December 18, 2025 • 42 mins
Austin reacts to what Joe Burrow said yesterday, questions Zac Taylor, compares this offseason to the 2020 offseason, and more in hour one on ESPN 1530!
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
This is Tony Pike since he three sixty about Cincinnati
from Cincinnati, sponsored in part by Skyline Chili. Stop by
Skyline Chili for a three way or cheese cony today.
Feeling good, It's Skyline time. This is ESPN fifteen thirtie
Cincinnati Sports Station.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Hi, Hello and welcome in to Tony Pikes Sincy three
sixty here on ESPN fifteen thirty. My name is Austin Ellmore.
I'm not Tony Pike. The big fella is out today.
He'll be back tomorrow. Looking forward to a Friday football frenzy,
one of our final ones of the year as we
reached the final three weeks of the NFL regular season.
(00:43):
Bengals are on the road at Miami this weekend. And
while there's there's not really a lot to talk about
when it comes to the x's and the o's and
the execution of the game and how you know, game
plans are formulated and what the strategy might be against
Quinn and Jalen Wattle and Devin a Chan. I think
(01:03):
that's lost on a lot of people now with the
game not having any playoff ramifications for either side, I
think both organizations are now into evaluation mode, and I
think for the Bengals, it's more about what do we
learn about this team that can be applied to the
offseason and applied to future Bengals teams. I think that's
(01:27):
what the rest of this season is about. So when
it comes to what's actually going to happen on the field,
as long as Joe Burrow doesn't get hurt, as long
as the Bengals don't get embarrassed, I think that's kind
of the number one thing that people are looking for.
I'll be watching on Sunday. I look forward to it.
We'll talk a lot about what Joe Burrow had to
(01:47):
say yesterday, including in this first segment. You'll hear from
the Bengals quarterback. You're gonna hear from him throughout the
show because he spoke for twenty minutes yesterday about a
lot of different stuff. It was the exact opposite think
of the press conference that took place a week ago yesterday,
which sent the national media into a frenzy about the
(02:09):
future of Joe Burrow. We'll talk about that as well,
coming up in football in the Natty, and we'll talk
about Zach Taylor and rehash what he said yesterday, and
in particular in exchange that he had yesterday with a
reporter about his contract. That's all coming up in just
a minute, but our typical Thursday show, we'll talk to
(02:29):
John Sheeran from A to Z Sports covering the Cincinnati Bengals.
Wrote a great piece today that really centers around my
number one topic, which is this offseason. I do think
the Bengals are closer than we think. I'll explain why
a little bit later on. We'll get John's perspective at
one o'clock. We'll have our talkbacks as we normally do
at one twenty. At two o'clock, Keegan Nickoson from Bearcatjournal
(02:52):
dot com will join us. I've got questions about how
we got here with Jisel James and how we got
here with the bear Cat football program. They've made a
couple of moves in recent days to try to sustain
what they have been doing. We'll talk to Keegan about
all of that. We'll do a college basketball whip around.
Following that, you'll hear from Richard Patino, from Darren Horn,
(03:15):
from Wes Miller in our number three as well, and
we'll also talk to Chad Brindle. Chad is in for
Moegar this afternoon from three to six. Chad will stop
by four quick hits at the end of the show.
What happened last night, though, Well, let's start with the
college hoops. The Bearcats beat Alabama State eighty eight fifty
one at Fifth Third Arena. Big night from Bob. Bob
(03:38):
Miller twenty six points on eleven of twelve from the
field at fourteen rebounds as well. He was spectacular as
the Bearcats get right against one of the worst defensive
teams in the country. Bob, as i mentioned, had twenty
six Gisel James off the bench twenty minutes of action
had sixteen points for Cincinnati. We'll talk more about Jigsele
(04:00):
as the show goes along. Xavier got smoked in their
Big East opener. They were at home at the Centas
Center against Creighton, and Creighton whooped them ninety eight to
fifty seven. Muskies are now eight and four. They traveled
to Georgetown on Saturday.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Again.
Speaker 2 (04:15):
You'll hear from Richard Patino later on in the show.
NK you lost as well. In Horizon League play. They
lost to Oakland eighty two seventy seven. The Norris are
nine and four, but They're one and two to begin
Horizon League play. They host Charleston on Sunday. You'll hear
from Darren Horn later. If you're wondering about Kentucky, they've
(04:35):
got like a whole week off. They beat Indiana over
the weekend and they don't play again until Saturday against
Saint John's. That is eleven AM coverage beginning right here
on ESPN fifteen thirty circling back to the Horizon League.
I don't know if you saw this, but Doug Gottlieb,
the head coach at Green Bay and also the host
of the Doug Gottlieb Show on Fox Sports Radio, he
(04:58):
announced that he's taken a break from his radio show.
He's stepping away to put more into being the coach
of the green Bay Phoenix.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
So that's interesting.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
Other college sports news, Ohio University fired their head coach
Brian Smith over quote serious misconduct. To be the second
year in a row that OU will be looking for
a new head football coach. Coming up tonight Thursday night football, huge,
huge game between the Los Angeles Rams and the Seattle Seahawks.
(05:30):
This game is in Seattle at Lumenfield, home of the
twelfth Man and both these teams have eleven wins. This
is basically the NFC West Championship game, and more than likely,
whoever wins it is going to have the number one
seed in the NFC. A couple of big injuries, Seattle
will be without their starting left tackle and best offensive lineman,
(05:50):
Charles Cross. Meanwhile, the Rams have listed DeVante Adams as
doubtful with that hamstring injury he suffered on Sunday and
has been dealing with for most of the season. I
believe will be a game time decision, but unlikely that
he will play tonight. If you're wondering about the gambling
side of things, well, as of this morning, Seattle favored
(06:11):
by a point and a half. More on all of
that a little bit later on. Let's start, though, with
what happened yesterday and the Zach Taylor press conference and
the Joe Burrow press conference. Everything this week with the
Bengals had been centered around what's going to happen this offseason,
whether it's Zach Taylor getting fired or Duke Tobin getting
(06:34):
fired or somebody please got anybody getting fired. That's kind
of what it felt like Bengals fans wanted out of
this season. And once we got to this level and
all the failures that have happened, Okay, who's going to
pay the price to this? Are any heads going to
roll because of the failure that has been the twenty
twenty five season in the answer to that question, basically
(06:57):
as reported by Paul dayan Or Junior earlier this week,
is nu And so my question has been, Okay, well,
if they aren't going to fire anyone, what about your
process is going to change so that you can fix it.
But there's been something that I don't quite understand that
happened yesterday and I still don't understand it today. So
(07:20):
Dayner reports that Zach Taylor had a contract extension given
to him after the twenty twenty two season. The Bengals
went to the AFC Championship Game, had a chance to
win that game and lost, and Zach has given another
one year extension on his contract. It's not reported at
(07:41):
the time, it's not announced by the team at the time.
No one knows that this happens until Paul reports it
a couple of days ago, and so I think it's
strange that it was never reported. If you're the Bengals,
why not when you give your coach a contract extension,
(08:03):
announced that he's gotten a contract extension. Especially at that point,
vibes were at an all time high for this franchise. Yeah,
they had lost the AFC Championship game, but still they
had gone to back to back AFC Championship games. The
new standard had been set. This is our guy, we
believe in him. We've given him another contract extension. We've
(08:26):
added a year on. Why you wouldn't explain that or
announce that. I don't understand, And let's say that you
do it, And everyone's like, hey, we don't want to
make a big deal of this. I don't want anybody
to know about this, blah blah blah. Okay, well news
dump it on a Friday afternoon in January before the
Super Bowl at five point thirty in the afternoon. Oh yeah,
(08:49):
by the way, we added a year on to Zach Taylor. Okay, cool.
Nobody would have said a word about it then. Instead
it becomes now a talking point because of the failures
later on. It would have shifted the entire perspective of
this season for a lot of people. Had we all
(09:11):
known that Zach had two years left on his deal. Now,
I don't know that it should. If you're underperforming, you're underperforming.
If you're the reason the team is losing, you're the
reason the team is losing, and your job should be questioned.
I don't know that that Zach is the main reason
for the failures this year, but it is without question
(09:32):
he's played a role in it. It's harder to justify
firing a guy with two years left on his deal
than one. And so because that was not known, it
shifted and shaped the conversation around Zach Taylor. And so
you fast forward to this week and you have Paul
(09:52):
Danner Junior, who is as trusted and like as good
as it comes when it comes to covering a team.
