The Tony and Mo Training Camp Show LIVE from Bengals Training Camp -- 7/25/25

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Alive from Bengals training Camp. This is a special edision
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(00:22):
Oakley Greens. Now from the airport, paint and body quality
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Mo on the ESPN fifteen thirty, the official home of
the Bengals.

Speaker 2 (00:36):
Just another gorgeous morning for Bengals training camp practice today.
Moeger and Tony Pikey AE dorn Window Tony and Mo
Training Camp Show. Thanks to our friends at AE dorn Window.
They sell the best and service the rest. Thanks to
our friend Adam weberfor sponsoring our broadcast and of course
for his support of the Bengals all these many years.

(00:57):
If you're looking for Clinton and Company on ESPN Radio,
not happening today, Day three of Bengals training camp. We
are here. We've got our tent and a lot to
talk about. Tom.

Speaker 3 (01:08):
Yeah, the big news there is the tent.

Speaker 2 (01:10):
The tent.

Speaker 3 (01:10):
We've got a tent We've got a little bit of
a side drape here that that is preventing sun from
creeping in, thanks to Mike Mills. If you look across
the field into the bleachers, all you see are fans
waving yes, like not the fans themselves, but the fans
they're holding in their hands. It's hot here today, but
it's another opportunity for this team to come out here
and get some good work done. Saw yesterday a little

(01:31):
bit of the the ramifications of heat. A couple of
players had either leave practice with cramps or take some
drills off. So you're you're now starting to get in
I really don't start it until next week when you
start talking about the thick of training camp. Right, you're
starting to get in it. Eight days in a row
for these players. You know, your your mood changes a
little bit really light the first two days. Right now,

(01:53):
you're starting to get tired of seeing these guys every
day running through the same stuff. So you're starting to
get into the thick and the meat of training camp.

Speaker 2 (02:00):
I was, you know, I've heard players talk about this before,
like the newness wears off pretty quickly, right, something about
day one? All right, it's like the first day of school, right,
there's newness to it. Everybody's sharp, everybody's crisp, everybody's excited,
everybody feels really good physically, and then after a couple
of days, it's like, oh man, you know, and and
the light at the end of the tunnel might be there,
but it is way off in the distance. I always

(02:20):
think it's interesting to hear and see about which teams,
which players, and which units power through. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:27):
Look, it's a day off of yesterday where the offense dominated,
so I'm eager to see what the defense's response is today.
But I think if you also were to go into
camp and say who's going to win most of the days,
you'd say the offense. Yes, Like this is a defense
that is still learning to defense that's playing against an
offense that they're not going to see like many others

(02:48):
they are going to play. So you want to get
as much good work as you can. But if you're
out Golden, you want to see how your guys respond
after getting punched in the mouth a little bit yesterday.
And if you're the Bengals offensively, can you put two
good days in a row? Can you build on what
you were able to do yesterday and this portion of
training camp, do you start to see more players maybe

(03:11):
that you weren't expecting starting to emerge. We know the
core guys, we know the guys we're going to talk
about more often than not, But are there any players
that start to take that jump in day three of
training camp? And are there players that start to fall off?
You gotta imagine every single day they're installing. Yes, every
single day they're putting in more and more and more plays.

(03:31):
And if you're behind one day, they don't hold up
the rest of the team. They just install more. So
you get to day three, day four, all of a sudden,
maybe some guys are now overwhelmed with the mental load
that the playbook is becoming. Other veterans and guys are
staying on top of it, but you also kind of
see that starting to happen through training camp.

Speaker 2 (03:51):
We're going to go through some X factors for this
team coming up a little bit later on this hour,
and we sort of did a blow by the AFC
North on when we were here for day one. We'll
do something in a little bit greater detail as it
relates to the Browns, the Ravens and the Pittsburgh Steelers.
We have to talk about yesterday's loser of the day
at Bengals training camp, and it's worth mentioning for the

(04:13):
second consecutive day. I don't know that we have decided
on what to call the award we give out for
the first one to show up, but for the second
consecutive day, Al Golden wins.

Speaker 3 (04:22):
It really setting the lead by example strategy. Yes, he's
been fantastic.

Speaker 2 (04:26):
Well though that guy that was running at the end
of training camp yesterday might still be doing laps around here.
I have no idea. We'll see. Let's start though, with
something we talked about yesterday. So Noah Fan made his visit,
came in, has left, No contract has been signed, no steak.
I've read that the visit went well, but he's gonna
go take a visit with the New Orleans Saints. So

(04:46):
he leaves without signing a contract. That certainly doesn't mean
that the Bengals can sign him. But that's where things
stand with Noah Fan.

Speaker 3 (04:53):
And if you if you're going to New Orleans and you're
gonna sign now, you're signing because of the money. You're
not gonna go watching New Orleans practice offensively correct after
watching this and say, yeah, this is probably a better
fit for me. The fit is here, the ability to
make the most of your value is here. It comes
down to I'm assuming the dollars that would be offered

(05:14):
by the Bengals versus what the Saints could probably offer
as well. It also is good to note that Mike
Petralia looks normally dressed today.

Speaker 2 (05:22):
I thought he looked normally dressed yesterday, did you Yeah, okay,
I thought that the banana It's because I would have
thought had if which Jamar Chase called out in.

Speaker 3 (05:30):
The press, cat if Traggs was the guy that I
was hoping he was, he'd have went back to that
supermarket and he'd have found another obscure outfit and he'd
have worn it today.

Speaker 2 (05:38):
I just would I'd pick a different, you know, fruit
to feature. Yeah, every single day. Yesterday it was bananas,
Today it'd be strawberries. That's I think.

Speaker 3 (05:45):
I think that's a miss.

Speaker 2 (05:46):
Lemons are lines you know tomorrow or the next day
of training camp. You know, maybe kiwi app I mean
lots of.

Speaker 3 (05:52):
Fruits feels like a miss from Trags. We've yet to
see Jeremy Row. He took a little bit of a
beating yesterday.

Speaker 2 (05:57):
From a media standpoint, he might be deciding, you know what,
I'm gonna take today off. I'm gonna get ready to
cover Reds and Rays tonight. Perhaps Red's raised tonight. Music
festival here, Tonight's start going on downtown, going on in
the Bengals training camp. You got music fest, ll cool
Jay tomorrow night, Big three is happening. I had a
chance to interview Jordan Crawford yesterday and go listen to

(06:18):
that on the app if you want, and Reds and
Rays coming up as well. I think I got through
to some people though, as it relates to no a
fan really yeah, because I think you had to remind
folks that last year the Bengals, I think they were
eighth or ninth in the league in twelve personnel, two
tight ends on the field, and it worked. And the
reason why I was the ascension of Eric All And
I think that's you know, the season is so long.

(06:40):
That is a name that's very easy to forget. But
in many respects, you're trying to replace him right when
he when he was on the field last year, and Tony,
you know, with you, with you and I on Mondays,
I slobbered over how much I liked Eric All because
he's just the typical tight end that you know, the
Bengals have been looking for my entire life. Well, you're

(07:01):
you're trying to fill that role. You're trying to replace him,
And I think I think it's very it's very it's
very rare that I that I convince people. But you know,
there were folks when we found out the Bengals were
going to bring in Noah Fan for a visit, who
are like, ah, yeah, but he doesn't play guard, And
I go, cool, aren't they still trying to replace? And
then I would pause Eric All, Oh yeah, and.

Speaker 3 (07:23):
So future Bengals ring of honor.

Speaker 2 (07:25):
Yeah, you're still trying to do that. Noah Fan could
still conceivably do that.

Speaker 3 (07:29):
You know, we spend so much time in the offseason
talking about wide receiver three what the Bengals, and if
you go by watching what the Bengals do, they drafted
tight ends.

Speaker 2 (07:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (07:41):
Why because they want to be more of a twelve
personnel team. They want to be able to line up
and run the ball and use play action and create matchups.
Because you have two elite guys outside. If you could
play out a more twelve personnel. That gives you Jamar,
it gives you t It gives you two tight ends
that more than able to win one on one matchups,

(08:02):
and it gives you Chase Brown in the backfield. I
think if if you were able to sit Zach Taylor
or Dan Pitcher down and say, hey, if you had
your pick of one Drive one Series one play, what
personnel grouping are you wanting to run out of? I
would say they would say twelve. That's that's who they
want to be.

Speaker 2 (08:21):
Which is what they were about thirty percent of the
time last year. And that accounts for you know, all
the time that Eric Hall wasn't around.

Speaker 3 (08:26):
They want to be that and it fits Burrow so well,
and it fits the play action so well. And you
talk about one high two high safety looks, you can
get that safety to roll down because you're in twelve personnel,
You got the threat to run, you got to get more.

Speaker 2 (08:41):
Hats into the box.

Speaker 3 (08:42):
Everything to me would point to wanting to operate out
of more twelve personnel. And I think that's why they
drafted Eric Hall. And in turn, now I think that's
why they brought in No a fan for a visit.

Speaker 2 (08:53):
Yeah, makes too much sense. I hope he gets done.
He's not at the mall. We are not on no
a fan and watch at the house which Joe is
here today.

Speaker 3 (09:05):
He's not taking him out to lunch.

Speaker 2 (09:06):
Yo. Well you know they could they can go. Remember
with Leo Collins, it was cupcakes and crackers, and they
were trying to convince us that they were eating at
Joe Burrow's house cupcakes and crackers. Yeah, and and and
look maybe they were. I still am skeptical of that.
I I hope if they bring into a fan that
he ends up being better than Lele Collins.

Speaker 3 (09:23):
As the captain of ESBN fifteen thirty. Oh, do you
plan any meals or or things where maybe you're going
to boost the.

Speaker 2 (09:31):
Camaraderie here I can have folks over. What would you
go with? Well, I mean, you know I lined up
we would do a skyline that you have the palette
of a fourth breathe correct, So we're not going to
go you can keep it simple. We're going to go
very simple with you a lot of coaches. I mean,
we've got a Donado's pizza coming later today. And I
asked you what you wanted cheez a lot of which
is what my eight year old does.

Speaker 3 (09:50):
A lot of coaches have, like their their personnel or
their their group that come over to the place. A
lot of them have pools. You already got the pool
thing checked off.

Speaker 2 (09:57):
Yeah, come on over.

Speaker 3 (09:59):
Okay, that's what a captain does.

Speaker 2 (10:01):
You know, I've got a kid free day at my
house on Sunday.

Speaker 3 (10:03):
Oh I had two of those, the last two and
then it got yeah, abrupted quickly last night when the.

Speaker 2 (10:10):
Kids returned home. Ball game huh, game over over not
necessarily happening. Good news is we're two days in the
training camp. You know, Miles Murphy left yesterday because if
he kind of felt like he got the best of
t Higgins yesterday, and so a very clean first couple
of days of training camp. If you're looking for some
good reading, Paul Danner Junior at the Athletic has a

(10:32):
good piece today on the plan for Joe Burrow in
the preseason, how it came together and how much he
wants to play in the games that don't count. What
I'm kind of curious is, and I certainly hope this
doesn't end up being something we have to confront. It's
easy to say players are going to play in the preseason, right,
and then the game starts and circumstances start to become

(10:54):
what they.

Speaker 3 (10:54):
Are, and then you have to maybe adjust. Yeah, you're
you're gonna always have to adjudge. What I'm interested in is,
outside of Joe Burrow, because he's been very adamant that
he needs to play, what does the snap kind of
look like for the other starters, because you don't want
to leave him out there on an island without his guys.
I think it's interesting. But you mentioned t Higgins yesterday
because it was a little bit of concern because he
was getting stretched out, and you're like, oh, he's in

(11:16):
a lower body injury. I think it's fascinating because you
and I talked about what happens if he's able to
play seventeen. I think it's fascinating. We've heard and listen
to a lot of Well, they've changed up maybe the
routine for t Higgins the soft tissue injury, and what
he can do from a rehab standpoint, what he can
do from a training standpoint.

