May 28, 2025 • 62 mins
We’re staring into the abyss of 1975’s Jaws to see what will gaze back. Cosplayer extraordinaire, Smash B, joins us to talk about her favorite movie of all time. In this episode, we celebrate 50 years of Bruce the Shark as we navigate the mental health effects of small towns, isolation and mental health & much more.
If you or someone you know is reading this right now and struggling with suicide, depression, addiction, or self-harm - please reach out—comment, message, or tweet’ at us. Go to victimsandvillains.net/hope for more resources. Call the suicide lifeline at 988. Text "HELP" to 741-741. There is hope & you DO have so much value and worth!
Abyss Gazing: A Horror Podcast is a production of Victims and Villains is written by Josh “Captain Nostalgia” Burkey (& produced by), Mark Moore & Billy Tabor. Music for this episode comes courtesy of Kevin MacLeod (https://bit.ly/agktheme) & Purple Planet (https://bit.ly/ppcoms).
You can now support us on Patreon. Help us get mental health resources into schools and get exclusive content at the same time. Click here (http://bit.ly/vavpatreon) to support us today!
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/abyss-gazing-a-horror-podcast--5223870/support.
If you or someone you know is reading this right now and struggling with suicide, depression, addiction, or self-harm - please reach out—comment, message, or tweet’ at us. Go to victimsandvillains.net/hope for more resources. Call the suicide lifeline at 988. Text "HELP" to 741-741. There is hope & you DO have so much value and worth!
Abyss Gazing: A Horror Podcast is a production of Victims and Villains is written by Josh “Captain Nostalgia” Burkey (& produced by), Mark Moore & Billy Tabor. Music for this episode comes courtesy of Kevin MacLeod (https://bit.ly/agktheme) & Purple Planet (https://bit.ly/ppcoms).
You can now support us on Patreon. Help us get mental health resources into schools and get exclusive content at the same time. Click here (http://bit.ly/vavpatreon) to support us today!
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/abyss-gazing-a-horror-podcast--5223870/support.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Welcome to a biscase again, or podcast where we celebrate
all things spooky and mental health.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
This is Billy and we might need a bigger vote.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
I'm your other girl host, Josh Ed.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
I am weird with or without Mark, so I'm joined
by one of my weird friends on this episode, Smash
from a Last Player.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
Hello, Yes, Hi, how are you.
Speaker 4 (00:35):
I'm very excited to talk about my all time favorite
movie in the world.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
We are talking about nineteen seventy five's Jaws that dropped
celebrate fifty years this year, So I am kind of
curious about this for you and you as well, Billy,
But like, what is it about this movie that renders
it to be like the number one movie for you?
Speaker 2 (01:05):
I'll let her go first.
Speaker 4 (01:07):
Okay, backstory, I first was shown Jaws when I was
like five years old at the beach of course, so
that already in my mind was like, cool, we're gonna
show a scary movie to a kid this early. We
do it with my kids too, but for me, like
(01:33):
it's a The score is done by John Williams. B
is the Steven Spielberg movie. And then when you look
at like the actual statistics, this was the highest grossing
movie until nineteen seventy seven when it got knocked out by.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Star Wars.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
Something. Wow, that's not surprising.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
So for me, I live in the Virginia Each area,
so I mean, need I say water. I mean they
started haberboard shark attacks lately, but when I was younger,
it wasn't that common. But the fact that you know,
I live in an area that's got an ocean front
to it, that's a big tourist thing that this could
(02:19):
actually happen, so that one of the big things.
Speaker 4 (02:24):
Virginia Beach has had great whites tracked through there and
through like the Chesapeake. So like y'all are right.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
In the zone.
Speaker 5 (02:32):
Yeah, Gray, As the years of I've learned this because
I was always curious as the years have gone on,
especially since this movie was shot.
Speaker 2 (02:43):
But the water is getting warmer. It drove it drives
them more to the area.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
Very re assuring. Thank you for giving me.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
Will you come back down to visit you want to
go swimming?
Speaker 1 (02:59):
I I'm okay, And I am probably the only person
on this phone, on this podcast and maybe maybe in
existence that found this movie because of finding Emo.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
So, uh, Bruce Fridge not food.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
Bruce when Finding Nemo came out.
Speaker 3 (03:23):
I was twelve and my sister and I loved that movie.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
And remember watching a behind the scenes documentary of or futurette.
They were talking about how Bruce the Shark was named
after Jaws, and I was like, oh, I got to
see this movie. And I was like, for a twelve
year old Josh, he was not impressed by this movie.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
But adult Josh loves this movie.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
And this is this is a summer staple that we
watch every year now.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
So well, I mean the other with this movie, not
necessarily the movie itself, but I saw something about the
ride when they were first building it. Did you hear
about that? They they had people working on it and
something happened the night before. They didn't realize that the
people actually died. They're floating in the water. Oh and
(04:17):
they hear about that, the bodies floating in there, and
they started running the ride while the bodies were still
in there.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
The uh. The only reference for any Jaws ride that
I have on this movie would be the universal like
back Loot Tour. I've heard people like to kind of
talk about it and kind of talk about like what's
involved in it, and so like that's like the only
(04:47):
like reference to this one I got. And back to
the future too, you know where they made Jaws nineteen Yeah,
which we'll be covering apparently very soon.
Speaker 4 (05:00):
There's also a Jaws Broadway show now, so it's okay.
But what's really funny is the guy who's Quint, his
son plays him in the show, and the show is
called The Shark Is Broken, and it's all about everything
that went wrong during the shoot of the movie.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
Okay, I was.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
I was like for a second, I was like, how
does Jaws translate to a stage play?
Speaker 3 (05:31):
But that the making of makes a lot more sense.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Yeah, I mean, and during the making of it, it's rumored,
or a lot of it is not even speculated anymore,
that they were drunk the whole time. A lot of
people were drinking really heavily while they were filming it.
Some of the scenes they were still drunk while they
were shooting it.
Speaker 4 (05:53):
Checks I believe it.
Speaker 1 (05:57):
One of the things that this we talked about last
episode about how Halloween was this like pioneer for the
horror genre, and specifically when you look at the kind
of what people often refer to as the Golden Age
of horror, it's boils down to three things, and I
will probably get these wrong, but it's boobs, bad decisions,
(06:19):
and body count.
Speaker 3 (06:21):
I think so.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
Mark might disagree with me on that one, but those
are typically the three we've been we've been talking more
increasingly about, like sex within the genre, from Underworld to
this one, and this one kind of almost the opening.
It's never kind of dawned on me, the fact that
(06:45):
you're following a couple that's literally leaving a party to
go off skinny dip and have sex, and it's such
an incredible opening. But specifically, what I think it reason
why it's worth being kind of talking about being a
pioneer for the genre in terms of sex and you know, violence,
(07:07):
and what we would kind of later see in a
slasher the slasher boom of the nineteen eighties is that
this is kind of one that predates it. You know,
we see we would see it later in Countless Friday,
the Thirteenth movies, a little bit of Nightmare on Elm Street.
Halloween sequels would definitely have that it was primarily in
(07:27):
the horror of the slasher genre. But I mean, I
think you could also make the argument here that this
was really one of the first films in the horror
genre to kind of do that.
Speaker 4 (07:39):
I think it's the top film in the horror genre
from the start, just like cinematically and when you look
at everything, like just the way the movie is made,
like not the behind the scenes stuff, but like the
actual like frame by frame and how they did everything
(08:00):
on like the two biggest fears that humans have, which
is fear of the unknown yep, and fear of isolation,
and that is the entire like from first scene of
the movie to the last scene, like that is the
entire time.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
I would also say that fear of death is probably
worth it mentioning in that because I mean that kind
of runs parallel here. There are there are so many
great scenes that kind of explore that where man, the
little boy who's the Kittner boy gets killed, and you
(08:41):
have that great scene after they find the tiger shark
where Missus Kittenner comes up to Brody and basically like
slaps him across the face.
Speaker 3 (08:49):
Is like, you know, look, we heard that you knew.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
This was a thing, and yet you chose to do it.
And one of the things that I think is really
fascinating about this is it's probably something that when I
watched this as a kid, I didn't really understand. But
now as an adult and now is somebody that runs
a small business but also a nonprofit, I kind of
(09:15):
have this vantage point of the mayor a little bit
more like, don't get me wrong, total piece of shit,
but you know, I kind of under feel like I
have a deeper understanding now of that internal battle of
you know, needing to keep the economy flowing, but also
(09:35):
at the same time keeping needing to you know, keep
that source of the economy going.
Speaker 3 (09:41):
Essentially.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
Yeah, it wasn't just the mayor though, I mean you
had the motel keeper, the everybody else in that meeting
stating well, how bad was it in asking all these
other questions, where on one side it's like, why is
this even a question? You've got somebody that's dead and
you're just gonna give the shark all kinds of more
food basically, and instead of going the route of being saved,
(10:07):
they're like, look, we need the money, or you know,
our town could try out.
Speaker 4 (10:12):
So you also have to look at like character development
and the way they created the characters. Chief Brodie is
coming in as a New York Police officer going to
this little tiny town, this little tiny island where if
you are not originally from the island, if you are
(10:33):
not a local, you would not know how situations are
just like swept under the rug.
Speaker 3 (10:41):
Yeah, I think you see that a little bit more
in small towns.
Speaker 1 (10:45):
Like I think it's like we talked about that a
lot in stories, but having lived in a small town,
there's a lot of topics that you just don't talk
about because they were stigmatized. You know, mental health is
a huge one, you know, being a a podcaster, you
know that's yeah, that we you know, specialize specifically in
(11:06):
kind of attempting to destigmatize that big one.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
That's that's that's a huge thing.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
And so it's not a huge surprise that you see
that practice kind of littered throughout the film.
Speaker 3 (11:17):
I never really kind of.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Looked at from a small town type of vantage point,
but I think it kind of adds this new layer
of depth to the movie that I didn't quite see before.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
On top of that, he's like, I hate to say
the outsider, but you know, the outsider. He's coming into
the small town. They're like you just got here, what
last year and everything, and you're trying to come in
and change rules. On top of that, he's he's trying to,
I guess, face his own fear because he had a
huge fear of drowning, yet he moved to an island.
(11:52):
That's part of his character development too, is he's facing
that fear on top of it because he is surrounded
by wank.
Speaker 4 (12:00):
It definitely has the best Well this is my opinion,
but like characters for horror movies at that time, like
they really give you in depth versus like I even
think about now, like with certain movies the characters aren't
fully fleshed out and you're not getting that backstory to
(12:20):
them first that you're like, oh my gosh, please just
go back to the monster, like I'd rather see the monster.
But like that's just me.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
I will say, I will fully commit to agreeing with
you because I don't love this movie nearly as much
as you do. But I definitely think that this is
one of them the pioneers and showing the capabilities of
what storytelling could be in the horror genre, you know,
because this was kind of kind of stood outside of
(12:53):
you know, not necessarily being as over the top and
kind of campy as like Godzilla was, but it's not
necessarily also as deadly as you know, slashers that would
later kind of give way in the you know, next
(13:14):
three to five years following this, This was kind of
something that really stood out as being really unique within
the genre to where it was a little bit part
creature feature. You had a little bit of comedy in.
Speaker 3 (13:25):
It, you had a little bit of.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
Psychological thriller in it, you had a little bit of
a drama in it. It just kind of fits like
it was in something for everyone kind of films, And
you know, I think again it's one of those films
that showcases really what the capability of a genre piccher
(13:49):
could be. And you know, I will also agree not
to that to sound like the old man yelling at
the clouds, but they don't. They don't really make movies
like this anymore, or if they do, they don't really
kind of get after.
