July 23, 2025 • 44 mins
PTSD After Divorce — Join guest Sinta Ebersohn, Post Traumatic Growth Mentor, as she shares her expertise and insight into navigating the emotional challenges of PTSD after divorce. Together with host Tina Huggins, Divorce & "Narcissist Conflict" Specialist, they explore how to recognize, heal, and grow through the trauma of relationship loss on The Awakening. Watch now on NEWStreamingNetwork.com!
More About Tina: Tina Huggins, CTA Life Coach certified, CDC Divorce Coach, CDC Transitions Coach, CDC Recovery Coach, TKG Restorative Family Mediator Certified, TKG Family Circle Certified. I have coached for over 30 years coming from the background of law enforcement and self-defense instructor.
Connect with Tina: Email: coachtinalynn@gmail.com Website: https://divorcecoachspecialist.com/
More about Sinta: Globally acknowledged and respected, Sinta Ebersohn is a pioneering voice in the field of Post Traumatic Growth. With decades of lived and professional experience, she empowers individuals, families and workforces to turn adversity into strength and disruption into transformation.
Connect with Sinta: info@getupandgrow.co.za https://sintaebersohn.co.za/ https://fairdivorce.co.za/
More About Tina: Tina Huggins, CTA Life Coach certified, CDC Divorce Coach, CDC Transitions Coach, CDC Recovery Coach, TKG Restorative Family Mediator Certified, TKG Family Circle Certified. I have coached for over 30 years coming from the background of law enforcement and self-defense instructor.
Connect with Tina: Email: coachtinalynn@gmail.com Website: https://divorcecoachspecialist.com/
More about Sinta: Globally acknowledged and respected, Sinta Ebersohn is a pioneering voice in the field of Post Traumatic Growth. With decades of lived and professional experience, she empowers individuals, families and workforces to turn adversity into strength and disruption into transformation.
Connect with Sinta: info@getupandgrow.co.za https://sintaebersohn.co.za/ https://fairdivorce.co.za/
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
You're listening to WGSNDB Go and Solo Network Singles talk
radio channel, where we take a lighthearted and candidate approach
to discussions on the journey of relationship, laws, divorce, parenting,
being single, relationships, building, dating, and yes sex. Join our
listeners and begin living your best life.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Hello, welcome to my show The Awakening here on WGSS
ANDDB the Going Bold and Going Solo Network. The information
and opinions expressed on this show are just that, the
opinions of the individual speaking based on their individual personal experiences.
They are not intended to diagnose and do not constitute
(00:47):
professional advice or recommendations. So you know the pain, stress,
and struggle that divorcing men and women go through, Well,
there is a way to find peace, insanity and assist
your lawyer all in the legal process. This saves you
thousands of dollars. My name is Tina. I'm your divorce coach,
professional divorce planning specialist, restored, a family mediator and conflictional
(01:10):
co parenting coach. So today I'm joined by Cinta, Edmbers
and a Hither and Butcher it again, go ahead and
say it for us properly. Everson and I should be
able to say that a little bit better because I
do have a little bit of German background that I speak.
But anyways, we're joined here by Cinta. Sinta is globally
(01:34):
acknowledged and respected. She is a pioneering voice in the
field of post traumatic growth. With decades of lived and
professional experience. She empowers individuals, families, and the workforce to
turn adversity into strength and disruption into transformation. So I
(01:56):
am truly honored to have you here, Santa. So can
you kind of explain what the post traumatic stress is
so that our viewers kind of have an understanding.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
Thanks Tina for having me. I'm very honored to be here.
I think anybody who's gone through a divorce needs what
knows what trauma is and the stress of that. Specifically,
we not strangers to that at all. But post traumatic
growth means to me what we do with that traumatic experience,
(02:33):
how we integrate the life lessons that we learn, and
how we grow from that.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Yes, and I when I was kind of reading through
your bio, and I literally could go back to points
in my life where because of my divorce and some
of the things that happened in my marriage brought about
PTSD post traumatic stress, and I think that many of
(03:00):
us experience that, whether we've learned to label that yet
or not. But one of the situations that happened in
my marriage was my husband, my ex husband grabbed my
wrist and was I was I'm not one to like
to fight, and especially to go through the screaming and
yelling and the belittling that happened. And so I was
(03:22):
getting ready to leave the fight the room, and he
grabbed my wrist and I released it because I was
a trained martial artist, and I ended up hitting the
door jam in the process, breaking the back of my hand,
and then he threw me on the bed and stuck
his knee in my chest. And so years down the road,
(03:44):
I was dating somebody else and he went he went
to I don't It wasn't fight induced or anything. There
was a little bit of friction, but he went to
grab my hand, not really my wrist, but I instantly
pull back, and I can remember the effect. It wasn't
like I even had a choice. It just happened.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
It's almost like a reflex.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
And also, of course, with your martial arts training, you know,
you learn how to do these things literally with art thinking,
because if it's a really threatening situation, you have to
do that. You can't hesitate for a moment. But yet
we have memories that trigger us later in life when
we find ourselves in similar situations, and post traumatic stress
(04:34):
and disorder is just that. It's when we carry the
things over from the past experiences and they show up
in our current lives in weird and wonderful ways because
we haven't dealt with them fully mm hmm.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
And I mean there's all kinds of situations that I
can kind of go back to that had some form
of PTSD, so for me, and so we're going to
get into how you help people change this into something
positive because I have worked on this, not with you,
but I have worked on this for a long time.
(05:11):
And so now I am noticing that I've learned little
tricks like mel Robbins talks about the five four three
two one, you turn around and do something different than
what you're doing. And mine isn't quite like that that
I do that, but I do. I take a deep
breath and I count five, and then I think about
(05:33):
what I'm going to say or do in the context
of a confrontation or what could be a confrontation, so
kind of tell us a little bit about how you
work and how that works in your field.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
I have to say we are fortunate because there are
so many people all over the world who work with
trauma and specifically PTSD and you know, post traumatic growth.
So there are endless sources where we can get information.
There are so many processes and modalities and kinds of
therapies and things you know, for us to choose amongst
(06:12):
that we actually know. Living in a very fortunate time,
I have deducted from all my studies and my lived
experience and working with clients over many years, some processes
that I find work quite effectively. But saying that, I
must also stress that it's really unique for every person.
There's no one recipe that works for everyone. So I
(06:35):
have to get to know my client thoroughly to understand
which process or therapy or principles or theories would work
best for them. But I have developed my own get
up and grow process which makes room for adjusting for
(06:55):
every individual, and it basically consists of four steps. The
first step is the get step, and that's get working
around gaining a thorough understanding of what has happened, what
is happening to me, what that impact is on me,
and how it affects the people close to me, the
people around me. Once I have a thorough understanding of
(07:18):
that here in my head, then I can move on
to what I call the up phase. And the up
to me means I update my system literally like we
would update our software of our computers or our phones.
So I update my system with the knowledge that I've
gained or the insight that I've gained, and I upgrade
myself so we figure out what the life lessons are
(07:42):
that lie in these experiences, and in doing that, we
can conclude that I might benefit from CBT, or I
might benefit from a bit of neurolinguistic programming or EMI
or whatever there is some of the things I'm trained
to do myself, and others I will refer to one
(08:03):
of my colleagues to do that.
Speaker 4 (08:04):
But it's only once we.
Speaker 3 (08:05):
Have that thorough understanding so we get the situation, and
when we start doing looking at how and where we
can update to upgrade ourselves, that we really know what
our needs are. So I can't just go to a
psychologist for therapy somebody who doesn't know divorce somebody who
might not have experienced divorced themselves.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
You know, it must be somebody who.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
Specializes in it, or like a divorce coach like you are.
I've been a divorce mentor for many years. We need
to understand the specific dynamics of that and then apply
the best system or process to that person.
Speaker 4 (08:42):
So once we've done that.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
Then the and in the get up and Grow. The
and stands for I adapt or I adjust to my circumstances,
or I adapt to the changed circumstances or what my
future is going to look like the new situation. The
N is for navigate, then I navigate through that, and
I work out how to navigate through that, And the
(09:06):
D is for I direct or divert whatever is needed
in the situation. And then we get to the grow
when we've done all those three steps in the beginning,
and we look back and we evaluate and we assess
and we see how we apply, we learn from that,
and we repeat it. It's literally a step one, two, three, four,
(09:27):
and we repeat that. And it's a process that we
can do or apply anywhere in our lives with any adversity,
any hardship, any challenge, any traumatic experience that I have
found through the years that work very well.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
So I do get up.
