Be Ye Reconciled: The Power of Forgiveness

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Talk about and a conversation that.

Speaker 2 (00:11):
About the parassing that jewation. Welcome to this show.

Speaker 3 (00:17):
I'm your host, Pastor Shay, and today we're dealing with
the topic beee reconcile, the power of forgiveness.

Speaker 2 (00:26):
I'm super excited.

Speaker 3 (00:28):
Today to have in that studio the senior pastor of
Oasist Church, in the person of Apostle. Friends, Apostle, welcome
to the show.

Speaker 1 (00:42):
Thank you so much, so glad to be here. Blessings
to you, Pastor. Amen, we're excited about being here tonight.

Speaker 2 (00:48):
I listen, listen, I'm super excited. I'm so glad that
you're here.

Speaker 3 (00:54):
And I believe that we're gonna have an amazing show
dealing with what I think is an amazing top the.

Speaker 2 (01:00):
Sensitive topic in the church.

Speaker 3 (01:02):
And that's really for us to walk as I respond,
in a place of forgiveness and reconciliation.

Speaker 2 (01:09):
So we are not even gonna slow down. We're gonna
jump right in and just.

Speaker 3 (01:14):
Before we dealt into the harder questions, the harder questions,
I want to level set with those who are gonna
be watching. You know what is is what is forgiveness
from a biblical definition?

Speaker 1 (01:27):
Okay, So for us to really get an understanding of
what real forgiveness is. According to the scripture, we need
to understand what this word actually what it means on
the Hebrew side as well as a on the Greek side.

Speaker 4 (01:43):
And so in the Hebrew, this word means.

Speaker 1 (01:45):
To cover or to atone or to make reconciliation. And
we understand what the toonement is because Jesus atoned our
sins for us, He watched our sins away. Our sins
were forgiving because of the sacrifice that he made. Also,
this word also means appeasement or conciliation, and it reflects

(02:08):
an act of making peace.

Speaker 4 (02:09):
This is the Hebrew mentality of this particular word.

Speaker 1 (02:13):
And then on the Greek side of this word, when
we see it used in the New Testament, it is
this now that translates to reconciliation and it refers to
restoration of a relationship right especially between two different individuals.

Speaker 4 (02:30):
And we have several verses of scripture, such as Romans.

Speaker 1 (02:32):
Five and eleven that talks about that, and it also
means as a verb, it means to reconcile or to
change mutually. And I know that we're gonna hit on
that later about the mutuality that is involved in forgiveness,
and so when we start talking about that, it emphasizes
transformation from enemy to friendship.

Speaker 4 (02:56):
And that's a big deal.

Speaker 2 (02:58):
Wow, that's powerful.

Speaker 3 (02:59):
That it's so powerful, and it's interesting you use the
Hebrew definition. Another another word in Hebrew four forgiveness is
that word to.

Speaker 4 (03:08):
Pardon, right, Yeah, the word to partener just.

Speaker 3 (03:11):
Forgiveness, right is too And when you look at the
definition of pardon, it means to allow an offense to
pass without punishment. That right there, powerful, powerful, And so
what I wanted to do, there's a scripture in the
Bible Apostle Matchew five.

Speaker 2 (03:30):
Twenty three and twenty four where Jesus.

Speaker 3 (03:33):
Now I was talking with his disciples, and so I
want us to look at that real quick even.

Speaker 2 (03:38):
To further lay this out.

Speaker 3 (03:39):
And really that was that was a good definition. We
needed to really get that definition.

Speaker 2 (03:45):
And so what I want to do is I want
to just read that scripture real.

Speaker 3 (03:49):
Quick for everybody. Matche five twenty three, twenty four. I
was trying to bring it up on the screen, but
just give me one second, match.

Speaker 2 (04:01):
You five twenty three, twenty four. I want to read
that one second. There we go. It's on the screen.
Thank you so much.

Speaker 3 (04:11):
Hey, So therefore, if thou bring thy gift to the
altar and they're remembrance that thy brother, I like that
word brother. No, we're not talking about just random people,
talking about people possibly have relationship, had an order against thee.

Speaker 2 (04:29):
Leave that gift before the altar. Go thy way first
be reconciled.

Speaker 3 (04:35):
I love the fact that definition that you gave the
Hebre definition says, you know what a byproduct of forgiveness
is reconciliation. Forgiveness is reconciliation to thy brother, this is
Jesus now. And then coming off with your gift, I'm
going to give you a minute just to just to

(04:56):
just to add a little she had a little life
on this text.

Speaker 1 (04:59):
That yes, and so this is what I you know,
I really love this verse of scripture because of the
fact that we especially you know, we are so super
super spiritual, and we love to talk about how we
go into the presence of God, how we pray, how
we seek the Lord, how we fast, and how we

(05:20):
I'm an intersessor and all of these wonderful things. And
as we are reading in this verse right, we're seeing
that God is more concerned about us walking in unity
than he is about us offering our gifts. And so
as we are looking at this verse of scripture, if
you you know, the thing we think about is well,

(05:43):
I don't have nothing against them.

Speaker 4 (05:45):
I didn't do anything to them.

Speaker 1 (05:46):
This is putting the responsibility on us.

Speaker 4 (05:50):
If you think.

Speaker 1 (05:51):
That your brother has something against you, that changes everything,
That changes everything. God is not saying, okay, well, if
you got something to get your brother.

Speaker 4 (06:02):
He says no.

Speaker 1 (06:03):
If you come to the altar, if you aren't in
your regular prayer time, you done started, you a good
old fast, and you seeking the Lord. You got up
at five am, you doing your five am prayer, and
as soon as you hit your knees, you remember that
your brother has something against you. Get up off your

(06:23):
knees and stop crying out to God and go get
that thing right with your brother. Because that is that
is how you know that your prayer is working. That's
how you know you got real relationship with God, because
because God begins to deal with you about the state
of your brother's heart toward you.

Speaker 4 (06:42):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (06:43):
So it's the place where reconciliation is the spiritual act
of worship. Yeah, And he says, before you come worship
mat He's more concerned about how we treat one other, yes,
our relationship than our worship. So do you think it's interesting, Apostol?

Speaker 2 (06:59):
So how many is hee? We just don't? We just
go on that Holy Spirit have its ways. Some how
it is.

Speaker 3 (07:06):
That there are people that can enter into uship, enter
into services, enter into service in the House of God,
knowing that there is stuff in their heart that they
need to get right, knowing that there's.

Speaker 2 (07:21):
A person that is sitting right in the same role
or maybe on the other side of the sanctuary. How
it is that we can just overlook that place. Isn't
that heart is hard to become harden? Is adult talk
to us?

Speaker 1 (07:36):
I absolutely believe that there is a hardness of heart
that has taken place. And you know, these these places
like especially here in that Matthew five and twenty three
twenty four, when you're looking at that verse, and that
was actually in my notes as well as I was
looking at it.

Speaker 4 (07:53):
The scripture is is clear.

Speaker 1 (07:55):
That reconciliation right and and and even in another space
of minutes in the scripture and second printy, it talks
about us having the ministry of reconciliation, not the ministry
of traveling the world, not the ministry of preaching on
the street, not the ministry of having an itinerant calendar.
This is the thing that God is most concerned about.

