December 16, 2025 • 45 mins
Justin Gaard leads the show in place of Dan Barreiro and opens the show by giving an update on the Twins ownership situation, as well as previewing the NBA Cup Championship. Then Kevin Seifert joins in studio to talk about JJ McCarthy, and Jalen Nailor.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
I love my life. That's says I lost my life.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Welcome in bit a minute.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
It is the Cake Show edition of to Bumper guards
Ian for Dan the next couple of days.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
Dan, we'll be back on Thursday.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
We were here until six fifteen tonight because we've got
Vikings programming to get in and then the Minnesota while
back in action against the Washington Capitals Game two of
the Quinn Hughes Era tonight at Grand Casino Arena. To
help us with that, my buddy Kevin Gorg is going
to join right around four thirty. He's on the guest
lineup today. Mace in your Face will join at five o'clock.
He needed to switch from Wednesday to Tuesday. Works out
(02:11):
well for me. There's a ton of stuff I want
to get into with Mace. He was in studio last
week when the Sharon Moore Michigan meltdown happened and first broke,
so I know there was some instant reaction from Mace there.
Now there's a lot more to the story and the
story after the story, who replaces Sharon Moore at Michigan.
There's a lot to get into there, and I'm looking
(02:31):
forward as a guy who's been through a coaching search
or two when he was the coach. What's going on
right now in places like Arizona State. What's going on
right now in Alabama or Washington or Dinky Town in
terms of jostling for the next Michigan head coaching job.
Mace at five o'clock and Kevin Seaffert, because it's Tuesday,
he will join right around three point thirty. And we
(02:53):
believe mister Seffert from ESPN is coming in studio. Devin
Ward is here with me for the first hour. Kara Savage,
we'll check in right around four. The Brad Shawn Brian
Kampean text line, as always is six four six eight six.
You can text anything and anything at any time. Also
hit me at Guardzi. On social media, Twitter's good, Instagram's good.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
It's all there for you.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
Want to start, though, with a little bit of breaking
news or speculation, at least a development in the Twins
ownership story. Aaron Gleaman tweeted it out he had some
work to do with Dan Hayes, his partner at the
Athletic today, we're finally getting a little bit more information
about the minority owners the ones we've been waiting for
since the day that we learned the pole Ad family
was taking the team off the market. These mysterious minority
(03:37):
owners apparently are surfacing and they're apparently close to that
partial sale that in a big sense, will give the
team and give the current ownership group a fresh start financially.
It's described as quote a significant manner in terms of
cleaning up the club's finances and could set the stage
(03:57):
for a more lucrative deal in the future. And we'll
foreshadow to that a more lucrative sale in the future.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
The Nuts and Bolts as we know them.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
They're selling twenty percent of the franchise to three different
minority partnerships groups. The one point seventy five billion is
the valuation. You may recall that I think it was
the Tampa Bay Rays that sold for one five The
Twins I think could have sold for one to five.
They thought they were worth a little bit more than that,
and they had the five hundred million dollars in debt
that they were trying to work themselves out of, and
(04:28):
so they ended up taking it off the market. And
it appears that these three minority partnership groups are going
to help a lot with that here's the paragraph finalize
the transaction that helps a club five hundred million dollars
in debt return to sound financial footing while also requiring
the addition of three seats to the team's ownership advisory board.
That according to league sources telling The Athletic, basically, it
(04:52):
appears that the debt appears to be going away. There's
no disputing that they have been losing a bunch of money,
and it makes sense why, and that's outlined in the story.
They have a great season in twenty nineteen, believe that
was the Dong Show squad that went into Don Tober
that ended up losing to the Yankees, and they never
really got a chance to capitalize on that because what
happened in twenty twenty something called the COVID nineteen coronavirus
(05:15):
pandemic where fans were not allowed to come. They lost
a bunch of money. The story outlines how they didn't
lay anybody off. They continued to pay minor league players
some things that other organizations did not do that may
have contributed to them being in a precarious financial situation.
So that's how it all started. But we know why
it all continued was as Rock Obaldelli would say and
(05:38):
said many.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Times, we know it's not good baseball.
Speaker 3 (05:41):
They haven't had very good teams the last couple of years,
and people haven't been showing up to target field, and
the money continued to hemorrhage. But we're learning more about
who these people are, and this is where I think
it gets interesting, because they are described one of the
groups as New York bankers, another group is one of
us there Minnesota based, and then there's a third group
(06:03):
that apparently is a bunch of different limited partners who
just wanted to purchase small chunks of an MLB franchise.
And we're apparently involved in this thing as it was
going along the last couple of months. And as I'm
reading the story, there's quotes from anonymous sources and they're
obviously twin sources, so they're trying to paint it in
(06:23):
the most positive picture as they can that this is
all good news, and this is great and we're going
to be back on strong financial footing, and we're looking
at all different avenues now to improve the ball club,
and we're looking for fresh ideas. There's another pole ad
who's coming in with Joe. I think it's his older
brother Tom. So now we've got two pole Ads that
are going to have the seat at the table.
Speaker 2 (06:44):
And that all sounds.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
Good and it reads Rosie, and it probably is good
in the grand scheme of things, that the team is
getting back to somewhat solid financial footing where at least
they're not five hundred million dollars in debt anymore. But
one thing I do know about banks, banks like to
make money and the other thing I think to keep
(07:07):
banks healthy. One thing they can't do is lose money.
And I was texting around today just different people that
are loosely affiliated sources close to the situation, and I said,
does the story you read today does that leave you more.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
Cynical about what's going to happen with the twins?
Speaker 3 (07:25):
Or does it leave you more optimistic in the short
term about what's going to happen with the twins? And
somebody phrased it, I thought pretty succinctly, and I thought
made a good point because of who is jumping into
the team bankers, financial people, and we remember the pole
Ads got their start as bankers. If you want to
(07:45):
go all the way back to Carl, they don't like
to lose money. They're not interested in losing money, and
this source basically said, I think they're basically just wiping
debt off the books and then they'll run very low
payrolls to avoid losing money. And that's my biggest fear too.
We're getting back on secure financial footing and we're staying there.
(08:09):
That's what they're going to try to do here, which
means they're not interested in shelling out a bunch of cash.
Right now, they're not interested in selling shelling out a
bunch of cash.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
For the next couple of years.
Speaker 3 (08:20):
We're going to get through a labor deal that I
think is coming up in about two seasons. We're going
to try to get to the next TV contract phase,
which is I think twenty twenty nine. If it's not
twenty nine, is twenty eight, and then we'll see what happens.
And that's my biggest fear, and I'm pretty sure that's
what's going to happen, and that should be the fans'
(08:40):
biggest fear too, is that we're getting the cash infusion
that we needed to get us back on solid footing.
But once we do that, we're not going to be reckless.
We're not going to be aggressive. We're not going to
do anything that we haven't done the last handful of years.
We're going to be remarkably fiscally responsible. The other word
for that could be cheap, and I think we've all
(09:02):
kind of seen how that story goes. Doesn't mean that
they can't win, just means it's going to be really hard,
and they've got to be right on about nine other things.
When you're not willing to invest the financial resources and
you're not willing to take the big swings and the
big chances, you really have to be right. You've got
to be right on your traff picks. You've got to
be right on your trades. You've got to be right
on your value contracts. You've got to hope that aging
(09:23):
veterans that are coming in for one last stab at
glory overperform. That was actually part of the twenty nineteen team.
We want to talk about Nelson Cruz being a big
part of that. And that's where I think it's scary
if you're a Twins fan, because once more bankers get involved,
and in some cases, I don't know, maybe venture capital people,
maybe private equity people, I don't know exactly, when it's
(09:43):
just described as New York bankers. That can be very
loose interpretation. I think most of us are smart enough
to know what that means. Bankers don't like losing money.
They want to make money and when they invest in
something at this level. Part of the story talked about
how the twins are positioning themselves to be in a
good spot when all of these other things happen. The
(10:04):
labor deal happens, the TV contracts happen, and they might
be in a good spot when they want to sell again.
It feels like they're going to hold the asset, keep
the asset running cheaply, try not to lose money, and
then be much more positioned to sell something when all
of that comes to fruition and there's more certainty about
the television finances, there're more certainty about possible salary floors,
(10:27):
all the revenue sharing stuff that goes into CBAS.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
That's the scary part.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
And with pitchers and catchers reporting about two and a
half months from now, that's kind of where I'm left
with it. It's good that we've got info about what's going
on now, it's good that there's more money coming into
the team. But I think the good news kind of
stops there, and that's the unfortunate part. If you are
a baseball fan in this town, they will have to
do something remarkably out of character to get me to
(10:53):
reverse my thinking on this. And I'd love to be wrong.
I would love to be incorrect about my feeling on this,
but just feeling about who's involved, what we're learning about it,
what the backgrounds of these folks usually are, and how
they operate. I don't get a great sense that there's
this big light at the end of the tunnel for
twenty twenty six, maybe not even twenty twenty seven, and
(11:15):
maybe not even twenty twenty eight. You can hit the
bratch on Brian Cafe in text line six four six
eighty six with your reaction there. Like I said, you
can hit me at Guardzi on social media Twitter or Instagram,
both work. We've got Kevin Sefer coming up at the
bottom of the hour. Don't forget Kevin Gorg about four
point thirty to talk about the Quinn Hughes era and
a bunch of stuff Minnesota wild related. Mace will be
in my face from five to six tonight. We're out
(11:36):
at six fifteen for Vikings programming. As well as the
Wild pregame show with Kevin Fallness coming up at six
forty five. When we come back, though the future of
the NBA may have arrived already, and unfortunately it does
not appear to be Anthony Edwards. I'll explain when we
come back.
Speaker 4 (11:53):
Yeah, welcome back to the Fancake Show edition of to
(12:33):
Bumber Guardsian for Barrero Today, the Tuesday regulars, Kevin Seffert
will join in studio about ten minutes from now.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
Glenn Mason, a Wednesday regular, will be coming in on
a Tuesday. Luigi lu Nani's going to join on Thursday.
This week, we're messing around with the week with everybody's schedules.
Kevin Gorg will give us a hockey fix around four thirty.
