Cincy 360 w/ Austin Elmore -- 7/14/25

Austin is riding solo! He talks Reds with Jeff Carr and Steve Offenbaker, takes your calls, talks Bengals, checks in with Mo Egger, and more on ESPN 1530!

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Skyline Chile Sincy three to sixty about Cincinnati from Cincinnati,

(00:05):
sponsored in part by Skyline Chile. Stop by Skyline Chile
for a three way or chee Coney Today. Feeling good,
It's Skyline Time. This is ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.

Speaker 2 (00:18):
Hi, Hello, Welcome in Cincy. Three sixty ESPN fifteen thirty,
Cincinnati's sports Station. My name is Austin Omore. No Tony
Pike today, No Tony Pike all week. The big fella
is getting some R and R down in Florida, hanging
out with the family. It is officially load management season
for Tony Pike. He will be back next week. In

(00:41):
the meantime, it's you and I all week, and it's
All Star Break in Major League Baseball. Home Run Derby tonight,
All Star Game tomorrow, and the Reds are at the
unofficial halfway point of the season. So I thought to myself,
let's break down, Let's do the autopsy on the first
half of the red season. And who better to do

(01:03):
that with then with the guys from the Locked On
Reds podcast, Steve Offenbaker and friend of the show Jeff Carr.
Friend of the radio station, Jeff Carr making his return.
You know, when he comes in, it's fanfare. You know,
there's a parade, people lining up to shake his hands.
When Jeff Carr comes in, and I'm sitting over a
telling Steve's better, Steve's a better Steve's a better podcaster

(01:24):
than Jeff. All these people don't understand it. But Steve
and Jeff are here to talk some Reds with us,
because I think if you would have said three games
over five hundred at the All Star break, we would
have signed up for it. But I don't know that
we would have been all that excited about it. Steve,
let's start with you. How do you feel about the

(01:44):
Reds three games over at the break?

Speaker 3 (01:47):
You know, Jeff and I talked about this very question
on today's show, and the answer that kept coming to
my mind was, Man, you know, I mean, you're right.
If you told me at the beginning of the season
this team would would scrap and fight its way through
injuries and be three game over five hundred and be
in a position to do something you would naturally want
to be excited about that. Sure, but the way that
this team has performed, they've got there, but they have

(02:09):
done it in the single most frustrating way possible, each
and every time they have an opportunity to do so.
So for me, I think they've drained the emotion out
of me. They've drained the excitement out of me. They've
pulled the wind out of my sales time and time again.
And I want to be excited. I want to move
forward with this team and be energized. I need the
All Star Break just as much as they need the
All Star Break.

Speaker 2 (02:29):
I think a lot of Reds fans would say that, Jeff,
you're the optimist. You're always glass at full. How do
you feel after the unofficial first half? The All Star
break is like toms for some heartburn after you just
had too much pizza. That's what I'm feeling right now, because, like,
don't get me wrong, three games over five hundred is
all well and good, and it feels like they're within

(02:49):
striking distance of just getting into the dance. Just get
me into the playoffs, and this is exactly what I
would have signed up for. But it simply feels like
they should be better. I see different games, and this
last week was a perfect example of they were in
the first game with Colorado, should have beat them.

Speaker 4 (03:07):
There.

Speaker 2 (03:08):
Yeah, you can make the case that there were a
couple of pitches that didn't go their way in the
first game against the Marlins that then all of a
sudden the Marlins blew the doors wide open on them.
But they should have won that first game early on.
But ultimately they continue to play down or up to
their competition. So I just saw something a minute ago
that said that the Reds have the second hardest schedule

(03:28):
the rest of the way. Good. I'm glad we're not
playing bad teams, because that seems to be the teams
they lose it. Yeah, it's hard to explain how or
why they do that, and I think one of the
topics we can get into a little bit later on
is like the whole leadership thing. But to me, the
word that keeps coming back is consistency. I can't figure
out why are they so inconsistent? And that's to Steve's point.

(03:51):
What just drains you. It's like every night, it's like
colle here we go again, Like how I don't understand
that the lack of consistency. Yes, this is a young team,
but these are guys that have been in the big
leagues now for a little while. Most of them enough
to know better. How are they so inconsistent?

Speaker 3 (04:08):
Well, that's the only thing they're consistent with. And it's
been several seasons now, right. They do these things where
they go to Cleveland and win, they go to Detroit
and win, but then they lose series to the White Sox,
they lose, lose games to the Rockies.

Speaker 2 (04:20):
They split with the Fish.

Speaker 3 (04:21):
You know, this is the thing I think where I
had hoped Tito Francona would have had more of an impact.
Also when he came in, you know, the talk was
the right words, it was the right things. It's we're
going to hold players accountable, We're going to play the
game the right way. The biggest problem they've had was
the inconsistency, and I think that's the last real mountain.

(04:43):
Francona's got a climb with this team. He's got to
get them to a point where they win the series
they're supposed to win while still taking it to the
big dogs and beating the Detroits and beating the you know,
winning those games against teams that are better than five hundred.

Speaker 2 (04:56):
I felt like there was some time early on in
the season, maybe a little bit longer, that Terry Francona
was still trying to get his feet wet, trying to
like get back into a rhythm, remembering how to do this.
I mean, the guy's managed thousands of big league games.
Of course he knows how to do it. But it
was almost like he took a little bit of while
a little bit of time to knock the rust off

(05:17):
well and think about too. Where he was in his
last stop in Cleveland. He had a veteran team that
he was with for years and years and years. He
that was his team. All of the fingerprints were all
over the place from him. He walks into this situation
with a lot of young players that were really unproven,
a lot of talent but not a lot of production,
and so he's got to figure out exactly how to

(05:38):
bridge that gap, and he's also got to figure out
how he fits in with this team. It's clear that
he's the kind of guy that leads an organization through example,
and he's got like guys buying into who he is
as a manager. But then when you're you know, zero
to two and you got a run around second base
with two outs, what does that mean for the guy

(06:00):
at the plate? How does Terry Francona manage that guy
when he strikes out, because there's been a lot of
those cases, especially in this Rocky series when they go
oh for fifteen with runs in scoring, because there's the
first two games that you're like, okay, where is the
influence there? And we see it in different scenarios like
what happened on Sunday. As long as the Rockies are
gonna make mistakes, just take advantage of them. Yeah, that's

(06:21):
something they didn't do a lot of last year. How
would you grade? We're gonna get into grades. It's grading season,
it's list season, especially in football, and now at the
All Star break there's a lot of grades. How different
is the grade that you give the Reds as a
whole compared to the grade that you give Terry Francona
as a manager, Because like I feel like they're a

(06:42):
C plus. They could have been a bee, but they
shot themselves in the foot. The injuries kind of kept
them down a little bit.

Speaker 5 (06:49):
Overall.

Speaker 2 (06:50):
They weren't consistent enough C plus because they're above five
hundred and they are within, without a doubt, striking distance
of a playoff spot. And at the end of the day,
I don't want to say the bar is that low,
but can you just get to the damn playoffs and
see what happens with the pitching that you have, but
also felt like it could have been better. What's the
grade for each the Reds and franco I.

Speaker 3 (07:11):
Think you're pretty spot on with the C. You know,
C is average, right, and this team is average. They're
just a little bit above five hundred. They're right in
the middle of the pack. They're doing their things. I
think ce is fair. As far as grading Francona, that's
a hard one because I feel like he struggled. He
You're right to get his feet under him, to get
the rust off, to learn the team.

Speaker 2 (07:30):
Whatever that was.

Speaker 3 (07:31):
So when you look at that, you know, I feel
like he has some detention, some weekend Saturday school going on.

Speaker 2 (07:36):
There, some remediation.

Speaker 3 (07:39):
You know, he's not failing. Maybe he's a little bit
better than a D. I think he's a C minus
on his way up. I think he gets better each
time out and the end of season grade will be
much better than that. Just the way things started and
kind of the sluggishness of the team and the way
it performed, I think that's part of it.

Speaker 2 (07:55):
But I attribute Andrew Rabbit's performances this year and the
confidence that he has on the mound to Terry Francona,
because I don't think David Bell lets him go as
deep into games as he's been going this year. I mean,
he's already got a complete game under his belt. He
was getting close to a complete game his last appearance.
I think that there's something about the way that Terry
Francona works with Derek Johnson with this pitching staff, that

(08:17):
we're seeing this starting staff get the best out of them.
And I mean even credit to him with Nick Martinez
in the way that he managed him during that weird spell,
whereas like he pitched four times in eight days and oh,
by the way, almost threw a new header on that
fourth that fourth outing. I think there's something to do.
I give Terry Francona a bee. I think that he
started out rough, he's figured out his mistakes. He ain't

(08:38):
having any in Jabou close out games anymore, Oh my gosh. Uh,
And we're not seeing those weird things, those weird like
I think the whole thing with Santiago est but all
about higher in the lineup was he just didn't trust
Matt McClain enough, then he trusts him. Now he's got
him back where he should be, and he's got Santiago
Espin all back where he should be on the bench. Yeah, gosh,

(08:59):
that was a stretch of time too, wasn't it. You
know I have written down here to talk about your
biggest concerns, you who your most confidence And I feel
like my biggest concern is Matt McLain because I think
the dude has all the stuff we need and it's
unfair to judge him because he's still got so few

(09:20):
at bats compared to everybody else miss an entire season,
but without him being the consistent guy at that two spot,
how far can the offense really go? That's my biggest concern,
And overall the starting pitching. I think you're right, Like
when it comes back to Francona. I was reading an article.

(09:41):
I think the article Gordon Whittemyer wrote about his two
thousandth career victory and how Alex Corus said he does
a great job of letting the superstars be the superstars,
or the stars be the stars. And I think he's
done a good job of like letting Andrew out Abbott
develop into a star or like there was that one
outing in San Francisco where he let Hunter Green go
that extra inning in ultimately didn't work. The Reds won

(10:02):
the game, but you know, Hunter Green maybe pitched a
little bit longer than he should have. I think that,
and like the empowerment of the players, he deserves a
lot of credit for. But at what point do they
take ownership and say, okay, this is our team? As
well as is looking to Terry Francona is like, hey,
are we doing this right? That's something that that I
think is interesting to watch how it develops over into

(10:23):
the second half.

Speaker 3 (10:23):
You know, I think Matt McClain's a good choice for
you know, who are we most concerned or who do
we need to have the consistency? For me, it's Hunter Green,
whom you just mentioned.

Speaker 2 (10:31):
I am.

Speaker 3 (10:31):
I have never, at least I don't recall, maybe you
guys do a time where there was an injury to
a superstar pitcher like this and everybody was just kind
of shrugging their shoulders and going, we don't know, Yeah,
he's hurt.

Speaker 2 (10:43):
He says he's hurt. We don't know.

Speaker 3 (10:44):
The MRI looks good, but we're just gonna have to
let Hunter tell us when he can pitch. I don't
remember a time where it was like, yeah, he's hurt,
but we don't know why, and we don't know when
he's coming back or if he's coming back. So that's
that's a big deal because with him, this rotation is
pretty good heading into a potential wildcard. Without him, we're
talking trade deadline. You may have to go get a

(11:06):
starter if you don't have him, because Chase Burns is
gonna have a pitch limit. Ray Miley's probably not coming back.
Chase Petty is not the answer this season. You're gonna
need another arm. So he's the real wildcard, and for me,
my big concern lies there. They get him back, looks
good for a wildcard push. They don't get him back.
There's a lot more questions than there are answers.

Speaker 2 (11:26):
That's true. Am I allowed to say Nick Krawl?

Speaker 6 (11:28):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (11:30):
I think my biggest concern is Nick I think my
biggest concern in most parts of my life is Nick
Krawl because the threads all of these questions can be
answered by him, yeah, or they could not be answered
by him because he needs to do something at this
trade deadline. There is no Stan Patten feel good about it.
They stand pat They're gonna win eighty three eighty four games.
I think that they need an outfielder and they don't

(11:52):
even have to go get you know, a Taoscar Hernandez
or somebody like that. They can go get an expiring
deal guy that doesn't cost that much in a trade.
They can go get another bullpen arm and really help
out this bullpen, and they can go get that starting pitcher.
I look at Adrian Houser from the Chicago White Sox
that I don't think he would break the bank in
order to acquire a guy like that. So there's definitely

(12:12):
guys out there. But this is not something he has done.
He has not done the acquire talent or acquire major
league talent trade. He has done the acquire future talent trade.
He has done the reset button trade. He has not
done the all right, we're here, let's take a step
forward and get here. Trade. So how does he go
about that? Is it gonna be the Wheeling and Dale

(12:35):
and Jim Bowden where it's like we gave up how much?
Or is it going to be the half measures and
things that we've seen here in the last decade or
so where it's like, well we need an outfielder, let's
go get Marlon Burt. No, we can't do that either.
So there's got to be a concerted effort from him
to supplement the things on this roster. Else we're not

(12:58):
talking about the wildcard. Yeah, I want to talk about
that when we come back into the next segment, because
you know, Steve talked about how almost exhausting it is
to be three games over five hundred at the break,
and I think there's understandable levels of frustration to that.
There's understandable levels of excitement to that. But if I
think back to the All Star break two years ago,

(13:19):
and I know we keep bringing up twenty twenty three,
you know why because it was probably the most fun
any of us have had in a Red season in
a long time. And they were ten games over five
hundred at the All Star at the deadline, and they
were in first place, and they were like it was
there for them to do it. And they got Sam Mall.
Saam Mall pitched pretty well, but the bugaboo for that

(13:40):
team was starting pitching, and the Reds relied on people
will get healthy. David Bell's doing a good job we'll fit,
we'll add a little bit to the bullpen, and we'll
be all right. And I think they gave up like
thirty runs over the next two games after the All
Star break, and it's like, oh yeah, we still don't
have any starting pitchers. We've been talking about the issue
shoes and the weaknesses of this team for a while.

(14:02):
A power bat, right, maybe a corner infielder, a third baseman,
starting pitching. Are they going to change at any point
to say, Okay, we're actually going to go for it,
like you said, Jeff, And I think there's been some indicators. Okay,
we're gonna move on from Jamer, We're gonna call up
Chase Burns. We paid Terry Francono a lot of money.

(14:23):
You've shown me Okay, there's something there, but are you
going to prove it at the trade deadline? Is really
gonna be the most interesting part. Let's table that and
get to it after the break, because we have a
lot to get to as we recap the first half
quote unquote half of the season. Reds fifty and forty seven,
coming off of a series victory over the Colorado Rockies

(14:45):
that they just barely squeaked out over the Colorado Rockies.
But they did it nonetheless, and the All Star Break
is here with Steve Offfenbaker and Jeff Carr from the
Lockdown Reds podcast for the whole first hour you are
listening two cent. My name is Austin Elmore. Our one
brought to you by Skyline Chile on the home of
the Bengals, Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 7 (15:08):
Now your chance to win one thousand dollars entered this
nationwide keyword on our website, money.

Speaker 2 (15:14):
Swinging a broken background for a second, bubbled.

