August 18, 2025 • 28 mins
Title=The Trump Summit:
Description=Today, we dive into the critical discussions taking place at the White House as President Trump meets with European leaders, including President Zelensky of Ukraine. Our experts Niall Gardner and Gordon Chang provide keen insights on the failures of the Obama and Biden administrations and how Trump's leadership contrasts sharply with their weak approaches. We dissect the potential for a peace deal between Ukraine and Russia, including land swaps and security guarantees, while emphasizing the need for increased pressure on Moscow. Tune in as we explore the implications of these negotiations and the broader geopolitical landscape!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
All right, thanks Scott Shannon. Hour to Sean Hannity Show.
Write down our toll free telephone number if you want
to be a part of the program. Anyway, we are
following the news developing at the White House all day long.
Today is the President welcomes all the leaders. Let's see
from the President of France, the UK Prime Minister of
(00:21):
the German Chancellor, the Finnish President, NATO Secretary, the Prime
Minister of Italy, and much much more and President Zelenski
in the hopes that the President can follow through on
his summit with Vladimir Putin. The President did say that
he will call Putin after what takes place at the
(00:43):
White House today. Anyway, here with analysis, we have Nile Gardner.
He's the director of the Heritage Foundation's Margaret Thatcher Center
for Freedom and also Gordon Chang, author of The Coming
Collapse of China, the Great US China Tech War, former
US Trade rep in his own right, Nile, welcome back
(01:03):
to the program. I'm making the case in two ways.
I'm arguing Number one, that I really do blame this
mess on both Obama and on Joe Biden. And I
give President Trump a lot of credit for trying to
clean it up. I don't think Europe is blameless in
(01:23):
this either. They have funded Putin's war machine by buying
his energy. None of them have ever tried to really
engage with him. They have isolated him. They are completely
impotent in trying to deal with him. And if any
country benefits the least in a possible peace deal with
Ukraine and Russia, I would argue it's the USA, and
(01:45):
the only person that could pull this off, whether you
like President Trump or not, is him. And he's moving
at the speed of Trump. He's not wasting time. He's
trying to get this thing resolved, and he's already had
success around the globe with India, Pakistan, is Iran, Rwanda, Congo, Serbia, Kosovo, Thailand, Cambodia,
are many of Zabaijan, Egypt, Ethiopia.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
So I mean he's trying.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
He said, it's by far the hardest of all of them.
I think if it does come down to a deal,
I think it's going to end up being land swaps
of some kind with security guarantees. Uh not quite Article five,
not NATO related, but NATO like Article five security guarantees
for Ukraine. I just hope there's an end to the
(02:31):
killing myself, Nile.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
Yes, well, it's quite great to be on the show,
thank you very much. And you know, my view is
a strong agreement with that. But basically with cousin Trump's
leadership right now, it's a huge change actually from what
we saw with Joe Biden, with with Barack Obama's both
(02:57):
very weak neat leaders in my In my view, in contrast,
Trump projects strength and leadership, and you'll see that today
at the White House summit, of course, with European leaders
gathered together with President Zdanskiv of Ukraine. There's only one
man in the world who can bring together this kind
of of of coalition, and that's that's President Trump. And
(03:18):
President Trump course determined to bring about end of the
war in Ukraine, a war that should have been averted,
frankly by by Joe Biden, who actually did nothing to
avert the war in the first place.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
And let's not niall, he never picked up a phone,
he never made one phone call, he never while Putin
was amassing troops and military equipment on the Ukrainian border.
Speaker 3 (03:42):
Yeah, that's exactly the case. And also let's not forget
that Barack Obama when he was President, refused to actually
send any defensive weapons to the Ukrainians and so, whereas
President Trump did do so during his first presidency. And
so there is remarkable, I think, between the kind of
grit and determination that we're seeing from the US presidency
(04:05):
today with the absolutely useless approach taken by by both
Biden and and Obama previously. So America certainly is back
on the world stage right now.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
What is your take, Gordon Chang?
Speaker 1 (04:20):
And I do have a China question involving this, because
I think one of the reasons Putin even went to
Alaska is because Trump was able to up European or
NATO country's commitment to NATO more than double to five
percent of GDP. I do think the European trade deal
we're nearly a trillion dollars in committed moneys for American
(04:42):
energy rather than Russian energy, play role. I do believe
the fifty percent tariffs that the President put on India
played a role. And I do believe the president's selling
sophisticated weaponry to Ukraine and to NATO is also playing
a big part in it. But one has to wonder
if the president is back during China and saying we
(05:03):
don't want you to buy any more Russian oil.
Speaker 4 (05:06):
Yeah, I agree with all of that. Sean with regard
to China, they want this war to continue indefinitely, and
the reason is that they believe that if the war continues,
the US is not going to pay as much attention
to China in East Asia. And we know this because
Chinese Foreign Minister Wogi on July second, when he was
(05:27):
talking to Kayak Kalis, the EU Foreign policy chief, actually
said this. He said, they don't want Russia to lose
the war in Ukraine because they're worried about the change
and focus of the US. Well, you just extrapolate a
little bit. It means that if the war in Ukraine ends,
the US is going to be paying attention to China
in East Asia. So I think the Chinese are fueling
(05:50):
this and because of that, they believe they get a
real advantage, and they've been supporting Russia across the board,
including providing soldiers to the Russians. So this is all
in support on the part of Beijings for the war efforts.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Yeah. I know that people don't like the way I'm
describing that. I think the only way this is end
is the following way, and that's going to be yeah,
in terms of land transfers, and probably a fairly dramatic
increase in land that is taken over by Putin. I
(06:27):
mean there's a certain percentage now of Ukraine that Vladimir
Putin has complete control over. I would imagine some most,
if not all, of it stays with him. And I
say that with a heavy heart because I don't like
to reward bad behavior.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
Nile.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
But you know, the Donyek's region, for example, is about
half and half and I'm not sure what happens to
that region. Don Boss is another area where I think
there's some question marks, and a few other coastal areas.
