Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I'm just going to read are you ready? And then well,
just read Elliott. This isn't me talking, I'm reading from
what somebody said. Sorry, spicebag, that is a curry berg.
I have a medical condition that's being treated by low
cost prescription medications.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Are we following?
Speaker 1 (00:24):
I have a medical condition because this is key, that
is being treated by low cost prescription medications. My doctor
would like to see better results, which he expects would
be achieved by a newer medication.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
But it's more expensive.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
He suggested that if I, quote forgot to take my
current low cost meds for a week before my next
blood test, the insurance company would agree that the more
expensive medication was required to treat my condition.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
And that they would approve the pricier prescription.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
For the record. The week without med meds poses little
medical risk to me. Would it be unethical for me
to discontinue my current prescription before my blood work in
order to have the pricier meds approved.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
Wow, doctor's orders.
Speaker 4 (01:32):
And it's it's going to be cheaper, and I don't
think the pharmaceutical companies will go out of business because
of it.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Okay, that's like, But which side of the fence. Do
you want me to play?
Speaker 4 (01:44):
I can see you playing both sides, but that's what
the doctor told me to do.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
The Yeah, no, I'll answer everybody.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
Ninety nine out of one hundred people would exactly be
one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Oh, I don't think it's not the Oh, one hundred
out of one hundred people. Oh way, Oh, I bet it, Okay,
ninety eight you wouldn't do that. I'd do it in
a second.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
Yeah, I would be made very nervous, even though it's
doctor's order.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
You need it, you need the medication helped me get
better and better results.
Speaker 3 (02:15):
Also for a week, making myself more ill. Yeah, but
they said it is little to no risk. Pose it
poses little risk. But then what if I'm then a
documented case when this doc comes up or this facility
or hospital whatever with insurance fraud issues?
Speaker 2 (02:36):
Number one, I'm.
Speaker 4 (02:40):
I don't know. I mean, I just told you my
memory is awful. I just I just did what. I
don't know.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
The doctor said, I went and got my blood test.
I don't remember. I got a lot going on.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
I went and took the blood test, and it said I.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Needed the meds, and I got the meds. I may
one hundred out of one hundred, may be right.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
I would I do it every no hesitating. But don't
people do.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
This all the time. Don't people do this all the time.
Speaker 3 (03:06):
There are ways to code things, and a doctor may
not even tell you they're doing it. Some are more
open about it that they code things so that insurance
will cover it.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Right, that's good.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
Is that fraud?
Speaker 1 (03:20):
No, because, like Diane said, like all the pharmaceuticals are
going to go out of business.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
You can't look at things that way. You can't catch
us like saying it's okay to shoplift from this store
but not the mom and pop.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Yeah, and people believe that they do they.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
Do They're like what they can't afford to lose it?
Speaker 2 (03:41):
No, it is I actually have a bigger problem with
that than this. This is fine shoplift.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
I would do this all day. I just think you're
not giving people enough credit for well.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
I'm giving people credit for doing it.
Speaker 4 (03:58):
No, he's saying you you saying.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
Okay, But that doesn't make you a bad person.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
The system is bad. But that's another bad argument. You
can't go with the systems and fix the system. And
I won't do it like this doesn't break it it's
already broken like that exactly. That's not a great argument either,
but it's.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
A good one. It's better.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
It's better than I'm stealing from a big box store.
I was trying to think. I don't think I've ever
done that though.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
Been convinced to no, no, nowhere it's mess with your
blood work or.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
Yeah, like I don't think I I know I've never
done that where it's been like, hey, this medication may
be better than this medication. Like I'm trying to think
back to my loopus days. I don't think I was
ever like, oh well, if it looks worse, I'll get this,
which is better.
Speaker 5 (04:54):
Man.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
But I would do it.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
Listen, if a doctor floated that by me, I'd be like,
and by the way, I've already said I'll go I'll
go to jail for a source.
Speaker 5 (05:05):
Right.
Speaker 3 (05:06):
This is a lot different than that.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
You are a patient, Okay, well yeah, I guess so.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
But that that's at that point you just got to
play stupid.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
I don't I don't know. I'm not a doctor. I'm
a patient. Go ask the doctor. Well, no, don't do that.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
In his yeah, in his testimony, he said he advised
patient to stop taking medicine.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Well did he name me? Well, don't say that.
Speaker 3 (05:29):
You need one of those non lawyers.
Speaker 6 (05:31):
Also, the the the what are the odds that are
really going to do that?
Speaker 3 (05:35):
I know, I know, once again you're pointing at the
scope of the operation. But again it's a question of ethics,
and it doesn't boil down to can I get away
with it? That shouldn't be how you gauge you. You
can't get away world dilemma. That's just that's basic Uh
(05:57):
ethics there, that's ethics one O one.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (06:02):
Nobody's getting hurt. So we're setting aside that this could
affect your health negatively in that time period.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Doctor told me it won't. In the one week, it won't.
Speaker 3 (06:11):
Yeah, the actors have been wrong before. Okay, but this
is actually how the frog came to light a patient's death.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
The no no, so yes, put that aside. Put that aside.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
You will show no ill effects, no ill effects of
going a week without your meds, zero ill effects.