Speaker 4 (09:42):
And grow.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Process with my clients. But again it's different for every person.
It's not a fixed recipe. You need a holistic approach
and a really wide view of what can work, what
is art there that is available that works for people.
And of course, something that I specifically specialize in a
lot I enjoy doing it is the high conflict situations,
(10:07):
the really challenging things. I also have a process where
I teach people a couple of tricks and systems to
deal with conflict effectively, especially the really really bad stuff
when there's aggression or victimization or alienation, intimate partner abuse,
that sort of stuff.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
And as you know, I deal with the abuse and
of things and whether it has been physical abuse, but
in all cases, you know, physical abuse, all of it
roots down to the psychological abuse that starts. Alienation, the control, manipulation,
(10:48):
those types of things that start and they you know,
I just wrote a little bit. I'm writing a book,
and so I was writing in that chapter and I
was writing about that manipulation and we're going through our
dating process that is, that's where it starts to show up.
We just don't realize that it's starting to happen. And
(11:10):
if we can be aware that these things are possibly
starting to happen, we can keep an eye on them.
The reality is, and I tell my clients this is
that in the abuse and is we can't change them.
We can't change them. We can change us. We can
learn adapt like you are. And in some cases where
(11:33):
the significant other is narcissistic, they're not always narcissistic, but
they can come across narcissistic, but the person loves them
and wants to keep them in their life. Maybe it's
not a significant other, maybe it's a sibling or even
a child or a parent. Well then we just as
(11:54):
how you talk about the process, we have to learn
how to adapt apt set our own boundaries, and a
lot of people don't understand boundaries. We can't set boundaries
on the other person. We have to set boundaries and
keep them ourselves. These boundaries are our boundaries and we
have to enforce them in so in what you're saying,
(12:16):
it's very much the same way. We again, we can't
control the outside. We have to only and can only
control ourselves.
Speaker 3 (12:27):
It's the curse of control. The manipulation. The narcissistic abuse
that happens is such a difficult thing because it's not tangible,
it's not easy to prove. And I find often that
the stories of what people do, the really horrible things
that people do, are unbelievable. They like the things we
(12:48):
find in the soap operas. People don't believe it, and
they certainly don't understand it if they haven't experienced it themselves.
So those are really tough things to work with people. Yeah,
the whole world, there's still a lot of room for
education and awareness to increase around those things.
Speaker 4 (13:08):
And also I have to.
Speaker 3 (13:09):
Say that there are words that are thrown around these days.
Every other person going through a divorce that I come
across claims that their ex is a narcissist, and it's
a clear difference. I think all of us exhibit some
narcissistic traits from time to time, demaining depending on the
situation and how stress we are under and how high
(13:30):
the conflict is and all that sort of stuff.
Speaker 4 (13:32):
But to be a really truly properly screened.
Speaker 3 (13:37):
And diagnosed person with narcissistic disorder narcissistic personality disorder is
a completely different thing.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
MM hmmm hm. And you know, I've had clients come
to me and tell me that there are acts as
a narcissist, and I will work with them one week
or two weeks, and already I can tell you they're not.
They're maybe. But we all can exhibit negative reactions to
(14:07):
people or because of people or two people, and we
can all do that, so we can all basically be
narcissistic at times in our lives. And Annette Chesney, who's
been on the show a couple of times, she's got
what she calls a narc spectrum. And so it goes
from zero to five, and a lot of really great
(14:29):
people sit at zero but can bounce up to one
or two when they're put into a situation. We call
that situational abuse. And situational abuse does not mean that
the person is an abuser. Now, in my relationship with
the broken hand in things, it was becoming that way.
(14:49):
It was situational. That's how it started. And the longer
at what was going on, the worse it got, and
the worse it was going to get. And we either
need it professional help, merit or counseling or coaching, or
one of us needed to get out or individual, And
that's what happened with me, is is I went for
(15:10):
individual therapy, and that's when I realized I needed to
get out. I was the problem. I was somewhat in
his eyes, the instigator, and I wasn't. I would be
home doing absolutely nothing when he'd come home and taxicated
and blow up, and I couldn't control that, but I
(15:32):
could control me.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
It's like, you know the expression that says it takes
two to tango, m that's too to solve that problem,
resolve the issues in that relationship. I had the similar experience.
I ended up being the only one getting help and
learning and growing well. My ex husband just was not interested.
As far as he was concerned, everything was my fault.
(15:56):
So you can't stay in a relationship like that if
you don't grow together, if you're not hitting in the
same direction, or at least more or less in the
same direction, you're just going to grow further apart. So
there's no point in staying there.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
Yeah, I have lots of clients that beat themselves up afterwards.
What did I do wrong? How could I have fixed it?
You know? And it again, just like you just said,
it takes two and we have to work together. Now,
I had stated earlier, if we have a difficult person
in our lives, but we need to keep them or
want to keep them in there, then again we have
(16:34):
to do the work. One. We have to recognize that
their issues are not our fault. Their issues, even what
they say are are it's not our fault. We have
to to right away go okay, this is whatever. So,
for instance, I have a friend who is he's an
(16:54):
American veteran and he had part of his leg blown up.
So he goes through his own stages of PTSD, and
so recently he had a situation. And because I have
worked with the vets quite a bit on dealing with
that part in divorce and separate, because I do a
lot of anti suicide work with twenty two a day.
(17:18):
And what I have learned is that when they're going
through that, you know, it's hands off. You've got to
let them unless they've gone through their own work, doing
their own work. If you're supporting them, it's hands off,
words off. You can't help them, you can't talk them
(17:38):
through that. All you can do is be present, and
sometimes that's not close present, that's possibly folding clothes in
the next room. And he went through a situation. He
had come to visit and he went through a situation.
That's why he came, because he was going through his thing.
And so he got here and he was having remembering words.
(18:02):
PTSD can cause all kinds of things and having trouble,
and so right away wanted to put a blame on something,
and I was close, So I became blame. When we're
in that situation, we have to go, Okay, really, it's
not about me. It wasn't me, And so I left
the room and did my thing, and pretty soon they apologized.
(18:24):
They had stayed long enough that they were ready to
leave and felt that they were comfortable to leave. But
those are types of things that PTSD causes and that
we might see on the outside.
Speaker 3 (18:38):
Do you know I'd love to share with you how
I explain boundaries to my clients. As I'm listening to you,
I can see I'd love to share this with you
because it helps to understand how we must manage our boundaries.
What you spoke about knowing that this is about me
and that's not about me. I always say, it's like
(19:00):
being a farmer on my own farm. I know that
there's a demarcated area. That is my area where I farm,
and I am also the person who decides what I
do on there. Let's say, for example, I decide to
keep some sheep and some chickens, and I grow wheat
(19:24):
and barley for example. I am in control of what
I do on my farm. I decide when I feed
the sheep, when I have to water the wheat, when
I have to cut it off or.
Speaker 4 (19:39):
Reap it, or sell.
Speaker 3 (19:41):
Some of my sheep because there are too many of them,
or buy in some food. I have to maintain the
fence and make sure the gateworks properly, just to give
some examples. So the farmer's next door to me have
their own setup in which they are in control, and
they might farm with different things than I do. So
if I use my intimate partner as an example, who
(20:03):
farms right next to me, I'll bought boundaries joined, but
they never overlap, and I might form sheep and chickens,
and my partner might work with cattle for example. So
if I find car done on my farm, then I
know it comes from the cattle next door. It doesn't
(20:26):
come from me because I don't have cattle in my farm.
If my partner finds eggs in his farm, he knows
that egg comes from me, because I'm the one with
the chickens. And that's the same thing as the issues,
the unresolved trauma, the problems, the behavioral patterns and things
that we have. I need to understand myself and my
(20:48):
own farm well enough so that I can identify what
reginates here on my farm and what comes from next door.