(08:17):
And so for us we have absolutely grown dull in
our heart, and we have put emphasis on the wrong thing.

Speaker 4 (08:25):
We have put emphasis.

Speaker 1 (08:26):
On giftedness and not on brokenness in the presence of God,
and not on reconciliation and unity in the body. And
you know, I don't understand how we think that we're going.

Speaker 4 (08:41):
To fight and bite and devour.

Speaker 1 (08:44):
One another here on earth and go to Heaven with
each other anyhow.

Speaker 4 (08:47):
It's just not happening. And it's not happening.

Speaker 3 (08:51):
Not only that, but actually enter into a place of
worship knowing that you know that there's you.

Speaker 2 (08:57):
Know, there's a place, a situation that needs to be
addressed in yourselfment.

Speaker 3 (09:02):
And so interestingly enough that when you gave your definitely
Hebrew definition of forgiveness, it points back to reconciliation.

Speaker 2 (09:10):
And I really believe that. And we're going to get
to the hard question in the second.

Speaker 3 (09:15):
But in your definition, you sort of define reconciliation, which
means to make peace the act of course, it's people
or groups of people watch this, wats this who may
have had an argument before a disagreement, and watch this.
Though it could have been a fractured relationship because of pain,
green anger, but it's when those relationships come back together,

(09:40):
that's what that's what reconciliation look like.

Speaker 2 (09:42):
You want to talk about that just a little bit
before I hit you with my first hard question.

Speaker 1 (09:47):
Well, you know what, this is a good thing because
because one of the things that we have to understand
is that they're in order for us to really say
that we have reconciled.

Speaker 4 (09:55):
You know how we said, well I forgave him and
I forgave.

Speaker 1 (09:58):
Her, but there's no real rea reconciliation, right, and if
we have really reconciled, according to this this Greek definition,
the idea behind this reconciliation is that there is a
mutual change. Both of you decide that you've got to
work through this situation. And there's an emphasis on transformation

(10:21):
and you're transforming from enemies to friends again.

Speaker 4 (10:26):
And so this is the thing.

Speaker 1 (10:28):
You know, we said, well you can forget, I can
forgive you, but I ain't gonna forget. And uh, you know,
I forgive you, but you know that don't mean that
we're gonna be friends again. Well, you didn't really reconcile,
that's all. You didn't reconcile, you know. And so when
we you can't say that y'all reconciled. If relationship has

(10:52):
not been restored, that's good, that's good. And so we
gotta stop saying that we have forgiven, because when we
have been forgiven, when God forgives us and we are
reconciled back to God, our relationship with God is restored.

Speaker 2 (11:08):
That's right, that's right. Not only is in the story
of ourself he.

Speaker 1 (11:13):
Keeps no record of wrongdoing up, no records, you know.

Speaker 2 (11:18):
Because Love keeps no record of wrongdoing right.

Speaker 3 (11:21):
And interesting enough, in the Book of Luke, Luke said
something powerful Luke, chapter twenty three, verse thirty four.

Speaker 2 (11:28):
When we talk about.

Speaker 3 (11:30):
Who is the standard, who is the model crisis the model.

Speaker 2 (11:33):
Christis the measurements that he's the standard.

Speaker 3 (11:36):
And I believe he gave us the greatest model of
what forgiveness looks like.

Speaker 2 (11:43):
In the Book of Luke twenty three, verse thirty four.

Speaker 3 (11:45):
He while he was on the gross, Jesus was on
the gross. How being ridiculed, being passed, being have a
crown of Thun puts on his head long, they took
his garment, they cast lots upon it. He was, he suffered,
he was piercing the side, water came out. We know
the harshness of the things.

Speaker 2 (12:06):
That our heavenly Father suffered.

Speaker 3 (12:08):
And the Bible sex while he was on the cross,
Jesus said.

Speaker 4 (12:13):
Father, come on.

Speaker 2 (12:15):
Them, for they know not what they do. And so
when we talk.

Speaker 3 (12:19):
About the model of the giveness, it is yes, yeah,
go ahead.

Speaker 1 (12:25):
Well, I think I think one of the things that
we have to be able to do when it comes
to reconciling with other people, we have to first be
able to see where we fit in the equation of
what has been done wrong, because a lot of times
we think, well, it wasn't my fault, you know, it
was it was them. And you know, the Bible gives
us keys to work through conflict to bring us back

(12:47):
to reconciliation with one another.

Speaker 4 (12:49):
But we got to take the time. You know, this
is the thing that we do.

Speaker 1 (12:53):
You know, we love to get these topical Bibles, you know,
and we love to do these topical studies, but but
we don't want to study how to find myself back
in right standing with my brother. Right, we gotta learn
that God has given us the tools that are necessary
through his word.

Speaker 4 (13:12):
Everything that we need is in the Word of God.

Speaker 1 (13:14):
But what happens to us is we're so busy psychologizing, right,
we want to put psychology on it.

Speaker 4 (13:21):
We want to sit in the therapist's office.

Speaker 1 (13:22):
And I'm not against therapy, but especially if it's if
it's you know, with a biblical worldview. Okay, I'm I'm
for that, but but I'm I'm against it if it
doesn't lead you back to doing things God's way. And
so we have to begin to learn that even if
you are looking at a twelve step program or you

(13:45):
looking at whatever it is that you're looking at.

Speaker 4 (13:47):
You better look to the Word of God first.

Speaker 1 (13:49):
And so when we start talking about working through conflict,
and and I wrote some things out about working through
conflict and how we can take steps toward reconciliation. And
one of the things that in that process is number one,
it's self examination.

Speaker 4 (14:04):
The Bible tells us to examine our own heart.

Speaker 1 (14:07):
When you read in Matthew Chapter seven, verses three through five,
it tells you to examine your own heart and your
motives before you confront anybody else.

Speaker 4 (14:19):
Second, way, a second, right, a second.

Speaker 1 (14:23):
Because you know what we do, we our chest get tight,
we start feeling some kind of way we start.

Speaker 4 (14:29):
And here's the thing.

Speaker 1 (14:30):
When somebody does something wrong to you, the first thing
you start doing.

Speaker 4 (14:34):
You start having conversations in your own head. You start
talking to yourself.

Speaker 1 (14:38):
And you ever be riding in the street, riding down
the street in your car, or you in a room
by yourself and somebody did something to you, and all
you can think of is what that person did, and
you rehearsing all of that stuff in your hand about
what you thought somebody did. But are you doing what
Matthew seven says, are you examining yourself?

Speaker 4 (14:57):
Have you looked at what?

Speaker 1 (14:59):
What have you contributed to the conflict that now has
brought you to the place that you need to reconcile
with your brother? And that's that's what's missing.

Speaker 2 (15:10):
That's awesome.

Speaker 3 (15:11):
And the other thing about you said driving down the road,
and it is so true. When we have unforgiveness, we
in a place of holding on to a fence in
which leads bitterness and anger and all us.

Speaker 2 (15:24):
The thing about offense, offense has a voice.

Speaker 4 (15:27):
Oh yes it does, Yes, it does offense.

Speaker 3 (15:30):
For love you and make you think everybody is doing
something against you.

Speaker 2 (15:35):
Because it has a voice, and in actuality we open
up that door. The Bible says it this way that
when you when.

Speaker 3 (15:43):
You don't forgive, it talks about the it's a parable
about about the unjust servant who when he was forgiven.

