Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Pastor ed Young is our guest and pastor, as I mentioned,
just to kind of signpost for folks, if you can
hold with me for just a little longer, I'd first
like to talk about some advice for parents and grandparents
who are who are involved in the in the rearing
of their grandchildren, about how you guide Christians to teach
(00:21):
your child about Christmas from the Christian perspective, the life
of Christ, the birth of Christ, and not just the
words you use and the lessons you use, but the
actions you take. Can you can you kind of give
some proscriptive, actual guidance there please?
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Yeah. Well, you know, actually, in our modern world, we
have resorted back to Freud, We resorted back to the
progressives and they tell us, you know, how to bring
up you children, and we did that partially with my
three sons. I can tell you that, you know, we'd
(00:58):
go buy the books by this author, by this individual,
we would use a spoon to discipline, and we're caught
up in the secular human way of raising children. What
I've done, Michael, in the past three months, I went
back and took the Bible and I just took basic
passages of how people would bring up their children at
(01:21):
biblical times, and I made it very relevant as to
what we do in the area of discipline, et cetera.
And I asked my church one time. I said, you
know the Bible verse to spare the rod is for
the child, and every hand went up. I said, there's
only one problem with that. That's not in the Bible,
(01:42):
but we think it is. But it doesn't mean to
use the rod in the Bible for your child. It
primary doesn't mean we don't discipline. I use the belt.
We use a lot of things with my boys, hopefully
appropriate at age and situation. But the word rod, they're
in Bible, and he talks about the rod, but not
(02:02):
in that context is the standard of God's rules and
regulations of how you bring up your children quickly from
birth until they're too you're the servant and the slaves
to the children. Your wife, Michael, with your boys at
that period of time, she was a full time slave.
But from two to thirteen the world changes, and that's
(02:26):
when the parents must become the want of a better word,
God in the life of those kids. In other words,
you just say. I've heard modern people say, well, don't
say just because I told you so. Oh yes. From
from three to thirteen, it's just because I told you so.
They aren't able to think rationally, and you build into
them a respect, a discipline where they're trustworthy. You teach
(02:50):
them miners, you teach them all those basic things, and
you got a small window there. Now, these ages are
not dogmatic, of course, and that is when mom and
Dad had become the authority and the life of those kids. Now,
from thirteen to eighteen, you begin to teach and of
course discipline differently as well. You begin to examine that,
(03:11):
you begin to deal with that in their lives because
now you reason with them and you talk to them rationally. Yes,
this is why we don't do this, this is why
our family operates like this, this is why etc. Etc.
So we have to understand the segments in the life
of our kids. And the Bible is so clear. I've
taken each one of those segments, Michael, and I've spent
(03:32):
over six weeks just talking about parenting God's way and
God's style. Basically, that is it, and it is so
fundamental in our day and age. I talk to parents
all the time and their kids is say seventeen, and
they'll say, you know, I've just lost control of my son.
I said, well, I said, let's go back and have
(03:55):
a READO. Let's start at three. And that's what happens
a lot of parents. And I tell you I have
three sons, ten grandchildren. I have five great grandchildren. Michael,
I can't believe that, and I'd love to have a redo.
I didn't do it all right, I assure you, but
I am saying to pride, the biblical principles in parenting
would be the revolution in our society as much as
(04:18):
any other single thing. And I didn't do them perfectly.
But I tried to go back and put that down.
And that's a whole different conversation. And it starts, by
the way, with the dynamic marriage. Man, if your marriage
has chemistry and firepower, and I know your marriage does,
and I guarantee that's the basic of it, basis of it. Therefore,
(04:38):
the parents own the same page that they never have
any controversy there, and that is so important. The best thing, Michael,
that I taught my boys is that I was in
love with their mother and their mother was in love
with me. That's the best training you can live before
your kids. Short sermon, but you touch the very important
(04:59):
I think right.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
My mother used to say that a woman can tell
what kind of husband you're going to be by how
you treat your mother. And my brother Chris and I
used to say, Mom, you're just saying that so we'll
be nice to you.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
But it is true.
Speaker 4 (05:16):
It is true.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
A man who treats his wife with this spot, a
man who does not diminish insult his wife, that's a
man that you It's it's going to be good to
work with, work for work, beside live Norton, next door
to carpool with play ball with. That's going to tell
you a lot about that person. It really really is
(05:38):
uh and it makes a big difference. It makes a
huge difference. I want to get to Israel, and I
want to do that in the next segment, but I
got about two minutes two and a half minutes left.
Speaker 3 (05:47):
I want to ask.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
You, you know about traditions, because some of our traditions
and our rituals and a Southern Baptists, we're not as
ritualistic as say our Catholic friends are. But are there
some rituals and traditions that you think represent a sort
of allegory of an importance to our message and take
about three minutes if you would on that.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
All right, Well, we talk about Advent, and that's contrary
to mind your background, but I think Advent is a
good thing. Advent is the four Sundays. I have to
know them, the thirteenth prior to Christmas, and that's the
Advent calendar. And each one of those four Sundays, and
I will go into the details of that is a
good time to look at specific things in which family, friends, hobbies,
(06:33):
et cetera takes place. And Advent not only is Advent
means coming by the way that which will come, and
it's a celebration of Christmas that will come, and it's
also a celebration of the second coming of Jesus Christ.
Jesus came into time and history and space, and he
will come again and bring down the curtain of history.
(06:56):
So that is a celebration of Advent, and that's a
good tradition. Family years two we have all kinds of traditions,
you know. We go to Christmas Eve services, we exchange gifts.
We try to put it to a limit there among
all the adults, and we read the Christmas story as
if we'd never heard it before. And it's just a
(07:17):
fun thing for our family. We eat too much and
then our calendar, Our tradition is very simple. We have
what thirty something Christmas Eve services and our churches in Houston,
and when I get through that last Christmas Eve. By
the way, this year we have a Christmas Eve Eve
service and some we have more Friday and Saturday and
(07:40):
then Christmas Eve it's home Sunday. So we really are
trying to get it all in. And my tradition is
my wife and I now they have empty nests. We
get on a plane Christmas morning and we go off
and recover. But that's just our tradition for a good
number of years. But every family needs those traditions that
they practice as best they can, because you know, home
(08:03):
is where we want to be Christmas, isn't it, And
that's home is where our family is, where our friends are.
So there's a lot of good traditions that I think
speak of Christmas Eve that we can celebrate if I
had time to go, But that had the calendar that
many of the liturgical churches do, which I think is
a super thing.
Speaker 1 (08:20):
Ancidentally, you're listening to.
Speaker 3 (08:22):
The Michael Berry's show.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
We are talking with Pastor ed Young of Second Baptist Church,
and we've been talking about Christian traditions and being a
Christian parent, a Christian spouse, and a Christian in modern America.
