Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
The views and opinions expressed in the following programmer those
of the speaker and don't necessarily represent those of the
station it's staff, management or ownership.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Good morning, you'll find me out with Pete and the
Poet Gold.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
I'm Peter Leon and I'm the Poet Gold and we're.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
On the air this morning with a Lisha Kahan from
the Prison's brain Trust. And before we get to Alicia
and her various topics and complications, we're going to go
right to the poet goal for her weekly poem prayer
incantation goal. Please let it roll.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Okay, i haven't done this in a long time, so
I'm going to do the drum beats to rhythm. I can.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
My favorite.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
Yeah, well, I'm glad you like it, Peter, the drum beats,
the rhythm that tells my heart. I can the drum
beats rhythm that tells my heart. I can the drum
beats rhythm that tells my heart. I can? I can?
I can the drum beats the rhythm that tells my heart.
I can. I can be like Harriet's subman running, but
I'm not running. I'm creating, not aping. She gave me
(01:01):
that option. Years ago with her sacrifice, so I may
grow up and walk on water like Christ, because he
is so dope and nice, displaying outstanding possibilities everywhere. Tap
me on the shoulders, pointing me to the stars, and said,
there are the stairs. With faith the sides of a
mustard seed, you can move mountains, build igloos on deserts,
(01:21):
turn rain drops into beads of gold, and create the
greatest stories that will ever be told. I'm a descendant
of the keenest mathematicians. Did you not know that? Recognize
they figured the equation and built pyramids from a grain
of sand, set a top of transmitter, sending me messages
through the rhythm of the beat of the drum, telling
my heart. I can the drum beats rhythm that tells
(01:42):
my heart. I can the drum beats rhythm that tells
my heart. I can the drum beats the rhythm that
tells our hearts.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
We can, and I can say again, I like that one.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
You like that?
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Yeah, I think I'm gonna get a lot of support
in the studio for that one.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Okay, all right has.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
Her vast numbers of original poems, But my experience is
anything that has some music to when she actually sings
and that's a quasi singing song. I love those ones.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
Yeah, I call those poelities.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Polity, which is your own word, right it is, okay,
So I don't want to send anybody scurrying away to
a dictionary, at least as I'm talking about words. I
at least was struck by the title of your group
on Prisoner's brain Trust, and maybe you could explain some
of the fundamentals to that.
Speaker 3 (02:35):
Yeah, absolutely so, we're the person were the Prisoner's brain Trust.
We have started in twenty twenty three, and before then
we were an organization. We were working with the newburg
LGBTQ Center as Queers for Justice under one simple goal
connecting community with currently incarcerated individuals. But the story came
(02:56):
long before that. As us as a group, I'm being
formed formerly incarcerated ten years in prison, individuals that I'm
friends with, who I consider family. We're talking about the
r we scout there. How can we tell our stories
of the pure trauma that we have faced on the
inside and since getting released and connecting with folks, And
since twenty seventeen we've been organizing and since twenty twenty three,
(03:20):
as the Prisoner's Brain Trust founded under the principles of
the green Haven Think Tank, where a group of prisoners
who after the attic Cop Rising were in Greenhaven Correctional Facility,
really expanding this idea of how can we not let
the attic op Rising happen again, and how can we
connect the community with prisoners and learning from those foundations
(03:40):
and keeping the memory of life, of making sure that
currently incarcerated voices are heard, because they're not heard in
our in Albany, they're not heard in the communities right
they're sitting behind in the backdrop of the American world
is where all these prisons are. There's ten prisons within
the Hudson Valley and their voices owner and they're behind
the trees, behind the mountains and living off the memory
(04:03):
is that it starts with a gray RDA a symbols
of bulb and with a bull and with a little
bit of trust, anything can happen.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Now when you say that they are not heard, that
through organizations like yourself, to your organization serves as a
bridge for their voices. Who do you want them? Who
are the listeners? When you say that I heard, what's
the message to be received?
Speaker 3 (04:25):
The message I received is to community members and to
elected officials. Right, elected officials have the power to change laws. Right,
have the power to change these systemic laws.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
Right.
Speaker 3 (04:35):
And but it really is also addressing to the community
of where we put these elected officials into power, and
it's doing what is right for them to actually making
systemic change. And when working within policy issues is that
a lot of different interests are involved. And when looking
at those different interests, it's never asked of like what
(04:55):
do individuals were incarcerated think about this particular policy? What
do they think? What is the most important thing? And
one of the things that we're here to talk about
is like our policy campaign, it's really like what are
the what are the priorities of the prison population. We
have fifteen incarcerated team members across five New York State prisons.
(05:16):
Like I said, we've been growing since two thousand and
nineteen something like that. Yeah, and we've expanded and to
bring their ideas of creating these community based programs. We
have a prisoner agenda that lists the priorities of the
policy and engaging the community through artwork, through testimonial through
to call up their elective officials to move to that
(05:38):
power to let's let's move one as a community, to
bring people home and to really start changing a lot
of these systemic issues that fill our prisons right in
our own backyard.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
Even that word home is an interesting word because I
think that most middle class people, and I think it's
probably even more pronounced in the white middle class, which
I'm clearly a member of, we don't think of people
who are incarcerated as having a home. We think that
(06:09):
they are imprisoned. And because as soon as you use
the word home, you're bringing up somebody's humanity, and I
think it's easier for you know, the dominant group, to
make believe that inmates are not entirely human. They don't
(06:31):
have things like homes, and so the language around it
is important. So for you to use a phrase let's
bring them home, I mean they're they're members of a family,
they're members of a community, the members, they're members of
a force of great good, which are of course we've
(06:52):
experienced in Poughkeepsie. A lot of our prominent leaders have
been formally incarcerated people. But home is a big one.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
I just want to I know a lot of people
get confused on whether or not if the prison population
has a right to vote on you know, during elections
while they're incarcerated or after incarceration.
Speaker 3 (07:15):
No, currently incarcerated prisoners don't have the right to vote.
When you get released, you do have your rights back,
but that law did not change until actually the year
I went home twenty seventeen that you had to after
it first started off as after a year home that
you could apply for a voter parttern I think they
call that at the time from the governor and then
(07:37):
a year later they give to anybody. As soon as
you walk out the door, you have the right to vote,
and you know, and that's one of the core reasons
why the prisoners bring trusted to exist is simply because
people are incarcerated. There's thirty thousand people incarcerated in New
York State right and that's just within the state prisons.