But if my view in the and if this war continues,
how many more you know people are going to end
(07:05):
up losing their lives? Number one, innocent people, women and
children being targeted by Putin. And let me be clear,
I think Putin's a murdering dictator, thug. I have no
admiration for Vladimir Putin, But if you do want the
war to come to an end, that's the only way
in reality I see it happening.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
What is your thought?
Speaker 1 (07:24):
And in exchange, I think the security guarantees, including Article
five like security agreements will be put in place with Ukraine,
and weaponry will be sold to Ukraine by the United
States and other countries. I think that would offer security
guarantees that that.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
Certainly Ukraine didn't have prior to this conflict.
Speaker 3 (07:47):
Yes, I think that those are excellent points. And if
if Ukraine is to give up the Donbas region to Russia,
as Putin demands, the then Ukraine is is going to
need a security guarantee in return, and I think that's
basically what the White House is really proposing right now.
(08:11):
Of course, details being discussed today as as we speak,
in fact, but the reality is that the only way
I think Ukrainians will will decide to stop fighting will
be if there is a security guarantee in place, some
kind of NATO style Article five guarantee, but of course
(08:33):
not under the auspices of NATO. So this would involve,
for example, British and French ground forces in Ukraine to
protect Ukrainian territory. There may be some US military air support,
for example, but this would not be a NATO operation.
So quite quite a quite a unique sort of proposal,
(08:55):
but one that may actually succeed At the same time,
of course, I think it's vital that the Russians make
some concessions themselves, and that should include returning the tens
of thousands of Ukrainian children who have been abducted, kidnapped,
basically and basically forced to live in Russia and Milania.
(09:18):
Trump wrote a very powerful letter to Adami Putin talking
about these children, and I think that as part of
any kind of peace deal, it's imperative these children, Ukrainian children,
be returned back home to Ukraine where they belong. That
that should be a demand made of Vladimir Putin.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Listen.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
I totally completely agree with you, I really do. However,
Zelensky has been on record saying over and over again
that they're not going to give up any land.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
He said it's impossible.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
If that is his position, then this is going to
be a fight to the finish, of my view, and
there's going to be a lot more death between now
and the end of this war.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
Yeah, I think I think that that's that's right. And
you know, the challenge for Zelensky, of course, is to
to be able to continue fighting against a far bigger adversary,
but also the time when public opinion inside Ukraine is
moving further and further in support of a negotiated settlement,
and so so immense challenges for the Zelensky of the Ukraine.
(10:23):
Is a fought incredibly bravely against a brutal and barbaric enemy.
And the question now is whether Zelensky is willing to
trade poetry for a four piece while you know, potentially
gaining a vital security guarantee. So so we'll have to
see how things move in the coming days and weeks.
(10:46):
So far as you point out, of course, Zolensky is
refusing even considered the idea of giving up territory, So
we'll have to see how that moves forward in the
next few days.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
Now, we'll see what does you take Gordon.
Speaker 1 (11:00):
I mean, if is Zolenski really that you know, dug
in as it relates to any concessions, as it relates
to land he did in exchange for security guarantees, so
there's not a third invasion.
Speaker 4 (11:13):
Yeah, he does appear to be dug in. There are
a couple of other things though, that we should talk about.
One of them is if the United States does enforce
its sanctions and cuts off money to the Russian war machine,
then we could be having very different conversations on what
a peace agreement looks like. You know, I remember Sean
that during the Cold War we did not recognize Soviet
(11:36):
sovereignty over the three Baltic states and Lo and behold
those three states that the Lithuania and Estonia are now
considered sovereign and they're actually members of NATO. Because these
untold events can occur, such as the collapse of the
Soviet Union, and we can see a collapse of the
Russian Federation as well, So there's a lot going on here,
(11:57):
especially because Putin doesn't want to fire. This means that
all sorts of things can occur because the fighting will continue,
and during that fighting there's a lot of uncertainty. So
there might be terms which we do not think are possible,
but could be, especially if the United States does impose
those sanctions and enforce them rigorously, along with the European
(12:21):
Union and our other partners.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
At the end of the day, this is going to
be a Ukraine, Zolensky and europe decision, is it not, Nile, Yeah, I.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
Think I think so. And this is a matter of
Ukrainian sovereignty and self determination. Ultimately, any deal will have
to be made by by Ukraine directly with with with Moscow,
and President Trump is really facilitating a likely thilateral summit
(12:52):
in the weeks ahead. But ultimately Zelenski will have to
negotiate this deal directly with with with with Putin. The
Lencio will have to make those those decisions. I do
think it's imperative the United States ramp up the pressure
on Moscow at this At this time and present, Trump
(13:14):
has spoken about severe consequences for the Russians if they
don't end the war. I think we need to hear
a lot more of that messaging being put forward by
by the United States in the coming days and weeks.
After all, this is a Russian war of aggression against Ukraine.
Russia is the invading force uh and and Russia needs
(13:36):
to act end to end the war. And so US
pressure on Russia must be significantly increased further and if necessary, yes,
severe economic sanctions have to be imposed on the Russians,
and we should, we should bring the Russian economy to
its need if vladerim Putin doesn't want to end end
the war, so all options have to be on the table.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
Oh, I agree, and anyway, I appreciate both of you.
Nile Gardner, good to hear your voice again. Gordon Chang
always good to hear your voice. Also, eight hundred and
nine foot one show is on number. If you want
to be a part of the program the media, I
will tell you in this country if it's if it's
never been this obvious.
Speaker 2 (14:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
One ms DNC host exploding live on air over putent talks,
ranting Trump doesn't give a sh about democracy. What is
Trump really gaining here except that the world will be
a better, safer place. I go back to what my
friend Barry Farber said, There's never been a country in
the history of mankind that's accumulated more power and abused
(14:38):
it less than the US. And I go on to explain,
there's never been a country in the history of the
world that's accumulated more power and used it to advance
for good and to advance the human condition more than
our country.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
Never happened.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
I think one of the funniest stories is MSDNC is
to change their name amid a spinoff from NBC.
