Alan Dershowitz on Why He Left the Democratic Party

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Speaker 2 (00:09):
He You are listening to Talkline Network Radio, America's longest
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And welcome to another edition of Talkline. I am zeb Brenner.
We got a great show for you. I do want
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(01:15):
Professor Emeritus Alan Dershowitz, where he talks about leaving the
Democratic Party, has almost eight hundred thousand views just on YouTube.
So if you haven't done so, please become a subscriber
of talk Line with Zev Brenner on YouTube. I would
greatly appreciate that. And by the way, speaking of Alan Dershwititz,
since we've had so much interest, in fact, New York Post,

(01:37):
Jerusalem Posts, Newsweek, a lot of publications picked up our story.
In fact, you can read it in the papers if
you go online. So we're going to present an encore
performance of our interview with Harvard Law Professor Emeritus Alan
n Avid Dershwitz on why he left the Democratic Party
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You're listening to talk Line with Zev Brenner, America's premier
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Speaker 11 (05:39):
And now here's your host.

Speaker 3 (05:43):
Amon Back is always a tree to speak to. Harvard
Law Professor Emeritus Alan Avid Deerschwitz written over fifty books.
He really is such a proud supporter of Israel. Ward
is glad to have him on. So welcome back to
the show and happy birthday coming up. I know you're
bermitster Parsha show with them you seventy three anniversary where
Misser taking place?

Speaker 4 (06:01):
Right, that's right, and I'm going to Kabbad. I'm going
to Kabbad tonight for Friday night dinner. We have a
new kabat on Martha's viny and we get four five
hundred people.

Speaker 3 (06:10):
Didn't you start the Kabbat of Martha's Vinion?

Speaker 12 (06:12):
Credit?

Speaker 4 (06:13):
I started the cob out of Martha's Vinyards, started the
combout at Harvard, and so very proud of those accomplishments.
The Cobbout at Harvard was the first cub out in
any American university. Now they are over three hundred, so
it's very important. And Kabbad has been the strongest voice
for Israel on campuses, so it's really important. I'm practicing.

(06:34):
I have to lane from my show dim for next
Shavist show t for show three in D ten. Oh,
share record, We'll see if I can.

Speaker 12 (06:44):
Do the rest of it.

Speaker 3 (06:45):
Are you going to give you b miszv speech too?

Speaker 4 (06:48):
I don't remember my mitzvahs speech. All I remember is
the rabbi, Rabbi Mersky put me down.

Speaker 5 (06:53):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (06:53):
He said, well, he's a good speaker, and he lained
very well.

Speaker 12 (06:57):
But he's not a very good student. I was a
bundit in school.

Speaker 4 (07:01):
But before we get to anything subspstantive, I just wanted
to mention the passing of a great Jew this morning.
Professor Shlomo Sternberg, who was probably the youngest mathematics PhD
perhaps in American history. He got his PhD from John
Hopkins at the age of seventeen, went on.

Speaker 12 (07:20):
To teach at Harvard.

Speaker 4 (07:23):
I think he became an assistant professor at twenty one
to twenty two. I had the honor of teaching with him.
We tought a course together on math and probabilities and
Talmudic and English law, and we had wonderful times together.

Speaker 12 (07:37):
He was.

Speaker 4 (07:39):
Eight eighty eight or eighty seven years old.

Speaker 12 (07:43):
He died in your shulam this morning.

Speaker 3 (07:45):
I'm sorry to hear that. Yeah, how old was he again?

Speaker 12 (07:49):
Eighty seven?

Speaker 4 (07:50):
Remember the last time I saw him, he was writing
on a donkey in the Old City of Jerusalem. And
he was always excavating and finding great things underneath his house.
He was an amazing, amazing man, amazing mathematician, a great
mench grew up in Brooklyn. I think he went to

(08:14):
tell Mutical Academy, but I'm not sure. But I got
to know him at Harvard and when we were teaching together,
and we were the Jewish Jews at Harvard. He was
strictly Orthodox.

Speaker 3 (08:26):
I was not, but we weren't you Orthodox in your younger years.

Speaker 12 (08:30):
Until I was twenty nine, until I was twenty nine,
I was strictly Orthodox.

Speaker 4 (08:34):
I never had a cookie that didn't have a U
on it.

Speaker 12 (08:39):
And you know, I try to be traditional.

Speaker 3 (08:41):
Now, but far before he started out. You have to
tell the story of you went to dinner with Green
Dean Griswold.

