November 11, 2025 • 37 mins
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
The Friday Football Fees heads south to Buffalo Wings Lakeville
this week. You can join PA Nordo alc Lewis from
ninter noon as they get you set for Sunday's divisional
battle with the Bears. All on joining the Great Wings
chance win prizes all morning. Doors open at eight am.
You pull details now, KFA dot com, keyworcolendar.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Hey, it's Ben Gaslin.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Beloveds Scribe covers the Minnesota vikings for the Star Tribute.
Startribune dot com is a podcasting whiz with access vikings
and don't forget the newsletter at ben Gasline via Twitter
via x as where you can learn more about that.
And this is courtesy of Standard Heating and Air and
Standardheating dot Com. Always great to have mister Ben gesling
(00:56):
with us on Tuesdays here at Twin Cities Orthopedics Performance Center. Yesterday,
when nine to Noon was laying out what we perceived
to be ABCD topics like one, two, three, four, five. Yeah,
a lot of minutia to discuss, but the A topic
for nine to noon was win or lose. The raising
(01:16):
of this quarterback is the A topic for the organization.
Yes in the estimation of nine to noon and it
sounds like you, I would agree with that. So then
we went through some names and I got to eventually
the who's the greatest quarterback quarterback in the history of
the Minnesota Vikings target.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Okay, he went to the Hall of Fame, right he did.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
And he also hosted Saturday Night Live several times and
work Monday Night Football like pretty popular, right.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
In his first four starts, one touchdown, six interceptions, he
completed fifty percent of his passes. This thing ain't easy,
as as McCarthy knows, O'Connell knows, the fan base is learning.
It's only four games with him and good morning, good morning.
Speaker 4 (01:56):
Yeah, it's It is an interesting discussion because this thing
of how patient you be with a young quarterback is
we see different gradations of this, and a lot of
times it's a young quarterback that's on a team that
didn't have the expectations that this one did, where you're
coming off a fourteen wins season and everybody's thinking this
(02:19):
could be a team that takes the next step and
wins a playoff game in twenty twenty five, and you're
going with all of those kind of priors that get
put on JJ McCarthy in a year where he's still
twenty two years old. He is I think if he
finishes the season, if he starts every game the rest
of the season, he'll be like the tenth or eleventh
quarterback in this century to start twelve games before his
(02:44):
twenty third birthday. He doesn't turn twenty three until January,
so he is still very, very very young. But the
thing that makes it tricky is this is not a
team that was built to say, okay, let's take the
patient pas with a young quarterback. So it's this balance of, yes,
(03:04):
he is going to have to develop. I mean, I
was looking up things yesterday. I think there are seventy
quarterbacks that have been drafted in the first round in
this century. Of that McCarthy I think is like fifty
six in terms of his passer rating his first four starts,
so not good, right, But the name the two names
directly below him on that list are Matthew Stafford and
(03:24):
Jared Goff, and Josh Allen is further down the list.
So there is just a steep learning curve at this
position in the NFL.
Speaker 5 (03:35):
And we acknowledge passer rating not the end all the conversation,
but it kind of leads you down a road of
understanding trials and tribute threats.
Speaker 4 (03:42):
Yeah, it's just it's not going to be a player
at his most efficient probably at this point. So, yeah,
this this idea of raising a quarterback, and I you know,
talking to people internally, some of it is you build
the veteran roster in part so that the raising of
the young quarterback is easier in theory that there are
(04:04):
fewer unknowns around him, and it makes the development process
a little smoother in that idea as well. But this
is also a team that expected to win and be
a contender in the NFC, and it's hard to do
both of those things at the same time, I think
is the basic lesson of this kind of what we're
finding out.
Speaker 5 (04:23):
So maybe we created some expectations in which we were
trying to thread one of the tougher needles.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
Yeah we could ever possibly do.
Speaker 4 (04:30):
Yeah, But I also think I don't think the team
shot away from that though. I mean, I think talking
to people internally and just the way that they discussed
things before the season, I don't think anybody was sitting
here saying, well, the quarterbacks twenty two.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
So you kind of have.
Speaker 4 (04:45):
To look at this year is a little bit of
a building process, and you're not going to win in
twenty twenty five. I don't think anybody in this building
was looking at it that way. The question, I suppose
becomes how realistic was that? And maybe that was a
little bit of a moonshot, So you know, maybe that's
where you find things to be and you know, maybe
he starts to figure things out in the second half
(05:05):
of the season and you see progress and they start
to win games as a result of that. But I
think what we're seeing early is, yeah, in the first
four I mean, now you have Patrick Mahomes at the
top of that list. Patrick Mahomes a fantastic unicorn right away. Yeah,
he's a unicorn. He's not somebody that you're going to say, oh, well,
why aren't you up to that standard? Like very few
people who have ever played this position are up to
(05:26):
any of the standards that Patrick Mahomes has ever hit
in his career. So, yes, he's a unicorn. And you
have names lower on that list that include some of
the best quarterbacks in the NFL, including one that won
a Super Bowl with Kevin O'Connell four years ago in
Los Angeles. So it is a tough thing to learn
(05:47):
on the fly, and I think we are seeing that
in real time in a lot of ways.
Speaker 5 (05:51):
So let me let me ask you this because I'm
first of all, one thousand percent in on the patients thing.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
Yeah, and I just.
Speaker 5 (05:58):
I've just learned now over the lastly two months is
I had to recalibrate my expectations for what this team
can ultimately do in twenty twenty five. The injuries are
a part of it, but really the QB is a
big part of it too. And frankly, defensively, all the
takeaways have gone away.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
I mean, you just think about complimentary football.
Speaker 5 (06:18):
But the instant pushback that you'll get whether you write
about these other individuals passion ratings and records and such
early on, is that they're all going to say Matthew
Stafford was a top pick for a hideous Lions team. Yep,
Jared Goff top pick, hideous Rams team. You can go
down that road. The Bills had really been trying to
(06:41):
build something a little better defensively. I think there were
six win team as over the year, so not bottom
of the barrel wasn't until year three. Actually, before Josh
Allen truly lifted off right, But that instant is okay, Well,
we won fourteen games.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Last year and we have justin Jefferson.
Speaker 5 (06:58):
You cannot ever compair those two in their development paths
simply because we have number eighteen and that I've kind
of had a hard time putting the words together any
of nine to noon sometimes just in general, I guess
I have trouble putting words together. But to that argument,
the idea that JJ McCarthy's development simply is either a
(07:21):
shorter arc to the finish line or an easier path
to the finish line simply because he has these weapons,
I'm having a hard time putting the words together to it.
I just don't buy that that JJ McCarthy simply by
nature of what's around him that he sees he magically
sees the field better than the average twenty two year old,
(07:44):
that he's instantly going to get it more quickly than
other young qbs ever did, just because there happened to
be more resources around him.
Speaker 4 (07:53):
Well, I think a couple of things come to mind there.
The first one, I guess is when they picked JJ McCarthy,
they were not a fourteen win team. They were a
team coming off a seven and ten season that had
lost Kirk Cousins from most of that year, and they
go fourteen and three in part because Sam Darnold has
a great year. And I'm not saying that that means
(08:13):
all the expectations shouldn't be high in twenty five, but
like I've said, the team was leaning into the high expectation.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
The team set the bar correct.
Speaker 4 (08:21):
Yeah, but it is just kind of this quirky thing
because nobody last year was saying, oh, this is a
fourteen win team. They surprised everybody to do that, and
then you kind of become it's the old Bud Grant thing,
the old you know that he I think told Kevin
O'Connell right away that the joke was, hey, don't win
too fast. You set the expectations high and then it's
hard to you know, start with the bar a little lower,
(08:42):
and then they love you going forward. Obviously, that's been
kind of a back and forth for Kevin o'connelly. Wins
thirteen his first year, and then they slide back and
then it's fourteen and then this year they've already lost
more games than they did last year. So the expectations
have been a little bit kind of a la carte
in some ways, I think. So that makes it tricky there.
(09:04):
But the other piece of it that comes to mind
with the Justin Jefferson thing is, yes, you have Justin Jefferson,
But I think one of the things that they talk
about a lot, and they've talked about with every quarterback
that's been here, whether it's Kirk Cousins, Nick Mullen's, the
rest of the cast of thousands and twenty three Sam Darnold,
is you also deal with the fact that everybody plays
(09:27):
Justin Jefferson differently than they play most receivers in the
NFL in terms of the coverage that's getting floated his way. So, yes,
you have him, and yes it's sometimes just hey, don't
over complicated, throw Justin Jefferson the ball.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
He's better than everybody else.