Speaker 3 (14:05):
To this level.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Like I feel like, you know, not to say that
we don't get more modern day entries into it, Like
I think Jordan Peel's really good at doing character development,
os Good Perkins.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
Is really good at it.
Speaker 1 (14:20):
But it just kind of feels like a lot of
the you know, sometimes we're just worried about body count
and how people can die. You know, that's kind of
like the main focus we want, and a movie like
Jaws reminds us that, like no, you can have these
really deep film deep themes.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
That are dealing with.
Speaker 1 (14:42):
You know, Mark Billy, he brought it up earlier saying,
like you know, him trying to overcome the fear of drowning.
But also at the same time, you can also have
these things where you know, we are kind of going
over these these themes of isolation, you know, and the
(15:02):
fear of the unknown, and you know, really being daring
to be vulnerable enough to actually participate in a conversation
about it, not just continue to sweep it under the rug.
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(15:24):
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Speaker 3 (15:26):
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(15:49):
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(16:11):
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Speaker 3 (16:26):
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Speaker 2 (16:57):
Yeah, no, definitely, I mean like you've already hit it
several times. There's a bunch of mental health in this. Uh,
I mean just I can't pronounce it, but the fear
of sharks is a big one for a lot of people. Yeah,
and I mean this whole movie is just the whole thing.
Speaker 1 (17:13):
So which I mean to like, to the credit of
Steven Spielberg, I don't think that you would have a
fear like this if it wasn't after be because I
mean when you read about films that had this type
of impact, like it was This and The Exorcist, like
those were like the two like tent pole films of
(17:36):
the decade that had this profound effect on people to
where people were like I've read stories about people after
seeing this movie were afraid to take a bath or
even a shower, like anything.
Speaker 3 (17:51):
Where like water could do it.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
Now, like I've seen like Australia movies and like clips
where like you got alligators coming up through like the
whole or like spider spiders or freaking snakes coming up
the toilet, and I'm like, no, that would terrify me.
But Sharks seems like a now by today's standards, seems
like a little bit outlandish. But a little snake in
(18:15):
the pooper, Nope.
Speaker 4 (18:17):
What's crazy is I still think Jaws holds up today.
And what's even crazier is the movie is one hundred
and twenty four minutes long. You only see the killer
on screen for four minutes. The shark is on screen
for four minutes. That's crazy to me, Like that is
(18:37):
such a cool feat to have, and it still scares
people today.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
I mean, like Billy said, like earlier in the podcast,
like the fact that, like you know, we're starting to
see more and more of these, Like that's terrifying, Like
because a part of it that like when you go
to something like the ocean, you expect this like sense
of safety, right you expect there to be this like
sense of it's gonna be okay if I go swimming here,
(19:08):
Like there's not gonna be any sharks. So I'm sure
you might get things like jellyfish or crabs that might
sting and pinch and prod, but like shark attacks, like
come on, it's seek to see that.
Speaker 3 (19:21):
I see.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
I feel like you're getting more and more of those
now kind of as we climate change is a real thing, we.
Speaker 4 (19:30):
Also just have access to more. It's getting reported more.
Like there's always been stuff that happened. I will say,
I don't know if I agree on the whole the
ocean is safe aspects because I look at it as
I'm a land mammal. I am going into a water
mammal domain. So like I am fully always aware now again,
(19:54):
because I grew up going to the beach every summer,
we were around sandbar sharks and sand and tiger sharks,
and we'd also go into the estuaries and do the
shark tagging of the pups. So those were bull sharks
and scallop heads. So like for me, I'm always like, Okay,
if I'm getting in here, like I'm in their domain,
(20:16):
they can eat me. I understand.
Speaker 1 (20:19):
Let me let me paraphrase what I mean when I
say the ocean is safe, because what's it like? The
statistics is like we only know like what the ocean
is like. It's something crazy like that. Basically, if I
can have ocean water up to my collar bone, that
(20:41):
is the safety that I'm talking about. I'm not going
in any past then Nope, Nope. That's that's the reason
why I will go swim in a pool.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
But what's crazy is that's deep enough for some of
the sharks yep.
Speaker 4 (20:56):
And some of the sharks are shindy. Yeah, like, and
if they get caught in the surf, like, you're screwed, dude. Like,
it doesn't matter unless you get a really really big
short beach, like, you're not safe.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
We're gonna get it to where Josh is never gonna
go swimming in.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
I will stick to I will stick to pools where
it is safe.
Speaker 2 (21:21):
Yep.
Speaker 3 (21:23):
Stick to pools they were, they're safe. Yep. I don't.
Speaker 1 (21:27):
I don't need to think about any type of weird
concoction that final destination could come up.
Speaker 3 (21:35):
We won't be covered later.
Speaker 2 (21:43):
And it's funny to think that from Jaws, Spielberg went
to what was it Close Encounters as what?
Speaker 1 (21:52):
Yeah, I watched that movie.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
And he turned down Jaws two. At least that's what
I read somewhere.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
I'm kind of curious about this Saws to the second movie.
Speaker 4 (22:06):
Yes, okay, well that makes sense why the rest stuck?
Speaker 2 (22:10):
So yeah?
Speaker 1 (22:11):
Well okay, so here is the other thing about uh,
these movies. So I I'm just gonna pull a card
from Mark and say that none of those sequels exists.
Speaker 3 (22:24):
They've they've never exist.
Speaker 2 (22:26):
I agree with you one d percent.
Speaker 1 (22:30):
Because This is one of those movies that you don't
need sequels too. Like, granted, I understand like why there
are sequels to this movie. It made a butt ton
of money. I understand that from like a financial perspective,
But this movie stands alone so well.
Speaker 3 (22:46):
We talked about we talked about it.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
It's it's opening and how well this film has one
of the greatest endings in cinematic history, Like how do
you kind of just top top something like this? Just
seems very very baffling to me, And the fact that
they got progressively worse from what I've read, is just
(23:10):
very sad. But they you know, maybe they would have
inspired Sharknado, so maybe maybe maybe Spielburg can have write
that stone.
Speaker 4 (23:21):
It is important to remember this did come from a book.
It came from Peter Benchley's Jaws, so like they followed
that so closely that, like you said, there really never
should have been any other movies beyond this one.
Speaker 1 (23:39):
And I think it's if I remember correctly, Benchley hadn't
they hadn't even published the book yet, and they had
they had optioned it out, and Spielberg had gotten his
hands on it, because I believe if I remember correctly.
Benchley came out with the book in seventy four, this
movie came out seventy five.
Speaker 3 (24:00):
Right, It was very very close.
Speaker 4 (24:04):
Yeah, not many people had even heard of the book
before the movie. And then I guess somewhere at the
in credits somewhere it mentions Peter Benchley's book and it
mentioned him. But that, like, and then I think theater
everyone started, yeah, and then I think everything else started.
Speaker 2 (24:24):
Yeah. So you know, this movie took them one hundred
and fifty nine days to make, right.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
M Someone tells me that that that field doesn't feel
like enough time. But we were also slower back in
the seventies when it came to making movies.
Speaker 4 (24:40):
So, but they also like started and stopped a bunch
because she kept breaking.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
That's what I was going to say. They kept having
problems with Bruce the shark breaking and with other issues
like ocean conditions and all that made it take longer.
Speaker 1 (24:57):
Well, I mean, such you know, when you when you
make a film that is primarily working in faith with
the elements, I mean, you expect it as.
Speaker 3 (25:08):
Much a lot of this movie. I feel like what
makes this movie have such a lasting.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
Legacy is the fact that it feels natural, like the
fact that it takes place feels like Amy feels like
a place that is, you know, lived in.
Speaker 2 (25:28):
Yeah and.
Speaker 1 (25:31):
Yeah, uh, you know it feels it feels like it's
lived in, and you know everyone kind of has that
small town charmed to us. We were talking about earlier,
where you know, the mayor at one point says, you know,
this is a summer town where we make summer dollars.
Speaker 3 (25:46):
You know, so.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
Many of the people that live there rely on the
economy of those of that tourus of those things, and
you know, it's it's got to be like really hard.
It's kind of live in a town like that where
you kind of have three months. I guess it's probably
(26:07):
four or five months out of the year that like
kind of fund the remainder of the other seven months.
Speaker 4 (26:17):
I know, real world Island du Fusky, it's off of
South Carolina, they only had a certain amount of months
throughout the year you had to take a ferry in.
The only mode of transportation was bike or golf cart.
And when weather patterns it started to change and the
(26:40):
ocean got a little warmer, that area became a sharp
nursing ground. So all the tourism left, and I'm not
even sure they use it for anything more than like weddings.
At this point, no one gets in the water. You
can't swim. It's just now. I don't know if there
(27:02):
were ever any shark attacks that happened, but.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Like see, i'd be the crazy one. I don't want
to go to swim, but I'd like to go down
there just to see the sharks. I wouldn't get in
the water. Just let me see the sharks.
Speaker 3 (27:17):
I'm good, I'm all right. Just what we have aquariums for.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
Well, I mean I've been to the aquariums and all, but.
Speaker 3 (27:28):
Billy's like, nah, I need to wrestle one.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
We need we need to see.
Speaker 4 (27:34):
Free diving. You can always free dive. I've done that before.
It's a little scary without a cage, but not terrible.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
I don't know if I want to be in a
cage after this movie, right.
Speaker 4 (27:44):
That's what I'm saying. I'd rather free dive and swim
away like Hooper.
Speaker 1 (27:48):
Yeah, stuck in a.
Speaker 4 (27:49):
Cage and there are like that's that's actually happened in
like the last five years, where shark got stuck on
the top of the cage.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Yeah, yeah, nope, Josh you sure, I am.
Speaker 3 (28:09):
I am a okay with that.
Speaker 1 (28:13):
Yeah. So mental health in this movie, yeah, uh yeah,
we we kind of we We've kind of danced around
about a few of the topics in this one, but
isolation is one that I think you brought smash that
I think is really fascinating to look at through the
lens of But this one in particular, because there is
(28:36):
this small town mentality, and part of this thing that
comes along with small town mentalities is not only is
this literally an island, you know, out of away from
the population, but also you have that ice, that small
town mentality issue where if you are going through certain things,
(28:58):
they it feels more heavily bless you.
Speaker 3 (29:03):
I think.
Speaker 1 (29:05):
It feels stronger that sense of isolation because you feel
like you can't turn to someone or you feel like
you're a burden. I know when we moved to from
the small town we lived in to Virginia, there was
it took me probably about a year and a half
to get out of that mentality.
Speaker 2 (29:27):
You know.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
I think this movie kind of dicapsulates it so well,
especially with Chief Brody, because here you have a guy
that you know is literally has a fear of water,
you know, and he's kind of having to oversee it
and also fight off politics alongside shark attacks. And you know,
(29:50):
also kind of getting to see him grow was a
really good treat kind of at the end to see
he was ultimately the one that kind of brought him down.
But again, and you'd really never see him talk openly
about why he doesn't like water, and it's not until
he actually has the conversation that that dinner conversation where
(30:13):
his wife actually brings it up to Triface's character.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
Yeah, and with the isolation, it could be more than
just one person. It could be the town feeling the
isolation of why that's why they want to bring the
guests in because again with the money and all, they
feel isolated and everything separated, where bringing people in breaks
the isolation at least for a couple of months. On
top of that, being in a small town, you you
(30:40):
can worry about, Okay, I do say something to somebody,
how is this going to get around or what's everybody
gonna think? And and that play that can play a
huge factor in a small town or even just the
amongst a couple of groups of friends where you start
saying are they gonna look at me different or whatever?