Speaker 2 (15:51):
Of this big debt, he went.

Speaker 3 (15:53):
And actually the people who are who are the smaller debt,
and and the Bible says he was put in jail
to be tormented with ourself to tormenting spirits talking about
So it's in the word that when we hold on
to unforgiveness, that's exactly what happened.

Speaker 2 (16:13):
We are tormented.

Speaker 3 (16:15):
But I want to get to this place because I
think it's clear that we understand based on your definition
and based on the biblicult scriptures will reference us.

Speaker 2 (16:24):
Are that for a believer?

Speaker 3 (16:26):
Now we know the world, the world when you get
mad with the people in the world, for you kill
I kill your cat. But in the Church we requiet
to forgive.

Speaker 2 (16:38):
And so is forgiveness.

Speaker 3 (16:40):
Now then, apostle, is it a process or is it
a choice?

Speaker 2 (16:46):
A decision? Here?

Speaker 3 (16:48):
Let me let me let me tell you where I'm
going so a little context to my question.

Speaker 2 (16:53):
Do I forgive me your fans and.

Speaker 3 (16:56):
Then the Holy Spirit processes me through it? Or or
do I have to be processed first at that life?
Forgive because I believe sometimes by virtue of the offense,
it could be something heavy, it could be something excruciating.
You know, sometimes we think we are now justified to

(17:17):
hold onto it because of what has happened. So is
it a choice or is it a process or is
it a little of both, depending on the severity of
the offense.

Speaker 1 (17:28):
Okay, so I'm wanna say something, and I know this
is not gonna be very popular, and I don't care,
so you know what I'm saying, because.

Speaker 4 (17:37):
Here's our reality.

Speaker 1 (17:39):
I believe that working through the conflict is the process, right,
but reconciliation and forgiveness is a choice. Working through the
conflict is the process because you gotta work through the conflict,
the thing that brought you there in the first place,
to where you were wounded. I don't say that it

(17:59):
doesn't take you time to get over the effect of
what you have felt, right, but to reconcile and forgive
is a choice.

Speaker 4 (18:08):
And I often say this, especially to married.

Speaker 1 (18:10):
Couples because you know, they always talking about you know,
we talk about love and things like that, and we
always you know, see how people talk about well, you know,
I don't want to I don't want to be with
this one, and I don't want to be with that
one or whatever. And we often equate love with warm
and fuzzies, you know what I'm saying. We we we

(18:32):
equate love with ooh, I feel like this, and I
feel like that.

Speaker 4 (18:35):
But honey, love is not a feeling. Love is a.

Speaker 1 (18:37):
Choice, a choice, okay, just as forgiveness is a choice,
and so you have to choose to reconcile. It takes
deliberation to reconcile because you understand. And let me say
this to us, people of God, because even as you
have said, pastor, God is dealing with us as believers.

Speaker 4 (19:02):
We're not talking to the world.

Speaker 1 (19:03):
We know that the world are championship grudge holders, okay,
but not in the charge that that shouldn't be nagged
among us. Right, So your process is working.

Speaker 4 (19:15):
Through the conflict, okay.

Speaker 1 (19:18):
And and and in our humanness and our humanity it
may you know, learning to trust again is a process.
I'll give you that right, I'll give you that, but
not forgiveness.

Speaker 4 (19:31):
Uh, it's a choice. Because if that's the case.

Speaker 1 (19:35):
Then then that means that if we're going to God
and if we confess our sins, he's faithful and justine
forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all
on righteousness.

Speaker 4 (19:48):
That don't say process. That that don't say process.

Speaker 1 (19:52):
What if God went through a process before he forgave
us And you might say, well, I ain't God, but
you got the spirit of God on the inside, which
empowers you to be able to love through the hard
places and forgive through difficulty.

Speaker 2 (20:11):
That's It's true.

Speaker 4 (20:13):
I'm with you.

Speaker 2 (20:14):
It's your choice. It's your choice. We so no matter
what people do to us, we have the choice to
forgive them but not togive. It's not a feeling, it's
a decision. It's a choice that we have to make.

Speaker 3 (20:28):
Listen, I wanna I want to pivot a little bit more,
and I want you to.

Speaker 2 (20:35):
Just before I go into.

Speaker 3 (20:38):
Some other some other little some other little sensitive spots.

Speaker 1 (20:41):
I'll call them sensive sensitive spots.

Speaker 2 (20:47):
I want you to talk about a time. Talk about
the time when you experience maybe.

Speaker 3 (20:52):
Your I don't know, a situation where it was truly
difficult to forgive and how you handle that well.

Speaker 1 (21:00):
As I said to you before we got started here,
I've had several situations where it was difficult being in
pastoral ministry. You are in a vulnerable place, right, yes,
And the occupational hazard is a pain. It is you know,

(21:20):
being misunderstood, being misread right, and and conflict is an
occupational hazard.

Speaker 4 (21:28):
And so.

Speaker 1 (21:30):
You know, I hadn't had to go through, you know,
periods of times with people that I was good.

Speaker 4 (21:37):
To, I mean helped them out.

Speaker 1 (21:41):
We had a situation at one point and at our church,
and I had a young lady that was at our
church and she didn't have a place to stay.

Speaker 4 (21:49):
I was bringing her to my house and she was,
you know, taking shower at my house.

Speaker 1 (21:54):
I had a house full of people, so she couldn't
stay with me at my house, but she was her
and her family were sleeping at the I didn't tell
the church that she was sleeping at the church, for
her and her family were sleeping at the church. She
would come to my house and take a shower during
the day, her and her kids, you know, and you know,
everything I could do to try to help her get
on her feet.

Speaker 4 (22:11):
I helped her search for a house.

Speaker 1 (22:13):
I talked to the landlord to help the landlord, you know,
let her move into the house without no money, you know,
to try to get things together like like that was
God in and of itself, you know, just over the top,
over and above.

Speaker 4 (22:25):
And then because I made a decision at church that
she did not like, because I did not move when
she wanted me to move.

Speaker 1 (22:34):
When I tell you, she left our church and ran
my name down like I don't know what.

Speaker 2 (22:39):
Wow.

Speaker 4 (22:40):
And it was.

Speaker 1 (22:40):
Difficult for me because because first of all, when I love,
I love with all my heart. I love hard, you know,
and I do you know, because I understand that we
all go through difficulty or whatever.

Speaker 4 (22:54):
And I'm gonna tell you something.

Speaker 1 (22:55):
That was a hard space. That was a hard place
for me, you know. And the the the enemy would
love for us to experience hurt like that, especially after
you have done for people, and after you have loved
on people and been there for them, that you would
close your heart your bowels of compassion. Yes, yes, that

(23:19):
you would shut down your bowels of compassion and not
help nobody else and see people struggle and not stick
your hand out and help them and not do anything
like like to really shut you down.

Speaker 4 (23:33):
And and I want to and I want to.

Speaker 1 (23:35):
I want to lay this out because I'm telling these
are things that I.

Speaker 4 (23:39):
Labored in prayer over and ask God.