This is a dude who knows his stuff. He's been
doing it for a long time. He's got great relationships
in the organization. If Paul reports it, it's true. This
(10:13):
is dude, a dude that is very well respected, reports it.
Why does Zach Taylor act like he doesn't want to
talk about it. What purpose does it serve Zach Taylor
to not confirm this report?
Speaker 3 (10:32):
What purpose does it serve?
Speaker 2 (10:34):
How does it help him to say, uh, I don't
want to talk about that. How does it hurt him
to say I don't want to talk about that. What
is the harm in admitting that your contract has an
expiration date in twenty twenty seven. We're not asking you
to pontificate about the deal, not asking you to explain
(10:59):
you know how it happened to Bob, but just say, hey,
when's when's your contract actually up?
Speaker 4 (11:03):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (11:03):
Twenty twenty seven? Okay?
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Why is that hard for Zach Taylor to admit? I
struggle to understand the purpose of hiding that, of covering
that up. In case you missed it yesterday, here was
the exchange with Zach Taylor and uh I believe it
was Mike Petralia yesterday during Zach's press conference.
Speaker 5 (11:24):
You don't get a chance to talk to ownership or
do we don't get that opportunity. What kind of assurances
have you been given from Hong? We just talk every week.
Every week you've talked about your contractor every week we
talk about everything. When was the last time spoken about
your contract? And sass, that's not really part of our conversation.
It's every week. We're just trying to create together a
(11:44):
great plan to win football games and make sure our
team's ready to go. Make sure I'm ready to go.
So I know that's of curiosity to you guys, but
we're just focused on being the Dolphins. Fair to say
that's reassessed after the season every year you invest them. Yeah, yeah,
we don't.
Speaker 4 (12:01):
Get a chance.
Speaker 5 (12:01):
Okay, Well I'm sorry, Okay, I'm just being straightforward with that.
Speaker 4 (12:06):
We would ask them, Oh, we don't get them, Okay.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
I didn't love that those questions came because Zach denied
confirming that his contract was up in twenty twenty seven,
that he had signed that extension following the AFC Championship game,
And that little snippiness, that little arrogance, that little smile
(12:32):
on the face of Zach Taylor, while Trags is just
doing his job and asking the right questions and fair
questions about it and making sure it's known to Zach,
not that Zach needs to be reminded that, Hey, you're
the one who has to answer these questions because we
don't get to talk to anybody else. And I just
(12:54):
felt like, to me an avoidable thing, just say I
don't want to talk about my contract. I sign an
extension and after the AFT Championship game it's up in
twenty twenty seven. But I know that we're focused on
getting getting ready to beat the Miami Dolphins and turning
this thing around.
Speaker 3 (13:09):
It could be that simple.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
But yet again there's a complicated inefficiency to the communication
of this franchise, unnecessary complications to the communication.
Speaker 3 (13:25):
It happens repeatedly.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
Over and over and over and over again, and in
a season that has already been stained by the failures
on the field and stained by the nonsense of the
contract situations off of it. Whether it was early in
the year dragging it out with t and Jamar, or
(13:48):
the Shamar Stewart thing, or the Trey Hendrickson thing, and
now the Zach Taylor thing, there is very little alignment
on the clear messaging by the organization other than Zach's
gonna be the guy who stands up there and takes
all the arrows. And this will be in the news
(14:10):
cycle for a couple of days and then it'll go
away and everybody will forget after we play another game.
I just don't understand why there cannot be more transparency
or understanding of what is or is not the truth
and what the plan is for Zach Taylor. And I
(14:34):
don't understand why Zach can't just say yes, this is
my contract status. It is again at least in my mind,
and it may not be talked about by anybody in
that organization. Just another unnecessary conversation, Another unnecessary distraction.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
Here we go again.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
Here's something that doesn't actually pertain to football that's being
talked about.
Speaker 3 (14:59):
How is that helpful to anybody?
Speaker 2 (15:01):
But based off the way they played on Sunday, maybe
you don't want to talk about football. I can understand
that as well. Five one, three, seven, four nine, fifteen
thirty is the phone number. We'll take some calls later
this afternoon. If you want to call in be a
part of the show. You can also tweet at me
at Audi elmore aut y E L M O r EM.
(15:23):
Coming up next, Football in the NATTI. The Bengals, I
think are at a crossroads this offseason, but they're at
an intersection they've been to before. I'll explain next. ESPN
fifteen thirty, Hey, Alexi.
Speaker 1 (15:39):
Is Football in the NATI, brought to you by Postman
Law on ESPN fifteen thirty, the official home of the
Cincinnati Bengals.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
Football and the NATI here on Tony Pike since e
three to sixty I'm Austin Ohmore, no Tony Pike today,
but I've been thinking a lot about the twenty twenty
five Bengals and who they remind me of. They remind
me of the twenty twenty Bengals. That was a team
that undoubtedly had some talent. They had some dudes that
(16:11):
could play. You might remember Gino Adkins was on that team.
What about AJ Green? He was there, Tyler Boyd was
at the top, maybe the peak of his powers as
the best slot receiver in the NFL. There were some
good young defenders, like there was you know, there was
something on that twenty twenty team, but they won just
(16:32):
four games. Joe Burrow rookie quarterback that year, coming out
of COVID, going through the whole nonsense that was that
at the time. And so it felt like repeatedly over
the course of the twenty twenty season, the Bengals couldn't
really get out of their own way all right, Like
they were competitive, but something would go wrong and they
(16:52):
just would snowball and they just weren't that good, and YadA, YadA, YadA.
It just felt like it was never going their way.
And I feel like there's a lot of similarities to
the twenty twenty team and this team right now. The
Bengals are four and ten. The twenty twenty team finished
four eleven and one, and that season they won two
(17:16):
of their last three games. They did it without Joe Burrow,
who you might remember, right before Thanksgiving had his knee
blown out in Washington, and so two of the final
three games they win with Ryan Finley at quarterback, the
Steelers Monday Night game and a game at Houston in
which the offense was incredibly efficient and T Higgins and
samaj p Ryd and those guys were sensational. But the
(17:42):
Bengals weren't that good. They had had a tough season.
Nothing really seemed to go their way. And we often
look back on that Steelers game in twenty twenty as
like a turning point, a needle mover, a cornerstone event
in this franchise, as being the moment, like the culture changed.
(18:05):
And while I agree that the wins in two of
those final three games were helpful to the culture in
the locker room, I think the culture was really curated
in the off season following the twenty twenty year, and
I've been digging into that off season and this upcoming
off season and the similarities between them so going into
(18:30):
the twenty twenty one season. So the twenty twenty off
season into twenty twenty one, the Bengals had about sixty
million dollars in cap space. Right now, they have a
little more than sixty million dollars in cap space going
into twenty twenty six. And while the wins at the
(18:51):
end of the year helped create the culture, it was
curated by a free agent class that featured Cheetabaya Woozie,
Trey Hendrickson, Mike Hilton, Larry Ogan, Jobi Riley Reef, and
Eli Apple. Now you might think of Reef and Apple
as a couple of guys who didn't do much, but
(19:13):
they did play a role, albeit minor, on a small
on a good team on good teams for two years
in a row. That is a big, impactful veteran free
agent class that came in and helped establish the culture.
You might remember the year before is when they signed
(19:35):
Von Bell and DJ Reeder. They had invested in the
veteran leadership for a young team, and in twenty twenty
they maximized as much as they could that offseason. Going
into twenty one, their salary cap. As I said they
had sixty million dollars to spend, they spent fifty seven million.
(19:59):
Of The Bengals had three point eight million dollars in
cap space by the end of twenty twenty one, or
by the end of that season. They spent all the
way up to the cat for the most part. They
also drafted Jamar Chase, Joseph Osai, and Evan McPherson. Now,
(20:20):
three good draft picks is not ideal, but you'll still
take three good hits in the NFL draft anytime. And
obviously Jamar Chase, it goes without saying the impact that
he's had on this franchise. Evan McPherson was a big
part of that as well. Joseph Osai has been an
(20:41):
impactful role player on this team. I think we're still
waiting for more from Joseph, but it makes me think
that offseason the Bengals also extended one of their young
pass rushers god by the name of Sam Hubbard. Could
Joseph Osai be this year Sam Hubbard? And then in
training camp they got creative. They traded for a defensive
(21:04):
lineman by the name of bj Hill. So think about
that one off season. Going into the Super Bowl year
with sixty million dollars in cap space to spend, they
acquired bj Hill and Larry Ogunjobi and Trey Hendrickson. They
reworked their entire defensive line. They added two cornerbacks, Mike
(21:26):
Hilton and Chida Beya Woozier. They got veteran experienced locker
room leaders that they added to a young team that
needed it. One of the biggest misconceptions about this franchise
right now is that they don't have money to spend
because of Burrow, because of Chase, and because of Higgins.
