October 1, 2025 • 10 mins
Matt McRae wants more transparency from the Alliance board around the Dawn Meats proposal which continues to polarise shareholders.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Remember Matt McCrae farms at Makata and joins us this
afternoon on the Musta mat. Good afternoon, it's good to
see a bit of sunshine finally.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Yeah, afternoon, Andy, it certainly is. It's been a freezingly
wet and cold last month, but it's yaps. We're turning
a corner this morning.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Since we spoke last how's things been?
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Yeah, not too bad. We've pretty much done a u
lemming now taking an opportunity in a dry, non windy
day to get a few week drives shut out in
the way. Feed levels have dropped quite significantly. It's just
been the gross that hasn't been there. Probably being a
bit colder, the demand has been slightly high, so yeah,
be good to get a few miles away. But yeah,
(00:59):
it's all right so far. We haven't tailed or anything yet.
But there seems to be a few more lambs about
them last year, which is a good start.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
So certainly a better situation than this time last year.
From your from your understanding.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
And the next of the what i'd say, Yeah, it
is where like this time last year. Is so going
to drive around some of the hot paddocks and their
lemons certainly we've been ahead of that this year and
we have. Probably the main difference is we've just had
a wee few drawing days in between, whereas last year
there's nothing, so we'll probably still tip out the same
(01:35):
amount of rainfall. But yeah, just looking for a good
October to get those years lactating well. And yes, the
lambs are a bit bigger at winning tom would be good.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
What would your rainfall figures be so far for the year?
For the months even.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Tipped out to share two twenty meals last year, but
last month I should say, but there was about seven
many mills that fell on the probably day either side
of that month. Yeah, so it's certainly well above long
term average. But yeah, we're over a meter of ron
for the year already, which has probably a good hundred
(02:14):
meals up on where we could be. But yeah, I
think July was well behind and September was well up.
We're probably not far away, to be fair, Matt.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
The Alliance Groove has been all to talk this week
the road shows, with the directors and Mark Win and
Willie Visa as well of course the chair and chief
executive respectively, going around the traps. I went along to
the Gore meeting was kind of poignant that it was
just a stormy night outside as everyone sat inside and
listened to this proposal with Dawn meets.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
Yeah, it certainly was shut up to Gore as well
and listened, And yeah, I'm certainly taken a few calls
about it the last few days to and yeah, there's
the lot of frustration and disappointment probably two words that
you could use about it. But I guess most yearholders
(03:08):
understand how we got here, but pretty frustrated around yeah,
the deal that's been presented, and yeah, the vision on
the way forward.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
I suppose there seemed to be the key word there
in the room the other night, frustration, But there was
almost people resigned to the fact that if this didn't
go through, then we're next to for alliance. But you've
got a different viewpoint.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Yeah, yeah, I do. Like I'm probably sitting on the
fence at the moment, but I don't see the Dawn
deal is actually providing providing us as a long term future,
and I guess that's what I was hoping to hear
out of those roadshow meetings. But yeah, just pumping more
money and there's nothing actually structurally that was going to
(03:53):
change in terms of the way they operate or as
the industry operates, which when you're yeah, we just can't
continue down the last men standing avenue. And there's other
companies that are struggling as well, So what don't actually
use this opportunity as a to create something better as
(04:14):
an industry rather than just paffing off the last men
Because there's probably another company from what I hear that's
not too far from being in a similar position against Yeah,
just frustrating, But the banks are probably hiding behind the
directors and what I learned in the meetings as I've
obviously had a fair say and how we've got to
this point. So like to say a bit of leadership
(04:35):
from the banking industry and maybe all these Aussie banks
are possibly behind it, but a bit of vision from
them around helping create something where sheep and beef and
can be a little bit more positive and people can
invest in it and maybe their verage age in that
room would be a few years youngest.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
But if it doesn't, no vote, is it worth thinking
about what could happen in a couple of weeks time.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
Yeah, I don't know. I think things have changed slightly
from when when they put the steel together a few
months ago. There is a wee bit more in the
coffers floating ground. But yeah, I guess i'd dislike to
see the directors enough and say that they wouldn't wave
the white flag at the first opportunity that actually end
(05:20):
the banking industry too, like a lot of these banks
are banking chef and beef farmers, and even like the
dairy farmers. It's flying Carl stock in it through the industry.
