Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to finding out with Pete and the poet Gold.
I'm Poet Gold, and Peter Lennard is not with us today,
but I am going to start with a poem and
then introduce you to our guest, Karmen Smallwood. So Carmen,
I said to Carmen when she walked in. We're going
to engage her in this poem today since we're in
the early parts of Women Month, and I'm going to
share with you. Who moves the mountain?
Speaker 2 (00:20):
We move the mountain.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Who moves the mountain?
Speaker 2 (00:22):
We move the mountain.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
In our lives, there are blocks and walls, at times
appearing insurmountable, yet we climb, finding nooks and crannies to
grab hold of sink hooks into gingerly we go. It's
true patience is a virtue. Peaks take time to reach,
Truth takes time to see. Hope moves us on so
our fears can be overcome. I am an American woman
(00:46):
born in a place where oppression was and sometimes still
is common practice, where women were considered not capable of
possessing a body and mind weaker than the stars and
stripes did not include our equal rights. But who moves
the mountain.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
We move the mountain. Who moves the mountain, we move
the mountain.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
There is still a movement that echoes the shouts of
those who fought for national suffrage. There is still a
movement to shatter the glass ceiling of economic deprivation. Break
down the walls and the glass ceiling will fall. There
is still a movement to stand for fair and equitable life,
representing those who voices are suppressed. There's still a movement
against the extremes who claim to be pro life, and
(01:25):
yet they oppress the rights of the life when it's born.
Who moves the.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Mountain, we move the mountain. Who moves the mountain, We
move the mountain.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Does history take great pleasure in stories of subjugation where
male dominance creates systemic social diseases, where humanity resists no evolution,
still building a country on terror and greed because of
subconscious fright of annihilation? What do you believe? Who moves
the mountain, we move the mountain. Who moves the mountain, We.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Move the mountain.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
Thank you, Caren, you did that well. Welcome Carmon Smallwood,
the Assistant Commissioner for Youth Services here in Duchess County.
How you doing today.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
I'm doing great.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Yeah you're doing Yeah great, that's fantastic. So tell our
listeners a little bit about you know, what your role is,
and then we'll talk about Women's Month and your participation
in Poe Goold Knows Women Leads Duchess last year.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
Thank you, Poe Gold.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
So as part of my work with Duchess County, I
oversee what's called the Path the Promised Initiative. It really
is a multi year effort to ensure that all youth
in Duchess County have the assets that they need to
be successful as they emerge into adulthood. So that runs
the gamut between secure housing resources for youth who are
homeless and run away. It also involves providing mental health
(02:42):
services and brief intervention services for youth that need support
not only at home, but also in schools and in
the communities. We also work with our local probation departments
and provide resources for justice involved youth. And in addition
to that, we provide funding through New York State funds
and county dollars to support not only nonprofit organizations, but
(03:04):
also municipalities and schools within Dutchess County. So our services
really run the gamut between providing services, opportunities, and support
for youth and their families throughout Dutchess County.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Well, I mean it's good that you have your hands
in the organization itself, not you specifically, but the organization
itself is touching upon a well rounded sphere of the
services that you may find that that youth need. Question
for you, are the youth mostly? Do you find teenagers
that experience mostly the hardship or middle schoolers or what's
(03:39):
the what's the age group that you find that you're
helping most of Right.
Speaker 3 (03:44):
Now, we're primarily focused on our preteens and teens. But
that's not to say that our younger youth are not
experiencing hardships either.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
It's just that they're more prevalent.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
They're more emergent now with our teenagers and especially in
terms of the mental health issues that we're seeing that
amongst our teams more so than some of our other groups.
But we serviced all youth in our county in our
various services and programs.
Speaker 1 (04:10):
Now, last year, you know, being a women leader in
your capacity in Duchess County, you participated in poetgo Knows
Women Lead Duchess and for those listeners who are not
did not have the opportunity to hear some of our
shows last year during Women's Month. It's a show that
it's a conference more or less a workshop that's designed
to bring women leaders together here in Duchess County. It
(04:34):
was my way of sort of saying thank you for
all the hard work that the women community and women
leaders put forth in our community to make change and
advocate for others. So you participated in that, what was
your takeaway? You know, did you have some insights that
you brought into your world so to speak, that you
(04:56):
felt were applicable? I mean, what was your takeaway from
the event?
Speaker 3 (04:59):
Its of well, first, I want to thank you for
having the vision and the foresight to even put this
event together. But my biggest takeaway was to focus on gratitude.
And I say that because during that event, I was
able to have opportunity to thank someone who was a
mentor to me, someone who was in the room, and
(05:22):
so it was really special to me to have that
opportunity to tell her how much she means to me
in that space in real time while she's still here.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
With us, you know.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
And I thought that focusing on gratitude was the thing
that was going to help me through the most difficult
things that I've been experiencing in the job and at home.
But to focus on being thankful is really my biggest
takeaway from that event.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
Right, Yeah, thankful for not even just in the event,
And I can totally relate to that, even for the growth.
You know, when something seems to be challenging, people say,
how can you be thankful for that? You know, well,
I'm thankful that something gave me the grace to be
able to grow through it, to learn about the experience
and maybe apply something different if I'm faced with the
(06:07):
same challenge, you know, And so there is a certain
gratitude in that growing space. What does Women's Month mean
to you? When you know we all have our months, right,
we all have our months. So you know what is
that when people say, well, Women's Month, what resonates with
you in that?
Speaker 3 (06:25):
I always thought it was a time for reflection, for
like deep reflection on the women in my life and
what they went through to get to where they are
and who am I had to say, why I can't
do anything when these women have done things even more
difficult than I've ever done. So I reflect on that,
especially when I'm thinking about some challenges that I'm dealing
(06:48):
with and really focusing on other women and how they
were able to overcome and that's given me the strength
to push through some of the adversity.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
I want to talk about some of those women. You know,
share a story.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
Okay, Well, at that event, my mentor, who happens to
be the commissioner of our Department of Community and Family Services,
was at the event, and that is Sabrina Marzuka. I
have known her for a good twenty years and in
one of my early professional experiences, she actually hired me to.
