The Tony and Mo Training Camp Show LIVE from Bengals Training Camp -- 8/13/25

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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(00:23):
of yesterday, knowledge of today broadcast area. Here's Tony and
Mo on ESPN fifteen thirty, the official home of the Bengals.

Speaker 2 (00:33):
What's up, Good morning, Thank you for joining us. It's
the AE dorn Window Tony and Mo Training Camp Show
on ESPN fifteen to thirty. A service of AE dorn Window.
They sell the best and service the rest are thanks
to Adam Weber for sponsoring our broadcast and for his
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(00:54):
his buddies out of the way. All right. We are
here covering Bengals training camp. We are actually here, are
getting set to practice. We are at our typical setup
just outside the end zone, corner of the end zone,
right behind the pylon. This is one of those practices
Tony closed to the public. There's no VIP ten here
and so we're happy to be your eyes and ears

(01:16):
for today's workout, a workout that has been billed as
one that is going to be intense, spirited and heavy.

Speaker 3 (01:23):
It's also a workout that nut We will not be
starting at ten am, very late arriving Bengal crowd today
as players are are coming onto the field. But yes,
everything we've heard up to this point is building to today.
Even yesterday inside the bubble, it wasn't one of those
intense physical long practices. What we're told and what we

(01:46):
understand is that is today. Because when you start to
look at the schedule off day tomorrow, right Friday, we
will be here, but it's essentially gonna be a walkthrough
because they're gonna get ready to head to Washington over
the weekend. So you're not gonna get a ton of
action on Friday. It's gonna be more getting ready for
Washington themselves the opponent. Whereas today is still in that

(02:07):
camp mode ones verse one's one on one, seven on
seven team. I think they're gonna do some move the
ball today, some unscripted stuff. So this is if you
look at the camp schedule, probably where things peak After this,
everything starts to go downhill a little bit, start preparing
for Washington. There's a quick turnaround between Game two and

(02:27):
Game three of the preseason, and then you are preparing
for the Cleveland Brown. So this will be physical, It
should be intense, and should be fantastic to follow along with.

Speaker 2 (02:37):
If we're gonna get a fight during it's gonna if
we're gonna get a skirmish, if we're gonna get if
we're gonna get a fracas, a brawl a Donnybrook, if
we're gonna get a fight training camp in melee, Today
strikes me as the most likely day because it's gonna
be a little bit more physical. It's hot, we're outside,
it's kind of the dog days of camp. The regular

(02:58):
season opener is still weeks away. I would imagine my
money is on today. If we get anything during training camp, Yeah,
that rises to the level of actual fight. Today is today, Yeah,
there's just the first couple of weeks. You still got
that excitement of training camp. There's the freshness and newness
of it. Now you just want the season to start.

Speaker 3 (03:18):
Yeah, And in the meantime, you're just out here going
against the same person you've been going against now for
a couple of weeks, you're leaning on each other. There's
been a couple instances during camp where where there's been
some some talking back and forth. I listened when Paul
Dinner Paul Dinner Junior joined you yesterday about Orlando Brown.
Junior was a little bit vocal, Jordan Battle was a

(03:41):
little bit vocal. Those things pour over a little bit.
And if you're going to see something, I would bet
you're going to see it today.

Speaker 2 (03:48):
I'm hoping for it. We'll see. Let's talk about something
that we have been watching since we got here maybe
about twenty five before ten o'clock, and that's the early
work by the wide receivers. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (03:58):
Wide receivers are usually the first out here and they
go through a lot of individual work, from holding a
ball and getting hit with a pad to try to
secure the ball, to just little footwork drills that you're
finishing with catching the passes. But what's been interesting since
we've been down here covering these practices is that it's
always the receivers and then it's Chase Brown, right, And

(04:20):
if you followed along in the offseason, one of Chase
Brown's big things that he wanted to work on was
the passing game, not only pass protection, but being a
better route runner, being able to catch passes out of
the backfield. He has spent more time before practices with
the wide receivers and then after practice when we're sitting
here until three o'clock, he's one of the last ones

(04:42):
in because he's always on the jugs machine. So we
know what he can do as a running back. But
I think he has really made an effort, and it
shows when he's out here going through individual stuff with
wide receivers how much that passing game is important to
him and developing his game.

Speaker 2 (04:56):
You know, one of the wide receivers we've talked about
a lot here during training because of how well he's played,
how well he's how good he's looked in practice, has
been Jermaine Burton. And obviously the conversation over the last
couple of days has shifted toward his absence, his injury,
the swelling he is apparently dealing with. I don't see
Jermaine out here today. He worked out in the rehab
field yesterday. We'll see if he goes on Monday night.

(05:20):
The closer we get to Monday without him practicing, the
more you would believe he's not gonna go see secured
a roster spot. That was going to be my question.

Speaker 3 (05:28):
Because I think Charlie Jones is a secure rosters had
a good camp.

Speaker 4 (05:32):
Yeah, he had a good camp.

Speaker 3 (05:32):
He had a good preseason game, And if you think
about him, they essentially are the same role uh huh,
emergency wide receiver right and solid special teams player.

Speaker 2 (05:43):
Right?

Speaker 3 (05:43):
Can you keep two of those same players on the roster?
Yoshivos is gonna make the roster obviously.

Speaker 2 (05:50):
So I guess the question is if the answer for
Jamaine is no, then who takes his spot?

Speaker 4 (05:55):
Right?

Speaker 3 (05:56):
Where do you use that spot? Is it at wide receiver?
Is it at you know, an extra tight end?

Speaker 2 (06:01):
Well? Has anybody at that position done anything so far
to make you feel it should supplant a guy who
you took in the third round last year in spite
of all of his off field issues.

Speaker 4 (06:11):
Yeah, I don't think so yet.

Speaker 3 (06:13):
But if you're another one of these receivers out here
in these lines, I would see it as an opportunity
over the next couple of days. Sours kind of open
doors open. He's not run away with it by any means.
He's in a good, solid camp, But I think it's
certainly something to watch for as you go forward.

Speaker 2 (06:27):
You know, we said about Jermaine Burton that he was
gonna have to show something in the games. Yeah, if
he doesn't have that opportunity on Saturday, is he really
going to get one in the final pre I mean, I.

Speaker 3 (06:41):
Think it's how much would he be able to showcase
in the final preseason game that year with the third teams?

Speaker 2 (06:45):
My guess is Jermaine Burton will be a member of
the Cincinnati Bengals this year. But if he wasn't guaranteed
the spot at the end of last season, and he
wasn't guaranteed the spot during OTA's and mini camp, and
he wasn't necessarily guaranteed the spot once training camp started,
is he guaranteed the spot now that he is essentially
non practicing.

Speaker 4 (07:03):
I don't think.

Speaker 3 (07:04):
I don't think he has lost a spot right now,
But as you said, I certainly think over these next
couple of days and Monday, the door's open for someone
to kick it down to where if you notice someone
and say, okay, this this guy.

Speaker 2 (07:16):
Deserves some conversation.

Speaker 3 (07:18):
This guy, this guy deserves someone too to take an
extra look at no question would not be something. All
the time we've spent talking about Jermaine Burton for.

Speaker 2 (07:28):
Good and bad reasons. I mean, he can't emphasize this enough.
If you weren't listening to us the first I don't
know show I mean he was. We talked often about
how you knew nothing about him, and you showed up
to a practice, you would say, man, number eighty one,
that's got to be one of your best players, and
you know he's He's a guy who's status on this
team and status in the NFL is kind of tenuous.

Speaker 3 (07:48):
Yeah, I think it's going to be very, very intriguing
going forward. Obviously, with him being a third round pick,
you still think there's some upside there. But the conversation
is starting the season fast, right. Is he one of
those those top guys on the roster that gives you
the best chance to factor in as much as you
can to get something done.

Speaker 2 (08:09):
The preseason game on Monday. The plan right now is
for the starters to basically play a half. Do you
dangle the carrot to the offense in particular, Hey, go
out and score and execute well in the first two drives,
and then you can have the rest of the night off.

Speaker 3 (08:24):
Yeah, because you don't want to say just one drive,
because there is something to coming to the sideline, getting
on the iPads, going through the function of making some
adjustments in between series, and then going back out there.
But if they do what they did in preseason game
number one, what else do you need to see?

Speaker 2 (08:42):
Right? Because it was so balanced.

Speaker 3 (08:43):
Yes, you saw Chase Brown, you saw the running game,
you saw the passing game. Joe Burrow was nine for ten.
It was just crisp and clean. I would I would
certainly be open to adjusting on the fly. Defensively, huh huh. No,
haven't earned it. You've not earned it. You have no
equity from last year. You have a lot to show.

(09:03):
And it is essentially for the defense their final real
test as well. I don't foresee them playing a lot
in the third preseason game because of the quick turnaround.
I wouldn't I wouldn't suspect to see a lot of
starters in that third game, so I need as many
reps as possible with the defense. I wouldn't mind them

(09:24):
seeing a rep a series in the third quarter. Go
in at halftime, make your halftime adjustments, come out and
show that you can put those twos well, are.

Speaker 2 (09:32):
There adjustments to make? If they do? They what do
they do? They dumb it down? They go vanilla? Yeah, yeah,
do you really adjust from that?

Speaker 4 (09:38):
I don't add a thing.

Speaker 3 (09:39):
Whatever the playbook was for Philly, I'm not adding a
thing because that was clearly too.

Speaker 2 (09:44):
Much, way too much for this.

Speaker 4 (09:46):
That was base.

Speaker 2 (09:47):
I don't want to see what anything else is. You know,
I think with this discussion about the defense, you know
I was. I've been told you're being a little bit
unfair because Al Golden needs some time, and you know
I will. I'll account for that. I'll account for it's
gonna take a little bit of time for Al Golden

(10:08):
to have his fingerprints all over this defense. Danner and
I talked about this a little bit yesterday. I'll account
for new DC need some time. It's not gonna be
exactly what you wanted to be in week one. That's
completely reasonable. But it's very reasonable to expect a better
performance acknowledging that, acknowledging that it's gonna take some time
for Al Golden, it's completely reasonable to expect something that

(10:31):
just looks better than it did against Philadelphia.

Speaker 3 (10:33):
Yeah, I just I didn't expect on my end.

Speaker 2 (10:38):
To be.

Speaker 3 (10:41):
Blown away by how they were out physical against second
thirteen games, pushed around like that, That to me was
the most like if you have a assignment blown in
your first preseason game with a new coordinator, in a
new scheme and some new guys in there, okay, Yeah,
if you miss a tackle here and there, okay, But
to me, they just got pushed around. And to me,

(11:01):
if you're going against twos and threes no offense, those
aren't starters in the NFL. And I had this conversation
with Austin yesterday and his you know, his reasoning in
response was well, Philly, they have a good system in place.
That's true, but those guys aren't starting on any other
NFL team, or they would be somewhere else. Tanner McKee
might be a good backup, he's not a starter in

(11:23):
the NFL, and he torched you. So I think there
are different levels to giving someone some time, especially like
if ol Golden came in and it was like, holy cow,
that scheme he ran at Notre Dame. It was so
advanced and now he's got to try to incorporate it here.
The conversation has been dumbing things down, running more base
and allowing guys to go make one on one plays. Well,

(11:45):
guys had one on one chances, they didn't make any plays.
That's demoralizing, that's worrisome. And now you almost have to
see some sort of you know, leap forward in between
games or else you're going to be in a very
tough position.

Speaker 2 (12:01):
And they also don't get the excuse of youth, because
this is what they've chosen to go in. They've they've
chosen to go in this direction, lean on guys who
have been here for a while, lean on some players
who are not all that experienced, as you know, quality
NFL starters. You don't get that excuse either. Yeah, this
is you know, we went through the list the other day.

