Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Long before Ross Perot ran for president in ninety two.
People forget what an impressive effort that was. A reform
minded successful business man, no nonsense, Let's stop talking about
the silly stuff and solve the problems the way you
would do with the business. I had a great deal
(00:21):
of respect for Ross Parrot when Mark White was elected
governor in eighty two. I remember Ross Perot was his
dollar a year guy who came in and just brought
common sense solutions to educational problems. And I think that
(00:44):
most of those educational reforms, not all, but most of
those were good, higher standards, real consequences. But the important
part there was the same Ross Perot that attempted to
rescue the hostage is out of Iran, was bringing business
principles and traditional American values. You know, you meet these guys,
(01:09):
they're self made, hard working, no nonsense, solve the problem
whatever you look like, put the best person in the job,
and we need more of that. So a fellow named
Joe Penland I first met at Chris's funeral and he
drove over to Orange. We shook hands, we talked for
(01:31):
a minute, and later I was asked to partner up
with him on KLVI out of Beaumont on a project
that he created call Contract from the American People, and
the idea was, these candidates are all saying exactly what
you want to hear, but there's no real commitment to
(01:51):
do the things that matter, to focus on the issues
that matter and not the identity politics. And then he
popped up again at least my screen our campaign in
Beaumont is ongoing. He popped up again at the Tucker
Crosson event where he's one of the sponsors, and I thought,
you know, I'm constantly telling people to stop hiding from
(02:12):
public life. If you are a successful businessman and start
being a person of influence, and you'll be surprised what
a difference you can make, and asked him to spend
a few minutes with us. Joe Penland, welcome to the program.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Thanks for having me on.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
You can find him at Joe from Texas dot com.
It is easier to hide from the spotlight a lot
of people that I say, you know, you have great ideas.
Why don't you get more involved. You don't have to
run for office. You could basically do what you're doing.
What was that moment for you? I know you served
on the school board. But for what was that moment
(02:47):
for you where you said, I can't just sit by
and let this country go to hell?
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Well, I guess when the border got just the doors
came wide open on the border, and see that being
a border state, that rained real true to me. You know,
being in business for fifty years, Michael, is not an
easy task, but it's a wonderful experience in this country.
I don't want to see that slip away. You know,
(03:15):
we need immigration in this country. You know, our birth
rate is shrinking. As you've talked about before, a lot
of people have We need to do things in the
right way. People need to look at what's at stake
before they just vote. You know, people need to test
the water before you dive in, so to speak. All
those those sayings come true when I think about America today.
(03:37):
You know, coming up in Frisco, Texas in the fifties
working in the cotton fields, Dad had a stroke. We
were very poor, at a hard time making it, but
we made it because Mam was there. She loved it.
She took care of us and she took on extra work.
And it taught me then that if I was going
to get ahead in life and get off of that
bad street I was on that I had to work.
(04:00):
There was no handouts seventy years ago when I was
born nineteen fifteen. For seventy four years ago, it was
no handouts, and we were so proud to just have anything,
make anything, make it ourselves. You talked about ross Paro.
I think about Rossboro a lot, being a fellow Texan
did not want to be president of the United States.
(04:20):
I have a real close friend, the former Comptroller General
of the United States, Dave Walker, who is close friends
with Rosspuo, very close friends. Actually was in the last
interview that he had. Those are all great people. You
look at Walnald Reagan, what he did when so Security
was running out, and I just start looking because I'm
a Social Security child, and all these things starting mounting up.
(04:43):
Michael to me and I said, you know what, You've
made it in the best country in the world, no doubt,
by far. Nobody can ever come close to this country.
I made it from nothing to what I am today.
And I can give back and I can help a
few thousand people, Michael, our area. But the only way
to help millions of people is we have to get
(05:04):
Donald Trump elected as president, he's got to get back
in the White House, get some common sense back into Washington.
We have to have JD go to the University of
Trump for four years, learn all he can, and stay
another eight so we can have twelve years to try
to get some common sense back in this country because
we're going to run off the cliff if we don't.