Speaker 2 (07:18):
Do a job that I really had no idea about
it all.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
But at the time, she was overseeing our health department
and I was overseeing a grant through the state Health Department,
and I remember some of the state priorities changed and
we were facing losing funding for the programming, and I
remember sitting in a room with her and just crying, crying,
and then feeling embarrassed that I'm in front of these
(07:43):
professionals and especially her, and just crying about losing the
funding and how it was going to impact our young people,
not even at all thinking about how might impact my job,
but thinking about the youth that we had been working
with through this health Department grant and I remember her
reaching over, rubbing my back and saying it was going
to be okay. And in that moment, I truly believe
(08:05):
so I said she said it, I believe it.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
That's what it's going to be.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
And I'm gonna truly thank her for that and every
other time I've gone to her for the challenge, for
her to keep reassuring me that everything is going to
be okay, and it always is.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
I want to come back to that. But to our listeners,
those who are just tuning in, you're listening to finding
out with Pete and the Poet Gold. I'm Poet Gold
and Peter's not with us here today, but trust me,
he will be back for our next show. So that
that rings empathy. Empathy, you know, and I do you Well,
(08:40):
I'll keep my opinion to myself with that. Let me
just ask you a question. Do you find empathy in
the workplace equitable or not? Hmm?
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Interesting?
Speaker 3 (08:54):
Well, I try to promote a workplace that promotes empathy,
and I can only do things that are within my
control right, so within my department and my staff. You know,
we do spend a lot of time myself speaking to
staff about things that are happening to them, things that
they are experiencing, and me allowing them to feel comfortable
(09:17):
in the space to do so because I know that
if they are not feeling secure, it's going to impact
the work, right.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
And I always say that.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
We are a team, like if some one of our
team members aren't doing well, all of us aren't doing well,
and that signals for us to jump in and support.
So we really do act like a team. We are
there for each other. If we need something done, we
step in, no questions, ask and get it done.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
But we're also there to support each other.
Speaker 3 (09:42):
In the difficult times as well and come together in
communities to support one another.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Now do you think that that's that that's a characteristic
uniquely sort of there that women carry the ability to
be a little bit more compassionate, the ability to hold
empathy for others. Because there's a lot of language today
around merit merit base, you know, we have to focus
(10:07):
on things being merit based and let's move out of
the emotion area. What do you feel about that? Notice,
I said, what do you feel right, Yes, yes.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
So you're playing words there.
Speaker 3 (10:20):
I've been in other spaces that were more male dominated,
and I didn't really feel that same sense of community
that I feel in spaces that have women leadership. Not
to say that those other spaces weren't great, it was
just different. I know that now in the spaces that
I'm in that are headed by women, I feel much
(10:42):
more comfortable and the spaces than I was previously.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
So when we look at.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
Merit and those things, yes, there's space in place for that,
but I also think there's space for human connection and
really focusing on the needs of the individual and what
it is that they need to do their job successfully.
Once you find that thing that they need, they will
achieve greatness, right, right, So we can't.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
Overlook one to look at the other.
Speaker 3 (11:13):
It can't just be Merit isolated by itself, but looking
at them those needs, addressing them, supporting them and helping
them to be the best that they can be in
that workplace, and that's what true success really is.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
Right. I think there's you know, there's there's a four
personality types. I have sales background, and there's four personality types.
There's the shock, you know, that's merit based, it's just
all about the money. Just let's just do what we
need to do and make it happen. And and then
there's the urchin the detailed or an individual, and there's
the dolphin, the person who likes to have a lot
(11:46):
of fun, and the whale. The whale is the person
that's I guess the giver so to speak, doesn't want
to have a conversation really about money, but once to
have a conversation about change, and it's more of a
feeling type of individual the whale. But I have found
in having worked in corporate environments, having worked in environments
(12:08):
where it's about mindfulness, that the person that can have
both to you to your point that you were bringing out,
will work the longest hours, you know, will not feel
like they're going home underappreciated, exhausted. You know they would
they would be willing to give the one hundred and
ten percent with a simple pat on the back, with
(12:31):
the simple I think you did a great job, or
how can I help you do something greater than where
you are? Is there an obstacle that we can help
you overcome?
Speaker 2 (12:41):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (12:42):
Yeah, so you bring that, you bring that to you
your team.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
Absolutely and I tell them to focus on the mission.
What is our mission and that should be our north
star driving us to do this work. Yes, there are
going to be times where it's hard and it's going
to be difficult, but if we focus on the mission,
at the end of the day, we can say we've
done everything we could to achieve that to work towards
that mission, and it gives us a sense of peace
(13:07):
and all. Everything's not always going to be right, and
they know that I'm never coming down on them or
saying you didn't do it right. I always say what
could be done differently? How can we how could we
look at this situation and make some improvements based upon
what's happening.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
But it's not a right or wrong thing to me.
Speaker 3 (13:22):
It's like, Okay, let's look at a different perspective and
how we address this particular issue.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
In the room last year for Poego's Women Leads dutcheses,
were there any stories that resonated with you that you
can you can recall, or any activity that you know
that moved the needle for you.
Speaker 3 (13:42):
Yeah, well it wasn't an activity per se, but I
think we were all gifted with a two dollars bill
and that was really special to me because it's unique
and it's rare. And I was looking around the room
and I think I said to someone, I was like, yeah,
just like us, you know, like we are all unique,
we are all rare, we're all valuable, just like this
two dollar bill. I think I said that, And it's like,
(14:03):
we have to remember that, especially when we're in spaces
where people don't value us or devalue us. We have
to remember just how special, rare and valuable that we are.
And so I actually have that in my room as
a reminder of that, really.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
I do. I look at it often.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
I was like, that's right, I'm rare, I'm valuable, and
I'm unique. And I look at that, and I think
that's another takeaway that I took from there.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
Now, now Carmen spells her name with the K. What
was your affirmation? It's an activity that we do so
that you can see yourself in a good light when
the world may be beating you down. So what was
your What was your Do you remember your affirmation?
Speaker 3 (14:39):
I believe it was kind and I really truly tied
to be kind in any space that I'm in, even
if I'm not feeling.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
It deep down.
Speaker 3 (14:47):
I really pushed through that because I think that changes
the atmosphere when you bring a level of kindness to spaces,
especially when you might be dealing with someone who's not
being kind that I always try to maintain kindness no
matter what I'm faced with, to change the atmosphere and
the outcome of that situation.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
Have you have you found success in that in some way?
