Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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and welcome up on.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
To the show.
Speaker 3 (00:20):
Peter King.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Peter, longtime NFL journalist, multiple awards and obviously the pride
as Grant Smith made me put down of Ohio University's E. W.
Script School of Journalism. Peter, how are you doing this evening.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Benjamin, I'm great. Thanks for talking to a forgotten old man.
I appreciate it, well.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
Not forgotten by me personally.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
I remember the first time that I met you was
at was Ram's training camp. I believe it was twenty ten,
and I was a lowly nobody and still not that
I'm anybody now, but a lowly nobody, and you took
time out to answer every question I asked you humbly
and graciously, and it's stuck with me. It has stuck
with me over the last fifteen years. And I was
(01:01):
As I was sitting there thinking about the end of
the season, the state of football, the state of sports journalism,
I thought, what better person to talk to than the
guy who pioneered a lot of it in Peter King.
So I appreciate you taking some time tonight. Sure, let's
start with the way that football has has evolved over
the years, and it is such an absolute money machine
(01:24):
now as far as it goes, but we're on to
seventeen game seasons and I think we all see an eighteen.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
Game season down down the line.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
The playoffs have expanded now we've got multiple wildcards, seven teams,
and you know, as far as that goes. Over the years,
as you've watched the game of professional football evolve, what
has stuck with you as being Hey, that was a
great advancement, and what has stuck with you is is
maybe then an ill conceived choice by the game.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
What a good question, Benjamin, Thank you, And I'll tell
you there's two things that occurred to me when you
start talking about that. One is that as you talk
about increasing the number of games in a season, we
just watched the end of the season where the San
(02:13):
Francisco forty nine ers went from prime Super Bowl contender
to having almost every one of their prime offensive weapons
with the exception of the quarterback, go down with an
injury for much, if not all, of the season. And
(02:35):
you know, if you look at the guys who were
playing for them at the end of the year, you
know when Ayuk is gone, when McCaffrey is gone, you
know when Kittle is banged up. It just you look
at it and you just say, this is something that
you know you're going to kill the Golden Goose if
(02:55):
you try to keep doing this. And it's not only them.
If you look at the Green Bay Packers on Sunday,
the Green Bay Packers look like Alan Alda in mash
for crying out loud. It was absurd. They didn't have
anybody left. And yet the NFL wants to say, Okay,
seventeen games, no problem, We're going to go to eighteen.
(03:18):
And you've got the new executive director of the NFLPA
who comes out and tells Mike Jones of the athletic Hey,
I want to see more football. Everybody wants to see
more football. And I'm saying to myself, what is wrong
with this picture? So that really bothers me. The way
(03:41):
the NFL talks about health and safety all the time
and then they say, oh, we'll just add another game.
That bothers me. But I think the one other thing
that's going on in the game right now is that
at least to me, I mean, I am not one
(04:04):
of those guys. Look. I covered the NFL for forty years.
The first year I ever covered the NFL was nineteen
eighty four and I worked in Cincinnati. I was covering
the Bengals and Sam White's the rookie coach. My second
week on the job, he called me into the office
and he says, you want to know who we're going
to draft? And I said, yeah, I'd love to know.
(04:26):
And I thought he was kidding. He wasn't kidding. He
told me who they were going to draft, and he
told me almost every guy in like the first four
or five rounds. And I wrote about it the next
day and I looked like Noster Damis. But in those
days you could get away with things like that. There
(04:48):
was no Internet, there was no anything. And yet to me,
I think the game is absolutely fantastic. I can't wait
for these four games this weekend. Do I think that
Kansas City is going to get much of a game
from Houston. I don't, but you know what, who knows
the edge rushers in Kansas City could take advantage of
(05:11):
the weakness of the Chiefs, which is their edge protection,
you know. And every game I think has a chance
to be a really good game, the best of which
is the last one. Look. I went into last weekend,
I was positive the Broncos had a good chance to
give Buffalo a game, and they didn't. But that doesn't
(05:33):
mean that I don't like the Broncos. I like the
Broncos a lot, so I am not one of these
games so much better in the old days. I love
this modern game. I love everything about the game, but
I don't love the powers that be trying to make
it an eighteen game season. It's just you can't ask
(05:56):
this much of the human body.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Agree, And once again we're talking with the great Peter King,
whose Football Morning in America was one of my must
absolute must reads at all time.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
I believe if I'm not mistaken, Yeah you were.
Speaker 1 (06:13):
You were in Cincinnati, mentioned that that was where you
started and covering the Bengals.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
I believe your first game was against the Broncos.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
Was it not the first game that I ever covered
in the NFL was Cincinnati at Denver. That was the
That was the first game of the of the new
era of the of the Bengals. So yeah, I remember
it very well. And they had a first draft pick
that year, Ricky Hunley who they could never sign, who
(06:40):
ended up going to Denver. And you know what's funny,
when I retired, I was looking back at some old stories,
and right before the draft, I said, well, it's going
to come down for the Bengals. The first pick, seventh
overall is going to come down to two linebackers, one
Ricky Hunley two Ron. I mean, how much do you
(07:02):
think the Bengals regret that pick now? Because obviously Ron
Rivera was a centerpiece on a Super Bowl team in Chicago.
But you know, look, that was that was a really
really fun time to cover pro football.
Speaker 4 (07:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
I can't imagine you were you were mentioning the anecdote
about why you're sitting you down and telling you who
they were going to draft, And I can't imagine anybody
doing that now. I mean, we have to we have
to beg borrow and steel just to get the bread crumbs.
Over the years, I've been fortunate enough, you know, to
be able to get a little.
Speaker 3 (07:29):
Bit here or there. But it's it's it's pulling tea.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
Those relationships don't exist anymore in the in the kind
of cutthroat world.
Speaker 3 (07:36):
That it is now.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
It's it's sports shurtleism has changed. I mean, so much
of sports journalism now is aggregation. There's there's very few
trustworthy on the ground reporters doing what you did back then.
Speaker 3 (07:47):
It's just a major aggregation thing now.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
And it irritates me because a lot of false stuff
gets put out there, run through the mill, and then
everybody spreads it.
Speaker 3 (07:54):
And you know how it is. It takes one match
to burn ten thousand trees.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
Yeah, I would just say that to me. And again,
I don't say this because I retired, but I believe
that I'm probably going to be the last person to
ever do the job the way I did the job,
which is and it's because of finance. Is quite honestly,
(08:21):
I think it's because I was able to go to
a game for the last i'd say thirty five years
that I covered the NFL. I was able to go
to almost any game I wanted to any week and
report on it and write about it and now that
just simply does not happen. I was able to spend
(08:42):
a month every summer going to NFL training camps, which
certainly is not going to happen anymore. I'm just taking
an absolute wild guess that's probably a twenty thousand dollars perk. Now,
if you want to go, go see twenty five twenty
two to twenty five training camps, which I think is
(09:05):
absolutely essential if you want to cover the NFL the
right way. But anyway, I do think that aggregation is easy,
and I think that, like if you look, let's just say,
the show Inside the NFL, which you know I don't
I'm not a regular watcher, but it's you know, Chris Long,
(09:28):
I think, Chad Johnson, and I forget who Ryan Clark,
you know, and they're on it. They're sitting in a
studio and they're talking to me. Isn't that what every
show is now? A bunch of former players sitting around
and talking. I like all those guys, I truly do.
But Inside the NFL used to be a story a
(09:49):
show where we would go do stories. You know, I
worked there for six years where we would go do stories,
real deep. We all reported stories on everybody around the NFL.