So yeah, it'd probably would be disappointed if they did
wave the white flag and it went down that way.
But maybe it needs a bigger picture approach than just alliance.
(05:42):
And we've obviously got a reasonable amount of money invested
in them, and the way I look at it, either way,
those years are going to be worth very little or nothing.
So I can swallow my pride and take that if
it means that in ten or fifteen years we're talking about, yeah,
some decent structural change in the industry, not just getting
(06:04):
brought up where they are.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
And the counter offer as well, by the so called
way KaiA five as they have been named, talking about
voting against the door Meet's proposal. But embracing an alternative
capital model proposed which they put out in a letter
to sharholders last week. Do you think that's a viable option.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
Yeah, I've pondered that, Phil the Good and I have
spoke to a couple of those people that have put
it together. I guess it has one option of a
no vote, and some of it does have merit if
you look at it and a big picture of you,
But there's certainly a lot of questions come out of it.
Two And I'd like to see some of those bigger
(06:43):
shareholders that have probably put some of these farmer directors
in front up and say that they would not take
their volume payments and throw that in the kedytos. There's
got to be some structural changes either way. Either way
this goes in my opinion, And yeah, we've got to
(07:04):
see what those what those actually look like, because you
can't just carry on operating the way they are. And
I'd fully acknowledge that they have made turned around in
the last twelve or eighty months and in making a profit,
the will is turning, but for probably smaller and medium
shareholders in younger ones slight I'd still classify myself. We
(07:26):
probably want to see more than that.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Okay, say it's a no vote, Matt White, chance a
knight in shining armor come striding through the door on
a stallion with another offer there to say the company.
Do you think this is realistic to think like that.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Yeah, yeah, it's a tough one, to be fair, I'm
not confident now, but if it is a yes vote,
I think the banks and some of the previous management
get off scot free in some as a left to
swallow the bills. Do I think that's theory? They're probably not,
(08:01):
but I guess yeah, it will come down to there's
a lot For me, it's going to come down to
a gatfield vote, and yeah, I'm not that happy with
either option at the moment, to be fair.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
So when you're talking to farmers out in your neck
of the woods there down towards wonder and way, what's
the general feeling about it, Philly.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Max I said earlier, it's mainly the frustration. There's a
few people vote have already sort of decided which way
they're going to vote, but you know, just looking for
a way bit more leadership around what the medium to
long term future looks like. Like I said earlier, and
(08:45):
it's not just an alliance problem. It's like an industry problem.
When you walked into that or walked out of that
room and gore like probably didn't fill you with confidence
to be investing in the industry. And it's not really
what I want. I want more of a positive industry
(09:05):
to be part of, and yeah that people want to
be Yeah, I want to be part of and make
it profitable too. So yeah, I think I think some
of these other companies are sitting back and waiting to
see what is going to happen with the liance. I'd
probably challenge them to put a better offer on the
(09:28):
table in terms of where we're heading as an industry.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
Just finally, Matte, interesting you bring that up where we
are headed as a remat industry. Do you think this
is a chance for a bit more of a unified
approach throughout the red meat sector in New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
I would love to see it. Am my confident it
would happen. Probably not so much. There's been plenty of
people that have tried in the past. But you can't
let a crisis, a good crisis, go to waste. Maybe
it is that's probably head needs to heaven at a
few levels above my pay grade. But yeah, I'm probably
(10:06):
telling some people that are sitting back and waiting to
see where they end up. There'll be there may be
an opportunity, mister, if they don't get off their hands
pretty quickly.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
And I mentioned good on you, Matt. I always appreciate your time.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Rose too, any.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
Matt McCrae farming at Macata talking about the Alliance steal
Penny Simmons MP from the cargo. She's up next.
