May 23, 2025 • 41 mins
In this powerful and inspiring episode, we sit down with James Sherman, a dedicated advocate, educator, and Substance Use Navigator whose personal journey from homelessness and active drug use in Philadelphia to becoming a core team member at The Everywhere Project is nothing short of remarkable. James shares how receiving life-saving materials from the very organization he now serves helped him survive — and how he now pays it forward through education on overdose reversal, harm reduction tools like testing strips, and fighting stigma around substance use. We explore the impact of compassionate drug policies, real-world statistics, and the power of lived experience in shaping better support systems. Tune in for a conversation about resilience, purpose, and the human side of harm reduction.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
Welcome to be a voice. I'm Brick Carpenter of the
Sousula Media. Thanks for joining us today. Today, I have
a guest that I'm very excited about because I've been trying,
i think, for like the past maybe three years to
rope this guy in here and have him come and
sit down with me and spend some time and share
his story and his journey and you know, just the
incredible things that he does and who he is. For
(00:43):
those of you who don't know who he is, his
name is James Sherman. For those of you who do
know who he is, he is known as Sherm. Today,
I have Sherm. What's going on?
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Brother? Oh?
Speaker 3 (00:51):
W were you man? Thanks for having me?
Speaker 2 (00:52):
My gosh about time?
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Well, I canceled a few times. I'm a busy guy.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
It's just like you know, three years, you know, I
try to get you on my dance card.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Somehow, this is true.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
I didn't even have to bribe you with anything. I
didn't promise you food or nothing or it's great anything
for you, britt, right on, right on. Well, thanks for
showing up today. How's it going? Man?
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Blessed? This can be truly? Yeah, truly, you.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
Know people say that all the time, you know, you know,
I'm blessed, I'm blad you know, but you know certain
people say it and they mean it, and you just
had you know, truly, yeah, you know, and that that's
interesting because it's sort of a good segue into you know, well,
first of all, like I know who you are, and
you know, I admire and love the hell out of Via,
And but who are you sherm You know who is
James Sherman.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
You do a little cliff notes version out there.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
Yeah, the cliff notes I guess is I'm a kid
that well I'm not a kid anymore, but I'm a
kid who grew up to still. Yeah, I am thirty
three this month. So but I grew up in a
household two parents who are Hameron addicts, and you know,
told myself I would never choose that life. Right, and
fast forward, you know, fifteen twenty years later, you know,
(02:02):
addicted to heroin, homeless and Kensington, freshly out of the military,
didn't really have a clue about life. And you know,
four years in recovery, now I'm truly blessed to see
a different life, different side of things.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Four years. Yeah, it's been that long now.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Yeah, January was four.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
That's awesome. Congratulations, Thanks man. It's been cool to watch.
Speaker 3 (02:21):
Your journey, cool to see you involved.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
You know, and it's interesting because we talk about that, like,
you know, it is an evolution. I don't think people
realize that that when you go into recovery and you
start your recovery journey, you know, people are.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
Always like, oh my gosh, you're the person that you were.
Speaker 1 (02:37):
No, you're never the person you were before. It's really
not because if you were, you'd be right back where
you started. So you became this whole new person. And
you have a history. So you're both your parents were
addicted to heroins, right, Yeah, so you grew up in
a household seeing this.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
Yeah, I think when I think about my childhood, you know,
even as young as like six or seven, I remember
seeing it, you know, tie offs on the ground, little
orange caps, you know, which at the time, as a kid,
you know, you maybe not put two and two together,
But the older you get, you're kind of just like, wow,
I was, I was in the thick of it.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
He was right there in your house, Yes, it was. Yeah,
you know, did you ever visually see it? Did you
see that happening or.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
Yeah, yea, even though its really young, I can remember,
you know, parents slumped over, you know, syringes around. I
think I think that young. I went into the foster
care system at nine, so I think, you know, six
seven eight, I was so young that I didn't really
I didn't really know what it was yet. You know,
I knew life was chaotic. Dad was in and out
of the house and then out of prison. Oldest brother
(03:37):
was pretty fed up with how life was. But I
didn't understand yet.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
I came later, well, at six seven eight.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
I mean, it's how do you even understand turning thirty
three sometimes, you know, so that let alone that young
to process what's going on, you're sort of just, you know,
like a little head spinning.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
You know.
Speaker 1 (03:52):
It's not the same as Johnny or Susie's house, you know,
and I'm.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
Not sure why, but this is different.
Speaker 3 (03:59):
It is.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
And then you went foster care at the age of nine.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
Yeah, I was fortunate. Both of my brothers came with me.
We all went to the same foster care system, which.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
Was nice because how old are your brothers?
Speaker 3 (04:08):
Three years apart? So three three three, so my oldest
one six years older than me and my second my
middle brother's three years.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Older than me. Okay, so the youngest.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Yeah, you're the baby, baby, I'm the baby.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
So they took you are able to go together?
Speaker 3 (04:19):
Yeah, so we went together. My oldest brother, Dante, chose
to stay in foster care till he was eighteen because
he was fifteen or so when it happened. But me
and my brother Tony were adopted by the Sherman family. So,
you know, everyone knows me a Sherm. That's actually not
my birth name, which is interesting. But the Sherman's, beautiful family,
great family, love my mom to death, took me in
and adopted me.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
So, so your nickname is was was a given name?
Speaker 2 (04:44):
Then? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (04:45):
So I was? My last name at birth was Cardella.
I'm Irish and Italian.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Well it's interesting because when you said Dante, I'm like, well,
where does Sherman fit into Dante? I had that going
to so that I'm like, that's an interesting name. Okay,
So all right, and where where did you were were
you born? Right?
Speaker 3 (05:00):
So? I was born in Detroit. I grew up all
over Michigan. Born in Detroit, moved up north, you know,
was lived up there with my birth parents, was adopted
up north, and yeah, I ended up going to a
boarding school in Battle Creek and you know, had families
still in Livonia, Southfield, so pretty much all over Michigan,
but North as we're out, Yeah, okay, Yeah, I have a.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Friend that lived there and you know, a great little area.
It's interesting.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
Yeah, different.
Speaker 1 (05:27):
Yeah, you know, so you went to Battle Creek so
was that was that a military school?
Speaker 3 (05:31):
Yeah, so that's kind of when it when it started
for me as far as addiction is concerned, you know,
you know, I think back like twelve thirteen, fourteen, having
my first alcoholic beverages, drinking, liking the way I felt,
you know, and it just progressed, right.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Tried so you got young twelve thirteen, I.
Speaker 3 (05:47):
Think thirteen was my first drink. Yeah, it progressed, you know,
tried my first opioid at fifteen, sixteen and sixteen, get
in a lot of trouble with the law as far
as you know, kids, stuff, breaking in, ring whatnot. And
Mom approaches me and says, he I want you to
go to this program. It's called the Michigan Youth Challenge Academy.
And I remember like kicking and screaming, like I'm not going.
(06:10):
I'm not going, and she said just go to the orientation.
If you don't like, you don't have to go. And
I went in that place. It really made me feel
like you're not man enough to make it through my program.
It worked, the reverse psychology on young sixteen years It worked,
and I went and I did it and it was
a twenty two week long program military worker.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
And that's why you went because you were like, you're
not going to tell me I'm not going to succeed.
Speaker 3 (06:34):
That's how it started. Yeah, And when I got there, oh, man,
I wanted to leave so many times. I think that
was the first accomplishment of my life.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
So was it like a teen challenge? Is that what it? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (06:44):
Pretty much. So I left there with a ged some
college credits, which was enough at the time to get
into the military. And that's when I went to the
Air Force.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
You're in the Air Force. They had four years sick.
So in this teen challenge youth challenge, what was it called.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
Yeah, Michigan Youth Challenge Academy.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Where was it.
Speaker 3 (07:03):
It's in Battle Creek, Michigan and it's on like it's
on a National Garden reservation, old Air base so it's,
you know, really military style. You're going living in the dorms,
you're marching around campus, you're wearing BDUs, you're shining your boots.
It was the real deal, man.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
And that was how old sixteen.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
I got out of there December turned seventeen in May,
So about six months six months?
Speaker 2 (07:29):
Did you drink in those six months?
Speaker 3 (07:31):
Not at the place? Oh, when I came home, when
you came home from Yeah, when I came home, you
went those yes, which is a great just point in
general about recovery, right and support. And you know, I
thought that that place would change me. So did my family.
And I came out and link right back up the
same friends, same girls, same groups, and you know, it's
(07:51):
backsmoking weed, experimenting with pills. I think that's how I
ended up going to the military. Mom had had enough
and she pretty much said, hey, you know, you're not
living on my roof without a job or going to
college or something like that. And I said, oh, I
guess I'll go in the military.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
You know, it's interesting because when you said mom, like
we talk about a lot, we talk about how people
forget that families are affected by this more so than
sometimes the person that's going through it, because person going
through it sometimes oblivious and you know that whatever, but
you know, to have your mother do this, and this
was your not even biological mother, this was your adoptive
(08:27):
mother at the age of nine, and this is now twelve,
three years into this, you know where you know, some
people just throw their hands up and be like, exactly done, absolutely,
you know, and she was like, no, you're you're doing this.
Speaker 3 (08:41):
Yeah, wonderful woman. Man Anita Sherman all over her to death.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
She's still in Michigan.
Speaker 3 (08:46):
Yep, still in Michigan. I haven't seen her probably a
year and a half now or the last time I
saw her, she came.
Speaker 2 (08:52):
Out here and she call her mom or Anita.
Speaker 3 (08:54):
Call her mom. You know, I know my biological mom.
We talk briefly, you know, and the mutual respect is there.
She's like, hey, Anita raised you. She's a wonderful woman.
And I feel the same way. You know, she earned
that title.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
Right, Your mom's doing well, your biological mom.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
And biological mom is doing well. Dad is a little iffy.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
Yeah, hey, yeah, got you got one out of two.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
That's absolutely that's good.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
And there's a relationship that's that you know, but you
also have that win. So so you were then you
got out of there seventeen, Yeah, and went to the
military Air Force.
Speaker 2 (09:30):
Where the air Force? Where'd they take you in the
air Force?
Speaker 3 (09:33):
So I started out in San Antonio, Texas. He was
there for about six months. And I mean, listen, that's
how I got up to the East coast. Most stationed
at McGuire Air Force Base over in Jersey. Didn't know
anything about the East Coast at all, you know, Midwest boy,
and I got here and it's like, you know, we
here in the twelve stuff. Fellowships like the Islam's were
always there, and you know they were in the military.