I mean, I remember I went and did Drew Brees
when he was breaking out in New Orleans, taking a
walk with his dog, and he in Autumn Park in
(10:12):
New Orleans. I you know, I don't know, It's just
a lot of these things. It's so much easier to
just sit in the studio now, as ESPN does, as
NFL Network does. It's just so much easier to sit
in the studio and less costly than to actually go
out and report. That bothers me a lot about the
(10:36):
future of our business, and not just in covering the
NFL and covering anything.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
Talking with the great Peter King and yeah, I think
you were probably the first, you know, insider to do it.
And it's it's funny, that's a title I carry here
at this station. But I always ask, you know, what
are we exactly are we inside of I'm certainly we.
Speaker 3 (10:55):
Certainly don't get the access that you used to you know.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
Quite a bit ago, and and that sort of fascinates me.
The relationships watching you know in your career that you
built up alone, the way that you were able to
have those those moments, those exposures, those conversations and be
able to do that, and I must confess from my end,
there's a whiff of jealousy that that does not exist
in that measure, you know, anymore, or at least very
rarely in anymore as far as that goes, you know,
(11:21):
pivoting a little bit to football and talking about these playoffs,
and you mentioned the kansasity in the Texans game. You
got an interesting matchup here with Buffalo and Baltimore coming
up here probably the one and two votes for the MVP.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
I think that's what the second time that's happened when
you had Peyton Manning Tom Brady do it.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
But it's fascinating to me because these are two quarterbacks
that almost no one believed in when they were coming out.
Lamar Jackson was a guy that they suggested you convert
to wide receiver. Josh could throw the ball a mile,
but you wondered if that'd be within a half mile
of the target. As we look at this now and
how this has evolved, what do you take away from
the way that these young men's careers started to where
they are now.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Well, I think Lamar Jackson is so interesting because he
was sort of the you know, the tip of the
Iceberg for really really good quarterbacks who were also and
everybody would say, well, what about Michael Vick. I don't
think Michael Vick was as good a quarterback as you know,
(12:22):
as Lamar Jackson has turned out to be. I mean,
he clearly was equal as an athlete, maybe better, who knows,
I don't know. But they're both incredibly good running the
ball and all that. But I do think that one
of the great things that we have seen about Lamar
(12:43):
Jackson is he's become more of a complete player than
he was when he came in the game. Now, you know,
he still does have a little bit of the you know,
you got to play better in the playoffs residue to him,
and you know he's done. He obviously did fine in
his first game this postseason. But you know, this is
(13:08):
the kind of game this weekend that makes legacies. It
just does. And at some point Lamar to be a great,
great player, Lamar Jackson is going to have to win
huge games, and a kind of game this weekend is
a huge game. But I'll tell you the one thing
I really like about Josh Allen. I mean, I love this.
(13:31):
I remember Josh Allen's second year in the league, his
completion percent or a third year in the league, rather,
his completion percentage went way up. This was I think
it was twenty twenty. His completion percentage went up like
ten points. And I remember I ran into Tony Romo,
and Romo told me that basically he had had a
(13:55):
conversation with Josh Allen the previous year at the Super Bowl,
and in essence, you know, talk to him a little
bit about how, hey, you got to get better. You
gotta you know, you got to get better at all
aspects of your game, at all facets of your game.
And Josh Allen went to work on being a better
(14:16):
and more accurate passer. And I think it just goes
to show you, honestly, that you very rarely find quarterbacks
who come into the NFL as finished products. It's one
of the reasons why, quite honestly, if I were a
Broncos fan, I would be so damn excited about the
(14:38):
future because look what happened to bo Nicks this year, when,
first of all, there were a lot of people who
are kind of negative about him anyway coming in and
you know, he had the kind of year you know
that you just say, oh my Gosh, this guy was
significantly better as a rookie than pay Manning was than
(15:02):
almost all rookie quarterbacks are. And yet and he has
the kind of attitude you can just tell that he
is burning to learn, and he's with a coach who
can teach him. So you know, to me, I love
that game this weekend, But it also reminds me that
(15:22):
you're never in the first You're never going to be
a great, great quarterback, a flawless quarterback in your first
couple of years. It takes time, and both of these
guys are proving that.
Speaker 5 (15:35):
Hey, Peter Grant Smiths here and as a fellow Bobcat,
it's an honor to chat with you. I remember reading
the article last year when they posted it on their
website about you reflecting on your forty years and the
future of sports journalism, And with your conversation with Ben
here tonight, I wonder what advice you would have for
someone who's up and coming in this industry or trying
(15:56):
to get into it. What would you tell them to
really focus on in their career.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
Well, I've actually talked to I'm doing some teaching at
Seaton Hall in New Jersey, and one of the things
that I've said is, you know, I don't care. I mean,
if you really want to do this job, if you
really want to do this job, you got to be versatile.
You got to be well read, and I mean you
(16:23):
got to read some books. Get off your phone. Get
off your phone. You know, the phone has become a
crutch for so many people, and it doesn't help you.
It really doesn't help you. You need to actually learn
to be a better writer, and you learn to be
a better writer by reading. So that's one thing. I think.
(16:43):
The second thing I would say, in terms of versatility,
we have no idea in the next five or ten
years how stories are going to be told. One of
the things that I was very lucky to do was
to have the ability to be in this sort of
golden era of sports writing. I mean, I don't know
(17:05):
if I came along today, what would I do? Would
I have to Even though I had a podcast near
the end, and I did work a lot in TV
and I did do some radio, you get the feeling
that you know, you're not really going to make a
great living long term by just simply writing. You've got
(17:27):
to do other things. So I would urge people to
be versatile. But you know the bottom line in this
whole thing, Unless you're curious, you have no chance. You
got to be curious, and you have to exercise that
curiosity every day when you watch the Denver Broncos. You know,
when you wake up on Monday morning, if you cover
(17:48):
the Denver Broncos, you have to say, Okay, here's my
off season project. How is bo Nix going to get
better in year two? And I would I mean, I
don't care if you have access to bow Nix or
Peyton or college coach or maybe his off season quarterback coach,
(18:14):
whoever it is. But you know, the one story in
Denver that everybody wants to know. I think I don't know,
it's what I would want to know. Tell me about
bow Nicks in year two? How is he going to
be better? So, I mean, those are the kind of
stories that, in my opinion, I think you have to
be totally focused on. You got to be curious about.
Speaker 4 (18:36):
Peter.
Speaker 3 (18:37):
We vastly appreciate your time.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
Thank you for being so generous and gracious with it,
and you made the evening and maybe even the year
of young grad Smith in there.
Speaker 3 (18:46):
We certainly appreciate you.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
You jumping on here for a little bit, and I
wish you well in your retirements, and I hope that
you are living your best life right now. You are
an inspiration of myself and many others, and I again
appreciate your time this evening.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
I appreciate guys, thanks a lot for having me.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
All right, take care. Peter King, the Great Peter King
brought us country night back. After this, I said sixty
nine zeros in text lot, a lot of a lot
of great texts saying that was a great interview and
what a great guest. You know, Peter King is a
legend to anybody who's worked in this business for any
period of time, and he was so gracious to give
us an interview and do that. And Peter doesn't didn't
(19:23):
do really do interviews anymore. He's he's retired. He really
does not do many interviews. But we managed to We
managed to get him on the for that one.
Speaker 5 (19:31):
So yeah, I had to be pretty persistent with him
this morning the name drop you and my connection to
Ohio University. And then a couple of hours later he said,
all right, I'll hop.
Speaker 3 (19:39):
Out with you guys.