(21:50):
That's not true. They have the money, and they have
the blueprint. They've done it before.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
Now.
Speaker 2 (21:59):
Is it realistic to expect that the Bengals hit on
five or six free agents.
Speaker 3 (22:07):
I don't know that it's realistic to feel that way.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
I don't know that it's realistic to expect him to
hit on all six draft picks. Maybe, like Zach said yesterday,
but to act as if they can't do it because
of financial constraints is simply wrong. It's not true. And
as much as we want to dump on Duke Tobin
and he deserves it, this was his director, his player,
(22:34):
personnel department that led this to happening, led this charge,
led this free agent push. Now, they weren't perfect in
those years. They missed on Trey Wains, they missed on
McKenzie Alexander, they missed on free agents. Everybody does. But
to look at this and say, Okay, they know how
(22:54):
to do it, They've done it, we know what it
looks like. And oh, by the way, at any point,
they can restructure Joe Burrow's contract and they can easily
create more cap space if they want to cut a
few guys here, move a few guys there, restructure this that,
blah blah blah. You could be looking at eighty million
(23:15):
dollars before you know it. That's more than enough in
a salary cap that will almost certainly go up again
this offseason for the Bengals to get right back. In contention,
Joe Burrow was asked yesterday about why he thinks the
Bengals are not that far away. Here's the conversation with
(23:36):
the Bengals quarterback on Sunday.
Speaker 6 (23:37):
You said not that far when asked how close this
organization was to getting back to.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
Those big stages. Why do you think you guys are.
Speaker 7 (23:46):
Not that far.
Speaker 6 (23:49):
Well, we have young guys that are getting better. I
think we have really smart coaches. We have a lot
of highly talented people that go out and perform at
a high level on Sundays, weekend and week out. You know,
it's hard for me to it's hard for me to
(24:12):
talk about the totality of the season this year because
I was removed from it for so long, and you know,
I really I haven't had a season. I've played four
games and that's frustrating to me, and kind of it
made me feel like I was on the outside looking
in for a lot of it because that's what happens.
(24:35):
And so I'm just getting my feet wet again with
all this and it feels good. But you know, I
feel confident in the people that we have that we
have here.
Speaker 3 (24:44):
There you go.
Speaker 2 (24:44):
That's from the quarterback himself, and everybody wants to hyper
analyze everything that he says. And if it's true that
everything he says is measured and there's a purpose behind it,
well then I'm sure he wouldn't just loose lipped say
we're not that far away. Tony and I debated this
earlier this week. I've been saying it for most of
(25:07):
the season for all the reasons I just outlined, and
by looking at the Bengals schedule next year, I really
don't think that they are that far away. Now, let's
just quickly go through that for a moment. Next year,
they'll play the third place team in the AFC West,
which is gonna be the Kansas City Chiefs. The Chiefs
(25:27):
go into this offseason with Mahomes fresh off of surgery,
probably gonna be without Travis Kelcey, and they're over forty
million dollars forty million dollars over the cap. That's gonna
be a different looking Chiefs team than what we've seen
in the past, but you still expect them with Mahomes
and Reid to be formidable. They're gonna have the Jacksonville
(25:48):
Jaguars at home, obviously a good team, a team that
played them tough, but not a team that keeps you
up at night. The Tennessee Titans will be in Cincinnati
next year, the New Orleans Saints, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers,
and then of course the AFC North. That's a pretty
favorable home schedule. The Bengals traditionally are pretty good at
(26:12):
pay Court Stadium under Zach Taylor. Then you look at
their road schedule. They play the AFC East team that
finishes in third place, which will be the Miami Dolphins. Okay,
anything about that team, Scarret probably gonna be with a
new head coach, might be with a new quarterback.
Speaker 3 (26:34):
No Tyreek Hill. More than likely.
Speaker 2 (26:36):
They're also going to play an NFC East team who
finishes in third place. That's more than likely going to
be the Commanders. That team is gonna be dealing with
a lot of turnover. They have to go to Houston,
not gonna be easy. They got to go to Indianapolis,
probably not gonna be easy. They traveled to Atlanta and
Carolina and the rest of the AFC North. That is
not a schedule that has you struggling to find wins.
(26:59):
If you do what you're supposed to do in the
offseason to supplement your roster and build around your quarterback,
it's not that crazy. I'm not trying to be the
glass half fool guy. I'm not trying to do this
is truly what I feel. If you spend the money
the way you're supposed to, if you're aggressive in hunting
(27:21):
down the pieces that you need, and if you can
do anything about your process when it comes to drafting.
That gets you back closer to what you did in
the twenty twenty draft and in the twenty one draft.
You will be competitive in this conference again next year,
so long as everybody stays healthy, and that's a big
if across the entire National Football League. But to act
(27:43):
as if the Bengals are so far away, I simply
don't believe that, and all the other nonsense around this
organization right now, I think is distracting us from the
fact that, like, oh yeah, they really could be good,
sooner rather than later. They don't have to strip this
thing down. We'll talk next segment about this Burrow conversation
(28:09):
and Carson Palmer and Andrew Luck and all this other hogwash.
It's it's people that aren't really looking at the bones
of the operation here and saying, Okay, how can they
actually get back to being good? What are the changes
that can be made? That's what I'd like to know.
We'll take a break, we'll come back. This is Tony Pike.
(28:31):
Since he three to sixty on ESPN.
Speaker 1 (28:33):
Fifteen thirty, you've been listening to Football in the NATTI
on ESPN fifteen thirty. The official home of the Cincinnati
Bengalsteen thirty.
Speaker 4 (28:50):
Jada Thomas into the left corner for Celestie under the.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
Hoop bounce pass from Zella to Baba Ed Miller dumps
it and again.
Speaker 2 (28:58):
There Baba Miller out here playing with little bitty boys
out here.
Speaker 3 (29:02):
He's just he's like.
Speaker 1 (29:03):
A big breath from the backyard right now.
Speaker 3 (29:06):
Just throw it in there as you can't stop.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
Dan Horde Steve Logan on the call last night as
the Bearcats whoop up on Alabama State at fifth third Arena.
More on that coming up later on in our number three.
Baba went cuckoo with twenty six points fourteen boards for
U se Uh in that game last night. We'll hear
from Kegan nickoson at two o'clock. He was there covering
(29:30):
the game and the return of Gisel James. That's coming
up later on in the show. I want to get
to uh, the Joe Burrow conversation and the national media
fanning the flames on such a thing in a moment.
But first let's go to the phones five one, three, seven, four, nine,
fifteen thirty. Let's go to Fort Thomas and talk to Brian. Brian,
(29:51):
what's up, hi?
Speaker 7 (29:53):
Audie. I agree about about them having a chance to
turn it around. NFL is the most competitively, the most
evenly matched in in the United States, so it's not
it's not unheard of to come back and you know,
change things around very quickly. As look at Denver. Denver
(30:14):
was garbage two years ago. Right now they probably one
of the favorite Super Bowl And I think as a fan,
I'm not as freshly about this year. I'm more flusher
about last year. Like last year was just a wasting
opportunity and like Joe got a freak injury this this year,
sure got hurt, team played terrible, whatever, But last year,
like if they would have went on a you know,
(30:36):
a playoff, made the playoffs and won a couple of games,
just wouldn't be as upsetting as a fan. But I
feel like we're just we'll it's just being wasted right now.
Speaker 2 (30:45):
Yeah, that's a great point, and that's I think that season.
I mean, if if we get to this the end
of this thing and we never see the Bengals get
back to you know that that level of contending in
the AFC, We're gonna look back on the twenty four
season and think, golly, what could have been with the
season like that with Joe and Jamar and they just
(31:07):
didn't do enough to follow it up in the offseason.
Speaker 7 (31:11):
Yeah, it's it's and so it's I think as a fan,
I think we're at least me personally, I'm just I'm
just frustrating. Just I want to have a chance to win.
And in the NFL, if you got a quarterback, which
everybody knows we do, yeah, you can win. You can win.
Speaker 4 (31:27):
You can win it all.
Speaker 7 (31:28):
And that's you know, we just were dying to win.
We want a parade. That's that's it. This whole city
just wants the parade.
