November 12, 2025 • 13 mins
How common is it for people to be living double lives?
Former Deputy Police Commissioner Jevon McSkimming is awaiting sentence after pleading guilty to having child sexual exploitation and bestiality material on his work devices.
An IPCA report also found complaints of McSkimming being a sexual predator were ignored, the emails the woman sent instead being used to prosecute her for harassment.
Private Investigator Julia Hartley Moore told Kerre Woodham that the number of people living double and secret lives is an epidemic.
"I think they just do it because they can,” she said.
“People have an endless capacity to deceive each other – I think that certain people will never and there’s certain people that will, and there’s a hell of a lot that do.”
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the carry wood of morning's podcast from
News Talks.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
He'd be Julia Hartley Moore joins me now private investigator,
owner and founder of JHM Private Investigation Services. She joins
me from France via WhatsApp, living her best life. Very
good morning to you, Julia.
Speaker 3 (00:25):
It's a good evening to me. Morning to you. Now.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Double lives. You know we're hearing a bit about that
because of I don't know if you've kept up with
the goings on at Police HQ.
Speaker 3 (00:40):
Yes, I have heard a little bit about it, but
my job is uncovering double lives, so continue.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Yes, how common is it for people to be living
a double life? Brand Roach, the Public Service Commissioner, made
reference to it this morning that people, you know, need
to front foot it. But if you're living a double life,
you want it secret. You're not going to front foot today, Carrie.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
It is. It's like an epidemic. I mean that's what essentially. Yeah, yeah,
I mean just recently we had a client who at
Christian couple and she just wondered what her husband was
up to on the weekends and she and what it
turned out to be was that he was running a
(01:29):
string of brothels that she and owned property all over
New Zealand that she had no idea about here. We
had another one who the husband purchased a home about
four minutes away from his family home where he put
in his his partner and her child and he lived
(01:54):
with her and with his wife, without his wife knowing.
He would go on. He would say he was going
on business trips to his wife and he'd be four
minutes down the road with his lover and the child.
It's this is just I could go on and on
and on and on. It's just it's it's kind of
what that is our work, that is what we do.
And people say, why does it matter? Well, it matters
(02:17):
hugely when you look at the finances. It's about financial
and fidelity, so it's it does matter. Well, what's happened
in New Zealand is appalling. I think it's appalling.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
So are they addicted to the thrill of it, the
fact that it is a secret.
Speaker 3 (02:38):
I think, you know, Kerry, I think they just do
it because they can. You know, it's there's some people
that are just programmed to betray, to be deceitful, you know.
I think that's what a lot of it is, and
people have an endless capacity to deceive each other. So
(02:58):
I think there's that certain people will never and there's
certain people that will, and there's a hell of a
lot that, do.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
You say people? So that includes women as well?
Speaker 3 (03:08):
Right, oh, yeah, totally. It's not just male, it's not
just men. Yeah, it's and women probably get away with
it a lot more that they are not discovered as
much as men are because women often have a plan.
Women are far more deceitful, manipulative, and all the rest
of it, and carry out a plan, usually with the
(03:28):
aid of a friend, a girlfriend, someone close, whereas guys
don't think about it. They just blunder in and do it.
And they usually That's why when I kind of refer
to a lot of my cases, I say the guy
did this, the guy did that, because we catch them.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
But women are more difficult to find.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
Women are more difficult and usually the guys we're catching
where you know of a high end, intelligent professional people,
they're not silly guys. You know, these men have got
very good jobs, but when it comes to emotional intelligence
and it comes to things like this, they're idiots.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
Well, they also must have a lot of money like,
I mean, I don't think I'll be able to blunder
down the road and just buy a house to install
my toy.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
Boy. This is exactly right. They do have a lot
of money. And the thing is the more money they have,
the more they can play. For example, we had one
guy that flew from Auckland to Queenstown, booked into a
hotel in Queenstown and said to the receptionist, now, Locke,
if my wife rings, just tell her I'm out. So
(04:39):
he then flew back to Auckland and spent a weekend,
a long weekend with his girlfriend, and of course the
wife was ringing, and when you know, she just heard
he was out, probably playing golf, for doing whatever. Didn't
worry about it. But he wasn't out. He wasn't he
just he was. I mean, you know, the the things
that they do, the elaborate plans they come up with
(05:01):
to deceive, is incredible.