We will talk about the Quinn Hughes era. We will
talk about goaltending with the former state championship goaltender from Burnsville,
Kevin Gorg.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
An hour and change from now.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
There's been kind of a silly debate over the last
few years, and it's certainly talkable and it's something that
everybody likes to have an opinion on. When Lebron James
and Steph Curry and who else would be in that mix,
Kevin Durant when they eventually retire, and it's going to
be sooner rather than later. Certainly with Lebron, who's I
think in season twenty two or twenty three something like that,
(13:24):
you know, in his near forties, when they set sail
and they head out and they finally call it a career.
Speaker 2 (13:31):
Who's going to be the next face of the NBA.
Speaker 3 (13:35):
And it's one of those conversations that's fun, pretty harmless,
and pretty meaningless at the end of the day, because
there's going to be a handful that take it into
the next generation.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
I think that's pretty clear.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
But a name that comes up all the time is
Anthony Edwards and it makes sense, and certainly in terms
of Americans, he's probably the best American born basketball player
right now when you factor in the last handful of
MVPs have all come from somewhere else, whether it's Canada
with Sga, Serbia with Jokic, obviously Lucas going to be
(14:08):
in that mix, Giannis Grease. It's become a very international
game and everybody's looking for the next great American and
they're looking for the next face of the NBA, and
Antis said, I don't have a lot of interest in that.
I don't believe him. I think he wants all the smoke,
which is why I love Anthony Edwards. But I think
the conversation has been rendered a little bit irrelevant and
(14:28):
a little bit moot, because the next phase of the NBA,
I think, is already here. And he plays tonight in
the NBA Cup Championship game against the New York Knicks.
He plays for the San Antonio Spurs Davy and his
name is Victor Webbin Yama. And like the guys I
just mentioned, he's not one of us. He's not American.
He as we know, he's from France. And if you
(14:49):
want to further the conversation, when the Olympic Games comes
around here in twenty twenty eight and goes to Los Angeles,
I think France is going to be the favorite to
win the gold medal. I think they are loaded for
bear and Wemby's going to be like twenty two years
old and ready to take over everything.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
And if you watch the game the other.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
Night against the Oklahoma City thunder watch how we played,
Watch how we acted, listen to what he said after
the game. Wemby's here and it's a scary thought to
think about because we've often talked about the Wilds road
to a Stanley Cup and what they did this year
to shake things up to compete just in their division.
(15:26):
When you think about Colorado and Dallas as two of
the best teams in the National Hockey League, the two
teams that right now are pretty much dominating the NHL,
it's scary to think that you're going to have to
go through those teams to try to get where you
want to get to even to get into the second round.
The way that the NHL works, I think we've got
a similar scary proposition when it comes to the National
(15:48):
Basketball Association. We know about the Thunder. They're unbelievable. That
was their second loss the other night. They're twenty four
and two, that had a sixteen game win streak. They've
got a bunch of really good young players. Have to
make some financial decisions here in the next couple of years,
but they've got like fifty draft picks, including maybe three
lottery picks in a very loaded twenty twenty six. As
the experts say NBA draft class next season, they're going
(16:11):
to be a problem essentially for a decade. Unless a
bunch of things go dramatically wrong, and it doesn't appear
that there's any indication that's going to happen. I think
the Spurs have entered the chat, and I think Wemby
has entered it in a big way. And if everyone's
being honest, this is happening way sooner than I think
anybody thought it would In his second year.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
He just missed a bunch of time with an injury.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
And that is the one asterisk when you talk about
a guy who's seven foot four, seven foot.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
Five, whatever. He is big guys.
Speaker 3 (16:40):
When they get hurt, especially with their feet or their
lower body, things can go pair shaped. But he comes back,
only plays twenty one minutes, but if you watched it,
he was essentially the reason that they won the game.
After hanging with OKC for the entire fourth quarter, he
hits the big shot over Caruso talk it's a ton
of you know what to them, and then continued the
(17:03):
conversation after and I loved it for a bunch of reasons.
Everybody knows how I feel about the thunder. If you don't,
you can just podcast one of the shows from last
week where Dan and I argued about it. I respect
big time how they go about their business every single night.
You never have to question effort there. They never you
never hear them say things that you've heard the Wolves say.
(17:24):
We just don't want to play these games, like aunt seth.
We just want to fast forward to the postseason and
see what happens there. It's like, we don't realize we
need to show up every night. The Thunder don't have
to worry about that. And Sga, to his credit, kind
of leads that charge and says, I'm not thinking about
beating the Warriors record or the Bulls record, or setting
the record for wins, whatever it is. I'm not even
(17:44):
thinking about winning a second championship. I'm worried about the
next game. That is all commendable. I respect the hell
out of them for all of that, but I don't like.
I don't like how they play and what I love
about when Bin Yama is not only is it obvious
he doesn't like how they play, like a lot of
players do don't and a lot of teams don't, Wolves included,
but he said something about it, and he was pretty
(18:07):
frontal about it. And I know Jalen Williams from the
Thunder thought he was being a little subliminal.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
I don't think so.
Speaker 3 (18:13):
When he says after the game, we're about to embark
on something that's pure and great and he calls it
ethical basketball, I could have kissed him. It was great,
and not just because I agree with him on whatever
he thinks about the Thunder. I like the fact that
he's not backing down from the smoke. I like the
fact that he's running into the fire because I do
(18:34):
think there is a little bit of a resignation, and
some of it might be exasperation with how the Thunder
seemed to get to play the way that they play
with the fouling all the time, and then we know
about the SGA stuff, and I'm sure that gets frustrating.
We can see it on the Timberwolves when they play
the Thunder and the Thunder are going to be here
on Friday night eight thirty. It's frustrating, and I'm guessing
(18:56):
at times it's annoying, and I love that when Bin
Yama is here for all of it. And he was
asked about it again today to kind of clarify the
ethical basketball statement, and he did back off a little
bit and tried to make it a little bit more
about how the Spurs play in terms of moving the
ball and less isolation and everything that comes with that.
(19:18):
But so I'm a little disappointed in Wemby that way,
but I love the fact that he's going after him
and he's not backing down, and it's clear he has
no respect for chet Holmgren, the local kid, has no
respect for him as a guy. The way that he
sent the shot back, the way that he screamed when
Holmgren missed a free throw. I think this is going
to be something really fascinating to watch, And as a
(19:41):
Wolves fan, it's scary because they have a lot of
the same attributes as Oklahoma City. When you think about
young players, assets, draft picks. Castle's obviously very good, Dylan
Harper a lottery pick, very good. They made the trade
for the guard that I coveted probably more than anybody.
Dearon Fox a year ago. I loved de Aaron Fox.
He's fitting in beautifully on that team. It's a scary
(20:03):
proposition when you're trying to figure out how your team
is going to beat that team for potential championships down
the road. And as much as I love what the
Wolves have done the last few years, they're going to
have to come to a reckoning with that. And what's
going to be fascinating is does Tim Conley go Tim
Conley on it and make another big swing here at
(20:24):
some point, whether it's this year or in the very
near future, because these guys are.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
Only beginning and wembin Yama is only.
Speaker 3 (20:31):
Beginning, and for the Timberwolves, for USA basketball. When you
think about the Olympics, it's a pretty scary situation. But
in terms of the Oklahoma City stuff, I love it.
I love that he's all about that. I love that
he was going after those guys. I love that he
wasn't backing down on the court, off the court. I
love all of it, and I would if i'm if
(20:53):
I'm if I'm picking the NBA Cup tonight, I'm picking
the Spurs over the Knicks, a game which you can
watch on Amazon Prime.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
Should be cool.
Speaker 3 (21:00):
Hit the bratch on Brian kfan text line six four
six eighty six on that also tweet me at guards
you when we come back.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
We'll shift to Vikings. Kevin Seaffert will join.
Speaker 3 (21:08):
Among the topics for him, is there a JJ and
KOC schism and do they have a decision to make
a wide receiver that we may never have seen coming.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
All of that was seafer when we can.
Speaker 3 (21:18):
Doe Tuesday right around three thirty, bumper to bumper Guardsian
(21:49):
for Barrero. Why is the time matter because it's Kevin
Seaffert time around three thirty sometimes four. ESPN's own joins us,
usually in studio. I don't shame you if you don't
come in studio like regular hostess. I understand you have
other obligations, but I appreciate that you came in anything for.
Speaker 2 (22:04):
You and happy to do it.
Speaker 5 (22:05):
There's some people that I won't make the effort that
I made today for it.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
No snonami today to.
Speaker 5 (22:10):
Deal with no no, no, no late access schedule at
the Viking, so happy to be here.
Speaker 3 (22:16):
Do you have empathy for high school concession stand workers
now that you've been through the meat grinder at our
local high school's varsity game?
Speaker 2 (22:26):
When was that last Thursday night?
Speaker 5 (22:28):
Yes, you know, I've done those before, but this I
think maybe the game was not quite as competitive. So
a lot of the especially a lot of the kids
were looking for other things to do that were in
otherwise would have been enraptured by the game. Yeah, and
so we had a steady flow and I may or
may not have been dripping with sweat by the end
of it.
Speaker 2 (22:47):
Can confirm yes, you needed a recovery period.
Speaker 5 (22:49):
We am Your poor daughter came asking for popcorn, and
we weren't like we were running the popcorn machine the
entire time, and we could never keep up with all
the popcorn requests.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
It's good popcorn, it's great popcorn. I was bitter.
Speaker 5 (23:00):
You're out of pretzels. Yeah, I love there's a limited supply.
Get there early for the pretzels. For the people who
were listening, Well, you're right, we were hanging on for
dear life. All of our kids were in the back
gym plane you can do that too.
Speaker 3 (23:12):
We just threw them in the back gym and then
Jillian wanted some popcorn, so we went to popcorn. Did
you guys notice that I spilled the nacho cheese all
over the front counter or did I do a good
job of cleaning that up immediately upon getting the nachos?
I pure progression to my way from pretzel to nachos.
Speaker 2 (23:28):
Well there most of that.
Speaker 5 (23:29):
You were probably the oldest person that came up to
the concession stand over the course of that two hours,
so we were dealing with a lot of kids that
were likely candidates to spill stuff or not make it
out of there without some sort of incident. So I
didn't notice it was you who had done it.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
No, and well, when I asked you for napkins, that
was why I thought I was one of the kids.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
No, that was for me.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
It was for the adult. There's just immediate and the cheese.