Speaker 2 (31:35):
Yeah, I'm right there with you, Brian. Thank you for
the phone call. And you know, you bring up a
good point. It's actually kind of a good segue. Part
of the reason why things went south between Carson Palmer
and Mike Brown was because Carson did not believe that
Mike was committed to exhausting every avenue to make the
team better, to turn it into a championship contender. And
(31:59):
I think before we get into this conversation, I would
like to note I am not comparing Carson Palmer to
Joe Burrow. Joe is the best quarterback I think that's
ever played for the Bengals. I think he is the
most talented quarterback that's ever played for the Bengals. And
I think he has a very different personality than that
of Carson Palmer. I think he's a much better player
(32:21):
than Carson Palmer. And this with Carson all happened fifteen
years ago. It's a lot different world now than it
was then. But the fundamental disagreement between Mike Brown and
Carson Palmer was that they weren't doing enough to compete
for a Super Bowl and Carson it just didn't sit
(32:44):
well with Carson. He felt like the Bengals could be
doing so much more than they've done. The Bengals have
changed a lot since then, and they have been more aggressive,
they have spent more money, They have evolved so much
more than I think a lot of people are willing
to give them credit for. And I don't think that
(33:05):
the place they're at right now with Joe Burrow is
even remotely close to where they were at with Carson Palmer.
I'm not trying to compare the two situations. What I'm
trying to explain is this thing with Burrow. To me,
when you go back to his press conference last week,
to all the conversation this week, all of it. The
(33:28):
flames are being fanned by the national media. They're pouring
gasoline on the fire. The reason it's happening is because
there's precedent. The precedent has a direct impact on the narrative.
If the Carson Palmer and Mike Brown thing had never happened,
this wouldn't be a conversation with Joe Burrow wanting to
(33:51):
leave the Bengals when they drafted him in twenty twenty.
There was a narrative out there that Joe wouldn't want
to play for the organization. That wouldn't have happened if
not for the Eli Manning thing that it happened years before.
Joe keeps getting injured, and then the Andrew Luck thing
gets brought up because we've seen it happen before. Because
(34:12):
there is precedent with Palmer and Brown, that leads to
people who maybe don't follow this closely, or don't know
Joe that much, or don't know exactly what's going on
within the organization to try to connect the dots and
come up with a hot take to say, Okay, this
is what's gonna happen again in Cincinnati, because that's the
way the Bengals do business. The Bengals have evolved, maybe
(34:35):
not as much as they should, and Joe is not
there even close to being the same type of person
that Carson Palmer is. But I just want you to
know this conversation is happening because of the precedent that
was set by the actions of Carson Palmer and Mike
Brown previously. That's why this is happening. And I'm not
(34:57):
dismissing what Joe has said or the wa that he
said it. Now, I stand by my belief that I
think last week Joe was having a bad day and
it came across that way and people ran with it,
and I think that made things worse, and whatever he
was going on in his life, clearly he wasn't all
the way there on Sunday. Had mental mistakes, had protection mistakes,
(35:18):
was not accurate with the football. There's a myriad of
reasons why that could happen. I have enough banked memories
of Joe Burrow playing over the last six years that
I don't think that's gonna happen again. And I don't
think there's a trend that's about to start, but I
do at least know the way he has talked. He's
(35:41):
unhappy with the way the organization has approached last season
in this season.
Speaker 3 (35:47):
And he should be.
Speaker 2 (35:48):
Every person in that organization should be unhappy with the
results of last year and with this year.
Speaker 3 (35:55):
And I'm sure.
Speaker 2 (35:56):
Joe, to an extent, and kind of like you heard
in that clip in the last segment, wonders how much
he can say because of his injuries and feels in
a way like he's on the outside looking in. We'll
talk more about what Joe said about his opinion being heard,
but here's Joe yesterday talking about his future with the Bengals.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
How much do you love?
Speaker 6 (36:19):
Like a body ever thought about that, You think about it,
but you think about a lot of different things, and
in your life, just like everybody does. You think about
all different possibilities that could happen. I'm gonna be playing
for a long time. I expect to play for a
(36:40):
long time, and I expect to play well and consistently
great for a long time.
Speaker 3 (36:45):
So much speculation is there?
Speaker 6 (36:48):
Ever?
Speaker 4 (36:48):
Is there any world in your mind where you're not
the quarterback of the Bengals next year?
Speaker 6 (36:54):
I could I couldn't.
Speaker 4 (36:54):
I can't see that now.
Speaker 2 (36:57):
I didn't you ever both thought about the possibility of
not being the quarterback here.
Speaker 3 (37:00):
During your career, or.
Speaker 6 (37:03):
You think about a lot of things, and when you.
Speaker 2 (37:06):
Look at quarterbacks over the course of their time, great ones,
Haydon Brady, do you kind of have to understand that you.
Speaker 3 (37:14):
Never know what this legal bringing. What did you learn
from watching how their career is on fold of time?
Speaker 6 (37:19):
Yeah, A lot of crazy things happen every year. Michael
Parsons got traded right before the right before the season.
I think this year that is a something I haven't
seen in a long time in the NFL. So crazy
things can happen.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
Bengals quarterback Joe Burrow, He's right, crazy things can happen
in the NFL. But he wants to play for a
long time. He expects to play for a long time
and at a high level for a long time, and
also understands that life in the NFL you never know
what's going to happen, which furthers the point that the
(38:03):
Bengals should be exhausting every avenue to aggressively pursue a championship.
Now again, looking forward at the next couple of years.
The opportunity is right there in front of you. You've
got the money, you've got the cap space, you've got
the quarterback. You don't have any more excuses. Five one, three, seven,
(38:23):
four nine, fifteen thirty. This is ESPN fifteen.
Speaker 8 (38:26):
Thirty, WCKY, Cincinnati and iHeartRadio Station g Garanteed Human ESPN
fifteen thirty.
Speaker 4 (38:35):
I heard radio from the any Weather Heating and dared
Temstar Weathers Center.
Speaker 3 (38:41):
Here's your forecast. This report is sponsored by Mel's Auto Glass.
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Speaker 1 (39:02):
Tony Pike since he three sixty on ESPN fifteen thirty.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
A little bit of time here before we talked to
John Shearon, a is E sports covering the Cincinnati Bengals.
This is Tony Pikes, since he three sixty. Let's go
to Minneapolis and talk to Charles. Charles, what's on your mind?
Speaker 3 (39:28):
Hey?
Speaker 4 (39:28):
How are you?
Speaker 7 (39:29):
Just?
Speaker 4 (39:30):
Quickly you know back on the whole ownership, being a
lifelong Bengal fan here the only team ever liked. I
know you mentioned earlier about there being president and sort
of anchoring it to the Carson Palmer issue, but it
was actually precedent beyond that. It was he was TJ.
Housman's out obviously, you know him was on an interview
(39:50):
and he said when he first got the Cincinnati speaking
of president, there was no water and gatorade in the
locker room.
Speaker 3 (39:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (39:59):
I so there's precedence. There's so many things that this
team had, hopefully inadequate by any stretch of the magic,
by any standard considering themselves to be a professional organization,
and as such, we continuously come to this point. There
shouldn't even have been a need for Mike Brown to
come out and say we're going to do everything we
(40:22):
can to sign Joe Duh. Like you know, at the time,
they said, why would he need to say these kinds
of things?
Speaker 7 (40:28):
Why?
Speaker 4 (40:29):
Because the precedent has always been with this organization that
they're awful.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
Yeah, that's that's my point. Now, the good thing is
they've they've changed. They don't do the stuff that they
did twenty years ago. When TJ was here. That's all changed, thankfully,
But you're right, the precedent has led to the narrative,
and until you do something to change the narrative, that's
what people are going to fall back on, and that's
their fault.
Speaker 4 (40:53):
Yes, thank you, thank you for your time. Love the show,
trust in the show, thank you man, appreciate it, Thanks
for the call. Yeah, I mean, without a doubt, until
you do something to change the narrative, the narrative is
going to exist. It is the unfortunate reality. And the
Bengals are often a day late and a dollar short
(41:16):
when it comes to doing that. They've made strides, but
they're often too late. They were too late and signing
Jamar Chase they cost themselves a lot more money. They
were too late in signing T. Higgins, they cost themselves
a lot more money. They often create bigger headaches for
themselves because they're reactive instead of proactive. That's something they
(41:39):
need to improve on. This is an off season where
you have a chance to do that.
Speaker 2 (41:45):
You have a chance to say we're going to be
proactive in our our pursuit of better defensive players, of
changing our draft strategy, of whatever it might be. When
we come back, we'll talk to John Scheran covering the
Bengals eight to Z Sports. This is Tony Pike's since
he three p. Sixty on the home of the Bengals, Cincinnati,
ESPN fifteen thirty.