Speaker 2 (06:28):
As a matter of fact, you may even feel better.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
I thought the tests were going to show that's not
the case.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
And then I'm going to get the more expensive medication
for the cheap all better.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
Where am I going, Christian.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
I'm sure there are some people though who ninety nine
of them are with you and me and one.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Is with Tyler Hi Elliott in the morning. Also, can
I apologize you now?
Speaker 1 (07:01):
Sometimes if you eat chips and salsa, if it's hot,
you have to keep eating it to keep.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Your mouth from burning.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
That's what I'm doing with a spice bag right now,
Like I got to burn going, but I got to
keep seating it anyway.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
Yes, go ahead, sir, Hi, Yes, sir, yes, sir.
Speaker 5 (07:18):
Oh, hey, so happy to talk to you guys. So
this situation's happening with me right now. Actually, so I
see a doctor for mental health reasons. And so I
tried ketamine like ketamine therapy a couple of years back,
right and maybe maybe a year ago. My my doctor said, hey,
(07:41):
I can prescribe this now, but you have to you know,
you have to take a couple of questionnaires and I
have to fill out some medical history.
Speaker 7 (07:48):
And she said, if you happened to score this number
or above on the questionnaire, then you would qualify, so
you know.
Speaker 5 (07:59):
How the treatment covered.
Speaker 7 (08:01):
I was like, okay, I'll bear that in mind when
next time I take it. Right and then so I
took it again and my score happens across a certain threshold,
and my insurance they covered.
Speaker 5 (08:14):
The I mean treatment.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
So was anything done to manipulate your score.
Speaker 7 (08:21):
Other than me inplating the numbers a little bit?
Speaker 5 (08:23):
Now?
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Oh so you were told get to this number and
you were like, I can manipulate that.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
And now you're on the good meds. Now you're on
kenemine and you're great.
Speaker 5 (08:33):
Yeah, yeah, I would do it ten times out of ten,
I think, yeah, but.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
You are doing it actually, but you know what, No,
but you know what, what's the lesson in that? What's
the lesson in that? What better to treat the person
than the company? Well? Of course, thank you, Yeah, that's
who I am.
Speaker 3 (08:54):
But is it? Is it kind of thank you sir?
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Hey, by the way, is ketamine great?
Speaker 5 (09:00):
It's life changing?
Speaker 3 (09:01):
Oh god? Yes, all right, very good, Thank you sir,
Thank you.
Speaker 4 (09:05):
But are you faulting the doctor for her saying you know,
if you get this score, okay, if you get this score,
to sort.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Of put that, to tell you what the parameter is worth.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
That, yeah, to put that in his head.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
They were just saying, if you get a score, I
could do it. If not I can't because.
Speaker 4 (09:22):
I'm I'm sure it. The ketamine's not cheap.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
No, you know what that is.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
That's the doctor trying to backpedal their way out of going,
don't take your medication, just going, I don't know how
you'll score, but if you score this high, we'll be
able to do it.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
It's smoother.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
That's that proverbial gray area.
Speaker 3 (09:41):
Some people say. It's kind of like when the doctor
asks where your pain is at.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Always say seven.
Speaker 3 (09:48):
You've actually instructed us to do that.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Always say seven.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
But I sit there and seven comes with with with
with pain, pain management.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
Always say seven.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Whenever I'm in there, and I know you're quick to
say it's all in my head, no matter my malady,
but I start over explaining myself, well, is being shot
a ten?
Speaker 8 (10:10):
Like?
Speaker 3 (10:10):
I don't want to say hi, even if it is
bothering me, because being on fire being oh my god,
by a car.
Speaker 1 (10:19):
Is worse than frozen shoulder. Yes, of course it is.
So I sit there and try to be very very honest.
But they're not saying what's your pain compared to somebody else?
They're saying, what is your pain? And you always say seven?
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Eight, say nine.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
That's a little bit like really frozen shoulder and your
pain's a nine.
Speaker 3 (10:37):
Soft doctor grabs the file opens the door. Actually, my
neck on the side eight on my shoulder is bothering
me this morning. But I know why I got caught
under my custom pillow. And when I woke up this morning,
I was at the strangest angle because you know, my
my pillow has like little arms, and then my goes
(11:00):
into is it a big stuff? You can call it
a teddy bear bears not the type for reading like.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
No, no, no, it was. It was a plushy and
it had the it had the hands. It's okay like pillows.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
It's a squish man.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Anyway. Right, So and if you.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
Went to the doctor today, you would say, I don't know,
it's somewhere around a seven or an eight.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
It really hurts, and they give you pain meds.
Speaker 1 (11:32):
If you go in and go well, if being shots
at ten, I'm probably out of three. Then all you're
gonna get is a little tap on the ass and
told to get out of there, get the meds.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
I want the treatment to be appropriate for my actual condition.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
You know what gets rid of pain? Pain medication.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
I for this morning, instead of taking some higher profen
all the way in I just tried to self massage.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
No, no, And by the way, you know what you
could get for that bikead in?
Speaker 3 (12:00):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (12:01):
Please bad.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
You know it doesn't work a bottle of self massage.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
You know what else works for that? Percoset, two of
the greatest things ever invented. Hi Elliott in the morning.
I mean, yeah, Hi, who's that?
Speaker 5 (12:20):
Oh?
Speaker 9 (12:21):
This is Jack and Richmond.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Yes, sir, I used.
Speaker 9 (12:24):
To work for a health insurance coming a few years ago.
