Ep. 34: Hole in the Wall Getaway

Join Big Addison and Jesse Deubel as they discuss the history and magnificence of Columbus, NM and the vast public lands surrounding this quaint community. Today, most visitors to Columbus are there for a short stop while en route to Old Mexico. Situated just a few miles north of the port of entry to Palomas, MX visitors often stay on the US side of the border and walk over to Mexico for shopping, dining and reduced price medical care. The treasures of this region are plentiful and one of New Mexico's best kept secrets. A visit here wouldn't be complete without checking out Pancho Villa State Park. Jesse Deubel frequents the area because it offers some of the most exceptional quail hunting in the world. Complete with luxurious amenities and a welcoming attitude towards hunting dogs, the Hole in the Wall Getaway makes a perfect homebase for hunters. In addition to robust quail populations and a high concentration of javelina, the nearby Florida Mountains are home to gravity-defying persian ibex. The spectacular public lands around this region are rich with cultural sites and they deserve permanent protection. A National Monument designation would ensure that these areas remain pristine for future generations while simultaneously enhancing existing uses like hunting, hiking, regulated off-highway-vehicle adventures and cattle grazing. For more information about the benefits a national monument would provide, please visit www.protectmimbrespeaks.org . Enjoy the Listen!

For more info:
Hole in the wall getaway
Palomas
Columbus, NM
NWMF

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Hello everybody. Jesse Dubell here withthe AIVA Podcast. Really excited today to
be sitting down with a new friendof mine, a gentleman by the name
of Big Addison. Big Addison,you want to spend a minute introducing yourself
to our listeners. Well, yeah, good morning everybody, and Jesse,
thanks for the opportunity to talk toyou today. I certainly appreciate it.
The New Mexico Wildlife Federation presents theAHIVA Podcast. My name's Addison Bachmann.

(00:27):
I go buy Big Addison. Ihappen to be a big guy. Yeah.
I'm here in Columbus, New Mexico. It's one of those places on
the planet that everybody kind of knowsabout. And I'll tell you why they
know about it here in a while, But nobody really understands where Columbus is
or why it's so famous. Butbefore we get into that, basically,

(00:49):
you know, I'm from southern California, raisin bread out there. My uncle,
my mother's brother, in a lateeighties, he decided to move his
wood turning business, which was partof the family business, and then my
grandfather started out in Compton. Hedecided to move to Columbus and set up

(01:11):
the first Makila Dora over in Colomas, which is an American manufacturer that produces
in Mexico and then ships back intothe United States right to sell the product.
So that's why, and that's howthe family came here. So after
about a couple of years, hewas having some really good success and he

(01:33):
asked my mother to come out hereand help. And she was an accountant,
booker, booking person, bookkeeper bytrade, and so she came out
and she built a hotel here,a bed and breakfast called Martha's Place,
and so away they went for thirtyyears. Basically we were big fish in

(01:55):
a very small barrel. Columbus hasabout a thousand people maybe at the time
when they moved here, maybe seventeenhundred. And you know, they came
here, they had a little bitof money and started in businesses and the
way they went and they both weremayors in fact right now, my uncle's
Mary. He was just elected mayoragain. So you know, we got
a lot of got a lot ofskin in the game here in Columbus.

(02:17):
Right. So in two thousand andeight, after the wars and blah blah
blah, I came out here tohelp retire my mother. She was getting
up in age, couldn't walk upstairsanymore take care of the hotel, right,
So I came out here to helpretire her, and I did that
for eight years, and then shefinally sold the place to her brother,
my uncle Philip, who's the mayor, and now he's running it. And

(02:38):
so why are we here today becausekind of family tradition. You know,
I've been in the hospitality business allmy life, has been a lot of
things all my life, but thatwas one thing that I did, and
just carrying on the tradition of thehotel, I decided to turn my little
home here into a bed and breakfast. And that's how you found me,
and that's how we met here today. Yeah, this has been a great

(03:01):
time here in Luna County, Addisonand I had such an awesome experience with
this property. Do you want todescribe the property itself for our listeners they
can have an understanding of what thisreal unique lodging situation provides, because it's
pretty exceptional. Yeah. So,Columbus, the village of Columbus. You

(03:23):
can hardly even see it from here, but I'm actually in the village of
the city of the village of Columbus. They had to annex this place,
the property up here, so we'reway up top outside of the village.
Up up top, they had tobuild a new school and elementary school.
In order to do that, theyhad to annex all the land into the

(03:43):
village. So my area up heregot annexed all right about ten years ago.
So we're way away from the village. When you go outside here,
you can't even see it right.Alls you see is sunrises on one side
and the sunsets on the other end. You know, Mexico to uh to
the south. It's it's five milesaway from my house. At night,

(04:04):
it lights up, you can seeall the city lives. It's pretty.
It's called Colomus, Mexico. Anduh So I have this really unique property
and this really unique little village.I'm very, very lucky. Uh A
lot of people here don't live andhave this kind of you know, property
that I have. And it's youknow, it's just a little over an

(04:25):
acre, but for some reason,it just just has a great vibe and
and and it's kind of sprawling.It feels sprawling, and you know,
I work it every day. Imean, it's just become my zen to
take care of this property. Well, you know, it's just, uh,
it's really refreshing to wake up inthe morning and go out the front
door, look out the window andjust see a huge covey of Gamble's quail,

(04:45):
you know, making their way pickingaround, looking for looking for food.
And yeah, watch those interactions,and that's just what a great way
to start, you know, that'spart of it. You know. I
uh, honest, honest to god, I I didn't want. The last
place I ever wanted to go wasColumbus, New Mexico, you know.
I mean, I'm from southern California. I grew up going to the beach
every day, you know, fastcars and pretty girls and surfing. You

(05:06):
know. Last place I ever thoughtI'd end up was in the middle of
the desert, you know. Andby god, it's just beautiful and I've
really come to love it. Andyou're right, the animal life, the
quail, my favorite of the roadrunners. You know, they hang around
for generations. I got a familyhere that I've known for about ten years
and I feed them. We takesome raw Hamburger out there, and you

(05:26):
know, and they love it.And we have avelina and we've got you
know, the coyotes and all thatkind of stuff. And I'm fortunate also
that I have a block wall aroundthe house, so you know, I
have animals, dogs and they canrun around. I don't have to worry
about that kind of stuff. Andit's a it's just a good spot.
You know. I wake up tothe sunrise and I go to bed to
the sunset. It's like Hawaii,you know, got all the beach,

(05:47):
got all the sunsets, all thesun rises. I just don't have the
water. Yeah. Well, youknow, for a lot of our listeners,
they might not be familiar with withColumbus. You just said it was
five miles from the Mexico border,so we're roughly thirty miles south of Demming.
And I'm curious to hear how largeColumbus is, if you have an

(06:08):
idea population wise, And then alsoi'd like to hear you talk about the
way it's changed, if it hasover the years since you were first introduced
to it until today. Okay,well, now we're gonna have some fun,
because Columbus is it's just a crazyplace. I mean, you wouldn't
think in a million years that there'sanything going on in this town, right,

(06:29):
it's really small, Like I said, I think we're around one thousand
people. Most of the roads aredirt. We have the highway that goes
through town, and we have ourBroadway that is paved, and that's about
it. And it's the wild wildWest out here. You know, from
downtown you're a three mile drive togo to Mexico across the border. We
have a port of entry there.So Columbus. The interesting thing about Columbus

(06:54):
is this the name Ponsovia. Okay, the whole world know the name Poncevia.
You say that, and people knowthat name. They see it on
T shirts, they see on anadvertisers, they know Pontsvilla inside out.
But really nobody really knows why theyknow that name Ponservia. And the reason
is Columbus, New Mexico. Andthe crazy thing about it is that Columbus

