January 13, 2026 • 42 mins
Paul Dehner Jr. of The Athletic and The Growler Podcast joined us to discuss the impact of Mike Tomlin's resignation in Pittsburgh on the Bengals, his Duke Tobin mega-press conference takeaways, and the likelihood of a couple pending free agents returning to Cincinnati.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
You found Cincinnati's ESPN fifteenth third, Well you sure have.
What's up?
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Good afternoon, I'm Legger. This is ESPN fifteen thirty. Thanks
for listening. Hopefully you're having an unbelievable Tuesday. Paul Danner
Juniors here from The Athletic and the Growler podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
Covering the Bengals, fighting about the Bengals, podcasting about the Bengals,
and tweeting about the Bengals at Paul Danner Junior, there's
a few things to discuss.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
How are we doing doing good? How are you good?
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Man?
Speaker 1 (00:32):
I always like it when we record something Tuesday morning
on the podcast and it's already old news by the
time I reach you here at three o'clock.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Yes, we're talking about Mike Tomlin, talking about Mike Tomlin
out done, stepping down in Pittsburgh with time left on
his contract.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
One man remains the dean of AFC North coaches, I
mean almost the dean of the NFL at this point.
I mean you're talking. He's on the short list of
longest ten yured coaches in the NFL. I just was
retweeted it. There's red, Yeah, there's like seven. Him and
Lafleur came in the same very close to the same time.
(01:10):
I just retweeted it. I have to go find the
exact list here. Let's see. So Red McVeigh seventeen, you
had McVeigh, Shanahan and McDermott was the seventeen class. Obviously
Andy Reid was hiring twenty thirteen. And then you have
Zach Taylor and Matt Lafleur in twenty nineteen. The old head.
There's the old heads, Laflour and Zach Taylor. I mean,
(01:34):
incredible that this is where, this is where we're at,
but this is where we're at.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
This is there felt like last night watching that game
against the Texans, there felt like a sense of finality,
especially listening to Troy Aikman talked during the broadcast about
Aaron Rodgers as well, but Mike Tomlin and maybe having
his pick of broadcasting jobs during the game there there
(02:00):
felt like that felt like it. Yeah, that there there
was a sense of like this is this is changing,
this is over, this is it.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
Yeah. It has a feeling of like one of those
worst kept secret deals where the certain people knew yeah
and were hinting and trying not to say what they
kind of want to say. And then especially when you
get into something like a broadcast team like that. Yeah,
uh yeah, it felt like that what it's this is
going to be such an interesting dynamic because the Steelers
(02:35):
are still in purgatory. Yeah, Like, I still Tomlin to me,
while it was old and stale or whatever you want
to call it there and they lost these playoff games,
he's still a good Like, he's still a really good coach.
They were in roster purgatory. Yes, more than coach purgatory. Agree, Like,
(02:55):
I think that Tomlin has every ability to win in
the postseason despite the struggles that they've had. They just
haven't been able to figure out quarterback. They have invested
in aging players, and maybe part of that is he's
worked them too hard during the course of the year.
You can debate the philosophy on that, but like, you
got to have somebody that can come in and have
(03:15):
an answer to fixing quarterback, and I just don't know
that anybody can come in and immediately push that button
with where Pittsburgh stands and where the league sits outside
of another version of the band aids that they've been
doing with these free agent mid tier guys.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
You think of nine, ten years ago when they had
Ben Roethlisberger still was you know about a B a
B level quarterback, still very capable, and they had Le'Veon
Bell and Antonio Brown and there was a real dynamic offense.
And then since the immediate aftermath of that to now,
the offense every year for them has looked exactly the same. Yes,
(03:52):
Houston exacerbated that last night with that defense. And I
don't watch every Pittsburgh Steelers game, but watching them as
I do playing the Bengals and just being a follower
of the league, it feels like, independent of coordinator, quarterback, personnel, weaponry,
offensive line, that the offense looks exactly the same every
(04:13):
single year. I don't know how that's going to change
from this year to next.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
Well, you know, if you bring in somebody with more
of a modern offensive philosophy, you're like, okay, let's tap
into the massive McVeigh shanahan the whole league at this Yeah,
but they've never done anything like that there. They've had
defensive coaches, guys with different backgrounds, you know, Arthur Smith,
who's not exactly in that. So if you're maybe there,
(04:42):
it's like a hey, a Clint Kubiak or somebody that's
bringing an offensive person, but you never know. I mean,
think about how outside of the box Mike Tomlin was
as an original higher for them. I mean he was
not even really I mean he was recordinated for one year. Yeah,
but like very much off the mat. Who is that right?
And he's been here that long. They're not afraid to
(05:03):
do that. And you gotta feel like you can get
an incredible coach just due to the stability that you
know you're gonna have there compared to anywhere else. So
a fascinating search for me. But you know, the fallout
in the North is Okay, we keep talking about the
(05:23):
pressure on this team to win in twenty twenty six,
like this is just one level up. It's kind of
the same way of talking about this past season where
there it was, it was accessible when you wasted a chance.
This feels like you had the year where your offense
was super healthy, you went nine to eight and didn't
make the playoffs, right, you had the year this past
(05:44):
year where the North was a disaster. You get Joe
Burrow back in record time and you still can't make
You couldn't find a way to have it relevant. Really,
by the time you get here and make the playoffs.
The entire division is now changing head coaches, except in
your pump up the continuity. If you can't get off
to a fast start and try to win this division,
(06:04):
that's three strikes, right, And I think we've it's felt
that way for a while, and it certainly feels like
this is only putting more of a spotlight on the
just extreme pressure cooker of this year for Zach Taylor,
and who knows, maybe by connection when you look at
the support statement put out by Mike Brown Duke Togan
(06:26):
as well.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
And then if things don't work, the Bengals will just
hire Mike Tomlin, trade for apparently, Oh that's right, Yeah, Well,
I mean you know he's got one more year left
Mike Tomlin does on his coaching contract, correct, right, So
if you wanted him now, you'd have to trade for him.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
My guess is the Bengals aren't gonna do that.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
But you and I both know if Mike Tomlin is
not coaching a team in twenty twenty six, this entire
season will play out against the backdrop of people demanding
that they hire Mike Tomlin, this coach that so many
of us have spent years making fun of will suddenly
be the apple of our eyes?
Speaker 1 (06:58):
Yeah? Oh, this will happen with so many I mean,
this is what this is, what it always is. I'm
curious what what TV job like? Where where's he gonna
where's he gonna land? Is it? Is it gonna be?
I guess is it gonna be Fox? Is it gonna be?
Is it gonna be something like Belichick where he's doing
a little bit more kind of unique stuff with different
(07:18):
people to re I I don't, I don't. I'm curious
to see what that ends up looking like. Yeah, I
mean I'm imagining that's a studio role.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
Probably Mike Tomlin sitting in a booth calling you know,
uh panthers, uh buccaneers on the third Fox Team.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
Yeah. I like him on like a Monday. I like
him on like a reaction type show. But would be interesting.
But I mean, that's that's the path, right, that's the
rehab path. You go, you do a year of TV,
and then you're everybody. He's clearly trying to take this
Sean Payton path here at this point, right, I mean,
this was the same concept, the same idea. A lot
(07:57):
of other stuff going on with Sean but like then
gets right into this. He's gets this huge contract for Denver,
and because he had created this idea, he's gonna come
in and fix it. And here he is having fixed
it for the number one seed in the AFC. And
I'm sure Mike is like, I would love to actually
coach a team with a quarterback again at some point,
and that'd be nice. The Bengals have a quarterback. You
(08:18):
do have a quarterback, So so here you go.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
So there it is. I know he's got ties to
the reach, he has ties to the region. He's worked
for a mom and pop franchise before, right, I mean
the difference division, the differences between the Bengals and Steelers
structurally are not that different, right, I mean there's not
that many. So yeah, Mike Tomlin, Bengals head coach, twenty twenty.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
Seven sounds good. Sure, market Town.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
All right, you're at the Big press conference on on Friday.
I was Big Media Events the event you wrote about
your takeaways? I did, Oh, I love when I love when.
Speaker 1 (08:57):
You print him out for me.
Speaker 2 (08:58):
But yeah, because it's easier for me to high stuff.
I'm still a big print guy.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
I know you are. Besides, we have reams of paper
here that somebody is paid for. I was just thinking
about how big of a prink guy you are, because
I was just texting with Dan Brugo a little earlier,
talking to a little bit of just some random draft stuff. Heck.
I was like, oh, mo's got to be like getting
the toner on demand right now.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
So a few things and we're up against it. So
we'll carry this to the next segment. I guess the
first one would be that thing on Friday took on
a life of its own. It's an hours hour long.
There's people who don't cover the team who are there.
