Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Nils.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Hey, good morning, Vinnie.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Nils Gravilious La Pi. I love having you back on
the show. Man. I'm glad you came back on.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
It's my sen shit pleasure. How are you, Vinny?
Speaker 1 (00:12):
I mean, I'm going to do something I don't know
if I've ever done before as far as radio is concerned.
Right now, and considering the time difference, you know your
LA base. Like I said, I'm just going to own
the fact. We're rolling tape right now for playback of
this this exchange tomorrow morning, first thing tomorrow morning on
my show, and I want to own it because we've
(00:36):
got a guy accused of killing four people at a
Montana bar. The search is on. What do you think
the chances are that by the time I hear this
tomorrow morning they found their men.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Well, chances are pretty good, Vinny. But I think chances
are excellent that they find a dead man.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
Suicide.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
I'm assuming that's correct. Did you get a look at
the photo of him exiting the crime scene clad and
only his boxers?
Speaker 1 (01:12):
I did. And what's written most disconcerting to me, outside
of the horrific event, Nil's is the fact that I
had to do a little bit of homework to get
and thankfully our liaison helped too, because the coverage of
this Montana bart is nil. If you don't mind riffing
(01:34):
on your name a little bit, there not a lot
of media attention here.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Well, it isn't a good look and a Conda's a
nice little mining town, but it's a tough place to
earn a living. There aren't a lot of resources for
a veteran suffering from PTSD and psychosis. And Michael Paul
Brown has a long history of emotional instabilities, you know,
(02:04):
subsequent to his military service. He's been diagnosed in the
past with paranoid schizophrenia. It is my belief that that
is probably a rising of concentrated great cannabis use. There
are a lot of people who advocate for PTSD veterans
to use cannabis to treat it, and anybody with a
(02:27):
predisposition to paranoid schizophrenia should should stay far away from cannabis.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
I actually work with a veteran who that's exactly. I mean,
he's I have interesting days with him, yeah, and he's
a gentle soul, so I've got that going for me.
But he'll have episodes, he'll have panic attacks, and did
(02:55):
this cannabis and interesting variations like it's a big part
of his life and we have long conversations about it too.
How sometimes I don't think it serves him well, and
now other times I can see how it does well.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
This is what I can say about PTSD. PTSD causes hypervigilance,
but the PTSD does not induce hallucinations or paranoid delusion.
Paranoid schizophrenies gets of effective disorder, both of which can
arise of cannabis use do cause those things. Now, Michael
(03:38):
Paul Brown is ultimately responsible for the actions that he took.
I think he probably failed to take his problems seriously
enough to ask for help. The four people that he
murdered allegedly murdered were people that he knew. Ten o'clock
(04:00):
in the morning may indicate that he was up all night,
who knows, and he maybe had some rationale in his
mind for killing them, but it still amounts to irrational violence.
If he's willing to do that level of violence to
(04:21):
people who knew him that he didn't really have much
conflict with in the past, chances are very good he
would take his own life. He has an older brother,
I believe William Brown serving life without parole in the
Montana Penitentiary for letting the out of someone with a
(04:42):
knife back in two thousand and one. I believe so
these men maybe from a troubled family.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
Yeah, it sounds like that's definitely possible here now. Like
I said, add do a little homework as far as
the media coverage of this story. And another factor that
I think is and I wanted to bounce it off
off you and again while with Nils Gravillius, a Los
Angeles based a private detective. And also it was a
(05:17):
book you had out right, the author of Skull Diggory
and sub Rosa. They were both published a while back,
but you've got a newer one that came out.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Correct, that's correct. Any I've got my professional memoir. Some
might call it true crime, but it's a true to
life book about thirty years in the saddle as a
private detective in Los Angeles working in the Pinkerton Service
and Army counter intelligence. It is entitled The Last Lawman
and it will be published in June of twenty twenty
(05:47):
six by Post Till Press. Really looking forward to getting
the book out.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
Yeah, I can't wait to read it myself, but I
wanted to bounce this off you, considering what you do
for a living, and you're seen at all kind of guy.
I noticed the weapon used there's nowhere to be found,
and I think that plays a role in why there's
what was it? Probably a handgun or so if it
(06:11):
were an AR fifteen, Okay, now we run It's almost
like our our publications have a department for it. We
got an AR fifteen, send it to the AR fifteen office.
They'll churn it out. The weapon of choice doesn't beg
for coverage.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
I feel like you may be under something. There are
media reports that it was a long weapon of some sort,
maybe a shotgun or a rifle, but we haven't seen
a photo of the weapon. NOAR fifteen's are quite common
in Montana, are they. It may have been one, but
(06:48):
you're probably onto something. If the police had posed with
an AR fifteen at a podium, we'd be hearing about that.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
Well. And it's like you said, no, Vin, did you
see him, you know in his boxers? And I did,
and I saw no weapon. So his back the still
shot that I saw it was as back as he
was leaving in boxers, you know, And if it were
a rifle, surely you'd see the stem, you'd see something somewhere.
So I'm thinking of as it's more handgun of the
(07:19):
handgun variety.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
But I think that we're going to learn more about it.