(07:19):
has this really interesting connection with thenine to eleven attack in New York.
You're like, huh, yeah,I would have never guessed that, right,
So check this out. So priorto the nine to eleven attack in
New York, the last time onforeign army invaded the cotton in the United

(07:44):
States was by Pontshevilla in nineteen sixteenwhen he came into Columbus and attacked the
village and burnt a lot of itdown. That killed people, and a
lot of bad things went on thatday. A right, nobody ever talks
about nine eleven gets all the credit, but the fact is Columbus was the
last time before nine eleven that aforeign army invaded. Okay, So the

(08:09):
really interesting part is it's just,you know, this stuff is just it's
just crazy. But so if yougo downtown right now, if you leave
my house, you go down tothe highway to Highway eleven, and you
head into town. There's one intersectionin town. Okay, that intersection at
the corner on either side and oneside is the Old Railroad Museum. Because

(08:30):
at the time Columbus was the biggestcity in New Mexico. We had an
army base here. We had atrain that came from El Paso to deliver
all the goods to keep it goinghere, to keep the army you know,
supply blah blah blah. So atthe intersection is the Old Train Museum
and across the street, across thehighway is the Paservilla State Park. Right

(08:54):
that intersection is at highways nine eleven, nine and E. The exact spot
where Pontslovia attacked this place was atthe intersection of nine to eleven and so
into. You know, one hundredyears later nine to eleven happened by another
foreign army. It's just it's justa weird you know, yeah, analogy,

(09:16):
but that's it's the truth. Andso that's why Poncelovilla is famous.
Okay, that's why you know thename. This is where it happened.
So if you're a history buff andyou love the military, by god,
you need to come down here andspend a day or two. Because the
fact is Columbus is where the airForce started. This is the home of
the United States Air Force. Thefirst time the airplanes were ever used in

(09:39):
a military operation that they used togo after Pontsovia, right by General Blackjack
Pershing, all right. And notonly was the first use of the airplane,
it was called the Jenny, theJenny airplane. I don't know if
you know anything about stamp collecting,but the most valuable staff in the war

(10:00):
old has been at one time isthe upside down Jenny plane. Right,
the most valuable every stab click inthe world wants to get their hands on
that step all right, that's fromthe plane here in Columbus. The other
crazy thing is this was also thefirst time that tanks were used in military
service US military service. And guesswho they brought in as a young kid

(10:22):
to head up the tank command andhe guesses no, no, but I'm
fascinated to hear about it. Aguy by the name of George Patten.
Wow, this is where he started. He got his training on the tank.
And you gotta go down there tolook at what the tank is.
I mean, you wouldn't get nothingin a million years. I mean it's
just you know, but this iswhere George Patten got his start and went

(10:45):
on to you know, Germany andwent on and became the tank commander of
all time. Right, yeah,well you know that The history here is
is I mean magnificent. And I'venot even scratched the surface, really,
and driving around Columbus for the lastfew days spending time here in the community,
I've passed punch of via State Park. I haven't stopped at the state
park, but I'm curious if youhave an idea as to how many people

(11:11):
annually might visit that particular park,and what other tourist attractions or what what
else attracts people from out of townto come and explore this place. Well,
you know, I have the nameof my little business here is called
the Hole in the Wall Getaway,And I start out on the website,
I say, right off the bat. You know, we all know there's
not a whole lot of good reasonsto come to Columbus, Okay, unless

(11:35):
you're a history buff, a rockcollector, a hunter. I mean,
you know, I'm there are thereare There are reasons that come here if
you have those things. So it'snot a big attraction, you know,
for the world, all right,but it is for those people that are
interested in those things. And I'mtelling you, if you love the military
and you love your history, youhave to come here. I mean,
you just this is this is thewhere a lot of it began, all

(11:56):
right. So anyway, I'm sorry. I wanted to say also about the
state park. You brought that up. It used to be very crowded.
Every year. Our hotel, thefamily the business you know, for thirty
years, just got tons of businessfrom all the people came to visit their
friends that were staying at the park, right, they needed a place to

(12:16):
stay while they were here. Butthe craziest thing about that park, going
back to nine to eleven is this. Imagine in New York City, at
the site of the nine to elevenbombing, the plane crashes, that they
decided to build a national park andname it Osama bin Laden National Park.

(12:39):
Wow, I mean, would theydo that? You wouldn't think so,
of course. But in Columbus wehave the Patsavilla State Park. They named
the state park after the guy whocame here and burned the place down instead
of General Blackjack Pershing or George Pattonor any number of people that are famous.

(13:00):
You know, we're made famous here. So that's the craziest thing ever.
I mean, I you know,I don't know how to defend that,
but what I will say is this, one hundred years later, we
all just get along. It's alljust past history to us. It's part
of our culture and we embrace itall. The wonderful thing about Columbus is

(13:22):
you know that we all do getalong, not only just the people in
the community, but also across theboard. In Colomas. You know,
we have the benefit of being ableto cross over and get all our medicines
or buy our eyeglasses and you know, get those medical service, the dentistry
and all that kind of stuff.And you know, a third of all
the prices you're paying, you know, on this side of the defense.
So that's a great that's a greatvalue and a good reason to come here.

(13:45):
And frankly, that's how my mother, you know, made a hotel
business for thirty years. People cominghere to get dentures. Yeah. Well
they had to have their teeth pulledand they needed a place to stay for
three or four days while their dentureswere made, right, And that's it.
That's what's going on down here.Yeah. Wow, Well, you
know I had the opportunity since I'vebeen down here to go spend some time
at the Pink Store and yeah Polomasand have lunch and just a great little

(14:09):
place to make up and some ofthe friendliest people you'll ever meet. It
was just really spectacular. But youmentioned that the state park used to be
packed. Yeah, you said thatin the past. Tense Has that changed
over time? It seemed to changesomewhere around like two thousand and fifteen,

(14:33):
twenty fourteen. Some are around thatarea. I don't know. I've never
been able to understand what changed,but it went from i mean, absolutely
being packed every winter to you know, being very sparse. I have noticed
the last couple of years that's pickingup again a little bit, so that's
good. I assume. I canonly assume that people are fearful for some
reason to come down here because ofthe border situation, and you know,

(14:56):
they hear things or whatnot. Butthe funniest thing about Columbus is we have
absolutely zero problems. We don't haveany of the issues that you see all
over the news, not a singleone. All right, nothing is happening
here. And my guess is thatit has to do with you know,
we have a wall that you godown to the border, and that wall
goes in both directions, all theway to Texas one way and all the

(15:18):
way to Arizona or the other.So I think that probably has a lot
to do with you know why whywe're just so peaceful and calm here,
and you know, we go overto Palmers, we don't even think twice
about it. We just go backand forth, and you know we're treated
just you know great over there,and and you know, you want to
have a good lunch and a goodmargarita. The Pink Store is definitely a
place to go. Say hello toYvonne and Sergio for me, they're the

(15:41):
owners of the place. Yeah,it's just been a really great experience meeting
all of the local people. Butwhat really attracts me to the area,
and I come down to this,not Columbus specifically, but down to this
part of the state very regularly,and it's all of the outdoor recreation opportunities
at exist. Jumping up on birdhunter and the quail hunting here second to

(16:03):
none. You can get a varietyof species in a small geographic area,
and of course the hovelina that you'retalking about, and just the desert landscape
just as a place to escape thebig city and the hustle and bustle of
modern life and all of the screensand emails. For sure, I mean
this, it's you going back intime when you go to Columbus. I
can just tell you that right nowwe are thirty miles from the closest city