Speaker 7 (15:16):
By our sand Here come to Penson with the winning run.

Speaker 2 (15:21):
The Reds rally and get off the mat and score
two in the ninth to beat the Rockies four to three.
Tommy Thraw on the calls, the Reds walked it off
on Saturday against the Rockies. They were able to win
again yesterday, take two out of three. They went five
and five in that ten game stretch prior to the
break that we had been talking about for so long.

(15:43):
I think most people would consider that a disappointment. But
they're three games over five hundred going into the All
Star Break. Welcome back in Sincy. Three to sixty. I'm
Austin Elmore, Tony Pike out this week, and I'm joined
in studio in hour number one by Jeff Carr and
Steve offenbake Or from The Reds. They locked on Reds Podcast,

(16:03):
available wherever you get your podcasts, including the iHeartRadio app.
And we're kind of doing the autopsy on the first
half of the red season and looking ahead to maybe
the deficiencies of this team and where they can get
better and the idea of Nick Krawl being aggressive and
the organization showing Okay, we're really serious about winning. What

(16:29):
do they need to do or what would Krawl have
to do to make you feel like, Okay, we're actually trying.
Because I've talked in the past, like you know, the
Dick Williams moves didn't always work out, but I had
no problem because that dude was swinging. And I want
to see you and feel like my team is trying
to win. I haven't really felt that with Nick Krawl.

(16:49):
I've been extremely critical of Nick Krawl. What does it
take or what do you need to see to feel like, Okay,
the Reds are trying.

Speaker 3 (16:59):
I need to see more one move now And that's
been a problem in the past right, they've done a thing,
but does not all of the things, and the team
still continues to struggle. This team has three big needs
right now. The one we've been talking about for three
years now, which is a power hitting, right handed outfielder
that doesn't even have to be an everyday guy at
this point. It could be a platoon guy that you
come up with Benson or Freeley and you meet that

(17:21):
need that way. The other piece of it is they're
going to have to bolster this bullpen in some way,
shape or form. There's been some great bullpen work and
there's been some not so great bullpen work. Jeff and
I kind of have that group out there divided into bullpen,
A bullpen B and they need truly another a type
arm at the back end of this bullpen to help
take the pressure off of Pegan.

Speaker 2 (17:40):
Is he going to hold up all season? And we
don't know.

Speaker 3 (17:42):
This is the most save opportunities he's had pretty much ever,
so he could wear down. And then you run into
the question that I mentioned earlier, which is starting pitcher.
Do you go get a starting pitcher, do you not
go get a starting pitcher, or do you use a
starting pitcher that you have now to go out and
address these other needs, because that could also be something
they may have to do, depending on what ownership allows

(18:05):
Nick Crawl to do financially, he may have to cut
money to add money. And there's a real easy target
in the rotation right now.

Speaker 2 (18:11):
Yeah, right, and then you would definitely have to add
to the rotation if you if you were to trade
Nick Martinez and save that money. I think that the focus,
at least if they're gonna take a big swing, which
I emphasize I don't believe they have to. They just
need to take a couple of swings, like they've been
looking at strike three for a couple of years now,
or in shopping pilots, they went to Kroger to get

(18:32):
some milk and eggs and came home with mesquite flavored
barbecue chips and forgot the milk and the eggs. So
I really think like they've got to attack this deadline
with what they would at need. I never would have
guessed mesquite flavored barbecue chips would have been mentioned at all.
He's undefeated with this, Austin. I'm telling you what, that

(18:52):
is honestly perfect. Like they've there's been so much mesquite
flavored barbecue chips. On this team, there's been a lot
where it's just like that sounds really awesome, and then
you realize they taste the same as regular barbecue chips. Anyway,
where they should take their big swing, it should be
in the bullpen, because it feels like Emilio Began is
getting stretched to the point that he's never been. Tony

(19:14):
Santion for sure, Scott Barlow might get one hundred and
sixty appearances, dude, and I feel like at some point
those guys' arms are going to fall off. And then
when you really want to talk about the group A
vers Group B, I'm starting to wonder if there are
more than two pitchers in Group A, and then you
could start to have the argument that Tony Santeon might
be trending to a group B. Now, so you're only

(19:34):
talking about Emilio Pagan as your one guy that you
know you can trust every single time out. That's going
to wear him down too, So go get another guy.
There even might be a chance that they call up
the Baltimore Orioles and get two birds with one stone,
because they've got a couple of outfielders that are on
expiring deals, and they've got some bullpen guys that they

(19:56):
could reset their farm system with, ala Felix Batista, who
has looked a lot better recently. So the Reds could
really make a good deal with Baltimore if that is
on the table. But I think that Steve's right, like
multiple deals need to happen. One deal is going to
make a spiel like three games over five hundred. Yeah, yeah, no,

(20:17):
you're exactly right. You mentioned the idea of potentially trading
Nick Martinez. Is there anyone on the roster that you
feel like? I mean Martinez obviously because of financially where
he's at and the amount of money that he's costing
the team. Is there anyone else on the big league
roster that you think could be traded? Well, I know

(20:38):
that there's been a lot of talk recently about the
whole Rays model. Like the Reds want to operate like
the Rays. They want to operate like the Guardians and
things like that. Could they operate like the Brewers? That
would be cool, You're right, operate like the Bruis. We're
talking about teams. I would do anything to be the Brewers.

Speaker 6 (20:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (20:54):
The Brewers are amazing. They get rid of everybody and
they're still good. Yeah, that would mean Tony that Tyler
Stevenson and Gavin Lux are tradeable, which I don't think
anybody would sign up for it, And I don't know
what the return would be because you're talking about two
guys that do have another year of team control. But

(21:14):
the Ray's model is if they don't have that guy
signed before his one plus year, and that's where both
these guys are, then they are looking to trade them
and see what they can get. Now, the Rays also
trade those guys for prospects in a lot of different cases,
or guys who are right close to the major leagues.
That's not what this team needs right now, and so
if they go make that kind of a trade, that's

(21:37):
going to signal something completely different that I think the
fan base will revolt against. Sure, but if the Reds
front office wants to be like those teams, then those
guys are available.

Speaker 3 (21:46):
You know, there's no city in the country that loves
their players more than Cincinnati loves their players. They don't
have to be good all the time, they just have
to be beloved hard, play hard, and it gets them
a job here. You're correct, and by no means I'm
by advocating trading Tyler Stevenson, but if you are making
a trade to address a need on your team, you're
going to deal from your surplus. You're going to deal

(22:08):
from your strength. And right now this team has the
luxury of two hitting catchers, one of them better defensively
than the other, and one of those catchers nearing the
end of the window. Tyler Stevenson's has been approached about
an extension last offseason. Wasn't really interested in the conversation.
The numbers weren't close, That's what we heard. They were
far apart, so that hasn't been revisited. You're in a

(22:31):
trade deadline, you have an opportunity to make the postseason.
You have to deal from strength. It makes sense now.
I would much rather see them put together a package
of prospects, not touch the major league team, add to
it versus takeaway from it. But you know, the question
you threw at us was who from the major league
team that's somebody you could deal from the major league.

Speaker 2 (22:47):
I didn't expect that answer, but that is really interesting,
And you know, I think the idea of let's just
say that that were to happen, I think Stevenson's a
pretty well liked guy, not just by the fan base
but on the team. And Travino is well, I think
he's one of the rare guys on the team that
actually provides some veteran leadership, that actually has some experience
to help these young dudes. And he's also not an

(23:09):
everyday catcher. I don't think anyone thinks he is going
to hit three hundred on the season. Eventually, he will
come back down to earth at least a little bit.
So that's fascinating. But you brought up prospects. I'm always
in favor of trading might bees for certainties. Doesn't always
work that way. A lot of the trend in baseball,
I guess the last couple of years has been teams
want major league talent at least more frequently as of late.

(23:33):
Is there anybody in the system, Steve that you think
untouchable at the trade deadline?

Speaker 3 (23:38):
Well, we've been talking about this, you know, I know
he's currently on the major league roster right now, but
I don't trade Chase Burns, I don't trade Ret Louder.
We've had some conversations about is south Stewart on that
list of do not trades probably, so anybody else if
you put the right package together, you can trade him.

Speaker 2 (23:55):
Those are the three names that come to mind for me.
I would trade anybody else in the system. Yeah, I kinda.
I don't know, Like I feel like south Stewart is
the only guy in the minor leagues right now that
I would say is close, but I would not call
him untouchable. Reet Louder is tough because he's hurt right now,
so I almost wouldn't mind hearing his name in a trade.

(24:16):
But that is my immediate fan brain and knowing that
in the future he's probably a top end of the
rotation type of guy that would be a tough one
like that would need to be a huge deal. That's
the big kind of swing that I think the Reds
don't need to take. And at the same time, Chase Burns,
I think Chase Burns is the only guy that you
would say is untouchable. There are so many metrics, and

(24:36):
I get a lot of people have seen three starts
and they think they know who he is. But there
are so many metrics like the stuff plus type of
metrics that are saying he is really good, and there
are a lot of baseball riders that cover the entire league,
not just the Reds, that are saying this dude could
be a top end of the rotation type of guy
very very soon. So I think that would be really

(24:58):
tough to get rid of them. I think he's the
only guy I would say's untouchable. Speaking of Chase Burns,
what's your takeaway from his short big league experience. He's
performed well. I think he's here a little early.

Speaker 3 (25:09):
I think we're seeing that it was more of a
move of necessity versus congratulations, You've earned your promotion, same
like Rhet Louder last year. But he's making the most
of this opportunity. I like how he came back from
basically just having his face beat in in his second start,
and he's working his way back. His stuff looks great.
You know, his numbers project well. Is he gonna last

(25:32):
the whole season in the big league rotation?

Speaker 2 (25:34):
I doubt it.

Speaker 3 (25:35):
A lot of that depends on Hunter Green, who we
talked about earlier. But whether he goes back to the
minors or not, he will not be available near the
end of this season or for a potential postseason. He
has a hard stop innings cap that the Reds are
going to honor. They are not going to risk his
long term viability for two extra starts this season.

Speaker 2 (25:53):
He'll get shut down. Do you think if Hunter comes
back relatively soon, let's say by the end of this month,
and I think that's push. But let's say he comes
back by the end of this month starts to look
like himself. Is there a path put Chase Burns in
the bullpen and maybe help them down the line if
they're in a playoff push and manage his innings that way.

(26:14):
I like the idea. I don't know if it helps him,
And I think this is the reason why I was
so six to one a half dozen the other one.
Ever he was called up like, I was excited to
see him in the major leagues, but I felt as
though the Reds were prioritizing their own roster over his
individual development, and that really hurt Jose Barrero. Like Jose Barrero,

(26:35):
all the scouts loved him, and honestly, anytime in TRIPLEA,
everybody was like, this dude's going on a rock. But
I felt like he got his confidence shattered very early
on whenever the Reds brought him up. During twenty twenty
and he just wasn't ready. And I worry about that
a little bit. With Chase Burns, and I get it,
he's another worldly talent, and I think that we will
see him continue to progress. His third start told me

(26:58):
all I need to know about Chase Burns for his
very first cup of coffee in the major leagues, and
that he was able to hang with Zach Wheeler following
me in a start in Boston where he absolutely looked
like he was overmatched, and he was able to pitch
very very well against a very good Phillies lineup. So
I think individually he's got the chops, but I don't
want them to mess around with it too much. I

(27:19):
think they got to prioritize the player over the team
in this case.

Speaker 3 (27:22):
And I would be a hard note on this because
remember when you could put a guy in the bullpen,
he gets up, he warms up, he doesn't get in
the game, he says down, he warms up again, he
throws pitches. If you're gonna use Chase Burns, you keep
him in the rotation, You let him do I move
Nick Martinez to the bullpen, assuming he's still on this team.
Let him help the team that way. And then when
you reach the innings cap on Chase Burns, Martinez slides
back into the rotation.

Speaker 4 (27:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (27:42):
I think that does make a lot of sense. And
to your point, the Reds have talked a lot about
that regiment and like learning how to be a big
league pitcher and like what you go through during the
week and like setting him up to get his routine
down pat as a starting pitcher. That's interesting you mentioned
the word progression. I want to talk about progression when
we come back, because I think some guys have progressed

(28:06):
I think some guys maybe not so much through the
first quote unquote half of the season. Steve Offenbaker, Jeff Carr,
Locked On Red's Podcast with Us Hour one of Sincy
three to sixty, brought to you by Skyline Chilly on
ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati Sports Station. Yea, nay, yeah, that's
right into page thirty since he three sixty ESPN fifteen thirty.

(28:35):
Austin Elmore solo today but not solo right now, joined
by Jeff Carr and Steve Offenbaker from the Locked On
Reds podcast for an hour of Red's Conversation. Cincinnati fifty
and forty seven at the All Star Break All Star
Game coming up on Tuesday. Home Run Derby tonight. The
home Run Derby is tonight and you can hear it
right here on ESPN fifteen thirty. You have not lived

(28:58):
until you've heard a radio broad cast of the home
Run Derby. It is I'm serious. It's incredibly entertaining that
in the three point competition at the NBA All Star Game,
it's actually electric on the radio. You guys might not
be thinking I'm serious right now, but I'm dead serious.
Listen to the home Run Derby on the radio. You
will enjoy it, and you can do it tonight here

(29:20):
on ESPN fifteen thirty. Cal Rawley's in the Home Run Derby.
He's made some progress this year. Some Reds have made
some progress this year, some maybe not so much. Who
do you feel like Steve starting with you has taken
the biggest step forward for the Reds this season? And

(29:41):
is it or could it be Elie de la Cruz
just being consistent?

Speaker 3 (29:45):
Well, that's the easy answer. Ellie is the easy answer.
Ell He's done a lot of things differently this year.
He's continuing to move towards that MVP type player and
that's the easy answer for me.

Speaker 2 (29:55):
It's Andrew Abbott. Though for me, that's the guy that.

Speaker 3 (29:58):
Has grown the most and had the most impact because
we didn't expect that he would be the ace of
this rotation. We didn't expect him to be an All
Star in in this year. But because of injury, because
of the way things have gone, because of the inconsistency
of Nicolodolo. You know, we talked about consistency earlier. Andrew
Abbott has had to emerge as the leader of this rotation,

(30:19):
the ace of this staff, and he has embraced it
and he's just run with it. And you know, if
you had told me he was gonna be an All
Star selection with a sub to era and just be
mister consistency for this team, you know, I might have
questioned your enthusiasm a little bit. But he's done all
those things and so for me, he's been the biggest surprise.
He has made the most progress year over year from
last year this year is the guy.

