September 2, 2024 • 10 mins
Ticket prices have increased exponentially over the years as retailers take advantage of dynamic pricing schemes.
Otherwise known as surge pricing, dynamic pricing sets flexible prices that change depending on the demand.
Many fans of Oasis wound up forking out double the advertised price of £148.50 (NZ$313.38) for the band’s reunion tour, spending £355.20 (NZ$749.58) instead.
The UK Government has stepped in, announcing a probe into the surge pricing.
Chris Schulz, Senior Investigative Journalist at Consumer NZ, told Kerre Woodham that we’ve seen prices go up and up since Covid, and ticket companies seem to be pushing how fast fans are willing to go to pay for those tickets.
He said that with the outcry over Oasis tickets we might have found that line, and maybe this is the point where politicians are calling for regulation.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Kerry Wood of Morning's podcast from
News Talks'd be.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Thousands of Oasis fans waited long hours and virtual cues
over the weekend to get their hands on tickets for
the band's reunion shows, which many thought would never happen,
only to find that prices had been hiked as part
of a dynamic pricing scheme. The UK government has stepped
into the furory and announced a probe into the surge pricing.
Chris Schultz is a senior investigative journalist at Consumer New
(00:34):
Zealand and has done a deep dive into how dynamic
pricing works. He joins me, now, very good morning.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
To you, you Tol you Kerry, how are you good?
Speaker 2 (00:43):
Thank you? You also understand how entertainment works. Am I the
last person? Well, I think I'm the second to last
person in the world to understand that that's how ticket
prices are set. I had no idea.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
Yeah, I think we've all experienced surge pricing and demand
pricing in some way. You know, whether you've stooke an
Ober at six pm on a Friday and pay a
life more than you would say at ten am, or
if you try and book a hotel or a flight
during school holidays and find it's a lot more than
if you go at other times of the year. I
(01:16):
think what's what's new is seeing this in the concert
ticket buying world. And I think we're seeing an outcrade too,
because post COVID, a lot of big acts are touring
and people are buying concert tickets and record numbers, and
maybe that's not something they've done a lot of and
they're that new to seeing sort of surge pricing and
(01:38):
in demand pricing work when they put a ticket into
their part online and suddenly find it's a lot more
than they thought it might be.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
How long have ticket do all ticket sellers do this?
Speaker 3 (01:55):
Ticket Tech and ticket Master are the main two and
the only two I think that do it, and you'll
mostly see it for the biggest shows. So when you
talk to ticket masters, they'll say, look, we just provide
a service. It's down to the artist whether they choose
to use it or not. So if you're angry, be
angry at the artists for turning this in demand pricing on.
(02:18):
So as a consumer, how it works as a certain
portion of tickets are set aside for this in demand
pricing structure and the rest of the normal price. For example,
Scisser when she came earlier this year, I bought a
GA ticket for two hundred and fifty dollars, but the
in demand price for that ticket was five hundred and
(02:38):
fifty dollars. People who didn't get in to get the
two hundred and fifty dollars tickets paid the five hundred
and fifty dollars ticket price. Chris Stapleton, the country singer,
same thing. His in demand tickets were five hundred dollars,
and I think they're about two fifty for the normal one.
So it depends where you are and those digital cues
as to whether you can get in and get those
(02:59):
cheaper tickets if you're late. Often in demand tickets because
of them are expensive. They're the only ones that are left.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
So it's up the artists to decide whether to turn
that facility on or off.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
Yes, what Ticketmaster has told me.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
Yeah, did Taylor Swift do it? I bet she didn't.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
No, I don't think she did. The big fray around
that was just a number of people who wanted tickets,
and so that crashed the master sciet and which means
she Yeah, everyone was mad about that. I don't think
she did know, but Oasis certainly has. Their tickets went
from one hundred and thirty five pounds to three hundred
(03:41):
and fifty five friend of mantickets, which makes them about
sort of seven eight hundred New Zealand dollars, which is
a hell of a lot of money for a concert
ticket to see a band that allegedly from the working
class population in Manchester.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
Yeah, well, there's divorces to pay for, and you know,
what odds do you give on them lasting the tour? Seriously,
reporter had.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
On only that first show is the guaranteed one. I
think after that it's all beds are off.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Oh my god, I know. But it's interesting how they
also use the algorithms to apparently now that's all come
out to know how much you are willing to pay
for a ticket, and then they will charge.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
Your Well, when you're dealing with fandom, it's a you know,
hotels and air flights and all that kind of stuff.
You can go another time. It's it's fine, you can
just choose to travel some other time, but to see
a concert. You don't know when Taylor's was coming back.