Speaker 4 (09:40):
But when you have to read through all those coverages
and you're a quarterback that doesn't have the reps in
the bank to say, Okay, I know how to process
through this and I can get the ball to Justin
Jefferson in these settings, it makes it more complex, I
think than just Hey, Justin Jefferson's there. This is idiot
proof to throw them the ball and let him do something.
(10:01):
I think there are some complexities that come because of
the way teams play him.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Well with with the youthful nature of this quarterback and
the inexperience. Yeah, and all the targets for Jefferson, both
his touchdowns with McCarthy. Do you do you think as
they move forward like with with with McCarthy. Okay, so
there is a swivel. We've seen it when we watch
games back. Yeah, first rate, You'll do the best he
(10:28):
can to get through those reads, but there's still work
that needs to be done with that, right right, Okay,
So if it's different than he thought it would be,
and maybe the pressure's hotter than he thought it would be,
do you think he's just it's not it's not a
bleep it. It's just kind of all right, well, this
whole thing broke down. I'm throwing a dayteen, you know,
and like in essence settling for that more than he.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
Needs to at this stage. I mean, it's hard to say.
Speaker 4 (10:54):
You have to probably go back through every play to
say definitively on that, but yeah, I think it's a
lot of trying to figure your way through it and
read things and I think the clock in general has
been a question whether it's do I stay in here
another click and let something open up, or do I hold?
Am I holding the ball too long and then I'm
(11:15):
dealing with pressure? I mean on Sundays, certainly he was
understanding at times he needed to get out, and you
have to decide other times where he could have hung
in there and made a play down field. He certainly
trust his legs, and I think you see that quite
a bit, that he's willing to bail and make things
happen with his feet. But except the one time, Yeah,
he has one fewer pick if he trusted his legs
(11:36):
on that third and five, yeah, and six and tries
to beat the linebacker to the.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
Right to the first down line. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (11:42):
I think the general figuring out the clock in terms
of the coverage, how it declares the down and distance,
what my options are? So much of this is it.
It's kind of the answer to some of this stuff
as well. It depends. It's like, what's the context of
what's happening around me, and how do I apply the
proper decision making to all these different contexts. I think
(12:05):
that is part of the reason this position takes so
long to learn is it takes a long time to
have seen everything and store it in a way that
you can say, Okay, well, yeah, I saw this against
this team back in Week ten of the twenty twenty
five season. If he's in year four, I think that
rep may be more useful than it is in the moment,
(12:27):
if that makes sense. But yeah, I think a lot
of it is just so context dependent that the best
ones figure out, Okay, this is the answer in this
particular spot, and I can get to it fast enough
to make something happen.
Speaker 3 (12:40):
But off the first four Yeah, it is reality and
fair to say, just like this side of Tom Brady. Yeah,
they all all the kids hold it too long. Yeah,
all the kids get indecisive. Yes, and it gradually comes
together for the ones who are gifted.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
I think that's right.
Speaker 4 (12:58):
I mean, I think his time to throw on Sunday,
it was like three and a half seconds, Like that
doesn't work. That's I think was the longest in the NFL,
one of his longest of the year. That just doesn't
work in the NFL. You've got to get rid of
the ball faster than that. And I think they've stressed that.
I think he probably knows that we'll hear from him tomorrow.
But yeah, a lot of it is they hold it
too long because the processing speed is just not quite
(13:22):
there yet. We're talking about a computer from my childhood
in terms of the processing speed. We're not talking about
the new and whatever ad I just got for a
new MacBook with an M five process or whatever that
you're saying the kid QB's on dial up right now, Well,
there's a little bit of time. I think the technological
advancements come when you get the fastest processes here in
(13:42):
your brain.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
Well he's about to leave the Bears on red. Yeah, yeah,
it's yeah.
Speaker 4 (13:49):
I think that just takes time to get to that
level of decision making. I mean, I can remember Kirk
Cousins at times, and this is you know, Kirk Cousins
is not the best quarterback to ever play the game, certainly,
but a guy that has done it for a long time.
Speaker 5 (14:03):
Who has notebooks filled with that correct from four or
five years ago that he studies yep, and with the little.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Brain monitoring thing on his head. I mean, what a
carnival at his house?
Speaker 4 (14:13):
Well yeah, but I mean there would be times where
you'd hear him say, well, I saw this coverage and
this guy was going over here, so I knew that
meant that one and two were not there. So I
was going to check three, Three was not there. Okay,
then I'm going to four. It's like you did all
of that in two point three seconds. So I mean
that is a lot of the secret sauce of playing
this position in the NFL is being able to arrive
(14:35):
at those conclusions that fast. And if you don't have that,
those path rushers are going to be in your face
pretty quickly.
Speaker 5 (14:42):
So in terms of helping JJ McCarthy, yeah, because there's
a part of this where he's got to be raised
on the fly. We set expectations, we got a veteran roster.
Part of those expectations, Ben was complimentary football, and I
mentioned it kind of at the beginning of this, where
you know, I'm not interested in putting arbitrary percentages on things,
but when I think about this team, the QB certainly
(15:03):
is the a topic. But for fans, if they can
be patient with the QB, you know, there are other
places that might draw their ire and it's the it's
the the lack of takeaways. It can be by the way,
forty two attempts for the kid. I think in any situation,
you're going to have a hard time winning that game
much at this stage if we can't get some things
(15:24):
going on the ground, But then the other thing just
kind of a general lack of discipline.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
Now, when Ko was.
Speaker 5 (15:29):
Talking yesterday, it was clear that it was on his
mind because it was almost like, hey, how you guys doing.
By the way the cadence on the false starts, I
got to coach better.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
You know, what is your vibe with that?
Speaker 5 (15:40):
In terms of as we've looked for identity with the
team that has good times bad times, really at this
stage of the year, the identity is inconsistency and really
a lack of discipline around the kid QB as we're
trying to raise them on the flo right, And.
Speaker 4 (15:55):
I don't think that works because I think a lot
of this was built. I mean, yes, you wanted to win,
but it also was I know, on offense, the vision
was let's put as many veterans around him as possible
so that there's not this need to hold hands. There's
not a need to say, well, this person didn't do
their job quite the right way. So the quarterback has
(16:17):
to overcome that. I mean, you'll hear Kasi at Alfaments
and Kevin O'Connell talk about but this is a quasy
phrase overcoming context with quarterbacks where the house is burning
and it doesn't matter because the quarterback is so good
he can make something happen. That is not what they're
expecting JJ McCarthy to do at age twenty two. Maybe
in four years or you know, two or three, whatever,
(16:39):
but I don't think that's happening now. So I think
some of the problem has been when you have proven players,
either on the offensive line or you know, some drop
passes at times, I think justin Jefferson, that would have
been a tough touchdown catch on Sunday between two guys,
but the best wide receiver in the world probably would
say he should make that catch.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
It was put in a great spot, it was a
great throw.
Speaker 4 (17:01):
And then defensively, at times this year it's been not
being able to stop the run. It's been the lack
of turnovers, and injuries play into some of these things.
But yeah, I think there are some moments where you say, Okay,
there are enough proven players on this team that you
would expect to execute at a little.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
More reliable level. That probably haven't.
Speaker 4 (17:20):
And if you don't have a quarterback that's in a
position to overcome all of that, it makes it tough.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
Ben Gesling, Star Tribune, Star Tribune dot Com, Standard Heating
and Air, thank you very much, Standardheating dot Com. Thank
you for the yearly sponsorship of several things, but including
the Scribe nine to noon each and every Tuesday. To
close this segment and land the plane on this conversation,
(17:45):
it's moving on to the Bears. The Vikings are undefeated
in the division. The Bears are winless in the division.
The Vikings found a way to go to Ford Field
and beat Jared Goff and Jamiir Gibbs. Meanwhile, the Chicago
Bears gave up fifty two to the Troy Lyons. No,
that was very early in the season, So somebody needs
to overcome some form of context. Yeah, I guess, I
(18:06):
guess we'll figure out how that works out Sunday and
then won't. Yeah, but how far squeeze, we're on the
quasy train over here, how far down the road on
the Bears are you? And just if you haven't looked
or read or mashed on a lot of it yet,
completely fine, It's Tuesday. Games on Sunday. You're an elite
(18:27):
football mind stream your consciousness. What do you think of
the Bears?
Speaker 4 (18:30):
Well, I haven't done a ton of research on the
games in the weeks since we saw them. I haven't
done a ton of film review on them yet. It
was a lot of yesterday was looking back at McCarthy
and all the false starts and went into some of
those things.