Speaker 3 (42:02):
Having insurance isn't the same as having state farm
This is Tony Pike since he three sixty about Cincinnati
from Cincinnati, sponsored in part by Skyline Chili. Stop by
Skyline Chili for a three way or cheese cony today.
Feeling good, It's Skyline time. This is ESPN fifteen thirtie
Cincinnati Sports Station.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Hi, Hello and welcome in to Tony Pikes Sincy three
sixty here on ESPN fifteen thirty. My name is Austin Ellmore.
I'm not Tony Pike. The big fella is out today.
He'll be back tomorrow. Looking forward to a Friday football frenzy,
one of our final ones of the year as we
reached the final three weeks of the NFL regular season.
(00:43):
Bengals are on the road at Miami this weekend. And
while there's there's not really a lot to talk about
when it comes to the x's and the o's and
the execution of the game and how you know, game
plans are formulated and what the strategy might be against
Quinn and Jalen Wattle and Devin a Chan. I think
(01:03):
that's lost on a lot of people now with the
game not having any playoff ramifications for either side, I
think both organizations are now into evaluation mode, and I
think for the Bengals, it's more about what do we
learn about this team that can be applied to the
offseason and applied to future Bengals teams. I think that's
(01:27):
what the rest of this season is about. So when
it comes to what's actually going to happen on the field,
as long as Joe Burrow doesn't get hurt, as long
as the Bengals don't get embarrassed, I think that's kind
of the number one thing that people are looking for.
I'll be watching on Sunday. I look forward to it.
We'll talk a lot about what Joe Burrow had to
(01:47):
say yesterday, including in this first segment. You'll hear from
the Bengals quarterback. You're gonna hear from him throughout the
show because he spoke for twenty minutes yesterday about a
lot of different stuff. It was the exact opposite think
of the press conference that took place a week ago yesterday,
which sent the national media into a frenzy about the
(02:09):
future of Joe Burrow. We'll talk about that as well,
coming up in football in the Natty, and we'll talk
about Zach Taylor and rehash what he said yesterday, and
in particular in exchange that he had yesterday with a
reporter about his contract. That's all coming up in just
a minute, but our typical Thursday show, we'll talk to
(02:29):
John Sheeran from A to Z Sports covering the Cincinnati Bengals.
Wrote a great piece today that really centers around my
number one topic, which is this offseason. I do think
the Bengals are closer than we think. I'll explain why
a little bit later on. We'll get John's perspective at
one o'clock. We'll have our talkbacks as we normally do
at one twenty. At two o'clock, Keegan Nickoson from Bearcatjournal
(02:52):
dot com will join us. I've got questions about how
we got here with Jisel James and how we got
here with the bear Cat football program. They've made a
couple of moves in recent days to try to sustain
what they have been doing. We'll talk to Keegan about
all of that. We'll do a college basketball whip around.
Following that, you'll hear from Richard Patino, from Darren Horn,
(03:15):
from Wes Miller in our number three as well, and
we'll also talk to Chad Brindle. Chad is in for
Moegar this afternoon from three to six. Chad will stop
by four quick hits at the end of the show.
What happened last night, though, Well, let's start with the
college hoops. The Bearcats beat Alabama State eighty eight fifty
one at Fifth Third Arena. Big night from Bob. Bob
(03:38):
Miller twenty six points on eleven of twelve from the
field at fourteen rebounds as well. He was spectacular as
the Bearcats get right against one of the worst defensive
teams in the country. Bob, as i mentioned, had twenty
six Gisel James off the bench twenty minutes of action
had sixteen points for Cincinnati. We'll talk more about Jigsele
(04:00):
as the show goes along. Xavier got smoked in their
Big East opener. They were at home at the Centas
Center against Creighton, and Creighton whooped them ninety eight to
fifty seven. Muskies are now eight and four. They traveled
to Georgetown on Saturday.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Again.
Speaker 2 (04:15):
You'll hear from Richard Patino later on in the show.
NK you lost as well. In Horizon League play. They
lost to Oakland eighty two seventy seven. The Norris are
nine and four, but They're one and two to begin
Horizon League play. They host Charleston on Sunday. You'll hear
from Darren Horn later. If you're wondering about Kentucky, they've
(04:35):
got like a whole week off. They beat Indiana over
the weekend and they don't play again until Saturday against
Saint John's. That is eleven AM coverage beginning right here
on ESPN fifteen thirty circling back to the Horizon League.
I don't know if you saw this, but Doug Gottlieb,
the head coach at Green Bay and also the host
of the Doug Gottlieb Show on Fox Sports Radio, he
(04:58):
announced that he's taken a break from his radio show.
He's stepping away to put more into being the coach
of the green Bay Phoenix.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
So that's interesting.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
Other college sports news, Ohio University fired their head coach
Brian Smith over quote serious misconduct. To be the second
year in a row that OU will be looking for
a new head football coach. Coming up tonight Thursday night football, huge,
huge game between the Los Angeles Rams and the Seattle Seahawks.
(05:30):
This game is in Seattle at Lumenfield, home of the
twelfth Man and both these teams have eleven wins. This
is basically the NFC West Championship game, and more than likely,
whoever wins it is going to have the number one
seed in the NFC. A couple of big injuries, Seattle
will be without their starting left tackle and best offensive lineman,
(05:50):
Charles Cross. Meanwhile, the Rams have listed DeVante Adams as
doubtful with that hamstring injury he suffered on Sunday and
has been dealing with for most of the season. I
believe will be a game time decision, but unlikely that
he will play tonight. If you're wondering about the gambling
side of things, well, as of this morning, Seattle favored
(06:11):
by a point and a half. More on all of
that a little bit later on. Let's start, though, with
what happened yesterday and the Zach Taylor press conference and
the Joe Burrow press conference. Everything this week with the
Bengals had been centered around what's going to happen this offseason,
whether it's Zach Taylor getting fired or Duke Tobin getting
(06:34):
fired or somebody please got anybody getting fired. That's kind
of what it felt like Bengals fans wanted out of
this season. And once we got to this level and
all the failures that have happened, Okay, who's going to
pay the price to this? Are any heads going to
roll because of the failure that has been the twenty
twenty five season in the answer to that question, basically
(06:57):
as reported by Paul dayan Or Junior earlier this week,
is nu And so my question has been, Okay, well,
if they aren't going to fire anyone, what about your
process is going to change so that you can fix it.
But there's been something that I don't quite understand that
happened yesterday and I still don't understand it today. So
(07:20):
Dayner reports that Zach Taylor had a contract extension given
to him after the twenty twenty two season. The Bengals
went to the AFC Championship Game, had a chance to
win that game and lost, and Zach has given another
one year extension on his contract. It's not reported at
(07:41):
the time, it's not announced by the team at the time.
No one knows that this happens until Paul reports it
a couple of days ago, and so I think it's
strange that it was never reported. If you're the Bengals,
why not when you give your coach a contract extension,
(08:03):
announced that he's gotten a contract extension. Especially at that point,
vibes were at an all time high for this franchise. Yeah,
they had lost the AFC Championship game, but still they
had gone to back to back AFC Championship games. The
new standard had been set. This is our guy, we
believe in him. We've given him another contract extension. We've
(08:26):
added a year on. Why you wouldn't explain that or
announce that. I don't understand, And let's say that you
do it, And everyone's like, hey, we don't want to
make a big deal of this. I don't want anybody
to know about this, blah blah blah. Okay, well news
dump it on a Friday afternoon in January before the
Super Bowl at five point thirty in the afternoon. Oh yeah,
(08:49):
by the way, we added a year on to Zach Taylor. Okay, cool.
Nobody would have said a word about it then. Instead
it becomes now a talking point because of the failures
later on. It would have shifted the entire perspective of
this season for a lot of people. Had we all
(09:11):
known that Zach had two years left on his deal. Now,
I don't know that it should. If you're underperforming, you're underperforming.
If you're the reason the team is losing, you're the
reason the team is losing, and your job should be questioned.
I don't know that that Zach is the main reason
for the failures this year, but it is without question
(09:32):
he's played a role in it. It's harder to justify
firing a guy with two years left on his deal
than one. And so because that was not known, it
shifted and shaped the conversation around Zach Taylor. And so
you fast forward to this week and you have Paul
(09:52):
Danner Junior, who is as trusted and like as good
as it comes when it comes to covering a team.
