Pat R. Steps 11-12 - Step Series at Life Is Good Group - 9/4/2025

Pat R. Steps 11-12, Step Series at Life Is Good Group, Boca Raton, FL. 9/4/2025

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
I recovered alcoholic. My name is Patt Rogan.

Speaker 2 (00:04):
Thanks to the Twelve Steps of Alcoholics Anonymous outline in
this Big Book of Alcoholics Anonymous, which is the.

Speaker 1 (00:09):
Program of AA, I have recovered.

Speaker 2 (00:12):
From a seemingly hopeless state of mind and body, and
for that I would be forever grateful. A didn't just
save my life, but it gave me a new life,
and I absolutely enjoy my life today. It's hard to
believe that any and I were talking before the viewing.
I'm going to hit seventy this month, and.

Speaker 1 (00:35):
None of it for that's yes, Jesus, because I'm gonna
lie about it everywhere else principles my ass. But we
were talking about that, and just I never thought.

Speaker 2 (00:58):
That I would even make it this far, let alone
be in the health that I'm in at this particular stage.
I mean I drank and smoked everything that you could
possibly put into your body. I mean stuff that wasn't
supposed to be in a pipe.

Speaker 1 (01:15):
I told it. And I can't believe I can still
breathe to this day.

Speaker 2 (01:20):
I mean, my lungs are I can get to check
ups and my lungs are fine, and my stomach isn't
tore up and just so how that happens. I mean,
that's truly by the grace of God in this program
and you guys, and I'll forget. So I want to
tell you guys right now that I want to thank
you for having me here.

Speaker 1 (01:37):
There are people in this church that I truly love.

Speaker 2 (01:40):
There's a hand there's not many that I use that
word for shdd And notice I use that word very
sparing you. I like a lot of you, a lot,
you know, but I love a handful of people. I mean,
there's just I use that word spared because I think
it really means something when you.

Speaker 1 (01:56):
Say that, and it's deep, it's it's uh.

Speaker 2 (01:59):
I don't use it for everybody, but there's a handful
of people in this room that I truly love and
we're partner. We walked this thing together shoulder to shoulder,
and a lot of you know everything about me. It
was a handful of you that know everything about about
pat and I don't share that with everybody. I have
a pretty small circle all people that I really trusted.

(02:21):
You know, a couple of guys sitting over here, you
know that I truly love and trust me.

Speaker 1 (02:28):
One sitting here, and there's a couple other you if
I miss you, sord so thank you. I really appreciate friendship.

Speaker 2 (02:40):
I appreciate being there when I needed you, and a
lot of you have been there for a lot of years.

Speaker 1 (02:44):
So you know, I'm gonna I'm gonna.

Speaker 2 (02:47):
Play around with with with twelve and eleven here, and
I kind of like I think eleven is forever. You know,
there's only a few times in the book where Bill
repeats himself.

Speaker 1 (02:57):
You know.

Speaker 2 (02:57):
One is in chapter three with control, you know, five talkings,
he use his word control.

Speaker 1 (03:02):
We know that that Bill is a wordsmith.

Speaker 2 (03:05):
We know that he's a literature major, you know, so
he confuses us sometimes because he doesn't like to repeat himself.
So he uses a bunch of words that mean the
same thing, and we think he means something different, but
he doesn't.

Speaker 1 (03:16):
But there's a.

Speaker 2 (03:17):
Few cases where control, the lack of control and the
ability to control another attempt to control. He's trying to
make a freaking point, you know. He does it there,
and he does it in chapter four with power, he
repeats power four times.

Speaker 1 (03:31):
He does it in chapter five in honesty he repeats
honesty over and over again.

Speaker 2 (03:36):
And he does it again here in ten would continue, continue, continue, continue,
you know, not maintain, continue, continue, continue, continue to grow
an understanding and effectiveness you know, more God, more gone.

Speaker 1 (03:54):
I mean, it's just is this incredible.

Speaker 2 (03:57):
I think it's I don't know if it's Emint who
says that there's this incredible desire for more God. That
is continued improving with our relationship with God, which is
Step eleven, right to improve our conscious contact with God.
Praying only for the knowledge of His will for us
and the power to care. No praying only for that.
I mean, it doesn't mean you can't pray for the stuff.

(04:18):
But Step eleven is about that. You know, what is
your will for me today? And and and my spiritual
experience I share with you my my major experience, my
white light moment. If you will came in step five
for me. You know, my life changed. The obsession was
lifted after my fifth step. I did it with a

(04:38):
priest because I don't trust you and uh, and I
didn't trust my sponsor at the time because I don't
trust anybody. I didn't trust my father and trust my mother.
I don't trust my sister, my brother, and so I'm
not trusting you. But I have an experience I am
a pisary after my fifth step, and I've been wanting
more of that ever since, and that and that has improved.

(05:00):
I as I got to six and seven, and I
started changing some of my behaviors.

Speaker 1 (05:05):
Practicing new behaviors. And it didn't always happen overnight.

