July 9, 2025 • 30 mins
When her mother was suddenly left alone under difficult and unexpected circumstances, Marie Swift found herself navigating the emotional and logistical complexities of elder care, spousal loss, and shifting family dynamics. With candor and compassion, she reflects on the lessons learned—both personal and financial—during a time of crisis, offering insight into the importance of asking the right questions and finding clarity amidst chaos.
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Ask Good Questions is broadcast live Wednesdays at 6PM ET on W4CY Radio (www.w4cy.com) part of Talk 4 Radio (www.talk4radio.com) on the Talk 4 Media Network (www.talk4media.com). Ask Good Questions is viewed on Talk 4 TV (www.talk4tv.com).
Ask Good Questions Podcast is also available on Talk 4 Media (www.talk4media.com), Talk 4 Podcasting (www.talk4podcasting.com), iHeartRadio, Amazon Music, Pandora, Spotify, Audible, and over 100 other podcast outlets.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
The topics and opinions express in the following show are
solely those of the hosts and their guests, and not
those of W FOURCY Radio. It's employees are affiliates. We
make no recommendations or endorsements for radio show programs, services,
or products mentioned on air or on our web. No
liability explicitor implies shall be extended to W FOURCY Radio
or its employees are affiliates. Any questions or comments should
be directed to those show hosts. Thank you for choosing
(00:21):
W FOURCY Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Welcome to to Ask Good Questions Podcasts, broadcasting live every Wednesday,
six pm Eastern Time on W four CY Radio at
w four cy dot com. This week and every week,
we will reach for a higher purpose in money and life,
as well as a focus on health and wellnes. Now,
(00:49):
let's join your host, Anita bell Anderson as together we
start with Asking Good Questions.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Hello, this is your host, Benita bell Anderson, and welcome
to the Ask Good Questions podcast. We are so excited
that you're here today. We have an extra special guest,
someone that I've known now for a while and I've
been watching her progress. She's also in the financial industry.
Her name is Marie Swift, and I would love to
(01:23):
invite her to the Proverbial podcast stage right now. Hello, Hello, Hello, Hello.
I'm so glad you're here. I've been looking forward to
this conversation because I feel like this is going to
be such an important topic that everyone needs to be
thinking about and hear about. So I'm going to read
(01:45):
this little diddy about you and then we'll get into
our discussion. All right, sounds good, Okay, Well, here's here's
a little short bio about Marie. Our guest today is
Marie Swift, found and CEO of Impact Communications. While known
for her expertise in the financial services industry, and I
(02:08):
want to tell you, yeah, this girl gets around. Marie
joins us today in a deeply personal capacity. She'll be
sharing her family's experience navigating the complexities of eldercare, sudden
spousal change, and the challenging dynamics that emerged when her
(02:28):
mother became suddenly single under unexpected and difficult circumstances. Marie
will bring a unique perspective, blending her professional understanding of
financial matters with the raw emotional realities of family crisis,
and will share valuable lessons learned about asking the right
(02:51):
questions in times of immense stress and change. So have
you got any beginning thought that you'd like to begin with.
Speaker 4 (03:02):
Well, as I thought about this conversation today, Bonnie, I
was nervous. I am a professional communicator. I do marketing
and pr for a living. I've done it for a
very long time. I coach people on how to be
articulate and gracious and graceful under pressure. But this is,
as you said, a very deeply personal and vulnerable matter
(03:26):
for me, and it is a little raw. I just
got back two days ago from an unexpected respite care
visit to help my sister. Bless her heart, she is
just a saint. My sister is now the primary caregiver
for my mother, and we're going to talk about that.
But my initial thinking is that life comes at you
(03:48):
in unexpected ways, and I'm a better person for the journey.
But it has been hard.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
Yeah. I have got many examples in my family, including
my mother and my sister and my brother. Yeah, I'm
with you. Well, can you take us back. Let's begin here.
Can you take us back when you first realized that
your mother was going to need care.
Speaker 4 (04:16):
Yeah, at the time that the stroke happened. My mom
was eighty nine. This was November last year, so about
eight months ago, and she wanted to continue living independently.
We had no idea that a stroke was in her future.
She was living independently. She was living in a community
(04:37):
of other people in an independent retirement community, very active singing,
going to the community choir that she practiced in her
church activities, you know, all of the things.
Speaker 5 (04:50):
With her family.
Speaker 4 (04:51):
I live in Kansas City, my sister lives in Idaho,
my mom lives in Utah, and we have three brothers
who are in Colorado.
Speaker 5 (05:00):
In California.
Speaker 4 (05:01):
So when my mom decided that her right hand was
excuse me, her left hand was bothering her with carpal
tunnel and she wanted to continue to play the piano,
one of the loves of her life. She thought, well,
carpal tunnel surgery will take care of that.
Speaker 5 (05:17):
Well.
Speaker 4 (05:17):
As a result of getting ready for that surgery and
taking her off her medication some of her blood dinners,
she actually a stroke happened because of that, and so
fortuitously I was there to help her recover from the
carpal tunnel surgery. But when I woke up that morning,
it was as if there was a voice drawing me
(05:38):
out of my air mattress in the living room. It said, Marie,
get up, and it was a man's voice, and I
could guess that maybe it was a divine calling for
me to wake up and to check on my mother.
And she was in her bed just a short distance
from me. And it's hard to hear over some of
(05:59):
them metal devices, like oxygen machines. But I went and
she was having a stroke. And it took me a
minute to realize that she was having what they call
a waking stroke, where you wake up and it's very scary.
You're having a stroke as you come out of sleep.
So those were the moments where everything changed. I had
come in for a three day visit to keep my
(06:21):
mom company while she recovered from what should have been
minor surgery, and instead this complication meant that she would
have long term medical care needs.
Speaker 3 (06:33):
Wow, well, how did that sudden change impact her? I
mean emotionally and physically. You know it must have been
I mean, I I you know, I always joke about this.