Remember Matt McCrae farms at Makata and joins us this
afternoon on the Musta mat. Good afternoon, it's good to
see a bit of sunshine finally.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Yeah, afternoon, Andy, it certainly is. It's been a freezingly
wet and cold last month, but it's yaps. We're turning
a corner this morning.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Since we spoke last how's things been?
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Yeah, not too bad. We've pretty much done a u
lemming now taking an opportunity in a dry, non windy
day to get a few week drives shut out in
the way. Feed levels have dropped quite significantly. It's just
been the gross that hasn't been there. Probably being a
bit colder, the demand has been slightly high, so yeah,
be good to get a few miles away. But yeah,
(00:59):
it's all right so far. We haven't tailed or anything yet.
But there seems to be a few more lambs about
them last year, which is a good start.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
So certainly a better situation than this time last year.
From your from your understanding.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
And the next of the what i'd say, Yeah, it
is where like this time last year. Is so going
to drive around some of the hot paddocks and their
lemons certainly we've been ahead of that this year and
we have. Probably the main difference is we've just had
a wee few drawing days in between, whereas last year
there's nothing, so we'll probably still tip out the same
(01:35):
amount of rainfall. But yeah, just looking for a good
October to get those years lactating well. And yes, the
lambs are a bit bigger at winning tom would be good.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
What would your rainfall figures be so far for the year?
For the months even.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Tipped out to share two twenty meals last year, but
last month I should say, but there was about seven
many mills that fell on the probably day either side
of that month. Yeah, so it's certainly well above long
term average. But yeah, we're over a meter of ron
for the year already, which has probably a good hundred
(02:14):
meals up on where we could be. But yeah, I
think July was well behind and September was well up.
We're probably not far away, to be fair, Matt.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
The Alliance Groove has been all to talk this week
the road shows, with the directors and Mark Win and
Willie Visa as well of course the chair and chief
executive respectively, going around the traps. I went along to
the Gore meeting was kind of poignant that it was
just a stormy night outside as everyone sat inside and
listened to this proposal with Dawn meets.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
Yeah, it certainly was shut up to Gore as well
and listened, And yeah, I'm certainly taken a few calls
about it the last few days to and yeah, there's
the lot of frustration and disappointment probably two words that
you could use about it. But I guess most yearholders
(03:08):
understand how we got here, but pretty frustrated around yeah,
the deal that's been presented, and yeah, the vision on
the way forward.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
I suppose there seemed to be the key word there
in the room the other night, frustration, But there was
almost people resigned to the fact that if this didn't
go through, then we're next to for alliance. But you've
got a different viewpoint.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Yeah, yeah, I do. Like I'm probably sitting on the
fence at the moment, but I don't see the Dawn
deal is actually providing providing us as a long term future,
and I guess that's what I was hoping to hear
out of those roadshow meetings. But yeah, just pumping more
money and there's nothing actually structurally that was going to
(03:53):
change in terms of the way they operate or as
the industry operates, which when you're yeah, we just can't
continue down the last men standing avenue. And there's other
companies that are struggling as well, So what don't actually
use this opportunity as a to create something better as
(04:14):
an industry rather than just paffing off the last men
Because there's probably another company from what I hear that's
not too far from being in a similar position against Yeah,
just frustrating, But the banks are probably hiding behind the
directors and what I learned in the meetings as I've
obviously had a fair say and how we've got to
this point. So like to say a bit of leadership
(04:35):
from the banking industry and maybe all these Aussie banks
are possibly behind it, but a bit of vision from
them around helping create something where sheep and beef and
can be a little bit more positive and people can
invest in it and maybe their verage age in that
room would be a few years youngest.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
But if it doesn't, no vote, is it worth thinking
about what could happen in a couple of weeks time.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
Yeah, I don't know. I think things have changed slightly
from when when they put the steel together a few
months ago. There is a wee bit more in the
coffers floating ground. But yeah, I guess i'd dislike to
see the directors enough and say that they wouldn't wave
the white flag at the first opportunity that actually end
(05:20):
the banking industry too, like a lot of these banks
are banking chef and beef farmers, and even like the
dairy farmers. It's flying Carl stock in it through the industry.