You know nothing better.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
Did we give you more cheese to replace it or no?
I didn't want to ask plenty. Well, you were laboring
back there.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
I didn't want to have to come back to me
if you were laboring for the long line.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
I didn't want to have to make an incident out
But it.
Speaker 5 (24:07):
Would have been bad if we had run out of
cheese because you needed a replacement.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
Exactly.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
I feel like I made the mess myself. I shouldn't
bother you with it. But thank you for the service.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
It was great.
Speaker 3 (24:17):
Yeah, you offered her fresh popcorn, said we got a
fresh batch.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
Come up.
Speaker 3 (24:20):
I actually wanted to just get the hell out of
there and get back to the game, but she wanted
the fresh popcorn.
Speaker 2 (24:24):
We took care of it. Appreciate it. All right.
Speaker 3 (24:26):
If you have questions for Seafert, Bradshawn, Brian Campe in
texta line is six four six eight six, you can
tweet me at guardsy as well. He'll be hanging out
for a while. Kevin Gorg about an hour from now.
What has clicked? I call him the young quarterback because
that's what Kevin O'Connell calls him, the young quarterbacks. Not
just a quarterback, He's the young quarterback. JJ McCarthy. Two games,
pretty good performances back to back. What has been the
(24:46):
difference a couple of things we had.
Speaker 5 (24:49):
I think it's only fair to acknowledge the external bit
of it, which is, I would not say Washington's defense
nor the Cowboys defense have been ranked amongst the top
schemes in the in the in the NFL. And so
if we're gonna if we're gonna know, as we should
have that he played some of his worst games against
(25:10):
really good defenses like the Packers and the Falcons earlier
this year, then we should acknowledge that when he plays
well against a bad defense, that that's part of the circumstances.
But I do think there's something you know he he
whether it was Kevin O'Connell saying a couple of weeks ago, like,
let's just drop this whole mechanics conversation, thank god, at
(25:33):
least publicly. I think the public part of it, you know,
had an impact. I remember asking, uh JJ McCarthy, you know,
to what extent has this whole conversation, uh, you know
held you, not held you back, but impacted you. And
he said something along the lines of, you know, you're
not going to change your swing on the twelfth on
the twelfth hole of golf course. And so I took
(25:56):
that to mean like it's like, just got to get
through it, and then after the round is over, then
you then you figure out what you need to change
in terms of your swing, or you go to the
driving range. And so I think there has there clearly
seems to have been an effect. And Kevin O'Connell calls
it the quieted mind. But he seems to be playing
(26:16):
like he just doesn't look like he's as frenetic as
he was. He seems to have a lot, just a
lot more fluidity to the basic parts of playing football
at that position, the drop back, the you know, surveying
the field, the actual physical execution of the throw, it
just doesn't look as frenetic. And some of it is
that he hasn't you know, that he's gotten great pass
(26:37):
protection slash, he hasn't faced you know, a ton of pressure.
But even when he wasn't facing pressure in earlier games,
he was creating it for himself in some cases.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
And so there's there's all those things.
Speaker 5 (26:51):
And there's also like the idea that the first six
starts of your career are probably not going to be
the best six starts, and that nobody was surprised.
Speaker 2 (27:00):
I don't.
Speaker 5 (27:00):
I would have been surprised if you told him them
before the season that the young quarterback would struggle, because
young quarterbacks often do. The concern was the degree to
which he was struggling, and that it was relatively historic
in this in this era in terms of people in
their first six starts, and even if he made a
(27:21):
big jump, like would that jump be from historically bad
to you know, still below average? And so he's been
he's made a bigger jump in terms of performance than
just that, and so that has I think reassured at
least some people that this isn't gonna be like the
all time bust of busts, Right, this isn't the JaMarcus
Russell situation that they're dealing with. But and so I
(27:42):
think that's those are some of the things I you know,
I don't. I still think that they work on mechanics
and they work on technique, but just the the public,
I think the public focus on it being removed, you know,
I think has had some level of effect on on
JJ's ability to just kind of, you know, run through
the offense. People have talked about it being you know, simplified,
(28:05):
and and you know, they stripped down a bunch of stuff,
and they had it is, but they had done that
prior to the cessation of Yeah, like there was they
had pulled some stuff out, and they were when they
had a leader, were tied running the ball more than.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
They usually do.
Speaker 5 (28:21):
And so some of the things that people are picking
up on now, I think we're underway prior to the
start of this. But in a nutshell, I'd say, in
an extended nutshell, I'd say, that's what's happened.
Speaker 2 (28:32):
When did when did they start stripping it down?
Speaker 5 (28:34):
Oh, I think it started prior to the concussion, you know.
I mean, the Green Bay game plan was run, run, run, run, run, run, run,
and then.
Speaker 2 (28:44):
That's still three weeks ago. Yeah, yeah, that's not very
long ago.
Speaker 5 (28:47):
No, but but where but that was before he started,
you know, playing better, you know, and so uh, it's
not I don't think that they got to the Washington
game and suddenly and the and their game plan for
that game was dramatic different than what it was in
Green Bay. They had a different opponent, and they had
you know, he had he had a different offensive line
(29:08):
as well that Ryan Kelly was back, and so he
was playing with all five of his offensive linemen and
so a combination of things there. But I but you know,
there there's no doubt that if you were to compare
the offense to what they're trying to do now, and
you know in the heyday of Sam Darnold downfield or
Kirk Cousins downfield, it doesn't necessarily compare. But I do
think that those those changes were underway before the statistical
(29:32):
improvement that McCarthy has shown.
Speaker 3 (29:34):
I know, nobody wants to go back to the international trips,
you in particular, and O'Connell for sure.
Speaker 2 (29:41):
I'm thrilled that I was. I went, I'm just glad
I'm home.
Speaker 3 (29:43):
Yeah, and everybody was. It was grading on everybody. It's
is what it sounded like at the end. You've talked
about that with Dan. But to go back to the
rhetoric part of it, I remember listening to that when
they when he when koc was talking about what JJ
McCarthy was doing on the practice field. I remember going,
does that make any sense to anybody like that? We're
really focusing on like he's got he's about to go
play and you can't be thinking about all these things
(30:06):
base balanced body posture, feet and eyes the analogy. JJ's right,
But I guess I'm wondering why did they think they
could do.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
It that way?
Speaker 3 (30:14):
Because that the conversation we're having now, the way I've
said it is, I wish we were having this conversation
when it was seventy five degrees in sunny, not just
because it's cold in Minnesota now, but it means it's
like August or September and there's still a season to
potentially build upon.
Speaker 5 (30:28):
Yeah, I think I don't think you know, you said
it was during the International Games that he started you
started noticing and picking up on him talking about it.
That's not when they started focusing on it though, Like
it had been a focus. Yeah, you know, the whole
offseason and maybe even going back to before his knee
injury last summer into the spring through training camp, and
(30:54):
I think there was probably some you know, acknowledgment slash
frustration slash apps avation that it hadn't really stuck.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
And so.
Speaker 5 (31:05):
I don't know if they anticipated it would be as
difficult of a of a job as it turned out
to be. Like people are like think that you can't
change a guy's mechanics, Well, it happens pretty frequently on
some level. Like you've seen guys like like go, look
at the way Aaron Rodgers threw the ball at Cal
and watch how he throws it now, like maybe that
(31:26):
was part him. Maybe that was Mike McCarthy when he
first got there, but he like his his throwing motion
for example. I don't and this is not even what
we're talking about with JJ in terms of his mechanics.
But but it's not uncommon for at the NFL level
for people to change mechanics J.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
Yeah, and so.
Speaker 5 (31:46):
And sometimes it's as simple as some teams like when
you're in shotgun to have one foot in front of
the other. Some say, you know, it's put your left
foot up in your right foot back. Some want it
to be balanced. Tom Brady as talked about these things.
So it's sometimes it's something as small as that, and
sometimes it's as big as you know, the position that
(32:08):
your shoulders are in, or the you know, the other
those other things. And I think what they were identifying
was that some some throws were not being executed primarily
because these combination of mechanics were causing it. And so
it was early enough in the season to not just
give up on it. I don't know if they anticipated
it would not really stick, and so the public part
(32:29):
of it probably was, you know, you could you could
maybe conjecture that this was to put them on blast
and basically say, I think I've talked to Dan about
this and say, like, you know, it's not working. You've
seen coaches do this before, and I don't know if
Kevin O'Connell had, but you know it's not working privately,
(32:50):
so let's see if we can raise the ante and
make sure he understands how important this is. You know,
it could be you know, there's there's lots of different
like explanations swirling through the NFL why this would come up.
I think it was just Kevin O'Connell answered, answering the
questions and you know, going into a fair bit of
(33:11):
detail because that's this whole world is a quarterback then.
Speaker 2 (33:14):
And you guys pulled it the thread surgically.
Speaker 5 (33:16):
Yeah, And you guys we always play you know, we
play a role and they play a role. And it
became a conversation the same way that the pure progression
stuff became a conversation last week. And I actually liked
that conversation and I want more of those conversations to
over the It's yeah, it's yeah. It just feels more
substantive and more relevant than you know them. I for
(33:37):
the shot that you took it as earlier today, yeah,
or that who's going to be the m v P
or like you know, which which coach is going to
be the first one fired?
Speaker 2 (33:45):
You know, like there's and that's there's not.
Speaker 5 (33:46):
It's not to say those conversations don't also have a
place in this world, but I personally like that, and
so I you know why they thought that they could
change his mechanics in the middle of the season.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
I think it was.
Speaker 5 (34:00):
Just the continuing a process that began behind the scenes
without a lot of public discussion long before that.
Speaker 3 (34:06):
How hard in miles per hour does he throw some
of these passes? Do we have that analytic because there
are some there's some high heat being out there, especially
when he's feeling it, which I actually think is good.
Like he's got to dial it back obviously, but I
like when he's confident and he's zipping it around.
Speaker 5 (34:20):
Yeah, there's a time and a place for that, Like
ideally that would manifest, like when he's confident and excited
and competitive, that manifests, and just the quick the quickness
of getting rid of the ball and the decisiveness and
so there's just there's just some times when you know, mean,
Justin Jefferson is a great receiver.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
TJ.