Speaker 2 (05:05):
How much, oh it has helped along by willful ignorance.
You don't want to blow up your home, you choose
not to know.
Speaker 3 (05:16):
I look, I think, because do you know you're correct?
Because most people often say, oh my gosh, Julia, how
do you tell these people what's going on? Well, the
thing is they know by the time they come to me,
they actually know in their heart, they know. They don't
want to believe it. They want me to say it
isn't happening, but deep down they know. It's taken a
(05:36):
long time before they pick up the phone for me
to me. So it's some of course who wants to
really have to, you know, look this in the face
and realize that this is what's going on. And now
what do I do? Do I stay? Do I accept it?
What do I do? And a lot of people stay.
(05:57):
Most people stay, that's the tragedy. They do stay, and
they think there's no other option, but there is. I
mean it for your men health, you know, it's not
good to stay because you actually don't ever get past
it unless your partner comes clean without you having to
make them.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
When it comes to that kind of infidelity, that's one thing,
but the illegal porn addiction is another. And maybe if
you're gambling or stealing money from your employer, something that's
illegal that you're keeping hidden. Is there a sense of
(06:37):
relief from people when they are busted.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
You kind of would think there would be, But to
be fair, we never have had that Oh okay, they yeah,
I mean, as we would think that, right, But often
people that do this kind of stuff don't think that
they're justifying everything they do all the time. So, I mean,
we've had a lot of cases with illegal sexual addictions
(07:04):
and it and it's really that's really tough when that's
that's discovered and the partner who discovers.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
It and they're not grateful that it's all come clean
and they can get help and start to live a better.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
Life because a lot of the times, honestly they have
they like I say, they've justified it to themselves and
it's not that bad, you know, I mean, you know,
some people are just boring. Some people have just stayed.
I mean, this is you know, it's not that bad,
and it's kind of tragic that that's how they think
and that's how they've convinced themselves when it is serious,
(07:41):
it's really bad.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
It's interesting to say it's an epidemic because you'd only
see it from from clients, so you'd get a would
you get a distorted view of how people behave It's
but like I remember a prostitute saying to me that
all married men cheat, Like no, they don't. And she said, well,
the only men I have a marriage. And I'm like,
but you don't see every man in New Zealand.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
No, exactly right, exactly right. And I don't say that
because I know all men don't cheat, see, I know
that for a fact. But when when you say that,
it's a distorted view. No, we actually are there on
the ground on the we are seeing. We are seeing it,
we are watching it, we're following it. We're watching these guys.
(08:21):
We know what they're telling their wives. We know what
we're seeing, and what we're seeing is not what they're
telling their wives, you know. So well, we just had
a guy the other day saying to his wife he
was just taking his car and to have it serviced.
And sure enough, he was heading in the right direction
for that. But then my investigator said, he's gone up
(08:42):
the street, just a residential, very nice residential street, and
he's gone up a long right of way and there
was rather large numbers on the letterbox, you know, bigger
than the other houses in the street. Well, as investigators,
we know straight away that's a prostitute, that's a brothels ah.
You know. Sometimes you could probably see the numbers from
(09:04):
space that big. I didn't know that you go there
and so and then and then the other the idiotic
thing he did. We were able to see up into
this parking area, up in the right of way. She
comes out, she's given him a kiss. I mean, clearly
they knew each other. He had been seeing her for
(09:25):
a long time. There was they were very very friendly,
you know. So and yet you know, he had he
told his wife that he was getting the car service
he could. He stuck to that story when he got home,
but the wife knew otherwise by then.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
So she in her hand.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Yeah. Yeah. So look, it's just there's different levels of it, Carrie,
There's different levels of it. And that's the thing. You know,
some are really bad, some of these double lives that
go on for you know, quite a long time, and
his children involved. That's that's that's really really bad. And
(10:06):
that is and that's where a lot of my clients,
over over a lot of time, a lot of thinking,
actually do take action because you know that their partner
has set up a double life with someone else and
financially supported that person out of matrimonial funds, so you know,
and had children and all I think what that does
(10:27):
to the primary family.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
It's just devastating. Will it'd be worse too if you
had your suspicions and were gas lit. That would that
would make you unhinged where you would think you were
going mad.