Speaker 2 (15:05):
Not not even NBC.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
As liberal as they are, as left wing as they are,
wants to be associated with the lying and conspiracy theory
pedaling over at ms D n C. H did you notice, Linda,
they're trying to change the name now, I know.
Speaker 4 (15:24):
NBC MS now, which stands from my source for news,
opinion and the world.
Speaker 5 (15:30):
And look, Andrew, they even have a graphic up.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
I like there it is. It looks very sporty.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
Oh, it looks very very sporty. Really rolls off the tongue,
rolls off the tongue. It's still to us, it's forever
will be ms D n C. Nothing has changed here
at all, whatsoever.
Speaker 6 (15:51):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (15:52):
Anyway, we're still watching and seeing, you know what the
fallout is going to be from the President and his
attempt meeting with European and the NATO leaders today. You know,
so if you look at the key takeaways from the summit,
you know President Trump saying to me, there's no deal
until there's a deal.
Speaker 2 (16:09):
He's right.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
The President, you know, going into great specificity in details,
talking about he wanted to move quickly, he wants to
get to trilateral negotiations. He's willing to be a part
of it. It's up to Zelenski to now get a
deal done. The President also laid out you know, the
two conditions which I went over earlier. I won't repeat
myself that where he could get a deal right now,
(16:32):
Zelenski has been pretty adamant saying that they will that
Ukraine will never give up land. If they don't, then
there will be no resolution to this conflict. That just
won't be There'll be no resolution at all. President keeps
reiterating that he's trying to save lives using the power
of the United States, which is a noble cause. I think,
(16:56):
if you really want what this breaks down to, there's
going to be land swaps and massive security measures in
place for Ukraine moving forward so there's not a third invasion,
you know, President Trump and the lead up to today
said Zelensky's his advice. Does Lensky's make the deal? I
think if they don't make a deal, I think both
(17:17):
countries are going to suffer massive losses. And I don't
know to what extent the world is going to have
an appetite to continue. Europe has shown no appetite to
get involved and actually do something of value in this
entire conflict from the very beginning.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
They really haven't.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
They have fallen down on the job and frankly been
a disappointment, and I take it even a step further.
I think they are partially responsible for where we are today.
But that said, our friend Matt Towery over at Insider
Advantage came out with a poll today, what is your
opinion of President Trump's job performance? Fifty four percent. This
(17:56):
is pulled right after the summit that took place on Friday.
Fifty four percent approval rating and a forty four percent
disapprove approval rating. The exact opposite of what of the
polling companies that have never in ten years been able
to pull Donald Trump the right way, not one time.
(18:17):
They always get it wrong. President Trump deployed four thousand
troops to the Caribbean to combat drug cartels. That kind
of went a little bit unnoticed. I noticed that the Secretary,
the Homeland Security Chief, Christy Nome, has been forced into
military housing amid surging death threats. That's not good to hear.
She'll join us on Hannity tonight. Also, DC crime, we
(18:41):
have an update on that. Sixty eight suspects were arrested
Saturday night. Is as part of President Trump's DC crackdown
on crime. Nearly seventy people, and that's a lot of people.
And MSDNC is dismissing fears about DC's safety, saying, well,
it ain't Maybury.
Speaker 2 (19:00):
What does that mean.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
I mean, if you look at every capital country in
the entire world, we have forty one homicides per one
hundred thousand. The next worst country with the highest homicide
rate per one hundred thousand is sixteen. I mean when
Bagdad and Mexico City and Al Salvador, you know, and
and all these other countries are safer than Washington, d C.
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Maybe it's time that you want help.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
There's actually a few people that are surprisingly saying that
they ope, they're open to the help. All right, let's
get to our phones. Texas, God bless Texas. Robert, you're
on the Sean Hannity Show. Hi, Robert, are you there?
I guess not. Jim and Minnesota. Jim, you're on the
Sean Hannity Show. Hi, glad you called.
Speaker 5 (19:50):
Hi Sean, thanks for taking my call. I listened to
your show often, and I'm a supporter of President Trump.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
I was calling thank you.
Speaker 5 (19:58):
That I'm disappointed in you or position that you think
giving up that Ukraine, giving up land at this time
is the right way to go.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
And apparently When did I ever say it was my
position that I think that Ukraine that I want Ukraine
to give up land?
Speaker 2 (20:12):
When did I say that?
Speaker 5 (20:14):
You haven't said that, but you think that that's the
way it's going to have to go.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
And I think that's the way.
Speaker 1 (20:19):
If you're asking me for analysis, which is different than
what I want. I don't like the fact that you
reward a country that invades an innocent country and they
end up with more land.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
I don't like the principle of it.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
However, given the choices where we are, I think that's
the reality of any if there's going to be any deal,
that's where it's going to land, in my opinion.
Speaker 5 (20:40):
And I understand that, but I disagree. At this time,
President Trump has said that if President Putin was not
going to stop the fighting in Ukraine, that he would
face severe sanctions. We have not tried that, and I
think that needs to be done first, and he needs
to say get out of Ukraine, stop the fighting, or
those sanctions are going to go in place.
Speaker 1 (21:02):
We know what the severe sanctions are going to be.
It's very simple, it's not complicated. The sanctions are going
to be exactly what President Trump has started and the
sanctions will be like the U EU trade deal, and
European countries will now buy more and more of their
energy from US and not from Russia. That then cuts
(21:22):
off as the funding of his war machine. I think
the President also puts pressure on other countries like he
did with India fifty percent tariff.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
I think that's all in place.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
I think the President will continue to sell arms to Ukraine,
but if you don't get a deal. And I'm being
and I think the President's being very realistic in terms
of what's possible. I'm not saying I like it. I'm
just saying this is where I think it ends, if
it's going to end.