(05:25):
I can't sit on the porch. I used George Jones
as my music when I come out talking when I
was opening for Tucker because I'm gray hair, but I'm
not ready for the rocking chair. I've got to do
something to give back to this great country.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
You know, you got me thinking about that song, and
I'm sure you know the story. But they performed that
at the Country Music Awards the year that it came out,
and it was kind of his middle finger of the industry,
to the labels and all that were putting him out
(06:04):
to pasture. And I think that happens a lot in
our society. The first time I went to India with
my wife was December of nineteen ninety and I was
amazed what degree of respect Indians have for older folks
in their country, because it's understood that that is wisdom
(06:27):
and experience and knowledge. And I've thought about this for
thirty five years now, and the trend has escalated. We
have become a society. To quote Oscar Wilde, youth is
wasted on the young. We have become a nation that
(06:48):
is obsessed with young people. And social media escalated this
because it reaffirmed everything that is awful about the high
school herd mentality, and so the Kardashians and the call
herd daddy in all of this is it is an
(07:11):
accelerated version of the opposite of what you just talked
about guys like you. There's a guy named Victor Perez
who is the who like you. After a successful business career,
stepped up and served as the president of the Katie
ISD School Board and does a great job. And guess what,
he's not trying to launch to the next position. Joe Penland,
(07:34):
hang with us. It's Joe for Texas dot Com. You
can read the contract. It's none of the silly fluff.
It's about fixing the issues that we care about. When
it comes to the economy, do you believe Americans are
better off than they were four years ago?
Speaker 2 (07:51):
Michael Barrier, So I was raised as a middle class chick.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
For books wrote his own Thanksladen's Judent. Well, I say
that because you wouldn't know. But if you know, you know.
The website is Joe from Texas dot Com. We do
(08:17):
a little duo campaign for Beaumont that we recorded to
ask people to go to the website, read it and
if it's something you support, spread the message. It's called
the Contract from the American People, Joe. What was the
idea behind that?
Speaker 2 (08:34):
Well, you know, we looked at things that I think
are the most important things to America today and this
came from a study that Dave Walker did that Rossboro funded.
And the people are really way ahead of the politicians, Michael.
The politicians think we're all in the dark or not.
(08:55):
We understand problems, We understand things are not like they
work ten fifty twenty years ago, and we understand we
need to have some changes. And that's why I went
on this tour with Tucker Calson. I wanted to get
myself out there in front of people and see if
I could talk to people, what could I resonate with them?
Would they would they understand what I was talking about?
(09:17):
When I just got right down and talked on what
I call my level. I struggled to get out of
high school. I made it through twelve years and that
was enough. And I got to work. And thank god
I didn't have the money to go to college, because
I don't know what I've amounted to if I had.
But this is what America was about. So I got
out on that tour to listen to people and talk
to people and stand there in front of ten or
(09:39):
twelve thousand people and tell them a short story about
my life and how we could help people that are
enduring that kind of pain today. I was so amazed
at when people would come up to me and line
up after every show and want to talk and tell
me how much they appreciate the story and how much
it resonated with them. And a man and woman walked
(10:01):
up to me in Pennsylvania said, Joe, thank you for
the story. The lady was crying so that it just
moved me. She said, I'm going to vote for Donald
Trump now, just by what you said. And you told
us that's the only way we can save our country
and save social Security and the other things that are
dear to us today. So I've been on the line, said,
(10:22):
my husband's been telling me this is the way we
got to go. And I said, well, that's great. I'm
glad that you that you see the light. That it
doesn't matter is that a man of woman, black or white.
That's not the issue. Who's the best for the job,
who's the best surgeon for the job, who's the best
teacher for your children? We got to look at what's
good for us, not what you Well, you just don't
(10:44):
like this, you just don't like that, Michael. I hear
you talk about that a lot. But people just get
they're wearing their feelings on their shoulder to the point
that they're going to their family do without. I had
another woman walk up to me. She said, Joe, I
know Donald Trump's the right guy. There's no two ways
about it. I know he's the business guy and he's
who we need to leave this country. But I can't
(11:06):
warm up to him. I ma'am, I saw. Let me
ask you this, do you dislike Trump more than you
love your family or this country? She said absolutely not.
I said, then you've answered your own question. We need
to do what's right for America. Time is running out,
Social Security will go broke in less than nine years,
and there's seventy million of you. When I was looking
(11:28):
at her talking to her on social security, I said,
I'm on social security. I said, can you stand a
twenty five percent cutting them? She said no, I'm barely
making it now. Is that what this is all about?