Losing their right to vote. They don't get a say
into what elective officials represent their communities. They don't get
(07:57):
a say of what who represents They don't give a
say of who actually represents them in office or what
policies are actually pushed because they're not voters. They're not
putting the elected officials and when they come home. Absolutely,
But if we're looking at like what the laws around
like folks coming home and that actually ability to vote
is like you have to find out all this information yourself.
(08:18):
They make it hard to like, you have to know
that you have the right to vote right like, and
that's what we do that as the prisoner's brain trust.
But just they don't tell you that information once you
get released, that you now have your voting rights back.
They tell you they're taking them away, but they don't
tell you get them back.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
You get them back. And what about paying after your release.
I've heard stories of people who were still paying for
their sentence so to speak, monetarily.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
No, absolutely so No, that's New York.
Speaker 3 (08:46):
Yeah, there was. I would say, I don't quote me
on the years. A couple of years ago, so I
would say three or four years ago, there was this
law that eliminated all that he finds. It eliminated for
people who have to wear electronic mobs undering basically paying
fines for that. But up until I would say twenty
twenty one, people would have to pay thirty dollars to
go to parole every single month. People would have to
(09:09):
pay for electronic monitoring bracelets. If depending on where individuals
fall under insurance, you have to pay for the mandated
programs you have to do drug treatment, anchor management, workforce.
A lot of those programs are given for free, but
if you're not covered under Medicaid, which is definitely a
lot easier now, but you had to pay them out
of pocket. And I've heard stories about that. It didn't
(09:29):
affect me. I was covered by interns simply just by
coming home. But people did have to pay for that.
And I had to pay for my parole during my
time that I was on parole, and until I got
off thirty dollars a month being on food stamps. Look
at taking six months for a job, right and still
having that required requirement to pay.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
That's a Your arithmetic gets very simple if you get
out of If you get released and you don't saw
out with the job, you're broke, and then you have
to pay for parola. That's a lot. I was not
aware of that at all. And you know there's also
(10:13):
a felony law that you I know is prominent and
you're thinking you want to talk about that. Yeah, absolutely,
murder a felony. Yeah, So this is the Prisoner's Bring Trust.
We worked with people who are currently incarcerated and to
create a campaign on our prisoner agreenda is to get
rid of the law that's called the felony murder law doctrine,
(10:33):
which is not murder at all. It's somebody who somebody
can be charged with second degree murder even if they
were not at the scene of the crime, if they
didn't have any attent on killing the person, if they
were a person that was in the car. And so
at the Prisoner's Bring Trust, we're highlighting five different voices
individuals that all been affected by this by this what
(10:54):
is called the felony murder law, and all the individuals
that did not pull the trigger, did not commit the crime,
did not was not at the location. One of the
co founders of the Prisoner's Brain Trust Paris wasn't even
at the location when the crime happened. And it's now
doing twenty five to life. The people who confess to
the murders are already home and have been home for
eight years. Well, nobody likes that, right.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
If you're just tuning in, you're listening to finding Out
with Pete and the poet Gold. I'm Peter Leonard and
I'm the poet gold and we're here with our guest
Alisha Khan. That said it right, all right, co executive
director of the Prisoner's Brain Trust.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
And yeah, you know, you speak so easily about it,
but when you're thinking of the injustice around it. You know,
if somebody had any relationship to a crime. You know,
you go rob a drugstore and you're in the car
waiting for the getaway. You have no intention of there
(11:49):
being any violence or murder, but things go wrong. When
somebody gets shot, you're in for murder. I mean, you
should be in for something maybe, but it's certainly not murder.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
I think the thinking is that, you know that when
you are in that situation, you're looking at the whole
picture of what possibly could go wrong. You know, it's
it's I know, sometimes you know crimes will happen because
maybe I'm sure to food or something and I'm going
to go stick somebody up, But in the processing things
go awry, and so I think that falls out of
(12:20):
you know, you need to think about the fact that
things can go around. I'm not saying I'm I'm for that,
but I think that's part of where they're thinking you know,
comes from with those type of laws.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
Well, see what it is is that it's this wall
is used as a catch all. Right, this is why
prosecutors have ninety nine point six percent conviction rates off
of guilty. Please, Now, the reality is is that the felony.
What we're trying to do is we're trying to hold
prosecutors accountable because the person who is the getaway driver,
there's a law for that. They would go and gone
(12:50):
to prison for being a getaway driver for the crime.
The person that goes into the store to rob somebody
on the person that they may have been with might
have on alive somebody, right, and so there's a charge
for robbery, and they will still get charged for robbery.
They still get you know whatever you know the possession is.
And well, what this particularly does is that this will
allows the district attorney not to prove that the person
(13:11):
was doing the Berkeley, not to prove that the person
was there, but simply, oh, we have evidence that you
are somewhere in the facility, that you are somehow connected
and so you and so now we get to force
so district attorneys can force guilty. Please, right, majority of
our convictions in New York State are in the United States,
period are done by guilty please, and our district attorney
(13:33):
isn't elected official, and not a lot of people realize
that that these journeys are hiring their conviction rates of like, oh,
we can prove here, we can charge you with felony
murder because you were simply there, when it's not allowing
the actual districttorney to do the investigative work. Right, Because
if the district attorney was able to do the investigative work,
people like Paris was not at the scene of the crime,
(13:54):
People like John one of who lent out his keys
to his friends while he was sleeping, is now doing
twenty five delay for murder, right like this, This is
the It's abused in so many different levels, right.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
And what you were talking about earlier about the citizenry
being informed, I mean among all of our listeners, I
think almost nobody. Let me just say, nobody actually thinks
the person was sleeping when a crime gets committed, I
should be in for twenty five dollars, right, absolutely, you
know that's just not controversial. And if the citizenry was
informed about that, it would not.
Speaker 1 (14:31):
Happen, or you're in a car with someone and you
don't know they have drugs in the back, but you
know they give you a ride and you the next
minute you stopped, and now you're going down a rabbit
hole because of something that you weren't even informed about when.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
You were talking about it before. It occurred to me
that it's sort of akin to working for a company.
I say, you know, you're an employee or working HR,
but the company gets convicted of tax fraud, and you know,
and the treasurer committed tax fraud is going is going
(15:05):
to be punished that you should be punished for working
in HR. You know, it's not fair, so you're just
working in the company. They don't indict everybody. Yeah, it
just gets the treasure or the CEO whatever. It's really unfair.
And you also refer very casually to the Attica and
(15:28):
many many people don't know about Attaka. Can you explain
the history on that?