Speaker 5 (34:38):
Hockinson has great hands. Yeah, Jordan Addison over the years
has had pretty darn good hands. And so when you
see them not catch a pass like you can go
and one in two directions, is it because they lost
concentration or they're not their hands aren't as good anymore,
or they suddenly forgot how to you know, the fundamentals
of catching a ball, or even though it hit their hands,
(35:01):
was there something about the timing of it?
Speaker 2 (35:05):
Was it thrown before.
Speaker 5 (35:06):
They had a chance to adjust or is it coming
in too hot? You know, that doesn't mean that they
still shouldn't catch it at this level, but you have
to ask yourself, why are these passes? Why are people
who don't normally drop passes dropping passes or being unable
to come up with them? And you know, I think
some of that is is just the speed that he
throws the ball at all.
Speaker 2 (35:27):
Right, so you were in the room.
Speaker 3 (35:28):
How legit is the schism between KOC and JJ about.
Speaker 5 (35:32):
The gritty I don't know legitimately, Like I think that O'Connell,
you know, and Wes Phillips kind of clarified it today, like,
you know, they're young coaches and their hip in a
lot of ways. But but but they're still coaches, and
so you don't have to even have experienced a moment
(35:53):
where a guy spikes the ball before he crosses the
goal line, or he's involved in some kind of a
averate you know, uh taunt that event even doesn't wipe
the score off but causes a penalty, or they slow
down and somebody who runs a four to one forty
catches up and tackles them before they get to the
(36:13):
end zone, and they end up with a field goal,
so you don't have to experience one of those what
seems like an outlier but lives on for all in
all time and all the blooper lists and videos that
are out there to feel very strongly that start the
celebration after you cross the end zone. So I don't
think that, like you know, I don't. I don't think
(36:34):
it's a schis him. I thought the whole the most
interesting because I thought was very predictable response from O'Connell
and from West Phillips.
Speaker 2 (36:41):
The whole.
Speaker 5 (36:41):
The most more interesting part of it, frankly was that
JJ kind of, you know, I asked kind of what
I thought was a throwaway question about you plan that
you know, you know when you're gritty and this and that,
and he basically said, like they told he did it
in practice, they told him not to do it, but
because of who the kind of person he is, that
made him more enticed and he did it anyway, and
I'll get a minus. And like I I mean, that
(37:03):
was we love honest answers. We want people to not
you know, go into cliches, and we certainly don't want
people to to answer in ways that aren't truthful. It
was just a surprising thing to reveal that I went
against what my coach has told me. And you wondered, like,
what you know, is he just being a goofball and
(37:25):
because he's a goofball and saying that, or was there
like a message being sent.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
I don't.
Speaker 5 (37:32):
I'm not aware of any like big thing between them,
but it was. It was definitely jarring for him to
say that. I mean, it's not his first game, and
it's not his first postgame interview. Like he he You
could say he's young, and you could say he's inexperience,
but when you're the quarterback at Michigan, you're you're in
public a lot, and so I don't think that he
has any misunderstanding of what it means when you say
(37:53):
things in public. And so it was just surprising. And again,
like I as you know, just a human being. I
prefer people being honest and and giving their true answers
and and not feeling like they have to be guarded
about everything they say. It was just an unusually direct response.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
I liked how Koc said, I want to see that
forty time he tells us about That's like a good
gentle like ko scolding.
Speaker 2 (38:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (38:17):
Yeah, the second time, he's kind of said because the
nine stuff irked him, it seemed like as well, right, yeah.
Speaker 5 (38:21):
He said, uh and he and and that was on
the last Tuesday with PAP on their YouTube slash VN
slash kfan collaboration a lot of platforms, Yes, there are,
and and he you know, he left them kind of
left himself, you know, open. And so if that's really,
if the nine thing really is who you are, then
(38:42):
embrace it. But if it's not, and you're just kind
of creating a character, basically, let's let's let's hold off
on that. So I didn't take that, so it didn't
qualify it really as a direct shot, and neither did
the forty thing. And and that felt like a reference
to like an insect, almost like an insight joke between
them that we were not privileged to.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
But yeah, and.
Speaker 5 (39:06):
When a season is like this, a lot of us
can sit there and try to pick apart every word
and every exchange and wonder if it's what it means
and what it doesn't mean. And they're still getting to
know each other and still getting to know what their
relationship can be and will be. But there's there's more
than just a few sort of breadcrumbs there that suggest
(39:29):
that this that the on field struggles have not the
struggles have not been limited to on field, and that
there's still a lot a lot to be built behind
the scenes as well. This is not recency bias for
my question.
Speaker 3 (39:45):
Because I've been a big I still can't call them
speedy because I don't have a good vibe with them.
Speaker 2 (39:49):
I'm gonna call hm Jalen Nailer.
Speaker 3 (39:50):
Sure they can call him speedy with the two touchdowns
from this last Sunday's game against the Cowboys. But part
of the reason why Adam Thielen is in Pittsburgh right
now playing with Aaron Rodgers is because Jalen Naylor, I think,
has emerged as a legit wide receiver.
Speaker 2 (40:04):
He's a free agent at the end of the year.
Speaker 3 (40:06):
I heard gustling with Pa and Nordo today talking about
that and that someone's probably going to come in and
pay this guy. I'm wondering, is there a world, speaking
of schisms and things that have happened on and off
the field, where they say we like Jalen Naylor more
than Jordan.
Speaker 5 (40:22):
Addison long term, you're reading my mind. I'm going to
potentially write about that potentially. I love it, And so
you have to tune in.
Speaker 3 (40:30):
No, I think you do one of those short videos
so I don't have to read it all forty.
Speaker 5 (40:33):
Five seconds as much a video as much better than
a six hundred and fifty lad story in the day
of this day and age.
Speaker 2 (40:40):
But I think it's a legit conversation.
Speaker 5 (40:42):
It's a conversation, you know, and you could and there's
a lot of tentacles to it because I think if
you took if you only did on field, I think
you won't find too many people who would pick Jalen
Naylor over Jordan Addison.
Speaker 2 (40:56):
I would probably agree if we're just talking.
Speaker 5 (40:58):
I mean, and it's not an in all to Jalen,
like Jordan's is really said this from the moment he
got here, like there's another level to him. Yes, still
really hasn't totally been unlocked.
Speaker 3 (41:10):
But and that's probably why Naylor's getting opportunities, right because
you've got Justin, You've got Jordan. Yeah, yeah, so Naylor
is you know, a lot's come in his way probably
because of that.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
I'm not immune to.
Speaker 5 (41:20):
That, yeah yeah, And so and then you get to
the off field and you say, has the off field
for Jordan Addison been troubling or has it just been weird?
And like, frankly, how do you decide and what's and
does it matter? And if there's a difference, does it matter?
Because ultimately, what you're worried about is players not being
available to you because of the NFL policies when you
(41:45):
run into off field trouble.
Speaker 2 (41:47):
And so.
Speaker 5 (41:49):
I have never ever since that the Vikings were truly
concerned about Jordan Addison off the field in ways that
would make them alter the way that they think about
his future. Okay, but his off the field issues maybe
would make them a little less hesitant to you know,
(42:10):
on a financial level, like how much do you commit
and how much do you wait?
Speaker 2 (42:15):
They could, they could.
Speaker 5 (42:16):
I mean, he's eligible for contract extension after the season.
I thought, so this is year three, So the first
year you can get a deal is after you're done
with your third year, and so he could get one
now and you might be able to get a deal,
some level of a deal, you know, compared to what
Jalen Naylor might get when he's a total free agent
on the open market, or you might just wait and
(42:40):
just pay him, you know, pick up his fifty year
option if you want to, and for the next two
years just kind of pay him year to year and
then decide after that, and it might cost you more.
You might your caution might be rewarded in that situation,
But I I have not sense that there's a really
(43:02):
deep argument in terms of what direction they should go in.
It's kind of a bummer because they've not drafted really well.
You're the guy, and like he's the one of them,
one of the people, like I mean of that twenty
twenty two draft, especially who like has been a hit,
you know, and they hit on him that to get
to be in a position where your third receiver and
(43:26):
had the quarterback situation been more reliable this year, his
numbers will be much much better. I mean, not that
I'm all twenty two guy, but you don't have to
be an all twenty two guy to look at plays
from the bigger angle and see how often he's open,
frankly and so, but to have that be a six
round pick is you know, impressive, and that they should
(43:48):
be lauded for that as much as we rip them
for all the picks that haven't worked out. And so
it's it's a good conversation. It's a smart conversation. I
don't think the answer is like one hundred percent to
zero percent. But I don't think that. I don't sense
that the Vikings have viewed Jordan Addison off the field
(44:09):
issues as being serious enough to fundamentally change the fact
that he was their first round pick, and he's been
and he's really good and and could continue to pair
with at least for the next two years.
Speaker 2 (44:20):
With Justin, I.
Speaker 3 (44:22):
Would be very nervous. I'd be very when you miss
a walk through in London. From what I'm told, it was,
you know, kind of a hard place to get lost in.
Speaker 5 (44:30):
I mean you have to work to you have to
work to get away from the team, Yes, because there
was nothing around it.
Speaker 3 (44:35):
Yeah, that makes me a little bit nervous. But while
I look forward to reading that story, I'm glad that
we're on the same page. That makes me feel better
that I'm not just thinking about weird things off the top.
Speaker 2 (44:43):
Of my head. No, completely legitcase. He's had a great season.
Speaker 3 (44:46):
I mean, you think about the fourth down catch he
had against Detroit, Right, he's obviously at some touchdown he's
doesn't drop.
Speaker 2 (44:52):
Going back to last year, when Jordan Adison was hurt,
he was really good.
Speaker 3 (44:55):
I think he's been a really nice find and like
we've seen before, you know, sometimes those are the guys
that you lose and you have to be okay with it.
You can't keep everybody, but that'd be a tough one
to lose, because I think he's been really good.
Speaker 2 (45:06):
Yeah, just getting going with Seafert if you have questions
for him.