And you alluded earlier to Israel, and I'm glad you
did because it's in the news. There is a war
going on, and everybody views Israel differently. Almost all of
(08:48):
my Jewish friends view Israel as a tribal homeland of
fellow Jews. And they're very protective. I mean, and some
people would argue they're more protective of Israel than they
would be anywhere in the world. And there's a lot
that goes into that. But from your perspective as a Christian,
and I know you have preached on this, what is
the importance of Israel, modern Israel to a Christian American
(09:15):
at Christmas?
Speaker 2 (09:16):
Well for me and for a lot of Christians today.
So many of us have been I've been to Israel,
Michael thirty thirty five times with groups and sometimes all
kinds of groups, sometimes with Jewish groups, and so I
love Israel. When I go to Israel, I've been on
the Sea of Galilee. You may have to, by the way,
ped we all do you know.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
But the last time you and I and Lisa were together,
we were talking about the trip that you take every year,
and you take a group I believe.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
To Israel. Can you make a pilgrimage out of it?
Speaker 2 (09:48):
We really do. And it's more fun than you ever
have in your life. If it's not, you know, anyway,
So you go, the Bible comes alive. We know the
Sea of Galilee. I've been on the Sea of Galilee.
I fished in the Sea of Galilee. And we just
go to all the historic places. Nothing like going to
the open tomb, nothing like c And Israel is a
a one country, by the way, Michael, you know that
(10:11):
it's a fabulous country in and of itself. It's our
only real, probably closest thing to a democracy, not only
in the Middle East, but maybe any other place. Maybe
Great Britain would be there, maybe a couple other countries.
But Israel a fabulous country. Is very developed, it's very clean.
Their medicine is probably better than ours. Their it is
(10:33):
much better than ours. They're a head on a lot
of things. And the Jews are fabulous people. You know.
Every Jewish boy is either a doctor or a rabbi.
And so the in between their scientists. They're brilliant people.
And I can see why God has so blessed in
raw talent the Jewish people, because they are to be
(10:54):
and they will be one day evangelists of the rest
of the world when they see and except Jesus as Messiah.
But Israel today is full of so many problems and contradictions.
Their political climate is not unlike ours. And I have
been there and walked the streets so many many times.
(11:15):
It has a special place. A lot of people who
are entered eschatology. They're talking about the end times. And
I know preachers who take the Bible and say, we're
in this phrase and the cup is happening now. And
people ask me that, I say, look, I don't know.
The Bible says only the Father knows. Jesus doesn't know.
(11:35):
The Holy Spirit doesn't know that is on the Father's
calendar when he breaks down the curtain of history. Now, Michael,
I don't see anything that has to take place in
a prophetic way that isn't already in place nineteen forty eight,
you know, through Harry Truman, we established the nation of Israel,
and so in this conflict we need to realize. Somebody said,
(11:58):
Israel is living on stone the land. Well, the Bible
is a pretty old book, and the last time I
checked it was Palestine was inhabited by the Jews, and
so that's a pretty good title, deed. I think as
far the distribution that we're seeing now, it is amazing
to me, Michael, of how much hatred has come anti
(12:21):
Semitism in this moment. And I really have been shocked
at that, I really have. And it shows how the
left wing progresses in the habit the White House and
much of our culture. They don't really have any ideology
that's consistent. You know that. I know that. And here
(12:41):
you would think, for example, i'd give a Zenian illustration
of females. Who gave dignity to females. It is Jesus Christ.
He said, you're not male or female, you're not bond
or free. He made us all one. By the way, Michael,
you need to read. I got a couple of looks
you love to reach. I do not believe race is
(13:01):
a reality. We'll be divided by race. Race. There's no
such thing as race. You can't find race in one
page of one word in the Bible. We're all a
part of one race, that's a human race. What has
the pigmentation of your skin, of my skin, anything else
have anything to do with anything? I don't know, it doesn't.
(13:22):
So you take all the dividing things out of it.
Christ comes and unifies, and that's what he did with
that rembant in Israel when he came and establish his
body of the Church. So Israel is in trouble. But
to give it politically what I believe that in Yahoo
and his crews, they're going to take care of these
demonic Hamasue people. They're just isis as you know, we
(13:45):
born in another the other ideology that's demonic in what
it's doing. And those who believe there's some kind of
equality between those who would slaughter babies and those who
would rake women, and those who would take hostages of
twelve thirteen hundred people, you will equate that with some
kind of political misunderstanding or misstep of Israel. That is crazy.
(14:09):
That's like comparing a typhoon to a sneeze with wind
in the air. It's no comparison. And I think that
the left part of our political society has been exposed
like never never before because of what's happening in Israel.
You see all their bigotry, their prejudice, their narrowness. And
(14:32):
I could go on and own at this subject. So
Israel has a very definite place in the latter days.
And the last time I checked Armageddon is in Israel,
I had stood right there on the bank and looked
at it for myself. So the bottom line, God is
up to something. I don't know, to be honest, Michael,
if God can salvage the United States, I really don't
(14:56):
know that. I hate to say that, I believe it.
I'm working that He will come back and free us
once again. We established the biblical principles, which the Constitution
is absolutely based on. And I'm just praying for our land.
I'm praying for Israel, and I just trust that we
haven't yet had the great turning to God, the revival
(15:18):
of people all shapes, all forms, all backgrounds, all nationalities,
all ethnicities. I pray we haven't had that yet, and
it will come. And maybe you know, it'll just come
around Christmas, when God established himself in human flesh and said,
come follow me, receive me, and you'll have a brand
(15:40):
new life. Michael, you could take all the leaders of
all the countries and all the ideologies, all the theocracies
of the world, and they could take Jesus in their
life and be forgiven and have a new life. There
wouldn't be another problem in this universe. You see, God
knew what he was doing. He said, the answer to
(16:01):
all this begins with a baby.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
I love how you brought that back in a perfect circle.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
You know you are.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
You are really really good at conveying a message through
a story.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
It's powerful.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
It is a work for a good company.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
Michael Pastor, I got thirty seconds before I have to
cut off. I'm grateful for you. Tell me one thing
about just an insight in you. Tell me one thing
about you that you love about Christmas that is not
such a serious thing. One thing you look forward to.
Speaker 2 (16:39):
Ah, I look forward to once in a while giving
a gift to one of my kids and my wife
and they smile and laugh and say, you know, I've
always wanted that. I didn't know it, yep, And I'm
working on that. Twenty four to seven. I have some
females by gifts for me every year, and you know,
(16:59):
and expresses her needs, but it doesn't express my personality.
I'm always looking for that, Michael, and once in a
while I've done it. By the way, I gave Joe
Beth a puppy years ago, King Charles that he left
us earth after fourteen years, and that was the best
gift I've ever give him to it. I want to
(17:20):
find another gift like that, Michael, for my budget.