Speaker 2 (11:36):
And what that looks like.

Speaker 3 (11:38):
These days, I think are where you have to pay
attention because it gets so hot and when fatigue starts
to set in a little bit. You then maybe start
to worry does that affect their route? Does that affect
coming in and out of breaks? How do you manage
that from T Higgins? Because he's been a guy that's
been very susceptible to those soft tissue injuries. On a

(11:59):
day like this where it's so hot and like I
said that the fatigue starts to set in. Maybe you
compromise something coming out of a break. That's what you
got to watch out for. But ideally, whatever they changed
in the offseason is gonna work for T Higgins. You're
gonna have him for seventeen. Yeah, that's and one.

Speaker 2 (12:15):
You know it, the narrative changed dramatically. But when the
Bengals were not gonna bring T Higgins back, it was
in part at least because of the hesitancy over his injuries. Right,
He's a guy who just has dealt with a lot
of leg injuries, a lot of lower body injuries, and

(12:35):
last year just fed that. Now again, the you know,
obviously things changed because at number nine, things pivoted in
a completely different direction and they signed him. And I
think we're all on board with that. But the Bengals
as an organization had some hesitancy because of T Higgins
and his history of injuries.

Speaker 3 (12:53):
I wonder as well as we get into camp and
we talk about.

Speaker 2 (12:57):
Looking for a faster start.

Speaker 3 (12:59):
The previous camps that I've attended, usually you get into
about the third day and you start seeing the VET
days come out. Sure, I wonder if there's an emphasis
on less VET days to get more work done. And
if not, who's gonna who's gonna get.

Speaker 2 (13:12):
The first VET day? I'm gonna guess Orlando Brown.

Speaker 3 (13:15):
Okay, or probably not a bad game, but like.

Speaker 2 (13:18):
Who would be like candidates for VET days? Orlando Brown,
Ted Carris, j Hill, Logan Wilson, Logan Wilson. You know,
like Andrew Whitworth used to get VET days all the
time and we would kind of joke about it, like
especially during the season, he would look at the injury
report and on Wednesday he never practiced, right, but he
had been in the league at that point, you know,
eight or nine years, and you know clearly was one

(13:40):
of the best players on the team. How many guys
would would get afforded VET day right accommodations we mentioned
some of Orlando Brown, Ted Carris, Chase Higgins, Is Burrough,
gonna take a VET day. I don't think he does.
Think he does, that's just not his on the quarterback.
I'm not taking a vet now, you know, defensively, especially

(14:01):
now with Ritter breathing down his back. Defensively, I'll go
Logan Wilson. Yeah, and bj Hill's been in the league
for a while, Cam Tiller, Britt get a vet day. No,
he got bet. You can't get a vet day last benched,
That cannot happen.

Speaker 3 (14:16):
So nothing, none of the none of the current defensive
lineman or defensive ends. No, you need every rep you
can get. Yeah, so there are there are less vet
day Canada. I mean last year, Trey Hendricks and Von Bell.
I mean those guys are getting vet days. Gino Stone
get a vet day?

Speaker 2 (14:32):
No, if you get if you if you would get
asked to take a pay cut. No days. Now my
condition for me, I'll take a pay cut. My my
condition would be I'll take a pay cut, but I
never have to practice. Yeah, but no, Geno Stone doesn't
get a vet day.

Speaker 3 (14:45):
Yeah I won't. I'm interested who gets the first VET
day for the Bengals.

Speaker 2 (14:48):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (14:49):
And if there are less overall vet days in a
in a push to start the season fast.

Speaker 2 (14:55):
I think you deserve VET days more than most of
these guys.

Speaker 3 (14:57):
I'll take a VET day or for my vacation. Already
feels like it was two months ago.

Speaker 2 (15:02):
I want to take it one. Next door, it's fourteen
minutes after ten o'clock. We are broadcasting from Bengals training camp.
Tony and Mo a e door and window. Toni and
Mo Training Camp show. We are here together till twelve o'clock.
Since he three sixty at noon, I am back in
studio from three to six today we'll have walla wall
Bengals training camp coverage for you. Don't forget. We are

(15:22):
thirteen days away from the first preseason game Bengals and
Eagles in Philadelphia.

Speaker 3 (15:27):
Res move yet.

Speaker 2 (15:28):
The Reds have not traded for au Hainios Farez or
Stephen Quad.

Speaker 3 (15:32):
Has Messi been suspended yet for skipping the All Star Game.

Speaker 2 (15:35):
I don't know. Hopefully he does FC Cincinnati versus Messi. Yeah,
after cloppering the you know, man, maybe Messi saw Evander.
I don't want that smoke. FC Cincinnati on the road against.

Speaker 3 (15:48):
US intermamis that was running yesterday. Really I think so
you think he's think he's here to he looks disheveled.

Speaker 2 (15:56):
Well, had you spent all day running labs around these
practice field?

Speaker 3 (16:00):
Now they got him pushing this on assuming heavy machinery.

Speaker 2 (16:03):
That is a very large piece of machelle I wonderwood.
That's a predator to thirty five hundred inverter. Oh yeah,
we want to thank Oakley greens Toe five point three
toph We want to thank Airport Painting Body for sponsoring
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talk X factors when we come back on the Tony

(16:25):
and Moo Training Camp Show. Thanks to eighty Door and
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Speaker 4 (16:34):
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Speaker 2 (16:41):
This woman sounds like twenty minutes after ten o'clock. This
is ESPN fifteen thirty eighty Dorn Window, Tony Demo Football
Show broadcasting live from Bengals training camp. What we got
a we got kickoff? You're the practicing the kickoff right now,
in front of us. Tone Hevin McPherson dropping one right
in front of the goal line, and uh, even though

(17:02):
nobody ever returns a kick anymore, they're practicing.

Speaker 3 (17:06):
Practice. Unis look nice though, These things look sharp, they do.
I like the white Yeah, I like the all white.
Sure look is is McPherson actually kicking these or these
going through the jugs machine and they're not simulating.

Speaker 2 (17:20):
Money Money Mack is is kicking.

Speaker 3 (17:23):
The ball on watch he's gonna I think he's gonna
simulate a kick and they're gonna throw through that judge machine.

Speaker 2 (17:28):
Because I think he just kicked that last one though, because.

Speaker 3 (17:31):
Because you know what you want, you you want to
save his leg to make kicks.

Speaker 2 (17:35):
But don't you like, if you're gonna do this strategically,
doesn't the kicker have to practice ball placement?

Speaker 3 (17:39):
You would think so. You would think so, although this
is just a kick return drill because the kicking team
has those yellow caps on, gotcha?

Speaker 2 (17:50):
So okay. Jermaine Burton bringing one to.

Speaker 3 (17:52):
That looks like he's Yeah, it's him and McPherson in
the hall wide open. If we can get one to
open up like that, Money.

Speaker 2 (17:58):
Mack was the last line of defense there and Simmons
special Jermaine Burton, But I mean legitimately, Now, there's there's
something about that that we talk about Jermaine Burton working
his way into wide receiver. The pathway to that starts
with what he's doing right now, which is contributing on
special teams.

Speaker 3 (18:12):
I honestly, if you're looking at this current roster, who
is better on this roster for a return specialist? Charlie
Jones still yeah, But.

Speaker 2 (18:27):
You know it's like when they had Brandon Tate and
Adam Jones. And Brandon Tate was fine and he was reliable.
You know, Marvin Lewisy's always talking about, like the number
one thing we need is a part returner who can
catch the ball and ensure that our offense comes out
onto the field. But Adam Jones was the more electrifying guy.
And I don't know that that's the most fair comparison.

(18:48):
I feel like with Charlie Jones, you know what you got, Yeah.
I feel like with with Jermaine Burton, you don't. But
what you think you have is better than what Charlie
Jones pac Man Jones for.

Speaker 3 (18:58):
Jermaine's sake, I hope when you need a big return
in a big moment, you throw him back there.

Speaker 2 (19:03):
That's maybe that's what they would do with ad him.
But Adam Jones was also playing every snap on defense, right,
So the thinking then was, we can't have him returning
all the kicks because of the workload on defense. I
don't know that Jermaine Burton is going to have such
a heavy workload on offense right that he can't return kicks.

Speaker 3 (19:19):
He he to me though, is one of those guys
that if the ball gets in his hand, good things
can happen.

Speaker 2 (19:23):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (19:24):
Now, I think a lot of the problem last year
was how do you get the ball in his hands
based on a route knowledge and right coverage recognition and
things like that. If you're telling him, hey, get back here,
catch this ball and make people miss. He did it
at Alabama, he did it in the SEC really well.

Speaker 2 (19:39):
Did it at Georgia and at Georgia.

Speaker 3 (19:42):
Give him a chance to do it here more often
than not.

Speaker 2 (19:44):
Well, you know, we were gonna go through X factors
and you can't have that conversation without talking about him.
And look like the he's going to get an opportunity
starting on the seventh when they play Philadelphia he's gonna
get on the field and he will have a chance
in a game to change, to start to change the conversation.
And maybe you could argue he has started to change

(20:06):
it just a little bit, but none of it matters
if you can't do something against other teams. And so,
you know, you talk about things we're going to be
looking for. And I get accused sometimes of talking too
much about Jermaine Burna. He's a third round pick, right
like they they valued him enough to use a third
round pick on him. Last year was a waste last year,
even when he did things in preseason games, the story

(20:28):
was who he's doing it against. Because of his work habits,
he'll be on the field with a chance to do
something starting in thirteen days. Here's your shot, man, here's
your shot to prove that you deserve a larger role
on this team and you could be counted on.

Speaker 3 (20:45):
Yeah. When I think of when I think of X factors,
I don't think of the core group of players on
this team. I don't think of the stars. I think
of like, if this player exceeds expectations, it's going to
boot this team even more. Jermaine Burton is that if
Jermaine Burton exceeds expectations right and becomes a legitimate past

(21:08):
catching threat and a legitimate return threat, then then that
becomes an X factor. If you think of on the
defensive side of the ball, and we talked about Oron Burks.
You know, I don't know if people really know what
to think.

Speaker 2 (21:25):
Of Oron Burks.

Speaker 3 (21:26):
Well, it's interesting because in a small sample size in
the playoffs he was awesome.

Speaker 2 (21:30):
It's interesting with him. They sign him and then they
drabed Dimitrius Knight and immediately Demitrius Knight's the starter. Correct,
But you know that's okay. Oron Brooks was a backup
in Philadelphia and still you had a chance to play
a prominent role. Like if I'll say this, if Oron
Brooks is like the third linebacker and you don't need

(21:50):
to play him more, right, then Al Golden's defense is
taking off that.

Speaker 3 (21:54):
Yeah, right, If that's the case, then okay, things are
starting to happen here. Like beach Hill to me, is
always going to be an X factor on this team
because they were so bad against the run last year
and he flashed at times with an ability and we
see in the NFL all the time and it's the
Philadelphia Eagles model right now. They plug the middle. Yes,
you cannot do anything against the Eagles up the middle.

(22:16):
That makes you one dimension on the run game. And
they get so much push. And we've talked about pressure before, Yeah,
and not just always sacks. From a quarterback standpoint, I
would rather pressure come off the edge that I can
push up and get out, or I can escape outside.
If pressure is coming in your face, that affects your

(22:36):
drive into the throw, That affects your step, it affects
you're worried about your arm hidden against a helmet. You've
got to move right to left. Sacks come from those
edge spots more often than not, but quarterbacks usually feel
like they can navigate around that. Now, if you've got
edge pressure and you go to push up and get
out and there's pressure up the middle, that's where you're
in trouble. So the ability to generate pressure up the middle,

(23:00):
it's not just about Osai and Murphy and Shamar Stewart
and Trey Hendrickson. It's about those guys on the interior.
Can they get enough push not to register twelve and
a half sacks, yeah, but to make that quarterback comfortable
to maybe he can't drive into a throw that throws
Sales high. Gino Stone gets an interception on the back end.
That's that's how you become an X factor up front.