Speaker 3 (45:08):
Six four six eight six A is the Brat Shawn
Brian Kfe and text line Jonathan Gernard koc announced is
out for the year with his injury. They're going to
clean all of that up and he's going to be
shut down for the remaining three games, which means it's
time for an extended look at Dallas Turner. We'll get
Seaffert's thoughts on that and much more when we continue
I love my life. That's says I lost my life.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Welcome in bit a minute.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
It is the Cake Show edition of to Bumper guards
Ian for Dan the next couple of days.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
Dan, we'll be back on Thursday.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
We were here until six fifteen tonight because we've got
Vikings programming to get in and then the Minnesota while
back in action against the Washington Capitals Game two of
the Quinn Hughes Era tonight at Grand Casino Arena. To
help us with that, my buddy Kevin Gorg is going
to join right around four thirty. He's on the guest
lineup today. Mace in your Face will join at five o'clock.
He needed to switch from Wednesday to Tuesday. Works out
(02:11):
well for me. There's a ton of stuff I want
to get into with Mace. He was in studio last
week when the Sharon Moore Michigan meltdown happened and first broke,
so I know there was some instant reaction from Mace there.
Now there's a lot more to the story and the
story after the story, who replaces Sharon Moore at Michigan.
There's a lot to get into there, and I'm looking
(02:31):
forward as a guy who's been through a coaching search
or two when he was the coach. What's going on
right now in places like Arizona State. What's going on
right now in Alabama or Washington or Dinky Town in
terms of jostling for the next Michigan head coaching job.
Mace at five o'clock and Kevin Seaffert, because it's Tuesday,
he will join right around three point thirty. And we
(02:53):
believe mister Seffert from ESPN is coming in studio. Devin
Ward is here with me for the first hour. Kara Savage,
we'll check in right around four. The Brad Shawn Brian
Kampean text line, as always is six four six eight six.
You can text anything and anything at any time. Also
hit me at Guardzi. On social media, Twitter's good, Instagram's good.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
It's all there for you.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
Want to start, though, with a little bit of breaking
news or speculation, at least a development in the Twins
ownership story. Aaron Gleaman tweeted it out he had some
work to do with Dan Hayes, his partner at the
Athletic today, we're finally getting a little bit more information
about the minority owners the ones we've been waiting for
since the day that we learned the pole Ad family
was taking the team off the market. These mysterious minority
(03:37):
owners apparently are surfacing and they're apparently close to that
partial sale that in a big sense, will give the
team and give the current ownership group a fresh start financially.
It's described as quote a significant manner in terms of
cleaning up the club's finances and could set the stage
(03:57):
for a more lucrative deal in the future. And we'll
foreshadow to that a more lucrative sale in the future.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
The Nuts and Bolts as we know them.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
They're selling twenty percent of the franchise to three different
minority partnerships groups. The one point seventy five billion is
the valuation. You may recall that I think it was
the Tampa Bay Rays that sold for one five The
Twins I think could have sold for one to five.
They thought they were worth a little bit more than that,
and they had the five hundred million dollars in debt
that they were trying to work themselves out of, and
(04:28):
so they ended up taking it off the market. And
it appears that these three minority partnership groups are going
to help a lot with that here's the paragraph finalize
the transaction that helps a club five hundred million dollars
in debt return to sound financial footing while also requiring
the addition of three seats to the team's ownership advisory board.
That according to league sources telling The Athletic, basically, it
(04:52):
appears that the debt appears to be going away. There's
no disputing that they have been losing a bunch of money,
and it makes sense why, and that's outlined in the story.
They have a great season in twenty nineteen, believe that
was the Dong Show squad that went into Don Tober
that ended up losing to the Yankees, and they never
really got a chance to capitalize on that because what
happened in twenty twenty something called the COVID nineteen coronavirus
(05:15):
pandemic where fans were not allowed to come. They lost
a bunch of money. The story outlines how they didn't
lay anybody off. They continued to pay minor league players
some things that other organizations did not do that may
have contributed to them being in a precarious financial situation.
So that's how it all started. But we know why
it all continued was as Rock Obaldelli would say and
(05:38):
said many.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Times, we know it's not good baseball.
Speaker 3 (05:41):
They haven't had very good teams the last couple of years,
and people haven't been showing up to target field, and
the money continued to hemorrhage. But we're learning more about
who these people are, and this is where I think
it gets interesting, because they are described one of the
groups as New York bankers, another group is one of
us there Minnesota based, and then there's a third group
(06:03):
that apparently is a bunch of different limited partners who
just wanted to purchase small chunks of an MLB franchise.
And we're apparently involved in this thing as it was
going along the last couple of months. And as I'm
reading the story, there's quotes from anonymous sources and they're
obviously twin sources, so they're trying to paint it in
(06:23):
the most positive picture as they can that this is
all good news, and this is great and we're going
to be back on strong financial footing, and we're looking
at all different avenues now to improve the ball club,
and we're looking for fresh ideas. There's another pole ad
who's coming in with Joe. I think it's his older
brother Tom. So now we've got two pole Ads that
are going to have the seat at the table.
Speaker 2 (06:44):
And that all sounds.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
Good and it reads Rosie, and it probably is good
in the grand scheme of things, that the team is
getting back to somewhat solid financial footing where at least
they're not five hundred million dollars in debt anymore. But
one thing I do know about banks, banks like to
make money and the other thing I think to keep
(07:07):
banks healthy. One thing they can't do is lose money.
And I was texting around today just different people that
are loosely affiliated sources close to the situation, and I said,
does the story you read today does that leave you more.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
Cynical about what's going to happen with the twins?
Speaker 3 (07:25):
Or does it leave you more optimistic in the short
term about what's going to happen with the twins? And
somebody phrased it, I thought pretty succinctly, and I thought
made a good point because of who is jumping into
the team bankers, financial people, and we remember the pole
Ads got their start as bankers. If you want to
(07:45):
go all the way back to Carl, they don't like
to lose money. They're not interested in losing money, and
this source basically said, I think they're basically just wiping
debt off the books and then they'll run very low
payrolls to avoid losing money. And that's my biggest fear too.
We're getting back on secure financial footing and we're staying there.
(08:09):
That's what they're going to try to do here, which
means they're not interested in shelling out a bunch of cash.
Right now, they're not interested in selling shelling out a
bunch of cash.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
For the next couple of years.
Speaker 3 (08:20):
We're going to get through a labor deal that I
think is coming up in about two seasons. We're going
to try to get to the next TV contract phase,
which is I think twenty twenty nine. If it's not
twenty nine, is twenty eight, and then we'll see what happens.
And that's my biggest fear, and I'm pretty sure that's
what's going to happen, and that should be the fans'
(08:40):
biggest fear too, is that we're getting the cash infusion
that we needed to get us back on solid footing.
But once we do that, we're not going to be reckless.
We're not going to be aggressive. We're not going to
do anything that we haven't done the last handful of years.
We're going to be remarkably fiscally responsible. The other word
for that could be cheap, and I think we've all
(09:02):
kind of seen how that story goes. Doesn't mean that
they can't win, just means it's going to be really hard,
and they've got to be right on about nine other things.
When you're not willing to invest the financial resources and
you're not willing to take the big swings and the
big chances, you really have to be right. You've got
to be right on your traff picks. You've got to
be right on your trades. You've got to be right
on your value contracts. You've got to hope that aging
(09:23):
veterans that are coming in for one last stab at
glory overperform. That was actually part of the twenty nineteen team.
We want to talk about Nelson Cruz being a big
part of that. And that's where I think it's scary
if you're a Twins fan, because once more bankers get involved,
and in some cases, I don't know, maybe venture capital people,
maybe private equity people, I don't know exactly, when it's
(09:43):
just described as New York bankers. That can be very
loose interpretation. I think most of us are smart enough
to know what that means. Bankers don't like losing money.
They want to make money and when they invest in
something at this level. Part of the story talked about
how the twins are positioning themselves to be in a
good spot when all of these other things happen. The
(10:04):
labor deal happens, the TV contracts happen, and they might
be in a good spot when they want to sell again.
It feels like they're going to hold the asset, keep
the asset running cheaply, try not to lose money, and
then be much more positioned to sell something when all
of that comes to fruition and there's more certainty about
the television finances, there're more certainty about possible salary floors,
(10:27):
all the revenue sharing stuff that goes into CBAS.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
That's the scary part.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
And with pitchers and catchers reporting about two and a
half months from now, that's kind of where I'm left
with it. It's good that we've got info about what's going
on now, it's good that there's more money coming into
the team. But I think the good news kind of
stops there, and that's the unfortunate part. If you are
a baseball fan in this town, they will have to
do something remarkably out of character to get me to
(10:53):
reverse my thinking on this. And I'd love to be wrong.
I would love to be incorrect about my feeling on this,
but just feeling about who's involved, what we're learning about it,
what the backgrounds of these folks usually are, and how
they operate. I don't get a great sense that there's
this big light at the end of the tunnel for
twenty twenty six, maybe not even twenty twenty seven, and
(11:15):
maybe not even twenty twenty eight. You can hit the
bratch on Brian Cafe in text line six four six
eighty six with your reaction there. Like I said, you
can hit me at Guardzi on social media Twitter or Instagram,
both work. We've got Kevin Sefer coming up at the
bottom of the hour. Don't forget Kevin Gorg about four
point thirty to talk about the Quinn Hughes era and
a bunch of stuff Minnesota wild related. Mace will be
in my face from five to six tonight. We're out
(11:36):
at six fifteen for Vikings programming. As well as the
Wild pregame show with Kevin Fallness coming up at six
forty five. When we come back, though the future of
the NBA may have arrived already, and unfortunately it does
not appear to be Anthony Edwards. I'll explain when we
come back.
Speaker 4 (11:53):
Yeah, welcome back to the Fancake Show edition of to
(12:33):
Bumber Guardsian for Barrero Today, the Tuesday regulars, Kevin Seffert
will join in studio about ten minutes from now.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
Glenn Mason, a Wednesday regular, will be coming in on
a Tuesday. Luigi lu Nani's going to join on Thursday.
This week, we're messing around with the week with everybody's schedules.
Kevin Gorg will give us a hockey fix around four thirty.