Let's staying working for him anymore. But I would say
it's definitely smarter to have your doctor life where you
lie straight to your insurance because they will fight tooth
and nail to save tenny's and spend thousands of dollars
doing it.
Speaker 1 (12:43):
Who's that the insurance the most five?
Speaker 7 (12:45):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Well yeah, but I got that. Well, they're gonna come
investigate me for that number.
Speaker 9 (12:52):
Come on, No, they're not going to investigate you, but
if you but they will just say no. Nowadays, everything
when it comes to claims, it goes through AI first,
and it's automatically denied every single time. If it's anything big,
you have to have your doctor or you yourself have
to fight the insurance company and get us to actually
(13:14):
go in and talk to a person. Then you get
approved usually.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
The second time.
Speaker 9 (13:19):
But if you don't, right, you have to fight a
little more. But usually they're not going to anything after that.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
So like, but go back to the example that I
was reading, is it was just the result of blood work.
Would be what triggers you to be able to get
that medication? What is the fighting on that? They're not
going to fight on that. Look at my blood work.
Speaker 9 (13:41):
They're going to look at your blood work and see
that you didn't have the medication we were taking in
your system when you had the blood work done.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
How did they know that I was supposed to be
taking medication?
Speaker 9 (13:51):
Well, if it's a put forward by your doctor, but
then the prescription, it's then his notes and he says
you should be taking this, even if it's over the counter.
That something they're going to look for. Oh, so you
know you said you should be taking four hundred milligrams
tilet all every day. If they see you don't have
tile and all in your system, they know you're not
doing what you're supposed to be doing with don't deny it?
Speaker 2 (14:12):
Does it isn't it a thank you, sir. That's a
good tip.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Isn't it hard to believe that somebody at assurance company
is reading your blood and your doctor's notes.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
You know doctor's notes there are.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
Well, I said, it's Ai. Yea oh, it's not even
a human. Oh well, AI make.
Speaker 2 (14:26):
Some mistakes, ut balk it's the love of my life.
Speaker 3 (14:31):
How dare you? From Instagram? Yes, I had a herniated disk.
The sports med told me, or asked me if I
had tingling down my legs into my toes. I didn't,
but then the sports med told me I did have
tingling down my legs and into my toes because that's
the only way I could get the approval for the MRI.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
Okay, there you.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
By the way, I thought of the one time that
I did this when was that? It wasn't with medicine, though,
What do you mean? When I was in a car accident.
This is when I lived in Houston and I got
hit by a police car that didn't have their lights
on or anything. But I got I got, I got
spun out on the freeway and the insurance adjuster came
(15:22):
to my apartment and said, hey, I looked at the
car and obviously there's significant damage.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
Not enough to be totaled.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
Although you know what, I didn't look at the front
wind shield or the back wind shield.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
Was the back windshield shattered? And I'm just I'm a teenager.
So I looked at him.
Speaker 1 (15:46):
He's like, if that back windshield is shattered, we can
write the car up as being totaled. He said, so,
why don't you go out and look and just come
back and tell me. So I went out and I
came back and said it shattered, and he said, great,
I'm gonna have to take a picture of it. And
I was like, oop, hold on a second, and took
a baseball beat outside, bashed the back window, came back
(16:07):
in and he took a picture and they totaled it.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
That's doing a solid.
Speaker 2 (16:11):
That's the insurance company doing it. And I won't name it.
I won't name the I won't name the insurance company.
Speaker 3 (16:18):
We've definitely covered the car related insurance.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
How is this any different.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
You're working directly with the doctor. Yeah, well you're not.
In your case, it was in the insurance.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
But it's still telling me to bogie the claim.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
So another theorists come through from a couple of people
x on Instagram as well, you said he would achieve
How did he How did he explain what the new
more expensive medication it would play it would it would
make the results better? What was the phrasing hold on
(16:55):
I'd like to see better results.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
My doctor would like to see better results, which he
expecs would be achieved by the newer, more expensive medication.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
So we didn't even consider this. There are a couple
of people believing that this doctor gets kickbacks from the
expensive medication, but not the cheaper medication.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
So the doctor what they get there they get.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
Now I have to think I have to thank al
Toyto because in Dope Sick, when they were when they
were doling out the opioids, like you saw that where
they weren't getting like money back, but they were getting
taken care of.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
Yeah, you can go get a speaker's fee. Yeah, speakers
feed lots of lunches.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
Let's go to dinner, food ola, yeah, TVs, all kinds
of stuff.
Speaker 3 (17:43):
Sure, exactly.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
Oh so maybe the doctor's getting something, getting some kind
of some kind of reach around from the pill company.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
So which, by the way, good, Well.
Speaker 3 (17:53):
No, wow, that's not good to push stuff because you're
benefiting as the doing it for me he's doing it
for him. Yes, yeah, people are theorizing.
Speaker 2 (18:04):
Oh that's a good theory, that's a good thing. So
now I'm a pawn.
Speaker 3 (18:09):
Yes, yeah, Okay, you're getting your meds free.
Speaker 1 (18:16):
So he may just be telling me they're better because
he's getting he's getting a surf and turf dinner.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
For pushing it. Yes, good win win. Meds are good,
but you.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
Just want to see better results, which means the guy's
doing fine.
Speaker 5 (18:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
I don't even have to be on meds for a week.
I'm a hypochondriac. I got a frozen shoulder.