Speaker 2 (05:08):
I mean, I had to practice honesty because honesty sometimes
puts me in a light or I don't look good,
you know, and I don't like to not look good.
You know, it's important for me for you to like me.
It's important for me to be accepted. Money is important
to me. It's not the most important thing, but it's important.
The material is not the most important thing, but it's important.

(05:32):
Relationships are important. So anything that affects those things. I
had a hard time. I told you, I think it
was loud. It was last week or a couple of
weeks ago. Where the things that were gonna put me
in jail were easy to let go, things that were
gonna get me arrested were easy to let go. But
the things that just made me look bad as simple
as they were, you know, just like being late for work?

Speaker 1 (05:53):
Why are you late? I caught the breech, No you didn't,
you slept it, you know, but I'm not telling you.

Speaker 2 (05:59):
I I think if that makes me look stupid, yeah,
but I would walk away with that with a new attitude.

Speaker 1 (06:04):
I would walk away with that with an awareness that
I just.

Speaker 2 (06:07):
Lied to my boss and that made me uncomfortable, and
that conflicts me when I feel uncomfortable. And the next
time I'm confronted with that same question, I'd probably lie again.

Speaker 1 (06:21):
I mean, it's a different lie this time, caught traffic
or something. You know, Damn you did it. And the
third time I didn't say anything. I just went but
in lie in life. And then eventually I thought, oh,

(06:45):
I give a shit, you know, what's the big deal.
Why am I lying about this? Why do I continue?
Why don't I just get up early enough and make
it to work on time, you know? And now I'm like,
if I'm fifteen minutes early, I'm on top.

Speaker 2 (06:57):
That's just the way I get right, you know, I
don't really have to be at work in any particular time.
It's good for me to be here at a particular time.
But I'm there before everybody. I mean, I'm there.

Speaker 1 (07:07):
I leave. I leave the house like six point thirty
in the morning because it's just so that I'm there
before everybody else and I don't have to sit.

Speaker 2 (07:12):
In traffic or have that traffic excuse, because there is
none when I go.

Speaker 1 (07:18):
But it takes practice, you know.

Speaker 2 (07:19):
And as I continue to practice that, I'm getting closer
to God.

Speaker 1 (07:23):
As I continue this lifetime.

Speaker 2 (07:25):
And of amends, I keep getting closer. Thought I would
have never imagined that I would look forward to making amends.
When I got here and I looked at that step,
I would you gotta be Kidney, I think I share
with you. Bride was reading the doctor's opinion of me,
and I go, do I have to call the irs?

Speaker 1 (07:41):
He says, pack, you're on step one? You know that's nine.

Speaker 2 (07:45):
I said, yeah, but really, but you know, when I
got to nine, I wanted that to go away. I
want it to go away. What do I have to
do to make that go away? What do I have
to do to make this conflict go away? Because I
drink over conflict. I don't do well with the conflict.
I'm an emotional cripple. I might be emotionally unstable, it

(08:11):
might be.

Speaker 1 (08:11):
The right word.

Speaker 2 (08:13):
So I need to stay out of contradict or I
need a drink.

Speaker 1 (08:18):
And that's just the bottom line.

Speaker 2 (08:20):
And then when we get to ten, eleven and twelve,
now I get the practices and grow in these steps.

Speaker 1 (08:28):
And what I start to.

Speaker 2 (08:29):
Learn is things like restraint. Right, like restraint. I think
it was Peter Wright heerd say it years ago. Somebody
comes into me and says, I acted out on some
old behavior today.

Speaker 1 (08:41):
No, that was today.

Speaker 2 (08:43):
That's current behavior, right, that's not old behavior. Right, old
behaviors something you don't do it anymore.

Speaker 1 (08:51):
You just to do it.

Speaker 2 (08:51):
You don't do it anymore. But if it's still doing it,
it's current. So I stopped reacting, I stopped showing. I
started showing some restraint. I think the book says tongue
in pen. I think thumb and.

Speaker 1 (09:04):
Send is the proper term. None.

Speaker 2 (09:07):
Don't send the freaking text, right, at least apples start
to let you edit that shit, bring it back, give
you like five seconds.

Speaker 1 (09:17):
To get it back. You know, at least you think
you got it back anyway. But you can't unsend. You can't.

Speaker 2 (09:26):
Once it's doctor, it's out there. Don't send the email.
You know, wait a minute, you know, wait a day
before you send that out there. Don't send the text.
That's what I'm talking That's what keeps me out of Carton.
When that customer confronts me, I don't have to confront them.
I don't have to let them take me out of
my zone. I can just look at them as this

(09:48):
book tells me to look at them as wonder what's
going on in their life that is acting them to
be like that, is making them be like that. I
wonder what kind of stress they're on your and once
to say after that, I wonder if there's any thing
I could do to help, And we start looking at
life from a different end. And so I'm eliminating a
lot I don't say, and I eliminated all of it.