Speaker 1 (19:40):
Yeah, he's Yeah, I've known Peter since since twenty ten
out there at RAMS. It was the RAMS training camp.
He was doing that very thing, travel around all the
training camps. It was then the then Saint Louis RAMS,
and that was the first time we had really connected.
I was trying to latch on there and anyway, the
rest is history. But he's so great. I'd love to
get him back on. I wanted to ask him ques
is about the Hall of Fame. Why Mike Shanahan Henry
(20:02):
Ellard aren't in. But that's beside the point. We got
to go right back out to the Kwa Common Sparrel Hotline.
We had the warm up act in Peter King. Now
it's time for the main event. Parker, Gabriel Parker, how
you doing the sceanon?
Speaker 4 (20:12):
I don't even joke about something. Peter came the main
event wherever whenever, every day of the week and twice
on Sunday.
Speaker 3 (20:21):
Well you know, you know it is. This is like
the going at the comedy club.
Speaker 1 (20:24):
Right, you got the warm up act and then we
put the main I thought.
Speaker 4 (20:28):
You a drunk that stumbles up to the microphone after
the show's over at the comedy club.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
Oh you know what, I appreciate that you're self deprecating
enough to have fun with that, you know, Parker, as
we as we look at this thing, the season's over,
disappointing in successful season. Sean Payton, George Payton come out,
and the first thing I want to talk about is
Sean Payton. One of the comments that he made is
not surprising to me, but I also don't think it
precludes something. And that is Sean Payton talking about we
(20:57):
don't want a future back, you know, kind of going
with that kind of coming. But I don't think that
precludes them from going after a running back early. I
think that what they're trying to say is we don't
want a twenty to twenty five touch a game workload
on anyone.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
I think I think you're spot on, and frankly, like
I even thought, I think even that might be at
least that's a little further than even I interpreted the
comment like I just he just literally said, we're not
going to have one running back like you know, and
of course not like you know you need. He just said.
The next thing he said was the season's too long
and there's too much physical toll that these guys take.
(21:33):
And so to me, it's like you want. You're not
going to sit there and say like, Okay, well we
have a guy who we think is a good number one,
so we're good. Like they're always looking. And he told
the story. Actually I think I asked him later about
the joker and he told the joker position kind of
and he told the story about you know, the late
mister Benson in New Orleans saying, why are you interested
(21:55):
in Reggie Bush? We have duce McAllister and Charlott's sort
of like, yeah, Reggie not that kind of running back.
He's like he's like a do everything running back, and
so like to me, it's more just a matter of,
like I thought, it signaled, if nothing else, their intention
to really go to work this offseason on the skill positions.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Well, you duvetail right into the next part of this,
and that is a joker is the popular buzzword term whatever.
Speaker 3 (22:22):
You want to, you know, make it around around town here.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
But really what that means is we're looking for that
versatile chess piece that creates mismatches.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
And Sean Payton has had that.
Speaker 1 (22:30):
Whether that was Reggie Bush or whether that was Jimmy
Graham or whomever, Taysom Hill, whomever, that was over the
course of his career in New Orleans.
Speaker 3 (22:38):
That's something that we're looking for here and don't have
when you look at this roster.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
You know, the fans talk about upgrading the receiving corps,
and I think that the easiest way to upgrade this
receiving core is by getting a playmaker tight end that's
going to open things up for them, not necessarily signing
or trading for a Garrett Wilson.
Speaker 4 (22:59):
Oh yeah, I know, one hundred percent agree.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
I mean, in fact, like Sean made sort of an
interesting comment.
Speaker 4 (23:04):
On Wednesday about how they always had that player at
either running back or tight end and then they and
he said, and we never had a Pro Bowl receiver,
which obviously is not true. Michael Thomas was really good,
especially at the height of his powers. But I think
the point sort of stands, which is, if you have
Alvin Kamara or Jimmy Graham or you know, Reggie Bush
(23:26):
or whatever, if you have that guy they had just
had a bunch of them all the way through, and
they come in different shapes and sizes, then you then
you're in the driver's seat. Then you're dictating about how
matchups get you know, put together and this and that,
and so like you're dictating to the defense rather than
the defense saying, okay, we're going to take away this
and then what are you going to do? And so
(23:46):
that to me is what they're missing. They've been missing
it for quite a while. And you know, like all
you have to do is look at the numbers, like
the I think Devantay Williams was thirty second in the
NFL in rushing. There were twenty five tight ends in
the NFL that had more yards than the Broncos trio
of tight ends, Like there are just star every week
(24:08):
the Broncos played a team that had at least a
guy that was unlike something the Broncos had. And so
if you can even the playing field on that, or
if you can get yourself a jack of all trade
type of player, whether it's like you say, a tight
end in the draft or running back in the draft,
somebody in free agency, Like there are guys out there,
(24:29):
non receivers that I think can really sort of change
the completion of the offense.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
Tied with Parker Gabriel at Parker J. Gabriel from the
Denver Post.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
You know, as we turn the page on this season,
look forward to next season.
Speaker 3 (24:44):
I think we've got the quarterback. I hope we have
the quarterback.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
Certainly he feels like that this is and it's going
to be the guy, at least for the foreseeable future.
We look at the Houston Texans of regression this year
with CJ. Stroud, and you know, people are putting him
in the Mahomes echelon last year and now all of
a sudden, you know, you're it's a little bit different.
Speaker 3 (25:07):
We we expect defensive coordinators to come out.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
There and get the tape on bow and you know,
and and and craft defenses to come after him. I
tend to think just based on his sort of aggressive way,
I guess he studies the game that that his CounterPunch
will be will be good. The question here, I guess is,
you know, who is that gonna be with?
Speaker 3 (25:28):
What is the weapon next year? Who's the guy?
Speaker 1 (25:29):
Because this team, this feels like a team that we're
we're sitting here developing a youth movement on offense.
Speaker 3 (25:35):
Who's the guy?
Speaker 2 (25:36):
Is it?
Speaker 1 (25:36):
Marvin Mims was this late season breakout when the coaching
staff finally realized the most exposive player on the field
should probably be you know, on the field.
Speaker 3 (25:44):
Is Marvin Mms the guy next year?
Speaker 4 (25:47):
I think he's one of them, you know, But I
think that there's a couple as they sort of like
we were just talking about, like, I think there's that
there's a couple of pieces, you know, that just aren't
in the building at this point. And that's to me, Like,
you know, d J. Stroud's an interesting comparison. Obviously, bo
Nix didn't have the rookie year that c J. Stroud
had last year, but Houston, like it was by mid
(26:08):
season they knew and then what did they do? They
wasted no time. They went out, you know, Okay, Stefan Diggs,
Joe Mixon, like Mixon.
Speaker 2 (26:15):
Had a great year.
Speaker 4 (26:16):
Obviously they had injury issues, but the approach was, Okay,
you've got the infrastructure built, you find the quarterback, now
go load up around them as much as you can.
And part of that's because obviously the windows open when
the quarterback's on his rookie contract. Some of it, too,
is because defenses aren't going to, you know, start to
figure out the quarterback and you've got to have, you know,
(26:37):
more than you had rookie year going forward to keep up,
you know, with with the way the defenses are going
to sort of adjust it to the quarterback, and so
you know, I honestly think, like, I think it's probably
you know, I think you're talking about adding two tight
ends between for maybe two in the draft. I think
you're talking about, you know, revamping the running back room.