Speaker 4 (08:50):
My first week at Harvard Law School. The Dean invited
me at dinner with my wife.

Speaker 12 (08:55):
I was a new young assistant professor. I was twenty
five years old.

Speaker 4 (08:58):
And his wife served, you know, roast beef and some
string string beans and some mashed potatoes. And I ate
the string beans and the mashed potatoes, but I didn't
eat the beef. And the dean called me over and said,
didn't you like my wife's cooking? And I said, yeah,
but I'm Kosher, so I can't eat meat that is

(09:19):
not kosher. And he said, well, why don't you just
tell your people's time to.

Speaker 12 (09:25):
Give that up.

Speaker 4 (09:26):
The Catholics have given up not eating meat on Friday.
Why don't your people join the rest of the world
and eat whatever we serve you? And I thought he
was joking, so I said, well, I'll check with my people.

Speaker 3 (09:38):
But didn't he say that, Ken, you got a dispensation
when you're at a dean's house to eat whatever's on
the plate.

Speaker 12 (09:43):
So I saw.

Speaker 4 (09:45):
Him a couple of days later in the hall and
I said, Dean, I checked with my people. They said,
we've been doing it for three thousand years. We'll keep
doing it for some more years. So that was my
relationship with ing Griswold in the beginning. He liked me
very much, but he also wanted me to speak at
a club called the Club of Odd Volumes, And so

(10:06):
I called the club and I found out they didn't
accept Jews, so I said to the club, I can't
speak at a club that doesn't accept Jews. And Judge
Bailey Aldrich, who was the president of the club, said, well,
you don't understand.

Speaker 12 (10:18):
We're not asking you.

Speaker 4 (10:19):
To be a member, We're just asking you to be
a speaker. I said, that's the point. I won't speak
at an organization. And the dean called me in and said,
oh my god, you're ruining your chances of tenure. You
should speak at that club. A number of the people
on it a own on the board that approves your tenure.
I said, I just have to take my chances. But
I have a policy. I will never speak at a
club that discriminates against anyone. I walked out of clubs

(10:41):
that discriminated against women, Jews, blacks, and so I've maintained
that position all.

Speaker 12 (10:46):
Of my life.

Speaker 3 (10:48):
There's a new book that came out I didn't read it,
called Legal Gladiator. It's about your life story by Solomon Schmid.
Is this story in the new book that's coming at.

Speaker 4 (10:55):
That came out? I think I don't know, haven't. I've
only read part of the book. Remember, it's not an
authorized biography. He just wrote it was He's twenty years old,
he decided to write this biography. I have it right here.
I'm about halfway through it. It's, you know, like five
hundred pages long. He's a terrific writer, and he tells
a lot of things. He says things that I didn't

(11:17):
know about me because he interviewed a lot of people
who don't like me, people who do like me. So
I would strongly recommend reading it if you're interested in
my life or you know the history of the Jewish
people in the last half a century. It really tells
that story as well. So it's called Legal Gladiator and
it's published by Hot Books I think is the name

(11:39):
of the company, and I so far Skyhorse Publishing. So far, I've.

Speaker 12 (11:46):
Enjoyed what I read.

Speaker 4 (11:47):
He tells a lot of stories about me growing up
in Borough Park in Brooklyn.

Speaker 3 (11:51):
Well, should get you and him together for a show there. Great,
I'd be happy to do that.

Speaker 4 (11:56):
That'd be great.

Speaker 3 (11:56):
Okay, So I want to get to the Democratic National
Convention passed. Were you happy with how everything's transpiring?

Speaker 4 (12:03):
I was so unhappy. It was the most anti Jewish,
anti Israel, anti Zionist convention I have experienced, and I
have been watching conventions since nineteen fifty two, win Adlee Stevenson.
Let me tell you why this was the worst convention
in history, in of American history. They had more anti Jewish,

(12:27):
anti Zionist people who were speaking, starting with aoc miserable
anti anti Zionist bigot.

Speaker 12 (12:36):
Then of course they had.

Speaker 4 (12:39):
Liz Warrent, who was one of the most anti Jewish people.

Speaker 12 (12:44):
In the Senate.

Speaker 4 (12:45):
Then they had Bernie Sanders, one of the most anti
Jewish people in the Senate. Then to top it off,
they have one of the worst anti Semites in modern
American history last night at the convention, and.

Speaker 12 (13:04):
More and more and more.

Speaker 3 (13:05):
Now, who was that person that they had that number
four and c NBC whatever.