It's like, this is never going to happen to you
and me, Right, We're not gonna We're not going to
I can only imagine because you and I are both
(06:55):
strong independent women, and I'm guessing that your mom was
probably a strong independent woman, right. My mom taught us
all how to ATV ride, and she would rep her engine,
look over her shoulder and say eat my dust as
she would race away and leave us behind in her dusk.
So she taught us how to be strong, independent people.
(07:17):
And so as a single mother raising five rather rambunctious children,
me being the oldest of the five, she led the
example of being independent, being self reliant, having that good
pioneering spirit and put your shoulder to the wheel and
do what you need to do and just suck it
up buttercup and no cry babies allowed.
Speaker 5 (07:39):
So my mom was like that.
Speaker 4 (07:41):
She was tender, she was sweet, but she knew how
to get stuff done. And that's how she raised her kids.
And I am I am a credit to her. I
hope and I hope to continue to make her proud
throughout the rest of my life and beyond. So, yes,
my mom was independent, living independently at age eight and
men she moved her the retirement village because she was
(08:04):
forced out of her home when her husband became significantly ill.
With dementia, like the bad kind of dementia that feels
like Alzheimer's but they don't call it that. Where there
was a lot of aggression and bless his Hearty was
a sweet gentleman for most of their eighteen year marriage,
but towards the end he was not himself, and so
(08:28):
that blended family. The other siblings said, asked that she
leave the home with three days notice, asked that she
take her things immediately with three days notice, because she
was no longer needed in the caregiver capacity. And so
with three days notice, we moved her out of that
home where she'd lived with her husband for eighteen years
(08:50):
and moved her to the independent residential community where she
had some quite a bit of adjustments. So she wasn't
quite single at that point because her husband was still alive,
and yet he was not the man that she married
where they had so many good years together, and so
we had to recuperate from that wound, those hardships, all
(09:11):
of that financial hardship, and the adjustment emotionally and mentally
from that, and then eighteen months.
Speaker 5 (09:20):
Later the stroke. So that's a lot.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
Well did it make her? Was she angry or how?
Speaker 4 (09:29):
Yes, the situation with the blended family. She was angry,
she was sad, she was confused, she felt jilted, she
felt thrown out. We were all angry, confused, and there
was There were conversations with attorneys and clergy and other
people therapists to help us through this, But at the
(09:52):
end of the day, the daughters of her husband moved
him to a memory care center and we were forced
to move our mother to independent living when she could
have and wanted to stay in their family home.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Yeah, well, what were the most immediate challenges for you?
Speaker 4 (10:13):
Well, so, during the time of transition from the marriage
unraveling due to the dementia and the blended family complications,
there were a lot of challenges supporting moms. So my
sister and I were able to be there for Mom
to support her through all of that and the decision
making that had to occur. But she did eventually get
(10:34):
settled and was relatively happy in the independent living environment
where she made new friends and so forth. So there
were a lot of immediate challenges and needs to be
there with Mom, but nothing like the journey that unfolded
when she had her stroke in November.
Speaker 3 (10:51):
Yeah. Well, I'm just wondering from a you know, because
we're both financial professionals, but from your perspective, and I
think this is really unique because since you're in the
financial industry, what are some of the biggest surprises or
blind spots that you think that you encountered with this.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
Yeah, so I had no idea how Medicare works. And
my mom has a Medicare advantage plan, and she also
has a secondary Medicare gap policy. Now that may sound unusual,
but my mom was working at Utah Valley Hospital for
so many years and they had this wonderful retiring benefit
(11:33):
where she had a gap policy to fill the bills
and the medical bills that came along that the advantage
plan wouldn't pay. So we had relatively few financial worries
as long as we fought the insurance system. And so
what we found is that the insurance system for people
(11:55):
of a certain age with a certain prognosis is geared
towards discharging them. And we had to use some pretty
tough positioning to advocate for our mother, who said she
wanted to live. She wasn't done living, she had more
life to live, she had more stories to tell. So
we had to really work hard. My sister and I
(12:15):
to figure out a way to convince the two insurance carriers,
if you will, or the different divisions to work together
to create a plan and not to discharge on mother prematurely.
We also found that some of the medical facilities, such
as the skilled nursing centers and the stroke centers that
(12:37):
we were encountering, that they were ready to push her
out and give up on her.
Speaker 5 (12:41):
And so we advocated for.
Speaker 4 (12:43):
Her financially and also with medical care, even in the
face of medical providers telling us to give up.
Speaker 3 (12:52):
Yeah, you know, I'm thinking about my sister. My sister
had this horrendous autoimmune things that went on for her.
Her We fouindly. We finally ended up taking her home
from the facility where we had her and having a
whole huge, long, roundabout thing with different members of the
(13:13):
family helping care as well as like two or three nurses.
But my sister, you know, I'm just thinking about what
the patient thinks about. My sister looked at me one
day when I was caring for her, and she says,
I never thought this would happen, yeah, you know, And
I was like, I never thought this would happen either.
(13:34):
You know, and so you just it's as much as
you know, we have both you know, had all these
years in the financial industry, but there's nothing that quite
prepares you for that individual personal experience that was happening
to you, right.
Speaker 4 (13:53):
Yeah, I mean, you know, once our mother got through
the acute care from the urgency room up to the
stroke unit at Utah Valley Hospital and into the elite
rehab where they put her on a feeding tube and
that was pretty hard to watch, told her that she
wouldn't walk again, eat again, talk again, give up.
Speaker 5 (14:15):
You know, all of that.
Speaker 4 (14:16):
We advocated for her care and we kept asking her, mom,
is this what you want? And she says she wanted
to continue on. But to see your hero, your mother
go through this and the frailty of life and the
human condition, it's really eye opening when you see all
of that. And you know, there's a lot of humility
(14:39):
that comes into the equation from not just that hospital experience,
but into a skilled nursing center where they said she
needs to go to a nursing home and we said,
not going to happen, not in our DNA.
Speaker 5 (14:52):
We don't do that in our family.