Speaker 2 (30:40):
While it may seem easy, I think that there's one
number about Elia de la Cruz that is the most surprising.
I'm not talking about any on pace numbers. We know
the on pace numbers like he's on pace to do
really well and home runs and RBIs and all this
other stuff. The thing that just absolutely baffles me is
he was always going to be a guy that has
a high batting and I average on balls and play
because of his speed, He's able to beat out a

(31:02):
lot of other hits that other guys can't. He's able
to turn singles into doubles far easier than most. But
his batting average on balls and play is down by
like a considerable amount from last year, which usually follows
with him being less productive in every other category like
less batting average, less on base percentage. Babbit is the

(31:22):
kind of thing that you look at and you say,
this guy is getting lucky or unlucky according to last year.
He's getting him lucky with his babbit, but he's not.
His production has taken so much of a step forward
that he's a little bit more immune to batting average
on balls and play than I expected him to be.
His plate discipline has gotten so much better, But it's

(31:45):
just the quality of contact, and it's not necessarily even
the hard hit rate or the exit velocity. It's just
the fact that he is able to barrel the ball
and control where it goes so much better, and he
hits from the right side of the plate so much
better that I think he has taken a step forward
that is noticeable enough that it cannot go unlooked. How

(32:06):
do you assess Ellie's defense through the first half. It's
gotten better, but it's mis still frustrating. It's it's you know,
it's inconsistent the theme.

Speaker 3 (32:15):
You know, you watch a player that can throw the
ball one hundred miles an hour across the infield, gun
guys down at the plate and then skips a throw
to first base on a play where it really didn't
need to happen. It wasn't rushed, it wasn't something spectacular,
It was a routine ground ball. So I need a
little bit more consistency from his defense. It is better
than last year, but still he's still takes place. He
still takes some plays off, I think, and that's the

(32:38):
next part of his defense heeds.

Speaker 2 (32:41):
How do you explain Matt McClain. I think it's a
little bit of sophomore slump, like what Spencer Steer went
through last year, and it's a little bit of what
Tyler Stevenson dealt with his return from the collarbone injury.
We talked a lot about that year. It was like, man,
what is going on with Tyler Stevenson, But he had
that crazy injury to an area that is very key
to your swing. And same with with you know, not

(33:04):
collarbone obviously, but the labrum with Matt McClain, like he
probably had to relearn his swing a little bit from
the muscle, you know, muscle memory side of things. There's
a lot of ingrained sort of routine that goes into
a swing when it comes to a major league ballplayer.
There's a reason that we know Ken Griffey junior swing.

(33:25):
But you took a key part of that out for
Matt McClain and said, all right, now relearn this with
that muscle now being completely repaired. And I think that
it's taken him some time, and I think we're starting
to see it here, especially these last two weeks. It
seems like he's hit the ball really well. He's found grass.
That's something that we talked about a lot early, is
that he was hitting the ball hard, he was just

(33:45):
finding gloves. And that's why it was so hard to
stand on a table and say you have to send
him down because he has to work on something. Never
said he had to work on something. I just wanted
to see the ball hit the grass, you know, like
a golfer sees the ball go into the hall. That's
what we need to see from him. And we're seeing
his stats tick up according.

Speaker 3 (34:04):
And the Reds ask him to do all this at
the major league level after having not played for a year.
So you're coming off an injury, your shoulder's not quite right.
We want you to fix it. We want you to
do it against major league pitching, and we want you to.

Speaker 2 (34:15):
Do it right now. So it was a pretty big ask.

Speaker 3 (34:17):
So I agree with Jeff that things are starting to
trend in the right direction with him.

Speaker 2 (34:22):
Same like with Spencer Steer.

Speaker 3 (34:23):
Spencer Steer started the year hurt and there was stuff
going on with the shoulder, and we've now finally seen
him turn a corner. And I think we're seeing Matt
McCain turn the same corner and getting back into routines.
And I think the second half for both of those
players is going to be a lot better than the
first half was.

Speaker 2 (34:36):
I am a big, big Spencer Steer believer. I don't
really know, Yeah, I don't know. I know it doesn't
maybe make the most sense, but for whatever reason, I
just think that's a dude that's going to be a
successful big leaguer. I want to backtrack to Ellie real quick,
because I wrote down stealing bases. It's not happening as
much for the entire team and Ellie a little bit

(34:59):
more over the last week or so. Do you think
that's something that the Reds could tweak or should tweak.
They could be more aggressive, Yeah, they could remember that.

Speaker 3 (35:08):
Also, Ellie had some nagging leg stuff going on and
that slowed him down a bit. He was, you know,
taking care of him, keeping himself in the lineup. But also,
you know, Terry Francona told us this from the beginning
that they were going to run, but they were going
to be smarter about when they ran and how they ran. Now,
maybe they over corrected a little bit early on, and
I see that there's scenarios just recently where they could

(35:30):
have sent Ellie and avoided a double play, but they
didn't and it cost them ultimately. I think those are
the tweaks that are going to start happening where Francona
loosens the leash a little bit and lets these guys
go it's gonna tick up in the second half.

Speaker 2 (35:42):
But I don't think by a lot.

Speaker 3 (35:44):
I think this is kind of who they are now,
not as aggressive running the bases, because there were a
lot of times under David Bell they ran themselves right
out of inning.

Speaker 2 (35:51):
True, very true, right, And I think the aggressiveness is
a team wide thing, not even just an elly thing.
I was looking at this the other day. They have
less steal attempts. They have less advanced attempts at least
according to Baseball Savan than they did last season. They're
on pace to have a lot less in that, but
there's still a top ten team when it comes to
the value they provide with their base running. So I

(36:12):
think they're right, they're going to tick up the aggressiveness.
Barry Larkin also made a point on the television broadcast,
it's like a bout a week ago that the thing
with Ellie's steels is he's hitting the ball so much better,
and there's a lot of times where he's finding himself
on second base because he's lugging almost five hundred going
into the All Star Break. That there's part of it.
It's like it would be awesome if he stole third,

(36:35):
But I think he's doing a lot more with the
bat than he has in years past that he doesn't
need to compensate for with his legs, and because of
that we've seen less steals. I still think he finishes
the year around fifty, maybe even sixty. But yeah, I
think it's interesting to note the less steals. But man,
I think that everything else for him has ticked up
in a way that it doesn't bother me. You said

(36:58):
Andrew Abbot, You said de la Cruz. When it comes
to progression, who's another name you feel like could take
a significant step forward in the second half if this
team gets to where they want to go, which is
back to the playoffs. That's a tough one because I
feel like there are a few and it kind of
depends on a couple of different things. I think that

(37:19):
the first guy that comes to mind for me is
Tyler Stevenson and the injury. You wanted to trade him
five minutes ago. Well, I don't want to just I
just don't want to get it just.

Speaker 4 (37:30):
Right.

Speaker 2 (37:31):
Jeff hates how many players that I've hated over the years,
according to some others anyway, But no, I think it's
Tyler Stevenson because we haven't seen his best stuff yet.
And I think that from the plate, he continues to
hit the ball hard, he's just getting unlucky. He's the
guy that bab It does matter quite a bit.

Speaker 4 (37:51):
Four.

Speaker 2 (37:51):
We talked a lot about batting Averagon balls and play
with Ellie. It matters for Tyler Stevenson. And as much
as his athletics slide for a double the other day,
really that at some point he can run the bases
really well. He's not known for that, and I think
that it's all about the bat to ball thing with him,
and he's hit the ball really well, he's just not
seeing the results. I think we'll see the results the
second half.

Speaker 3 (38:12):
And for me, I think we need to see some
more progression from Noelvie Marte.

Speaker 2 (38:15):
He's going to get more playing time at third.

Speaker 3 (38:18):
We're looking at him still being pulled as a defensive
replacement laden games. I would like to see that stop.
I would like to see Noelvie progress to a point
where Tito just can't take him out. He needs to play,
He needs to play. So for me, that's the next
guy that you would hope could continue to develop and
turn a corner.

Speaker 2 (38:33):
Here in the second half.

Speaker 3 (38:35):
You know, we talk about this jokingly all the time
about you know, addition through health, addition through promotion from within,
Like they need this guy to go, and if he goes,
then so does the Reds offense a little bit.

Speaker 2 (38:46):
We've seen it the last several days from him.

Speaker 3 (38:47):
When he has a good game, the Reds find themselves
in a position to win because the lineup needs just
that one more guy that can go.

Speaker 2 (38:54):
So Novi Martes, my guy, I think I agree with
that a lot. And I you know, Noelvi twenty three
years old. The kid needs to play, and he's gonna
screw up, but he needs to play a little bit,
kind of like Ellie did when he was going through
some of his defensive issues and stuff like that. This
has flown by. We have one segment left. I want
to ask you guys a little bit about the major

(39:14):
league draft that is happening right now and has happened
for the last couple of days, the minor league system.
We saw that salth Stewart got promoted to Triple A Louisville.
We'll talk about that and more. This is since E
three to sixty on ESPN fifteen thirty thirty since E
three to sixty hour one, getting ready to close up

(39:36):
shop on a Monday ESPN fifteen thirty on Austin elmore
tea pipe back next week he is on load management season,
So it's just me this week right now though, joined
by Steve Offenbaker Jeff Carr of the Locked On Reds podcast.
As we continue to talk about the Reds at the
All Star break, let's dip down into the minor leagues

(39:56):
for just a minute. We talked about the quote unquote
untouchables in a potential trade scenario. Steve, for you, who
are some names that we need to keep an eye
on Our Reds fans should keep an eye on in
the minor league system as their season wraps up? I
guess about a month and a half left in their season.

Speaker 3 (40:13):
Well right now, for me, the number one guy is
a guy we mentioned a little earlier, and that's South Stewart.
We just saw him in the Futures game, you know,
Oh for one put the bomb play as Jeff looked
up for us there during the break. And for me,
that's probably the closest guy, the guy you should be
paying attention to now.

Speaker 2 (40:27):
In a pinch, might see him this year.

Speaker 3 (40:29):
Interesting, it'd be better I think if it was next
year that we saw him, but it could happen this year.
You look at how he's doing. Pipeline has him as
the number three prospect in the system. Now he'll move
up those rankings because I know that Chase Burns, who's
already in the major leagues, are ahead of him, right,
so those ratings will adjust. But he's probably the guy
I'm keeping my eye on most you look at, you know,
even the other guy in the Futures Game. Do know
was in the Futures Game for the Reds, But nineteen

(40:51):
years old, can't buy a beer yet, He's a long
ways away. He's going to have to check back in
a few years down the road. You know, it's a
name we keep here come up. Obviously the Reds are
highlighting him by having him in the Futures Game, but
he's still a long ways away. So I think Stuart's
probably the most immediate possibility of a guy to keep
an eye on that could actually get here soon.

Speaker 2 (41:11):
There's two names that I think could be traded based
on guys that need to be protected from the Rule
five draft in this offseason, and the Reds might subvert
that by just trading him for a major leaguer now,
and that's Edwin Arroyo and Hector Rodriguez. Edwin Arroyo of
course big part of that Mariner's trade, and a lot
of folks, including myself at least at the time, wondered

(41:32):
if he would move Ellie off of shortstop. He hasn't
quite hit for power though, and he's still down in
the minor leagues kind of slugging under four hundred. You
wonder if that's ever going to come about. He is
hitting around two eighties. Another shoulder injury guy too, Yeah,
another shoulder injury guy as well. And then Hector Rodriguez
is the best outfield prospect. And it's really hard to

(41:53):
squint and see who the second best outfield prospect is
me in the Reds outfield or in the Reds organization.
So that that's gonna be the next guy that you
see come up and he could make a difference in
the outfield, or he could just be another Blake Dune
guy like that that he's a quadruple A guy. Just
because the Red system isn't that strong in the outfield,
why can't they draft and develop outfielders. The focus isn't there.

Speaker 3 (42:15):
I mean they could, that's not the decision they've made,
though they've made two decisions. It's hard to go out
inside free agent pitching. It's very, very expensive. Therefore they
need to grow their own so that's been focused priority
number one.

Speaker 2 (42:26):
Focus.

Speaker 3 (42:26):
Priority number two is get the athletes, which is the shortstops,
and we can move them around, we can find them
new homes, we can draft those guys because again expensive,
So they're drafting the best athletes on the field and
trying to move them to spots that they need.

Speaker 2 (42:40):
They're drafting the pitching. The hope is you can convert.

Speaker 3 (42:43):
Those those shortstops to outfielders, so they're not drafting outfielders.
But what that leads to then is you look around
the system and you're like, well, until we actually do
move these guys off of shortstop, there is an apparent
lack of outfield depth anywhere in the system where they're
really eyeing a couple shortstops, a couple infielders to eventually
move I think.

Speaker 2 (43:00):
When I believe that they have found the sweet spot
with pitching development, and there's a lot of folks around
the industry that look at the Reds and say they
are a good organization for developing pitching. Now, they just
quite haven't translated that to the position side of things.
And we had a great conversation with current Red scout
Tyler Gibbons, and he kind of talked about the Reds
philosophy when it comes to adding young players and drafting

(43:22):
young players and trading for minor leaguers. They look for
traits and then they can teach skill, is how they
approach this. There's other teams that look for skills as
well as traits, but the Reds put a lot more
weight on the traits and the athleticism of a player,
and they believe they can teach that skill as they
go through the minor league. So that's why you always
see other teams drafting players that they'll talk a lot

(43:43):
about the hit skill, and then when the Reds draft guys,
they talk a lot about the athleticism. That's just kind
of how the Reds have positioned themselves as an organization.
But I don't think they found that sweet spot teaching
the hit skill just yet. The MLB Draft is happening
as we speak. What do we know about the players
the Reds have selected so far, and most notably their

(44:04):
first round pick, a guy with a great name, Steel Hall,
a shortstop from Alabama. High school shortstop from Alabama.

Speaker 3 (44:12):
Well, right now, just going to give you the specifics
on these guys, because he's really been following this close.
I just want to start off the conversation though, by
saying that what we know is that we don't know.

Speaker 2 (44:21):
These guys are five years away.

Speaker 3 (44:23):
The Reds made a decision in this draft to go
young into to the high school class.

Speaker 2 (44:28):
You know, and not just the Reds.

Speaker 3 (44:30):
You know, eight of the first fifteen picks were high
school shortstops in this draft. So Major League Baseball as
a whole is looking at that crop of players. What
that means is there's a lot of unknowns. There's a
lot of time that's going to have to pass before
we see any of these guys be remotely close to
contributing at the big league level. Now that being said,
you look at these players. They did go get a

(44:50):
couple good ones.

Speaker 2 (44:51):
Yeah, steel Haul. The trait is his athleticism and his speed,
because scouts have raided his speed a seventy on the
twenty to eighty six and that is considering like Major
League players. That's not saying he's a seventy grade high
school speed. He's a seventy grade speed for players that
they look at in the Major League. So he is fast,
and he has a fast bat according to scouts, but

(45:14):
he's got some swinging miss potential. He's got to really
develop at the plate. It's following along kind of with
what I said where the Reds are really prioritizing athleticism
and they believe they can teach him to be a
decent hitter down the road. Some scouts believe that he's
got potential to hit fifteen to twenty home runs in
a season, but they think it's probably more likely he
will be a ten to fifteen homer guy. So we're

(45:36):
we're looking more at like on base speed threat middle
of the field. Some think he stays at shortstop, others
think he can move to center field, which either or
is really a good thing conversation. Yeah, it's a good
thing to have, But that's exactly where the Reds are
and they're betting on their development system on getting in there. Well,
this has been a blast, been a lot of fun.
I really appreciate you guys coming up here and making

(45:58):
some time for us. Steve, I know you're about to
fly back to the Big Island. God bless you, man.
I don't know how you do? How long? So what
do you fly to? Like California?