Speaker 4 (13:11):
His name is, Sharpton, Reverend Sharpton, you know, the guy
who provoked the program in Crown Heights after that tragic
accidental killing of that young.

Speaker 12 (13:23):
Young boy, young man. You know.

Speaker 4 (13:26):
So here's the way the Democrats figured it out. They're
not going to let these anti Semites and anti Zionists
speak about Israel. And they didn't, you know, they all
did the pablum about Israel.

Speaker 12 (13:36):
Oh, we support a ceasefire, we support a return to
the hostages.

Speaker 4 (13:39):
But they instructed them not to talk about Israel. But
by giving them platforms, what it says is that when
AOC does call Israel a genocidal country and rails against it,
she now has the imprimatur of the Democratic Party. When
Bernie Sanders rails against Israel, he has the imprimatur.

Speaker 12 (13:59):
When Liz Warren and when.

Speaker 4 (14:03):
Everybody else, they had so many speakers from the Black
Congressional Caucus who didn't attend Benjamin Nuttanio's speech, and of
course there wasn't a single Progerial speaker. But okay, I
understand that they didn't want to have Israel the center
of this, so they didn't have any pro Israel.

Speaker 12 (14:21):
They didn't have any anti Israel speakers, but.

Speaker 4 (14:24):
They had people speaking who they legitimated and gave the
imprimature of the Democratic Party who tomorrow will be making speeches.
And in the past I've been making speeches against Israel
and against Jews, and obviously that gives them an imprimatur,
and that gives them legitimacy from the Democratic Party. And

(14:46):
then of course, every time I see Shapiro Joshapiro, I
understand that if his name were John Shepherd, not Joshapirou,
he'd have been the Democratic nominee. I don't think that
Kamala Harris is anti Semitic. I don't think that she
didn't pick Shapiro just because he was Jewish because she

(15:09):
doesn't like Jews. I think that she got a lot
of pressure. We know, she got a lot of pressure
from the hard left of the Democratic Party, and she
knew that if she nominated Josh Shapiro, who would help
her win the election by winning Pennsylvania, there would have
been demonstrations not only outside but inside the Democratic Convention.
And then my old friend President of the United States,

(15:31):
who I like, I really like. You know, I've known
Joe Biden since nineteen eighty I worked with him on
the Kennedy Ted Kennedy's campaign. And he had the chutzpa
to get up there and say that these people outside
who are tearing down fences and demanding hamas, and.

Speaker 3 (15:49):
I'm burning American and Israeli flags, American flags.

Speaker 12 (15:53):
Saying they have good points. They have good points.

Speaker 4 (15:56):
And this is after he says I'm running for president
because Donald Trump said about the people in Charlottesville, there
are fine people on both sides.

Speaker 12 (16:05):
Well, he didn't say that.

Speaker 4 (16:06):
Let's be very clear about that I have an obed,
and Yesterday's Wall Street Journal that made that whole thing
very clear. He never said that. What he said is
he condemns the neo Nazis. He condemns the people who
said Jews will not replace us. He said, to a
fine people on both sides of the debate about whether
to take down robertie Lee's statue, I know there are

(16:27):
fine people on both sides of that debate, because I'm
on that side of that debate. I don't believe we
should be destroying statutes. I mean, there are reasonable alternatives.
Put them in a museum with an explanation, okay, But
there are fine people on both sides of the whole
debate about what you do with historical monuments. But there
were no fine people at the debate, at the standing

(16:48):
outside of the convention center and screaming Hamas will win,
screaming we are all Hamas, screaming there was nothing wrong
with October seventh, what's wrong with our coobas. Somebody said,
Uh no, there aren't fine people, and they don't make
fine points. And so I was disgusted as a democratic
national convention, absolutely disgusted.

Speaker 3 (17:10):
We're speaking Harvard Law Professor Emeritus, Alan Avid Dershowitz.

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Speaker 3 (23:30):
We're speaking Harvard Law Professor Emeritus Alan Avidderschowitz. So are
you ready to leave the Democratic Party?

Speaker 4 (23:38):
I am no longer a Democrat. I am an independent.
I'll decide who to vote for at the last minute
based on totality, the circumstances. I want to see how they.

Speaker 12 (23:47):
Deal with Iran.

Speaker 4 (23:49):
I want to see how they deal if you run
attacks the United States. I want to encourage the current
administration to support Israel.

Speaker 12 (23:56):
So I'm not revealing my.

Speaker 4 (23:57):
Vote until you know, maybe November four. Get to hear
all the information, all the evidence. But I am no
longer a member of the Democrats.

