August 22, 2024 • 8 mins
Tony talks wrist injuries with Bob Mangine of NovaCare, on ESPN 1530!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome back. Rolling along hour number three a service a
pen station here on this Thursday afternoon. Let's get right
into it. He is the head trainer for the University
of Cincinnati men's basketball program. We'll talk more about them
next week, but for now from novacare Bob Man Jean
joining us right now.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
What's up, Bob Tony. I'm great Bengo Camp one for you.
It's been fun your reports every day on the radio,
and it sounds like things are going well.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Thank you, thank you. It is it's been fun to watch.
And I've said this for a while. You know, I
used to hate training camp. I love it now because
I get to leave whenever I want. I don't have
to stay. I don't have to go through eight hours
of meetings every day. I just go talk about what
I see and then I get out of dodge. It's
the best type of way of view training camp.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Absolutely, it's been better for me because I don't even
go down. That's it.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
That's it, all right, here's what I want to talk.
I've talked a lot in the last two weeks about
Joe Burrow, and we know I believe it's the Scaffo
lunate Ligham that was repaired for Joe Burrow. And again
we don't speculate into the severity or the intricacies of
each individual player's injury because that's speculation. We don't have
all the details, we don't have the reports, we don't
(01:12):
have the images, anything like that. But what I've seen
is a quarterback that is constantly it feels like trying
to stretch or squeeze his hand and trying to figure
out different grip and get that range of motion back.
So when you talk about risk injuries, when you talk
about a ligament injury, let's start, Bob with the word
I keep hearing a lot and that's scar tissue. How
(01:34):
difficult does it become in a rehab process to try
to break away the scar tissue and to get back
that full range of motion.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Well, again, in a ligament injury, Tony, and you've been
through your share of surgery, that the fact that as
you have the ligament heel, there's scar tissue that builds
up around the ligament. Otherwise it went and heal. The
whole purpose of the scar tissue is to be the
tissue within a ligament or a tendon or whatever. Now,
(02:05):
in small joints like the staff of a lunate joint,
and I've seen a lot of staff of lunate joints
in other sports as well as football. That's a small joint.
And therefore, whenever that and you're immobilized, right, so you've
had your surgery, you go into your your wrist plink,
you're immobilized, and they try to start movement as soon
(02:25):
as it's safe. But you still get that star tissue
between those two bones and realize the wriskle joints are
really small, so even a small amount of star tissue
can limit those bones moving in the right direction. You know.
Probably an even better example is I always had trainer,
(02:45):
as you know, for US Olympic diving for twenty five years,
and the kids, in order to enter the pool off
of a platform are hitting the water at thirty five
miles an hour, and what what happens would cock their
wrist back or pull their wrists all the way back
to enter the water and have the water set down.
(03:06):
And in US diving we probably had a ton of
scafeod lunate ligament injuries. They would develop what we call
a slack risk, a risk where the scafold lunate joint
would start to become our critic. The kids would end
up with surgery. So you've got a chronic inflammatory problem
(03:29):
as well. So the more you use a joint after surgery,
that joint can inflame and the little ligaments around that
joint are involved in the inflammation. The athletes have to
learn to listen to their bodies, so as they're practicing,
as they're doing activity, they have to, you know, understand
(03:50):
it's going to get sore, and when it gets sore,
they have to get in there, get treated, get the
physical therapists working with it, get the occupational therapists working
with it, and progress and a nice slow case. Here's
the biggest concern I have, whether it's football, diving, even
men's basketball with wrist injuries, it's the repeat contact or
(04:11):
the repeat fall. What was the mechanism that started the
whole thing going and then all of a sudden, one
day you're sacked from behind, you can't control your fall.
One day you're hitting the water with the wrong wrist position,
and now the risk gets pushed back the wrong way.