(10:08):
Some days there's you know, cat's looking for conflicts.

Speaker 1 (10:11):
Some days, you know, unfortunately. But most days I'm trying
to stay out of it.

Speaker 2 (10:18):
And when I do get in it, I got a
step that can take me back out of it. I
got a step that says, Hey, did you just act
out on some current behavior? Did you just act out
on some defective character? You need to ask God to
help you work on this. Do you own amends to
that customer? Do you own amends to that driver? You

(10:41):
need to call you a sponsor. Share this with a
sponsor or a friend, and I can get back in
the zone we were.

Speaker 1 (10:56):
I think we're talking last week.

Speaker 2 (10:58):
It just nothing seems to last forever though, right like
it's for me. I'm gonna speak for myself that that
good can be my worst enemy. Right good stop was
as good as the enemy of the best. Right that's
the same, right is that? But good never seems to last.
For I've found good many times in my mind, and

(11:22):
it just doesn't seem to last because.

Speaker 1 (11:24):
I need more. We talked about the maintenance word. That
maintenance means to stay.

Speaker 2 (11:31):
The same unless you're unless it's a living item, and
then means to promote its growth. But there's no there's
no stay in the same year. You're either grown or
you're gone, progressing or regressing. There's no dressing. You know,
you're not gonna be able to just stay in that spot.
At least I'm not. And maybe I'm worse than most

(11:53):
people here, you know, but I've never been able to
stay in that zone doing exactly what I did yesterday.
I can't stay sober on yesterday's sobriety. I can't stay
sober on yesterday's recovery. That river flowed I got to
start over again every single water and at night I
got to make sure my slave is clean, and if

(12:14):
it's not, and that next morning, I got to make
it clean. Because I don't know how much conflict I
can take. Before I started to medicate, and it won't
start with a drink or a drug. It'll start a
sex spree or a money spree or something like that,
you know, something else that will take me out of
that moment. But then it's back, and then I'm.

Speaker 1 (12:37):
Stuck with me again.

Speaker 2 (12:40):
I was. I'm gonna give you some examples of where
I have hit a wall and either it was my
awareness of hitting the wall that took me out of it,
or somebody else's awareness of me hitting the wall, and
it took me out of you know. And usually it
was some of the else saying what are you doing?

Speaker 1 (13:02):
You know?

Speaker 2 (13:03):
And I was probably in a little maybe my first
year recovery, a little after my first year recovery. In
the fifth chapter closed and it moved to Larry and
it left a void.

Speaker 1 (13:15):
I got sober at the fifth chapter.

Speaker 2 (13:16):
Company left a void in Lighthouse Point, Papa, and I'm
gonna name the clubhouse, but me and Billy and Karen
Uh opened up this clubhouse, right, and we put our
names on the leaks basically, you guys open, you know,
and and with a lot of help we overed it.
And I was the treasurer. Of course, my name's on

(13:38):
the lease. I'm going to be the treasurer.

Speaker 1 (13:40):
And there were two singers on the chat, but I
was the treasurer. I was. I was the treasurer for
almost five years.

Speaker 2 (13:50):
Somebody in their infinite wisdom decided to order all the
bank statements from the bank and do an audit.

Speaker 1 (13:58):
And they brought all these banks.

Speaker 2 (14:00):
I said, a business meaning accused me of stealing money
from the clubs right now. It was the anniversary night.
My son was there, my oldest son was there, and
talk about old behavior, I was. I was furious.

Speaker 1 (14:19):
Matter of fact, my son hadn't stopped me and stepped
between me and this.

Speaker 2 (14:23):
Guy you know who it was, and I would have
punched his song bitch in front of my son. He
would have watched his five years sober dad punched a
crap out of this guy in front of an AA
meeting in front of the clubs, right, and that was it.
I hit Instead of punching him, I hit him with
the Chibo and I said, I said, it's all yours,

(14:46):
you know, And I took my name off the least
and I left.

Speaker 1 (14:53):
Talk about a resent.

Speaker 2 (14:56):
In some and in most cases, the resent it redirected
me to where I need it to be.

Speaker 1 (15:04):
Right.

Speaker 2 (15:05):
There's always like like you're either gonna You're either gonna
hit the wall and have a breakdown or a.

Speaker 1 (15:09):
Breakthrough, right.

Speaker 2 (15:10):
And so I hit the wall and I decided to
get the hell away from all of you people in
Pampaa on Derko Beach and I go find a home group.

Speaker 1 (15:18):
I had the West.

Speaker 2 (15:19):
Boca called the Boca Voice. And I didn't share this
with you guys earlier. When I did my fifth step.

Speaker 1 (15:31):
I left something out. I did the best cycle at
that time.

Speaker 2 (15:38):
And I'm you know, I'm not telling you that I'm
I'm happy about leaving something out, but I'm telling you,
if I hadn't done my fifth step at all, I
would have never had the experience I had in that
fifth step.

Speaker 1 (15:51):
I would have probably gotten drunk.