Speaker 3 (15:35):
Yeah, absolutely so. In nineteen seventy one, there's what is
called Attica uprising at Attica Correctional Facility, which is in
New York State prison located near Buffalo work sorry, the
city of Buffalo actually located. I think the town is
actually called Attica, but it's near Buffalo, and in nineteen
seventy one individuals. What ended up happening is like the
(15:58):
conditions were bored at that time. Prisoners weren't acting visitis,
prisoners were not getting access to mail and not access
to the family's access to legal help. And the reality
is that all the correctional officers in Attica were all white.
Majority of the prisoners inside of Attica Correctional facility were
black or brown. A lot of the individuals because of
his nineteen seventy one got were there because of cointel
(16:19):
pro and how that individuals were former black panthers, former
young lords, all coming to inside of the state prison
system in one way or another. And the day before,
on September, September ninth, well September eighth, they killed somebody
inside of Attica, the correctional officers did. And on September ninth,
the prisoners had enough of it. It wasn't necessary, it
(16:40):
wasn't something that was planned, We're going to be doing this.
It just was a breaking point. It was a breaking
point of where where an officer was putting hands on
somebody else and people stepped in and then they controlled
a deep blockyard, and for five days, prisoners built community.
They created health tends to make sure everybody was healthy,
and they had people who were like medically trained. And
these are prisons, all prisoners, no correctional officers. They had security,
(17:03):
they had food, they had sleeping guds, They had a
policy team to talk about their demands of what they wanted.
And they weren't asking to be flown out of Attica.
They were simply asking, we want to be able to
go on visits brother families, we want legal mail, we
want to be able to access the courts. And after
those five days, they would not give the prisoners immunity,
and so Governor Rockefell sentenced the National Guard. They armed
(17:26):
state police, they armed correctional officers, they armed town people,
and they murdered individuals. They murdered twenty six incarcerated men
who were inside of Attica, plus tenk correctional officers. They
were held hostage. And the aspects of the aftermath that
happened forward and being in prison and being with people
(17:47):
who was incarcerated in Attica, is you know, telling me
the story about the aspects of like from that moment
after all those people were killed, is what the green
Haven Think Tank started and what actually the catalyst to
the modern day prison abolition movement of where there's the
reason why there's college inside of prison. If you ever
check out the Barred prison college program, right, they're amazing, Right.
(18:10):
The reason why that you can have business with your family,
you can access the courts, why that you can obtain
a ged a vocational trade, why organizations like these can
actually exist is because of the Attica Uprising and all
that led to you know today, and there's what its
bars because despite everything that they were getting in the
Attica Uprising, it is slowly being taken away by the state,
(18:33):
especially with the recent correctional officers strike that was recent
ago across New York State, and with the murder of
Robert Brooks and Massia and Nyataua and those things are
the aspects of how all that was, all the blood
that was spilled for all these changes has now often
gott mute.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
I think one of the programs that came out of
that program I went through, if I'm correct, AVP, I'll
turn to violence. A Quaker program that I studied came
out of that.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Yeah, absolutely, And there's so many and so one of
the programs that did come out that was the alternative
the Violence Project and of where they teach conflict resolution
and how to be in community. And it's been a
program for since nineteen seventy six and it runs in
it's actually internationally at this point. It is and the
college to write ABP the Puppies behind Bar programs. If
(19:22):
you've seen the new movie Sing Sing with the Rehabilitation
through the Arts movie, that was, you know, one of
the reasons of like because of that uprising and.
Speaker 2 (19:33):
Very few nineteen seventy one, you know, fifty years ago,
almost nobody when they reviewed the whole incident, especially from
the point of view what we have now, nobody thinks
the conditions in Attica were respectful of anybody's human rights. So,
I mean, the prisons really had a case as the point,
(19:55):
and almost nobody thinks that Governor rockefellas response to it,
in other words, we're going to solve this by violence
was a good idea looking back on it, I remember
at the time it was as if the inmates were
holding the whole state hostage. You know, the way it
got reported and what they were looking for is, you know,
(20:17):
a basic stuff.
Speaker 1 (20:18):
To be treated like humans.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Yeah, treated respect for human rights. And a person was
very important in Poughkeepsie in subsequent years was Lachief Islam,
who was part of the thing tank on that and uh,
you know, La Chief became a very prominent Poughkeepsie leader
and was really one of the founders of the Family
(20:40):
Partnership Center, and you know, attracted other great leaders, you
like Trey Arronton came because when he came home, he
came home to Poughkeepsie instead of the Bronx, because that's
what La Chief was. And these are very important people
and our local history.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
And then I want to get you know, massive degrees
and you know, become educated in various fields and social workers.
If you're just tuning in, you're listening to finding out
with Pete and the Poet Gold. I'm Peter and on
the Poet Gold and we're here with Alicia Kahan, who
was the co executive director for the Prison Brain Trust.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
Yeah, Olisha, I really love when you first your first
paragraph talking on the air, you mentioned that you were
formally you are a formally incarcerated person. Because what that
does it not only legitimizes, but it humanizes everything else
you say, you know, so it's, uh, there's nothing theoretical
(21:39):
about having spent time in prison, and just how would
you characterize that ten years of your life?
Speaker 3 (21:52):
Not a happy one? So for me, I identify as a
trans woman. New York State Department of Corrections did not
match regnized that I spent my ten years inside of
a mail facility. Trauma happened. I don't think we have
enough time in a podcast to go through that, but
it is it definitely the reality is this to turn
(22:16):
my world upside now. I'm from the Hudson Valley. I
grew up in Goshen, right in Orange County. I grew
up predominantly in white suburbia. I was a firefighter, right,
My uncles were police officers. The law was good in
my eyes, right, and so going into prison and my
(22:37):
story has, you know, a lot to do with drug addiction,
and that's what led me into prison for ten years
and it was not fun. But at the end of
the day, I met some amazing people. I met some
amazing people in the world that have contributed my own
personal growth and development. The contribution of I always liked
(22:58):
to shadow of Paris of somebody who is you know,
inspired me to be the person that I am today
when I walked out of the When I walked out
of prison in twenty seventeen, I had forty dollars in
my pocket and my clothes in my back. Right, I
can say that I have a much beautiful life now
and everything like that. And so it's just the It
was definitely difficult, but also the reality is that it's
(23:22):
it opened up my eyes and gave me the ability
to open up the eyes of other different community members
of like the reality of like I lived in the
Hutson Valley all my life. It wasn't until I went
to prison that I realized that there was ten prisons
within the Hudson Valley, right, like all like drive through
these neighborhoods, been at Poughkeepsie in high school, right, all
these different areas Newburgh, Kingston. Only to see that, right
(23:45):
and because we don't see that, right, we don't see
that how that prison system is not only to dehumanize individuals,
but it also it takes away from our economy. It
is it takes away industries from coming in here. It
takes away the whereas prisons are now used as a
place of employment, a place of labor, where it becomes
(24:06):
less so of actual like a place of healing and
a place of rehabilitation. I can't say that prison rehabilitated
me whatsoever. I can probably say that I got clean
off of heroin for fifteen years a survived prison. But
I did it with the help of the prisoners. And
I think that's what we look at all these amazing
things that we see on social media and the TV
(24:26):
of all these amazing things that prisoners do, and we
do it because we build community with each other. And
it's not the state that's helping us. It's us as
prisoners looking out for each other. If it wasn't for Paris, Paris,
they go home. Tell your story. Tell the story of
what it's like to be a trans woman inside of
a male's prison for ten years. I think it was
in eight different prisons altogether, eight different prisons across the state.