Speaker 4 (14:54):
So if you fast forward from the skilled nursing center
where they said give us, You've done all you can.
And then we went to we moved from Utah Valley
up to Salt Lake Valley where we had different team members.
She said, yes, we can still work with her. Yes,
there's still progress to be made. Stroke centers and another
(15:14):
rehabilitation stroke hospital, and now into outpatient therapies and now
home therapies. She is talking, she is singing, she is
walking with a walker, she is telling her stories. She
still needs a twenty four to seven companion, but that's okay.
There's still good life to live. And that journey is priceless.
(15:37):
The moments that we've shared, the mother daughter experiences, the prayers,
the fasting, the family circles. It has changed me profoundly
about what it means to be a human being.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
So basically, what I think i'm hearing you say is
don't give up. Do what you know is right. And
from a you know and I'm thinking from a financial perspective,
what would you tell our listeners, what should they what
should they have in place? What financial documents or arrangements
(16:11):
do you think would be most helpful with something like this?
Speaker 4 (16:16):
Fortunately for us, our mother has been a planner. She
had been a single mom raising the five of us
for so long. She did have a second marriage where
he passed away, and then she remarried into this third marriage,
and then you heard this story about how that unraveled.
But Mom had always been independent, and so she had
a will, she had a trust. She'd been preparing my
(16:38):
sister and I to take over her finances and her logistics,
and what to do with the family home when it
came time to sell, how to divvy things up, where
her bank accounts were, where her keys were, meeting her
financial advisor, going to the CPA. So we've been doing
this like a rehearsal for what happens to Mom? What
do we do if something happens to Mom? But we
(17:00):
didn't expect it to happen because of a stroke. We
expected because her pacemaker would give out after a certain
number of years. And so we had done all of
these things. But I would say to those who don't
have those things, if you don't have those things in place,
and you're also having to manage the medical and emotional
side of things and the logistics, man, you are in trouble.
(17:22):
So thankfully, for us, it was a horrible journey, but
a wonderful journey in so many ways. But we didn't
have to worry about where are the keys? What do
we do about the renters? You know, how do we
manage the taxes and the finances?
Speaker 3 (17:37):
What do you think you learned about the elder care system?
You know, whether that's legal or medical or housing.
Speaker 5 (17:44):
That you wish more families knew.
Speaker 4 (17:48):
Have a plan, know ahead what you what the contingencies
might or might not be. We never expected this to
happen so well. We'd been good planners. We didn't expect
that mom would have us need to move from her
home to an independent living center, from an independent living
center into assisted or home care twenty four to seven.
(18:09):
So just think through those scenarios and beyond the financials
and the logistics, like what could happen? And how could
you be prepared for that at least thinking through your
options ahead of time.
Speaker 3 (18:22):
Do you feel like, what are the moments that come
to mind that you feel like the system failed you
and filled your family and failed your mother most particularly.
Speaker 4 (18:35):
You know, we slept by our mother's bed, My sister
and I took turns twenty four to seven. We were
with her and not that we didn't trust the medical care.
We were in some of the best facilities in Utah
Valley and Salt Lake Valley, but we saw that mistakes
were made and that people who are in a condition
(18:56):
where they can't advocate for themselves, they need people there
to advocate. So it's not a failure so much is
just a weak spot in the way care gets delivered,
and that people are even medical professionals make mistakes and
make bad judgment calls. So I would say that the failure,
the chinks that we saw were in competencies from time
(19:20):
to time and.
Speaker 5 (19:21):
Just people saying give up.
Speaker 4 (19:24):
But that's not what we're going to do, and the
family continue to advocate for her and to make the
care better for her because the days that she has
ahead they may not be as many as as she
would like, but we think she has another several.
Speaker 5 (19:39):
Good years left and we're want the best of them.
Speaker 3 (19:43):
Yeah, you want it to be the best that it
can be. Yeah, Well, do you feel like you have
there been instances where you had to balance honoring your
mother's wishes with making critical decisions on her behalf. I mean,
are you you know?
Speaker 2 (19:59):
So?
Speaker 3 (19:59):
I know from my personal experience where like my sister
would say, I don't want you to be here. You
can go, you need to go away, But I knew
that I was going to stay there. So how did
you ever? Do you have something that comes to mind
when thinking about balancing what their wishes are with what
(20:21):
you know needs to happen.
Speaker 4 (20:23):
I remember when we moved Mom out of her independent
living apartment up to an airbnb to be closer to
her therapies, that she sat on the bed and she
was having a moment of despair, and she said, just
take me to the nursing home. I don't want to
be a burden anymore for you girls. And we sat
(20:46):
side by side with her and we hugged her, and
I felt to say to her, Mom, you don't belong there,
you don't belong in a nursing home.
Speaker 5 (20:56):
We will work our way through this.
Speaker 4 (20:57):
So her wish in that moment was of despair not
to be a burden on us, But we knew that
what we would really want to do personally and in
her honor, her wish when she's not despairing is to
continue on to be tough and to continue to get
the therapies and the medical care that have made a
difference where the prayers that were answered are that she
(21:22):
has continued to exceed all expectations for a now ninety
year old woman. Yeah, well, what do you think your
mother would want others to know from her experience of
becoming suddenly single. Well, she told me on this last
trip when I was in Utah with her, make sure
(21:44):
if you get remarried, Marie, that you do not move
into your new husband's home and he does not move
into your home.
Speaker 5 (21:51):
Get a new home.
Speaker 4 (21:52):
That way, you are less likely to have a situation
where the children come in and say, well, this is
dad's home.
Speaker 5 (22:00):
You need to go.
Speaker 4 (22:01):
You're no longer needed or wanted here. You're not our mom,
and thanks for being a companion to dad, see you later,
So get your own home, Mom said to me. And
I think she would want people to know that medical
professionals don't always understand the.
Speaker 5 (22:16):
Work that therapists do.