Speaker 3 (18:42):
But we got a couple of things for you then,
just cursory. Okay, Yeah, since the bye, the Bears are
four and one. Their only loss was to Baltimore, not
Lamar Tyler Huntley. During those five games, they're running for
one eighty five per and it's clear there's a galvezing
nature to a certain extent taking place between the quarterback
(19:03):
and the coach. With the way they I don't care
if it's bad team, bad team. They found a way
to outdo the context of games whatever however you put
it earlier, and they they learned how to win dramatic games.
And then when it comes to the teams they've played
this year, Nordo has what was that with the Bears?
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Fifteen one? Well, fifteen forty one and one is the
collective record. Yeah, six teams.
Speaker 4 (19:28):
They beat Bengals in that comeback the Giants last week
when Jackson Dark gets heard.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
So I mean that that's the the quick fire, quick
touch context with this six and three team. Dj Moore
has caught a touchdown, run for a touchdown, and thrown
a touchdown. So anyway, Dj Moore, we're happy for him.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
What do you think?
Speaker 4 (19:47):
Yeah, I mean I think they have started to figure
some things out. You've certainly seen more productive idiots, more
productivity on offense between kidder productive idiots. Yeah, yeah, something
there I a lot not a productive way to phrase
that word. You're out kicking the content. Productivity is the
word I was looking for. There's been more of that
(20:09):
with Ben Johnson, Caleb Williams. DeAndre Swift has been a
big factor too. I mean you see a lot of
where they're trying to mold that team to look what
look like what the Lions have, where it's it's Colton
Lovelin instead of Sam Laporta, it's DeAndre Swift instead of
Jamior Gibbs, it's you know, building the offensive line some
of the things they've done, and then it's a quarterback
that meshes with what Ben Johnson wants to do. Yeah,
(20:32):
I think there's going to be probably another stage of
growth for them yet, and they probably need to do
it against some more complex defenses. But you certainly see
the growth and that's what they've been talking about needing
for a long time, specifically with Kleb Williams. Somebody can
kind of get his ear and make it work. But
it's been noticeable progress and it'll be interesting to see
the second time around with Brian Flora.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Is what that looks like?
Speaker 3 (20:53):
Sunday solid run run blocking, okay, three to two, big
beefy straw, tight end. Josh Oliver maybe returning this weekend.
And also a question for the scribe, the beat writer
about press conferences and timing. That's all around the corner.
Ben Gesling from Standard Heating and Air with sponsored by
(21:17):
Standard Heating and Air and Standard Heating dot Com. Meanwhile,
I was DOUBLEB with the cash then good morning, Good morning.
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Speaker 3 (21:58):
Teachers Ben Gestling with a nine to noon Each and
every Tuesday. We are at Twin City's Orthopedics Performance Center,
specifically the t CEO Studios as part of the Second
to None Vikings Entertainment Network Family and Paige Jaeger Jagger
(22:18):
is part of it and we bank her for her
contributions and a dedication to each and every Tuesday with
us here because twenty five minutes from now, Minnesota, Vikings
head coach Kevin O'Connell joins us. You can of course
listen to it here live at FM one hundred point
three KFAM. You're at back via podcasting or x's and
o's on Wednesday nights after Bumper to Bumper or watch
(22:42):
it at vikings dot com.
Speaker 5 (22:43):
Can we can we get some talkbacks for the coach
by the way, just all you got to do, name
and where you're from.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
Yep.
Speaker 5 (22:49):
We do our weekly talkback of the day if you will,
and we'll play one for the coach.
Speaker 3 (22:55):
Yep, talkback talkback Tuesday from tco. So we'll play a
talkback for Kevin O'Connell probably within the next forty five
minutes free iHeart audio app microphone. You know what to
do with Let me ask you this when when it
comes to the course of the battle. Okay, we're in
(23:15):
the middle right now. Yeah, at Green Bay's five to
three in one, Minnesota's four and five. So there was
a question posed to Matt Lafleur last night after a
very tightly contested emotional loss as head coach of a
five to three and one team, and the question the
(23:38):
question was do you feel your coaching for your job?
Speaker 2 (23:43):
So here here's my question to you.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
Because we're at a lot of press conferences together, I
never asked questions. Yeah, what's the reason I never asked
questions Because I'm I'm fortunate enough to have a half
hour with the head coach every Tuesday or tape pregame
shows with them and spend time with him like that, right,
that's not my time, sure, but I like being at
the press conferences or listening to them because of you
(24:07):
and Alec and Dane and Kevin and just so Emily
and so on and so on. I just it's like,
you know, one of these Kevin O'Connell press conferences within
the last week and change, after all that wentz terrorism.
You know, it's having talked to Kevin on Tuesday, there
are different questions to be had on Wednesday, and I
appreciate that. I'm just sitting back waiting for somebody to
tell me about Josh Oliver. And Emily like her right
(24:29):
at the end, is like, well, yeah, I mean Josh,
how's he doing?
Speaker 2 (24:33):
Or however she put it.
Speaker 5 (24:34):
So.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
I saw her at practice the next day, come up
to her, put my arm around her, said I barely
know you. I waited twenty two minutes for a Josh
Oliver question, and I just really want to thank you
for asking that. So to each their own with how
they execute your toil. Here's the question. Is it proper
timing or is it crass to ask somebody after a
(24:56):
game who leads a team with a winning record. By
the way, but after an emotional game, do you feel
your coaching for your job? I think it's grand standing.
I think it's inappropriate at that time. Yeah, personally speaking,
you want to do that on a Wednesday or on
a Friday, cool? Yeah, But anyway, the individual who did it,
(25:18):
I felt was grand standing. What's your feeling on the timing?
Speaker 4 (25:22):
Yeah, I mean I think that's probably a question. I
mean that's maybe a Monday after a game. The particular
context in that setting is useful. I think the question
is pertinent relative to Matt laflor because great, the Packers
have a new team president. Oh, great the Packers have
I think that team president has said I'm not giving
(25:44):
extensions to Matt Lafluor and Brian Kutakuntz because I want
to see what this is going to be. So the
topic is more relevant than it would be.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
Great.
Speaker 4 (25:53):
Oh, I don't know for a team that just extended
its head coaching GM this offseason. So I think the
time is going to be front of mind for the
people that cover the Packers and a lot of veteran
reporters that do that. But yeah, there is that question
of when do you ask it. I don't know that
that's one I would have gone with right after a game.
After a game, it's emotional. I mean, everybody's kind of
(26:15):
reacting with their first thoughts and they haven't had time
to sit down and process and decompress in that setting.
I think that's probably something I would have done on
a Monday, but you know, it's or a Wednesday or
a Prime. Yeah, sure, probably a Monday or a Wednesday,
because Friday is generally all about the next one.
Speaker 3 (26:33):
Sunday is all about the one that just happened. Yeah,
so I think we're in Lockstown.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
Yeah, yeah, and it is.
Speaker 4 (26:39):
It always is tricky in some settings because you do
see times where reporters are asking questions and you can
tell it's because people know these things are live streamed
and people know their voices are heard, and there's kinds
of ways to build your brand. I don't think that
was happening with this particular question. I think it was
probably because that topic is relevant to that beat, because
(27:01):
that team is dealing with it, so we can we
can decide whether Sunday, Monday, Wednesday, Friday is the best
time to do it. But I you know, you do
see times where that happens in a general sense with
people asking questions that way. I think that I'm not
a big fan of that in general when you see
that happening. And again, I think this question probably is
from a news gathering perspective, it's just when should it
(27:23):
happen that the grandstanding stuff. When I do see it,
I'm kind of like, okay, right, I don't know that
I need this.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
Well, I mean, you.
Speaker 5 (27:29):
Would typically if and let's say the guy who asked
the question is writing an article just new regime and
such and so head coach GM, it's it's not free
money anymore. Now, it's like looking towards the future. Maybe
there's some if not now when type of conversations with
the team. So if you're writing an article about that,
(27:49):
you would probably maybe even plan the release of that
article so that you didn't have to ask that question
after a difficult emotional loss, so you could get coach
quotes in con text, maybe on a Tuesday morning after
a Monday night game, et cetera. So you kind of
you have some autonomy in terms of how you can
gear your content and ultimately find the right times to
(28:10):
ask maybe some tougher questions.
Speaker 2 (28:12):
Yeah, there certainly are times for that.
Speaker 4 (28:13):
And you know that whenever you write something, it is
only fair to have asked the person on the record
about the thing that you're writing about.
Speaker 2 (28:21):
I mean, that's part of the job.
Speaker 4 (28:23):
So you do have some autonomy in the sense of
I can release my story later if I want to
ask this question at a better time, or ask it,
you know, whenever the right moment to get a more
thoughtful answer might be. Yeah, you do have some autonomy
over that.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
But I think the.