Speaker 3 (17:22):
For it's a.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
Special thing because most of the time it doesn't land
like we'd like it to. Pastor ed Young, thank you
for making time and sharing your ministry with us today.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
Michael, God bless you. You bring your wife and family
to the Big Show, and I guarantee it they'll love it.
We got flying angels and you won't believe it. And
we got the largest cast. We'll have five hundred people
in the cast and it will be knocking out John
fun for everybody.
Speaker 4 (17:47):
Love.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
I'd love to have you is Michael.
Speaker 3 (17:48):
Got to shoot up here amongst just one of us.
Got to have some relief, Amen, Michael Barry Show.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
As some of you know, because I talk about my
personal life on the air, it's all I got to
talk about, and I share how I interact.
Speaker 5 (18:04):
With the policies and politics that we talk about.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
Because at the end of the day. These aren't academic discussions, right.
If the government takes over our health care, that's going
to affect you. And just because you're young and healthy
and haven't needed health care yet or recently, you don't
realize that, and you see it as some sort of
arcane or ethereal existential discussion. But that's not where it
(18:30):
is for me. I have a brother who died of
the clock shot, a perfectly able bodied law enforcement officer
with over thirty years who died of the clock shot
January twenty twenty two. My father is eighty four, and
since he was twenty years old and had to be
discharged from the Coastguard on his deathbed with a severe
(18:53):
case of diabetes and they didn't know how to treat
it back then, they sent him home to die, and
he read and experimented, and here we are. He's eighty
four and still alive, still battling diabetes by the day.
He is in constant contact with doctors, and many of
them have told me, your dad knows more about diabetes
than diabetes doctors do, because in an era before we
(19:14):
had proper insulin, he was managing his blood sugar that's
unheard of and he still has his vision in all
tin of his fingers and toes well. He's a man
of great self discipline and the willingness to experiment on
himself and get enough sleep and not drink, and you know,
do the things that are necessary. And then, of course
my mother, five years younger than him, My father was
supposed to go first, and my mother would nurse him
(19:37):
until the end of his life. And she up and
passes on us. And she ended up having als that
basically just eventually took over her body and left her
unable to breathe.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
Her lungs just wouldn't function, and it was a horrible,
horrible way to go.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
She died in hospice at our home. I have been
in and out of hospitals just with these things so
many times over the last few years that I have
come to learn a lot about the medical care system.
You know, I had a minor stroke on August first,
twenty sixteen. I you know, we've all had our medical issues.
(20:19):
I'm much better now about taking care of my health
and getting my checkups and all that. But the policy
issue of how we deliver healthcare in a marketplace of
people trying to heal you and provide wellness and prevent
all these things. It's gotten. It's all messed up, and
I don't think people really even understand why it's all
(20:42):
messed up. And so today I would like to step
back from the news of the day and address this.
There is a fellow who has been highly recommended when
I bring these questions up, named Charles Silver. He is
the McDonald endowed Share of Civil Procedure at Versity of
Texas at Austin School of Law. I don't know if
(21:04):
he was there when I was there in the mid nineties.
I don't know him, but his work has been widely
widely discussed, particularly his book Overcharged, Why Americans pay too
much for healthcare. Professor Silver, welcome to the program.
Speaker 4 (21:23):
Thank you, Michael, pleasure to be here.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
I must first ask you if you were on faculty
from ninety three to ninety six when I was there.
Speaker 4 (21:31):
I was. I started teaching at Texas in nineteen eighty seven.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
Oh well, okay, well, I was a Lino Graula acolyte
and I was the first crop. There were two of
us that were sent to England to get an LLM degree,
so I was kind of checked out after my second year.
Once I had my offer, I was kind of checked out,
but I'm sorry that I never met you.
Speaker 3 (21:57):
I had a wonderful.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Experience at the University of Texas School of Law. It's
a it's a great university law school, and I am
the better for it. So I think a lot of
you for being on factory there.
Speaker 3 (22:08):
It's a great institution. Let's thank you.
Speaker 4 (22:11):
I'm sorry I didn't get to meet you when you
were a student.
Speaker 1 (22:14):
Indeed, the book overcharged why Americans pay too much for healthcare?
If somebody says, Michael, I'm going to come back and
listen on the podcast later, but give me the one
minute answer, and then let's get granular and dig into this,
what's the one minute answer as to why we pay
too much for healthcare?
Speaker 4 (22:34):
The one minute answer, we rely far too heavily on
third party payment arrangements, which means insurance companies, Medicare, Medicaid, Tricare, VA,
whatever they happen to be, instead of paying for healthcare
directly the same way we pay for pretty much everything else, food, cars, housing,
(22:58):
You know, we pay for the vast majority of things directly,
meaning we pay for them ourselves, and we don't have
the problem of excessive spending or inflation or costs, or
hidden bills or surprise bills or phony charges. All that
worked really well. The one exception is the healthcare sector,
where we rely very very extensively on third parties to
(23:22):
pay for things, and that just screws everything up. Now,
the other thing is we have way too much governmental
involvement in the healthcare sector. There are lots and lots
of regulations that make things worse for consumers. By and large,
the regulations have the purpose of protecting the producers, not
the consumers, So we should do a lot less in
(23:44):
that way.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
You did that.
Speaker 5 (23:46):
You were technically finished at fifty eight seconds. You added
an addendum to the end that I will admit will
it is admissible in this case. But you achieved the
fifty eight seconds. Quite impressed that you did.
Speaker 1 (24:01):
So let's start drilling down on these things. I got
a minute left in this segment, but I have dedicated
some time to talk about this because I think a
lot of people are frustrated, especially when they start getting
all these bills and they go to the emergency room
and the place is packed, and then they can't get
in to see a doctor, and then they wonder you know,
(24:23):
why does something cost ten thousand dollars that took twenty minutes.
It just there's nothing else that requires this. It all
seems so frustrating to people, and I would like to
drill down and get into the actual reasons why this works.
Let me start by prefacing, and we'll get to this
(24:45):
in the next segment.
Speaker 3 (24:46):
Because I don't want to have to cut you off.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
I want to first talk about what if we were
to do a zero based budget, we were to go
back to John Locke's state of nature, and let's start
all over and have a cash on only.
Speaker 3 (25:01):
Health delivery system.
Speaker 1 (25:03):
Let's do away with insurance, and let's talk about who
the winners and losers out of that would be. And
more importantly, if I'm if I'm a consumer of health services,
because I don't believe that healthcare is a right. If
I'm a consumer of health services, would this be better
or worse for me? So hang tight right there. Our
guest is Professor Charles Silver. I encourage you to read
(25:25):
the book Overcharged, Why Americans pay too much for.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
Health care Fellers, and you listen to the Michael Berry Show.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
Good that.