Basketball players are going to go up for a rebound,
(04:32):
and I've had this happen where the kids, wrist gets
caught on the rim as they're coming down, and they
actually get a ligament injury because the wrist is up
on the rim while the rest of the body starts
coming down and they can't get the rist off the
rim rest enough. So the big issue I have is
how did it start and how do we prevent that
(04:55):
repeat injury because if you keep hurting the ligament, you
keep stretching the ligament, then that ligament is going to
inflame and you're not going to be a happy camper.
One other point you've been through this yourself, is that
joint those that wrist area has multiple nerves coming through
that area, yep. And if the wrist is inflamed and the
(05:16):
nerves get inflaved, now all of a sudden, you get
tingling in your hand, You get you know, various other
symptoms in your hand. And we had a quarterback here
before you You may not remember, well, you do remember
because you know him pretty well, but he had a
wrist injury and hand injury, and it was more of
a nerve problem than it was the actual ligaments within
(05:39):
the wrist and the fracture in the hand, and he
had a hard time griping the ball. Yeah, and you
know he had a great game, but again he struggled
with it.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
Yeah, it feels like we've seen Joe Burrow trying to
figure out the grip. And here's the thing, I guess
my follow up to that, Bob. You know, at the
beginning of camp, it was talked about, well, Joe Burrow
is going to miss practices, that's part of the place.
He missed one practice all camp, So I mean that
would tell me like, structurally, at this point, you're not
getting hit at camp. Structurally, everything seems to be fine
(06:09):
and in place. But as you mentioned, it's about how
are you navigating that pain? How do you navigating the
feeling in your hand and for now what may be
the new normal? Is that fair? Again, without knowing the
intricacies of an injury, you're almost trying to relearn some
stuff because structurally it does feel like you're sound. You
mentioned reinjury. I remember when I broke my forearm for
(06:30):
the second time. We were practicing specifically how I had
to fall if I were to get hit. I mean,
we were that advanced in it. But structurally he's not
missing practices, So at this point you do kind of
have to relearn how to just deal with what may
be a new normal for an extended amount of time.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Correct, because these injuries, these intricate risk injuries, no matter
what sport, they're very delicate. They're small joints. As I said,
there's a lot of nerves around him. The joints don't
have much movement. So anytime you get any heavy scarring
within the joint after an injury, it's tough to get
(07:09):
the mobility back and maintain the mobility. And again, practice
is practice. Practice is non contact practice. You know. Again,
I know they practice against the other teams and they
try to rep on game speed, but you and I
both know that once the ball kicks off on game day,
the whole speed kicks up a notch h and the
(07:31):
level of contact kicks up and much. It's no different
than Remember when we had Brian Kelly here. All we
did was tag off and thud. We never went to
the ground, and we would come out of camp, look
him beautiful, because we didn't have a lot of injuries
under Brian because his philosophy was tag off and thud,
no real contact. And all of a sudden, we're playing
(07:51):
the games and you're now facing real high volume contact
and that's when a trainer, you know trainer and get
really scared or nervous about, you know, uncontrolled contact with
an uncontrolled fall.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Sure, Bob, you are the best. This has been awesome.
I look forward to talking more about basketball getting back
and how close the season is. We'll get to that
next week. As always, Bob, so appreciative your time. Man,
Have a great rest of the week, have a great weekend.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Yeah, Tony, looking forward to listening to the rest of
your Bengal reports on the radio. And you know, hopefully
the Bengals have a good game tonight and you keep
everybody safe and healthy.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
I love it. That is Bob Manjean from Novacare speaking
of Novacare. When it comes to your physical well being,
you want a physical therapist you can trust. That's Novacare Rehabilitation.
