June 18, 2025 • 8 mins
Changes to allow over the counter sales of Melatonin in New Zealand alongside relaxing rules on magic mushrooms as medicine.
MedSafe's approved Melatonin for sale to adults without a prescription.
Psilocybin remains unapproved, but one specifically qualified psychiatrist is now permitted to prescribe it for treatment-resistant depression.
Broadcaster Sonia Gray has been trialling psychedelic drugs as an anxiety treatment, and joined Kerre Woodham to speak about her experience.
“Nothing is a silver bullet, and nothing is going to work for everybody all the time, but we need more tools.”
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the carry wood of morning's podcast from
News Talks.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
He'd be broadcaster Sonya Gray has recently appeared on screen
doing exactly that. It's basically doing a trial of alternative
therapies for depression, and she joins us, now, very good
morning to you, Sonya. Hi Kerrie, thank you so much
(00:32):
for taking the time.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
It's a pleasure.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Is this a good will this be good news for
people who suffer from depression and other disorders of the mind.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
I think so. I think it's really exciting.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
I mean, nothing is a silver bullet, and nothing is
going to work for everybody all the time. But obviously
we need more tools. You know, we're in a mental
health crisis and we need to look wider. And I
think this is great, great for Cameron Lacy the doctor.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
And yeah, I was thinking the thing. I wasn't going
to name them given the numbers of no.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
But it's out there that I.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Exactly. So what is it in terms of what psilocybins
can do? What is it what's different about them psilocybins?
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Oh, psilocybin Sorry, well I don't know, that's what I say.
I think it's either either, So Psilocybin is kind of
the active ingredient in magic mushrooms.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Now I am not an expert, Carey, no.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
No, but I was. I was ringing. I was ringing
because most people aren't and most people are just ordinary
people trying to find something to help.
Speaker 3 (01:49):
Yeah, yeah, exactly, and a lot of people are really desperate.
And I went into so the documentary is mind Menders,
and I went into filming very skeptical, I would say,
and very cautious and someone that hasn't ever taken psychedelic
drugs in any form, And I can say I think
(02:13):
my mind has changed. I think, yeah, still cautious, and
I think, you know, these are Class A drugs and
because they can do harm if they're not used in
the right way under supervision. So I didn't take psilocybin
as part of the documentary. I took a microdos LSD
(02:36):
and macro dos ketamine. But yeah, we obviously interviewed doctor
Cameron Lacy and a lot of other people on psilocybin
and the benefits and some people's lives have been completely
changed by this when nothing else has worked, when they've
been on all the other drugs. So you know, who
(02:57):
are we to say you can't do that, you can't
try that.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
That's just plain dumb. You've got to try everything. And
you know, these drugs have been around in a natural
state for a lot of these drugs have been around
in a natural state for a very long time. Not
here to mean obviously, but you know some of them and.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
Yeah, yeah, well they've been used for thousands of years
by indigenous cultures.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
So yeah, everything's worth a try. So when you say
you think your mind has changed, do you feel like
it's jumped back onto the tracks if you know what
I mean?
Speaker 3 (03:29):
Oh, I mean, I mean my mind has changed in
terms of all drugs are bad.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
Oh what I kind of was, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:37):
Yeah, I think you know, I've been humbled a little bit.
I've seen and heard and I think experienced the healing
qualities I guess of psychedelics.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
Still, I want to say that with you know, cautionary
add on that that it's not like I didn't go
out and source these on the streets and take them.
That would have been something I would do and I
don't think is advisable. So it's really difficult because there
is so many restrictions and hopefully things will moving in
(04:16):
the right direction where this can be opened up for
more practitioners to use as part of therapy.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
I think as cannabis will and cannabinoids have become and
medicinal cannabis have become more readily available through prescription, I
think people's minds have changed to you know, it might
have been the same thing that you experienced. People who
had hitherto been really opposed to any kind of drug
whatsoever illegal drug as opposed to pharmaceutical drug its suddenly
(04:48):
finds that nothing is helping them, and all of a sudden,
the cannabis and the properties in cannabis are and it
does make them think, huh okay, well maybe maybe not
all drugs bad.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I was. I didn't realize how.