We're promoting it like it's a game. It doesn't have
to be that way. But my guess is, and you
(09:41):
address this, you can tell me if I'm wrong. I
feel like that event, the Duke Tobin end of year
press conference, should be a thing, and I'm guessing it will.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
It felt like he suggested as much at the end,
with a if you guys want this, I'm happy to
do it. And I think we all kind of we're
looking at each other like, yeah, we want this, like
we always want this, And I feel like it's fine
to say I think this should be the punishment for
not making the playoffs, is you have to do this
because it's it's fine, Like, if you make the playoffs,
(10:13):
your schedule ends up closer to where he was talking
in Mobile anyway. But if we could just have it
in Cincinnati, I think everyone would appreciate that. But I
if that's what he's saying, that he's happy to do that,
then I think this should one hundred percent be a
thing every single year. There's no reason it shouldn't. He's
(10:34):
in this position and he should have to answer those
questions and it was fine. I do think it becomes
less of the event and kind of firing lines that
it ended up being when it happens regularly. I think
the build up and the hype and the he needs
to be doing this that went on for over a
(10:58):
year when we were talking, you know, even further back
than that, all of that building up to that moment,
I think turned it into what it became. I don't
think it has to be like that. There's probably ways
to avoid it being quite like that that you can
figure out logistically on their end or our end or whatever.
But I do think that it being a thing feels
(11:20):
like if he's gonna say i'll do it. Then we're
gonna say, let's do it. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
I did enjoy the hype. I did enjoy the build up.
I enjoyed the fact that we were running promos for it.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
I enjoyed the fact that there were folks who would
like put their entire early.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
Friday afternoon on pause.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Yeah, so they can listen to And by the way,
I never want to hear how there's fan apathy ever again,
because you had people who in the middle of a
work day, We're putting everything aside to listen to a
press conference involving Duke Tobin. Right, so miss me with this,
nobody cares about the Bengals anymore. That was a media event.
(11:57):
Every Bengals fan I know was at least paying attention.
Many were following on social media, Many were listening on
ESPN fifteen thirty. Many were watching on the Bengals Twitter feed.
But folks were locked into a press conference. Ain't no apathy.
No TV was preempting programming. Yes, was the Laker or
whoever's on TV during the day.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
There were lots of commercials for the general and personal
injury attorneys that had to get made good. This week
because they were carrying the press conference.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
Well that's the that's the point is that's people want
people want this, Fans deserve this, you know what I mean?
They and now I knew they were going to be disappointed.
Of course they were. Anybody that like, this has happened again.
Like we've talked to Duke so many times, and it
is anticipated every time you do, and every time. He's
(12:53):
not a newsbreaker. He's not a he's not a shake
he's not a giving stuff up guy. Like he's not
a drop bombs at the at at media availability type.
He's fairly polished turn in that regard. Like I knew
that that was how it was going to be coming
out of it. It would have been stunning if it
(13:13):
would have come anywhere near the hype that was happening
towards it. But that said, it's still great that the
hype existed to put a point and a focus on
the fact that it needed to happen.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
I said on Thursday, I think we're building this up
to the point that folks are expecting a show. Yeah,
and it's not going to be a show. You may
not like the answers, you may not like the questions,
it's not going to be a show, and so I
think the build up invariably set the entire thing up
to disappoint people because it wasn't going to be a performance.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
I said this on my podcast, and I was like,
I felt like people thought that it should be like
remember when the guy threw the shoe at George Bush.
It should be like I think people expected me to
ask a question and then throw a shoe at them,
and then my follow up should be the other shoe.
I'del like that's what people wanted or expected this, like
(14:07):
you know, and this massive yell yelling back and forth
or whatever, and it was I think everybody just had
their their questions if they wanted to get in. It's
just hard when you can't really have a conversation, right,
like and that's the like this is on the on
the on the like totem pole of things and and
(14:29):
and platforms and places that you can do this Like
this is pretty low right in terms of getting getting
in actual answers. But I do understand that why this
is where it had to be and in this particular moment.
But you were never gonna get like a good conversation
about the state of things in that room.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
All right, Well, I have an idea for next to
yours press conference that I want to share with you.
We also have to talk about your free agency preview. Yeah,
we have a lot of a lot.
Speaker 1 (14:57):
Of that's the one that made you make a weird sound. Yes, yes, speaking.
It's nineteen minutes after three o'clock. Mogger.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
Paul Danner Junior is here from The Athletic and the
Growler Podcast. He's here till four. We are here till
six on ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
Twenty three after three o'clock.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
This is ESPN fifteen thirty Paul Danner Junior from The Athletic,
the latest edition of the Growler Podcast with apparently my
crappy internet connection.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
Is up right now. I didn't know what to do.
I watched, Yeah, I watched it and it wasn't good.
So it's okay. I fear something out. The audio was
The audio was fine, Yeah, the audio was fine. It
was rainy in and out of some grain as a time.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
You ever seen video from like the International Space Station, Yeah,
that's what I look like for my basement.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
Why can't we figure this out? I don't know why.
I don't know. Oh, I have to get on that
all right.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
So a few things about the press conference Megapress conference,
which lasted sixty three minutes, in your opinion is we've
done it before, a fair counter to fan distrust.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
It's an audio platform. I need you to tell you
need me to talk about that.
Speaker 2 (16:10):
I mean, because that was that was a theme, right,
We've we've done it before. So there's fan distrust, which
is a large part why everybody wanted this big megapress conference.
Even so fan distrust. The message from Duke was essentially
we've had successes, We've done it before. Is that a
fair counter to the fan distrust? No?
Speaker 1 (16:30):
I mean I think that the idea that something that
worked for or five years ago is definitely going to
work now is not. You would you wouldn't accept that
from your coaching staff saying well, look, the types of
offenses we were running in twenty twenty one are still
going to work exactly the same as they do. Know
the League of Alls every year, right, it changes, and
(16:52):
that is the same in the off season, the league
of alves and the way people use certain contract stretchers
more wide widely, the way players expect more types of
certain to whether it's year two guarantees or void years
or any of the things you're going to talk about
the way free agency is handled, the way that picks
are coming into the league, like every Yes, some things
(17:15):
stay the same, but things do change and evolve, and
you guys have to evolve with it. Now. Is that
saying that they can't come in here and it can
end up looking like it did four and five years
ago in terms of execution. Sure, but you can't shoot
down the idea that some things maybe need to be
(17:35):
done differently because the league changes and you need to
change along with it more often. And it's a lot
of I'm sure the frustration with the way people talk
about the scouting staff size, right, and it's not necessarily
about the people doing it. It said, Okay, everyone else is
throwing just armies of analytics people at this stuff, and
(18:00):
and people that can come from every angle of understanding
all of that. Then in the projections and models and whatever,
and yeah, they they added Trey La Bounty, right, they
got to now in the analytics department, that's part of it, right,
Like one one or two people working with your scouting
department when you already don't have you know, all the
(18:22):
area scouts and everything else that that other people do
is gonna draw attention. More people are investing in that stuff.
That is part of the evolution of the league. Does
that mean you can't still go down there and hit
on a Marius Mims No, obviously, yeah, or or whatever,
or hit on draft picks that that do or don't
hit like it doesn't. It doesn't mean anything. It's just
(18:42):
it's just why not have those advantages? Why why not
have that information as well? I understand that. And you
can't say that things are gonna work that the way
they did four and five years ago. The league changes
too fast. It's just the league changes too fast. There's
too many advantages that team staying ahead of that trend
and gain every year to dismiss it as well, we'll
(19:03):
just do it the same as we did four or
five years ago.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Do you believe if Duke Tobin had complete and total
carte blanche that he would keep the scouting staff size
what it is.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
Yeah, if I don't think it's a thing where he can't.
Speaker 2 (19:19):
So if he decided I want to hire four new
people in scouting and analytics and in player personnel, you
believe that he would have the ability to say to Mike,
I want to hire four folks.
Speaker 1 (19:32):
I think so, I do I think that he could
have that. I think I have never once. I mean,
they have added across whether it's coaching staff or even
in the scouting staff. Over the course of the time
that I've been talking to Duke, you know, decade and
a half now, they have added. They have increased sizes
(19:56):
of things, They've done things differently. He's gotten that, and
every step of the way has said the same thing
to me, like this is the size, like I don't
want it to be much more. I like the small
nature of it. I like the collaborative nature of it.
This is like his message that he put out there
last Friday is very similar to probably the first time
(20:17):
I asked him thirteen years ago. Honestly, I mean, it
hasn't really changed a whole lot. And so I do
think that if they felt like that would help them
win having those people, that they would do it. I
don't think it's a thing where there's no you can't
have any more people here, there's not money for that.
I really do not think that is the case. I
(20:39):
think this is largely the preferred nature of it.
Speaker 2 (20:43):
I don't know a lot about prediction markets, but if
I did, I would try to see if I could
find Bengals to take pass Russia in round one. Right, Yeah, Now,
pass rushier doesn't have to mean edge. No, we've talked
about this. One of their grave mistake has been, you know,
getting three techniques who were not pass rushers, you know,
(21:04):
good run stoppers. So if I go on Calshie or
one of these prediction markets, be Calshy guy. No, I
don't really understand how that works. I have a hard
enough time tracking my bets on FanDuel. Yeah, but could
I do you think I could could find this market
where I make a wager predicting that the Bengals take
pass Rusher in round one based on the Duke Tobin
(21:25):
mega press conference.
Speaker 1 (21:27):
Yeah, I mean that was the point of the things
that came out of it in terms of a real,
real answers. It was that this is gonna be the folkus.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
If you wanted transparency in any part of that press conference,
there it was.
Speaker 1 (21:41):
That was it. It was. It was Wait, now there's
probably some frustration in that that's exactly what we were
saying last year, and it was a run stuffing nose
tackle in bj Hill, right, everybody knew you needed pass
rush and there was no especially from the interior, right,
and it was like no, it was the message was
(22:02):
if we stop the run better, we'll have more opportunities
to run the past. Or was the messaging this year?