Speaker 2 (23:21):
We've seen it work here, DJ Reader, Y Garry Ogunjobi
bj Hill, Geno Ekins. And the perfect illustration of what
you're talking about is the Philadelphia Eagles most recent game,
because you and I talked about it the Monday after
when they beat the Chiefs in the Super Bowl. Yeah,
the story of that game was Patrick Mahomes takes the
snap and immediately in his face it not necessarily coming

(23:42):
from left to right. Yeah, pressure up the middle neutered
that Kansas City offense. So when we talk about X factors,
I'll give you one Shamar Stewart. Yeah, but I mean
you laugh. Yeah, if there's a resolution to this, and
I know I asked you, like, how much can you
miss before? Yeah, you know it's too much to make up.

(24:08):
It might not be likely. But let's say the light
bulb comes on and he goes, Okay, I got a sign.
He was the seventeenth overall pick. Yeah, he didn't get
a lot of sacks, that's obvious. He did apply a
lot of pressure. He was back there like he was
beating his man.

Speaker 3 (24:26):
Yeah, he lived in the backfield.

Speaker 2 (24:27):
He lived in the backfield. What if, like you can't
account for it now because he's not here, and when
he does get here, maybe he's missed too much time.
But if I'm doing X factor, which is something that
can go either way, like what if what if he
gets here and he's just marginally disruptive, that's better than

(24:48):
anything they had that wasn't Trey Hendrickson last year.

Speaker 3 (24:50):
Yeah, I don't know how it works, like with him
being away right now, does he have any communication with
the team at all?

Speaker 2 (24:57):
Because if no, he sent a message to his teammates,
I think I forget which media outlet it was. You know, hey,
I'm working out down here.

Speaker 3 (25:03):
But like so I wonder again because I mentioned at
the top, you start to get into the thick of
this now where a guys start to fall off because
of the install. If everything that has been installed starting
Tuesday when they when they really started to meet Wednesday, Thursday,
now Friday, four days of install, how much of that
has he got I know he has a playbook.

Speaker 2 (25:25):
But let me ask you this, all right, Yes, he's
got to learn the defense, But dude, there's the quarterback.
Go get correct.

Speaker 3 (25:29):
And that's why I think it's more of a if
it is him this year, it's a seven to ten
play package. Or you're not asking him to turn down
to loop, you're not asked to play line games. You're
asking him to drop into coverage. Hey, third and seven,
go in there and get the quarterback. Yeah, that's all
you need to do, right. What about because this was
once a guarantee, but a guy we've talked about. Can
Evan McPherson be the next factor? Sure he cause he

(25:51):
has been. Sure Kim he wasn't, but he has been
for this team and what he was able to do
to take off from I think a little stress on
the offense is a lot as opposed to if he's
not making kicks, the pressure that puts on a quarterback.
Like I talked about yesterday, third and six, you're on
the thirty eight yard line, McPherson's missed two. You're probably

(26:13):
trying to fit a ball into a tight window that
could go poorly. If Evans the Evan we think he is, well,
then you just you throw the ball away or you
take a check down for three yards and you go
kick the field goal.

Speaker 2 (26:26):
If so, I think the Bengals are going to go
eleven and six. Okay, the over unders ten and a half,
let's say they say it. If they go like twelve
and five or thirteen and four, those added victories will
be because of them Evan McPherson, because to me, that
means they will have won a game where offensively they're

(26:48):
just kind of stuck in the mud. But McPherson bangs
home four field goals, including two from fifty plus, and
they escape with a win, right the sort of kicks
he didn't make last year. If you're gonna have a
special season, look, yeah, we want the Bengals to win
every game forty two to ten. But if you're gonna
have a special season, you know, as somebody who played
on championship teams, there's certain games that you just have

(27:09):
to we have to grind it out, we have to
figure it out. Our punters got to win one for us,
or you know, a part of the team that typically
doesn't step off big. If they're gonna have a special season,
to me, you look at one or two of those
games ago. They won that one, and they won that
one because of special teams as a whole or because
of Evan mcpheerson. I think he's a big X factor.
And frankly, look, he was hurt last year, and to

(27:32):
a degree, you give him the benefit of the doubt.
But I think the conversation takes place pretty early. If
week one, you know, look, if he misses a fifty
eight yarder, Okay, cool, we're gonna give you another shot.
But if he is as inconsistent as he was last
year early in the season, I don't think it's gonna
be very long before we start talking about what.

Speaker 3 (27:52):
What's the conversation against Cleveland If he goes out for
his first kick of the year, forty seven yarder and
misses it. Competition correct, Yeah, Like, there's no more there's
no more leash, there's no more equity that you've built up,
There's no more let's just wait, he'll work this out.
You can't afford that, like it cost this team games
last year.

Speaker 2 (28:11):
If a Marnius Men's in the first game gives up
four sacks, what are we gonna say, right, you can't
play him right now? His backup is on the roster,
Evans is not. But like, I'm not treating the kicker
any differently.

Speaker 3 (28:22):
No, you have to operate in this season with urgency
because what happened at the end of last year. You
were one game away and there was a handful of
games that you could have won that you didn't. So
if the goal is a super Bowl and the easiest
way to the super Bowl is home field advantage easier,
you gotta win the AFC North, then Week one there

(28:42):
better be urgency. If something is not where it needs
to be, it's not let's just wait, give it a
game or two, they'll figure it out. You don't have
that luxury. All we spent so much time down the
stretch last year. Well, you don't want to play the
Bengals if you're in the playoffs, right, no one would
want to play this team, and then he make the playoffs.
They had opportunities. They shot themselves in the foot. You

(29:05):
don't get the luxury anymore to just wait it out
with certain players, go win now.

Speaker 2 (29:10):
I think there's a ton of pretty obvious X factors
in the secondary, But I'll make it about one guy,
and we've talked about him a lot already. It's Cam
Taylor Britt. I think there's a world where Cam Taylor
BRIT's a pro Bowl player. I think the raw ability
and the glimpses that we have seen from him would
suggest that's a possibility. It's also entirely possibly gets pnched.

(29:34):
I think he's a massive X factor. I think at
the secondary, like we talk about, like what if these
units are elite? If the secondary ends up being really, really,
really good, the main reason it happens is Cam Taylor
brit is awesome. Is that an overly simplified way of
looking at it. I mean, I'll stay in the secondary

(29:56):
any of them, right, dax Ale, Jordan battle Stone, I
mean one.

Speaker 3 (30:02):
It's I think a lot of people view the position
of least depth. There's so many unknowns at safety, and
there was glimpses as the season winded down from Genostone
that seems like the player you paid, he did play
well down the street, he did play well down the stretch.
Now what I think is interesting with that, and we
saw this on the first day of camp. There was

(30:24):
an audio clip of Genostone on a safety blitz timed
it up perfectly and Al Golden is just losing his
mind over it. Perfect love that that's what we need.
If a simplified system and Al Golden can allow Genostone
to play faster and that safety group have more confidence. Well,

(30:46):
then you're in a completely different conversation because it's been
such a a a position of conversation for much of
the offseason. And I mentioned this yesterday. I heard Solomon
Wilcox with Charlie Goldsmith. You know, pres sure is is
secondary's best friend.

Speaker 2 (31:03):
You.

Speaker 3 (31:03):
You could take sast Gardener right now and anyone else
in the league, and if the defensive line is not
making plays and getting to the quarterback, no one's going
to cover that long. So those two go handed.

Speaker 2 (31:12):
Him just really quick. There. It looks like they're running
fade routes right in front of us. This one fades.
This could be where we catch one, whether it's a
ball or a player in our lap. Jamar Chase, Jermaine
Burton just caught passes directly in front of us.

Speaker 3 (31:25):
Back shoulder Andre Joshivash on a dart from Joe Burrow.

Speaker 2 (31:30):
Where's uh, there's number four on the other side. Gotcha again?
Still not sure I've seen that. I'm still not sure
I've seen Now he's thrown right into our lab. I'm
still not sure. I've seen one of his throats, gritter
back corner, another completion touchdown to tap.

Speaker 3 (31:46):
Cole Burgess too easy. Look at that.

Speaker 2 (31:49):
There's there's another one that's unguardable for Shad Owens.

Speaker 3 (31:54):
I think Joe Burrow would have to play four quarters
in the first preseason game. He doesn't want to let
you don't want to let Desert see the field.

Speaker 2 (32:00):
The thing is like you might have to like not
play Joe, hide him so you can trade him, yeah,
or if not, Hi, Dez, that's the thing. You don't
want to. You don't want to.

Speaker 3 (32:09):
Here comes jam Chase again.

Speaker 2 (32:11):
You don't want the other NFL Des is not throwing
to Jamar Chase. For what it's worth, look at that.

Speaker 3 (32:14):
Look at that dime right in front of Mike Brown
and Dave Lapham.

Speaker 2 (32:21):
Gets the golf cart ride. Look at that.

Speaker 3 (32:23):
I don't know if it's a great time to be
going talking about out routes in the road.

Speaker 2 (32:28):
This is where if you're a guy like Des Rudder,
be very careful with the throw with with with Mike
Brown and Bengals Ring of Honor inductee Dave Lapham. You
see connection all right?

Speaker 1 (32:42):
Uh?

Speaker 2 (32:42):
In a bit we're gonna We're gonna run through the
AFC North and talk about some training camp storylines for
the Brown Steelers and Baltimore Ravens. But when we come back,
can we talk about we always talk about like who
won the day at camp? Who was the start? We're
gonna talk about yesterday's biggest loser, the loser of the
day at Bengals training camp. When we come like it's
twenty four minutes away from eleven o'clock. It's the eight

(33:03):
E Dorn Window, Tony and Mo Football Show on ESPN
fifteen thirty, Cincinnati Sports.

Speaker 4 (33:07):
Station, ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 2 (33:13):
We are live from Bengals Training Camp, a special edition
of the A E. Dooran Window, Tony and Mo Football Show.
We sell the best and service the rest. We are
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(33:36):
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Speaker 3 (33:49):
It's one thing to be able to come and broadcast
at training camp. It's another thing to be at training
camp and have action right in your lap.

Speaker 2 (33:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (33:56):
Like, over the course of the break, Chase Brown caught
a wheel route in the red zone and literally finished
under our tent. Said, hey guys, exchange pleasantries, moved on,
but the action is now right in front of us.
From a quarterback wide receiver standpoint, they call this drill mo.

Speaker 2 (34:15):
Routes on air, Okay, because there's no dB.

Speaker 3 (34:18):
What you don't do here is put the ball on
the ground. The ball cannot hit the ground on routes
verst air right, and if so, you've got bigger problems. Right,
No incompletions here, but this is again more get the play,
call in, get in and out of the huddle, make
sure you're lining up in the right spot. And then,
like we talked about the other day, this is for
Joe Burrow now to say, all right, I'm going through

(34:39):
my normal drop. Does this split match my drop? Does
a ten yard out match my three step? No, hitch,
I mean you are, You're going through all the intricacies,
and right here on this play, right here, Jermaine Burton
didn't even move or Andre Yoshwas didn't even move. So
that's what you're you're trying to iron out. You're trying

(35:00):
to say, Okay, what feels best for me right here
that I can get to in my drop, in my
read and iron out here and then go back and say, okay,
let's cut that. Let's add a three and a hitch
on the drop. Let's add no hitch, a cutch er
split down by two yards. I mean so many different intricacies,
but that's where you're trying to out iron out now

(35:20):
with routes on air.