Speaker 5 (21:50):
But I think you have to give strong sanctions a
chance first, and that's not happened. Well.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Look, Lindsey Graham is going to join us as a bill,
a very strong sanctioned bill. I think eighty five Senators
now have signed on to it. I agree with you
that there's got to be major consequences, As the President said,
if Putin doesn't at least try to meet them part way.
I'm not going to get into the history of what
(22:18):
Russia thinks and what Ukraine thinks or what they're going
to do here. At the end of the day, these
countries have a choice to make. This is the reality,
and then there's you know, the hand you dealt versus
the hand you wish you had. And if you're dealing
with the hand that you have, for us to achieve
what you want would probably take a good eighteen months
(22:40):
to two years for the sanctions to fully impact the
Russian economy the way we want. I don't think it's
going to happen immediately because you've got to get other
countries to get on board.
Speaker 5 (22:51):
That's true. But if you think the killing is going
to stop, you can't trust Putin and it's going to
happen again.
Speaker 1 (22:57):
Well it could, but that's what that's why on the
other side of the equation, that's why Ukraine and Zelenski
will get the security guarantees, including the equivalent of Article
five security measures. That means that if you invade the Ukraine,
then all these other countries are pledging to get involved
(23:18):
in the war against Russia, which nobody wants. I mean,
we don't want to full on war in Europe, to
a full out war in Europe, do we.
Speaker 5 (23:26):
They also pledged to help him out when he gave
up his nuclear weapons and we didn't do that.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Well, let me ask you this question, how many people
are going to die while your sanctions program is being implemented.
Because Trump's only been in office seven months. You can
blame Biden for all of this, but how many people
are you willing to let die in the process.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
I'm just curious.
Speaker 5 (23:46):
I guess I'm looking at the future and saying that
more people are going to die in the future. If
you've Putin has said what he wants to do. He
wants to re establish the Soviet Union, and he says it,
and you know, we just don't listen to him and
don't believe them.
Speaker 1 (24:00):
He said it in the past. I pay attention to it,
but he's not made the effort or the movement. And
I also think we learned one other thing. The Russian
army is not as tough as they thought they were.
Ukrainians have fought valiantly in this conflict. Anyway, we'll see
at the end of the day. I'd like to see
the killing end. I don't like any solution, to be honest.
(24:21):
I wish that Russia would just turn around and go
back home, but that's not a possibility. So ideal in reality,
not in the world that I wish we had. I
wish evil didn't exist in the world. Rich in New Jersey, Hey, Rich,
how are you glad you called an?
Speaker 6 (24:35):
How are you the reason I called? I can understand
why Zelenski doesn't want to give up land for peace,
and everyone seems to think that's what has to happen.
But I think we should think outside the box a
little bit. Has anyone considered if you would be able
to lease land to Russia much the way that China
did that long term lease for Hong Kong, and then
(24:58):
when the lease is up, the land would be turned
over to the Ukraine. It's just something that Russia would
occupy for a while, and then that way they would
have their warm water port and they would have protection
for their Russian brethren. They are sort of living in
the eastern portion of Ukraine.
Speaker 1 (25:15):
My understanding is the only land that would outright go
to Russia would be Crimea, and that everything else would
be considered along the lines of I think what you're
describing quote a land swap, but in the end, let's
be real, we're just playing semantics. I think that Russia
is gaining territory and Ukraine is losing territory. Are they
(25:39):
willing to give it up in the name of real
security this time? So there's not a third invasion, that's
the question. So I actually think language is a little
bit different. They call them a land swap, but I
don't think it's any really. I don't think it's different
than what you're describing.
Speaker 6 (25:56):
I'm thinking that it would be Ukraine's land, but it
would be a long term lease, and when the lease
is up, that land goes back to the Ukraine. And
but what that does is it either exposes Putin as
a liar because the things he initially said with the
reason for him going into Ukraine would be resolved if
that lease took place, and ben Zelensky would be able
(26:17):
to say, we've retained our pre war borders. And you know,
while the Russians are going to be there for a while,
it's a transitional thing. They're using it for a while,
but when the lease is up.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
But you and I both know that that's all semantics
and is not reality, right we wink wink, nod, nod.
We know that once Russia has it, they're not giving
it back to Ukraine.
Speaker 6 (26:39):
Well, Sean is something to consider. Thanks for taking my mind.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
Listen.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
I think that's what the words land swap mean. I
don't think you're off base here. I think that's what
they're talking about anyway. Carl and Marilyn. Carl, you're on
the Sean Hannity Show.
Speaker 7 (26:56):
Hi, Sean, Thanks for taking my call. I have such
great respect for you. I love your show, telling the
Paul screener that I'm a big follower of the great One.
And last night, oh yeah, he was talking about the
fact that as your prievous colors were mentioning the power
(27:17):
of the that Trump has over Putin for financial reasons
with the sanctions. Do you believe that there are sanctions
that would be strong enough to pull the rug completely
out from under them instead of long term or short term.
Speaker 1 (27:37):
I think the only reason Putin came to the table
is because the President forced NATO to more than double
their commitment to defense. I think it's because of the
EU trade Deal, where I mean it's a sanction in
the sense that Western Europe won't buy their energy from
Putin anymore, but they'll buy it from US. I think
(27:59):
the tariffs on India, that's a sanction. I think selling
weapons to Ukraine in a way you can describe it
if you want, depending on the semantics you want to use,
that would be a sanction. I'm not I'm in favor
of harder sanctions, especially if they can't come to a deal.
You know, do I think it's going to I think
(28:20):
the President is committed to resolving this quickly, and if
you want to do it quickly, the only way it's
going to end is with land swaps versus real security
guarantees for Ukraine. Now, if you want to play long
ball and you're willing to accept all the dead people
in the interim, then then we could talk about the
(28:40):
sanctions strategy, which you know, I'd like to see the
strongest sanctions possible, especially if Putin doesn't come to the table. Anyway,
good call. We have a lot of smart callers today
eight hundred nine one. If you want to be a
part of the program,
All right, thanks Scott Shannon. Hour to Sean Hannity Show.