(26:59):
I think you're obviously you're talking about a decision with
Courtland Sutton and like how much cap allocation do you
want there? And I think M's and vaile are are
really important to this, you know, like MEM's especially because
of the game breaking abilities. So I just part of
me is like, I just I just wouldn't be surprised
if those three skill groups look quite a bit different
(27:20):
by the time training camp starts. Are certainly by time
training camp and then they looked, you know, week eighteen
and in the wildcard game.
Speaker 1 (27:27):
I completely agree with you, And I mean, I believe
they'll probably go after you know, Juwan Johnson a free
agency and then draft a tight end. You know, you
gotta go to the You're gonna go to the draft
for a running back, and then whatever happens at receiver.
I mean Courtland's you know, market how you sink twenty
four to twenty eight ap y. I don't know if
you pay that, but that's certainly gonna gonna you know,
raise all manner of questions. Backup quarterback? Are they bring
(27:49):
in one of these guys back somebody else in? There's
the offense in and of itself outside of the line
is going to look markedly different. I think next year, uh,
stepping outside the Broncos firm. Then going bigger picture here
in the NFL. You know the Raiders, it looks like
they're two leading candidates for their coaching job. Pete Carroll,
Ben Johnson. How tough is this division? I mean, you
(28:09):
bring let's let's just say, Pete Carroll. You bring Pete Carroll,
and how tough is this division? All of a sudden
when you've got Andy Reid, Jim Harriball, Sean Payton, Pete Carroll.
Mean to the NFC playoffs from like twenty ten to
twenty nineteen for real.
Speaker 4 (28:21):
Like if that were the case, Like and you asked
the question like who's the worst coach in the division,
Like what would the answer be? You know, that would
be amazing And honestly, like I thought it was interesting then,
Like there was a moment after the Broncos clinched where
Sharlot at the podium after the game, and he said,
just sort of in passing, he was like, you know,
last year, like he's like, I wasn't really trying to
(28:43):
jump into the same division as Patrick Mahomes. And he
was saying that in the context of how great he
thought the ownership group was and they gave him game
balls and all this stuff. But like the point is true.
I mean, anybody you know entertaining the notion of being
the head coach or the general manager of the Raiders,
Like there's only.
Speaker 2 (29:00):
Thirty two of those jobs in each position.
Speaker 4 (29:02):
Obviously, like there's going to be supply, but it is
a daunting job. I mean, look at what Jim Harbaugh
did in one year in Los Angeles, look at what
Sean Payton's done in two years in Denver. Look at
the quarterbacks of the other three teams. Obviously one of
them is an entirely his own category. And then you know,
(29:23):
Herbert's really really good and Nicks is promising, and then
in Vegas you've got nothing, and so like that is
a it's a tough job. It's a big challenge. It
would be super interesting with either of those guys Ben
Johnson because he's the next hot thing, and Pete Carroll
because of obviously the resume and so and whoever gets
(29:48):
there and whoever gets the GM job, they're going to
look at the rest of the division and go, oh,
this is not going to be easy.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:55):
Certainly probably one of the roughest divisions in football if
you look at the jobs of a for Ben Jonson.
One of the conversations that was having earlier today with
the pluses and drawbacks of the three main contenders, I'm like,
why wouldn't you consider Jacksonville in the softest division on
Earth rather than the buzz saul that's the AFC West.
Speaker 3 (30:12):
I'm wired a little different.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
I want to challenge, but you know, if you if
you're looking for longevity, it would feel like Jacksonville would be,
uh would be would be primed for that sort of thing.
As we look at the playoffs this weekend, you got
Buffalo taken on Baltimore. I think it's gonna be the
second time in NFL history where you would potentially have
the one and two votes for the the MVP squaring
off in the playoffs. In Lamar and Josh Allen, I
(30:35):
think the last time that happen would be Tom Brady
and Peyton Manning. As we as we look at this game,
is there a team here you you tend to favor
in that game?
Speaker 4 (30:45):
Well, I just like it's kind of funny because we
obviously saw a bunch of these teams over the course
of the season, and I just thought Baltimore was on
a different level than anybody else. Denver played obviously then
like Buffalo in the postseason, no joke there, and so
you know, Dave Flowers obviously makes a big difference. I
just it's hard for me, especially with the way you know,
(31:07):
Baltimore's come around defensively a little bit. I know they're
going on the road.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
I don't know that they're gonna win up there, but man,
I just I just.
Speaker 4 (31:15):
Have a hard time picking against Lamar Jackson and Derrick
Henry and the way that they've the way that they've
played offensively recently, and obviously, like you know, no problems
on the other side either, but but man, I just
think you know, Baltimore's playing as good as anybody, and
that Batfield duo, I mean, what are you supposed to do, Like,
how are you supposed to take away one or the other. Right.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
It was when they when they brought in Dereck Henry
and I was like, oh my, this is gonna be
a this is gonna be a disaster for opposing defenses
because what are you doing here? You got to stay
light in the box because you got to set the
edge and make sure Lamar didn't take off on you.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
And oh, by the way, you've got the.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
Human battering ram, you know, freight train that is Derick
Henry and uh.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
I think nothing.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Summarized my feelings on that more than watching him go
after Minka fits pass, where I was like, is this
even football anymore?
Speaker 3 (32:02):
Because it looks like Shang's song and Mortal Kombat? Your
soul is mine? As he stiff armed him through the earth.
You know what do you do?
Speaker 1 (32:10):
Just cross your fingers and praise pretty much.
Speaker 4 (32:12):
And I mean you heard like you heard Van Josis
before it Denver played them. He literally was like, you know,
He's like, you have to stop the run, like and
that's that's I think there's a lot of defensive coaches
that are wired that way, like they're gonna try to
run at you. You have to stop the run and
then you deal with the rest of it, and the
Broncos like they set out to try to do that
(32:33):
and Lamar torched them. And obviously the day Flowers is
healthy them had.
Speaker 2 (32:36):
A huge day.
Speaker 4 (32:37):
But no matter what it is that you take away,
they can do the other thing exceptionally well. And I think,
like outside of that, the strange game against Cleveland is
I haven't watched every minute of them, but like, except
for that loss that they had at Cleveland maybe you know,
early second half of the year, every time I've watched Baltimore,
their offense just looks the same, like they're just doing
(32:59):
the same types of things to whoever is in front
of them. And so that's a, uh, that is a
heck of a challenge for it being the divisional round
of the AFC playoffs.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
I certainly don't don't enview anyone having to having to
try to do that would be just a nightmare week
sitting there, like, how am I gonna how am I
gonna scheme this up so my guys.
Speaker 3 (33:19):
Can stop this or slow it down in any in
any event.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
As the playoffs are rolling on here, we're getting down
to it.
Speaker 3 (33:25):
Who you get to in the Super Bowl this year?
Speaker 4 (33:27):
Yeah, I mean I think baltim I think I'll think Baltimore.
I know that's maybe maybe a bad deal with them
having to go on the road, and then obviously you
know they'd have two road games from here, right if
Kansas City takes care of of Houston. But I just
love the way they're playing. And then on the other side, man,
I know they've had all the injury stuff and all that,
(33:48):
but just at this point, like at this point, like
I think we need to see Detroit into super Bowl.
Speaker 1 (33:52):
Just like for what we've been through any part theer art,
we got the theme music, we got a role man,
sorry to cut you.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
Off, Paul's Moore, Detroit, Joe the Board, Detroit
Speaker 1 (34:00):
Love It, Broncos Country Tonight, lo'st from Time Up Next,
Your Soul is Mine
Guys, iHeart as partner with a Dream Center, we're taking
donations for families affected by the southern California wildfires. You
donate the residence in need by texting Relief as R
E L I E F to three three one zero
zero For this segment, Special Tree, at least for me,
get to go out to the KWA Commas Barrel hotline
and welcome up on.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
To the show.