Speaker 2 (35:22):
So this is happening right in front of us. If
you haven't been down here, there's two main practice fields
and the team is split between the two. So we
have right in front of us quarterbacks and wide receivers
off on the other field. You'll see linebackers. You'll see
some dbs down there, and that's the group right in
front of the fans, and the bleachers are pretty full.

(35:43):
You see a lot of people waving fans to cool off.
It is very hot here. We got some bridge folks,
We've got folks up on the bridge. Folks standing up
on the bridge watching the turnout again today is awesome.
I think more people here today than yesterday, which makes
sense because it's a Friday. I do have to address this.
I was reading on Bengals Talk dot com there the

(36:05):
recap of day two yesterday, and Jay Morrison writes about
how security had to remove a fan yesterday oh after
he yelled an obscenity following t higgins long touchdown against
DJ Turner, and Jay writes, Jay Morrison writes, the fan
yelled a captain obvious comment to the defense that it
shouldn't let receivers get behind them. The quote quote because

(36:27):
what happens when you do, You're effing toast. So other
fans in the area obviously took exception. There's a ton
of kids here. Apparently, according to Jay, this guy didn't
back down, and his rationale for his language was, Look,
these kids are gonna hear cussing everywhere they go. And
then the guy, apparently, according to Jay, challenged the responsible

(36:48):
adults to take it outside, at which point security intervened
and removed him. Yeah, that guy would be he is
training camp day two, the loser of the day.

Speaker 3 (36:58):
Yeah, our first one, our first loser of training camp.

Speaker 2 (37:01):
That to me, like, I love, we're set up. We
are sort of on the opposite end of the fans.
I wish I would have seen that a clown as
a general rule, as as somebody who can let the
exploit is fly when you got kids around, can you
be cool? Correct?

Speaker 3 (37:16):
That's the thing for me. If kids are present and
you're reasoning and rationale, is they're gonna hear that stuff anyway?

Speaker 2 (37:22):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (37:24):
Like this is this is set up?

Speaker 2 (37:26):
Also, does the defense need your coaching?

Speaker 3 (37:28):
The Bengals do a great job of making this accessible
for the fans. Oh yeah, and the way that is
and yesterday they were on the practice field closest to
the fans. Yeah, which is even better for those fans.
So it was good for the defense because that guy
could coach them up, come down here and just enjoy
the day. I tell you, what are we doing? That stuff?

Speaker 2 (37:48):
It just drives me absolutely insane. I assume he was
with somebody, like, what do you say to the guy
that you're with, Hey, gotta go? How do you get
kicked out of a training camp practice? Yeah? I guess
we know would be yesterday's loser of the day. I
like that. I hope we don't have to have a
loser of the day every day. No, he got Jeremy
Rowe off the hook.

Speaker 3 (38:09):
Well, trags got raw off the hook.

Speaker 2 (38:12):
They tracks as a loser. I tracks just dresses. You
know how he wants. Makes him happy.

Speaker 3 (38:16):
I'm gonna double down on it. I've yet to see
Row down here today.

Speaker 2 (38:20):
He's no word to be said. He's listening. I'm sure
he is.

Speaker 3 (38:24):
He's probably at the mall looking for uh say, shopping
for shoes.

Speaker 2 (38:29):
All right, uh, when we come back. Actually, we'll do
this at the top of the hour. We'll we touched
briefly on Monday on the the other teams in the
AFC North. I heard a hot take from Chris Canty
yesterday on ESPN Radio. He says the Steelers are going
to finish in last place, which I don't think is likely,
but I also don't think it's that implausible. We just

(38:50):
can't see the Browns. We'll see if the Browns have
a road map to have a season better than everybody expects,
and find out what the Ravens regular season kryptonite is
as well. We'll do that coming up at eleven o'clock.
It's the A E. Dorn Window, Tonyan Mode Training Camp Show.
As Jamar Chase catches another touchdown right in front of

(39:11):
us through ro out ESPN fifteen three, He's gonna make
the team ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati Sports.

Speaker 5 (39:17):
Station from the Any Weather, he Heating and Dared Tame Stom.

Speaker 2 (39:22):
Nine away from eleven o'clock, it's the eight E. Dorn Window,
Tony and Mo Football Show on ESPN fifteen. Yes, it
is broadcasting live from Bengals training camp. We are here
Tony and I till noon since E three to sixty
at twelve o'clock. I am on today at three five Tony.
We'll have live training camp reports at three forty five,
four forty five and uh in five forty four. What

(39:45):
do you like doing more the training camp reports or
the season preview reports? Oh, preview? Yeah, I think that's
a change in power. I think it's the little more
meat on the bone. We're doing a season preview.

Speaker 3 (39:57):
When now we have the Tony and Moto Camp show
going right into CINT three sixty. It's a little different
five in the afternoon for the because you don't get
the live camp update of practice happening in the background. Right,
it's more recapping. So give me the season preview reports. Uh,
first play off team is going to be a sack.

Speaker 2 (40:16):
Now, look at look at that stability, Joe.

Speaker 3 (40:19):
That's a I'm gonna I'm crediting Miles Murphy with a
sack on that play.

Speaker 2 (40:22):
First of all, the snap was terrible, terrible. That Ted
Karras snap was I mean he Joe looked like Matt
McClain catching a line drive at second base. It is
over his head.

Speaker 3 (40:32):
This was brought up yesterday because I think JJ. Did
you see JJ watch tweet yesterday?

Speaker 2 (40:35):
I did.

Speaker 3 (40:36):
Yeah, there's a lot to that because we don't know
specifically what every drill is, and normally the players don't,
but they pick up on it within like one or
two plays, right, Like, there are specific periods where it's
third and long. You're gonna see a lot more pressures.
There's gonna be third and short. As a fan, you're
just watching and you're not realizing what the situation is

(40:57):
on every single play, but it is. It's hard to tell.
Like what we just witnessed right here, a run play
without pads. How do you know what would have happened
on that play? You want to say it's blocked up. Well,
but look look to me like, well, I don't know
who's making a tackle, you know, if he's missing attack
like until you actually which is another point of training camp.
I think it'll be interesting. Do they ever tackle down here?

(41:19):
Years past, it's been no other teams still do. This
team is misstackles under Luanna Roumo. Does Al Golden want
to ever go live? And you could? You can control
that too, Hey, this this period is short yardage, but
it's live third and one, third and two, fourth and
one and uh and you can switch it that way.

Speaker 2 (41:36):
How do you ramp up the level of physicality and
camp and not tackle?

Speaker 3 (41:39):
Correct? You can't, right, I mean that's been one of
my thoughts that we've had for for a couple of years.

Speaker 2 (41:45):
Burton across the field, eludes a tackle, they blow the whistle.
He would have been tackled there. J I mean Burton
makes a play.

Speaker 3 (41:50):
You know, yesterday the first play of eleven on eleven's
Joe Burrow through a back shoulder fade to Jermaine Burton.
Today on the third play, he makes a point to
target Jermaine Burton, gaining his trust, perhaps gaining the trust
and if you're Joe Burrow. Let me see if I
can rely on this guy. Let me throw him more passes,
because you know who you can rely on, Jamar Chase

(42:10):
t Higgins. You know where they're gonna be. Give some
other guys some chances. So far, so good for Jamaine Burton.
I like four callers yesterday and since he three to
sixty asked about Jermaine burt Uh huh. I mean it's
a that's a topic that a lot of people are
wondering about coming into this camp.

Speaker 2 (42:26):
Myself among them, like, how could again, like they they
when they drafted him. Okay, maybe they hadn't totally ruled
out that T Higgins was gonna come back, but their
plan with t Higgins was he's not a part of
our future. I know people don't like to hear that,

(42:46):
but that was their plan. So they took a wide
receiver in the third round, maybe not believing that in
year two he would fully replace t higgins production. But
you've got to think at least part of the thinking
was if, and maybe even back then, when T Higgins
isn't on the team anymore, we're gonna be fine because
we've drafted this kid who played two SEC schools.

Speaker 3 (43:07):
Could you make the same argument on why they drafted
Miles Murphy. Yeah, whether that was Trey Henderson or Sam.

Speaker 2 (43:13):
Hubbard, of course.

Speaker 3 (43:13):
Yeah, So you have two players on each side of
the ball, or one player on each side of the
ball that was drafted to replace a current member of
this team.

Speaker 2 (43:22):
Well, and not replace him this year. You got to
not replace him this year because Trey is under contract.
But like that speaks to what they've been unfortunately so
bad at in recent years.

Speaker 3 (43:32):
But would this conversation with Trey Henderson be easier If
Miles Murphy last year was amazing, they.

Speaker 2 (43:36):
May have traded him right, Like they may have said,
all right, Trey, we're gonna move you. Yeah, I mean
that that might have actually happened. But it speaks to
the problem that has snowballed in recent years. You know,
we've all talked about this. The problem isn't that they
let Jesse Bates go. The problem is that the plan
to replace him didn't work. Go back ten years or

(43:57):
nine years. The problem isn't that they let Andrew Whitworth go.
It's that the plan to replace Andrew Whitworth didn't work.
It's not it's not letting a player get away, it's
either not having a plan or not having your plan
work to replace them. They've had that issue with years.
By the way, if you remember midway through last season,
what was all anybody was talking about? And let Joe

(44:19):
Mixon go? And then when Chase Brown started to get
used and was productive, it was like, Okay, they have
replaced Joe Mixon and that's you know, Chase was already
on the team. I get it. And Joe had a
productive season with the Texans, played great in the playoffs.
But it's good players are going to leave. Good players
are going to get old. Good players are going to
decide I want to play somewhere else. Good players are

(44:41):
going to get into contract issues. Good players are are
going to be, you know, salary cap cut fodder. Like
you're going to lose good players. You have to you
don't have to bat a thousand, but you got to
be better than they have. And so t Higgins became
more of a need. Why we got no one to
replace him? Yeah, that's partially on Jermaine Burton, Trey Hendrickson.

Speaker 3 (45:03):
They probably why Trey Hendrickson feels that he has power here.

Speaker 2 (45:06):
Right, You you don't have a plan to replace me
like Miles Murphy, good luck want to replace me with
Shamar Stewart, cool sac and a half last year. That
over the course of the next five, six, seven years
has to change. They we you would love it if
every good player stayed. It's just not the reality of
life in the NFL. Right, they have to And again

(45:28):
like the Dax Hill thing. By now, Dax Hill is
supposed to be a good starting caliber safety. Now we're
still trying to figure out what position he could play. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (45:36):
Uh, Toz Brooks with the twos here has had a
very successful team period. He's got two passes, just had
a nice run up the middle. There, that's a player.
We talked about the running back room, huh a little
bit more and how that's going to pay in itself out.
So I think overall this has been a successful offensive
team period.

Speaker 2 (45:52):
Right.

Speaker 3 (45:52):
We did see a mi Keasicki drop cut right in
the middle of his Yeah, you've got to get no
a fan back here immediately. You just can't have that.

Speaker 2 (46:01):
Would you put Mike Kisiki under the heading under the
category of X factor.

Speaker 3 (46:07):
I don't know, because I think you I think we
already know.

Speaker 2 (46:10):
Kind of know what the year looks, what the.

Speaker 3 (46:11):
Year looks like like. I yeah, you could give me
one of the cards. Sure, as an X factor because
there's so many questions there. Wow, here's an X factor
right here. The lowering us waters Kevin Barnett not his
best dress day of training camp. I think it looks fine,
but he has at least given us waters.