And I also need to be able to be honest
enough to identify when my chickens have strayed and they've
gone into my partner's farm and they've gone to lay
their eggs there, because that's not ideal, that's not what
(21:09):
we want. So it's just a simple image that I
always use to illustrate how we work with boundaries. But
it means that we are in control of our own farm,
and we have no control about our neighboring farms, or
our partners or the people close to us. Although we
touch signs, and although we might have certain things that
are the same or we have certain things in common,
(21:32):
we must be clear about where they come from and
who is responsible for them. So if my chickens stray,
I am responsible to go and fetch them and bring
them back. I'm responsible for maintaining the fence so they
can't come out and go and cause a disturbance next door.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
So I don't know whether you knew this, but I
was raised on a farm, and so I'm going to
help people see a little bit offside to that. So
if we don't have boundaries, So in the state of Colorado,
which is where I was raised, it is a it's
a free roaming state. So in other words, if you
(22:14):
don't want your neighbor's cows on your property, you have
to fence them out. So if you don't have boundaries,
then those cows, the chickens, the everything can come onto
your property and cause you problems, tear down, you know,
eat your garden, do all of that kind of stuff,
and it's not your neighbor's fault. Yes, that's where we
(22:38):
have to understand. We have to put up those boundaries,
build those fences to keep them out, and we have
to enforce that fence to keep their cattle or sheep
out from our property. And I think that I love,
obviously that you explained it like this, because I have
(23:00):
actually seen what happens when you don't have your fences
up or don't maintain those fences, and the neighbors cows
mix with your cows, and the fight that pursues because
of this. Yes, so we have to make sure that
we maintain those boundaries. And to me, maintaining boundaries really
(23:22):
means keeping myself, my mental self healthy.
Speaker 3 (23:28):
And being very clear about who I want to be,
where I want to be, what I will tolerate or
allow on what I won't. That's where it starts.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
Mm hmm. And that boundaries are, you know, really, that's
what I work with my clients on probably the most
is the boundaries, but not setting the boundaries, but keeping
yourself healthy enough to keep the boundaries strong. And so
(23:59):
we have to work on that. And so one of
my clients actually told me something that she would do
when she was out and about away from her husband
when they were married, is that she would have this
alter alter ego, and she'd go out as this alter
ego and she would talk about this alter ego. And
so after she was finished telling me that story, I said,
(24:21):
what's exactly what we need to do. We need to
bring that alter ego here, because that alter ego is
stronger than the person that's sitting here right now, so
you need to become that alter ego. So it was
a great, great analogy of how each of us have
to help help ourselves keep those boundaries.
Speaker 3 (24:43):
And it's a constant job. It's a lifelong process. It's
not something we do once often then we've got it
all sorts of out. We need to work at it
all the time because life changes and we change, so
we need to re evaluate that and move the fences
a bit, put the gates in another place, you know,
or bring in some new stock or whatever it is.
(25:06):
If I'm staying to sticking to the form analogy, but
it's actually very exciting work to do to increase our
self awareness. When we work on our boundaries. It's empowering,
but difficult and painful sometimes.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
M And therein lies the fact that we are not narcissists,
because a true narcissist, one that could be diagnosed, refuses
to accept responsibility. It's always somebody else's fault. They won't
not even want accept responsibility for those things, and they
blame you and those types of people. If we choose
(25:42):
to stay in that relationship, whatever that relationship looks like,
and we're not taking care of ourselves. We won't make
it through it. I know me in my relationship, and
I don't know whether I would classify my ex husband
a low level narcissist or not, but I know that
(26:03):
had I stayed in that relationship, I would be dead.
I would have probably taken my life because I wasn't
taking good enough care of me. I was trying to
grow and he would cut the growth off. I would
try to grow and he'd cut the growth off. And
part of that was fear that I was out growing him.
And because he wouldn't grow with me, we did grow apart.
(26:27):
And that's okay. I tell my clients that all the time.
It's okay. That was the right thing at that moment.
We needed what we've got. Now it's time for us
to move to the next chapter.
Speaker 3 (26:38):
I'm so glad you mentioned that because it's my third
step and there gets up and growth process where I
talk about adapting and adjusting. It's important to know that
we must not adapt or adjust to the other person
in the relationship. We adapt to who we want to become,
who we choose to be going forward. And there's a
(26:58):
distinct difference between too. If we keep on adapt into
our partner. We're minimizing ourselves and making ourselves and smoll
until this nothing left.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
And that's where the suicidal idation comes from. You know,
because I've worked with you know, suicide, I've I've helped
in that arena since I was a child, because I
had my own issues and and people would cut me
off and wouldn't let me go. And finally when I
realized that, Okay, if they're cutting me off, I have
(27:32):
to move. I have to put my boundaries up, or
or just go out and buy a whole new lot
of land and grow there. So that's what I did,
is I bought a new lot of land and I
moved so in that that kind of takes me into
my client's next step, that is the taking care of
(27:56):
themselves so they don't end up in this kind of
relationship again.
Speaker 4 (28:00):
Again.
Speaker 3 (28:00):
Yeah, that's the probably one of the biggest dangers coming
out of a divorce or separation, especially if it's high conflict.
If we don't do the work to figure out what
went wrong there, or what mistakes we made, or how
we neglected ourselves, we're just going to repeat it.
Speaker 4 (28:19):
So that's a very important work to do. I agree
with you.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Yeah, Yeah, and that understanding the boundaries being able to
become the person you want to be, the alter ego
that you want to be, being able to be that
person all the time, you know, and that doesn't mean
that it's one hundred percent of the time. But when
we're having a bad day, it's okay. So I lost
(28:44):
my husband a year ago and the whole month of June,
because that was the timeframe, that whole month of June.
I didn't know I was off, but I wasn't myself.
I didn't feel right and it could be that it
was depression. I couldn't tell you because I have been
depressed and it didn't feel that way, but it was off.
(29:04):
And we slip. And the whole thing is is just
because we slip and fall down, just like a little kid,
they fall down and we let them get themselves up.
Then pretty soon they fall. The next time, they get
up without crying. That's what we need to do.
Speaker 3 (29:22):
Yeah, that's what That's where my name Get Up and
Grow comes from. The ideas started with when life knocks
is done, we have to get up and grow. Otherwise
we're going to keep on being knocked down, or we're
going to keep on falling over the same obstacle, but
getting up, and we get better at getting up the
more we get up where the more we practice it,
(29:44):
and every time we learn and grow, we better at
it the next time.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
Mm hmmmm. And so Get Up and Grow is your program?
And don't you have a podcast yourself? I do.
Speaker 4 (29:58):
It's also called Get Up and Grow.
Speaker 3 (30:01):
I spent a lot of time and effort on divorce
because I actually have a platform for divorce itself called
Fair Divorce that I founded in twenty fifteen, So we're
celebrating ten years with that. I am very passionate about that.
That's actually where the turn came around for me to
start working with trauma, specifically because of my own experience.
(30:24):
My own divorce was absolutely disastrous and a drawn out,
very very expensive situation. But yeah, my podcast, I spent
a lot of time talking about divorce on all the
issues related to it, co parenting again, high conflict, alienation,
which is rife and abuse.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
Well, I was lucky enough to be a guest on
your show, and I know our conversation was very much
so based around the divorce and in understanding in the
next and things like that. And I think you know
so often people just don't realize just how costly a
divorce is. And it's not just financial out of your pocket,
(31:12):
it's it costs you a lot of your soul. You
pay for things with essence that you don't even have
to pay, and so it changes you. It can jade
you in a really bad direction. So many people will
get the divorce and never want to have another relationship
because they were treated so bad and until they do
(31:35):
the work, they can't move on. And so having the
support like your support and divorce and then the get
up and Grow program, those are super important for people
that are going through a divorce because without that support,
you're going to pay with things you'll never be able
(31:56):
to get back from your soul again.
Speaker 3 (32:00):
With you. And unfortunately, most parts of the world even
still today, don't understand the need for divorce support that
covers everything. Traditionally, everybody goes down the litigation route, or
the one alternative that is slowly starting to get traction
is mediation. But still the majority of people go for litigation,
(32:23):
which is acrimonious and it always tends, you know, it
turns into a disastrous fight or a battle, a war
with several battles costing a lot of money, So people
don't understand the real need for a divorce coach like yourself,
or a divorce mentor like I call myself, because you
look at the whole picture, You look at every aspect
(32:44):
of that. Like you said, the cost is not only financial,
there's a lot. It brings about a tremendous amount of
life changes. If they are children involved, you have to
change and adapt your parenting style to help your children
to get through. There's so many things that you have
to look at. And then the recovery after that, you
literally have to rebuild your life or start building a
(33:08):
new life from scratch. For some people, it's complex, and
it's really really important to get proper guidance, proper support.