Now it's a pass rush is king and got to
have it. So yeah, and there's only so many places
you can get that, like you're gonna have a hard
You can get edges in free agency, like you can,
it's gonna cost you. You can't get elite three techniques
(22:26):
without paying out the notes. And there's really not gonna
be any So whether you're talking about looking to the
draft for that, that certainly seems the most likely that
somebody up there is in and a draft that will
have that. And then Caleb Downs as well is gonna
be in that conversation obviously just by the nature of
how good he has been. And then we'll have premium
(22:47):
position conversations that everybody loves. But yeah, it's clearly pass
rush as the focus of I would think for agency
and the draft in some capacity. All Right, we do
have to talk.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
I have a couple of questions about next year's Duke
Tobin Mega press conference.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
And then we have to get to your list of
free agencies. And I'll try to replicate the sound that
I made. Okay, when I read one of the capsules
about the the guys who are due to leave the
Bengals if they don't resign them.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
I have a feeling that just knowing your history here,
you know where this is going right to one person immediately.
Speaker 2 (23:21):
Yeah, So before I printed it, I hit control F
and I typed in two words, Geno Stone.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Yeah, got right to it.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
I read the rest, but yes, I you should have
just started with him. The picture here should not be
of Trey Hendricks. I don't care about him, Gino Stone.
We'll get to that when we come back. It's twenty
eight away from four o'clock. This is ESPN fifteen thirty,
Cincinnati Sports Station. It's at twenty three from four o'clock.
This is ESPN fifteen thirty Moeger with Paul Danner Junior
(23:54):
from the Athletic dot Com and the Growler Podcast. If
you missed it, Mike Tomlin steps down his head coach
of the Pittsburgh Steelers after nineteen seasons. Of course, in
those nineteen seasons, the losses never outweighed the wins. Congratulations
to him. The Houston Texans points dramatically outweighed Pittsburgh's last night,
thirty to six, which means Marvin Lewis got to mention
(24:15):
on TV last night seven straight playoff losses.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Do you feel like you gotta feel like Marvin went
to the wine cellar and found an extra nice bottle
last night to celebrate not being the sole owner of
the seven straight playoff losses you had to have had
to have. That's got to feel good. Although the flip
side is people are gonna bring up the fact that
you also had seven straight playoff losses, where that people
(24:40):
had kind of probably forgotten that for a while. Now
I haven't forgotten. I haven't. Manye, those watching the broadcast
probably had, but I know you had.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
Next year's Duke Tobin mega press conference events. Will he
continue to mention Joe Flacco?
Speaker 1 (24:57):
Sure? Specially he's back, you know.
Speaker 4 (25:00):
So.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
A former athletics director at U See once gave me
an authentic throwback basketball jersey, which I thought was really
nice and I was deeply appreciative, and I sent him
a handwritten thank you note and then when I framed
it and hung it in my basement, I took a
picture of it and sent it to him. Made just
a point of expressing my gratitude. For the next two
(25:24):
and a half years, every time I saw this guy,
he would bring up the jersey that he gave me.
How's that jersey I gave you? It's awesome, looks great
at my wall. Hey, remember when I gave you that jersey?
Is this how Duke Tobin's gonna treat Joe Flacco? Or
three four years down the road, assuming he's in his
current capacity, he's going to remind us, oh'd you like
that Joe Flacco game against the Steelers?
Speaker 1 (25:44):
Remember when I traded for him? Is this going to
be the new thing? Well? Sure, every time we ever met.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
By the way, it was Mike Boone, I'm stunned.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
I'm stunned. Stunned. No, uh yeah, because anytime we talk
about the trade deadline again, m m you.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
Know he remember, didn't even wait to the deadline last
year and.
Speaker 1 (26:09):
Say we don't make deals in season anymore. That traded
for Joe Flacco. Anytime we talk about quarterback injuries, I'm
sure we'll never have to talk about quarterback injuries anymore? Uh? Anytime?
You know, we we talk about willingness to part ways
with draft picks at some point do business with a division,
the division rival to the can't remember that? And next
time they play Pittsburgh remember last time? Yeah, it's gonna
(26:35):
be There's there's there, it is, It's right there.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
I mean he showed up with that notepad. Did he
just write Flacco on it?
Speaker 1 (26:43):
I would like actually to see what was exactly on that.
I don't feel like something that just said Flacco with
a little heart next to it or something or a star.
Speaker 2 (26:51):
Here's what the press conference needs next year. You need
that lady who covers the Jacksonville Jaguars, Lynn Jones, to
just go in there and remind you that he's doing
a great job.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
Are you really a sports writer if you haven't weighed
in on that situation in Jacksonville?
Speaker 1 (27:06):
Yes, because I consider myself a sports writer, and I refuse, Okay,
I'm just not. I'm just because to me, I, in
my opinion, the proper response is to not have an
opinion on it, because here's the thing, something weird can
happen in a press conference. And also to roll my
eyes and we'll move on, Like I don't do I
agree that that should be happening in a press conference. No,
(27:29):
but not to the point like whatever, something stupid happened,
and you move on and go about your day. It's
not something that needs to be the end of the world.
It's not an epidemic happening in press conferences across our
great country right where every single press conference has some
very nice lady telling somebody how great they are. That's
not happening if this was becoming an issue in like
(27:50):
press conferences everywhere are bogged down by empathetic, nice women,
Like what are we talking about? Like, it's just a
weird thing that happened in a press conference. Weird things happened,
altil Yeah, so okay, you move. It doesn't have to
be a statement on the end of journalism as we
know it in and like this just can't Like, I mean,
(28:12):
what are we doing? I just I don't understand why
it has to be such a thing. And I guess
now I just broke my own rule by having an
opinion on it.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
You know, if you remember, for about three days the
Reds were gonna hire ron Oaster as the manager, and
we had somebody here who wanted me, as like a
twenty year old producer to dress up as the Oaster
Bundy and go to the press conference and pass out eggs.
And I, even at that young age, knew that's not
(28:40):
a good idea. So, uh, you know, I've been in
meetings where we have kicked around the idea of defying
the sanctity of the press conference. Fortunately, great journalism mine
like me stepped up and said, no, would you like.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
To talk about the sanctity of a press conference to
somebody who watched a little person come in and ask
questions to more? That's right? When he called Johnny Manzila midget. Yes, yeah,
and he showed up the next day and sat front
and center.
Speaker 4 (29:07):
Sanctity. Look, it's open man. Yeah, do with this space
what you would like? Andy Reid when he starts his
press conference, has time's yours?
Speaker 1 (29:19):
Right?
Speaker 2 (29:19):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (29:20):
Do with it what you'd like? Yeah, do with it?
What you'd like is my page. I do have a question.
Speaker 2 (29:24):
One of my favorite things about any sports press conferences,
in any moment of levity, it feels like there's an
obligation to laugh more extremely than the moment allows.
Speaker 1 (29:34):
I think we got that on Friday. Uh yeah, who
by us laughing or him?
Speaker 2 (29:39):
So Duke made a reference to Kelsey's question and he said, oh,
you don't want to come to Mobile. And then there
was you know, I thought it was a lighthearted moment.
There was a falling in that room, and I so
here's my question, Like, in that moment, that's it's not tense,
but it's it's a guy talking about the team that failed.
It's his responsibility. It's it's not going to be uh,
(29:59):
you know, a comedy routine. He's not gonna do stand up.
But in a moment like that where there's just a
little tiny unease, is there sort of an unwritten rule
that you're supposed to laugh louder than the moment actually allows,
as if the joke is funnier than it really is,
just to break the tension.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
Yeah, we call it weakscribe laughter. Okay, where it's like,
you know, we admit that we're weak. We're just trying
to keep it. We're just trying to like play along here. Okay.
I don't know about extra, but there is also a
need to have like some sort of other emotion other than,
like you said, a little bit of tension that existing
in that room, so that anything that resembles comedy, even
(30:42):
in the like faintest of terms, feels funnier in that
room than it actually is, just by the nature of
everyone kind of wishing that they were in a place
where laughter was accepted.
Speaker 2 (30:53):
It reminded me of being in court for my divorce
when the just said something that was not that funny,
but it lightened the tension a little bit, and all
parties in the room decided that we were watching Mitch
Hedberg at his prime.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
Yeah, in fairness, In fairness, I probably laughed loudest at
the Mobile because I am happiest to not be going
to Mobile anymore.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
I don't blame you one more thing about the press conference.
You folks who cover the team and do a great job,
and the Bengals beat core is collectively awesome. And I
said this to you on your podcast, and I'll reiterate
it today. As a fan, I wish that setting would
have been limited to you guys. I get that that's
(31:39):
not realistic. How do you guys feel when the folks
who typically aren't there or typically don't cover sports come
in and they've got questions When there's a finite amount
of time and you don't know when your next opportunity
for a Duke Tobin availability like that is going to be.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
I mean, I don't love it because, like I said earlier,
it's not the best way to talk to Duke or
have a conversation with him to get real answers. But
I mean, it's it's it's there, it's open. I would
love I would love for there to be a qualifying
circuin number like you have to have been at seventy
five percent of Zach Taylor Wednesday press conferences. There's something
(32:17):
to be to earn admission to the Duke Turbine end
of year deal, right or something like that. I would be,
I would be I would support something like that where
people that have been there all year and and but
everyone has a right to be there. I like, I
have always liked the Duke Tobin side sessions at the
(32:42):
Combine probably of anything we do with him all year.