Speaker 4 (22:18):
Occupational therapists, physical therapists, speech therapist, mental therapists. We have
had a lot of therapists who have been life savers
and exceeded the doctor's expectations. And I have those people
who are other family members who confirm that that is true.
Many times the medical professionals who are saving lives do
(22:39):
not fully understand the good work that these therapists can
do if given enough of a runway. So I think
Mom would want people to know that about medical care.
Speaker 3 (22:49):
Is there anything that you think you'd do differently now
that you've been through or now that you're, you know,
kind of on the downhill side of this journey? Hopefully,
hopefully she just has some good years and then passes
away peacefully. But is there anything you do differently now?
Speaker 4 (23:10):
Prior to the separation and the adversity that was faced
in this splendid family situation, I would have thought ahead
about what could have happened and not been so pollyanna
and trusting. I would have started thinking about those possible
scenarios as life went on and what could have happened,
and I would have asked a better question. I would
(23:30):
have said, why are you doing this? And I didn't.
I should have delved into why the other family was
pushing in the direction that they were, and why what
seemed like such cruelties occurred. I would have found a
way to take more time for myself to recharge my batteries.
(23:51):
There was a time where my sister and I after
four months was seeming like, when is this going to end?
Sleeping by mom's bed twenty four to seven, taking turns.
I would have found a better way to recharge my batteries.
I would have found a better way for my sister
to get respect care. But when you're in those moments
and you don't think you can leave, you just stick
around and you shuck it up and you do what
(24:13):
you need to do.
Speaker 3 (24:14):
Yeah. Yeah, but that is a very good point because
if you if your health fails, then you're not any
good to anybody, and that that's a sobering thing that
you have to take care of yourself asolegally you on. Wow, Well,
what's one powerful question that people should ask themselves or
(24:38):
their loved ones today before a crisis hits? What do
you think is if somebody is saying, oh, we're not
there yet, but it might come someday, What's what's that
one powerful question people should ask?
Speaker 5 (24:53):
Who?
Speaker 4 (24:56):
How far do you want to go? What kind of heroics?
My mom had an NDA or excuse me and do
not to resuscitate? So I got the initials wrong, empty
as another thing right, But she in the moment, she
decided that that was no longer what she wanted to
do that she it wasn't resuscitation, but it was sustenance.
It was the feeding tube that she accepted. It wasn't
(25:17):
intubation to breathe, but it was sustenance to give her
time to see if she could make it. So think
about that. Would you really want a feeding tube? Google
it and see what happens when you get a feeding
tube and there are a couple kinds and it was
you know, would you want to do that? And could
you change your mind in the moment? Think through those
(25:38):
medical what ifs. You know, life happens to us all,
whether it's a stroke or something else. So you know,
think through those possibilities and really talk with your family
so that they're clear about what your wishes are, and
then figure it out in the moment. Of course there
needs to be adjustments, but then try to try to
(26:00):
stick to the guidelines of the person or you what
you would want, right.
Speaker 3 (26:06):
I think, you know, my experience in the last twenty
five years helping people get their wills and doing all that,
a lot of times people are just they just don't
want to deal with it, and they're just saying, oh,
that'll never happen to me, and my experience has been
you know, you and I as financial professionals, we have
(26:28):
to say no, you need to get these documents in
place because you don't want to judge. I mean, because
what happens if none of those documents were in place?
What would have happened to her? Yeah? I mean if
there was nothing, If there was nothing there, and if
there was no daughters there.
Speaker 5 (26:50):
How is she going?
Speaker 3 (26:51):
You know, can you imagine what a train wreck that is?
Speaker 4 (26:54):
It would have been a train wreck.
Speaker 3 (26:56):
Yeah, especially with her being told to get out of
the house.
Speaker 4 (27:01):
Yeah. I would also just counsel to get a second
opinion on your prenups.
Speaker 3 (27:06):
Yes, yeah, absolutely. Wow, Well our time is gone, can
you believe it? I feel like we could go on
and on and talk about stories and everything that happened
with this sort of thing. But I think we've covered
a lot of the important things that need to be
thought about. And what would be what would you like
(27:28):
to kind of sum up this discussion with partying thought.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
You know, it's hard to sum it up in one thought,
but to thine own self be true, and myself said,
mom wants to live. I'm going to do everything to
fight with her as long as she wants to fight.
So that was true for me, that was true for
my sister, and for all of you who are listening
or watching. You know, to thine own self be true
(27:57):
and to your loved ones be true.
Speaker 3 (28:00):
It's really the most loving thing you can do, isn't it.
To get your documents and arrangements in place as much
as possible. Of course, we don't know, we can't possibly
know what the particulars are going to be about, what challenge.
Speaker 5 (28:15):
Is laid before us.
Speaker 3 (28:17):
But just getting those things in places, that's kind of
like the base thing my mom. You know what my
mom used to say. My mother said, take care of
your business, carry your business, and then you just go
with the flow with whatever has to happen beyond that.
Speaker 4 (28:39):
Absolutely well, I did have a good business plan in place.
I am an entrepreneur. I had in my next generation
takeover and the business ran well without me for almost
four months before I started.
Speaker 5 (28:51):
Stepping back in. So that was a good.
Speaker 4 (28:54):
Fire drill to make sure that my business is okay.
Speaker 3 (28:58):
Right, Yeah, because the the financial ramifications. So what if
somebody is like working for somebody else and can't take
time off, Yeah, there's lots and lots of things. That's
so you have to go, Okay, what's the plan, Hey,
what's the plan? B? What if this happened? What if
anything happened? You can just say, well, what about taking
(29:18):
time off and things like that. So this is kind
of just like an over the treetops look at doing
some planning and making arrangements for especially the many, many
many people out there that are looking at I'm probably
going to be having to do some care of parents someday.
And so, Marie, thank you so much for being with
(29:41):
us today. This is such an important topic. I will
have your information available for people to contact you if
someone wants to follow up and ask some more questions
from you.
Speaker 5 (29:56):
Thank you, Bonnie so and so.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
With that we'll say audios, thank you so much for
joining us on the Ask Good Questions podcast.