I have.
Speaker 3 (15:09):
Actually, just this week, I was dealing with a difficult
situation with an individual who you know, we were in
some disagreements and I just went to her with.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
All kinds of kindness that I just chiled and went to.
Speaker 3 (15:23):
Her, and our whole conversation totally shifted and by the
end of it we were both laughing and really really
supporting each other. So, yeah, that was a recent, real
story that just happened a couple of days ago.
Speaker 1 (15:37):
Kindness works. I think kindness is, you know, underrated with people.
People have this thing about being what they feel being vulnerable,
and I get it, there's a fear in there. Before
I continue, if you're just tuning in, you're listening to
finding out with Pete in the poet Gold and I
am Poet Gold and Peter is not here today, but
he will be back with us in our next couple
of shows. And thank you to our listeners for tuning
(15:59):
in talking about kindness. Right at this moment, I'm here
with Carmen Smallwood, the Assistant Commissioner for Youth Services a
Duchess County. So, going back to my point, kindness is underrated. Yeah,
some people feel there's a saying like, don't you know,
don't be a what is it a wall, a floor mat?
You know, with kindness if you're too kind. I don't
(16:20):
believe in the thing that you can be too kind,
you know. Yes, I mean it's just you're kind or
you're not kind. Yes, that's the bottom line. You're kind
of you're not kind. And and so there's a there's
a fear in being kind that people have. Why do
you think they have that?
Speaker 3 (16:41):
Well, interesting you brought up that fear of kindness because
prior to serving in this position, I actually served as
a probation officer for nine years in Duchess County. I'm
working alongside justice involved youth and adults, and my colleagues
would often say, well, you're too kind, right, And I said, what.
Speaker 2 (17:00):
Do you mean?
Speaker 1 (17:01):
I liked your head tilt when you did that studio.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
Yeah, I just didn't understand where there are coming from.
Why can I be kind and show kindness to people
who are in our justice system. There's nothing good that's
going to come from me being mean towards people or
acting authoritative and aggressive.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Nothing's gonna come from that. I said, I'm not going
to change who I am because you have a fear
or because you don't like how I'm acting.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
I'm gonna approach every situation with kindness, no matter who
steps into my office, who I'm dealing with. And by
the way, my outcomes were very great. My versisi vism
rates were low, and I believe it's because I treated
people as humans walking in, not as someone who was
a who had a misdemeanor or a felony, convection convention.
It's just a human coming in who had a challenge
(17:53):
that we needed to work on.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
Together to open.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
And that goes back to the empathy. Yes, yeah, no,
you know people will if you can empathize, people will produce. Yes,
people produce because all of us just want to be
acknowledged in some form or another. You know, I call
it the big hug, and I get it that, you know,
sometimes it's hard to receive the hug, especially if you
(18:17):
don't come from an environment that is a hugging environment
or an environment of kindness.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
You know.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
I have an interesting story about I was on the
subway and a gentleman was, you know, coming through, and
he was begging, and I reached in my pocket and
I gave him a dollar. There was a gentleman sitting
across from me, maybe a little bit to my right,
and he proceeded at that point. It was very interesting
the dynamic. He proceeded to talk to the people to
(18:45):
the right and to the left of him to condemn
my behavior of giving the gentleman the dollar. Now, normally,
if I have food, I give food, you know, but
I didn't have food that day, so I was like, okay,
let me give you a dollar bill. And I've watched
the stress in this man for my act of kindness
(19:06):
sort of ruined his day so much that he had
to sort of bring together people to agree, you know,
And I thought to myself, Wow, this is just at
that point, I just became the observer, you know, sort
of like sort of like a psychologist, you know, observing
something of behavior. And I was like, Wow, this is
really deep. How far we will go to cover up
(19:30):
our own fears, you know, cover up that that I
don't I rather be mean and so, but I don't
want to be seemed to be mean. So I need
other people to affirm my hate, affirm my meanness, and
justify it with me. It was a it was a
really really strange kind of thing. How people do that? So,
(19:52):
what's going on in your office? Now? What's going on
in the agency?
Speaker 3 (19:56):
Ah, I'm glad that you asked, because talking about empathy
and highness. We're actually getting ready to start our eighth
Youth and Police Initiative Session. It's a program we started
a few years ago just bringing youth and law enforcement
officers who patrol their communities, in their neighborhoods together to
learn from each other, to break down the stereotypes, and
(20:16):
to build community amongst each other. We are starting it
Monday at Poughkeepsie High School and we have officers representing
the city in the town of Poughkeepsie, the Sheriff's Department,
our State police, and the Hyde Park Police Department and
probation and we have just.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
Been doing this.
Speaker 3 (20:37):
It's not a whole prescribed program, But it's learning from
each other and the youth tell their stories, the officers
tell their stories. We break bread together and transformation begins.
And it's one of the programs that I have found
to be so much successful in terms of our officers
and our youth being able to learn from each other
(20:57):
and come together in community.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
You're going into the schools with this, Yes, yeah, that's
that's that's really cool because I remember when I was
a child, we had a community. We had beat cops,
you know, cops who used to walk the beat. And
I think it makes a big difference of you know,
when you see our cop was Tony, I still remember
his name, you know, and he was on a motorcycle
(21:22):
all the time, you know, and he was just there
talking to the you know, local store owners. But it
makes a huge difference, not even at a point of
safety where you feel safe, but you're communicating with another person, yes,
you know, who has been given the authority to create
a safe environment for you. But after a while, you
(21:44):
sort of see that person just as a person. Yes,
you know.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
That's really the goal of the program, to see each
other's people, right, humans who are existing who have a
lot of similarities that they would not normally know about
unless they are in these spaces to really talk about that, right, right,
So that's what we do. We just create the space
for them to come together and then they do the
hard work together.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
Now, how long is the program been going on.
Speaker 3 (22:07):
We started in twenty twenty two, okay, and we've had
one hundred and twelve youth successfully complete the program. And
we added a mentoring component into it so the youth
will continue to participate in mentoring activities with the officers.
And then for the past two years, we've been teaming
up with other kids in New York State and bringing
our kids and officers to Binghamton University to a larger
(22:30):
conference to talk about the youth and police relationships.