(24:49):
They gave me the state tour, right, because that's what
it means to be trans if you don't get liked,
to get moved, right, if you know people have a
problem with you.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
But did you find these prisoners, these the prison prisons
are in neighborhoods.
Speaker 3 (25:03):
Yeah, they're they're in middle of the woods. Like there's
like we could get in a car right now, like
right here from Pisi and we can get to ten
different prisons. It's it's there.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
But you said they're in the middle of the woods.
Speaker 3 (25:14):
Yeah, they're they're in they're basically in the backdrop of
like the mountains, like Shuanga. It's like very like you
have other prisons that are close to the city. Is
sing Sing You could drive right down down the street
and you will see sing sing right. But then you
look at Shiwanga, you look at Fishkill, you look at
Downstate which is now closed, and right right there and Beacon,
you look at Eastern right in Ulster County, NAP and AC.
Speaker 1 (25:36):
It's I guess I'm distinguishing between h I guess, jail
and prison.
Speaker 3 (25:40):
So yeah, absolutely, So there's the like we have a
jail at the block, we have the jail up the lock.
That is where people go who are either serving less
than a year or people that are waiting trial. And
so that's the So that's what jails. Once a person
is sentenced to a year or more, they go to
state prison. And so yeah, so every county has a
county jail. It gets confusing because we hear a lot
(26:03):
about Rikers Island. Rikers Island essentially represents all the five boroughs.
It gets a little confusing when you talk about New
York City systems, but everywhere outside of that it's there.
Each county has a jail and that's awaiting sentencing or
doing what is called a county year less than a year,
but anything more than a year that is sentenced, that
is convicted goes to state personal in.
Speaker 2 (26:23):
Terms of the humanizing. While you were talking that fellow,
we mentioned earlier Tree Arrington, who is a formerly incarcerated
person who found the real Skills network of a very
important youth program in Poughkeepsie at the Family Partnership Center
which transitioned but A Tree had a thousand talents and
(26:44):
one of them was cooking. And at Vaster College that
have a prison program there, and they had a day
in which the inmates from green Haven and the students
who went there over a thirty year period were reunited
for a great day and Tree was doing the cooking
(27:04):
for that. Okay, because you could do do so many things.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
I'm a shout out. I'm a shout out Sharon his wife, Sharon,
you know, because because Sharon Sharon's a lot of those meals.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
But nobody's gonna be surprised if Sharon.
Speaker 1 (27:16):
Didn't more cooking Sharon.
Speaker 2 (27:21):
I wasn't disguising that fact, but nobody's surprised. But I
remember Tree saying I went to the event and you know,
just jogging around with the food, and Tree said in
this deep whisper to himself almost but you know he
could hear he goes today, I'm cooking for kings. Yes,
(27:42):
and nobody it was the first time I ever, uh,
in my imagination, had notion that people who were incarcerated
were king. I mean, there's of course a lot of talent,
and Tree had a poetic way of saying it, but
you're humanizing and uh, people who were incarcerated in Trees
(28:04):
sort of in his vision, they were kings who they
suffered injustice, and they were And.
Speaker 1 (28:09):
There were great events, you know, I mean the green
Haven Advasa, those events, you know, that's really just wonderful
environments where you know, the fulling incarcerated, you know, had
come out, really made tremendous dribes such as yourself in
their life and we're doing advocacy work. It wasn't just
some coming out and and dropping everything. They were actually
(28:31):
the bridge for community for those who were still incarcerated.
Speaker 2 (28:35):
One of gus, who was the head of the prominent
in the attic of think tank is going to Eddie Els.
I don't know a few you know, and you know
he would go regularly to the VA green Haven Union.
Was a vaster faculty member who will organized the very
(28:58):
thirty years in a row every Friday. He was in
green Haven with students. And so there's a lot of
great stuff and we only have better minute left, but
could you just give us a sense of how people
could get in touch with you if they wanted more
information on anything from the Valny Murder of law two
(29:20):
other projects you have.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
So we're on Instagram at the Prisoner's brain Trust. And
also September thirteenth, right here in Poughkeepsie, it will be
our sixth annual Attica Community Uprising Community Remembrance Day event
at the water Park. It's on a Saturday, two to
six free food, DJ artwork by incuss Rate individuals. Poetry
(29:43):
that is written by incuss Rate individuals. We have as
a poetry book different nonprofits all across the Hudson Valley
to remember the legacy of Attica and to continue onting
to get people involved with all the amazing work that
goes on here in the Hudson Valley.
Speaker 1 (29:55):
And he's at the water park. Where's the water park? Where?
Where is the WORL Park? Said you said, you said
worst park?
Speaker 2 (30:03):
Where?
Speaker 3 (30:03):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (30:03):
Yeah, I think the.
Speaker 3 (30:07):
War Bickkeepsie waterfron Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
Okay, yeah, got you, got you okay.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
And I might also mention Dennis Woodbine as somebody who
did not let know what to you for uh tree
or a tree. But he's a person who's been on
the show, and he's a formerly close rated person who
is in charge of outreach his family UH Services Family
Partnership Center. And Dennis is just another example of somebody
(30:31):
who has really contributed mightily to the culture here and Poughkeepsie,
especially for you.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
Absolutely so thank you so much Alicia for coming on
and please come back again. Yeah you know, and and
let us know what's going on maybe as it gets
closer to the September thirteenth event. And to our listeners,
thank you for listening to finding out with peting the
poet goal. We appreciate you
The views and opinions expressed in the following programmer those
of the speaker and don't necessarily represent those of the
station it's staff, management or ownership.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Good morning, you'll find me out with Pete and the
Poet Gold.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
I'm Peter Leon and I'm the Poet Gold and we're.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
On the air this morning with a Lisha Kahan from
the Prison's brain Trust. And before we get to Alicia
and her various topics and complications, we're going to go
right to the poet goal for her weekly poem prayer
incantation goal. Please let it roll.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Okay, i haven't done this in a long time, so
I'm going to do the drum beats to rhythm. I can.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
My favorite.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
Yeah, well, I'm glad you like it, Peter, the drum beats,
the rhythm that tells my heart. I can the drum
beats rhythm that tells my heart. I can the drum
beats rhythm that tells my heart. I can? I can?