Write down our toll free telephone number if you want
to be a part of the program. Anyway, we are
following the news developing at the White House all day long.
Today is the President welcomes all the leaders. Let's see
from the President of France, the UK Prime Minister of
(00:21):
the German Chancellor, the Finnish President, NATO Secretary, the Prime
Minister of Italy, and much much more and President Zelenski
in the hopes that the President can follow through on
his summit with Vladimir Putin. The President did say that
he will call Putin after what takes place at the
(00:43):
White House today. Anyway, here with analysis, we have Nile Gardner.
He's the director of the Heritage Foundation's Margaret Thatcher Center
for Freedom and also Gordon Chang, author of The Coming
Collapse of China, the Great US China Tech War, former
US Trade rep in his own right, Nile, welcome back
(01:03):
to the program. I'm making the case in two ways.
I'm arguing Number one, that I really do blame this
mess on both Obama and on Joe Biden. And I
give President Trump a lot of credit for trying to
clean it up. I don't think Europe is blameless in
(01:23):
this either. They have funded Putin's war machine by buying
his energy. None of them have ever tried to really
engage with him. They have isolated him. They are completely
impotent in trying to deal with him. And if any
country benefits the least in a possible peace deal with
Ukraine and Russia, I would argue it's the USA, and
(01:45):
the only person that could pull this off, whether you
like President Trump or not, is him. And he's moving
at the speed of Trump. He's not wasting time. He's
trying to get this thing resolved, and he's already had
success around the globe with India, Pakistan, is Iran, Rwanda, Congo, Serbia, Kosovo, Thailand, Cambodia,
are many of Zabaijan, Egypt, Ethiopia.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
So I mean he's trying.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
He said, it's by far the hardest of all of them.
I think if it does come down to a deal,
I think it's going to end up being land swaps
of some kind with security guarantees. Uh not quite Article five,
not NATO related, but NATO like Article five security guarantees
for Ukraine. I just hope there's an end to the
(02:31):
killing myself, Nile.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
Yes, well, it's quite great to be on the show,
thank you very much. And you know, my view is
a strong agreement with that. But basically with cousin Trump's
leadership right now, it's a huge change actually from what
we saw with Joe Biden, with with Barack Obama's both
(02:57):
very weak neat leaders in my In my view, in contrast,
Trump projects strength and leadership, and you'll see that today
at the White House summit, of course, with European leaders
gathered together with President Zdanskiv of Ukraine. There's only one
man in the world who can bring together this kind
of of of coalition, and that's that's President Trump. And
(03:18):
President Trump course determined to bring about end of the
war in Ukraine, a war that should have been averted,
frankly by by Joe Biden, who actually did nothing to
avert the war in the first place.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
And let's not niall, he never picked up a phone,
he never made one phone call, he never while Putin
was amassing troops and military equipment on the Ukrainian border.
Speaker 3 (03:42):
Yeah, that's exactly the case. And also let's not forget
that Barack Obama when he was President, refused to actually
send any defensive weapons to the Ukrainians and so, whereas
President Trump did do so during his first presidency. And
so there is remarkable, I think, between the kind of
grit and determination that we're seeing from the US presidency
(04:05):
today with the absolutely useless approach taken by by both
Biden and and Obama previously. So America certainly is back
on the world stage right now.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
What is your take, Gordon Chang?
Speaker 1 (04:20):
And I do have a China question involving this, because
I think one of the reasons Putin even went to
Alaska is because Trump was able to up European or
NATO country's commitment to NATO more than double to five
percent of GDP. I do think the European trade deal
we're nearly a trillion dollars in committed moneys for American
(04:42):
energy rather than Russian energy, play role. I do believe
the fifty percent tariffs that the President put on India
played a role. And I do believe the president's selling
sophisticated weaponry to Ukraine and to NATO is also playing
a big part in it. But one has to wonder
if the president is back during China and saying we
(05:03):
don't want you to buy any more Russian oil.
Speaker 4 (05:06):
Yeah, I agree with all of that. Sean with regard
to China, they want this war to continue indefinitely, and
the reason is that they believe that if the war continues,
the US is not going to pay as much attention
to China in East Asia. And we know this because
Chinese Foreign Minister Wogi on July second, when he was
(05:27):
talking to Kayak Kalis, the EU Foreign policy chief, actually
said this. He said, they don't want Russia to lose
the war in Ukraine because they're worried about the change
and focus of the US. Well, you just extrapolate a
little bit. It means that if the war in Ukraine ends,
the US is going to be paying attention to China
in East Asia. So I think the Chinese are fueling
(05:50):
this and because of that, they believe they get a
real advantage, and they've been supporting Russia across the board,
including providing soldiers to the Russians. So this is all
in support on the part of Beijings for the war efforts.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Yeah. I know that people don't like the way I'm
describing that. I think the only way this is end
is the following way, and that's going to be yeah,
in terms of land transfers, and probably a fairly dramatic
increase in land that is taken over by Putin. I
(06:27):
mean there's a certain percentage now of Ukraine that Vladimir
Putin has complete control over. I would imagine some most,
if not all, of it stays with him. And I
say that with a heavy heart because I don't like
to reward bad behavior.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
Nile.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
But you know, the Donyek's region, for example, is about
half and half and I'm not sure what happens to
that region. Don Boss is another area where I think
there's some question marks, and a few other coastal areas.
But if my view in the and if this war continues,
how many more you know people are going to end
(07:05):
up losing their lives? Number one, innocent people, women and
children being targeted by Putin. And let me be clear,
I think Putin's a murdering dictator, thug. I have no
admiration for Vladimir Putin, But if you do want the
war to come to an end, that's the only way
in reality I see it happening.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
What is your thought?
Speaker 1 (07:24):
And in exchange, I think the security guarantees, including Article
five like security agreements will be put in place with Ukraine,
and weaponry will be sold to Ukraine by the United
States and other countries. I think that would offer security
guarantees that that.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
Certainly Ukraine didn't have prior to this conflict.