Speaker 3 (46:08):
And yeah, I fly from Big Island ConA to Seattle,
change planes and then get into Columbus.

Speaker 2 (46:12):
How long is it from Seattle to.

Speaker 3 (46:14):
Five hours each leg? So about a ten hour flight?
Oh my gosh, God love you man, I love them.
You want to talk about a Reds fan, a true commitment?
Where can people follow along to everything you guys have
and what do you have that you've been working on
at Lockdown Reds.

Speaker 2 (46:30):
You can follow the Lockdown Reds podcast everywhere you get
your podcasts, including the iHeartRadio app. Got a lot of
great draft stuff up there, and we're going to be
really honing in on the trade deadline coming up. You
can also watch us on YouTube and talk some Reds
baseball there, and you can follow us on social media.
You can follow Steve at s Offenbaker with two f's
on X and then you can follow me at Jeff

(46:52):
Carr with three f's on X and TikTok as well.
Having a lot of fun talking Reds on the TikTok
of you considered adding an F just to no, you know,
I didn't go to college in Alabama, so I spell
my name right. Some might wonder if that's third F
as an initial or maybe a statement to everybody else.

(47:14):
Jeff car Steve Offenbaker, Thank you guys so much. We'll
take a break, we'll come back. I'll talk a little
bit more about the Reds recap the weekend. We've got talkbacks,
We've got a Bengals conversation to have a lot still
coming up in the next two hours on Cincy three sixty.
Thank you so much for listening. Hour two is next
on the Home of the Bengals, ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 8 (47:33):
WCKY, Cincinnati, make us the number one pre set on
your car radio and on the free, new and improved
iHeartRadio app Free never sounded so good.

Speaker 9 (47:42):
ESPN fifteen thirty, Hey, do you run a small business?

Speaker 1 (47:45):
But Cincy three sixty about Cincinnati from Cincinnati, sponsored in
part by Cincy Shirts, Cincy Shirts All Cincy, all Day.
This is ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.

Speaker 2 (48:00):
Hi, Hello, welcome in our number two of Cincy three
sixty on ESPN fifteen thirty. My name is Austin Elmore.
Apologies for getting in here a little bit late. We
had a great conversation up in the first hour with
Jeff Carr and Steve Offenbaker about the Reds that'll be
up on the podcast shortly. My thanks to my guy

(48:21):
Tarren Bland, who came in a little bit early today
so that he could produce that first hour so we
had enough space to make that work. I am back
in the producer and host chair for the rest of
the show and phone lines are officially open. Five one, three, seven,
four nine fifteen thirty is the phone number. You can
also tweet it me at audiol More a U T

(48:41):
y E L M o r E about to have
a Revivefitnessystems dot com poll question coming up that is
coming up. I failed to mention that. My apologies in
the first hour. I'm working on that. There's been a
lot of moving parts, but we're here now. Talkback's coming
up about fifteen to twenty minutes from right now. Your

(49:02):
phone calls, we'll talk a little Bengals coming up in
the final hour of the show as well. Moegroill stop
by for quick hits and locks of the Night. The
Reds continue to make picks in the Major League Baseball Draft.
Some of their more recent picks, They've drafted Mason Neville,
who is an outfielder from the University of Oregon, in

(49:23):
the fourth round. In the fifth round, they selected outfielder
Eli Pitts, who was a high school player out of
Georgia in the Atlanta area. They've also drafted right hander
Brayden Osbolt from Kennesaw State University in the sixth round.
Major League Baseball Draft happening this week in Atlanta. Coming
up tonight home run Derby at Truest Park in Atlanta, Georgia,

(49:46):
home of the Braves, and last last minute change to
the lineup. Ronald Accouny Junior, who was supposed to be
the hometown hero for the Braves, dealing with some back
tightness so he is not going to participate in the derby,
is replaced by his teammate Matt Olsen, big left hander,
which right now I might be I might be taking

(50:07):
matt Olsen to potentially win that home run derby. He's
got experience at ballpark's a little friendlier to left handers. Maybe,
just maybe matt Olsen wins the home run derby tonight again,
you can hear it on ESPN fifteen thirty coverage beginning
at eight o'clock All Star Game tomorrow. Right now, Ellie
de la Cruz, Andrew Abbott, among others, meeting with the

(50:29):
media for MLB All Star Game Media Day, and Charlie Goldsmith,
who's down there covering it, says that Ellie is getting
the true superstar treatment. He is all over in the
promotional you know, billboards and posters and all sorts of
stuff down there in Atlanta, including a big one right
outside the ballpark. He's getting a kind of a larger

(50:52):
media arrangement for media day at the All Star Game. This,
of course, Ellie's second All Star Game of his career.
So here's my thought on the Reds And it was
great talking to Jeff and Steve about that, and ultimately
what it comes down to is, can you prove to me,
as a Reds fan that you're trying to win? Can

(51:15):
you excuse me, I just had to sneeze my apologies.
Can you prove to me that you're trying to win,
that you're putting your eggs in this basket instead of
trying to put your eggs into what might be, or
in the eggs of all the potential guys that will
be here a few years from now, or worrying about prospects.

(51:40):
Are you putting your eggs in the basket of let's
try to get back to the playoffs? Now? The big
wild card in the second half is going to be
what the hell is going on with Hunter Green? I'm
frustrated by the fact that potentially their best picture he's
not right now because he's not available. But a guy
who could be their best picture be and I believe

(52:00):
can be one of the best pitchers in baseball is
not available, and there's confusion and uncertainty surrounding his injury.
This is, unfortunately, something we've had to deal with a
lot with this ball club, not just Hunter Green, with
other guys are confusing about how long they're out and
this and that, blah blah blah. It's becoming exhausting. But

(52:23):
if Hunter Green comes back and is healthy and is
anything like he was at the start of this season,
the Reds have a legitimate chance to make the playoffs,
and once they get to the playoffs, make some noise.
But now do things shift because Hunter may not be available?
Who knows if he'll pitch again this year, and if so,

(52:45):
do the Reds then have to change their priorities to
keep the starting pitching afloat, keep the bullpen afloat, as
opposed to trying to add offense. It would be great
if At McLain at the return of the All Star
Break turns into Matt McClain from twenty twenty three, If
Noel v Marte turns Intel v Marte from twenty twenty three,

(53:08):
that Will Benson produces at the level Will Benson produced
in that second part of twenty twenty three. But that's
a big ask. I want the organization to make moves
that tell me we are trying to win. They've done
that so far. The hiring of Terry Francona, the amount
of money that they're paying him in and of itself,

(53:29):
is an indicator we are trying to win. Okay, calling
up Chase Burns, Yes, it might have been out of
need more than anything else, but they very easily could
have gone a different direction with a subpar player. Instead
they go and bring up their best prospect. That to
me is saying they're trying to win. Cutting ties with

(53:52):
Jammer Candelario and not just continuing to play him to
me is says they're trying to win. And on top
of all of that, and we talk often about this
organization's financial standing or their financial philosophy towards building a winner,

(54:14):
Here's what we know for sure. The Reds are not
going to outspend every team in Major League Baseball. They're
not going to outspend every team in their division. They're
not going to outspend nearly anybody. They are going to
be in the bottom third of spending, in the bottom
to whatever however you want to say. They're not going
to go crazy financially. But the Reds, whether you take

(54:35):
it as an insult or not, one of their philosophies
is if people come to games, we have more money
to spend. And from an attendance standpoint, the Reds have
done pretty good. And this town shows up when the
baseball team is interesting, and when you have a guy
like Andrew Abbott and a guy like Elie de la Cruz,

(54:57):
teams show up certainly helps. When you I have a
home series in the middle of the week with the
New York Yankees that you're gonna make a bunch of
money off of, they have said directly, financial flexibility is
created by attendance at the ballpark. I don't like the
sound of that. I don't want it to be that way,

(55:18):
but this is the way they choose to do business.
They've made a lot of money this year. They've honored
Pete Rose, they made a lot of money off of that.
They've honored the Big Red Machine, They've made money off
of that. So I would think based off of the
way that this first half of the season has gone,

(55:39):
and the moves that they have made, and just the
general understanding that the franchise and their fan base is
getting impatient, you would think they understand that. I don't
think the people down there are stupid. I don't believe
that at all. And I do believe they want to win.
But are they willing to go the extra mile? Are
they willing to push a little bit outside their comfort

(56:01):
zone to try to win. They're probably not comfortable paying
Terry Francona what they're paying him. They probably unexpectedly and
uncomfortably are paying Nick Martinez what they are paying him,
But they're doing it. Can they say screw it, We're
going for this, Especially if maybe you have a South

(56:22):
Stewart on the horizon, who might be here next year
to help you, especially if you believe that Matt mcclan's
going to turn it around. Especially if you can get
an outfielder that might be here for a year or
two that's going to hit a bunch of home runs
at this ballpark. Maybe one of those guys that comes
up is going to eventually develop into a center field
I don't know, but can you go for it now?

(56:45):
Can you be the team that says we've got the pitching.
It may not happen like this again, let's go. Reds
fans are understandably reluctant to believe they will do that
because of what happened in twenty twenty three. And I
was one of those guys saying, just keep everybody, let's
enjoy this and see what happens in the next couple years.

(57:06):
Why I was wrong. I wish they would have gone
after it. I wish they would have been more aggressive.
I heard Moe talking about this on Sunday morning, that
the idea of the starting pitching was their biggest weakness
going into the trade deadline in twenty twenty three, and
they didn't address it and almost immediately it came back

(57:26):
to bite them in the butt. We have been talking
for years about the biggest weakness. Everybody knows what the
biggest weakness is. They can't hit for power. The bullpen
is a little bit overworked. They're inconsistent offensively. Can they
acquire somebody who hits the ball out of the ballpark.
Can they acquire somebody who protects La de la Cruz

(57:48):
in the lineup, maybe more or better than Austin Hayes.
Can they create more opportunities to score runs to help
alleviate the pressure on the pitching. We all know what
the issue is. Baseball fans in this town are not stupid,
nor are the people running the organization. But at some

(58:08):
point there has to be a willingness, a commitment to
say all right, I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna try.
It's like that with anything in life. You know, at
some point you say, Okay, I'm going to commit to
working out four days a week, I'm going to commit
to starting to training for a marathon. I'm going to
commit to this new job and see what I can do.

(58:31):
I'm going to commit to whatever it might be and
say all right, this is what I'm going to do that.
This is my plan of action, this is how I'm
going to attack it. Maybe the chain of events was
set in motion back in October when they hired Francona.
He's not going to be the manager here forever. Ellie
de la Cruz isn't going to be here forever. You

(58:53):
would hope that they view Ellie and view Hunter, and
view Abbott and view McClain and look around and say, Okay,
this is it, like this is our best chance. Let's
do everything in our power to supplement those guys so
that we can be competitive here. I don't give a

(59:13):
damn about the Dodgers. I don't care about the Padres,
I don't care about the Cubs. I don't care about
the teams that they might face if they get to
the playoffs. Just get to the playoffs and see what happens.
That should be the mentality, especially the way this team
is built. I say it all the time, and I

(59:35):
know I sound like a broken record, but I'm not
afraid to demand that the organizations in this city are
in aggressive pursuit of a championship. That is the job
of a fan, and so I don't want them to
make the same mistake twice. Three games over five hundred
or ten games over five hundred, it doesn't matter. You're

(59:56):
over five hundred and you're within reach of a wild
card spot. You have a chance to get back to
the playoffs, and once you get there, who knows what
can happen. Reds fans are tired of waiting. I would
think the organization understands that. I would think the people
there are also tired of waiting. There's a lot of

(01:00:17):
money to be made. If you want to make everything
about money, there's a lot of money to be made
by being a playoff team. There's a lot that can
happen between now and then, and if nothing else, I
would just like you to commit to me as a fan. Yes,
we're trying, we're doing this for you, We're trying to win.

(01:00:38):
We look around at the people around, We look at
Ellie and look at Hunter and look at Abit and say,
we're trying to win. Now. This is our best shot.
We're going to learn from the mistakes we made two
years ago and give everything we can over the next
five And maybe that's why they're drafting a bunch of
high school kids this year, because they know that five
years from now, when those dudes are ready to get

(01:00:59):
to the big League, there's gonna be a change, a
changing of the guard with a lot of these players leaving.
I don't know, Maybe it's impossible truly to evaluate a
team or an organization like that. But now that we've
reached this point in the season, am I excited? My thrilled?

(01:01:20):
Am I over the moon that this team is three
games over five hundred? No? I feel like they had
left a lot of meat on the bone, and I
think a lot of Reds fans feel that way. But
feel a lot better about them being three games over
than three games under. I feel a lot better about
their starting pitching. I feel a lot better about their
all Stars. I feel a lot better about the bullpen,
feel a lot better about what they can be based

(01:01:45):
off how they played at points this year. Can Terry
Francona loosen up a little bit? Can they find some
consistency in the All Star break? Can there be a focus?
Can there be a turning point? Can somebody come in
and change the locker room, change the clubhouse? The bar

(01:02:06):
is is low? Honestly, like the Bengals when they start
training camp in ten days from now, nine days from now.
The bar is the super Bowl. That's high, that's hard,
that's nearly unattainable. With the Reds, the bar is like, hey,
can you guys play in the postseason? Can you at
least get there, Let's see what happens. Like the bar

(01:02:29):
for the Bengals with the Burrow going in twenty twenty one,
it's like, oh, crap, we made the playoffs. Can you
guys win a playoff game? That'd be cool. And then
they went to the super Bowl and everyone's like, all right, yeah,
now the bar is the super Bowl. The Reds right now,
it's like, hey, can you make the playoffs? Just like
win a series and then we'll be happy for a
little while. Like it's that low. I hope that they're

(01:02:54):
willing to commit to that. Again, a lot of meat
on the bone from the first part of the season,
but they're in it and that at least counts for something.
So let's go after it now while we can. That's
my mentality. I hope that's their mentality. Hope they understand
and see the window and say, all right, this is

(01:03:16):
the time. We'll take a break, we'll come back. Your
talkbacks are next. This is Cincy three to sixty hour two,
brought to you by Cincy Shirts on the Home of
the Bengals Cincinnatis, ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 1 (01:03:28):
Now is back on ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.

Speaker 9 (01:03:35):
All right, bough, let me hear you good loud oh
wld hah too ah free.

Speaker 2 (01:03:46):
Well listen to sup to backs well, listen to the clouds.
Get me a bud of supproud James. We hope those
other two diver come back, rout for totally all off

(01:04:11):
and come close to the show. We got Hack Roight,
Hello the stars over talk back show, rods Well, rods Well,
welcome back in. Since he three sixty it's time for talkbacks. Talkbacks,

(01:04:31):
of course, brought to you by since He Shirts, and
not a bunch of them today, but we've got plenty
of time for him. And let's see what we got
on the docket.