Speaker 3 (18:38):
Yeah that you'll try this new one if it doesn't
work up back to the old one.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
Yeah, and doc would have already gotten a surf and turf.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
So yes, that's good. It just adds to what we
said in beginning. We know the system is broken, but
it was an ethics question to start. Should you feel
comfortable yes partaking?
Speaker 5 (18:58):
Yes?
Speaker 3 (18:58):
And my answer is no is.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Yes because I don't know if my doctor's on the
take or not. I'm just following doctors word if he's
If the doc's on the take, the doc's on the take.
Speaker 3 (19:08):
But even if that's not the case, you said you
still find no moral issue with it, right right, yeah,
big big Pharma.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Yeah, I'm sorry. I don't feel bad for the slackers Stackers.
What was the name of the company, the opioid people
from dope Sick?
Speaker 3 (19:28):
Oh? I don't know.
Speaker 4 (19:29):
What was the name of the family, And you said Stackers,
I was thinking Stacker two.
Speaker 2 (19:33):
The oh like big lou.
Speaker 3 (19:35):
Now what was the name of the of the of
the fact the oxyconon family, Yeah, from Purdue, Yeah, the Sackler, Sackler, Sackler,
big Sackler. Is this is this a tragedy of the commons?
And I understand I don't know mine?
Speaker 7 (19:50):
Is it?
Speaker 5 (19:52):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (19:52):
No, no, let me ask him, Let me ask Wills.
Speaker 3 (19:54):
I believe you're correct. I'm sorry.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Of the commons.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
I'm so glad I'm not them commons. You mean the
people that wash my shoes.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
What's a tragedy of them? What's a tragedy of them?
Speaker 3 (20:15):
I do say, looking disgust on his face.
Speaker 6 (20:21):
Oh, now he's got a pound. Now that's a tragedy
of the commons. Look at the common pout. He doesn't
have what I have. I don't have. I don't have
a neck pillow. You have a man who holds my
neck as I sleep. WO tragedy of commons?
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Anyway, I'm sorry, what were you saying?
Speaker 3 (20:43):
I thank you guy? The concept, yeah, at least the
name of it, right. The saddest part is this is
not a direct comparison. I should have just called it
something else, right, because I realized that healthcare it is
not universal, and it's it's not a right, and it's
certainly a privilege in this country. But for those that
(21:09):
do have health insurance, if you consider that to be
the commons, right, a big, massive space, which is where
this concept's born out of. When everyone takes advantage of
something and acts in their self interest, it is to
the detriment of all involved. So so when you raise
(21:38):
your hand and say I'll be a part of the problem,
are you say, increasing premiums for somebody else? Yeah, Diane,
we're doing it too. What about is another great argument? Yeah,
(22:00):
but you see, that's not exactly the tragedy of the commons. No,
it's not.
Speaker 2 (22:04):
No, it's not.
Speaker 5 (22:05):
Hi.
Speaker 9 (22:05):
Who's this good morning?
Speaker 4 (22:08):
Yes?
Speaker 7 (22:08):
Hi?
Speaker 2 (22:08):
What can I do for you?
Speaker 5 (22:11):
Hi?
Speaker 8 (22:11):
My name is.
Speaker 10 (22:11):
Caitlin from Richmond. I just wanted to say, you know,
medication prices are already artificially inflated. There's been evidence that
people will file patents to try to make the medications cheap,
and then big form of companies will go in and
sell that medication for a much higher price and push
them out.
Speaker 8 (22:29):
Exactly exactly, And it's like the system is already set
up against you. If this is a question of your health,
you have to do it's best for you. The system
is going to get its money back somehow somewhere. And
Tyler's right, there's a potential for premiums to increase, but
they are already so dramatically inflated that I mean, it's
(22:50):
almost impossible.
Speaker 10 (22:51):
To actually get what you need nowadays without.
Speaker 1 (22:55):
You know what, you know what this is? You know
what this is. This is haggling over a bottle of
wine at a restaurant. Yeah, because it's so overpriced that
you're just trying to talk your way down with like
corkage fees and stuff like that pays.
Speaker 3 (23:08):
For wine, Like the pole are talking.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
Remember when that poor man painted in front of me.
I didn't even look at him. No, the Prince do that.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
Carlia Hall, Please, she's not she's not Bridges. I'm sorry,
what were you saying? Lady, ma'am.
Speaker 9 (23:32):
No, no, I was just gonna say.
Speaker 10 (23:34):
It's almost more like saying like, hey, I don't want
to pay for this dish that I sent back because
it was wrong, because the medic the medication is not working.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
Yeah, now you're getting into a word.
Speaker 3 (23:46):
You definitely ate the whole thing.
Speaker 2 (23:47):
Yeah, then you're not getting that was awful.
Speaker 3 (23:49):
Give me money back?
Speaker 1 (23:50):
No, no, no more than a bite or two, you're
out like that, I'll fight for all right.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
Very good, very good. I feel like we solved it.
Very good.
Speaker 1 (23:57):
Thank you, ma'am, thank you, thank you. All right, very good.
Ninety nine out of one hundred.
Speaker 3 (24:03):
Oh you backed off one, Yeah, I did because at
Tyler this one.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
Yeah, all right, give me a give me a quick break.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
Oh, I know where I'm going. I know where I'm going.
Give me a quick break.