So yeah, it'd probably would be disappointed if they did
wave the white flag and it went down that way.
But maybe it needs a bigger picture approach than just alliance.
(05:42):
And we've obviously got a reasonable amount of money invested
in them, and the way I look at it, either way,
those years are going to be worth very little or nothing.
So I can swallow my pride and take that if
it means that in ten or fifteen years we're talking about, yeah,
some decent structural change in the industry, not just getting
(06:04):
brought up where they are.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
And the counter offer as well, by the so called
way KaiA five as they have been named, talking about
voting against the door Meet's proposal. But embracing an alternative
capital model proposed which they put out in a letter
to sharholders last week. Do you think that's a viable option.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
Yeah, I've pondered that, Phil the Good and I have
spoke to a couple of those people that have put
it together. I guess it has one option of a
no vote, and some of it does have merit if
you look at it and a big picture of you,
But there's certainly a lot of questions come out of it.
Two And I'd like to see some of those bigger
(06:43):
shareholders that have probably put some of these farmer directors
in front up and say that they would not take
their volume payments and throw that in the kedytos. There's
got to be some structural changes either way. Either way
this goes in my opinion, And yeah, we've got to
(07:04):
see what those what those actually look like, because you
can't just carry on operating the way they are. And
I'd fully acknowledge that they have made turned around in
the last twelve or eighty months and in making a profit,
the will is turning, but for probably smaller and medium
shareholders in younger ones slight I'd still classify myself. We
(07:26):
probably want to see more than that.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Okay, say it's a no vote, Matt White, chance a
knight in shining armor come striding through the door on
a stallion with another offer there to say the company.
Do you think this is realistic to think like that.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Yeah, yeah, it's a tough one, to be fair, I'm
not confident now, but if it is a yes vote,
I think the banks and some of the previous management
get off scot free in some as a left to
swallow the bills. Do I think that's theory? They're probably not,
(08:01):
but I guess yeah, it will come down to there's
a lot For me, it's going to come down to
a gatfield vote, and yeah, I'm not that happy with
either option at the moment, to be fair.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
So when you're talking to farmers out in your neck
of the woods there down towards wonder and way, what's
the general feeling about it, Philly.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Max I said earlier, it's mainly the frustration. There's a
few people vote have already sort of decided which way
they're going to vote, but you know, just looking for
a way bit more leadership around what the medium to
long term future looks like. Like I said earlier, and
(08:45):
it's not just an alliance problem. It's like an industry problem.
When you walked into that or walked out of that
room and gore like probably didn't fill you with confidence
to be investing in the industry. And it's not really
what I want. I want more of a positive industry
(09:05):
to be part of, and yeah that people want to
be Yeah, I want to be part of and make
it profitable too. So yeah, I think I think some
of these other companies are sitting back and waiting to
see what is going to happen with the liance. I'd
probably challenge them to put a better offer on the
(09:28):
table in terms of where we're heading as an industry.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
Just finally, Matte, interesting you bring that up where we
are headed as a remat industry. Do you think this
is a chance for a bit more of a unified
approach throughout the red meat sector in New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
I would love to see it. Am my confident it
would happen. Probably not so much. There's been plenty of
people that have tried in the past. But you can't
let a crisis, a good crisis, go to waste. Maybe
it is that's probably head needs to heaven at a
few levels above my pay grade. But yeah, I'm probably
(10:06):
telling some people that are sitting back and waiting to
see where they end up. There'll be there may be
an opportunity, mister, if they don't get off their hands
pretty quickly.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
And I mentioned good on you, Matt. I always appreciate your time.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Rose too, any.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
Matt McCrae farming at Macata talking about the Alliance steal
Penny Simmons MP from the cargo. She's up next.
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