Speaker 2 (46:28):
He sort of looks like when your dad goes to
work on casual Friday, right, Yeah, but it's not quite
casual enough.

Speaker 3 (46:36):
Yeah, gue, who I hope I'm out At one point
in my life when I can wear clothes that tight,
you can still keep my body in shape?

Speaker 2 (46:44):
God knows I can. All right, let's talk about the
AFC North when we come back. A Door and Window
Tony and Mo Football Show from Bengals Training Camp on
ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station nationally know locally.

Speaker 1 (46:56):
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(47:17):
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D three powered number two A E. Dorn Window Tony
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all these many years. We got some red zone happening
right in front of us, which is pretty awesome. Joe

(47:52):
Burrow at the controls that particular play, that completion to
Mikasiki didn't work.

Speaker 3 (48:00):
Couple of yards, got a couple of yards. You don't
have to hit hole runs in the red zone. What
if it's third down, what if it's fourth down?

Speaker 2 (48:05):
Second?

Speaker 3 (48:05):
We got the down in distance markers right here.

Speaker 2 (48:07):
And see that? Okay, very good? All right? So red
zone drill happening right in front of us. Lucas Patrick,
our buddy Austin Elmore informs us, Austin's and Ken what
he's telling us. What's happening a Bengals training camp. Lucas
Patrick walked off with a trainer. Is that what he
wasn't carted off, walked off with the trainers.

Speaker 3 (48:24):
Austin's got a vested interest in Lucas Patrick and some
of the other guards.

Speaker 2 (48:28):
You know, I was just made aware of this. Can
you outline this quickly for me?

Speaker 3 (48:31):
Yeah. So we talked earlier in the offseason and said,
if if Cody Ford and Cordell Volson are your starting guards,
I think you're gonna be in trouble. And Austin was
very adamant that they're not going to be the starting
guards right, that they will do enough and they will
not be starting Game one.

Speaker 2 (48:51):
I agree with Austin.

Speaker 3 (48:52):
I am a huge fan of the Dakory Deck down
in Florida, and Austin said on air, if Cody Ford
and Kodo Volson are starting Week one against Cleveland, I
will fly down and watch the game at the Docker.

Speaker 2 (49:06):
That's the greatest punishment of all time. It's I've lost
a lot of bets in my life. I wish the
payoff was God, I gotta go to Florida and sit
at the Dakree Deck and watch football.

Speaker 3 (49:14):
But it's a it's o g It's in in the
morning out at night, so you don't get to enjoy
get the overnight. You don't get the overnight.

Speaker 2 (49:21):
That's Austin needs somebody to negotiate on his behalf.

Speaker 3 (49:25):
He came up with it. He was he was that confident.

Speaker 2 (49:28):
What happened? What do you have to do if anybody
else starts at guard? That's that was never you have
to go to the Dakory Deeck deal. Can I go
with like go and Austin no matter.

Speaker 3 (49:37):
Who who loses? Yes, I get to go with you man.
All right.

Speaker 2 (49:41):
So we've got action unfolding right in front of us.
There's a Joe Burrow to T Higgins in the back
of the end zone. That's six.

Speaker 3 (49:48):
That ball went over four different defenders heads in the
red zone. Unbelievable touch.

Speaker 2 (49:54):
He's pretty good. He's pretty good. Let's uh, we we
spend a little bit of time on my We had
a lot going on, and we sort of just quickly
brushed over the other AFC North teams. Let's be going
with the Steelers, who I think most of observers, because
of the Aaron Rodgers situation and because of their playoff drought,
would say, are the most interesting of the four teams.

(50:15):
Take your rooting allegiances away. I heard Chris Canty on
ESPN Radio yesterday predict that the Steelers are going to
finish on last place. My guess is that's not gonna happen.
My take on the Steelers is this, they are going
to have their moments this year, which they did last season. Sure,
they have a good defense, they have an expensive defense.

(50:36):
They have an aging veteran roster, and they have Aaron Rodgers.

Speaker 3 (50:39):
With their roster in aging. Is Jalen Ramsey an X
factor for you? Yeah, yeah, yeah, big time kind of something.
We're not talking a ton about j wat deal got done.
They do have Jalen Ramsey in the secondary.

Speaker 1 (50:50):
Sure.

Speaker 2 (50:51):
So my take on the Steelers is, like last year,
they were a playoff team. I don't think anybody looked
at them as a legitimate threat to win the AFC. Yeah,
they have their moments. They're tough to play week in
and week out. I think they're they're not in that
upper tier. I think Aaron Rodgers, even at his age,

(51:12):
is gonna have his moments where you go, yep, that's
Aaron Rodgers. I don't think you view him as one
of the absolute uppercross quarterbacks in the NFL. I think
that adds up to a Steelers team that wins nine
games ten games might make the postseasons.

Speaker 3 (51:31):
Are nine and a half. Steelers are eight and a half.

Speaker 2 (51:33):
In the winter. I'm still struck by Pittsburgh last year
in the postseason, how they just got beat up. Baltimore
lined up and did to the Steelers. With the Steelers
have done to everybody else for decades, I'm gonna guess
they're not in last place. That said, I've watched a
lot of great quarterbacks in their final season where they

(51:53):
fall off the cliff the cliff quickly. They haven't won
a postseason game in forever. It is an older roster,
and I think if there's a world where yes, the
Steelers have more losses than wins for the first time
in the Tomlin era.

Speaker 3 (52:06):
I just I think DK Metcalf is an upgrade for them.
I think with what Russell Wilson was although the way
he played against.

Speaker 2 (52:14):
The Bengals last year of his last hurrah.

Speaker 3 (52:18):
Yeah, I'm still not writing them off just yet because
they have good tight end play which Aaron Rodgers can utilize.
They have a legitimate threat in DK Metcalf. What does
the run game look like because at this point in
your career. If you're Rogers, you need an effective run
game because you're relying so much on.

Speaker 2 (52:38):
And they have a lot of question and.

Speaker 3 (52:40):
They still a really good defense, and so I know,
I I don't think they're a last place team. I think,
but I do think like when when you're viewing Pittsburgh,
if you're trying to get where you're trying to get
for the Bengals, then it's not a year where you
trip up against Pittsburgh. If you're a contender, you beat
them twice. Yes, yes, right like that. That's that's how

(53:03):
I pay. Don't let them come into your building and
score forty five on correct By the way, Jermaine Barton
just kind of touchdown pass from Jake Browning. The Jermaine
Burton camp continues.

Speaker 2 (53:14):
So far, one might argue, perhaps in contention for winner
of the day, we're still looking for a loser of
the day.

Speaker 3 (53:19):
Camper of the day, Camper of the day. That's a
captain vote thing. Captains usually vote on winner and loser
of the day.

Speaker 2 (53:26):
It sure is. I'm gonna guess the Steelers are a
nine to ten win team. I'm gonna guess they extend
the drought. Of not winning a postseason game, which goes
back to January of twenty seventeen.

Speaker 3 (53:36):
And then what right, because it feels like they've gone
more all in.

Speaker 2 (53:41):
Well, then what with Aaron Rodgers like that? Then what
with their quarterback situation? Like they're not going to be
so awful that they're drafting in the top five. So
you know that that is a that is a franchise
Ben Roethlisberger. They held on to him too long or
he overstayed his welcome. They've tried other dudes, They've tried
the Russell winner of the day, remain Burton right in
the back of the end.

Speaker 3 (54:01):
No one can guard him.

Speaker 2 (54:02):
No, right now, nobody is. But I think what's interesting
is like them long term is the real world where
the playoff drout continues and the organization says, Mike, thanks,
you've been awesome. You're gonna be in camp one day,
but new voices needed. And then what did they do
at quarterback? Well?

Speaker 3 (54:20):
Will Howard currently at campus thirteen to fifteen, six touchdowns
passing in one rushing. Are we doing this, maybe Will Howard?
We're keeping training camps. Maybe Will Howe. I was just
sent that by a Pittsburgh Steeler fan.

Speaker 2 (54:31):
Are we like, nobody here is doing that? Right? Nobody
here is.

Speaker 3 (54:34):
Document I'm gonna document Burrow to Chase right here, look
at this Burrow Chase to Chase seven on seven Gold.

Speaker 2 (54:43):
Breaks a couple of tackles.

Speaker 3 (54:45):
Now, in years past, there have been folks in the
media that document every pass, every complete here.

Speaker 2 (54:51):
Yes, are they still here? Are they still on this beat? Yes?
They would.

Speaker 3 (54:57):
They would go back and forth at the end of
the day and Tanne, what'd you have Joe today? And
I was like, Wow, what are we doing it?

Speaker 2 (55:03):
Yeah? And now I'm the same guy that was tracking
the des River's completions.

Speaker 3 (55:08):
Well, that's easy because physically we haven't seen like, we
don't know that he's twenty eight for twenty nine, right,
We just know we've seen one ball hit the ground
and that was a pass interfare.

Speaker 2 (55:15):
Come on over here, that's that's chucked in the double
coverage and the ball goes in and out of the
hands of t Higgins.

Speaker 3 (55:22):
That was as close to getting a ball.

Speaker 2 (55:23):
Now that that young man right there got a ball,
he can't keep it.

Speaker 3 (55:27):
That's a good question.

Speaker 2 (55:28):
Why can't that kid in the Jamar chaster? Is he
just it went past the rope.

Speaker 3 (55:33):
If a ball comes to me without warm up, are
you flinging it? I'm flinging the thing.

Speaker 2 (55:39):
I've never wanted to see anything more. I take major
issue with what just happened here. Yeah, that kid should
be allowed. That's your ball. There's a rope that divides
where fans can stand versus you know, where the players are.
That ball crossed the rope. That kid picked it up.
That young man should be allowed to keep that football. Yeah,
it's not like he jumped the rope to get it.

(56:00):
He should be allowed to keep that football. The Cleveland Browns,
they stink. Arch Manning quarterback of the Browns in twenty
twenty six.

Speaker 3 (56:09):
That's what they're going for right now. Again, they do
still possess. I liked that they take that they took
Mason Graham.

Speaker 2 (56:15):
I think they had if you remove the quarterbacks, eea
a good draft. I think that a good draft.

Speaker 3 (56:21):
I think their defense is still ridiculously scary, and that
that to me, is what makes Week one nerve wracking.
Is their defense.

Speaker 2 (56:29):
I think Kevin Stefanski is a good coach. Miles Garrett's
all world. They have good pieces on defense.

Speaker 3 (56:36):
I you know, I don't know how they score points consistently.

Speaker 2 (56:39):
Dylan Gabriel, Kenny Pickett, Joe Flaccoshandora Sanders don't get a
quarter each get a quarter. I don't think either of
those guys is going to be the starting quarterback of
the Browns in twenty twenty six.

Speaker 3 (56:49):
We might be watching the starting quarterback of the Browns
in twenty twenty six right now, by the way we
keep our updates going, Jamar Chase just abused Cam Taylor
Brett on an end own fade.

Speaker 2 (57:00):
It's gonna do that to a lot of people.

Speaker 3 (57:02):
Are you a fan of the colored advisors, that guys
who are doing training camp. Yeah, I think they look
If I can go back and do it again, I'd
wear a colored advisor. I think they look cool. Who
does good job? Though it away? Lived to see another play.

Speaker 2 (57:16):
He threw that into the Hospitality ten. Yeah, a lot
of flag footballers here today completed it. Yeah, there's a
lot of young ladies who played flag football in the
Hospitality ten today. Dez just tried to complete a pass
to one of them.

Speaker 3 (57:27):
Yeah, threw it away, Live to see the next play.
Love that train of thought from a Quarterbackers turned the
ball over a little bit in the NFL.

Speaker 2 (57:33):
That was the That was the pass that he missed
to Alec Peers and the cotton ball that would have
changed the dynamics of that game.