Speaker 6 (24:18):
More Breakfast show on Baby Safe for next, Camilla
I'm just going to read are you ready? And then well,
just read Elliott. This isn't me talking, I'm reading from
what somebody said. Sorry, spicebag, that is a curry berg.
I have a medical condition that's being treated by low
cost prescription medications.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Are we following?
Speaker 1 (00:24):
I have a medical condition because this is key, that
is being treated by low cost prescription medications. My doctor
would like to see better results, which he expects would
be achieved by a newer medication.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
But it's more expensive.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
He suggested that if I, quote forgot to take my
current low cost meds for a week before my next
blood test, the insurance company would agree that the more
expensive medication was required to treat my condition.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
And that they would approve the pricier prescription.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
For the record. The week without med meds poses little
medical risk to me. Would it be unethical for me
to discontinue my current prescription before my blood work in
order to have the pricier meds approved.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
Wow, doctor's orders.
Speaker 4 (01:32):
And it's it's going to be cheaper, and I don't
think the pharmaceutical companies will go out of business because
of it.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Okay, that's like, But which side of the fence. Do
you want me to play?
Speaker 4 (01:44):
I can see you playing both sides, but that's what
the doctor told me to do.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
The Yeah, no, I'll answer everybody.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
Ninety nine out of one hundred people would exactly be
one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Oh, I don't think it's not the Oh, one hundred
out of one hundred people. Oh way, Oh, I bet it, Okay,
ninety eight you wouldn't do that. I'd do it in
a second.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
Yeah, I would be made very nervous, even though it's
doctor's order.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
You need it, you need the medication helped me get
better and better results.
Speaker 3 (02:15):
Also for a week, making myself more ill. Yeah, but
they said it is little to no risk. Pose it
poses little risk. But then what if I'm then a
documented case when this doc comes up or this facility
or hospital whatever with insurance fraud issues?
Speaker 2 (02:36):
Number one, I'm.
Speaker 4 (02:40):
I don't know. I mean, I just told you my
memory is awful. I just I just did what. I
don't know.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
The doctor said, I went and got my blood test.
I don't remember. I got a lot going on.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
I went and took the blood test, and it said I.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Needed the meds, and I got the meds. I may
one hundred out of one hundred, may be right.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
I would I do it every no hesitating. But don't
people do.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
This all the time. Don't people do this all the time.
Speaker 3 (03:06):
There are ways to code things, and a doctor may
not even tell you they're doing it. Some are more
open about it that they code things so that insurance
will cover it.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Right, that's good.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
Is that fraud?
Speaker 1 (03:20):
No, because, like Diane said, like all the pharmaceuticals are
going to go out of business.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
You can't look at things that way. You can't catch
us like saying it's okay to shoplift from this store
but not the mom and pop.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Yeah, and people believe that they do they.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
Do They're like what they can't afford to lose it?
Speaker 2 (03:41):
No, it is I actually have a bigger problem with
that than this. This is fine shoplift.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
I would do this all day. I just think you're
not giving people enough credit for well.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
I'm giving people credit for doing it.
Speaker 4 (03:58):
No, he's saying you you saying.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
Okay, But that doesn't make you a bad person.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
The system is bad. But that's another bad argument. You
can't go with the systems and fix the system. And
I won't do it like this doesn't break it it's
already broken like that exactly. That's not a great argument either,
but it's.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
A good one. It's better.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
It's better than I'm stealing from a big box store.
I was trying to think. I don't think I've ever
done that though.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
Been convinced to no, no, nowhere it's mess with your
blood work or.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
Yeah, like I don't think I I know I've never
done that where it's been like, hey, this medication may
be better than this medication. Like I'm trying to think
back to my loopus days. I don't think I was
ever like, oh well, if it looks worse, I'll get this,
which is better.
Speaker 5 (04:54):
Man.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
But I would do it.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
Listen, if a doctor floated that by me, I'd be like,
and by the way, I've already said I'll go I'll
go to jail for a source.
Speaker 5 (05:05):
Right.
Speaker 3 (05:06):
This is a lot different than that.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
You are a patient, Okay, well yeah, I guess so.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
But that that's at that point you just got to
play stupid.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
I don't I don't know. I'm not a doctor. I'm
a patient. Go ask the doctor. Well, no, don't do that.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
In his yeah, in his testimony, he said he advised
patient to stop taking medicine.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Well did he name me? Well, don't say that.
Speaker 3 (05:29):
You need one of those non lawyers.
Speaker 6 (05:31):
Also, the the the what are the odds that are
really going to do that?
Speaker 3 (05:35):
I know, I know, once again you're pointing at the
scope of the operation. But again it's a question of ethics,
and it doesn't boil down to can I get away
with it? That shouldn't be how you gauge you. You
can't get away world dilemma. That's just that's basic Uh
(05:57):
ethics there, that's ethics one O one.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (06:02):
Nobody's getting hurt. So we're setting aside that this could
affect your health negatively in that time period.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Doctor told me it won't. In the one week, it won't.
Speaker 3 (06:11):
Yeah, the actors have been wrong before. Okay, but this
is actually how the frog came to light a patient's death.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
The no no, so yes, put that aside. Put that aside.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
You will show no ill effects, no ill effects of
going a week without your meds, zero ill effects.