I think that plays effect too.
Speaker 1 (31:01):
That's the other thing that like really sucks about being
in a small town is that there is that small
town that echo effect to where like if I was
to go to you, billy and say, hey, like, I'm
been really struggling with, you know, an addiction to you know,
video games or pills or you know, like put in
(31:24):
whatever thing you want to put in here. You know,
something like that like rocks a small town. It makes
or breaks families. And I think the other thing too
is that there's with small towns there is this routine mentality,
and I think you kind of get to see that
throughout the course of this where in the meeting where
(31:46):
Quinn announces that like, you know, hey, like I'll capture
for three three thousand, I'll kill it for ten, like
that whole entire seed.
Speaker 3 (31:53):
There's a moment early on where one of the.
Speaker 1 (31:57):
Townspeople asks Brody, like, hey, are you guys playing on
closing the beach? And he's like, just like this like
a little bit of a pause and he's like yes,
and you have the like there's like this uproar as
a result, and I think it's because you have these
this town that has been acquainted with doing something for
(32:19):
you know, a certain way for the better part of
you know, decades and if not generations, that's now being
challenged and now as being a Britain and so that
is another thing that you have to kind of also
battle against in a small town.
Speaker 2 (32:36):
Yeah, especially when you are outsider like like he was
to where you're trying to go against the grain and
then turn around and get blamed for the second shark
attack because he didn't shut down the beach because they
didn't want to.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (32:54):
When I think if you look at each individual character,
every single one of them faces isolation in one way
or another. I'm not going to go into the like
minor characters, but like I even think about like Alex
Kittner's mother is going through her entire grief in isolation
(33:14):
because she thought her son was the first person for
this to happen to and then finds out that Chrissy
was attacked and it wasn't a boating accident a week prior.
So you have you know her, you have Hooper who
comes in and is a know it all shark expert. Ye,
(33:37):
and he's from you know, the big city, so like
he has this mentality of like, oh my gosh, no
one understands me, Like he's calling in like I don't
need to go on holiday and look at sharks. I
have a big, great white here. And when I think
about that, you know, there's that aspect, there's Brody being
(33:58):
relatively new to the island not fully there. Then you
have you know, it's you can tell just by interactions.
The wife doesn't quite fit in yet, so she's isolated.
When you look at where the house is situated on
the island, even the house is isolated from the main
(34:20):
street and where most of the main people on the
board of directors for the businesses and the mayor, they're
all living inside that main street of town. But then
you also have like Quinn's isolation in the fact that
he has an obsession with sharks, whether whether they want
to admit it or not. When you look at his shack,
(34:43):
you can tell like he firmly believes their demons from
help and that is also why he's the main guy
to go for the sharks. But at the same time
he doesn't know anything about them, so like everyone is
isolated with the main three guys everyone's.
Speaker 6 (35:02):
Isolated until I would say that point where they're all
sharing their scars and then you get the backstory of
quint in the Indianapolis.
Speaker 4 (35:14):
Yeah, and then that leads into like fear of water.
Speaker 2 (35:20):
And I was going to say the other thing about this,
it does have it hits on kind of like at
the time it wouldn't have been, but kind of like bullying.
The fact that the sheriffs on the ship trying to
get are on the boat for the ferry trying to
get the kids out of the water at the very
beginning when they're like they're out there trying to get
their badges or whatever it was, and then they pull
(35:41):
the car on the ferry and corner him and get
the medical director or the medical examiner to change what
he said on the paperwork and make the sheriff change
exactly to match that. That's that's crazy.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
Yeah, which is a leak. I'm pretty sure.
Speaker 1 (36:01):
I don't know, but it sounds illegal.
Speaker 2 (36:07):
But but it's a small town, so it didn't matter.
Speaker 1 (36:11):
Yeah. I I'm happy for people that, you know, find
peace and find joy in small towns. I have not
had the greatest experience in small towns, so you know,
and I think a movie like Jaws kind of definitely
embodies what that is. Like, you know, Smash, you just
(36:31):
kind of went through this entire roster of characters that
we spend these two hours with and we just kind
of see how broken they really are. And I think
with especially with a town like Amity, it's really easy
to look and kind of get lost in the the
(36:52):
glitz and the glamour of you know, this being a
tourist spot, this being a you know, good place to
you know, raise kids and to visit, and you know,
all of these other things, but you kind of miss
out on really like, nah, this is a really like
fucked up place, like in the long the grand scheme
(37:13):
of things, and it's not even you know, Bruce just
happens to be like the icy or the cake. This
is kind of just what forces these people to kind
of essentially, for lack of a better word, like face
their own demons. And I think it's fascinating that the
scene that you brought up where they're all kind of
(37:33):
comparing scars is kind of a fascinating juxposition to have
against this because here you essentially have the outsiders of
this town that are kind of sharecase, sharing their own
stories about how this isn't just necessarily a isolated incident,
(37:53):
but this is something that's kind of like a common
occurrence throughout their entire existence as people. How would you
guys like to help us get mental health resources into schools, conventions,
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(38:15):
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Speaker 3 (38:27):
And depression, and to get exclusive.
Speaker 1 (38:30):
Content that you can't get anywhere else. And you guys
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Speaker 3 (38:36):
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Speaker 1 (38:39):
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Speaker 4 (39:05):
I think one of the most powerful points to when
Brody realizes every single decision he's making in every single
action is being watched. Is when he's at the dinner
table with Sean dealing with the fact that he just
(39:27):
got a kid killed because he kept the beaches open
and Alex Kittner dies. But Sean is sitting at the
table copying everything his dad does, like rubbing his forehead
and Brody they're doing this, and Brody starts to recognize
and notice like, Okay, my sons are watching my actions.
(39:50):
The whole town is watching my actions. And he starts
to have to grapple with do I do what's right
and save everyone or do I go along with the
same small town mentality. And that I would say, that's
one of those like key mental health moments that I
(40:11):
like picked out in the movie.
Speaker 3 (40:15):
Is just like.
Speaker 4 (40:17):
A really clear moment of expression of you can really
see and feel what he's dealing with.
Speaker 1 (40:26):
Yes, That's one of the things that I think a
lot of people kind of miss on the conversation of
mental health is that mental health has these ways of
manifesting physically that you know, whether you want to address
a current issue that you are having or it's an
(40:52):
ongoing lingering process. It has this way of manifesting small things,
you know, whether it's you know, raise your hair because
of stress or I know sometimes when I had before
I wasn't therapy, I had like really bad anxiety attacks
and my right eye underneath would flutter really bad and
(41:19):
you can see it, and it was like, I've just
got to ignore this, you know, just kind of wipe
it away and hope that nobody notices. But you know,
it can lead to things like, you know, loss of appetite,
loss of sleep. You know, there's so many different physical
ailments that present themselves when it comes to you know,
(41:41):
having mental health issues and just kind of try to
push them down sooner or later they come to the surface.
Speaker 2 (41:49):
Yeah, And I mean you're saying lots of appetite. It
can also be the opposite. It could be that you
start eating a lot more and everything because you're trying
to hide stuff for here to press or something like that.
It could be to where you go into like shakes
without even realizing it, or anything else that you know physically,
(42:12):
but it could be stuff that you don't recognize that
other people start seeing in you or watching you. That
could be signs that you know you're struggling, And I.
Speaker 1 (42:25):
Mean that's the other thing too, is that like having
that goes into the conversation of having healthy community, that
goes into the conversation of making sure that you are
surrounding yourself with people that you know are rooting for
you and your mental health at the end of the day.
(42:45):
You know, I've I know, I've kind of talked about
it off and on since our return back in April,
But like dude, I I I.
Speaker 3 (42:54):
Don't know if I would still be here if it
wasn't for Billy.
Speaker 2 (42:59):
I do it again.
Speaker 1 (43:00):
You know, when everything kind of happened with Erica originally
like it was, it was it was hard, and.
Speaker 3 (43:08):
You know, it was really really hard to kind of endure.
Speaker 1 (43:12):
And kind of go through those things and face those feelings.
But again, it's one of those things of going through
it is like perseverance is gonna be the way that
you're gonna make it through to the other side and
be a stronger person because of it. And it comes
down to community, to people that a know what is
(43:35):
normal for you and what's not normal for you, What
is normal behavior and what's not normal behavior. So you know,
like if I was around you know, Billy and Mark
when we all live in different areas, like several hours apart.
So like if I knew that, you know, either one
of you guys ate three square meals a day and
(43:56):
you know, maybe walked a mile. Yeah, you know, had
a normal routine, and I started to see that routine
kind of dissipate. I know that there's something wrong. And
it's also about like a the importance of understanding the
warning signs for depression and suic of prevention also as
well as like paying attention to the people that you're
(44:18):
in community with.
Speaker 2 (44:19):
That's exactly what I was going to say, is to
have the people around you that not necessarily you're the
center of their attention or whatever, but that they're paying attention.
They can see even even with you being a Richmond
b being in Norfolk and Mark being where he's at
an hour behind us, even through texts, I know y'all
(44:43):
well enough to note I can sometimes tell and they'll
they'll tell you. I'm like, dude, what's wrong, what's going on?
What do you mean? So it's one of those if
you've gone through it, you can see it in others
a lot of times once you realize that you've gone
through things, and that's that's what of the reasons why
I tried to step up for you, because I had
already gone through all that. I knew what you were
(45:05):
going through and a lot of people don't, so to
have that kind of foresight of what's happening, I just
wanted to make sure I was there to help you.
Speaker 4 (45:16):
You know, you talked about communities and cosplay is either
the most toxic or your best friend. And I know,
at least with my friend, with some of my friends,
just with some of the stuff I've been dealing with,
Like we went to the Renaissance Fairy yesterday and one
(45:38):
of them mentioned that my demeanor was completely different and
how I got out of costume and was quiet. That's
like one of the main things. If I stopped talking,
something's going on. But like for the fact that they
said nothing and waited until the of the day when
(46:01):
it was just us and not the rest of the
group to be like, I need to know what's going on.
That was really powerful.
Speaker 7 (46:08):
But you know, with without people and without a good community,
like they're just things would just build and build and
build until explosion.
Speaker 1 (46:20):
And it's it's also hard to find that right one,
because I want to make a statement and I want
everyone to hear my heart in it. Just because you
have friends doesn't necessarily mean you as a community. Like
I can have people that I talk to and then
I pick up on on a daily basis, Like I mean, Smash,
(46:43):
you reached out during Erica's hospitalization. We talked, you know,
we talked off and on for a couple of weeks,
like you know. But it's one of those things that
it's like, I'm very appreciative of that, and I have, like,
I have friends that are like like that at like
you and Billy, and I.
Speaker 3 (47:01):
Also have other people that.
Speaker 1 (47:04):
I could go five six years without talking to them
and we just pick it up like you know nothing.
And again, those are those are people that, like I
would I would still call friends, you know, but the
people that are in the thick with you, that are
daring to be in the trenches and that are willing
to look that close because to your point, Smash, not
(47:25):
everyone is going to study body language and be willing
to understand or pay attention enough to win those those
times happen. That's the sign of community. That is the
sign of people that truly care about your well being.
Speaker 2 (47:44):
Yeah, And I mean it's not necessarily studying body language though,
because I could say that with you, Josh. I never
sat there and just stared at you across the room
paid attention.