And in fairness, you know, I you know, take shots
at mobile right, pretty good? Yeah, like for us for me,
now not for everyone else, I understand, because not everyone's
going to go down there. There's no TV element, it's
very unorganized, there's not a lot of structure, but you
(33:04):
know you're getting it's if you're willing to go there,
it can be worth it. I like when we go
to Indianapolis and we're able to it usually is just
the beat group that goes. It's away from the podium
that most people see much more much more conversational and
we know, you know there's a lot you're closer to
(33:26):
things about to happen in March. So I I've always
liked that as my favorite of all the availabilities during
the year. Mock Turtle Soup's a little crazy and it's
more focused on the season and other stuff. There's the
whole road MIC's going that day. That's always been my
my the best environment in my opinion, And so yeah,
(33:46):
I mean that's but the it's whatever they want it
to be. Like I'm happy that they're doing it there
because it didn't it needed to be put into that space.
It needs to be in the lights. Like that's that's
important that that moment exists.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
You broke down as you do every year, the pending
free agents, who stays, who goes, and you kind of
encapsulate each guy with where things stand, what they've accomplished,
and then you put a percentage on their chances of returning.
I want folks to read the piece, but I highlighted
here Gino Stone chance of return fifteen percent. Yeah, this
(34:27):
is fifteen percent higher than it should be. Years ago,
when the radio station was in Mount Adams, you know,
we would share a building with a parking garage and
people would park in that garage to go to the bars.
And one night I had to go as a young
kid to run extra innings, and so I went to
UDF to get something to eat, got a hot fudge Sunday,
(34:47):
and I'm getting on the elevator on a Friday or
Saturday night, and there's a couple on the elevator engaged
in amorous behavior. Oh and as the elevator door swings open,
there are these two people in various degrees of undress.
And I made a sound that was exactly the sound
that I made when I saw fifteen percent chance that
(35:09):
Geno Stone is gonna come back. I would try to
make the sound for you, but I am coming off
having a cold, and my voice is a little scratchy,
but it was high pitched, it was sudden, and it
was disconcerting.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
I wasn't sure you were going with that. That's the
exact sound that I made.
Speaker 2 (35:29):
I went to it. I hit all f read to
think about Gino. You were you were generous in assessing
his play chance of return fifteen percent.
Speaker 1 (35:39):
Yes, because I've not gonna rule him out as a backup.
Like to me, if backups play too well, not if
they're behind genostone. But it's to me, it's I think
that's what he is. Yeah, I think he's a backup
safety in the NFL, CFLs I there's a fifteen is
(36:02):
a not a big number. Okay. It's just if you
get to a position where they sign a safety and
they're like, well we need a backup, and he's out
there and he's basically signed for the league minimum, and
he knows the system and can be in the reserve role,
then it's not impossible. I'm not gonna rule that scenario out.
If this was the starting number, it would be like
(36:25):
one percent or whatever, you know, I would. I do
not see a world where they're running back Gino's stone
is the starter. Of course. Last year, I didn't see
a world where they said we believe in you and
then gave him a pay cut and kept him out
there all year, right, even though the play was poor. Yes,
that said, I don't you know, I don't see that snarre.
The one is if there's a backup role, then there's
a backup role. This cup of water that I'm holding.
Speaker 2 (36:47):
If I said take a drink and there's a fifteen
percent chance you will die, would you take a drink?
Speaker 1 (36:53):
No, you would go fifteen percent. That's a pretty good
chance I'm gonna die.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
Tell I feel about Genostone, Dalton Riisner seventy five percent?
Speaker 1 (36:59):
Why is it that low? It's the Bengals, it's guard,
it's you know, Dalton has how much of a pay
raise would he would he get? He's a good question, James,
James Repene and I have had some passionate debates about this.
I don't I don't think. I mean, this is a
guy that's never made more than three He's a veteran
(37:20):
in his career. He's basically made the league minimum, you know,
this past year. But waited all the way to the
end hoping there would be a market for him. At
some point there wasn't. He signed up for one and change,
so did what he was good and he he they
found a role and everyone's vouching for him. But was
he league minimum to five million per year better than
(37:40):
he has been his entire career. I don't know. It's
probably in the middle there somewhere. There's probably a version
of a two years eight with some sort of something
that everybody feels like they're happy that where you land
in this, But I don't know that there's a history
of him holding out and and you know, holding out
(38:00):
in the terms of not signing immediately last year, like
last year and years before that.
Speaker 2 (38:04):
That wasn't the first time that, but he has said
that's what he doesn't want to do, doesn't want to do,
and but the Bengals have to get that done. So
I I, you know, seventy five percent is still on
the high side. But there's the twenty five percent of
guard re Reisner's history ambiguity. I think that goes into this.
I think everyone would like to get it done.
Speaker 1 (38:23):
But I don't know. Fre agency is weird man stuff.
Weird stuff happened. This does feel like as you have
put it, this does feel like the layup. Do you
still have the hoop and the ball? I do, yeah, okay,
I do like that. I still feel it's like that
but I so, in.
Speaker 2 (38:38):
All seriousness, what I do with some of these is
I try to I try to guess what value you're
going to put, what percentage you're going to put.
Speaker 1 (38:46):
I nailed it with Joe Flacco.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Yeah, thirty three. I didn't nail it with any of
these other guys.
Speaker 1 (38:51):
Yeah. I thought Reisner would be higher. I thought, Ohsai
would be a little higher. I think I put it
at thirty. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (38:57):
Uh, you're obviously operating with a lot more back on
knowledge to me. But I nailed it with Joe Flacco.
Speaker 1 (39:02):
Yeah, I just think it is. I mean, Duke Tobin
mentioned eight times and then there and they would love
to have him, right, but it's just not in their
court because they have they can't offer the one thing
he wants, and that's to play. Somebody might offer him
(39:22):
the ability to play, and he's going to choose that
place over this one more than likely because he wants
to play and no one would blame him. And but
I definitely think there's whatever scenario exists of if he,
you know, doesn't want to sign up to be a backup,
but is in a starter somewhere that he can just
hang out, especially after he did what he did this year.
(39:46):
Why do you need to get in I mean, maybe
he just wants to be around the guys or whatever,
but he doesn't need to do that. So it's I'm
really curious to see how that plays itself out and
how necessary Joe feels like it is to have his
team set in the summer, how necessary the Bengals feel
(40:06):
like it is knowing Blacko could get picked up by
any team in the league at any point if you
isn't under contract with them, to then fill that with
somebody else, whether it be a Tyrod Taylor or any
number of traditional backups that you would hear thrown around there, right,
So what is that? What does that look like? I
don't know. That's an interesting little puzzle for them to
(40:27):
figure out. I'm sure in a perfect world they would say,
Joe Flacco, we will sign you for one year's one
year and five million dollars and you can be our
backup and mark that down today. I'm sure they would
be happy to do that. I just don't think Joe's
going to do that. When does the mock off season exercise?
Hand deep in the sheets right now, trying to go
through it. Yeah, it's very tedious every position, trying there's
(40:50):
not a lot of you know, there's not even a
lot of markets out there for what the free agents
to be are going to be. So I'm trying to
figure out what values are going to be on every
guy and remember how the Google doc works, and I'm
in that part. It's always it's the it's the darkest
before the dawn. I'm at that part where I'm like,
I'm never gonna make it. Every year I reach a
point in the mock off season sheet where I say
(41:11):
I'm just never gonna get it done. But it is
supposed to be out next week. Well I feel like that.
I feel like it's I'm hoping it's gonna happen, but
I'm in a dark place with it right now.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
What I remember about last year's exercise is my glee
and cutting ginostone, so I get to replicate that this year.
But also I I I bang my fist on the
table for Milton Williams, Yeah, who I watched single handedly
wreck the LA Chargers.
Speaker 1 (41:34):
Yeah. A takeaway of the weekend for me was look
at all of these great defense and tell me what's
one thing they have in common? Just game wrecking defensive tackles. Yeah,
across all of these games, you know what I mean,
just changing everything.
Speaker 2 (41:48):
But I might have a ceremony when I cut Genostone.
Speaker 1 (41:53):
There's no cut. Well, there's when you ceremoniously pick a
different safety.
Speaker 2 (41:58):
Yes, okay, literally any human being alive. Gina Stone is
probably an awesome guy, and here I am just destroying
the dude.
Speaker 1 (42:09):
Yeah, it's not fair yet he's he's nice enough.
Speaker 2 (42:13):
He I'm sure he's a wonderful man, but it's not
about that whole boy. No, Well, thank you as always great.
Make sure you catch the Growler podcast and read Paul's
work at the Athletic dot com. Follow him at Paul
Danner Junior. And we'll talk to you next week.
Speaker 1 (42:27):
I look forward to hopefully you'll be healthy enough next
week and you can make the sound. Yeah, I want to.
I want to hear what it is.