I can the drum beats the rhythm that tells my heart.
I can. I can be like Harriet's subman running, but
I'm not running. I'm creating, not aping. She gave me
(01:01):
that option. Years ago with her sacrifice, so I may
grow up and walk on water like Christ, because he
is so dope and nice, displaying outstanding possibilities everywhere. Tap
me on the shoulders, pointing me to the stars, and said,
there are the stairs. With faith the sides of a
mustard seed, you can move mountains, build igloos on deserts,
(01:21):
turn rain drops into beads of gold, and create the
greatest stories that will ever be told. I'm a descendant
of the keenest mathematicians. Did you not know that? Recognize
they figured the equation and built pyramids from a grain
of sand, set a top of transmitter, sending me messages
through the rhythm of the beat of the drum, telling
my heart. I can the drum beats rhythm that tells
(01:42):
my heart. I can the drum beats rhythm that tells
my heart. I can the drum beats the rhythm that
tells our hearts.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
We can, and I can say again, I like that one.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
You like that?
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Yeah, I think I'm gonna get a lot of support
in the studio for that one.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Okay, all right has.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
Her vast numbers of original poems, But my experience is
anything that has some music to when she actually sings
and that's a quasi singing song. I love those ones.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
Yeah, I call those poelities.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Polity, which is your own word, right it is, okay,
So I don't want to send anybody scurrying away to
a dictionary, at least as I'm talking about words. I
at least was struck by the title of your group
on Prisoner's brain Trust, and maybe you could explain some
of the fundamentals to that.
Speaker 3 (02:35):
Yeah, absolutely so, we're the person were the Prisoner's brain Trust.
We have started in twenty twenty three, and before then
we were an organization. We were working with the newburg
LGBTQ Center as Queers for Justice under one simple goal
connecting community with currently incarcerated individuals. But the story came
(02:56):
long before that. As us as a group, I'm being
formed formerly incarcerated ten years in prison, individuals that I'm
friends with, who I consider family. We're talking about the
r we scout there. How can we tell our stories
of the pure trauma that we have faced on the
inside and since getting released and connecting with folks, And
since twenty seventeen we've been organizing and since twenty twenty three,
(03:20):
as the Prisoner's Brain Trust founded under the principles of
the green Haven Think Tank, where a group of prisoners
who after the attic Cop Rising were in Greenhaven Correctional Facility,
really expanding this idea of how can we not let
the attic op Rising happen again, and how can we
connect the community with prisoners and learning from those foundations
(03:40):
and keeping the memory of life, of making sure that
currently incarcerated voices are heard, because they're not heard in
our in Albany, they're not heard in the communities right
they're sitting behind in the backdrop of the American world
is where all these prisons are. There's ten prisons within
the Hudson Valley and their voices owner and they're behind
the trees, behind the mountains and living off the memory
(04:03):
is that it starts with a gray RDA a symbols
of bulb and with a bull and with a little
bit of trust, anything can happen.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Now when you say that they are not heard, that
through organizations like yourself, to your organization serves as a
bridge for their voices. Who do you want them? Who
are the listeners? When you say that I heard, what's
the message to be received?
Speaker 3 (04:25):
The message I received is to community members and to
elected officials. Right, elected officials have the power to change laws. Right,
have the power to change these systemic laws.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
Right.
Speaker 3 (04:35):
And but it really is also addressing to the community
of where we put these elected officials into power, and
it's doing what is right for them to actually making
systemic change. And when working within policy issues is that
a lot of different interests are involved. And when looking
at those different interests, it's never asked of like what
(04:55):
do individuals were incarcerated think about this particular policy? What
do they think? What is the most important thing? And
one of the things that we're here to talk about
is like our policy campaign, it's really like what are
the what are the priorities of the prison population. We
have fifteen incarcerated team members across five New York State prisons.
(05:16):
Like I said, we've been growing since two thousand and
nineteen something like that. Yeah, and we've expanded and to
bring their ideas of creating these community based programs. We
have a prisoner agenda that lists the priorities of the
policy and engaging the community through artwork, through testimonial through
to call up their elective officials to move to that
(05:38):
power to let's let's move one as a community, to
bring people home and to really start changing a lot
of these systemic issues that fill our prisons right in
our own backyard.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
Even that word home is an interesting word because I
think that most middle class people, and I think it's
probably even more pronounced in the white middle class, which
I'm clearly a member of, we don't think of people
who are incarcerated as having a home. We think that
(06:09):
they are imprisoned. And because as soon as you use
the word home, you're bringing up somebody's humanity, and I
think it's easier for you know, the dominant group, to
make believe that inmates are not entirely human. They don't
(06:31):
have things like homes, and so the language around it
is important. So for you to use a phrase let's
bring them home, I mean they're they're members of a family,
they're members of a community, the members, they're members of
a force of great good, which are of course we've
(06:52):
experienced in Poughkeepsie. A lot of our prominent leaders have
been formally incarcerated people. But home is a big one.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
I just want to I know a lot of people
get confused on whether or not if the prison population
has a right to vote on you know, during elections
while they're incarcerated or after incarceration.
Speaker 3 (07:15):
No, currently incarcerated prisoners don't have the right to vote.
When you get released, you do have your rights back,
but that law did not change until actually the year
I went home twenty seventeen that you had to after
it first started off as after a year home that
you could apply for a voter parttern I think they
call that at the time from the governor and then
(07:37):
a year later they give to anybody. As soon as
you walk out the door, you have the right to vote,
and you know, and that's one of the core reasons
why the prisoners bring trusted to exist is simply because
people are incarcerated. There's thirty thousand people incarcerated in New
York State right and that's just within the state prisons.
Losing their right to vote. They don't get a say
into what elective officials represent their communities. They don't get
(07:57):
a say of what who represents They don't give a
say of who actually represents them in office or what
policies are actually pushed because they're not voters. They're not
putting the elected officials and when they come home. Absolutely,
But if we're looking at like what the laws around
like folks coming home and that actually ability to vote
is like you have to find out all this information yourself.