Speaker 3 (07:47):
Yes, I think that those are excellent points. And if
if Ukraine is to give up the Donbas region to Russia,
as Putin demands, the then Ukraine is is going to
need a security guarantee in return, and I think that's
basically what the White House is really proposing right now.
(08:11):
Of course, details being discussed today as as we speak,
in fact, but the reality is that the only way
I think Ukrainians will will decide to stop fighting will
be if there is a security guarantee in place, some
kind of NATO style Article five guarantee, but of course
(08:33):
not under the auspices of NATO. So this would involve,
for example, British and French ground forces in Ukraine to
protect Ukrainian territory. There may be some US military air support,
for example, but this would not be a NATO operation.
So quite quite a quite a unique sort of proposal,
(08:55):
but one that may actually succeed At the same time,
of course, I think it's vital that the Russians make
some concessions themselves, and that should include returning the tens
of thousands of Ukrainian children who have been abducted, kidnapped,
basically and basically forced to live in Russia and Milania.
(09:18):
Trump wrote a very powerful letter to Adami Putin talking
about these children, and I think that as part of
any kind of peace deal, it's imperative these children, Ukrainian children,
be returned back home to Ukraine where they belong. That
that should be a demand made of Vladimir Putin.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Listen.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
I totally completely agree with you, I really do. However,
Zelensky has been on record saying over and over again
that they're not going to give up any land.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
He said it's impossible.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
If that is his position, then this is going to
be a fight to the finish, of my view, and
there's going to be a lot more death between now
and the end of this war.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
Yeah, I think I think that that's that's right. And
you know, the challenge for Zelensky, of course, is to
to be able to continue fighting against a far bigger adversary,
but also the time when public opinion inside Ukraine is
moving further and further in support of a negotiated settlement,
and so so immense challenges for the Zelensky of the Ukraine.
(10:23):
Is a fought incredibly bravely against a brutal and barbaric enemy.
And the question now is whether Zelensky is willing to
trade poetry for a four piece while you know, potentially
gaining a vital security guarantee. So so we'll have to
see how things move in the coming days and weeks.
(10:46):
So far as you point out, of course, Zolensky is
refusing even considered the idea of giving up territory, So
we'll have to see how that moves forward in the
next few days.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
Now, we'll see what does you take Gordon.
Speaker 1 (11:00):
I mean, if is Zolenski really that you know, dug
in as it relates to any concessions, as it relates
to land he did in exchange for security guarantees, so
there's not a third invasion.
Speaker 4 (11:13):
Yeah, he does appear to be dug in. There are
a couple of other things though, that we should talk about.
One of them is if the United States does enforce
its sanctions and cuts off money to the Russian war machine,
then we could be having very different conversations on what
a peace agreement looks like. You know, I remember Sean
that during the Cold War we did not recognize Soviet
(11:36):
sovereignty over the three Baltic states and Lo and behold
those three states that the Lithuania and Estonia are now
considered sovereign and they're actually members of NATO. Because these
untold events can occur, such as the collapse of the
Soviet Union, and we can see a collapse of the
Russian Federation as well, So there's a lot going on here,
(11:57):
especially because Putin doesn't want to fire. This means that
all sorts of things can occur because the fighting will continue,
and during that fighting there's a lot of uncertainty. So
there might be terms which we do not think are possible,
but could be, especially if the United States does impose
those sanctions and enforce them rigorously, along with the European
(12:21):
Union and our other partners.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
At the end of the day, this is going to
be a Ukraine, Zolensky and europe decision, is it not, Nile, Yeah, I.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
Think I think so. And this is a matter of
Ukrainian sovereignty and self determination. Ultimately, any deal will have
to be made by by Ukraine directly with with with Moscow,
and President Trump is really facilitating a likely thilateral summit
(12:52):
in the weeks ahead. But ultimately Zelenski will have to
negotiate this deal directly with with with with Putin. The
Lencio will have to make those those decisions. I do
think it's imperative the United States ramp up the pressure
on Moscow at this At this time and present, Trump
(13:14):
has spoken about severe consequences for the Russians if they
don't end the war. I think we need to hear
a lot more of that messaging being put forward by
by the United States in the coming days and weeks.
After all, this is a Russian war of aggression against Ukraine.
Russia is the invading force uh and and Russia needs
(13:36):
to act end to end the war. And so US
pressure on Russia must be significantly increased further and if necessary, yes,
severe economic sanctions have to be imposed on the Russians,
and we should, we should bring the Russian economy to
its need if vladerim Putin doesn't want to end end
the war, so all options have to be on the table.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
Oh, I agree, and anyway, I appreciate both of you.
Nile Gardner, good to hear your voice again. Gordon Chang
always good to hear your voice. Also, eight hundred and
nine foot one show is on number. If you want
to be a part of the program the media, I
will tell you in this country if it's if it's
never been this obvious.
Speaker 2 (14:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
One ms DNC host exploding live on air over putent talks,
ranting Trump doesn't give a sh about democracy. What is
Trump really gaining here except that the world will be
a better, safer place. I go back to what my
friend Barry Farber said, There's never been a country in
the history of mankind that's accumulated more power and abused
(14:38):
it less than the US. And I go on to explain,
there's never been a country in the history of the
world that's accumulated more power and used it to advance
for good and to advance the human condition more than
our country.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
Never happened.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
I think one of the funniest stories is MSDNC is
to change their name amid a spinoff from NBC.
Speaker 2 (15:05):
Not not even NBC.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
As liberal as they are, as left wing as they are,
wants to be associated with the lying and conspiracy theory
pedaling over at ms D n C. H did you notice, Linda,
they're trying to change the name now, I know.
Speaker 4 (15:24):
NBC MS now, which stands from my source for news,
opinion and the world.
Speaker 5 (15:30):
And look, Andrew, they even have a graphic up.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
I like there it is. It looks very sporty.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
Oh, it looks very very sporty. Really rolls off the tongue,
rolls off the tongue. It's still to us, it's forever
will be ms D n C. Nothing has changed here
at all, whatsoever.