(12:22):
How many guys on this defense right now? Are you
saying it's time for them to show something or you
got to move on? Tons?

Speaker 3 (12:29):
I mean go through the secondary, Tom Taylor, Britt, everybody
in the second Jax Hill, Yeah, everyone at the back end. Yeah,
I think we've talked before practice today. You can make
an argument about Logan Wilson. Who is Logan Wilson Right now?
Arren Burk's comes over. He's got something to prove they
drafted Demetrius Knight at Barrett Carter. Did they get those
picks right? Joseph Osia, Miles Murphy. We've talked a ton
about they have something to prove, ye, Shamar Stewart, everyone's

(12:53):
did they.

Speaker 2 (12:53):
Get it right?

Speaker 3 (12:54):
One and a half sacks last year in college? Like
you go up and down this defense. It's a bunch
of guys. We're saying, well, they better show something now
or else.

Speaker 2 (13:04):
That's a that's a lot, even your your two defensive
tackles you took last year. By the way, McKinley Jackson
had a nice night on against Philadelphia, But Chris Jenkins
and McKinley Jackson, Like, you're right, it's huge draft picks
a year two. Man, you know, Chris Jenkins was the
second round pick. You're asking those guys to to take
a major step forward. That's the thing about this defense.
Everybody says, and I get it, like they've just got

(13:26):
to be league average. Okay, they've just got to be
league average. Are we sure that can happen?

Speaker 4 (13:30):
Right?

Speaker 2 (13:31):
Are we sure that can happen? Given the amount of
inexperience and given what we saw from a lot of
the same players were on this year's team last year.
Where are they exponentially better this year than they were
last year? On defense?

Speaker 3 (13:41):
Yes, other than new defensive coordinator? Like where where do
you point? Because as much heat as he took, Jermaine
Pratt still had a lot of tackles. You had a
lot of mistackles, a lot of miss tackles. Sure, but
you're you're replacing some production there.

Speaker 2 (13:57):
I want to say they're gonna be better after the
passer because one of those dudes is was Shamar, Miles Murphy,
Joseph Osai, one of those guys is going to be
better at getting to the quarterback than what they had
last year. And by the way, Chamar was pretty impressive
in the game against Philly. Yeah, but I want to say,
but I can be dead wrong about this. I want

(14:19):
to say they're going to be better getting after the quarterback. Yeah,
we want to.

Speaker 3 (14:23):
Yeah, and we hope, But so much of the offseason
has been built around Yeah.

Speaker 2 (14:27):
I hope.

Speaker 3 (14:28):
I hope that Al Golden coming in changes things. I
hope a fresh start for Cam Taylor Britt. I hope
Shamar Stewart is the guy. I hope they get Trey
Hendrickson signed and he can produce at the same level
he's produced for the last couple of years, Like, I
don't have to do that on offense right outside of guard.
I hope they protect Joe Burrow, but I know what
they are. I don't hope Joe Burrow can repeat what
he did last year. I don't hope Jamar Chase now.

(14:50):
I hope Tee Higgins stays healthy for seventeen years. But
there aren't nearly as many questions on the offensive side
of the ball, you know, And yet I was you
asked the question in one of our training camp reports yesterday,
because we've talked so much about the defense, and you said,
if you could significantly upgrade one position between now and
the start of camp or the start of the season,
is it D line, is it the secondary, or is

(15:12):
it O line? Ultimately, I'd still say oh line. As
much as we've talked about this defense here, I would
still say OH line, because it's that important.

Speaker 2 (15:21):
Yeah, I still say safety because they were so bad
at explosives last year, and because Geno Stone was so bad,
and because what they have behind him is so unproven. Yeah,
you know, I would love a veteran safety just in
that mix. But if you said, no, Mo, you can't

(15:44):
have that. Instead you could have somebody else who's going
to help protect Joe Burrow, then that would be fine,
right Like, I mean, they're putting a lot of faith
in Lucas Patrick.

Speaker 3 (15:52):
Well because at this point I don't know MO that
if they were let's say Justin Simmons, if they signed
Justin Simmons today, what is he good for on the
defense as a whole? How much help right one player?
If they were to go get the top available guard
right now, all of a sudden, I'm like, Okay, yeah,
good guard. Carris is solid, Orlando Brown junior, Marius Mems.

(16:14):
We like what we saw from Fairchild. All of a sudden,
you feel better about Joe Burrow being protected because I
didn't feel good on the first third down of the
preseason when Lucas Patrick Whift and Joe Burrow nearly hit
his hand on a defender's helmet. Right like that, that
to me is more important than anyone on the defense.

Speaker 2 (16:32):
I would like both. I still they were so bad
at explosives last year. Gino Stone may prove that their
faith in him was justified, But again they've said they've
sent mixed messages as it relates to him as well. Yeah,
asking him to take a pay cut. It's sixteen minutes
after ten o'clock. Bengals, we're still stretching, going through their stretching.
It's a long stretch for what we anticipate being a

(16:55):
long workout.

Speaker 3 (16:56):
Good tracks, man, tracks. You got the jacket on today.
I don't understand.

Speaker 2 (17:01):
That looks like a heavy jack. That looks like the
sort of thing you would wear when it's like forty
five degrees out. Yeah, it ain't forty five. It's a
lot of insulation there. Uh huh.

Speaker 4 (17:11):
Good for tracks.

Speaker 2 (17:12):
It is when you're that cool. Yep, you need a jacket.
Ye doesn't matter what tiny not out here sitting on
a stool or anything like that. Seventeen minutes after ten o'clock. Uh,
we'll set things up for you. Since he three sixty
coming up at noon with Tony and Austin. I return
at three o'clock today. Tony is with me three forty five,
four forty five and five forty five for the latest
on the Bengals training camp updates and so much more so.

(17:34):
We're local all the way until six o'clock tonight. It's
the A E. Doorn Window, Tony and Mode Training Camp
Show on ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 5 (17:42):
Cincinnati Sports Station for ESPN fifteen thirty Orange and Black
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Speaker 2 (17:53):
It's the AE darn Window Tony and Mode Training Camp
Show on ESPN fifteen thirty, a service of AE dorn
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(18:14):
Clair Roofing Hotline, Mulleger and Tony Pike maybe ten yards
behind the back corner pile line on the pylon on
the right side of the end zone on field number one,
watching training camp practice. Watching a punk drill right now,
pretty exciting.

Speaker 3 (18:31):
See one gentleman up on the bridge. Yep, the Bridge
Brigade has one.

Speaker 2 (18:35):
Today.

Speaker 3 (18:36):
Officials are in full force today, We've got a full
complement of officials.

Speaker 2 (18:39):
Yeah, wearing shorts. And it was yeah, it's.

Speaker 3 (18:43):
Like golfers when they're in like their practice rounds.

Speaker 2 (18:45):
Yeah, how could you not? Uh, it's worth mentioning because
you know you were here yesterday. I was for a while,
and you were as you went to check in to
get your wristband to do the show that we didn't
do tomorrow. Yesterday you were noticing who was there and
not there in their respective parking space. Yeah, players love.
There was no Trey hendrickson yesterday, but you did see

(19:08):
a car in trade card. Unless someone's taking a spot.
What happens if that happens by beef? What happens if
somebody is, like you were talking about a campfight, I'm
parking here?

Speaker 3 (19:17):
Yeah? How did they divvy up parking spaces as well?
Because I get like the first couple you see Jamar Chase,
Joe Burrow, t Higgins, Logan Wilson, Orlando Brown Junior, and
then like one of the first ones is Lucas Patrick.
Is that like part of the deal, Like, Hey, here's
your signing bonus and we'll throw in this prime parking space.

Speaker 2 (19:36):
You know, when I started working at the radio station spot,
we were no, we were in Mount Adams, right, and
we you know, like now we share the building with
like forty different companies, but in Mount Adams it was
just us. So we had two floors of parking and
on one floor some people had their own parking space.
Our general manager at the time, did Mike McConnell did. Yeah,

(19:57):
back in the day, Bob Trump, he had his own
parking space. And I guess this is before I started
working there. But somebody parked in his spot and he
deflated their tires. Wow, wow, serious And like I asked
him about this, like did that really happen. He's like, yeah,
it's like, somebody parked my space. I deflated their tires.
That's serious. Yeah. I would always ask like, what do

(20:18):
you have to do to earn your own parking place? Yeah,
you never got it, don't worry about it. And then
when we moved to Kenwood and we share the building
with all these other companies, the people that had their
own parking space, they were mad that they didn't suddenly
have parking space at the the new place.

Speaker 3 (20:34):
I don't see him yet out here though. I don't
see Trey looking for Trey Hendrickson.

Speaker 2 (20:38):
Now.

Speaker 3 (20:38):
The D line does work out if we're on field one.
They do a lot of their individual work all the
way over on field three right which we don't have
the greatest view of right now. But we are going
through those special teams periods, hopefully geting those out of
the way.

Speaker 2 (20:51):
Now, I did think it was cool that Shamar Stewart
talked about some of the stuff that Trey Hendrickson has
been talking with him about. Yeah, I mean, I.

Speaker 3 (21:01):
There is so much value in what Trey Hendrickson can
share with a rookie, especially a guy like Shamar Stewart
who is physically gifted with every tool you need, but
you just can't come to the NFL and bull rush
or speed rush. Folks need moves. How do you set
things up? How do you use your leverage? When do
you decide to try to speed rush versus bull rush?

(21:23):
When do you try to spend I mean, all of
those things are so valuable. And say what you want
about Trey as a run defender, say what you want
about him getting his hands on any passes or or
lining up in multiple spots he can get after the
passer and he uses a full variety of moves. Having
someone like that to be able to pour into you

(21:44):
or to just ask questions, you know, why do you
go with this move on this situation versus this move?
Like that's all stuff that if Trey's not here, you
can't get.

Speaker 2 (21:54):
Well, and it answers the question we asked on the
day that he showed up, right, like, what's he gonna do?
What's his involvement gonna be? Is he gonna come out
and just stand there? Is he gonna grant stand? Like?
What's is he gonna be hands on and working with
his teammates even if he's not practicing. And based on
what we had watched when he's been out here, and
then listening to Shamar Stewart talk about Trey's willingness to help,

(22:17):
I give him credit for that. You know, hey, is
he gonna show up and be a pro? Is he
gonna show up and at least be helpful? And when
I listened to Shamar Stewart and read some of the quotes,
the answer for me at least.

Speaker 3 (22:27):
Was yes, Yeah, And I do think it's interesting. We
talked yesterday on centy three to sixty with Joe Danneman.
Is there a point where that changes? Is there a
point where Trey says, you know what I showed back up,
I've been out here, I've been professional, I've helped I
flew with the team to Philly. I'm helping the young guys.

(22:49):
But if we're not making up any ground, does Trey
then go back and say, Okay, I've got to to
redraw the line in the sand, right, Because I would
imagine at some point there's gonna be more frustration because
he's already he's been on both ends of the spectrum here,
he's coming, he's held his own media scrum, and he's
also been this professional and consummate teammate like Jamar Chase

(23:11):
was last year that you want to have in those situations.
Does it get to a point where him and his
camp get together and say, look, we've tried to be
the nice guys. We've tried to do this as the
good teammate, the captain, but if it's not advancing, maybe
we need to remove ourselves from the equation again to
send a message. I wonder if it gets to that

(23:33):
point at all. Between now and ideally he gets signed.