Speaker 1 (22:33):
And what have you been finding that the youths are
communicating with you to the police officers.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
Well, initially, many of our kids said that they don't
want anything to do with the police. They've told me
that the police kill them, that they don't like minorities,
that all they do is cause trouble in their neighborhoods.
Is what I'm hear from young people. A sense of
fear and a sense of not wanting to be in
any spaces, and also for some youth saying they don't
want to be seen with officers, to be shown as
(23:03):
being someone who is in communication with officers in case
there are conflicts in the community. They don't want to
be associated with officers. That's what we see initially in
and I tell the young people, I said, you know what,
if you just come to the first night and you
feel like you don't ever want to come back, that's fine,
but I want you to just give it a try.
(23:26):
All of our young people are like, this is great,
we want to come back. Can I do it again?
Can we stay later?
Speaker 2 (23:30):
Can I? And then through that process they're telling me in.
Speaker 3 (23:34):
The street that they've seen the officer, that they're hanging
out with them. Some of the officers assault and the
kids in the park playing basketball around eleven o'clock. Normally
there are antenna would have been up and said, what
are these kids doing in the park?
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Officer now joining.
Speaker 3 (23:47):
Them and playing basketball with them in the park at
night and recognizing these kids and understanding their stories better
now because of these.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
Programs, and I'm sure that that's the transformative experience for
the officers as well.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
Absolutely well, some of the kids now said that they
wanted to be law enforcement officers and go into that field.
Kids who said they didn't want anything to do with
law enforcement are now looking to pursuing those careers. We
have one individual in the program who just started the
Explorer's program through the Sheriff's Department. This was not even
in her career trajectory before she was involved in the program.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
Right. I was just looking at the time here on
the clock. We were good. We're good, We're good. So
how if someone wanted to access services through your organization,
what would they do?
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Well?
Speaker 3 (24:37):
We are looking on the Dutchess County website. That's how
a lot of people find out about us. We are
Duchess County Youth Services Division. We're also known as the
Dutchess County Youth Bureau, and we are at eighty five
Civic Center Plaza. We share the same building as the
Health Department. We are open pretty much Monday through Friday,
nine to five. You can contact our office numbers eight
(25:00):
four or five four eight six three one two nine,
call us or stop by if you are having an
issue with one of your young people, or you yourself
are having issue and need to talk to someone I
would say the majority of our referrals for our intervention
services come directly from the schools.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
We get the school.
Speaker 3 (25:19):
Referrals and also Probation Department we work with them as well,
but we're open to others in the community that need support.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
Can you repeat that number?
Speaker 3 (25:28):
Yeah, you can call it eight four five four eight
six three one two nine. Also look at the Duchess
County website and look for the Duchess County Youth Services
Division also known as the Youth Bureau, So Duchess County
Youth you will find us. We're also located at eighty
five Civic Center, PLAZM, Poughkeepsie.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
So Women's Month is here, you know, and uh, I
want to thank you for being with us. We're not
quite wrapping up yet, but I want to ask you
what message would you give to women who are exploring
different career paths. What would you say to women?
Speaker 3 (26:10):
Well, I would say my career path was all over
the place. It was not linear, it was up and down,
and it had a lot of twists and turns.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
But I would just say just do it, just go
for it.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
A lot of time, our fear holds us back from
even taking that first step. And I was just speaking
with someone earlier today and I said, you have to
take that leap of faith.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
Go for it.
Speaker 3 (26:32):
Maybe it will work out, maybe it won't, but you
don't want to live with regrets and saying I wish
I did do that, I wish I could have did that.
Just go for it and watch the opportunities unfold.
Speaker 2 (26:43):
For you.
Speaker 1 (26:44):
What was one of your most challenging moments and you're
in your in your up and down, you know world,
and panning out your career.
Speaker 3 (26:52):
Uh, definitely being a probation officer. It's not a role
that I ever thought I would be in at all,
and I think one of them, no, hands down. The
most challenging thing for me was firearms training. Having never
even really seen a gun and now I have to
complete farms qualifications. Was difficult, not only physically but mentally
(27:15):
training the process. But having gone through that, I and
told myself, if I could do that, I could do
anything anything.
Speaker 2 (27:23):
And I truly believe that now.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
What was mentally I'm curious what was mentally training about it?
Speaker 3 (27:28):
Just the fact that I would be in the position
to potentially take someone's life.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
Ah, okay, okay, I get it. Carrying a farm, right.
Speaker 2 (27:35):
That's that's the piece that was difficult to think about.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
I had a conversation with the Actually, it's funny a
friend the other night on I don't own a gun.
I grew up in a family of guns. You know,
we had a we were a hunter's my family, and
so there were always you know, twenty two's and twelve
gay shotguns and you know all around. I've shot a
couple of them when I was a kid right up
(28:00):
here in upstate New York, you know. And and so
there was this we were going back and forth whether
or not to get a gun, become a gun owner
or not, you know, and what that's like. My friend
was in your space and saying, I don't think I
can do that. I'll just keep the baseball bat by
my bed.
Speaker 3 (28:16):
You know.
Speaker 1 (28:17):
You know, I'm like, well, you know, you're four ten.
I don't really know how well that's going to do,
you know, saying you know, but I but I could
appreciate the position because it you know, that thought of
possibly taking someone's life, you know, is a hard space,
(28:40):
of course to be in. And and definitely you're out
of that kindness moment, right You're in survival mode. So
but you know, Carmen, thank you for a green to
come on and do our you know, one of our
early shows for Women's Month. We look forward to having
you once again at God Knows Women Lead Duchess. And
(29:02):
to our listeners, thank you for tuning in to finding
out with Pete and the Poet Gold and Peter will
be back with me soon, So thank you everyone for listening.
Thank you Hi. I'm Poet Gold and to celebrate International
Women's History Month, iHeartRadio and Pete and the Poet Gold
are partnering together to bring you the second annual Poet
Gold Knows Women Lead Duchess Luncheon. What I mean is
(29:24):
that Duchess is one of the most women led counties
in New York State. From our elected officials to nonprofit
agency heads, we're building a collaborative, compassionate community life which
creates better lives for our families and individuals. So be
sure to tune in because I Know Women Lead Duchess
Welcome to finding out with Pete and the poet Gold.