Speaker 10 (01:04:42):
Hey guys, it's Reggie and Maryman Reggie wet blanket. But
the home stand against the Marlins and the Rockies going
four and seven. That that doesn't feel like a wind
to me. That feels like a The road trip we
had before that was rough, and we're kind of right
back to.

Speaker 2 (01:04:58):
Where we were we're all always right here.

Speaker 10 (01:05:00):
Every Monday, it feels like we're right day, you know,
we got hope, and then it just kind of slips
away and grab it back where. This has been a
bipolar season for sure, but I still have hope.

Speaker 2 (01:05:10):
Let's go. Yeah. I mean, they can't get more than
four games over five hundred. They can't. They haven't gone
more than four games under five hundred. It's just kind
of been swaying back and forth between those two things,
and it does feel like every Monday it's on the
right side of the sway. Listen, I was. I was
at a concert on Saturday, and I really was trying

(01:05:33):
not to think about sports for a little bit. I
was trying to unplug. My friend says to me, the
Reds are losing again. I'm like, ohh crap, And so
instead of enjoying the concert, I pull my phone out
and I'm watching every pitch thinking, gosh, Monday is gonna
be miserable if they lose to the Rockies, if they
lose a series to the Rockies, Like, no, they're not

(01:05:54):
gonna do this. And thankfully they turned it around. But
to me, you know, I always thought about that ten
games going into the home stand or going into the
All Star break, because it was like, yes, the seven
game homestand with Miami and Colorado, but the three in
Philadelphia beforehand, I thought was a good test against a
veteran team who's going to be in the playoffs and

(01:06:17):
is a difficult team to play it. Obviously, Zach Wheeler
was one pitch away from a perfect game. Chase Burns
struggled a little bit at times, and there was you know,
up and down, but all together in that ten games
they went five and five, which is just indicative of
who they are, right like, kind of who they've been
all season long. Can they get anything or anywhere or

(01:06:37):
someone or something to get them to get over that hump?
I don't know. Yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:06:43):
Shout out to my new favorite talkbacker peg Leg Pete
rerepping long John Silvers, I love.

Speaker 2 (01:06:51):
It, fish like food. Shout out to part time Pike.

Speaker 3 (01:06:56):
And talk back God vacation Bug, he's hanging out and
see us to Key Dachree.

Speaker 2 (01:07:04):
Tony's like, I don't believe in tipping.

Speaker 9 (01:07:07):
I don't want to tip.

Speaker 11 (01:07:08):
Talk back guys like I got you brow magically makes
for two of the appear.

Speaker 2 (01:07:14):
Yeah, I would you know, waiting on, you know, any
sort of correspondence from Tony. I mean, I try to
give the guy a space, but I you know, I
normally at least get one picture from Tone as he
celebrates vacation.

Speaker 12 (01:07:26):
Austin Elmore, standing on business, everybody got to ask you
a question there, Austin, if you can create some local
pro sports content this week, what would it be The
Reds make a move that makes sense, the Bengals give
an extension to Trey Henderson or shad Mar Stewart sign
his rookie deal, take care of Ebody, and always remember, Oh.

Speaker 2 (01:07:50):
Dang, that's a good question. That's kind of like a
start bench cut of things hanging over the sports teams.
I would like the if I could pick, I would
art Shamar Stewart signing his rookie deal, I would bench
Trey Hendrickson getting an extension, and then the Red's making
a move solely because I think I don't think the

(01:08:11):
Reds will make a move until later in the month.
I don't know if teams are wheeling and dealing quite yet,
but I would like to get the other two things
shirt up prior to training camp starting in nine days.

Speaker 7 (01:08:23):
Awesome.

Speaker 1 (01:08:24):
What's up.

Speaker 13 (01:08:25):
It's ice here.

Speaker 2 (01:08:25):
What I do a great job as always when T
Pike's on vacation. Awesome, awesome news. I'm so happy you guys.

Speaker 13 (01:08:32):
Are doing more local programming. The Tonyamo Football Show during
Bengals training camp from ten to Noon's gonna be awesome.

Speaker 2 (01:08:40):
Hopefully this turns into something permanent.

Speaker 13 (01:08:43):
We get more local sports talk red at the break.
Are they contenders or pretenders? What's your thoughts?

Speaker 2 (01:08:53):
I think right now they are pretenders. They're just too
inconsistent for me to think they're contenders.

Speaker 11 (01:09:00):
Guys, we've only got twelve more days of this ICQO
Big Three commercials. Man, it's really gonna be a shame
when it's gone. Only twelve more days. Cherish every moment
it's right.

Speaker 2 (01:09:13):
Make the most of it because you're three out three basketball.

Speaker 14 (01:09:17):
Austin, hope you had a great weekend.

Speaker 2 (01:09:19):
Thank you.

Speaker 14 (01:09:19):
On this date, in nineteen eighty nine, Yits in Loveland
was born. He wasn't born in Loveland, he was born
in christ Hospital.

Speaker 2 (01:09:26):
But I digress.

Speaker 14 (01:09:28):
It's traditional where I come from that you give blessings
on your birthday, So I will bless Tony Austin and
talkback nation. Everyone should have a year full of health
and happiness and all the things you want, including a
Bengal Super Bowl victory. I won't get too greedy a
Red's playoff appearance.

Speaker 2 (01:09:46):
Have a good one. Wow yits thank you and happy birthday, Audie.

Speaker 5 (01:09:51):
It's the top to this hour. You're asking as a
Freds fan, can the Reds prove that they're trying to win?
My frustration in watching and listening to them is they
either play up or down to the level of their competition,
and that's very frustrating. I don't know if it's because

(01:10:13):
they're young or they just don't have the killer instinct
on beating people they should.

Speaker 2 (01:10:21):
Yeah, I feel that for sure. Like you know, they
don't always win those games, but it feels like they're
a lot more competitive against good teams. And I don't
really know why that is. I don't have any really
explicit explanation for it, but that's exactly what we're talking about.
It's like, can you get to a level of consistency

(01:10:43):
that says this is our standard of play instead of like,
all right, hopefully we find a way to win today. No,
they go out and kick somebody's butt.

Speaker 15 (01:10:52):
As always, flexing and repident Natty out here, it's sunny,
very hot.

Speaker 2 (01:10:56):
Come on, Ron, what a Boddy? You know you're riding solo?
I see, Oh I hear. That's good.

Speaker 15 (01:11:01):
That first hour Straight Power with Jeff Carr fantastic information
far as the riz. This homestand was for real, let's
just be real disappointing a little bit. You finished off
with the two game wins, but I'm not as confident
on how y'all finished. But the front office do something
about this, because if you don't, Man, we tired of this.

Speaker 2 (01:11:20):
Do something, front office. Yeah, I really really just don't
want to have like all these conversations again, as much
as like people are exhausted about talking about Trey Henderson
and Shamar Stewart, like I'm exhausted to be like, oh,
the Reds really didn't go for it, Like I don't
want to doubt how badly my team wants to win.

(01:11:45):
That is a terrible place for a fan to be.

Speaker 15 (01:11:47):
Oh yeah, I'm back for a double dip. You gotta
get this one off my chest. This is for this
team right here. Man, how in the world.

Speaker 2 (01:11:54):
I'm so sick of the colors yellow and black. I
can't stand it. I really can't stand it.

Speaker 15 (01:12:00):
Uh, Columbus crew, really we had to nothing lead on
them to zip I turn around next to you know,
we took an ale. It sucks loving to that team
up there. It really sucks. I want to bury that
team so bad. That's all right, though, We'll be back.
We still run the East. We'll be back.

Speaker 2 (01:12:17):
Yeah, that was a disappointing result. We'll get into that
a little bit in the third hour as well. Uh,
it's salt in the wound that it happens at the
hands of your biggest rival. It's also salt in the
wound that it happens again at your home stadium where
Columbus you know, scores four unanswered to beat you, and

(01:12:37):
the hell is real Derby. That is tough stuff for
f C Cincinnati, especially the way they started. We'll get
into that a little bit later on. But yeah, gut
punch loss for the Orange and Blue.

Speaker 16 (01:12:50):
Yeah, I know I'm gonna sound like a broken record,
but they they just really really need to make a move.

Speaker 17 (01:12:59):
Man.

Speaker 16 (01:12:59):
They need a powerheader so bad. If they don't go
get a good bat, I think even with the good
starting pitch and they have, it's just not gonna It's
just not gonna be enough for him.

Speaker 2 (01:13:15):
Yeah, man, it's it's I'm right there with you, Austin.
Bryan Milford, how you doing, buddy?

Speaker 18 (01:13:24):
Great great interview with Jeff and the other gentleman. I
forgot his name, Steve. Could you like winning the home
run derby tonight? Either cal Raley or Byron Buxton? For me,
I wish the Reds would consider trading for him. But yeah,
it cost an armor a leg, dude. Anyway, have a
good day.

Speaker 2 (01:13:44):
Yeah, I would love Byron Buckston. I mean, I'm still
seared in my memory the way he dominated the Reds
when the Twins were here a couple of weeks ago.
I think four homers in three games. I think my
top two are Matt Olsen and Byron Buckston. Those are
the two that I'm rooting for in the home derby.
But I was talking to Jeff about this off the
air a little bit. He said that Junior Cameron Aro

(01:14:04):
from the Twins is like the guy nobody's talking about,
Like watch out for him to just show up.

Speaker 19 (01:14:11):
Austin, I agree with you. The Reds are on the
verge of doing something incredible. It's never been done in
the history of Major League Baseball. Therefore, I am signing
an executive order placing sanctions and tariffs on all the

(01:14:36):
thirty one remaining Major League baseball team.

Speaker 2 (01:14:40):
Thank you.

Speaker 3 (01:14:41):
As long as there's heritage bankson, I will be back
next summer ball.

Speaker 20 (01:14:46):
Baby, everyone in the iHeartRadio studio shows up to a
little league baseball field and you have a home run
derby five out per person three innings.

Speaker 4 (01:15:03):
Who walks away with the trophy me?

Speaker 2 (01:15:06):
I would, And then I'm gonna go DJ Hodge second.
And after that, hmmm, it's a good question. I'm trying
to think of like a top three, you know, like
who's gonna be on the podium. I'm gonna say me
number one. Just sheer power, I mean little league field
launching those. I'm gonna say DJ number two. And I

(01:15:31):
don't want to. I don't want to say Pike would
come in third, but he is. He's still pretty athletic,
but he talked. I would never want him to find out.
I spoke highly of his ability to hit a baseball,
even if it's you know, like home run Derby type
of stuff. But I think it would be him. Yeah,

(01:15:53):
I say me DJ Hodge, Tony Pike, give me one
let me start it.

Speaker 20 (01:16:02):
Give me one male and one female to win.

Speaker 2 (01:16:05):
Oh, one male and one female. Well, I'm gonna take me,
uh as the male. Trying to think who we got, hmm,
I'm gonna say Marcia, Marcia Capele. She she would win.
All right, that's our last one. Nobody knows what I'm
talking about, but that would be I've tried. Actually, you know,

(01:16:27):
I've tried to. I asked our boss when time, I said,
what do you think we just play some wiffleball in here?
He said no. So I thought about maybe asking for
forgiveness instead of permission, but I don't know how well
that would go over. All right, we'll take a break.
We'll come back. That was talkbacks. Phone lines are open
officially five one, three, seven, four nine, fifteen thirty if

(01:16:47):
you want to call in and be a part of
the show. By the way, revive Fitnessystems dot com. Pole
question it is up on social media at audio more
at ESPN fifteen thirty. What grade you give the reds
for the first half you vote? I'll tell you the
results next Since three sixty, ESPN fifteen thirty. Hi zois Aldana,

(01:17:08):
what's going on in baseball?

Speaker 17 (01:17:10):
Getting ESPN is fifteen thirty From iHeartRadio.

Speaker 2 (01:17:21):
Since E three sixty ESPN fifteen thirty. Welcome back in.
I'm Austin Elmore. In case you're wondering, Big Tone out
this week, he's on vacation, much deserved for the Big Fellow.
Hope he's enjoying it. The All Star Game is tomorrow night,
and there was something that happened over the weekend that
I was kind of bothered by. And this is something

(01:17:43):
we'll get into a little bit more as tomorrow goes
along and get into the actual All Star Game, because
you know, the Derby is exciting, Like I love the Derby.
I'm looking forward to the Derby. I hope you'll listen
to the Derby here on ESPN fifteen thirty. But something
happened with the All Star Game this weekend that is

(01:18:06):
bothersome to me. But first, revivefitnessystems dot Com Poll question
presented by Revivefitnessystems dot Com and coach PJ. Street. The
theme of the show today is where are you at
after the Reds first half? How do you feel? What
grade do you give the Reds in the first half
right now? Sixty percent say C sixty percent say C,

(01:18:29):
twenty two percent say B, eleven percent give them a
D or an F, and five and a half percent
give them an A. I'm surprised by both the D
slash F numbers and the A numbers call equaling out
to sixteen percent of the vote. Yeah, C, Like that's

(01:18:52):
just just they'll pass the class, right and just get
to next year and don't be awful. I think the
standards should be higher, but that's where we're at with
a lot of fans right now, and at least they're
in it. At least they're in it. What happened over
the weekend that I'm a little bit bothered by is

(01:19:17):
that Milwaukee Brewers right hander rookie right hander Jacob Mizerowski,
also known as the Miz, was named to the National
League All Star Team. He has made five career starts now.
In those five career starts, he's been very good. He

(01:19:37):
has an ERA of two point eighty one. He's pitched
twenty five innings. He struck out thirty three batters. He
at times has been dominant, nearly through a no hitter
in his first game. He's a really, really good young
prospect that is exciting and worthy of being mentioned and

(01:19:59):
talked about in paid attention to because of his early dominance,
but the fact that after five major league games in
his career he's been named to the All Star Team
when there are other pitchers that are more deserving, more experienced.