(08:18):
They make it hard to like, you have to know
that you have the right to vote right like, and
that's what we do that as the prisoner's brain trust.
But just they don't tell you that information once you
get released, that you now have your voting rights back.
They tell you they're taking them away, but they don't
tell you get them back.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
You get them back. And what about paying after your release.
I've heard stories of people who were still paying for
their sentence so to speak, monetarily.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
No, absolutely so No, that's New York.
Speaker 3 (08:46):
Yeah, there was. I would say, I don't quote me
on the years. A couple of years ago, so I
would say three or four years ago, there was this
law that eliminated all that he finds. It eliminated for
people who have to wear electronic mobs undering basically paying
fines for that. But up until I would say twenty
twenty one, people would have to pay thirty dollars to
go to parole every single month. People would have to
(09:09):
pay for electronic monitoring bracelets. If depending on where individuals
fall under insurance, you have to pay for the mandated
programs you have to do drug treatment, anchor management, workforce.
A lot of those programs are given for free, but
if you're not covered under Medicaid, which is definitely a
lot easier now, but you had to pay them out
of pocket. And I've heard stories about that. It didn't
(09:29):
affect me. I was covered by interns simply just by
coming home. But people did have to pay for that.
And I had to pay for my parole during my
time that I was on parole, and until I got
off thirty dollars a month being on food stamps. Look
at taking six months for a job, right and still
having that required requirement to pay.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
That's a Your arithmetic gets very simple if you get
out of If you get released and you don't saw
out with the job, you're broke, and then you have
to pay for parola. That's a lot. I was not
aware of that at all. And you know there's also
(10:13):
a felony law that you I know is prominent and
you're thinking you want to talk about that. Yeah, absolutely,
murder a felony. Yeah, So this is the Prisoner's Bring Trust.
We worked with people who are currently incarcerated and to
create a campaign on our prisoner agreenda is to get
rid of the law that's called the felony murder law doctrine,
(10:33):
which is not murder at all. It's somebody who somebody
can be charged with second degree murder even if they
were not at the scene of the crime, if they
didn't have any attent on killing the person, if they
were a person that was in the car. And so
at the Prisoner's Bring Trust, we're highlighting five different voices
individuals that all been affected by this by this what
(10:54):
is called the felony murder law, and all the individuals
that did not pull the trigger, did not commit the crime,
did not was not at the location. One of the
co founders of the Prisoner's Brain Trust Paris wasn't even
at the location when the crime happened. And it's now
doing twenty five to life. The people who confess to
the murders are already home and have been home for
eight years. Well, nobody likes that, right.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
If you're just tuning in, you're listening to finding Out
with Pete and the poet Gold. I'm Peter Leonard and
I'm the poet gold and we're here with our guest
Alisha Khan. That said it right, all right, co executive
director of the Prisoner's Brain Trust.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
And yeah, you know, you speak so easily about it,
but when you're thinking of the injustice around it. You know,
if somebody had any relationship to a crime. You know,
you go rob a drugstore and you're in the car
waiting for the getaway. You have no intention of there
(11:49):
being any violence or murder, but things go wrong. When
somebody gets shot, you're in for murder. I mean, you
should be in for something maybe, but it's certainly not murder.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
I think the thinking is that, you know that when
you are in that situation, you're looking at the whole
picture of what possibly could go wrong. You know, it's
it's I know, sometimes you know crimes will happen because
maybe I'm sure to food or something and I'm going
to go stick somebody up, But in the processing things
go awry, and so I think that falls out of
(12:20):
you know, you need to think about the fact that
things can go around. I'm not saying I'm I'm for that,
but I think that's part of where they're thinking you know,
comes from with those type of laws.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
Well, see what it is is that it's this wall
is used as a catch all. Right, this is why
prosecutors have ninety nine point six percent conviction rates off
of guilty. Please, Now, the reality is is that the felony.
What we're trying to do is we're trying to hold
prosecutors accountable because the person who is the getaway driver,
there's a law for that. They would go and gone
(12:50):
to prison for being a getaway driver for the crime.
The person that goes into the store to rob somebody
on the person that they may have been with might
have on alive somebody, right, and so there's a charge
for robbery, and they will still get charged for robbery.
They still get you know whatever you know the possession is.
And well, what this particularly does is that this will
allows the district attorney not to prove that the person
(13:11):
was doing the Berkeley, not to prove that the person
was there, but simply, oh, we have evidence that you
are somewhere in the facility, that you are somehow connected
and so you and so now we get to force
so district attorneys can force guilty. Please, right, majority of
our convictions in New York State are in the United States,
period are done by guilty please, and our district attorney
(13:33):
isn't elected official, and not a lot of people realize
that that these journeys are hiring their conviction rates of like, oh,
we can prove here, we can charge you with felony
murder because you were simply there, when it's not allowing
the actual districttorney to do the investigative work. Right, Because
if the district attorney was able to do the investigative work,
people like Paris was not at the scene of the crime,
(13:54):
People like John one of who lent out his keys
to his friends while he was sleeping, is now doing
twenty five delay for murder, right like this, This is
the It's abused in so many different levels, right.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
And what you were talking about earlier about the citizenry
being informed, I mean among all of our listeners, I
think almost nobody. Let me just say, nobody actually thinks
the person was sleeping when a crime gets committed, I
should be in for twenty five dollars, right, absolutely, you
know that's just not controversial. And if the citizenry was
informed about that, it would not.
Speaker 1 (14:31):
Happen, or you're in a car with someone and you
don't know they have drugs in the back, but you
know they give you a ride and you the next
minute you stopped, and now you're going down a rabbit
hole because of something that you weren't even informed about when.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
You were talking about it before. It occurred to me
that it's sort of akin to working for a company.
I say, you know, you're an employee or working HR,
but the company gets convicted of tax fraud, and you know,
and the treasurer committed tax fraud is going is going
(15:05):
to be punished that you should be punished for working
in HR. You know, it's not fair, so you're just
working in the company. They don't indict everybody. Yeah, it
just gets the treasure or the CEO whatever. It's really unfair.
And you also refer very casually to the Attica and
(15:28):
many many people don't know about Attaka. Can you explain
the history on that?