I'm Poet Gold, and Peter Lennard is not with us today,
but I am going to start with a poem and
then introduce you to our guest, Karmen Smallwood. So Carmen,
I said to Carmen when she walked in. We're going
to engage her in this poem today since we're in
the early parts of Women Month, and I'm going to
share with you. Who moves the mountain?
Speaker 2 (00:20):
We move the mountain.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Who moves the mountain?
Speaker 2 (00:22):
We move the mountain.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
In our lives, there are blocks and walls, at times
appearing insurmountable, yet we climb, finding nooks and crannies to
grab hold of sink hooks into gingerly we go. It's
true patience is a virtue. Peaks take time to reach,
Truth takes time to see. Hope moves us on so
our fears can be overcome. I am an American woman
(00:46):
born in a place where oppression was and sometimes still
is common practice, where women were considered not capable of
possessing a body and mind weaker than the stars and
stripes did not include our equal rights. But who moves
the mountain.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
We move the mountain. Who moves the mountain, we move
the mountain.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
There is still a movement that echoes the shouts of
those who fought for national suffrage. There is still a
movement to shatter the glass ceiling of economic deprivation. Break
down the walls and the glass ceiling will fall. There
is still a movement to stand for fair and equitable life,
representing those who voices are suppressed. There's still a movement
against the extremes who claim to be pro life, and
(01:25):
yet they oppress the rights of the life when it's born.
Who moves the.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Mountain, we move the mountain. Who moves the mountain, We
move the mountain.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Does history take great pleasure in stories of subjugation where
male dominance creates systemic social diseases, where humanity resists no evolution,
still building a country on terror and greed because of
subconscious fright of annihilation? What do you believe? Who moves
the mountain, we move the mountain. Who moves the mountain, We.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Move the mountain.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
Thank you, Caren, you did that well. Welcome Carmon Smallwood,
the Assistant Commissioner for Youth Services here in Duchess County.
How you doing today.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
I'm doing great.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Yeah you're doing Yeah great, that's fantastic. So tell our
listeners a little bit about you know, what your role is,
and then we'll talk about Women's Month and your participation
in Poe Goold Knows Women Leads Duchess last year.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
Thank you, Poe Gold.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
So as part of my work with Duchess County, I
oversee what's called the Path the Promised Initiative. It really
is a multi year effort to ensure that all youth
in Duchess County have the assets that they need to
be successful as they emerge into adulthood. So that runs
the gamut between secure housing resources for youth who are
homeless and run away. It also involves providing mental health
(02:42):
services and brief intervention services for youth that need support
not only at home, but also in schools and in
the communities. We also work with our local probation departments
and provide resources for justice involved youth. And in addition
to that, we provide funding through New York State funds
and county dollars to support not only nonprofit organizations, but
(03:04):
also municipalities and schools within Dutchess County. So our services
really run the gamut between providing services, opportunities, and support
for youth and their families throughout Dutchess County.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Well, I mean it's good that you have your hands
in the organization itself, not you specifically, but the organization
itself is touching upon a well rounded sphere of the
services that you may find that that youth need. Question
for you, are the youth mostly? Do you find teenagers
that experience mostly the hardship or middle schoolers or what's
(03:39):
the what's the age group that you find that you're
helping most of Right.
Speaker 3 (03:44):
Now, we're primarily focused on our preteens and teens. But
that's not to say that our younger youth are not
experiencing hardships either.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
It's just that they're more prevalent.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
They're more emergent now with our teenagers and especially in
terms of the mental health issues that we're seeing that
amongst our teams more so than some of our other groups.
But we serviced all youth in our county in our
various services and programs.
Speaker 1 (04:10):
Now, last year, you know, being a women leader in
your capacity in Duchess County, you participated in poetgo Knows
Women Lead Duchess and for those listeners who are not
did not have the opportunity to hear some of our
shows last year during Women's Month. It's a show that
it's a conference more or less a workshop that's designed
to bring women leaders together here in Duchess County. It
(04:34):
was my way of sort of saying thank you for
all the hard work that the women community and women
leaders put forth in our community to make change and
advocate for others. So you participated in that, what was
your takeaway? You know, did you have some insights that
you brought into your world so to speak, that you
(04:56):
felt were applicable? I mean, what was your takeaway from
the event?
Speaker 3 (04:59):
Its of well, first, I want to thank you for
having the vision and the foresight to even put this
event together. But my biggest takeaway was to focus on gratitude.
And I say that because during that event, I was
able to have opportunity to thank someone who was a
mentor to me, someone who was in the room, and
(05:22):
so it was really special to me to have that
opportunity to tell her how much she means to me
in that space in real time while she's still here.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
With us, you know.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
And I thought that focusing on gratitude was the thing
that was going to help me through the most difficult
things that I've been experiencing in the job and at home.
But to focus on being thankful is really my biggest
takeaway from that event.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
Right, Yeah, thankful for not even just in the event,
And I can totally relate to that, even for the growth.
You know, when something seems to be challenging, people say,
how can you be thankful for that? You know, well,
I'm thankful that something gave me the grace to be
able to grow through it, to learn about the experience
and maybe apply something different if I'm faced with the
(06:07):
same challenge, you know, And so there is a certain
gratitude in that growing space. What does Women's Month mean
to you? When you know we all have our months, right,
we all have our months. So you know what is
that when people say, well, Women's Month, what resonates with
you in that?
Speaker 3 (06:25):
I always thought it was a time for reflection, for
like deep reflection on the women in my life and
what they went through to get to where they are
and who am I had to say, why I can't
do anything when these women have done things even more
difficult than I've ever done. So I reflect on that,
especially when I'm thinking about some challenges that I'm dealing
(06:48):
with and really focusing on other women and how they
were able to overcome and that's given me the strength
to push through some of the adversity.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
I want to talk about some of those women. You know,
share a story.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
Okay, Well, at that event, my mentor, who happens to
be the commissioner of our Department of Community and Family Services,
was at the event, and that is Sabrina Marzuka. I
have known her for a good twenty years and in
one of my early professional experiences, she actually hired me to.