Speaker 1 (25:41):
Professor Charles Silver is our guest and has promised. At
the end, I given him a moment to consider, Professor,
what if we go back the book is overcharged? Why
Americans pay too much for health care? What if we
did away with all insurance and we went cash only?
How would that change things?
Speaker 4 (26:00):
Mean a lot of things for the better, but some
things for the worse. So a lot of things would
be better, you know, we wouldn't have to worry about
things like surprise medical bills where you don't even know
what something is going to cost when you get the
service delivered. There's actually a very large retail health sector.
So if you want to get laser eye surgery, for example,
(26:22):
you have to pay for that yourself because it's not
covered by insurance typically. But you know what, it's actually
very affordable. And the price for laser surgery. Are you
ready for this? The price has substantially declined since LASIK
was developed, and it's gotten much better too. There are
new forms of lask and all that has happened because
(26:45):
there is no overlay of insurance. Where where in the
healthcare sector except in the private payment sector can one
find prices that have declined. Now, there are no hospital
services that I'm aware of that cost less now than
they used to. But in the private sector where we
purchase cosmetic surgery, I mentioned Lasik. There's also the Surgery
(27:09):
Center of Oklahoma, which operates on a cash basis. But
there are lots of services that people can buy directly,
and those things that part of the market works incredibly
well with. As I said, we don't have surprise bills.
Everybody knows that they're going to pay before the service
is delivered, and nobody gets billed for more than the price.
The prices are posted, we don't have to have a you.
(27:31):
In the hospital sector, we have this federal Transparity rule
transparency rule that hospitals routinely ignore that's supposed to require
them to post their prices. But in the retail sector,
we don't have that, and everybody posts their prices anyway.
So a lot of things would work better if we
did that, But the one thing that would work worse
(27:51):
would be emergencies where you're facing a risk of a
catastrophic cost that you know, people just can't afford to
bear on their own. That's where insurance has a role
to play. Catastrophic costs.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
Yeah, Professor I have long advocated that we should if
people would understand. For instance, I only have liability insurance
on my vehicles, and people say you have to No, no, no,
I pay cash for my vehicles.
Speaker 3 (28:20):
The only reason people are over insured in.
Speaker 1 (28:22):
Most cases is because the person holding the loan wants
you to have insurance for more than the value of
what they're of what they've loaned you money for in
case the thing gets burned down or trashed, they want
their money once. You don't have to do that. In
my opinion, I'm a safe driver. I've never met an
insurance claim. In my opinion, it's a bad business deal.
(28:44):
So what I tell people to do is get catastrophic
health insurance so when it hits fifteen thousand and up,
it's good. And then pay cash and you'll be shocked
how many doctors will discount what you get and they're
happy to have the cash. I go to a doctor
named Mary Tally Boden for all my upper respiratory stuff,
and she's a cash only doctor, which, as you know,
(29:06):
a lot of people are going to. And you go
in and you make your payment and it's insanely cheap,
and then there's no documentation. Later there's no you know,
insurance letter arrives. Do we pay this? No, we wait
to pay this. She's happier. She doesn't have to have
a bunch of billing clerks. You literally pay the same
way if you bought yogurt there. I think this is
the answer, Professor, Well.
Speaker 4 (29:28):
I agree with you because I go to a doctor
who works on the same basis. So my doctor I
pay a monthly subscription fee too, But I can go
as many times as I want. You know, I don't
need to go all the time, fortunately, but if I
need to go, she usually can see me either that
day or the next day, and I get some tests
(29:49):
performed in house at no charge, and it's it's a
great working arrangement. Like you, I don't get it. I
don't worry about my insurance company, you know, not paying
for something. So I think I agree with you. The
cash payment is a very good approach for basic health care.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
So let's have a little history lesson. Professor Charles Silver
is our guest. The book is called Overcharged, Why Americans
pay too much for healthcare. Let's go back to wherever
the starting point is. You want it to be nineteen
fifty or nineteen seventy, Where did it start going wrong,
because we all know it's wrong. Now, where did it
start going wrong?
Speaker 4 (30:31):
Oh, that's easy. It started going wrong in the mid
nineteen sixties when Medicare and Medicaid came online. In my book,
I show how doctors and hospitals fees changed after Medicare
and Medicaid took effect in nineteen sixty five, And basically,
both of those statutes initially let doctors and hospitals charged
(30:54):
whatever they wanted for services, and so not surprisingly, they
started raising their rate immediately. I mean really immediately after
the enactment of those programs, we were beset with health
care inflation that exceeded the real growth rate of the GDP,
and we have been struggling with healthcare inflation ever since.
(31:16):
But everything about the arrangement is wrong. I mean, who
in their right minds let's people who are selling things
set their own prices without any market constraints. I mean,
that's a recipe for disaster, right, And then, of course
that couldn't last forever. So the government eventually did get
into the price setting business in Medicare and Medicaid. But
(31:37):
of course we all know that government price setting is terrible.
It never works properly. It's really hard to set good prices,
to set prices accurately. And moreover, the government really doesn't
have the right set of interests. You know, I want.
It's not just the price that matters to me, it's
the convenience. Right. How long do I have to wait
(31:58):
to see my doctor? How friendly is my doctor, How
good is my doctor? There are all these things. Different
doctors should have different prices, and markets can work all
that stuff out, but governments just are notoriously unable to
do that. And so as a result, we've had this
terrible system. And because it's so terrible, it's constantly in
(32:20):
need of patching. I mean, every time I turn around,
there's a new bill, a new proposal being put on
the table for some kind of regulation to fix a
problem that only exists because the government created it. It's
never going to be fixed. It's impossible to fix it.
We really need to just scrap these arrangements and go
(32:41):
back to a simple cash based system for fundamental care,
and then things will start. It will immediately be out
of the spending crisis. The prices will moderate because hospitals
and doctors and drug companies and all that will have
to deal with the realities of the limited budgets of consumers.
They'll also have to face competition. That's hugely important. You know,
(33:04):
one I mentioned the retail health sector. You know, one
of the reasons lasik is cheap is because there are
a lot of laser providers and any ophthalmologists can enter
the field who wants to. So there's a lot of competition,
and competition is good for consumers. So we need to
get rid of these competition frustrating regulations. Let's increase the supply.
(33:26):
Let you know, foreign doctors who can pass American exams
come in and treat people. We need to just open
the floodgates for providers because we have this artificially created shortage.
You know, that's one of the ways that doctors and
hospitals have increased their revenues. It's by preventing new entrants
(33:46):
from coming in and you know, outcompete. So we have
to get rid of all that stuff.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
Professor Charles Silver at the University of Texas School of Law,
my alma mater, is our guest.
Speaker 3 (33:57):
This book is overcharged.