Speaker 2 (42:33):
I'll see what I can do. Yeah, but by then
my throats at like eighty five percent. Yeah, but yeah,
very good. It is four minutes away from four. We're
gonna give away Reds Fest tickets next hour. If you
know your Red's off season acquisition so you don't have
to do a ton of boning up. This is ESPN
fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports station,
You found Cincinnati's ESPN fifteenth third, Well you sure have.
What's up?
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Good afternoon, I'm Legger. This is ESPN fifteen thirty. Thanks
for listening. Hopefully you're having an unbelievable Tuesday. Paul Danner
Juniors here from The Athletic and the Growler podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
Covering the Bengals, fighting about the Bengals, podcasting about the Bengals,
and tweeting about the Bengals at Paul Danner Junior, there's
a few things to discuss.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
How are we doing doing good? How are you good?
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Man?
Speaker 1 (00:32):
I always like it when we record something Tuesday morning
on the podcast and it's already old news by the
time I reach you here at three o'clock.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Yes, we're talking about Mike Tomlin, talking about Mike Tomlin
out done, stepping down in Pittsburgh with time left on
his contract.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
One man remains the dean of AFC North coaches, I
mean almost the dean of the NFL at this point.
I mean you're talking. He's on the short list of
longest ten yured coaches in the NFL. I just was
retweeted it. There's red, Yeah, there's like seven. Him and
Lafleur came in the same very close to the same time.
(01:10):
I just retweeted it. I have to go find the
exact list here. Let's see. So Red McVeigh seventeen, you
had McVeigh, Shanahan and McDermott was the seventeen class. Obviously
Andy Reid was hiring twenty thirteen. And then you have
Zach Taylor and Matt Lafleur in twenty nineteen. The old head.
There's the old heads, Laflour and Zach Taylor. I mean,
(01:34):
incredible that this is where, this is where we're at,
but this is where we're at.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
This is there felt like last night watching that game
against the Texans, there felt like a sense of finality,
especially listening to Troy Aikman talked during the broadcast about
Aaron Rodgers as well, but Mike Tomlin and maybe having
his pick of broadcasting jobs during the game there there
(02:00):
felt like that felt like it. Yeah, that there there
was a sense of like this is this is changing,
this is over, this is it.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
Yeah. It has a feeling of like one of those
worst kept secret deals where the certain people knew yeah
and were hinting and trying not to say what they
kind of want to say. And then especially when you
get into something like a broadcast team like that. Yeah,
uh yeah, it felt like that what it's this is
going to be such an interesting dynamic because the Steelers
(02:35):
are still in purgatory. Yeah, Like, I still Tomlin to me,
while it was old and stale or whatever you want
to call it there and they lost these playoff games,
he's still a good Like, he's still a really good coach.
They were in roster purgatory. Yes, more than coach purgatory. Agree, Like,
(02:55):
I think that Tomlin has every ability to win in
the postseason despite the struggles that they've had. They just
haven't been able to figure out quarterback. They have invested
in aging players, and maybe part of that is he's
worked them too hard during the course of the year.
You can debate the philosophy on that, but like, you
got to have somebody that can come in and have
(03:15):
an answer to fixing quarterback, and I just don't know
that anybody can come in and immediately push that button
with where Pittsburgh stands and where the league sits outside
of another version of the band aids that they've been
doing with these free agent mid tier guys.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
You think of nine, ten years ago when they had
Ben Roethlisberger still was you know about a B a
B level quarterback, still very capable, and they had Le'Veon
Bell and Antonio Brown and there was a real dynamic offense.
And then since the immediate aftermath of that to now,
the offense every year for them has looked exactly the same. Yes,
(03:52):
Houston exacerbated that last night with that defense. And I
don't watch every Pittsburgh Steelers game, but watching them as
I do playing the Bengals and just being a follower
of the league, it feels like, independent of coordinator, quarterback, personnel, weaponry,
offensive line, that the offense looks exactly the same every
(04:13):
single year. I don't know how that's going to change
from this year to next.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
Well, you know, if you bring in somebody with more
of a modern offensive philosophy, you're like, okay, let's tap
into the massive McVeigh shanahan the whole league at this Yeah,
but they've never done anything like that there. They've had
defensive coaches, guys with different backgrounds, you know, Arthur Smith,
who's not exactly in that. So if you're maybe there,
(04:42):
it's like a hey, a Clint Kubiak or somebody that's
bringing an offensive person, but you never know. I mean,
think about how outside of the box Mike Tomlin was
as an original higher for them. I mean he was
not even really I mean he was recordinated for one year. Yeah,
but like very much off the mat. Who is that right?
And he's been here that long. They're not afraid to
(05:03):
do that. And you gotta feel like you can get
an incredible coach just due to the stability that you
know you're gonna have there compared to anywhere else. So
a fascinating search for me. But you know, the fallout
in the North is Okay, we keep talking about the
(05:23):
pressure on this team to win in twenty twenty six,
like this is just one level up. It's kind of
the same way of talking about this past season where
there it was, it was accessible when you wasted a chance.
This feels like you had the year where your offense
was super healthy, you went nine to eight and didn't
make the playoffs, right, you had the year this past
(05:44):
year where the North was a disaster. You get Joe
Burrow back in record time and you still can't make
You couldn't find a way to have it relevant. Really,
by the time you get here and make the playoffs.
The entire division is now changing head coaches, except in
your pump up the continuity. If you can't get off
to a fast start and try to win this division,
(06:04):
that's three strikes, right, And I think we've it's felt
that way for a while, and it certainly feels like
this is only putting more of a spotlight on the
just extreme pressure cooker of this year for Zach Taylor,
and who knows, maybe by connection when you look at
the support statement put out by Mike Brown Duke Togan
(06:26):
as well.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
And then if things don't work, the Bengals will just
hire Mike Tomlin, trade for apparently, Oh that's right, Yeah, Well,
I mean you know he's got one more year left
Mike Tomlin does on his coaching contract, correct, right, So
if you wanted him now, you'd have to trade for him.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
My guess is the Bengals aren't gonna do that.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
But you and I both know if Mike Tomlin is
not coaching a team in twenty twenty six, this entire
season will play out against the backdrop of people demanding
that they hire Mike Tomlin, this coach that so many
of us have spent years making fun of will suddenly
be the apple of our eyes?
Speaker 1 (06:58):
Yeah? Oh, this will happen with so many I mean,
this is what this is, what it always is. I'm
curious what what TV job like? Where where's he gonna
where's he gonna land? Is it? Is it gonna be?
I guess is it gonna be Fox? Is it gonna be?
Is it gonna be something like Belichick where he's doing
a little bit more kind of unique stuff with different
(07:18):
people to re I I don't, I don't. I'm curious
to see what that ends up looking like. Yeah, I
mean I'm imagining that's a studio role.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
Probably Mike Tomlin sitting in a booth calling you know,
uh panthers, uh buccaneers on the third Fox Team.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
Yeah. I like him on like a Monday. I like
him on like a reaction type show. But would be interesting.
But I mean, that's that's the path, right, that's the
rehab path. You go, you do a year of TV,
and then you're everybody. He's clearly trying to take this
Sean Payton path here at this point, right, I mean,
this was the same concept, the same idea. A lot
(07:57):
of other stuff going on with Sean but like then
gets right into this. He's gets this huge contract for Denver,
and because he had created this idea, he's gonna come
in and fix it. And here he is having fixed
it for the number one seed in the AFC. And
I'm sure Mike is like, I would love to actually
coach a team with a quarterback again at some point,
and that'd be nice. The Bengals have a quarterback. You
(08:18):
do have a quarterback, So so here you go.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
So there it is. I know he's got ties to
the reach, he has ties to the region. He's worked
for a mom and pop franchise before, right, I mean
the difference division, the differences between the Bengals and Steelers
structurally are not that different, right, I mean there's not
that many. So yeah, Mike Tomlin, Bengals head coach, twenty twenty.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
Seven sounds good. Sure, market Town.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
All right, you're at the Big press conference on on Friday.
I was Big Media Events the event you wrote about
your takeaways? I did, Oh, I love when I love when.
Speaker 1 (08:57):
You print him out for me.
Speaker 2 (08:58):
But yeah, because it's easier for me to high stuff.
I'm still a big print guy.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
I know you are. Besides, we have reams of paper
here that somebody is paid for. I was just thinking
about how big of a prink guy you are, because
I was just texting with Dan Brugo a little earlier,
talking to a little bit of just some random draft stuff. Heck.
I was like, oh, mo's got to be like getting
the toner on demand right now.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
So a few things and we're up against it. So
we'll carry this to the next segment. I guess the
first one would be that thing on Friday took on
a life of its own. It's an hours hour long.
There's people who don't cover the team who are there.
We're promoting it like it's a game. It doesn't have
to be that way. But my guess is, and you
(09:41):
address this, you can tell me if I'm wrong. I
feel like that event, the Duke Tobin end of year
press conference, should be a thing, and I'm guessing it will.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
It felt like he suggested as much at the end,
with a if you guys want this, I'm happy to
do it. And I think we all kind of we're
looking at each other like, yeah, we want this, like
we always want this, And I feel like it's fine
to say I think this should be the punishment for
not making the playoffs, is you have to do this
because it's it's fine, Like, if you make the playoffs,
(10:13):
your schedule ends up closer to where he was talking
in Mobile anyway. But if we could just have it
in Cincinnati, I think everyone would appreciate that. But I
if that's what he's saying, that he's happy to do that,
then I think this should one hundred percent be a
thing every single year. There's no reason it shouldn't. He's
(10:34):
in this position and he should have to answer those
questions and it was fine. I do think it becomes
less of the event and kind of firing lines that
it ended up being when it happens regularly. I think
the build up and the hype and the he needs
to be doing this that went on for over a
(10:58):
year when we were talking, you know, even further back
than that, all of that building up to that moment,
I think turned it into what it became. I don't
think it has to be like that. There's probably ways
to avoid it being quite like that that you can
figure out logistically on their end or our end or whatever.