Speaker 2 (07:18):
Do a job that I really had no idea about
it all.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
But at the time, she was overseeing our health department
and I was overseeing a grant through the state Health Department,
and I remember some of the state priorities changed and
we were facing losing funding for the programming, and I
remember sitting in a room with her and just crying, crying,
and then feeling embarrassed that I'm in front of these
(07:43):
professionals and especially her, and just crying about losing the
funding and how it was going to impact our young people,
not even at all thinking about how might impact my job,
but thinking about the youth that we had been working
with through this health Department grant and I remember her
reaching over, rubbing my back and saying it was going
to be okay. And in that moment, I truly believe
(08:05):
so I said she said it, I believe it.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
That's what it's going to be.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
And I'm gonna truly thank her for that and every
other time I've gone to her for the challenge, for
her to keep reassuring me that everything is going to
be okay, and it always is.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
I want to come back to that. But to our listeners,
those who are just tuning in, you're listening to finding
out with Pete and the Poet Gold. I'm Poet Gold
and Peter's not with us here today, but trust me,
he will be back for our next show. So that
that rings empathy. Empathy, you know, and I do you Well,
(08:40):
I'll keep my opinion to myself with that. Let me
just ask you a question. Do you find empathy in
the workplace equitable or not? Hmm?
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Interesting?
Speaker 3 (08:54):
Well, I try to promote a workplace that promotes empathy,
and I can only do things that are within my
control right, so within my department and my staff. You know,
we do spend a lot of time myself speaking to
staff about things that are happening to them, things that
they are experiencing, and me allowing them to feel comfortable
(09:17):
in the space to do so because I know that
if they are not feeling secure, it's going to impact
the work, right.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
And I always say that.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
We are a team, like if some one of our
team members aren't doing well, all of us aren't doing well,
and that signals for us to jump in and support.
So we really do act like a team. We are
there for each other. If we need something done, we
step in, no questions, ask and get it done.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
But we're also there to support each other.
Speaker 3 (09:42):
In the difficult times as well and come together in
communities to support one another.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Now do you think that that's that that's a characteristic
uniquely sort of there that women carry the ability to
be a little bit more compassionate, the ability to hold
empathy for others. Because there's a lot of language today
around merit merit base, you know, we have to focus
(10:07):
on things being merit based and let's move out of
the emotion area. What do you feel about that? Notice,
I said, what do you feel right, Yes, yes.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
So you're playing words there.
Speaker 3 (10:20):
I've been in other spaces that were more male dominated,
and I didn't really feel that same sense of community
that I feel in spaces that have women leadership. Not
to say that those other spaces weren't great, it was
just different. I know that now in the spaces that
I'm in that are headed by women, I feel much
(10:42):
more comfortable and the spaces than I was previously.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
So when we look at.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
Merit and those things, yes, there's space in place for that,
but I also think there's space for human connection and
really focusing on the needs of the individual and what
it is that they need to do their job successfully.
Once you find that thing that they need, they will
achieve greatness, right, right, So we can't.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
Overlook one to look at the other.
Speaker 3 (11:13):
It can't just be Merit isolated by itself, but looking
at them those needs, addressing them, supporting them and helping
them to be the best that they can be in
that workplace, and that's what true success really is.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
Right. I think there's you know, there's there's a four
personality types. I have sales background, and there's four personality types.
There's the shock, you know, that's merit based, it's just
all about the money. Just let's just do what we
need to do and make it happen. And and then
there's the urchin the detailed or an individual, and there's
the dolphin, the person who likes to have a lot
(11:46):
of fun, and the whale. The whale is the person
that's I guess the giver so to speak, doesn't want
to have a conversation really about money, but once to
have a conversation about change, and it's more of a
feeling type of individual the whale. But I have found
in having worked in corporate environments, having worked in environments
(12:08):
where it's about mindfulness, that the person that can have
both to you to your point that you were bringing out,
will work the longest hours, you know, will not feel
like they're going home underappreciated, exhausted. You know they would
they would be willing to give the one hundred and
ten percent with a simple pat on the back, with
(12:31):
the simple I think you did a great job, or
how can I help you do something greater than where
you are? Is there an obstacle that we can help
you overcome?
Speaker 2 (12:41):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (12:42):
Yeah, so you bring that, you bring that to you
your team.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
Absolutely and I tell them to focus on the mission.
What is our mission and that should be our north
star driving us to do this work. Yes, there are
going to be times where it's hard and it's going
to be difficult, but if we focus on the mission,
at the end of the day, we can say we've
done everything we could to achieve that to work towards
that mission, and it gives us a sense of peace
(13:07):
and all. Everything's not always going to be right, and
they know that I'm never coming down on them or
saying you didn't do it right. I always say what
could be done differently? How can we how could we
look at this situation and make some improvements based upon
what's happening.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
But it's not a right or wrong thing to me.
Speaker 3 (13:22):
It's like, Okay, let's look at a different perspective and
how we address this particular issue.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
In the room last year for Poego's Women Leads dutcheses,
were there any stories that resonated with you that you
can you can recall, or any activity that you know
that moved the needle for you.
Speaker 3 (13:42):
Yeah, well it wasn't an activity per se, but I
think we were all gifted with a two dollars bill
and that was really special to me because it's unique
and it's rare. And I was looking around the room
and I think I said to someone, I was like, yeah,
just like us, you know, like we are all unique,
we are all rare, we're all valuable, just like this
two dollar bill. I think I said that, And it's like,
(14:03):
we have to remember that, especially when we're in spaces
where people don't value us or devalue us. We have
to remember just how special, rare and valuable that we are.
And so I actually have that in my room as
a reminder of that, really.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
I do. I look at it often.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
I was like, that's right, I'm rare, I'm valuable, and
I'm unique. And I look at that, and I think
that's another takeaway that I took from there.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
Now, now Carmen spells her name with the K. What
was your affirmation? It's an activity that we do so
that you can see yourself in a good light when
the world may be beating you down. So what was
your What was your Do you remember your affirmation?
Speaker 3 (14:39):
I believe it was kind and I really truly tied
to be kind in any space that I'm in, even
if I'm not feeling.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
It deep down.
Speaker 3 (14:47):
I really pushed through that because I think that changes
the atmosphere when you bring a level of kindness to spaces,
especially when you might be dealing with someone who's not
being kind that I always try to maintain kindness no
matter what I'm faced with, to change the atmosphere and
the outcome of that situation.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
Have you have you found success in that in some way?