(09:55):
I was couldn't stop drinking, couldn't control my drinking.
Speaker 2 (09:59):
You know, if you a little bit more, doesn't it.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
Yeah, yeah, I think that is a fair assumption of
the public eye that you know, a lot of people
drink in the military. And I think at least for me,
it was because I couldn't use drugs, all.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
Right, because you've got popped for that, that's right, huge exactly,
So you drank heavily in the military to mask all
that to not have to use before the military was
more weed and.
Speaker 3 (10:22):
Yeah, experiment with pills opiates, and you know, I mean,
but even a fourteen fifteen experiment with those opiates. It's
so different experimenting than later in life when it's like, oh,
this is the missing piece.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, No, I get that, because you
know what, you can sort of like walk away because
it's like, Okay, you're still fourteen, You're still just that whatever.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
But yeah, I get that. So there you are in
the military. You're in San Antonio, you got MacGuire, yep, Jersey,
in Jersey, you got how and how long ago was that?
Speaker 3 (10:51):
I got out in twenty thirteen, so I was in
nine to thirteen.
Speaker 2 (10:56):
Was it an honorable discharge?
Speaker 3 (10:58):
It was, by the great of God. I had done
a lot of things, got Article fifteen, lost rank, all
these certain things, and the Air Force was actually trying
to downsize at the time, and they said, hey, everyone
with an Article fifteen, we're offering to get out honorably early.
My drill sergeant pulled me in the office. I said absolutely, yeah,
I said absolutely. I think truly the alcoholic and addict
(11:20):
in me was telling myself, Hey, this is a godsend,
like this is your opportunity to get out and not
have a dishonorable discharge. And I took it. I ran
with it. I got out.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
So sort of a way of you saying, you know what,
now it's time to figure it out. So you got
out once you got out in twenty thirteen, you know
here you are on the East coast.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
Yeah, after you're going through it all and everything, you stayed.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
Yeah, this is probably when it really kicks off into
addict schrm, excuse me. I got out twenty thirteen, stayed here,
chose to stay here, I guess because I told myself
there'd be more opportunity here, you know than Michigan. Well
that's what it ended up being. But uh, I got
(12:03):
out when it was going to community college, not taking
it serious at all. I was living in Burlington, New Jersey, Okay,
so still in Berlinton County, was going to it was
Burlinton County community College at the time. Now it's rowing
but and yeah, I think the first thing I thought
was I'm not in the service anymore. I'm not subject
to urns, and I want to try some things. And
(12:23):
I did, you know, and I always tell people, you
know about my journey, is that like I tried all
these different things, right, you name, and I tried it.
None of them were a problem until it was an opioid.
You know. A buddy said, he's that weird.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
It was like, you know, the same thing, and I'm
going to cut you off there. But I don't think
anybody could really understand that. And you know, everybody's like,
oh my gosh, you know you tried everything. I'm like,
I did, yeah, I'm like, and nothing really caught me until.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
It was fun partied, you know, went out whatever. But
nothing was like this is the missing link the feeling. Yes,
so you know, yeah, A buddy said, you know, you
got to try one of these, You're gonna love it,
And I did for the next eight years.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Isn't it interesting? And did you think about this when
you when you.
Speaker 1 (13:07):
Did your first opioid, think about your biological parents and
the did you remember that at all?
Speaker 2 (13:14):
Did you have that in the back of your mind
or the forefront.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
Or that's such a great question. I don't think any
of that processes until later in recovery, where I'm really
able to sit with my thoughts right and do some
soul searching that sometimes happened in jail cells and detox beds.
And rare yes. And that's when the correlation comes where
it's like, man, I totally get why my parents were
(13:39):
who they were. You know, I always talk about, you know,
with my daughter, and you know, when she was born,
it was like, I have to get myself together. I'm
not going to be who my parents were. And lo
and behold it happened. That's just the power of addiction.
And it was like, in that moment, I forgave my
parents because I was like, I get it. I get
it now. They didn't. It's not that they had a
lack of love for me. It's that their substance use
disorder was strong.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
They had a lack of love for themselves, the same
as you and I and everybody else that goes through this.
And I was talking to a friend about this the
other day, and I think people tend to forget about
that that it's you know, you know, the reason I
asked that question was because that's probably part of the
trauma that triggers you to into the substance use disorder,
into the disease. Because it is a disease, as you've
(14:24):
come to realize, in many forms. You know, how old
your daughter about to be seven?
Speaker 2 (14:30):
About to be seven, and you are you see her now?
Speaker 3 (14:34):
And I just went to the Phillies game, her first
Phillies game the other night.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
It was her first Phillies.
Speaker 3 (14:38):
Game, her first Phillies games.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
Oh my gosh, you did you behave during the game
as you are.
Speaker 3 (14:43):
Like I did. I even allowed us to leave in
the seventh, which doesn't happen often. She was getting nantcy.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
But it was a night game.
Speaker 3 (14:49):
Yeah game, But yeah, man, I love that you touched
on the lack of love because I can't. I can't
feel enough for how true that is. You know, I
think when I think my addiction and you know, my
almost two years of homelessness, and you know, no desire
to live. That's what it boiled down to sow.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
And sure, you know this is a lot to uppeal in
the time we had because you have to come back
because of the fact that it's going to be a
lot to do. But you know, here you were, you
you know, you had this loving family that took you in.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
You went to this went to this school that sort
of straightened out a little bit, and then you went
to the Air Force where you had more free rein
and discovered alcohol was a lot easier than when drugs were.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
Sometimes a little more cheaper.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
Yeah, and you know, it was easier waking up with
a hangover than sometimes waking up, you know, or maybe
not waking up from something else. You know, you were
over there, you're going to you know, community college. How
did you end up then homeless? Yeah, I'm going to
jump right to that.
Speaker 3 (15:50):
You're right, it is a lot to unpack. Yeah, you know,
and I'll send you my bill for the therapy. But
it's cool, man, Now I could touch the basis is that,
you know, my opioid addiction to me, all the places
it takes everyone, you know, all my nevers came true.
You know, I thought I could maintain as long as
I wasn't homeless, or I could maintain as long as
I kept a job, or you know, as long as
(16:10):
I wasn't stealing from people, or you know, I could
do pills. But it's never going to be heroin. All
the stipulations I put on my diction, you know, eventually
all went out the window. So I think Kensington became
home when I found out how cheap drugs were, how
easy they were to access, accessible, very accessible. You know,
I'll never forget somebody putting me onto like Kensington for
(16:31):
the first time, and I was I was just mind blown.
Coming from the Midwest, you need to know somebody and
call somebody, and to see how open air drug market
works was was just crazy to me. And I think
like many other people who live in the counties or
the suburbs, you know, it becomes a point where it's
like is it worth coming down and copying and going
back home and coming down to and it's just, hey,
(16:52):
I'm just gonna stay. And I always say it, you know.
I remember that first night, like being out here all
night and like not really knowing where should I sleep,
like where safe, and like realizing there is no safe
and I think, you know, you touched on that lack
of love and that's kind of you know, in the
back of my mind at the same time to say,
you know what, I I don't deserve any more than
(17:13):
these people that are sleeping on the street. So I'm
just going to become one. And it happens that quick.
Speaker 2 (17:18):
And at the time, did you have a place to
go back to?
Speaker 3 (17:20):
So I didn't. Around the same month that I became homeless,
I had been evicted for not paying my rent. You know,
I was in and out of rehabs, in and out
of jail, and the run from probation landlords looking for me.
So I was evicted on the fifteenth and like towards
the end of the month, I ended up homeless in Kensington.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
And you had been in treatment prior to this, in
and out of treatment.
Speaker 3 (17:39):
In and out a few times. Yeah, yeah, a few times.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
He say. You know, we all know that.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
You know, we're not unique. That's something very common and
which is sad to say because that's what goes on.
But in and out of jail, And may I ask like,
was it just typical?
Speaker 2 (17:53):
Like typical?
Speaker 3 (17:55):
Yeah, you definitely may ask, because I'm very passionate about
criminally justice impacted people because of it. You know, all
of my criminal charges are stemmed from drug use, you know. Stealing.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
Yeah, all those boxes you checked real quick, like, I'm
never going to do that.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
I'm not going to do that. Out going to do that.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
Those those boundaries you put on the usage were prior
to all went out the window, all of them.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
So stealing, go.
Speaker 3 (18:20):
Ahead, Yeah, it's so stealing, you know, petty theft, distribution,
you know, phony possession. I think you know, at a
point in my addiction too. I thought if I could
sell the drugs, I could make enough money to do
the drugs. And monkey can't sell bananas, I tried. So yeah,
all my jail stays were directly correlated to my substance use.
Speaker 1 (18:42):
That's why in the early two thousands that was the
worst coke dealer ever, because like, oh, you're coming over to.
Speaker 2 (18:48):
Buy, why don't you stay for a little bit, We'll
go through this whole rock.
Speaker 3 (18:51):
Yeah, let me do a couple.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
Yeah exactly, and then you know it's two in the morning. Yea.
But so there you were in Kensington first night.
Speaker 3 (18:58):
How old were you so at that time I would
have been twenty five, right.
Speaker 1 (19:03):
At that age where we're our cognitive and our our
whole development is supposed to kick in the overdrive.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
You know, there you were, you know where.
Speaker 1 (19:13):
Most people are out there seeking out that career job aspect.
And you know that that significant other, with the white
offense and two point five children, you made, you actually
made the conscious decision to.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
Just say fuck at.
Speaker 3 (19:30):
All I did. I did the daughter probation, the family,
you know, none of it mattered. The only thing that
matter was one more. You know, how am I going
to get this next bag. How am I going to
get this next money? That's all that mattered, you know,
And I think, you know, like I said, none of
that came till you know, we were talking about family earlier.
(19:52):
None of that came until my recovery that I realized
how much I put my family.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
Through, you know, And because I want I want people
to know know this, and I say this all the
time because as a person that is that went through
active addiction for thirty years of his life. We're selfish.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
We are.
Speaker 1 (20:09):
If we weren't selfish, we wouldn't have been on the streets,
we would have left people behind.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
We wouldn't be worried about our next fix.