Speaker 3 (24:06):
When did you resign the Democratic Party?

Speaker 4 (24:08):
Well, gradually over time, I think a lot of things
pushed me in that direction. Kamala Harris's failure to comply
with their constitutional obligation to preside over the Senate in
the House joint sessions for Naton pushed me a lot
over that, and what Joe Biden said pushed me over that.

(24:30):
But I think the thing that really pushed me is
how the Democrats conducted their convention. I cannot be associated
with the party that features as its speakers AOC Sharpton,
Liz Warren, and.

Speaker 12 (24:47):
Bernie Sanders. That's not my party.

Speaker 3 (24:50):
Well your opinion, Governor Tim Wells.

Speaker 12 (24:52):
I don't know very much about it. He seems pretty
decent guy.

Speaker 4 (24:55):
I mean, he did do his thesis on Holloco. There's
some controversy about that. He seems like a decent guy.
And you know, there Kelly was a decent guy, and.

Speaker 12 (25:08):
Shapiro's this guy.

Speaker 10 (25:09):
Look.

Speaker 4 (25:09):
I don't love some of the things Shapiro said. I
don't love the fact that he called foolishly called Natagne,
who one of the worst leaders in history. I don't
like the fact that he had to apologize for something
he wrote when he was twenty years old. I'm not
a big, big fan of Shapiro. What I am is

(25:32):
very very certain, without any doubt that if Shapiro's name
was John Shepherd and he was the governor of Pennsylvania,
he'd be the Democratic NOWINI vice president right now. That
I'm absolutely convinced.

Speaker 3 (25:44):
I think, which I'm surprised that he did that. He
had to sell out. He was trying to become vice
presidential candidates, so he made those remarks taking back his
proiseral stances. It didn't help him anyway, and it only
heard him with his committity. He's fairly observed from what
I understand.

Speaker 12 (25:59):
Yeah, always hurts him.

Speaker 4 (26:00):
Look, you can be an observant and you can be
an anti Semitic bigott. Look at what's his name, Peter Beinart.
He claims to be observant, and he doesn't believe Israel's
right to exist. He doesn't believe Israel should be a
Jewish state. He believes that America should stop arming Israel.

(26:21):
He's observant, so isn't it natura karta? Observant and they
are a bunch of racist bigots, So you know, observant
doesn't have anything to do with it. I'm as much
of a Zionist as there ever has been, and neither
theatre hurts the on nor eye.

Speaker 12 (26:36):
Were observant? Are observant?

Speaker 14 (26:38):
Well?

Speaker 3 (26:38):
You were observant and you aren't. Aren't you getting more observed?
You're habbat? Aren't you getting more observed? This time goes on.

Speaker 4 (26:44):
You get up every morning and I say to Modaani,
when you know, when you're eighty almost eighty six years old,
you can't take it for granted. You're gonna wake up
in the morning. And I've had too many friends who
haven't woken up in the morning. So every morning I
go back and I think of my grandmother.

Speaker 12 (27:00):
What you would come in and say? Did you say
the madani yet?

Speaker 4 (27:02):
So I said, Modannie, yeah.

Speaker 3 (27:04):
Out sure you mentioned before you were observed until twenty nine.
What happened at twenty nine that changed you?

Speaker 4 (27:11):
I had children, and I decided I didn't want to
impose on. I was observant until I was twenty nine
because of my parents. I did not myself believe.

Speaker 12 (27:23):
That it was essential to be kosher.

Speaker 4 (27:27):
I just it wasn't. It wasn't in me, and I
didn't want my children to have that that burden. We
kept the kosher home. Of course, we kept the kosher home.
Because my mother. I wanted to make sure my mother
was available, but we were not.

Speaker 12 (27:43):
I don't work on Saturday.

Speaker 4 (27:45):
But we were not technically show Meshabad and I go
to shool as often as I can.

Speaker 3 (27:50):
No I know you're doing. You go to parking senegare
you go? You have you your former kabatman dil KABATWRII
putting filling on you. Huh, dil kabat FWRII putting filling
on you.

Speaker 12 (27:59):
They always try to put fill in.

Speaker 4 (28:01):
I always say to the young man, when you put
on filling as often as I had as many times
then come back and ask me so because they're usually
like eighteen year olds.

Speaker 3 (28:09):
So I think, don't do it to anybody that wants
to put on till.

Speaker 4 (28:13):
It's it's okay. Look, I have a traditional Jew. I
believe in many things in the Jewish tradition. I teach
a course that combbe by the way on ray sheet.
I had my class yesterday. We dealt with the two
issues of Abraham arguing with Hashem.