(16:30):
out in the middle of the highdesert, and it is beautiful and when
it rains it smells like heaven outhere. I'll tell you what it's just
I mean, it's something to behold. It really is. And if you
know, I learned to love thedesert and it's just I get up and
I just I just love looking atyou know, every day it's a different

(16:51):
picture, it's a different thing.It's a different landscape, the way the
light shines, you know, allof it is just it's just a really
fascinating place to live. And it'sjust crazy because it's just a tiny little
pulled duck. Well, you know, the night sky certainly something to capture
your imagination looking at the stars,because there's really no light pollution whatsoever down

(17:11):
here. I mean, at leastit doesn't feel like it. And we
were fortunate to get a pretty goodrain yesterday. And so the smell of
the Kreoso it's the only place inthe world that I've been able to capture.
That smell is one section of NewMexico from SoCoRo down to to here
essentially, and then you know westobviously you can go a little into Arizona,

(17:33):
but you get north of Secoro,that smell I've never I mean,
you just well there goes away rightexactly, yeah, exactly. So it's
a for someone that hasn't experienced it. It's hard to describe. It's hard
for me to try to illustrate withwords what that what that fragrance is with
people have an idea, you know, people how they know what pine tree
smell like. They know, likewhen they're up in the mountains, everything

(17:55):
smells like pine. Or you're outin the farm and you smell the wheat
for the wheat feel. You know, it's the same thing here. When
it rains, that creoso it justjust gives off this most pleasant smell and
it's just everywhere, just surrounds you, and you know, like the greatest
things, like in the morning,just when the sun rises and after a
good rain and the creosol smell startscoming up and you're just out there with

(18:18):
a good cup of coffee and watchingthe sunrise. I mean, it's a
good life, it really is.And you know, you walk out the
front door of this place here wherewe're sitting in the morning, and the
birds, I mean, there's Idon't know how many species of birds you
can see in one sitting. Butthe sounds too, is the as the
desert comes alive and the sun peaksup over the horizon and the birds or

(18:40):
just it's a cacophony of activity.It's it's really a spectacular way to get
every things I have. I havea couple of places that I just really
enjoy sitting where I can watch youknow, I have some bird feeders out
here, so I just sit andwatch them and enjoy that all the time,
for sure. Like I said,and the Roadrunners of the most fun.
I one day I was out herein a rodeoard. I got up
on the wall and he started streamingcalling. I don't know what he was

(19:03):
doing, but he was. Igot my phone out and I recorded him
all right, and then I playedit back and he started talking to himself
and we went back and forth byusing his voice to talk to him.
And it was great. It wasit was just and he was right there
on the wall. The thing aboutthis road ros is are pretty brave and
a lot of times you can kindof almost walk, you know, right

(19:25):
up to him. You know,they'll they'll let you. And they're prehistoric,
you know, they look like alittle dinosaur, the little raptors,
you know, and they are too, I mean they go after all the
lizards and yeah, Quill, likeI said, Yeah, there's there's something
to watch for sure, boy andthe birds of prey. I've seen a
number of different hawk species, youknow, raptors in the area. And

(19:45):
what's what's really noteworthy, I think, Addison, is that as I'm driving
around and I've been down here nowfor I guess four days, and as
we've talked about, I'm down heretalking to community members and trying to get
a feel for the appetite for thiscommunity to see an increase in economic development,
and then asking whether or not,you know, a national monument designation

(20:10):
of some of these magnificent public landswould be a thing that might attract some
additional tourism dollars and things like that. But as I've been down here,
having those conversations and just really connectingto this wonderful place, I've noticed that
I can drive for hours on theseroads down here, even the paved roads,
without passing in other vehicles. Right, I mean, there's there's just

(20:33):
nobody out here, and so thereason for out here, I mean,
that's why there's you know, Colembus, Columbus, it has nothing. I
mean, there's no jobs, whichis the problem. Right, Colembus is
dying from Puratrician. Okay, becausethe kids grow up, the first thing
they can do is leave because there'snothing here, right, and then the
rest are just getting old and dying. Right, So we do need And

(20:57):
why it's so hard to convince thepeople here in Columbus to accept new I
don't know, but they don't wantit. You know, it's very hard,
but it needs to happen or Columbusis gonna fade away and it won't
be much longer. Okay, Sojust I mean this year, last year,
the end of last year, DollarGeneral opened a store in Columbus.

(21:18):
That's the first commercial business to openin Columbus, New Mexico. Wow,
everything else is Mama Pop. WhenI say everything else, the one gas
nation, the one grocery store,which is about the size of a shoe
box, and you know there's notmuch there. You can buy a beer
and wine, so there's not Imean, there's two cafes and you never

(21:41):
know when they're going to be open. So you know, this is it's
a it's a it's a crazy placeto live. I don't know, I
don't know how to describe it.I mean, I just love it to
death. You'd think that there'd benothing ever to talk about in Columbus.
But there's always something to talk aboutin Columbus, right, something's going on
down here. But yeah, Iknow the project you're talking about, I

(22:02):
believe is the membrase that's Mountain Range, right. Well, yeah, it's
the Members Peaks National Monument, Andit's essentially just an idea at this point.
I mean, we've got a proposal. We're at the stage of the
campaign where we're trying to get communitybuy in, trying to get support from
the community, answer questions because thereany time you propose a change, it's

(22:22):
scary. You know, generally humansare just averse to change, or they're
concerned or they're scared about how it'sgoing to affect things. And so there
were a lot of questions about thisparticular proposal, and most of those can
be answered by going to protect Memberspeaksdot org, which is a website we've
set up to provide information to peoplewho would like to learn more. But
there's a lot of there's a lotof misinformation circulating. There's a lot of

(22:45):
concern that designation of the national Monumentcould be perceived as government overreach or as
a land grab we're hearing those termsa little bit, but the reality is
this is affecting Bureau of Land Managementmanaged land already. So this is already
land that's under the management and careof the Bureau of Land Manage. I
know your audience understands what you justsaid, but just for the people who

(23:08):
don't, what he just said ispeople are accusing this of being a government
land grab, But the land thatthey're trying to grab is land they already
have. It's government lands b lM land. So that makes no sense
to me whatsoever. That's a that'sa that's a losing argument going out the
gate as far as I'm concerned.Yeah, it's it's been difficult to try
to overcome that narrative. And theother you know, details that are that

(23:33):
are causing concern for people are likewill existing rights continue to exist on these
lands. There's a lot of localmembers of the community who are in the
ranching business, you know, they'reinvolved in agriculture and they're grazing cattle and
they have a lease that allows themto graze those cattle on our public land.
And we're going about this in sucha way that all those different interests

(23:56):
are considered and so that existing landuses will continue into the future. So
if we've got a rancher who's utilizingthose public lands to raise cattle and provide
food for our country, that's goingto continue to exist. That lease will
continue to exist. And a lotof the the questions we're answering, we're
trying to point to the Oregon MountainsDesert Peaks National Monument as a model.