Speaker 1 (20:16):
You know what I'm saying. It's all those things I
think we are. People will dispute it and say you
shouldn't say that, but at the brutality and the reality
of it is, we are.
Speaker 3 (20:24):
No we are. And I think you know, my shot
at recovery came from other people loving me, right, you
know you hear that too, right, love them un till
they love themselves, And that that's my story. I entered
recovery with nothing but the clothes on my back. And
you know, out of a jail cell.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Did you have shoes on your feet?
Speaker 3 (20:42):
I did, That's literally one outfit, no phone, didn't even
have a toothbrush. I don't say that to brag.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
That's that's the first Reality's what's going on, not even
you know, a mile from here to Lily, you know,
and a mile from here is where you were, you
know it is, and you were there.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
For how many years?
Speaker 3 (21:01):
How long? Almost two years?
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Two years homeless?
Speaker 3 (21:05):
Yeah, eighteen months if it was straight, the last six
months there. This is all during the pandemic. So it's
like I try to rehab, left rehab mo vet. So
I go down to VA. I frequent the VA a lot.
I'm in their seventh floor addiction unit, and then eventually
locked up and put in jail. And that's kind of
what broke the cycle.
Speaker 1 (21:24):
And as as somebody that's in active substance use, we
we know how to work things, we really do. I
mean I always tell people that, like, listen, you can't
bullshit a bullshitter, especially one.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
That you know was very good at it.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
The VA, especially people that you know how to worked
at which is great, you know, to that extent, they
should be work because they don't really work for it.
Speaker 2 (21:45):
I think that's now, So that's a whole different show.
It is, But you know, you're out there on the streets, man.
What what's it like.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
Waking up in a different place or maybe not even
knowing where you're waking up?
Speaker 2 (22:00):
Yeah, can you describe that to me?
Speaker 3 (22:03):
It's brutal. I think, like one thing that's like misconcepted
though a lot is that like when you're so dug
in on being a homeless, addicted person, you lose sight
of so much, not knowing what month it is, who's
in the super Bowl, who the president is time like
essentially isn't real. You know, it doesn't matter if it's Tuesday.
(22:24):
It doesn't matter if it's Sunday. You know, I wake
up with one thing on my mind, which is that
I need some money. I need it now because if
I don't, I'm going to be sick. And if I'm sick,
I'm not going to be a good person.
Speaker 1 (22:37):
And I probably woke up late and I can get
to the Sampson time. Yeah, you know, things like that,
And that's that's what happens in our minds.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
We go through that.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
We live for the next day to figure out how
we're going to get that next fix to make sure
that we're well, yeah, because if not, we're going to
be very unwell.
Speaker 3 (22:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
And if we're unwell, we don't know how.
Speaker 1 (22:56):
We're going to be so at that stage, and yet
you're on these streets and you see yourself in the mirror.
Speaker 2 (23:02):
What do you think, Sharan, what were you thinking? Did
you recognize yourself?
Speaker 3 (23:06):
I think it it it at the end of the
two years in a jail cell is when it finally happened.
Where like I'm looking in the mirror, I could see
my ribs. You know, I'm one hundred and ten pounds.
My hair was so long. You know, I'm very transparent
of who I was. Right, head lice, body lice wounds
starting to develop from xylazine hitting the supply.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
You came into the end of that. I did well
the beginning of it, right in the beginning beginning of yes.
Speaker 3 (23:31):
And I think in jail looking at myself in that mirror,
just not recognizing it.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
Got some opening sores there, which you know, you know,
I was very fortunate.
Speaker 2 (23:40):
I say it like that, but I was. I was
very fortunate to get out of it.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
Right when started hitting, you know, when fetty started coming
around is when I you know, when I started overdose
of five times, I'm like, wait, I know what I'm doing.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
Why am I overdose?
Speaker 3 (23:51):
It's still overdose?
Speaker 1 (23:52):
You know, So what's going on? And that's a fetty.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
I went out. I don't want anything to do with that,
and I'm loud.
Speaker 1 (23:58):
I don't know how and you know, like that becomes
something you crave them because that's what your body needs.
Speaker 2 (24:04):
Yeah, so that was in the end. So how long
were you in jail for?
Speaker 3 (24:07):
So that's the interesting thing. You know, a lot of
people here, I was a locked for a year, two years,
ten years, and that's what changed them. I was only
in jail for fifty three days.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
Who wants to be in jail for fifty three minutes?
Speaker 3 (24:17):
Right, I agree, it's I guess it's.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
A life sentence to me.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
Right, It's amazing to me what happened in those fifty
three days though, just what happened, seeing myself in the
mirror like that, calling my family for the first time,
talking to my kid for the first time, and so long.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
Those years of the streets. Did you ever reach out
to your parents?
Speaker 3 (24:35):
No, so my parents, my mom and my adopted sisters
and my blood brother were keeping tabs on me through
faces of Kensington Kensington Beach on Instagram. Like seeing me
on these exploitative platforms is actually how they were ensuring
I was still alive.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
Which you know, for us, it's it's it's a it's
a way of like, it's way of sort of like
now who we are of like saying we don't want
to ever see that.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
But in a way for them, it was comforting. Huh.
Speaker 3 (25:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
You know, so you went to jail. You go to
jail for fifty three.
Speaker 3 (25:09):
Days active warrants running from probation, public intoxication. I was,
you know, up in the counties, knotted out somewhere to
wah wah, and it was.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
Time fifty three days. You got out, and you.
Speaker 3 (25:21):
Were So I got out and I went right to
a recovery house. And I went to this recovery house
with the intentions of not staying there, like I was
truly on sure if I wanted to be in recovery
or not. And you know, got dug in on twelve
step fellowships, which you know, I'm not really a partaker
of anymore in my recovery, but in the beginning it
was so good for me. I needed it. People loved
(25:43):
me until I was ready to love myself. You know,
having commitments and stuff like that made me feel part
of something which I hadn't in so many years, to
feel part of, to feel wanted. I think that's when
the shift changes in my recovery where I'm like, you
know what, maybe this is worth living life without substance
because I'm start to like who I am.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
You were you said that you you wanted to be
a part of something, and I say, that's like the
Johann hari Ted talk. We're missing our connections, right, those
healthy connections, those positive connections, and you know you started
to say, oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (26:15):
I get them.
Speaker 1 (26:15):
And it's funny you say that because I went to
IOP for the simple fact that I thought I was gonna.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Look good and from the judge right, But when I
got there, I realized I really like you liked it.
Speaker 3 (26:23):
I liked it.
Speaker 1 (26:25):
I was like, when I first got there, I'm like,
I am not like these people, right, Like I don't
know these people.
Speaker 2 (26:29):
I'm not like these people if this isn't me.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
But like when I got there, I liked it because
I liked it because I realized, like I was missing that.
So there you were connections and all of a sudden
you weren't a skinny guy anymore then.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
No, No, I wasn't. I was putting weight on. I
was able to you know, pay my bills, have a
cell phone.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
You're working, Yeah, you're getting money. Yeah, legit.
Speaker 3 (26:50):
My first job, I was riding a bicycle four forty
five in the morning into a car wash. It sucked,
but I did what I had to do.
Speaker 2 (26:58):
But it was a job. It was legit.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
Yeah, And you were willing to do that. It's funny
because we're willing to do anything for drugs. We're really
willing to do anything drugs out there on the streets.
But what we're willing to do to stay off the
drugs is even more incredible because it takes so much more.
So to get up a four forty five and ride
your back to a car wash. I'm sorry, I don't
want to watch cars. I don't want to be you know,
(27:21):
I get it. So you were doing that, and dude,
and right now, what are you doing?
Speaker 3 (27:27):
Yeah? Right now, I'm working at the hospital the research coordinator,
so I meet with people in the emergency rooms and
to do research around substance use.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
So wait, four years ago, you were on the streets,
open rooms, all that fifty three days in jail. Yeah,
and then you were riding your back to a car
wash and now you're working at a hospital as a resource.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
Yeah. I guess it didn't jump like that.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
This is definitely another episode. You're coming back because we're.
Speaker 3 (27:52):
Gonna have to. You're gonna have to. But I will
touch on that, like, you know what we were talking about,
those misconnections. You know, when I entered recovery, I really
liked it because I started to like who I was,
but I still hadn't found that passion yet, and you know,
I wanted to because you know, I always believed that
life wasn't about being happy, like life was about having
a purpose. And then I went to my first outreaching
(28:13):
Kensington and I was, you know, handing out food and
supplies and harm reduction and stuff to people. I literally
was sleeping on the concrete with the McPherson Square park
six months prior, and it hit me. It hit me
bright right in the heart where I just I felt like,
this is what I need to be doing. I need
to be giving back to people who are suffering what
(28:33):
I did.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
So instead of potentially triggering you to say, you know what,
I sort of missed that this hits you, to say,
you know what, I want to make this better for
them and continue out myself. So I talk about it.
You know, we we tain our we turn our pain
into purpose.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
Yes, that's exactly right. So I waited a fair amount
of time. I was scared. I always tell people I
remember getting off ninety five, coming up the app it's
six months sober, and my stomach's like turn it and
I'm like, oh my gosh, I was living like this.
But like I said once, I you know, it was
the first time back since going into that jail cell
(29:11):
six months prior. But like I said, just engaging with people,
and like, you know, people that I consider my friends
that are still on house on the Avenue are asking
me quite literally, like how are you living without a substance?
Like how is it possible? How did you get out
of this? How do you not want to be here anymore?
How are you finding the motivation to continue each day
(29:32):
without substance?
Speaker 2 (29:34):
And what was your answer? What is your answer?
Speaker 3 (29:37):
My answer to them then was just happy to show
that it's possible. I think for me, right when I
entered recovery. A big part of that was not being
kind of pressured into it and people just doing what
I would call leave the door open, which would say, hey,
I love you. When you're ready, reach out, and that's
what I that's my answer. Now. You know people, some
people aren't ready to quit using drugs and that's okay,
(29:58):
and I tell them that, Hey, if you reach a
point where you don't want to do this anymore, this
is my number, call me. And I think leaving that
door open for people is important.
Speaker 2 (30:08):
Dude.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
You you have taken your life and like totally did one
to eighty. You know, you switch gears greatly, you know
a lot and embraced it. Like you didn't just say
see how this goes. You fully embraced it. You were
willing to work your way up from ten dollars that
hour to a research coordinator on a harm reduction team
at pen camp and not just that. Now you're traveling, man,
(30:31):
you're going to conferences. You're you're like taking pictures like Vegas.