Speaker 3 (10:41):
I think, but I think most of them are, because
most of these women will say to me, look, I've
asked him, I've said to him, tell me the truth.
But you see, that's the wrong thing to do. That's
not what you do. You don't want it because you
need no asking. A liar and a cheatah and a
deceiver is if he's deceiving you, is not going to
get you a yes, of course. So you've got to
(11:04):
keep your powder dry. You've got to get your evidence.
If you've got a niggle and it keeps coming back
and you just know something's going on, you get you
know it. You know what we're like as a woman,
we're intuitive. You can't help yourself. Don't say anything. I
know it's hard, but the minute you do, you could
change their behavior. And if you want to find out,
(11:26):
you could. It can take longer to find out. Keep
your powder dry, get your ducks in a row and
so you know, and get someone to get you that
evidence and then confront them if they if you can,
if it's safe too, But you don't do that either
if it's not safe, which we look after all of that,
(11:48):
so you know, we do risk assessments and things like
that there's any violence, you know, any violence, and if
there's somebody's been violent towards her, etc. I mean, we
don't ever ever let someone disclose the information they have
unless it's in a safe environment.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
Right because you wouldn't know, I mean you would you
were think he wasn't violent or she wasn't violent. But
if it's you'd wonder if you knew them at all
when you find out the evidence that you've gathered.
Speaker 3 (12:16):
I think, like I said to you before, most people do.
And most people, I'll say, I'll often say to a client,
has he ever been violent? And they'll say, oh, no, no, no,
well he well, well once he pushed me, once he
did this, you know, slammed in my hand in the door,
or and I just say that that that's violence, that
(12:36):
is violence. And you but they because they are so
used to their condition, so therefore they start thinking that's
the normal, you know, and that's not so bad because
I didn't die, it didn't you know, it got better,
and that's really terrible what this stuff does. And it
completely makes people feel like they're going nuts when they
(12:58):
do confront and they're told they're mad, they're told that
this is not happening, and yet every fiber in the
air being kind of tells them something's not right.
Speaker 2 (13:10):
Thank you so much for your expertise. Julia Hartley Moore,
private investigator, owner and founder of JHM Private Investigation Services.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
For more from Kerrywood and Mornings, listen live to News
Talks at B from nine am weekdays, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the carry wood of morning's podcast from
News Talks.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
He'd be Julia Hartley Moore joins me now private investigator,
owner and founder of JHM Private Investigation Services. She joins
me from France via WhatsApp, living her best life. Very
good morning to you, Julia.
Speaker 3 (00:25):
It's a good evening to me. Morning to you. Now.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Double lives. You know we're hearing a bit about that
because of I don't know if you've kept up with
the goings on at Police HQ.
Speaker 3 (00:40):
Yes, I have heard a little bit about it, but
my job is uncovering double lives, so continue.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Yes, how common is it for people to be living
a double life? Brand Roach, the Public Service Commissioner, made
reference to it this morning that people, you know, need
to front foot it. But if you're living a double life,
you want it secret. You're not going to front foot today, Carrie.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
It is. It's like an epidemic. I mean that's what essentially. Yeah, yeah,
I mean just recently we had a client who at
Christian couple and she just wondered what her husband was
up to on the weekends and she and what it
turned out to be was that he was running a
(01:29):
string of brothels that she and owned property all over
New Zealand that she had no idea about here. We
had another one who the husband purchased a home about
four minutes away from his family home where he put
in his his partner and her child and he lived
(01:54):
with her and with his wife, without his wife knowing.
He would go on. He would say he was going
on business trips to his wife and he'd be four
minutes down the road with his lover and the child.
It's this is just I could go on and on
and on and on. It's just it's it's kind of
what that is our work, that is what we do.
And people say, why does it matter? Well, it matters
(02:17):
hugely when you look at the finances. It's about financial
and fidelity, so it's it does matter. Well, what's happened
in New Zealand is appalling. I think it's appalling.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
So are they addicted to the thrill of it, the
fact that it is a secret.