Speaker 3 (15:35):
Yeah, absolutely so. In nineteen seventy one, there's what is
called Attica uprising at Attica Correctional Facility, which is in
New York State prison located near Buffalo work sorry, the
city of Buffalo actually located. I think the town is
actually called Attica, but it's near Buffalo, and in nineteen
seventy one individuals. What ended up happening is like the
(15:58):
conditions were bored at that time. Prisoners weren't acting visitis,
prisoners were not getting access to mail and not access
to the family's access to legal help. And the reality
is that all the correctional officers in Attica were all white.
Majority of the prisoners inside of Attica Correctional facility were
black or brown. A lot of the individuals because of
his nineteen seventy one got were there because of cointel
(16:19):
pro and how that individuals were former black panthers, former
young lords, all coming to inside of the state prison
system in one way or another. And the day before,
on September, September ninth, well September eighth, they killed somebody
inside of Attica, the correctional officers did. And on September ninth,
the prisoners had enough of it. It wasn't necessary, it
(16:40):
wasn't something that was planned, We're going to be doing this.
It just was a breaking point. It was a breaking
point of where where an officer was putting hands on
somebody else and people stepped in and then they controlled
a deep blockyard, and for five days, prisoners built community.
They created health tends to make sure everybody was healthy,
and they had people who were like medically trained. And
these are prisons, all prisoners, no correctional officers. They had security,
(17:03):
they had food, they had sleeping guds, They had a
policy team to talk about their demands of what they wanted.
And they weren't asking to be flown out of Attica.
They were simply asking, we want to be able to
go on visits brother families, we want legal mail, we
want to be able to access the courts. And after
those five days, they would not give the prisoners immunity,
and so Governor Rockefell sentenced the National Guard. They armed
(17:26):
state police, they armed correctional officers, they armed town people,
and they murdered individuals. They murdered twenty six incarcerated men
who were inside of Attica, plus tenk correctional officers. They
were held hostage. And the aspects of the aftermath that
happened forward and being in prison and being with people
(17:47):
who was incarcerated in Attica, is you know, telling me
the story about the aspects of like from that moment
after all those people were killed, is what the green
Haven Think Tank started and what actually the catalyst to
the modern day prison abolition movement of where there's the
reason why there's college inside of prison. If you ever
check out the Barred prison college program, right, they're amazing, Right.
(18:10):
The reason why that you can have business with your family,
you can access the courts, why that you can obtain
a ged a vocational trade, why organizations like these can
actually exist is because of the Attica Uprising and all
that led to you know today, and there's what its
bars because despite everything that they were getting in the
Attica Uprising, it is slowly being taken away by the state,
(18:33):
especially with the recent correctional officers strike that was recent
ago across New York State, and with the murder of
Robert Brooks and Massia and Nyataua and those things are
the aspects of how all that was, all the blood
that was spilled for all these changes has now often
gott mute.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
I think one of the programs that came out of
that program I went through, if I'm correct, AVP, I'll
turn to violence. A Quaker program that I studied came
out of that.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Yeah, absolutely, And there's so many and so one of
the programs that did come out that was the alternative
the Violence Project and of where they teach conflict resolution
and how to be in community. And it's been a
program for since nineteen seventy six and it runs in
it's actually internationally at this point. It is and the
college to write ABP the Puppies behind Bar programs. If
(19:22):
you've seen the new movie Sing Sing with the Rehabilitation
through the Arts movie, that was, you know, one of
the reasons of like because of that uprising and.
Speaker 2 (19:33):
Very few nineteen seventy one, you know, fifty years ago,
almost nobody when they reviewed the whole incident, especially from
the point of view what we have now, nobody thinks
the conditions in Attica were respectful of anybody's human rights. So,
I mean, the prisons really had a case as the point,
(19:55):
and almost nobody thinks that Governor rockefellas response to it,
in other words, we're going to solve this by violence
was a good idea looking back on it, I remember
at the time it was as if the inmates were
holding the whole state hostage. You know, the way it
got reported and what they were looking for is, you know,
(20:17):
a basic stuff.
Speaker 1 (20:18):
To be treated like humans.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Yeah, treated respect for human rights. And a person was
very important in Poughkeepsie in subsequent years was Lachief Islam,
who was part of the thing tank on that and uh,
you know, La Chief became a very prominent Poughkeepsie leader
and was really one of the founders of the Family
(20:40):
Partnership Center, and you know, attracted other great leaders, you
like Trey Arronton came because when he came home, he
came home to Poughkeepsie instead of the Bronx, because that's
what La Chief was. And these are very important people
and our local history.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
And then I want to get you know, massive degrees
and you know, become educated in various fields and social workers.
If you're just tuning in, you're listening to finding out
with Pete and the Poet Gold. I'm Peter and on
the Poet Gold and we're here with Alicia Kahan, who
was the co executive director for the Prison Brain Trust.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
Yeah, Olisha, I really love when you first your first
paragraph talking on the air, you mentioned that you were
formally you are a formally incarcerated person. Because what that
does it not only legitimizes, but it humanizes everything else
you say, you know, so it's, uh, there's nothing theoretical
(21:39):
about having spent time in prison, and just how would
you characterize that ten years of your life?
Speaker 3 (21:52):
Not a happy one? So for me, I identify as a
trans woman. New York State Department of Corrections did not
match regnized that I spent my ten years inside of
a mail facility. Trauma happened. I don't think we have
enough time in a podcast to go through that, but
it is it definitely the reality is this to turn
(22:16):
my world upside now. I'm from the Hudson Valley. I
grew up in Goshen, right in Orange County. I grew
up predominantly in white suburbia. I was a firefighter, right,
My uncles were police officers. The law was good in
my eyes, right, and so going into prison and my
(22:37):
story has, you know, a lot to do with drug addiction,
and that's what led me into prison for ten years
and it was not fun. But at the end of
the day, I met some amazing people. I met some
amazing people in the world that have contributed my own
personal growth and development. The contribution of I always liked
(22:58):
to shadow of Paris of somebody who is you know,
inspired me to be the person that I am today
when I walked out of the When I walked out
of prison in twenty seventeen, I had forty dollars in
my pocket and my clothes in my back. Right, I
can say that I have a much beautiful life now
and everything like that. And so it's just the It
was definitely difficult, but also the reality is that it's
(23:22):
it opened up my eyes and gave me the ability
to open up the eyes of other different community members
of like the reality of like I lived in the
Hutson Valley all my life. It wasn't until I went
to prison that I realized that there was ten prisons
within the Hudson Valley, right, like all like drive through
these neighborhoods, been at Poughkeepsie in high school, right, all
these different areas Newburgh, Kingston. Only to see that, right
(23:45):
and because we don't see that, right, we don't see
that how that prison system is not only to dehumanize individuals,
but it also it takes away from our economy. It
is it takes away industries from coming in here. It
takes away the whereas prisons are now used as a
place of employment, a place of labor, where it becomes
(24:06):
less so of actual like a place of healing and
a place of rehabilitation. I can't say that prison rehabilitated
me whatsoever. I can probably say that I got clean
off of heroin for fifteen years a survived prison. But
I did it with the help of the prisoners. And
I think that's what we look at all these amazing
things that we see on social media and the TV
(24:26):
of all these amazing things that prisoners do, and we
do it because we build community with each other. And
it's not the state that's helping us. It's us as
prisoners looking out for each other. If it wasn't for Paris, Paris,
they go home. Tell your story. Tell the story of
what it's like to be a trans woman inside of
a male's prison for ten years. I think it was
in eight different prisons altogether, eight different prisons across the state.