Speaker 2 (30:09):
Today's episode is over, but we did Ask Good Questions again,
didn't We don't miss out as we broadcast live every Wednesday,
six pm Eastern Time on W FOURCY Radio at w
fourcy dot com. Joined Nina Bellmerson next week for more
conversations with experts on finances, retirement, behavioral finance issues, health
(30:31):
and wellness, and more. Until then, remember to ask good questions.
The topics and opinions express in the following show are
solely those of the hosts and their guests, and not
those of W FOURCY Radio. It's employees are affiliates. We
make no recommendations or endorsements for radio show programs, services,
or products mentioned on air or on our web. No
liability explicitor implies shall be extended to W FOURCY Radio
or its employees are affiliates. Any questions or comments should
be directed to those show hosts. Thank you for choosing
(00:21):
W FOURCY Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Welcome to to Ask Good Questions Podcasts, broadcasting live every Wednesday,
six pm Eastern Time on W four CY Radio at
w four cy dot com. This week and every week,
we will reach for a higher purpose in money and life,
as well as a focus on health and wellnes. Now,
(00:49):
let's join your host, Anita bell Anderson as together we
start with Asking Good Questions.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Hello, this is your host, Benita bell Anderson, and welcome
to the Ask Good Questions podcast. We are so excited
that you're here today. We have an extra special guest,
someone that I've known now for a while and I've
been watching her progress. She's also in the financial industry.
Her name is Marie Swift, and I would love to
(01:23):
invite her to the Proverbial podcast stage right now. Hello, Hello, Hello, Hello.
I'm so glad you're here. I've been looking forward to
this conversation because I feel like this is going to
be such an important topic that everyone needs to be
thinking about and hear about. So I'm going to read
(01:45):
this little diddy about you and then we'll get into
our discussion. All right, sounds good, Okay, Well, here's here's
a little short bio about Marie. Our guest today is
Marie Swift, found and CEO of Impact Communications. While known
for her expertise in the financial services industry, and I
(02:08):
want to tell you, yeah, this girl gets around. Marie
joins us today in a deeply personal capacity. She'll be
sharing her family's experience navigating the complexities of eldercare, sudden
spousal change, and the challenging dynamics that emerged when her
(02:28):
mother became suddenly single under unexpected and difficult circumstances. Marie
will bring a unique perspective, blending her professional understanding of
financial matters with the raw emotional realities of family crisis,
and will share valuable lessons learned about asking the right
(02:51):
questions in times of immense stress and change. So have
you got any beginning thought that you'd like to begin with.
Speaker 4 (03:02):
Well, as I thought about this conversation today, Bonnie, I
was nervous. I am a professional communicator. I do marketing
and pr for a living. I've done it for a
very long time. I coach people on how to be
articulate and gracious and graceful under pressure. But this is,
as you said, a very deeply personal and vulnerable matter
(03:26):
for me, and it is a little raw. I just
got back two days ago from an unexpected respite care
visit to help my sister. Bless her heart, she is
just a saint. My sister is now the primary caregiver
for my mother, and we're going to talk about that.
But my initial thinking is that life comes at you
(03:48):
in unexpected ways, and I'm a better person for the journey.
But it has been hard.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
Yeah. I have got many examples in my family, including
my mother and my sister and my brother. Yeah, I'm
with you. Well, can you take us back. Let's begin here.
Can you take us back when you first realized that
your mother was going to need care.
Speaker 4 (04:16):
Yeah, at the time that the stroke happened. My mom
was eighty nine. This was November last year, so about
eight months ago, and she wanted to continue living independently.
We had no idea that a stroke was in her future.
She was living independently. She was living in a community
(04:37):
of other people in an independent retirement community, very active singing,
going to the community choir that she practiced in her
church activities, you know, all of the things.
Speaker 5 (04:50):
With her family.
Speaker 4 (04:51):
I live in Kansas City, my sister lives in Idaho,
my mom lives in Utah, and we have three brothers
who are in Colorado.
Speaker 5 (05:00):
In California.
Speaker 4 (05:01):
So when my mom decided that her right hand was
excuse me, her left hand was bothering her with carpal
tunnel and she wanted to continue to play the piano,
one of the loves of her life. She thought, well,
carpal tunnel surgery will take care of that.
Speaker 5 (05:17):
Well.
Speaker 4 (05:17):
As a result of getting ready for that surgery and
taking her off her medication some of her blood dinners,
she actually a stroke happened because of that, and so
fortuitously I was there to help her recover from the
carpal tunnel surgery. But when I woke up that morning,
it was as if there was a voice drawing me
(05:38):
out of my air mattress in the living room. It said, Marie,
get up, and it was a man's voice, and I
could guess that maybe it was a divine calling for
me to wake up and to check on my mother.
And she was in her bed just a short distance
from me. And it's hard to hear over some of
(05:59):
them metal devices, like oxygen machines. But I went and
she was having a stroke. And it took me a
minute to realize that she was having what they call
a waking stroke, where you wake up and it's very scary.
You're having a stroke as you come out of sleep.
So those were the moments where everything changed. I had
come in for a three day visit to keep my
(06:21):
mom company while she recovered from what should have been
minor surgery, and instead this complication meant that she would
have long term medical care needs.
Speaker 3 (06:33):
Wow, well, how did that sudden change impact her? I
mean emotionally and physically. You know it must have been
I mean, I I you know, I always joke about this.
It's like, this is never going to happen to you
and me, Right, We're not gonna We're not going to
I can only imagine because you and I are both
(06:55):
strong independent women, and I'm guessing that your mom was
probably a strong independent woman, right. My mom taught us
all how to ATV ride, and she would rep her engine,
look over her shoulder and say eat my dust as
she would race away and leave us behind in her dusk.
So she taught us how to be strong, independent people.