And I keep on coming back to lived experience. I
personally prefer to work with people who have had lived experience.
Also because all the academic training in the world cannot
(33:31):
replace lived experience.
Speaker 2 (33:34):
Oh and I agree, you know, in coaching aspects, I mean,
we're all taught that one of the things that we
do when we have a client that's going sideways, and
it's like, let's start, let's look at all the positive
things that you've accomplished to this point. So lived experiences
are great that way, and you know so often and
(33:57):
I can tell you we're talking about the hordes of divorce. Well,
I'm the one who left my ex husband, and six
months after I left him, I attempted suicide. Here I
worked in that arena, and here I was in that
horrible place. And the reason that that happened is I
(34:17):
didn't ask for help. So when we say that we pay,
you know, I almost made my children pay for the
rest of their lives by taking my life because my
pain was so intense that I couldn't see them or
the things around me. And that's we really I needed
to reach out and ask for help, because that was bad.
(34:41):
And after I experienced that, then I did. I did
reach out and ask for help, and it's that help
that set me on the path that I am today.
You know, I.
Speaker 3 (34:53):
Always say that when we get married, we involved so
many people in the process. In fact, we have a
huge celebration. Our families, our friends, everybody close.
Speaker 4 (35:05):
To us are there. They share it. That involved in.
Speaker 3 (35:08):
The planning and the execution and everything. The marriage is
a big thing. But when we separate or get divorced,
suddenly everything's kept secret, nobody knows exactly what's going on,
nobody else is involved in the process. We are suddenly
isolated and all.
Speaker 4 (35:23):
Alone when we go through.
Speaker 3 (35:26):
This, and we can probably talk for hours about why
we do that, but it's hard for most people to
say I need help, please help me, and to involve
people here in our the most of the time, the
breakdown of our marriage, the things that happen, the high conflict,
(35:48):
the struggles that escalate and become physical and abusive, or
things we are ashamed of.
Speaker 4 (35:55):
We don't want people to know.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
We'd rather keep it a secret and suffer in silence,
and then we find ourselves in a desperate and destitute situation.
And that's something that I also work hard on changing
for people when they come to me. This is one
of the first things we look at. Who do you
have in your corner, what support do you have, Who
(36:17):
have you told exactly what's going on, the whole truth,
the whole situation. We tend not to do that. We
can't go through the difficult things in life by our souls.
Speaker 4 (36:27):
We just can't. We're not made that way.
Speaker 2 (36:32):
Yeah, I didn't tell my family what was really going
on in my relationship. They thought I left my husband
for another man. Everybody did, and on the outside, that's
kind of what it looked like. I found somebody that
was in AA and was safe because my family wouldn't
support me. They wouldn't support me. They were bad mouthing
me and already and it didn't have anything directly to
(36:54):
do with this guy yet until after I left, and
four years later, I was no longer with that man.
It was a used situation, unbeknownst to me. I just
needed that safe space for that time frame. But I
was living with my mom and she decided to get
me and my ex husband back together for Thanksgiving and
(37:15):
invited him and my children over, and he got me
down on the floor in her living room in a
choke hold, and my youngest son had to pull him
off of me.
Speaker 4 (37:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (37:26):
Yeah, that's when she That was the last time her
and him talked. She knew that she saw as true colors,
so he didn't reach out to her, and she decided
that she wasn't going to reach out to him. She says,
I never saw that side of him. I'm like, I
tried to tell you, yes, re fact that you left
for somebody else.
Speaker 3 (37:48):
It's amazing how people jump to conclusions and make assumptions
that are most of the time incorrect. But then I
have to also say, when we have children, especially when
the young, there is a degree of secrets that we
have to keep, facts that we have to keep to
our souls to protect our children edge appropriately. And we
(38:10):
also it's hard to continue in co parent with somebody
who was that bad for you, or if the relationship
was that toxic and you have to continue to co
parent with that person, it's time difficult. So we do
keep things quiet. We do tend to keep things under wraps,
to keep the peace, to be able to co parent,
(38:32):
to also protect the image in front of the children
or the rest of the family. So there are valid
reasons for keeping some of it. But we all need
someone we can trust. We all need, like you said,
a safe space where we can let our hair down,
some other person that can witness our suffering and our
(38:52):
grief and the loss and the things that we're dealing with.
We really do we can't do without that.
Speaker 2 (39:00):
And so as we're getting ready to come to the
end of this center, can you kind of tell me
how people can find you. I know, all your kind
tagged information will be on the bottom. But if you
could tell us how they could find you.
Speaker 3 (39:19):
Yes, I have a website that's in my name, Santa
Yevson dot co dot z a, so you can search
for that and on there you'll find links to all
my other projects. If you're going through a divorce, you
can go to Fairdivorce dot co dot z a. You'll
find everything there and then get up and grow. Like
we've talked about, that is an online community that you
(39:40):
can join. You can sign up and join there. There's
a lot, there's a whole library of resources, information, resilience tools,
online courses, all sorts of things that you can imagine.
So there are three places from which you can find me.
And if you want to follow me on social media,
everything is on my name sometime this song, and I'm
(40:01):
on on all the social media platforms.
Speaker 2 (40:04):
Makes it easy to find you. So I am a
certified divorce coach, meaning that I'm training the complexities of divorce.
I've also dealt with the difficulties in a marriage. I
my father, and my late husband all had dealt with abuse.
So not only am I trained in divorce, I'm also
I've experienced the abuse and know how to get out
(40:27):
from here to there. You can find me and contact
me through my email Coach Tina Lynn at gmail dot com,
dot co O A C H T I n A
L y n N at Gmail. On my website is
Divorce Coachspecialist dot com. And I'm on social media Facebook
under Tina Lynn Huggins. That's h U G G I
(40:48):
n S LinkedIn under Tina Huggins, Instagram under Divorce Coach
Tina Lynn, and TikTok under divorce Divorce Tina So Sinta,
can you give some last minute advice to our viewers.
Speaker 3 (41:05):
I'd love to tell somebody who's going through a divorce
something that's very important. On the basis for me to
start with is to tell you that I believe you.
Whatever you're going through, the horrible things you've experienced, the
things you've seen your partner do that you never thought
would be possible, that you never expected. I want you
(41:28):
to know that I believe you. I've seen the worst
of the worst. I've stood between people who are literally
ready to kill each other physically. I know these bad
things happen, and I believe you, and there is a
way for you to move forward.
Speaker 4 (41:43):
Always so very good.
Speaker 2 (41:47):
And my advice is I've given this in the last
few shows, is to ask for help, share your story
with those closest to you, because when it's time for
you to make your accit, family are going to be
the ones that'll be there. In my case, I didn't
share any of my information, so my family wasn't there.
They believed him as opposed to me because I didn't
(42:10):
share with them. So start sharing, even if it's just
little bits here and little bits there, until you can
inform them of what's really going on in your life,
and then reach out for help because getting out of
this situation can be life threatening, so it's important that
it's done right and that you have an exit plan
(42:30):
in place. So Incinta's there, she can help you with
the emotional end of this as well as going through
your divorce, so she's got the get up and grow
aspect that can help you and definitely help you after
the fact, because again, you have to take care of
this person in order to be able to take care
(42:51):
of this out here. So very good. So many people,
including myself and you heard me talk about this earlier,
get to a bad place where we're considering suicide. Please
don't there is another day coming. This two shall pass.
(43:11):
If you are dealing with suicidal thoughts, please call nine
eight eight, and if you're in the Netherlands you can
dial one one three. Talk to somebody deal with the
situation right here, right now, until we can get you
help there to help support you out of this situation.
If you are in a situation where you need the police,
(43:32):
if there's violence going on in here. In the States,
it's nine to one to one, in the UK it's
nine nine to nine, and in the Netherlands it's one
one two. Once you get the police there, press charges.
