming
from Mike Brown and Duke Tobin, that they were pointing
the finger right at Chamar's agent. They weren't frustrated necessarily
with Shamar, they were frustrated with the agent who's giving
him this advice.

Speaker 4 (18:14):
Now, they questioned, maybe.

Speaker 5 (18:16):
Schamar picking this agent and paying money to hear this
guy's advice. But this needs to be figured out. This
has to get done.

Speaker 4 (18:29):
This to me is super urgent for Shamar Stewart to
get this figured out or he's going to be so
far behind that he could be inactive when the Bengals
starts the season in Cleveland.

Speaker 3 (18:41):
What was your favorite Mike Brown line yesterday?

Speaker 4 (18:45):
Uh, let me say so.

Speaker 5 (18:47):
Mike Brown was asked yesterday why at nearly ninety years old,
that he still goes out onto the field in a
golf cart, and he basically said, I just love ball,
and I think that's such a cool thing that at
ninety years old. Zach Taylor said Mike Brown of the
offseason is the only guy that still comes in on

(19:09):
the weekends every week. I mean, this is a guy
that you know, we can litigate this and we can
talk about this, and we can go on and on
about how much Mike Brown wants to win and how
much Mike Brown is invested in winning, and how they're
two different things. Mike Brown absolutely loves everything there is
to do with football practice, and I don't think there

(19:32):
are a lot of owners across the league who hop
in a golf cart every single day for every practice.

Speaker 4 (19:39):
And go out there and just watch.

Speaker 5 (19:41):
And I think there needs to be at least a
small appreciation for a guy who's nearly ninety years old
to do that. But my favorite line yesterday is I
don't want to pay a guy sitting in jail.

Speaker 4 (19:52):
That's just a wild comment. It's just so great.

Speaker 5 (19:56):
I mean, if you're a guy like me who works
in television or anybody media, when you get a SoundBite
like that, I mean, it's just absolute fire.

Speaker 4 (20:05):
I could not.

Speaker 5 (20:06):
Wait to share that because that was one of the
great things we've heard from mock Turtle Soup day. And
I can tell you this, you know, on Sunday night,
the night before I was sitting there talking to my
coworkers and I'm like, you know, I've done so many
of these free training camp sit down interviews with the
coaches and Mike Brown in so many years. You don't
get anything.

Speaker 4 (20:26):
Because the bang was typically don't.

Speaker 5 (20:28):
Talk about contracts and negotiations, and yesterday it was different.

Speaker 4 (20:32):
Yesterday it was a lot of fun.

Speaker 5 (20:34):
And for Mike Brown to throw down a bar like that,
that one is going to live in Hall of Fame
soundbites from Mike Brown.

Speaker 2 (20:43):
You talk about him being out there and stuff I
tell people all the time when I worked at the
Bengals Pro Shop, I worked there for like four years,
and I would work during the week, I would work
the weekends all the time. Every single day Mike Brown
was out there walking laps around the field.

Speaker 3 (21:02):
Didn't matter.

Speaker 2 (21:03):
If it was snowing, didn't matter, if it was ninety
five degrees, didn't matter. He was out there every single
day walking laps, which I always thought was kind of
cool for a guy at his age. I know, we're
almost out of time. Let's quickly shift gears to the reds.
Are they going to do anything in the next week
to make their team better?

Speaker 5 (21:25):
Let me ask you this because I'm curious of what
your answer would be to this. And my answer to
your question would be, I think they throw a band
aid on something and they had a bullpen arm. Certainly,
I think we've seen the bullpen needs a little bit
of help, needs a boost at this point of the year.
There's no doubt about that. And the other part I

(21:45):
would say about this conversation is I would hope that
the Reds try to add not just for this year,
but also something that can help their roster for next year.
In the year's going understanding that too. In a couple
of years in twenty twenty seven, we're staring down a
possible workstoppage. But my question to you would be, what's

(22:06):
the biggest name that you would consider expendable from this
Reds team that if they're going to make something that's
going to raise an eyebrow or turn some heads, what's
the biggest name that you would say that you would
be comfortable with this team dealing Niclodolo.