Speaker 3 (57:40):
If not if if that happens, U see beats Georgia.

Speaker 2 (57:43):
So the the Browns are gonna finish what three wins?

Speaker 3 (57:49):
Four four and a half as they're posted total, I
think that, I think that the end of the worst
team in.

Speaker 2 (57:53):
Football this year, and they're picking number one. Arch Mann.

Speaker 3 (57:55):
Yep.

Speaker 2 (57:56):
What's the Baltimore Ravens regular season kryptonite? I don't know
now I know what it is when they played the
Bengals because Cincinnati's defense, you said yesterday embarrassed Baltimore's. Cincinnati's
offense embarrass Baltimore's defense last year, And I think that's true.
But I don't know where the true weakness on that team.

Speaker 3 (58:14):
I look at Baltimore and I don't know if people
real Buffalo gets a lot of headlines, Kansas City gets
a lot of headlines right now, DraftKings. The Baltimore Ravens
are the favorite to come out of the AFC, and
how could you not? Yeah, like their glaring weakness last
year was their defense. Malachi Starks, Jaya Alexander, they drafted

(58:35):
Mike Green like their defense if they get the rookie
production is terrifying the potential their offense with Derrek Henry
and Lamar Jackson, those tight ends, Zay Flowers, who career
really took off when he fired his first agent and
got to a second agent. The only question that you

(58:56):
can have if you're the Ravens, is is Lamar ever
going to take that next step? He's great, He's so good,
you know what if but if it comes down to
a drive Mark Andrews.

Speaker 2 (59:07):
But if Mark Andrews catches that too, direconversion. But because
the story of that game is that Lamar delivered it.
But because he didn't, you still ask the question. I
don't know that I do, though, man, like he's a
great player. He is. He has proved so much, improved
so much as a passer. He doesn't throw picks and look, man,
I am a Bengals fan. I felt for Lamar Jackson

(59:30):
in the aftermath of that game in Buffalo, and I
felt for Mark Andrews too. But I felt for Lamar
Jackson because in the moment that everybody has been waiting
for that kind of situation, especially on the road in
the Elements trip to the AFC Championship game. On the line,
he delivered, he did his job, and Mark Andrews drops
a pass. So if if that ball, if Mark Andrews

(59:51):
catches that pass. To this day, we're talking about how
Lamar came up big in the clutch, even if they
lose the next game. Should we not say that because
Lamar because the Mark Andrews dropped that two point in version?

Speaker 3 (01:00:00):
How how do you how do you view the Bengals
matching up with the Ravens this year?

Speaker 2 (01:00:06):
Baltimore's better?

Speaker 3 (01:00:07):
Yeah? Like, if I go position by position like quarterback Bengals,
wide receiver Bengals. Where else is offensive line, no defensive line,
no linebacker, no ro Kwan Smith is still there?

Speaker 2 (01:00:24):
Safety, no corner, no hell we have the Ravens old
safety running back. Uh No. But here's the thing. I
mean running it happens with the running backs, right, Eventually
he's got to fall off. They fall off the cliff.
Chase Brown is ascending. I'll go running backs, okay, but hey,
and number one, I like the Bengals running back room.
I like thee but Derek Henry's awesome but that style

(01:00:46):
of runner like running backs age quickly. He's been in
this league, a lot of wear and tear, a lot
of contact like he's It would be unsurprising if Derek
Henry ran for sixteen hundred yards and had a great year.
It would be unsurprising if he lost at least half
a step.

Speaker 3 (01:01:01):
It's the game you go into among any other and say, Okay, Joe,
Jamar and t have to carry him. They've got to
be great. And they've done that before and it hasn't
been enough before. But that's the game. Like we alluded
to yesterday talking about the Bengals defense, the Ravens is
the type of game you don't have to shut them out.

Speaker 2 (01:01:19):
Can you get one or.

Speaker 3 (01:01:20):
Two stops in the second half and get the ball
back to Burrow? Right, because they couldn't do it last year.

Speaker 2 (01:01:25):
You gotta split with them.

Speaker 3 (01:01:27):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, I mean he split with them.
I mean, if you can go five and one in
the AFC North.

Speaker 2 (01:01:33):
If you won any hope of winning the division, you
maybe don't have to win both, but but you you've
got to split with them. Look, they lost both games
last year, they lost both games two years ago. Yeah, right,
Like that that second game of the season in twenty
twenty three was a heartbreaker. If they win that game,
they're a playoff team, even with Jake Browning's quarterback. Ye,

(01:01:55):
so both games were for the taking last year. The
game here two years ago was there for the taking.

Speaker 3 (01:02:05):
Yeah, you got to kick the door in.

Speaker 2 (01:02:06):
You got to kick the door in, and you've got
to take advantage when Joe Burrow cooks that that.

Speaker 3 (01:02:10):
Defense, which he has done, and.

Speaker 2 (01:02:13):
You gotta split with the if you're pushed the Ravens
to make moves that they made in the offseason, if
you're gonna win the division, you cannot lose to the
Ravens twice, which they have each of the last two years.

Speaker 3 (01:02:21):
That's that's the thing to me, Like I view that
other teams made specific moves with the Bengals in mind.
This year, the Ravens made a draft and a free
agent signing of Jia Alexander with the Bengals in mind.
The Pittsburgh Steelers went out and got Jalen Ramsey, probably
with the Bengals in mind, sure of having to play

(01:02:41):
that team two times a year. So if you reverse that,
did the Bengals make enough corresponding moves to help themselves
in the AFC North, Well.

Speaker 2 (01:02:51):
What did they do? What did the Bengals do this offseason?
Make it about the Ravens, the team they're chasing.

Speaker 3 (01:02:55):
They improve their run defense, Okay, on paper, on paper,
and t J. S Leeton, I think he's gould pick up.
They improve the run defense. I don't know. I don't
know where else.

Speaker 2 (01:03:05):
I mean, they the secondary may be improved. They didn't
add to it from outside. Yeah that's a fact. Yeah
that's got a change. But yeah, I mean, Director Jamar Stewart,
if you were to put if you were to put
an amount of money that matters to you on who
wins the AFC North, you still have to lean Baltimore.

(01:03:25):
I think you have to do it with the great right,
I think, and I I think the predicted order of
finish is what everybody's gonna predict. I think most are
gonna go Baltimore, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Cleveland one through four.

Speaker 3 (01:03:37):
Is there a team in the AFC that takes the
like Washington Commander's leap that no one's really talking. We
talked about Kansas City, We talk about Cincinnati and Baltimore.
We talked about the Buffalo Bills like it.

Speaker 2 (01:03:53):
Is it Denver? Denver was a playoff team last year?

Speaker 3 (01:03:56):
Is it the Chargers? Year two with Harball?

Speaker 2 (01:03:57):
Everybody see, everybody's gonna say that Argers.

Speaker 3 (01:04:00):
And look, you know no one's talking about is Jacksonville
Trevor Lawrence. It is still a good quarter Like it's Jacksonville,
a team that people are well, what's that bad division?

Speaker 2 (01:04:10):
What's interesting is a year ago at this time, everybody
was talking about Houston.

Speaker 3 (01:04:14):
Yeah, they've taken a major step back.

Speaker 2 (01:04:16):
It feels like, yeah, and nobody's discussing them right now.
I think everybody is still waiting for Justin Herbert. Now
with year two Jim Harball, waiting for Justin Justin Herbert
to truly join the the the group of upper tier quarterbacks.

Speaker 3 (01:04:33):
I like what New England did in the season.

Speaker 2 (01:04:35):
They take the AFC by storm, you know, the team
that I think is really fascinating because I think it
could be an absolute train wreck or they could be
really dangerous.

Speaker 3 (01:04:42):
Miami, Yeah, it's a weird hear for McDaniel too, like that.

Speaker 2 (01:04:47):
That could just devolve and be one of the league's
bigger dumpster fires. That's still a pretty talented team.

Speaker 3 (01:04:53):
Yeah, right, I agree. I think Denver's fascinating great defense.
Can bone next do enough? Like that's the year two quarterback?
Uh huh ascension that you're looking for, right, you know?
I mean that's just solid last year, but like year
two of C. J. Stroud didn't have as much no
fire as year one.

Speaker 2 (01:05:14):
No. No, I mean that the Texans won a playoff
game last year, but they were the team that is
at this time a year ago. But he was really
talking about I don't think as many people are right now. Raiders.

Speaker 3 (01:05:29):
No, Raiders did just move on from Christian Wilkins and
did not pay him, which is interesting when you look
at the Raiders.

Speaker 2 (01:05:35):
No, but like the Genostone Pete Carroll thing had some
magic in Seattle. It's an extraordinarily tough division. Yeah, but
Kansas City.

Speaker 3 (01:05:48):
As long as long as it's Mahome still and it's
Andy Reid, I have a hard time taking it away
from him.

Speaker 2 (01:05:52):
There's fun betting action on the Chiefs not making the postseason. Right. Look,
let's be honest. They get a ton of credit for
going as far as they did last year despite often
barely looking the part. Does that catch up to him
this season or do they turn into the Kansas City

(01:06:14):
Chiefs again.

Speaker 3 (01:06:15):
I mean they start Chargers, Eagles, Giants, Ravens, uh huh.
Then they get a road trip to Jacksonville, and then
you play the Lions, Raiders, Commanders, Bills, and Broncos. I
mean that's a dangerous, dangerous schedule.

Speaker 2 (01:06:29):
So I think we would agree in this Kansas City run,
where they've made five Super Bowls in six years, I
think this is the most difficult the AFC West has been. Yeah. Right,
they walked to tight rope the entire season last year.
Buffalo is still really good, Baltimore is still really good.

(01:06:50):
Joe Burrow is still really good. They don't play the
Bengals and Chiefs don't play in the regular season this year.
You don't bet against Mahomes. There are seven players spots.
Logic would dictate mathematically they're likely to get one. But
I do think there's a world where it's like all
the stuff we started to see last year that they

(01:07:10):
overcame the chinks in the en, they don't this year.
And like year to year, this happens all the time.
We always talk about like how good you have to
be in close games. They won every close game last year.
One year to the next. That often doesn't carry over.

Speaker 3 (01:07:21):
Yeah, water finds its level. Oh, people say well done.
Which we're about to kick off? Which water would find us?

Speaker 2 (01:07:28):
It's twenty three minutes after eleven o'clock Adorn Window, Tony
and Mo Training Camp Show from Bengals Training Camp on
ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station. Now your chance to.

Speaker 4 (01:07:39):
Win a thousand dollars and our ESPN fifteen thirty Orange
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Speaker 2 (01:07:51):
We are Alive from Bengals Training Camp a special edition
of the Tonyan Moe Training Camp Show thanks to Adorn Window.
Also thanks to five one three five one three t
p H. Also thanks to Oakley Greens. We are broadcasting
from the Airport Paint and Body Broadcast Area on the
Ray Saint Clair Roofing Hotline. Bengals Training Camp, Day three.

(01:08:15):
It feels like it feels like we're inching toward the
finish line. Although yesterday's practice, yesterday's practice went like a
minute or two past twelve o'clock, a bit if a
marathon work.

Speaker 3 (01:08:28):
Yeah, and it feels like, I mean, by the way
they're coming on the field here. It looks like we're
at least going to get another team period. Okay for
these guys in front of us, right here in front
of us would be fantastic. I'm looking right now because
the offensive line is walking out ahead of us. I
don't see Lucas Patrick with the offensive line right now.
That would be something to keep an eye on, especially

(01:08:51):
if you're Austin and you're looking at who's gonna start
Week one at the offensive line. But we haven't really
and it's hard.

Speaker 2 (01:08:57):
He is he is not out there.