I mean you probably would have thought you were like
panhandling in Vegas and wh would have thought you were
out there presenting.
Speaker 2 (30:39):
I know you present. Yeah, you train you train on
nar canons.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
Yeah, I do a lot of that across the city,
as you know, over reverse training.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
And you train not just like every day people. Sometimes
you're training some people that have some clout in the city. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (30:56):
Man, don't hate me up too much. Yeah, I know.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
This is this is this is this is what people need.
Speaker 3 (31:00):
No, you're you're right. The hope is there. You know,
I never thought I would be living this life working
at Ivy League University as a research coordinator. But you know,
something else I've learned in my recovery is that being
a peer is valuable. It's valuable to go in and
be able to talk to people and truly say, I
know what it's like. I understand I've overdosed. I'm an
(31:20):
overdose survivor. I was homeless, I slept on the avenue.
I get it. It's valuable.
Speaker 2 (31:25):
How many overdoses did you have?
Speaker 3 (31:26):
Nine? Nine times overdose show off?
Speaker 1 (31:29):
And I know, yeah, it's amazing though, like what those
overdoses can do for you to to fuel you even more. Right,
you know, you know when I tell people that, they
look at me like, oh, don't you know, because people
that look like us aren't overdose.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
No, you know, I woke up and got another one.
That's that's the reality.
Speaker 2 (31:48):
Pissed off, I walked away. I went from a piscorp
right back.
Speaker 3 (31:50):
Ye, you know, sick now.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
Thanks, yeah, thank you so much for Rooney. Thanks for
not any of the thing. But you know, I'm glad
that they didn't because it's the same. But you also
so don't you know, just do the research. You still
do outreach. You're with one of my favorite organizations next
to Philly Unknown course.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
You're with you know, the Everywhere Project project. Yeah, and
you do outreaches twice a week, twice a week.
Speaker 3 (32:13):
I'm volunteer coordinators, so more recently I've been doing a
lot more back end stuff. I get out to the
site when I can. I usually try to tell myself
at least once a month or you know, twice a month.
But yeah, two meal sites a week, community meal sites.
We feed families, we feed the kids, We feed anybody
on house who's hungry. You know the work we do. Man,
(32:33):
it's beautiful.
Speaker 2 (32:34):
And you were just in that lot of few years
prior to getting food.
Speaker 3 (32:38):
It's so awesome. You say that. So, you know, Tom,
the director of operations, and Jen and the executive director
fed me when I was on house in that lot
during the pandemic. I remember Tom, I remember Jen so
to be able to be on their team and you know,
help coordinate their volunteers. Man, it's meaningful, man.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
You know, I mean, and I don't want to use
any stigma words, but sometimes we can only just say
what we are about ourselves sometimes, you know, and I've
heard you say it and it's you know, in like
a passing, like a haha, you know, like you know
it was you know, the picture you had posted and
I want that pictures.
Speaker 2 (33:10):
I want them to put it on this I got
a video thing.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
But you would talk about being a dirt bag, yeah,
you know, and you know people think that they forget
that there's actual a person underneath it, that that can evolve,
you know, like that dirt bag has become like one
of the you know, blossoming flowers I've seen, you know,
and that's a really weird analogy.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
But like you have grown, you have like evolved, you
have made it.
Speaker 1 (33:32):
What is something like that you would go back and tell,
you know, you like young sherm, you know, eight years ago,
if you had the opportunity today.
Speaker 3 (33:40):
I think just to make your own decisions. You know,
I think a lot of obviously my addictions correlated to
my childhood trauma, but I think in a lot of
those peer pressuring moments, I didn't I didn't make my
own decisions, you know, when I can think of a
million other things outside of addiction that I you know,
(34:00):
is persuaded or convinced that making your own decisions and
just being like, you know, confident in who you are
is important and it goes a long way.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
Are you confident down yourself?
Speaker 3 (34:11):
Oh? I am. If you ask my girlfriend, sometimes I'm
too confident.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
Well, let's talk about confidence and your girlfriend. You know,
let's not sell it short.
Speaker 3 (34:20):
Mail.
Speaker 1 (34:20):
You're a little confident yourself. And I love that because
two of you that dynamic and is so important. And
Mels in recovery.
Speaker 3 (34:25):
As well, Mals and recovery as well.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
You two met doing the outreaches in the houses and that,
and so it's possible to have that mixture and recovery,
and it's great.
Speaker 3 (34:35):
It's beautiful to have that in common. Mel is a
beautiful person inside and out, and just to both you know,
be in recovery and want to help others. But also
I think you know, our recovery are they're very similar,
Like we know what recovery looked like at year one
and year four different and we're we're embracing of that
and we're there for each other. And I mean, she's wonderful, man.
Speaker 1 (34:57):
She's really my rock between year one and year fourage
every through the entitlement phase.
Speaker 2 (35:01):
Of course you're still there and you're gone.
Speaker 3 (35:03):
No I'm gone. I think, uh, I think I'm gone.
I think at this point.
Speaker 2 (35:08):
It's it's it'll come back. Trust me.
Speaker 3 (35:11):
I'm sure. I uh, you know, at this point, I
feel like sometimes I feel like I let people down
because I you know, my recovery doesn't look like it
did at one point in time. But that you know,
the big thing is I'm not injecting heroin in my
neck anymore. I live a purposeful life. I help other people.
(35:31):
I trust something greater than me. You know, the principles
that I learned early in recovery and I still live by.
I just you know, recovery is different for everyone, and
people need to be more accepting of that.
Speaker 1 (35:45):
I I I just stopped because like you know, the
the imagery that that that conjourn, it's probably a good
way to segue into almost closing, because if I opened
up more, we'll go for another two hours. But you know,
to to say that, you know, most people don't get it.
For you to just be real and say it that
you know, you're not shooting up in your neck anymore. Yeah,
(36:05):
I mean, you know, that's the realism of it.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
It is, that's the.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
Reality, you know any day that we don't pick up
the needle, you know when you know, what was that song?
The damage done?
Speaker 3 (36:17):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (36:18):
You know, and you know it holds true.
Speaker 1 (36:20):
Yeah, and it caused damage, but it also out of
that damage, you know, there came some really good stuff.
Speaker 3 (36:26):
Huh, yeah, it did, you know. And I think the
progression of recovery is great. In the beginning, you know,
something really little might be the wind, you know, and
I think you grow and you know, then it's it's
not about just not using the substance anymore. It's about
working on this and working on who you are, and
you know, just really upholding your character and being confident.
(36:47):
And you know, I think that my favorite thing about
who I am and recovery is that I'm dependable. You know,
I show up for my family, my mom, my brother,
you know, my sponsor when he calls, you know, other
guys I've helped find recovery too. My job, just being dependable,
my girlfriend, her family, you know, they call me, I
pick up the phone and I'm dependable And that feels good.
Speaker 1 (37:07):
Not just that, I well, it's dependable is the accountable part.
And I also know that you, uh, you have feelings now,
and I know that for the simple fact, like you
don't want to let people down, like you said. I've
experienced that with you, and sometimes I want to respond
like shut up, sure, like it's cool, we're good, we're
row you know. But I see that and that that's
a change in people, because before you didn't have that
(37:29):
type of feeling. No, I didn't, you know so, And
I love the fact that you said recovery is different
from everybody.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
We talk about that all the time. We preach that
it's so important. You know. I don't use the word
sober for people either.
Speaker 3 (37:40):
I love that.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
Why sober and clean? I get them out of the vocabulary.
Speaker 1 (37:44):
It scares people, it does, and then it segregates people
into like different you know, realms, and it shouldn't be that.
Speaker 3 (37:50):
It really and I used to use it. I was
I was very proud of the fact that I was
abstinent based, right, But for maybe someone who's out there
who isn't one hundred percent, they're still using a certain
substance and using it safely or moderately. You know, I
don't want them to feel discluded because you know, for me,
it's about living a life that isn't consumed with chaotic
(38:12):
drug use. And that's that's what that's what recovery is.
Speaker 2 (38:18):
That's awesome, that's a great place. Don't stop.
Speaker 1 (38:20):
It's telling me real quick. If somebody wants to volunteer
at the Everywhere Project, you get ahold of you. You
are volunteer coordinator. Yes, how would they get a hold.
Speaker 3 (38:26):
Of your Yeah, so sure them at Everywhere project dot org.
That's s H E. R M. Everywhere Project dot org.
Send me an email, or you can go on the
website Everywhere project dot org. Under the rs VP tab
you can pick the date that you choose and sign up.
Speaker 2 (38:39):
Do they need to show up to volunteer or the
other things they might be able to do for you.
Speaker 3 (38:42):
There's other things that we could have you do. We
also you know, Wednesday and Saturday or the community meal sites.
But we also have kit making over at our dropping
space at Jasper Studios. I think a lot of people
don't realize when you go to an outreach like who
prepares this stuff? Like we need help, so kit making
they can come to, you know, always happy to get
people out. It's, you know, whatever they need it for.
Speaker 1 (39:02):
And if they want to follow your personal journey, is
there anywhere on social media they can do that for
each Sure?
Speaker 3 (39:06):
Yeah, you can follow my LinkedIn James Sherman. We can
put it in the video or whatever. You know. That's
that's probably the one that I put out there the
most because it's my most professional journey. I mean, Facebook's fine.
Speaker 1 (39:17):
Too, and we needn't get into professional journey because there's
so much to that too. But it's great to see
and it's amazing to see. And I'm learning a lot
because you know me, I just sort of learn as
we go and that's it.
Speaker 2 (39:28):
And I learned from you, So thank you for that.
Speaker 1 (39:30):
And I want you coming back here, and you know
we're going to get you know, another one in because
there's a lot of dirt that we need to you know.
Speaker 3 (39:36):
There's a lot of stories on pack. But I mean, listen,
I can't thank you, not just for having me Britt,
but throughout the probably three years I've known you now,
you've just been so supportive, you know, whether it's a
text message, you know, like in a Facebook post, or
offering me an opportunity like this. You know, you've been
doing this a lot longer than me. I look up
to you as a respectable member of the community who's
(39:58):
doing outreach and recovery stuff. And I appreciate that.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
Oh man, gonna make me cry.