Speaker 2 (23:37):
Your guess is as good as mine. I think. To
predict what Trey Hendrickson is gonna do on a day
to day basis is a fool's Errand yeah, I mean
he's an unpredictable guy. Now, I still feel like this outcome,
the outcome of the Trey versus Bengals thing is pretty predictable.
It's gonna be that Trey plays for the Bengals Week one,

(23:58):
whether or not that's under a multi year deal, the
current deal. You know, your guess is as good as mine.
My guess is it will be under a multi year deal.
We will see. But predicting what he is going to
do between now and then, it's impossible. Nobody could have
imagined he was going to show up at Mini camp
and you know, do what he did. You may have
thought it was the greatest thing ever. You may have

(24:18):
thought it was stupid, you may have thought it was neither.
But I don't think any of us saw that happening. Then,
you know, he posts the the the instagram of him
driving on the highway and he's going to Jacksonville, and
he talked about, well, I can't listen to the whistle,
the train whistle when I live right across the We're like, okay,
so Trey's not here, and then suddenly Trey's here. Like

(24:41):
Predicting what that guy is going to do on a day.

Speaker 3 (24:43):
To day basis is just I just want to Because
since he's shown back up, everything's been talked about how
great he's been Yes, yes, is there a point where
he's like, you know what, We're nowhere closer now than
when I showed up and have done all this stuff.

Speaker 4 (24:57):
But sorry, but.

Speaker 2 (24:58):
Here's the thing, Like, what I would tell Trey is,
this isn't Zach Taylor's fault. This isn't Al Golden's fault.
This isn't Shamar Stewart's fault or Miles Murphy's fault. It's
not the fault of anybody that you would be working
with directly. So why not be a good guy with
those people? Why not be a good teammate with those folks?
Why not be a good a player in good standing

(25:21):
with the coaching staff and whatever your issue is? Like
to me, once he decided to show up, like, all right, Trey,
you're gonna do all the right things. And then that
doesn't mean he can't talk again publicly. Maybe he will.
That doesn't mean he can't be pissed off in ownership.
Maybe he is. But what I would say to Trey is, like,
you you did the right thing by coming out here.

(25:43):
Is it worth it to suddenly not do the right thing? Yeah?
And what is that he was gonna stand on the
side and not help out Shamar Stewart, not just.

Speaker 4 (25:49):
Mean like does he even come out here?

Speaker 3 (25:52):
Because if there's one person that will benefit by how
bad the defense, look, it's Trey Hendrickson. Yeah, who's gonna say,
you don't want to add me to this. You're good
with this, like you're good with with what they showed
against Philly.

Speaker 2 (26:05):
Well, the thing is, like, if you believe him that
he has no intention of playing under his current deal
and they don't get a deal done and he's gonna
sit out games that at some point he's gonna have
to leave. I mean, if if he's like, if he's like,
all right, I'm not playing the first game because they're
not giving me a new contract.

Speaker 4 (26:23):
Which I wonder.

Speaker 3 (26:24):
So you come off the game against Philly yesterday, they
go inside, but there was no report of him being
at practice. Right, if he's not out here today or
we don't see him today, and then it gets to
Friday and we don't see him on Friday, what does
that conversation then become where's Trey Hendrickson? Sure, well, you
know he was out here, he was the teammate, he
was helping. Does he travel to Washington like you traveled

(26:45):
to Philly with the team.

Speaker 2 (26:46):
I guess what I would say to Trey though, is like,
if you decided, Okay, you're gonna be here for a
week and a half or whatever it was, and then
suddenly you're not gonna be here, do you really think
that's going to force ownership's hand? Right?

Speaker 3 (26:57):
I think more of what force ownership's hand is watching
what we watched on Thursday. Sure, and if it happens
again on Monday and you're Trey and his representation, then
you say, what, we're gonna get this done?

Speaker 2 (27:08):
I think the only thing that really forces ownership's hand
to give Trey specifically what he wants is if he
makes it known without any shadow of a doubt, will
I'm going to miss games? And I mean plural mid games.

Speaker 3 (27:22):
Because what happens if they are equally as bad against
Washington as they were against Philly, you pretty much.

Speaker 2 (27:29):
Know what you're starting the season with. Is that enough to.

Speaker 3 (27:33):
Prompt you to say we can't risk that, we can't
risk You can't risk going to Cleveland and giving up
twenty eight points.

Speaker 2 (27:39):
Right to that all trying to get off to a
quick start, right. You know?

Speaker 3 (27:43):
The schedule I think lends itself pretty well, based on
who you're playing at what time. Jordan Addison is still
going to be suspended for the Vikings and it's j J.

Speaker 2 (27:50):
McCarthy three.

Speaker 3 (27:51):
You're still getting a new system in place with Cohen
and the Jacksonville Jaguars. In week two you start with
the Cleveland Browns. You got every indication to start three
and zero. Do not put something in the middle of
all that that that causes the issue.

Speaker 2 (28:06):
It's twenty nine away from eleven o'clock. It was the
most we talked about Trey Hendrickson all camp. I think, yeah,
there hasn't really been much to say. What kind of
curtzy It's an suv. Nothing over the top really like
you see in suv. Yeah, all right, twenty nine away
from eleven o'clock. Where at Bengals training camp practice? What

(28:27):
we what do we individual drills?

Speaker 3 (28:29):
We're still in individual drills. We just missed you know
some of those. The punt team inside the fifty where
you're trying to down the ball inside the ten where
the gunners we'll get off a block with pads and
try to locate the punt and down the punt before
it goes into the end zone. Something that seems pretty easy.

(28:49):
And every year we watch a gunner standing with his
feet on the goal line who just misses the ball
or it goes right to his hands.

Speaker 2 (28:56):
Right. You know, we're drilling everything down here. Everything's getting drilled,
and like that drill was a good one. I think
they did a good job of downing the ball inside
the town.

Speaker 3 (29:05):
They were there a long time. It was a fifteen
minute drill. But yeah, I mean it's stuff that has
to get done, uh getting into like the uh more
individual work. Now quarterbacks are with the running backs. You're
gonna work on some run fits. Wide receivers still going
through some individual stuff. So we're yet to get to
anywhere near the meat of this practice yet.

Speaker 2 (29:24):
Twenty seven away from eleven o'clock, the AE Dooran Window
Tony and Mo Training Camp Show continues on ESPN fifteen
thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.

Speaker 1 (29:32):
You'll feel the boomy.

Speaker 2 (29:35):
Twenty three away from eleven o'clock. It's the AE Dooran
Window Tony and Mo Training Camp Show. A service of
AE dooran Window. They sell the best end service the
rest Oakley Greens, all the sports, all the time, both
five to one to three, five to one to three,
t o pH We are broadcasting from the airport Paint
and Body broadcast area and we use the Ray Saint

(29:58):
Clair roofing hotline. I'm Bengals are practicing right in front
of us, Tony, what are we watching right now?

Speaker 3 (30:04):
Routes verse air ball can't hit the ground, ball hits
the ground this point in camp and you're a fringe
guy right to Good for you making the.

Speaker 2 (30:14):
Squad start packing.

Speaker 3 (30:15):
By the way, he saw this from James Rapine, Brent Souter,
Emelio Pagan, Matt McClain, all out here today watching practice.

Speaker 2 (30:21):
Pretty cool, Matt McClain. Big, big knock last night, Big
knock last night, Big win for the Reds night against
a really good pitcher and a chance, a chance Hunter
Green gets the ball to night, chance to win a
series against Philadelphia. You imagine the excitement when Train takes
the stage if they come off a series win against Philly.

(30:44):
The Mets explode offensively, so they break their seven game
losing streak. So the Reds remained two games behind New York,
but a very solid pitching performance by Brady Singer back
to back fund to kind of put it in cruise control.
When they pulled the tarpa off in the late innings.
They've played so many, you know, nip tuck type games.

Speaker 3 (31:02):
Somebody said yesterday that they feel like Andrew Abbott is
is getting tired, and I said, well, he went. Did
they watch him pitch the seven and two third's a
fantastic ball? Yeah, I don't think he's tired. I think,
you know, had had they done a couple of nights
ago what they did last night and gotten him to
like three runs instead of just the one, yeah, they

(31:22):
win that game.

Speaker 2 (31:23):
Had had it been three nothing, or had it been
three to one when Trey Turner got the hit and
made it three to two, and you know, Abbot gives
up that hit, then they pull him. Yeah, and then
Santyon gets you know, through the eighth inning, and Pegan
pitches the ninth and the Reds win the ball game.
Nobody's talking about Andrew Abbott being tired now, right, this

(31:43):
is his first season where he hasn't yet at least,
knock on wood, he hasn't gone on the injured list,
and so, you know, I guess for some of those guys,
you do wonder about them hitting a little bit of
a wall because they haven't pitched this much before. But
the guy that I saw on Monday night is not
a pitcher who is starting to suffer fatigue. No, he
was great.

Speaker 3 (32:02):
It is, but it's fun Monday night last night, seeing
the crowds at the ballpark, the atmosphere from mid August,
like that's what you want.

Speaker 2 (32:10):
I was there last night and it it felt like
August baseball should feel it and like a good crowd.
But everybody ended the game. Yeah, everybody you know, talking
about looking at their phones. Okay, what's New York doing
that sort of thing? Scoreboard watch talking about Hunter Green
coming back Like last night felt like playoff race baseball.

Speaker 3 (32:29):
I remember like growing up always going to games and
this was like when Roland was here, like series against
Cardinals and stuff like that, yes late in the season
which meant so much, and going down to the ballpark
and just loving the crowd.

Speaker 2 (32:42):
They did it.

Speaker 3 (32:43):
It was last year I think that they made a
run and the Tigers came into town. Yeah, and the
atmosphere was incredible. They ended up getting swept by the Tigers,
but it was such like it those crowds happen. You're like, man,
this is this is what baseball is supposed to be. Yeah,
it should be the norm.

Speaker 2 (32:57):
You know, I've heard from people like, well, you know,
at least they're playing meaningful baseball. They should every year,
but you know they play the Mets that first weekend
of September. Yeah, five, six, and seven. That game on
the seventh runs opposite to the Bengals opener in Cleveland.
But I think it'd be a blast if they can

(33:19):
hang in there and that series involves, you know, perhaps
the two teams that are in contention for that last
wildcard spot. That could be a really fun weekend at GABP. Yeah.
Kind of running out of homestands. They actually are.

Speaker 3 (33:32):
It's crazy this one, then two more that I'm nervous
about this West Coast road trip.

Speaker 2 (33:38):
Because as long as I can remember, I don't.

Speaker 3 (33:40):
Care where the opponents are. It feels like they go
on these trips and by the time they're back, you're like, oh,
I was.

Speaker 2 (33:45):
Thinking about that last week because David Ross is going
to call the game on Friday. They're the Apple TV game.
And when I think of David Ross, the first thing
I think of is in two thousand and six, the
Reds were in first place, I think by a game.
In two thousand and six and they go this time
a year to a like a ten game road trip
on the West Coast. The first game is in San

(34:07):
Francisco and they win it I think three to two.
David Ross hit a big two run home run, and
so the trip gets off to a great start. They
then lost their next eight I remember they won the
last one, but they went two and eight on the trip,
and by the time they came home they were like
six games out of first place.

Speaker 4 (34:25):
YEP.

Speaker 2 (34:26):
And there have been a few of those in recent
years where the August West Coast trip which involves some
American League teams this time, You're right, I worry more
about that than I do the Homestand they're playing right
now against the Phillies who came in hot and the
Brewers who are never gonna lose, hopefully until.

Speaker 3 (34:42):
They make it the whole season without being swept. And
if so, Parade Banner, what.

Speaker 2 (34:49):
Do they have. I have forty one games to go,
So that's what thirteen twelve thirteen series got a shot.
Not gonna get swept by Philly. Nope. By the way,
it's a big start for Hunter Green, big next couple
of weeks.

Speaker 3 (35:03):
For hun I wouldn't even say a big I'd say
a big couple starts to show that he can put
it together. And uh we we talked a little bit
the other day of you know, what do you do
when Hunter's back and Lodolo's back and said, I'd like
to get to that point, right, I'd like to figure out,
you know, what's the transpiring move if both are back healthy?