(24:21):
Now that occurred. You know,that monument was designated in the Organ Mountains,
obviously in some surrounding peaks in douniaAnda County. When was that twenty
thirteen was the designation, So whatwas the effect for them? Well,
what we've seen is more cattle onthe landscape today than there were back then.
Okay, so grazing hasn't been negativelyeffected. But what has happened is

(24:42):
we've seen a surge in tourism dollarscoming to the local community. I mean,
there's actually a store that exists nowthat's selling Organ Mountains Desert Peaks branded
apparel. You know, tourists comingand they want to leave with the souvenir,
They want to leave with something tocommemorate their experience on these wonderful lands,

(25:03):
and so in across the country,especially across the West, we're dealing
with the situation where we want toreally protect some of our public lands so
that future generations can enjoy the sametype of activities the hunting in some cases
some places, fishing, hiking,bird watching, rock climbing, I mean,
four wheeling. Regulated off highway vehicleuse is another thing people have talked

(25:27):
about. Well, you know,if if it's regulated, in other words,
you're on you know, the properlydesignated trails to use the side by
sides and four wheelers and all thoseuses would continue. Can you can make
sure as preserved exactly, so thoseuses all continue. But the effects in
Oregon mountains desert peaks have just beenpositive across the board. But one thing

(25:52):
that we have to be mindful of, I think, is loving a place
to death. Right, you couldyou could love a place so much that
you attract so much attention that youstart to have a real negative impact on
the landscape. But it's my opinionthat we are so far from that here.
I mean, this isn't Yellowstone,where there's lines of cars as far
as you can see trying to getto the place or get through the place.

(26:14):
There's so much room for additional visitation. And I'm talking about really responsible
visitation. The people who would travelhere to see this place and to experience
this place are the people who aregoing to appreciate its beauty and protect it.
In other words, these aren't peoplecoming here to leave beer cans on
the side of the road. Andthey decided to come here. They chose

(26:36):
they want to come here, right, exactly want to see it, that's
right. And so here we arein the middle of January, I guess,
the end of January, and it'sbeen sixty degrees. I mean when
I left Albuquerque to come down here, it was snowing and cold and a
little miserable. And the whole timeI've been down here, I mean I
in the evenings would put on alight coat, but it's completely comfortable.

(27:00):
Weather is just and of course it'sNew Mexico. The weather changes all the
time. But yeah, for thetime I've been here, I can't think
of a more comfortable place to spendthe last week of January. Well,
I know you got fortunate, nodoubt about it. Every year is different
as far as that goes. Youknow, sometimes the winters are very mild.
But even in the worst winter,it's nothing. I mean, you

(27:22):
know, it's a day or two, maybe a little inconvenience, a dusting
of snow here and there once awhile. That's the worst of it here.
Mostly it's just a very nice climateyear round. Well, of course
it gets really hot, you know, so it's you know, July and
August. Unless you like that,you know, that kind of sun,
probably not the best time to visit. Yeah, you know, Addison,

(27:44):
you were talking about the springtime here, so maybe maybe describe what the springtime
in Columbus is like. You know, I don't know if you know your
listeners, you know, if everyonelucky enough to really go through the seasons,
you know, being raised in southernCalifornia, I never did. I
never knew the difference. You know, everything stays green and flowers all year
around. Right, Well, herewe have the seasons. And the thing

(28:07):
about the spring is that you youjust watch the desert goes from brown to
alive, and it happens and thelike it happens after the first rain in
the spring. Okay. And thefunny thing about it is you can go
out there and you can water yourstuff, all day long with your hose
and your sprink as blah blah,and you will see nothing. That first

(28:30):
rain comes on the next day,everything is growing. It just it just
pops. It's just incredible. AndI'm serious. You'll come out one morning
it's like, oh my god,and you just walk around. Every cactus
is bloomed. You know, everytree has got leaves and it's green,
and the grass is turning ground.It's just it's just remarkable, you know.
So that's what I really love aboutspring timing Columbus. You know,

(28:52):
it really just comes alive. Yeah, I'm gonna have to spend more time
down here. I hope you do. In the spring, you know,
I tend to be in this area. Upland bird season in New Mexico runs
from November fifteenth to February fifteen tothat's quail season, and so that's been
my big reason for getting down here. But the beautiful thing about our federally
managed public lands is that they're managedwith a multiple use mandate. You know,

(29:17):
they're managed in such a way thatwe try to find a variety of
uses. Our management agencies try tofind a variety of uses and ensure that
there's opportunity for all of those differentuser groups to be able to exactly and
to be able to really coexist andcooperate with one another on the landscape,
so that when I'm out bird hunting, it wouldn't be uncommon for me to

(29:37):
come across someone who's with the Audubongroup and they're out bird watching, and
that's wonderful, that's fantastic, Imean exactly, and we should really embrace
and celebrate other people's reasons for beingout here. And there's people that are
out here hiking around looking for NativeAmerican artifacts, I mean, looking at
petroglyphs, which are plentiful throughout thedesert South No. I can tell you

(30:02):
what, you know, I doa lot of work here on my property,
digging and moving dirt and moving stuffaround. I'm just always constantly doing
well. I have a couple ofplaces inside my house that I put things
that I find because I always findjust digging, you know, I mean,
horseshoes like crazy. Keep in mind, this was an army base,
so you know this at one time, this place was just full of horses

(30:23):
and all that cavalry and all thatstuff was happening. By the way,
that's another thing. The last rideof the cavalry was in Columbus, New
Mexico. That's number three US AirForce Military tanks. Last ride of the
Cavalry Columbus, New Mexico. Anyway, I dig up soldier, you know,
the buttons from the uniforms, likeall that stuff all the time,
just right here in my yard.Wow. Yeah, yeah, you never

(30:45):
know what you're gonna find. Yeah, it's it's super neat. And I
really you know, I like thefact that we've got such an expansive amount
of this beautiful, untrammeled landscape essentially, and I like the fact that we
can spread out enough that everybody's useis protected. I like that everybody can
be out there for their own reasons. And it's really inspiring when we come

(31:08):
across one another and there's good conversationsthat I had, And sure you're surprised
to learn what someone else is upto. I mean, it could be
an herbalist that's out gathering medicinal plants. Yeah, but you all have the
one thing uncommon, right, youall want to be there that's right and
out there and seeing what's there andenjoying, you know, what it has
to offer. So well, youknow, it's got a good place to
start talking. Yeah, no,that's absolutely right. And it's just so

(31:32):
important to me that that some ofthese natural landscapes like this one, which
is expansive. You know, youdon't find areas as large and unpopulated as
this very often around this country.I mean in the west. Obviously it's
more common than it would be,say in the East, but to have
hundreds of thousands of acres without humandevelopment on it, essentially without the fragmentation.

(31:56):
I mean, we've got two trackdirt roads criss crossing the landscape and
things like that, but it's essentiallyundeveloped, right, untrammeled. It's intact
habitat for wildlife. I have tokeep it that way, and I assume
that that designation would go a longway and making sure it stays that way,
right, That's right, it would, and that's the entire intent of
it. That's the whole reason forit, is to protect it for future

(32:20):
generations and for our current generation ofcourse. But I guess the question sometimes
people ask is, well, whatdoes protection mean? Does that mean?
If it's protected, we can't useit, we can't go there. I
mean, I've even heard claims thathunting would be a use that was disallowed
under a monument designation, which justisn't true. It's complicated though, because

(32:42):
there are monuments all across the countrywhere that is not an allowed use.
Every monument is managed by something calledan RMP, which the land management agency
in this case it would be theBureau of Land Management comes up with a
resource management plan and that's the planthat they're going to execute to proper manage
that land for whatever the intended usesof that particular landscape are. And so

(33:07):
when those are and p processes aretaking place, the general public is invited
to be a part of that.And I always encourage people, whether it's
a United States Forest Service Forest Planor a BLM Resource management plan, if
these public lands are places that youcare about, places where you recreate,
places where you take your family andspend your vacations and all of those things,

(33:28):
and yeah, get involved, showup, be part of the management
process. But this particular BLM landout here, and all of the variety
of uses that are currently existing onthe landscape, the intent of this monument
designation is to ensure that those thingscan continue. But there's a lot of
potential threats to our public lands attimes. I mean, different foreign mining