(24:49):
They gave me the state tour, right, because that's what
it means to be trans if you don't get liked,
to get moved, right, if you know people have a
problem with you.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
But did you find these prisoners, these the prison prisons
are in neighborhoods.
Speaker 3 (25:03):
Yeah, they're they're in middle of the woods. Like there's
like we could get in a car right now, like
right here from Pisi and we can get to ten
different prisons. It's it's there.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
But you said they're in the middle of the woods.
Speaker 3 (25:14):
Yeah, they're they're in they're basically in the backdrop of
like the mountains, like Shuanga. It's like very like you
have other prisons that are close to the city. Is
sing Sing You could drive right down down the street
and you will see sing sing right. But then you
look at Shiwanga, you look at Fishkill, you look at
Downstate which is now closed, and right right there and Beacon,
you look at Eastern right in Ulster County, NAP and AC.
Speaker 1 (25:36):
It's I guess I'm distinguishing between h I guess, jail
and prison.
Speaker 3 (25:40):
So yeah, absolutely, So there's the like we have a
jail at the block, we have the jail up the lock.
That is where people go who are either serving less
than a year or people that are waiting trial. And
so that's the So that's what jails. Once a person
is sentenced to a year or more, they go to
state prison. And so yeah, so every county has a
county jail. It gets confusing because we hear a lot
(26:03):
about Rikers Island. Rikers Island essentially represents all the five boroughs.
It gets a little confusing when you talk about New
York City systems, but everywhere outside of that it's there.
Each county has a jail and that's awaiting sentencing or
doing what is called a county year less than a year,
but anything more than a year that is sentenced, that
is convicted goes to state personal in.
Speaker 2 (26:23):
Terms of the humanizing. While you were talking that fellow,
we mentioned earlier Tree Arrington, who is a formerly incarcerated
person who found the real Skills network of a very
important youth program in Poughkeepsie at the Family Partnership Center
which transitioned but A Tree had a thousand talents and
(26:44):
one of them was cooking. And at Vaster College that
have a prison program there, and they had a day
in which the inmates from green Haven and the students
who went there over a thirty year period were reunited
for a great day and Tree was doing the cooking
(27:04):
for that. Okay, because you could do do so many things.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
I'm a shout out. I'm a shout out Sharon his wife, Sharon,
you know, because because Sharon Sharon's a lot of those meals.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
But nobody's gonna be surprised if Sharon.
Speaker 1 (27:16):
Didn't more cooking Sharon.
Speaker 2 (27:21):
I wasn't disguising that fact, but nobody's surprised. But I
remember Tree saying I went to the event and you know,
just jogging around with the food, and Tree said in
this deep whisper to himself almost but you know he
could hear he goes today, I'm cooking for kings. Yes,
(27:42):
and nobody it was the first time I ever, uh,
in my imagination, had notion that people who were incarcerated
were king. I mean, there's of course a lot of talent,
and Tree had a poetic way of saying it, but
you're humanizing and uh, people who were incarcerated in Trees
(28:04):
sort of in his vision, they were kings who they
suffered injustice, and they were And.
Speaker 1 (28:09):
There were great events, you know, I mean the green
Haven Advasa, those events, you know, that's really just wonderful
environments where you know, the fulling incarcerated, you know, had
come out, really made tremendous dribes such as yourself in
their life and we're doing advocacy work. It wasn't just
some coming out and and dropping everything. They were actually
(28:31):
the bridge for community for those who were still incarcerated.
Speaker 2 (28:35):
One of gus, who was the head of the prominent
in the attic of think tank is going to Eddie Els.
I don't know a few you know, and you know
he would go regularly to the VA green Haven Union.
Was a vaster faculty member who will organized the very
(28:58):
thirty years in a row every Friday. He was in
green Haven with students. And so there's a lot of
great stuff and we only have better minute left, but
could you just give us a sense of how people
could get in touch with you if they wanted more
information on anything from the Valny Murder of law two
(29:20):
other projects you have.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
So we're on Instagram at the Prisoner's brain Trust. And
also September thirteenth, right here in Poughkeepsie, it will be
our sixth annual Attica Community Uprising Community Remembrance Day event
at the water Park. It's on a Saturday, two to
six free food, DJ artwork by incuss Rate individuals. Poetry
(29:43):
that is written by incuss Rate individuals. We have as
a poetry book different nonprofits all across the Hudson Valley
to remember the legacy of Attica and to continue onting
to get people involved with all the amazing work that
goes on here in the Hudson Valley.
Speaker 1 (29:55):
And he's at the water park. Where's the water park? Where?
Where is the WORL Park? Said you said, you said
worst park?
Speaker 2 (30:03):
Where?
Speaker 3 (30:03):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (30:03):
Yeah, I think the.
Speaker 3 (30:07):
War Bickkeepsie waterfron Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
Okay, yeah, got you, got you okay.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
And I might also mention Dennis Woodbine as somebody who
did not let know what to you for uh tree
or a tree. But he's a person who's been on
the show, and he's a formerly close rated person who
is in charge of outreach his family UH Services Family
Partnership Center. And Dennis is just another example of somebody
(30:31):
who has really contributed mightily to the culture here and Poughkeepsie,
especially for you.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
Absolutely so thank you so much Alicia for coming on
and please come back again. Yeah you know, and and
let us know what's going on maybe as it gets
closer to the September thirteenth event. And to our listeners,
thank you for listening to finding out with peting the
poet goal. We appreciate you
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal
Gregg Rosenthal and a rotating crew of elite NFL Media co-hosts, including Patrick Claybon, Colleen Wolfe, Steve Wyche, Nick Shook and Jourdan Rodrigue of The Athletic get you caught up daily on all the NFL news and analysis you need to be smarter and funnier than your friends.