Speaker 3 (02:38):
I think, you know, Kerry, I think they just do
it because they can. You know, it's there's some people
that are just programmed to betray, to be deceitful, you know.
I think that's what a lot of it is, and
people have an endless capacity to deceive each other. So
(02:58):
I think there's that certain people will never and there's
certain people that will, and there's a hell of a
lot that, do.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
You say people? So that includes women as well?
Speaker 3 (03:08):
Right, oh, yeah, totally. It's not just male, it's not
just men. Yeah, it's and women probably get away with
it a lot more that they are not discovered as
much as men are because women often have a plan.
Women are far more deceitful, manipulative, and all the rest
of it, and carry out a plan, usually with the
(03:28):
aid of a friend, a girlfriend, someone close, whereas guys
don't think about it. They just blunder in and do it.
And they usually That's why when I kind of refer
to a lot of my cases, I say the guy
did this, the guy did that, because we catch them.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
But women are more difficult to find.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
Women are more difficult and usually the guys we're catching
where you know of a high end, intelligent professional people,
they're not silly guys. You know, these men have got
very good jobs, but when it comes to emotional intelligence
and it comes to things like this, they're idiots.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
Well, they also must have a lot of money like,
I mean, I don't think I'll be able to blunder
down the road and just buy a house to install
my toy.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
Boy. This is exactly right. They do have a lot
of money. And the thing is the more money they have,
the more they can play. For example, we had one
guy that flew from Auckland to Queenstown, booked into a
hotel in Queenstown and said to the receptionist, now, Locke,
if my wife rings, just tell her I'm out. So
(04:39):
he then flew back to Auckland and spent a weekend,
a long weekend with his girlfriend, and of course the
wife was ringing, and when you know, she just heard
he was out, probably playing golf, for doing whatever. Didn't
worry about it. But he wasn't out. He wasn't he
just he was. I mean, you know, the the things
that they do, the elaborate plans they come up with
(05:01):
to deceive, is incredible.
Speaker 2 (05:05):
How much, oh it has helped along by willful ignorance.
You don't want to blow up your home, you choose
not to know.
Speaker 3 (05:16):
I look, I think, because do you know you're correct?
Because most people often say, oh my gosh, Julia, how
do you tell these people what's going on? Well, the
thing is they know by the time they come to me,
they actually know in their heart, they know. They don't
want to believe it. They want me to say it
isn't happening, but deep down they know. It's taken a
(05:36):
long time before they pick up the phone for me
to me. So it's some of course who wants to
really have to, you know, look this in the face
and realize that this is what's going on. And now
what do I do? Do I stay? Do I accept it?
What do I do? And a lot of people stay.
(05:57):
Most people stay, that's the tragedy. They do stay, and
they think there's no other option, but there is. I
mean it for your men health, you know, it's not
good to stay because you actually don't ever get past
it unless your partner comes clean without you having to
make them.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
When it comes to that kind of infidelity, that's one thing,
but the illegal porn addiction is another. And maybe if
you're gambling or stealing money from your employer, something that's
illegal that you're keeping hidden. Is there a sense of
(06:37):
relief from people when they are busted.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
You kind of would think there would be, But to
be fair, we never have had that Oh okay, they yeah,
I mean, as we would think that, right, But often
people that do this kind of stuff don't think that
they're justifying everything they do all the time. So, I mean,
we've had a lot of cases with illegal sexual addictions
(07:04):
and it and it's really that's really tough when that's
that's discovered and the partner who discovers.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
It and they're not grateful that it's all come clean
and they can get help and start to live a better.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
Life because a lot of the times, honestly they have
they like I say, they've justified it to themselves and
it's not that bad, you know, I mean, you know,
some people are just boring. Some people have just stayed.
I mean, this is you know, it's not that bad,
and it's kind of tragic that that's how they think
and that's how they've convinced themselves when it is serious,
(07:41):
it's really bad.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
It's interesting to say it's an epidemic because you'd only
see it from from clients, so you'd get a would
you get a distorted view of how people behave It's
but like I remember a prostitute saying to me that
all married men cheat, Like no, they don't. And she said, well,
the only men I have a marriage. And I'm like,
but you don't see every man in New Zealand.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
No, exactly right, exactly right. And I don't say that
because I know all men don't cheat, see, I know
that for a fact. But when when you say that,
it's a distorted view. No, we actually are there on
the ground on the we are seeing. We are seeing it,
we are watching it, we're following it. We're watching these guys.