(33:52):
interests could want to make a bigclaim and do some type of mining infrastructure
development or something. The other thingthat is a complicated conversation, but is
all of the renewable energy development that'staking place across the state. I'm talking
primarily wind and solar farms. Youknow, I recognize, you know,

(34:15):
the need for renewable energies. Iappreciate the industry starting to diversify and change
the ways in which we generate powerand energy and electricity and all the different
things here. But but where thosethings are sighted is super important. And
unfortunately, here in the desert southwest, I think there's a lot of people,

(34:37):
mostly not from there, a bigappetite for wanting to put those big
old solar arrays out in the middleof our beautiful landscape. And they're just
the ugliest things you ever saw,you know, And they don't bring any
beauty to the area whatsoever. Whetherthey work or out, that's another discussion,

(34:57):
but they're not worth looking at.And certainly I'd rather look at the
mountains than the than a big solarright. Yeah. And you know,
the first thing they do when they'regonna put in one of those developments,
they fence the whole perimeter of thearea and everybody's locked out, like you're
you know, you're no longer goingto be able to use that for any
other purpose. It's just there togenerate power, generate electricity. And then
you've got the issue of transmission.You've got to have the lines to transmit

(35:20):
that power everywhere it needs to go. But I think when it comes to
the siding, it's easy for peoplewho are not deeply connected to this landscape
in the way that you are todo a flyover and see this right spot
right there, the man, lookat we got all this land right that
we can. We can put thaton and there's nobody out there, and
there's no houses, and there's nobusinesses, and there's no solar stuff here.

(35:45):
On my profit, all my outdoorstuff is lit up by solar.
And I laugh because you know,when you think about solar always tells you
to, you know, point thatthing south tilted. You know a certain
film. Let me tell you,in New Mexico, you just lay a
flat straight up because that sun isyou know, so no doubt they have
an appetite for wanting to do thathere, you know, I mean it's

(36:05):
the exposed the sun exposure is youknow, sun up to sun down.
There's nothing gets in the way exceptfor the clouds, right, Yeah,
that's right. And so even thoughto the untrained eye or the person in
experience with this ecosystem, it lookslike a barren, lifeless land from afar,
I mean, you could pick outany square foot of this ground out
here and do a real deep analysisexamination of the life that's existing on that

(36:30):
little chunk of ground, and you'regoing to find a lot of things.
I mean, you're going to findjust incredible biodiversity, all of the different
types of life forms out here.And I think I think it's important for
people like you who are here locally, that are on the ground, that
depend on the beauty of this place, because let's face it, if this
was all turned into solar arrays andwindmills, you're going to lose any appetite

(36:55):
for people to travel here to spendtheir dollars. And as you said,
there's not a lot of jobs herein Columbus. You could probably work for
border patrol or you know, yeah, there might be a couple opportunities but
there's not a ton and we reallyI think would benefit from outside dollars being
injected into this local economy. Peopletheir money from elsewhere, and my personal

(37:16):
opinion about how to help the economyof Columbus in the short run because you
know, a long run plan ofgetting business to move here. You know
that's not going to happen overnight,you know what I mean. But what
can happen overnight is tourism, right, And why all the years people have

(37:38):
been in charge of this village don'tgo after the tourism dollars is just beyond
me. But this is this iswhat will draw people here because there are
reasons to come to this, notonly Columbus, but this whole area.
You know, there's lots and lotsof history. I mean, you've been
here for three days. All you'vedone is drive to all the places you
can go to from Columbus, right, Spend the day in Tombstone big speed.

(38:01):
You can get to l Passa,you can go up to Silver Springs,
Gia, the Gia Cave dwellings,uh, Carlsbad caverns uh on it
goes. I mean, you know, day trips in every direction. You
want to go, you know fromhere. Yeah, oh absolutely, and
in a week you're not going tosee a fraction of what the area offers.

(38:22):
And and then there's the the otherbenefit of just being here and not
running around looking at all of theother stuff, just to take a walk
through the desert and and look atthe look at the various cat die and
see the different insect life, andsmell the the plants and look at the
geology. You know, you mentionedthe rock counting. Rock counting is a

(38:44):
really popular activity out here. Itseems to be something that big deal.
Yeah, I mean, I youknow, I don't get it, but
you know, I have a tonof rock shore on my property, and
I do I pick up the onesthat look interested also on the side or
what not, you know. Sobut yeah, some people are just think
that's the greatest. Yeah. Well, I'm I'm really hopeful we're going to
be able to get more people showingup at the table and getting involved in

(39:07):
this conversation because it really needs tobe a community driven initiative. In other
words, you know, I livein Albuquerque essentially, so even though I'm
born and raised in New Mexico,lived here my entire life. I'm not
a local when it comes to LunaCounty. I'm not a local in Columbus,
I'm not a local, and dimmingI feel like i am sometimes because
I spend so much time around theFlorida Mountains and I've introduced other people to

(39:31):
the area. And when I bringsomeone who's never seen an ibex and set
up my spotting scope and you know, point it up at the mountain,
and I'm able to locate some ibeckson the sides of the cliffs of the
Florida Mountains. And I've got thislittle contraption called a phone scope. It's
like an adapter that attaches my cellphone to the spotting scope so that you
can see right on the screen whateveryou're looking at. And it's really helpful.

(39:54):
It's helpful for photography because I couldtake pictures at that point exactly.
I can pull it right up sothat two or three or four people we
can all be looking at the screentogether. Last time I was glassing,
I saw the most unbelievable mountain lion. You know. Yeah, it was
just it was so fantastic. Iwas glassing up to the Florida Mountains from

(40:15):
the east side, glassing. Yeah, that's a term in the hunting world.
It's a term we use when we'reusing binoculars or spotting scopes or high
powered optic seat there are glasses,and so we call it glassy. You
know, they're spending time behind theglass looking for things. And I've got
a sixty power spotting scope, youknow, so it's pretty it's a vortex

(40:36):
razor HD. It's it's pretty hightech, fancy stuff, you know.
It's it's a great scope. Butit was before sunrise, and I look
up and it was about a mileaway. You know, you can see
really far with these particular tools.And I see what looked to be a
mountain lion laying on top of arock. But the lion was the exact

(40:57):
same color as the rock it waslaying on, right, so it was
a little grainy because the sun hadn'tquite come up, and so I was
looking at it. Boy, thatsure looks like a mountain lion. Pretty
sure it is. But it wasa low light situation still because the sun
hadn't risen. And then as soonas the that side of the mountain got
illuminated, man, that boy,that lion just came to life. It

(41:19):
was it was gorgeous and a long, beautiful tail, you know, swooping
down in front of the rock.And then as soon as the sun hit
that lion, it stretched out justthe way a house cat would, you
know, Its front feet stretched wayforward and it's hind you know, it
arched its back, and I'm justin awe watching this, and then it

(41:39):
just nonchalantly jumped over the rock ontothe other side and it went the way
it disappeared, you know. Andthen for the next five minutes, I'm
like, as did that just happened? That really just happened. And I've
seen a lot of lions over theyears because I spent a lot of time
outside, but it's such a raresighting. I mean it, it's rare
to see a mountain lion in they. It's just not something you see

(42:00):
every day. And afterwards, Iremember kind of kicking myself a little bit
because I didn't take any pictures.I'm looking at it through the phone,
fress the punt exactly, and Ididn't. But when we take field trips
and we take local community members outto see these places, there's people who
live in Dimming who've been here theirwhole life that haven't seen an ibex right

(42:22):
up on the mountain. And whenI take someone a young person or or
someone who hasn't seen it before andintroduce them to that, I just see,
Yeah, they just light up andit's such a great experience. How
get here? So they came fromArabia or something? Yeah, well they
came that's a good question. Theycame from the Middle East, I guess

(42:43):
there. So we used to havetwo different types of ibex in the state.
We had Siberian ibex, which areup in northern New Mexican, and
the Persian Ibex here in the Floridas. The Siberian ibex never really made it.
They never they never took off.But apparently the habitat that the Persian
Ibex depend on in their native rangeis so similar to the Florida mountains.