Speaker 12 (28:33):
A lona.

Speaker 4 (28:33):
I said, mish butt.

Speaker 12 (28:35):
I went over that and I went over the ika
with the students. So I have a lot of students
on Martha's vineyard.

Speaker 4 (28:43):
Some non Jewish, Jewish and non Jewish who want to
study Bray Sheet, And look, I think bra Sheet is
one of the greatest books in history. And every issue
of philosophy of morality you can raise in in in
the in she You know, how do you resolve the
issue of the The question I put to the students

(29:05):
right at the beginning of the hour was how do
you reconcile the Abraham who says khalila la klaud of
God about strangers.

Speaker 12 (29:13):
He didn't know the.

Speaker 4 (29:13):
People in Saidham. He knew the people who were going
to be saved. But how do you reconcile that argumentative
Abraham with the Abraham when God says, you know, bring
your son, who you love, your only son, to a
mountain and orfer him for sacrifice. And Abraham says, all right,
I'll get ready, you know, mount.

Speaker 12 (29:32):
Up, my people, We'll go on the mountain.

Speaker 4 (29:34):
How do you reconcile the argumentative Abraham with the Abraham
who exceeds to God's command unquestionably? And you know, we
had a great discussion, and we went through Russia, and
we went through all the commentators. I wrote a book
about it called The Genesis of Justice in which I
go through all those stories. It's my favorite book that

(29:56):
I have my fifty four books, the Genesis of Justice
and Revenge from my two favorite books. And I love
teaching from the Genesis of Justice. And that's what I
did yesterday and I'll do it again next year.

Speaker 3 (30:07):
Tell me of your commentary, which I think you can
probably add to your course. Do you know that Avrum
separates himself from Lots and de Torre says, and that
after the separation was that God speaks to Abraham. So
most of the commentators say that as long as Load,
the evil lowe was with him, God didn't speak to him. However,
there's one commentator that says that God was upset with Avraham,
that here he is converting all these people and bringing

(30:28):
to the belief in one God, and his own nephew
he lets go. So God was angry at him that
he that he didn't take his nephew into the fold
and let him go away. And that's why God separate
himself for a while, because he felt that Loads should
have been part of him.

Speaker 4 (30:40):
Well and not distinguish himself when he sent out his
two daughters. Although commentators say, well, it was a ploy.
He sent out his two daughters because he knew the
men who were trying to attack his his guests were gay,
and they wouldn't accept his two daughters.

Speaker 12 (31:00):
And so it was just it was just buying time.

Speaker 4 (31:03):
Look, the thing, the great thing about the Torah, and
the great thing about Gray Sheet, is seventy faces.

Speaker 12 (31:08):
To the Torah. There are a million interpretations.

Speaker 4 (31:11):
And in my book Genesis of Justice, I'm probably the
most prominent lawyer lawyer ever to write a commentary on
Brey Sheet. So I bring to bear not generations of
Jewish learning, I quote them all, but I bring to
bear you know, sixty years of law, and I analyze
the Abraham A. K.

Speaker 12 (31:32):
Dash story through the law of attempts, and.

Speaker 4 (31:35):
You know homicide laws, and you know so and and
the argument with God I analyzed through the Blackstone notion.
Better ten guilty go free than when innocent be wrongly convicted.
So I bring to bear a legal analysis on the Torah.
And so maybe there are seventy one faces to the Torah.

Speaker 12 (31:56):
That's what.

Speaker 3 (31:59):
Our guest is. Former Democrat Harvard law professor Murders Allen
Avidersh was now an independent.

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Speaker 2 (38:56):
You're listening to Talk Line with Zev Brenner, America's premier
Jewish probabe cast on the year since nineteen eighty.

Speaker 6 (39:02):
One, and now here's your host.

Speaker 3 (39:06):
Our guest is former Democrat Harvard law professor murders Alan
Avi Dursch was now an independent. Now I interviewed Schabas
Kestenbaum from Harvard Divinity School. Great guy. I love Shabis,
but he said something that I think I want to
bring it to your attention, and I said Joshapiro felt
he had to sell himself out. And Shabas said on
this program that prior to October seventh, he took a

(39:29):
course dealing with settler colonialist and the professor was anti Israel.
In order to get an a in the course, he
wrote a paper attacking Israel and he got an A
in the coure. He didn't feel good about it, but
he felt it was a way of getting an a.
And he is a committed Jew and he loves Israel.
He had to write this paper attacking Hiss. We get
an A. In the course, you have a lot of
college students that are not as observant, not as committed

(39:51):
to Israel, but also feel the pressure becoming well, even
evangelical kids coming back from college. I woke, what do
we do? I know you mentioned to get rid of
the Jewish studies department. Well, how do I can change Well, first.