I said, just ma'am, it is we have to save
the economy. Have we got national security problems today? There's
a lot of hot buttons across this country today that
(11:48):
the politicians like to fester up on. Two things we
have to always stay steadfast on is our national security
and our finances. The only way we can have a
strong military is strong finances. You know, we're boring money
from China, Japan, foreign countries. China is aligning ourselves with
(12:09):
Russia and Iran. I mean, we're really on the brink
of going over the cliff. We formed out our national
security by not drilling in this country. If there was
a blueprint, Michael on how to destroy the greatest country
in the world, they're reading it on Pennsylvania Avenue right now.
And I hope right now that there's not just another
(12:31):
version of it laying on the desk for her to read.
We have got to change who lives in the white
house or this country is in a lot of trouble.
I'm not just blowing a lot of hot air and
telling people to get scared and all that. You should
have already been scared when your border got opened. You
should have already been scared when they quit drilling in
this country. How are we going to win a war
(12:51):
if we can't fuel our tanks in our military. I mean,
we have completely lost our way in this country. And
it's all because of Facebook and television and all this.
And you hear this, and you hear that. The truth
is this. I wanted to talk to the American people,
and the only way I could do it, to talk
to thousands of people, was to go on this tour
(13:12):
with Tucker Callson. My CPA and lawyer told me the
last thing, do not mention Donald Trump or JD Vance
or anything about the election. You are a sponsor. If
you say anything about that, you fund this yourself. First
thing I'd done is said something about Donald Trump. It
was my platform and I used it, and I'm so
(13:32):
happy I did. I met a lot of great people,
a lot of great Americans. They're just like me and
you and your mom and dad. They know what's best
for this country, and they love this country, and they're
and they're scared. They're all scared right now.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
They are. And I think it is when people are down,
when things get bad. Alcoholics know this, Gambling addicts know this,
people that get so fat they can't leave the bed
know this. Sometimes things have to get so bad before
(14:13):
people are moved to action. And my hope is we
have reached that point, because they can also go so
far that you can't fix it. And this is a
mess deporting these people, dealing with the problems we've inherited,
the problems with our criminal justice system, the people that
are in place, isn't It's going to be a real mess.
(14:35):
It is going to be an absolute mess to deal with.
An absolute mess. Joe, tell folks. I've got about a
minute and a half. Tell folks your business career and
your life career, your school board, and how you ended
up here. I think it's a good story.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
Well, we started out in Frisco, Texas. My dad you
mentioned it well ago about him, but he was an
alcoholic can't stroke in nineteen fifty seven. Two weeks later,
we didn't have enough to eat. My mom took in
laundry and did the very best she could, and we
took odd jobs. And a little bit later he passed away.
We got a SOB security check that helped us. My
(15:14):
older brother went in the Navy, so he has got
cut out. My next brother went in army, he has
got cut out. It was just me and John and Mama,
but we made it. The day after this election will
be November sixth, that'd be sixty years he's been passed away.
I'll go out there and visit with him and Mom,
and I'll let him know that I did everything I
could to try to make sure that we got the
(15:35):
right men back in the White House to save this
great country. My dad was in the war. A lot
of people. You go out to the cemetery and you
look out there at the little flags on Veterans Day.
All those people didn't lose their life in the war,
or lose a hand or a foot, but they were
all willing to do that for me and you to
sit here today. I don't take that lightly. I know
this is my calling. I am going to help America.
(15:57):
I cannot help enough Americans here. I've got to get
up to Washington and see if I can have some
influence there. If I can, that'd be great. If I can't,
I'll die trying. That's what I'm going to do. I
love this country. I love the country that have let
me build a business here for fifty years. I've got
employees been with me forty eight, forty six, forty five years.
(16:19):
That we do the right thing. We help our community.
You know. We take care of our children, we take
care of our employees, and we're going to give something
back every day because I promised Mama that I would
do that. I'd give back every day.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
Joe Pinland Joe from Texas dot Com twenty eighteen, which
all the up paper ballots, but that actually might be
one of the smartest systems the Michael Berry Show because
Russia cannot hack a piece of paper
Long before Ross Perot ran for president in ninety two.