(08:21):
We know what they're telling their wives. We know what
we're seeing, and what we're seeing is not what they're
telling their wives, you know. So well, we just had
a guy the other day saying to his wife he
was just taking his car and to have it serviced.
And sure enough, he was heading in the right direction
for that. But then my investigator said, he's gone up
(08:42):
the street, just a residential, very nice residential street, and
he's gone up a long right of way and there
was rather large numbers on the letterbox, you know, bigger
than the other houses in the street. Well, as investigators,
we know straight away that's a prostitute, that's a brothels ah.
You know. Sometimes you could probably see the numbers from
(09:04):
space that big. I didn't know that you go there
and so and then and then the other the idiotic
thing he did. We were able to see up into
this parking area, up in the right of way. She
comes out, she's given him a kiss. I mean, clearly
they knew each other. He had been seeing her for
(09:25):
a long time. There was they were very very friendly,
you know. So and yet you know, he had he
told his wife that he was getting the car service
he could. He stuck to that story when he got home,
but the wife knew otherwise by then.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
So she in her hand.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Yeah. Yeah. So look, it's just there's different levels of it, Carrie,
There's different levels of it. And that's the thing. You know,
some are really bad, some of these double lives that
go on for you know, quite a long time, and
his children involved. That's that's that's really really bad. And
(10:06):
that is and that's where a lot of my clients,
over over a lot of time, a lot of thinking,
actually do take action because you know that their partner
has set up a double life with someone else and
financially supported that person out of matrimonial funds, so you know,
and had children and all I think what that does
(10:27):
to the primary family.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
It's just devastating. Will it'd be worse too if you
had your suspicions and were gas lit. That would that
would make you unhinged where you would think you were
going mad.
Speaker 3 (10:41):
I think, but I think most of them are, because
most of these women will say to me, look, I've
asked him, I've said to him, tell me the truth.
But you see, that's the wrong thing to do. That's
not what you do. You don't want it because you
need no asking. A liar and a cheatah and a
deceiver is if he's deceiving you, is not going to
get you a yes, of course. So you've got to
(11:04):
keep your powder dry. You've got to get your evidence.
If you've got a niggle and it keeps coming back
and you just know something's going on, you get you
know it. You know what we're like as a woman,
we're intuitive. You can't help yourself. Don't say anything. I
know it's hard, but the minute you do, you could
change their behavior. And if you want to find out,
(11:26):
you could. It can take longer to find out. Keep
your powder dry, get your ducks in a row and
so you know, and get someone to get you that
evidence and then confront them if they if you can,
if it's safe too, But you don't do that either
if it's not safe, which we look after all of that,
(11:48):
so you know, we do risk assessments and things like
that there's any violence, you know, any violence, and if
there's somebody's been violent towards her, etc. I mean, we
don't ever ever let someone disclose the information they have
unless it's in a safe environment.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
Right because you wouldn't know, I mean you would you
were think he wasn't violent or she wasn't violent. But
if it's you'd wonder if you knew them at all
when you find out the evidence that you've gathered.
Speaker 3 (12:16):
I think, like I said to you before, most people do.
And most people, I'll say, I'll often say to a client,
has he ever been violent? And they'll say, oh, no, no, no,
well he well, well once he pushed me, once he
did this, you know, slammed in my hand in the door,
or and I just say that that that's violence, that
(12:36):
is violence. And you but they because they are so
used to their condition, so therefore they start thinking that's
the normal, you know, and that's not so bad because
I didn't die, it didn't you know, it got better,
and that's really terrible what this stuff does. And it
completely makes people feel like they're going nuts when they
(12:58):
do confront and they're told they're mad, they're told that
this is not happening, and yet every fiber in the
air being kind of tells them something's not right.
Speaker 2 (13:10):
Thank you so much for your expertise. Julia Hartley Moore,
private investigator, owner and founder of JHM Private Investigation Services.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
For more from Kerrywood and Mornings, listen live to News
Talks at B from nine am weekdays, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio.
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