Speaker 3 (05:06):
I guess the War on drugs had, you know, I
was born after that all started, and so I grew
up just you know, with the drugs are bad, and
I didn't sort of question it.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
I mean, I say, are the people you know like
took it like?
Speaker 3 (05:22):
But it was just that there's no there's no good necessarily,
and I didn't I didn't know about the potential healing
properties of particularly psychedelic drugs, and I don't think kidamine
is actually a psychedelic, but it has psychedelic properties.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
So kind of does I took well, I didn't take
here to mean. I was given here to mean when
I an hospital and I was told to think happy
thoughts otherwise you can go down a dark hole apparently.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Hey ho, hell yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
And I thought happy thoughts and the next thing, I
was galloping on a unicorn and you know, through a rainbow,
and there were bright lights and it was incredible. You know,
it was amazing, But I wouldn't do it again.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
Yeah, No, I totally understand that. And I think that's
why you need someone to guide you through. And I think,
you know, I started with the LSD micro dosing trial
and that was great and I did feel some benefits initially.
Then halfway through I got incredibly busy with work, and
no small amount of LSD is going to you know,
(06:32):
touch the sides of that.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
So you have to kind of look at it in
a holistic way.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
And I think the lead researcher said to me, if
you haven't got the basics in place, then these medicines
can't do anything, you know, like it's the icing on
the cake basically, So you've got to look after your sleep,
and you've got exercise and diet and all those things,
and then this can help help. It can sort of
(07:00):
be a catalyst to help you to get you know,
on track to having a healthier life. It's a very nuanced,
complicated topic, but it is so fascinating and there is
so much potential and yeah, I think looking at it. Sorry,
I was going to say that when I was microdacing
the LSD, I was just I headed at home. I
(07:22):
took it twice a week, went on with my day,
and I felt like there was something missing, and I
think that missing piece was the sort of therapy side
of things, yea, which is what the psychiatrist has been.
This is psilocybin therapy, so it's therapy with psilocybin, So
it's the whole package, you know, And I think that's
(07:44):
where the real benefit will be for people.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
Yeah, absolutely beautifully, Thank you so much, Sonja min. Mind Menders,
not mind Benders, but Mind Menders is available to watch
on neon, a two part documentary where Sonya goes out
to find out if psychedelics could help in the fight
against mental health and addiction crisis. For more from carry
(08:09):
Wood and mornings. Listen live to News Talks at B
from nine am weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the carry wood of morning's podcast from
News Talks.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
He'd be broadcaster Sonya Gray has recently appeared on screen
doing exactly that. It's basically doing a trial of alternative
therapies for depression, and she joins us, now, very good
morning to you, Sonya. Hi Kerrie, thank you so much
(00:32):
for taking the time.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
It's a pleasure.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Is this a good will this be good news for
people who suffer from depression and other disorders of the mind.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
I think so. I think it's really exciting.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
I mean, nothing is a silver bullet, and nothing is
going to work for everybody all the time. But obviously
we need more tools. You know, we're in a mental
health crisis and we need to look wider. And I
think this is great, great for Cameron Lacy the doctor.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
And yeah, I was thinking the thing. I wasn't going
to name them given the numbers of no.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
But it's out there that I.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Exactly. So what is it in terms of what psilocybins
can do? What is it what's different about them psilocybins?
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Oh, psilocybin Sorry, well I don't know, that's what I say.
I think it's either either, So Psilocybin is kind of
the active ingredient in magic mushrooms.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Now I am not an expert, Carey, no.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
No, but I was. I was ringing. I was ringing
because most people aren't and most people are just ordinary
people trying to find something to help.
Speaker 3 (01:49):
Yeah, yeah, exactly, and a lot of people are really desperate.