Speaker 3 (00:20):
Peter King.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Peter, longtime NFL journalist, multiple awards and obviously the pride
as Grant Smith made me put down of Ohio University's E. W.
Script School of Journalism. Peter, how are you doing this evening.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Benjamin, I'm great. Thanks for talking to a forgotten old man.
I appreciate it, well.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
Not forgotten by me personally.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
I remember the first time that I met you was
at was Ram's training camp. I believe it was twenty ten,
and I was a lowly nobody and still not that
I'm anybody now, but a lowly nobody, and you took
time out to answer every question I asked you humbly
and graciously, and it's stuck with me. It has stuck
with me over the last fifteen years. And I was
(01:01):
As I was sitting there thinking about the end of
the season, the state of football, the state of sports journalism,
I thought, what better person to talk to than the
guy who pioneered a lot of it in Peter King.
So I appreciate you taking some time tonight. Sure, let's
start with the way that football has has evolved over
the years, and it is such an absolute money machine
(01:24):
now as far as it goes, but we're on to
seventeen game seasons and I think we all see an eighteen.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
Game season down down the line.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
The playoffs have expanded now we've got multiple wildcards, seven teams,
and you know, as far as that goes. Over the years,
as you've watched the game of professional football evolve, what
has stuck with you as being Hey, that was a
great advancement, and what has stuck with you is is
maybe then an ill conceived choice by the game.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
What a good question, Benjamin, Thank you, And I'll tell
you there's two things that occurred to me when you
start talking about that. One is that as you talk
about increasing the number of games in a season, we
just watched the end of the season where the San
(02:13):
Francisco forty nine ers went from prime Super Bowl contender
to having almost every one of their prime offensive weapons
with the exception of the quarterback, go down with an
injury for much, if not all, of the season. And
(02:35):
you know, if you look at the guys who were
playing for them at the end of the year, you
know when Ayuk is gone, when McCaffrey is gone, you
know when Kittle is banged up. It just you look
at it and you just say, this is something that
you know you're going to kill the Golden Goose if
(02:55):
you try to keep doing this. And it's not only them.
If you look at the Green Bay Packers on Sunday,
the Green Bay Packers look like Alan Alda in mash
for crying out loud. It was absurd. They didn't have
anybody left. And yet the NFL wants to say, Okay,
seventeen games, no problem, We're going to go to eighteen.
(03:18):
And you've got the new executive director of the NFLPA
who comes out and tells Mike Jones of the athletic Hey,
I want to see more football. Everybody wants to see
more football. And I'm saying to myself, what is wrong
with this picture? So that really bothers me. The way
(03:41):
the NFL talks about health and safety all the time
and then they say, oh, we'll just add another game.
That bothers me. But I think the one other thing
that's going on in the game right now is that
at least to me, I mean, I am not one
(04:04):
of those guys. Look. I covered the NFL for forty years.
The first year I ever covered the NFL was nineteen
eighty four and I worked in Cincinnati. I was covering
the Bengals and Sam White's the rookie coach. My second
week on the job, he called me into the office
and he says, you want to know who we're going
to draft? And I said, yeah, I'd love to know.
(04:26):
And I thought he was kidding. He wasn't kidding. He
told me who they were going to draft, and he
told me almost every guy in like the first four
or five rounds. And I wrote about it the next
day and I looked like Noster Damis. But in those
days you could get away with things like that. There
(04:48):
was no Internet, there was no anything. And yet to me,
I think the game is absolutely fantastic. I can't wait
for these four games this weekend. Do I think that
Kansas City is going to get much of a game
from Houston. I don't, but you know what, who knows
the edge rushers in Kansas City could take advantage of
(05:11):
the weakness of the Chiefs, which is their edge protection,
you know. And every game I think has a chance
to be a really good game, the best of which
is the last one. Look. I went into last weekend,
I was positive the Broncos had a good chance to
give Buffalo a game, and they didn't. But that doesn't
(05:33):
mean that I don't like the Broncos. I like the
Broncos a lot, so I am not one of these
games so much better in the old days. I love
this modern game. I love everything about the game, but
I don't love the powers that be trying to make
it an eighteen game season. It's just you can't ask
(05:56):
this much of the human body.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Agree, And once again we're talking with the great Peter King,
whose Football Morning in America was one of my must
absolute must reads at all time.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
I believe if I'm not mistaken, Yeah you were.
Speaker 1 (06:13):
You were in Cincinnati, mentioned that that was where you
started and covering the Bengals.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
I believe your first game was against the Broncos.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
Was it not the first game that I ever covered
in the NFL was Cincinnati at Denver. That was the
That was the first game of the of the new
era of the of the Bengals. So yeah, I remember
it very well. And they had a first draft pick
that year, Ricky Hunley who they could never sign, who
(06:40):
ended up going to Denver. And you know what's funny,
when I retired, I was looking back at some old stories,
and right before the draft, I said, well, it's going
to come down for the Bengals. The first pick, seventh
overall is going to come down to two linebackers, one
Ricky Hunley two Ron. I mean, how much do you
(07:02):
think the Bengals regret that pick now? Because obviously Ron
Rivera was a centerpiece on a Super Bowl team in Chicago.
But you know, look, that was that was a really
really fun time to cover pro football.
Speaker 4 (07:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
I can't imagine you were you were mentioning the anecdote
about why you're sitting you down and telling you who
they were going to draft, And I can't imagine anybody
doing that now. I mean, we have to we have
to beg borrow and steel just to get the bread crumbs.
Over the years, I've been fortunate enough, you know, to
be able to get a little.
Speaker 3 (07:29):
Bit here or there. But it's it's it's pulling tea.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
Those relationships don't exist anymore in the in the kind
of cutthroat world.
Speaker 3 (07:36):
That it is now.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
It's it's sports shurtleism has changed. I mean, so much
of sports journalism now is aggregation. There's there's very few
trustworthy on the ground reporters doing what you did back then.
Speaker 3 (07:47):
It's just a major aggregation thing now.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
And it irritates me because a lot of false stuff
gets put out there, run through the mill, and then
everybody spreads it.
Speaker 3 (07:54):
And you know how it is. It takes one match
to burn ten thousand trees.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
Yeah, I would just say that to me. And again,
I don't say this because I retired, but I believe
that I'm probably going to be the last person to
ever do the job the way I did the job,
which is and it's because of finance. Is quite honestly,
(08:21):
I think it's because I was able to go to
a game for the last i'd say thirty five years
that I covered the NFL. I was able to go
to almost any game I wanted to any week and
report on it and write about it and now that
just simply does not happen. I was able to spend
(08:42):
a month every summer going to NFL training camps, which
certainly is not going to happen anymore. I'm just taking
an absolute wild guess that's probably a twenty thousand dollars perk. Now,
if you want to go, go see twenty five twenty
two to twenty five training camps, which I think is
(09:05):
absolutely essential if you want to cover the NFL the
right way. But anyway, I do think that aggregation is easy,
and I think that, like if you look, let's just say,
the show Inside the NFL, which you know I don't
I'm not a regular watcher, but it's you know, Chris Long,
(09:28):
I think, Chad Johnson, and I forget who Ryan Clark,
you know, and they're on it. They're sitting in a
studio and they're talking to me. Isn't that what every
show is now? A bunch of former players sitting around
and talking. I like all those guys, I truly do.