Speaker 4 (28:39):
Process of if you're writing that story, if that the
plan was to write that story after that game, you
do need to ask the question. It's not fair to
write something like that without giving the person that the
story is about a chance to respond and address it.
That's sometimes where you ask questions too, is say, hey,
this is only fair to put this in front of
(29:00):
you and let you shape it how you want.
Speaker 3 (29:02):
Well, that's that, that's true, and and and that's something
I overlooked. Okay, so but if if that is the
and again, I'm not you know, I'm not I'm not
trying to be woodword and Bernstein here for tend like
you know, like I've been an editor in chief at
a major newspaper. I'm simply saying, if that is the
(29:23):
context of your of your gamer, well it's not a gamer, right.
And if it's a sidebar or a column, well that's different. Okay,
So now I would be required to read it to
see how it meshed together. And and you know what,
it's fair for me to say what I'm saying because
(29:43):
of how wrapped up in opinions, uh, people in our
industry get with social media, and then you can just
constantly keep seeing Lafloor sucks, fire fire, fire, fire, fire, fire, fire, fire, fire, fire, fire,
fire fire, and it never stops because everybody has their
phone right in front of their face around the clock.
So if it's generated from that, well shame on you.
Speaker 4 (30:06):
Yeah, that's not something you should be using as your
assignment editor.
Speaker 2 (30:09):
And we see it.
Speaker 4 (30:10):
I mean, we get these questions all the time, and
you know, you get told, hey, you need to ask this,
and you need to you need to do this because
if you don't, you're a coward, and it's like no,
Sometimes it's that you're you're applying context that may be
different than what you're applying to it if you're sitting
at home watching it. So yes, if you are grabbing
(30:32):
your uh reading on social media using as the barometer
for what everybody's thinking, that's probably not the right way
to go about it. And it's a vocal minority of
the fan base.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
But I find it fullhardy for people in our positions,
with those who write stories that that tens, if not
hundreds of thousands read, right, those who talk into a microphone,
you know, with whatever the crowd size is there, I
think it's unfair to chastise the fan full are generally
nine out of ten times being they don't run enough.
(31:05):
Ask Kevin O'Connell, why doesn't run more? Really, that's how
you want to do it. Yeah, you want to go
at it that way, Okay, Well if you stop there,
cool because I'll stop too. But if you don't, it's well,
what situation are you talking about? What game are you
talking about? What was the offensive line?
Speaker 2 (31:22):
Like CJ.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
Hamplay? How many receivers were there? Where did the defense
rank against the run? How had they been doing during
that game?
Speaker 2 (31:31):
What was the weather? Lies? At first and fifteen? Right, So, if.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
Somebody wants to lay out context of things and go
back and forth.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
I love that.
Speaker 3 (31:39):
I don't live for it, but I live for discussions
like that where people are well prepared, they have context
and authenticity with their emotion behind it, and I love that.
But it's just so fleeting these days.
Speaker 4 (31:55):
Yeah, And I think that's where I would say the
value of somebody in my seat should be is that
when a fan is saying, hey, I want to know
about this because this is bothering me, then it is
my job to say, Okay, let's look at the context
here and form a question, not to you know, bang
on the door with a pitchfork. It's to get further
(32:17):
insight into the head coach's thought process. And that is
one thing when you're talking to Kevin O'Connell, he generally
will tell you what his thought process was on something,
and you can decide, Okay, I agree with that or
I don't, But I mean you know that he generally
will walk you down on a road of what he
was thinking, which I appreciate because that's that's all I
really want when I'm.
Speaker 3 (32:36):
Asking a question. But in our positions, timing is everything correct.
So I'm not gonna ask about a two point seven
yards per run over the course of a game and
a half at a certain time where things are hot.
I'm gonna wait for them to run quite well, and
then I'm gonna ask him, by the way, what's your
philosophy when it comes to meshing the run in the past,
(33:00):
Like when you know it's time to run more than past, Yeah,
it's time.
Speaker 5 (33:03):
You know.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
There's so much that goes into it, but that people
just don't understand.
Speaker 4 (33:06):
The point of the question is to get an answer
that illuminates things.
Speaker 2 (33:12):
It is not to.
Speaker 4 (33:14):
Make the question itself seem confrontational, cream or confrontational. It
is to elicit information that helps people understand the team
that they love a little bit better.
Speaker 3 (33:25):
Use That's how I see it. That's beautifully laid out.
Thank you, Yeah, thanks Madas. Good discussion. Awesome. Ben Gasoline's
start tribune Start tribune dot com. Now we have the
podcast Access Vikings. Learn more about that at Ben Gasoline
viax and don't forget the newsletter and it's courtesy of
Standard Heating and Air newsed in Nords Around the corner
than Kevin O'Connell, coach of the Minnesota Vikings fifteen minutes
(33:46):
from now.
Speaker 5 (33:47):
And welcome back it's nine to noon and it's News
(34:14):
de Nord and it's brought to you by the Casino
at Canterbury Park, which you've heard about the Pro Football
pick Them bit, which is sweet. It's on Thursdays and
you'll hear about it on Thursday. But how about this
the Casino at Canterbury Park. You got poker, blackjack, table games,
you got having SIPs of chips and tipping. Derek Allen
live racing season, cool musical events, you got so many
(34:35):
different things. You have a staff that actually is fun
and friendly to hang out with, which is nice as well.
I just love everything about Canterbury. They're getting into the
holiday spirit and here's how. Starting Black Friday Weekend, they're
giving away ten thousand dollars in cash and prizes. You
play your table games from noon to eight pm for
your chance to win. That's Black Friday Weekend starting the
(34:57):
twenty eight, twenty ninth, and thirtieth. But they also have
a new track side Christmas Tree Lot. You can pick
out your favorite tree, you sip on some free hot coco,
write a letter to Santa. Yeah, so you got the
ten k giveaway bit. Black Friday Weekend at Canterbury but
then they also have a tree lot, go pick up
your trees. That starts at nine am on Black Friday.
(35:20):
Oh that starts then? Yeah, they have everything at Canterbury Park.
Speaker 3 (35:23):
Guess where Ava, Stella and the most beautiful, laughing, crying
baby are going to be the week.
Speaker 2 (35:30):
After Black Friday? Yeah? CB, Why to get three trees?
Are you seriously? Though? I go it, there's a tree,
there's a tree farm. I'm not gonna mention.
Speaker 5 (35:38):
It's West Metro Southwest Metro that I've been going to
for years, and it's kind of a fun tradition. The
girls and I go and then I get a handsaw.
Oh and you go and.
Speaker 2 (35:48):
Pick out a tree.
Speaker 5 (35:49):
It's awesome, except beautiful Eva and Stella they always pick
out the tree where Dad's left, dragging it half a
freaking mile back to the jeep. It's so if I
have the ability to go to Canterbury and it's a
trackside tree lot and I just pick one up there,
I know where I'm going.
Speaker 3 (36:06):
Okay, well, I mean I'm not gonna you know, tradition
clearly matters to you. So therefore, go to that lot
with the saw, do the drag for one or two trees?
But since you have four trees in your house, what
do you want to do? Do you want to attack
a day with a saw or a five hundred dollars
voucher or something like chips in front of you? I'll
(36:30):
so just do them both. One is the one is
you and Molly. It's the adult tree day, yes, and
the heather is the kid tree day with the saw
and I'll laughing crying baby.
Speaker 5 (36:40):
No, that's a good call, given my what I've been
dealing with with trees, specifically in my backyard recently. I'll
do the sawing in the backyard. I'll get the Christmas
tree at Canterbury Park.
Speaker 2 (36:51):
You know what, seems like you just have so much
on your mind right now with that saw.
Speaker 3 (36:55):
Let's just do it like this. San Jose's in town
while should win again. Timberwolves handled busy and it's nicely
last night. They're very good at beating bad teams and
Chris Finch should be joining nine to noon relatively soon.
Green Bay lost to Philadelphia last night. Elton Jenkins got hurt,
so Didlane Johnson, the right tackle for the Philadelphia Eagles.
Wartz professional effort by the Philadelphia Eagles ramping up for
(37:19):
December nine to noon. Did not think the quarterback for
the board arrival particularly well anyway. That's News de Nord
provided by Canterbury Park and Canterbury Park dot com. When
we return, Kevin O'Connell, head coach of the Minnesota Viking,
joins us on kfan
The Friday Football Fees heads south to Buffalo Wings Lakeville
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You pull details now, KFA dot com, keyworcolendar.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Hey, it's Ben Gaslin.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Beloveds Scribe covers the Minnesota vikings for the Star Tribute.