Speaker 3 (40:04):
I don't baby here.
Speaker 2 (40:05):
That's another thing that sucks about recovery.
Speaker 3 (40:07):
Find you.
Speaker 1 (40:10):
It's bad. Yeah, But thank you for saying soon the
same to you. And I think that's really important to
know that, like you know, the fellowship that is developed
through this that, like I'll be honest with you, the
two of us would never be sitting here if we
didn't have that in common. Probably not it So no offense,
you know, but I'm glad we are, and I'm glad
we are sitting here.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
I'm glad you are.
Speaker 1 (40:29):
People you need to check out James Sherman, check out Shuram,
show up at an outreach, check out some of his trainings.
You want some NARCAN training, anything along those lines. Reach
out to this man. He will show it to you.
There's videos out there that Sharam does that you can
check them out as well. But thank you so much
for showing up today.
Speaker 3 (40:44):
Happy to train. Anybody want to learn about the local
drug supply and what's going on in and how to
use Narcan you want to get involved anything, Happy to.
Speaker 1 (40:52):
Help and that's what we need. Please and thank you
brother beautiful. Thanks, thanks for everybody out there. Remember whatever
is that you stand for, be a voice. This is
carpon On Husula Media.
Speaker 2 (41:01):
Have a great rest of your day.
Welcome to be a voice. I'm Brick Carpenter of the
Sousula Media. Thanks for joining us today. Today, I have
a guest that I'm very excited about because I've been trying,
i think, for like the past maybe three years to
rope this guy in here and have him come and
sit down with me and spend some time and share
his story and his journey and you know, just the
incredible things that he does and who he is. For
(00:43):
those of you who don't know who he is, his
name is James Sherman. For those of you who do
know who he is, he is known as Sherm. Today,
I have Sherm. What's going on?
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Brother? Oh?
Speaker 3 (00:51):
W were you man? Thanks for having me?
Speaker 2 (00:52):
My gosh about time?
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Well, I canceled a few times. I'm a busy guy.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
It's just like you know, three years, you know, I
try to get you on my dance card.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Somehow, this is true.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
I didn't even have to bribe you with anything. I
didn't promise you food or nothing or it's great anything
for you, britt, right on, right on. Well, thanks for
showing up today. How's it going? Man?
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Blessed? This can be truly? Yeah, truly, you.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
Know people say that all the time, you know, you know,
I'm blessed, I'm blad you know, but you know certain
people say it and they mean it, and you just
had you know, truly, yeah, you know, and that that's
interesting because it's sort of a good segue into you know, well,
first of all, like I know who you are, and
you know, I admire and love the hell out of Via,
And but who are you sherm You know who is
James Sherman.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
You do a little cliff notes version out there.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
Yeah, the cliff notes I guess is I'm a kid
that well I'm not a kid anymore, but I'm a
kid who grew up to still. Yeah, I am thirty
three this month. So but I grew up in a
household two parents who are Hameron addicts, and you know,
told myself I would never choose that life. Right, and
fast forward, you know, fifteen twenty years later, you know,
(02:02):
addicted to heroin, homeless and Kensington, freshly out of the military,
didn't really have a clue about life. And you know,
four years in recovery, now I'm truly blessed to see
a different life, different side of things.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Four years. Yeah, it's been that long now.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Yeah, January was four.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
That's awesome. Congratulations, Thanks man. It's been cool to watch.
Speaker 3 (02:21):
Your journey, cool to see you involved.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
You know, and it's interesting because we talk about that, like,
you know, it is an evolution. I don't think people
realize that that when you go into recovery and you
start your recovery journey, you know, people are.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
Always like, oh my gosh, you're the person that you were.
Speaker 1 (02:37):
No, you're never the person you were before. It's really
not because if you were, you'd be right back where
you started. So you became this whole new person. And
you have a history. So you're both your parents were
addicted to heroins, right, Yeah, so you grew up in
a household seeing this.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
Yeah, I think when I think about my childhood, you know,
even as young as like six or seven, I remember
seeing it, you know, tie offs on the ground, little
orange caps, you know, which at the time, as a kid,
you know, you maybe not put two and two together,
But the older you get, you're kind of just like, wow,
I was, I was in the thick of it.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
He was right there in your house, Yes, it was. Yeah,
you know, did you ever visually see it? Did you
see that happening or.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
Yeah, yea, even though its really young, I can remember,
you know, parents slumped over, you know, syringes around. I
think I think that young. I went into the foster
care system at nine, so I think, you know, six
seven eight, I was so young that I didn't really
I didn't really know what it was yet. You know,
I knew life was chaotic. Dad was in and out
of the house and then out of prison. Oldest brother
(03:37):
was pretty fed up with how life was. But I
didn't understand yet.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
I came later, well, at six seven eight.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
I mean, it's how do you even understand turning thirty
three sometimes, you know, so that let alone that young
to process what's going on, you're sort of just, you know,
like a little head spinning.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
You know.
Speaker 1 (03:52):
It's not the same as Johnny or Susie's house, you know,
and I'm.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
Not sure why, but this is different.
Speaker 3 (03:59):
It is.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
And then you went foster care at the age of nine.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
Yeah, I was fortunate. Both of my brothers came with me.
We all went to the same foster care system, which.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
Was nice because how old are your brothers?
Speaker 3 (04:08):
Three years apart? So three three three, so my oldest
one six years older than me and my second my
middle brother's three years.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Older than me. Okay, so the youngest.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Yeah, you're the baby, baby, I'm the baby.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
So they took you are able to go together?
Speaker 3 (04:19):
Yeah, so we went together. My oldest brother, Dante, chose
to stay in foster care till he was eighteen because
he was fifteen or so when it happened. But me
and my brother Tony were adopted by the Sherman family. So,
you know, everyone knows me a Sherm. That's actually not
my birth name, which is interesting. But the Sherman's, beautiful family,
great family, love my mom to death, took me in
and adopted me.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
So, so your nickname is was was a given name?
Speaker 2 (04:44):
Then? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (04:45):
So I was? My last name at birth was Cardella.
I'm Irish and Italian.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Well it's interesting because when you said Dante, I'm like, well,
where does Sherman fit into Dante? I had that going
to so that I'm like, that's an interesting name. Okay,
So all right, and where where did you were were
you born? Right?
Speaker 3 (05:00):
So? I was born in Detroit. I grew up all
over Michigan. Born in Detroit, moved up north, you know,
was lived up there with my birth parents, was adopted
up north, and yeah, I ended up going to a
boarding school in Battle Creek and you know, had families
still in Livonia, Southfield, so pretty much all over Michigan,
but North as we're out, Yeah, okay, Yeah, I have a.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Friend that lived there and you know, a great little area.
It's interesting.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
Yeah, different.
Speaker 1 (05:27):
Yeah, you know, so you went to Battle Creek so
was that was that a military school?
Speaker 3 (05:31):
Yeah, so that's kind of when it when it started
for me as far as addiction is concerned, you know,
you know, I think back like twelve thirteen, fourteen, having
my first alcoholic beverages, drinking, liking the way I felt,
you know, and it just progressed, right.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Tried so you got young twelve thirteen, I.
Speaker 3 (05:47):
Think thirteen was my first drink. Yeah, it progressed, you know,
tried my first opioid at fifteen, sixteen and sixteen, get
in a lot of trouble with the law as far
as you know, kids, stuff, breaking in, ring whatnot. And
Mom approaches me and says, he I want you to
go to this program. It's called the Michigan Youth Challenge Academy.
And I remember like kicking and screaming, like I'm not going.
(06:10):
I'm not going, and she said just go to the orientation.
If you don't like, you don't have to go. And
I went in that place. It really made me feel
like you're not man enough to make it through my program.
It worked, the reverse psychology on young sixteen years It worked,
and I went and I did it and it was
a twenty two week long program military worker.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
And that's why you went because you were like, you're
not going to tell me I'm not going to succeed.
Speaker 3 (06:34):
That's how it started. Yeah, And when I got there, oh, man,
I wanted to leave so many times. I think that
was the first accomplishment of my life.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
So was it like a teen challenge? Is that what it? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (06:44):
Pretty much. So I left there with a ged some
college credits, which was enough at the time to get
into the military. And that's when I went to the
Air Force.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
You're in the Air Force. They had four years sick.
So in this teen challenge youth challenge, what was it called.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
Yeah, Michigan Youth Challenge Academy.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Where was it.
Speaker 3 (07:03):
It's in Battle Creek, Michigan and it's on like it's
on a National Garden reservation, old Air base so it's,
you know, really military style. You're going living in the dorms,
you're marching around campus, you're wearing BDUs, you're shining your boots.
It was the real deal, man.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
And that was how old sixteen.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
I got out of there December turned seventeen in May,
So about six months six months?
Speaker 2 (07:29):
Did you drink in those six months?
Speaker 3 (07:31):
Not at the place? Oh, when I came home, when
you came home from Yeah, when I came home, you
went those yes, which is a great just point in
general about recovery, right and support. And you know, I
thought that that place would change me. So did my family.
And I came out and link right back up the
same friends, same girls, same groups, and you know, it's
(07:51):
backsmoking weed, experimenting with pills. I think that's how I
ended up going to the military. Mom had had enough
and she pretty much said, hey, you know, you're not
living on my roof without a job or going to
college or something like that. And I said, oh, I
guess I'll go in the military.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
You know, it's interesting because when you said mom, like
we talk about a lot, we talk about how people
forget that families are affected by this more so than
sometimes the person that's going through it, because person going
through it sometimes oblivious and you know that whatever, but
you know, to have your mother do this, and this
was your not even biological mother, this was your adoptive
(08:27):
mother at the age of nine, and this is now twelve,
three years into this, you know where you know, some
people just throw their hands up and be like, exactly done, absolutely,
you know, and she was like, no, you're you're doing this.
Speaker 3 (08:41):
Yeah, wonderful woman. Man Anita Sherman all over her to death.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
She's still in Michigan.
Speaker 3 (08:46):
Yep, still in Michigan. I haven't seen her probably a
year and a half now or the last time I
saw her, she came.
Speaker 2 (08:52):
Out here and she call her mom or Anita.
Speaker 3 (08:54):
Call her mom. You know, I know my biological mom.
We talk briefly, you know, and the mutual respect is there.
She's like, hey, Anita raised you. She's a wonderful woman.