Those charges are your key out of the relationship. Do
not drop those charges. Once you drop those charges, what
comes after the charges is dropped is generally much more
(43:54):
difficult or worse than what happened to you prior. So
this is your time, This is your chance to get out.
And the Domestic Violence Hotline is eight hundred seventy nine
nine seven two three three. That number again is eight
hundred seven ninety nine seventy two thirty three. And if
this has been helpful for you, please like, comment, and
(44:16):
share so that it can help others. Thank you so
much for being here. Santa, thank you so much for
having me. It was wonderful. I'm honored. Thanks Tina, thank you.
This has been a very wonderful conversation, so again, thank you.
Speaker 4 (44:31):
Yeah, fantastic.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
You're listening to WGSNDB going Solo Network Singles Talk Radio Channel,
where we take a lighthearted and candidate approach to discussions
on the journey of relationship, laws, divorce, parenting, being single, relationships, building, dating,
and yes sex. Join our listeners and begin living your
best life.
You're listening to WGSNDB Go and Solo Network Singles talk
radio channel, where we take a lighthearted and candidate approach
to discussions on the journey of relationship, laws, divorce, parenting,
being single, relationships, building, dating, and yes sex. Join our
listeners and begin living your best life.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Hello, welcome to my show The Awakening here on WGSS
ANDDB the Going Bold and Going Solo Network. The information
and opinions expressed on this show are just that, the
opinions of the individual speaking based on their individual personal experiences.
They are not intended to diagnose and do not constitute
(00:47):
professional advice or recommendations. So you know the pain, stress,
and struggle that divorcing men and women go through, Well,
there is a way to find peace, insanity and assist
your lawyer all in the legal process. This saves you
thousands of dollars. My name is Tina. I'm your divorce coach,
professional divorce planning specialist, restored, a family mediator and conflictional
(01:10):
co parenting coach. So today I'm joined by Cinta, Edmbers
and a Hither and Butcher it again, go ahead and
say it for us properly. Everson and I should be
able to say that a little bit better because I
do have a little bit of German background that I speak.
But anyways, we're joined here by Cinta. Sinta is globally
(01:34):
acknowledged and respected. She is a pioneering voice in the
field of post traumatic growth. With decades of lived and
professional experience. She empowers individuals, families, and the workforce to
turn adversity into strength and disruption into transformation. So I
(01:56):
am truly honored to have you here, Santa. So can
you kind of explain what the post traumatic stress is
so that our viewers kind of have an understanding.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
Thanks Tina for having me. I'm very honored to be here.
I think anybody who's gone through a divorce needs what
knows what trauma is and the stress of that. Specifically,
we not strangers to that at all. But post traumatic
growth means to me what we do with that traumatic experience,
(02:33):
how we integrate the life lessons that we learn, and
how we grow from that.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Yes, and I when I was kind of reading through
your bio, and I literally could go back to points
in my life where because of my divorce and some
of the things that happened in my marriage brought about
PTSD post traumatic stress, and I think that many of
(03:00):
us experience that, whether we've learned to label that yet
or not. But one of the situations that happened in
my marriage was my husband, my ex husband grabbed my
wrist and was I was I'm not one to like
to fight, and especially to go through the screaming and
yelling and the belittling that happened. And so I was
(03:22):
getting ready to leave the fight the room, and he
grabbed my wrist and I released it because I was
a trained martial artist, and I ended up hitting the
door jam in the process, breaking the back of my hand,
and then he threw me on the bed and stuck
his knee in my chest. And so years down the road,
(03:44):
I was dating somebody else and he went he went
to I don't It wasn't fight induced or anything. There
was a little bit of friction, but he went to
grab my hand, not really my wrist, but I instantly
pull back, and I can remember the effect. It wasn't
like I even had a choice. It just happened.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
It's almost like a reflex.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
And also, of course, with your martial arts training, you know,
you learn how to do these things literally with art thinking,
because if it's a really threatening situation, you have to
do that. You can't hesitate for a moment. But yet
we have memories that trigger us later in life when
we find ourselves in similar situations, and post traumatic stress
(04:34):
and disorder is just that. It's when we carry the
things over from the past experiences and they show up
in our current lives in weird and wonderful ways because
we haven't dealt with them fully mm hmm.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
And I mean there's all kinds of situations that I
can kind of go back to that had some form
of PTSD, so for me, and so we're going to
get into how you help people change this into something
positive because I have worked on this, not with you,
but I have worked on this for a long time.
(05:11):
And so now I am noticing that I've learned little
tricks like mel Robbins talks about the five four three
two one, you turn around and do something different than
what you're doing. And mine isn't quite like that that
I do that, but I do. I take a deep
breath and I count five, and then I think about
(05:33):
what I'm going to say or do in the context
of a confrontation or what could be a confrontation, so
kind of tell us a little bit about how you
work and how that works in your field.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
I have to say we are fortunate because there are
so many people all over the world who work with
trauma and specifically PTSD and you know, post traumatic growth.
So there are endless sources where we can get information.
There are so many processes and modalities and kinds of
therapies and things you know, for us to choose amongst
(06:12):
that we actually know. Living in a very fortunate time,
I have deducted from all my studies and my lived
experience and working with clients over many years, some processes
that I find work quite effectively. But saying that, I
must also stress that it's really unique for every person.
There's no one recipe that works for everyone. So I
(06:35):
have to get to know my client thoroughly to understand
which process or therapy or principles or theories would work
best for them. But I have developed my own get
up and grow process which makes room for adjusting for
(06:55):
every individual, and it basically consists of four steps. The
first step is the get step, and that's get working
around gaining a thorough understanding of what has happened, what
is happening to me, what that impact is on me,
and how it affects the people close to me, the
people around me. Once I have a thorough understanding of
(07:18):
that here in my head, then I can move on
to what I call the up phase. And the up
to me means I update my system literally like we
would update our software of our computers or our phones.
So I update my system with the knowledge that I've
gained or the insight that I've gained, and I upgrade
myself so we figure out what the life lessons are
(07:42):
that lie in these experiences, and in doing that, we
can conclude that I might benefit from CBT, or I
might benefit from a bit of neurolinguistic programming or EMI
or whatever there is some of the things I'm trained
to do myself, and others I will refer to one
(08:03):
of my colleagues to do that.
Speaker 4 (08:04):
But it's only once we.
Speaker 3 (08:05):
Have that thorough understanding so we get the situation, and
when we start doing looking at how and where we
can update to upgrade ourselves, that we really know what
our needs are. So I can't just go to a
psychologist for therapy somebody who doesn't know divorce somebody who
might not have experienced divorced themselves.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
You know, it must be somebody who.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
Specializes in it, or like a divorce coach like you are.
I've been a divorce mentor for many years. We need
to understand the specific dynamics of that and then apply
the best system or process to that person.
Speaker 4 (08:42):
So once we've done that.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
Then the and in the get up and Grow. The
and stands for I adapt or I adjust to my circumstances,
or I adapt to the changed circumstances or what my
future is going to look like the new situation. The
N is for navigate, then I navigate through that, and
I work out how to navigate through that, And the
(09:06):
D is for I direct or divert whatever is needed
in the situation. And then we get to the grow
when we've done all those three steps in the beginning,
and we look back and we evaluate and we assess
and we see how we apply, we learn from that,
and we repeat it. It's literally a step one, two, three, four,
(09:27):
and we repeat that. And it's a process that we
can do or apply anywhere in our lives with any adversity,
any hardship, any challenge, any traumatic experience that I have
found through the years that work very well.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
So I do get up.
Speaker 4 (09:42):
And grow.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Process with my clients. But again it's different for every person.
It's not a fixed recipe. You need a holistic approach
and a really wide view of what can work, what
is art there that is available that works for people.
And of course, something that I specifically specialize in a
lot I enjoy doing it is the high conflict situations,
(10:07):
the really challenging things. I also have a process where
I teach people a couple of tricks and systems to
deal with conflict effectively, especially the really really bad stuff
when there's aggression or victimization or alienation, intimate partner abuse,
that sort of stuff.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
And as you know, I deal with the abuse and
of things and whether it has been physical abuse, but
in all cases, you know, physical abuse, all of it
roots down to the psychological abuse that starts. Alienation, the control, manipulation,
(10:48):
those types of things that start and they you know,
I just wrote a little bit. I'm writing a book,
and so I was writing in that chapter and I
was writing about that manipulation and we're going through our
dating process that is, that's where it starts to show up.