Speaker 3 (47:53):
He's got banopular, just a little bit of lotion.
Speaker 4 (47:57):
I got.
Speaker 2 (48:00):
But no, it's it's more of a just take care
enough to pay attention. Like you said earlier, paying attention
and like studying is two different things. To be. Studying
means I'm tentatively trying to pay attention to where paying
attention because I care is a different reason. It's hey,
i'm watching. I could see the little signs even though
(48:20):
I don't I'm not specifically looking for it. Yeah, Like,
for instance, her example, I would have maybe pulled her
aside earlier in the day, and you know I would
have done that more of a not do it in
front of everybody, but pull you aside and say, hey,
what's going on? What do we need to fix? What's
you know, what's happening. I'm the type I don't want
(48:43):
to do it in front of everybody, but at the
same time, I don't want to wait till the end
of the day where your day is ruined at something
that's ten o'clock in the morning. We're leaving at five
in the afternoon, and you didn't have any fun.
Speaker 1 (48:54):
Yeah, you know, she could have like pulled you aside
and be like, I need help carrying one of these
large ass turkeys, like really would be like, you look hungry,
let's go get a turkey lake.
Speaker 3 (49:08):
Hey.
Speaker 4 (49:09):
I mean she tried, She did try. She she asked
multiple times, please let's go eat something. And I finally
caved into Hawaiian ice in the middle of the day. Nice,
but that was like the small victory, and she was like,
all right, small victory, let it go till the end
(49:31):
because she knew. She also knew if she pushed me,
I would probably cry.
Speaker 2 (49:35):
Well, that's the other thing. It's either when you push somebody,
it depends on that person. You're either going to piss
them off, make them cry, or make them avoid you
the rest of the day.
Speaker 3 (49:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (49:45):
So it is that that is that balance of like
you know, being there for someone, but also at the
same time, like kind of having the knowledge in the
foresight to like also know their limitations and know you know,
if I say this, is it going to actually do harm?
Speaker 3 (50:07):
Is it going to do good?
Speaker 1 (50:09):
Or is it going to end up making the situation worse,
And that's that's kind of the The other thing too,
is that, like you know, sometimes people aren't ready to
talk about their feelings, and sometimes people just need to
be in the vicinity of other people, you know.
Speaker 2 (50:25):
But the point I'm gonna make though, is even though
they kept pushing, even if they would ask once or twice,
you knew they were there at that point waiting on you.
Whereas if somebody didn't step up, it's like you're there
about yourself. Goes back to the isolation thing with Jaws.
Speaker 4 (50:42):
So yeah, well, and you know we talked about like
hiding emotions and stuff and or avoidance of people, Like
I know, it's like the simplest of lines and Jaws,
but it's they are actively trying to put a barrel
on brute and Brodie's wife calls and Quinn.
Speaker 8 (51:05):
Goes, yeah, we're just catching a couple of Marlin's out here.
Looks like Brody caught a bid, going okay, he'll be
home for dinner. See ye bye, I gotta go, And
that would have been the last time a she ever
heard from Quint again.
Speaker 4 (51:18):
But like they're literally.
Speaker 9 (51:21):
Facing off a fifteen foot beast, and he's like hiding
the seriousness of the matter, which could go back to
the small town mentality as well.
Speaker 3 (51:34):
Well.
Speaker 2 (51:34):
It could also go back because I watched I've watched
a couple of shows lately that have done this. It
could go back to he may not have cared, but
a lot of people, if they care, they may hide
that so it doesn't scare the other person because there's
nothing they can do. And then Miles and Miles Nautic
go away from the island from the island, so it
(51:58):
could have been look, I'm not going to make her worry,
let's just get this done.
Speaker 1 (52:02):
That also too, could have been a a male thing.
You know, not to pull that card, but men have
a really hard time talking about our emotions, you know,
whereas uh, you know, the argument is often made times
where you know, if you show your emotions then you
(52:24):
know your you're viewed as weak, or if you talk,
you know, about your feelings then like you're belittled because
of it.
Speaker 3 (52:30):
It's like fuck that noise, man, like open up and
talk about it.
Speaker 1 (52:35):
And that to me like that See in particular, that's
what I kind of read that as is like mixture
of whatever, you guys, you know, everything you guys have
said so far. But like also the fact that like
this is like this is a guy like you know,
like you talk about like you can.
Speaker 3 (52:51):
See that there's like.
Speaker 1 (52:55):
It really and it feels almost kind of like Brodie
really doesn't open up about some of the things that
he's dealing with until like alcohol is introduced. Like that's
the other thing too that he kind of feels like
it's that's when his guards kind of let down.
Speaker 2 (53:13):
Yeah, and in the scene you're talking about where they
did the scars and all that stuff where they were drinking,
that's the scene that Quinn was actually drunk filming it.
I mean it was in if I remember right, it
was pretty cool. Yeah, in special credits and all that.
It's like that was just crazy that he was drunk
(53:34):
filming that scene. So it fit perfect because that's the
way he was actually acting.
Speaker 4 (53:39):
Reminds me of that go ahead, spach oh, I was
just gonna say, I didn't know that, but it's incredible
because like the way he retells, I'm okay, so I'm
a little nerd. I'm gonna show you all this real quick,
but I made bad ribbons and it has the quote
that he's talking about the Indianapolis. Because there's so much
(54:00):
emotion in that one scene. I cry. I know Jaws
is a whrror. I cry every time he talks about
the Indianapolis because he talks about how many went in
the water and how many came out, and it's insanity.
Speaker 1 (54:17):
Yeah, I was gonna say that this is completely random,
but knowing that he was drunk during that scene reminds
me of that. There's a scene where in Birdman where
they're doing the dress rehearsal and Edward Norton's character was
a method actor and so he gets like plaster drunk
before they do.
Speaker 3 (54:37):
The read throughs, and God, got it.
Speaker 1 (54:42):
I'd have been fun directing that that scene for him.
That's all I will say.
Speaker 2 (54:48):
I just wish I was there to see the Mechanical
Shark for this. Honestly, that that was the start of
the movie. The just I'd want to see Bruce.
Speaker 3 (54:58):
I've seen so.
Speaker 4 (55:01):
I've learned so much about that mechanical Shark. Wait, because
I did. I did a Jaws panel at a convention
or it was a soap box, which was really me
getting to sit in a bar and talk about why
Jaws is the best movie ever and celebrating fifty years.
So I did all this extensive research into everything, and
(55:24):
like apparently at one point there was like like any
when they first put it in salt water, it instantly
broke down, like the salt fried the mechanics and like
like just like all the crazy stuff that happened was
(55:44):
just crazy. And then I thought they used I thought
Chrissy was acting at the beginning, and then I thought, oh,
maybe they used the mechanical shark. No, it was a person.
There was a person pulling her under there scuba.
Speaker 1 (56:01):
God to be the person that had that job, it's crazy.
I'm also curious. I have two questions for you, being
a super Josspan. I want to know if you know,
so the actress that plays Chrissy, that has had that
moment im mortalized in so much of pop culture, how
(56:26):
much was she actually like paid for her likeness to
like have that on the image where like you have
her and then Brewster.
Speaker 4 (56:37):
I have no, I have no idea, but I do
know she just recently passed away, so we can't really
ask her if we don't know the answer.
Speaker 3 (56:46):
That's true.
Speaker 1 (56:47):
My second question is how big in terms of model,
I don't know if you know this or not. How
big is the model that was the tiger shark that
they found that was the false alarm in the movie
compared to Bruce.
Speaker 4 (57:03):
I don't know, but I would say based on estimations,
what they used in the movie looked to be about
eight to ten feet. And I know the actual mechanical
shark because it's only the half of it. Bruce was
only like measured at like eight or like, like he's
supposed to be fifteen feet, which fun fact, male great
(57:28):
white sharks at a maximum hit eleven feet. So if
they're saying that shark was fifteen feet, it's a mama shark.
It is a female shark, probably pregnant female shark. Just
to add the actual like science to this, But I
know somewhere in Martha's vineyard they have the tiger shark
(57:51):
on display, like the actual model of that tiger shark,
which probably would be like eleven feet. Even tiger sharks
don't really get that big in real life, so like
the whole sizing is so wrong on everything, and like
also tiger sharks would never be found in cold coastal
(58:15):
waters like ever, so the fact that you're going after
a great white and a tiger and then you catch
a tiger shark in the area. It's just not it's
not actually, I'm not saying it doesn't happen. There are
some times where something weird happens, but it's just very
(58:39):
very strange interesting. Okay, Yeah, but I do know that
they pulled I know Spielberg pulled the actual shark attacks
that happened in New Jersey in uh it was either
like nineteen oh eight or nineteen.
Speaker 2 (58:59):
O twll twelve it was twelve twelve.
Speaker 4 (59:03):
Yeah, but I know they and like that is what
most of this is based off of. Well, Peter Binchley's
book too.
Speaker 2 (59:10):
I was going to say you it was out of
the book? Was it not about those early shark attacks.
That's what he kind of based it off of. So
it's not a true story, but it's loosely based off
of all of that.
Speaker 3 (59:21):
I mean, you could say the same about the Exorcists,
So yeah.
Speaker 4 (59:24):
Yeah you can. But I don't know if that really
answered your question.
Speaker 1 (59:31):
Maybe I just have like two specific of like questions,
And like when someone tells me they're a super like
super nerd about something, I'm like all right, what is
the square root of an Isoceles trying kind of approach.
Speaker 4 (59:44):
My My expertise is more on like the I guess
I did it memories, so I remember a lot of
the quotes.
Speaker 8 (59:52):
I remember a lot of the.
Speaker 4 (59:55):
I'm also an EmPATH and I have synesthesia. So not
only am I feeling the emotions that are going on
in the movie because it's John Williams, I see colors
when the music plays.
Speaker 3 (01:00:09):
Yeah, what is uh?
Speaker 1 (01:00:10):
So this is this last thing? I will ask if
we could we can we can call it a night.
What is the craziest or coolest thing that you learned
for the panel?
Speaker 4 (01:00:20):
Like learned for it versus learned at it either or Okay,
the coolest I'm trying to think there were so many.
There's so many cool things, though, and we didn't even
talk about half of them. We ended up talking about
everyone's favorite shark in their favorite scene in the movie.
(01:00:45):
I guess the only thing that I really this is
not nice though. I learned that Richard Dreyfus is a
really really really terrible personal life. And it made me
completely think about how like all of Hooper's mannerisms and
(01:01:10):
everything like that, And I'm like, oh, it's like toned down, dryfuss,
which so I guess that's not really the I consider
that cool to learn, like.
Speaker 1 (01:01:22):
Okay, like yeah, which is ironic considering the fact to
Billy's point that Spielberg followed this movie up with Close
Encounters of the Third Kind re teamed with Trifus.
Speaker 3 (01:01:35):
Yeah, so kind of ironic.
Speaker 1 (01:01:40):
All right, well, I think it's gonna do it for us.
On this episode of Abyscazing Smash where can people find
you online?
Speaker 4 (01:01:49):
It's Smashed b cosplay across TikTok, Facebook, Instagram, Discord, twitch watch.
Speaker 1 (01:01:57):
All right, and you guys, you guys can find Mark
here every Wednesday except for today at six pm Eastern
Standard time. Wherever you guys get your podcasts from. Just
look at Abisgazing. Billy hit us with the greatest social
media on the internet.
Speaker 2 (01:02:11):
It's Letterbox and I'm at v A Boy ninety nine.