Speaker 2 (15:54):
So I did the best I could at that time.
And I tell the guys, I sponsor, you do the
best you can at this time because we're gonna He
visited this over and over and over again. So I
go out to this meeting called the Boca Boys, and
this guy named Howard c shares his story and almost
shares my piece, and I left out of my visits

(16:19):
something very simil and I was able to get free.
I was able to It was a sex thing, kids
being kids.

Speaker 1 (16:26):
It was one of those kind of things embarrassing.

Speaker 2 (16:28):
I was afraid to share a priest because I thought
he would judge me. And I got to do a
fifth step with Howard and get rid of it and
make it go away. And Howard wasn't shocked at all.
I shared something with me very similar that he almost
shared from the Ponia, and Howard became my sponsor until
till we passed, you know, up until I was there

(16:50):
almost ten.

Speaker 1 (16:50):
Years at the Boca Boys.

Speaker 2 (16:54):
So I'm cruising along at the Boca Boys, right, everything's great.
I got a news sponsor, I got this great men's group.
It's on fire, and I can't stand meeting anymore. I
am sitting in this meeting that probably saved my life
at that particular time, and I.

Speaker 1 (17:13):
Am restless, irtal, and discontent.

Speaker 2 (17:16):
If that son of a bitch tells the dog and
ketchup story one more time, I'm gonna punch him.

Speaker 1 (17:22):
I just I've heard the story forever. I knew what
everybody was gonna share. Everybody'd been in the home. I
knew what.

Speaker 2 (17:27):
Everybody was gonna share. I knew what every story everybody
was gonna tell. I knew every experience that this guy
was gonna share. I was sick of his.

Speaker 1 (17:34):
Group, right, my home group.

Speaker 2 (17:38):
Right, I'm sitting every one air goes, the dog.

Speaker 1 (17:42):
Could ketchup stuff.

Speaker 2 (17:47):
And I share with Howard Shower, I don't think I
could do this same one. And he says, oh, you know,
you know patients in tolerance ten stuff? You know? Yeah, right,
So I share with Billy, and Billy hands me this
prayer called the prayer of Jabez, and he says, start
praying to see what happens. Look, I don't know how

(18:08):
prayer works. I don't know if it changes things or
it puts me in a position to change and the
mindset to change.

Speaker 1 (18:13):
Don't know. I just know that when I pray, things change,
that's all. And I have faith in that. I have faith.

Speaker 2 (18:20):
So I started praying, and the short version of the
prayer is protect me, bless me, bless me, and protect
me and expand my territory. That's the short version of
that prayer. And I started praying this prayer every day.
So I get these people from Hollywood. It ask me
to do a big of study.

Speaker 1 (18:36):
In Hollywood at the Hollywood Happy Hour, and I tell him, no,
I can't do that. It's my home group night.

Speaker 2 (18:45):
You hear what I just said, the meaning I hate.
I'm about going to do it because that's the night
that lead meet and I tell Billy, and Billy says,
you missed the answer answered your prayer and you missed it.
So I told Howard, I said, look, I'm gonna take

(19:06):
this committee. I'm going to go do twelve weeks in
Hollywood Happy Hour and then I'll be back. That was
twenty four years ago. I've been back twice to get
the medallion out to what by the way, to my
first sponsee, who I swore I was wasting my time
on Dwayne right, and I wonder if Dwayne's around on

(19:27):
the he's law here. But Dwayne came in on this
first DUI hadn't lost anything, still had his business, his wife,
his family. As this is it doesn't I shall gave
him a twenty seven year medallion recently. You know. That's uh,
that's how that's why you just say, yes, well somebody
asked responsible, because you just don't know.

Speaker 1 (19:45):
I don't know, you know. So I leave that meeting.
And what comes out of that, What comes out.

Speaker 2 (19:53):
Of that redirection, that resentment that redirected me, what comes
out of that is I get asked just speak by
Brian and Zilon.

Speaker 1 (20:02):
Right.

Speaker 2 (20:03):
I run into this guy Bill Kay, who's probably on here,
and Bill is looking for a sponsor, and I said, Bill,
I'll sponsor, and he goes, oh, that's okay, you know, yeah,
those thanks, you know. But then a week or two
later he comes back to me and ask me the sponsor.
We start studying the Big Book in his apartment at

(20:24):
a halfway house. I'm not going to mention halfway house,
but at a treatment center halfway house up the street.
And then other people know we're studying the Big Book,
and Timmy starts coming in.

Speaker 1 (20:36):
There's other guys starts coming in.

Speaker 2 (20:37):
And then the next thing you know, the room is
full and we're too big, so we have to move
down to the gymnasium. So we get to the gymnasium.
The gymnasium gets too small, So we have to move
into the office and we start a meeting in the
office where the Deerfield Beach Study Group start, and we
call it the Deerfield Beach Study Group. Central Facts starts there,
student the back to basics that when we take people two.
The steps starts there too, you know, the bid them

(21:00):
book meeting. So we start these groups there that has
been my home group now where I don't.