Speaker 1 (23:41):
To, you know, help me to walk in forgiveness so
that I would not you know what I'm saying, make
other people pay for what she had done, as well
as make her pay because you know, like you're saying,
you know, you know, we love that tip for tat
you kill my dog, kill your cat. We love that,

(24:02):
you know what I'm saying. We love to be able
to get people back. But Ephesians four thirty one and
thirty two, be kind and compassionate, forgiving each other.

Speaker 4 (24:14):
As Christ forgave you.

Speaker 1 (24:16):
How could I get up and preach without compassion and forgiveness.
How am I going to get up and preach this
gospel of Jesus Christ holding a grudge in my heart
because I feel like somebody did me dirty. Listen to
me and we forget that. The scripture tells us Jesus said,
he said, they persecuted me bad, bad, they gonna persecute you.

Speaker 4 (24:40):
The servant is not better than his master.

Speaker 1 (24:44):
And so that was that was one of those things
where it was really it was really really hard, you know.
And I can say this in my house, and this
is part of my testimony.

Speaker 4 (24:54):
You know, my husband and not been through things.

Speaker 1 (24:55):
Whatever, we were separated, Honey, she ain't want to come
home and be in this with him? What And I
had to forgive to see reconciliation in my house. And
I had to listen to God. And that's part of
the key. You gotta listen to God. You know what
God is saying to you. But do you want to

(25:16):
obey what God is.

Speaker 4 (25:17):
Saying to you? You don't?

Speaker 1 (25:19):
You got It takes you putting your flesh down, mortifying.
That means killing your flesh, you know. And we want
to preach nice, soft, cushy messages, but let me tell
you something.

Speaker 4 (25:34):
Walking where God is ugly.

Speaker 1 (25:37):
I'll give what nobody saying when you get down to
the to the nitty and the gritty of it. Walking
with God is ugly because your flesh is ugly.

Speaker 4 (25:45):
My flesh is ugly.

Speaker 1 (25:47):
And God will deal with us about our flesh and.

Speaker 4 (25:51):
How we think we are right.

Speaker 1 (25:54):
Come on, and so we gotta humble ourselves and understand
that we are commanded. This is not a request in
Ephesians for thirty one and thirty two.

Speaker 4 (26:05):
Be kind and compassionate. Come on, we got to learn
how to show compassion. We want compassion.

Speaker 1 (26:13):
Show to us, but we don't want to show it
to other people. And if Jesus forgave us, we must
it is and I need to say this, This is it.

Speaker 4 (26:23):
Forgiveness is a mandate. We are mandated by the Word
of God to forgive others.

Speaker 3 (26:30):
Which means, wow, this is so good, which means, Apostle,
we have to forgive quickly.

Speaker 2 (26:37):
Yes, doesn't mean that we got.

Speaker 3 (26:39):
Over the sting of the pain, because I heard you
talk about that, that sting.

Speaker 2 (26:44):
I'm coming to that state, the sting of the offense.

Speaker 3 (26:48):
But we have to forgive quickly because when we don't forgive,
we are literally opening ourselves up for the kingdom of darkness.

Speaker 2 (26:56):
Be forgiven says in this way said give no place
to the.

Speaker 3 (27:00):
Del no place, and let's forget an advantage.

Speaker 2 (27:05):
And so we have to We have to do it
the Bible way.

Speaker 3 (27:08):
And I believe that the people are gonna watch this
and maybe watching this who say, well.

Speaker 2 (27:12):
Whatever, you know, they hurt me. And I'm gonna hold
on to this until I'm good and real ready to
let it go. But the reality is if you do
that as you are not you're not in.

Speaker 3 (27:21):
Viible, you're outside of the outside of the scripture, or you're
really just responding to your feelings in your emotion because
it's a mandate that.

Speaker 2 (27:31):
We will, we should forgive.

Speaker 3 (27:32):
Stay close, guys, We'll be right back after this message.

Speaker 2 (27:38):
Show fans, I'm your girl. Past the shame listen.

Speaker 3 (27:40):
I've been hosting this show for six plus years. We
have amazing content. We've done shows such as the Urban
Church Overcome and Rejection When the Church Mother Speaks, That
was an amazing show, had me cracking up. But we
also did a show called The Games Women Play, and
you guys know we can play some games. What I
want to hear from the Let's Talk Show fans Wood

(28:03):
shows you will like for us to address with a
biblical perspective. Leave a coming below and don't forget to subscribe.

Speaker 2 (28:14):
Welcome back to the show.

Speaker 4 (28:15):
Listen.

Speaker 3 (28:16):
Today we're being dealing with the topic b e or
reconcund the power of forgiveness, and just before the break
apart of you were sharing you know, your experience in
that situation and and in full transparency it was, you know,
because the reality.

Speaker 2 (28:31):
Is offense is hurt. Let's be real.

Speaker 3 (28:34):
People can hurt us to the core. And sometime when
people get mad with you. One thing with people is
interesting to me is.

Speaker 2 (28:40):
People will get mad with you, run your name.

Speaker 3 (28:43):
Through the month, but they forget to talk about the
good you did for them.

Speaker 2 (28:48):
If you want to tell the story, let's tell the
whole story. And I guarantee you the good would a
way that lie. Amen, that was that was free.

Speaker 3 (28:58):
We're gonna go down. We're not gonna go down tonight. Amen, hallemah.
We want to continue.

Speaker 2 (29:05):
This is so good. We want to continue.

Speaker 3 (29:08):
Uh, And I want to pivot as we actually believe
it or not.

Speaker 2 (29:11):
Time wis facts. I want to talk about let's see,
let's see. Yeah, you brought this up earlier, but I
want to go back there because I believe we say
this so much. You know, I forgive it, but I'm
gonna forget.

Speaker 3 (29:28):
But based on our definition of offer, you haven't forgiven them.
If you're still saying I'm forgiven them and I'm not
gonna forget us to us to say I'm gonna keep
a racket in the chronicles of my heart on the
things they did to me.

Speaker 2 (29:43):
And so now I watch this, I'm letting Holy Spirit
need no more.

Speaker 3 (29:47):
I'm letting my the chronicles of my heart determine how
I respond to them.

Speaker 2 (29:51):
If I'm nice to them, should I talk to them?

Speaker 3 (29:54):
So now I've created this awn little self management stuff
going on, not not being.

Speaker 2 (29:59):
Led by the Holy So.

Speaker 3 (30:00):
I want to talk about that because a lot of
believers said it, Oh, I forgive them, but I'm surely
not gonna forget them.

Speaker 2 (30:06):
But reconciliation bear has fruit. Yes, talk about it, Apostle.

Speaker 1 (30:11):
Well, here, here's the here's the thing for us, And
we have so many examples in the scripture of what
reconciliation looks like.

Speaker 4 (30:19):
We are the product of it first and foremost because
we have been reconciled back to God.

Speaker 1 (30:24):
So they're checked right there here put put put a
little little ticket in that.

Speaker 4 (30:29):
Box, righty.

Speaker 1 (30:31):
We we love that, but but that just puts us
on the receiving end. But we have to look at
us as on the giving end of that. And and
like you said, sometimes it may still sting. We're not
talking about that it didn't happen. We're not saying that
it didn't hurt. We're not saying that you didn't experience
the pain that you have experienced. But you know, you

(30:54):
gotta begin to ask God to really take out this
stone hard because our hearts are hard by sin nature,
our hearts are hard, and so you got to go
to God and ask him to get that heart out
of you. But we have so many examples of what
reconciliation looks like.