Speaker 2 (35:21):
You know, is.

Speaker 3 (35:21):
It is it Chase Burns to the bullpen?

Speaker 2 (35:26):
Is it lttel? Even though you still got Martinez and
they're kind of the same guy. I love the idea
of Chase Burns as a weapon.

Speaker 4 (35:31):
Oh my gosh.

Speaker 2 (35:32):
And he doesn't have to have a defined role, no,
like you need him in the seventh when the runner on,
Yeah you can't, you can't pitch the contact you need
to swing in a miss, Go get him. Yeah, it
doesn't have to be Well, he helps, I would imagine,
no doubt about it. Like you, you put him in
the best position we're in the short term, he could
succeed and help your club, And I'm with you like that,
that role could evolve, that role could change from game

(35:54):
to game. One. That's gonna be a full day for
those three guys because it's an early game. Yeah, they're
they're basically gonna have to go from here over.

Speaker 3 (36:02):
To the ballpark and then stick around for train. Perhaps
they can do that at Castianos. I saw he's stuck
around for Snoop Dogg Monday night. Right, who sticks around
for train drops A Jupiter.

Speaker 2 (36:14):
I don't know. I don't know. I couldn't tell you.

Speaker 4 (36:18):
I haven't seen a ball hit the ground here.

Speaker 2 (36:19):
That's good, That's exactly what we wanted right now. We
talked about the there no balls on the ground. T Higgins.
He just looks big, doesn't He is big, big, stronger.

Speaker 4 (36:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (36:28):
Yeah, it's like he's ready for ready to go for
the season. So he's ready to go play seventeen.

Speaker 2 (36:33):
He's got like, you know, the the game socks.

Speaker 4 (36:38):
Yeah, he looks like he's taking today like a game.

Speaker 2 (36:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (36:40):
He was out here before practice. He had the headphones on,
kind of going through his own stuff. They didn't bring
the tennis balls out right, But I think based on
these guys getting ready today, they're they're treating today almost
like a game day with that that sort of kind
of emotion and aggressiveness.

Speaker 2 (36:59):
It is sixteen minutes away from eleven o'clock. We are
broadcasting from Bengals training camp just behind the back right
corner pylon on field number one, watching routes on air.
I never saw a ball hit the ground, not yet,
So that's a step in the right direction, and hopefully

(37:20):
we get some eleven on eleven here very very soon.
We'll step away a doorn window Tony and Mo Training
Camp show on ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station from
the Johnson he It's ten away from eleven o'clock on
the AE dooran window Tony and Mo Training Camp Show. Tony,
can I quickly ask opinions or something that has nothing
to do with the Bengals or football. I don't know

(37:41):
if you were listening during that break, but in the
see eighteen years I've been hosting on this radio station,
I think the spot that we have aired the most
is the one about ladder safety. Yeah, is that a
problem in your house? No? No, it's never been a problem.
Are there really that many people falling off ladder? I'm
also I'm also not a fan of heights.

Speaker 3 (38:02):
Okay, so outside of like the small ladder, I understand,
I'm not going anywhere.

Speaker 2 (38:05):
Near Is there really a major issue in the United States?
Of America with people I can constantly just falling.

Speaker 3 (38:10):
Off ladder my family and friend group. I've never met
anyone or know of anyone that's.

Speaker 2 (38:15):
Had a ladder problem likewise, that like I'm naturally, seems
like a pandemic, seems like something that like we're just
not paying enough attention. So yes, ladder safety, all right,
is vital? All right? No ladders here at Bengals training
camp practice? What are we watching now? Tone now?

Speaker 3 (38:31):
They're just getting these skilled players together and essentially walking
through some some route concepts, probably something that they installed
earlier today from a route standpoint, getting those together. That's
probably what they're going to be doing when these two
sides get together, because the defense.

Speaker 2 (38:47):
Is kind of going through the same thing.

Speaker 3 (38:48):
They're going through their fits, they're going through drops, they're
going through different coverages that they're adding. So this is
just taking what was installed today and then actually putting
it to use before you get into these teams and
seven on seven drills.

Speaker 2 (39:01):
What is an install meeting?

Speaker 4 (39:03):
Like?

Speaker 2 (39:03):
How long does that go?

Speaker 3 (39:05):
The ones I was a part of hours it is
for the younger players, it's it's just a lot to
take in For Jill Burrow and veterans. It's all stuff
that you install each and every year you just kind
of rewrite the install and where you need to be
and then add some some wrinkles to it. But I
mean our minimum hours max, right.

Speaker 2 (39:26):
I mean it's a Is that a lot in one hour?
How many concepts are you going over?

Speaker 3 (39:31):
The problem is you only probably get about five to
ten concepts in the hour because they're just so when
you think of it, all, right, here's the concepts, So
here's our alignment. This is the personnel grouping we're going
to run it out of. How many multiple personnel groupings
can you run it out of? Is everyone on the
same page? What protection is being attached to the concept?
What depth of the are the wide receivers getting to?

(39:54):
What do the wide receivers have to adjust if you're
getting one high verse too high? Who's hot versus blue?
It's you know, all of these things. So you're spending
a ton of time on one concept throughout the preseason
just to make sure that you have answers to everything.

Speaker 2 (40:08):
And that's in one meeting. Yeah, one one hour meeting. Yeah. Wow,
it's a lot. And that happens every day during camp.

Speaker 3 (40:16):
Yeah, every day during camp and then a lot of
the preseason two, a lot of the the off season two.

Speaker 2 (40:21):
So that's that process begins during OTAs, during mini camp.

Speaker 3 (40:26):
Yep, you're installing as soon as you get into any
of the off season programs. You're starting your install then,
just to try to get a leg up, right, But
you're obviously not able to put it to use like
they are now until you get to training camp and
things like that.

Speaker 2 (40:38):
Yeah, does that process at all continue once the real
games begin?

Speaker 3 (40:42):
No, So you put what you do is you put
in as much as humanly possible from a playbook standpoint,
and then you you you actually shrink the playbook down
week to week.

Speaker 4 (40:52):
Okay, but now you can.

Speaker 3 (40:53):
So now I have this vast playbook that I can
pick and choose from based on what Washington does a
majority of the time. So, hey, Washington's more of a
one high man. Look, we're gonna grab all these concepts
and this is going to be in the game plan
this week. So you want to put as much in
as possible and then make it simplified moreed.

Speaker 4 (41:11):
When the regular season starts.

Speaker 3 (41:12):
Right, So once you get into the game by game preparation,
the playbook actually shrinks down a lot.

Speaker 2 (41:18):
I'm sure you haven't. Never have you ever sat in
on the defensive meeting.

Speaker 3 (41:21):
No, no, no, I like picking defensive player and coaches brains. Yes,
you know, hey, you know we we ran that concept today.
Why'd you cover it this way? Or why did you
make those adjustments? We do that a lot, but never
sitting in because normally they're happening.

Speaker 2 (41:37):
At the same happened on the same time. So as
the offense is meeting to go over those route concepts,
what are those dbs doing same thing, same thing? How
they're covering each potential route content? Right?

Speaker 4 (41:50):
Coverages?

Speaker 3 (41:51):
You could talk about, you know, coverage combinations, because there's
you know, your basic stuff is, uh, cover two, cover three,
cover for man demand. But then you get into cover
six where one side of the field you're running quarters,
the other side you're running cover two. You know, you're
obviously trying to change up a lot. Then you get
into blitzes.

Speaker 2 (42:11):
Are we doing any of that here because they're dumbing
it down.

Speaker 4 (42:14):
Yeah, we dumb it down.

Speaker 3 (42:15):
I would imagine like in the defensive meetings, they just eat,
they have like pizza parties.

Speaker 2 (42:21):
Let's just make sure we have eleven guys on the field,
they do pizza parties at the defense. So they're doing
the hard work, the complex tough on offense.

Speaker 3 (42:30):
Huh you imagine like the defense like they get done
and they peek around in the offense is still meeting.
It's like, what else do you want to do?

Speaker 2 (42:37):
Do we have snow cones today? Get out early because
I have lunch somewhere. No, because you can't do that
because you don't want to.

Speaker 3 (42:45):
You don't want to leave and be like, well they're
not but any working. You're just sitting there like, well,
who's ordering pizza? Do we door dashing today?

Speaker 2 (42:52):
During the course of a game week, how many hours
are you spending in a meeting? Oh, it's a team meeting,
position group meeting. Meeting is an offense.

Speaker 3 (43:01):
I would say when you start on Monday, I would
say you average three hours a day of just meetings.

Speaker 2 (43:07):
Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday.

Speaker 3 (43:09):
Yeah, so leading up to a game I would say
fifteen to twenty hours your meeting during the week.

Speaker 2 (43:13):
One of my goals in life is to never have
a job where I have to be in a lot
of meetings. Well, you're in a good one now. You
never meet correct, which is why NFL football player does.
Let's like this part looks fun. Yeah, the part where
I'm sitting in a meeting for three hours every day.

Speaker 3 (43:29):
Yeah, thanks, This was the part I hated. I hated
the walk through aspect.

Speaker 2 (43:33):
Becau's just so slow, right, Like it does look tedious.

Speaker 3 (43:36):
Yeah, And there are times throughout the day, like when
they're meeting in the morning or in this case in
the afternoon, they'll meet and then at times go onto
the game field and just walk through stuff with jim
shoes on, right, so you can actually see it in action. Okay,
So there's a lot of time you're you're doing that
those types of things on the field.

Speaker 2 (43:53):
Night we are an hour in the books eight e
dorn Window, Tony and Training Camp Show since he three
to sixty coming up at noon, and then The Moegger
Show at three o'clock. Here on the official home of
the Bengals, ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station and.

Speaker 5 (44:08):
The fifty thousand lot orange and black home of the
Cincinnati Bengals, Cincinnati's espwenty fifteen thirty.

Speaker 1 (44:15):
Live from Bengals Training Camp. This is a special edision
of the Tony and Mo Football Show. Brought to you
by AE Dorned Window. We sell the best and service
the rest. Also by Cincinnati Tax Resolution powered by TOE
five one three five one three TPH Oakley Greens. All
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(44:39):
from the airport, paint and body Quality of Yesterday, Knowledge
of Today broadcast Sarria and here's Tony and Mo on
the ESPN fifteen thirty, the official home of the Bengals.

Speaker 2 (44:52):
It's the second hour of the AE Dorn Window Tony
and Mo Training Camp Show, Live from Bengals Training Camp
under our tent. We're out side, we're practicing. It's I
mean we're not practicing. The Bengals are right in front
of us. Today's show is a service of a door
and window. They sell the best end service the rest.
Thanks to Adam Webber for sponsoring our broadcast and for
his support of the Cincinnati Bengals all these many years.

(45:16):
Tony Pike was with me since he three sixty. Coming
up in just about an hour, things are ratcheting up
a little bit. Tone.

Speaker 3 (45:23):
Yes, it looks like they're moving the ball here down
the field, which would mean we're getting a little bit
more of the unscripted looks that we've talked about. They
haven't done a ton at training camp, but when they have,
offense has.

Speaker 4 (45:35):
Won more often than not. From an unscripted point of.

Speaker 2 (45:37):
View, Yeah, when they've when they've done this, the offense
has had its way. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (45:41):
So second down, so Joe Burrow just made a pass
because he was under pressure. It gets caught, but it's
short of the first down. So they are going unscripted here,
which is an opportunity to to kind of call plays
on the fly, something out the see al Golden needs
to do more of, something the offense wants to do
more of. I'm sure it is interesting. First third down

(46:03):
we've seen today some AJ p Ryan comes in, which
would tell me probably a passing situation here on like
third and four. But I'm much more a fan of
the unscripted from a quarterback standpoint, because there are such
things as you know, playing the script when you talk
about what guys are able to do, and defenses study

(46:24):
that stuff and they look over different things that are coming.
So this this gives you the opportunity that you cannot cheat.
You have to react to what's happening, and we're just
reacting to Jamar Chase catching a really nice back shoulder
pass on third down.