Speaker 1 (21:05):
Know, last twenty years right rejection or redirection.

Speaker 2 (21:14):
Redirection five years later and this is just like, this
is why I can't stay the same because of these
moments that are put in my life, because of these
oh god, these things that reveal my recovery. I don't
like to call them tests because they're not tests. They
really reveal my recovery. They tell me where I'm really at,

(21:35):
where's your dependence really at at?

Speaker 1 (21:39):
You know. And I was divorced when I came in here.

Speaker 2 (21:41):
I got remarried at two years sober. I was married
almost fifteen. I was fifteen years sober, and my wife
wanted out of the marriage. She don't want to be
married to AA anymore. And that's what she was married to.
Her defense, she married an because.

Speaker 1 (22:00):
I'm all in or I'm all out. I'm not for
a normy, you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (22:04):
I Am not gonna She had done her last gratitude
freaking dinner. You know, I'm not going anymore your picnics.
You know, I'm done with his bs, you know. And
I just want to smoke a joint on Friday and
have a couple of drinks and watch TV.

Speaker 1 (22:20):
You know, you want to go to your meeting. Go
to your meeting. And that's kind of what happened, you
know it was.

Speaker 2 (22:25):
And look, the beauty of that fifteen years was my
son's got to be with their mother and father while
they grew up. My oldest son was out of the
house already, My youngest son was deployed in Iraq at
the time. Yeah, and here I am, fifteen years sober,
going to a divorce.

Speaker 1 (22:46):
I was freaking crushed. And I think it was more.

Speaker 2 (22:51):
I think it was more me being a failure because
I understood her point of view. I understood that a
normy doesn't want to be here. They don't want to
be here, they want a normal life. They want to
go out Friday night. I have a couple drinks and
dinner in the home, go on Saturday night, do a
little dancing.

Speaker 1 (23:08):
Just not me. It's just not me. I'd rather be here.
I would rather be here. This is my happy place.
But it's not Enius and I get it. But I
was crushed, absolutely crushing.

Speaker 2 (23:22):
You talk about wanting to run, I'm fifteen years sober
and I don't.

Speaker 1 (23:25):
Want to drink. I want to run.

Speaker 2 (23:28):
I want I'm going to become a hermit up in
the mountains of Pennsylvania in the Alleghaty Nationals. I had
my spot picked up by Millstone Creek. Right, I'm going
to start in a tent and then I'm going to
build a cabin. I mean, I had this thing work
I hadn't worked out.

Speaker 1 (23:46):
You know, I'm out of here. I can't do this.
I can't do people anymore.

Speaker 2 (23:54):
And I'm cruising up and down a one A, just
like contemplating where I'm going.

Speaker 1 (23:59):
And Billy Calsey, And this is why, if you wonder
why I call you during the day, this is why
I call you. Billy said you were on my heart.
I hadn't talked to Billy.

Speaker 2 (24:11):
He was doing the travel team with his kids with
the baseball and off hadn't talked to Billy for maybe
two years. Billy says, you put on my heart. Now.
If you wonder why I call you, that's why I
call you. If you wonder why I call you out
of blue, that's why. Because you came on my own.

Speaker 1 (24:27):
I never ignore that anymore. I never ignore. I'll send
you a text or I'll call you. And I said
I'm fine, you know. Billy said, no, there's something going on.
What's going on? And I told what was going on?
He said, well, we're going to pick you up tonight.
We're gonna take you down to see Russell.

Speaker 2 (24:50):
Russell knows this story here next week, right, And I said, no,
I don't do Russell.

Speaker 1 (24:56):
No, not Russell, you know. I said, he's that God's they.

Speaker 2 (25:00):
Say Jesus and stuff, and the meetings they're violating traditions,
you know. And I said, I'll just stay long and
he said, no, we're coming to get you. And they
take me down to the on track. I don't want
some group and what was it? And Dixie I went
in in North Miami? Yeah, what was the name of John?
You remember?

Speaker 1 (25:19):
Met on track? Right?

Speaker 2 (25:21):
And so Russell opens the meeting like this, if you're
here for the first time, if you're new and you're
here for the first time.

Speaker 1 (25:29):
You might want to go to another meeting and you
guys will.

Speaker 2 (25:32):
Hear this next week, right, He says, I'm here for
the guy who's fifteen twenty twenty five years sober, who's
dying inside right now. And I went, oh, my god,
he's talking to me now. I didn't know that Russell
opens a lot of meetings like that. I thought it
was about me, you know. And I went up in
the after the meeting, I said, Russell, and I was like, tears,

(25:54):
Miss Russell, you were talking to me. And he says,
my special these guys with time in AA in a
flat line, he says, and I can see it.

Speaker 1 (26:07):
I can see it. I'm recognized. And he says, you know,
maybe you need something more than that pigle.