Speaker 1 (01:02:15):
I'm at Captain Nostalgia and you guys can check us
out over there. And I also just did a series
for Mission Possible for the main victims and villains. Feed
Dan and I talked about all eight movies, so go
check that out as well. See what my my spicy
hot takes are on Tom Cruise and his stunt work
(01:02:39):
until next I remember the logger you gazed into the abyss.
The more the abyss gazes back into you.
Welcome to a biscase again, or podcast where we celebrate
all things spooky and mental health.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
This is Billy and we might need a bigger vote.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
I'm your other girl host, Josh Ed.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
I am weird with or without Mark, so I'm joined
by one of my weird friends on this episode, Smash
from a Last Player.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
Hello, Yes, Hi, how are you.
Speaker 4 (00:35):
I'm very excited to talk about my all time favorite
movie in the world.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
We are talking about nineteen seventy five's Jaws that dropped
celebrate fifty years this year, So I am kind of
curious about this for you and you as well, Billy,
But like, what is it about this movie that renders
it to be like the number one movie for you?
Speaker 2 (01:05):
I'll let her go first.
Speaker 4 (01:07):
Okay, backstory, I first was shown Jaws when I was
like five years old at the beach of course, so
that already in my mind was like, cool, we're gonna
show a scary movie to a kid this early. We
do it with my kids too, but for me, like
(01:33):
it's a The score is done by John Williams. B
is the Steven Spielberg movie. And then when you look
at like the actual statistics, this was the highest grossing
movie until nineteen seventy seven when it got knocked out by.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Star Wars.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
Something. Wow, that's not surprising.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
So for me, I live in the Virginia Each area,
so I mean, need I say water. I mean they
started haberboard shark attacks lately, but when I was younger,
it wasn't that common. But the fact that you know,
I live in an area that's got an ocean front
to it, that's a big tourist thing that this could
(02:19):
actually happen, so that one of the big things.
Speaker 4 (02:24):
Virginia Beach has had great whites tracked through there and
through like the Chesapeake. So like y'all are right.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
In the zone.
Speaker 5 (02:32):
Yeah, Gray, As the years of I've learned this because
I was always curious as the years have gone on,
especially since this movie was shot.
Speaker 2 (02:43):
But the water is getting warmer. It drove it drives
them more to the area.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
Very re assuring. Thank you for giving me.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
Will you come back down to visit you want to
go swimming?
Speaker 1 (02:59):
I I'm okay, And I am probably the only person
on this phone, on this podcast and maybe maybe in
existence that found this movie because of finding Emo.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
So, uh, Bruce Fridge not food.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
Bruce when Finding Nemo came out.
Speaker 3 (03:23):
I was twelve and my sister and I loved that movie.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
And remember watching a behind the scenes documentary of or futurette.
They were talking about how Bruce the Shark was named
after Jaws, and I was like, oh, I got to
see this movie. And I was like, for a twelve
year old Josh, he was not impressed by this movie.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
But adult Josh loves this movie.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
And this is this is a summer staple that we
watch every year now.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
So well, I mean the other with this movie, not
necessarily the movie itself, but I saw something about the
ride when they were first building it. Did you hear
about that? They they had people working on it and
something happened the night before. They didn't realize that the
people actually died. They're floating in the water. Oh and
(04:17):
they hear about that, the bodies floating in there, and
they started running the ride while the bodies were still
in there.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
The uh. The only reference for any Jaws ride that
I have on this movie would be the universal like
back Loot Tour. I've heard people like to kind of
talk about it and kind of talk about like what's
involved in it, and so like that's like the only
(04:47):
like reference to this one I got. And back to
the future too, you know where they made Jaws nineteen Yeah,
which we'll be covering apparently very soon.
Speaker 4 (05:00):
There's also a Jaws Broadway show now, so it's okay.
But what's really funny is the guy who's Quint, his
son plays him in the show, and the show is
called The Shark Is Broken, and it's all about everything
that went wrong during the shoot of the movie.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
Okay, I was.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
I was like for a second, I was like, how
does Jaws translate to a stage play?
Speaker 3 (05:31):
But that the making of makes a lot more sense.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Yeah, I mean, and during the making of it, it's rumored,
or a lot of it is not even speculated anymore,
that they were drunk the whole time. A lot of
people were drinking really heavily while they were filming it.
Some of the scenes they were still drunk while they
were shooting it.
Speaker 4 (05:53):
Checks I believe it.
Speaker 1 (05:57):
One of the things that this we talked about last
episode about how Halloween was this like pioneer for the
horror genre, and specifically when you look at the kind
of what people often refer to as the Golden Age
of horror, it's boils down to three things, and I
will probably get these wrong, but it's boobs, bad decisions,
(06:19):
and body count.
Speaker 3 (06:21):
I think so.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
Mark might disagree with me on that one, but those
are typically the three we've been we've been talking more
increasingly about, like sex within the genre, from Underworld to
this one, and this one kind of almost the opening.
It's never kind of dawned on me, the fact that
(06:45):
you're following a couple that's literally leaving a party to
go off skinny dip and have sex, and it's such
an incredible opening. But specifically, what I think it reason
why it's worth being kind of talking about being a
pioneer for the genre in terms of sex and you know, violence,
(07:07):
and what we would kind of later see in a
slasher the slasher boom of the nineteen eighties is that
this is kind of one that predates it. You know,
we see we would see it later in Countless Friday,
the Thirteenth movies, a little bit of Nightmare on Elm Street.
Halloween sequels would definitely have that it was primarily in
(07:27):
the horror of the slasher genre. But I mean, I
think you could also make the argument here that this
was really one of the first films in the horror
genre to kind of do that.
Speaker 4 (07:39):
I think it's the top film in the horror genre
from the start, just like cinematically and when you look
at everything, like just the way the movie is made,
like not the behind the scenes stuff, but like the
actual like frame by frame and how they did everything
(08:00):
on like the two biggest fears that humans have, which
is fear of the unknown yep, and fear of isolation,
and that is the entire like from first scene of
the movie to the last scene, like that is the
entire time.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
I would also say that fear of death is probably
worth it mentioning in that because I mean that kind
of runs parallel here. There are there are so many
great scenes that kind of explore that where man, the
little boy who's the Kittner boy gets killed, and you
(08:41):
have that great scene after they find the tiger shark
where Missus Kittenner comes up to Brody and basically like
slaps him across the face.
Speaker 3 (08:49):
Is like, you know, look, we heard that you knew.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
This was a thing, and yet you chose to do it.
And one of the things that I think is really
fascinating about this is it's probably something that when I
watched this as a kid, I didn't really understand. But
now as an adult and now is somebody that runs
a small business but also a nonprofit, I kind of
(09:15):
have this vantage point of the mayor a little bit
more like, don't get me wrong, total piece of shit,
but you know, I kind of under feel like I
have a deeper understanding now of that internal battle of
you know, needing to keep the economy flowing, but also
(09:35):
at the same time keeping needing to you know, keep
that source of the economy going.
Speaker 3 (09:41):
Essentially.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
Yeah, it wasn't just the mayor though, I mean you
had the motel keeper, the everybody else in that meeting
stating well, how bad was it in asking all these
other questions, where on one side it's like, why is
this even a question? You've got somebody that's dead and
you're just gonna give the shark all kinds of more
food basically, and instead of going the route of being saved,
(10:07):
they're like, look, we need the money, or you know,
our town could try out.
Speaker 4 (10:12):
So you also have to look at like character development
and the way they created the characters. Chief Brodie is
coming in as a New York Police officer going to
this little tiny town, this little tiny island where if
you are not originally from the island, if you are
(10:33):
not a local, you would not know how situations are
just like swept under the rug.
Speaker 3 (10:41):
Yeah, I think you see that a little bit more
in small towns.
Speaker 1 (10:45):
Like I think it's like we talked about that a
lot in stories, but having lived in a small town,
there's a lot of topics that you just don't talk
about because they were stigmatized. You know, mental health is
a huge one, you know, being a a podcaster, you
know that's yeah, that we you know, specialize specifically in
(11:06):
kind of attempting to destigmatize that big one.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
That's that's that's a huge thing.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
And so it's not a huge surprise that you see
that practice kind of littered throughout the film.
Speaker 3 (11:17):
I never really kind of.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Looked at from a small town type of vantage point,
but I think it kind of adds this new layer
of depth to the movie that I didn't quite see before.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
On top of that, he's like, I hate to say
the outsider, but you know, the outsider. He's coming into
the small town. They're like you just got here, what
last year and everything, and you're trying to come in
and change rules. On top of that, he's he's trying to,
I guess, face his own fear because he had a
huge fear of drowning, yet he moved to an island.
(11:52):
That's part of his character development too, is he's facing
that fear on top of it because he is surrounded
by wank.
Speaker 4 (12:00):
It definitely has the best Well this is my opinion,
but like characters for horror movies at that time, like
they really give you in depth versus like I even
think about now, like with certain movies the characters aren't
fully fleshed out and you're not getting that backstory to
(12:20):
them first that you're like, oh my gosh, please just
go back to the monster, like I'd rather see the monster.
But like that's just me.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
I will say, I will fully commit to agreeing with
you because I don't love this movie nearly as much
as you do. But I definitely think that this is
one of them the pioneers and showing the capabilities of
what storytelling could be in the horror genre, you know,
because this was kind of kind of stood outside of
(12:53):
you know, not necessarily being as over the top and
kind of campy as like Godzilla was, but it's not
necessarily also as deadly as you know, slashers that would
later kind of give way in the you know, next
(13:14):
three to five years following this, This was kind of
something that really stood out as being really unique within
the genre to where it was a little bit part
creature feature. You had a little bit of comedy in.
Speaker 3 (13:25):
It, you had a little bit of.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
Psychological thriller in it, you had a little bit of
a drama in it. It just kind of fits like
it was in something for everyone kind of films, And
you know, I think again it's one of those films
that showcases really what the capability of a genre piccher
(13:49):
could be. And you know, I will also agree not
to that to sound like the old man yelling at
the clouds, but they don't. They don't really make movies
like this anymore, or if they do, they don't really
kind of get after.
Speaker 3 (14:05):
To this level.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Like I feel like, you know, not to say that
we don't get more modern day entries into it, Like
I think Jordan Peel's really good at doing character development,
os Good Perkins.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
Is really good at it.
Speaker 1 (14:20):
But it just kind of feels like a lot of
the you know, sometimes we're just worried about body count
and how people can die. You know, that's kind of
like the main focus we want, and a movie like
Jaws reminds us that, like no, you can have these
really deep film deep themes.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
That are dealing with.
Speaker 1 (14:42):
You know, Mark Billy, he brought it up earlier saying,
like you know, him trying to overcome the fear of drowning.
But also at the same time, you can also have
these things where you know, we are kind of going
over these these themes of isolation, you know, and the
(15:02):
fear of the unknown, and you know, really being daring
to be vulnerable enough to actually participate in a conversation
about it, not just continue to sweep it under the rug.
If you were someone you know is listening to this
podcast right now and you're struggling with suicide, addiction, self harm,
or depression, we encourage you guys to please reach out.
(15:24):
This is the heartbeat or why.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
We do what we do.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
Suicide is currently the tenth leading cause of death in
the United States, and as of this recording, there are
one hundred and thirty two suicides that take place each
and every day on American soil, and when you scale
back internationally, there are eight hundred thousand successful suicides. That
is one death roughly every forty seconds. So if you
(15:49):
were someone you know was struggling, you guys can go
to Victims and Films dot net ford slash hope. That
resource is going to be right in the description where
ever you guys are currently listening or streaming this, There
you'll find resources that include the National Suicide Lifeline, which
is one eight hundred two seven three eighty two fifty five.