Speaker 6 (15:51):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (15:52):
Anyway, we're still watching and seeing, you know what the
fallout is going to be from the President and his
attempt meeting with European and the NATO leaders today. You know,
so if you look at the key takeaways from the summit,
you know President Trump saying to me, there's no deal
until there's a deal.
Speaker 2 (16:09):
He's right.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
The President, you know, going into great specificity in details,
talking about he wanted to move quickly, he wants to
get to trilateral negotiations. He's willing to be a part
of it. It's up to Zelenski to now get a
deal done. The President also laid out you know, the
two conditions which I went over earlier. I won't repeat
myself that where he could get a deal right now,
(16:32):
Zelenski has been pretty adamant saying that they will that
Ukraine will never give up land. If they don't, then
there will be no resolution to this conflict. That just
won't be There'll be no resolution at all. President keeps
reiterating that he's trying to save lives using the power
of the United States, which is a noble cause. I think,
(16:56):
if you really want what this breaks down to, there's
going to be land swaps and massive security measures in
place for Ukraine moving forward so there's not a third invasion,
you know, President Trump and the lead up to today
said Zelensky's his advice. Does Lensky's make the deal? I
think if they don't make a deal, I think both
(17:17):
countries are going to suffer massive losses. And I don't
know to what extent the world is going to have
an appetite to continue. Europe has shown no appetite to
get involved and actually do something of value in this
entire conflict from the very beginning.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
They really haven't.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
They have fallen down on the job and frankly been
a disappointment, and I take it even a step further.
I think they are partially responsible for where we are today.
But that said, our friend Matt Towery over at Insider
Advantage came out with a poll today, what is your
opinion of President Trump's job performance? Fifty four percent. This
(17:56):
is pulled right after the summit that took place on Friday.
Fifty four percent approval rating and a forty four percent
disapprove approval rating. The exact opposite of what of the
polling companies that have never in ten years been able
to pull Donald Trump the right way, not one time.
(18:17):
They always get it wrong. President Trump deployed four thousand
troops to the Caribbean to combat drug cartels. That kind
of went a little bit unnoticed. I noticed that the Secretary,
the Homeland Security Chief, Christy Nome, has been forced into
military housing amid surging death threats. That's not good to hear.
She'll join us on Hannity tonight. Also, DC crime, we
(18:41):
have an update on that. Sixty eight suspects were arrested
Saturday night. Is as part of President Trump's DC crackdown
on crime. Nearly seventy people, and that's a lot of people.
And MSDNC is dismissing fears about DC's safety, saying, well,
it ain't Maybury.
Speaker 2 (19:00):
What does that mean.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
I mean, if you look at every capital country in
the entire world, we have forty one homicides per one
hundred thousand. The next worst country with the highest homicide
rate per one hundred thousand is sixteen. I mean when
Bagdad and Mexico City and Al Salvador, you know, and
and all these other countries are safer than Washington, d C.
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Maybe it's time that you want help.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
There's actually a few people that are surprisingly saying that
they ope, they're open to the help. All right, let's
get to our phones. Texas, God bless Texas. Robert, you're
on the Sean Hannity Show. Hi, Robert, are you there?
I guess not. Jim and Minnesota. Jim, you're on the
Sean Hannity Show. Hi, glad you called.
Speaker 5 (19:50):
Hi Sean, thanks for taking my call. I listened to
your show often, and I'm a supporter of President Trump.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
I was calling thank you.
Speaker 5 (19:58):
That I'm disappointed in you or position that you think
giving up that Ukraine, giving up land at this time
is the right way to go.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
And apparently When did I ever say it was my
position that I think that Ukraine that I want Ukraine
to give up land?
Speaker 2 (20:12):
When did I say that?
Speaker 5 (20:14):
You haven't said that, but you think that that's the
way it's going to have to go.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
And I think that's the way.
Speaker 1 (20:19):
If you're asking me for analysis, which is different than
what I want. I don't like the fact that you
reward a country that invades an innocent country and they
end up with more land.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
I don't like the principle of it.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
However, given the choices where we are, I think that's
the reality of any if there's going to be any deal,
that's where it's going to land, in my opinion.
Speaker 5 (20:40):
And I understand that, but I disagree. At this time,
President Trump has said that if President Putin was not
going to stop the fighting in Ukraine, that he would
face severe sanctions. We have not tried that, and I
think that needs to be done first, and he needs
to say get out of Ukraine, stop the fighting, or
those sanctions are going to go in place.
Speaker 1 (21:02):
We know what the severe sanctions are going to be.
It's very simple, it's not complicated. The sanctions are going
to be exactly what President Trump has started and the
sanctions will be like the U EU trade deal, and
European countries will now buy more and more of their
energy from US and not from Russia. That then cuts
(21:22):
off as the funding of his war machine. I think
the President also puts pressure on other countries like he
did with India fifty percent tariff.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
I think that's all in place.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
I think the President will continue to sell arms to Ukraine,
but if you don't get a deal. And I'm being
and I think the President's being very realistic in terms
of what's possible. I'm not saying I like it. I'm
just saying this is where I think it ends, if
it's going to end.
Speaker 5 (21:50):
But I think you have to give strong sanctions a
chance first, and that's not happened. Well.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Look, Lindsey Graham is going to join us as a bill,
a very strong sanctioned bill. I think eighty five Senators
now have signed on to it. I agree with you
that there's got to be major consequences, As the President said,
if Putin doesn't at least try to meet them part way.
I'm not going to get into the history of what
(22:18):
Russia thinks and what Ukraine thinks or what they're going
to do here. At the end of the day, these
countries have a choice to make. This is the reality,
and then there's you know, the hand you dealt versus
the hand you wish you had. And if you're dealing
with the hand that you have, for us to achieve
what you want would probably take a good eighteen months
(22:40):
to two years for the sanctions to fully impact the
Russian economy the way we want. I don't think it's
going to happen immediately because you've got to get other
countries to get on board.