Speaker 2 (06:28):
As a matter of fact, you may even feel better.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
I thought the tests were going to show that's not
the case.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
And then I'm going to get the more expensive medication
for the cheap all better.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
Where am I going, Christian.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
I'm sure there are some people though who ninety nine
of them are with you and me and one.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Is with Tyler Hi Elliott in the morning. Also, can
I apologize you now?
Speaker 1 (07:01):
Sometimes if you eat chips and salsa, if it's hot,
you have to keep eating it to keep.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Your mouth from burning.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
That's what I'm doing with a spice bag right now,
Like I got to burn going, but I got to
keep seating it anyway.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
Yes, go ahead, sir, Hi, Yes, sir, yes, sir.
Speaker 5 (07:18):
Oh, hey, so happy to talk to you guys. So
this situation's happening with me right now. Actually, so I
see a doctor for mental health reasons. And so I
tried ketamine like ketamine therapy a couple of years back,
right and maybe maybe a year ago. My my doctor said, hey,
(07:41):
I can prescribe this now, but you have to you know,
you have to take a couple of questionnaires and I
have to fill out some medical history.
Speaker 7 (07:48):
And she said, if you happened to score this number
or above on the questionnaire, then you would qualify, so
you know.
Speaker 5 (07:59):
How the treatment covered.
Speaker 7 (08:01):
I was like, okay, I'll bear that in mind when
next time I take it. Right and then so I
took it again and my score happens across a certain threshold,
and my insurance they covered.
Speaker 5 (08:14):
The I mean treatment.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
So was anything done to manipulate your score.
Speaker 7 (08:21):
Other than me inplating the numbers a little bit?
Speaker 5 (08:23):
Now?
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Oh so you were told get to this number and
you were like, I can manipulate that.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
And now you're on the good meds. Now you're on
kenemine and you're great.
Speaker 5 (08:33):
Yeah, yeah, I would do it ten times out of ten,
I think, yeah, but.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
You are doing it actually, but you know what, No,
but you know what, what's the lesson in that? What's
the lesson in that? What better to treat the person
than the company? Well? Of course, thank you, Yeah, that's
who I am.
Speaker 3 (08:54):
But is it? Is it kind of thank you sir?
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Hey, by the way, is ketamine great?
Speaker 5 (09:00):
It's life changing?
Speaker 3 (09:01):
Oh god? Yes, all right, very good, Thank you sir,
Thank you.
Speaker 4 (09:05):
But are you faulting the doctor for her saying you know,
if you get this score, okay, if you get this score,
to sort.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Of put that, to tell you what the parameter is worth.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
That, yeah, to put that in his head.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
They were just saying, if you get a score, I
could do it. If not I can't because.
Speaker 4 (09:22):
I'm I'm sure it. The ketamine's not cheap.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
No, you know what that is.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
That's the doctor trying to backpedal their way out of going,
don't take your medication, just going, I don't know how
you'll score, but if you score this high, we'll be
able to do it.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
It's smoother.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
That's that proverbial gray area.
Speaker 3 (09:41):
Some people say. It's kind of like when the doctor
asks where your pain is at.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Always say seven.
Speaker 3 (09:48):
You've actually instructed us to do that.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Always say seven.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
But I sit there and seven comes with with with
with pain, pain management.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
Always say seven.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Whenever I'm in there, and I know you're quick to
say it's all in my head, no matter my malady,
but I start over explaining myself, well, is being shot
a ten?
Speaker 8 (10:10):
Like?
Speaker 3 (10:10):
I don't want to say hi, even if it is
bothering me, because being on fire being oh my god,
by a car.
Speaker 1 (10:19):
Is worse than frozen shoulder. Yes, of course it is.
So I sit there and try to be very very honest.
But they're not saying what's your pain compared to somebody else?
They're saying, what is your pain? And you always say seven?
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Eight, say nine.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
That's a little bit like really frozen shoulder and your
pain's a nine.
Speaker 3 (10:37):
Soft doctor grabs the file opens the door. Actually, my
neck on the side eight on my shoulder is bothering
me this morning. But I know why I got caught
under my custom pillow. And when I woke up this morning,
I was at the strangest angle because you know, my
my pillow has like little arms, and then my goes
(11:00):
into is it a big stuff? You can call it
a teddy bear bears not the type for reading like.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
No, no, no, it was. It was a plushy and
it had the it had the hands. It's okay like pillows.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
It's a squish man.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Anyway. Right, So and if you.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
Went to the doctor today, you would say, I don't know,
it's somewhere around a seven or an eight.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
It really hurts, and they give you pain meds.
Speaker 1 (11:32):
If you go in and go well, if being shots
at ten, I'm probably out of three. Then all you're
gonna get is a little tap on the ass and
told to get out of there, get the meds.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
I want the treatment to be appropriate for my actual condition.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
You know what gets rid of pain? Pain medication.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
I for this morning, instead of taking some higher profen
all the way in I just tried to self massage.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
No, no, And by the way, you know what you
could get for that bikead in?
Speaker 3 (12:00):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (12:01):
Please bad.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
You know it doesn't work a bottle of self massage.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
You know what else works for that? Percoset, two of
the greatest things ever invented. Hi Elliott in the morning.
I mean, yeah, Hi, who's that?
Speaker 5 (12:20):
Oh?
Speaker 9 (12:21):
This is Jack and Richmond.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Yes, sir, I used.
Speaker 9 (12:24):
To work for a health insurance coming a few years ago.