Speaker 4 (40:01):
Of all, I would never write a paper that was
anti Israel to get an A. What I might do
tactically is to say, let me lay out the anti
Israel argument so that I can answer them. So then
you lay out the anti Israel arguments. I did that
in my book, The Case for Israel. By the way,
I've just finished another book at a little pamphlet that we're
going to circulate among college students as they enter college

(40:22):
this semester. And it's a pamphlet that answers the ten
main false claims, the blood libels that the Prohomas people
are spreading on college campuses today. So I'm going to
circulate that pamphlet among college students.

Speaker 12 (40:41):
It's you know, it's really an.

Speaker 4 (40:43):
Updated pamphlet based on my book the Case for Israel,
because in the Case for Israel, which I wrote, you know,
twenty five years ago, I lay out all the arguments
that are made against Israel and then I answer them.
So I'm doing that now for the new arguments that
have been made against Israel post doc to seven, and
I'm hoping that, you know, college kids around the country

(41:04):
will have it as a resource to be able to answer.
But I'm one of those people who's very opposed to
parents who say we're not going to send our kids
to Harvard or Yale or Columbia. No, send them, just
equip them, give them the weapons to fight back and
report a professor who downgrades you because you take the
position that's different from the professors. Look, one of the

(41:26):
people who got the highest grades in my course was
Ted Cruz. Why just Ted Cruise always disagreed with me.
And if you wanted to get a great grade in
my class, you disagree with me, you beat me in argument.
You know, it's like the Great story in the Tumult
over the Oven, where you know, they fight with rebela

(41:48):
other and they say, if we're right, let the mountain move,
let the river chains, let the walls crumble. And finally
let God speak. And God speaks and says, REBELI Ezer
is right. And of course the students say to him, well, God,
you gave us the Torah stand of our arguments. You know,
we have a method for interpreting it. Will interpret it.

(42:10):
And then it's later said that God responded by saying.

Speaker 12 (42:14):
My children have defeated me.

Speaker 4 (42:18):
Yeah, so you know I love that story and I
love when my students.

Speaker 12 (42:22):
Defeat me an argument.

Speaker 4 (42:24):
When I taught the Akadai yesterday, I said, the akkada
is a current issue. Every parent in Israel who gets
notification from the Ideaf. That notification says, bring your child,
bring your son, your daughter up to the mountain where
we can train him and offer him as a sacrifice.

(42:44):
We hope we won't be a sacrifice, but offer him
as a sacrifice to the Ideaf to defend and protect Israel.
So every Israeli family has an akai dah in their life.
So you know, the Torah is so relevant to current
events that we see all around us.

Speaker 3 (43:02):
Absolutely listen. Not everybody has a professor such as yourself
that enjoys being challenged. I would assume that Shab is
in his class with the Arab teacher who was anti
Isra would not have appreciated a paper which he said
both sides, and I'm sure a lot of other professors,
but he shouldn't be.

Speaker 4 (43:19):
A professor at Harvard or anywhere else. But they are professor,
I know, but they shouldn't be and we should be
fighting against them. I succeeded in having tenure denied to
Norman Finkelstein because he shouldn't have been a professor.

Speaker 12 (43:31):
He didn't understand two sides of many issues.

Speaker 4 (43:34):
You know.

Speaker 12 (43:34):
There's the famous story of Harry Truman. When he was president.

Speaker 4 (43:37):
He called in his attorney general and says, I need
a new legal counsel. Could you get me a lawyer
who was in an accident and lost one of his arms?
And the Attorney general said, oh my god, mister president,
you're so nice to handicapped people. He said, no, no, no,
nothing he can do with that. He says, every time
I have a lawyer, he always tells me, on the
one hand, on the other hand, I'm sick and tired
of that. I want a one handed lawyer. You just

(43:57):
tell me what I want to hear. Well, I'm not
the one hand the teacher everything for me is on
the one hand, and on the other hand.

Speaker 3 (44:03):
In the moments we have left, what are your thoughts
about the assassination of President Trump? There are all kinds
of disturbing things and the saying it was incompetence on
the local level of the federal level. The body of
the person the shooter was was cremated. What kinds of
thing do you believe in in some of the conspiracy
theories or you think it just completely ineptitude.