But I do think that it being a thing feels
(11:20):
like if he's gonna say i'll do it. Then we're
gonna say, let's do it. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
I did enjoy the hype. I did enjoy the build up.
I enjoyed the fact that we were running promos for it.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
I enjoyed the fact that there were folks who would
like put their entire early.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
Friday afternoon on pause.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Yeah, so they can listen to And by the way,
I never want to hear how there's fan apathy ever again,
because you had people who in the middle of a
work day, We're putting everything aside to listen to a
press conference involving Duke Tobin. Right, so miss me with this,
nobody cares about the Bengals anymore. That was a media event.
(11:57):
Every Bengals fan I know was at least paying attention.
Many were following on social media, Many were listening on
ESPN fifteen thirty. Many were watching on the Bengals Twitter feed.
But folks were locked into a press conference. Ain't no apathy.
No TV was preempting programming. Yes, was the Laker or
whoever's on TV during the day.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
There were lots of commercials for the general and personal
injury attorneys that had to get made good. This week
because they were carrying the press conference.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
Well that's the that's the point is that's people want
people want this, Fans deserve this, you know what I mean?
They and now I knew they were going to be disappointed.
Of course they were. Anybody that like, this has happened again.
Like we've talked to Duke so many times, and it
is anticipated every time you do, and every time. He's
(12:53):
not a newsbreaker. He's not a he's not a shake
he's not a giving stuff up guy. Like he's not
a drop bombs at the at at media availability type.
He's fairly polished turn in that regard. Like I knew
that that was how it was going to be coming
out of it. It would have been stunning if it
(13:13):
would have come anywhere near the hype that was happening
towards it. But that said, it's still great that the
hype existed to put a point and a focus on
the fact that it needed to happen.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
I said on Thursday, I think we're building this up
to the point that folks are expecting a show. Yeah,
and it's not going to be a show. You may
not like the answers, you may not like the questions,
it's not going to be a show, and so I
think the build up invariably set the entire thing up
to disappoint people because it wasn't going to be a performance.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
I said this on my podcast, and I was like,
I felt like people thought that it should be like
remember when the guy threw the shoe at George Bush.
It should be like I think people expected me to
ask a question and then throw a shoe at them,
and then my follow up should be the other shoe.
I'del like that's what people wanted or expected this, like
(14:07):
you know, and this massive yell yelling back and forth
or whatever, and it was I think everybody just had
their their questions if they wanted to get in. It's
just hard when you can't really have a conversation, right,
like and that's the like this is on the on
the on the like totem pole of things and and
(14:29):
and platforms and places that you can do this Like
this is pretty low right in terms of getting getting
in actual answers. But I do understand that why this
is where it had to be and in this particular moment.
But you were never gonna get like a good conversation
about the state of things in that room.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
All right, Well, I have an idea for next to
yours press conference that I want to share with you.
We also have to talk about your free agency preview. Yeah,
we have a lot of a lot.
Speaker 1 (14:57):
Of that's the one that made you make a weird sound. Yes, yes, speaking.
It's nineteen minutes after three o'clock. Mogger.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
Paul Danner Junior is here from The Athletic and the
Growler Podcast. He's here till four. We are here till
six on ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
Twenty three after three o'clock.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
This is ESPN fifteen thirty Paul Danner Junior from The Athletic,
the latest edition of the Growler Podcast with apparently my
crappy internet connection.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
Is up right now. I didn't know what to do.
I watched, Yeah, I watched it and it wasn't good.
So it's okay. I fear something out. The audio was
The audio was fine, Yeah, the audio was fine. It
was rainy in and out of some grain as a time.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
You ever seen video from like the International Space Station, Yeah,
that's what I look like for my basement.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
Why can't we figure this out? I don't know why.
I don't know. Oh, I have to get on that
all right.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
So a few things about the press conference Megapress conference,
which lasted sixty three minutes, in your opinion is we've
done it before, a fair counter to fan distrust.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
It's an audio platform. I need you to tell you
need me to talk about that.
Speaker 2 (16:10):
I mean, because that was that was a theme, right,
We've we've done it before. So there's fan distrust, which
is a large part why everybody wanted this big megapress conference.
Even so fan distrust. The message from Duke was essentially
we've had successes, We've done it before. Is that a
fair counter to the fan distrust? No?
Speaker 1 (16:30):
I mean I think that the idea that something that
worked for or five years ago is definitely going to
work now is not. You would you wouldn't accept that
from your coaching staff saying well, look, the types of
offenses we were running in twenty twenty one are still
going to work exactly the same as they do. Know
the League of Alls every year, right, it changes, and
(16:52):
that is the same in the off season, the league
of alves and the way people use certain contract stretchers
more wide widely, the way players expect more types of
certain to whether it's year two guarantees or void years
or any of the things you're going to talk about
the way free agency is handled, the way that picks
are coming into the league, like every Yes, some things
(17:15):
stay the same, but things do change and evolve, and
you guys have to evolve with it. Now. Is that
saying that they can't come in here and it can
end up looking like it did four and five years
ago in terms of execution. Sure, but you can't shoot
down the idea that some things maybe need to be
(17:35):
done differently because the league changes and you need to
change along with it more often. And it's a lot
of I'm sure the frustration with the way people talk
about the scouting staff size, right, and it's not necessarily
about the people doing it. It said, Okay, everyone else is
throwing just armies of analytics people at this stuff, and
(18:00):
and people that can come from every angle of understanding
all of that. Then in the projections and models and whatever,
and yeah, they they added Trey La Bounty, right, they
got to now in the analytics department, that's part of it, right,
Like one one or two people working with your scouting
department when you already don't have you know, all the
(18:22):
area scouts and everything else that that other people do
is gonna draw attention. More people are investing in that stuff.
That is part of the evolution of the league. Does
that mean you can't still go down there and hit
on a Marius Mims No, obviously, yeah, or or whatever,
or hit on draft picks that that do or don't
hit like it doesn't. It doesn't mean anything. It's just
(18:42):
it's just why not have those advantages? Why why not
have that information as well? I understand that. And you
can't say that things are gonna work that the way
they did four and five years ago. The league changes
too fast. It's just the league changes too fast. There's
too many advantages that team staying ahead of that trend
and gain every year to dismiss it as well, we'll
(19:03):
just do it the same as we did four or
five years ago.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Do you believe if Duke Tobin had complete and total
carte blanche that he would keep the scouting staff size
what it is.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
Yeah, if I don't think it's a thing where he can't.
Speaker 2 (19:19):
So if he decided I want to hire four new
people in scouting and analytics and in player personnel, you
believe that he would have the ability to say to Mike,
I want to hire four folks.
Speaker 1 (19:32):
I think so, I do I think that he could
have that. I think I have never once. I mean,
they have added across whether it's coaching staff or even
in the scouting staff. Over the course of the time
that I've been talking to Duke, you know, decade and
a half now, they have added. They have increased sizes
(19:56):
of things, They've done things differently. He's gotten that, and
every step of the way has said the same thing
to me, like this is the size, like I don't
want it to be much more. I like the small
nature of it. I like the collaborative nature of it.
This is like his message that he put out there
last Friday is very similar to probably the first time
(20:17):
I asked him thirteen years ago. Honestly, I mean, it
hasn't really changed a whole lot. And so I do
think that if they felt like that would help them
win having those people, that they would do it. I
don't think it's a thing where there's no you can't
have any more people here, there's not money for that.
I really do not think that is the case. I
(20:39):
think this is largely the preferred nature of it.
Speaker 2 (20:43):
I don't know a lot about prediction markets, but if
I did, I would try to see if I could
find Bengals to take pass Russia in round one. Right, Yeah, Now,
pass rushier doesn't have to mean edge. No, we've talked
about this. One of their grave mistake has been, you know,
getting three techniques who were not pass rushers, you know,
(21:04):
good run stoppers. So if I go on Calshie or
one of these prediction markets, be Calshy guy. No, I
don't really understand how that works. I have a hard
enough time tracking my bets on FanDuel. Yeah, but could
I do you think I could could find this market
where I make a wager predicting that the Bengals take
pass Rusher in round one based on the Duke Tobin
(21:25):
mega press conference.
Speaker 1 (21:27):
Yeah, I mean that was the point of the things
that came out of it in terms of a real,
real answers. It was that this is gonna be the folkus.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
If you wanted transparency in any part of that press conference,
there it was.
Speaker 1 (21:41):
That was it. It was. It was Wait, now there's
probably some frustration in that that's exactly what we were
saying last year, and it was a run stuffing nose
tackle in bj Hill, right, everybody knew you needed pass
rush and there was no especially from the interior, right,
and it was like no, it was the message was
(22:02):
if we stop the run better, we'll have more opportunities
to run the past. Or was the messaging this year?