Let's staying working for him anymore. But I would say
it's definitely smarter to have your doctor life where you
lie straight to your insurance because they will fight tooth
and nail to save tenny's and spend thousands of dollars
doing it.
Speaker 1 (12:43):
Who's that the insurance the most five?
Speaker 7 (12:45):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Well yeah, but I got that. Well, they're gonna come
investigate me for that number.
Speaker 9 (12:52):
Come on, No, they're not going to investigate you, but
if you but they will just say no. Nowadays, everything
when it comes to claims, it goes through AI first,
and it's automatically denied every single time. If it's anything big,
you have to have your doctor or you yourself have
to fight the insurance company and get us to actually
(13:14):
go in and talk to a person. Then you get
approved usually.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
The second time.
Speaker 9 (13:19):
But if you don't, right, you have to fight a
little more. But usually they're not going to anything after that.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
So like, but go back to the example that I
was reading, is it was just the result of blood work.
Would be what triggers you to be able to get
that medication? What is the fighting on that? They're not
going to fight on that. Look at my blood work.
Speaker 9 (13:41):
They're going to look at your blood work and see
that you didn't have the medication we were taking in
your system when you had the blood work done.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
How did they know that I was supposed to be
taking medication?
Speaker 9 (13:51):
Well, if it's a put forward by your doctor, but
then the prescription, it's then his notes and he says
you should be taking this, even if it's over the counter.
That something they're going to look for. Oh, so you
know you said you should be taking four hundred milligrams
tilet all every day. If they see you don't have
tile and all in your system, they know you're not
doing what you're supposed to be doing with don't deny it?
Speaker 2 (14:12):
Does it isn't it a thank you, sir. That's a
good tip.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Isn't it hard to believe that somebody at assurance company
is reading your blood and your doctor's notes.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
You know doctor's notes there are.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
Well, I said, it's Ai. Yea oh, it's not even
a human. Oh well, AI make.
Speaker 2 (14:26):
Some mistakes, ut balk it's the love of my life.
Speaker 3 (14:31):
How dare you? From Instagram? Yes, I had a herniated disk.
The sports med told me, or asked me if I
had tingling down my legs into my toes. I didn't,
but then the sports med told me I did have
tingling down my legs and into my toes because that's
the only way I could get the approval for the MRI.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
Okay, there you.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
By the way, I thought of the one time that
I did this when was that? It wasn't with medicine, though,
What do you mean? When I was in a car accident.
This is when I lived in Houston and I got
hit by a police car that didn't have their lights
on or anything. But I got I got, I got
spun out on the freeway and the insurance adjuster came
(15:22):
to my apartment and said, hey, I looked at the
car and obviously there's significant damage.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
Not enough to be totaled.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
Although you know what, I didn't look at the front
wind shield or the back wind shield.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
Was the back windshield shattered? And I'm just I'm a teenager.
So I looked at him.
Speaker 1 (15:46):
He's like, if that back windshield is shattered, we can
write the car up as being totaled. He said, so,
why don't you go out and look and just come
back and tell me. So I went out and I
came back and said it shattered, and he said, great,
I'm gonna have to take a picture of it. And
I was like, oop, hold on a second, and took
a baseball beat outside, bashed the back window, came back
(16:07):
in and he took a picture and they totaled it.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
That's doing a solid.
Speaker 2 (16:11):
That's the insurance company doing it. And I won't name it.
I won't name the I won't name the insurance company.
Speaker 3 (16:18):
We've definitely covered the car related insurance.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
How is this any different.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
You're working directly with the doctor. Yeah, well you're not.
In your case, it was in the insurance.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
But it's still telling me to bogie the claim.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
So another theorists come through from a couple of people
x on Instagram as well, you said he would achieve
How did he How did he explain what the new
more expensive medication it would play it would it would
make the results better? What was the phrasing hold on
(16:55):
I'd like to see better results.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
My doctor would like to see better results, which he
expecs would be achieved by the newer, more expensive medication.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
So we didn't even consider this. There are a couple
of people believing that this doctor gets kickbacks from the
expensive medication, but not the cheaper medication.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
So the doctor what they get there they get.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
Now I have to think I have to thank al
Toyto because in Dope Sick, when they were when they
were doling out the opioids, like you saw that where
they weren't getting like money back, but they were getting
taken care of.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
Yeah, you can go get a speaker's fee. Yeah, speakers
feed lots of lunches.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
Let's go to dinner, food ola, yeah, TVs, all kinds
of stuff.
Speaker 3 (17:43):
Sure, exactly.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
Oh so maybe the doctor's getting something, getting some kind
of some kind of reach around from the pill company.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
So which, by the way, good, Well.
Speaker 3 (17:53):
No, wow, that's not good to push stuff because you're
benefiting as the doing it for me he's doing it
for him. Yes, yeah, people are theorizing.
Speaker 2 (18:04):
Oh that's a good theory, that's a good thing. So
now I'm a pawn.
Speaker 3 (18:09):
Yes, yeah, Okay, you're getting your meds free.
Speaker 1 (18:16):
So he may just be telling me they're better because
he's getting he's getting a surf and turf dinner.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
For pushing it. Yes, good win win. Meds are good,
but you.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
Just want to see better results, which means the guy's
doing fine.
Speaker 5 (18:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
I don't even have to be on meds for a week.
I'm a hypochondriac. I got a frozen shoulder.