Speaker 3 (01:08:59):
It's hard because you don't really get to see the trenches,
especially until you go live, Like, how can you really
judge what Dylan Fairchild's doing right now?

Speaker 2 (01:09:07):
Is that possible? That's a great question. I mean, I
you know, it's when I think of and I said
this to you, I think yesterday, when when I think
of all the years you've been coming down here to
do training camp reports, what I think of, more than
anything were the assessments of trench play ones versus ones

(01:09:28):
on the D line versus offensive line, and how often
the play of the offensive line in camp ended up
foreshadowing the play that we would see from that group
once once the games actually begin. Look, Dylan Fairchild was
drafted to be the starting guard. He was not drafted
for this to be a red shirt year. If he
is not starting, something has gone wrong. Now you'll credit

(01:09:49):
whoever beats him out. But on draft night, you know,
you and I were talking to the monday after the
draft on on Draft night close we almost got up
all that a ball broken up on a throw to
t Higgins. On draft night, the idea was, Dylan Fairchild's
going to be a starting guard.

Speaker 3 (01:10:08):
Yes, what's what he was drafted for.

Speaker 2 (01:10:10):
What gets in the way of that happening beyond you know,
an injury something like.

Speaker 3 (01:10:13):
That, him not performing the way they hoped he would
him not. I feel like it would have to be
a huge, huge letdown if he doesn't win the starting job.
I feel like he's going to be given every opportunity.
If not, then he's either not the player you hoped
you draft drafted or he's not ready yet based on
the understanding of the offense and what he needs to

(01:10:35):
be doing. Either way I think would be a disaster
for this offense. I just if you draft a guy
in the third round at a position of extreme need,
he needs to fill that void.

Speaker 2 (01:10:45):
From like an SEC's cool is not North Dakoast.

Speaker 3 (01:10:48):
By the way, there are videos of Lucas Patrick limping
off the field. Our guy James Orpeen said they were
looking at his right calf. Okay, but he didn't get
caught it off.

Speaker 2 (01:10:56):
He walked off. He walked off. Yes, okay. Well hopefully
hopefully it's just a cramp for Lucas. Yes, hopefully that's okay.
And it does, I guess, disqualify him from being the
camper of the day.

Speaker 3 (01:11:09):
You have an early favorite not to go to DEAs,
but I don't want to.

Speaker 2 (01:11:13):
It can't be him every day. It could be Yeah,
I mean, if you win a championship one year doesn't
mean he can't win it the next. True, I'm gonna
say Jermaine Burton.

Speaker 3 (01:11:22):
He's crushed it today.

Speaker 2 (01:11:23):
He's caught every ball that I have seen. He's run
a variety of routes. You know, he's lining up right now,
and you know, we'll we'll, we'll see what happens here.
But I'm gonna say Jermaine Burton because you don't want
to make too much out of a training camp practice.
But based on what I've seen, I've seen a guy
who has taken a few steps to earn the trust
of Joe Burrow, which he didn't obviously have last year.

(01:11:45):
Candidate for Loser of the.

Speaker 3 (01:11:46):
Day, Oh, I don't have one yet. Okay, I don't
have one yet. I haven't seen Jeremy Rowan all to day.

Speaker 2 (01:11:57):
After yesterday, no showed a little bit. You know, we
always talking about like how I got get to bounce back.
I got Jeremy hasn't bounced back today.

Speaker 3 (01:12:03):
Loser of the Day is the decision that if the
ball goes out of the roped area, that you have
to give it back.

Speaker 2 (01:12:10):
I mean, how much is a football call?

Speaker 3 (01:12:11):
I think I think that that should be a rule. Now,
if you were to to leap.

Speaker 2 (01:12:19):
Over the rope and go grab the football, you get
kicked out. You get kicked out.

Speaker 3 (01:12:22):
If that ball leaves the roped area and goes to
a young fan, that should be that young fans ball
to key.

Speaker 2 (01:12:30):
How much does a football cost?

Speaker 3 (01:12:31):
Sixty bucks? Seventy bucks?

Speaker 2 (01:12:33):
An NFL ball cost that much?

Speaker 3 (01:12:35):
The duke? The duke is one hundred bucks the NFL.

Speaker 2 (01:12:38):
Do you think they got the NFL's latest media deal,
I think all Told was worth thirteen billion dollars. It
was reported this week the Bengals got like four hundred
and fifty million dollars in revenue sharing. You think they
can't afford one or two straight footballs to end up
an MSLF. How many during the course of camp? Would
that be max? Five?

Speaker 3 (01:12:57):
And that would be max that a ball goes out.

Speaker 2 (01:12:59):
The course, I'll say ten. I mean, well, there's only
eight public practices, right, I think there's only five more
after today. There's a couple that are closed the season
ticket holders. But no, I'll say, I'll say one a day,
one ball a day. You can't afford one football. And
again it's worth mentioning. It's not like, you know, somebody
jumps the rope, climbs out, knocks somebody out of the way.

(01:13:21):
That football literally rolled to that kid and he picked
it up on the other side of the rope. It
should be a rule that you get to keep that
before he could even read what the ball said. And
I'll say this, if it's anybody over the age of eighteen,
deal give the ball back. If it's that kid's ten
years old, give the guy his ball. It's the National

(01:13:42):
Football League, it Major League Baseball ball goes into the
same baseballs don't cost as much as football, but the
balls go into the stands during batting practice and in
the game, plus get thrown in. I think the same
rules should apply. You get to keep the football, So
the loser of the is whoever came up with that rule.

Speaker 3 (01:14:01):
Yep. Do you have anything you want to say on
the Reds and Euano Suarez? Does anything happen there?

Speaker 2 (01:14:07):
Nothing has happened there. Look, they have six games between
now and the trade deadline. They play a decent team
this weekend, play a good team next week, although a
Dodgers team that has recently been swept twice by the
Milwaukee Brewers. I know the Diamondbacks made a trade yesterday
and so the fire sale is maybe beginning. A Euhaneo

(01:14:29):
Suarez is perhaps the hottest commodity out there. If I'm Arizona,
I'm gonna draw this out to the last minute because
I'm gonna create a bidding war. So even if the
Reds make a great offer now, the Diamondbacks are gonna
sit on it because they're they're not compelled. They're gonna
see if the Yankees will do better, if the Mariners
will do better, if somebody else will do better. I
guess the two things I want to know specifically about

(01:14:50):
a johanneo Suarez are number one, how far will the
Reds go to get them? Is this gonna be the
sort of thing where we hear like, ah, you know what,
there was interest.

Speaker 3 (01:15:00):
We've already heard like the Yankees are interested.

Speaker 2 (01:15:03):
Yeah, and it's aggressive, been aggressive in their offer? Or
can the Reds justify not being as aggressive because Plan
B whatever that is, if it's an outfielder, if it's
a couple of bullpen arms, Plan B just is better
and doesn't cost as much but can provide nearly as

(01:15:24):
much help as Gino.

Speaker 3 (01:15:26):
Yeah, Camper of the day. Jermaine Burton just made a
unbelievable catch over two defenders from Jake Browning for another
Jermaine Burton touchdown.

Speaker 2 (01:15:35):
We should turn this into something, you know, like Thanksgiving
turkey la, like John Madge, we give some some sort
of Camper of the Day. Yeah, we have any food,
well you think camp like you know, like canteen. Oh,
you know something like that Camper of the Day I like,
and it can be like a traveling trophy, like you
give it up the next day to the next person
who's camper of the day.

Speaker 3 (01:15:53):
Yeah, we could have like boy scout patches, let's a
ESPN fifteen thirty on them.

Speaker 2 (01:15:59):
Yeah, or we could.

Speaker 3 (01:16:00):
Get like that's going to that's going to that that
right now is going to Jermaine.

Speaker 2 (01:16:04):
Burg camper the day.

Speaker 3 (01:16:05):
Yep.

Speaker 2 (01:16:05):
Okay, it's case closed, Yes, no matter what, it's case
closed because you know things are almost over because they've
started to pass things out to the flag football was
over here. Sure, Tanner Hudson just made a nice catch
in the back of the ndzone. Yeah, but it's not
gonna be Tanner Hudson down there.

Speaker 3 (01:16:22):
But there's these the VIP ten, which we're right next
to today. It's filled with girl flag football players from
around the area.

Speaker 2 (01:16:30):
And I think there's some young men. Mike Martin, the
former Bengal, Yeah, longtime coach at Taff High School's got
a flag football team here.

Speaker 3 (01:16:36):
But there's been different folks in there every day. And
about the time that practice starts to wrap up the Bengals,
some of the personnel down here they go and hand
out things that the folks down here can get signed.

Speaker 2 (01:16:49):
Well, can I be honest with you, In that ten
they have on these high top tables you know choch
Keys little giveaways. They've got some Bengals sunglasses. Oh I
really want to pair of those Bengals. I don't. I
don't want to take a pair from, you know, one
of the little kids. But if you know one of
the adults doesn't want their Bengal sunglasses, I would. I'm

(01:17:11):
a big fan of cheap sunglasses. Yes, I always lose losunglasses,
so not that those are cheap, but you know they're
the kind you'd wear to the pool or that.

Speaker 3 (01:17:20):
Right, just perfect a pool day for you.

Speaker 2 (01:17:22):
I'm sure it's going to be a pool weekend for me,
no doubt about it. Quickly and we're doing Bengal stuff here,
and the training camp is continuing, and Joe Burrow is
about to take a snap in the shotgun with Jamar Chase.
Why do his right? T Higgins lined up to his left.
Charlie Jones is on the field right now. We'll see
what happens here and then I'll ask my question. We've

(01:17:43):
got a handoff inside and uh.

Speaker 3 (01:17:48):
That wouldn't have won anywhere, That wouldn't have gone anywhere.
That was that was going to be stopped.

Speaker 2 (01:17:53):
That was t J.

Speaker 3 (01:17:53):
Slayton in on the plot.

Speaker 2 (01:17:54):
Yeah, t J. Slayton, Chase Brown took a hand off
your Your take on where the Reds are with Eumenius
was since you brought it up.

Speaker 3 (01:18:03):
Yeah, I just I desperately want them to go do it, because,
like the argument for the Reds is always, well, you know,
you don't want to part ways with the future. How
many years are we going to keep saying the future?
And then the guys get up here and they still
don't do enough to compete.

Speaker 2 (01:18:20):
Well, here's my thing. You can't pound your chest and
boast how great your farm system is and we've got
a surplus and we're well stocked, and then hoard everybody
and go, no, we've got to protect our future. If
you really have a good farm system, if you really
have a surplus, if you really are happy with the
overall accumulation of talent you have, you're willing to deal
from it, right And if you're not willing to that

(01:18:41):
tells me your farm system is not as great now. Yeah,
there are always one or two players that, if they're
not untouchable, you're really reluctant to trade.

Speaker 3 (01:18:48):
But it's just exhausting to always be yes, well we
like this player. We just can't give that much up.

Speaker 2 (01:18:54):
I think two of the most significant accomplishments in my
adult life is a sports fan and have been Number
one that Major League Baseball teams have gotten fans to
invest in how much money they're making. And number two,
they have convinced fans that going for it is bad strategy. Yeah.
I mean I I put a pole question on Twitter
yesterday and thirty percent of people didn't want I you
Hanesuarez crazy and and and it's like, oh my goodness,

(01:19:19):
Jamar Chase in the back of the end zone. You
heard the ooz and ohs there? Yeah, did he just
beat Cam Taylor Brett? He did? Wow?

Speaker 3 (01:19:26):
But that would that to me?

Speaker 2 (01:19:28):
Hang with Cam? Jamar is doing that to everybody.

Speaker 3 (01:19:31):
More the ball like you could not have had better coverage?