Speaker 4 (22:26):
I'm with you.

Speaker 5 (22:27):
I think Nicklodolo neelvi Marte were the two names that
I thought I would be most comfortable with this team
moving Now. I know noelv is starting to come on
a bit, but I still feel like maybe right now
Noelvi's his projection has a little bit more weight than
his actual production. I think people still project him to

(22:50):
be something that he may not be able to reach,
but certainly the way he's playing right now, I think
ups his profile. But I think Nick Lodolo is the answer.

Speaker 3 (22:59):
Yeah, that's considering Chase.

Speaker 5 (23:01):
Burn and Red louder Or on the way and available
and are expected to be in this team starting rotation
next year. And then you have Andrew Abde have Hunter Green,
and if you have four really good starters, you're off
to a great start in building a roster.

Speaker 3 (23:14):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (23:14):
I agree, And I get the feeling that they will
do something that's like, uh, we might make a run
this year, but this will help us for next year,
because all they ever talk about is next year. Do
you like mock turtle soup?

Speaker 4 (23:28):
I didn't eat it yesterday. I tried it once.

Speaker 5 (23:30):
It's fine, it's okay, but but I did not eat
it yesterday.

Speaker 3 (23:35):
That the last time you had a mock turtle soup.

Speaker 4 (23:38):
Three years ago. I tried it for the first time.
I passed on it the first fifteen years.

Speaker 5 (23:42):
I finally said, you know what, I'm going to have this,
and it was fine. I think if it was at
a hot temperature, I had it tature.

Speaker 3 (23:53):
Okay, Okay, it's womb ish.

Speaker 4 (23:56):
Yeah, I needed more of a hot I think it
would be better. But I was the only one at
my table who didn't need it, and people were staring
at me. I'm like, I just don't want it.

Speaker 3 (24:04):
Who al was at your table? I want names, okay, so.

Speaker 4 (24:07):
Let me go across the table.

Speaker 5 (24:09):
It was Kevin Barnett from Channel twelve. It was Yati
Trigellis from Channel twelve. It was Austin Tanner from Channel twelve.
It was Austin Briskey, who I work with at Channel nineteen.

Speaker 4 (24:22):
That was our table. Yeah, that was our table.

Speaker 3 (24:24):
So two Austin, but not a third.

Speaker 4 (24:28):
You could have been there, Audie.

Speaker 3 (24:29):
Oh, I wasn't invited.

Speaker 4 (24:31):
So come on down next year.

Speaker 3 (24:33):
You think if I just show up they'll let me in.

Speaker 4 (24:37):
Well, you know, I'll put you on the Fox nineteen passay.

Speaker 3 (24:40):
That would be nice.

Speaker 4 (24:41):
You can go with Charlie Goldsman.

Speaker 2 (24:42):
I was gonna say that would be nice. That'd be
more than I normally get. All right, Uh, Joe, I
appreciate you. Thank you for your time. Looking forward to
your coverage at camp. H really appreciate it. Man.

Speaker 3 (24:52):
What do you guys got? What's coming up?

Speaker 4 (24:54):
Okay? Big deal?

Speaker 5 (24:55):
Tomorrow you can see Zach Taylor and Joe Burrows press
conferences live on Fox nineteen Now and then Thursday are
first of what will be multiple pre season specials two o'clock,
three o'clock on Thursday on Fox nineteen Now will also
replay it that night at eleven thirty on Fox nineteen.

Speaker 4 (25:15):
Now. Am I going to see Tony there tomorrow?

Speaker 2 (25:17):
You? Well maybe if he shows up? Yes, uh, He
and Mo will be live from ten am to noon tomorrow.

Speaker 4 (25:26):
Outstanding. I'll look for him all.

Speaker 2 (25:27):
Right, Thanks, Joe, Pey Audi that is Fox nineteen, Joe
on Twitter, and Yes, Tony and Mo Training Camp show
live tomorrow ten am to noon on ESPN fifteen thirty.
I look forward to that. We'll take a break, we'll
come back. Talkbacks are next on the Home of the Bengals,
ESPN fifteen thirty.

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