Speaker 2 (26:15):
I looked at and yeah, do you what do you mean?
He said, Well, there's other folks. He says, it's even
a bigger book. I'm not promoting anything here. I'm just
telling you my experience.

Speaker 1 (26:31):
Okay, I'm not.

Speaker 2 (26:32):
I'm not.

Speaker 1 (26:34):
Because so I left there shaking my head like yeah,
and boy, continual improvement of our understanding of God? Who
is God? When is God? Start asking these kinds of questions.

Speaker 2 (26:51):
He planted a seed, right, and I'm thinking about what
he's saying, still dying inside. And Peter m comes down
from Jersey to speak at the Dear Field P's study
group at the Halfway House Treatment Center whatever it was
at that time. And after the group, after the meeting,

(27:11):
spoke for our anniversary meeting. And after the meeting, him
and I and already went to Frankie Johnny's where Luigi
Doola is now, right, and we're sitting there and me
and Peter are having this philosophical debate.

Speaker 1 (27:25):
I say that I was having this debate with Peter right.

Speaker 2 (27:30):
Peter wasn't debating anything right about whether people can raise
from the dead and virgion can.

Speaker 1 (27:35):
Have babies, you know, that kind of thing, you know.
And he just sat there and he didn't say it work.
He just looked at me with this look in his eyes,
and he asked, He said, Pat, I got a question
for you. He says what I said. What he says,
did you ever think you would be fifteen years sober?
I said, nah. He said that's a miracle, is it?

Speaker 2 (27:55):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (27:56):
Yeah? He said, so anything's possible.

Speaker 2 (28:00):
And I couldn't debate that yeah, I guess anything's possible.
And we were leaving the restaurant and Russell and Peter
says this, maybe you should go back to the religion
of your childhood and leave for.

Speaker 1 (28:14):
A good reason. That hit me and I was consumed
by it, like why did I leave? Well, I know
why I left when.

Speaker 2 (28:27):
I thought I'm sober. Now I'm looking at it through
a different lens. Now, you know why I left because there.

Speaker 1 (28:34):
Were principles that you had to live by.

Speaker 2 (28:38):
To be part of I thought, right, like, there was
this these gates and this fire. If you lived by
the principles, you went to the gates, and if you didn't,
you live, you went to the fire. And I couldn't
live up by the principles. So I'm going to the fire,
so I have to deny this shit.

Speaker 1 (28:58):
Put me up. This is just bull.

Speaker 2 (29:00):
You know.

Speaker 1 (29:01):
Well, we had this purgatory thing halfway house. I guess
where you weren't bad enough to burn, you're good enough
to go to the gate.

Speaker 2 (29:11):
You went to halfway and I think people would say
a prayer and you get shot up.

Speaker 1 (29:17):
I don't know how that wor good behavior. I don't
know how that work.

Speaker 2 (29:24):
But that's why that there's a story in the back
of the book. I think it's called Window of Opportunity
where they talk about when normal people can't live up
to the principles, they changed their behavior to meet the principles.

Speaker 1 (29:38):
Alcoholics lower the principles.

Speaker 2 (29:42):
When they can't live up to their goals, they changed
their behavior to meet their goal. We lower our goals.
And that's exactly what I had been doing. It was
longer in my principles to match my behavior, and I thought,
what have I got to lose?

Speaker 1 (30:00):
And that was Saturday night.

Speaker 2 (30:01):
I went to church Sunday, one first time I had
gone since I was thirteen twelve, since my grandmother stopped
making me go when I became such a pain in
the ass that she said, okay, forget, I'll thank your
brothers and sisters.

Speaker 1 (30:17):
I think I was twelve. I threw up the God.
If you're there, God, if you're a reader, I need.

Speaker 2 (30:33):
You, not.

Speaker 1 (30:35):
Help me. And I had my second spiritual experience in
that church. Can't prove it to you, God proved it
to me. I can't prove God to you, but it's
been proven to me. And it was this.

Speaker 2 (30:52):
Peace again that came over me. And here's what came
to my mind. First, think, I'll never forget what came
to my mind. For why would you want to be
with somebody that doesn't want to be with you? That's
that's like too easy, that's like too simple. Why would
you want to be with somebody that doesn't want to
be with you?

Speaker 1 (31:11):
Let her go? Let her go?

Speaker 2 (31:15):
And I was said, piece And the other thing that
came out my party is Garrett. You need to ask
Garrett the sponsor. Now Garrett was part of the God
Squad too. He was part of the other section of
the God Squad. And and I left that church and
I called my wife at the time, and I said,

(31:37):
take whatever you want.

Speaker 1 (31:38):
I'll be fine.

Speaker 2 (31:39):
You know, my first divorce, I put a gun to
my head and if you got to share that, if
you got The first week I was here, I had
committed I almost committed suicide. The second divorce was take
what you want, I'll be fine. You want the house ticket,
I don't even need the money right now, whatever you want.