Startribune dot com is a podcasting whiz with access vikings
and don't forget the newsletter at ben Gasline via Twitter
via x as where you can learn more about that.
And this is courtesy of Standard Heating and Air and
Standardheating dot Com. Always great to have mister Ben gesling
(00:56):
with us on Tuesdays here at Twin Cities Orthopedics Performance Center. Yesterday,
when nine to Noon was laying out what we perceived
to be ABCD topics like one, two, three, four, five. Yeah,
a lot of minutia to discuss, but the A topic
for nine to noon was win or lose. The raising
(01:16):
of this quarterback is the A topic for the organization.
Yes in the estimation of nine to noon and it
sounds like you, I would agree with that. So then
we went through some names and I got to eventually
the who's the greatest quarterback quarterback in the history of
the Minnesota Vikings target.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Okay, he went to the Hall of Fame, right he did.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
And he also hosted Saturday Night Live several times and
work Monday Night Football like pretty popular, right.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
In his first four starts, one touchdown, six interceptions, he
completed fifty percent of his passes. This thing ain't easy,
as as McCarthy knows, O'Connell knows, the fan base is learning.
It's only four games with him and good morning, good morning.
Speaker 4 (01:56):
Yeah, it's It is an interesting discussion because this thing
of how patient you be with a young quarterback is
we see different gradations of this, and a lot of
times it's a young quarterback that's on a team that
didn't have the expectations that this one did, where you're
coming off a fourteen wins season and everybody's thinking this
(02:19):
could be a team that takes the next step and
wins a playoff game in twenty twenty five, and you're
going with all of those kind of priors that get
put on JJ McCarthy in a year where he's still
twenty two years old. He is I think if he
finishes the season, if he starts every game the rest
of the season, he'll be like the tenth or eleventh
quarterback in this century to start twelve games before his
(02:44):
twenty third birthday. He doesn't turn twenty three until January,
so he is still very, very very young. But the
thing that makes it tricky is this is not a
team that was built to say, okay, let's take the
patient pas with a young quarterback. So it's this balance of, yes,
(03:04):
he is going to have to develop. I mean, I
was looking up things yesterday. I think there are seventy
quarterbacks that have been drafted in the first round in
this century. Of that McCarthy I think is like fifty
six in terms of his passer rating his first four starts,
so not good, right, But the name the two names
directly below him on that list are Matthew Stafford and
(03:24):
Jared Goff, and Josh Allen is further down the list.
So there is just a steep learning curve at this
position in the NFL.
Speaker 5 (03:35):
And we acknowledge passer rating not the end all the conversation,
but it kind of leads you down a road of
understanding trials and tribute threats.
Speaker 4 (03:42):
Yeah, it's just it's not going to be a player
at his most efficient probably at this point. So, yeah,
this this idea of raising a quarterback, and I you know,
talking to people internally, some of it is you build
the veteran roster in part so that the raising of
the young quarterback is easier in theory that there are
(04:04):
fewer unknowns around him, and it makes the development process
a little smoother in that idea as well. But this
is also a team that expected to win and be
a contender in the NFC, and it's hard to do
both of those things at the same time, I think
is the basic lesson of this kind of what we're
finding out.
Speaker 5 (04:23):
So maybe we created some expectations in which we were
trying to thread one of the tougher needles.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
Yeah we could ever possibly do.
Speaker 4 (04:30):
Yeah, But I also think I don't think the team
shot away from that though. I mean, I think talking
to people internally and just the way that they discussed
things before the season, I don't think anybody was sitting
here saying, well, the quarterbacks twenty two.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
So you kind of have.
Speaker 4 (04:45):
To look at this year is a little bit of
a building process, and you're not going to win in
twenty twenty five. I don't think anybody in this building
was looking at it that way. The question, I suppose
becomes how realistic was that? And maybe that was a
little bit of a moonshot, So you know, maybe that's
where you find things to be and you know, maybe
he starts to figure things out in the second half
(05:05):
of the season and you see progress and they start
to win games as a result of that. But I
think what we're seeing early is, yeah, in the first
four I mean, now you have Patrick Mahomes at the
top of that list. Patrick Mahomes a fantastic unicorn right away. Yeah,
he's a unicorn. He's not somebody that you're going to say, oh, well,
why aren't you up to that standard? Like very few
people who have ever played this position are up to
(05:26):
any of the standards that Patrick Mahomes has ever hit
in his career. So, yes, he's a unicorn. And you
have names lower on that list that include some of
the best quarterbacks in the NFL, including one that won
a Super Bowl with Kevin O'Connell four years ago in
Los Angeles. So it is a tough thing to learn
(05:47):
on the fly, and I think we are seeing that
in real time in a lot of ways.
Speaker 5 (05:51):
So let me let me ask you this because I'm
first of all, one thousand percent in on the patients thing.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
Yeah, and I just.
Speaker 5 (05:58):
I've just learned now over the lastly two months is
I had to recalibrate my expectations for what this team
can ultimately do in twenty twenty five. The injuries are
a part of it, but really the QB is a
big part of it too. And frankly, defensively, all the
takeaways have gone away.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
I mean, you just think about complimentary football.
Speaker 5 (06:18):
But the instant pushback that you'll get whether you write
about these other individuals passion ratings and records and such
early on, is that they're all going to say Matthew
Stafford was a top pick for a hideous Lions team. Yep,
Jared Goff top pick, hideous Rams team. You can go
down that road. The Bills had really been trying to
(06:41):
build something a little better defensively. I think there were
six win team as over the year, so not bottom
of the barrel wasn't until year three. Actually, before Josh
Allen truly lifted off right, But that instant is okay, Well,
we won fourteen games.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Last year and we have justin Jefferson.
Speaker 5 (06:58):
You cannot ever compair those two in their development paths
simply because we have number eighteen and that I've kind
of had a hard time putting the words together any
of nine to noon sometimes just in general, I guess
I have trouble putting words together. But to that argument,
the idea that JJ McCarthy's development simply is either a
(07:21):
shorter arc to the finish line or an easier path
to the finish line simply because he has these weapons,
I'm having a hard time putting the words together to it.
I just don't buy that that JJ McCarthy simply by
nature of what's around him that he sees he magically
sees the field better than the average twenty two year old,
(07:44):
that he's instantly going to get it more quickly than
other young qbs ever did, just because there happened to
be more resources around him.
Speaker 4 (07:53):
Well, I think a couple of things come to mind there.
The first one, I guess is when they picked JJ McCarthy,
they were not a fourteen win team. They were a
team coming off a seven and ten season that had
lost Kirk Cousins from most of that year, and they
go fourteen and three in part because Sam Darnold has
a great year. And I'm not saying that that means
(08:13):
all the expectations shouldn't be high in twenty five, but
like I've said, the team was leaning into the high expectation.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
The team set the bar correct.
Speaker 4 (08:21):
Yeah, but it is just kind of this quirky thing
because nobody last year was saying, oh, this is a
fourteen win team. They surprised everybody to do that, and
then you kind of become it's the old Bud Grant thing,
the old you know that he I think told Kevin
O'Connell right away that the joke was, hey, don't win
too fast. You set the expectations high and then it's
hard to you know, start with the bar a little lower,
(08:42):
and then they love you going forward. Obviously, that's been
kind of a back and forth for Kevin o'connelly. Wins
thirteen his first year, and then they slide back and
then it's fourteen and then this year they've already lost
more games than they did last year. So the expectations
have been a little bit kind of a la carte
in some ways, I think. So that makes it tricky there.
(09:04):
But the other piece of it that comes to mind
with the Justin Jefferson thing is, yes, you have Justin Jefferson,
But I think one of the things that they talk
about a lot, and they've talked about with every quarterback
that's been here, whether it's Kirk Cousins, Nick Mullen's, the
rest of the cast of thousands and twenty three Sam Darnold,
is you also deal with the fact that everybody plays
(09:27):
Justin Jefferson differently than they play most receivers in the
NFL in terms of the coverage that's getting floated his way. So, yes,
you have him, and yes it's sometimes just hey, don't
over complicated, throw Justin Jefferson the ball.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
He's better than everybody else.
Speaker 4 (09:40):
But when you have to read through all those coverages
and you're a quarterback that doesn't have the reps in
the bank to say, Okay, I know how to process
through this and I can get the ball to Justin
Jefferson in these settings, it makes it more complex, I
think than just Hey, Justin Jefferson's there. This is idiot
proof to throw them the ball and let him do something.