You don't know if Oasis will ever play again. So
(04:50):
there's that real demand there. And I think we've seen
that post COVID. You know, we've seen ticket prices go
up and up. They really seem to be pushing how
fast fans are willing to go to pay for those tickets.
And I think maybe you know this outcry over Oasis
it's in the UK, Maybe we've found that line. Maybe
this is the point where you know, politicians are calling
(05:11):
for regulation. It would be nice to see some kind
of rules set around maybe how many tickets can be
charged to their in demand pricing structure or how you know,
maybe they're not allowed to be set a more than
double maybe it's only sort of a twenty five percent
increase or something. It'd be really nice to see some
some rules and regulations around that to some openness, you know,
(05:34):
to make it a bit fairer.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
So they you know, if you've got a particular expense
of divorce to pay for, you can have five percent
of your tickets as in demand, not twenty percent or
fifty percent or something.
Speaker 3 (05:47):
Exactly. Well, where where it gets really unfair is when
an artist sells out a show and someone's paid those
in demand prices then announces another show. I spoke to
someone so this had happened to they'd bought a ticket
for Scissor. They'd paid sort of four hundred and fifty
five hundred dollars for that ticket, and then she out
another show and the demand wasn't as great for that show.
(06:08):
There were lots of tickets available at the normal price
of two hundred and fifty dollars, and so you know,
suddenly you're stuck with a ticket. You can't sell it
because there's there's just normal tickets available at a cheaper price.
So yeah, it's a really tricky thing and I'm not
surprised people aren't happy about it.
Speaker 2 (06:28):
Well, they've managed to put rules around scalping, so that's good.
I wonder if they can do it around dynamic. But
interesting they were saying the story that some London pubs
are going to charge more for a pint at peak times,
they're going to do and demand you know, demand surging
as well.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
We have seen this. Wendy's did try and do it
for Burgers and there was an outcry and they had
to stop it because people were so mad about it.
It does take sort of people power to change these things.
But when it comes to concert tickets. You know, we'd
have to stop buying tickets, but no one's going to
do that because we all want to see Tayless Worth
(07:04):
of Oasis live.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
So yeah, acc you know I did see Fleetwood Mac
in the original lineup. I'm sure I paid over the
odds for tickets in Vegas, but I don't remember.
Speaker 3 (07:18):
Now.
Speaker 2 (07:18):
That was in the dim mists of time and you
kind of forget about what you've paid.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
It's true, there are ways to try and avoid this,
so that was my one way.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Sorry, what was that?
Speaker 3 (07:32):
Yes, if you get into the pre sales. Often there
are sort of presales for certain credit card holders. If
you sign up for an artist's fan club, you're lofting
pre sale access and then you can access those cheaper tickets.
The other thing I'd suggest is, like it might sound
pretty obvious, but like there are great acts playing all
(07:53):
over the country. Maybe they're not in stadiums, maybe they're
in smaller venues, but you can often have a better
experience at you know, Whammy Bar in Auckland or the
Power Station or meow and Wellington with just for or
five hundred people. You're closer to the act, it's more
personal it's easy to get a beer, you're not standing
in the rain. To consider seeing a smaller act in
(08:15):
a smaller venue where those in demand ticket pricing structures
just they're not there because the act's not big enough.
But you may have a better time.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
I have to say one of the best nights I've
had recently was the ab A tribute band at the
Postman's Leg at Glenfield twenty bucks at the door. She
was a beauty.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
It was a fun night, exactly exactly.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
What about when you're booking, say for airlines or for
the ticketmaster? Is there a way can you get a
VPN or can you you know, a private kind of
internet address or is it best to go through a
broker to hide your information? Is there any way of
doing that or are they on top of.
Speaker 3 (08:53):
All of that. I've tried this, and I think it's
tricky because, yeah, you see, I saw the people were
sort of five or six screens open on their desktop.
But I think because you have to be logged into
ticket MARSK, you're already in there once and I think
they can see if you're in there sort of six times,
and it's the same for each screen. You're stuck at
(09:14):
a certain place in the queue on the same screen,
So I'm not sure that helps. I have tried this.
I've had you know, my computer open, my iPad open,
and my phone open, and it certainly didn't help me
get any any closer to those precious tickets. So I'm
not sure the jury's out on that one. I think
(09:34):
if there's a concert leg oasis and there's just like
millions of people trying to get in there, it is
a lottery.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
What about trying to hide the information that you give
to a New Zealand ticket master to supermarkets? Is there
any way of protecting your privacy there or is it
just the modern world and get with it.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
I have heard of this that you know, you visit
you visit any Zealand and search for tickets, you know,
one time in the morning and go back later and
they've remembered your details and something the tickets are a
lot higher. I'm I'm not sure. I haven't actually done
any investigation into that. It might be it might be
worth trying.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
Yeah, well, do report back if you get any kind
of positive outcome. Would be very interested to hear, and
I appreciate your insights. Chris Sholt senior investigative journalist Consumer
New Zealand news Talk said B it's accorded to eleven.