(32:00):
And I was finally just let it go. I'll be fine.
I saw Garrett that A couple of days later we
met it ownfish Max. I remember said both of them.
I said Garrett, you scare the hell out of me.
I said, but I need what you've got, and he said,
let's go. The first thing he had me to do

(32:23):
was the timeline. He said, I want you to look
at significant events that have taken place in your life.
You take five year increments of your life, and I
want you to write down the good memories and the
bad memories. And my god, did that explain why I
don't trust you? And why I'm afraid of cockroaches? I

(32:44):
never knew till then. I'm not going to go over
that I have this. I'm like, I'm not afraid of
bouts except German cockroaches.

Speaker 1 (32:54):
And someday I'll tell you the story. But it was
Garrett was my sponsor until he passed. That'sn't it. Three years?
Four years?

Speaker 3 (33:05):
Oh my god, eight years. You'll get to another level.
Open up, another book, opened up, another book, started studying
some other principles. So what do you do when you're
doing everything this book tells you to do and you're

(33:26):
following upon That's all I'm asking?

Speaker 1 (33:29):
Where do you go? Where do you get more God? Right?

Speaker 2 (33:33):
I need more God than this has to offer. That's
where I got. Doesn't mean you're going to get there,
it doesn't mean you're there. That's where I ended up.
I needed more than what this had to offer. I
needed more than eighty three through eighty eight, which I
was doing.

Speaker 1 (33:47):
Every single day.

Speaker 2 (33:49):
But I needed more than it, and I fouled more
than it. And I love going to church, any church,
by the way. I mean, I'm a member of the church,
but I love to any church, just like I love
coming here. I get the same feeling when I walk
into that that I feel when I walk into here.

Speaker 1 (34:08):
There's just a presence, there's a piece.

Speaker 2 (34:11):
The outside is out there, and I'm in here and
everything is fine when I'm in here. I found so
many other options now other than a drink or a job.
Between walking into any church and feeling peace, between walking
to any a meeting, I don't care if it's a
N A C A, d AA h A, I don't
care what a it is, maybe not GA, but I

(34:37):
feel a presence and I feel a piece in that room.
I feel that when I call my sponsees and we're
talking some twelve step here, that's I feel that what
I call. I feel that when I call a Nick.
I feel that when I call Jesse. I feel that
I call any.

Speaker 1 (34:54):
Of my sponsors that are sitting here right now.

Speaker 2 (34:56):
You know, I feel a piece when they call me,
when they text me and they call me, I feel connected.

Speaker 1 (35:08):
And it's as much as I hate speaking, when.

Speaker 2 (35:13):
I'm done speaking, it feels kind of fifth stepish, do
you know what I mean? It feels like I've accomplished something,
and hopefully I've accomplished something for God, because let's be clear.

Speaker 1 (35:24):
That's what this is all about.

Speaker 2 (35:26):
Having had a spiritual awaken having had having found a
relationship with this invisible power that.

Speaker 1 (35:33):
We're going to call God. For now, I have recovered.
I've had a spiritual awakened.

Speaker 2 (35:40):
I have had a personality change sufficient to recover from alcoholism.
I've had a personality change sufficient to recover from any
problem that I face.

Speaker 1 (35:51):
Relationship problems, health.

Speaker 2 (35:53):
Problems, job problems, career stuff doesn't matter. This program has
given me an answer to all of them.

Speaker 1 (36:05):
And that's the message. I mean. If you're new here now,
I mean, the good news is you don't have to
believe in anything. If you're new here, you don't have
to believe in anything.

Speaker 2 (36:16):
You just have to believe that you don't have the power,
and maybe, just maybe you can connect to a power
that we're talking about, you some visible power that you
can call whatever you want for now that will solve
your problem. You don't have to have faith, you just
have to be willing to believe. You just have to say, Okay, maybe,
why would.

Speaker 1 (36:36):
You do that?

Speaker 2 (36:37):
Because you're gonna freaking die, That's why we do that.
Because I ran out of ideas, die an alcoholic addic death,
or accept spiritual health, go on to the bitter end
walking out your intolerable situation, or accept spiritual health.

Speaker 1 (36:54):
I decided to say, Okay, maybe this will work.

Speaker 2 (36:58):
And I'm telling you I can't even put into words
the miracles that have taken place in my life. The
most important thing in my life today, the central fact
of my life today is God.

Speaker 1 (37:12):
That is the central fact of my life.

Speaker 2 (37:14):
My relationship with my wife does not exist if I
don't have a relationship with God. Because I'm a taker
by nature, I'm a taker. God has just the opposite.
God said, you need to sacrifice to show your love.
You need to sacrifice to show your love. I read

(37:35):
one of the things that I had posted years ago,
a couple of years ago in my memories Today it
says that marriage is not fifty to fifty. Divorce is
fifty to fifty. Marriage is one hundred percent, one hundred percent.
In some days I have to be one twenty and
some days she has to be one twenty. The compensate
for the twenty that I'm missing. But that's what love is,

(38:00):
is sacrificing for someone and being happy about it, giving
away something to someone like a sponsee, giving away something
and being grateful to be able.