But Inside the NFL used to be a story a
(09:49):
show where we would go do stories. You know, I
worked there for six years where we would go do stories,
real deep. We all reported stories on everybody around the NFL.
I mean, I remember I went and did Drew Brees
when he was breaking out in New Orleans, taking a
walk with his dog, and he in Autumn Park in
(10:12):
New Orleans. I you know, I don't know, It's just
a lot of these things. It's so much easier to
just sit in the studio now, as ESPN does, as
NFL Network does. It's just so much easier to sit
in the studio and less costly than to actually go
out and report. That bothers me a lot about the
(10:36):
future of our business, and not just in covering the
NFL and covering anything.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
Talking with the great Peter King and yeah, I think
you were probably the first, you know, insider to do it.
And it's it's funny, that's a title I carry here
at this station. But I always ask, you know, what
are we exactly are we inside of I'm certainly we.
Speaker 3 (10:55):
Certainly don't get the access that you used to you know.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
Quite a bit ago, and and that sort of fascinates me.
The relationships watching you know in your career that you
built up alone, the way that you were able to
have those those moments, those exposures, those conversations and be
able to do that, and I must confess from my end,
there's a whiff of jealousy that that does not exist
in that measure, you know, anymore, or at least very
rarely in anymore as far as that goes, you know,
(11:21):
pivoting a little bit to football and talking about these playoffs,
and you mentioned the kansasity in the Texans game. You
got an interesting matchup here with Buffalo and Baltimore coming
up here probably the one and two votes for the MVP.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
I think that's what the second time that's happened when
you had Peyton Manning Tom Brady do it.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
But it's fascinating to me because these are two quarterbacks
that almost no one believed in when they were coming out.
Lamar Jackson was a guy that they suggested you convert
to wide receiver. Josh could throw the ball a mile,
but you wondered if that'd be within a half mile
of the target. As we look at this now and
how this has evolved, what do you take away from
the way that these young men's careers started to where
they are now.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Well, I think Lamar Jackson is so interesting because he
was sort of the you know, the tip of the
Iceberg for really really good quarterbacks who were also and
everybody would say, well, what about Michael Vick. I don't
think Michael Vick was as good a quarterback as you know,
(12:22):
as Lamar Jackson has turned out to be. I mean,
he clearly was equal as an athlete, maybe better, who knows,
I don't know. But they're both incredibly good running the
ball and all that. But I do think that one
of the great things that we have seen about Lamar
(12:43):
Jackson is he's become more of a complete player than
he was when he came in the game. Now, you know,
he still does have a little bit of the you know,
you got to play better in the playoffs residue to him,
and you know he's done. He obviously did fine in
his first game this postseason. But you know, this is
(13:08):
the kind of game this weekend that makes legacies. It
just does. And at some point Lamar to be a great,
great player, Lamar Jackson is going to have to win
huge games, and a kind of game this weekend is
a huge game. But I'll tell you the one thing
I really like about Josh Allen. I mean, I love this.
(13:31):
I remember Josh Allen's second year in the league, his
completion percent or a third year in the league, rather,
his completion percentage went way up. This was I think
it was twenty twenty. His completion percentage went up like
ten points. And I remember I ran into Tony Romo,
and Romo told me that basically he had had a
(13:55):
conversation with Josh Allen the previous year at the Super Bowl,
and in essence, you know, talk to him a little
bit about how, hey, you got to get better. You
gotta you know, you got to get better at all
aspects of your game, at all facets of your game.
And Josh Allen went to work on being a better
(14:16):
and more accurate passer. And I think it just goes
to show you, honestly, that you very rarely find quarterbacks
who come into the NFL as finished products. It's one
of the reasons why, quite honestly, if I were a
Broncos fan, I would be so damn excited about the
(14:38):
future because look what happened to bo Nicks this year, when,
first of all, there were a lot of people who
are kind of negative about him anyway coming in and
you know, he had the kind of year you know
that you just say, oh my Gosh, this guy was
significantly better as a rookie than pay Manning was than
(15:02):
almost all rookie quarterbacks are. And yet and he has
the kind of attitude you can just tell that he
is burning to learn, and he's with a coach who
can teach him. So you know, to me, I love
that game this weekend, But it also reminds me that
(15:22):
you're never in the first You're never going to be
a great, great quarterback, a flawless quarterback in your first
couple of years. It takes time, and both of these
guys are proving that.
Speaker 5 (15:35):
Hey, Peter Grant Smiths here and as a fellow Bobcat,
it's an honor to chat with you. I remember reading
the article last year when they posted it on their
website about you reflecting on your forty years and the
future of sports journalism, And with your conversation with Ben
here tonight, I wonder what advice you would have for
someone who's up and coming in this industry or trying
(15:56):
to get into it. What would you tell them to
really focus on in their career.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
Well, I've actually talked to I'm doing some teaching at
Seaton Hall in New Jersey, and one of the things
that I've said is, you know, I don't care. I mean,
if you really want to do this job, if you
really want to do this job, you got to be versatile.
You got to be well read, and I mean you
(16:23):
got to read some books. Get off your phone. Get
off your phone. You know, the phone has become a
crutch for so many people, and it doesn't help you.
It really doesn't help you. You need to actually learn
to be a better writer, and you learn to be
a better writer by reading. So that's one thing. I think.
(16:43):
The second thing I would say, in terms of versatility,
we have no idea in the next five or ten
years how stories are going to be told. One of
the things that I was very lucky to do was
to have the ability to be in this sort of
golden era of sports writing. I mean, I don't know
(17:05):
if I came along today, what would I do? Would
I have to Even though I had a podcast near
the end, and I did work a lot in TV
and I did do some radio, you get the feeling
that you know, you're not really going to make a
great living long term by just simply writing. You've got
(17:27):
to do other things. So I would urge people to
be versatile. But you know the bottom line in this
whole thing, Unless you're curious, you have no chance. You
got to be curious, and you have to exercise that
curiosity every day when you watch the Denver Broncos. You know,
when you wake up on Monday morning, if you cover
(17:48):
the Denver Broncos, you have to say, Okay, here's my
off season project. How is bo Nix going to get
better in year two? And I would I mean, I
don't care if you have access to bow Nix or
Peyton or college coach or maybe his off season quarterback coach,
(18:14):
whoever it is. But you know, the one story in
Denver that everybody wants to know. I think I don't know,
it's what I would want to know. Tell me about
bow Nicks in year two? How is he going to
be better? So, I mean, those are the kind of
stories that, in my opinion, I think you have to
be totally focused on. You got to be curious about.
Speaker 4 (18:36):
Peter.
Speaker 3 (18:37):
We vastly appreciate your time.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
Thank you for being so generous and gracious with it,
and you made the evening and maybe even the year
of young grad Smith in there.
Speaker 3 (18:46):
We certainly appreciate you.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
You jumping on here for a little bit, and I
wish you well in your retirements, and I hope that
you are living your best life right now. You are
an inspiration of myself and many others, and I again
appreciate your time this evening.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
I appreciate guys, thanks a lot for having me.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
All right, take care. Peter King, the Great Peter King
brought us country night back. After this, I said sixty
nine zeros in text lot, a lot of a lot
of great texts saying that was a great interview and
what a great guest. You know, Peter King is a
legend to anybody who's worked in this business for any
period of time, and he was so gracious to give
us an interview and do that. And Peter doesn't didn't
(19:23):
do really do interviews anymore. He's he's retired. He really
does not do many interviews. But we managed to We
managed to get him on the for that one.
Speaker 5 (19:31):
So yeah, I had to be pretty persistent with him
this morning the name drop you and my connection to
Ohio University. And then a couple of hours later he said,
all right, I'll hop.