Speaker 12 (44:23):
I complete ineptitude.

Speaker 4 (44:24):
One of my closest friends of the former Secret Service agent,
he was on the President Ford detail, and so I
spent a lot of time with them recently going over
all the mistakes that were made, and it was look,
I have a theory in life, if there's a choice
between something happening by ineptitude or by malice, it's generally ineptitude.
Sometimes it's malice. But I don't believe in these conspiracy theories.

(44:46):
I don't believe in the conspiracy theory about JFK. You know,
I don't also don't think the Warrant Commission did a
very good job, but I don't think there was any
conspiracy there.

Speaker 3 (44:58):
You don't believe in conspiracy theory about the assass same.

Speaker 12 (45:02):
Well, there, it wasn't. I mean, it wasn't a conspiracy theory.

Speaker 4 (45:06):
We know that there were other people involved than than
just him.

Speaker 12 (45:11):
You know.

Speaker 4 (45:11):
Do you know that his family asked me to represent him.

Speaker 3 (45:14):
Uh, come here.

Speaker 4 (45:16):
Yeah, the Sunday he was killed on I think it
was most Shabbat. I was supposed to have lunch with
him the following Tuesday at Harvard because he was coming
for the GEO, the General Organization. That's lunch with him,
and of course he was killed. And then Uh, that Sunday,

(45:37):
the family knocked at my door. They were from Toronto, Canada,
and they asked me if I would come and defend him,
And I said, if he denies that he did the shooting,
and if there's evidence that he didn't do the shooting,
I'll defend him.

Speaker 12 (45:49):
But if he claims that it's.

Speaker 4 (45:51):
Justified, I can't defend them because I don't believe it
was justified.

Speaker 12 (45:54):
I mean, it was a terrible thing.

Speaker 3 (45:56):
And what happened. What did they tell you so.

Speaker 4 (45:58):
That he he did do it and that he was
going to argue justifications.

Speaker 12 (46:04):
So I couldn't do it.

Speaker 3 (46:05):
But it turns out the way the theories go that
it was blanks in the gun that he passed by,
and that he was set up by Shabbakh, and there
were all kinds of consistencies in that case. I did
a little research on.

Speaker 4 (46:16):
That, okay, but you know you can can disagree. That's
at your show you have me on. We disagree. We
have different views about religion. By the way, if any
of you ever ever get invited to your home for
a Friday night dinner, take the invitation. It was one
of the greatest uh abbout dinners that I've ever had.

(46:38):
The conversation was beyond belief. With your incredibly brilliant family,
one more brilliant than the other. Uh you know, it's
really interesting. I have the same thing in my family.
You and I have something in common. We are the
dumbest people in our families. Everybody else in the family
is so much smarter than we are. You know, I
have just to brag a little bit. My grandson just

(47:00):
graduated Columbia Medical first in his class. My daughter graduated
law school first in her class. Go to graduated medical
school first in her class. And my son graduated College
University of Pennsylvania first in his class. And I graduated
law school first in my class. So you know, if
there was an Olympic gold medal for being first, we
would have a lot of medals. And it's not genetic,

(47:22):
it's hard work. It's that I think all of us
and I'm sure you have that and why your family
is so brilliant that we instill a work ethic meritocracy,
that's the key. The reason Jews in israela hated so
much is because we stand for meritocracy. No country in
the world has ever been as successful as Israel based

(47:43):
on meritocracy, startup nation. There's no natural resources, there were
victims of the Holocaust. They did it on their own
Jews also Jews like us, we made it on meritocracy.
You know, a Jewish kid from Borough Park with a
name like Dershowitz isn't going to get a Harvard law
professorship or Quote law clerk based on looks or based
on you know background. The only way we get that

(48:05):
is by finishing first. And so meritocracy is the key.
And they hate us because we believe meritocracy and DEI diversity,
equity inclusion is the opposite of meritocracy.

Speaker 3 (48:16):
Absolutely, it has to be on the marriage because we suffer.
If you have somebody who's there not because he deserves
it because of race or ethnic origin, means you get
bad service.

Speaker 12 (48:26):
Well let me tell you too that I was on
an airplane.

Speaker 4 (48:28):
Not so long ago, coming from Martha's Video to New
York and it went through the worst I was. The
whole family was on my plane, my grandchildren, my sons,
and the plane went through this horrible, horrible storm. And
I think everybody on that plane was thinking the same thing.
We hope our pilot is not a dea pilot. We
hope the pilot is the best pilot.