I have.
Speaker 3 (15:09):
Actually, just this week, I was dealing with a difficult
situation with an individual who you know, we were in
some disagreements and I just went to her with.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
All kinds of kindness that I just chiled and went to.
Speaker 3 (15:23):
Her, and our whole conversation totally shifted and by the
end of it we were both laughing and really really
supporting each other. So, yeah, that was a recent, real
story that just happened a couple of days ago.
Speaker 1 (15:37):
Kindness works. I think kindness is, you know, underrated with people.
People have this thing about being what they feel being vulnerable,
and I get it, there's a fear in there. Before
I continue, if you're just tuning in, you're listening to
finding out with Pete in the poet Gold and I
am Poet Gold and Peter is not here today, but
he will be back with us in our next couple
of shows. And thank you to our listeners for tuning
(15:59):
in talking about kindness. Right at this moment, I'm here
with Carmen Smallwood, the Assistant Commissioner for Youth Services a
Duchess County. So, going back to my point, kindness is underrated. Yeah,
some people feel there's a saying like, don't you know,
don't be a what is it a wall, a floor mat?
You know, with kindness if you're too kind. I don't
(16:20):
believe in the thing that you can be too kind,
you know. Yes, I mean it's just you're kind or
you're not kind. Yes, that's the bottom line. You're kind
of you're not kind. And and so there's a there's
a fear in being kind that people have. Why do
you think they have that?
Speaker 3 (16:41):
Well, interesting you brought up that fear of kindness because
prior to serving in this position, I actually served as
a probation officer for nine years in Duchess County. I'm
working alongside justice involved youth and adults, and my colleagues
would often say, well, you're too kind, right, And I said, what.
Speaker 2 (17:00):
Do you mean?
Speaker 1 (17:01):
I liked your head tilt when you did that studio.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
Yeah, I just didn't understand where there are coming from.
Why can I be kind and show kindness to people
who are in our justice system. There's nothing good that's
going to come from me being mean towards people or
acting authoritative and aggressive.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Nothing's gonna come from that. I said, I'm not going
to change who I am because you have a fear
or because you don't like how I'm acting.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
I'm gonna approach every situation with kindness, no matter who
steps into my office, who I'm dealing with. And by
the way, my outcomes were very great. My versisi vism
rates were low, and I believe it's because I treated
people as humans walking in, not as someone who was
a who had a misdemeanor or a felony, convection convention.
It's just a human coming in who had a challenge
(17:53):
that we needed to work on.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
Together to open.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
And that goes back to the empathy. Yes, yeah, no,
you know people will if you can empathize, people will produce. Yes,
people produce because all of us just want to be
acknowledged in some form or another. You know, I call
it the big hug, and I get it that, you know,
sometimes it's hard to receive the hug, especially if you
(18:17):
don't come from an environment that is a hugging environment
or an environment of kindness.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
You know.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
I have an interesting story about I was on the
subway and a gentleman was, you know, coming through, and
he was begging, and I reached in my pocket and
I gave him a dollar. There was a gentleman sitting
across from me, maybe a little bit to my right,
and he proceeded at that point. It was very interesting
the dynamic. He proceeded to talk to the people to
(18:45):
the right and to the left of him to condemn
my behavior of giving the gentleman the dollar. Now, normally,
if I have food, I give food, you know, but
I didn't have food that day, so I was like, okay,
let me give you a dollar bill. And I've watched
the stress in this man for my act of kindness
(19:06):
sort of ruined his day so much that he had
to sort of bring together people to agree, you know,
And I thought to myself, Wow, this is just at
that point, I just became the observer, you know, sort
of like sort of like a psychologist, you know, observing
something of behavior. And I was like, Wow, this is
really deep. How far we will go to cover up
(19:30):
our own fears, you know, cover up that that I
don't I rather be mean and so, but I don't
want to be seemed to be mean. So I need
other people to affirm my hate, affirm my meanness, and
justify it with me. It was a it was a
really really strange kind of thing. How people do that? So,
(19:52):
what's going on in your office? Now? What's going on
in the agency?
Speaker 3 (19:56):
Ah, I'm glad that you asked, because talking about empathy
and highness. We're actually getting ready to start our eighth
Youth and Police Initiative Session. It's a program we started
a few years ago just bringing youth and law enforcement
officers who patrol their communities, in their neighborhoods together to
learn from each other, to break down the stereotypes, and
(20:16):
to build community amongst each other. We are starting it
Monday at Poughkeepsie High School and we have officers representing
the city in the town of Poughkeepsie, the Sheriff's Department,
our State police, and the Hyde Park Police Department and
probation and we have just.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
Been doing this.
Speaker 3 (20:37):
It's not a whole prescribed program, But it's learning from
each other and the youth tell their stories, the officers
tell their stories. We break bread together and transformation begins.
And it's one of the programs that I have found
to be so much successful in terms of our officers
and our youth being able to learn from each other
(20:57):
and come together in community.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
You're going into the schools with this, Yes, yeah, that's
that's that's really cool because I remember when I was
a child, we had a community. We had beat cops,
you know, cops who used to walk the beat. And
I think it makes a big difference of you know,
when you see our cop was Tony, I still remember
his name, you know, and he was on a motorcycle
(21:22):
all the time, you know, and he was just there
talking to the you know, local store owners. But it
makes a huge difference, not even at a point of
safety where you feel safe, but you're communicating with another person, yes,
you know, who has been given the authority to create
a safe environment for you. But after a while, you
(21:44):
sort of see that person just as a person. Yes,
you know.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
That's really the goal of the program, to see each
other's people, right, humans who are existing who have a
lot of similarities that they would not normally know about
unless they are in these spaces to really talk about that, right, right,
So that's what we do. We just create the space
for them to come together and then they do the
hard work together.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
Now, how long is the program been going on.
Speaker 3 (22:07):
We started in twenty twenty two, okay, and we've had
one hundred and twelve youth successfully complete the program. And
we added a mentoring component into it so the youth
will continue to participate in mentoring activities with the officers.
And then for the past two years, we've been teaming
up with other kids in New York State and bringing
our kids and officers to Binghamton University to a larger
(22:30):
conference to talk about the youth and police relationships.