Speaker 3 (19:39):
Out with you guys.
Speaker 1 (19:40):
Yeah, he's Yeah, I've known Peter since since twenty ten
out there at RAMS. It was the RAMS training camp.
He was doing that very thing, travel around all the
training camps. It was then the then Saint Louis RAMS,
and that was the first time we had really connected.
I was trying to latch on there and anyway, the
rest is history. But he's so great. I'd love to
get him back on. I wanted to ask him ques
is about the Hall of Fame. Why Mike Shanahan Henry
(20:02):
Ellard aren't in. But that's beside the point. We got
to go right back out to the Kwa Common Sparrel Hotline.
We had the warm up act in Peter King. Now
it's time for the main event. Parker, Gabriel Parker, how
you doing the sceanon?
Speaker 4 (20:12):
I don't even joke about something. Peter came the main
event wherever whenever, every day of the week and twice
on Sunday.
Speaker 3 (20:21):
Well you know, you know it is. This is like
the going at the comedy club.
Speaker 1 (20:24):
Right, you got the warm up act and then we
put the main I thought.
Speaker 4 (20:28):
You a drunk that stumbles up to the microphone after
the show's over at the comedy club.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
Oh you know what, I appreciate that you're self deprecating
enough to have fun with that, you know, Parker, as
we as we look at this thing, the season's over,
disappointing in successful season. Sean Payton, George Payton come out,
and the first thing I want to talk about is
Sean Payton. One of the comments that he made is
not surprising to me, but I also don't think it
precludes something. And that is Sean Payton talking about we
(20:57):
don't want a future back, you know, kind of going
with that kind of coming. But I don't think that
precludes them from going after a running back early. I
think that what they're trying to say is we don't
want a twenty to twenty five touch a game workload
on anyone.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
I think I think you're spot on, and frankly, like
I even thought, I think even that might be at
least that's a little further than even I interpreted the
comment like I just he just literally said, we're not
going to have one running back like you know, and
of course not like you know you need. He just said.
The next thing he said was the season's too long
and there's too much physical toll that these guys take.
(21:33):
And so to me, it's like you want. You're not
going to sit there and say like, Okay, well we
have a guy who we think is a good number one,
so we're good. Like they're always looking. And he told
the story. Actually I think I asked him later about
the joker and he told the joker position kind of
and he told the story about you know, the late
mister Benson in New Orleans saying, why are you interested
(21:55):
in Reggie Bush? We have duce McAllister and Charlott's sort
of like, yeah, Reggie not that kind of running back.
He's like he's like a do everything running back, and
so like to me, it's more just a matter of,
like I thought, it signaled, if nothing else, their intention
to really go to work this offseason on the skill positions.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Well, you duvetail right into the next part of this,
and that is a joker is the popular buzzword term whatever.
Speaker 3 (22:22):
You want to, you know, make it around around town here.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
But really what that means is we're looking for that
versatile chess piece that creates mismatches.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
And Sean Payton has had that.
Speaker 1 (22:30):
Whether that was Reggie Bush or whether that was Jimmy
Graham or whomever, Taysom Hill, whomever, that was over the
course of his career in New Orleans.
Speaker 3 (22:38):
That's something that we're looking for here and don't have
when you look at this roster.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
You know, the fans talk about upgrading the receiving corps,
and I think that the easiest way to upgrade this
receiving core is by getting a playmaker tight end that's
going to open things up for them, not necessarily signing
or trading for a Garrett Wilson.
Speaker 4 (22:59):
Oh yeah, I know, one hundred percent agree.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
I mean, in fact, like Sean made sort of an
interesting comment.
Speaker 4 (23:04):
On Wednesday about how they always had that player at
either running back or tight end and then they and
he said, and we never had a Pro Bowl receiver,
which obviously is not true. Michael Thomas was really good,
especially at the height of his powers. But I think
the point sort of stands, which is, if you have
Alvin Kamara or Jimmy Graham or you know, Reggie Bush
(23:26):
or whatever, if you have that guy they had just
had a bunch of them all the way through, and
they come in different shapes and sizes, then you then
you're in the driver's seat. Then you're dictating about how
matchups get you know, put together and this and that,
and so like you're dictating to the defense rather than
the defense saying, okay, we're going to take away this
and then what are you going to do? And so
(23:46):
that to me is what they're missing. They've been missing
it for quite a while. And you know, like all
you have to do is look at the numbers, like
the I think Devantay Williams was thirty second in the
NFL in rushing. There were twenty five tight ends in
the NFL that had more yards than the Broncos trio
of tight ends, Like there are just star every week
(24:08):
the Broncos played a team that had at least a
guy that was unlike something the Broncos had. And so
if you can even the playing field on that, or
if you can get yourself a jack of all trade
type of player, whether it's like you say, a tight
end in the draft or running back in the draft,
somebody in free agency, Like there are guys out there,
(24:29):
non receivers that I think can really sort of change
the completion of the offense.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
Tied with Parker Gabriel at Parker J. Gabriel from the
Denver Post.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
You know, as we turn the page on this season,
look forward to next season.
Speaker 3 (24:44):
I think we've got the quarterback. I hope we have
the quarterback.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
Certainly he feels like that this is and it's going
to be the guy, at least for the foreseeable future.
We look at the Houston Texans of regression this year
with CJ. Stroud, and you know, people are putting him
in the Mahomes echelon last year and now all of
a sudden, you know, you're it's a little bit different.
Speaker 3 (25:07):
We we expect defensive coordinators to come out.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
There and get the tape on bow and you know,
and and and craft defenses to come after him. I
tend to think just based on his sort of aggressive way,
I guess he studies the game that that his CounterPunch
will be will be good. The question here, I guess is,
you know, who is that gonna be with?
Speaker 3 (25:28):
What is the weapon next year? Who's the guy?
Speaker 1 (25:29):
Because this team, this feels like a team that we're
we're sitting here developing a youth movement on offense.
Speaker 3 (25:35):
Who's the guy?
Speaker 2 (25:36):
Is it?
Speaker 1 (25:36):
Marvin Mims was this late season breakout when the coaching
staff finally realized the most exposive player on the field
should probably be you know, on the field.
Speaker 3 (25:44):
Is Marvin Mms the guy next year?
Speaker 4 (25:47):
I think he's one of them, you know, But I
think that there's a couple as they sort of like
we were just talking about, like, I think there's that
there's a couple of pieces, you know, that just aren't
in the building at this point. And that's to me, Like,
you know, d J. Stroud's an interesting comparison. Obviously, bo
Nix didn't have the rookie year that c J. Stroud
had last year, but Houston, like it was by mid
(26:08):
season they knew and then what did they do? They
wasted no time. They went out, you know, Okay, Stefan Diggs,
Joe Mixon, like Mixon.
Speaker 2 (26:15):
Had a great year.
Speaker 4 (26:16):
Obviously they had injury issues, but the approach was, Okay,
you've got the infrastructure built, you find the quarterback, now
go load up around them as much as you can.
And part of that's because obviously the windows open when
the quarterback's on his rookie contract. Some of it, too,
is because defenses aren't going to, you know, start to
figure out the quarterback and you've got to have, you know,
(26:37):
more than you had rookie year going forward to keep up,
you know, with with the way the defenses are going
to sort of adjust it to the quarterback, and so
you know, I honestly think, like, I think it's probably
you know, I think you're talking about adding two tight
ends between for maybe two in the draft. I think
you're talking about, you know, revamping the running back room.