Speaker 2 (46:36):
Yeah, that was actually good coverage on the far sideline.
It was really good coverage. Yeah, Yeah, it was really
good coverage. I think. Yeah that was Jamar Chase on
the far sideline from US. I believe that was Cam
Taylor Britt and the coverage was really really good. Offense
moving the ball, Well, here Jamar Chase is going to
do that to a whole lot of people. Yeah, now
we have a Chase Brown getting a carry and bursting through.

Speaker 3 (46:57):
That's the worst though, run plays in team drills where
there's no tackling because you're trusting these officials to just
come out and I guess decide where the tackle would
have happened at.

Speaker 2 (47:08):
Well, two plays prior to that, there was a checkdown
pass to Chase Brown. Yeah, and I don't I couldn't
tell who the defender was, but he would have been
able to pretty much to capitate Chase Brown if you
were allowed to. Yeah, Instead it went for like a
three yards. It looks like that was a little generous.
That was about a seven yard game on the round. Yeah, yeah,
sure it was.

Speaker 3 (47:28):
Do we have like a for this bro, we have
like a red zone sponsor we want to get to.
They've entered the oh And.

Speaker 2 (47:36):
Red zone, you know in recent years. Last year for
the Bengals it was the Miami University red Zone. Yeah,
we've had the Toyota red Zone. I think we've had
the Hines red Zone. Yeah, you know, we could just
make up our own spot. Do we want this to be?
Is there somebody you want to give a good plug to. No, No,
they've entered the red zone, though they haven't the red
zone and done so with uh, with relative ease, With

(47:59):
relative ease. Shamar Stewart lining up on the left side,
a guy that we've talked a lot about his his
impacts so far in camp, kind of got there, laid
on the tackle.

Speaker 3 (48:10):
I have I've yet to see at this point, and
I've not been like looking Hardcrod, I've yet to see
Trey Hendrickson.

Speaker 4 (48:17):
Out here today.

Speaker 2 (48:18):
Uh. I think he is.

Speaker 3 (48:20):
I think that's him behind the offense over there, watching
the defense get marched on right now.

Speaker 2 (48:27):
Over there by bj Yah right now, And I see
him right now.

Speaker 4 (48:29):
He's a good.

Speaker 2 (48:30):
Teammate, being a good teammate's helping out the offense. Yeah,
he's He's given some pointers to to Joe, Here's here's
what I would have done to you on that play, Joe,
there's like six, there's there's t Higgins catching a touchdown
pass directly in front of Jordan Battle.

Speaker 4 (48:49):
That.

Speaker 3 (48:49):
Uh, that reminded me a lot of both things I
saw against Philly. The offense go right down the field
and the opposing offense go right down the field.

Speaker 2 (48:56):
On the Bengals defense, the theme of that game against
Philip was not much resistant. We just watched and we
did just watch it. On the difference is that's arguably them,
that's arguably the best offense in the NFL. That's not
Tanner McKeon company.

Speaker 4 (49:11):
Tanner's not starting in the NFL.

Speaker 2 (49:13):
No, No, he's not. Joe Burrow is not only starting
in the NFL, he might be the best player to
what do you think Tanner McKee would have been on
the QB Tears ahead of if you, if you, if
you just would have watched Thursday, and if you just
would have listened to the people who carry water for
the Bengals making excuses for them, you would think Tanner
McKee is right there with Burrow and Allen and Lamar

(49:34):
Jackson and Patrick Yeah Tier two, Yeah, just maybe tied
with Jalen Hurt, so I think was tier two.

Speaker 4 (49:40):
Yeah, seems to make sense. Look at this.

Speaker 2 (49:43):
Who were you guys just des Ritter getting the second
team reps today?

Speaker 4 (49:47):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (49:47):
Yeah, sure is he? Sure is how we're cooking? Interesting? Interesting?

Speaker 4 (49:53):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (49:54):
Well, you know, yesterday we were talking about Jake Browning
attempting to throw passes with his left arm YEP, and
I guess maybe that didn't work.

Speaker 4 (50:00):
Yeah, maybe they didn't like that on the film.

Speaker 2 (50:02):
Maybe didn't like that on the film.

Speaker 4 (50:03):
And see Macpherson at safety today.

Speaker 2 (50:05):
Didn't like what they saw in the film from him
in the preseason game against Philly, and so you know,
perhaps perhaps Dez has a chance to make a statement here.

Speaker 3 (50:12):
You know, second short really appropriate time for a play
action deep ball or.

Speaker 2 (50:18):
You know a patent quarterback run.

Speaker 3 (50:20):
Yeah, there's the play action and there's no blocking.

Speaker 2 (50:27):
Dez.

Speaker 4 (50:29):
I don't think Dez was getting out of that one.

Speaker 2 (50:31):
As they lost de Dez could have pulled off the
boomeras size and type fake. Yeah, it was still gonna
end up in disaster. That was what do you call
that party? Party in the backfield? Yes, party in the backfield.
Kids against old Dez.

Speaker 3 (50:46):
We haven't made mention of him much, but I don't
think that was Cordell Volson's best rep Courtell Guard.

Speaker 2 (50:52):
I don't know if there is a player in camp,
and now I think about this relative to how much
we have focused on the offensive line, I don't know
that there is a player in camp that has been
paid attention to less than Cordell Vowls that started last year. Yes,
that's crazy.

Speaker 3 (51:09):
Yes, I mean started on one of the most prolific
offenses in the NFL, that had a triple Crown winner
and the best statistical season of Joe Burrow. And we
have not mentioned him at all in camp.

Speaker 2 (51:20):
I mean aside from I think Danna wrote a piece
about him during the summer, you know, because he was
asked to take a pay cut and he did, and
you know all that, but beyond that, you certainly didn't
really you weren't wowed by him in the preseason game. Yeah,
we haven't seen him do anything that would make you
want to talk about him here during practice, And.

Speaker 3 (51:39):
We've talked about guard play needing help, yes, and we've
not brought him.

Speaker 2 (51:43):
Up at all, and we haven't even like considered the
possibility that that help could come in the form of
a guy who started right I think every game last year.
That's incredible. What a fall, which so that would suggest
that perhaps his place on the roster is ten years.

Speaker 4 (52:00):
I would think. So we'll find out.

Speaker 2 (52:05):
There's no a fan catching the pass and barreling his
way through a bunch of guys who aren't allowed to tackle.

Speaker 4 (52:13):
That's just put your shoulders down.

Speaker 2 (52:15):
He'd put his shoulders down, hands on the football and said,
you guys can't tackle me. So I'll just see if
I can clip one of you with my shoulder.

Speaker 4 (52:22):
Great ball protection.

Speaker 3 (52:24):
Absolutely what you want to say, Absolutely, absolutely, I will
say it.

Speaker 2 (52:28):
Joe Burrow is back a quarterback.

Speaker 3 (52:30):
It hasn't been much chunk plays though. No, it's been
short intermediate stuff for the most part that we've seen today.

Speaker 2 (52:36):
After this point, it's been dink and dunk, which you
know that this we've talked about how teams are going
to play the Bengals, you know, rush for a drop
seven and if that's the case, you know, it's exactly
what you got to do. Exactly.

Speaker 3 (52:50):
That's the that's really I think one of the first
times this camp we've seen the preston at penalties false
start there defense was showing a pressure late off line
got a little bit, uh, a little bit star crazy.

Speaker 2 (53:03):
We have officials working today's practice in shorts, in short
in shorts, officials in shorts. I don't know why they
can't wear shorts like in September when it's still really hot.
I don't either, What's what why?

Speaker 3 (53:12):
It's the same rule with golfers, Like why golfers can't
wear shorts?

Speaker 2 (53:15):
Well, like the coaches on the sideline. Yeah, Like if
I was an NFL head coach, I would petition. Look,
I got to stand there and ninety degrees out in
September on a Sunday one o'clock is another false start?

Speaker 3 (53:26):
Yeah, sure it is back to back pre snap penalties.
Now offense is going in the wrong direction. That was
a delay of game.

Speaker 2 (53:32):
How do you get at the game in a training camp?

Speaker 3 (53:35):
Ractice can't practice. Officials are spotting the ball way too quick.

Speaker 2 (53:38):
Huh. I'm sure this is going over well with number nine. Yeah,
I didn't get the playing on time. Interesting, all right?

Speaker 3 (53:47):
You want to get underneath number nine's skin. Put into
a lot of second twelve.

Speaker 2 (53:53):
And then you want to get under my skin. Run
the ball on second to twelve if they go second
long run now throwing it. Yeah, Burrow.

Speaker 4 (54:04):
And Joe just got hit on that play.

Speaker 2 (54:07):
He's down. I mean he's watched the offense run toward him. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (54:13):
I don't know which defender it was, if he actually
tackled him or just fell into him.

Speaker 2 (54:17):
So Joe hit the deck and then got up very
quickly and kind of ran away from the crowd of
players that ran over. I'm guessing to a cost, the
defender who brought him to the ground.

Speaker 3 (54:31):
Shamar Stewart was in the area. I don't know if
it was him that actually, and I don't want to
say they tackled him. I think they lost their balance
and and the momentum carry. But when you look back,
I mean that defender was on top of Joe Burrow.
When that's not what you want to see a training camp.

Speaker 2 (54:46):
No, no, no no. But when you're doing you're Shamar
Stewart and you have four and a half sacks in
your college football career, maybe you're a little bit tempted.

Speaker 3 (54:55):
To I'm not the way to make a name this
narrative instantly, that is a uh. That was that was
as about of a tense training camp moment as you
can get And that was followed up with unbelievable pressure
on Joe Burrow on that one. He had to get
the rid of the ball early and the defense got
to stop.

Speaker 2 (55:12):
And then I think that was a nice pass break.
Was that Marco Wilson? Man? Is that Marco Wilson running
down on on a ball intended for Jamar Chase?

Speaker 3 (55:20):
That ball had to come out way earlier than what
he wanted because of pressure in his face. Yeah, that
was not the offensive line's best series.

Speaker 2 (55:28):
No, that wasn't the offense as a hole penalties.

Speaker 3 (55:31):
Yeah, Joe Burrow was on his back, which can never
happen in a in a camp practice, right, and uh
then pressure.

Speaker 2 (55:38):
In his face? N interesting, So now that's not ideal. No,
but we're going back to dez Ritter.

Speaker 3 (55:44):
But good job by the defense. Yes, defense gotta stop
and they dumbed it down a little bit there.

Speaker 2 (55:49):
And you mentioned something that's important that Shamar Stewart was in.

Speaker 3 (55:52):
The backfield, Yeah, which has been a get clarification. What
I like most is like all the media members who
are videoingplayer now scouring their phones to see who actually
came up with the hit, right.

Speaker 4 (56:08):
You don't want to be that player.

Speaker 2 (56:11):
No, I mean one of that.

Speaker 4 (56:16):
That was nerve wracking.

Speaker 2 (56:19):
Yeah, I mean whenever you see your starting quarterback, especially
if it's Joe Burrow on his back hit the deck
what I after a pass. What I loved about that
was the offensive players who are not involved in this
drill standing on the sideline all charged out onto the field,
which in years past hasn't been the case. Which in
a regular season game you're not allowed to as.

Speaker 4 (56:37):
A penalty, but in a.

Speaker 3 (56:40):
Practice setting, I'm surprised we didn't see more of a
of a melee there.