Speaker 4 (31:14):
And again, it is that transforming that relationship. It's through mutuality.

Speaker 1 (31:21):
Both parties, okay, are agreeing that we are no longer
going to be enemies, We're going to be friends. Okay,
there's a transforming in that relationship. And so when we
look in scripture, we see Joseph and his brothers. Now,
think of think of that how God positioned him. Joseph

(31:42):
waited all of those years. Now some of us would
have been seething.

Speaker 4 (31:48):
Like a part of hot water.

Speaker 1 (31:53):
And when you realize your brothers walked in the room
and you got the upper hand. You know what I'm saying,
We be like how you're like, man, now, you know
what I'm saying, popping our collars, and that's not the
right spirit.

Speaker 4 (32:05):
The Bible shows us how Joseph's heart.

Speaker 1 (32:08):
Was broken when he saw his brothers, and he knew
that everything that he had experienced was all to get
him to the place where he was.

Speaker 4 (32:18):
Can't ID posit.

Speaker 1 (32:19):
To you tonight that the brokenness that you've experienced, the
pain that you have experienced, the betrayals that you have experienced,
the people lying on you, walking away from you, all
of that has been orchestrated by God.

Speaker 4 (32:31):
And we often say this, and I say this so
our church all the time.

Speaker 1 (32:35):
How we always quote the steps of a good man
or ordered by God? But how about winning them? Steps
order you to people walking over the front of you
and down the back of you. Have your steps been
ordered by God?

Speaker 4 (32:47):
Then? Oh?

Speaker 1 (32:48):
Yes they have. And so we see that in scripture.
We see that with Joseph and his brother. We see
that with David and Saul. David could have killed Saul,
but he understood but where God had positioned him. Do
you understand where God has positioned you? You gotta be
able to descern where you are and don't let flesh

(33:11):
cause you to get in a place where you don't
bear the fruit of that forgiveness. And let's talk about that,
because you know John the Baptists dealt with describes in
the Pharbacies when they came out into the wilderness while
he was out there baptizing right, he said, you scribes,
you know you you are vipers who told y'all to

(33:32):
come out here. You need to bring for a fruit
of repentance. Repentance had listen. Repentance has a look, it
is firit. Repentance has a look, and it's not eye rolling,
it's not sucking your teeth, it's not turning your back
on people. The fruit a real reconciliation and forgiveness is

(33:56):
being able to look past the wounds that were that
were inflicted upon you and love people regardless of what
has happened to you, because you realize that it's really
not about you.

Speaker 3 (34:10):
It is so I mean, Joseph in the text, I
think it's a Genesis fifty he said, he said, I'm
in the place of God.

Speaker 2 (34:17):
In other words, you meant it today for my evil,
but God meant it for my goodness. And actually it's
a mindset right about the mindset.

Speaker 3 (34:26):
And no matter what happened to me, I know that
even in that, even in the offense, in the mishandling,
the being misused, whatever, that brings us into this place
of the sting that we have a responsibility to forgive.
It's a mindset, it's a choice. Amen, And so wow,
this is good.

Speaker 2 (34:45):
This is good.

Speaker 3 (34:46):
So there really is no place for the believer to say, oh,
I forgive you, but I'm not gonna forget.

Speaker 4 (34:52):
It's not it's not the Bible way believers.

Speaker 2 (34:55):
Well, we say we forgive, we forget the matter of fact,
let's talk about that. The the text.

Speaker 3 (35:00):
I don't have description in front of me. Yeah I do,
Matthew chapter No, hold on, I think I had it.
I may have the other scripture. Can we put up
the other scripture tonight where Jesus, there we go, there
we go. Oh one, not that one. I want to
come back to that one. That's a good that's a
good one too. But this is subscription where Jesus Peter
is having a conversation with Jesus and Peter, Jesus, you

(35:24):
take Jesus.

Speaker 2 (35:24):
How often to forgive my brother.

Speaker 3 (35:31):
Seven? Jesus say no, no, no, Peter. And I'm prophrasing,
m hm. I can say when I.

Speaker 2 (35:42):
When I study that text in detail, one of the
things I.

Speaker 3 (35:45):
Learned apostle from studying that text is simply their So
if you offended me today, right, are you offended me
for whatever reason?

Speaker 2 (35:53):
I should give you. If you come back and offended
me again, I should forgive you.

Speaker 3 (35:58):
In other words, with Jesus was saying, there is no
limit to offense.

Speaker 2 (36:03):
It's the place where we extend mercy.

Speaker 1 (36:06):
Come on, we extend see to people, right yea, So Jesus, you.

Speaker 2 (36:12):
Know this is all work. It's like a mathematical gatalation.

Speaker 3 (36:17):
So she seventy times that's it, and I will forgive
it no more.

Speaker 2 (36:22):
He says, no, there's no limit.

Speaker 3 (36:23):
There's no limit there seventy times seven. It was never
about the seventy times seven.

Speaker 2 (36:28):
It's Jesus saying.

Speaker 3 (36:29):
That we don't really have a place, Henny, believers to
walk in unforgiveness. It should not be a fruit that
we bear. Unforgiveness should not be a fruit that a believer.

Speaker 2 (36:41):
That's right, period. It should not be a fruit there.

Speaker 3 (36:44):
And so listen, we got to we got to forgive.

Speaker 2 (36:49):
It's hard. So this forgive and forget it's just not
biblical sayings. It is not biblicult. And you also mentioned.

Speaker 3 (36:55):
Aponsole that depending on the on the the offense, you know,
you may have to the process like you say, working
on the reconciliation made me. Now I have to rebuild
trust and that takes time. Right, So it's not gonna
happen over life.

Speaker 2 (37:09):
But we have to forgive.

Speaker 3 (37:12):
I just keep hearing it like it's a choice, Like
we don't have her like forgive quickly when something happened.
Have a mindset that you know what, by the help
of Holy Spirit, I can forgive quickly.

Speaker 2 (37:24):
I let it go quickly, because the minute you give
the enemy an inch, he will he I mean, he will.

Speaker 4 (37:31):
Work that thing.

Speaker 3 (37:32):
He will thought about that situation, about that person and
illuminated before you, and you will think you're that person
being in an a thing from ten years ago, because
he's like remember when you when she passed you, and
she overlooked you, she passed the cake over you, and
a fool sense he will play in your mind when

(37:52):
when offense happened, forgive quickly, so you move.

Speaker 2 (37:55):
On, amen.

Speaker 3 (37:56):
I want to pivot too, unless you want to add
something a thought apostle right there.

Speaker 4 (38:01):
Yes, I just wanted to.

Speaker 1 (38:02):
I wanted to add to what you were saying there
and from that Matthew eighteen.

Speaker 4 (38:06):
And twenty one.

Speaker 1 (38:09):
Jesus was also saying to Peter, expect offenses to come.

Speaker 4 (38:15):
Expect it, right, you know, you say, oh.

Speaker 1 (38:17):
My god, I'm so surprised by so and so and
so doing that.

Speaker 4 (38:21):
Why why? Why?