(26:59):
I think you're obviously you're talking about a decision with
Courtland Sutton and like how much cap allocation do you
want there? And I think M's and vaile are are
really important to this, you know, like MEM's especially because
of the game breaking abilities. So I just part of
me is like, I just I just wouldn't be surprised
if those three skill groups look quite a bit different
(27:20):
by the time training camp starts. Are certainly by time
training camp and then they looked, you know, week eighteen
and in the wildcard game.
Speaker 1 (27:27):
I completely agree with you, And I mean, I believe
they'll probably go after you know, Juwan Johnson a free
agency and then draft a tight end. You know, you
gotta go to the You're gonna go to the draft
for a running back, and then whatever happens at receiver.
I mean Courtland's you know, market how you sink twenty
four to twenty eight ap y. I don't know if
you pay that, but that's certainly gonna gonna you know,
raise all manner of questions. Backup quarterback? Are they bring
(27:49):
in one of these guys back somebody else in? There's
the offense in and of itself outside of the line
is going to look markedly different. I think next year, uh,
stepping outside the Broncos firm. Then going bigger picture here
in the NFL. You know the Raiders, it looks like
they're two leading candidates for their coaching job. Pete Carroll,
Ben Johnson. How tough is this division? I mean, you
(28:09):
bring let's let's just say, Pete Carroll. You bring Pete Carroll,
and how tough is this division? All of a sudden
when you've got Andy Reid, Jim Harriball, Sean Payton, Pete Carroll.
Mean to the NFC playoffs from like twenty ten to
twenty nineteen for real.
Speaker 4 (28:21):
Like if that were the case, Like and you asked
the question like who's the worst coach in the division,
Like what would the answer be? You know, that would
be amazing And honestly, like I thought it was interesting then,
Like there was a moment after the Broncos clinched where
Sharlot at the podium after the game, and he said,
just sort of in passing, he was like, you know,
last year, like he's like, I wasn't really trying to
(28:43):
jump into the same division as Patrick Mahomes. And he
was saying that in the context of how great he
thought the ownership group was and they gave him game
balls and all this stuff. But like the point is true.
I mean, anybody you know entertaining the notion of being
the head coach or the general manager of the Raiders,
Like there's only.
Speaker 2 (29:00):
Thirty two of those jobs in each position.
Speaker 4 (29:02):
Obviously, like there's going to be supply, but it is
a daunting job. I mean, look at what Jim Harbaugh
did in one year in Los Angeles, look at what
Sean Payton's done in two years in Denver. Look at
the quarterbacks of the other three teams. Obviously one of
them is an entirely his own category. And then you know,
(29:23):
Herbert's really really good and Nicks is promising, and then
in Vegas you've got nothing, and so like that is
a it's a tough job. It's a big challenge. It
would be super interesting with either of those guys Ben
Johnson because he's the next hot thing, and Pete Carroll
because of obviously the resume and so and whoever gets
(29:48):
there and whoever gets the GM job, they're going to
look at the rest of the division and go, oh,
this is not going to be easy.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:55):
Certainly probably one of the roughest divisions in football if
you look at the jobs of a for Ben Jonson.
One of the conversations that was having earlier today with
the pluses and drawbacks of the three main contenders, I'm like,
why wouldn't you consider Jacksonville in the softest division on
Earth rather than the buzz saul that's the AFC West.
Speaker 3 (30:12):
I'm wired a little different.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
I want to challenge, but you know, if you if
you're looking for longevity, it would feel like Jacksonville would be,
uh would be would be primed for that sort of thing.
As we look at the playoffs this weekend, you got
Buffalo taken on Baltimore. I think it's gonna be the
second time in NFL history where you would potentially have
the one and two votes for the the MVP squaring
off in the playoffs. In Lamar and Josh Allen, I
(30:35):
think the last time that happen would be Tom Brady
and Peyton Manning. As we as we look at this game,
is there a team here you you tend to favor
in that game?
Speaker 4 (30:45):
Well, I just like it's kind of funny because we
obviously saw a bunch of these teams over the course
of the season, and I just thought Baltimore was on
a different level than anybody else. Denver played obviously then
like Buffalo in the postseason, no joke there, and so
you know, Dave Flowers obviously makes a big difference. I
just it's hard for me, especially with the way you know,
(31:07):
Baltimore's come around defensively a little bit. I know they're
going on the road.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
I don't know that they're gonna win up there, but man,
I just I just.
Speaker 4 (31:15):
Have a hard time picking against Lamar Jackson and Derrick
Henry and the way that they've the way that they've
played offensively recently, and obviously, like you know, no problems
on the other side either, but but man, I just
think you know, Baltimore's playing as good as anybody, and
that Batfield duo, I mean, what are you supposed to do, Like,
how are you supposed to take away one or the other. Right.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
It was when they when they brought in Dereck Henry
and I was like, oh my, this is gonna be
a this is gonna be a disaster for opposing defenses
because what are you doing here? You got to stay
light in the box because you got to set the
edge and make sure Lamar didn't take off on you.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
And oh, by the way, you've got the.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
Human battering ram, you know, freight train that is Derick
Henry and uh.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
I think nothing.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Summarized my feelings on that more than watching him go
after Minka fits pass, where I was like, is this
even football anymore?
Speaker 3 (32:02):
Because it looks like Shang's song and Mortal Kombat? Your
soul is mine? As he stiff armed him through the earth.
You know what do you do?
Speaker 1 (32:10):
Just cross your fingers and praise pretty much.
Speaker 4 (32:12):
And I mean you heard like you heard Van Josis
before it Denver played them. He literally was like, you know,
He's like, you have to stop the run, like and
that's that's I think there's a lot of defensive coaches
that are wired that way, like they're gonna try to
run at you. You have to stop the run and
then you deal with the rest of it, and the
Broncos like they set out to try to do that
(32:33):
and Lamar torched them. And obviously the day Flowers is
healthy them had.
Speaker 2 (32:36):
A huge day.
Speaker 4 (32:37):
But no matter what it is that you take away,
they can do the other thing exceptionally well. And I think,
like outside of that, the strange game against Cleveland is
I haven't watched every minute of them, but like, except
for that loss that they had at Cleveland maybe you know,
early second half of the year, every time I've watched Baltimore,
their offense just looks the same, like they're just doing
(32:59):
the same types of things to whoever is in front
of them. And so that's a, uh, that is a
heck of a challenge for it being the divisional round
of the AFC playoffs.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
I certainly don't don't enview anyone having to having to
try to do that would be just a nightmare week
sitting there, like, how am I gonna how am I
gonna scheme this up so my guys.
Speaker 3 (33:19):
Can stop this or slow it down in any in
any event.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
As the playoffs are rolling on here, we're getting down
to it.
Speaker 3 (33:25):
Who you get to in the Super Bowl this year?
Speaker 4 (33:27):
Yeah, I mean I think baltim I think I'll think Baltimore.
I know that's maybe maybe a bad deal with them
having to go on the road, and then obviously you
know they'd have two road games from here, right if
Kansas City takes care of of Houston. But I just
love the way they're playing. And then on the other side, man,
I know they've had all the injury stuff and all that,
(33:48):
but just at this point, like at this point, like
I think we need to see Detroit into super Bowl.
Speaker 1 (33:52):
Just like for what we've been through any part theer art,
we got the theme music, we got a role man,
sorry to cut you.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
Off, Paul's Moore, Detroit, Joe the Board, Detroit
Speaker 1 (34:00):
Love It, Broncos Country Tonight, lo'st from Time Up Next,
Your Soul is Mine
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