People forget what an impressive effort that was. A reform
minded successful business man, no nonsense, Let's stop talking about
the silly stuff and solve the problems the way you
would do with the business. I had a great deal
(00:21):
of respect for Ross Parrot when Mark White was elected
governor in eighty two. I remember Ross Perot was his
dollar a year guy who came in and just brought
common sense solutions to educational problems. And I think that
(00:44):
most of those educational reforms, not all, but most of
those were good, higher standards, real consequences. But the important
part there was the same Ross Perot that attempted to
rescue the hostage is out of Iran, was bringing business
principles and traditional American values. You know, you meet these guys,
(01:09):
they're self made, hard working, no nonsense, solve the problem
whatever you look like, put the best person in the job,
and we need more of that. So a fellow named
Joe Penland I first met at Chris's funeral and he
drove over to Orange. We shook hands, we talked for
(01:31):
a minute, and later I was asked to partner up
with him on KLVI out of Beaumont on a project
that he created call Contract from the American People, and
the idea was, these candidates are all saying exactly what
you want to hear, but there's no real commitment to
(01:51):
do the things that matter, to focus on the issues
that matter and not the identity politics. And then he
popped up again at least my screen our campaign in
Beaumont is ongoing. He popped up again at the Tucker
Crosson event where he's one of the sponsors, and I thought,
you know, I'm constantly telling people to stop hiding from
(02:12):
public life. If you are a successful businessman and start
being a person of influence, and you'll be surprised what
a difference you can make, and asked him to spend
a few minutes with us. Joe Penland, welcome to the program.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Thanks for having me on.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
You can find him at Joe from Texas dot com.
It is easier to hide from the spotlight a lot
of people that I say, you know, you have great ideas.
Why don't you get more involved. You don't have to
run for office. You could basically do what you're doing.
What was that moment for you? I know you served
on the school board. But for what was that moment
(02:47):
for you where you said, I can't just sit by
and let this country go to hell?
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Well, I guess when the border got just the doors
came wide open on the border, and see that being
a border state, that rained real true to me. You know,
being in business for fifty years, Michael, is not an
easy task, but it's a wonderful experience in this country.
I don't want to see that slip away. You know,
(03:15):
we need immigration in this country. You know, our birth
rate is shrinking. As you've talked about before, a lot
of people have We need to do things in the
right way. People need to look at what's at stake
before they just vote. You know, people need to test
the water before you dive in, so to speak. All
those those sayings come true when I think about America today.
(03:37):
You know, coming up in Frisco, Texas in the fifties
working in the cotton fields, Dad had a stroke. We
were very poor, at a hard time making it, but
we made it because Mam was there. She loved it.
She took care of us and she took on extra work.
And it taught me then that if I was going
to get ahead in life and get off of that
bad street I was on that I had to work.
(04:00):
There was no handouts seventy years ago when I was
born nineteen fifteen. For seventy four years ago, it was
no handouts, and we were so proud to just have anything,
make anything, make it ourselves. You talked about ross Paro.
I think about Rossboro a lot, being a fellow Texan
did not want to be president of the United States.
(04:20):
I have a real close friend, the former Comptroller General
of the United States, Dave Walker, who is close friends
with Rosspuo, very close friends. Actually was in the last
interview that he had. Those are all great people. You
look at Walnald Reagan, what he did when so Security
was running out, and I just start looking because I'm
a Social Security child, and all these things starting mounting up.
(04:43):
Michael to me and I said, you know what, You've
made it in the best country in the world, no doubt,
by far. Nobody can ever come close to this country.
I made it from nothing to what I am today.
And I can give back and I can help a
few thousand people, Michael, our area. But the only way
to help millions of people is we have to get
(05:04):
Donald Trump elected as president, he's got to get back
in the White House, get some common sense back into Washington.
We have to have JD go to the University of
Trump for four years, learn all he can, and stay
another eight so we can have twelve years to try
to get some common sense back in this country because
we're going to run off the cliff if we don't.