This is a dude who knows his stuff. He's been
doing it for a long time. He's got great relationships
in the organization. If Paul reports it, it's true. This
(10:13):
is dude, a dude that is very well respected, reports it.
Why does Zach Taylor act like he doesn't want to
talk about it. What purpose does it serve Zach Taylor
to not confirm this report?
Speaker 3 (10:32):
What purpose does it serve?
Speaker 2 (10:34):
How does it help him to say, uh, I don't
want to talk about that. How does it hurt him
to say I don't want to talk about that. What
is the harm in admitting that your contract has an
expiration date in twenty twenty seven. We're not asking you
to pontificate about the deal, not asking you to explain
(10:59):
you know how it happened to Bob, but just say, hey,
when's when's your contract actually up?
Speaker 4 (11:03):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (11:03):
Twenty twenty seven? Okay?
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Why is that hard for Zach Taylor to admit? I
struggle to understand the purpose of hiding that, of covering
that up. In case you missed it yesterday, here was
the exchange with Zach Taylor and uh I believe it
was Mike Petralia yesterday during Zach's press conference.
Speaker 5 (11:24):
You don't get a chance to talk to ownership or
do we don't get that opportunity. What kind of assurances
have you been given from Hong? We just talk every week.
Every week you've talked about your contractor every week we
talk about everything. When was the last time spoken about
your contract? And sass, that's not really part of our conversation.
It's every week. We're just trying to create together a
(11:44):
great plan to win football games and make sure our
team's ready to go. Make sure I'm ready to go.
So I know that's of curiosity to you guys, but
we're just focused on being the Dolphins. Fair to say
that's reassessed after the season every year you invest them. Yeah, yeah,
we don't.
Speaker 4 (12:01):
Get a chance.
Speaker 5 (12:01):
Okay, Well I'm sorry, Okay, I'm just being straightforward with that.
Speaker 4 (12:06):
We would ask them, Oh, we don't get them, Okay.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
I didn't love that those questions came because Zach denied
confirming that his contract was up in twenty twenty seven,
that he had signed that extension following the AFC Championship game,
And that little snippiness, that little arrogance, that little smile
(12:32):
on the face of Zach Taylor, while Trags is just
doing his job and asking the right questions and fair
questions about it and making sure it's known to Zach,
not that Zach needs to be reminded that, Hey, you're
the one who has to answer these questions because we
don't get to talk to anybody else. And I just
(12:54):
felt like, to me an avoidable thing, just say I
don't want to talk about my contract. I sign an
extension and after the AFT Championship game it's up in
twenty twenty seven. But I know that we're focused on
getting getting ready to beat the Miami Dolphins and turning
this thing around.
Speaker 3 (13:09):
It could be that simple.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
But yet again there's a complicated inefficiency to the communication
of this franchise, unnecessary complications to the communication.
Speaker 3 (13:25):
It happens repeatedly.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
Over and over and over and over again, and in
a season that has already been stained by the failures
on the field and stained by the nonsense of the
contract situations off of it. Whether it was early in
the year dragging it out with t and Jamar, or
(13:48):
the Shamar Stewart thing, or the Trey Hendrickson thing, and
now the Zach Taylor thing, there is very little alignment
on the clear messaging by the organization other than Zach's
gonna be the guy who stands up there and takes
all the arrows. And this will be in the news
(14:10):
cycle for a couple of days and then it'll go
away and everybody will forget after we play another game.
I just don't understand why there cannot be more transparency
or understanding of what is or is not the truth
and what the plan is for Zach Taylor. And I
(14:34):
don't understand why Zach can't just say yes, this is
my contract status. It is again at least in my mind,
and it may not be talked about by anybody in
that organization. Just another unnecessary conversation, Another unnecessary distraction.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
Here we go again.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
Here's something that doesn't actually pertain to football that's being
talked about.
Speaker 3 (14:59):
How is that helpful to anybody?
Speaker 2 (15:01):
But based off the way they played on Sunday, maybe
you don't want to talk about football. I can understand
that as well. Five one, three, seven, four nine, fifteen
thirty is the phone number. We'll take some calls later
this afternoon. If you want to call in be a
part of the show. You can also tweet at me
at Audi elmore aut y E L M O r EM.
(15:23):
Coming up next, Football in the NATTI. The Bengals, I
think are at a crossroads this offseason, but they're at
an intersection they've been to before. I'll explain next. ESPN
fifteen thirty, Hey, Alexi.
Speaker 1 (15:39):
Is Football in the NATI, brought to you by Postman
Law on ESPN fifteen thirty, the official home of the
Cincinnati Bengals.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
Football and the NATI here on Tony Pike since e
three to sixty I'm Austin Ohmore, no Tony Pike today,
but I've been thinking a lot about the twenty twenty
five Bengals and who they remind me of. They remind
me of the twenty twenty Bengals. That was a team
that undoubtedly had some talent. They had some dudes that
(16:11):
could play. You might remember Gino Adkins was on that team.
What about AJ Green? He was there, Tyler Boyd was
at the top, maybe the peak of his powers as
the best slot receiver in the NFL. There were some
good young defenders, like there was you know, there was
something on that twenty twenty team, but they won just
(16:32):
four games. Joe Burrow rookie quarterback that year, coming out
of COVID, going through the whole nonsense that was that
at the time. And so it felt like repeatedly over
the course of the twenty twenty season, the Bengals couldn't
really get out of their own way all right, Like
they were competitive, but something would go wrong and they
(16:52):
just would snowball and they just weren't that good, and YadA, YadA, YadA.
It just felt like it was never going their way.
And I feel like there's a lot of similarities to
the twenty twenty team and this team right now. The
Bengals are four and ten. The twenty twenty team finished
four eleven and one, and that season they won two
(17:16):
of their last three games. They did it without Joe Burrow,
who you might remember, right before Thanksgiving had his knee
blown out in Washington, and so two of the final
three games they win with Ryan Finley at quarterback, the
Steelers Monday Night game and a game at Houston in
which the offense was incredibly efficient and T Higgins and
samaj p Ryd and those guys were sensational. But the
(17:42):
Bengals weren't that good. They had had a tough season.
Nothing really seemed to go their way. And we often
look back on that Steelers game in twenty twenty as
like a turning point, a needle mover, a cornerstone event
in this franchise, as being the moment, like the culture changed.
(18:05):
And while I agree that the wins in two of
those final three games were helpful to the culture in
the locker room, I think the culture was really curated
in the off season following the twenty twenty year, and
I've been digging into that off season and this upcoming
off season and the similarities between them so going into
(18:30):
the twenty twenty one season. So the twenty twenty off
season into twenty twenty one, the Bengals had about sixty
million dollars in cap space. Right now, they have a
little more than sixty million dollars in cap space going
into twenty twenty six. And while the wins at the
(18:51):
end of the year helped create the culture, it was
curated by a free agent class that featured Cheetabaya Woozie,
Trey Hendrickson, Mike Hilton, Larry Ogan, Jobi Riley Reef, and
Eli Apple. Now you might think of Reef and Apple
as a couple of guys who didn't do much, but
(19:13):
they did play a role, albeit minor, on a small
on a good team on good teams for two years
in a row. That is a big, impactful veteran free
agent class that came in and helped establish the culture.
You might remember the year before is when they signed
(19:35):
Von Bell and DJ Reeder. They had invested in the
veteran leadership for a young team, and in twenty twenty
they maximized as much as they could that offseason. Going
into twenty one, their salary cap. As I said they
had sixty million dollars to spend, they spent fifty seven million.
(19:59):
Of The Bengals had three point eight million dollars in
cap space by the end of twenty twenty one, or
by the end of that season. They spent all the
way up to the cat for the most part. They
also drafted Jamar Chase, Joseph Osai, and Evan McPherson. Now,
(20:20):
three good draft picks is not ideal, but you'll still
take three good hits in the NFL draft anytime. And
obviously Jamar Chase, it goes without saying the impact that
he's had on this franchise. Evan McPherson was a big
part of that as well. Joseph Osai has been an
(20:41):
impactful role player on this team. I think we're still
waiting for more from Joseph, but it makes me think
that offseason the Bengals also extended one of their young
pass rushers god by the name of Sam Hubbard. Could
Joseph Osai be this year Sam Hubbard? And then in
training camp they got creative. They traded for a defensive
(21:04):
lineman by the name of bj Hill. So think about
that one off season. Going into the Super Bowl year
with sixty million dollars in cap space to spend, they
acquired bj Hill and Larry Ogunjobi and Trey Hendrickson. They
reworked their entire defensive line. They added two cornerbacks, Mike
(21:26):
Hilton and Chida Beya Woozier. They got veteran experienced locker
room leaders that they added to a young team that
needed it. One of the biggest misconceptions about this franchise
right now is that they don't have money to spend
because of Burrow, because of Chase, and because of Higgins.