Novacare has been the exclusive physical therapy and athletic trainer
provider to the Bearcats for over twenty years. Go to
novacare dot com to request an appointment today. The Bearcats trust Novacare,
so can you. We'll wrap things up and we get
back with Mowgor Quick Hits Locks of the Night on
(08:53):
Sincy three sixty a service of Penn Station on ESPN
fifteen thirty
Welcome back. Rolling along hour number three a service a
pen station here on this Thursday afternoon. Let's get right
into it. He is the head trainer for the University
of Cincinnati men's basketball program. We'll talk more about them
next week, but for now from novacare Bob Man Jean
joining us right now.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
What's up, Bob Tony. I'm great Bengo Camp one for you.
It's been fun your reports every day on the radio,
and it sounds like things are going well.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Thank you, thank you. It is it's been fun to watch.
And I've said this for a while. You know, I
used to hate training camp. I love it now because
I get to leave whenever I want. I don't have
to stay. I don't have to go through eight hours
of meetings every day. I just go talk about what
I see and then I get out of dodge. It's
the best type of way of view training camp.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Absolutely, it's been better for me because I don't even
go down. That's it.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
That's it, all right, here's what I want to talk.
I've talked a lot in the last two weeks about
Joe Burrow, and we know I believe it's the Scaffo
lunate Ligham that was repaired for Joe Burrow. And again
we don't speculate into the severity or the intricacies of
each individual player's injury because that's speculation. We don't have
all the details, we don't have the reports, we don't
(01:12):
have the images, anything like that. But what I've seen
is a quarterback that is constantly it feels like trying
to stretch or squeeze his hand and trying to figure
out different grip and get that range of motion back.
So when you talk about risk injuries, when you talk
about a ligament injury, let's start, Bob with the word
I keep hearing a lot and that's scar tissue. How
(01:34):
difficult does it become in a rehab process to try
to break away the scar tissue and to get back
that full range of motion.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Well, again, in a ligament injury, Tony, and you've been
through your share of surgery, that the fact that as
you have the ligament heel, there's scar tissue that builds
up around the ligament. Otherwise it went and heal. The
whole purpose of the scar tissue is to be the
tissue within a ligament or a tendon or whatever. Now,
(02:05):
in small joints like the staff of a lunate joint,
and I've seen a lot of staff of lunate joints
in other sports as well as football. That's a small joint.
And therefore, whenever that and you're immobilized, right, so you've
had your surgery, you go into your your wrist plink,
you're immobilized, and they try to start movement as soon
(02:25):
as it's safe. But you still get that star tissue
between those two bones and realize the wriskle joints are
really small, so even a small amount of star tissue
can limit those bones moving in the right direction. You know.
Probably an even better example is I always had trainer,
(02:45):
as you know, for US Olympic diving for twenty five years,
and the kids, in order to enter the pool off
of a platform are hitting the water at thirty five
miles an hour, and what what happens would cock their
wrist back or pull their wrists all the way back
to enter the water and have the water set down.
(03:06):
And in US diving we probably had a ton of
scafeod lunate ligament injuries. They would develop what we call
a slack risk, a risk where the scafold lunate joint
would start to become our critic. The kids would end
up with surgery. So you've got a chronic inflammatory problem
(03:29):
as well. So the more you use a joint after surgery,
that joint can inflame and the little ligaments around that
joint are involved in the inflammation. The athletes have to
learn to listen to their bodies, so as they're practicing,
as they're doing activity, they have to, you know, understand
(03:50):
it's going to get sore, and when it gets sore,
they have to get in there, get treated, get the
physical therapists working with it, get the occupational therapists working
with it, and progress and a nice slow case. Here's
the biggest concern I have, whether it's football, diving, even
men's basketball with wrist injuries, it's the repeat contact or
(04:11):
the repeat fall. What was the mechanism that started the
whole thing going and then all of a sudden, one
day you're sacked from behind, you can't control your fall.
One day you're hitting the water with the wrong wrist position,
and now the risk gets pushed back the wrong way.