Speaker 2 (56:45):
Perhaps it was acknowledged it was a mistake, somebody lost
their balance, maybe he was shoved into them. Man, but
that would go down, I think is the scariest moment
of training camp so far, without a doubt. And then
the next the next play he got rid of the ball.
But we have another pre snab penalty. Oh boy, oh boy,
that's going to be Cordell Volson there. We talked about him,

(57:09):
Cordel Volson with the fall start penalty.

Speaker 4 (57:15):
Yeah, this is uh, this has not been the uh.

Speaker 3 (57:19):
You know that this practice was built as one that
you want to get a lot of your major work in.

Speaker 4 (57:23):
You want to do a lot of evaluating.

Speaker 2 (57:25):
Uh huh.

Speaker 3 (57:26):
The team drills that we've seen to this point have
not been a great great start.

Speaker 2 (57:31):
Well, we had the offense moved though the first team
alls moved them all pretty pretty well. That last drive
was but there's been some slop with penalties fall starts
for somehow. We had one leg game another penalty. See
this is this is where they need to make up
the refs like they do in a regular season game
so we can find out exactly who the guilty party was.

Speaker 3 (57:53):
We have seen the exact same thing happened on the
last two series. Second down fall start, second down delay game.
All of a sudden, you're in a second or third
and long scenario.

Speaker 2 (58:06):
Des Ridder remains in a quarterback with Jake Browning, perhaps
watching his Bengals career fall apart in front of him
as des Masters the second team offense in the shot
on Dez is looking to go deep instead throws a checkdown.
That's Tanner Hudson, I believe.

Speaker 4 (58:23):
All preseason Tanner Hudson.

Speaker 2 (58:25):
Tanner Hudson had a really nice game, played a lot
of snaps, had a really nice game, had a lot
of snaps in the game against the Philadelphia Eagles. Tight
end on this team is suddenly interesting. Yeah, with the
addition of Noah fen it's an interesting position.

Speaker 3 (58:40):
We talked a lot about twelve personnel and what that
brings to the table. That that is. Now, that was
a third down checkdown from from des Ritter. Yeah, defense win.

Speaker 2 (58:53):
Defense won that one touchdown drive after that, and like
on that play it was I mean, he went through
his progressions, was nothing, there was nothing downfield that was
really good coverage, and then he checked down to Tanner
Hudson for what would have been a very small game
certainly not good enough to pick up the first down.
So I think we would call that a win for

(59:14):
the defense. Yeah, defense one, Defense wins that one. All right,
it's a quarter after eleven. It's the eight e dooran
Window Tony and Mo Training Camp Show, broadcasting live as
you could tell from today's Bengals training camp practice. Since
E three to sixty comes your way at noon. Don't
forget Monday night. We've got the Bengals and Commanders in Washington.
That game will kick off at eight o'clock and we'll

(59:36):
have it for you live on ESPN fifteen thirty. It's
sixteen after eleven o'clock Tonyan Mo Training Camp Show on
ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Stations.

Speaker 5 (59:45):
Our ESPN fifteen thirty Orange and Block hotline is built
by Racing Claire Roofing your Homes Trusted Problem Solver.

Speaker 2 (59:55):
Twenty minutes after eleven o'clock, it's the eight e dooran
Window Tony and Mo Training Camp Show. Thanks to eighty
Door and Window as well as Oakley Greens all the
sports all the time, as well as Top five one, three,
five three. Oh and we also are broadcasting from the
airport Painted Body broadcast area. A nice area. It's a

(01:00:17):
very nice area, and we use the Ray Saint Clair
Roofing Hotline. What are we watching right now?

Speaker 3 (01:00:21):
Tone back to special teams, back to more special much
like we described with the offensive and defensive walkthroughs earlier
from Install, similar stuff going on here.

Speaker 2 (01:00:32):
They are this is this is kickoff full go. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:00:35):
The uh, the the defenders in this scenario or the
kick return team. They all have pads, so you're not
hitting or anything like that. You're gonna hit with the pads.
But just a a kickoff team. I wouldn't even say
full speed, more of a little bit of a walk
through here.

Speaker 2 (01:00:51):
How many speeding tickets have you gotten in your life? One? One? One? One?

Speaker 4 (01:00:56):
Was it when I was at UC?

Speaker 2 (01:01:00):
How fast were you going? I think it was like
sixty and forty miles? Garrett got his eighth citation for speeding.

Speaker 4 (01:01:06):
How is that even possible?

Speaker 2 (01:01:07):
Since joining the NFL. Most recently got a one ticket
for going one hundred miles an hour in a sixty
mile an hour zone in northeast Ohia. Time to just
get yourself a driver, you know. So I got a
speeding ticket in high school. I got a speeding ticket
in college. I got two speeding tickets in two thousand

(01:01:31):
and six. Yeah, because I got them like in consecutive weekends. Nice.
I got one in front of Molar High School in
two thousand and four. Doesn't it like jack up your
insurance and rates? It screws up your insurance. So if
you've had that many, if your miles Garrett. The most
recent one I got was in Indiana driving to a
UC Notre Dame basketball game in two thousand and eight.
So it's been a while. Yeah, So I am not

(01:01:52):
one to comment on someone's led foot, although it has
been seventeen years since I've gotten one. I don't know
that I've ever been forty over.

Speaker 3 (01:01:59):
No again, just have a driver. You're Miles Garrett, right,
why are you driving anyway? Sit in the back of
your car and do whatever you need to do on
the way to wherever you're going.

Speaker 2 (01:02:11):
He also flipped a purse three times while speeding trying
to avoid an animal three years ago. George Costanza, I
don't know that I'm getting in a car driven by
Miles Garrett.

Speaker 4 (01:02:22):
Probably not.

Speaker 2 (01:02:23):
He'll get you there quick, but you know not.

Speaker 3 (01:02:25):
Maybe you know, when they gave him all that money
that they did, maybe they could, you know, implement a
clause where he doesn't drive.

Speaker 2 (01:02:30):
Anymore wow one hundred mph?

Speaker 3 (01:02:33):
Because if you're the Browns, like you have to be
at some point like dude, right, guaranteeing you all this money?

Speaker 2 (01:02:38):
Yes, what are you doing? Could so, as I recall,
if you go more than twenty five over, you have
to go to traffic school, right, yeah, and you get
your license taken away.

Speaker 3 (01:02:46):
And there's never a point where I'll be on like
the road and be like, I want to try to
get this to one hundred real quick.

Speaker 2 (01:02:52):
Oh I have, but I haven't done it like that.
I've wanted to go one hundred months.

Speaker 3 (01:02:57):
Just doesn't cross my mind to be like, yeah, yeah,
you get home from work like, hey bad.

Speaker 2 (01:03:02):
You've only had one ticket. One ticket, so you've never
had to go to traffic school. Now. I had to
go to traffic school in Newport. No, this is as
a result of the speeding ticket I got in high school.
I had to go to never again. Yeah, because there's
a lot of people in traffic school who are there
for reasons that aren't you know, just ay sped, Like
there's in four hours and the teacher is not friendly. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:03:24):
I think my dad last year didn't renew his license,
uh huh, and it got to a point where it
went over the a lot of times, so he had
to retake all his driving courses.

Speaker 2 (01:03:32):
I was my last beating ticket. I was driving. I
think that's like Route two thirty one where you go
north of Indy to South Bend. Uc was playing a
basketball game and I was in a hurry and the
guy pulled me over and I had like my stuff waiting,
and I said to him, and I wasn't being a
smart ass, but I said like, hey, officer, I'm in
a real hurry. And he's like that's exactly why I
pulled over. That's cool. Can you just do what you

(01:03:55):
gotta do right the ticket.

Speaker 3 (01:03:57):
I've had countless times where maybe I'm like, you know,
I'm going thirty five or forty and it turns to
a twenty five and I see a cop and there's that.

Speaker 4 (01:04:04):
Moment where you're holding your breath.

Speaker 3 (01:04:05):
Yeah, And then I look in the backseat and like
the kids are back there, and I'm like, how could
I potentially use them to get out of something that
may be occurring.

Speaker 2 (01:04:14):
Have you ever talked your way out of a ticket?

Speaker 4 (01:04:16):
I have, Yeah, I did. I did it last year.
It's crazy.

Speaker 3 (01:04:21):
Last year, I was coming back from a UC football
game with Wilder, my son in the back, and my
brother Devin was with me, and I legit probably rolled
through a stop sign when I was getting off the
exit into Redding, and I would I probably drove like
four blocks and never heard the cop behind me. He

(01:04:43):
claims that his lights were on, but at the middle
of the day, I didn't hear a siren. Finally, when
I did, I pulled into like a bank and Redding
and he like pulls into the side of me and
like was approaching the car like ready to draw his weapon,
like thought that I was of evading him, right or
eluding him, and so like he comes and gets my information.

(01:05:04):
You know, Wilder's crying in the back. I'm like, he's like,
what are you doing? I was like, I just worked
a game coming home. He's like, do you know why
I stopped you? I was like, no, he rolled that.
You rolled the stop sign and then you evaded me
for four blocks, and I'm like, I can assure you
I wasn't evading. Like if I was evading you, I
would have tried to speed off like I was going
twenty five. I just didn't see you behind me, right,

(01:05:25):
And he was very stand offish and then went back
to his car, and I think ran my information and
then I, as that was happening, got one of the
reading police guys that I know, and by the time
he had come back, he was like, you're good.

Speaker 2 (01:05:40):
To go, mister Pike. Very nice, Okay, okay, I wasn't
trying to evade you. You weren't going one hundred in
a seit. I thought things were about to like, like
why is he approaching me like that? Interesting? I've never
had anything like that. But anyway, Miles Garrett making news
in the NFL for shout out to Miles Garrett one
hundred nph in a sixty Slow it down, just a
little bit, low it down, just uh, just my first

(01:06:02):
beating ticket. I'll never forget it. It was the Saturday morning
that the Bengals drafted ka John A. Carter number one overall. Oh,
you were just excited. I was. It was the morning
after our senior prom I was driving home, still still
have my ducks on man at seven in the morning.

Speaker 4 (01:06:19):
That's a county.

Speaker 2 (01:06:21):
Police officer pulls me over. What's up? Like, I got
to get home to watch the draft. We just trade
it up to take John Carter. No, No, let me off. No,
He's like, well, where are you been? Like problem was
last night? You know? He's like, well, do you have
a good time. I'm like, yeah, I really did. That's

(01:06:42):
why I'm driving in my tucks in seventh.

Speaker 4 (01:06:44):
I got to get home, watched.

Speaker 2 (01:06:46):
The draft, so I got the whole like, well, we
expected you home a little bit sooner than you know. Eight,
I'm like, well, did you expect me to not to
have one of these? And I held up my ticket
and I had got a traffic school am all right, Well,
that was a great segment. What do wean we're still
watching kickoff returns?

Speaker 3 (01:07:00):
Why we're doing that segment because it's still special I
don't have to take it anything away from special teams.
It's important, but it's just not too great for, you know,
to be able to describe what's going on as Evian
McPherson just keeps kicking the ball.

Speaker 2 (01:07:12):
Yeah, well that's what he does. He's a kicker. They
tried him in safety yesterday and yeah, didn't work out.
Evan McPherson did nail home a fifty one yard field
goal against Philadelphia. Not an insignificant development.

Speaker 3 (01:07:23):
No, that that needs to get back to being the
norm where you see him take the field for a
fifty plus yarder and you think, okay, we got this right.
Joe Burrow needs that right for you know, third down
management inside the thirty five yard line as well.