Speaker 1 (33:59):
Why Americans pay to dang much for healthcare? I added
the dang, but I think we all feel it more
with Professor Silver coming up
Pastor ed Young is our guest and pastor, as I mentioned,
just to kind of signpost for folks, if you can
hold with me for just a little longer, I'd first
like to talk about some advice for parents and grandparents
who are who are involved in the in the rearing
of their grandchildren, about how you guide Christians to teach
(00:21):
your child about Christmas from the Christian perspective, the life
of Christ, the birth of Christ, and not just the
words you use and the lessons you use, but the
actions you take. Can you can you kind of give
some proscriptive, actual guidance there please?
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Yeah. Well, you know, actually, in our modern world, we
have resorted back to Freud, We resorted back to the
progressives and they tell us, you know, how to bring
up you children, and we did that partially with my
three sons. I can tell you that, you know, we'd
(00:58):
go buy the books by this author, by this individual,
we would use a spoon to discipline, and we're caught
up in the secular human way of raising children. What
I've done, Michael, in the past three months, I went
back and took the Bible and I just took basic
passages of how people would bring up their children at
(01:21):
biblical times, and I made it very relevant as to
what we do in the area of discipline, et cetera.
And I asked my church one time. I said, you
know the Bible verse to spare the rod is for
the child, and every hand went up. I said, there's
only one problem with that. That's not in the Bible,
(01:42):
but we think it is. But it doesn't mean to
use the rod in the Bible for your child. It
primary doesn't mean we don't discipline. I use the belt.
We use a lot of things with my boys, hopefully
appropriate at age and situation. But the word rod, they're
in Bible, and he talks about the rod, but not
(02:02):
in that context is the standard of God's rules and
regulations of how you bring up your children quickly from
birth until they're too you're the servant and the slaves
to the children. Your wife, Michael, with your boys at
that period of time, she was a full time slave.
But from two to thirteen the world changes, and that's
(02:26):
when the parents must become the want of a better word,
God in the life of those kids. In other words,
you just say. I've heard modern people say, well, don't
say just because I told you so. Oh yes. From
from three to thirteen, it's just because I told you so.
They aren't able to think rationally, and you build into
them a respect, a discipline where they're trustworthy. You teach
(02:50):
them miners, you teach them all those basic things, and
you got a small window there. Now, these ages are
not dogmatic, of course, and that is when mom and
Dad had become the authority and the life of those kids. Now,
from thirteen to eighteen, you begin to teach and of
course discipline differently as well. You begin to examine that,
(03:11):
you begin to deal with that in their lives because
now you reason with them and you talk to them rationally. Yes,
this is why we don't do this, this is why
our family operates like this, this is why etc. Etc.
So we have to understand the segments in the life
of our kids. And the Bible is so clear. I've
taken each one of those segments, Michael, and I've spent
(03:32):
over six weeks just talking about parenting God's way and
God's style. Basically, that is it, and it is so
fundamental in our day and age. I talk to parents
all the time and their kids is say seventeen, and
they'll say, you know, I've just lost control of my son.
I said, well, I said, let's go back and have
(03:55):
a READO. Let's start at three. And that's what happens
a lot of parents. And I tell you I have
three sons, ten grandchildren. I have five great grandchildren. Michael,
I can't believe that, and I'd love to have a redo.
I didn't do it all right, I assure you, but
I am saying to pride, the biblical principles in parenting
would be the revolution in our society as much as
(04:18):
any other single thing. And I didn't do them perfectly.
But I tried to go back and put that down.
And that's a whole different conversation. And it starts, by
the way, with the dynamic marriage. Man, if your marriage
has chemistry and firepower, and I know your marriage does,
and I guarantee that's the basic of it, basis of it. Therefore,
(04:38):
the parents own the same page that they never have
any controversy there, and that is so important. The best thing, Michael,
that I taught my boys is that I was in
love with their mother and their mother was in love
with me. That's the best training you can live before
your kids. Short sermon, but you touch the very important
(04:59):
I think right.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
My mother used to say that a woman can tell
what kind of husband you're going to be by how
you treat your mother. And my brother Chris and I
used to say, Mom, you're just saying that so we'll
be nice to you.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
But it is true.
Speaker 4 (05:16):
It is true.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
A man who treats his wife with this spot, a
man who does not diminish insult his wife, that's a
man that you It's it's going to be good to
work with, work for work, beside live Norton, next door
to carpool with play ball with. That's going to tell
you a lot about that person. It really really is
(05:38):
uh and it makes a big difference. It makes a
huge difference. I want to get to Israel, and I
want to do that in the next segment, but I
got about two minutes two and a half minutes left.
Speaker 3 (05:47):
I want to ask.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
You, you know about traditions, because some of our traditions
and our rituals and a Southern Baptists, we're not as
ritualistic as say our Catholic friends are. But are there
some rituals and traditions that you think represent a sort
of allegory of an importance to our message and take
about three minutes if you would on that.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
All right, Well, we talk about Advent, and that's contrary
to mind your background, but I think Advent is a
good thing. Advent is the four Sundays. I have to
know them, the thirteenth prior to Christmas, and that's the
Advent calendar. And each one of those four Sundays, and
I will go into the details of that is a
good time to look at specific things in which family, friends, hobbies,
(06:33):
et cetera takes place. And Advent not only is Advent
means coming by the way that which will come, and
it's a celebration of Christmas that will come, and it's
also a celebration of the second coming of Jesus Christ.
Jesus came into time and history and space, and he
will come again and bring down the curtain of history.
(06:56):
So that is a celebration of Advent, and that's a
good tradition. Family years two we have all kinds of traditions,
you know. We go to Christmas Eve services, we exchange gifts.
We try to put it to a limit there among
all the adults, and we read the Christmas story as
if we'd never heard it before. And it's just a
(07:17):
fun thing for our family. We eat too much and
then our calendar, Our tradition is very simple. We have
what thirty something Christmas Eve services and our churches in Houston,
and when I get through that last Christmas Eve. By
the way, this year we have a Christmas Eve Eve
service and some we have more Friday and Saturday and
(07:40):
then Christmas Eve it's home Sunday. So we really are
trying to get it all in. And my tradition is
my wife and I now they have empty nests. We
get on a plane Christmas morning and we go off
and recover. But that's just our tradition for a good
number of years. But every family needs those traditions that
they practice as best they can, because you know, home
(08:03):
is where we want to be Christmas, isn't it, And
that's home is where our family is, where our friends are.
So there's a lot of good traditions that I think
speak of Christmas Eve that we can celebrate if I
had time to go, But that had the calendar that
many of the liturgical churches do, which I think is
a super thing.
Speaker 1 (08:20):
Ancidentally, you're listening to.
Speaker 3 (08:22):
The Michael Berry's show.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
We are talking with Pastor ed Young of Second Baptist Church,
and we've been talking about Christian traditions and being a
Christian parent, a Christian spouse, and a Christian in modern America.