You can also text help to seven four one seven
(16:11):
four one. Also have a plethora of other resources including churches,
getting connected with counselors, LGBT resources like the Trevor Project,
and also a veteran the hotline as well.
Speaker 3 (16:26):
Please, if you.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
Hear nothing else in the show, understand that you, yes,
you listening to this right now, have value and worth.
Speaker 3 (16:36):
We get it.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
Suicide, depression, mental health. These are hard topics and this
stigma around them doesn't make it any easier. But please
consider the resources right in the descriptions below wherever you
guys are listening, because once again, you have value and
you have worth, so please stay with us.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
Yeah, no, definitely, I mean like you've already hit it
several times. There's a bunch of mental health in this. Uh,
I mean just I can't pronounce it, but the fear
of sharks is a big one for a lot of people. Yeah,
and I mean this whole movie is just the whole thing.
Speaker 1 (17:13):
So which I mean to like, to the credit of
Steven Spielberg, I don't think that you would have a
fear like this if it wasn't after be because I
mean when you read about films that had this type
of impact, like it was This and The Exorcist, like
those were like the two like tent pole films of
(17:36):
the decade that had this profound effect on people to
where people were like I've read stories about people after
seeing this movie were afraid to take a bath or
even a shower, like anything.
Speaker 3 (17:51):
Where like water could do it.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
Now, like I've seen like Australia movies and like clips
where like you got alligators coming up through like the
whole or like spider spiders or freaking snakes coming up
the toilet, and I'm like, no, that would terrify me.
But Sharks seems like a now by today's standards, seems
like a little bit outlandish. But a little snake in
(18:15):
the pooper, Nope.
Speaker 4 (18:17):
What's crazy is I still think Jaws holds up today.
And what's even crazier is the movie is one hundred
and twenty four minutes long. You only see the killer
on screen for four minutes. The shark is on screen
for four minutes. That's crazy to me, Like that is
(18:37):
such a cool feat to have, and it still scares
people today.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
I mean, like Billy said, like earlier in the podcast,
like the fact that, like you know, we're starting to
see more and more of these, Like that's terrifying, Like
because a part of it that like when you go
to something like the ocean, you expect this like sense
of safety, right you expect there to be this like
sense of it's gonna be okay if I go swimming here,
(19:08):
Like there's not gonna be any sharks. So I'm sure
you might get things like jellyfish or crabs that might
sting and pinch and prod, but like shark attacks, like
come on, it's seek to see that.
Speaker 3 (19:21):
I see.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
I feel like you're getting more and more of those
now kind of as we climate change is a real thing, we.
Speaker 4 (19:30):
Also just have access to more. It's getting reported more.
Like there's always been stuff that happened. I will say,
I don't know if I agree on the whole the
ocean is safe aspects because I look at it as
I'm a land mammal. I am going into a water
mammal domain. So like I am fully always aware now again,
(19:54):
because I grew up going to the beach every summer,
we were around sandbar sharks and sand and tiger sharks,
and we'd also go into the estuaries and do the
shark tagging of the pups. So those were bull sharks
and scallop heads. So like for me, I'm always like, Okay,
if I'm getting in here, like I'm in their domain,
(20:16):
they can eat me. I understand.
Speaker 1 (20:19):
Let me let me paraphrase what I mean when I
say the ocean is safe, because what's it like? The
statistics is like we only know like what the ocean
is like. It's something crazy like that. Basically, if I
can have ocean water up to my collar bone, that
(20:41):
is the safety that I'm talking about. I'm not going
in any past then Nope, Nope. That's that's the reason
why I will go swim in a pool.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
But what's crazy is that's deep enough for some of
the sharks yep.
Speaker 4 (20:56):
And some of the sharks are shindy. Yeah, like, and
if they get caught in the surf, like, you're screwed, dude. Like,
it doesn't matter unless you get a really really big
short beach, like, you're not safe.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
We're gonna get it to where Josh is never gonna
go swimming in.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
I will stick to I will stick to pools where
it is safe.
Speaker 2 (21:21):
Yep.
Speaker 3 (21:23):
Stick to pools they were, they're safe. Yep. I don't.
Speaker 1 (21:27):
I don't need to think about any type of weird
concoction that final destination could come up.
Speaker 3 (21:35):
We won't be covered later.
Speaker 2 (21:43):
And it's funny to think that from Jaws, Spielberg went
to what was it Close Encounters as what?
Speaker 1 (21:52):
Yeah, I watched that movie.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
And he turned down Jaws two. At least that's what
I read somewhere.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
I'm kind of curious about this Saws to the second movie.
Speaker 4 (22:06):
Yes, okay, well that makes sense why the rest stuck?
Speaker 2 (22:10):
So yeah?
Speaker 1 (22:11):
Well okay, so here is the other thing about uh,
these movies. So I I'm just gonna pull a card
from Mark and say that none of those sequels exists.
Speaker 3 (22:24):
They've they've never exist.
Speaker 2 (22:26):
I agree with you one d percent.
Speaker 1 (22:30):
Because This is one of those movies that you don't
need sequels too. Like, granted, I understand like why there
are sequels to this movie. It made a butt ton
of money. I understand that from like a financial perspective,
But this movie stands alone so well.
Speaker 3 (22:46):
We talked about we talked about it.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
It's it's opening and how well this film has one
of the greatest endings in cinematic history, Like how do
you kind of just top top something like this? Just
seems very very baffling to me, And the fact that
they got progressively worse from what I've read, is just
(23:10):
very sad. But they you know, maybe they would have
inspired Sharknado, so maybe maybe maybe Spielburg can have write
that stone.
Speaker 4 (23:21):
It is important to remember this did come from a book.
It came from Peter Benchley's Jaws, so like they followed
that so closely that, like you said, there really never
should have been any other movies beyond this one.
Speaker 1 (23:39):
And I think it's if I remember correctly, Benchley hadn't
they hadn't even published the book yet, and they had
they had optioned it out, and Spielberg had gotten his
hands on it, because I believe if I remember correctly.
Benchley came out with the book in seventy four, this
movie came out seventy five.
Speaker 3 (24:00):
Right, It was very very close.
Speaker 4 (24:04):
Yeah, not many people had even heard of the book
before the movie. And then I guess somewhere at the
in credits somewhere it mentions Peter Benchley's book and it
mentioned him. But that, like, and then I think theater
everyone started, yeah, and then I think everything else started.
Speaker 2 (24:24):
Yeah. So you know, this movie took them one hundred
and fifty nine days to make, right.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
M Someone tells me that that that field doesn't feel
like enough time. But we were also slower back in
the seventies when it came to making movies.
Speaker 4 (24:40):
So, but they also like started and stopped a bunch
because she kept breaking.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
That's what I was going to say. They kept having
problems with Bruce the shark breaking and with other issues
like ocean conditions and all that made it take longer.
Speaker 1 (24:57):
Well, I mean, such you know, when you when you
make a film that is primarily working in faith with
the elements, I mean, you expect it as.
Speaker 3 (25:08):
Much a lot of this movie. I feel like what
makes this movie have such a lasting.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
Legacy is the fact that it feels natural, like the
fact that it takes place feels like Amy feels like
a place that is, you know, lived in.
Speaker 2 (25:28):
Yeah and.
Speaker 1 (25:31):
Yeah, uh, you know it feels it feels like it's
lived in, and you know everyone kind of has that
small town charmed to us. We were talking about earlier,
where you know, the mayor at one point says, you know,
this is a summer town where we make summer dollars.
Speaker 3 (25:46):
You know, so.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
Many of the people that live there rely on the
economy of those of that tourus of those things, and
you know, it's it's got to be like really hard.
It's kind of live in a town like that where
you kind of have three months. I guess it's probably
(26:07):
four or five months out of the year that like
kind of fund the remainder of the other seven months.
Speaker 4 (26:17):
I know, real world Island du Fusky, it's off of
South Carolina, they only had a certain amount of months
throughout the year you had to take a ferry in.
The only mode of transportation was bike or golf cart.
And when weather patterns it started to change and the
(26:40):
ocean got a little warmer, that area became a sharp
nursing ground. So all the tourism left, and I'm not
even sure they use it for anything more than like weddings.
At this point, no one gets in the water. You
can't swim. It's just now. I don't know if there
(27:02):
were ever any shark attacks that happened, but.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Like see, i'd be the crazy one. I don't want
to go to swim, but I'd like to go down
there just to see the sharks. I wouldn't get in
the water. Just let me see the sharks.
Speaker 3 (27:17):
I'm good, I'm all right. Just what we have aquariums for.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
Well, I mean I've been to the aquariums and all, but.
Speaker 3 (27:28):
Billy's like, nah, I need to wrestle one.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
We need we need to see.
Speaker 4 (27:34):
Free diving. You can always free dive. I've done that before.
It's a little scary without a cage, but not terrible.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
I don't know if I want to be in a
cage after this movie, right.
Speaker 4 (27:44):
That's what I'm saying. I'd rather free dive and swim
away like Hooper.
Speaker 1 (27:48):
Yeah, stuck in a.
Speaker 4 (27:49):
Cage and there are like that's that's actually happened in
like the last five years, where shark got stuck on
the top of the cage.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Yeah, yeah, nope, Josh you sure, I am.
Speaker 3 (28:09):
I am a okay with that.
Speaker 1 (28:13):
Yeah. So mental health in this movie, yeah, uh yeah,
we we kind of we We've kind of danced around
about a few of the topics in this one, but
isolation is one that I think you brought smash that
I think is really fascinating to look at through the
lens of But this one in particular, because there is
(28:36):
this small town mentality, and part of this thing that
comes along with small town mentalities is not only is
this literally an island, you know, out of away from
the population, but also you have that ice, that small
town mentality issue where if you are going through certain things,
(28:58):
they it feels more heavily bless you.
Speaker 3 (29:03):
I think.
Speaker 1 (29:05):
It feels stronger that sense of isolation because you feel
like you can't turn to someone or you feel like
you're a burden. I know when we moved to from
the small town we lived in to Virginia, there was
it took me probably about a year and a half
to get out of that mentality.
Speaker 2 (29:27):
You know.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
I think this movie kind of dicapsulates it so well,
especially with Chief Brody, because here you have a guy
that you know is literally has a fear of water,
you know, and he's kind of having to oversee it
and also fight off politics alongside shark attacks. And you know,
(29:50):
also kind of getting to see him grow was a
really good treat kind of at the end to see
he was ultimately the one that kind of brought him down.
But again, and you'd really never see him talk openly
about why he doesn't like water, and it's not until
he actually has the conversation that that dinner conversation where
(30:13):
his wife actually brings it up to Triface's character.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
Yeah, and with the isolation, it could be more than
just one person. It could be the town feeling the
isolation of why that's why they want to bring the
guests in because again with the money and all, they
feel isolated and everything separated, where bringing people in breaks
the isolation at least for a couple of months. On
top of that, being in a small town, you you
(30:40):
can worry about, Okay, I do say something to somebody,
how is this going to get around or what's everybody
gonna think? And and that play that can play a
huge factor in a small town or even just the
amongst a couple of groups of friends where you start
saying are they gonna look at me different or whatever?
I think that plays effect too.