Speaker 3 (18:38):
Yeah that you'll try this new one if it doesn't
work up back to the old one.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
Yeah, and doc would have already gotten a surf and turf.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
So yes, that's good. It just adds to what we
said in beginning. We know the system is broken, but
it was an ethics question to start. Should you feel
comfortable yes partaking?
Speaker 5 (18:58):
Yes?
Speaker 3 (18:58):
And my answer is no is.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Yes because I don't know if my doctor's on the
take or not. I'm just following doctors word if he's
If the doc's on the take, the doc's on the take.
Speaker 3 (19:08):
But even if that's not the case, you said you
still find no moral issue with it, right right, yeah,
big big Pharma.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Yeah, I'm sorry. I don't feel bad for the slackers Stackers.
What was the name of the company, the opioid people
from dope Sick?
Speaker 3 (19:28):
Oh? I don't know.
Speaker 4 (19:29):
What was the name of the family, And you said Stackers,
I was thinking Stacker two.
Speaker 2 (19:33):
The oh like big lou.
Speaker 3 (19:35):
Now what was the name of the of the of
the fact the oxyconon family, Yeah, from Purdue, Yeah, the Sackler, Sackler, Sackler,
big Sackler. Is this is this a tragedy of the commons?
And I understand I don't know mine?
Speaker 7 (19:50):
Is it?
Speaker 5 (19:52):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (19:52):
No, no, let me ask him, Let me ask Wills.
Speaker 3 (19:54):
I believe you're correct. I'm sorry.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Of the commons.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
I'm so glad I'm not them commons. You mean the
people that wash my shoes.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
What's a tragedy of them? What's a tragedy of them?
Speaker 3 (20:15):
I do say, looking disgust on his face.
Speaker 6 (20:21):
Oh, now he's got a pound. Now that's a tragedy
of the commons. Look at the common pout. He doesn't
have what I have. I don't have. I don't have
a neck pillow. You have a man who holds my
neck as I sleep. WO tragedy of commons?
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Anyway, I'm sorry, what were you saying?
Speaker 3 (20:43):
I thank you guy? The concept, yeah, at least the
name of it, right. The saddest part is this is
not a direct comparison. I should have just called it
something else, right, because I realized that healthcare it is
not universal, and it's it's not a right, and it's
certainly a privilege in this country. But for those that
(21:09):
do have health insurance, if you consider that to be
the commons, right, a big, massive space, which is where
this concept's born out of. When everyone takes advantage of
something and acts in their self interest, it is to
the detriment of all involved. So so when you raise
(21:38):
your hand and say I'll be a part of the problem,
are you say, increasing premiums for somebody else? Yeah, Diane,
we're doing it too. What about is another great argument? Yeah,
(22:00):
but you see, that's not exactly the tragedy of the commons. No,
it's not.
Speaker 2 (22:04):
No, it's not.
Speaker 5 (22:05):
Hi.
Speaker 9 (22:05):
Who's this good morning?
Speaker 4 (22:08):
Yes?
Speaker 7 (22:08):
Hi?
Speaker 2 (22:08):
What can I do for you?
Speaker 5 (22:11):
Hi?
Speaker 8 (22:11):
My name is.
Speaker 10 (22:11):
Caitlin from Richmond. I just wanted to say, you know,
medication prices are already artificially inflated. There's been evidence that
people will file patents to try to make the medications cheap,
and then big form of companies will go in and
sell that medication for a much higher price and push
them out.
Speaker 8 (22:29):
Exactly exactly, And it's like the system is already set
up against you. If this is a question of your health,
you have to do it's best for you. The system
is going to get its money back somehow somewhere. And
Tyler's right, there's a potential for premiums to increase, but
they are already so dramatically inflated that I mean, it's
(22:50):
almost impossible.
Speaker 10 (22:51):
To actually get what you need nowadays without.
Speaker 1 (22:55):
You know what, you know what this is? You know
what this is. This is haggling over a bottle of
wine at a restaurant. Yeah, because it's so overpriced that
you're just trying to talk your way down with like
corkage fees and stuff like that pays.
Speaker 3 (23:08):
For wine, Like the pole are talking.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
Remember when that poor man painted in front of me.
I didn't even look at him. No, the Prince do that.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
Carlia Hall, Please, she's not she's not Bridges. I'm sorry,
what were you saying? Lady, ma'am.
Speaker 9 (23:32):
No, no, I was just gonna say.
Speaker 10 (23:34):
It's almost more like saying like, hey, I don't want
to pay for this dish that I sent back because
it was wrong, because the medic the medication is not working.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
Yeah, now you're getting into a word.
Speaker 3 (23:46):
You definitely ate the whole thing.
Speaker 2 (23:47):
Yeah, then you're not getting that was awful.
Speaker 3 (23:49):
Give me money back?
Speaker 1 (23:50):
No, no, no more than a bite or two, you're
out like that, I'll fight for all right.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
Very good, very good. I feel like we solved it.
Very good.
Speaker 1 (23:57):
Thank you, ma'am, thank you, thank you. All right, very good.
Ninety nine out of one hundred.
Speaker 3 (24:03):
Oh you backed off one, Yeah, I did because at
Tyler this one.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
Yeah, all right, give me a give me a quick break.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
Oh, I know where I'm going. I know where I'm going.
Give me a quick break.
Speaker 6 (24:18):
More Breakfast show on Baby Safe for next, Camilla
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