Speaker 12 (48:47):
You all think that.

Speaker 4 (48:48):
When you have surgery, you want the surgeon.

Speaker 12 (48:50):
To be the very best.

Speaker 4 (48:52):
And I think we as Americans have the right to meritocracy.

Speaker 12 (48:58):
Otherwise we will know longer be the.

Speaker 4 (49:00):
Greatest country in the world if we stopped being a meritocracy.
And so this room for affirmative action, but it has
to be based on merit. It has to be based
on where you've come from. For example, you might say
that Vance is an affirmative action student. Fine, but it
wasn't based on race. It was based on the fact
that he came from a background of a family a

(49:20):
mother who was a drug addict, father who left.

Speaker 12 (49:23):
And he made it.

Speaker 4 (49:24):
He made it, finished first in his class in Ohio,
then went to Yale Law School.

Speaker 12 (49:28):
That's meritocratic.

Speaker 3 (49:29):
Does the events the vice presidential candidates?

Speaker 4 (49:32):
Yeah, yeah, you know he's not the only one. Meritocracy
is the key to success of any country or any group.
And you know, if you are woke, you're going to
go broke.

Speaker 3 (49:42):
Professor. Professor did the final question, did you let the
Democratic Party know that you left him?

Speaker 4 (49:48):
Yes, I've been very public about it.

Speaker 3 (49:51):
Respond to you.

Speaker 4 (49:52):
They knew I left before I knew I left. So
about a year ago, there was an event at Martha's Vineyard.
It was sponsored by the Jewish Democrats of Martha's Vineyard.
With all due respect, there's no one more Jewish on
Martha's Vineyard than me at the time, no one more democratic,
and no one more associated with the vineyard.

Speaker 12 (50:12):
I'd been there in fifty five years.

Speaker 4 (50:14):
Not only didn't I get invited to contribute money to it,
I was disinvited. I was told I couldn't come. That's
the Democrats, and they had an event for two hours.
The word Israel was not mentioned once. Jewish Democrats of
Martha's Vineyard have a two hour event. They talked about

(50:34):
abortion and gay rights. They did not talk about Israel,
didn't mention it once. I know that because the people
who were there told me how upset they were that
I was disinvited and that Israel wasn't mentioned. That's the
Jewish Democrats of Martha's Vindia, So I think they knew
I wasn't a Democrat even before I did.

Speaker 3 (50:52):
Did Larry David any other Democrats from that group go
to Martha's Vineyard for the Kiddish.

Speaker 12 (50:56):
At least no they and they don't go to Kabad.

Speaker 4 (51:00):
We had seven hundred people at a Jewish cultural event
in Martha's Vineyard, and the bigoted newspaper in Martha's Vineyard
never mentioned the cultural event, the culture. They just mentioned
that there were nine protesters standing outside with hamosclags. So,
you know, Martha's is a difficult place. But I you know,

(51:20):
I love the scenery. My kids are here, my daughter
and her husband are here now, my sons are coming
up in the next few days. They're all going to
be here from my birthday. So love the vineyard. Don't
love a lot of the people from the vineyard.

Speaker 3 (51:35):
Harvard Low Professor Meritis Helen Alvidors was former Democratic now
Independent's celebrating another bar mitzvah on Parsha Chaufton, So happy
birthday in Mazeltov.

Speaker 4 (51:45):
Okay, by the way, on chof Dim, there's a great
phrase in favor of meritocracy and against identity politics. Low
takkir panim not recognized faces when you do justice. And
that's a key to what Husham instructs judges that they

(52:06):
have to do. Do not recognize faces, don't peak under
the blindfold of justice. And today we see too much
peaking and too much recognition of faces. So I'm proud
to have choked him as my barmess vessed and.

Speaker 3 (52:20):
We're gonna have a Barmesster celebration. You can test for
Friday night. Then you can recite from chaftm or bracious.
You'll have your pick.

Speaker 4 (52:27):
Well, I like choke them.

Speaker 3 (52:29):
Okay, wonderfulness listen, nozzletee, thank you for joining us.

Speaker 4 (52:33):
Well, good week, good months to everybody.

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That can't be busy with that.

Speaker 14 (53:36):
Our website is so outdated. I can't be busy with that.
What about social media appearances?

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It can't be.

Speaker 16 (53:41):
Busy with that?

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Speaker 2 (54:11):
You're listening to talk Line with Zev Brenner, America's premier
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Speaker 4 (54:18):
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