Speaker 5 (22:51):
That's true. But if you think the killing is going
to stop, you can't trust Putin and it's going to
happen again.
Speaker 1 (22:57):
Well it could, but that's what that's why on the
other side of the equation, that's why Ukraine and Zelenski
will get the security guarantees, including the equivalent of Article
five security measures. That means that if you invade the Ukraine,
then all these other countries are pledging to get involved
(23:18):
in the war against Russia, which nobody wants. I mean,
we don't want to full on war in Europe, to
a full out war in Europe, do we.
Speaker 5 (23:26):
They also pledged to help him out when he gave
up his nuclear weapons and we didn't do that.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Well, let me ask you this question, how many people
are going to die while your sanctions program is being implemented.
Because Trump's only been in office seven months. You can
blame Biden for all of this, but how many people
are you willing to let die in the process.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
I'm just curious.
Speaker 5 (23:46):
I guess I'm looking at the future and saying that
more people are going to die in the future. If
you've Putin has said what he wants to do. He
wants to re establish the Soviet Union, and he says it,
and you know, we just don't listen to him and
don't believe them.
Speaker 1 (24:00):
He said it in the past. I pay attention to it,
but he's not made the effort or the movement. And
I also think we learned one other thing. The Russian
army is not as tough as they thought they were.
Ukrainians have fought valiantly in this conflict. Anyway, we'll see
at the end of the day. I'd like to see
the killing end. I don't like any solution, to be honest.
(24:21):
I wish that Russia would just turn around and go
back home, but that's not a possibility. So ideal in reality,
not in the world that I wish we had. I
wish evil didn't exist in the world. Rich in New Jersey, Hey, Rich,
how are you glad you called an?
Speaker 6 (24:35):
How are you the reason I called? I can understand
why Zelenski doesn't want to give up land for peace,
and everyone seems to think that's what has to happen.
But I think we should think outside the box a
little bit. Has anyone considered if you would be able
to lease land to Russia much the way that China
did that long term lease for Hong Kong, and then
(24:58):
when the lease is up, the land would be turned
over to the Ukraine. It's just something that Russia would
occupy for a while, and then that way they would
have their warm water port and they would have protection
for their Russian brethren. They are sort of living in
the eastern portion of Ukraine.
Speaker 1 (25:15):
My understanding is the only land that would outright go
to Russia would be Crimea, and that everything else would
be considered along the lines of I think what you're
describing quote a land swap, but in the end, let's
be real, we're just playing semantics. I think that Russia
is gaining territory and Ukraine is losing territory. Are they
(25:39):
willing to give it up in the name of real
security this time? So there's not a third invasion, that's
the question. So I actually think language is a little
bit different. They call them a land swap, but I
don't think it's any really. I don't think it's different
than what you're describing.
Speaker 6 (25:56):
I'm thinking that it would be Ukraine's land, but it
would be a long term lease, and when the lease
is up, that land goes back to the Ukraine. And
but what that does is it either exposes Putin as
a liar because the things he initially said with the
reason for him going into Ukraine would be resolved if
that lease took place, and ben Zelensky would be able
(26:17):
to say, we've retained our pre war borders. And you know,
while the Russians are going to be there for a while,
it's a transitional thing. They're using it for a while,
but when the lease is up.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
But you and I both know that that's all semantics
and is not reality, right we wink wink, nod, nod.
We know that once Russia has it, they're not giving
it back to Ukraine.
Speaker 6 (26:39):
Well, Sean is something to consider. Thanks for taking my mind.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
Listen.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
I think that's what the words land swap mean. I
don't think you're off base here. I think that's what
they're talking about anyway. Carl and Marilyn. Carl, you're on
the Sean Hannity Show.
Speaker 7 (26:56):
Hi, Sean, Thanks for taking my call. I have such
great respect for you. I love your show, telling the
Paul screener that I'm a big follower of the great One.
And last night, oh yeah, he was talking about the
fact that as your prievous colors were mentioning the power
(27:17):
of the that Trump has over Putin for financial reasons
with the sanctions. Do you believe that there are sanctions
that would be strong enough to pull the rug completely
out from under them instead of long term or short term.
Speaker 1 (27:37):
I think the only reason Putin came to the table
is because the President forced NATO to more than double
their commitment to defense. I think it's because of the
EU trade Deal, where I mean it's a sanction in
the sense that Western Europe won't buy their energy from
Putin anymore, but they'll buy it from US. I think
(27:59):
the tariffs on India, that's a sanction. I think selling
weapons to Ukraine in a way you can describe it
if you want, depending on the semantics you want to use,
that would be a sanction. I'm not I'm in favor
of harder sanctions, especially if they can't come to a deal.
You know, do I think it's going to I think
(28:20):
the President is committed to resolving this quickly, and if
you want to do it quickly, the only way it's
going to end is with land swaps versus real security
guarantees for Ukraine. Now, if you want to play long
ball and you're willing to accept all the dead people
in the interim, then then we could talk about the
(28:40):
sanctions strategy, which you know, I'd like to see the
strongest sanctions possible, especially if Putin doesn't come to the table. Anyway,
good call. We have a lot of smart callers today
eight hundred nine one. If you want to be a
part of the program,
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Sean Hannity
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New Heights with Jason & Travis Kelce
Football’s funniest family duo — Jason Kelce of the Philadelphia Eagles and Travis Kelce of the Kansas City Chiefs — team up to provide next-level access to life in the league as it unfolds. The two brothers and Super Bowl champions drop weekly insights about the weekly slate of games and share their INSIDE perspectives on trending NFL news and sports headlines. They also endlessly rag on each other as brothers do, chat the latest in pop culture and welcome some very popular and well-known friends to chat with them. Check out new episodes every Wednesday. Follow New Heights on the Wondery App, YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to new episodes early and ad-free, and get exclusive content on Wondery+. Join Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts or Spotify. And join our new membership for a unique fan experience by going to the New Heights YouTube channel now!