Speaker 1 (38:24):
Because because things are gonna happen, you know what I'm saying.
I'm not saying to expect bad from people, but expect
to have to forgive because none of us are perfect, right,
and sometimes you can somebody can say something to you
and it causes pain inadvertently, you know, or it may
anger you or may offend you inadvertently. You know what

(38:46):
I'm saying, And so you gotta be ready. Jesus was
trying to help Peter to understand that you are going
to have to You're gonna have to position yourself to
show mercy to your brother, and that that's the thing
we're expecting perfection, you know.

Speaker 4 (39:05):
He said, how often shall I forgive.

Speaker 1 (39:07):
My brother, not a stranger, my brother, somebody I'm in
relationship with, somebody, somebody who's connected to me in my heart?

Speaker 4 (39:17):
How often should I forgive him?

Speaker 1 (39:19):
And he's saying, listen, expect misunderstanding, Expect offenses to come,
Expect for you to have to forgive him, and expect
to have to do it more than once, because if
I let you off the hook and say you only
got to do it one time, then you're gonna do
it at one time and walk away.

Speaker 4 (39:37):
True.

Speaker 2 (39:40):
You know I've experienced. You know, it's interesting.

Speaker 4 (39:42):
You know.

Speaker 3 (39:43):
My next question was around how do I forgive someone
who is in sorry or doesn't acknowledge the herd on offence.
But I want to spend that question around because I
have that experience where people will say, will come to
me after an entire year, It's like, oh my God,
Holy Spirit, to you for an entire year.

Speaker 2 (40:02):
Who we need to go on the altar? But like, like, you.

Speaker 3 (40:05):
Know, I had this thing in my heart against you,
and it's being brilliant like like, but see, my point is,
but I didn't even know that. You didn't even give
me the opportunity to reconcile teaching right there. You held
that in your heart that you said I said something,
did something. Whatever you want, you never came.

Speaker 4 (40:27):
You have a even that's.

Speaker 3 (40:29):
Not an excuse. That is not an excuse. The Bible
said of you not you go to me. You have
a respond.

Speaker 4 (40:36):
Let me know.

Speaker 3 (40:37):
You can't hold me a prisoner in your heart for
something you never told me.

Speaker 1 (40:42):
I Oh my god, oh my god, oh my god,
oh my god, said you know, I just know you.

Speaker 2 (40:51):
You have a respect teacher. Let me know because in
the kingdom, because a mindset and our hearts towards reconciliation.
If you come to me and I the same mindset,
we will work that thing out.

Speaker 3 (41:05):
The enemy will tell you to do is hold on
to that thing right so he can feed it and
he can see it, and he can just develop and
develop and develop and watch this maybe maybe about just
maybe I don't know, maybe there was something in me
watch that that belong to you.

Speaker 2 (41:22):
But because you allow a fence to.

Speaker 3 (41:24):
Block it, Come on, James, the enemy play and our
emotions when we hold on two offenses and unforgiveness.

Speaker 1 (41:33):
Well I want to I want to address that, because
you know, we try to make that our excuse, but
you know what every man's gonna be without excuse, because
were gonna get this word.

Speaker 4 (41:41):
Okay, we're gonna get this word.

Speaker 1 (41:44):
And so I want to read verse the scripture Matthew
twelve excuse me not Matthew Romans twelve and eighteen. Yes,
I get it that sometimes it seems like reconciliation is
not possible, right. I know that Sometimes we'll say, well,
you know, I'm I did everything I could, and you
know I didn't know nothing about it, and they did

(42:04):
this and I have no idea.

Speaker 4 (42:06):
Listen to me.

Speaker 1 (42:07):
There's a process to how we should be walking with God.

Speaker 4 (42:11):
Okay, exactly exactly.

Speaker 1 (42:17):
And so if you know you come to the place
where you didn't know about it, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (42:25):
You were just you know, totally unaware.

Speaker 1 (42:27):
Or you did your best to bring reconciliation and you
were unable.

Speaker 4 (42:34):
Okay, Well, let's see what the scripture says. Okay, in
these cases, you are still required to forgive. You are
not off the hook.

Speaker 1 (42:42):
You are still required to forgive, You are required to
release the offense to God, and you are still required
to walk in peace.

Speaker 4 (42:53):
Do you hear what I said?

Speaker 1 (42:54):
You are still required to forgive, to release the offense
to God, and to walk in peace. That means you're
not running around here. Well you know Sally did X,
Y and Z to me and she a devil. No,
that's not what you're doing. Come on here, walk in peace.
I'm gonna give you because we say it like this.

(43:16):
If I can book it, I can live it. So
let me book it for you. Romans twelve and eighteen
tells us that it's as if it's possible, as much
as lie as in you to be at peace with
all men and holiness, without which no man shall see
the Lord. So if you don't live in peace with people,

(43:36):
not just holiness, see we like to Oh, you gotta
live holy, but you gotta be at peace with people too.

Speaker 4 (43:41):
Hell raisers are not going to heaven. Come. Hell raisers
are not going to heaven. That's number one. Number two.

Speaker 1 (43:54):
Mark eleven and twenty five tells us to forgive others
so that our father in heaven will forget us.

Speaker 2 (44:01):
Right.

Speaker 1 (44:02):
Then we also have Psalm thirty four fourteen. You know
why I know these verses a scripture. You know why
this stuff is in my notes because I gotta keep
my heart clean too. I'm not telling you nothing that
is not a reality for me every single day, to
keep my heart clean, to walk in love with my brethren.

Speaker 4 (44:23):
Let me explain something to you.

Speaker 1 (44:24):
We have responsibility, right, and I'm gonna read the verse
of scripture. But this is Psalm thirty four to fourteen.
It says seek peace and pursue it. Pursue it yes,
even when reconciliation fails.

Speaker 4 (44:38):
This is what you're supposed to do.

Speaker 1 (44:40):
Seek peace and pursue it. Pursue after peace, go after
it with everything that's in you. You know how you
go after trying to clear your name with somebody lied
on you?

Speaker 4 (44:52):
Come, come on here, didn't I say to you in
the beginning?

Speaker 1 (44:57):
You are called to forgive, you are call to release
the offense, and you are called to walk in peace.
So you cannot you cannot use as an excuse you
know what I'm saying. Well, I tried and they didn't
want to receive what I had to say. You still,
you still are required by God, mandated.

Speaker 4 (45:20):
To forgive, to release it, and to walk in peace.

Speaker 1 (45:24):
And not just walk in peace, but pursuit peace.

Speaker 4 (45:28):
Are you pursuing?

Speaker 1 (45:29):
That means you chasing it, You running after it, even
if it seems like it's evading you.

Speaker 4 (45:35):
You going after it. You chase it until you can
catch it.

Speaker 2 (45:39):
Wow, that's serious. Oh yeah, no, that's powerful and that's something.

Speaker 3 (45:51):
Pursue peace, right, Yes, it's it's what we should bear. Listens,
as we're getting ready to bring this whole discussion to close,
want to deal with the we be tald I think.

Speaker 2 (46:03):
We've defined it.

Speaker 3 (46:04):
We've talked about, you know, the definition of it.

Speaker 2 (46:07):
What is reconciliation? What is forgiveness?

Speaker 3 (46:09):
We give biblical definition, biblical models, biblical example, which leaves
everyone watching this and everyone that will watch there's no
excuse not to forgive quickly.

Speaker 2 (46:21):
That's the that's the key undertune out.