(05:25):
I can't sit on the porch. I used George Jones
as my music when I come out talking when I
was opening for Tucker because I'm gray hair, but I'm
not ready for the rocking chair. I've got to do
something to give back to this great country.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
You know, you got me thinking about that song, and
I'm sure you know the story. But they performed that
at the Country Music Awards the year that it came out,
and it was kind of his middle finger of the industry,
to the labels and all that were putting him out
(06:04):
to pasture. And I think that happens a lot in
our society. The first time I went to India with
my wife was December of nineteen ninety and I was
amazed what degree of respect Indians have for older folks
in their country, because it's understood that that is wisdom
(06:27):
and experience and knowledge. And I've thought about this for
thirty five years now, and the trend has escalated. We
have become a society. To quote Oscar Wilde, youth is
wasted on the young. We have become a nation that
(06:48):
is obsessed with young people. And social media escalated this
because it reaffirmed everything that is awful about the high
school herd mentality, and so the Kardashians and the call
herd daddy in all of this is it is an
(07:11):
accelerated version of the opposite of what you just talked
about guys like you. There's a guy named Victor Perez
who is the who like you. After a successful business career,
stepped up and served as the president of the Katie
ISD School Board and does a great job. And guess what,
he's not trying to launch to the next position. Joe Penland,
(07:34):
hang with us. It's Joe for Texas dot Com. You
can read the contract. It's none of the silly fluff.
It's about fixing the issues that we care about. When
it comes to the economy, do you believe Americans are
better off than they were four years ago?
Speaker 2 (07:51):
Michael Barrier, So I was raised as a middle class chick.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
For books wrote his own Thanksladen's Judent. Well, I say
that because you wouldn't know. But if you know, you know.
The website is Joe from Texas dot Com. We do
(08:17):
a little duo campaign for Beaumont that we recorded to
ask people to go to the website, read it and
if it's something you support, spread the message. It's called
the Contract from the American People, Joe. What was the
idea behind that?
Speaker 2 (08:34):
Well, you know, we looked at things that I think
are the most important things to America today and this
came from a study that Dave Walker did that Rossboro funded.
And the people are really way ahead of the politicians, Michael.
The politicians think we're all in the dark or not.
(08:55):
We understand problems, We understand things are not like they
work ten fifty twenty years ago, and we understand we
need to have some changes. And that's why I went
on this tour with Tucker Calson. I wanted to get
myself out there in front of people and see if
I could talk to people, what could I resonate with them?
Would they would they understand what I was talking about?
(09:17):
When I just got right down and talked on what
I call my level. I struggled to get out of
high school. I made it through twelve years and that
was enough. And I got to work. And thank god
I didn't have the money to go to college, because
I don't know what I've amounted to if I had.
But this is what America was about. So I got
out on that tour to listen to people and talk
to people and stand there in front of ten or
(09:39):
twelve thousand people and tell them a short story about
my life and how we could help people that are
enduring that kind of pain today. I was so amazed
at when people would come up to me and line
up after every show and want to talk and tell
me how much they appreciate the story and how much
it resonated with them. And a man and woman walked
(10:01):
up to me in Pennsylvania said, Joe, thank you for
the story. The lady was crying so that it just
moved me. She said, I'm going to vote for Donald
Trump now, just by what you said. And you told
us that's the only way we can save our country
and save social Security and the other things that are
dear to us today. So I've been on the line, said,
(10:22):
my husband's been telling me this is the way we
got to go. And I said, well, that's great. I'm
glad that you that you see the light. That it
doesn't matter is that a man of woman, black or white.
That's not the issue. Who's the best for the job,
who's the best surgeon for the job, who's the best
teacher for your children? We got to look at what's
good for us, not what you Well, you just don't
(10:44):
like this, you just don't like that, Michael. I hear
you talk about that a lot. But people just get
they're wearing their feelings on their shoulder to the point
that they're going to their family do without. I had
another woman walk up to me. She said, Joe, I
know Donald Trump's the right guy. There's no two ways
about it. I know he's the business guy and he's
who we need to leave this country. But I can't
(11:06):
warm up to him. I ma'am, I saw. Let me
ask you this, do you dislike Trump more than you
love your family or this country? She said absolutely not.
I said, then you've answered your own question. We need
to do what's right for America. Time is running out,
Social Security will go broke in less than nine years,
and there's seventy million of you. When I was looking
(11:28):
at her talking to her on social security, I said,
I'm on social security. I said, can you stand a
twenty five percent cutting them? She said no, I'm barely
making it now. Is that what this is all about?