Very sad case. Moore's going to be revealed fairly soon.
I'd say, there's a there's another man in the wilds
of eastern Washington right now who's accused of murdering his daughters,
another veteran, and he's another man whom I believe will
(07:46):
be found ultimately dead of.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Suicide, and no less than Dan Bongino himself. Now the FBI,
you know, the Deputy director posting that the Bureau is
sending personnel to Ana Conduct to help with this. That's probably,
you know, the story needs updating. Care that's they've probably
already arrived, I would imagine by now.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
I would believe, so they're probably dispatched from the Denver
office of the Bureau.
Speaker 1 (08:17):
Now. Interestingly enough too, and I'm sure you saw this.
The Owl Bar where this took place, it's got some history.
It's got a very interesting backstory. The bar as yeah,
in like the eighteen hundreds.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
And well, it was a mining town, and distractions and
entertainment for miners were few and far between in the
nineteenth century, we could imagine, so the Owl Bar probably
does have a real history.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
Says it served the town's smelt workers. That's according to
a nineteen eighty seven story in the Montana Standard, and
it cited the book Watering Holes in stating the bars
building opened in eighteen ninety three. For whatever that's worth,
I mean, Montana. I feel it's such a one of
(09:11):
our most beautiful states. But it is a it's a
veteran's it's a veteran mecca. Is that safe to say?
Nils Montana, I would say it is.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Well, it's it's sparsely populated up until recently read the
steep was fairly cheap there.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
Really it's beautiful too, Is it cheap there? That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
It's it's very beautiful, but it's rather cold in the winter.
I was looking at the weather on the morning that
our subject went missing. It was fifty four degrees at
seven o'clock in the morning on Saturday. Wow.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
Yeah, well, this is going to be interesting. I'll be
in touch later today between now and tomorrow morning when
this here is but I'll own it then too. We'll
see if anything transpair transpires between now and then. I
think it's fifty to fifty. Would you agree, Like there's
a chance something good. There's a chance we're in the
(10:10):
same place this time.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Tomorrow, we could be status quo tomorrow. Any they've devoted
some resources to this, and any experienced criminal investigator is
going to know that there's an excellent chance he's already
taken his own life, but still an old They still
have to be very cautious. He's a man very familiar
(10:31):
with small arms and could be quite dangerous to approach
if he's still alive.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Yeah, they say armed and dangerous. Well, we'll see, like
I said again, and I'll be in touch later today
via X. It's Nils Gravilius. What is your handle on
X again too, because I want people to make sure
they follow you if they can.
Speaker 2 (10:49):
At Detective Nils. There is an X formerly Twitter
Nils.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Hey, good morning, Vinnie.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Nils Gravilious La Pi. I love having you back on
the show. Man. I'm glad you came back on.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
It's my sen shit pleasure. How are you, Vinny?
Speaker 1 (00:12):
I mean, I'm going to do something I don't know
if I've ever done before as far as radio is concerned.
Right now, and considering the time difference, you know your
LA base. Like I said, I'm just going to own
the fact. We're rolling tape right now for playback of
this this exchange tomorrow morning, first thing tomorrow morning on
my show, and I want to own it because we've
(00:36):
got a guy accused of killing four people at a
Montana bar. The search is on. What do you think
the chances are that by the time I hear this
tomorrow morning they found their men.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Well, chances are pretty good, Vinny. But I think chances
are excellent that they find a dead man.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
Suicide.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
I'm assuming that's correct. Did you get a look at
the photo of him exiting the crime scene clad and
only his boxers?
Speaker 1 (01:12):
I did. And what's written most disconcerting to me, outside
of the horrific event, Nil's is the fact that I
had to do a little bit of homework to get
and thankfully our liaison helped too, because the coverage of
this Montana bart is nil. If you don't mind riffing
(01:34):
on your name a little bit, there not a lot
of media attention here.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Well, it isn't a good look and a Conda's a
nice little mining town, but it's a tough place to
earn a living. There aren't a lot of resources for
a veteran suffering from PTSD and psychosis. And Michael Paul
Brown has a long history of emotional instabilities, you know,
(02:04):
subsequent to his military service. He's been diagnosed in the
past with paranoid schizophrenia. It is my belief that that
is probably a rising of concentrated great cannabis use. There
are a lot of people who advocate for PTSD veterans
to use cannabis to treat it, and anybody with a
(02:27):
predisposition to paranoid schizophrenia should should stay far away from cannabis.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
I actually work with a veteran who that's exactly. I mean,
he's I have interesting days with him, yeah, and he's
a gentle soul, so I've got that going for me.
But he'll have episodes, he'll have panic attacks, and did
(02:55):
this cannabis and interesting variations like it's a big part
of his life and we have long conversations about it too.
How sometimes I don't think it serves him well, and
now other times I can see how it does well.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
This is what I can say about PTSD. PTSD causes hypervigilance,
but the PTSD does not induce hallucinations or paranoid delusion.
Paranoid schizophrenies gets of effective disorder, both of which can
arise of cannabis use do cause those things. Now, Michael
(03:38):
Paul Brown is ultimately responsible for the actions that he took.