Speaker 3 (46:24):
Of this whole conversation, to give quickly and pursue reconciliation. Right,
I want to talk about though, the consequences of walking
in unforgiveness. Let's talk about some people understand the dinner
is what every every decision, Your decision is.

Speaker 2 (46:43):
What brings consequences, whether good or bad.

Speaker 3 (46:47):
And so when we talk about the what are some
of the consequences of walking and unforgiveness.

Speaker 1 (46:53):
Of possible Well, you know, one of the things that
we don't understand is that when we start with walking
in unforgiveness, initially, initially it seems like there aren't any Initially,
it seems like nothing is happening because I'm not walking
in forgiveness like I should, right, you know, or because

(47:14):
I'm still holding on too grudges.

Speaker 4 (47:16):
But you know what, everything that you.

Speaker 1 (47:18):
Start holding onto in your heart right number one, you
are closing God's.

Speaker 4 (47:25):
Ear to you. That's that's that's number one. Okay. You
can be thinking that you're going into prayer and God
is hearing you.

Speaker 1 (47:33):
We've already quoted scripture that show us that if you
do not forgive, God will not forgive you.

Speaker 4 (47:39):
So so let's just put.

Speaker 1 (47:41):
It in plane old basic layman's terms. You going to
hell with gasoline draws on.

Speaker 4 (47:47):
Okay, that's.

Speaker 2 (47:53):
V I p's VP delivery be ip.

Speaker 1 (47:57):
You got you a b I P ticket, Okay, because
you do not, and that is one of the worst
consequences walking in unforgiveness is that God is not hearing you,
that you have shut yourself off from God and now
you face eternal damnation because you don't want.

Speaker 4 (48:19):
To let something go. That's number one.

Speaker 1 (48:21):
Number two, it is a scientific fact that people who
walk in unforgiveness end up with all kinds of heart trouble,
have your pressure, acid reflux disease, heart attacks, cancers, and
all kinds of things that fester in your body because

(48:41):
the bile, the bitterness of unforgiveness that takes root now
starts having physical manifestations because you refuse to let go
of something that happened in your past. So now you're
on your way to hell and you sick. You going real.

Speaker 4 (49:03):
Fast, you go, you going real fast. You don't even
have no time.

Speaker 1 (49:11):
You are cutting your own life short because you don't
want to let go of something that somebody did to you,
you know what I'm saying. And so these are things
that we gotta we gotta think about this and way
our options, way your options. Is it worth you dying
and going to hell? Or you mean to tell me
Jesus died for you. You left the world, came over

(49:34):
into the church, and you're gonna let a grudge take
you to hell after you came out of all the
hell you went through. You gotta be kidding me. Come on,
you gotta be kidding me.

Speaker 4 (49:44):
You. Unforgiveness is a poison. It is a poison. You
gotta let it go, yes, ma'am.

Speaker 2 (49:52):
You know. I well, it's so funny you said that.
It's like a I'm just reading it says.

Speaker 3 (50:00):
Forgiveness is like drinking poison, expecting.

Speaker 4 (50:04):
The other persons to cost.

Speaker 2 (50:07):
The offense to die, and so wow, I mean, it's.

Speaker 3 (50:10):
This is real that when you walk in unforgiveness, you
open up yourself to the spirit up infirmity.

Speaker 2 (50:17):
And so yes, it has.

Speaker 3 (50:18):
Been proven that sickness is tied directly to unforgiveness.

Speaker 2 (50:22):
And so believe us we got to check that place.

Speaker 3 (50:26):
We have to do self examination tonight and ask the Lord.
The momble says, no man knows the heart, but God
ab the Lord to check the fortements of our heart,
the crevices of.

Speaker 2 (50:37):
Our heart, to see if there's anything in there.

Speaker 3 (50:41):
Because one thing I know about the place of unforgiveness.
The enemy will let you think that you're forgiven that person,
and that you go on your little happy way and
tell the moment you're about to step into something big,
and then all of a sudden he opens up an
issue in the course of heaven and say, hey, Jesus.

Speaker 2 (50:58):
He take look at that stuff she's still.

Speaker 3 (51:01):
Holding there and for them to strom pursuing and doing
the things that God has for us.

Speaker 2 (51:08):
Man that it's a scary place to walk in the
place about.

Speaker 4 (51:12):
The news cannot add this to this.

Speaker 1 (51:14):
You may mention of this versus scripture earlier when we
were talking. And this is Matthew eighteen twenty three through
thirty five, and I want to read this in the amplified,
and it says therefore the Kingdom of Heaven is like
a human king who wished to settle accounts with his attendants.

Speaker 4 (51:27):
When he began the accountant.

Speaker 1 (51:29):
One was brought to him, who owed him ten thousand talents,
probably about ten million dollars. And because he could not
pay his master. He because he could not pay, his master,
ordered him to be sold with his wife and his
children and everything that he possessed, and payment to be made.

Speaker 4 (51:45):
So the attendant fell on his knees.

Speaker 1 (51:47):
Begging him, have patience with me, and I will pay
you everything. And his master, his master's heart was moved
with compassion, and he released him and forgave him, canceling
the debt. But the same attendant, as he went out,
found one of his fellow attendants who owed him one
hundred dinari, which was about twenty dollars, was way less

(52:08):
than what he owed, and he caught him by the
throat and said, pay what you owe. So his fellow
attendant fell down and begged him earnestly, give.

Speaker 4 (52:17):
Me time and I will pay you.

Speaker 1 (52:18):
But he was unwilling, and he went out and had
him put into prison till he should pay the debt.
When his fellow attendant saw what had happened, they were
greatly distressed, and they went and told everything that had
taken place to their master. Then his master called to
him and said to him, you contemptible and wicked attendant,
I forgave and listen to the scripture, My God, halle lujah,

(52:43):
you contemptible and wicked attended. I forgave and canceled all
that great debt of yours, because you begged me too.
And should you not have had pity and mercy on
your fellow attendance, as I had pity and mercy on you.

Speaker 4 (52:58):
Who are you who's holding a grudge? This word?

Speaker 1 (53:01):
And in wrath, his master turned him over to the
torturers till he should pay all that he owed. So also,
my heavenly father will deal with every one of you.
If you do not freely forgive your brother from your
heart of his offenses. Hear the word of the Lord.
You want a prophecy, hear the word of the Lord.

(53:23):
If you do not forgive, God is going to turn
you over to the tormentors. He's going to turn you
over to be tortured. Unforgiveness is torment, Come on, y,
it is torment.

Speaker 4 (53:37):
It is torture.

Speaker 1 (53:38):
That's why you can't sleep, and you keep running these
the same scenarios through your mind all night long because
you don't want to forgive. I don't care what how
difficult your divorce was. I don't care who stole money
from you. I don't care who did whatever it is
that they have.

Speaker 4 (53:56):
Done to you.

Speaker 1 (53:57):
You need to let go so that you do not
find yourself in a place where God torments you and
allows you to be tortured.

Speaker 4 (54:07):
The scripture is plain.

Speaker 1 (54:08):
He said, so also, my heavenly Father, and this is
Jesus telling this parable.

Speaker 4 (54:13):
He said, so also, my heavenly Father will do with
every one of.

Speaker 5 (54:17):
You if you do not freely forgive your brother, your brother,
your sister in Christ, that one that your heart is
connected to, that one that you got relationship with, this torment.