(07:17):
And so as a single mother raising five rather rambunctious children,
me being the oldest of the five, she led the
example of being independent, being self reliant, having that good
pioneering spirit and put your shoulder to the wheel and
do what you need to do and just suck it
up buttercup and no cry babies allowed.
Speaker 5 (07:39):
So my mom was like that.
Speaker 4 (07:41):
She was tender, she was sweet, but she knew how
to get stuff done. And that's how she raised her kids.
And I am I am a credit to her. I
hope and I hope to continue to make her proud
throughout the rest of my life and beyond. So, yes,
my mom was independent, living independently at age eight and
men she moved her the retirement village because she was
(08:04):
forced out of her home when her husband became significantly ill.
With dementia, like the bad kind of dementia that feels
like Alzheimer's but they don't call it that. Where there
was a lot of aggression and bless his Hearty was
a sweet gentleman for most of their eighteen year marriage,
but towards the end he was not himself, and so
(08:28):
that blended family. The other siblings said, asked that she
leave the home with three days notice, asked that she
take her things immediately with three days notice, because she
was no longer needed in the caregiver capacity. And so
with three days notice, we moved her out of that
home where she'd lived with her husband for eighteen years
(08:50):
and moved her to the independent residential community where she
had some quite a bit of adjustments. So she wasn't
quite single at that point because her husband was still alive,
and yet he was not the man that she married
where they had so many good years together, and so
we had to recuperate from that wound, those hardships, all
(09:11):
of that financial hardship, and the adjustment emotionally and mentally
from that, and then eighteen months.
Speaker 5 (09:20):
Later the stroke. So that's a lot.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
Well did it make her? Was she angry or how?
Speaker 4 (09:29):
Yes, the situation with the blended family. She was angry,
she was sad, she was confused, she felt jilted, she
felt thrown out. We were all angry, confused, and there
was There were conversations with attorneys and clergy and other
people therapists to help us through this, But at the
(09:52):
end of the day, the daughters of her husband moved
him to a memory care center and we were forced
to move our mother to independent living when she could
have and wanted to stay in their family home.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Yeah, well, what were the most immediate challenges for you?
Speaker 4 (10:13):
Well, so, during the time of transition from the marriage
unraveling due to the dementia and the blended family complications,
there were a lot of challenges supporting moms. So my
sister and I were able to be there for Mom
to support her through all of that and the decision
making that had to occur. But she did eventually get
(10:34):
settled and was relatively happy in the independent living environment
where she made new friends and so forth. So there
were a lot of immediate challenges and needs to be
there with Mom, but nothing like the journey that unfolded
when she had her stroke in November.
Speaker 3 (10:51):
Yeah. Well, I'm just wondering from a you know, because
we're both financial professionals, but from your perspective, and I
think this is really unique because since you're in the
financial industry, what are some of the biggest surprises or
blind spots that you think that you encountered with this.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
Yeah, so I had no idea how Medicare works. And
my mom has a Medicare advantage plan, and she also
has a secondary Medicare gap policy. Now that may sound unusual,
but my mom was working at Utah Valley Hospital for
so many years and they had this wonderful retiring benefit
(11:33):
where she had a gap policy to fill the bills
and the medical bills that came along that the advantage
plan wouldn't pay. So we had relatively few financial worries
as long as we fought the insurance system. And so
what we found is that the insurance system for people
(11:55):
of a certain age with a certain prognosis is geared
towards discharging them. And we had to use some pretty
tough positioning to advocate for our mother, who said she
wanted to live. She wasn't done living, she had more
life to live, she had more stories to tell. So
we had to really work hard. My sister and I
(12:15):
to figure out a way to convince the two insurance carriers,
if you will, or the different divisions to work together
to create a plan and not to discharge on mother prematurely.
We also found that some of the medical facilities, such
as the skilled nursing centers and the stroke centers that
(12:37):
we were encountering, that they were ready to push her
out and give up on her.
Speaker 5 (12:41):
And so we advocated for.
Speaker 4 (12:43):
Her financially and also with medical care, even in the
face of medical providers telling us to give up.
Speaker 3 (12:52):
Yeah, you know, I'm thinking about my sister. My sister
had this horrendous autoimmune things that went on for her.
Her We fouindly. We finally ended up taking her home
from the facility where we had her and having a
whole huge, long, roundabout thing with different members of the
(13:13):
family helping care as well as like two or three nurses.
But my sister, you know, I'm just thinking about what
the patient thinks about. My sister looked at me one
day when I was caring for her, and she says,
I never thought this would happen, yeah, you know, And
I was like, I never thought this would happen either.
(13:34):
You know, and so you just it's as much as
you know, we have both you know, had all these
years in the financial industry, but there's nothing that quite
prepares you for that individual personal experience that was happening
to you, right.
Speaker 4 (13:53):
Yeah, I mean, you know, once our mother got through
the acute care from the urgency room up to the
stroke unit at Utah Valley Hospital and into the elite
rehab where they put her on a feeding tube and
that was pretty hard to watch, told her that she
wouldn't walk again, eat again, talk again, give up.
Speaker 5 (14:15):
You know, all of that.
Speaker 4 (14:16):
We advocated for her care and we kept asking her, mom,
is this what you want? And she says she wanted
to continue on. But to see your hero, your mother
go through this and the frailty of life and the
human condition, it's really eye opening when you see all
of that. And you know, there's a lot of humility
(14:39):
that comes into the equation from not just that hospital experience,
but into a skilled nursing center where they said she
needs to go to a nursing home and we said,
not going to happen, not in our DNA.
Speaker 5 (14:52):
We don't do that in our family.
Speaker 4 (14:54):
So if you fast forward from the skilled nursing center
where they said give us, You've done all you can.
And then we went to we moved from Utah Valley
up to Salt Lake Valley where we had different team members.
She said, yes, we can still work with her. Yes,
there's still progress to be made. Stroke centers and another
(15:14):
rehabilitation stroke hospital, and now into outpatient therapies and now
home therapies. She is talking, she is singing, she is
walking with a walker, she is telling her stories. She
still needs a twenty four to seven companion, but that's okay.