(10:01):
I think there are some complexities that come because of
the way teams play him.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Well with with the youthful nature of this quarterback and
the inexperience. Yeah, and all the targets for Jefferson, both
his touchdowns with McCarthy. Do you do you think as
they move forward like with with with McCarthy. Okay, so
there is a swivel. We've seen it when we watch
games back. Yeah, first rate, You'll do the best he
(10:28):
can to get through those reads, but there's still work
that needs to be done with that, right right, Okay,
So if it's different than he thought it would be,
and maybe the pressure's hotter than he thought it would be,
do you think he's just it's not it's not a
bleep it. It's just kind of all right, well, this
whole thing broke down. I'm throwing a dayteen, you know,
and like in essence settling for that more than he.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
Needs to at this stage. I mean, it's hard to say.
Speaker 4 (10:54):
You have to probably go back through every play to
say definitively on that, but yeah, I think it's a
lot of trying to figure your way through it and
read things and I think the clock in general has
been a question whether it's do I stay in here
another click and let something open up, or do I hold?
Am I holding the ball too long and then I'm
(11:15):
dealing with pressure? I mean on Sundays, certainly he was
understanding at times he needed to get out, and you
have to decide other times where he could have hung
in there and made a play down field. He certainly
trust his legs, and I think you see that quite
a bit, that he's willing to bail and make things
happen with his feet. But except the one time, Yeah,
he has one fewer pick if he trusted his legs
(11:36):
on that third and five, yeah, and six and tries
to beat the linebacker to the.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
Right to the first down line. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (11:42):
I think the general figuring out the clock in terms
of the coverage, how it declares the down and distance,
what my options are? So much of this is it.
It's kind of the answer to some of this stuff
as well. It depends. It's like, what's the context of
what's happening around me, and how do I apply the
proper decision making to all these different contexts. I think
(12:05):
that is part of the reason this position takes so
long to learn is it takes a long time to
have seen everything and store it in a way that
you can say, Okay, well, yeah, I saw this against
this team back in Week ten of the twenty twenty
five season. If he's in year four, I think that
rep may be more useful than it is in the moment,
(12:27):
if that makes sense. But yeah, I think a lot
of it is just so context dependent that the best
ones figure out, Okay, this is the answer in this
particular spot, and I can get to it fast enough
to make something happen.
Speaker 3 (12:40):
But off the first four Yeah, it is reality and
fair to say, just like this side of Tom Brady. Yeah,
they all all the kids hold it too long. Yeah,
all the kids get indecisive. Yes, and it gradually comes
together for the ones who are gifted.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
I think that's right.
Speaker 4 (12:58):
I mean, I think his time to throw on Sunday,
it was like three and a half seconds, Like that
doesn't work. That's I think was the longest in the NFL,
one of his longest of the year. That just doesn't
work in the NFL. You've got to get rid of
the ball faster than that. And I think they've stressed that.
I think he probably knows that we'll hear from him tomorrow.
But yeah, a lot of it is they hold it
too long because the processing speed is just not quite
(13:22):
there yet. We're talking about a computer from my childhood
in terms of the processing speed. We're not talking about
the new and whatever ad I just got for a
new MacBook with an M five process or whatever that
you're saying the kid QB's on dial up right now, Well,
there's a little bit of time. I think the technological
advancements come when you get the fastest processes here in
(13:42):
your brain.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
Well he's about to leave the Bears on red. Yeah, yeah,
it's yeah.
Speaker 4 (13:49):
I think that just takes time to get to that
level of decision making. I mean, I can remember Kirk
Cousins at times, and this is you know, Kirk Cousins
is not the best quarterback to ever play the game, certainly,
but a guy that has done it for a long time.
Speaker 5 (14:03):
Who has notebooks filled with that correct from four or
five years ago that he studies yep, and with the little.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Brain monitoring thing on his head. I mean, what a
carnival at his house?
Speaker 4 (14:13):
Well yeah, but I mean there would be times where
you'd hear him say, well, I saw this coverage and
this guy was going over here, so I knew that
meant that one and two were not there. So I
was going to check three, Three was not there. Okay,
then I'm going to four. It's like you did all
of that in two point three seconds. So I mean
that is a lot of the secret sauce of playing
this position in the NFL is being able to arrive
(14:35):
at those conclusions that fast. And if you don't have that,
those path rushers are going to be in your face
pretty quickly.
Speaker 5 (14:42):
So in terms of helping JJ McCarthy, yeah, because there's
a part of this where he's got to be raised
on the fly. We set expectations, we got a veteran roster.
Part of those expectations, Ben was complimentary football, and I
mentioned it kind of at the beginning of this, where
you know, I'm not interested in putting arbitrary percentages on things,
but when I think about this team, the QB certainly
(15:03):
is the a topic. But for fans, if they can
be patient with the QB, you know, there are other
places that might draw their ire and it's the it's
the the lack of takeaways. It can be by the way,
forty two attempts for the kid. I think in any situation,
you're going to have a hard time winning that game
much at this stage if we can't get some things
(15:24):
going on the ground, But then the other thing just
kind of a general lack of discipline.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
Now, when Ko was.
Speaker 5 (15:29):
Talking yesterday, it was clear that it was on his
mind because it was almost like, hey, how you guys doing.
By the way the cadence on the false starts, I
got to coach better.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
You know, what is your vibe with that?
Speaker 5 (15:40):
In terms of as we've looked for identity with the
team that has good times bad times, really at this
stage of the year, the identity is inconsistency and really
a lack of discipline around the kid QB as we're
trying to raise them on the flo right, And.
Speaker 4 (15:55):
I don't think that works because I think a lot
of this was built. I mean, yes, you wanted to win,
but it also was I know, on offense, the vision
was let's put as many veterans around him as possible
so that there's not this need to hold hands. There's
not a need to say, well, this person didn't do
their job quite the right way. So the quarterback has
(16:17):
to overcome that. I mean, you'll hear Kasi at Alfaments
and Kevin O'Connell talk about but this is a quasy
phrase overcoming context with quarterbacks where the house is burning
and it doesn't matter because the quarterback is so good
he can make something happen. That is not what they're
expecting JJ McCarthy to do at age twenty two. Maybe
in four years or you know, two or three, whatever,
(16:39):
but I don't think that's happening now. So I think
some of the problem has been when you have proven players,
either on the offensive line or you know, some drop
passes at times, I think justin Jefferson, that would have
been a tough touchdown catch on Sunday between two guys,
but the best wide receiver in the world probably would
say he should make that catch.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
It was put in a great spot, it was a
great throw.
Speaker 4 (17:01):
And then defensively, at times this year it's been not
being able to stop the run. It's been the lack
of turnovers, and injuries play into some of these things.
But yeah, I think there are some moments where you say, Okay,
there are enough proven players on this team that you
would expect to execute at a little.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
More reliable level. That probably haven't.
Speaker 4 (17:20):
And if you don't have a quarterback that's in a
position to overcome all of that, it makes it tough.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
Ben Gesling, Star Tribune, Star Tribune dot Com, Standard Heating
and Air, thank you very much, Standardheating dot Com. Thank
you for the yearly sponsorship of several things, but including
the Scribe nine to noon each and every Tuesday. To
close this segment and land the plane on this conversation,
(17:45):
it's moving on to the Bears. The Vikings are undefeated
in the division. The Bears are winless in the division.
The Vikings found a way to go to Ford Field
and beat Jared Goff and Jamiir Gibbs. Meanwhile, the Chicago
Bears gave up fifty two to the Troy Lyons. No,
that was very early in the season, So somebody needs
to overcome some form of context. Yeah, I guess, I
(18:06):
guess we'll figure out how that works out Sunday and
then won't. Yeah, but how far squeeze, we're on the
quasy train over here, how far down the road on
the Bears are you? And just if you haven't looked
or read or mashed on a lot of it yet,
completely fine, It's Tuesday. Games on Sunday. You're an elite
(18:27):
football mind stream your consciousness. What do you think of
the Bears?
Speaker 4 (18:30):
Well, I haven't done a ton of research on the
games in the weeks since we saw them. I haven't
done a ton of film review on them yet. It
was a lot of yesterday was looking back at McCarthy
and all the false starts and went into some of
those things.
Speaker 3 (18:42):
But we got a couple of things for you then,
just cursory. Okay, Yeah, since the bye, the Bears are
four and one. Their only loss was to Baltimore, not
Lamar Tyler Huntley. During those five games, they're running for
one eighty five per and it's clear there's a galvezing
nature to a certain extent taking place between the quarterback
(19:03):
and the coach. With the way they I don't care
if it's bad team, bad team. They found a way
to outdo the context of games whatever however you put
it earlier, and they they learned how to win dramatic games.