Speaker 2 (01:19:34):
Yeah, I mean Cam had a big smile on his face,
like right, you know not, what else are you doing?
Coverage is okay, nothing I can do. Joe and Jamar
are doing that to everybody.

Speaker 3 (01:19:44):
We said it earlier as well, Like when you see
the first group out there, Miles Murphy towers over everybody.

Speaker 2 (01:19:49):
He does he looks the particle, Yes, he checks the ball,
He looks the part we were doing the X factor
thing last hour. Yep. If Miles Murphy's oh, you don't
want to say, play like a first round pick. But
if Miles Murphy can start to deliver on the promise
that we all thought he had, that changes the map.

(01:20:09):
That changes the equation for this team.

Speaker 3 (01:20:11):
Yeah, back to the on the to finish the Suarez side.
Whether it's Suarez or it's someone else, this team desperately
needs to send a message. Like I thought it was
startling that they come out from the All Star break
and win a couple of games, and your closer basically
takes a postgame interview to say, we talked about this
as a team. We want to force the hand of

(01:20:32):
the organization. Yeah, I mean that tells me the locker
rooms on board with it.

Speaker 2 (01:20:36):
What do you think Ellie Dela Cruz wants? Yeah, you know,
I mean, like, for as much as people obsess over
got to sign Ellie, Gotta sign Ellie, even if you
believe that that's a pipe dream, it's at least slightly
more realistic if you win while you have the aggressive
pursuit of a championship, And if I'm Ellie Dela Cruz,
I want to win now I want to play in
the postseason now, and look, maybe they would have played

(01:20:58):
his best on the against the best. Maybe they lose
five of their next six and they followed a five
and a half back, and you go, you know what,
a Uhaneo Suarez isn't gonna make that much of a difference.
But from a mechanical standpoint, you can't convince me they
can't use a guy who's got thirty six home runs.
From an emotional standpoint, I just I think it'd be
so refreshing and so much fun to see the Reds
do something that was specifically pointed at winning right now, and.

Speaker 3 (01:21:21):
A position Suarez would be that this team doesn't really
have an answer for at this point.

Speaker 2 (01:21:25):
Now, we just saw a brilliant catch in the back
of the end zone opposite us.

Speaker 3 (01:21:33):
Jordan Moore making place. Now, everybody's getting to the party today, everybody.

Speaker 2 (01:21:39):
I think Joe Burrow makes a lot of these guys
look really damn good.

Speaker 3 (01:21:42):
Yeah, I mean, but I would say, and again, this
is more of a of a thing because Joe Burrow
made it a practice. One offense wins today feels to
me like it did. Yeah, yeah, to me, I think
it's back to back days where the offense dominated.

Speaker 2 (01:21:58):
But that's you know again, that's that should be the theme.
And it doesn't mean that the defense is bad. The
Bengals have a very good offense. The Bengals have a
defense that has a lot of question marks. To me,
would be a bigger story if.

Speaker 3 (01:22:13):
The offense wasn't right winning most days and you factor
in that, not only is the defense behind, you got
a new coordinator that it's on a new system.

Speaker 2 (01:22:21):
Yeah, this is it's gonna take a while. Dan Pitcher
year two, Zach Taylor year seven, Joe Burrow year six,
Jamar Chase year five. I mean it's there's a hell
of a lot more continuity, there's a hell of a
lot more familiarity, and and and frankly, there's a hell
of a lot more proven NFL talent offensively. Yeah, that
on defense, But look, man, if you're out Golden, and
you've talked about this, if you're out Golden, what better

(01:22:44):
unit to go up against than this group right here
led by number nine.

Speaker 3 (01:22:49):
Now, I'd like to follow up on my guy tracks.
The banana shirt today is actively wearing. As he just
walked by two sets of glasses. He has sunglasses with
reading glasses over them. Your thought on that as.

Speaker 2 (01:23:06):
A non glasses wear I really don't, okay, I mean,
does he not have prescription to some questions? You know?
I don't know. Is that typically something you don't do?
I don't see it much. No, I think he really don't. Uh.
Tracks has made a statement for the last two days,
no question.

Speaker 3 (01:23:25):
I like that, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:23:27):
But you know what they say though, is like journalists
never want to be the story. They want to tell
the story. Tracks kind of became the story yesterday.

Speaker 3 (01:23:35):
Yeah, sitting in the front row.

Speaker 2 (01:23:37):
Got the bananas on.

Speaker 3 (01:23:38):
Yeah, he knew what he was doing.

Speaker 2 (01:23:40):
And so I wonder if that creates some dissension among
his colleagues in the media. Oh, now, you know, Paul
Danner Junior's not becoming a story, Kelsey Conway's not becoming
a story? Quiet or do you feel like collective poised?
But you know what Tracks bounce back today? He did
Jeremy Rown, Who it is? Where is Jeremy? It's quarter

(01:24:04):
to twelve eight Doorton Window, Tony and Mo Football Show,
Bengals still working out it. It looks like des Ritter
is gonna take a few snaps going away. From us.

Speaker 3 (01:24:13):
Now that first play the ball got out of bounds.
I'm wondering if this is a two minute situation here.
I'm wondering if we're going situational football.

Speaker 2 (01:24:22):
Is that something you typically do this early in camp.

Speaker 3 (01:24:25):
I don't think it hurts to do it. I think
what I like when they get into the portion of
camp is the uh, the ball movement to where you're
not scripting what play you're gonna do. But if you're
gaining four yards now you got second and six, right,
because that helps to play callers as well. Looking at
what just happened, this is this is still scripted. It

(01:24:46):
looks like they're actually like showing some some plays or
what to do in the huddle. So might be this
might be something for the defense as well.

Speaker 2 (01:24:55):
All right, well, training camp continues a door window tonyan
Mo Training Camp show. Since he three sixty comes up
at loaded today.

Speaker 3 (01:25:05):
Tommy Glender is going to talk about FC Cincinnati terrific,
a different football and Charlie Goldsmith is gonna go inside
and then he's gonna come back out here at one
o'clock as well.

Speaker 2 (01:25:14):
Can't beat that, so and then I'll take the mantle
at three o'clock. We're also loaded today. Phil Steele Oh,
the author of the best college football publication on the planet,
Taylor Twelman, is going to be on.

Speaker 1 (01:25:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:25:26):
I got FC Cincinnati versus Miami, and I will believe
this one I see it. But I have been told
we are getting an in studio visit from ice.

Speaker 3 (01:25:34):
Cue ice Cube Baby.

Speaker 2 (01:25:35):
Now. When I was thirteen years old, I got my
mom's friend, Joanne Mayer to buy me America's Most Wanted
which was ice Cube's tape, which that's when they started
putting the you know, parental advisory on albums. But I
wanted it so bad because I wanted to hear all
the curse words. So I gave my mom's friend, Joanne Mayor,

(01:25:56):
like nine dollars and she went and got me the cassette.

Speaker 3 (01:25:58):
Did she tell your mom?

Speaker 5 (01:26:00):
Uh?

Speaker 2 (01:26:00):
Probably, I don't think my mom really cared all that much.
So that is one of the very first cassette tapes
I ever like went out of my way to get
because of in studio with you he is. I have
been told ice Cube is coming up to visit us
in studio wow, because he's in town for the Big Three. Yeah,
So we're looking forward to him. So big day of broadcasting.

Speaker 3 (01:26:21):
Here, and you just left me off the list.

Speaker 2 (01:26:23):
No, no, no, no, last but not least. Yeah, Tony Pike
with training camp and it's gonna be exciting. All right,
we'll step away. We're broadcasting from the airport Paint and
Body broadcast area and uh also dropping food off today.
Oh your guys at Denatos.

Speaker 3 (01:26:44):
Oh my gosh, our guy Bill Asiri let me know
that we let us know Donato's is coming down. If
there's one thing, MO that's important for this training camp,
it's make sure we're fed.

Speaker 2 (01:26:55):
Make sure we're fed.

Speaker 3 (01:26:56):
We're losing a lot of fluids and a lot from
our body being down here.

Speaker 2 (01:27:00):
One could say that I could stand to lose some
fluid pounds. All right. Uh, it's thirteen minutes away from
twelve o'clock Sincy three to sixty coming up at the
top of the hour eighty dorn Window Tony and Moe
Training Camp show on ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati Sports Stage
from the Baker Heating Tempstar Weather Center. Here's your forecast.
This report is sponsored by Dell Technologies.

Speaker 5 (01:27:21):
The new Dell AIPC within tel Core Ultra helps you
fast forward through busy work like editing images, summarizing meeting notes,
and responding to Jim's long emails, leaving more time for
you time. Get a new Dell AIPC starting in seven
to forty nine eighty nine at Dell dot com slash
ai dash PC.

Speaker 2 (01:27:36):
Welcome to Autozobe. What are you working?

Speaker 4 (01:27:38):
Natti's ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 3 (01:27:43):
Five Training Camp rolls on Mike Petralia. Just stop by
James Rapene, Just stop by Trags looks normal today. Doesn't
have a banana shirt on anything else like that? I
did see on a Kroger's Facebook page. They sent a
message that searches for banana shirt on their website are

(01:28:07):
up an ungodly amount overnight. Anybody know why? Shout out
the tracks man. Just running business in the city of Cincinnati.
It is the Tony and Mo Training Camp Show. Thanks
to AE Door and Windows, where they sell the best
and service the rest. Thanks to them for making this possible.
Thanks to Adam Weber for his continued support to make

(01:28:29):
this show possible and his continued support of the Cincinnati
Bengals for all these years. Things are still going on
at training camp. They are now doing some field goals
Evan McPherson. I've not seen him miss a kick yet.
But this is now three days in a row, where

(01:28:50):
in years past, the first couple days of training camp
this team is out here hour and twenty minutes. This
is going to be the third day that this team
goes right up to about two hours every day of camp.
We've yet to see a veteran day at training camp
this year three days in. I don't know if any
of that plays into the Zach Taylor Fast Start initiative,

(01:29:15):
but from a visible standpo it has been visibly different
the last couple of days. It has been more work
on the field. It has been more drills, more teamwork,
more individual work, and I think there has been a
concerted effort. When you look at what this team has
done and what they need to do and why they're

(01:29:36):
handling the first couple of days of training camp like this,
I think it's a good step forward. Obviously, there's a
lot that this team wants to accomplish. Long way to go.

Speaker 2 (01:29:44):
We did.

Speaker 3 (01:29:46):
A segment at the start of the hour to kind
of highlight the AFC North and I'm more leaning to
the fact that it's a two horse race between the
Baltimore Ravens and the Cincinnati Bengals. But Bengals have work
to do. If they're going to past the Baltimore Ravens
in the AFC North and in the AFC as a whole,
then they have significant work to do. And we constantly,

(01:30:07):
constantly talk about, well, it just feels like camp in
Pittsburgh is different. It just feels like camp in Baltimore
is more physical or more intense. Smaller sample size, but
at least through three days down here, I think this
is the most intense we've seen in doing training camp

(01:30:28):
coverage of the Cincinnati Bengals from an intensity standpoint and
a workload standpoint.

Speaker 2 (01:30:34):
Early on.

Speaker 3 (01:30:34):
Now again next week starts to dive into a little
bit different training camp. The dog days of training camp,
the playbook is expanding. You're going up against the same
group of teammates every single day. Frustrations start to kick in,
and you kind of get to that point where you
separate winners or the risers and some follers, some players

(01:30:59):
that can't keep up with the playbook, some players that
can't keep up with the install and then on the
other end, you have players that are keeping up that
are doing the things they need to be doing that
are showing that this is a jump for them going
into to year two or year three, or whatever it
may be for each individual player. We got to take
a break. The Tony and Moe training camp portion of

(01:31:22):
the show is done. That means since E three point
sixty is next on the ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports
station in the home of the Bengals,

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