Speaker 2 (01:07:36):
All right, it's twenty eight minutes after eleven o'clock. It's
the A. E. Dorn Window, Tony and Mo Football Show.
That segment a service of the Ohio Highway Patrol on
ESPN fifteen thirty. Cincinnati sports station Dinata has just made
your day. It's twenty nine away from noon. It's the
Ae Doran Window, Tony and Mo Football Show on ESPN

(01:07:57):
fifteen thirty. Now, one bad thing just happened, One good
thing just happened. The good is our guy. Jim Mooring
from the Holy Grail brought us lunch. Holy Grail the
home of our pregame coverage starting on September the fourteenth. Yeah,
every one o'clock games, we start at nine am. No

(01:08:17):
better plays to post up today. Today would be a
great day to go to the Grail five ten reds game.
So you cut off work, you go to the ball
game and then you watch train.

Speaker 3 (01:08:27):
You get trained, get train, and you know, we asked
the question where are where are all the UC folks.
We haven't heard many people that are going to Nebraska, right,
Obviously they're gonna be at the Holy Ground.

Speaker 2 (01:08:36):
Don't go to Nebraska, though, go to Kansas City. Yeah,
Kansas City. They go to the Holy Grail.

Speaker 3 (01:08:40):
They got the Chad Brendle's got the UC season opener
watch party against Nebraska.

Speaker 2 (01:08:45):
Two weeks from tomorrow. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:08:47):
Yeah, since he lights swag is gonna be on displays,
going to be unbelievable. They got giveaways. It's essentially not
just the home for NFL, Grail's a home for college
football as well.

Speaker 2 (01:08:57):
The Grail is the home for Cincinnati Sports yess Bengals,
college football, college basketball, and no better place. I got
the turkey bacon rap, you got the chicken tenders. Yeah,
I'm trying something new today, really switching it.

Speaker 4 (01:09:09):
Up, trying out the chicken tenders.

Speaker 2 (01:09:11):
Can't beat that, all right, that's that's the good thing
that happened. The good thing that happened is Jim Mooring
showed up with lunch. Yes. The bad news is we
had what another false start on the offensive line? How
many is that today? Three false starts?

Speaker 3 (01:09:23):
Two delay of games and Joe Burrow being on the
ground once and he just got these are not the things.
But maybe that's because the defense is is stepping up.

Speaker 2 (01:09:36):
Is that because I'll get another another whistle.

Speaker 3 (01:09:39):
Time out, I'll go and just use one of his timeouts? Maybe,
though maybe the offense could have done that before the
delay game penalty.

Speaker 2 (01:09:47):
Do you get unlimited timeouts during an I think you're
just just as many as you want. Yeah, okay, not,
you would say, to this stage of the day, not
a great day for the offensive line.

Speaker 3 (01:10:00):
Not a good day for the offensive line. Even the
touchdown drive we saw was a lot of quick release,
sure get the ball out of your hands type stuff
from Joe Burrow. So yeah, it's it's not been their
best work yet. I think we have seen a little
bit more of the defense today showing a little pressure,
know whether they bring it or not, but it has
resulted in some of those false start penalties from the
offensive line. Right when you got guys, you see those

(01:10:23):
double A gap blitzes a lot now very hard to
decipher by the way, the double A gap because you
have to treat it like they're gonna come and they're
gonna blitz. You've got to change up your protection schemes.

Speaker 2 (01:10:32):
But now you're you're talking about two defenders kind of
planning up to blitz right up the center over the center. Yeah,
because you have to respect it like they're going to blitz.
And when you do that, you're changing your protection. You're
changing who you're hot. So it changes like you have
to communicate more. The receivers have to be on the
same page. The running back the old line with protection,
It does change a lot when you see that that

(01:10:52):
that pressure, especially up the middle.

Speaker 4 (01:10:54):
Another sack.

Speaker 3 (01:10:55):
Why Why wouldn't that was Joseph Osai beating Lucas Patrick.

Speaker 2 (01:10:58):
Yeah, and a and a pass down the right sideline
that falls out of bounds. If you're playing against the
Bengals and their offensive line, understanding their weaknesses on the interior,
why wouldn't you double a gap blitz?

Speaker 3 (01:11:12):
Like every time you see more and more teams doing
that now because of that, you know, and just by
lining up in the in the double a gap doesn't
mean you got a blitz. You're gonna see more teams
that line up there just to get the check from
the offense and then bail out of there and still
rush four or maybe even three at times that that's
sometimes like you see games where you'll say, man, they
only rush three or four. Why is the tight end

(01:11:33):
blocking the defensive end right? Well, that's because they forced
the offense to change the protection. It was misread. And
now all of a sudden, you've got Tanner Hudson blocking
Miles Garrett instead of Orlando Brown Junior blocking Miles Garrett.

Speaker 2 (01:11:45):
We've got Dez ritterback in a quarterback. I'm not sure.
During eleven on eleven I've seen Jake Brownington no it's
it's been. It's been burrowing Ritter at this point, statements
being made, it's being made. You know, Jake is just
standing over there in the end zone. He's paying attention.
He's not like he's not dressed though, He's not like
he can't. I mean, he's not like he hasn't gone
through individual drills. But des Ritard for his third series

(01:12:07):
out there running the Bengals office.

Speaker 3 (01:12:09):
This is the point though about camp where I I'm
curious because we just saw Joseph O Said make a
great play and ultimately sacked Joe Burrow. Is that because
the defense is making strides or is it because the
offensive line is not where it needs to be.

Speaker 2 (01:12:25):
Well, I'll tell you what I see, and you know
a lot more about this than I do. I see
decent pressure being applied to the quarterback. I also think
I see pretty good coverage. Yeah, I certainly think I
saw it on that play and they check down. I
think we've seen the secondary today, which I don't think
we've seen a pass completed over ten yards. No, we
haven't seen. We saw the back shoulder throw on the

(01:12:48):
opposite side lines of Jamar Chase on the very first
drive and I think that was the longest completion. So
you know, the term coverage sack is going to come
to mind. I think we've seen over the course of
these what they've been four or five eleven on eleven drives.
I think we've seen good downfield coverage by the Bengals, which, Yeah,
that's an encouraging sign, right. Another that is not a

(01:13:11):
very encouraging sign.

Speaker 4 (01:13:13):
Another delay a game, like.

Speaker 3 (01:13:17):
How how does that happening? And how is there not
more urgency? Like this is not an officiating thing officials
are doing with their they're sure, yeah, and forced the rules,
spot the ball and start the clock? How and and
and the fact that the thing is Zach Taylor is
ten yards behind the huddle, Like there's not communication issues.

(01:13:38):
They are just moving entirely too slow in and out
of the huddle.

Speaker 2 (01:13:45):
That's happening right now with des Ritter at quarterback. It
was also happening with Joe Burrow at quarterback. Yeah, both
first and second team right now. So can you can you,
like I asked her rhetorically, how does that happen? I'll
ask you from the standpoint of somebody who's played quarterback,
how does that happen?

Speaker 4 (01:14:02):
Uncertainty.

Speaker 3 (01:14:03):
Maybe you maybe in getting the playout, you mess up
some of the verbiage of getting the playout. Maybe someone
lines up in the wrong spot. Maybe you've got to
change protection and you're unsure of what you're seeing, so
it takes a little bit more time to do so.
But all of that stems from uncertainty, whether it's formation,
whether it's pressure, whether it's what your responsibility is, what

(01:14:24):
the protection is, that's causing a lot of these delay
of games we've seen.

Speaker 2 (01:14:28):
Today, Joe Burrow is back at quarterback as the Bengals
call a run play that would have gotten next to nothing.
That would have gotten next to nothing with Chase Brown.
That was well defended. Yeah, that was well defended. That
was again very well blocked.

Speaker 3 (01:14:41):
That was the one offensive drive we've seen resulted in
a touchdown was short quick passing. Since then, anytime they've
tried to get anything developing down the field, there has
been too much pressure on Joe Burrow that he's either
got to throw it away or check it down.

Speaker 2 (01:15:00):
And now we have some motion out to the left
and Burrow it's got some time to throw there, throws
a pass that t Higgins makes a diving catch for
but they call it incomplete.

Speaker 3 (01:15:08):
Even that though Burrow's having to move in the pocket right, Like,
there's just not the clean pocket that you want to
see right now from an offensive line point of view.

Speaker 2 (01:15:17):
All right, So can I like go glass half full
and say the Bengals up front are winning at the
point of attack on defense.

Speaker 3 (01:15:24):
That that the only the only hesitation is we've seen
that throughout training camp at different times, right, And then
the game came and they got outmanned by second third
teamers up front for Philly. Right, So is that a
is that an offensive line detriment? Is that the defense improving?
For glass half full, we'll say the defense is improving.

Speaker 2 (01:15:43):
Okay, Okay, we'll go that's a sack.

Speaker 4 (01:15:47):
That's gonna be another sack on Burrow.

Speaker 2 (01:15:48):
Here's a pass down field who's running for his life
in and out of the arms of t Higgins another
three and out two defenders there. That's in a in
a game setting what we just saw as a sack. Yeah,
So how many sacks at least three, at least three?
How many penalties either fall star six total or delay
a game?

Speaker 4 (01:16:06):
Six total penalties?

Speaker 2 (01:16:07):
And that's the fifth drive We've seen three by three
with Joe's quarterback and two with Dez.

Speaker 3 (01:16:13):
We've seen one touchdown drive and the other four drives
have not yielded a first down.

Speaker 2 (01:16:17):
Interesting.

Speaker 3 (01:16:18):
Maybe Al Golden is just are you're giving the D
back into his name today?

Speaker 2 (01:16:23):
I will set Ol Golden gold today it's Al Golden
because the D has shown up. Maybe they're confusing Joe
and Dez. Maybe Al Golden is going, you know what,
we're We're not gonna dumb it down as much. We're
going to expand what.

Speaker 4 (01:16:37):
This has expanded. Al Golden defense.

Speaker 3 (01:16:41):
We did see Al Golden talk to Mike Brown before
practice today. Uh huh, got called over on the golf cart.
Maybe it was like, hey, time to time to take
the training wheels off.

Speaker 2 (01:16:49):
Yeah, congratulations on your Broils award. But this same college
football pal, why did it take eight months for them
to get the Broyls Award to Yeah, that's a great question, right,
great question. Couldn't have presented that to him like a
week after they named him the top assistant coach in
college football? Yeah, eight months later, he finally gets hard work.

Speaker 3 (01:17:07):
Timing couldn't have been worse after you just gave up
four to five to the second third teamers for Philming.

Speaker 2 (01:17:11):
You're telling that video of the Bengals. At least there
are players in that meeting room, like, mam, is this
the worst a coach of college football? All right, let's
get a first down here. We've got Dez back behind center.
We're we're both big Des Ritder fans. Is there is
there a legitimate reason we haven't talked about why Dez

(01:17:33):
is getting all the second team snaps.

Speaker 4 (01:17:35):
I think it's just a day.

Speaker 3 (01:17:36):
I think you're you're trying to evaluate as much as
possible today. Okay, and you've had years to evaluate Jake Browning,
you know what he is. You like what Dez did
in the first preseason game. You're probably just wanting to
give him more reps that you can actually evaluate.

Speaker 2 (01:17:48):
Okay, you know Jake Browning got a lot in the
in the preseason game as well.

Speaker 3 (01:17:52):
You've seen him in more games. Give Des an opportunity
with some some live bulleteer to actually pick up a
first down for the offense. Yeah, that's a that's a
sight to see move the chains a little bit. I
thought we'd have so much more action down here.

Speaker 2 (01:18:10):
I really did. Yeah, because I never crossed they have
across the fifty on us. Jordan More catching the pass
on a quick slant from Des River. All right, well,
moving a little bit closer to us. I wanted to
see some action if you're yeah, obviously.

Speaker 3 (01:18:23):
I'd like to see a pass that goes, you know,
over twenty yards right in the air.

Speaker 2 (01:18:27):
Yeah. Uh. They're working on the far side of the
field from us, working towards us. There's a pass over
the middle that falls in and out of the arms
of Is that Gary Brightwell?