Now it's a pass rush is king and got to
have it. So yeah, and there's only so many places
you can get that, like you're gonna have a hard
You can get edges in free agency, like you can,
it's gonna cost you. You can't get elite three techniques
(22:26):
without paying out the notes. And there's really not gonna
be any So whether you're talking about looking to the
draft for that, that certainly seems the most likely that
somebody up there is in and a draft that will
have that. And then Caleb Downs as well is gonna
be in that conversation obviously just by the nature of
how good he has been. And then we'll have premium
(22:47):
position conversations that everybody loves. But yeah, it's clearly pass
rush as the focus of I would think for agency
and the draft in some capacity. All Right, we do
have to talk.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
I have a couple of questions about next year's Duke
Tobin Mega press conference.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
And then we have to get to your list of
free agencies. And I'll try to replicate the sound that
I made. Okay, when I read one of the capsules
about the the guys who are due to leave the
Bengals if they don't resign them.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
I have a feeling that just knowing your history here,
you know where this is going right to one person immediately.
Speaker 2 (23:21):
Yeah, So before I printed it, I hit control F
and I typed in two words, Geno Stone.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Yeah, got right to it.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
I read the rest, but yes, I you should have
just started with him. The picture here should not be
of Trey Hendricks. I don't care about him, Gino Stone.
We'll get to that when we come back. It's twenty
eight away from four o'clock. This is ESPN fifteen thirty,
Cincinnati Sports Station. It's at twenty three from four o'clock.
This is ESPN fifteen thirty Moeger with Paul Danner Junior
(23:54):
from the Athletic dot Com and the Growler Podcast. If
you missed it, Mike Tomlin steps down his head coach
of the Pittsburgh Steelers after nineteen seasons. Of course, in
those nineteen seasons, the losses never outweighed the wins. Congratulations
to him. The Houston Texans points dramatically outweighed Pittsburgh's last night,
thirty to six, which means Marvin Lewis got to mention
(24:15):
on TV last night seven straight playoff losses.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Do you feel like you gotta feel like Marvin went
to the wine cellar and found an extra nice bottle
last night to celebrate not being the sole owner of
the seven straight playoff losses you had to have had
to have. That's got to feel good. Although the flip
side is people are gonna bring up the fact that
you also had seven straight playoff losses, where that people
(24:40):
had kind of probably forgotten that for a while. Now
I haven't forgotten. I haven't. Manye, those watching the broadcast
probably had, but I know you had.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
Next year's Duke Tobin mega press conference events. Will he
continue to mention Joe Flacco?
Speaker 1 (24:57):
Sure? Specially he's back, you know.
Speaker 4 (25:00):
So.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
A former athletics director at U See once gave me
an authentic throwback basketball jersey, which I thought was really
nice and I was deeply appreciative, and I sent him
a handwritten thank you note and then when I framed
it and hung it in my basement, I took a
picture of it and sent it to him. Made just
a point of expressing my gratitude. For the next two
(25:24):
and a half years, every time I saw this guy,
he would bring up the jersey that he gave me.
How's that jersey I gave you? It's awesome, looks great
at my wall. Hey, remember when I gave you that jersey?
Is this how Duke Tobin's gonna treat Joe Flacco? Or
three four years down the road, assuming he's in his
current capacity, he's going to remind us, oh'd you like
that Joe Flacco game against the Steelers?
Speaker 1 (25:44):
Remember when I traded for him? Is this going to
be the new thing? Well? Sure, every time we ever met.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
By the way, it was Mike Boone, I'm stunned.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
I'm stunned. Stunned. No, uh yeah, because anytime we talk
about the trade deadline again, m m you.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
Know he remember, didn't even wait to the deadline last
year and.
Speaker 1 (26:09):
Say we don't make deals in season anymore. That traded
for Joe Flacco. Anytime we talk about quarterback injuries, I'm
sure we'll never have to talk about quarterback injuries anymore? Uh? Anytime?
You know, we we talk about willingness to part ways
with draft picks at some point do business with a division,
the division rival to the can't remember that? And next
time they play Pittsburgh remember last time? Yeah, it's gonna
(26:35):
be There's there's there, it is, It's right there.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
I mean he showed up with that notepad. Did he
just write Flacco on it?
Speaker 1 (26:43):
I would like actually to see what was exactly on that.
I don't feel like something that just said Flacco with
a little heart next to it or something or a star.
Speaker 2 (26:51):
Here's what the press conference needs next year. You need
that lady who covers the Jacksonville Jaguars, Lynn Jones, to
just go in there and remind you that he's doing
a great job.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
Are you really a sports writer if you haven't weighed
in on that situation in Jacksonville?
Speaker 1 (27:06):
Yes, because I consider myself a sports writer, and I refuse, Okay,
I'm just not. I'm just because to me, I, in
my opinion, the proper response is to not have an
opinion on it, because here's the thing, something weird can
happen in a press conference. And also to roll my
eyes and we'll move on, Like I don't do I
agree that that should be happening in a press conference. No,
(27:29):
but not to the point like whatever, something stupid happened,
and you move on and go about your day. It's
not something that needs to be the end of the world.
It's not an epidemic happening in press conferences across our
great country right where every single press conference has some
very nice lady telling somebody how great they are. That's
not happening if this was becoming an issue in like
(27:50):
press conferences everywhere are bogged down by empathetic, nice women,
Like what are we talking about? Like, it's just a
weird thing that happened in a press conference. Weird things happened,
altil Yeah, so okay, you move. It doesn't have to
be a statement on the end of journalism as we
know it in and like this just can't Like, I mean,
(28:12):
what are we doing? I just I don't understand why
it has to be such a thing. And I guess
now I just broke my own rule by having an
opinion on it.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
You know, if you remember, for about three days the
Reds were gonna hire ron Oaster as the manager, and
we had somebody here who wanted me, as like a
twenty year old producer to dress up as the Oaster
Bundy and go to the press conference and pass out eggs.
And I, even at that young age, knew that's not
(28:40):
a good idea. So, uh, you know, I've been in
meetings where we have kicked around the idea of defying
the sanctity of the press conference. Fortunately, great journalism mine
like me stepped up and said, no, would you like.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
To talk about the sanctity of a press conference to
somebody who watched a little person come in and ask
questions to more? That's right? When he called Johnny Manzila midget. Yes, yeah,
and he showed up the next day and sat front
and center.
Speaker 4 (29:07):
Sanctity. Look, it's open man. Yeah, do with this space
what you would like? Andy Reid when he starts his
press conference, has time's yours?
Speaker 1 (29:19):
Right?
Speaker 2 (29:19):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (29:20):
Do with it what you'd like? Yeah, do with it?
What you'd like is my page. I do have a question.
Speaker 2 (29:24):
One of my favorite things about any sports press conferences,
in any moment of levity, it feels like there's an
obligation to laugh more extremely than the moment allows.
Speaker 1 (29:34):
I think we got that on Friday. Uh yeah, who
by us laughing or him?
Speaker 2 (29:39):
So Duke made a reference to Kelsey's question and he said, oh,
you don't want to come to Mobile. And then there
was you know, I thought it was a lighthearted moment.
There was a falling in that room, and I so
here's my question, Like, in that moment, that's it's not tense,
but it's it's a guy talking about the team that failed.
It's his responsibility. It's it's not going to be uh,
(29:59):
you know, a comedy routine. He's not gonna do stand up.
But in a moment like that where there's just a
little tiny unease, is there sort of an unwritten rule
that you're supposed to laugh louder than the moment actually allows,
as if the joke is funnier than it really is,
just to break the tension.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
Yeah, we call it weakscribe laughter. Okay, where it's like,
you know, we admit that we're weak. We're just trying
to keep it. We're just trying to like play along here. Okay.
I don't know about extra, but there is also a
need to have like some sort of other emotion other than,
like you said, a little bit of tension that existing
in that room, so that anything that resembles comedy, even
(30:42):
in the like faintest of terms, feels funnier in that
room than it actually is, just by the nature of
everyone kind of wishing that they were in a place
where laughter was accepted.
Speaker 2 (30:53):
It reminded me of being in court for my divorce
when the just said something that was not that funny,
but it lightened the tension a little bit, and all
parties in the room decided that we were watching Mitch
Hedberg at his prime.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
Yeah, in fairness, In fairness, I probably laughed loudest at
the Mobile because I am happiest to not be going
to Mobile anymore.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
I don't blame you one more thing about the press conference.
You folks who cover the team and do a great job,
and the Bengals beat core is collectively awesome. And I
said this to you on your podcast, and I'll reiterate
it today. As a fan, I wish that setting would
have been limited to you guys. I get that that's
(31:39):
not realistic. How do you guys feel when the folks
who typically aren't there or typically don't cover sports come
in and they've got questions When there's a finite amount
of time and you don't know when your next opportunity
for a Duke Tobin availability like that is going to be.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
I mean, I don't love it because, like I said earlier,
it's not the best way to talk to Duke or
have a conversation with him to get real answers. But
I mean, it's it's it's there, it's open. I would
love I would love for there to be a qualifying
circuin number like you have to have been at seventy
five percent of Zach Taylor Wednesday press conferences. There's something
(32:17):
to be to earn admission to the Duke Turbine end
of year deal, right or something like that. I would be,
I would be I would support something like that where
people that have been there all year and and but
everyone has a right to be there. I like, I
have always liked the Duke Tobin side sessions at the
(32:42):
Combine probably of anything we do with him all year.