(21:50):
That's not true. They have the money, and they have
the blueprint. They've done it before.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
Now.
Speaker 2 (21:59):
Is it realistic to expect that the Bengals hit on
five or six free agents.
Speaker 3 (22:07):
I don't know that it's realistic to feel that way.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
I don't know that it's realistic to expect him to
hit on all six draft picks. Maybe, like Zach said yesterday,
but to act as if they can't do it because
of financial constraints is simply wrong. It's not true. And
as much as we want to dump on Duke Tobin
and he deserves it, this was his director, his player,
(22:34):
personnel department that led this to happening, led this charge,
led this free agent push. Now, they weren't perfect in
those years. They missed on Trey Wains, they missed on
McKenzie Alexander, they missed on free agents. Everybody does. But
to look at this and say, Okay, they know how
(22:54):
to do it, They've done it, we know what it
looks like. And oh, by the way, at any point,
they can restructure Joe Burrow's contract and they can easily
create more cap space if they want to cut a
few guys here, move a few guys there, restructure this that,
blah blah blah. You could be looking at eighty million
(23:15):
dollars before you know it. That's more than enough in
a salary cap that will almost certainly go up again
this offseason for the Bengals to get right back. In contention,
Joe Burrow was asked yesterday about why he thinks the
Bengals are not that far away. Here's the conversation with
(23:36):
the Bengals quarterback on Sunday.
Speaker 6 (23:37):
You said not that far when asked how close this
organization was to getting back to.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
Those big stages. Why do you think you guys are.
Speaker 7 (23:46):
Not that far.
Speaker 6 (23:49):
Well, we have young guys that are getting better. I
think we have really smart coaches. We have a lot
of highly talented people that go out and perform at
a high level on Sundays, weekend and week out. You know,
it's hard for me to it's hard for me to
(24:12):
talk about the totality of the season this year because
I was removed from it for so long, and you know,
I really I haven't had a season. I've played four
games and that's frustrating to me, and kind of it
made me feel like I was on the outside looking
in for a lot of it because that's what happens.
(24:35):
And so I'm just getting my feet wet again with
all this and it feels good. But you know, I
feel confident in the people that we have that we
have here.
Speaker 3 (24:44):
There you go.
Speaker 2 (24:44):
That's from the quarterback himself, and everybody wants to hyper
analyze everything that he says. And if it's true that
everything he says is measured and there's a purpose behind it,
well then I'm sure he wouldn't just loose lipped say
we're not that far away. Tony and I debated this
earlier this week. I've been saying it for most of
(25:07):
the season for all the reasons I just outlined, and
by looking at the Bengals schedule next year, I really
don't think that they are that far away. Now, let's
just quickly go through that for a moment. Next year,
they'll play the third place team in the AFC West,
which is gonna be the Kansas City Chiefs. The Chiefs
(25:27):
go into this offseason with Mahomes fresh off of surgery,
probably gonna be without Travis Kelcey, and they're over forty
million dollars forty million dollars over the cap. That's gonna
be a different looking Chiefs team than what we've seen
in the past, but you still expect them with Mahomes
and Reid to be formidable. They're gonna have the Jacksonville
(25:48):
Jaguars at home, obviously a good team, a team that
played them tough, but not a team that keeps you
up at night. The Tennessee Titans will be in Cincinnati
next year, the New Orleans Saints, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers,
and then of course the AFC North. That's a pretty
favorable home schedule. The Bengals traditionally are pretty good at
(26:12):
pay Court Stadium under Zach Taylor. Then you look at
their road schedule. They play the AFC East team that
finishes in third place, which will be the Miami Dolphins. Okay,
anything about that team, Scarret probably gonna be with a
new head coach, might be with a new quarterback.
Speaker 3 (26:34):
No Tyreek Hill. More than likely.
Speaker 2 (26:36):
They're also going to play an NFC East team who
finishes in third place. That's more than likely going to
be the Commanders. That team is gonna be dealing with
a lot of turnover. They have to go to Houston,
not gonna be easy. They got to go to Indianapolis,
probably not gonna be easy. They traveled to Atlanta and
Carolina and the rest of the AFC North. That is
not a schedule that has you struggling to find wins.
(26:59):
If you do what you're supposed to do in the
offseason to supplement your roster and build around your quarterback,
it's not that crazy. I'm not trying to be the
glass half fool guy. I'm not trying to do this
is truly what I feel. If you spend the money
the way you're supposed to, if you're aggressive in hunting
(27:21):
down the pieces that you need, and if you can
do anything about your process when it comes to drafting.
That gets you back closer to what you did in
the twenty twenty draft and in the twenty one draft.
You will be competitive in this conference again next year,
so long as everybody stays healthy, and that's a big
if across the entire National Football League. But to act
(27:43):
as if the Bengals are so far away, I simply
don't believe that, and all the other nonsense around this
organization right now, I think is distracting us from the
fact that, like, oh yeah, they really could be good,
sooner rather than later. They don't have to strip this
thing down. We'll talk next segment about this Burrow conversation
(28:09):
and Carson Palmer and Andrew Luck and all this other hogwash.
It's it's people that aren't really looking at the bones
of the operation here and saying, Okay, how can they
actually get back to being good? What are the changes
that can be made? That's what I'd like to know.
We'll take a break, we'll come back. This is Tony Pike.
(28:31):
Since he three to sixty on ESPN.
Speaker 1 (28:33):
Fifteen thirty, you've been listening to Football in the NATTI
on ESPN fifteen thirty. The official home of the Cincinnati
Bengalsteen thirty.
Speaker 4 (28:50):
Jada Thomas into the left corner for Celestie under the.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
Hoop bounce pass from Zella to Baba Ed Miller dumps
it and again.
Speaker 2 (28:58):
There Baba Miller out here playing with little bitty boys
out here.
Speaker 3 (29:02):
He's just he's like.
Speaker 1 (29:03):
A big breath from the backyard right now.
Speaker 3 (29:06):
Just throw it in there as you can't stop.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
Dan Horde Steve Logan on the call last night as
the Bearcats whoop up on Alabama State at fifth third Arena.
More on that coming up later on in our number three.
Baba went cuckoo with twenty six points fourteen boards for
U se Uh in that game last night. We'll hear
from Kegan nickoson at two o'clock. He was there covering
(29:30):
the game and the return of Gisel James. That's coming
up later on in the show. I want to get
to uh, the Joe Burrow conversation and the national media
fanning the flames on such a thing in a moment.
But first let's go to the phones five one, three, seven, four, nine,
fifteen thirty. Let's go to Fort Thomas and talk to Brian. Brian,
(29:51):
what's up, hi?
Speaker 7 (29:53):
Audie. I agree about about them having a chance to
turn it around. NFL is the most competitively, the most
evenly matched in in the United States, so it's not
it's not unheard of to come back and you know,
change things around very quickly. As look at Denver. Denver
(30:14):
was garbage two years ago. Right now they probably one
of the favorite Super Bowl And I think as a fan,
I'm not as freshly about this year. I'm more flusher
about last year. Like last year was just a wasting
opportunity and like Joe got a freak injury this this year,
sure got hurt, team played terrible, whatever, But last year,
like if they would have went on a you know,
(30:36):
a playoff, made the playoffs and won a couple of games,
just wouldn't be as upsetting as a fan. But I
feel like we're just we'll it's just being wasted right now.
Speaker 2 (30:45):
Yeah, that's a great point, and that's I think that season.
I mean, if if we get to this the end
of this thing and we never see the Bengals get
back to you know that that level of contending in
the AFC, We're gonna look back on the twenty four
season and think, golly, what could have been with the
season like that with Joe and Jamar and they just
(31:07):
didn't do enough to follow it up in the offseason.
Speaker 7 (31:11):
Yeah, it's it's and so it's I think as a fan,
I think we're at least me personally, I'm just I'm
just frustrating. Just I want to have a chance to win.
And in the NFL, if you got a quarterback, which
everybody knows we do, yeah, you can win. You can win.
Speaker 4 (31:27):
You can win it all.
Speaker 7 (31:28):
And that's you know, we just were dying to win.
We want a parade. That's that's it. This whole city
just wants the parade.