Basketball players are going to go up for a rebound,
(04:32):
and I've had this happen where the kids, wrist gets
caught on the rim as they're coming down, and they
actually get a ligament injury because the wrist is up
on the rim while the rest of the body starts
coming down and they can't get the rist off the
rim rest enough. So the big issue I have is
how did it start and how do we prevent that
(04:55):
repeat injury because if you keep hurting the ligament, you
keep stretching the ligament, then that ligament is going to
inflame and you're not going to be a happy camper.
One other point you've been through this yourself, is that
joint those that wrist area has multiple nerves coming through
that area, yep. And if the wrist is inflamed and the
(05:16):
nerves get inflaved, now all of a sudden, you get
tingling in your hand, You get you know, various other
symptoms in your hand. And we had a quarterback here
before you You may not remember, well, you do remember
because you know him pretty well, but he had a
wrist injury and hand injury, and it was more of
a nerve problem than it was the actual ligaments within
(05:39):
the wrist and the fracture in the hand, and he
had a hard time griping the ball. Yeah, and you
know he had a great game, but again he struggled
with it.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
Yeah, it feels like we've seen Joe Burrow trying to
figure out the grip. And here's the thing, I guess
my follow up to that, Bob. You know, at the
beginning of camp, it was talked about, well, Joe Burrow
is going to miss practices, that's part of the place.
He missed one practice all camp, So I mean that
would tell me like, structurally, at this point, you're not
getting hit at camp. Structurally, everything seems to be fine
(06:09):
and in place. But as you mentioned, it's about how
are you navigating that pain? How do you navigating the
feeling in your hand and for now what may be
the new normal? Is that fair? Again, without knowing the
intricacies of an injury, you're almost trying to relearn some
stuff because structurally it does feel like you're sound. You
mentioned reinjury. I remember when I broke my forearm for
(06:30):
the second time. We were practicing specifically how I had
to fall if I were to get hit. I mean,
we were that advanced in it. But structurally he's not
missing practices, So at this point you do kind of
have to relearn how to just deal with what may
be a new normal for an extended amount of time.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Correct, because these injuries, these intricate risk injuries, no matter
what sport, they're very delicate. They're small joints. As I said,
there's a lot of nerves around him. The joints don't
have much movement. So anytime you get any heavy scarring
within the joint after an injury, it's tough to get
(07:09):
the mobility back and maintain the mobility. And again, practice
is practice. Practice is non contact practice. You know. Again,
I know they practice against the other teams and they
try to rep on game speed, but you and I
both know that once the ball kicks off on game day,
the whole speed kicks up a notch h and the
(07:31):
level of contact kicks up and much. It's no different
than Remember when we had Brian Kelly here. All we
did was tag off and thud. We never went to
the ground, and we would come out of camp, look
him beautiful, because we didn't have a lot of injuries
under Brian because his philosophy was tag off and thud,
no real contact. And all of a sudden, we're playing
(07:51):
the games and you're now facing real high volume contact
and that's when a trainer, you know trainer and get
really scared or nervous about, you know, uncontrolled contact with
an uncontrolled fall.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Sure, Bob, you are the best. This has been awesome.
I look forward to talking more about basketball getting back
and how close the season is. We'll get to that
next week. As always, Bob, so appreciative your time. Man,
Have a great rest of the week, have a great weekend.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Yeah, Tony, looking forward to listening to the rest of
your Bengal reports on the radio. And you know, hopefully
the Bengals have a good game tonight and you keep
everybody safe and healthy.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
I love it. That is Bob Manjean from Novacare speaking
of Novacare. When it comes to your physical well being,
you want a physical therapist you can trust. That's Novacare Rehabilitation.
Novacare has been the exclusive physical therapy and athletic trainer
provider to the Bearcats for over twenty years. Go to
novacare dot com to request an appointment today. The Bearcats trust Novacare,
so can you. We'll wrap things up and we get
back with Mowgor Quick Hits Locks of the Night on
(08:53):
Sincy three sixty a service of Penn Station on ESPN
fifteen thirty
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