There's still good life to live. And that journey is priceless.
(15:37):
The moments that we've shared, the mother daughter experiences, the prayers,
the fasting, the family circles. It has changed me profoundly
about what it means to be a human being.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
So basically, what I think i'm hearing you say is
don't give up. Do what you know is right. And
from a you know and I'm thinking from a financial perspective,
what would you tell our listeners, what should they what
should they have in place? What financial documents or arrangements
(16:11):
do you think would be most helpful with something like this?
Speaker 4 (16:16):
Fortunately for us, our mother has been a planner. She
had been a single mom raising the five of us
for so long. She did have a second marriage where
he passed away, and then she remarried into this third marriage,
and then you heard this story about how that unraveled.
But Mom had always been independent, and so she had
a will, she had a trust. She'd been preparing my
(16:38):
sister and I to take over her finances and her logistics,
and what to do with the family home when it
came time to sell, how to divvy things up, where
her bank accounts were, where her keys were, meeting her
financial advisor, going to the CPA. So we've been doing
this like a rehearsal for what happens to Mom? What
do we do if something happens to Mom? But we
(17:00):
didn't expect it to happen because of a stroke. We
expected because her pacemaker would give out after a certain
number of years. And so we had done all of
these things. But I would say to those who don't
have those things, if you don't have those things in place,
and you're also having to manage the medical and emotional
side of things and the logistics, man, you are in trouble.
(17:22):
So thankfully, for us, it was a horrible journey, but
a wonderful journey in so many ways. But we didn't
have to worry about where are the keys? What do
we do about the renters? You know, how do we
manage the taxes and the finances?
Speaker 3 (17:37):
What do you think you learned about the elder care system?
You know, whether that's legal or medical or housing.
Speaker 5 (17:44):
That you wish more families knew.
Speaker 4 (17:48):
Have a plan, know ahead what you what the contingencies
might or might not be. We never expected this to
happen so well. We'd been good planners. We didn't expect
that mom would have us need to move from her
home to an independent living center, from an independent living
center into assisted or home care twenty four to seven.
(18:09):
So just think through those scenarios and beyond the financials
and the logistics, like what could happen? And how could
you be prepared for that at least thinking through your
options ahead of time.
Speaker 3 (18:22):
Do you feel like, what are the moments that come
to mind that you feel like the system failed you
and filled your family and failed your mother most particularly.
Speaker 4 (18:35):
You know, we slept by our mother's bed, My sister
and I took turns twenty four to seven. We were
with her and not that we didn't trust the medical care.
We were in some of the best facilities in Utah
Valley and Salt Lake Valley, but we saw that mistakes
were made and that people who are in a condition
(18:56):
where they can't advocate for themselves, they need people there
to advocate. So it's not a failure so much is
just a weak spot in the way care gets delivered,
and that people are even medical professionals make mistakes and
make bad judgment calls. So I would say that the failure,
the chinks that we saw were in competencies from time
(19:20):
to time and.
Speaker 5 (19:21):
Just people saying give up.
Speaker 4 (19:24):
But that's not what we're going to do, and the
family continue to advocate for her and to make the
care better for her because the days that she has
ahead they may not be as many as as she
would like, but we think she has another several.
Speaker 5 (19:39):
Good years left and we're want the best of them.
Speaker 3 (19:43):
Yeah, you want it to be the best that it
can be. Yeah, Well, do you feel like you have
there been instances where you had to balance honoring your
mother's wishes with making critical decisions on her behalf. I mean,
are you you know?
Speaker 2 (19:59):
So?
Speaker 3 (19:59):
I know from my personal experience where like my sister
would say, I don't want you to be here. You
can go, you need to go away, But I knew
that I was going to stay there. So how did
you ever? Do you have something that comes to mind
when thinking about balancing what their wishes are with what
(20:21):
you know needs to happen.
Speaker 4 (20:23):
I remember when we moved Mom out of her independent
living apartment up to an airbnb to be closer to
her therapies, that she sat on the bed and she
was having a moment of despair, and she said, just
take me to the nursing home. I don't want to
be a burden anymore for you girls. And we sat
(20:46):
side by side with her and we hugged her, and
I felt to say to her, Mom, you don't belong there,
you don't belong in a nursing home.
Speaker 5 (20:56):
We will work our way through this.
Speaker 4 (20:57):
So her wish in that moment was of despair not
to be a burden on us, But we knew that
what we would really want to do personally and in
her honor, her wish when she's not despairing is to
continue on to be tough and to continue to get
the therapies and the medical care that have made a
difference where the prayers that were answered are that she
(21:22):
has continued to exceed all expectations for a now ninety
year old woman. Yeah, well, what do you think your
mother would want others to know from her experience of
becoming suddenly single. Well, she told me on this last
trip when I was in Utah with her, make sure
(21:44):
if you get remarried, Marie, that you do not move
into your new husband's home and he does not move
into your home.
Speaker 5 (21:51):
Get a new home.
Speaker 4 (21:52):
That way, you are less likely to have a situation
where the children come in and say, well, this is
dad's home.
Speaker 5 (22:00):
You need to go.
Speaker 4 (22:01):
You're no longer needed or wanted here. You're not our mom,
and thanks for being a companion to dad, see you later,
So get your own home, Mom said to me. And
I think she would want people to know that medical
professionals don't always understand the.
Speaker 5 (22:16):
Work that therapists do.
Speaker 4 (22:18):
Occupational therapists, physical therapists, speech therapist, mental therapists. We have
had a lot of therapists who have been life savers
and exceeded the doctor's expectations. And I have those people
who are other family members who confirm that that is true.
Many times the medical professionals who are saving lives do
(22:39):
not fully understand the good work that these therapists can
do if given enough of a runway. So I think
Mom would want people to know that about medical care.
Speaker 3 (22:49):
Is there anything that you think you'd do differently now
that you've been through or now that you're, you know,
kind of on the downhill side of this journey? Hopefully,
hopefully she just has some good years and then passes
away peacefully. But is there anything you do differently now?