And I feel the same way. You know, she earned
that title.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
Right, Your mom's doing well, your biological mom.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
And biological mom is doing well. Dad is a little iffy.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
Yeah, hey, yeah, got you got one out of two.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
That's absolutely that's good.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
And there's a relationship that's that you know, but you
also have that win. So so you were then you
got out of there seventeen, Yeah, and went to the
military Air Force.
Speaker 2 (09:30):
Where the air Force? Where'd they take you in the
air Force?
Speaker 3 (09:33):
So I started out in San Antonio, Texas. He was
there for about six months. And I mean, listen, that's
how I got up to the East coast. Most stationed
at McGuire Air Force Base over in Jersey. Didn't know
anything about the East Coast at all, you know, Midwest boy,
and I got here and it's like, you know, we
here in the twelve stuff. Fellowships like the Islam's were
always there, and you know they were in the military.
(09:55):
I was couldn't stop drinking, couldn't control my drinking.
Speaker 2 (09:59):
You know, if you a little bit more, doesn't it.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
Yeah, yeah, I think that is a fair assumption of
the public eye that you know, a lot of people
drink in the military. And I think at least for me,
it was because I couldn't use drugs, all.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
Right, because you've got popped for that, that's right, huge exactly,
So you drank heavily in the military to mask all
that to not have to use before the military was
more weed and.
Speaker 3 (10:22):
Yeah, experiment with pills opiates, and you know, I mean,
but even a fourteen fifteen experiment with those opiates. It's
so different experimenting than later in life when it's like, oh,
this is the missing piece.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, No, I get that, because you
know what, you can sort of like walk away because
it's like, Okay, you're still fourteen, You're still just that whatever.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
But yeah, I get that. So there you are in
the military. You're in San Antonio, you got MacGuire, yep, Jersey,
in Jersey, you got how and how long ago was that?
Speaker 3 (10:51):
I got out in twenty thirteen, so I was in
nine to thirteen.
Speaker 2 (10:56):
Was it an honorable discharge?
Speaker 3 (10:58):
It was, by the great of God. I had done
a lot of things, got Article fifteen, lost rank, all
these certain things, and the Air Force was actually trying
to downsize at the time, and they said, hey, everyone
with an Article fifteen, we're offering to get out honorably early.
My drill sergeant pulled me in the office. I said absolutely, yeah,
I said absolutely. I think truly the alcoholic and addict
(11:20):
in me was telling myself, Hey, this is a godsend,
like this is your opportunity to get out and not
have a dishonorable discharge. And I took it. I ran
with it. I got out.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
So sort of a way of you saying, you know what,
now it's time to figure it out. So you got
out once you got out in twenty thirteen, you know
here you are on the East coast.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
Yeah, after you're going through it all and everything, you stayed.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
Yeah, this is probably when it really kicks off into
addict schrm, excuse me. I got out twenty thirteen, stayed here,
chose to stay here, I guess because I told myself
there'd be more opportunity here, you know than Michigan. Well
that's what it ended up being. But uh, I got
(12:03):
out when it was going to community college, not taking
it serious at all. I was living in Burlington, New Jersey, Okay,
so still in Berlinton County, was going to it was
Burlinton County community College at the time. Now it's rowing
but and yeah, I think the first thing I thought
was I'm not in the service anymore. I'm not subject
to urns, and I want to try some things. And
(12:23):
I did, you know, and I always tell people, you
know about my journey, is that like I tried all
these different things, right, you name, and I tried it.
None of them were a problem until it was an opioid.
You know. A buddy said, he's that weird.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
It was like, you know, the same thing, and I'm
going to cut you off there. But I don't think
anybody could really understand that. And you know, everybody's like,
oh my gosh, you know you tried everything. I'm like,
I did, yeah, I'm like, and nothing really caught me until.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
It was fun partied, you know, went out whatever. But
nothing was like this is the missing link the feeling. Yes,
so you know, yeah, A buddy said, you know, you
got to try one of these, You're gonna love it,
And I did for the next eight years.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Isn't it interesting? And did you think about this when
you when you.
Speaker 1 (13:07):
Did your first opioid, think about your biological parents and
the did you remember that at all?
Speaker 2 (13:14):
Did you have that in the back of your mind
or the forefront.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
Or that's such a great question. I don't think any
of that processes until later in recovery, where I'm really
able to sit with my thoughts right and do some
soul searching that sometimes happened in jail cells and detox beds.
And rare yes. And that's when the correlation comes where
it's like, man, I totally get why my parents were
(13:39):
who they were. You know, I always talk about, you know,
with my daughter, and you know, when she was born,
it was like, I have to get myself together. I'm
not going to be who my parents were. And lo
and behold it happened. That's just the power of addiction.
And it was like, in that moment, I forgave my
parents because I was like, I get it. I get
it now. They didn't. It's not that they had a
lack of love for me. It's that their substance use
disorder was strong.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
They had a lack of love for themselves, the same
as you and I and everybody else that goes through this.
And I was talking to a friend about this the
other day, and I think people tend to forget about
that that it's you know, you know, the reason I
asked that question was because that's probably part of the
trauma that triggers you to into the substance use disorder,
into the disease. Because it is a disease, as you've
(14:24):
come to realize, in many forms. You know, how old
your daughter about to be seven?
Speaker 2 (14:30):
About to be seven, and you are you see her now?
Speaker 3 (14:34):
And I just went to the Phillies game, her first
Phillies game the other night.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
It was her first Phillies.
Speaker 3 (14:38):
Game, her first Phillies games.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
Oh my gosh, you did you behave during the game
as you are.
Speaker 3 (14:43):
Like I did. I even allowed us to leave in
the seventh, which doesn't happen often. She was getting nantcy.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
But it was a night game.
Speaker 3 (14:49):
Yeah game, But yeah, man, I love that you touched
on the lack of love because I can't. I can't
feel enough for how true that is. You know, I
think when I think my addiction and you know, my
almost two years of homelessness, and you know, no desire
to live. That's what it boiled down to sow.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
And sure, you know this is a lot to uppeal in
the time we had because you have to come back
because of the fact that it's going to be a
lot to do. But you know, here you were, you
you know, you had this loving family that took you in.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
You went to this went to this school that sort
of straightened out a little bit, and then you went
to the Air Force where you had more free rein
and discovered alcohol was a lot easier than when drugs were.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
Sometimes a little more cheaper.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
Yeah, and you know, it was easier waking up with
a hangover than sometimes waking up, you know, or maybe
not waking up from something else. You know, you were
over there, you're going to you know, community college. How
did you end up then homeless? Yeah, I'm going to
jump right to that.
Speaker 3 (15:50):
You're right, it is a lot to unpack. Yeah, you know,
and I'll send you my bill for the therapy. But
it's cool, man, Now I could touch the basis is that,
you know, my opioid addiction to me, all the places
it takes everyone, you know, all my nevers came true.
You know, I thought I could maintain as long as
I wasn't homeless, or I could maintain as long as
I kept a job, or you know, as long as
(16:10):
I wasn't stealing from people, or you know, I could
do pills. But it's never going to be heroin. All
the stipulations I put on my diction, you know, eventually
all went out the window. So I think Kensington became
home when I found out how cheap drugs were, how
easy they were to access, accessible, very accessible. You know,
I'll never forget somebody putting me onto like Kensington for
(16:31):
the first time, and I was I was just mind blown.
Coming from the Midwest, you need to know somebody and
call somebody, and to see how open air drug market
works was was just crazy to me. And I think
like many other people who live in the counties or
the suburbs, you know, it becomes a point where it's
like is it worth coming down and copying and going
back home and coming down to and it's just, hey,
(16:52):
I'm just gonna stay. And I always say it, you know.
I remember that first night, like being out here all
night and like not really knowing where should I sleep,
like where safe, and like realizing there is no safe
and I think, you know, you touched on that lack
of love and that's kind of you know, in the
back of my mind at the same time to say,
you know what, I I don't deserve any more than
(17:13):
these people that are sleeping on the street. So I'm
just going to become one. And it happens that quick.
Speaker 2 (17:18):
And at the time, did you have a place to
go back to?
Speaker 3 (17:20):
So I didn't. Around the same month that I became homeless,
I had been evicted for not paying my rent. You know,
I was in and out of rehabs, in and out
of jail, and the run from probation landlords looking for me.
So I was evicted on the fifteenth and like towards
the end of the month, I ended up homeless in Kensington.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
And you had been in treatment prior to this, in
and out of treatment.
Speaker 3 (17:39):
In and out a few times. Yeah, yeah, a few times.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
He say. You know, we all know that.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
You know, we're not unique. That's something very common and
which is sad to say because that's what goes on.
But in and out of jail, And may I ask like,
was it just typical?
Speaker 2 (17:53):
Like typical?
Speaker 3 (17:55):
Yeah, you definitely may ask, because I'm very passionate about
criminally justice impacted people because of it. You know, all
of my criminal charges are stemmed from drug use, you know. Stealing.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
Yeah, all those boxes you checked real quick, like, I'm
never going to do that.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
I'm not going to do that. Out going to do that.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
Those those boundaries you put on the usage were prior
to all went out the window, all of them.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
So stealing, go.
Speaker 3 (18:20):
Ahead, Yeah, it's so stealing, you know, petty theft, distribution,
you know, phony possession. I think you know, at a
point in my addiction too. I thought if I could
sell the drugs, I could make enough money to do
the drugs. And monkey can't sell bananas, I tried. So yeah,
all my jail stays were directly correlated to my substance use.
Speaker 1 (18:42):
That's why in the early two thousands that was the
worst coke dealer ever, because like, oh, you're coming over to.
Speaker 2 (18:48):
Buy, why don't you stay for a little bit, We'll
go through this whole rock.
Speaker 3 (18:51):
Yeah, let me do a couple.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
Yeah exactly, and then you know it's two in the morning. Yea.
But so there you were in Kensington first night.
Speaker 3 (18:58):
How old were you so at that time I would
have been twenty five, right.
Speaker 1 (19:03):
At that age where we're our cognitive and our our
whole development is supposed to kick in the overdrive.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
You know, there you were, you know where.
Speaker 1 (19:13):
Most people are out there seeking out that career job aspect.
And you know that that significant other, with the white
offense and two point five children, you made, you actually
made the conscious decision to.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
Just say fuck at.