We just don't realize that it's starting to happen. And
(11:10):
if we can be aware that these things are possibly
starting to happen, we can keep an eye on them.
The reality is, and I tell my clients this is
that in the abuse and is we can't change them.
We can't change them. We can change us. We can
learn adapt like you are. And in some cases where
(11:33):
the significant other is narcissistic, they're not always narcissistic, but
they can come across narcissistic, but the person loves them
and wants to keep them in their life. Maybe it's
not a significant other, maybe it's a sibling or even
a child or a parent. Well then we just as
(11:54):
how you talk about the process, we have to learn
how to adapt apt set our own boundaries, and a
lot of people don't understand boundaries. We can't set boundaries
on the other person. We have to set boundaries and
keep them ourselves. These boundaries are our boundaries and we
have to enforce them in so in what you're saying,
(12:16):
it's very much the same way. We again, we can't
control the outside. We have to only and can only
control ourselves.
Speaker 3 (12:27):
It's the curse of control. The manipulation. The narcissistic abuse
that happens is such a difficult thing because it's not tangible,
it's not easy to prove. And I find often that
the stories of what people do, the really horrible things
that people do, are unbelievable. They like the things we
(12:48):
find in the soap operas. People don't believe it, and
they certainly don't understand it if they haven't experienced it themselves.
So those are really tough things to work with people. Yeah,
the whole world, there's still a lot of room for
education and awareness to increase around those things.
Speaker 4 (13:08):
And also I have to.
Speaker 3 (13:09):
Say that there are words that are thrown around these days.
Every other person going through a divorce that I come
across claims that their ex is a narcissist, and it's
a clear difference. I think all of us exhibit some
narcissistic traits from time to time, demaining depending on the
situation and how stress we are under and how high
(13:30):
the conflict is and all that sort of stuff.
Speaker 4 (13:32):
But to be a really truly properly screened.
Speaker 3 (13:37):
And diagnosed person with narcissistic disorder narcissistic personality disorder is
a completely different thing.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
MM hmmm hm. And you know, I've had clients come
to me and tell me that there are acts as
a narcissist, and I will work with them one week
or two weeks, and already I can tell you they're not.
They're maybe. But we all can exhibit negative reactions to
(14:07):
people or because of people or two people, and we
can all do that, so we can all basically be
narcissistic at times in our lives. And Annette Chesney, who's
been on the show a couple of times, she's got
what she calls a narc spectrum. And so it goes
from zero to five, and a lot of really great
(14:29):
people sit at zero but can bounce up to one
or two when they're put into a situation. We call
that situational abuse. And situational abuse does not mean that
the person is an abuser. Now, in my relationship with
the broken hand in things, it was becoming that way.
(14:49):
It was situational. That's how it started. And the longer
at what was going on, the worse it got, and
the worse it was going to get. And we either
need it professional help, merit or counseling or coaching, or
one of us needed to get out or individual, And
that's what happened with me, is is I went for
(15:10):
individual therapy, and that's when I realized I needed to
get out. I was the problem. I was somewhat in
his eyes, the instigator, and I wasn't. I would be
home doing absolutely nothing when he'd come home and taxicated
and blow up, and I couldn't control that, but I
(15:32):
could control me.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
It's like, you know the expression that says it takes
two to tango, m that's too to solve that problem,
resolve the issues in that relationship. I had the similar experience.
I ended up being the only one getting help and
learning and growing well. My ex husband just was not interested.
As far as he was concerned, everything was my fault.
(15:56):
So you can't stay in a relationship like that if
you don't grow together, if you're not hitting in the
same direction, or at least more or less in the
same direction, you're just going to grow further apart. So
there's no point in staying there.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
Yeah, I have lots of clients that beat themselves up afterwards.
What did I do wrong? How could I have fixed it?
You know? And it again, just like you just said,
it takes two and we have to work together. Now,
I had stated earlier, if we have a difficult person
in our lives, but we need to keep them or
want to keep them in there, then again we have
(16:34):
to do the work. One. We have to recognize that
their issues are not our fault. Their issues, even what
they say are are it's not our fault. We have
to to right away go okay, this is whatever. So,
for instance, I have a friend who is he's an
(16:54):
American veteran and he had part of his leg blown up.
So he goes through his own stages of PTSD, and
so recently he had a situation. And because I have
worked with the vets quite a bit on dealing with
that part in divorce and separate, because I do a
lot of anti suicide work with twenty two a day.
(17:18):
And what I have learned is that when they're going
through that, you know, it's hands off. You've got to
let them unless they've gone through their own work, doing
their own work. If you're supporting them, it's hands off,
words off. You can't help them, you can't talk them
(17:38):
through that. All you can do is be present, and
sometimes that's not close present, that's possibly folding clothes in
the next room. And he went through a situation. He
had come to visit and he went through a situation.
That's why he came, because he was going through his thing.
And so he got here and he was having remembering words.
(18:02):
PTSD can cause all kinds of things and having trouble,
and so right away wanted to put a blame on something,
and I was close, So I became blame. When we're
in that situation, we have to go, Okay, really, it's
not about me. It wasn't me, And so I left
the room and did my thing, and pretty soon they apologized.
(18:24):
They had stayed long enough that they were ready to
leave and felt that they were comfortable to leave. But
those are types of things that PTSD causes and that
we might see on the outside.
Speaker 3 (18:38):
Do you know I'd love to share with you how
I explain boundaries to my clients. As I'm listening to you,
I can see I'd love to share this with you
because it helps to understand how we must manage our boundaries.
What you spoke about knowing that this is about me
and that's not about me. I always say, it's like
(19:00):
being a farmer on my own farm. I know that
there's a demarcated area. That is my area where I farm,
and I am also the person who decides what I
do on there. Let's say, for example, I decide to
keep some sheep and some chickens, and I grow wheat
(19:24):
and barley for example. I am in control of what
I do on my farm. I decide when I feed
the sheep, when I have to water the wheat, when
I have to cut it off or.
Speaker 4 (19:39):
Reap it, or sell.
Speaker 3 (19:41):
Some of my sheep because there are too many of them,
or buy in some food. I have to maintain the
fence and make sure the gateworks properly, just to give
some examples. So the farmer's next door to me have
their own setup in which they are in control, and
they might farm with different things than I do. So
if I use my intimate partner as an example, who
(20:03):
farms right next to me, I'll bought boundaries joined, but
they never overlap, and I might form sheep and chickens,
and my partner might work with cattle for example. So
if I find car done on my farm, then I
know it comes from the cattle next door. It doesn't
(20:26):
come from me because I don't have cattle in my farm.
If my partner finds eggs in his farm, he knows
that egg comes from me, because I'm the one with
the chickens. And that's the same thing as the issues,
the unresolved trauma, the problems, the behavioral patterns and things
that we have. I need to understand myself and my
(20:48):
own farm well enough so that I can identify what
reginates here on my farm and what comes from next door.
And I also need to be able to be honest
enough to identify when my chickens have strayed and they've
gone into my partner's farm and they've gone to lay
their eggs there, because that's not ideal, that's not what
(21:09):
we want. So it's just a simple image that I
always use to illustrate how we work with boundaries. But
it means that we are in control of our own farm,
and we have no control about our neighboring farms, or
our partners or the people close to us. Although we
touch signs, and although we might have certain things that
are the same or we have certain things in common,
(21:32):
we must be clear about where they come from and
who is responsible for them. So if my chickens stray,
I am responsible to go and fetch them and bring
them back. I'm responsible for maintaining the fence so they
can't come out and go and cause a disturbance next door.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
So I don't know whether you knew this, but I
was raised on a farm, and so I'm going to
help people see a little bit offside to that. So
if we don't have boundaries, So in the state of Colorado,
which is where I was raised, it is a it's
a free roaming state. So in other words, if you
(22:14):
don't want your neighbor's cows on your property, you have
to fence them out. So if you don't have boundaries,
then those cows, the chickens, the everything can come onto
your property and cause you problems, tear down, you know,
eat your garden, do all of that kind of stuff,
and it's not your neighbor's fault. Yes, that's where we
(22:38):
have to understand. We have to put up those boundaries,
build those fences to keep them out, and we have
to enforce that fence to keep their cattle or sheep
out from our property. And I think that I love,
obviously that you explained it like this, because I have
(23:00):
actually seen what happens when you don't have your fences
up or don't maintain those fences, and the neighbors cows
mix with your cows, and the fight that pursues because
of this. Yes, so we have to make sure that
we maintain those boundaries. And to me, maintaining boundaries really
(23:22):
means keeping myself, my mental self healthy.