Speaker 4 (54:31):
You got to ask God.

Speaker 1 (54:32):
To get this thing out of you, get this bitterness
out of you. God is sending this word to us
tonight because he does not want to allow us to
find ourselves lost in eternity over something minor. You're letting
things torment you for years. You've been holding on to
grudges for years. You've been holding on to what somebody
else did to you. For years, You've been holding on

(54:54):
to who left you, who's not your friend no more,
who don't want to talk to you no more, that
marriage that ended.

Speaker 4 (55:00):
You know what I'm saying. You don't got time to
hold that stuff in your heart no more.

Speaker 1 (55:04):
You gotta give that stuff to God. You gotta give
this to God. The Lord is dealing with us tonight.

Speaker 4 (55:11):
And I know that.

Speaker 1 (55:13):
None of us, none of us, want to be able
to be turned over to no tormentors, so that we
are lost, so that we do not or that we're
not able to walk in the things of God.

Speaker 4 (55:27):
I know it hurts. I know it happened to you.
I know they did it. Listen.

Speaker 1 (55:32):
God didn't say they didn't do it. But you have
a responsibility to forgive. Even if you feel like reconciliation
is not possible. That person may have died, that person
may may moved to another state. That person may have
blocked you, won't talk to you, won't answer your phone calls. Listen,
you still have a responsibility to pursue peace, to pursue

(55:55):
to forgive, to release it to God, and to pursue peace.
That is your responsibility. God, is gonna hold you accountable
for you. He's not hold you accountable for anybody else.
He's not holding you accountable for anybody else. We have
gone off for biblical examples. We have talked about personal examples.

(56:16):
We're hearing what Jesus is saying to us.

Speaker 4 (56:18):
Now, what will you do, oh child of God?

Speaker 1 (56:21):
Will you go into eternity holding onto a grudge, thinking
that you're gonna take your last breath and open your
eyes in heaven when in reality, you're gonna find yourself
opening your eyes in hell because you're holding a grudge.
I don't care who didn't meet your standard, who didn't
keep their word, who you feel like is not trustworthy,
who you feel like did things to you. I keep

(56:43):
your heart and your mind.

Speaker 4 (56:44):
Stayed on Jesus, ask God to help you, and I'm
gonna give you a couple of steps.

Speaker 1 (56:49):
While we're waiting for for pastor Chevy to come back,
I'm gonna give you a couple of steps to work
through conflict and reconciliation.

Speaker 4 (56:56):
Real quick. Number one, we said self examination.

Speaker 1 (56:59):
Number two, go directly to them, go directly to the
Matthew eighteen and fifteen tells us that we're supposed to
address them privately, go to them privately.

Speaker 4 (57:08):
We have scripture about this.

Speaker 1 (57:10):
We always talk about well with Bible says, what you
buying on earth, shall we bound in heaven? What you
loose on earth, shall we loose in heaven? And were
thinking that's talking about devils.

Speaker 4 (57:17):
No, that's talking about forgiveness and debts.

Speaker 2 (57:20):
Come on, Yes, it's.

Speaker 4 (57:23):
About letting people go.

Speaker 1 (57:24):
Number three, bring a witness if they don't want to,
if they don't want to receive you. Scripture says, bring
a witness. If it's unresolved, bring one or two witnesses
with you. I'm telling you how to work through conflict
and reconcile with your brother, if reconciliation is really your goal.
Number four, involve the church. Bring it to the church. Well,

(57:45):
I don't want to bring massy. Bring it to the
church that the church. Listen, we're gonna judge the world,
how we gonna judge the world, and we can't even
judge matters between one another.

Speaker 2 (57:56):
Come on this teaching.

Speaker 4 (57:58):
So this is stuff that is scripture. Bring it to
the church.

Speaker 1 (58:01):
Matthew eighteen and seventeen tells us that if this, if
it's unresolved, after you.

Speaker 4 (58:05):
Bring it to the witnesses.

Speaker 1 (58:06):
Bring witnesses with you, then you bring spiritual leadership and
involve them, and then finally forgive from the heart. When
you forgive from the heart, you're not holding grudges no more.
Matthew eighteen twenty one and twenty two tells us that
we should choose forgiven forgiveness even if.

Speaker 4 (58:25):
It's not asked for.

Speaker 1 (58:27):
So here God's speaking to us, and like God is
not angry with us.

Speaker 4 (58:30):
The Lord don't want us to be lost, but he
don't want us walking around holding grudges either. So you
gotta choose to forgive, just like you choose you this day,
whom you're gonna serve.

Speaker 1 (58:41):
Are you gonna serve your emotions or are you gonna
serve God with your whole heart and forgive like the
Bible tells us.

Speaker 3 (58:48):
Wow, Wow, what a way, What a way to bring
this broadcast to a close. Thank you so much, Apostle
for your time, for your wisdom.

Speaker 2 (59:00):
It was so good and I was actually.

Speaker 3 (59:01):
On I just want you all straight, because I just
wanted you to just flow and say.

Speaker 2 (59:06):
What God wanted you to say.

Speaker 3 (59:08):
Amazing, And so it is my prayer that something that
we've said tonight really touch some hearts and will cause
you know, erroneous thinking to be erroneous thinking to be dispelled.
Like we will really approach forgiveness to right way, the
biblical way.

Speaker 2 (59:24):
And that is as believe it's guys, we don't have
a choice.

Speaker 3 (59:28):
We have to forgive quickly. The word of God leads
us with no excuse.

Speaker 2 (59:34):
We've heard it. We've heard the word.

Speaker 3 (59:36):
Now we have to take what we've heard and apply
it into our daily lives.

Speaker 2 (59:41):
And guess what, we have a holy spirit that is
there to help us to walk in the place of forgiveness.
Any final words are possible for we close.

Speaker 1 (59:50):
Well, I just want to pray a prayer real quick
for those of us that are watching and those that
are going to come back and watch later. So Father,
we pray right now. God, you already know the difficulty
that we face. We know the pain, Lord, and you
know the pain Lord that those that are watching or
God that are gonna watch, that they have experienced.

Speaker 4 (01:00:07):
Now follow we pray for grace. We pray for.

Speaker 1 (01:00:09):
Strength God to be able to choose to forgive. Lord,
we give you every pain, we give you every art,
we give you every.

Speaker 4 (01:00:16):
Issue that has taking place. And follow.

Speaker 1 (01:00:18):
We don't want to allow anything to keep us out
of heaven. We don't want to be lost, and so
we ask you Lord, give us grace that we will
forgive even as you have forgiven us.

Speaker 4 (01:00:28):
And we give you praise and honor.

Speaker 1 (01:00:29):
Thank you for your word dealing with our hearts tonight,
and we declare over us that we will release everything
to you and pursue peace in Jesus's name.

Speaker 4 (01:00:39):
Amen.

Speaker 3 (01:00:40):
Amen, Thank you so much apos Sole, for being our
guests on tonight and doing such a tremendous job helping
us deal in the topic.

Speaker 2 (01:00:49):
Do you reconcile the power of forgiveness? Listen, it's my
life free. It's simply this.

Speaker 3 (01:00:55):
Always put God first and all else, and all else
will follow.

Speaker 2 (01:01:00):
It's all for washing to tonight. God, bless you.