(43:05):
And so I think it was agame commissioner by the name of Frank Hibbin,
And I might be mistaken on butI think that's who it was.
Who. Going back to this conversationabout economic development, recognize that our state
wildlife agency, the New Mexico Departmentof Game and Fish, is an enterprise
agency, meaning that it doesn't receivetaxpayer dollars from the general fund. That

(43:27):
state agency for essentially all of itshistory, has been funded exclusively by licensed
dollars. So when they sell huntingand fishing licenses, those dollars fund the
agency, and then there's a threeto one matching fund that comes from the
federal government, and that's money that'sgenerated through something called the Pittman Robertson Act
of nineteen thirty seven. So ifyou or I go to the local store

(43:51):
and buy a firearm or ammunition,without getting into all the details, just
figure eleven to thirteen percent of whatyou're is an excise tax that's attached to
firearms and ammunition. Those that moneyoften referred to as Pittman Robertson dollars.
That money goes to US Fish andWildlife Service, who then uses that to
fund the state Wildlife Agency. Soit's a recreational shooters, target shooters,

(44:15):
all that stuff. So game andfish is not funded by taxpayers and so
many years ago. And they're seriousgroup. I mean these guys they carry
badges. I mean they can arrestyou and all that kind of stuff.
They can arrest you and all thatkind of stuff, and they coordinate a
lot with border patrol down here inthis southern part of the state. There's
a lot of these, Yeah,a lot of law enforcement collaboration, and

(44:36):
our game wardens work for the NewMexico Department of Game and Fish. So
you've got the entire law enforcement division. Then you've also got the Biology division
because these are all the biologists whoare managing all of our wildlife. And
so the way it's structured, you'vegot the state agency that's the New Mexico
Department of Game and Fish make surethat our wildlife populations are properly managed,

(44:58):
you know, so we have robustpop relations into the future. A lot
of times when people are unfamiliar withhunting, they think it's just to go
out and shoot stuff and you know, kill a bunch of animals, and
that's how it works. But it'svery, very regulated, and opportunity is
allocated in such a way that it'san issue of supply and demand often in
this state, because there's fewer opportunitiesthan people who want those opportunities. But

(45:20):
that's all done to manage the populos, right yep. Well, for most
of the big game species in thestate, you've got to you've got to
draw a tag through the lottery system, and IBEX is that way absolutely and
so and in fact, for amature billy, if you're going to hunt
a mature billy, that's a maleIBEX. Then if you're using any legal

(45:43):
weapon, let's say we're gonna usea rifle, not archery equipment for example,
that's a once in a lifetime hunt. There's so much desire for that
hunt that if if I draw thatlicense, that's the only time in my
life I can ever have it.I've never been fortunate enough to draw that
particular license, so I've still applyevery year. In every year, I
put my name in and pay thefees and so on and so forth,

(46:05):
and I have to look at theproclamation. But I think for a non
resident who draws an IBEX tag,like a billy tag in New Mexico,
it's like fifteen hundred dollars or something, it's it's not inexpensive. And you're
talking about a forty pound animal fortyYeah, they're just tiny. They're a
little bitty. Yeah, really,they're little bitty animals. I mean they're
not very big at all. Catthat's right, they're super hard to see.

(46:28):
But when when people are spending thatkind of money. Yeah, when
they come to a community and they'vespent fifteen hundred dollars or something on just
the license, they're going to spendmoney while they're here. They're going to
spend money while they're here. Andso there's been taught conversation with regard to
the monument designation because the current proposalincludes the Florida Mountains as part of the
National Monument. Well even mountains here, Yeah, I have the trace romanos

(46:50):
that are you see outside? Yeah, my windows, absolutely beautiful, beautiful
mountains, and so those would allbe included. And there's been some people
saying, well, if that happens, the BLM's going to try to eliminate
the IBEX. They're going to eradicatethem. Because what I say is if
the BLM wanted to eradicate the IBEX, they already would have because they're already
on BLM land. That's the thing. And you know, there is a

(47:13):
big push by a lot of ourland management agencies across the country to try
to control or eliminate invasive species,and so some people have taken that and
become concerned that IBEX would be viewedas an invabled species. But the reality
is they're not native to join theirright exactly, they're not. They're not

(47:40):
invasive. We brought them here onpurpose and put them on the landscape.
And the reason that our Game Commissiondid that was the economic development. They
said, there's this landscape that's kindof inhospitable to a lot of wildlife species.
I mean, you're not going tofind an elk on top of the
Florida Mountains, that's for sure.It's just a very unique habitat type.

(48:00):
And so they said, but youknow, it seems suitable for this particular
species. And if we deal isit, is it just because it's so
is it rocky or what? Whyis it that they they take so well
to it? The ibex that's theprimary reason is it's it's vertical. There's
just vertical cliffs and crags and caves, and and there those little guys that
are standing on the side of mountainsexactly wonder. Yeah, they got all

(48:23):
four hoofs on what appears to bea vertical surface, and it's like they're
stuck on there like like some kindof a Yeah, they're they're they're such
a magnificent animal and they're dangerous Imean, they're dangerous to hunt because of
the terrain that they live in.You got to get up in that stuff,
draw you in. Yeah, exactlyso. But but I've I've hunted

(48:46):
them a number of times with mybow and arrow many years ago before here
in the Florida. Well, howcan you do that if you don't get
the lottery ticket? I'm glad youasked that question many many years ago.
The situation was that if you huntingwith archery equipment, you still had to
apply, but there was an unlimitednumber of licenses because the success rate was

(49:07):
so so so low. So itwas an opportunity for the Game Department to
sell licenses and generate that revenue forthe agency. Has that changed law with
the technology and the archery, yep, it sure has. It's changed.
And so now archery is also verylimited draw you have to apply and it's
not unlimited anymore. And a lotof that's because of the technology, because

(49:28):
back when when I was doing this, the maximum effective range of a bow
and arrow was very different than whatit is today modern compound bows with I
mean, it's just how far?How far can they shoot and kill?
Boy? I hate to say thisbecause it's because me. I encourage every
listener to be very, very intune with their personal capabilities, because one

(49:51):
thing I'll say, Addison is it'svery important to me that people who are
engaging the activity of hunting recognize thatthat we're taking the life of an animal,
and we owe that animal the maximumlevel of respect, and we have
to do everything possible to ensure aquick, a clean, a humane dispatch
of that animal. I mean,I feel strong that weel that to the

(50:13):
animals you set in your face,So I think what you're saying is shooting
a very long distance may not killthat animal, and it may be a
destructive thing. Yeah. The challengeis, I know guys who can hit
an orange at one hundred and fortyyards with an arrow. So if I
set an orange on top of atree stump at one hundred and forty yards,
and that's magnificent talent and skill andability, and I commend that.