Speaker 3 (23:28):
And being very clear about who I want to be,
where I want to be, what I will tolerate or
allow on what I won't. That's where it starts.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
Mm hmm. And that boundaries are, you know, really, that's
what I work with my clients on probably the most
is the boundaries, but not setting the boundaries, but keeping
yourself healthy enough to keep the boundaries strong. And so
(23:59):
we have to work on that. And so one of
my clients actually told me something that she would do
when she was out and about away from her husband
when they were married, is that she would have this
alter alter ego, and she'd go out as this alter
ego and she would talk about this alter ego. And
so after she was finished telling me that story, I said,
(24:21):
what's exactly what we need to do. We need to
bring that alter ego here, because that alter ego is
stronger than the person that's sitting here right now, so
you need to become that alter ego. So it was
a great, great analogy of how each of us have
to help help ourselves keep those boundaries.
Speaker 3 (24:43):
And it's a constant job. It's a lifelong process. It's
not something we do once often then we've got it
all sorts of out. We need to work at it
all the time because life changes and we change, so
we need to re evaluate that and move the fences
a bit, put the gates in another place, you know,
or bring in some new stock or whatever it is.
(25:06):
If I'm staying to sticking to the form analogy, but
it's actually very exciting work to do to increase our
self awareness. When we work on our boundaries. It's empowering,
but difficult and painful sometimes.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
M And therein lies the fact that we are not narcissists,
because a true narcissist, one that could be diagnosed, refuses
to accept responsibility. It's always somebody else's fault. They won't
not even want accept responsibility for those things, and they
blame you and those types of people. If we choose
(25:42):
to stay in that relationship, whatever that relationship looks like,
and we're not taking care of ourselves. We won't make
it through it. I know me in my relationship, and
I don't know whether I would classify my ex husband
a low level narcissist or not, but I know that
(26:03):
had I stayed in that relationship, I would be dead.
I would have probably taken my life because I wasn't
taking good enough care of me. I was trying to
grow and he would cut the growth off. I would
try to grow and he'd cut the growth off. And
part of that was fear that I was out growing him.
And because he wouldn't grow with me, we did grow apart.
(26:27):
And that's okay. I tell my clients that all the time.
It's okay. That was the right thing at that moment.
We needed what we've got. Now it's time for us
to move to the next chapter.
Speaker 3 (26:38):
I'm so glad you mentioned that because it's my third
step and there gets up and growth process where I
talk about adapting and adjusting. It's important to know that
we must not adapt or adjust to the other person
in the relationship. We adapt to who we want to become,
who we choose to be going forward. And there's a
(26:58):
distinct difference between too. If we keep on adapt into
our partner. We're minimizing ourselves and making ourselves and smoll
until this nothing left.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
And that's where the suicidal idation comes from. You know,
because I've worked with you know, suicide, I've I've helped
in that arena since I was a child, because I
had my own issues and and people would cut me
off and wouldn't let me go. And finally when I
realized that, Okay, if they're cutting me off, I have
(27:32):
to move. I have to put my boundaries up, or
or just go out and buy a whole new lot
of land and grow there. So that's what I did,
is I bought a new lot of land and I
moved so in that that kind of takes me into
my client's next step, that is the taking care of
(27:56):
themselves so they don't end up in this kind of
relationship again.
Speaker 4 (28:00):
Again.
Speaker 3 (28:00):
Yeah, that's the probably one of the biggest dangers coming
out of a divorce or separation, especially if it's high conflict.
If we don't do the work to figure out what
went wrong there, or what mistakes we made, or how
we neglected ourselves, we're just going to repeat it.
Speaker 4 (28:19):
So that's a very important work to do. I agree
with you.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Yeah, Yeah, and that understanding the boundaries being able to
become the person you want to be, the alter ego
that you want to be, being able to be that
person all the time, you know, and that doesn't mean
that it's one hundred percent of the time. But when
we're having a bad day, it's okay. So I lost
(28:44):
my husband a year ago and the whole month of June,
because that was the timeframe, that whole month of June.
I didn't know I was off, but I wasn't myself.
I didn't feel right and it could be that it
was depression. I couldn't tell you because I have been
depressed and it didn't feel that way, but it was off.
(29:04):
And we slip. And the whole thing is is just
because we slip and fall down, just like a little kid,
they fall down and we let them get themselves up.
Then pretty soon they fall. The next time, they get
up without crying. That's what we need to do.
Speaker 3 (29:22):
Yeah, that's what That's where my name Get Up and
Grow comes from. The ideas started with when life knocks
is done, we have to get up and grow. Otherwise
we're going to keep on being knocked down, or we're
going to keep on falling over the same obstacle, but
getting up, and we get better at getting up the
more we get up where the more we practice it,
(29:44):
and every time we learn and grow, we better at
it the next time.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
Mm hmmmm. And so Get Up and Grow is your program?
And don't you have a podcast yourself? I do.
Speaker 4 (29:58):
It's also called Get Up and Grow.
Speaker 3 (30:01):
I spent a lot of time and effort on divorce
because I actually have a platform for divorce itself called
Fair Divorce that I founded in twenty fifteen, So we're
celebrating ten years with that. I am very passionate about that.
That's actually where the turn came around for me to
start working with trauma, specifically because of my own experience.
(30:24):
My own divorce was absolutely disastrous and a drawn out,
very very expensive situation. But yeah, my podcast, I spent
a lot of time talking about divorce on all the
issues related to it, co parenting again, high conflict, alienation,
which is rife and abuse.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
Well, I was lucky enough to be a guest on
your show, and I know our conversation was very much
so based around the divorce and in understanding in the
next and things like that. And I think you know
so often people just don't realize just how costly a
divorce is. And it's not just financial out of your pocket,
(31:12):
it's it costs you a lot of your soul. You
pay for things with essence that you don't even have
to pay, and so it changes you. It can jade
you in a really bad direction. So many people will
get the divorce and never want to have another relationship
because they were treated so bad and until they do
(31:35):
the work, they can't move on. And so having the
support like your support and divorce and then the get
up and Grow program, those are super important for people
that are going through a divorce because without that support,
you're going to pay with things you'll never be able
(31:56):
to get back from your soul again.
Speaker 3 (32:00):
With you. And unfortunately, most parts of the world even
still today, don't understand the need for divorce support that
covers everything. Traditionally, everybody goes down the litigation route, or
the one alternative that is slowly starting to get traction
is mediation. But still the majority of people go for litigation,
(32:23):
which is acrimonious and it always tends, you know, it
turns into a disastrous fight or a battle, a war
with several battles costing a lot of money, So people
don't understand the real need for a divorce coach like yourself,
or a divorce mentor like I call myself, because you
look at the whole picture, You look at every aspect
(32:44):
of that. Like you said, the cost is not only financial,
there's a lot. It brings about a tremendous amount of
life changes. If they are children involved, you have to
change and adapt your parenting style to help your children
to get through. There's so many things that you have
to look at. And then the recovery after that, you
literally have to rebuild your life or start building a
(33:08):
new life from scratch. For some people, it's complex, and
it's really really important to get proper guidance, proper support.
And I keep on coming back to lived experience. I
personally prefer to work with people who have had lived experience.
Also because all the academic training in the world cannot
(33:31):
replace lived experience.