Speaker 2 (31:35):
Yeah, I'm right there with you, Brian. Thank you for
the phone call. And you know, you bring up a
good point. It's actually kind of a good segue. Part
of the reason why things went south between Carson Palmer
and Mike Brown was because Carson did not believe that
Mike was committed to exhausting every avenue to make the
team better, to turn it into a championship contender. And
(31:59):
I think before we get into this conversation, I would
like to note I am not comparing Carson Palmer to
Joe Burrow. Joe is the best quarterback I think that's
ever played for the Bengals. I think he is the
most talented quarterback that's ever played for the Bengals. And
I think he has a very different personality than that
of Carson Palmer. I think he's a much better player
(32:21):
than Carson Palmer. And this with Carson all happened fifteen
years ago. It's a lot different world now than it
was then. But the fundamental disagreement between Mike Brown and
Carson Palmer was that they weren't doing enough to compete
for a Super Bowl and Carson it just didn't sit
(32:44):
well with Carson. He felt like the Bengals could be
doing so much more than they've done. The Bengals have
changed a lot since then, and they have been more aggressive,
they have spent more money, They have evolved so much
more than I think a lot of people are willing
to give them credit for. And I don't think that
(33:05):
the place they're at right now with Joe Burrow is
even remotely close to where they were at with Carson Palmer.
I'm not trying to compare the two situations. What I'm
trying to explain is this thing with Burrow. To me,
when you go back to his press conference last week,
to all the conversation this week, all of it. The
(33:28):
flames are being fanned by the national media. They're pouring
gasoline on the fire. The reason it's happening is because
there's precedent. The precedent has a direct impact on the narrative.
If the Carson Palmer and Mike Brown thing had never happened,
this wouldn't be a conversation with Joe Burrow wanting to
(33:51):
leave the Bengals when they drafted him in twenty twenty.
There was a narrative out there that Joe wouldn't want
to play for the organization. That wouldn't have happened if
not for the Eli Manning thing that it happened years before.
Joe keeps getting injured, and then the Andrew Luck thing
gets brought up because we've seen it happen before. Because
(34:12):
there is precedent with Palmer and Brown, that leads to
people who maybe don't follow this closely, or don't know
Joe that much, or don't know exactly what's going on
within the organization to try to connect the dots and
come up with a hot take to say, Okay, this
is what's gonna happen again in Cincinnati, because that's the
way the Bengals do business. The Bengals have evolved, maybe
(34:35):
not as much as they should, and Joe is not
there even close to being the same type of person
that Carson Palmer is. But I just want you to
know this conversation is happening because of the precedent that
was set by the actions of Carson Palmer and Mike
Brown previously. That's why this is happening. And I'm not
(34:57):
dismissing what Joe has said or the wa that he
said it. Now, I stand by my belief that I
think last week Joe was having a bad day and
it came across that way and people ran with it,
and I think that made things worse, and whatever he
was going on in his life, clearly he wasn't all
the way there on Sunday. Had mental mistakes, had protection mistakes,
(35:18):
was not accurate with the football. There's a myriad of
reasons why that could happen. I have enough banked memories
of Joe Burrow playing over the last six years that
I don't think that's gonna happen again. And I don't
think there's a trend that's about to start, but I
do at least know the way he has talked. He's
(35:41):
unhappy with the way the organization has approached last season
in this season.
Speaker 3 (35:47):
And he should be.
Speaker 2 (35:48):
Every person in that organization should be unhappy with the
results of last year and with this year.
Speaker 3 (35:55):
And I'm sure.
Speaker 2 (35:56):
Joe, to an extent, and kind of like you heard
in that clip in the last segment, wonders how much
he can say because of his injuries and feels in
a way like he's on the outside looking in. We'll
talk more about what Joe said about his opinion being heard,
but here's Joe yesterday talking about his future with the Bengals.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
How much do you love?
Speaker 6 (36:19):
Like a body ever thought about that, You think about it,
but you think about a lot of different things, and
in your life, just like everybody does. You think about
all different possibilities that could happen. I'm gonna be playing
for a long time. I expect to play for a
(36:40):
long time, and I expect to play well and consistently
great for a long time.
Speaker 3 (36:45):
So much speculation is there?
Speaker 6 (36:48):
Ever?
Speaker 4 (36:48):
Is there any world in your mind where you're not
the quarterback of the Bengals next year?
Speaker 6 (36:54):
I could I couldn't.
Speaker 4 (36:54):
I can't see that now.
Speaker 2 (36:57):
I didn't you ever both thought about the possibility of
not being the quarterback here.
Speaker 3 (37:00):
During your career, or.
Speaker 6 (37:03):
You think about a lot of things, and when you.
Speaker 2 (37:06):
Look at quarterbacks over the course of their time, great ones,
Haydon Brady, do you kind of have to understand that you.
Speaker 3 (37:14):
Never know what this legal bringing. What did you learn
from watching how their career is on fold of time?
Speaker 6 (37:19):
Yeah, A lot of crazy things happen every year. Michael
Parsons got traded right before the right before the season.
I think this year that is a something I haven't
seen in a long time in the NFL. So crazy
things can happen.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
Bengals quarterback Joe Burrow, He's right, crazy things can happen
in the NFL. But he wants to play for a
long time. He expects to play for a long time
and at a high level for a long time, and
also understands that life in the NFL you never know
what's going to happen, which furthers the point that the
(38:03):
Bengals should be exhausting every avenue to aggressively pursue a championship.
Now again, looking forward at the next couple of years.
The opportunity is right there in front of you. You've
got the money, you've got the cap space, you've got
the quarterback. You don't have any more excuses. Five one, three, seven,
(38:23):
four nine, fifteen thirty. This is ESPN fifteen.
Speaker 8 (38:26):
Thirty, WCKY, Cincinnati and iHeartRadio Station g Garanteed Human ESPN
fifteen thirty.
Speaker 4 (38:35):
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Speaker 1 (39:02):
Tony Pike since he three sixty on ESPN fifteen thirty.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
A little bit of time here before we talked to
John Shearon, a is E sports covering the Cincinnati Bengals.
This is Tony Pikes, since he three sixty. Let's go
to Minneapolis and talk to Charles. Charles, what's on your mind?
Speaker 3 (39:28):
Hey?
Speaker 4 (39:28):
How are you?
Speaker 7 (39:29):
Just?
Speaker 4 (39:30):
Quickly you know back on the whole ownership, being a
lifelong Bengal fan here the only team ever liked. I
know you mentioned earlier about there being president and sort
of anchoring it to the Carson Palmer issue, but it
was actually precedent beyond that. It was he was TJ.
Housman's out obviously, you know him was on an interview
(39:50):
and he said when he first got the Cincinnati speaking
of president, there was no water and gatorade in the
locker room.
Speaker 3 (39:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (39:59):
I so there's precedence. There's so many things that this
team had, hopefully inadequate by any stretch of the magic,
by any standard considering themselves to be a professional organization,
and as such, we continuously come to this point. There
shouldn't even have been a need for Mike Brown to
come out and say we're going to do everything we
(40:22):
can to sign Joe Duh. Like you know, at the time,
they said, why would he need to say these kinds
of things?
Speaker 7 (40:28):
Why?
Speaker 4 (40:29):
Because the precedent has always been with this organization that
they're awful.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
Yeah, that's that's my point. Now, the good thing is
they've they've changed. They don't do the stuff that they
did twenty years ago. When TJ was here. That's all changed, thankfully,
But you're right, the precedent has led to the narrative,
and until you do something to change the narrative, that's
what people are going to fall back on, and that's
their fault.
Speaker 4 (40:53):
Yes, thank you, thank you for your time. Love the show,
trust in the show, thank you man, appreciate it, Thanks
for the call. Yeah, I mean, without a doubt, until
you do something to change the narrative, the narrative is
going to exist. It is the unfortunate reality. And the
Bengals are often a day late and a dollar short
(41:16):
when it comes to doing that. They've made strides, but
they're often too late. They were too late and signing
Jamar Chase they cost themselves a lot more money. They
were too late in signing T. Higgins, they cost themselves
a lot more money. They often create bigger headaches for
themselves because they're reactive instead of proactive. That's something they
(41:39):
need to improve on. This is an off season where
you have a chance to do that.
Speaker 2 (41:45):
You have a chance to say we're going to be
proactive in our our pursuit of better defensive players, of
changing our draft strategy, of whatever it might be. When
we come back, we'll talk to John Scheran covering the
Bengals eight to Z Sports. This is Tony Pike's since
he three p. Sixty on the home of the Bengals, Cincinnati,
ESPN fifteen thirty.
Speaker 3 (42:02):
Having insurance isn't the same as having state farm
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