We will talk about the Quinn Hughes era. We will
talk about goaltending with the former state championship goaltender from Burnsville,
Kevin Gorg.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
An hour and change from now.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
There's been kind of a silly debate over the last
few years, and it's certainly talkable and it's something that
everybody likes to have an opinion on. When Lebron James
and Steph Curry and who else would be in that mix,
Kevin Durant when they eventually retire, and it's going to
be sooner rather than later. Certainly with Lebron, who's I
think in season twenty two or twenty three something like that,
(13:24):
you know, in his near forties, when they set sail
and they head out and they finally call it a career.
Speaker 2 (13:31):
Who's going to be the next face of the NBA.
Speaker 3 (13:35):
And it's one of those conversations that's fun, pretty harmless,
and pretty meaningless at the end of the day, because
there's going to be a handful that take it into
the next generation.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
I think that's pretty clear.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
But a name that comes up all the time is
Anthony Edwards and it makes sense, and certainly in terms
of Americans, he's probably the best American born basketball player
right now when you factor in the last handful of
MVPs have all come from somewhere else, whether it's Canada
with Sga, Serbia with Jokic, obviously Lucas going to be
(14:08):
in that mix, Giannis Grease. It's become a very international
game and everybody's looking for the next great American and
they're looking for the next face of the NBA, and
Antis said, I don't have a lot of interest in that.
I don't believe him. I think he wants all the smoke,
which is why I love Anthony Edwards. But I think
the conversation has been rendered a little bit irrelevant and
(14:28):
a little bit moot, because the next phase of the NBA,
I think, is already here. And he plays tonight in
the NBA Cup Championship game against the New York Knicks.
He plays for the San Antonio Spurs Davy and his
name is Victor Webbin Yama. And like the guys I
just mentioned, he's not one of us. He's not American.
He as we know, he's from France. And if you
(14:49):
want to further the conversation, when the Olympic Games comes
around here in twenty twenty eight and goes to Los Angeles,
I think France is going to be the favorite to
win the gold medal. I think they are loaded for
bear and Wemby's going to be like twenty two years
old and ready to take over everything.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
And if you watch the game the other.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
Night against the Oklahoma City thunder watch how we played,
Watch how we acted, listen to what he said after
the game. Wemby's here and it's a scary thought to
think about because we've often talked about the Wilds road
to a Stanley Cup and what they did this year
to shake things up to compete just in their division.
(15:26):
When you think about Colorado and Dallas as two of
the best teams in the National Hockey League, the two
teams that right now are pretty much dominating the NHL,
it's scary to think that you're going to have to
go through those teams to try to get where you
want to get to even to get into the second round.
The way that the NHL works, I think we've got
a similar scary proposition when it comes to the National
(15:48):
Basketball Association. We know about the Thunder. They're unbelievable. That
was their second loss the other night. They're twenty four
and two, that had a sixteen game win streak. They've
got a bunch of really good young players. Have to
make some financial decisions here in the next couple of years,
but they've got like fifty draft picks, including maybe three
lottery picks in a very loaded twenty twenty six. As
the experts say NBA draft class next season, they're going
(16:11):
to be a problem essentially for a decade. Unless a
bunch of things go dramatically wrong, and it doesn't appear
that there's any indication that's going to happen. I think
the Spurs have entered the chat, and I think Wemby
has entered it in a big way. And if everyone's
being honest, this is happening way sooner than I think
anybody thought it would In his second year.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
He just missed a bunch of time with an injury.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
And that is the one asterisk when you talk about
a guy who's seven foot four, seven foot.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
Five, whatever. He is big guys.
Speaker 3 (16:40):
When they get hurt, especially with their feet or their
lower body, things can go pair shaped. But he comes back,
only plays twenty one minutes, but if you watched it,
he was essentially the reason that they won the game.
After hanging with OKC for the entire fourth quarter, he
hits the big shot over Caruso talk it's a ton
of you know what to them, and then continued the
(17:03):
conversation after and I loved it for a bunch of reasons.
Everybody knows how I feel about the thunder. If you don't,
you can just podcast one of the shows from last
week where Dan and I argued about it. I respect
big time how they go about their business every single night.
You never have to question effort there. They never you
never hear them say things that you've heard the Wolves say.
(17:24):
We just don't want to play these games, like aunt seth.
We just want to fast forward to the postseason and
see what happens there. It's like, we don't realize we
need to show up every night. The Thunder don't have
to worry about that. And Sga, to his credit, kind
of leads that charge and says, I'm not thinking about
beating the Warriors record or the Bulls record, or setting
the record for wins, whatever it is. I'm not even
(17:44):
thinking about winning a second championship. I'm worried about the
next game. That is all commendable. I respect the hell
out of them for all of that, but I don't like.
I don't like how they play and what I love
about when Bin Yama is not only is it obvious
he doesn't like how they play, like a lot of
players do don't and a lot of teams don't, Wolves included,
but he said something about it, and he was pretty
(18:07):
frontal about it. And I know Jalen Williams from the
Thunder thought he was being a little subliminal.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
I don't think so.
Speaker 3 (18:13):
When he says after the game, we're about to embark
on something that's pure and great and he calls it
ethical basketball, I could have kissed him. It was great,
and not just because I agree with him on whatever
he thinks about the Thunder. I like the fact that
he's not backing down from the smoke. I like the
fact that he's running into the fire because I do
(18:34):
think there is a little bit of a resignation, and
some of it might be exasperation with how the Thunder
seemed to get to play the way that they play
with the fouling all the time, and then we know
about the SGA stuff, and I'm sure that gets frustrating.
We can see it on the Timberwolves when they play
the Thunder and the Thunder are going to be here
on Friday night eight thirty. It's frustrating, and I'm guessing
(18:56):
at times it's annoying, and I love that when Bin
Yama is here for all of it. And he was
asked about it again today to kind of clarify the
ethical basketball statement, and he did back off a little
bit and tried to make it a little bit more
about how the Spurs play in terms of moving the
ball and less isolation and everything that comes with that.
(19:18):
But so I'm a little disappointed in Wemby that way,
but I love the fact that he's going after him
and he's not backing down, and it's clear he has
no respect for chet Holmgren, the local kid, has no
respect for him as a guy. The way that he
sent the shot back, the way that he screamed when
Holmgren missed a free throw. I think this is going
to be something really fascinating to watch, And as a
(19:41):
Wolves fan, it's scary because they have a lot of
the same attributes as Oklahoma City. When you think about
young players, assets, draft picks. Castle's obviously very good, Dylan
Harper a lottery pick, very good. They made the trade
for the guard that I coveted probably more than anybody.
Dearon Fox a year ago. I loved de Aaron Fox.
He's fitting in beautifully on that team. It's a scary
(20:03):
proposition when you're trying to figure out how your team
is going to beat that team for potential championships down
the road. And as much as I love what the
Wolves have done the last few years, they're going to
have to come to a reckoning with that. And what's
going to be fascinating is does Tim Conley go Tim
Conley on it and make another big swing here at
(20:24):
some point, whether it's this year or in the very
near future, because these guys are.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
Only beginning and wembin Yama is only.
Speaker 3 (20:31):
Beginning, and for the Timberwolves, for USA basketball. When you
think about the Olympics, it's a pretty scary situation. But
in terms of the Oklahoma City stuff, I love it.
I love that he's all about that. I love that
he was going after those guys. I love that he
wasn't backing down on the court, off the court. I
love all of it, and I would if i'm if
(20:53):
I'm if I'm picking the NBA Cup tonight, I'm picking
the Spurs over the Knicks, a game which you can
watch on Amazon Prime.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
Should be cool.
Speaker 3 (21:00):
Hit the bratch on Brian kfan text line six four
six eighty six on that also tweet me at guards
you when we come back.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
We'll shift to Vikings. Kevin Seaffert will join.
Speaker 3 (21:08):
Among the topics for him, is there a JJ and
KOC schism and do they have a decision to make
a wide receiver that we may never have seen coming.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
All of that was seafer when we can.
Speaker 3 (21:18):
Doe Tuesday right around three thirty, bumper to bumper Guardsian
(21:49):
for Barrero. Why is the time matter because it's Kevin
Seaffert time around three thirty sometimes four. ESPN's own joins us,
usually in studio. I don't shame you if you don't
come in studio like regular hostess. I understand you have
other obligations, but I appreciate that you came in anything for.
Speaker 2 (22:04):
You and happy to do it.
Speaker 5 (22:05):
There's some people that I won't make the effort that
I made today for it.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
No snonami today to.
Speaker 5 (22:10):
Deal with no no, no, no late access schedule at
the Viking, so happy to be here.
Speaker 3 (22:16):
Do you have empathy for high school concession stand workers
now that you've been through the meat grinder at our
local high school's varsity game?
Speaker 2 (22:26):
When was that last Thursday night?
Speaker 5 (22:28):
Yes, you know, I've done those before, but this I
think maybe the game was not quite as competitive. So
a lot of the especially a lot of the kids
were looking for other things to do that were in
otherwise would have been enraptured by the game. Yeah, and
so we had a steady flow and I may or
may not have been dripping with sweat by the end
of it.
Speaker 2 (22:47):
Can confirm yes, you needed a recovery period.
Speaker 5 (22:49):
We am Your poor daughter came asking for popcorn, and
we weren't like we were running the popcorn machine the
entire time, and we could never keep up with all
the popcorn requests.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
It's good popcorn, it's great popcorn. I was bitter.
Speaker 5 (23:00):
You're out of pretzels. Yeah, I love there's a limited supply.
Get there early for the pretzels. For the people who
were listening, Well, you're right, we were hanging on for
dear life. All of our kids were in the back
gym plane you can do that too.
Speaker 3 (23:12):
We just threw them in the back gym and then
Jillian wanted some popcorn, so we went to popcorn. Did
you guys notice that I spilled the nacho cheese all
over the front counter or did I do a good
job of cleaning that up immediately upon getting the nachos?
I pure progression to my way from pretzel to nachos.
Speaker 2 (23:28):
Well there most of that.
Speaker 5 (23:29):
You were probably the oldest person that came up to
the concession stand over the course of that two hours,
so we were dealing with a lot of kids that
were likely candidates to spill stuff or not make it
out of there without some sort of incident. So I
didn't notice it was you who had done it.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
No, and well, when I asked you for napkins, that
was why I thought I was one of the kids.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
No, that was for me.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
It was for the adult. There's just immediate and the cheese.
You know nothing better.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
Did we give you more cheese to replace it or no?