I think he probably failed to take his problems seriously
enough to ask for help. The four people that he
murdered allegedly murdered were people that he knew. Ten o'clock
(04:00):
in the morning may indicate that he was up all night,
who knows, and he maybe had some rationale in his
mind for killing them, but it still amounts to irrational violence.
If he's willing to do that level of violence to
(04:21):
people who knew him that he didn't really have much
conflict with in the past, chances are very good he
would take his own life. He has an older brother,
I believe William Brown serving life without parole in the
Montana Penitentiary for letting the out of someone with a
(04:42):
knife back in two thousand and one. I believe so
these men maybe from a troubled family.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
Yeah, it sounds like that's definitely possible here now. Like
I said, add do a little homework as far as
the media coverage of this story. And another factor that
I think is and I wanted to bounce it off
off you and again while with Nils Gravillius, a Los
Angeles based a private detective. And also it was a
(05:17):
book you had out right, the author of Skull Diggory
and sub Rosa. They were both published a while back,
but you've got a newer one that came out.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Correct, that's correct. Any I've got my professional memoir. Some
might call it true crime, but it's a true to
life book about thirty years in the saddle as a
private detective in Los Angeles working in the Pinkerton Service
and Army counter intelligence. It is entitled The Last Lawman
and it will be published in June of twenty twenty
(05:47):
six by Post Till Press. Really looking forward to getting
the book out.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
Yeah, I can't wait to read it myself, but I
wanted to bounce this off you, considering what you do
for a living, and you're seen at all kind of guy.
I noticed the weapon used there's nowhere to be found,
and I think that plays a role in why there's
what was it? Probably a handgun or so if it
(06:11):
were an AR fifteen, Okay, now we run It's almost
like our our publications have a department for it. We
got an AR fifteen, send it to the AR fifteen office.
They'll churn it out. The weapon of choice doesn't beg
for coverage.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
I feel like you may be under something. There are
media reports that it was a long weapon of some sort,
maybe a shotgun or a rifle, but we haven't seen
a photo of the weapon. NOAR fifteen's are quite common
in Montana, are they. It may have been one, but
(06:48):
you're probably onto something. If the police had posed with
an AR fifteen at a podium, we'd be hearing about that.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
Well. And it's like you said, no, Vin, did you
see him, you know in his boxers? And I did,
and I saw no weapon. So his back the still
shot that I saw it was as back as he
was leaving in boxers, you know, And if it were
a rifle, surely you'd see the stem, you'd see something somewhere.
So I'm thinking of as it's more handgun of the
(07:19):
handgun variety.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
But I think that we're going to learn more about it.
Very sad case. Moore's going to be revealed fairly soon.
I'd say, there's a there's another man in the wilds
of eastern Washington right now who's accused of murdering his daughters,
another veteran, and he's another man whom I believe will
(07:46):
be found ultimately dead of.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Suicide, and no less than Dan Bongino himself. Now the FBI,
you know, the Deputy director posting that the Bureau is
sending personnel to Ana Conduct to help with this. That's probably,
you know, the story needs updating. Care that's they've probably
already arrived, I would imagine by now.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
I would believe, so they're probably dispatched from the Denver
office of the Bureau.
Speaker 1 (08:17):
Now. Interestingly enough too, and I'm sure you saw this.
The Owl Bar where this took place, it's got some history.
It's got a very interesting backstory. The bar as yeah,
in like the eighteen hundreds.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
And well, it was a mining town, and distractions and
entertainment for miners were few and far between in the
nineteenth century, we could imagine, so the Owl Bar probably
does have a real history.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
Says it served the town's smelt workers. That's according to
a nineteen eighty seven story in the Montana Standard, and
it cited the book Watering Holes in stating the bars
building opened in eighteen ninety three. For whatever that's worth,
I mean, Montana. I feel it's such a one of
(09:11):
our most beautiful states. But it is a it's a
veteran's it's a veteran mecca. Is that safe to say?
Nils Montana, I would say it is.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Well, it's it's sparsely populated up until recently read the
steep was fairly cheap there.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
Really it's beautiful too, Is it cheap there? That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
It's it's very beautiful, but it's rather cold in the winter.
I was looking at the weather on the morning that
our subject went missing. It was fifty four degrees at
seven o'clock in the morning on Saturday. Wow.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
Yeah, well, this is going to be interesting. I'll be
in touch later today between now and tomorrow morning when
this here is but I'll own it then too. We'll
see if anything transpair transpires between now and then. I
think it's fifty to fifty. Would you agree, Like there's
a chance something good. There's a chance we're in the
(10:10):
same place this time.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Tomorrow, we could be status quo tomorrow. Any they've devoted
some resources to this, and any experienced criminal investigator is
going to know that there's an excellent chance he's already
taken his own life, but still an old They still
have to be very cautious. He's a man very familiar
(10:31):
with small arms and could be quite dangerous to approach
if he's still alive.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Yeah, they say armed and dangerous. Well, we'll see, like
I said again, and I'll be in touch later today
via X. It's Nils Gravilius. What is your handle on
X again too, because I want people to make sure
they follow you if they can.
Speaker 2 (10:49):
At Detective Nils. There is an X formerly Twitter
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