And I went into so the documentary is mind Menders,
and I went into filming very skeptical, I would say,
and very cautious and someone that hasn't ever taken psychedelic
drugs in any form, And I can say I think
(02:13):
my mind has changed. I think, yeah, still cautious, and
I think, you know, these are Class A drugs and
because they can do harm if they're not used in
the right way under supervision. So I didn't take psilocybin
as part of the documentary. I took a microdos LSD
(02:36):
and macro dos ketamine. But yeah, we obviously interviewed doctor
Cameron Lacy and a lot of other people on psilocybin
and the benefits and some people's lives have been completely
changed by this when nothing else has worked, when they've
been on all the other drugs. So you know, who
(02:57):
are we to say you can't do that, you can't
try that.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
That's just plain dumb. You've got to try everything. And
you know, these drugs have been around in a natural
state for a lot of these drugs have been around
in a natural state for a very long time. Not
here to mean obviously, but you know some of them and.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
Yeah, yeah, well they've been used for thousands of years
by indigenous cultures.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
So yeah, everything's worth a try. So when you say
you think your mind has changed, do you feel like
it's jumped back onto the tracks if you know what
I mean?
Speaker 3 (03:29):
Oh, I mean, I mean my mind has changed in
terms of all drugs are bad.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
Oh what I kind of was, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:37):
Yeah, I think you know, I've been humbled a little bit.
I've seen and heard and I think experienced the healing
qualities I guess of psychedelics.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
Still, I want to say that with you know, cautionary
add on that that it's not like I didn't go
out and source these on the streets and take them.
That would have been something I would do and I
don't think is advisable. So it's really difficult because there
is so many restrictions and hopefully things will moving in
(04:16):
the right direction where this can be opened up for
more practitioners to use as part of therapy.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
I think as cannabis will and cannabinoids have become and
medicinal cannabis have become more readily available through prescription, I
think people's minds have changed to you know, it might
have been the same thing that you experienced. People who
had hitherto been really opposed to any kind of drug
whatsoever illegal drug as opposed to pharmaceutical drug its suddenly
(04:48):
finds that nothing is helping them, and all of a sudden,
the cannabis and the properties in cannabis are and it
does make them think, huh okay, well maybe maybe not
all drugs bad.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I was. I didn't realize how.
Speaker 3 (05:06):
I guess the War on drugs had, you know, I
was born after that all started, and so I grew
up just you know, with the drugs are bad, and
I didn't sort of question it.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
I mean, I say, are the people you know like
took it like?
Speaker 3 (05:22):
But it was just that there's no there's no good necessarily,
and I didn't I didn't know about the potential healing
properties of particularly psychedelic drugs, and I don't think kidamine
is actually a psychedelic, but it has psychedelic properties.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
So kind of does I took well, I didn't take
here to mean. I was given here to mean when
I an hospital and I was told to think happy
thoughts otherwise you can go down a dark hole apparently.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Hey ho, hell yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
And I thought happy thoughts and the next thing, I
was galloping on a unicorn and you know, through a rainbow,
and there were bright lights and it was incredible. You know,
it was amazing, But I wouldn't do it again.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
Yeah, No, I totally understand that. And I think that's
why you need someone to guide you through. And I think,
you know, I started with the LSD micro dosing trial
and that was great and I did feel some benefits initially.
Then halfway through I got incredibly busy with work, and
no small amount of LSD is going to you know,
(06:32):
touch the sides of that.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
So you have to kind of look at it in
a holistic way.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
And I think the lead researcher said to me, if
you haven't got the basics in place, then these medicines
can't do anything, you know, like it's the icing on
the cake basically, So you've got to look after your sleep,
and you've got exercise and diet and all those things,
and then this can help help. It can sort of
(07:00):
be a catalyst to help you to get you know,
on track to having a healthier life. It's a very nuanced,
complicated topic, but it is so fascinating and there is
so much potential and yeah, I think looking at it. Sorry,
I was going to say that when I was microdacing
the LSD, I was just I headed at home. I
(07:22):
took it twice a week, went on with my day,
and I felt like there was something missing, and I
think that missing piece was the sort of therapy side
of things, yea, which is what the psychiatrist has been.
This is psilocybin therapy, so it's therapy with psilocybin, So
it's the whole package, you know, And I think that's
(07:44):
where the real benefit will be for people.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
Yeah, absolutely beautifully, Thank you so much, Sonja min. Mind Menders,
not mind Benders, but Mind Menders is available to watch
on neon, a two part documentary where Sonya goes out
to find out if psychedelics could help in the fight
against mental health and addiction crisis. For more from carry
(08:09):
Wood and mornings. Listen live to News Talks at B
from nine am weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
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