(01:20:20):
There are plenty of ways to look at the All
Star Game and ways we might fix it, and that's
what I'm going to talk about a little bit more tomorrow.
But I think, at the bare minimum, you shouldn't be
five games into your major league career and making the
All Star Team. And I know that, you know it's

(01:20:41):
not really his fault the way it works, and we'll
get into that, but I just don't think it's a
good look for baseball now. Paul Skins started the All
Star Game last year, and he pitched in eleven games.
I was a little I had paused then, a little

(01:21:02):
hesitant about it then, But at least he has double
digits and was dominant, and he was a craze and
he was a sensation, and him starting the All Star
Game I thought was good for the game, and you
knew exactly who this guy was. Now, maybe Jacob Miserowski
is just as good of if not better a pitcher
than Paul Skins, but he doesn't have the attention or

(01:21:26):
the popularity because of his backstory and maybe not coming
from the same background in college and being in the
World Series and the girlfriend thing with Paul Skins. Maybe
maybe it's just as good, but you know, it isn't
quite as nationally relevant. I don't know, but it's just
something about that rubbed me the wrong way. And part

(01:21:48):
of it is I'm tired of the Brewers being good
all the time, Like, did you see they won again?
The Brewers are like one hundred games over five hundred
again again, a team that spends less than the Reds
and is right back in the conversation I always talk
about doing more with less. Milwaukee is a game back
of the Cubs for the NL Central lead, a game

(01:22:12):
back of Chicago. They've won seven straight have Milwaukee. They're
sixteen games over five hundred. They are thirty three and
seventeen at home. I mean, go Lee, How do they
always do this? As far as the wild Card is concerned,

(01:22:33):
they are the top wild Card team with a four
game lead over the Padres and the Giants. The Giants
are just a half game out, The Reds are two
and a half the first three teams out of the
Giants a half game back, the Cardinals a game and
a half back, and the Reds two and a half back.
After that, there's a three game difference, as Arizona's three

(01:22:53):
games under five hundred and five and a half back
in the final wildcard spot. By the way, there are
reports over the weekend that Arizona is making a few
of their good young players available, including pitchers Merril Kelly
and Zach Gallen, who famously said the Reds are cheating
because of how the mound is built in Cincinnati, and
a guy by the name of a u Haanio Suarez

(01:23:16):
potentially available. I don't know, how would you feel about
the Reds getting Suarez, Like it feels like it makes
a lot of sense, but also kind of going back
to the conversation we had in the first hour with

(01:23:36):
Steve and Jeff about Noelvie Marte, you kind of got
to learn some stuff about the guy who exactly is
he going to be and he at twenty three years old,
needs to play baseball, needs to figure it out. And
that's kind of the balance part of the Reds, like
balancing winning, balancing development, bouncing trying to figure out the

(01:23:59):
future of the team. How would things kind of shake
up if Gino were to get here. I would assume
he'd got a DH and or maybe he'd play third
base and they'd find something for Marte to do. I
don't know. I don't know exactly what it would look like.
Maybe it'd be a platoon. Where do you put Gavin Lux?

Speaker 17 (01:24:14):
Like?

Speaker 2 (01:24:14):
How does this all work out? I don't know, but
I could. I would happily take a guy in au
Haineo Suarez, who's gonna end uphitting forty homers fifty homers
this year, and say, okay, uh, you come back home
to Cincinnati and see what you can do with this offense.
I don't hate the idea. I value winning, and he

(01:24:35):
would help the Reds win at least I think. I
worry is like, is it too good to be true?

Speaker 6 (01:24:41):
Right? You know?

Speaker 2 (01:24:42):
If fan favorite comes back and he's still being productive,
is it too good to be true? I don't know,
but I think the Reds should be kicking the tires
on that. For one thing. We know the Reds do
kick the tires. We'll take a break, We'll come back.
Phone calls. Uh five point three seven, four, nine, fifteen thirty.
You can tweet at me as well. Well. This is
since E three to sixty ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 1 (01:25:04):
Ky Cincinnati, make us the number one thirty Cincinnati sports station.

Speaker 2 (01:25:12):
Man already almost two hours down since E three sixty
ESPN fifteen thirty, Austin Elmore with you. Well, shift to
some Bengals in hour number three. We'll also talk a
little bit about FC Cincinnati, the gut wrenching loss they
had over the weekend. But phone lines are open five one, three, seven,
four nine, fifteen thirty for anything and everything you might

(01:25:36):
want to talk about. Let's go to the phones now
and talk to Mike in LA. What's up, Mike, what's
going on? Hello, Mike? Are you with me?

Speaker 4 (01:25:47):
Yeah, I'm with you. I just hang hung up to
her first second, as I've seen many people in my
room making too much noise.

Speaker 2 (01:25:54):
Do you need me to come back to you later? Yeah, yeah,
I'll put you back on hold. That'll be Mike, and
La will get to him a little bit later on.
But yeah, you know, kind of in the spirit of
that conversation from or that talkback, I believe it was
Kevin who left about if you could you know, create
the content of this week of like what's going to happen?

(01:26:15):
I would like to get everything short away with the Bengals.
Can we please just enter training camp without any distractions.
Can the focus be about football and not about contracts?
Can we stop having that conversation. I want the narrative

(01:26:40):
to shift, and it applies to the Reds and the Bengals.
I want them to be more like FC Cincinnati. This
weekend's result notwithstanding, because I want the narrative to shift
about each one of these teams. And the Bengals could
do themselves a lot of if they get this cleaned

(01:27:03):
up before training camp. More on that next phone calls
of course five one, three, seven, four, nine, fifteen thirty
tweet at me as well at audio more A U
T y E L M O R E our three
of since E three to sixty is next on the
Home of those Bengals ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 1 (01:27:19):
Tony Pike with my friends here at SIS Pennstation Eastco
Subs Since E three sixty about Cincinnati from Cincinnatis, spontered
in part by Penstation Eastco Subs handcrafted hot grilled subs,
fresh cut fries and lemonade. It's all about good taste.
Pennstation Eastco subs order online today. This is ESPN fifteen thirty,

(01:27:41):
Cincinnati Sports Station.

Speaker 2 (01:27:43):
Yes, indeed it is welcome into our three in Austin, Olmore,
Tony Pike out this week, back next week. Thank you
for being here, Thank you for listening to the show today.
Phone lines are open at five, one, three, seven, four, nine,
fifteen thirty. You can also go vote on a revived
fitnesses dot com poll question at audio More at ESPN

(01:28:04):
fifteen thirty on what grade you give the Reds as
the first half winds up? I talked about how I
would like there to be a shift in the narrative
with the two organizations in town, and how at you
earlier talking about the Reds, how I would just like
to feel for once like they're trying, like they're really

(01:28:27):
exhausting every avenue to try to win a championship. And
quite frankly, I've kind of felt like that with the
Bengals for the last couple of years. I've felt like, Okay,
they're at least going for it. They're changing, they're doing
all these different things to try to get this organization
to where it needs to be Now. Is it fair

(01:28:48):
to say that they are being aggressive in their pursuit
of a championship? Probably not. They still certainly have shortcomings
that hinder them, and most notably the way that they
approach contracts, contract extensions, their cap space, their cap space
moving forward, their struggles with the draft. Like there are

(01:29:08):
definitely things where the Bengals fall short, and I don't
think anybody would argue that the Bengals included. But there
was always a feeling, it has always been a feeling
over the last few years that the Bengals are trying
to win, they are being aggressive. But the more that
I think about this season and the more that I

(01:29:29):
think about the expectations attached to it, the more that
I watch quarterback and see Joe Burrow getting beat around
and having an MVP season and then losing a game
in the forties or by four points or whatever it
might be, the more I think, hmm, are the Bengals
being as aggressive as they need to be to take

(01:29:51):
the next step now? They've been pretty clear about the
way they viewed twenty twenty four. They viewed twenty twenty
four as a fluke, right, The Tanner Hudson fumble, the
Dejon Anthony pass interference, they got hot at the end.
The defense was all lou An Arumo's fault, and it
got fixed at the end. And they've got all this
young talent, and they still have Trey Hendrickson and YadA, YadA, YadA.

(01:30:14):
And if they're slightly better against the run, which was TJ.
Slayton and Orn Burke's being signed in free agency, in younger,
more athletic linebackers, which was Demetrius Knight and Barrett Carter
being drafted, and then you just get guys that are
certainly going to be better than Cordell Vohlsen and Alex Kappa, Well,
then everything will take care of itself. We talk often

(01:30:37):
that hope is not a strategy, but hope seems to
be a pretty big part of the Bengals plan going
into twenty twenty five. You hope that Shamar Stewart won't
care about the default language in his contract and he
shows up, and you hope that he's a lot more
productive in the NFL than he was in college. You
hope that Trey Hendrickson understands we're not gonna give you

(01:30:59):
a law long term extension, and you hope that he
doesn't cause a fuss about it. You hope that Miles
Murphy in the meantime can be the guy you drafted
him to be. You hope that you stay healthy in
the defensive back room because you don't have a lot
of depth beyond that. You hope that Geno Stone can
return to the guy who led the conference and interceptions.
And you hope that Jordan Battle continues to ascend. And

(01:31:21):
you hope all this happens with a new defensive coordinator
who you hope can transition easily from the college game
back to the NFL. Hope, hope, hope, hope, hope, hope.
Last year they were unlucky, right, That's the big thing.

(01:31:42):
You know. Even Burrow mentions it in quarterback that the
Bengals didn't get the ball to bounce their way a
lot that last year, except for that one time in
Dallas where there was a boneheaded play by the Cowboys
special teamer touched the ball after the punt had been
blocked and then was ultimately recovered by Muma Jong Mada,
and the Bengals went on to beat the Cowboys in

(01:32:03):
the game that they didn't play all that well, but
they found a way to win due to a blunder
by Dallas. They got lucky, but frankly, they weren't all
that lucky last year. But just because you didn't get
lucky for a majority of last year doesn't mean you
are going to get lucky for a majority of this year.
Think back to all the luck they had the year

(01:32:24):
they went to the super Bowl. Luck is a prerequisite
to winning a Super Bowl, by the way. You have
to get lucky. That's It's just how it works. With
a penalty, with a fumble, with a tip pass, with
a sack, with an injury, whatever it is, you've got
to get lucky. That's how it works. I think the
Bengals are putting too much into the idea of last

(01:32:46):
year was a fluke. And while I do believe the
team is talented, and while I do believe they could
get back to the super Bowl, I don't know that
I look at him and say they're gonna win twelve
thirteen games. You know. I listened to Hordes podcast, the
Bengals Booth Podcast, and he went around and talked to
all the beat riders and had them give their predictions

(01:33:06):
on the Bengals season, and almost every single one of
them had them at twelve wins between eleven and thirteen.
I find myself wondering, are we sure about that? Are
we sure this team is that good? Number One, It's
unfair to assume that Joe Burrow is going to play
at that high of a level again. Jamar Chase is

(01:33:32):
really really good and was really really good, and I
expect him to have a good season, But is it
fair to expect the guy to win a triple crown again?
And there are unproven guys on the offensive line who,
if the standard is play better than Kapa and Volsen. Sure,
maybe they could do that, but is that going to
have that much of an effect? It feels like to

(01:33:58):
me too much is being put into the idea of, well,
I hope things are a little bit better. I hope
we get luckier. And we've talked about Zach Taylor and
this team starting fast and how Zach has a warm
seat going into twenty twenty five, and I don't necessarily

(01:34:20):
disagree with that, but I kept thinking, and this is
not me being Zach Taylor apologist, as we all know
that I am. I am a big Zach guy, But
should his seat be all that warm? Considering the way
they've approached this offseason, minimal activity and free agency, questionable
draft picks at multiple positions, including one who may or

(01:34:43):
may not play this year, and thirty million dollars in
cap space that has not yet been spent, when there
are other viable options out there to improve your football team,
most notably at safety and at guard. And on top
of that, the on going continuous distraction that has nothing
to do with the head coach of the Bengals, which

(01:35:05):
is contract negotiations like Shamar Stewart and Trey Hendrickson. How
much of that is his fault? And I understand you
want to put the start fast thing on him, and
ultimately it is his responsibility as the head coach of
the football team. But if your first round pick is
missing training camp and your best defensive edge rusher and

(01:35:27):
your best defensive player period doesn't participate the entire time,
how much of that is really on Zach Because he
has nothing to do with those negotiations. That's not his department,
and yet the actions of that department affect the football department.

(01:35:48):
There is a narrative about the Bengals that says they
care more about winning foot or they care more about
winning contracts and contract negotiations than football games. Dislike that
narrative because at times it feels true, and I have
often said that I feel like the Bengals think a
prerequisite to winning football games is winning contract negotiations. I

(01:36:11):
would like to see that change. That being said, the
Bengals are finally doing things that other teams do and
now they're getting criticized for it. From a business standpoint,
it makes sense. But the question could be asked, and
it's a fair one, why are you choosing to do
this now? The pressure is on your coach and on

(01:36:34):
your quarterback and on your team to start quickly these negotiations,
These issues, seemingly small minute details in the grand scheme
of things are holding you back from achieving your goal.
It doesn't help the football team that those guys aren't practicing,

(01:36:57):
and we have nine days for this to happen before
or practices start adjacent to pay Core Stadium. But I
don't want the narrative around the organization to be that
they care more about winning contract negotiations than football games.
And I would like for the Bengals, and I want

(01:37:17):
to be very clear here, I stand on the side
of the Bengals. I stand on their side when it
comes to Trey, and I stand on their side when
it comes to Shamar. I think the Bengals are in
the right on both of those. I stand by that.
I firmly believe that. That being said, sometimes you got
to do stuff you don't want to do for the

(01:37:39):
greater good. Sometimes you got to do the right thing
when you don't want to. Sometimes you've got to be
willing to sacrifice your pride or your ego or your
dollars to do something that you're supposed to do. At
the end of the day, all that matters should be

(01:38:01):
how can I build this football team into a championship contender?
How do we win the Super Bowl? Contract disputes are
a part of life, and they're going to get worse
across the league because that's how people are and that's
our society. And that's a topic for another day. But
this isn't going away anytime soon. And so the Bengals,

(01:38:22):
and trying to protect themselves, are trying to do this
with Shamar Stewart, and maybe that's part of the deal
with Henderson. Who knows, But at what point do you
look around and say Okay, right, this isn't worth it.
We can deal with this later. I've talked before about
how the Bengals care right like what people think, more
than any time before. At some point you look around

(01:38:45):
and say, all right, listen, let's table this, let's get
these guys in camp. Let's go try to win the
Super Bowl. You have a hard time beating the allegations
that you care more about out money and business operations
than winning football games when stuff like this continues. Even

(01:39:08):
when you're right, and I believe the Bengals are even
when you're right, the Bengals have done a good job
of kind of setting themselves up. Even the Higgins and
Chase contracts, even the Burrow contracts, it's all built with
the future in mind. Burrow has easy restructures, the guarantees
and the outs for the Bengals, and the Higgins and
Chase deals, they make a lot of sense for the organization.

(01:39:30):
They have managed the cap well enough over the last
several years to put them in a position to be
more willing to take risks now, which is why part
of me says, all right, just give Tray what he
wants and let's get this thing over with and let's
get the dude in camp so that he can perform
and the Bengals can be better on defense, and the

(01:39:51):
shemar thing. The details seem so silly that it's not
even worth all of this. It's not worth it for
either one of them. But it's a constant headache and
a constant worry about is the team actually going to
be ready to perform on September the seventh in Cleveland?

(01:40:16):
And is all of this Zach Taylor's fault? No, I
get it. The guy has a warm seat going into
this year, But should he Should it be that warm
if most of the issues are out of his control?