Speaker 1 (31:01):
That's the other thing that like really sucks about being
in a small town is that there is that small
town that echo effect to where like if I was
to go to you, billy and say, hey, like, I'm
been really struggling with, you know, an addiction to you know,
video games or pills or you know, like put in
(31:24):
whatever thing you want to put in here. You know,
something like that like rocks a small town. It makes
or breaks families. And I think the other thing too
is that there's with small towns there is this routine mentality,
and I think you kind of get to see that
throughout the course of this where in the meeting where
(31:46):
Quinn announces that like, you know, hey, like I'll capture
for three three thousand, I'll kill it for ten, like
that whole entire seed.
Speaker 3 (31:53):
There's a moment early on where one of the.
Speaker 1 (31:57):
Townspeople asks Brody, like, hey, are you guys playing on
closing the beach? And he's like, just like this like
a little bit of a pause and he's like yes,
and you have the like there's like this uproar as
a result, and I think it's because you have these
this town that has been acquainted with doing something for
(32:19):
you know, a certain way for the better part of
you know, decades and if not generations, that's now being
challenged and now as being a Britain and so that
is another thing that you have to kind of also
battle against in a small town.
Speaker 2 (32:36):
Yeah, especially when you are outsider like like he was
to where you're trying to go against the grain and
then turn around and get blamed for the second shark
attack because he didn't shut down the beach because they
didn't want to.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (32:54):
When I think if you look at each individual character,
every single one of them faces isolation in one way
or another. I'm not going to go into the like
minor characters, but like I even think about like Alex
Kittner's mother is going through her entire grief in isolation
(33:14):
because she thought her son was the first person for
this to happen to and then finds out that Chrissy
was attacked and it wasn't a boating accident a week prior.
So you have you know her, you have Hooper who
comes in and is a know it all shark expert. Ye,
(33:37):
and he's from you know, the big city, so like
he has this mentality of like, oh my gosh, no
one understands me, Like he's calling in like I don't
need to go on holiday and look at sharks. I
have a big, great white here. And when I think
about that, you know, there's that aspect, there's Brody being
(33:58):
relatively new to the island not fully there. Then you
have you know, it's you can tell just by interactions.
The wife doesn't quite fit in yet, so she's isolated.
When you look at where the house is situated on
the island, even the house is isolated from the main
(34:20):
street and where most of the main people on the
board of directors for the businesses and the mayor, they're
all living inside that main street of town. But then
you also have like Quinn's isolation in the fact that
he has an obsession with sharks, whether whether they want
to admit it or not. When you look at his shack,
(34:43):
you can tell like he firmly believes their demons from
help and that is also why he's the main guy
to go for the sharks. But at the same time
he doesn't know anything about them, so like everyone is
isolated with the main three guys everyone's.
Speaker 6 (35:02):
Isolated until I would say that point where they're all
sharing their scars and then you get the backstory of
quint in the Indianapolis.
Speaker 4 (35:14):
Yeah, and then that leads into like fear of water.
Speaker 2 (35:20):
And I was going to say the other thing about this,
it does have it hits on kind of like at
the time it wouldn't have been, but kind of like bullying.
The fact that the sheriffs on the ship trying to
get are on the boat for the ferry trying to
get the kids out of the water at the very
beginning when they're like they're out there trying to get
their badges or whatever it was, and then they pull
(35:41):
the car on the ferry and corner him and get
the medical director or the medical examiner to change what
he said on the paperwork and make the sheriff change
exactly to match that. That's that's crazy.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
Yeah, which is a leak. I'm pretty sure.
Speaker 1 (36:01):
I don't know, but it sounds illegal.
Speaker 2 (36:07):
But but it's a small town, so it didn't matter.
Speaker 1 (36:11):
Yeah. I I'm happy for people that, you know, find
peace and find joy in small towns. I have not
had the greatest experience in small towns, so you know,
and I think a movie like Jaws kind of definitely
embodies what that is. Like, you know, Smash, you just
(36:31):
kind of went through this entire roster of characters that
we spend these two hours with and we just kind
of see how broken they really are. And I think
with especially with a town like Amity, it's really easy
to look and kind of get lost in the the
(36:52):
glitz and the glamour of you know, this being a
tourist spot, this being a you know, good place to
you know, raise kids and to visit, and you know,
all of these other things, but you kind of miss
out on really like, nah, this is a really like
fucked up place, like in the long the grand scheme
(37:13):
of things, and it's not even you know, Bruce just
happens to be like the icy or the cake. This
is kind of just what forces these people to kind
of essentially, for lack of a better word, like face
their own demons. And I think it's fascinating that the
scene that you brought up where they're all kind of
(37:33):
comparing scars is kind of a fascinating juxposition to have
against this because here you essentially have the outsiders of
this town that are kind of sharecase, sharing their own
stories about how this isn't just necessarily a isolated incident,
(37:53):
but this is something that's kind of like a common
occurrence throughout their entire existence as people. How would you
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(38:15):
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Speaker 3 (38:27):
And depression, and to get exclusive.
Speaker 1 (38:30):
Content that you can't get anywhere else. And you guys
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Speaker 3 (38:36):
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Speaker 1 (38:39):
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Speaker 4 (39:05):
I think one of the most powerful points to when
Brody realizes every single decision he's making in every single
action is being watched. Is when he's at the dinner
table with Sean dealing with the fact that he just
(39:27):
got a kid killed because he kept the beaches open
and Alex Kittner dies. But Sean is sitting at the
table copying everything his dad does, like rubbing his forehead
and Brody they're doing this, and Brody starts to recognize
and notice like, Okay, my sons are watching my actions.
(39:50):
The whole town is watching my actions. And he starts
to have to grapple with do I do what's right
and save everyone or do I go along with the
same small town mentality. And that I would say, that's
one of those like key mental health moments that I
(40:11):
like picked out in the movie.
Speaker 3 (40:15):
Is just like.
Speaker 4 (40:17):
A really clear moment of expression of you can really
see and feel what he's dealing with.
Speaker 1 (40:26):
Yes, That's one of the things that I think a
lot of people kind of miss on the conversation of
mental health is that mental health has these ways of
manifesting physically that you know, whether you want to address
a current issue that you are having or it's an
(40:52):
ongoing lingering process. It has this way of manifesting small things,
you know, whether it's you know, raise your hair because
of stress or I know sometimes when I had before
I wasn't therapy, I had like really bad anxiety attacks
and my right eye underneath would flutter really bad and
(41:19):
you can see it, and it was like, I've just
got to ignore this, you know, just kind of wipe
it away and hope that nobody notices. But you know,
it can lead to things like, you know, loss of appetite,
loss of sleep. You know, there's so many different physical
ailments that present themselves when it comes to you know,
(41:41):
having mental health issues and just kind of try to
push them down sooner or later they come to the surface.
Speaker 2 (41:49):
Yeah, And I mean you're saying lots of appetite. It
can also be the opposite. It could be that you
start eating a lot more and everything because you're trying
to hide stuff for here to press or something like that.
It could be to where you go into like shakes
without even realizing it, or anything else that you know physically,
(42:12):
but it could be stuff that you don't recognize that
other people start seeing in you or watching you. That
could be signs that you know you're struggling, And I.
Speaker 1 (42:25):
Mean that's the other thing too, is that like having
that goes into the conversation of having healthy community, that
goes into the conversation of making sure that you are
surrounding yourself with people that you know are rooting for
you and your mental health at the end of the day.
(42:45):
You know, I've I know, I've kind of talked about
it off and on since our return back in April,
But like dude, I I I.
Speaker 3 (42:54):
Don't know if I would still be here if it
wasn't for Billy.
Speaker 2 (42:59):
I do it again.
Speaker 1 (43:00):
You know, when everything kind of happened with Erica originally
like it was, it was it was hard, and.
Speaker 3 (43:08):
You know, it was really really hard to kind of endure.
Speaker 1 (43:12):
And kind of go through those things and face those feelings.
But again, it's one of those things of going through
it is like perseverance is gonna be the way that
you're gonna make it through to the other side and
be a stronger person because of it. And it comes
down to community, to people that a know what is
(43:35):
normal for you and what's not normal for you, What
is normal behavior and what's not normal behavior. So you know,
like if I was around you know, Billy and Mark
when we all live in different areas, like several hours apart.
So like if I knew that, you know, either one
of you guys ate three square meals a day and
(43:56):
you know, maybe walked a mile. Yeah, you know, had
a normal routine, and I started to see that routine
kind of dissipate. I know that there's something wrong. And
it's also about like a the importance of understanding the
warning signs for depression and suic of prevention also as
well as like paying attention to the people that you're
(44:18):
in community with.
Speaker 2 (44:19):
That's exactly what I was going to say, is to
have the people around you that not necessarily you're the
center of their attention or whatever, but that they're paying attention.
They can see even even with you being a Richmond
b being in Norfolk and Mark being where he's at
an hour behind us, even through texts, I know y'all
(44:43):
well enough to note I can sometimes tell and they'll
they'll tell you. I'm like, dude, what's wrong, what's going on?
What do you mean? So it's one of those if
you've gone through it, you can see it in others
a lot of times once you realize that you've gone
through things, and that's that's what of the reasons why
I tried to step up for you, because I had
already gone through all that. I knew what you were
(45:05):
going through and a lot of people don't, so to
have that kind of foresight of what's happening, I just
wanted to make sure I was there to help you.
Speaker 4 (45:16):
You know, you talked about communities and cosplay is either
the most toxic or your best friend. And I know,
at least with my friend, with some of my friends,
just with some of the stuff I've been dealing with,
Like we went to the Renaissance Fairy yesterday and one
(45:38):
of them mentioned that my demeanor was completely different and
how I got out of costume and was quiet. That's
like one of the main things. If I stopped talking,
something's going on. But like for the fact that they
said nothing and waited until the of the day when
(46:01):
it was just us and not the rest of the
group to be like, I need to know what's going on.
That was really powerful.
Speaker 7 (46:08):
But you know, with without people and without a good community,
like they're just things would just build and build and
build until explosion.
Speaker 1 (46:20):
And it's it's also hard to find that right one,
because I want to make a statement and I want
everyone to hear my heart in it. Just because you
have friends doesn't necessarily mean you as a community. Like
I can have people that I talk to and then
I pick up on on a daily basis, Like I mean, Smash,
(46:43):
you reached out during Erica's hospitalization. We talked, you know,
we talked off and on for a couple of weeks,
like you know. But it's one of those things that
it's like, I'm very appreciative of that, and I have, like,
I have friends that are like like that at like
you and Billy, and I.
Speaker 3 (47:01):
Also have other people that.
Speaker 1 (47:04):
I could go five six years without talking to them
and we just pick it up like you know nothing.
And again, those are those are people that, like I
would I would still call friends, you know, but the
people that are in the thick with you, that are
daring to be in the trenches and that are willing
to look that close because to your point, Smash, not
(47:25):
everyone is going to study body language and be willing
to understand or pay attention enough to win those those
times happen. That's the sign of community. That is the
sign of people that truly care about your well being.
Speaker 2 (47:44):
Yeah, And I mean it's not necessarily studying body language though,
because I could say that with you, Josh. I never
sat there and just stared at you across the room
paid attention.
Speaker 3 (47:53):
He's got banopular, just a little bit of lotion.
Speaker 4 (47:57):
I got.