(50:37):
But even the best shooter who canconsistently put that arrow in the exact spot
he wants it or she wants it. When you're dealing with a live animal
that moves one step and all ofa sudden, what would have been a
beautifully lethal shot becomes a wounding shotand he gets away and you can't get
him, and that's a terrible thing, the terrible thing. And so but
it's not uncommon to hear stories ofguys shooting further than one hundred yards with

(51:00):
archery equipment. Now, I tryhard not to, you know, tell
other people what they should or shouldn'tdo. But for me personally, that's
just too far. You know.I'm involved in the sport of archery and
in bow hunting because of the requirementto get close. I like to get
as up close and personal with withmy quarry as possible, and I want

(51:21):
to observe them, and I wantto spend time with them. And because
it's so challenging, it means Ihave a lot more time in the field.
You know. If I was ibexhunting and I saw an ibex at
say two hundred and fifty yards andI'm rifle hunting, oh my hunt's over,
right. If I'm bow hunting it, it hasn't even started, right,
you know, And I'm going toblow that stock, I'm going to
spook the animal. They're gonna getaway, and then I have to do
it again, and I'm don't haveto do it again, and so I

(51:44):
spend a lot more time in thefield. I get a lot more opportunities,
I have a lot more interactions withthe animals. I learn a lot
more about the animals and their behavior. And all of those reasons are why
I choose to bow hunt. Ifit was just about killing an animal,
a rifle is a more efficient weapon. But the point being, we brought
these animals in to generate money forthe Game Department. They do that,

(52:06):
and they've been really successful on themountain. Now, recent decisions by our
state Wildlife agency have resulted in alower than objective population. The department got
a little crazy on the nanny hunts, which are the female ibex, and
you start taking out female of aspecies, you really start to have population
level effects. So we're down to, you know, depending on the estimate

(52:30):
somewhere that they were like two hundredibex on that mountain. Oh from what
what was what was the peak?Oh? I think we were at some
point up over two thousand ibecs.Yeah, so we're way way way down
in population numbers. In the lastBig Game rule cycle, the Game Department
made some adjustments to try to fixthat. Situation. They've adjusted the way

(52:51):
that tags are issued to try tobring the population numbers back up. How
often do those animals calf once ayear? Yeah, and it's not uncommon
for them to have wins. Andthey have a pretty high survival rate,
is my understanding, compared to saya mule deer or a lot of other
hoofed wildlife that exists in the state. And it's primarily because of where they
live. I mean, it's predators, right, I mean, just the

(53:14):
mountain lions. You know, thosemountain lions can can certainly prey on them,
and they do. I've also heardstories. I've never personally seen this,
but I've heard stories of golden eaglesknocking the young kids off of the
cliff. So the kids, youknow, when they're real small, and
that they're even small when they're fullgrown. But when a young one is
on the edge of a cliff,I've heard reports that an eagle will swoop

(53:36):
down and just knock it off soit falls to its death, and then
they'll go down and scavenge on thecarcass. So they do have some predators,
but they're a really resilient animal thatcan go days and days and days
without water and live up in thecliffs and there's just and their senses they're
so we call it cagey, youknow a lot of times in the hunting

(53:57):
world. But they're very aware ofall of their roundings and their ice sight
is so powerful they can see youfrom a mile away in it. I
mean, they know you're coming.And they stay way up on top of
those cliffs where they have the vantagepoint. They can do everything. Have
spotters, they tell it. Dothey talk to each other? Yep?
They sure, yeah, they'll they'llget what we call a century, you
know, to stand up on topof the rock while the whole herd is

(54:20):
feeding and messing around and doing theirthing. They've got animals on lookout,
keeping an eye on the surroundings.And so they're they're super. How they
taste excellent, really excellent, AndI like chicken. No, no,
definitely not like chicken. But butthey are they really are excellent. And
do you compare them to anything orthey are really your nick by themselves.

(54:42):
You know, they're they're a goat, so you know, I guess you
could, you could compare them toa domestic goat. Gaming, No,
you know, gaming is an interestingterm. I think they they taste like
ibex, which is how I wantthem to taste. Like a lot of
people and I'm I'm I'm pretty involvedwhen it comes to the wild game cooking
activity. I love, you know, amateur chef or whatever you call me.

(55:07):
I'm not trained or anything like that. I'd never done it professionally,
but I spend a lot of timepreparing meals of wild game that I've harvested
out in the field. It's justsomething I take great pride in. And
so there's a lot of people outthere who always want to try to compare
this to beef. Well, ittastes a lot like beef, and I
when I'm involved in cooking wild game, I really like to celebrate the flavor

(55:29):
of the animal that I'm consuming.Whether it's a hovelina or an ibex,
or an elk or a caribou orwhatever it might be, they all taste
a little different. Now, youdidn't like the term gaming, Well,
what made you stop on that?Well, what I think sometimes people that
are in the people who consume wildgame sometimes make one of two mistakes.

(55:55):
One they want to compare it tobeef. They say, well, and
beef is kind of flavorless and it'sa pretty mild Yeah, like beef is
a vehicle to transport seasonings kind ofit. It doesn't have a lot of
flavor on its own. And soa lot of times when people compare something
to beef, which is a veryvery bland and flavorless thing, then they're

(56:15):
like, this doesn't taste like beef, and I'm like, that's why I
love it so much. So that'sone thing. So and if it doesn't
taste like beef. A lot oftimes people use the term gamey. Oh
it's gamey meaning but I don't see. But you're you're taking that as a
as a uh derogative term. Uhhuh. I think I say it as
that's a flavor. Sure, No, that's great. That's what I was

(56:37):
asking if it was like, no, that's great, and I appreciate that,
and I I was misinterpreting it.And it's common thing is most of
the time when people use the termgaming, they're using it in a negative
connotation. But I appreciate your useof it. And uh, it's a
it's a fairly mild flavor. It'snot a really strong flavor. But if

(56:58):
you're gonna it's its own and youknow, it works really really well in
like like Indian dishes, Indian cuisine, Middle Eastern cuisine, things like that,
one with strong flavor exactly, it'sreally exceptional like that. But the
other thing that that's right, that'sright. The other thing that I think

(57:20):
a mistake some people make when itcomes to wild game is not properly caring
for it in the field. Ifyou really want to have an exceptional meal
of wild game, you need totake great care with that animal exactly from
the time you're in the field andgetting it cooled off quickly. You know,
we're in a desert landscape. Ifyou shot an ibex and they live
in these cliffs that are very challengingto get to, and retrieving that animal

(57:44):
is a big, big deal.And I encourage people who are hunting them
to be aware of if you shootthat animal, are you going to be
able to get it? Because they'restory shot before you shoot. If you
shoot it, where's it going tofall? And if it does fall there,
can you retrieve it? Can youget it? And and can you
get it enough time? Because nowwhat is that? What's enough time?

(58:06):
You know, it depends on thetime of year. Depends on weather conditions.
There's a million different factors, butI would want to have that animal
in my possession releasing the heat,in other words, taking the skin off
and opening up the body cabin andgetting that body heat released within a matter
of hours. It's the heat thatcauses the problem. It does. Yeah,
if if, if you don't coolit down quickly enough, what you've

(58:29):
done is you've created an atmosphere thatwill grow bacteria. It allows bacteria to
grow, and you'll get spoilage.There's a thing called how do you solve
that? In the middle of you'rehunting, I'll you dress it and then
one I mean, you can't putit on ice. What do you do?
Well, generally, once you havethe animal, if you can remove
the skin and then just say liketake the quarters, take the meat off

(58:50):
of the carcass, so you've separatedit out, you can put it in
the shade, you can hang itjust air, you know, air cool
it's the it's not the heat ofthe temperature. Be in temperature that's as
concerning to me as the body heatof the animal being retained after the animals
die. Right, do you wantto you wanna allow that animal to cool
off to it. You know,ambient temperature is outside as quickly as possible,

(59:15):
and so it's it's it's an unbelievableactivity when when done right, the
rewards of it are are so immense. And so I spend a lot of
time trying to get people interested inhunting, and I take out a lot
of new hunters and really focus onon the ethics and the integrity and the
responsibility that we have of being goodstewards of the land that the animal depend