Speaker 3 (01:18:42):
I think sorry, Gary Brightwell, who had a nice, nice
return he did in the game, showed a little explosiveness
he did.

Speaker 2 (01:18:51):
Like that.

Speaker 3 (01:18:51):
That right there, in a nutshell is one of the
plays that Des has to take the next step. That's
a check down over the middle. You can't throw it
ninety miles an hour. Yeah, that's a I mean, you
got to understand that's a running back, right, make it
a very catchable ball and let him fall forward for
a yard or two. Even on that, that's a quick
swing there. That the ball placement is where Dez needs
to to just improve just a little bit.

Speaker 2 (01:19:12):
Kendrick Pryor with the wide receiver, the quick toss to
they wed we made us living on that ne Yes,
that exact play, Brian. They didn't.

Speaker 3 (01:19:22):
He didn't even care if the ball had a spiral
to it. He wants the ball out quick and he
wants the receiver to not break stride right. If you've
got to reach low or it takes a while to
load up, the defense has more time to react. You're
calling that and running it because you're out flanking the defense. Right,
you've got more numbers. They've got numbers in the box,
you've got numbers outside. In all likelihood, that's a tag

(01:19:43):
you always get tagged in in most sets of a
running play. That if the box is loaded and there's
more defenders than you have blockers, you have that swing
automatically built in right. But if you throw that, you
better outflank the defense.

Speaker 2 (01:19:56):
Nice one handed catch by Gary bright Well and the
swing pad since he runs up the left side line
and then checks out. So the the offense with desert
or a quarterback is moving it a little bit here. Nothing,
You've got a short yardage opportunity here. Oh, you got
to put in our guy. Got to put in our guy.

(01:20:17):
Taj Brooks, he is on the field right now.

Speaker 4 (01:20:21):
I'm thinking maybe a desk keeper.

Speaker 2 (01:20:23):
Hmm.

Speaker 3 (01:20:26):
Now, see this is this is a little bit of
the uncertainty though. He's walking up to the line and
I don't think he has quite an idea of what
he wants.

Speaker 2 (01:20:33):
To check that we have a delay a game penty Wow. Yeah,
and that looked like massive confusion. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:20:38):
I mean it's it's getting to the point where the
defense shows something and you're just not sure yet what
you want to check to or what.

Speaker 4 (01:20:45):
Is going to happen to get you in the right place.

Speaker 2 (01:20:46):
Is that just basic lack of familiarity I think I
think this offense, I mean, des has been in the
league now for a while. That's just basic lack of
familiator with familiarity with this offense.

Speaker 3 (01:20:55):
Yeah, you like you could watch that and just see
how his mind was trying to work.

Speaker 2 (01:21:00):
But see, like that's the thing, like we both love
Dez Dez played well against Philadelphia, Jake Browning did not. Whatever.
You will have folks who think, Okay, maybe it should
be a competition for the two. I want a guy
who if Joe Burrow goes into the protocol with five
minutes to go in the third quarter in game one,
knows the offense. Yeah, Jake Browning knows it. I mean,

(01:21:20):
you know, with I can't have whether it's Dez or
anybody else. Joe Burrow just threw that one almost, Is
that TJ.

Speaker 4 (01:21:28):
Slayton?

Speaker 3 (01:21:29):
Yes, I mean that ball was right in the arms
of TJ. Slayton as Joe Burrow was going to hit
another check down because he was pressured out of the
pocket again.

Speaker 2 (01:21:35):
Yeah, and and by the way, for those who don't know, TJ.
Slayton plays defensive tackle, but I but may make a
good guard. I would try it. Austin said that yesterday,
man t J. Slayton run a little bit six five
three forty. Remember the Bengals back in the day had
Jason Shirley, Yeah, one of the hard knocks years, and
they moved him from defensive tackle to they tried him
at at on the offensive line. That didn't I don't

(01:21:58):
think really worked out either.

Speaker 3 (01:21:59):
But you know, well, we're just watching check down after checkdown,
and I think a lot of it is the coverage.
But there's a point too that Joe doesn't have time
right now to even evaluate what's going on down without
because the pocket's been so uncomfortable that that stuff has
to get fixed before you go up against Miles Garrett

(01:22:20):
Company in Cleveland. Right, that can't be how you're living
on a play by play basis right now, This I
like because they put trips into the boundary, get a motion,
but they have Jamar Chase out to the field with
a lot more room to operate.

Speaker 2 (01:22:37):
Clean his pocket. We've had ball sales out of bounds.
There's more good coverage Marco Wilson on t Higgins. I
think that's three straight, four straight three and outs from
the ones. That was the most time that Joe has
had to throw. That was not a great ball, but
it was also good coverage downfield. All right, we'll step
away fourteen away from twelve o'clock since he three point

(01:22:58):
sixty coming up at the top of the hour. It's
the eighty Door and Window Tony and Moe Training Camp
Show on ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station from the
Wyoming air Temp Star Weather. It is eleven away from
now and since the three sixty on ESPN fifteen thirty.
It's the ae Door and Window Tony and Moe Training
Camp Show, broadcasting from the Airport Paint and Body broadcast area.

(01:23:24):
We've talked a lot as we've watched eleven on eleven.
The Bengals offensive line is kind of getting work today.
Orlando Brown is not practicing today. Cody Ford is in
at left tackle. Miles Murphy is also not practicing today.
Our guy James or Pene reports that Murphy got nicked
up at the end of yesterday's practice. So there you go.

Speaker 3 (01:23:44):
You know, I guess, if you want to take the
optimist view, if we were sitting here talking about the
offense going seven for seven or eight for eight on
touchdown drives, we would be panicking about the defense. I
don't think in watching that concerned about the old line. Yes,
I've been concerned about the old line since last season ended,
but it's not like I don't think the offense will

(01:24:06):
bounce back with burrowing company. So I guess if you're
going to have a side that, let's call it, is
going to dominate a day like this, I think it's
better that it's the defense.

Speaker 2 (01:24:15):
Sure, it's better for them, Sure, Sure, you would just
like to see it translate into a good performance in
a game on Monday, correct, because that didn't happen against correct.

Speaker 3 (01:24:28):
But after you know what yesterday was and you know
they were drawing back and forth I would have expected
the offense to kind of do what they did on
the first drive, just kind of carve them up, move
on down the field and go from there.

Speaker 2 (01:24:44):
So no Orlando Brown today. That may be nothing, may
not be worth paying attention to. But offensive line depth
is something we have wandered about and talked about a lot,
rightfully so over the the last few weeks.

Speaker 3 (01:24:56):
Yeah, and what we're going to continue to talk about again.
Cordell Volson's taking the two reps. He's been bad. He
was bad last year, Yes, so that tells me that
this far into camp he's still your second best option.

Speaker 4 (01:25:11):
That's worriesome.

Speaker 3 (01:25:13):
That's worriesome for a group that has been on the
top of my list on what to worry about since
the season ended last year. And we sat at Twin
Peaks and said they have to make sure that going
into next year, Joe Burrows protected better than he is
right still questioning if he's protected the way he needs
to be. Now there are more questions on defense, more
things you would have hoped would get addressed. But I

(01:25:37):
mean there's so many parallels that we spent the Reds
offseason talking about deficiencies on the team, and then those
deficiencies aren't addressed and they become deficiencies in spring training,
and then it becomes deficiencies during the season. Offensive line
was a deficiency last year.

Speaker 2 (01:25:56):
It's been a deficiency. He's been a deficiency in the years.

Speaker 4 (01:25:58):
In the preseason.

Speaker 3 (01:26:00):
Yeah, and again they showed really well against second and
third teamers in Philly. Mm hm, that's gonna be a
different case against the Commanders on Monday.

Speaker 2 (01:26:10):
It just you know that the Reds parallel. It's like
with the offense. When spring training ended, we all said,
it doesn't feel like they've done enough. They didn't do nothing,
but they didn't do enough. And on the offensive line
they didn't do nothing, but they didn't do enough. Right,
And I keep saying the same thing at the end

(01:26:31):
of the season last year, if I would have said, Hey,
what they're gonna do at guard is draft a guy
in the third round. And to Dylan Fairchild's credit, he
certainly had a positive performance against Philadelphia, but they're gonna
draft a guy in the third round and they're gonna
sign Lucas Patrick and that's it. You would have said
that's not gonna be good enough. And if I would
have said on the other side of the ball, Hey,
this offseason, the Bengals are not going to acquire a

(01:26:52):
safety or a corner in either free agency or the
draft or via trade. He would have said that's not
good enough, But that's what they did.

Speaker 4 (01:27:00):
Correct, So.

Speaker 2 (01:27:02):
In one of those areas, that lack of activity is
going to catch up to him. Maybe not all correct,
but in one of those areas the lack of activity
And I'll sort of shove corner aside because I think
there is some upside there and there are enough possible solutions.
But at either safety or on the offensive line, that's
going to catch up to them. Now, how does it

(01:27:22):
catch up to them? On the offensive line? Does that
mean that it hurts Joe Burrow? And on the defensive
side of the ball, does that mean they have a
hard time getting off the feel on third down? Does
that mean they have a hard time on explosive plays.
Does that mean they get gashed on a play that
could decide the game in the fourth quarter. It remains
to be seen, but I'm willing to bet that in
one of those two areas where it feels like they

(01:27:44):
didn't do enough, and in one where they didn't do anything,
that that catches up to him.

Speaker 3 (01:27:48):
And now you think, as practice is beginning to end,
this was built as the kind of the pinnacle.

Speaker 2 (01:27:55):
Yeah, the big day, big work day. We didn't see
one on one, we didn't see seven on sevens.

Speaker 3 (01:27:59):
It was all team. It was all unscripted. And the
lasting image we get from today is what we saw
from the offensive line getting let's call it what it is,
dominated for much of the offense.

Speaker 2 (01:28:09):
Looked like trash. They call it what it is. The
offense that that credit to what the guys in black
jerseys did today, that's the defense. Credit to those guys.
We saw good coverage, We saw them win at the
point of attack. What the Bengals put on the field
on offense today, penalties, inability to protect nothing downfield, not
no matter any of the weapons you have. If that's

(01:28:30):
the case, not not at all good enough, not at
all good enough. Again, maybe it's one bad day. Maybe
they come out and play great against the Washington Commanders.
If there's a unit on this team that you expect
to bounce back from a bad day, it's the offense.
The defense having its not having its way, but the
defense having good days. Has been a recurring theme during
training camp. But just looking at today in a vacuum,

(01:28:52):
the defense was markedly better this morning. I gotta say,
if that is the most intense work day.

Speaker 3 (01:28:59):
Of yeah, I was expecting more. I mean there was
just a lot of a lot of slow walk through
with special teams offense defense. Yeah, and what we see
four drives each.

Speaker 2 (01:29:10):
This kind of looked like what I expect Friday right
to look like. That's what I thought it was gonna be.

Speaker 3 (01:29:19):
Yeah, especially talking about you know where things are at
and where they're going. Everything's going to start now backing
off a little bit and getting ready into preparation for
each individual game. So very interesting to see kind of
what the conversation is after today with what the offense
was unable to do on the field, No question.

Speaker 2 (01:29:40):
It is four minutes away from twelve o'clock. Since he
three to sixty is moments away. Austin Elmore is going
to join us. We're broadcasting from Bengals training camp. Our
last a e Dorin window, Tony and Moe Training Camp
show will be on Friday morning at ten o'clock. Bengals
to go through a practice, we'll have it for you
and of course on Monday it's the Bengals and Commanders
preseason game number two. That game will kick off at

(01:30:03):
eight o'clock and you'll be able to listen to it
here on ESPN fifteen thirty with pregame coverage beginning at
three pm. It's the A. E. Dorn Window, Tony and
Moe Training Camp Show on ESPN fifteen thirty. Cincinnati Sports
Station that Countdown to Football is on

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