(01:40:38):
You know, Zach Taylor isn't the one who signs off
on who they draft or don't draft, or who they
sign or don't sign. He's in the conversations, But ultimately,
that's Duke Tobin's decision. And the budget that they have
and the way that they choose to spend their money,
that's that's not Zach's decision. And the way that they
choose to negotiate and the way that they handle the

(01:40:59):
relationship with the players, that's not Zach's decision. Zach coaches
the football team, and there are factors outside of his
control that are making his job harder, and he's the
one that has to answer for it when it comes
to wins and losses. And by the way, it's been
like this the whole time, which is why I like

(01:41:23):
Zach and I think he's done a good job, and
I think he deserves more credit. I have staunchly defended
him and the Bengals organization a lot on these airwaves,
but I've looked at this offseason. I've looked around at
the rest of the league, and I've wondered, you know, listen, man,
Joe's really freaking good. I think he's the best quarterback

(01:41:46):
in the NFL that can get you where you want
to go. Maybe it can get you far, can it
get you far enough? And I just wonder if the
Bengals are ever willing to say, let's go be a
team where the narrative is not about our frugality or

(01:42:09):
our stubbornness or our contract negotiations, but that it's in
the image and built in the image of Paul Brown,
who is a forward thinking, innovative football mind with tons
and tons of success to show for. At what point
do we build our team through his image? Instead of

(01:42:30):
the image that we have unfortunately allowed to be our
image for so long. I would like that to be
the way the Bengals go or approach team building. I
still think they're good. I still think they'll be competitive.
I still think they can be a legit Super Bowl contender.

(01:42:52):
But I'm going to look around and say, uh, yeah,
you know, if something goes wrong, if Burrow gets heard,
if he gets sacked, if the offensive line struggles, and
you're gonna be like, yeah, we kind of knew about this,
right because you guys didn't sign guards that were good enough,
or you don't have depth in the secondary and there's

(01:43:13):
there's nobody that can play safety. Do you feel confident
if Geno Stone gets goes down or like and you
got the thirty million dollars that you didn't spend, Like,
at what point does it change? I believe the Bengals
want to win, but this year I don't know that

(01:43:33):
they've emptied the clip. And is there anything that happens
between now and nine days from now when training camp starts,
to where the Bengals say, Okay, we're gonna wash our
hands of this and we're gonna focus on trying to
put a winning football team on the field tray, we'll
come to the table and we'll come to an agreement
or schamar, we'll remove this language or whatever, because we

(01:43:53):
want to put all our push, all our chips in
towards winning football games. And we'll reassess us next year,
or will reassess with the next draft pick, or will
change the way another time, because right now is too important.
That's the mentality I won because it's true. Right now
is the most important. This is the window you have

(01:44:17):
put a lot of your resources and focus on this season.
And if you go another year of not making the playoffs,
if you go another year of starting out slow, oh boy,
that's not good. Phone calls five one, three, seven, four nine,
fifteen thirty since E three to sixty, ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 7 (01:44:40):
Now your chance to win one thousand dollars. Enter this
nationwide keyword on our website.

Speaker 2 (01:44:45):
Bonus. That's bonas. Enter it now, Low Edgar. Reality is
they're probably not good enough.

Speaker 17 (01:44:52):
He dissects the local sports scene.

Speaker 2 (01:44:54):
They're not consistent enough.

Speaker 17 (01:44:56):
The way a fourth grader dissects across not reliable. Today
at three on ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 1 (01:45:04):
You Cincinnati, Cincy three sixty is back on ESPN fifteen
thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.

Speaker 2 (01:45:13):
Twenty after two ESPN fifteen thirty, twenty minutes from now,
Moegar Quick Hits Locks of the Night or no not
Locks of the Night. Gosh, that muscle memory. I mean,
it's been like a year. I still say that Quick
Hits with Malegger coming up at the end of the show.
Mos in three to six This afternoon phone calls five one, three, seven, four, nine,

(01:45:35):
fifteen thirty. Let's go to Boston where John is standing by.

Speaker 21 (01:45:38):
What's up John, Good afternoon, Austin. First of all, I
want to congratulate you. Going solo is one of the
toughest jobs in radio. I've been in radio for years
and I used to hate having to go solo. So
congratulations and kudos.

Speaker 4 (01:45:51):
To you, my friend.

Speaker 2 (01:45:52):
Thank you. I really appreciate that's very kind.

Speaker 21 (01:45:55):
No problem, uh talking about the Bengals obviously. First of all,
that you retweeted a couple of weeks ago from Warren
Sharp was I had to look at it five times
before it seemed to be believable, right, I mean, Jill Burrow,
the least blitzed quarterback in the NFL over the last
four years, the least blitz rate of any quarterback in
the NFL. That would lead you to think that they
don't want to blitz Hi because he's a great quarterback,

(01:46:16):
which he is, but they would not get a lot
of pressure on him just sending for well. As that
tweet from Warren Sharp said, he is also the most
hit quarterback in the NFL within two and a half
seconds of the ball being stacked, forty five percent higher
than the next kit quarterback. To me, you know what
that should be accompanied with is a picture of a
seesaw with both ends a pointed downwards to the ground,
because it just doesn't make any sense, right, Austin, That's

(01:46:38):
that's incredible. One other thing, two other things. I just
wanted to run by you to see what your thoughts
on this. We know that last year ninety three times
a team scored thirty three or more points in the NFL,
and thirty one of those teams were combined seventy nine
and seven in those games, which is a ninety two percentage.
The Bengals were three and four, forty winning percentage in

(01:46:59):
those games. I mean, if anybody's blaming him for them
not making the playoffs, they obviously didn't watch the games.
I do think he is the best quarterback in football.
The final thing, the most important thing, maybe the defense.
Obviously we know that last year they allowed fifty three
touchdowns twenty two field goals. That five to two touchdowns
allowed to field goals allowed ratio is the worst in
the NFL. If they could just button up something on defense,

(01:47:22):
mostly a free safety, maybe there'll be a bend, don't
break defense, because last year they were a bend and
break defense. And that's why I don't understand. Obviously, you
want to button up that offensive line, the interior offensive line,
to protect your franchise quarterback, but also just get someone
back there, free safety who could patrol the secondary, maybe
giving up field goals instead of touchdowns, and a couple
of those wins get turned around to win.

Speaker 2 (01:47:43):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, John, And I think the overall trend
in defense right now is like teams know that offenses
are really hard to stop and the way the rules
are and everything where it's like, Okay, we'll give you
some yards, but we don't want to give you points.
And for years under Luay n Aruo, that's what the
Bengals were good at. They were good at at buckling
down in the red zone and forcing teams to either

(01:48:04):
go for it on fourth down and fail or kick
the field goal. Last year, they just never really got
to those many that many situations. They gave up chunk plays,
they gave up red zone touchdowns, they weren't able to
hold teams. So you're right, if you flip just a
few of those possessions, the season might be entirely different.
And so yes, I agree, Ben, but don't break hopefully.

(01:48:25):
I think the idea with Al Golden's system is Genostone
gets to go back to being Genostone, patrolling the middle
of the field, being a bit of a ball hawk,
having a little bit more freedom. Again, that's hope being
able that he's able to do that. And on top
of it, if he goes down, do you have confidence
in Dejon Anthony or Tyson Anderson or anyone else to

(01:48:46):
be the guy who goes in and does that, or
hell even Dax Hill, I don't know that you do.
So the depth is a major issue. I think the
defense like it makes sense of like trying to get
a little bit more freedom for Genostone at safety. But
you're right, I mean, if they my whole thing the offseasons,
bank are they just marginally better a little bit on defense?
I think they slightly are against the run, but I

(01:49:07):
don't think that the margin of error is all that
much bigger than it was a year ago, which scares me. Yeah.

Speaker 21 (01:49:15):
I mean, and to your point about being a bend
don't break defense, we can go back several years ago.
In twenty eleven, the Packers had the thirty second ranked defense.
The Patriots had the thirty first ranked defense. They give
him a lot of guards, but not a lot of points.
The Packers that year when fifteen and one, the Patriots
win thirteen to three. You have a quarterback too, if
you give him the opportunity is going to win that

(01:49:38):
many games. Yeah, provided he's not chasing seven to ten
fourteen points the entire game. I mean, that's statistic. Where
they're three and four, was going thirty three more points.
That boggles my mind. I mean, it's just absolutely grotesque.
And again when people don't want to put him up
there with the top three other quarterbacks, it's laughable because
I think if you put them all on the same team,
you'd see that he is the best quarterback in Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:49:58):
Well, I agree with you, and that kind of comes
down to one or two possessions of game, John, And
thank you for the phone call. I really appreciate it,
and thanks for the kind words. One or two possessions
a game? Can you do one or two possessions a
game where you put the ball back in Joe Burrow's hands?
And if so, that might be the difference in winning
nine games and winning fourteen. I know one or two

(01:50:19):
possessions of game adds up quickly, but seriously, you stop
the third down, get the ball back in Burrow's hands. Hell,
I mean, we've seen him throw a ball four yards
to Jamar Chase and goes seventy five to the house.
That's what this offense is expecting to be. And I
don't know that there's as much the offense has to overcome.
You're really looking at two positions, the left guard and

(01:50:40):
right guard that have to be all right, let's see
what these guys do. But everybody else is back and
hitting the ground running and not worrying about a contract
with Jamar and not worrying as much about the risk
with Joe. And you know who you're starting running back
is going to be in Chase Brown and you have
built kind of your offense being able to put him
into it, and they figured out how to use Mike Giseki,

(01:51:02):
Like I expect the offense to hit the ground running,
at least I know they're gonna need to early on.
Let's try Mike in LA again. Mike, you're back on
the air. What's up, Mike? Are you with me? All right?
Well we tried, but uh, Mike, not entirely ready. But

(01:51:24):
to gonna go back to the previous point about you know,
trying to win and all that. I always think back
to what Jalen Hurt said, which is money is nice,
Championships are better? Right like that? That's that's the mentality
I want. Obviously I always talk about aggressive pursuit of

(01:51:45):
a championship, but what about money is nice? Championships are better?
You can have both, by the way, like that, there's
this I think there's this belief that like you have
to spend every single dollar on trying to win. You
don't have to do that. You've got to spend the
right dollars to win, and you've got to come up

(01:52:08):
with a plan that makes the most of the dollars
you do spend to win. That's my big thing. Let's
go back to the phones. Let's see if Mike is available. Now,
how about now Mike you with me?

Speaker 4 (01:52:21):
Yeah, I'm so sorry.

Speaker 11 (01:52:22):
Thanks?

Speaker 2 (01:52:22):
All right, man, what's on your mind?

Speaker 4 (01:52:25):
Well? Football, because that's your true love. I always know
how to keep you on the line longer we start
talking football. Well, that's true, and that's because that's what
you like, and that's cool. I like it too. But
real quick, on the baseball thing, this Brewer's thing. I
thought the Rays were going to be this story here. Nope,

(01:52:45):
we know who it is now, Milwaukee. Incredible, incredible. Now
this makes it so hard for the Reds. You even
look at a wild card, you're gonna have to jump
Billy or the Mets, and you come down here to Brewers,
probably not gonna to catch them. And then you got
to go over in the West and you got to
catch either one of the two Giants or the pondres.

(01:53:05):
Is that this Brewers thing makes it really hard now?

Speaker 2 (01:53:09):
H Yeah? I mean yeah. And the Reds have a
decent amount of games left against them, and that ultimately
will be a big thing for me, is like, can
they can the Reds at any point prove that they
can beat the Brewers consistently. This just hasn't happened, and
that will be one of the keys to their season
is those games that they play against Milwaukee, because yeah,
I mean they've already lost the season series to San Francisco,

(01:53:33):
who's ahead of them. They still have another trip to
San Diego coming up. Like, there's some big games that
they have to be able to play against teams ahead
of them, and Milwaukee is going to be the key
to all of it as far as I'm concerned.

Speaker 4 (01:53:45):
I agree Austin who was the announcer that filled in
for Sadak, Yes, or he was fantastic.

Speaker 2 (01:53:52):
Uh, you know, I think it was Jim Day all weekend.
I think Jim was in the entire weekend on TV.

Speaker 4 (01:53:59):
It didn't fail. I mean I watched it on TV
and I didn't. They don't usually spoil it. Sometimes at
the break they'll show the guys in the booths, and
maybe they did. It didn't sound like Jim to me.
But what I liked about it more than John and
John does a good job, but he's a little too
verbose for me, a little bit too statistic crazy, But
that was more like a traditional play by play guy

(01:54:21):
when you're on TV. You got a lot of picture
to do the words that you may want to interject
on your own. So I liked it. It was a change
of pay and Barry talked a little bit more now football.
Christian Whorf's injury is a big deal with Tampa. That's
a big one.

Speaker 2 (01:54:38):
Yeah, it has to have surgery and a miss at
least a little bit of time to start the season.
They were not expecting that. I mean that dude's an
All Pro tackle. I mean that's a big loss for Tampa.

Speaker 4 (01:54:50):
I felt sorry for him. That brings over to the
NFC Central real quick. That division is going to be
I mean, the Chicago is going to have a pretty
good football team and they're probably going to finish last
because I like, I really like Minnesota to take that
division over Detroit. I think losing those two coordinators are

(01:55:10):
going to make a difference.

Speaker 2 (01:55:12):
I think that's the biggest story in the NFL. That
are certainly the biggest story in the NFC is what
is the difference in Detroit with two new coordinators? And
how quickly does Ben Johnson get Caleb Williams up to speed?
How quickly can they turn that into something? And on
top of that, you know, I think that division is
fascinating because in Minnesota, JJ McCarthy has never taken a

(01:55:35):
snap in the NFL. I mean, who's to say that
he's not going to be or struggle at some point
even though I believe fully and Kevin O'Connell as a coach.
And on top of that, Green Bay is still good. Like,
that is a fascinating division.

Speaker 4 (01:55:50):
And O'Connell's got tons of faith. The whole organization does
McCarthy more than I do, but they know a hell.

Speaker 9 (01:55:56):
Of a lot more.

Speaker 4 (01:55:57):
And what did they do Austin talking about the Bengal
than spending and free agency. They went out and spent
one hundred and six million dollars on a new center
and a new right guard because they're serious about protecting
the cards. That's what you call commitment.

Speaker 2 (01:56:10):
H Yeah, exactly right.

Speaker 4 (01:56:12):
Minnesota to win that division issue. I really do. I
like them, That's all I had.

Speaker 2 (01:56:16):
Pal All right, Mike, I appreciate you man, good talking
to you.

Speaker 4 (01:56:20):
Take care buddy, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:56:22):
Yeah, I mean that. I talked about this a little
bit last week too, Like my biggest concern is still
the offensive line, and yeah, I think they can be
good enough, and I guess that's the low bar. But
like this whole thing goes to crap if Burrow is
not healthy. I mean, what he did last year was unbelievable.

(01:56:44):
It was nothing short of amazing to have the two
worst offensive linemen in football playing ahead of you. You
had a banged up left tackle for a decent chunk,
you had makeshift guys filling in for them. You had
pretty steady in Amarius Mems at right tackle. Carris was
you know, his head on a swivel trying to help
the guys next to him. What Burrow did last year

(01:57:06):
with that group in front of him is nothing short
of amazing. And it's why I believe he's the best
quarterback in the National Football League, not just because he
plays five miles down the street and he's a kid
from Ohio. I believe he's the best, seriously, and the
fact that he continues to be the best despite the
inability to fully invest in that line. Now, listen, at

(01:57:29):
one point, I think Bengals were top ten, top five,
and spending on the offensive line with Carris and Kappa
and Brown and others. There's some work to be done there,
and you hope that the running game takes a step
forward to just in general, make it easier in the
past game. That would be a start. But listen, we

(01:57:53):
all know this ship goes as Burrow goes, and if
he goes down, the whole thing's going down. There are
no lifeboats. There are no life jackets. Even if I
don't care how well Jake Browning played a couple of
years ago, doesn't matter. We'll take a break, We'll come back.
This is since he three to sixty ESPN fifteen thirty rules, Hey, Alexa,

(01:58:17):
what's going on in the NFL?