(59:39):
on for habitat and also of theanimals themselves. Because well, on that
note, I just you know,it just kind of brings it back to
the membrased project again. What standsa better chance of that land being respected
and taken care of in the fashionthat you're talking about, uh, being

(59:59):
held as a national monument and beingfinanced to take care of it, or
just letting it just be what itis and God knows whatever happens happens.
Yeah, that's a great question,and I think I think he nailed it.
Addison, I mean, I thinkmonument protections are key. I mean,
they're key tools. It's not thebe all end all that solves all

(01:00:22):
the world's problems. You still haveto manage the land. I mean,
you still need resources. We needto make sure our Bureau of Land Management
is properly resourced. We need tomake sure there's an adequate staff on the
ground to take care of these places. I mean, all this stuff is
important, especially if we're if we'rewe're having the intended result of more people

(01:00:42):
coming to enjoy the landscape. Well, if you're going to have increased human
activity, then it makes sense tohave increased law enforcement presence, which means
jobs, which means people go towork for BLM and they become a park
ranger and they you know, youhave the maybe there's a visitor center,
maybe there's just you know, theinterpretive signs that help people learn about the
area. Job bad way to makea living. Yeah, it's great,

(01:01:05):
and you're working for the federal government. You've got good benefits package. And
those are the kind of jobs Iwant to see coming to local communities like
Columbus and like dimming. And Ithink monument protection is a really ideal way
to preserve this existing culture that wehave that's tied to the landscape. And
again that includes cattle grazing. Well, you know this whole conversation we've had

(01:01:29):
and our combined histories and experiences together. We only have those because we've had
the opportunity to be able to goto these places and enjoy them, right,
and yeah, we need to protectthat so that our kids and our
grandchildren will be able to sit downand have these same chats and stories and
be able to compare. And youknow this needs to go on for sure,

(01:01:51):
it needs to live on. Yeah. Well, I couldn't agree more,
Adson, and I won't keep youmuch longer. We've been going at
it about an hour, but Iwant to thank you for taking the time
to have this conversation because it's beenfantastic, B for opening up your home,
uh in such unique fashion as thisAirbnb model, this bed and breakfast,
which is just excellent. I've enjoyedall of the amenities of the property,

(01:02:15):
the beautiful views, the vistas,the smells, the sites, the
sounds of the birds in the morning, but also like the weight room,
which is which is which is awesome. You know it's I don't think I've
ever stayed in a bed and breakfastthat had essentially a fully equipped gym where
I can go and get my morningexercise look on my big asis of Reno.

(01:02:36):
Yeah, it's I mean, thisis just it's it's such a great
place. Well, on that note, uh, the website is Hole in
the Wall Getaway dot com. Longname, I know, but you can
also go to Village of Columbus dotcom or you can go to Palomas Mexico
dot com. All of them.You can find the Hole in the Wall

(01:02:58):
Getaway, Okay, and everything youwant to find out about Columbus and Colombos
and everything in between. Yeah,and I'm talking about the Hole in the
Wall Getaway. Would you provide tothe listeners because I'm encouraging people listening to
this. If you've not spent timein far southwestern New Mexico, you've not
seen the Florida Mountains, if you'venot seen Tres Harmonas, if you haven't
you know, spent time in thisarea. Please you owe it to yourself

(01:03:22):
to come check it out, becauseyou're going to find that you'll be a
return visitor. This is such awonderful place. And when it comes to
to an exact location where you canstay and get an array of benefits.
And that's what I'd like you totalk about a little bit addison is all
of the other benefits. You know, I've been running around crazy, as
we've mentioned, going to different placesand working, and we had a county

(01:03:42):
commission meeting and all these kinds ofthings, so I haven't had a ton
of time to just relax here atthe property. But I'd like to hear
you talk about the charcoal file,fire cotab, which I think, yeah,
and then also the you know,the services you provide because you're a
you're a local expert. You're knowledgeableon these things, and I know depends
on who you ask. I know, you provide additional services for people who

(01:04:05):
might be interested in staying here,like transportation taking them to the border,
those kinds of things, you know, Uh, hospitality business. Brother,
you know, you just you gotto do everything for everybody and be be
you know, everybody's guy, right, And I just enjoy that to death.
I mean, I just I don'tknow if it runs in the family
or not, but I get thegreatest kick out of being a good host

(01:04:26):
and providing good service, all right. I really really enjoy that. Uh.
So I put all that effort hereinto the hole in the wall getaway,
uh and I built the whole ideawas to build a kind of a
theme. You know, this kindof like my idea is like an old
cowboy hide away, all right,you know, the whole the wall.
I mean, that's literally what it'slike here. You you you come into

(01:04:48):
Columbus, and then you drive upout of the village and you go past
kind of you know, a lotof the blight, a lot of the
you know, the trailer parks andblah blah blah, and you pretty soon
you find yourself you're outside of theand you're up here, and now you're
you're in the hole in the wall, and it's just vistas and horizons and
everything as far as you can see. So I wanted to take advantage of

(01:05:09):
that. So I've built an RVparking spot so I can I can I
can host a big RV. Theycan drive right through. I got a
place where they can set up campor whatnot. There the house here yourself.
What I've done is I've taken twothirds of the house. I live
in one third what I call thedoghouse. I've separated that from from the
other, from the big part ofthe house. So when you rent the

(01:05:30):
Hole in the wall getaway, yourent the whole two thirds of the house.
You get two bedrooms, you getthe private bathroom, you get the
living room, you get the viewingroom, you get the gym, you
get a full blown office. Igot green screen here if you do zoom
calls, right. I mean,I've got it all here. I have
all the great technology. I havefiber optic internet one hundred megabytes per second.

(01:05:51):
I mean it's all here, rightin the middle of the Old West.
It's it's it's really and the nutshellexplains what I love about this place.
It's where the new and the oldcome together, all right. And
by god, if we could justget some interest down here, because this
really is a unique, beautiful placeto see and visit. Yeah, I

(01:06:15):
appreciate the time and the opportunity totalk to you and your audience today.
Brother No, thank you so much, Addison, and thanks for again thanks
for allowing me to share this littleslice of heaven with you. I've sure
enjoyed it. This has been awonderful, wonderful trip. And can't wait
to get back down here for theNettie back down here. You gotta get
here in the spring and just tosee the difference, you know. Yeah,
it's just amazing, awesome. Well, Adison, thank you so much.

(01:06:38):
One more time. Let folks knowwhere they can find you one more
time. Okay, hole in thewall Getaway dot com is where you find
my little bed and breakfast here.But also, don't forget village of Columbus
not sorry, excuse me, ColumbusNew Mexico dot com and Columbus Mexico dot

(01:06:59):
com. I don't know if Imade it clear, but you know we
have a portomitry here twenty four hours. You can go back and forth,
all right, and you can comehere and go across. And one day
they use men to the pink store. What people do here is they come
over for the day. They goto the optrician, they get their eyes
checked, they order glasses. Theygo to the pink store and while they're
eating, their glasses are being made. And before they're done with lunch,

(01:07:20):
they bring you your new Suther glasses. And it costs you a hundred bucks.
They don't charge you for the eyeexam, if you buy a frame,
if you buy a pair of glasses. Wow, you know that's people
do that all the time. Theycome from El Paso, Silver City.
It's just It's a great thing todo to come down and spend the day,
have a great lunch, and gohome with the new Southern glasses.
Yeah. Well that's that's awesome.Thanks so much, Addison. Can't wait

(01:07:41):
till till the next time we're ableto hang out together and appreciate again,
appreciate everything. Man, it's beengreat. Brought on brother. Thanks for
listening to the Yahi Va podcast producedby Drift with Outdoors