Speaker 1 (38:10):
To do them.

Speaker 2 (38:13):
That's what God wants from God wants me to love
his children or her or it, whatever you want to
call it.

Speaker 1 (38:20):
I'm not even sure I never met the guy or girl.
That's what I've been given by this program.

Speaker 2 (38:31):
That's That's the message that I'm carrying today, is the
message of the awakening, the message of this transformation that
takes places through all this stuff. Now, it starts with
what's so let's do some basic twelve step talk, right,
What's it? Start with our story? It starts with our stories.
That's our most powerful, most valuable tool that we have

(38:53):
in this program. And every one of you, as Ben
would say, is a diamond is a diamond. I'll never
I'll stop saying that. That's Ben Troxel right there. You
are all diamonds. You are uniquely valuable in this program.
Somebody needs to hear your story.

Speaker 1 (39:09):
Not mine.

Speaker 2 (39:10):
There are people right now that did not identify what
a word I said tonight. But you'll get up here,
one of you will get up here at this podium,
and you will share and they will identify with you,
and they will come.

Speaker 1 (39:20):
Up to you and say, I did that. I felt
like that, that happened to me. What did you do?

Speaker 2 (39:25):
What did you do? How did you get this? That's
our most valuable weapon, right, our deep dark past unlocks
death and misery for the suffering attic an alcohol. How
great is that? How great is it? My defects become
my greatest assets.

Speaker 1 (39:44):
Right, and that's the bond we make at the beginning.

Speaker 2 (39:46):
We get that newcomer who walks intoor, and by the way,
our book says, we approach them.

Speaker 1 (39:50):
We don't wait for them to approach us.

Speaker 2 (39:53):
When somebody raises their hands in their new to AAA,
we approach them.

Speaker 1 (39:58):
No, it's this ego thing, Well, it don't come up
to bullshit. Mart Think says.

Speaker 2 (40:02):
When we approach the man, we approach them with the answer.
We lay the kid of spiritual tools at their feet.
We tell them our story, We get them to tell
their story.

Speaker 1 (40:13):
Did you try to quit? How'd you do?

Speaker 2 (40:16):
Well? I'll tell you why you didn't. It's called an
obsession of the behind. That's why. Because you can't see
what all call is going to do to you anymore.
All you can see is what it's going to do
for you. And then what happens when you start drinking?

Speaker 1 (40:30):
Can you? Can you control it?

Speaker 2 (40:32):
No? Well, let me tell you why about this chemistry
that we are chemically different. We have this allergy, the
allergic reaction, this physical craving. We do what the doctor's opinion?
Did we tell our story in the doctor's opinion?

Speaker 1 (40:45):
Don't we?

Speaker 2 (40:46):
We're restless, ereal, and discontent. We get ease and comfort
from a couple of drinks. Then we go on to
run and then we come out and we apologize, and
then we do that over and over and over again,
and they go like this, yeah, yeah, And if they don't,
if they go like this, we're done.

Speaker 1 (41:02):
Hey, we're done. So cool man, so cool? What did
you do well? I found this power? I call it God.

Speaker 2 (41:13):
The book calls it God. I kind of think it's
just pure energy, it's invisible.

Speaker 1 (41:21):
Shit. I got stop.

Speaker 2 (41:26):
And then if they say yeah, I'm ready to say,
if they're convinced of the three partent ideas, let's go,
let's get on, let's do three let's start right. Yeah,
let's find out the truth here and we and we
take them through the steps, you know, and then it's
on them. How well do they do well? As good

(41:46):
as they work the steps right, and then we live them.

Speaker 1 (41:49):
That's the deal I was. If we don't have to
deal with I'll close with it. We don't have to
deal with what's drunks too much anymore.

Speaker 2 (41:55):
You know, we got so many tools at our disposal
now I've been I mean, when I first came in here,
we were going one on twelve step calls all the time,
dragging these wet guy drug side of these bars and
all the apartments and trap houses. And you know, I
just recently with Karen speaking a couple of weeks ago.

Speaker 1 (42:10):
I don't they know. I'll tell you it was. It was.

Speaker 2 (42:14):
So she's sneaking and and this I'm not gonna say
his name, but he's he's a foot taller than me
and two hundred pounds heavier than me, right, and that's
not exaggerating, right. You know what my instincts were a
lot of my seat grabbed this and I dragged him outside.

Speaker 1 (42:27):
I was hoping somebody followed me. Nobody did.

Speaker 2 (42:31):
I that they're by myself with this giant who's drunk
out of his freaking mind. We wants to kick the meeting's.

Speaker 1 (42:37):
Ass, right, but just that's what we did. That's what
we did back today.

Speaker 2 (42:44):
But we have treatment centers and detoxes and stuff now.
They're doing most of that work for us now, but
we should be ready to do that at any time.
It's not convenient, but it's but it's slow rewarning.

Speaker 1 (42:57):
So thanks for letting me be here this