And then when it comes to the teams they've played
this year, Nordo has what was that with the Bears?
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Fifteen one? Well, fifteen forty one and one is the
collective record. Yeah, six teams.
Speaker 4 (19:28):
They beat Bengals in that comeback the Giants last week
when Jackson Dark gets heard.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
So I mean that that's the the quick fire, quick
touch context with this six and three team. Dj Moore
has caught a touchdown, run for a touchdown, and thrown
a touchdown. So anyway, Dj Moore, we're happy for him.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
What do you think?
Speaker 4 (19:47):
Yeah, I mean I think they have started to figure
some things out. You've certainly seen more productive idiots, more
productivity on offense between kidder productive idiots. Yeah, yeah, something
there I a lot not a productive way to phrase
that word. You're out kicking the content. Productivity is the
word I was looking for. There's been more of that
(20:09):
with Ben Johnson, Caleb Williams. DeAndre Swift has been a
big factor too. I mean you see a lot of
where they're trying to mold that team to look what
look like what the Lions have, where it's it's Colton
Lovelin instead of Sam Laporta, it's DeAndre Swift instead of
Jamior Gibbs, it's you know, building the offensive line some
of the things they've done, and then it's a quarterback
that meshes with what Ben Johnson wants to do. Yeah,
(20:32):
I think there's going to be probably another stage of
growth for them yet, and they probably need to do
it against some more complex defenses. But you certainly see
the growth and that's what they've been talking about needing
for a long time, specifically with Kleb Williams. Somebody can
kind of get his ear and make it work. But
it's been noticeable progress and it'll be interesting to see
the second time around with Brian Flora.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Is what that looks like?
Speaker 3 (20:53):
Sunday solid run run blocking, okay, three to two, big
beefy straw, tight end. Josh Oliver maybe returning this weekend.
And also a question for the scribe, the beat writer
about press conferences and timing. That's all around the corner.
Ben Gesling from Standard Heating and Air with sponsored by
(21:17):
Standard Heating and Air and Standard Heating dot Com. Meanwhile,
I was DOUBLEB with the cash then good morning, Good morning.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
The cash thing, the Fanta two minute a junk Chuck
want to give you a shot to win Bonus Box,
the National Cash contest at a KFA dot com. The
keyword is dollar for this hour. Keyword dollar KFA dot
com keyword. I remember that one teacher who made a difference,
believed in us, challenged us, or just made learning fun. Well,
now's your chance to say thank you in a big
way with Iheartradios Thank a teacher.
Speaker 2 (21:43):
It's powered by donors. Choose. Here's what you do.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
You nominated outstanding public school teacher who's gone above and
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Speaker 3 (21:58):
Teachers Ben Gestling with a nine to noon Each and
every Tuesday. We are at Twin City's Orthopedics Performance Center,
specifically the t CEO Studios as part of the Second
to None Vikings Entertainment Network Family and Paige Jaeger Jagger
(22:18):
is part of it and we bank her for her
contributions and a dedication to each and every Tuesday with
us here because twenty five minutes from now, Minnesota, Vikings
head coach Kevin O'Connell joins us. You can of course
listen to it here live at FM one hundred point
three KFAM. You're at back via podcasting or x's and
o's on Wednesday nights after Bumper to Bumper or watch
(22:42):
it at vikings dot com.
Speaker 5 (22:43):
Can we can we get some talkbacks for the coach
by the way, just all you got to do, name
and where you're from.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
Yep.
Speaker 5 (22:49):
We do our weekly talkback of the day if you will,
and we'll play one for the coach.
Speaker 3 (22:55):
Yep, talkback talkback Tuesday from tco. So we'll play a
talkback for Kevin O'Connell probably within the next forty five
minutes free iHeart audio app microphone. You know what to
do with Let me ask you this when when it
comes to the course of the battle. Okay, we're in
(23:15):
the middle right now. Yeah, at Green Bay's five to
three in one, Minnesota's four and five. So there was
a question posed to Matt Lafleur last night after a
very tightly contested emotional loss as head coach of a
five to three and one team, and the question the
(23:38):
question was do you feel your coaching for your job?
Speaker 2 (23:43):
So here here's my question to you.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
Because we're at a lot of press conferences together, I
never asked questions. Yeah, what's the reason I never asked
questions Because I'm I'm fortunate enough to have a half
hour with the head coach every Tuesday or tape pregame
shows with them and spend time with him like that, right,
that's not my time, sure, but I like being at
the press conferences or listening to them because of you
(24:07):
and Alec and Dane and Kevin and just so Emily
and so on and so on. I just it's like,
you know, one of these Kevin O'Connell press conferences within
the last week and change, after all that wentz terrorism.
You know, it's having talked to Kevin on Tuesday, there
are different questions to be had on Wednesday, and I
appreciate that. I'm just sitting back waiting for somebody to
tell me about Josh Oliver. And Emily like her right
(24:29):
at the end, is like, well, yeah, I mean Josh,
how's he doing?
Speaker 2 (24:33):
Or however she put it.
Speaker 5 (24:34):
So.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
I saw her at practice the next day, come up
to her, put my arm around her, said I barely
know you. I waited twenty two minutes for a Josh
Oliver question, and I just really want to thank you
for asking that. So to each their own with how
they execute your toil. Here's the question. Is it proper
timing or is it crass to ask somebody after a
(24:56):
game who leads a team with a winning record. By
the way, but after an emotional game, do you feel
your coaching for your job? I think it's grand standing.
I think it's inappropriate at that time. Yeah, personally speaking,
you want to do that on a Wednesday or on
a Friday, cool? Yeah, But anyway, the individual who did it,
(25:18):
I felt was grand standing. What's your feeling on the timing?
Speaker 4 (25:22):
Yeah, I mean I think that's probably a question. I
mean that's maybe a Monday after a game. The particular
context in that setting is useful. I think the question
is pertinent relative to Matt laflor because great, the Packers
have a new team president. Oh, great the Packers have
I think that team president has said I'm not giving
(25:44):
extensions to Matt Lafluor and Brian Kutakuntz because I want
to see what this is going to be. So the
topic is more relevant than it would be.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
Great.
Speaker 4 (25:53):
Oh, I don't know for a team that just extended
its head coaching GM this offseason. So I think the
time is going to be front of mind for the
people that cover the Packers and a lot of veteran
reporters that do that. But yeah, there is that question
of when do you ask it. I don't know that
that's one I would have gone with right after a game.
After a game, it's emotional. I mean, everybody's kind of
(26:15):
reacting with their first thoughts and they haven't had time
to sit down and process and decompress in that setting.
I think that's probably something I would have done on
a Monday, but you know, it's or a Wednesday or
a Prime. Yeah, sure, probably a Monday or a Wednesday,
because Friday is generally all about the next one.
Speaker 3 (26:33):
Sunday is all about the one that just happened. Yeah,
so I think we're in Lockstown.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
Yeah, yeah, and it is.
Speaker 4 (26:39):
It always is tricky in some settings because you do
see times where reporters are asking questions and you can
tell it's because people know these things are live streamed
and people know their voices are heard, and there's kinds
of ways to build your brand. I don't think that
was happening with this particular question. I think it was
probably because that topic is relevant to that beat, because
(27:01):
that team is dealing with it, so we can we
can decide whether Sunday, Monday, Wednesday, Friday is the best
time to do it. But I you know, you do
see times where that happens in a general sense with
people asking questions that way. I think that I'm not
a big fan of that in general when you see
that happening. And again, I think this question probably is
from a news gathering perspective, it's just when should it
(27:23):
happen that the grandstanding stuff. When I do see it,
I'm kind of like, okay, right, I don't know that
I need this.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
Well, I mean, you.
Speaker 5 (27:29):
Would typically if and let's say the guy who asked
the question is writing an article just new regime and
such and so head coach GM, it's it's not free
money anymore. Now, it's like looking towards the future. Maybe
there's some if not now when type of conversations with
the team. So if you're writing an article about that,
(27:49):
you would probably maybe even plan the release of that
article so that you didn't have to ask that question
after a difficult emotional loss, so you could get coach
quotes in con text, maybe on a Tuesday morning after
a Monday night game, et cetera. So you kind of
you have some autonomy in terms of how you can
gear your content and ultimately find the right times to
(28:10):
ask maybe some tougher questions.
Speaker 2 (28:12):
Yeah, there certainly are times for that.
Speaker 4 (28:13):
And you know that whenever you write something, it is
only fair to have asked the person on the record
about the thing that you're writing about.
Speaker 2 (28:21):
I mean, that's part of the job.