Speaker 17 (01:58:19):
Getting ESPN is fifteen thirty from iHeartRadio.

Speaker 2 (01:58:26):
Since he three p sixty Rolling right along Austin Elmore
in the Big Chair today, riding solo, no tone this week.
Moe Egger in a few minutes for quick hits ahead
of his show this afternoon three to six. Looking forward
to figuring out what mo has in store for this afternoon.
Enjoyed listening to Moe over the weekend, and uh enjoying

(01:58:49):
talking to callers. Five point three, seven four nine, fifteen thirty.
Let's go out to Hamilton. That's where Brian is. Brian,
what's on your mind?

Speaker 19 (01:58:58):
Hey?

Speaker 2 (01:58:58):
How you doing?

Speaker 11 (01:58:59):
Buddy?

Speaker 2 (01:58:59):
Good Man.

Speaker 18 (01:59:01):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (01:59:01):
I just you know, you were sitting there talking we
got thirty million dollars over the cap, right, why can't
we you know, get these guys, these other two signed,
you know, you know, Hendrickson and our number one draft pick.
But I mean, if we got thirty million out of
over the you know, over the cap, I mean, wouldn't
you go after a Kevin Zeitdler Or wouldn't you go

(01:59:24):
after you know, a Javan Holland or Justin Simmons. I mean,
I know Simmons thirty one years old, but I mean
you still got you know, people like Julian Blackman.

Speaker 2 (01:59:36):
You've got uh, I don't know, uh Smith, Uh yeah,
Julian Blackman because you're white, will Hernandez Marcus Williams, who
is another safety.

Speaker 6 (01:59:53):
Uh. But I'm saying, you know, even on your offensive line,
you said you were worried about the most Yeah, I
mean we had Zeidler. You know you know what kind
of player he is.

Speaker 2 (02:00:01):
Yeah, Kevin Zeitler I believe signed a deal already. He's
he's signed with the Titans, so he's not available right now.
But your point is is, no, yeah, he did sign
with Tennessee. So the point though, is that they've kind
of known this for a while and they still didn't
do it. That's the head sketch, head scratching part.

Speaker 6 (02:00:23):
Yeah, but you still got you know, Greg Van Rotten,
and you got James Daniels, you got Lake and Tomlinson.
Yeah for guards.

Speaker 2 (02:00:32):
I mean, that's the thing, Brian, That's what's inexplicable about it,
is like, I don't know, Sure, those guys may not
be the best possible guys, but are they at least
able to come in and compete with Dylan Fairchild who's
never played in the NFL, and Cody Ford or Lucas Patrick,
Like you would think at the very least you can

(02:00:53):
improve the bottom of the roster and perhaps the depth
by signing some of those guys. And they're not going
to cost you the full thirty million.

Speaker 6 (02:00:59):
No, would probably cost you, you know five or that
guy was talking about it probably costs you about six
million to get two of them.

Speaker 2 (02:01:05):
M h yeah, it's it's it's puzzling.

Speaker 6 (02:01:11):
And one other thing I was gonna ask you as
far as the Reds, I mean, I love the Reds,
you know, and I'm a Reds. I'm a Reds guy,
but I think it all comes down to ownership. Owner.
They never want to go out and get a great player.
They never want to go spend the money. They always all,

(02:01:32):
we're gonna you know, when the players do get good,
what do they do? They trade them off and then
you know we're going to rebuild.

Speaker 2 (02:01:41):
Yeah, Brian, I hear you, and thank you for the
phone call. I appreciate it. And I know a lot
of people feel the same way. Like there is not
a belief that the organizational philosophy with the Reds is
sound until they prove us Otherwise, nobody's gonna believe that
they're doing the right things, or they should be trying
to do the right things. I know who does do

(02:02:02):
the right things at all times. His name is Moegar.
He joined us next for quick Hits on ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 1 (02:02:09):
K Wise Stea continues on ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati's sports station.
It's time for since the three sixty quick hits on
ESPN fifteen.

Speaker 2 (02:02:21):
Yes, indeed it is, and Moegar joins us now for
quick hits. Hi, mo, how are you Audium? Well man?
What's going on? Not a whole lot, just sitting here
doing a talk show. How was your weekend? Do you
do anything fun?

Speaker 16 (02:02:31):
Uh?

Speaker 9 (02:02:32):
I went to the game on Saturday. Yeah, game that
for a while on Saturday felt like it was going
to mark the end of the season.

Speaker 2 (02:02:38):
Were you dreading coming to work either the next day
or today if they had lost that series to Colorado? Yes?

Speaker 9 (02:02:46):
Yeah, I mean and on Saturday you got to give
him credit because on multiple occasions Colorado had a guy
on third base with nobody out, Yes, and it felt
like that run was going to be the difference in
the game. All I can tell you is this the
game on Friday. I don't know. I don't know that
as an adult, which is pretty much for me the
cell phone era that my cell phone has blown up

(02:03:09):
as much as it did after that game on Friday,
like people I haven't heard from in years, right, like
literally late on Friday, I was writing people back, going
I don't know who this is. I just for some reason,
that triggered people, and I get why. Right the way
they lost Austin Hayes with maybe the worst offensive game
ever Tony Santin, they waste a good starting pitching performance,

(02:03:32):
they lose to the Rockies. That game triggered people, and
so I went to bed on Friday night, Going man,
Monday is going to be a long one if they
lose this series. Fortunately they did not.

Speaker 2 (02:03:43):
Do you think more people, more teams will intentionally walk
Ellie de la Cruz.

Speaker 9 (02:03:48):
Yeah, and look, Austin Hayes had a really awful game
on Friday. Some on the social media app that we
use most got mad at me for referencing the Austin
Hayes game. Had a bad game, dude, Like, sorry, I mean,
just I'm joking because you know.

Speaker 2 (02:04:04):
I said he looked like Ray Charles at the place
he sort of did he learned as bad as what I.

Speaker 9 (02:04:08):
And like when he came up in the ninth inning,
I was watching my wife and I said, like, this
is gonna be cool because he's gonna come up big.
It's gonna be one of those where he erases the
zero four, the double play at the strikeouts and he
gets the big hit, the Red's gonna win the game.
And it didn't happen that way. And it sucks for
him because he has had a good year. Well you know,
he hasn't hit a ton since coming off the injured list,

(02:04:29):
although he did bounce back nicely on Saturday and Sunday.
But uh, yeah, I don't know. I don't know that
on a really good team, which the Reds are not.
Theyrow On pays to win eighty three and a half games,
that's above five hundred. Doesn't mean it's really good. On
a really good team, that that's your cleanup hitter. And
I think lack of protection for Ellie Dela Cruz is
something that we're gonna confront now. The thing is with Ellie,

(02:04:52):
he can make him pay with his speed, and so
if you put him on, you know, there's a lot
of third place hitters. You put him on, they're not
gonna run provide, did they? You know they could take
a bag if there's not somebody in front of them.
But yeah, the protection for Ellie in the middle part
of the batting order. Look, I think in an ideal world,
Christian and Carnassi on Straam will not be playing for
Louisville right now. You know, he would be providing some

(02:05:14):
protection in the middle of the order, and they're just
not getting enough of it right now. So I think
what we saw on Friday with Ellie is a precursor
of perhaps things to come.

Speaker 2 (02:05:23):
What do you have coming up on your show? This afternoon.

Speaker 9 (02:05:26):
Well, an extension on what you've talked about a lot today.
The first half of the season, the first half of
the season is over. I was not aware, Austin, and
maybe you were, and maybe you follow some of the
different some different folks. There's a lot of people on
Twitter who have been like breaking off side trips to
go watch Alabama high school baseball.

Speaker 2 (02:05:45):
I had no idea. I don't know what people get
the time. I don't know what people I was not
aware that people that are Kentucky Derby experts in May.

Speaker 9 (02:05:54):
Oh that's right, yes, so I actually have on an
experts to talk about the draft. Reds take a seven
teen year old shortstop. I'm also told that they have
too many shortstops. Can you have too much of an
important thing?

Speaker 2 (02:06:07):
Right? Also, when this kid who they drafted from a.

Speaker 9 (02:06:10):
High school in Alabama is twenty two years old, Ellie
de la Cruz will be playing for the Philadelphia Phillies
or the Los Angeles Dodgers. So let's not worry about it.
But we'll spend some time on that. We have Christopher
Crawford from Seattle who is a prospects and draft expert.
He joins our show every year, he's going to be
with us. At three thirty five, you were talking about
what baseball has done with selecting an All Star who

(02:06:32):
has appeared in twenty five Big league innings. Yeah, I
think we get the All Star Game we won. I
think we get the All Star Game as fans that
we want. We will discuss, and you know, it's list season,
so is ranking quarterbacks. I don't care about quarterback rankings.
I don't care about quarterback rankings. My take on it
is this, It's like dating supermodels. You want your first pick,

(02:06:55):
go ahead, you want the second pick, go ahead. I'll
be more than happy with the third. I feel that
way about ranking Joe Burrow third. But I have a
bigger question about Joe Burrow that I will ask in
the four o'clock hour.

Speaker 2 (02:07:06):
I'm gonna ask you to make a list right now.
Where do you rank the home run derby in sporting
events throughout the year.

Speaker 9 (02:07:11):
I think it's one of the most fun and unique ones.
I think it's one of the most fun ones to
bet on.

Speaker 2 (02:07:16):
Ooh.

Speaker 9 (02:07:17):
I think it's been made better by not having Chris Berman.
And I'm not a Chris Berman hater, right, but I
think it's been made better by Chris Berman, but he couldn't.

Speaker 2 (02:07:27):
He was like the pitch clock, he couldn't keep up
when they made they changed the rules. I think it's
fun and it's it's unique.

Speaker 9 (02:07:34):
I you know, the reformatting of it that took place
in twenty fifteen here, I think has been a benefit
to it. I think it's become in you know, the
three days of All Star break games. I guess four
because they played the Futures Game on Saturday for some reason.
I think the home run derby's the bigger deal. I
think the home run Derby in twenty fifteen here passed

(02:07:55):
the All Star Game itself in terms of appeal. And
so I'm not going to tell that I'm gonna sit
down and watch every second, but I think it's a
chance and baseball does this well. The baseball itself doesn't
often let its hair down, but it does for the
home run Derby, which I like.

Speaker 2 (02:08:11):
Who's going to win? I like Matt Olsen to win
at home tonight. Okay, that makes me feel good because
I was having that feeling too. So now does that
mean you're gonna place a wager on.

Speaker 9 (02:08:22):
Met So here's the wager that I like you can
bet on a specific final, So matt Olsen versus Cal
Raley in the final is plus thirteen hundred.

Speaker 2 (02:08:32):
Ooh, So all those two.

Speaker 9 (02:08:34):
Guys have to do is make the final, and then
you can bet on and get plus twenty five hundred
for Olsen to beat Raleigh or plus twenty five hundred
for Big Dumper to beat matt Olsen. So you can
make both wagers both good value. But I like Matt
Olsen to win the night because I think it's gonna
be hot and humid, and I think he's gonna be
prepared for it, given the fact that's the ballpark he
plays in.

Speaker 2 (02:08:54):
If I'm not mistaken, he's the only guy in the
field with previous Derby experience as well. Yes, so I
think I think that might be the case. Bullpark is
a little bit conducive to to left handed hitters, right,
So yeah, looking forward to that, I'm trying to think,
did I miss anything else? I don't think so. I
don't think so. I don't believe on my list is

(02:09:16):
all right. I've see Cincinnati lost lost in like the
most painfully familiar way. Does just keep happening for such
a good team and a good organization. They continue to
have these like high profile games at home where they're
up to nothing and it feels like they are going
to steamroll the opponent, and then they lose tough own
goal by Miles Robinson the other night, and a frustrating

(02:09:38):
loss and an even more difficult prospect facing Lionel Messi
on Wednesday. I don't like the Brewers. I heard you
say all the time. They're like the Steelers, dude, We're like,
they're just difficult, so like they're just a pain in
the ass.

Speaker 9 (02:09:55):
One of my best friends is a hardcore Brewers fan,
played golf of them on Saturday from Milwaukee. Works for
the Bengals, hardcore Brewers fan, and here's his frustration and
my frustration with his team are the same. They don't
really try to win. They've traded away Josh Hater, they
gave away Corbyn Burns, they made no attempt to keep

(02:10:17):
Willie Adamis. They're talking about trading Freddie Peralta, Yeah, which
makes no sense. What they're a game at a first place.
And so what I don't like about that team is
they seemingly don't really try to win, but they're annoyingly
good a game at a first place. It's like, you know,
people say all the time, well, baseball's economics, the Reds
can't be the Dodgers, and I go, cool, be the Brewers. Yes, yes,

(02:10:38):
except if you have Corbyn Burns, you know, win with them,
don't trade them away that sort of thing.

Speaker 2 (02:10:42):
All right, fantastic, Yeah, that's just it. I kind of
looked up and I was like, these dudes have won
seven u or Dolly's six few games over five hundred,
They're a game back of the Cubs, and none of
this was expected.

Speaker 9 (02:10:53):
It's just well, they they've had a different manager, they
had a different general manager. They don't spend money. They
don't really spend money. It's just they got a cool ballpark.

Speaker 2 (02:11:02):
I do anything, and they're thirty three and seventeen at
that ballpark, which is pretty good. I do anything. All right, Mo,
thanks so much. We'll be listening this afternoon, Thank you, sir.
All right. That is Moe Egger three to six this
afternoon on ESPN fifteen thirty Tomorrow. I'll dive in a
little bit to that quarterback list ranking thing because it
is list season and I love list. I might make

(02:11:25):
one tonight. Actually, Joe Daniman's going to join us at
one o'clock tomorrow. We'll talk a little bit about the
All Star Game, Bengals training camp coming up, and a
whole lot more. Looking forward to tomorrow's show right back
here at noon. Thank you to Tarren Bland for stepping
in and producing the show in that first hour. Thank
you to Jeff Carr and Steve Offenbaker for coming up
to the studio and joining me for that first hour

(02:11:46):
to recap the Reds first half. And thank you for
listening to the show. Mo Egger is next. This has
been since e three to sixty on the Home of
the Bengals, Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen.

Speaker 22 (02:11:58):
Thirty WCKY, Cincinnati.

Speaker 8 (02:12:23):
Make us the number one pre set on your car
radio and on the free Knew It Improved iHeartRadio app
Free never sounded so good, ESPN fifteen thirty