Speaker 3 (19:30):
All I did. I did the daughter probation, the family,
you know, none of it mattered. The only thing that
matter was one more. You know, how am I going
to get this next bag. How am I going to
get this next money? That's all that mattered, you know,
And I think, you know, like I said, none of
that came till you know, we were talking about family earlier.
(19:52):
None of that came until my recovery that I realized
how much I put my family.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
Through, you know, And because I want I want people
to know know this, and I say this all the
time because as a person that is that went through
active addiction for thirty years of his life. We're selfish.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
We are.
Speaker 1 (20:09):
If we weren't selfish, we wouldn't have been on the streets,
we would have left people behind.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
We wouldn't be worried about our next fix.
Speaker 1 (20:16):
You know what I'm saying. It's all those things I
think we are. People will dispute it and say you
shouldn't say that, but at the brutality and the reality
of it is, we are.
Speaker 3 (20:24):
No we are. And I think you know, my shot
at recovery came from other people loving me, right, you
know you hear that too, right, love them un till
they love themselves, And that that's my story. I entered
recovery with nothing but the clothes on my back. And
you know, out of a jail cell.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Did you have shoes on your feet?
Speaker 3 (20:42):
I did, That's literally one outfit, no phone, didn't even
have a toothbrush. I don't say that to brag.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
That's that's the first Reality's what's going on, not even
you know, a mile from here to Lily, you know,
and a mile from here is where you were, you
know it is, and you were there.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
For how many years?
Speaker 3 (21:01):
How long? Almost two years?
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Two years homeless?
Speaker 3 (21:05):
Yeah, eighteen months if it was straight, the last six
months there. This is all during the pandemic. So it's
like I try to rehab, left rehab mo vet. So
I go down to VA. I frequent the VA a lot.
I'm in their seventh floor addiction unit, and then eventually
locked up and put in jail. And that's kind of
what broke the cycle.
Speaker 1 (21:24):
And as as somebody that's in active substance use, we
we know how to work things, we really do. I
mean I always tell people that, like, listen, you can't
bullshit a bullshitter, especially one.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
That you know was very good at it.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
The VA, especially people that you know how to worked
at which is great, you know, to that extent, they
should be work because they don't really work for it.
Speaker 2 (21:45):
I think that's now, So that's a whole different show.
It is, But you know, you're out there on the streets, man.
What what's it like.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
Waking up in a different place or maybe not even
knowing where you're waking up?
Speaker 2 (22:00):
Yeah, can you describe that to me?
Speaker 3 (22:03):
It's brutal. I think, like one thing that's like misconcepted
though a lot is that like when you're so dug
in on being a homeless, addicted person, you lose sight
of so much, not knowing what month it is, who's
in the super Bowl, who the president is time like
essentially isn't real. You know, it doesn't matter if it's Tuesday.
(22:24):
It doesn't matter if it's Sunday. You know, I wake
up with one thing on my mind, which is that
I need some money. I need it now because if
I don't, I'm going to be sick. And if I'm sick,
I'm not going to be a good person.
Speaker 1 (22:37):
And I probably woke up late and I can get
to the Sampson time. Yeah, you know, things like that,
And that's that's what happens in our minds.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
We go through that.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
We live for the next day to figure out how
we're going to get that next fix to make sure
that we're well, yeah, because if not, we're going to
be very unwell.
Speaker 3 (22:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
And if we're unwell, we don't know how.
Speaker 1 (22:56):
We're going to be so at that stage, and yet
you're on these streets and you see yourself in the mirror.
Speaker 2 (23:02):
What do you think, Sharan, what were you thinking? Did
you recognize yourself?
Speaker 3 (23:06):
I think it it it at the end of the
two years in a jail cell is when it finally happened.
Where like I'm looking in the mirror, I could see
my ribs. You know, I'm one hundred and ten pounds.
My hair was so long. You know, I'm very transparent
of who I was. Right, head lice, body lice wounds
starting to develop from xylazine hitting the supply.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
You came into the end of that. I did well
the beginning of it, right in the beginning beginning of yes.
Speaker 3 (23:31):
And I think in jail looking at myself in that mirror,
just not recognizing it.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
Got some opening sores there, which you know, you know,
I was very fortunate.
Speaker 2 (23:40):
I say it like that, but I was. I was
very fortunate to get out of it.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
Right when started hitting, you know, when fetty started coming
around is when I you know, when I started overdose
of five times, I'm like, wait, I know what I'm doing.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
Why am I overdose?
Speaker 3 (23:51):
It's still overdose?
Speaker 1 (23:52):
You know, So what's going on? And that's a fetty.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
I went out. I don't want anything to do with that,
and I'm loud.
Speaker 1 (23:58):
I don't know how and you know, like that becomes
something you crave them because that's what your body needs.
Speaker 2 (24:04):
Yeah, so that was in the end. So how long
were you in jail for?
Speaker 3 (24:07):
So that's the interesting thing. You know, a lot of
people here, I was a locked for a year, two years,
ten years, and that's what changed them. I was only
in jail for fifty three days.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
Who wants to be in jail for fifty three minutes?
Speaker 3 (24:17):
Right, I agree, it's I guess it's.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
A life sentence to me.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
Right, It's amazing to me what happened in those fifty
three days though, just what happened, seeing myself in the
mirror like that, calling my family for the first time,
talking to my kid for the first time, and so long.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
Those years of the streets. Did you ever reach out
to your parents?
Speaker 3 (24:35):
No, so my parents, my mom and my adopted sisters
and my blood brother were keeping tabs on me through
faces of Kensington Kensington Beach on Instagram. Like seeing me
on these exploitative platforms is actually how they were ensuring
I was still alive.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
Which you know, for us, it's it's it's a it's
a way of like, it's way of sort of like
now who we are of like saying we don't want
to ever see that.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
But in a way for them, it was comforting. Huh.
Speaker 3 (25:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
You know, so you went to jail. You go to
jail for fifty three.
Speaker 3 (25:09):
Days active warrants running from probation, public intoxication. I was,
you know, up in the counties, knotted out somewhere to
wah wah, and it was.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
Time fifty three days. You got out, and you.
Speaker 3 (25:21):
Were So I got out and I went right to
a recovery house. And I went to this recovery house
with the intentions of not staying there, like I was
truly on sure if I wanted to be in recovery
or not. And you know, got dug in on twelve
step fellowships, which you know, I'm not really a partaker
of anymore in my recovery, but in the beginning it
was so good for me. I needed it. People loved
(25:43):
me until I was ready to love myself. You know,
having commitments and stuff like that made me feel part
of something which I hadn't in so many years, to
feel part of, to feel wanted. I think that's when
the shift changes in my recovery where I'm like, you
know what, maybe this is worth living life without substance
because I'm start to like who I am.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
You were you said that you you wanted to be
a part of something, and I say, that's like the
Johann hari Ted talk. We're missing our connections, right, those
healthy connections, those positive connections, and you know you started
to say, oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (26:15):
I get them.
Speaker 1 (26:15):
And it's funny you say that because I went to
IOP for the simple fact that I thought I was gonna.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Look good and from the judge right, But when I
got there, I realized I really like you liked it.
Speaker 3 (26:23):
I liked it.
Speaker 1 (26:25):
I was like, when I first got there, I'm like,
I am not like these people, right, Like I don't
know these people.
Speaker 2 (26:29):
I'm not like these people if this isn't me.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
But like when I got there, I liked it because
I liked it because I realized, like I was missing that.
So there you were connections and all of a sudden
you weren't a skinny guy anymore then.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
No, No, I wasn't. I was putting weight on. I
was able to you know, pay my bills, have a
cell phone.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
You're working, Yeah, you're getting money. Yeah, legit.
Speaker 3 (26:50):
My first job, I was riding a bicycle four forty
five in the morning into a car wash. It sucked,
but I did what I had to do.
Speaker 2 (26:58):
But it was a job. It was legit.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
Yeah, And you were willing to do that. It's funny
because we're willing to do anything for drugs. We're really
willing to do anything drugs out there on the streets.
But what we're willing to do to stay off the
drugs is even more incredible because it takes so much more.
So to get up a four forty five and ride
your back to a car wash. I'm sorry, I don't
want to watch cars. I don't want to be you know,
(27:21):
I get it. So you were doing that, and dude,
and right now, what are you doing?
Speaker 3 (27:27):
Yeah? Right now, I'm working at the hospital the research coordinator,
so I meet with people in the emergency rooms and
to do research around substance use.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
So wait, four years ago, you were on the streets,
open rooms, all that fifty three days in jail. Yeah,
and then you were riding your back to a car
wash and now you're working at a hospital as a resource.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
Yeah. I guess it didn't jump like that.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
This is definitely another episode. You're coming back because we're.
Speaker 3 (27:52):
Gonna have to. You're gonna have to. But I will
touch on that, like, you know what we were talking about,
those misconnections. You know, when I entered recovery, I really
liked it because I started to like who I was,
but I still hadn't found that passion yet, and you know,
I wanted to because you know, I always believed that
life wasn't about being happy, like life was about having
a purpose. And then I went to my first outreaching
(28:13):
Kensington and I was, you know, handing out food and
supplies and harm reduction and stuff to people. I literally
was sleeping on the concrete with the McPherson Square park
six months prior, and it hit me. It hit me
bright right in the heart where I just I felt like,
this is what I need to be doing. I need
to be giving back to people who are suffering what
(28:33):
I did.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
So instead of potentially triggering you to say, you know what,
I sort of missed that this hits you, to say,
you know what, I want to make this better for
them and continue out myself. So I talk about it.
You know, we we tain our we turn our pain
into purpose.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
Yes, that's exactly right. So I waited a fair amount
of time. I was scared. I always tell people I
remember getting off ninety five, coming up the app it's
six months sober, and my stomach's like turn it and
I'm like, oh my gosh, I was living like this.
But like I said once, I you know, it was
the first time back since going into that jail cell
(29:11):
six months prior. But like I said, just engaging with people,
and like, you know, people that I consider my friends
that are still on house on the Avenue are asking
me quite literally, like how are you living without a substance?
Like how is it possible? How did you get out
of this? How do you not want to be here anymore?
How are you finding the motivation to continue each day
(29:32):
without substance?
Speaker 2 (29:34):
And what was your answer? What is your answer?