Speaker 4 (28:23):
So you do have some autonomy in the sense of
I can release my story later if I want to
ask this question at a better time, or ask it,
you know, whenever the right moment to get a more
thoughtful answer might be. Yeah, you do have some autonomy
over that.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
But I think the.
Speaker 4 (28:39):
Process of if you're writing that story, if that the
plan was to write that story after that game, you
do need to ask the question. It's not fair to
write something like that without giving the person that the
story is about a chance to respond and address it.
That's sometimes where you ask questions too, is say, hey,
this is only fair to put this in front of
(29:00):
you and let you shape it how you want.
Speaker 3 (29:02):
Well, that's that, that's true, and and and that's something
I overlooked. Okay, so but if if that is the
and again, I'm not you know, I'm not I'm not
trying to be woodword and Bernstein here for tend like
you know, like I've been an editor in chief at
a major newspaper. I'm simply saying, if that is the
(29:23):
context of your of your gamer, well it's not a gamer, right.
And if it's a sidebar or a column, well that's different. Okay,
So now I would be required to read it to
see how it meshed together. And and you know what,
it's fair for me to say what I'm saying because
(29:43):
of how wrapped up in opinions, uh, people in our
industry get with social media, and then you can just
constantly keep seeing Lafloor sucks, fire fire, fire, fire, fire, fire, fire, fire, fire, fire, fire,
fire fire, and it never stops because everybody has their
phone right in front of their face around the clock.
So if it's generated from that, well shame on you.
Speaker 4 (30:06):
Yeah, that's not something you should be using as your
assignment editor.
Speaker 2 (30:09):
And we see it.
Speaker 4 (30:10):
I mean, we get these questions all the time, and
you know, you get told, hey, you need to ask this,
and you need to you need to do this because
if you don't, you're a coward, and it's like no,
Sometimes it's that you're you're applying context that may be
different than what you're applying to it if you're sitting
at home watching it. So yes, if you are grabbing
(30:32):
your uh reading on social media using as the barometer
for what everybody's thinking, that's probably not the right way
to go about it. And it's a vocal minority of
the fan base.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
But I find it fullhardy for people in our positions,
with those who write stories that that tens, if not
hundreds of thousands read, right, those who talk into a microphone,
you know, with whatever the crowd size is there, I
think it's unfair to chastise the fan full are generally
nine out of ten times being they don't run enough.
(31:05):
Ask Kevin O'Connell, why doesn't run more? Really, that's how
you want to do it. Yeah, you want to go
at it that way, Okay, Well if you stop there,
cool because I'll stop too. But if you don't, it's well,
what situation are you talking about? What game are you
talking about? What was the offensive line?
Speaker 2 (31:22):
Like CJ.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
Hamplay? How many receivers were there? Where did the defense
rank against the run? How had they been doing during
that game?
Speaker 2 (31:31):
What was the weather? Lies? At first and fifteen? Right, So, if.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
Somebody wants to lay out context of things and go
back and forth.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
I love that.
Speaker 3 (31:39):
I don't live for it, but I live for discussions
like that where people are well prepared, they have context
and authenticity with their emotion behind it, and I love that.
But it's just so fleeting these days.
Speaker 4 (31:55):
Yeah, And I think that's where I would say the
value of somebody in my seat should be is that
when a fan is saying, hey, I want to know
about this because this is bothering me, then it is
my job to say, Okay, let's look at the context
here and form a question, not to you know, bang
on the door with a pitchfork. It's to get further
(32:17):
insight into the head coach's thought process. And that is
one thing when you're talking to Kevin O'Connell, he generally
will tell you what his thought process was on something,
and you can decide, Okay, I agree with that or
I don't, But I mean you know that he generally
will walk you down on a road of what he
was thinking, which I appreciate because that's that's all I
really want when I'm.
Speaker 3 (32:36):
Asking a question. But in our positions, timing is everything correct.
So I'm not gonna ask about a two point seven
yards per run over the course of a game and
a half at a certain time where things are hot.
I'm gonna wait for them to run quite well, and
then I'm gonna ask him, by the way, what's your
philosophy when it comes to meshing the run in the past,
(33:00):
Like when you know it's time to run more than past, Yeah,
it's time.
Speaker 5 (33:03):
You know.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
There's so much that goes into it, but that people
just don't understand.
Speaker 4 (33:06):
The point of the question is to get an answer
that illuminates things.
Speaker 2 (33:12):
It is not to.
Speaker 4 (33:14):
Make the question itself seem confrontational, cream or confrontational. It
is to elicit information that helps people understand the team
that they love a little bit better.
Speaker 3 (33:25):
Use That's how I see it. That's beautifully laid out.
Thank you, Yeah, thanks Madas. Good discussion. Awesome. Ben Gasoline's
start tribune Start tribune dot com. Now we have the
podcast Access Vikings. Learn more about that at Ben Gasoline
viax and don't forget the newsletter and it's courtesy of
Standard Heating and Air newsed in Nords Around the corner
than Kevin O'Connell, coach of the Minnesota Vikings fifteen minutes
(33:46):
from now.
Speaker 5 (33:47):
And welcome back it's nine to noon and it's News
(34:14):
de Nord and it's brought to you by the Casino
at Canterbury Park, which you've heard about the Pro Football
pick Them bit, which is sweet. It's on Thursdays and
you'll hear about it on Thursday. But how about this
the Casino at Canterbury Park. You got poker, blackjack, table games,
you got having SIPs of chips and tipping. Derek Allen
live racing season, cool musical events, you got so many
(34:35):
different things. You have a staff that actually is fun
and friendly to hang out with, which is nice as well.
I just love everything about Canterbury. They're getting into the
holiday spirit and here's how. Starting Black Friday Weekend, they're
giving away ten thousand dollars in cash and prizes. You
play your table games from noon to eight pm for
your chance to win. That's Black Friday Weekend starting the
(34:57):
twenty eight, twenty ninth, and thirtieth. But they also have
a new track side Christmas Tree Lot. You can pick
out your favorite tree, you sip on some free hot coco,
write a letter to Santa. Yeah, so you got the
ten k giveaway bit. Black Friday Weekend at Canterbury but
then they also have a tree lot, go pick up
your trees. That starts at nine am on Black Friday.
(35:20):
Oh that starts then? Yeah, they have everything at Canterbury Park.
Speaker 3 (35:23):
Guess where Ava, Stella and the most beautiful, laughing, crying
baby are going to be the week.
Speaker 2 (35:30):
After Black Friday? Yeah? CB, Why to get three trees?
Are you seriously? Though? I go it, there's a tree,
there's a tree farm. I'm not gonna mention.
Speaker 5 (35:38):
It's West Metro Southwest Metro that I've been going to
for years, and it's kind of a fun tradition. The
girls and I go and then I get a handsaw.
Oh and you go and.
Speaker 2 (35:48):
Pick out a tree.
Speaker 5 (35:49):
It's awesome, except beautiful Eva and Stella they always pick
out the tree where Dad's left, dragging it half a
freaking mile back to the jeep. It's so if I
have the ability to go to Canterbury and it's a
trackside tree lot and I just pick one up there,
I know where I'm going.
Speaker 3 (36:06):
Okay, well, I mean I'm not gonna you know, tradition
clearly matters to you. So therefore, go to that lot
with the saw, do the drag for one or two trees?
But since you have four trees in your house, what
do you want to do? Do you want to attack
a day with a saw or a five hundred dollars
voucher or something like chips in front of you? I'll
(36:30):
so just do them both. One is the one is
you and Molly. It's the adult tree day, yes, and
the heather is the kid tree day with the saw
and I'll laughing crying baby.
Speaker 5 (36:40):
No, that's a good call, given my what I've been
dealing with with trees, specifically in my backyard recently. I'll
do the sawing in the backyard. I'll get the Christmas
tree at Canterbury Park.
Speaker 2 (36:51):
You know what, seems like you just have so much
on your mind right now with that saw.
Speaker 3 (36:55):
Let's just do it like this. San Jose's in town
while should win again. Timberwolves handled busy and it's nicely
last night. They're very good at beating bad teams and
Chris Finch should be joining nine to noon relatively soon.
Green Bay lost to Philadelphia last night. Elton Jenkins got hurt,
so Didlane Johnson, the right tackle for the Philadelphia Eagles.
Wartz professional effort by the Philadelphia Eagles ramping up for
(37:19):
December nine to noon. Did not think the quarterback for
the board arrival particularly well anyway. That's News de Nord
provided by Canterbury Park and Canterbury Park dot com. When
we return, Kevin O'Connell, head coach of the Minnesota Viking,
joins us on kfan
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