And in fairness, you know, I you know, take shots
at mobile right, pretty good? Yeah, like for us for me,
now not for everyone else, I understand, because not everyone's
going to go down there. There's no TV element, it's
very unorganized, there's not a lot of structure, but you
(33:04):
know you're getting it's if you're willing to go there,
it can be worth it. I like when we go
to Indianapolis and we're able to it usually is just
the beat group that goes. It's away from the podium
that most people see much more much more conversational and
we know, you know there's a lot you're closer to
(33:26):
things about to happen in March. So I I've always
liked that as my favorite of all the availabilities during
the year. Mock Turtle Soup's a little crazy and it's
more focused on the season and other stuff. There's the
whole road MIC's going that day. That's always been my
my the best environment in my opinion, And so yeah,
(33:46):
I mean that's but the it's whatever they want it
to be. Like I'm happy that they're doing it there
because it didn't it needed to be put into that space.
It needs to be in the lights. Like that's that's
important that that moment exists.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
You broke down as you do every year, the pending
free agents, who stays, who goes, and you kind of
encapsulate each guy with where things stand, what they've accomplished,
and then you put a percentage on their chances of returning.
I want folks to read the piece, but I highlighted
here Gino Stone chance of return fifteen percent. Yeah, this
(34:27):
is fifteen percent higher than it should be. Years ago,
when the radio station was in Mount Adams, you know,
we would share a building with a parking garage and
people would park in that garage to go to the bars.
And one night I had to go as a young
kid to run extra innings, and so I went to
UDF to get something to eat, got a hot fudge Sunday,
(34:47):
and I'm getting on the elevator on a Friday or
Saturday night, and there's a couple on the elevator engaged
in amorous behavior. Oh and as the elevator door swings open,
there are these two people in various degrees of undress.
And I made a sound that was exactly the sound
that I made when I saw fifteen percent chance that
(35:09):
Geno Stone is gonna come back. I would try to
make the sound for you, but I am coming off
having a cold, and my voice is a little scratchy,
but it was high pitched, it was sudden, and it
was disconcerting.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
I wasn't sure you were going with that. That's the
exact sound that I made.
Speaker 2 (35:29):
I went to it. I hit all f read to
think about Gino. You were you were generous in assessing
his play chance of return fifteen percent.
Speaker 1 (35:39):
Yes, because I've not gonna rule him out as a backup.
Like to me, if backups play too well, not if
they're behind genostone. But it's to me, it's I think
that's what he is. Yeah, I think he's a backup
safety in the NFL, CFLs I there's a fifteen is
(36:02):
a not a big number. Okay. It's just if you
get to a position where they sign a safety and
they're like, well we need a backup, and he's out
there and he's basically signed for the league minimum, and
he knows the system and can be in the reserve role,
then it's not impossible. I'm not gonna rule that scenario out.
If this was the starting number, it would be like
(36:25):
one percent or whatever, you know, I would. I do
not see a world where they're running back Gino's stone
is the starter. Of course. Last year, I didn't see
a world where they said we believe in you and
then gave him a pay cut and kept him out
there all year, right, even though the play was poor. Yes,
that said, I don't you know, I don't see that snarre.
The one is if there's a backup role, then there's
a backup role. This cup of water that I'm holding.
Speaker 2 (36:47):
If I said take a drink and there's a fifteen
percent chance you will die, would you take a drink?
Speaker 1 (36:53):
No, you would go fifteen percent. That's a pretty good
chance I'm gonna die.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
Tell I feel about Genostone, Dalton Riisner seventy five percent?
Speaker 1 (36:59):
Why is it that low? It's the Bengals, it's guard,
it's you know, Dalton has how much of a pay
raise would he would he get? He's a good question, James,
James Repene and I have had some passionate debates about this.
I don't I don't think. I mean, this is a
guy that's never made more than three He's a veteran
(37:20):
in his career. He's basically made the league minimum, you know,
this past year. But waited all the way to the
end hoping there would be a market for him. At
some point there wasn't. He signed up for one and change,
so did what he was good and he he they
found a role and everyone's vouching for him. But was
he league minimum to five million per year better than
(37:40):
he has been his entire career. I don't know. It's
probably in the middle there somewhere. There's probably a version
of a two years eight with some sort of something
that everybody feels like they're happy that where you land
in this, But I don't know that there's a history
of him holding out and and you know, holding out
(38:00):
in the terms of not signing immediately last year, like
last year and years before that.
Speaker 2 (38:04):
That wasn't the first time that, but he has said
that's what he doesn't want to do, doesn't want to do,
and but the Bengals have to get that done. So
I I, you know, seventy five percent is still on
the high side. But there's the twenty five percent of
guard re Reisner's history ambiguity. I think that goes into this.
I think everyone would like to get it done.
Speaker 1 (38:23):
But I don't know. Fre agency is weird man stuff.
Weird stuff happened. This does feel like as you have
put it, this does feel like the layup. Do you
still have the hoop and the ball? I do, yeah, okay,
I do like that. I still feel it's like that
but I so, in.
Speaker 2 (38:38):
All seriousness, what I do with some of these is
I try to I try to guess what value you're
going to put, what percentage you're going to put.
Speaker 1 (38:46):
I nailed it with Joe Flacco.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Yeah, thirty three. I didn't nail it with any of
these other guys.
Speaker 1 (38:51):
Yeah. I thought Reisner would be higher. I thought, Ohsai
would be a little higher. I think I put it
at thirty. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (38:57):
Uh, you're obviously operating with a lot more back on
knowledge to me. But I nailed it with Joe Flacco.
Speaker 1 (39:02):
Yeah, I just think it is. I mean, Duke Tobin
mentioned eight times and then there and they would love
to have him, right, but it's just not in their
court because they have they can't offer the one thing
he wants, and that's to play. Somebody might offer him
(39:22):
the ability to play, and he's going to choose that
place over this one more than likely because he wants
to play and no one would blame him. And but
I definitely think there's whatever scenario exists of if he,
you know, doesn't want to sign up to be a backup,
but is in a starter somewhere that he can just
hang out, especially after he did what he did this year.
(39:46):
Why do you need to get in I mean, maybe
he just wants to be around the guys or whatever,
but he doesn't need to do that. So it's I'm
really curious to see how that plays itself out and
how necessary Joe feels like it is to have his
team set in the summer, how necessary the Bengals feel
(40:06):
like it is knowing Blacko could get picked up by
any team in the league at any point if you
isn't under contract with them, to then fill that with
somebody else, whether it be a Tyrod Taylor or any
number of traditional backups that you would hear thrown around there, right,
So what is that? What does that look like? I
don't know. That's an interesting little puzzle for them to
(40:27):
figure out. I'm sure in a perfect world they would say,
Joe Flacco, we will sign you for one year's one
year and five million dollars and you can be our
backup and mark that down today. I'm sure they would
be happy to do that. I just don't think Joe's
going to do that. When does the mock off season exercise?
Hand deep in the sheets right now, trying to go
through it. Yeah, it's very tedious every position, trying there's
(40:50):
not a lot of you know, there's not even a
lot of markets out there for what the free agents
to be are going to be. So I'm trying to
figure out what values are going to be on every
guy and remember how the Google doc works, and I'm
in that part. It's always it's the it's the darkest
before the dawn. I'm at that part where I'm like,
I'm never gonna make it. Every year I reach a
point in the mock off season sheet where I say
(41:11):
I'm just never gonna get it done. But it is
supposed to be out next week. Well I feel like that.
I feel like it's I'm hoping it's gonna happen, but
I'm in a dark place with it right now.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
What I remember about last year's exercise is my glee
and cutting ginostone, so I get to replicate that this year.
But also I I I bang my fist on the
table for Milton Williams, Yeah, who I watched single handedly
wreck the LA Chargers.
Speaker 1 (41:34):
Yeah. A takeaway of the weekend for me was look
at all of these great defense and tell me what's
one thing they have in common? Just game wrecking defensive tackles. Yeah,
across all of these games, you know what I mean,
just changing everything.
Speaker 2 (41:48):
But I might have a ceremony when I cut Genostone.
Speaker 1 (41:53):
There's no cut. Well, there's when you ceremoniously pick a
different safety.
Speaker 2 (41:58):
Yes, okay, literally any human being alive. Gina Stone is
probably an awesome guy, and here I am just destroying
the dude.
Speaker 1 (42:09):
Yeah, it's not fair yet he's he's nice enough.
Speaker 2 (42:13):
He I'm sure he's a wonderful man, but it's not
about that whole boy. No, Well, thank you as always great.
Make sure you catch the Growler podcast and read Paul's
work at the Athletic dot com. Follow him at Paul
Danner Junior. And we'll talk to you next week.
Speaker 1 (42:27):
I look forward to hopefully you'll be healthy enough next
week and you can make the sound. Yeah, I want to.
I want to hear what it is.
Speaker 2 (42:33):
I'll see what I can do. Yeah, but by then
my throats at like eighty five percent. Yeah, but yeah,
very good. It is four minutes away from four. We're
gonna give away Reds Fest tickets next hour. If you
know your Red's off season acquisition so you don't have
to do a ton of boning up. This is ESPN
fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports station,
Mo Egger News
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