Speaker 4 (23:10):
Prior to the separation and the adversity that was faced
in this splendid family situation, I would have thought ahead
about what could have happened and not been so pollyanna
and trusting. I would have started thinking about those possible
scenarios as life went on and what could have happened,
and I would have asked a better question. I would
(23:30):
have said, why are you doing this? And I didn't.
I should have delved into why the other family was
pushing in the direction that they were, and why what
seemed like such cruelties occurred. I would have found a
way to take more time for myself to recharge my batteries.
(23:51):
There was a time where my sister and I after
four months was seeming like, when is this going to end?
Sleeping by mom's bed twenty four to seven, taking turns.
I would have found a better way to recharge my batteries.
I would have found a better way for my sister
to get respect care. But when you're in those moments
and you don't think you can leave, you just stick
around and you shuck it up and you do what
(24:13):
you need to do.
Speaker 3 (24:14):
Yeah. Yeah, but that is a very good point because
if you if your health fails, then you're not any
good to anybody, and that that's a sobering thing that
you have to take care of yourself asolegally you on. Wow, Well,
what's one powerful question that people should ask themselves or
(24:38):
their loved ones today before a crisis hits? What do
you think is if somebody is saying, oh, we're not
there yet, but it might come someday, What's what's that
one powerful question people should ask?
Speaker 5 (24:53):
Who?
Speaker 4 (24:56):
How far do you want to go? What kind of heroics?
My mom had an NDA or excuse me and do
not to resuscitate? So I got the initials wrong, empty
as another thing right, But she in the moment, she
decided that that was no longer what she wanted to
do that she it wasn't resuscitation, but it was sustenance.
It was the feeding tube that she accepted. It wasn't
(25:17):
intubation to breathe, but it was sustenance to give her
time to see if she could make it. So think
about that. Would you really want a feeding tube? Google
it and see what happens when you get a feeding
tube and there are a couple kinds and it was
you know, would you want to do that? And could
you change your mind in the moment? Think through those
(25:38):
medical what ifs. You know, life happens to us all,
whether it's a stroke or something else. So you know,
think through those possibilities and really talk with your family
so that they're clear about what your wishes are, and
then figure it out in the moment. Of course there
needs to be adjustments, but then try to try to
(26:00):
stick to the guidelines of the person or you what
you would want, right.
Speaker 3 (26:06):
I think, you know, my experience in the last twenty
five years helping people get their wills and doing all that,
a lot of times people are just they just don't
want to deal with it, and they're just saying, oh,
that'll never happen to me, and my experience has been
you know, you and I as financial professionals, we have
(26:28):
to say no, you need to get these documents in
place because you don't want to judge. I mean, because
what happens if none of those documents were in place?
What would have happened to her? Yeah? I mean if
there was nothing, If there was nothing there, and if
there was no daughters there.
Speaker 5 (26:50):
How is she going?
Speaker 3 (26:51):
You know, can you imagine what a train wreck that is?
Speaker 4 (26:54):
It would have been a train wreck.
Speaker 3 (26:56):
Yeah, especially with her being told to get out of
the house.
Speaker 4 (27:01):
Yeah. I would also just counsel to get a second
opinion on your prenups.
Speaker 3 (27:06):
Yes, yeah, absolutely. Wow, Well our time is gone, can
you believe it? I feel like we could go on
and on and talk about stories and everything that happened
with this sort of thing. But I think we've covered
a lot of the important things that need to be
thought about. And what would be what would you like
(27:28):
to kind of sum up this discussion with partying thought.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
You know, it's hard to sum it up in one thought,
but to thine own self be true, and myself said,
mom wants to live. I'm going to do everything to
fight with her as long as she wants to fight.
So that was true for me, that was true for
my sister, and for all of you who are listening
or watching. You know, to thine own self be true
(27:57):
and to your loved ones be true.
Speaker 3 (28:00):
It's really the most loving thing you can do, isn't it.
To get your documents and arrangements in place as much
as possible. Of course, we don't know, we can't possibly
know what the particulars are going to be about, what challenge.
Speaker 5 (28:15):
Is laid before us.
Speaker 3 (28:17):
But just getting those things in places, that's kind of
like the base thing my mom. You know what my
mom used to say. My mother said, take care of
your business, carry your business, and then you just go
with the flow with whatever has to happen beyond that.
Speaker 4 (28:39):
Absolutely well, I did have a good business plan in place.
I am an entrepreneur. I had in my next generation
takeover and the business ran well without me for almost
four months before I started.
Speaker 5 (28:51):
Stepping back in. So that was a good.
Speaker 4 (28:54):
Fire drill to make sure that my business is okay.
Speaker 3 (28:58):
Right, Yeah, because the the financial ramifications. So what if
somebody is like working for somebody else and can't take
time off, Yeah, there's lots and lots of things. That's
so you have to go, Okay, what's the plan, Hey,
what's the plan? B? What if this happened? What if
anything happened? You can just say, well, what about taking
(29:18):
time off and things like that. So this is kind
of just like an over the treetops look at doing
some planning and making arrangements for especially the many, many
many people out there that are looking at I'm probably
going to be having to do some care of parents someday.
And so, Marie, thank you so much for being with
(29:41):
us today. This is such an important topic. I will
have your information available for people to contact you if
someone wants to follow up and ask some more questions
from you.
Speaker 5 (29:56):
Thank you, Bonnie so and so.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
With that we'll say audios, thank you so much for
joining us on the Ask Good Questions podcast.
Speaker 2 (30:09):
Today's episode is over, but we did Ask Good Questions again,
didn't We don't miss out as we broadcast live every Wednesday,
six pm Eastern Time on W FOURCY Radio at w
fourcy dot com. Joined Nina Bellmerson next week for more
conversations with experts on finances, retirement, behavioral finance issues, health
(30:31):
and wellness, and more. Until then, remember to ask good questions.
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The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.