I didn't want to ask plenty. Well, you were laboring
back there.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
I didn't want to have to come back to me
if you were laboring for the long line.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
I didn't want to have to make an incident out
But it.
Speaker 5 (24:07):
Would have been bad if we had run out of
cheese because you needed a replacement.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
Exactly.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
I feel like I made the mess myself. I shouldn't
bother you with it. But thank you for the service.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
It was great.
Speaker 3 (24:17):
Yeah, you offered her fresh popcorn, said we got a
fresh batch.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
Come up.
Speaker 3 (24:20):
I actually wanted to just get the hell out of
there and get back to the game, but she wanted
the fresh popcorn.
Speaker 2 (24:24):
We took care of it. Appreciate it. All right.
Speaker 3 (24:26):
If you have questions for Seafert, Bradshawn, Brian Campe in
texta line is six four six eight six, you can
tweet me at guardsy as well. He'll be hanging out
for a while. Kevin Gorg about an hour from now.
What has clicked? I call him the young quarterback because
that's what Kevin O'Connell calls him, the young quarterbacks. Not
just a quarterback, He's the young quarterback. JJ McCarthy. Two games,
pretty good performances back to back. What has been the
(24:46):
difference a couple of things we had.
Speaker 5 (24:49):
I think it's only fair to acknowledge the external bit
of it, which is, I would not say Washington's defense
nor the Cowboys defense have been ranked amongst the top
schemes in the in the in the NFL. And so
if we're gonna if we're gonna know, as we should
have that he played some of his worst games against
(25:10):
really good defenses like the Packers and the Falcons earlier
this year, then we should acknowledge that when he plays
well against a bad defense, that that's part of the circumstances.
But I do think there's something you know he he
whether it was Kevin O'Connell saying a couple of weeks ago, like,
let's just drop this whole mechanics conversation, thank god, at
(25:33):
least publicly. I think the public part of it, you know,
had an impact. I remember asking, uh JJ McCarthy, you know,
to what extent has this whole conversation, uh, you know
held you, not held you back, but impacted you. And
he said something along the lines of, you know, you're
not going to change your swing on the twelfth on
the twelfth hole of golf course. And so I took
(25:56):
that to mean like it's like, just got to get
through it, and then after the round is over, then
you then you figure out what you need to change
in terms of your swing, or you go to the
driving range. And so I think there has there clearly
seems to have been an effect. And Kevin O'Connell calls
it the quieted mind. But he seems to be playing
(26:16):
like he just doesn't look like he's as frenetic as
he was. He seems to have a lot, just a
lot more fluidity to the basic parts of playing football
at that position, the drop back, the you know, surveying
the field, the actual physical execution of the throw, it
just doesn't look as frenetic. And some of it is
that he hasn't you know, that he's gotten great pass
(26:37):
protection slash, he hasn't faced you know, a ton of pressure.
But even when he wasn't facing pressure in earlier games,
he was creating it for himself in some cases.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
And so there's there's all those things.
Speaker 5 (26:51):
And there's also like the idea that the first six
starts of your career are probably not going to be
the best six starts, and that nobody was surprised.
Speaker 2 (27:00):
I don't.
Speaker 5 (27:00):
I would have been surprised if you told him them
before the season that the young quarterback would struggle, because
young quarterbacks often do. The concern was the degree to
which he was struggling, and that it was relatively historic
in this in this era in terms of people in
their first six starts, and even if he made a
(27:21):
big jump, like would that jump be from historically bad
to you know, still below average? And so he's been
he's made a bigger jump in terms of performance than
just that, and so that has I think reassured at
least some people that this isn't gonna be like the
all time bust of busts, Right, this isn't the JaMarcus
Russell situation that they're dealing with. But and so I
(27:42):
think that's those are some of the things I you know,
I don't. I still think that they work on mechanics
and they work on technique, but just the the public,
I think the public focus on it being removed, you know,
I think has had some level of effect on on
JJ's ability to just kind of, you know, run through
the offense. People have talked about it being you know, simplified,
(28:05):
and and you know, they stripped down a bunch of stuff,
and they had it is, but they had done that
prior to the cessation of Yeah, like there was they
had pulled some stuff out, and they were when they
had a leader, were tied running the ball more than.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
They usually do.
Speaker 5 (28:21):
And so some of the things that people are picking
up on now, I think we're underway prior to the
start of this. But in a nutshell, I'd say, in
an extended nutshell, I'd say, that's what's happened.
Speaker 2 (28:32):
When did when did they start stripping it down?
Speaker 5 (28:34):
Oh, I think it started prior to the concussion, you know.
I mean, the Green Bay game plan was run, run, run, run, run, run, run,
and then.
Speaker 2 (28:44):
That's still three weeks ago. Yeah, yeah, that's not very
long ago.
Speaker 5 (28:47):
No, but but where but that was before he started,
you know, playing better, you know, and so uh, it's
not I don't think that they got to the Washington
game and suddenly and the and their game plan for
that game was dramatic different than what it was in
Green Bay. They had a different opponent, and they had
you know, he had he had a different offensive line
(29:08):
as well that Ryan Kelly was back, and so he
was playing with all five of his offensive linemen and
so a combination of things there. But I but you know,
there there's no doubt that if you were to compare
the offense to what they're trying to do now, and
you know in the heyday of Sam Darnold downfield or
Kirk Cousins downfield, it doesn't necessarily compare. But I do
think that those those changes were underway before the statistical
(29:32):
improvement that McCarthy has shown.
Speaker 3 (29:34):
I know, nobody wants to go back to the international trips,
you in particular, and O'Connell for sure.
Speaker 2 (29:41):
I'm thrilled that I was. I went, I'm just glad
I'm home.
Speaker 3 (29:43):
Yeah, and everybody was. It was grading on everybody. It's
is what it sounded like at the end. You've talked
about that with Dan. But to go back to the
rhetoric part of it, I remember listening to that when
they when he when koc was talking about what JJ
McCarthy was doing on the practice field. I remember going,
does that make any sense to anybody like that? We're
really focusing on like he's got he's about to go
play and you can't be thinking about all these things
(30:06):
base balanced body posture, feet and eyes the analogy. JJ's right,
But I guess I'm wondering why did they think they
could do.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
It that way?
Speaker 3 (30:14):
Because that the conversation we're having now, the way I've
said it is, I wish we were having this conversation
when it was seventy five degrees in sunny, not just
because it's cold in Minnesota now, but it means it's
like August or September and there's still a season to
potentially build upon.
Speaker 5 (30:28):
Yeah, I think I don't think you know, you said
it was during the International Games that he started you
started noticing and picking up on him talking about it.
That's not when they started focusing on it though, Like
it had been a focus. Yeah, you know, the whole
offseason and maybe even going back to before his knee
injury last summer into the spring through training camp, and
(30:54):
I think there was probably some you know, acknowledgment slash
frustration slash apps avation that it hadn't really stuck.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
And so.
Speaker 5 (31:05):
I don't know if they anticipated it would be as
difficult of a of a job as it turned out
to be. Like people are like think that you can't
change a guy's mechanics, Well, it happens pretty frequently on
some level. Like you've seen guys like like go, look
at the way Aaron Rodgers threw the ball at Cal
and watch how he throws it now, like maybe that
(31:26):
was part him. Maybe that was Mike McCarthy when he
first got there, but he like his his throwing motion
for example. I don't and this is not even what
we're talking about with JJ in terms of his mechanics.
But but it's not uncommon for at the NFL level
for people to change mechanics J.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
Yeah, and so.
Speaker 5 (31:46):
And sometimes it's as simple as some teams like when
you're in shotgun to have one foot in front of
the other. Some say, you know, it's put your left
foot up in your right foot back. Some want it
to be balanced. Tom Brady as talked about these things.
So it's sometimes it's something as small as that, and
sometimes it's as big as you know, the position that
(32:08):
your shoulders are in, or the you know, the other
those other things. And I think what they were identifying
was that some some throws were not being executed primarily
because these combination of mechanics were causing it. And so
it was early enough in the season to not just
give up on it. I don't know if they anticipated
it would not really stick, and so the public part
(32:29):
of it probably was, you know, you could you could
maybe conjecture that this was to put them on blast
and basically say, I think I've talked to Dan about
this and say, like, you know, it's not working. You've
seen coaches do this before, and I don't know if
Kevin O'Connell had, but you know it's not working privately,
(32:50):
so let's see if we can raise the ante and
make sure he understands how important this is. You know,
it could be you know, there's there's lots of different
like explanations swirling through the NFL why this would come up.
I think it was just Kevin O'Connell answered, answering the
questions and you know, going into a fair bit of
(33:11):
detail because that's this whole world is a quarterback then.
Speaker 2 (33:14):
And you guys pulled it the thread surgically.
Speaker 5 (33:16):
Yeah, And you guys we always play you know, we
play a role and they play a role. And it
became a conversation the same way that the pure progression
stuff became a conversation last week. And I actually liked
that conversation and I want more of those conversations to
over the It's yeah, it's yeah. It just feels more
substantive and more relevant than you know them. I for
(33:37):
the shot that you took it as earlier today, yeah,
or that who's going to be the m v P
or like you know, which which coach is going to
be the first one fired?
Speaker 2 (33:45):
You know, like there's and that's there's not.
Speaker 5 (33:46):
It's not to say those conversations don't also have a
place in this world, but I personally like that, and
so I you know why they thought that they could
change his mechanics in the middle of the season.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
I think it was.
Speaker 5 (34:00):
Just the continuing a process that began behind the scenes
without a lot of public discussion long before that.
Speaker 3 (34:06):
How hard in miles per hour does he throw some
of these passes? Do we have that analytic because there
are some there's some high heat being out there, especially
when he's feeling it, which I actually think is good.
Like he's got to dial it back obviously, but I
like when he's confident and he's zipping it around.
Speaker 5 (34:20):
Yeah, there's a time and a place for that, Like
ideally that would manifest, like when he's confident and excited
and competitive, that manifests, and just the quick the quickness
of getting rid of the ball and the decisiveness and
so there's just there's just some times when you know, mean,
Justin Jefferson is a great receiver.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
TJ.