Speaker 2 (48:00):
But no, it's it's more of a just take care
enough to pay attention. Like you said earlier, paying attention
and like studying is two different things. To be. Studying
means I'm tentatively trying to pay attention to where paying
attention because I care is a different reason. It's hey,
i'm watching. I could see the little signs even though
(48:20):
I don't I'm not specifically looking for it. Yeah, Like,
for instance, her example, I would have maybe pulled her
aside earlier in the day, and you know I would
have done that more of a not do it in
front of everybody, but pull you aside and say, hey,
what's going on? What do we need to fix? What's
you know, what's happening. I'm the type I don't want
(48:43):
to do it in front of everybody, but at the
same time, I don't want to wait till the end
of the day where your day is ruined at something
that's ten o'clock in the morning. We're leaving at five
in the afternoon, and you didn't have any fun.
Speaker 1 (48:54):
Yeah, you know, she could have like pulled you aside
and be like, I need help carrying one of these
large ass turkeys, like really would be like, you look hungry,
let's go get a turkey lake.
Speaker 3 (49:08):
Hey.
Speaker 4 (49:09):
I mean she tried, She did try. She she asked
multiple times, please let's go eat something. And I finally
caved into Hawaiian ice in the middle of the day. Nice,
but that was like the small victory, and she was like,
all right, small victory, let it go till the end
(49:31):
because she knew. She also knew if she pushed me,
I would probably cry.
Speaker 2 (49:35):
Well, that's the other thing. It's either when you push somebody,
it depends on that person. You're either going to piss
them off, make them cry, or make them avoid you
the rest of the day.
Speaker 3 (49:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (49:45):
So it is that that is that balance of like
you know, being there for someone, but also at the
same time, like kind of having the knowledge in the
foresight to like also know their limitations and know you know,
if I say this, is it going to actually do harm?
Speaker 3 (50:07):
Is it going to do good?
Speaker 1 (50:09):
Or is it going to end up making the situation worse,
And that's that's kind of the The other thing too,
is that, like you know, sometimes people aren't ready to
talk about their feelings, and sometimes people just need to
be in the vicinity of other people, you know.
Speaker 2 (50:25):
But the point I'm gonna make though, is even though
they kept pushing, even if they would ask once or twice,
you knew they were there at that point waiting on you.
Whereas if somebody didn't step up, it's like you're there
about yourself. Goes back to the isolation thing with Jaws.
Speaker 4 (50:42):
So yeah, well, and you know we talked about like
hiding emotions and stuff and or avoidance of people, Like
I know, it's like the simplest of lines and Jaws,
but it's they are actively trying to put a barrel
on brute and Brodie's wife calls and Quinn.
Speaker 8 (51:05):
Goes, yeah, we're just catching a couple of Marlin's out here.
Looks like Brody caught a bid, going okay, he'll be
home for dinner. See ye bye, I gotta go, And
that would have been the last time a she ever
heard from Quint again.
Speaker 4 (51:18):
But like they're literally.
Speaker 9 (51:21):
Facing off a fifteen foot beast, and he's like hiding
the seriousness of the matter, which could go back to
the small town mentality as well.
Speaker 3 (51:34):
Well.
Speaker 2 (51:34):
It could also go back because I watched I've watched
a couple of shows lately that have done this. It
could go back to he may not have cared, but
a lot of people, if they care, they may hide
that so it doesn't scare the other person because there's
nothing they can do. And then Miles and Miles Nautic
go away from the island from the island, so it
(51:58):
could have been look, I'm not going to make her worry,
let's just get this done.
Speaker 1 (52:02):
That also too, could have been a a male thing.
You know, not to pull that card, but men have
a really hard time talking about our emotions, you know,
whereas uh, you know, the argument is often made times
where you know, if you show your emotions then you
(52:24):
know your you're viewed as weak, or if you talk,
you know, about your feelings then like you're belittled because
of it.
Speaker 3 (52:30):
It's like fuck that noise, man, like open up and
talk about it.
Speaker 1 (52:35):
And that to me like that See in particular, that's
what I kind of read that as is like mixture
of whatever, you guys, you know, everything you guys have
said so far. But like also the fact that like
this is like this is a guy like you know,
like you talk about like you can.
Speaker 3 (52:51):
See that there's like.
Speaker 1 (52:55):
It really and it feels almost kind of like Brodie
really doesn't open up about some of the things that
he's dealing with until like alcohol is introduced. Like that's
the other thing too that he kind of feels like
it's that's when his guards kind of let down.
Speaker 2 (53:13):
Yeah, and in the scene you're talking about where they
did the scars and all that stuff where they were drinking,
that's the scene that Quinn was actually drunk filming it.
I mean it was in if I remember right, it
was pretty cool. Yeah, in special credits and all that.
It's like that was just crazy that he was drunk
(53:34):
filming that scene. So it fit perfect because that's the
way he was actually acting.
Speaker 4 (53:39):
Reminds me of that go ahead, spach oh, I was
just gonna say, I didn't know that, but it's incredible
because like the way he retells, I'm okay, so I'm
a little nerd. I'm gonna show you all this real quick,
but I made bad ribbons and it has the quote
that he's talking about the Indianapolis. Because there's so much
(54:00):
emotion in that one scene. I cry. I know Jaws
is a whrror. I cry every time he talks about
the Indianapolis because he talks about how many went in
the water and how many came out, and it's insanity.
Speaker 1 (54:17):
Yeah, I was gonna say that this is completely random,
but knowing that he was drunk during that scene reminds
me of that. There's a scene where in Birdman where
they're doing the dress rehearsal and Edward Norton's character was
a method actor and so he gets like plaster drunk
before they do.
Speaker 3 (54:37):
The read throughs, and God, got it.
Speaker 1 (54:42):
I'd have been fun directing that that scene for him.
That's all I will say.
Speaker 2 (54:48):
I just wish I was there to see the Mechanical
Shark for this. Honestly, that that was the start of
the movie. The just I'd want to see Bruce.
Speaker 3 (54:58):
I've seen so.
Speaker 4 (55:01):
I've learned so much about that mechanical Shark. Wait, because
I did. I did a Jaws panel at a convention
or it was a soap box, which was really me
getting to sit in a bar and talk about why
Jaws is the best movie ever and celebrating fifty years.
So I did all this extensive research into everything, and
(55:24):
like apparently at one point there was like like any
when they first put it in salt water, it instantly
broke down, like the salt fried the mechanics and like
like just like all the crazy stuff that happened was
(55:44):
just crazy. And then I thought they used I thought
Chrissy was acting at the beginning, and then I thought, oh,
maybe they used the mechanical shark. No, it was a person.
There was a person pulling her under there scuba.
Speaker 1 (56:01):
God to be the person that had that job, it's crazy.
I'm also curious. I have two questions for you, being
a super Josspan. I want to know if you know,
so the actress that plays Chrissy, that has had that
moment im mortalized in so much of pop culture, how
(56:26):
much was she actually like paid for her likeness to
like have that on the image where like you have
her and then Brewster.
Speaker 4 (56:37):
I have no, I have no idea, but I do
know she just recently passed away, so we can't really
ask her if we don't know the answer.
Speaker 3 (56:46):
That's true.
Speaker 1 (56:47):
My second question is how big in terms of model,
I don't know if you know this or not. How
big is the model that was the tiger shark that
they found that was the false alarm in the movie
compared to Bruce.
Speaker 4 (57:03):
I don't know, but I would say based on estimations,
what they used in the movie looked to be about
eight to ten feet. And I know the actual mechanical
shark because it's only the half of it. Bruce was
only like measured at like eight or like, like he's
supposed to be fifteen feet, which fun fact, male great
(57:28):
white sharks at a maximum hit eleven feet. So if
they're saying that shark was fifteen feet, it's a mama shark.
It is a female shark, probably pregnant female shark. Just
to add the actual like science to this, But I
know somewhere in Martha's vineyard they have the tiger shark
(57:51):
on display, like the actual model of that tiger shark,
which probably would be like eleven feet. Even tiger sharks
don't really get that big in real life, so like
the whole sizing is so wrong on everything, and like
also tiger sharks would never be found in cold coastal
(58:15):
waters like ever, so the fact that you're going after
a great white and a tiger and then you catch
a tiger shark in the area. It's just not it's
not actually, I'm not saying it doesn't happen. There are
some times where something weird happens, but it's just very
(58:39):
very strange interesting. Okay, Yeah, but I do know that
they pulled I know Spielberg pulled the actual shark attacks
that happened in New Jersey in uh it was either
like nineteen oh eight or nineteen.
Speaker 2 (58:59):
O twll twelve it was twelve twelve.
Speaker 4 (59:03):
Yeah, but I know they and like that is what
most of this is based off of. Well, Peter Binchley's
book too.
Speaker 2 (59:10):
I was going to say you it was out of
the book? Was it not about those early shark attacks.
That's what he kind of based it off of. So
it's not a true story, but it's loosely based off
of all of that.
Speaker 3 (59:21):
I mean, you could say the same about the Exorcists,
So yeah.
Speaker 4 (59:24):
Yeah you can. But I don't know if that really
answered your question.
Speaker 1 (59:31):
Maybe I just have like two specific of like questions,
And like when someone tells me they're a super like
super nerd about something, I'm like all right, what is
the square root of an Isoceles trying kind of approach.
Speaker 4 (59:44):
My My expertise is more on like the I guess
I did it memories, so I remember a lot of
the quotes.
Speaker 8 (59:52):
I remember a lot of the.
Speaker 4 (59:55):
I'm also an EmPATH and I have synesthesia. So not
only am I feeling the emotions that are going on
in the movie because it's John Williams, I see colors
when the music plays.
Speaker 3 (01:00:09):
Yeah, what is uh?
Speaker 1 (01:00:10):
So this is this last thing? I will ask if
we could we can we can call it a night.
What is the craziest or coolest thing that you learned
for the panel?
Speaker 4 (01:00:20):
Like learned for it versus learned at it either or Okay,
the coolest I'm trying to think there were so many.
There's so many cool things, though, and we didn't even
talk about half of them. We ended up talking about
everyone's favorite shark in their favorite scene in the movie.
(01:00:45):
I guess the only thing that I really this is
not nice though. I learned that Richard Dreyfus is a
really really really terrible personal life. And it made me
completely think about how like all of Hooper's mannerisms and
(01:01:10):
everything like that, And I'm like, oh, it's like toned down, dryfuss,
which so I guess that's not really the I consider
that cool to learn, like.
Speaker 1 (01:01:22):
Okay, like yeah, which is ironic considering the fact to
Billy's point that Spielberg followed this movie up with Close
Encounters of the Third Kind re teamed with Trifus.
Speaker 3 (01:01:35):
Yeah, so kind of ironic.
Speaker 1 (01:01:40):
All right, well, I think it's gonna do it for us.
On this episode of Abyscazing Smash where can people find
you online?
Speaker 4 (01:01:49):
It's Smashed b cosplay across TikTok, Facebook, Instagram, Discord, twitch watch.
Speaker 1 (01:01:57):
All right, and you guys, you guys can find Mark
here every Wednesday except for today at six pm Eastern
Standard time. Wherever you guys get your podcasts from. Just
look at Abisgazing. Billy hit us with the greatest social
media on the internet.
Speaker 2 (01:02:11):
It's Letterbox and I'm at v A Boy ninety nine.
Speaker 1 (01:02:15):
I'm at Captain Nostalgia and you guys can check us
out over there. And I also just did a series
for Mission Possible for the main victims and villains. Feed
Dan and I talked about all eight movies, so go
check that out as well. See what my my spicy
hot takes are on Tom Cruise and his stunt work
(01:02:39):
until next I remember the logger you gazed into the abyss.
The more the abyss gazes back into you.
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