Speaker 2 (33:34):
Oh and I agree, you know, in coaching aspects, I mean,
we're all taught that one of the things that we
do when we have a client that's going sideways, and
it's like, let's start, let's look at all the positive
things that you've accomplished to this point. So lived experiences
are great that way, and you know so often and
(33:57):
I can tell you we're talking about the hordes of divorce. Well,
I'm the one who left my ex husband, and six
months after I left him, I attempted suicide. Here I
worked in that arena, and here I was in that
horrible place. And the reason that that happened is I
(34:17):
didn't ask for help. So when we say that we pay,
you know, I almost made my children pay for the
rest of their lives by taking my life because my
pain was so intense that I couldn't see them or
the things around me. And that's we really I needed
to reach out and ask for help, because that was bad.
(34:41):
And after I experienced that, then I did. I did
reach out and ask for help, and it's that help
that set me on the path that I am today.
You know, I.
Speaker 3 (34:53):
Always say that when we get married, we involved so
many people in the process. In fact, we have a
huge celebration. Our families, our friends, everybody close.
Speaker 4 (35:05):
To us are there. They share it. That involved in.
Speaker 3 (35:08):
The planning and the execution and everything. The marriage is
a big thing. But when we separate or get divorced,
suddenly everything's kept secret, nobody knows exactly what's going on,
nobody else is involved in the process. We are suddenly
isolated and all.
Speaker 4 (35:23):
Alone when we go through.
Speaker 3 (35:26):
This, and we can probably talk for hours about why
we do that, but it's hard for most people to
say I need help, please help me, and to involve
people here in our the most of the time, the
breakdown of our marriage, the things that happen, the high conflict,
(35:48):
the struggles that escalate and become physical and abusive, or
things we are ashamed of.
Speaker 4 (35:55):
We don't want people to know.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
We'd rather keep it a secret and suffer in silence,
and then we find ourselves in a desperate and destitute situation.
And that's something that I also work hard on changing
for people when they come to me. This is one
of the first things we look at. Who do you
have in your corner, what support do you have, Who
(36:17):
have you told exactly what's going on, the whole truth,
the whole situation. We tend not to do that. We
can't go through the difficult things in life by our souls.
Speaker 4 (36:27):
We just can't. We're not made that way.
Speaker 2 (36:32):
Yeah, I didn't tell my family what was really going
on in my relationship. They thought I left my husband
for another man. Everybody did, and on the outside, that's
kind of what it looked like. I found somebody that
was in AA and was safe because my family wouldn't
support me. They wouldn't support me. They were bad mouthing
me and already and it didn't have anything directly to
(36:54):
do with this guy yet until after I left, and
four years later, I was no longer with that man.
It was a used situation, unbeknownst to me. I just
needed that safe space for that time frame. But I
was living with my mom and she decided to get
me and my ex husband back together for Thanksgiving and
(37:15):
invited him and my children over, and he got me
down on the floor in her living room in a
choke hold, and my youngest son had to pull him
off of me.
Speaker 4 (37:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (37:26):
Yeah, that's when she That was the last time her
and him talked. She knew that she saw as true colors,
so he didn't reach out to her, and she decided
that she wasn't going to reach out to him. She says,
I never saw that side of him. I'm like, I
tried to tell you, yes, re fact that you left
for somebody else.
Speaker 3 (37:48):
It's amazing how people jump to conclusions and make assumptions
that are most of the time incorrect. But then I
have to also say, when we have children, especially when
the young, there is a degree of secrets that we
have to keep, facts that we have to keep to
our souls to protect our children edge appropriately. And we
(38:10):
also it's hard to continue in co parent with somebody
who was that bad for you, or if the relationship
was that toxic and you have to continue to co
parent with that person, it's time difficult. So we do
keep things quiet. We do tend to keep things under wraps,
to keep the peace, to be able to co parent,
(38:32):
to also protect the image in front of the children
or the rest of the family. So there are valid
reasons for keeping some of it. But we all need
someone we can trust. We all need, like you said,
a safe space where we can let our hair down,
some other person that can witness our suffering and our
(38:52):
grief and the loss and the things that we're dealing with.
We really do we can't do without that.
Speaker 2 (39:00):
And so as we're getting ready to come to the
end of this center, can you kind of tell me
how people can find you. I know, all your kind
tagged information will be on the bottom. But if you
could tell us how they could find you.
Speaker 3 (39:19):
Yes, I have a website that's in my name, Santa
Yevson dot co dot z a, so you can search
for that and on there you'll find links to all
my other projects. If you're going through a divorce, you
can go to Fairdivorce dot co dot z a. You'll
find everything there and then get up and grow. Like
we've talked about, that is an online community that you
(39:40):
can join. You can sign up and join there. There's
a lot, there's a whole library of resources, information, resilience tools,
online courses, all sorts of things that you can imagine.
So there are three places from which you can find me.
And if you want to follow me on social media,
everything is on my name sometime this song, and I'm
(40:01):
on on all the social media platforms.
Speaker 2 (40:04):
Makes it easy to find you. So I am a
certified divorce coach, meaning that I'm training the complexities of divorce.
I've also dealt with the difficulties in a marriage. I
my father, and my late husband all had dealt with abuse.
So not only am I trained in divorce, I'm also
I've experienced the abuse and know how to get out
(40:27):
from here to there. You can find me and contact
me through my email Coach Tina Lynn at gmail dot com,
dot co O A C H T I n A
L y n N at Gmail. On my website is
Divorce Coachspecialist dot com. And I'm on social media Facebook
under Tina Lynn Huggins. That's h U G G I
(40:48):
n S LinkedIn under Tina Huggins, Instagram under Divorce Coach
Tina Lynn, and TikTok under divorce Divorce Tina So Sinta,
can you give some last minute advice to our viewers.
Speaker 3 (41:05):
I'd love to tell somebody who's going through a divorce
something that's very important. On the basis for me to
start with is to tell you that I believe you.
Whatever you're going through, the horrible things you've experienced, the
things you've seen your partner do that you never thought
would be possible, that you never expected. I want you
(41:28):
to know that I believe you. I've seen the worst
of the worst. I've stood between people who are literally
ready to kill each other physically. I know these bad
things happen, and I believe you, and there is a
way for you to move forward.
Speaker 4 (41:43):
Always so very good.
Speaker 2 (41:47):
And my advice is I've given this in the last
few shows, is to ask for help, share your story
with those closest to you, because when it's time for
you to make your accit, family are going to be
the ones that'll be there. In my case, I didn't
share any of my information, so my family wasn't there.
They believed him as opposed to me because I didn't
(42:10):
share with them. So start sharing, even if it's just
little bits here and little bits there, until you can
inform them of what's really going on in your life,
and then reach out for help because getting out of
this situation can be life threatening, so it's important that
it's done right and that you have an exit plan
(42:30):
in place. So Incinta's there, she can help you with
the emotional end of this as well as going through
your divorce, so she's got the get up and grow
aspect that can help you and definitely help you after
the fact, because again, you have to take care of
this person in order to be able to take care
(42:51):
of this out here. So very good. So many people,
including myself and you heard me talk about this earlier,
get to a bad place where we're considering suicide. Please
don't there is another day coming. This two shall pass.
(43:11):
If you are dealing with suicidal thoughts, please call nine
eight eight, and if you're in the Netherlands you can
dial one one three. Talk to somebody deal with the
situation right here, right now, until we can get you
help there to help support you out of this situation.
If you are in a situation where you need the police,
(43:32):
if there's violence going on in here. In the States,
it's nine to one to one, in the UK it's
nine nine to nine, and in the Netherlands it's one
one two. Once you get the police there, press charges.
Those charges are your key out of the relationship. Do
not drop those charges. Once you drop those charges, what
comes after the charges is dropped is generally much more
(43:54):
difficult or worse than what happened to you prior. So
this is your time, This is your chance to get out.
And the Domestic Violence Hotline is eight hundred seventy nine
nine seven two three three. That number again is eight
hundred seven ninety nine seventy two thirty three. And if
this has been helpful for you, please like, comment, and
(44:16):
share so that it can help others. Thank you so
much for being here. Santa, thank you so much for
having me. It was wonderful. I'm honored. Thanks Tina, thank you.
This has been a very wonderful conversation, so again, thank you.
Speaker 4 (44:31):
Yeah, fantastic.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
You're listening to WGSNDB going Solo Network Singles Talk Radio Channel,
where we take a lighthearted and candidate approach to discussions
on the journey of relationship, laws, divorce, parenting, being single, relationships, building, dating,
and yes sex. Join our listeners and begin living your
best life.
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