And you alluded earlier to Israel, and I'm glad you
did because it's in the news. There is a war
going on, and everybody views Israel differently. Almost all of
(08:48):
my Jewish friends view Israel as a tribal homeland of
fellow Jews. And they're very protective. I mean, and some
people would argue they're more protective of Israel than they
would be anywhere in the world. And there's a lot
that goes into that. But from your perspective as a Christian,
and I know you have preached on this, what is
the importance of Israel, modern Israel to a Christian American
(09:15):
at Christmas?
Speaker 2 (09:16):
Well for me and for a lot of Christians today.
So many of us have been I've been to Israel,
Michael thirty thirty five times with groups and sometimes all
kinds of groups, sometimes with Jewish groups, and so I
love Israel. When I go to Israel, I've been on
the Sea of Galilee. You may have to, by the way,
ped we all do you know.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
But the last time you and I and Lisa were together,
we were talking about the trip that you take every year,
and you take a group I believe.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
To Israel. Can you make a pilgrimage out of it?
Speaker 2 (09:48):
We really do. And it's more fun than you ever
have in your life. If it's not, you know, anyway,
So you go, the Bible comes alive. We know the
Sea of Galilee. I've been on the Sea of Galilee.
I fished in the Sea of Galilee. And we just
go to all the historic places. Nothing like going to
the open tomb, nothing like c And Israel is a
a one country, by the way, Michael, you know that
(10:11):
it's a fabulous country in and of itself. It's our
only real, probably closest thing to a democracy, not only
in the Middle East, but maybe any other place. Maybe
Great Britain would be there, maybe a couple other countries.
But Israel a fabulous country. Is very developed, it's very clean.
Their medicine is probably better than ours. Their it is
(10:33):
much better than ours. They're a head on a lot
of things. And the Jews are fabulous people. You know.
Every Jewish boy is either a doctor or a rabbi.
And so the in between their scientists. They're brilliant people.
And I can see why God has so blessed in
raw talent the Jewish people, because they are to be
(10:54):
and they will be one day evangelists of the rest
of the world when they see and except Jesus as Messiah.
But Israel today is full of so many problems and contradictions.
Their political climate is not unlike ours. And I have
been there and walked the streets so many many times.
(11:15):
It has a special place. A lot of people who
are entered eschatology. They're talking about the end times. And
I know preachers who take the Bible and say, we're
in this phrase and the cup is happening now. And
people ask me that, I say, look, I don't know.
The Bible says only the Father knows. Jesus doesn't know.
(11:35):
The Holy Spirit doesn't know that is on the Father's
calendar when he breaks down the curtain of history. Now, Michael,
I don't see anything that has to take place in
a prophetic way that isn't already in place nineteen forty eight,
you know, through Harry Truman, we established the nation of Israel,
and so in this conflict we need to realize. Somebody said,
(11:58):
Israel is living on stone the land. Well, the Bible
is a pretty old book, and the last time I
checked it was Palestine was inhabited by the Jews, and
so that's a pretty good title, deed. I think as
far the distribution that we're seeing now, it is amazing
to me, Michael, of how much hatred has come anti
(12:21):
Semitism in this moment. And I really have been shocked
at that, I really have. And it shows how the
left wing progresses in the habit the White House and
much of our culture. They don't really have any ideology
that's consistent. You know that. I know that. And here
(12:41):
you would think, for example, i'd give a Zenian illustration
of females. Who gave dignity to females. It is Jesus Christ.
He said, you're not male or female, you're not bond
or free. He made us all one. By the way, Michael,
you need to read. I got a couple of looks
you love to reach. I do not believe race is
(13:01):
a reality. We'll be divided by race. Race. There's no
such thing as race. You can't find race in one
page of one word in the Bible. We're all a
part of one race, that's a human race. What has
the pigmentation of your skin, of my skin, anything else
have anything to do with anything? I don't know, it doesn't.
(13:22):
So you take all the dividing things out of it.
Christ comes and unifies, and that's what he did with
that rembant in Israel when he came and establish his
body of the Church. So Israel is in trouble. But
to give it politically what I believe that in Yahoo
and his crews, they're going to take care of these
demonic Hamasue people. They're just isis as you know, we
(13:45):
born in another the other ideology that's demonic in what
it's doing. And those who believe there's some kind of
equality between those who would slaughter babies and those who
would rake women, and those who would take hostages of
twelve thirteen hundred people, you will equate that with some
kind of political misunderstanding or misstep of Israel. That is crazy.
(14:09):
That's like comparing a typhoon to a sneeze with wind
in the air. It's no comparison. And I think that
the left part of our political society has been exposed
like never never before because of what's happening in Israel.
You see all their bigotry, their prejudice, their narrowness. And
(14:32):
I could go on and own at this subject. So
Israel has a very definite place in the latter days.
And the last time I checked Armageddon is in Israel,
I had stood right there on the bank and looked
at it for myself. So the bottom line, God is
up to something. I don't know, to be honest, Michael,
if God can salvage the United States, I really don't
(14:56):
know that. I hate to say that, I believe it.
I'm working that He will come back and free us
once again. We established the biblical principles, which the Constitution
is absolutely based on. And I'm just praying for our land.
I'm praying for Israel, and I just trust that we
haven't yet had the great turning to God, the revival
(15:18):
of people all shapes, all forms, all backgrounds, all nationalities,
all ethnicities. I pray we haven't had that yet, and
it will come. And maybe you know, it'll just come
around Christmas, when God established himself in human flesh and said,
come follow me, receive me, and you'll have a brand
(15:40):
new life. Michael, you could take all the leaders of
all the countries and all the ideologies, all the theocracies
of the world, and they could take Jesus in their
life and be forgiven and have a new life. There
wouldn't be another problem in this universe. You see, God
knew what he was doing. He said, the answer to
(16:01):
all this begins with a baby.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
I love how you brought that back in a perfect circle.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
You know you are.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
You are really really good at conveying a message through
a story.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
It's powerful.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
It is a work for a good company.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
Michael Pastor, I got thirty seconds before I have to
cut off. I'm grateful for you. Tell me one thing
about just an insight in you. Tell me one thing
about you that you love about Christmas that is not
such a serious thing. One thing you look forward to.
Speaker 2 (16:39):
Ah, I look forward to once in a while giving
a gift to one of my kids and my wife
and they smile and laugh and say, you know, I've
always wanted that. I didn't know it, yep, And I'm
working on that. Twenty four to seven. I have some
females by gifts for me every year, and you know,
(16:59):
and expresses her needs, but it doesn't express my personality.
I'm always looking for that, Michael, and once in a
while I've done it. By the way, I gave Joe
Beth a puppy years ago, King Charles that he left
us earth after fourteen years, and that was the best
gift I've ever give him to it. I want to
(17:20):
find another gift like that, Michael, for my budget.