Speaker 1 (10:28):
For more from Carry Wooden Mornings, listen live to News
Talk Set B from nine am weekdays, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Kerry Wood of Morning's podcast from
News Talks'd be.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Thousands of Oasis fans waited long hours and virtual cues
over the weekend to get their hands on tickets for
the band's reunion shows, which many thought would never happen,
only to find that prices had been hiked as part
of a dynamic pricing scheme. The UK government has stepped
into the furory and announced a probe into the surge pricing.
Chris Schultz is a senior investigative journalist at Consumer New
(00:34):
Zealand and has done a deep dive into how dynamic
pricing works. He joins me, now, very good morning.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
To you, you Tol you Kerry, how are you good?
Speaker 2 (00:43):
Thank you? You also understand how entertainment works. Am I the
last person? Well, I think I'm the second to last
person in the world to understand that that's how ticket
prices are set. I had no idea.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
Yeah, I think we've all experienced surge pricing and demand
pricing in some way. You know, whether you've stooke an
Ober at six pm on a Friday and pay a
life more than you would say at ten am, or
if you try and book a hotel or a flight
during school holidays and find it's a lot more than
if you go at other times of the year. I
(01:16):
think what's what's new is seeing this in the concert
ticket buying world. And I think we're seeing an outcrade too,
because post COVID, a lot of big acts are touring
and people are buying concert tickets and record numbers, and
maybe that's not something they've done a lot of and
they're that new to seeing sort of surge pricing and
(01:38):
in demand pricing work when they put a ticket into
their part online and suddenly find it's a lot more
than they thought it might be.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
How long have ticket do all ticket sellers do this?
Speaker 3 (01:55):
Ticket Tech and ticket Master are the main two and
the only two I think that do it, and you'll
mostly see it for the biggest shows. So when you
talk to ticket masters, they'll say, look, we just provide
a service. It's down to the artist whether they choose
to use it or not. So if you're angry, be
angry at the artists for turning this in demand pricing on.
(02:18):
So as a consumer, how it works as a certain
portion of tickets are set aside for this in demand
pricing structure and the rest of the normal price. For example,
Scisser when she came earlier this year, I bought a
GA ticket for two hundred and fifty dollars, but the
in demand price for that ticket was five hundred and
(02:38):
fifty dollars. People who didn't get in to get the
two hundred and fifty dollars tickets paid the five hundred
and fifty dollars ticket price. Chris Stapleton, the country singer,
same thing. His in demand tickets were five hundred dollars,
and I think they're about two fifty for the normal one.
So it depends where you are and those digital cues
as to whether you can get in and get those
(02:59):
cheaper tickets if you're late. Often in demand tickets because
of them are expensive. They're the only ones that are left.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
So it's up the artists to decide whether to turn
that facility on or off.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
Yes, what Ticketmaster has told me.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
Yeah, did Taylor Swift do it? I bet she didn't.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
No, I don't think she did. The big fray around
that was just a number of people who wanted tickets,
and so that crashed the master sciet and which means
she Yeah, everyone was mad about that. I don't think
she did know, but Oasis certainly has. Their tickets went
from one hundred and thirty five pounds to three hundred
(03:41):
and fifty five friend of mantickets, which makes them about
sort of seven eight hundred New Zealand dollars, which is
a hell of a lot of money for a concert
ticket to see a band that allegedly from the working
class population in Manchester.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
Yeah, well, there's divorces to pay for, and you know,
what odds do you give on them lasting the tour? Seriously,
reporter had.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
On only that first show is the guaranteed one. I
think after that it's all beds are off.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Oh my god, I know. But it's interesting how they
also use the algorithms to apparently now that's all come
out to know how much you are willing to pay
for a ticket, and then they will charge.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
Your Well, when you're dealing with fandom, it's a you know,
hotels and air flights and all that kind of stuff.
You can go another time. It's it's fine, you can
just choose to travel some other time, but to see
a concert. You don't know when Taylor's was coming back.
You don't know if Oasis will ever play again. So
(04:50):
there's that real demand there. And I think we've seen
that post COVID. You know, we've seen ticket prices go
up and up. They really seem to be pushing how
fast fans are willing to go to pay for those tickets.