Speaker 5 (34:38):
Hockinson has great hands. Yeah, Jordan Addison over the years
has had pretty darn good hands. And so when you
see them not catch a pass like you can go
and one in two directions, is it because they lost
concentration or they're not their hands aren't as good anymore,
or they suddenly forgot how to you know, the fundamentals
of catching a ball, or even though it hit their hands,
(35:01):
was there something about the timing of it?
Speaker 2 (35:05):
Was it thrown before.
Speaker 5 (35:06):
They had a chance to adjust or is it coming
in too hot? You know, that doesn't mean that they
still shouldn't catch it at this level, but you have
to ask yourself, why are these passes? Why are people
who don't normally drop passes dropping passes or being unable
to come up with them? And you know, I think
some of that is is just the speed that he
throws the ball at all.
Speaker 2 (35:27):
Right, so you were in the room.
Speaker 3 (35:28):
How legit is the schism between KOC and JJ about.
Speaker 5 (35:32):
The gritty I don't know legitimately, Like I think that O'Connell,
you know, and Wes Phillips kind of clarified it today, like,
you know, they're young coaches and their hip in a
lot of ways. But but but they're still coaches, and
so you don't have to even have experienced a moment
(35:53):
where a guy spikes the ball before he crosses the
goal line, or he's involved in some kind of a
averate you know, uh taunt that event even doesn't wipe
the score off but causes a penalty, or they slow
down and somebody who runs a four to one forty
catches up and tackles them before they get to the
(36:13):
end zone, and they end up with a field goal,
so you don't have to experience one of those what
seems like an outlier but lives on for all in
all time and all the blooper lists and videos that
are out there to feel very strongly that start the
celebration after you cross the end zone. So I don't
think that, like you know, I don't. I don't think
(36:34):
it's a schis him. I thought the whole the most
interesting because I thought was very predictable response from O'Connell
and from West Phillips.
Speaker 2 (36:41):
The whole.
Speaker 5 (36:41):
The most more interesting part of it, frankly was that
JJ kind of, you know, I asked kind of what
I thought was a throwaway question about you plan that
you know, you know when you're gritty and this and that,
and he basically said, like they told he did it
in practice, they told him not to do it, but
because of who the kind of person he is, that
made him more enticed and he did it anyway, and
I'll get a minus. And like I I mean, that
(37:03):
was we love honest answers. We want people to not
you know, go into cliches, and we certainly don't want
people to to answer in ways that aren't truthful. It
was just a surprising thing to reveal that I went
against what my coach has told me. And you wondered, like,
what you know, is he just being a goofball and
(37:25):
because he's a goofball and saying that, or was there
like a message being sent.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
I don't.
Speaker 5 (37:32):
I'm not aware of any like big thing between them,
but it was. It was definitely jarring for him to
say that. I mean, it's not his first game, and
it's not his first postgame interview. Like he he You
could say he's young, and you could say he's inexperience,
but when you're the quarterback at Michigan, you're you're in
public a lot, and so I don't think that he
has any misunderstanding of what it means when you say
(37:53):
things in public. And so it was just surprising. And again,
like I as you know, just a human being. I
prefer people being honest and and giving their true answers
and and not feeling like they have to be guarded
about everything they say. It was just an unusually direct response.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
I liked how Koc said, I want to see that
forty time he tells us about That's like a good
gentle like ko scolding.
Speaker 2 (38:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (38:17):
Yeah, the second time, he's kind of said because the
nine stuff irked him, it seemed like as well, right, yeah.
Speaker 5 (38:21):
He said, uh and he and and that was on
the last Tuesday with PAP on their YouTube slash VN
slash kfan collaboration a lot of platforms, Yes, there are,
and and he you know, he left them kind of
left himself, you know, open. And so if that's really,
if the nine thing really is who you are, then
(38:42):
embrace it. But if it's not, and you're just kind
of creating a character, basically, let's let's let's hold off
on that. So I didn't take that, so it didn't
qualify it really as a direct shot, and neither did
the forty thing. And and that felt like a reference
to like an insect, almost like an insight joke between
them that we were not privileged to.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
But yeah, and.
Speaker 5 (39:06):
When a season is like this, a lot of us
can sit there and try to pick apart every word
and every exchange and wonder if it's what it means
and what it doesn't mean. And they're still getting to
know each other and still getting to know what their
relationship can be and will be. But there's there's more
than just a few sort of breadcrumbs there that suggest
(39:29):
that this that the on field struggles have not the
struggles have not been limited to on field, and that
there's still a lot a lot to be built behind
the scenes as well. This is not recency bias for
my question.
Speaker 3 (39:45):
Because I've been a big I still can't call them
speedy because I don't have a good vibe with them.
Speaker 2 (39:49):
I'm gonna call hm Jalen Nailer.
Speaker 3 (39:50):
Sure they can call him speedy with the two touchdowns
from this last Sunday's game against the Cowboys. But part
of the reason why Adam Thielen is in Pittsburgh right
now playing with Aaron Rodgers is because Jalen Naylor, I think,
has emerged as a legit wide receiver.
Speaker 2 (40:04):
He's a free agent at the end of the year.
Speaker 3 (40:06):
I heard gustling with Pa and Nordo today talking about
that and that someone's probably going to come in and
pay this guy. I'm wondering, is there a world, speaking
of schisms and things that have happened on and off
the field, where they say we like Jalen Naylor more
than Jordan.
Speaker 5 (40:22):
Addison long term, you're reading my mind. I'm going to
potentially write about that potentially. I love it, And so
you have to tune in.
Speaker 3 (40:30):
No, I think you do one of those short videos
so I don't have to read it all forty.
Speaker 5 (40:33):
Five seconds as much a video as much better than
a six hundred and fifty lad story in the day
of this day and age.
Speaker 2 (40:40):
But I think it's a legit conversation.
Speaker 5 (40:42):
It's a conversation, you know, and you could and there's
a lot of tentacles to it because I think if
you took if you only did on field, I think
you won't find too many people who would pick Jalen
Naylor over Jordan Addison.
Speaker 2 (40:56):
I would probably agree if we're just talking.
Speaker 5 (40:58):
I mean, and it's not an in all to Jalen,
like Jordan's is really said this from the moment he
got here, like there's another level to him. Yes, still
really hasn't totally been unlocked.
Speaker 3 (41:10):
But and that's probably why Naylor's getting opportunities, right because
you've got Justin, You've got Jordan. Yeah, yeah, so Naylor
is you know, a lot's come in his way probably
because of that.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
I'm not immune to.
Speaker 5 (41:20):
That, yeah yeah, And so and then you get to
the off field and you say, has the off field
for Jordan Addison been troubling or has it just been weird?
And like, frankly, how do you decide and what's and
does it matter? And if there's a difference, does it matter?
Because ultimately, what you're worried about is players not being
available to you because of the NFL policies when you
(41:45):
run into off field trouble.
Speaker 2 (41:47):
And so.
Speaker 5 (41:49):
I have never ever since that the Vikings were truly
concerned about Jordan Addison off the field in ways that
would make them alter the way that they think about
his future. Okay, but his off the field issues maybe
would make them a little less hesitant to you know,
(42:10):
on a financial level, like how much do you commit
and how much do you wait?
Speaker 2 (42:15):
They could, they could.
Speaker 5 (42:16):
I mean, he's eligible for contract extension after the season.
I thought, so this is year three, So the first
year you can get a deal is after you're done
with your third year, and so he could get one
now and you might be able to get a deal,
some level of a deal, you know, compared to what
Jalen Naylor might get when he's a total free agent
on the open market, or you might just wait and
(42:40):
just pay him, you know, pick up his fifty year
option if you want to, and for the next two
years just kind of pay him year to year and
then decide after that, and it might cost you more.
You might your caution might be rewarded in that situation,
But I I have not sense that there's a really
(43:02):
deep argument in terms of what direction they should go in.
It's kind of a bummer because they've not drafted really well.
You're the guy, and like he's the one of them,
one of the people, like I mean of that twenty
twenty two draft, especially who like has been a hit,
you know, and they hit on him that to get
to be in a position where your third receiver and
(43:26):
had the quarterback situation been more reliable this year, his
numbers will be much much better. I mean, not that
I'm all twenty two guy, but you don't have to
be an all twenty two guy to look at plays
from the bigger angle and see how often he's open,
frankly and so, but to have that be a six
round pick is you know, impressive, and that they should
(43:48):
be lauded for that as much as we rip them
for all the picks that haven't worked out. And so
it's it's a good conversation. It's a smart conversation. I
don't think the answer is like one hundred percent to
zero percent. But I don't think that. I don't sense
that the Vikings have viewed Jordan Addison off the field
(44:09):
issues as being serious enough to fundamentally change the fact
that he was their first round pick, and he's been
and he's really good and and could continue to pair
with at least for the next two years.
Speaker 2 (44:20):
With Justin, I.
Speaker 3 (44:22):
Would be very nervous. I'd be very when you miss
a walk through in London. From what I'm told, it was,
you know, kind of a hard place to get lost in.
Speaker 5 (44:30):
I mean you have to work to you have to
work to get away from the team, Yes, because there
was nothing around it.
Speaker 3 (44:35):
Yeah, that makes me a little bit nervous. But while
I look forward to reading that story, I'm glad that
we're on the same page. That makes me feel better
that I'm not just thinking about weird things off the top.
Speaker 2 (44:43):
Of my head. No, completely legitcase. He's had a great season.
Speaker 3 (44:46):
I mean, you think about the fourth down catch he
had against Detroit, Right, he's obviously at some touchdown he's
doesn't drop.
Speaker 2 (44:52):
Going back to last year, when Jordan Adison was hurt,
he was really good.
Speaker 3 (44:55):
I think he's been a really nice find and like
we've seen before, you know, sometimes those are the guys
that you lose and you have to be okay with it.
You can't keep everybody, but that'd be a tough one
to lose, because I think he's been really good.
Speaker 2 (45:06):
Yeah, just getting going with Seafert if you have questions
for him.
Speaker 3 (45:08):
Six four six eight six A is the Brat Shawn
Brian Kfe and text line Jonathan Gernard koc announced is
out for the year with his injury. They're going to
clean all of that up and he's going to be
shut down for the remaining three games, which means it's
time for an extended look at Dallas Turner. We'll get
Seaffert's thoughts on that and much more when we continue
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