Speaker 3 (17:22):
For it's a.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
Special thing because most of the time it doesn't land
like we'd like it to. Pastor ed Young, thank you
for making time and sharing your ministry with us today.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
Michael, God bless you. You bring your wife and family
to the Big Show, and I guarantee it they'll love it.
We got flying angels and you won't believe it. And
we got the largest cast. We'll have five hundred people
in the cast and it will be knocking out John
fun for everybody.
Speaker 4 (17:47):
Love.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
I'd love to have you is Michael.
Speaker 3 (17:48):
Got to shoot up here amongst just one of us.
Got to have some relief, Amen, Michael Barry Show.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
As some of you know, because I talk about my
personal life on the air, it's all I got to
talk about, and I share how I interact.
Speaker 5 (18:04):
With the policies and politics that we talk about.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
Because at the end of the day. These aren't academic discussions, right.
If the government takes over our health care, that's going
to affect you. And just because you're young and healthy
and haven't needed health care yet or recently, you don't
realize that, and you see it as some sort of
arcane or ethereal existential discussion. But that's not where it
(18:30):
is for me. I have a brother who died of
the clock shot, a perfectly able bodied law enforcement officer
with over thirty years who died of the clock shot
January twenty twenty two. My father is eighty four, and
since he was twenty years old and had to be
discharged from the Coastguard on his deathbed with a severe
(18:53):
case of diabetes and they didn't know how to treat
it back then, they sent him home to die, and
he read and experimented, and here we are. He's eighty
four and still alive, still battling diabetes by the day.
He is in constant contact with doctors, and many of
them have told me, your dad knows more about diabetes
than diabetes doctors do, because in an era before we
(19:14):
had proper insulin, he was managing his blood sugar that's
unheard of and he still has his vision in all
tin of his fingers and toes well. He's a man
of great self discipline and the willingness to experiment on
himself and get enough sleep and not drink, and you know,
do the things that are necessary. And then, of course
my mother, five years younger than him, My father was
supposed to go first, and my mother would nurse him
(19:37):
until the end of his life. And she up and
passes on us. And she ended up having als that
basically just eventually took over her body and left her
unable to breathe.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
Her lungs just wouldn't function, and it was a horrible,
horrible way to go.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
She died in hospice at our home. I have been
in and out of hospitals just with these things so
many times over the last few years that I have
come to learn a lot about the medical care system.
You know, I had a minor stroke on August first,
twenty sixteen. I you know, we've all had our medical issues.
(20:19):
I'm much better now about taking care of my health
and getting my checkups and all that. But the policy
issue of how we deliver healthcare in a marketplace of
people trying to heal you and provide wellness and prevent
all these things. It's gotten. It's all messed up, and
I don't think people really even understand why it's all
(20:42):
messed up. And so today I would like to step
back from the news of the day and address this.
There is a fellow who has been highly recommended when
I bring these questions up, named Charles Silver. He is
the McDonald endowed Share of Civil Procedure at Versity of
Texas at Austin School of Law. I don't know if
(21:04):
he was there when I was there in the mid nineties.
I don't know him, but his work has been widely
widely discussed, particularly his book Overcharged, Why Americans pay too
much for healthcare. Professor Silver, welcome to the program.
Speaker 4 (21:23):
Thank you, Michael, pleasure to be here.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
I must first ask you if you were on faculty
from ninety three to ninety six when I was there.
Speaker 4 (21:31):
I was. I started teaching at Texas in nineteen eighty seven.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
Oh well, okay, well, I was a Lino Graula acolyte
and I was the first crop. There were two of
us that were sent to England to get an LLM degree,
so I was kind of checked out after my second year.
Once I had my offer, I was kind of checked out,
but I'm sorry that I never met you.
Speaker 3 (21:57):
I had a wonderful.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Experience at the University of Texas School of Law. It's
a it's a great university law school, and I am
the better for it. So I think a lot of
you for being on factory there.
Speaker 3 (22:08):
It's a great institution. Let's thank you.
Speaker 4 (22:11):
I'm sorry I didn't get to meet you when you
were a student.
Speaker 1 (22:14):
Indeed, the book overcharged why Americans pay too much for healthcare?
If somebody says, Michael, I'm going to come back and
listen on the podcast later, but give me the one
minute answer, and then let's get granular and dig into this,
what's the one minute answer as to why we pay
too much for healthcare?
Speaker 4 (22:34):
The one minute answer, we rely far too heavily on
third party payment arrangements, which means insurance companies, Medicare, Medicaid, Tricare, VA,
whatever they happen to be, instead of paying for healthcare
directly the same way we pay for pretty much everything else, food, cars, housing,
(22:58):
You know, we pay for the vast majority of things directly,
meaning we pay for them ourselves, and we don't have
the problem of excessive spending or inflation or costs, or
hidden bills or surprise bills or phony charges. All that
worked really well. The one exception is the healthcare sector,
where we rely very very extensively on third parties to
(23:22):
pay for things, and that just screws everything up. Now,
the other thing is we have way too much governmental
involvement in the healthcare sector. There are lots and lots
of regulations that make things worse for consumers. By and large,
the regulations have the purpose of protecting the producers, not
the consumers, So we should do a lot less in
(23:44):
that way.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
You did that.
Speaker 5 (23:46):
You were technically finished at fifty eight seconds. You added
an addendum to the end that I will admit will
it is admissible in this case. But you achieved the
fifty eight seconds. Quite impressed that you did.
Speaker 1 (24:01):
So let's start drilling down on these things. I got
a minute left in this segment, but I have dedicated
some time to talk about this because I think a
lot of people are frustrated, especially when they start getting
all these bills and they go to the emergency room
and the place is packed, and then they can't get
in to see a doctor, and then they wonder you know,
(24:23):
why does something cost ten thousand dollars that took twenty minutes.
It just there's nothing else that requires this. It all
seems so frustrating to people, and I would like to
drill down and get into the actual reasons why this works.
Let me start by prefacing, and we'll get to this
(24:45):
in the next segment.
Speaker 3 (24:46):
Because I don't want to have to cut you off.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
I want to first talk about what if we were
to do a zero based budget, we were to go
back to John Locke's state of nature, and let's start
all over and have a cash on only.
Speaker 3 (25:01):
Health delivery system.
Speaker 1 (25:03):
Let's do away with insurance, and let's talk about who
the winners and losers out of that would be. And
more importantly, if I'm if I'm a consumer of health services,
because I don't believe that healthcare is a right. If
I'm a consumer of health services, would this be better
or worse for me? So hang tight right there. Our
guest is Professor Charles Silver. I encourage you to read
(25:25):
the book Overcharged, Why Americans pay too much for.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
Health care Fellers, and you listen to the Michael Berry Show.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
Good that.