And I think maybe you know this outcry over Oasis
it's in the UK, Maybe we've found that line. Maybe
this is the point where you know, politicians are calling
(05:11):
for regulation. It would be nice to see some kind
of rules set around maybe how many tickets can be
charged to their in demand pricing structure or how you know,
maybe they're not allowed to be set a more than
double maybe it's only sort of a twenty five percent
increase or something. It'd be really nice to see some
some rules and regulations around that to some openness, you know,
(05:34):
to make it a bit fairer.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
So they you know, if you've got a particular expense
of divorce to pay for, you can have five percent
of your tickets as in demand, not twenty percent or
fifty percent or something.
Speaker 3 (05:47):
Exactly. Well, where where it gets really unfair is when
an artist sells out a show and someone's paid those
in demand prices then announces another show. I spoke to
someone so this had happened to they'd bought a ticket
for Scissor. They'd paid sort of four hundred and fifty
five hundred dollars for that ticket, and then she out
another show and the demand wasn't as great for that show.
(06:08):
There were lots of tickets available at the normal price
of two hundred and fifty dollars, and so you know,
suddenly you're stuck with a ticket. You can't sell it
because there's there's just normal tickets available at a cheaper price.
So yeah, it's a really tricky thing and I'm not
surprised people aren't happy about it.
Speaker 2 (06:28):
Well, they've managed to put rules around scalping, so that's good.
I wonder if they can do it around dynamic. But
interesting they were saying the story that some London pubs
are going to charge more for a pint at peak times,
they're going to do and demand you know, demand surging
as well.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
We have seen this. Wendy's did try and do it
for Burgers and there was an outcry and they had
to stop it because people were so mad about it.
It does take sort of people power to change these things.
But when it comes to concert tickets. You know, we'd
have to stop buying tickets, but no one's going to
do that because we all want to see Tayless Worth
(07:04):
of Oasis live.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
So yeah, acc you know I did see Fleetwood Mac
in the original lineup. I'm sure I paid over the
odds for tickets in Vegas, but I don't remember.
Speaker 3 (07:18):
Now.
Speaker 2 (07:18):
That was in the dim mists of time and you
kind of forget about what you've paid.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
It's true, there are ways to try and avoid this,
so that was my one way.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Sorry, what was that?
Speaker 3 (07:32):
Yes, if you get into the pre sales. Often there
are sort of presales for certain credit card holders. If
you sign up for an artist's fan club, you're lofting
pre sale access and then you can access those cheaper tickets.
The other thing I'd suggest is, like it might sound
pretty obvious, but like there are great acts playing all
(07:53):
over the country. Maybe they're not in stadiums, maybe they're
in smaller venues, but you can often have a better
experience at you know, Whammy Bar in Auckland or the
Power Station or meow and Wellington with just for or
five hundred people. You're closer to the act, it's more
personal it's easy to get a beer, you're not standing
in the rain. To consider seeing a smaller act in
(08:15):
a smaller venue where those in demand ticket pricing structures
just they're not there because the act's not big enough.
But you may have a better time.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
I have to say one of the best nights I've
had recently was the ab A tribute band at the
Postman's Leg at Glenfield twenty bucks at the door. She
was a beauty.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
It was a fun night, exactly exactly.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
What about when you're booking, say for airlines or for
the ticketmaster? Is there a way can you get a
VPN or can you you know, a private kind of
internet address or is it best to go through a
broker to hide your information? Is there any way of
doing that or are they on top of.
Speaker 3 (08:53):
All of that. I've tried this, and I think it's
tricky because, yeah, you see, I saw the people were
sort of five or six screens open on their desktop.
But I think because you have to be logged into
ticket MARSK, you're already in there once and I think
they can see if you're in there sort of six times,
and it's the same for each screen. You're stuck at
(09:14):
a certain place in the queue on the same screen,
So I'm not sure that helps. I have tried this.
I've had you know, my computer open, my iPad open,
and my phone open, and it certainly didn't help me
get any any closer to those precious tickets. So I'm
not sure the jury's out on that one. I think
(09:34):
if there's a concert leg oasis and there's just like
millions of people trying to get in there, it is
a lottery.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
What about trying to hide the information that you give
to a New Zealand ticket master to supermarkets? Is there
any way of protecting your privacy there or is it
just the modern world and get with it.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
I have heard of this that you know, you visit
you visit any Zealand and search for tickets, you know,
one time in the morning and go back later and
they've remembered your details and something the tickets are a
lot higher. I'm I'm not sure. I haven't actually done
any investigation into that. It might be it might be
worth trying.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
Yeah, well, do report back if you get any kind
of positive outcome. Would be very interested to hear, and
I appreciate your insights. Chris Sholt senior investigative journalist Consumer
New Zealand news Talk said B it's accorded to eleven.
Speaker 1 (10:28):
For more from Carry Wooden Mornings, listen live to News
Talk Set B from nine am weekdays, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio
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