I said, just ma'am, it is we have to save
the economy. Have we got national security problems today? There's
a lot of hot buttons across this country today that
(11:48):
the politicians like to fester up on. Two things we
have to always stay steadfast on is our national security
and our finances. The only way we can have a
strong military is strong finances. You know, we're boring money
from China, Japan, foreign countries. China is aligning ourselves with
(12:09):
Russia and Iran. I mean, we're really on the brink
of going over the cliff. We formed out our national
security by not drilling in this country. If there was
a blueprint, Michael on how to destroy the greatest country
in the world, they're reading it on Pennsylvania Avenue right now.
And I hope right now that there's not just another
(12:31):
version of it laying on the desk for her to read.
We have got to change who lives in the white
house or this country is in a lot of trouble.
I'm not just blowing a lot of hot air and
telling people to get scared and all that. You should
have already been scared when your border got opened. You
should have already been scared when they quit drilling in
this country. How are we going to win a war
(12:51):
if we can't fuel our tanks in our military. I mean,
we have completely lost our way in this country. And
it's all because of Facebook and television and all this.
And you hear this, and you hear that. The truth
is this. I wanted to talk to the American people,
and the only way I could do it, to talk
to thousands of people, was to go on this tour
(13:12):
with Tucker Callson. My CPA and lawyer told me the
last thing, do not mention Donald Trump or JD Vance
or anything about the election. You are a sponsor. If
you say anything about that, you fund this yourself. First
thing I'd done is said something about Donald Trump. It
was my platform and I used it, and I'm so
(13:32):
happy I did. I met a lot of great people,
a lot of great Americans. They're just like me and
you and your mom and dad. They know what's best
for this country, and they love this country, and they're
and they're scared. They're all scared right now.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
They are. And I think it is when people are down,
when things get bad. Alcoholics know this, Gambling addicts know this,
people that get so fat they can't leave the bed
know this. Sometimes things have to get so bad before
(14:13):
people are moved to action. And my hope is we
have reached that point, because they can also go so
far that you can't fix it. And this is a
mess deporting these people, dealing with the problems we've inherited,
the problems with our criminal justice system, the people that
are in place, isn't It's going to be a real mess.
(14:35):
It is going to be an absolute mess to deal with.
An absolute mess. Joe, tell folks. I've got about a
minute and a half. Tell folks your business career and
your life career, your school board, and how you ended
up here. I think it's a good story.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
Well, we started out in Frisco, Texas. My dad you
mentioned it well ago about him, but he was an
alcoholic can't stroke in nineteen fifty seven. Two weeks later,
we didn't have enough to eat. My mom took in
laundry and did the very best she could, and we
took odd jobs. And a little bit later he passed away.
We got a SOB security check that helped us. My
(15:14):
older brother went in the Navy, so he has got
cut out. My next brother went in army, he has
got cut out. It was just me and John and Mama,
but we made it. The day after this election will
be November sixth, that'd be sixty years he's been passed away.
I'll go out there and visit with him and Mom,
and I'll let him know that I did everything I
could to try to make sure that we got the
(15:35):
right men back in the White House to save this
great country. My dad was in the war. A lot
of people. You go out to the cemetery and you
look out there at the little flags on Veterans Day.
All those people didn't lose their life in the war,
or lose a hand or a foot, but they were
all willing to do that for me and you to
sit here today. I don't take that lightly. I know
this is my calling. I am going to help America.
(15:57):
I cannot help enough Americans here. I've got to get
up to Washington and see if I can have some
influence there. If I can, that'd be great. If I can't,
I'll die trying. That's what I'm going to do. I
love this country. I love the country that have let
me build a business here for fifty years. I've got
employees been with me forty eight, forty six, forty five years.
(16:19):
That we do the right thing. We help our community.
You know. We take care of our children, we take
care of our employees, and we're going to give something
back every day because I promised Mama that I would
do that. I'd give back every day.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
Joe Pinland Joe from Texas dot Com twenty eighteen, which
all the up paper ballots, but that actually might be
one of the smartest systems the Michael Berry Show because
Russia cannot hack a piece of paper
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