Speaker 1 (22:33):
And what have you been finding that the youths are
communicating with you to the police officers.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
Well, initially, many of our kids said that they don't
want anything to do with the police. They've told me
that the police kill them, that they don't like minorities,
that all they do is cause trouble in their neighborhoods.
Is what I'm hear from young people. A sense of
fear and a sense of not wanting to be in
any spaces, and also for some youth saying they don't
want to be seen with officers, to be shown as
(23:03):
being someone who is in communication with officers in case
there are conflicts in the community. They don't want to
be associated with officers. That's what we see initially in
and I tell the young people, I said, you know what,
if you just come to the first night and you
feel like you don't ever want to come back, that's fine,
but I want you to just give it a try.
(23:26):
All of our young people are like, this is great,
we want to come back. Can I do it again?
Can we stay later?
Speaker 2 (23:30):
Can I? And then through that process they're telling me in.
Speaker 3 (23:34):
The street that they've seen the officer, that they're hanging
out with them. Some of the officers assault and the
kids in the park playing basketball around eleven o'clock. Normally
there are antenna would have been up and said, what
are these kids doing in the park?
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Officer now joining.
Speaker 3 (23:47):
Them and playing basketball with them in the park at
night and recognizing these kids and understanding their stories better
now because of these.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
Programs, and I'm sure that that's the transformative experience for
the officers as well.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
Absolutely well, some of the kids now said that they
wanted to be law enforcement officers and go into that field.
Kids who said they didn't want anything to do with
law enforcement are now looking to pursuing those careers. We
have one individual in the program who just started the
Explorer's program through the Sheriff's Department. This was not even
in her career trajectory before she was involved in the program.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
Right. I was just looking at the time here on
the clock. We were good. We're good, We're good. So
how if someone wanted to access services through your organization,
what would they do?
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Well?
Speaker 3 (24:37):
We are looking on the Dutchess County website. That's how
a lot of people find out about us. We are
Duchess County Youth Services Division. We're also known as the
Dutchess County Youth Bureau, and we are at eighty five
Civic Center Plaza. We share the same building as the
Health Department. We are open pretty much Monday through Friday,
nine to five. You can contact our office numbers eight
(25:00):
four or five four eight six three one two nine,
call us or stop by if you are having an
issue with one of your young people, or you yourself
are having issue and need to talk to someone I
would say the majority of our referrals for our intervention
services come directly from the schools.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
We get the school.
Speaker 3 (25:19):
Referrals and also Probation Department we work with them as well,
but we're open to others in the community that need support.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
Can you repeat that number?
Speaker 3 (25:28):
Yeah, you can call it eight four five four eight
six three one two nine. Also look at the Duchess
County website and look for the Duchess County Youth Services
Division also known as the Youth Bureau, So Duchess County
Youth you will find us. We're also located at eighty
five Civic Center, PLAZM, Poughkeepsie.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
So Women's Month is here, you know, and uh, I
want to thank you for being with us. We're not
quite wrapping up yet, but I want to ask you
what message would you give to women who are exploring
different career paths. What would you say to women?
Speaker 3 (26:10):
Well, I would say my career path was all over
the place. It was not linear, it was up and down,
and it had a lot of twists and turns.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
But I would just say just do it, just go
for it.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
A lot of time, our fear holds us back from
even taking that first step. And I was just speaking
with someone earlier today and I said, you have to
take that leap of faith.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
Go for it.
Speaker 3 (26:32):
Maybe it will work out, maybe it won't, but you
don't want to live with regrets and saying I wish
I did do that, I wish I could have did that.
Just go for it and watch the opportunities unfold.
Speaker 2 (26:43):
For you.
Speaker 1 (26:44):
What was one of your most challenging moments and you're
in your in your up and down, you know world,
and panning out your career.
Speaker 3 (26:52):
Uh, definitely being a probation officer. It's not a role
that I ever thought I would be in at all,
and I think one of them, no, hands down. The
most challenging thing for me was firearms training. Having never
even really seen a gun and now I have to
complete farms qualifications. Was difficult, not only physically but mentally
(27:15):
training the process. But having gone through that, I and
told myself, if I could do that, I could do
anything anything.
Speaker 2 (27:23):
And I truly believe that now.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
What was mentally I'm curious what was mentally training about it?
Speaker 3 (27:28):
Just the fact that I would be in the position
to potentially take someone's life.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
Ah, okay, okay, I get it. Carrying a farm, right.
Speaker 2 (27:35):
That's that's the piece that was difficult to think about.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
I had a conversation with the Actually, it's funny a
friend the other night on I don't own a gun.
I grew up in a family of guns. You know,
we had a we were a hunter's my family, and
so there were always you know, twenty two's and twelve
gay shotguns and you know all around. I've shot a
couple of them when I was a kid right up
(28:00):
here in upstate New York, you know. And and so
there was this we were going back and forth whether
or not to get a gun, become a gun owner
or not, you know, and what that's like. My friend
was in your space and saying, I don't think I
can do that. I'll just keep the baseball bat by
my bed.
Speaker 3 (28:16):
You know.
Speaker 1 (28:17):
You know, I'm like, well, you know, you're four ten.
I don't really know how well that's going to do,
you know, saying you know, but I but I could
appreciate the position because it you know, that thought of
possibly taking someone's life, you know, is a hard space,
(28:40):
of course to be in. And and definitely you're out
of that kindness moment, right You're in survival mode. So
but you know, Carmen, thank you for a green to
come on and do our you know, one of our
early shows for Women's Month. We look forward to having
you once again at God Knows Women Lead Duchess. And
(29:02):
to our listeners, thank you for tuning in to finding
out with Pete and the Poet Gold and Peter will
be back with me soon, So thank you everyone for listening.
Thank you Hi. I'm Poet Gold and to celebrate International
Women's History Month, iHeartRadio and Pete and the Poet Gold
are partnering together to bring you the second annual Poet
Gold Knows Women Lead Duchess Luncheon. What I mean is
(29:24):
that Duchess is one of the most women led counties
in New York State. From our elected officials to nonprofit
agency heads, we're building a collaborative, compassionate community life which
creates better lives for our families and individuals. So be
sure to tune in because I Know Women Lead Duchess
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