Speaker 1 (25:41):
Professor Charles Silver is our guest and has promised. At
the end, I given him a moment to consider, Professor,
what if we go back the book is overcharged? Why
Americans pay too much for health care? What if we
did away with all insurance and we went cash only?
How would that change things?
Speaker 4 (26:00):
Mean a lot of things for the better, but some
things for the worse. So a lot of things would
be better, you know, we wouldn't have to worry about
things like surprise medical bills where you don't even know
what something is going to cost when you get the
service delivered. There's actually a very large retail health sector.
So if you want to get laser eye surgery, for example,
(26:22):
you have to pay for that yourself because it's not
covered by insurance typically. But you know what, it's actually
very affordable. And the price for laser surgery. Are you
ready for this? The price has substantially declined since LASIK
was developed, and it's gotten much better too. There are
new forms of lask and all that has happened because
(26:45):
there is no overlay of insurance. Where where in the
healthcare sector except in the private payment sector can one
find prices that have declined. Now, there are no hospital
services that I'm aware of that cost less now than
they used to. But in the private sector where we
purchase cosmetic surgery, I mentioned Lasik. There's also the Surgery
(27:09):
Center of Oklahoma, which operates on a cash basis. But
there are lots of services that people can buy directly,
and those things that part of the market works incredibly
well with. As I said, we don't have surprise bills.
Everybody knows that they're going to pay before the service
is delivered, and nobody gets billed for more than the price.
The prices are posted, we don't have to have a you.
(27:31):
In the hospital sector, we have this federal Transparity rule
transparency rule that hospitals routinely ignore that's supposed to require
them to post their prices. But in the retail sector,
we don't have that, and everybody posts their prices anyway.
So a lot of things would work better if we
did that, But the one thing that would work worse
(27:51):
would be emergencies where you're facing a risk of a
catastrophic cost that you know, people just can't afford to
bear on their own. That's where insurance has a role
to play. Catastrophic costs.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
Yeah, Professor I have long advocated that we should if
people would understand. For instance, I only have liability insurance
on my vehicles, and people say you have to No, no, no,
I pay cash for my vehicles.
Speaker 3 (28:20):
The only reason people are over insured in.
Speaker 1 (28:22):
Most cases is because the person holding the loan wants
you to have insurance for more than the value of
what they're of what they've loaned you money for in
case the thing gets burned down or trashed, they want
their money once. You don't have to do that. In
my opinion, I'm a safe driver. I've never met an
insurance claim. In my opinion, it's a bad business deal.
(28:44):
So what I tell people to do is get catastrophic
health insurance so when it hits fifteen thousand and up,
it's good. And then pay cash and you'll be shocked
how many doctors will discount what you get and they're
happy to have the cash. I go to a doctor
named Mary Tally Boden for all my upper respiratory stuff,
and she's a cash only doctor, which, as you know,
(29:06):
a lot of people are going to. And you go
in and you make your payment and it's insanely cheap,
and then there's no documentation. Later there's no you know,
insurance letter arrives. Do we pay this? No, we wait
to pay this. She's happier. She doesn't have to have
a bunch of billing clerks. You literally pay the same
way if you bought yogurt there. I think this is
the answer, Professor, Well.
Speaker 4 (29:28):
I agree with you because I go to a doctor
who works on the same basis. So my doctor I
pay a monthly subscription fee too, But I can go
as many times as I want. You know, I don't
need to go all the time, fortunately, but if I
need to go, she usually can see me either that
day or the next day, and I get some tests
(29:49):
performed in house at no charge, and it's it's a
great working arrangement. Like you, I don't get it. I
don't worry about my insurance company, you know, not paying
for something. So I think I agree with you. The
cash payment is a very good approach for basic health care.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
So let's have a little history lesson. Professor Charles Silver
is our guest. The book is called Overcharged, Why Americans
pay too much for healthcare. Let's go back to wherever
the starting point is. You want it to be nineteen
fifty or nineteen seventy, Where did it start going wrong,
because we all know it's wrong. Now, where did it
start going wrong?
Speaker 4 (30:31):
Oh, that's easy. It started going wrong in the mid
nineteen sixties when Medicare and Medicaid came online. In my book,
I show how doctors and hospitals fees changed after Medicare
and Medicaid took effect in nineteen sixty five, And basically,
both of those statutes initially let doctors and hospitals charged
(30:54):
whatever they wanted for services, and so not surprisingly, they
started raising their rate immediately. I mean really immediately after
the enactment of those programs, we were beset with health
care inflation that exceeded the real growth rate of the GDP,
and we have been struggling with healthcare inflation ever since.
(31:16):
But everything about the arrangement is wrong. I mean, who
in their right minds let's people who are selling things
set their own prices without any market constraints. I mean,
that's a recipe for disaster, right, And then, of course
that couldn't last forever. So the government eventually did get
into the price setting business in Medicare and Medicaid. But
(31:37):
of course we all know that government price setting is terrible.
It never works properly. It's really hard to set good prices,
to set prices accurately. And moreover, the government really doesn't
have the right set of interests. You know, I want.
It's not just the price that matters to me, it's
the convenience. Right. How long do I have to wait
(31:58):
to see my doctor? How friendly is my doctor, How
good is my doctor? There are all these things. Different
doctors should have different prices, and markets can work all
that stuff out, but governments just are notoriously unable to
do that. And so as a result, we've had this
terrible system. And because it's so terrible, it's constantly in
(32:20):
need of patching. I mean, every time I turn around,
there's a new bill, a new proposal being put on
the table for some kind of regulation to fix a
problem that only exists because the government created it. It's
never going to be fixed. It's impossible to fix it.
We really need to just scrap these arrangements and go
(32:41):
back to a simple cash based system for fundamental care,
and then things will start. It will immediately be out
of the spending crisis. The prices will moderate because hospitals
and doctors and drug companies and all that will have
to deal with the realities of the limited budgets of consumers.
They'll also have to face competition. That's hugely important. You know,
(33:04):
one I mentioned the retail health sector. You know, one
of the reasons lasik is cheap is because there are
a lot of laser providers and any ophthalmologists can enter
the field who wants to. So there's a lot of competition,
and competition is good for consumers. So we need to
get rid of these competition frustrating regulations. Let's increase the supply.
(33:26):
Let you know, foreign doctors who can pass American exams
come in and treat people. We need to just open
the floodgates for providers because we have this artificially created shortage.
You know, that's one of the ways that doctors and
hospitals have increased their revenues. It's by preventing new entrants
(33:46):
from coming in and you know, outcompete. So we have
to get rid of all that stuff.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
Professor Charles Silver at the University of Texas School of Law,
my alma mater, is our guest.
Speaker 3 (33:57):
This book is overcharged.
Speaker 1 (33:59):
Why Americans pay to dang much for healthcare? I added
the dang, but I think we all feel it more
with Professor Silver coming up
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