Speaker 3 (29:37):
My answer to them then was just happy to show
that it's possible. I think for me, right when I
entered recovery. A big part of that was not being
kind of pressured into it and people just doing what
I would call leave the door open, which would say, hey,
I love you. When you're ready, reach out, and that's
what I that's my answer. Now. You know people, some
people aren't ready to quit using drugs and that's okay,
(29:58):
and I tell them that, Hey, if you reach a
point where you don't want to do this anymore, this
is my number, call me. And I think leaving that
door open for people is important.
Speaker 2 (30:08):
Dude.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
You you have taken your life and like totally did one
to eighty. You know, you switch gears greatly, you know
a lot and embraced it. Like you didn't just say
see how this goes. You fully embraced it. You were
willing to work your way up from ten dollars that
hour to a research coordinator on a harm reduction team
at pen camp and not just that. Now you're traveling, man,
(30:31):
you're going to conferences. You're you're like taking pictures like Vegas.
I mean you probably would have thought you were like
panhandling in Vegas and wh would have thought you were
out there presenting.
Speaker 2 (30:39):
I know you present. Yeah, you train you train on
nar canons.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
Yeah, I do a lot of that across the city,
as you know, over reverse training.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
And you train not just like every day people. Sometimes
you're training some people that have some clout in the city. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (30:56):
Man, don't hate me up too much. Yeah, I know.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
This is this is this is this is what people need.
Speaker 3 (31:00):
No, you're you're right. The hope is there. You know,
I never thought I would be living this life working
at Ivy League University as a research coordinator. But you know,
something else I've learned in my recovery is that being
a peer is valuable. It's valuable to go in and
be able to talk to people and truly say, I
know what it's like. I understand I've overdosed. I'm an
(31:20):
overdose survivor. I was homeless, I slept on the avenue.
I get it. It's valuable.
Speaker 2 (31:25):
How many overdoses did you have?
Speaker 3 (31:26):
Nine? Nine times overdose show off?
Speaker 1 (31:29):
And I know, yeah, it's amazing though, like what those
overdoses can do for you to to fuel you even more. Right,
you know, you know when I tell people that, they
look at me like, oh, don't you know, because people
that look like us aren't overdose.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
No, you know, I woke up and got another one.
That's that's the reality.
Speaker 2 (31:48):
Pissed off, I walked away. I went from a piscorp
right back.
Speaker 3 (31:50):
Ye, you know, sick now.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
Thanks, yeah, thank you so much for Rooney. Thanks for
not any of the thing. But you know, I'm glad
that they didn't because it's the same. But you also
so don't you know, just do the research. You still
do outreach. You're with one of my favorite organizations next
to Philly Unknown course.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
You're with you know, the Everywhere Project project. Yeah, and
you do outreaches twice a week, twice a week.
Speaker 3 (32:13):
I'm volunteer coordinators, so more recently I've been doing a
lot more back end stuff. I get out to the
site when I can. I usually try to tell myself
at least once a month or you know, twice a month.
But yeah, two meal sites a week, community meal sites.
We feed families, we feed the kids, We feed anybody
on house who's hungry. You know the work we do. Man,
(32:33):
it's beautiful.
Speaker 2 (32:34):
And you were just in that lot of few years
prior to getting food.
Speaker 3 (32:38):
It's so awesome. You say that. So, you know, Tom,
the director of operations, and Jen and the executive director
fed me when I was on house in that lot
during the pandemic. I remember Tom, I remember Jen so
to be able to be on their team and you know,
help coordinate their volunteers. Man, it's meaningful, man.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
You know, I mean, and I don't want to use
any stigma words, but sometimes we can only just say
what we are about ourselves sometimes, you know, and I've
heard you say it and it's you know, in like
a passing, like a haha, you know, like you know
it was you know, the picture you had posted and
I want that pictures.
Speaker 2 (33:10):
I want them to put it on this I got
a video thing.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
But you would talk about being a dirt bag, yeah,
you know, and you know people think that they forget
that there's actual a person underneath it, that that can evolve,
you know, like that dirt bag has become like one
of the you know, blossoming flowers I've seen, you know,
and that's a really weird analogy.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
But like you have grown, you have like evolved, you
have made it.
Speaker 1 (33:32):
What is something like that you would go back and tell,
you know, you like young sherm, you know, eight years ago,
if you had the opportunity today.
Speaker 3 (33:40):
I think just to make your own decisions. You know,
I think a lot of obviously my addictions correlated to
my childhood trauma, but I think in a lot of
those peer pressuring moments, I didn't I didn't make my
own decisions, you know, when I can think of a
million other things outside of addiction that I you know,
(34:00):
is persuaded or convinced that making your own decisions and
just being like, you know, confident in who you are
is important and it goes a long way.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
Are you confident down yourself?
Speaker 3 (34:11):
Oh? I am. If you ask my girlfriend, sometimes I'm
too confident.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
Well, let's talk about confidence and your girlfriend. You know,
let's not sell it short.
Speaker 3 (34:20):
Mail.
Speaker 1 (34:20):
You're a little confident yourself. And I love that because
two of you that dynamic and is so important. And
Mels in recovery.
Speaker 3 (34:25):
As well, Mals and recovery as well.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
You two met doing the outreaches in the houses and that,
and so it's possible to have that mixture and recovery,
and it's great.
Speaker 3 (34:35):
It's beautiful to have that in common. Mel is a
beautiful person inside and out, and just to both you know,
be in recovery and want to help others. But also
I think you know, our recovery are they're very similar,
Like we know what recovery looked like at year one
and year four different and we're we're embracing of that
and we're there for each other. And I mean, she's wonderful, man.
Speaker 1 (34:57):
She's really my rock between year one and year fourage
every through the entitlement phase.
Speaker 2 (35:01):
Of course you're still there and you're gone.
Speaker 3 (35:03):
No I'm gone. I think, uh, I think I'm gone.
I think at this point.
Speaker 2 (35:08):
It's it's it'll come back. Trust me.
Speaker 3 (35:11):
I'm sure. I uh, you know, at this point, I
feel like sometimes I feel like I let people down
because I you know, my recovery doesn't look like it
did at one point in time. But that you know,
the big thing is I'm not injecting heroin in my
neck anymore. I live a purposeful life. I help other people.
(35:31):
I trust something greater than me. You know, the principles
that I learned early in recovery and I still live by.
I just you know, recovery is different for everyone, and
people need to be more accepting of that.
Speaker 1 (35:45):
I I I just stopped because like you know, the
the imagery that that that conjourn, it's probably a good
way to segue into almost closing, because if I opened
up more, we'll go for another two hours. But you know,
to to say that, you know, most people don't get it.
For you to just be real and say it that
you know, you're not shooting up in your neck anymore. Yeah,
(36:05):
I mean, you know, that's the realism of it.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
It is, that's the.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
Reality, you know any day that we don't pick up
the needle, you know when you know, what was that song?
The damage done?
Speaker 3 (36:17):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (36:18):
You know, and you know it holds true.
Speaker 1 (36:20):
Yeah, and it caused damage, but it also out of
that damage, you know, there came some really good stuff.
Speaker 3 (36:26):
Huh, yeah, it did, you know. And I think the
progression of recovery is great. In the beginning, you know,
something really little might be the wind, you know, and
I think you grow and you know, then it's it's
not about just not using the substance anymore. It's about
working on this and working on who you are, and
you know, just really upholding your character and being confident.
(36:47):
And you know, I think that my favorite thing about
who I am and recovery is that I'm dependable. You know,
I show up for my family, my mom, my brother,
you know, my sponsor when he calls, you know, other
guys I've helped find recovery too. My job, just being dependable,
my girlfriend, her family, you know, they call me, I
pick up the phone and I'm dependable And that feels good.
Speaker 1 (37:07):
Not just that, I well, it's dependable is the accountable part.
And I also know that you, uh, you have feelings now,
and I know that for the simple fact, like you
don't want to let people down, like you said. I've
experienced that with you, and sometimes I want to respond
like shut up, sure, like it's cool, we're good, we're
row you know. But I see that and that that's
a change in people, because before you didn't have that
(37:29):
type of feeling. No, I didn't, you know so, And
I love the fact that you said recovery is different
from everybody.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
We talk about that all the time. We preach that
it's so important. You know. I don't use the word
sober for people either.
Speaker 3 (37:40):
I love that.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
Why sober and clean? I get them out of the vocabulary.
Speaker 1 (37:44):
It scares people, it does, and then it segregates people
into like different you know, realms, and it shouldn't be that.
Speaker 3 (37:50):
It really and I used to use it. I was
I was very proud of the fact that I was
abstinent based, right, But for maybe someone who's out there
who isn't one hundred percent, they're still using a certain
substance and using it safely or moderately. You know, I
don't want them to feel discluded because you know, for me,
it's about living a life that isn't consumed with chaotic
(38:12):
drug use. And that's that's what that's what recovery is.
Speaker 2 (38:18):
That's awesome, that's a great place. Don't stop.
Speaker 1 (38:20):
It's telling me real quick. If somebody wants to volunteer
at the Everywhere Project, you get ahold of you. You
are volunteer coordinator. Yes, how would they get a hold.
Speaker 3 (38:26):
Of your Yeah, so sure them at Everywhere project dot org.
That's s H E. R M. Everywhere Project dot org.
Send me an email, or you can go on the
website Everywhere project dot org. Under the rs VP tab
you can pick the date that you choose and sign up.
Speaker 2 (38:39):
Do they need to show up to volunteer or the
other things they might be able to do for you.
Speaker 3 (38:42):
There's other things that we could have you do. We
also you know, Wednesday and Saturday or the community meal sites.
But we also have kit making over at our dropping
space at Jasper Studios. I think a lot of people
don't realize when you go to an outreach like who
prepares this stuff? Like we need help, so kit making
they can come to, you know, always happy to get
people out. It's, you know, whatever they need it for.
Speaker 1 (39:02):
And if they want to follow your personal journey, is
there anywhere on social media they can do that for
each Sure?
Speaker 3 (39:06):
Yeah, you can follow my LinkedIn James Sherman. We can
put it in the video or whatever. You know. That's
that's probably the one that I put out there the
most because it's my most professional journey. I mean, Facebook's fine.
Speaker 1 (39:17):
Too, and we needn't get into professional journey because there's
so much to that too. But it's great to see
and it's amazing to see. And I'm learning a lot
because you know me, I just sort of learn as
we go and that's it.
Speaker 2 (39:28):
And I learned from you, So thank you for that.
Speaker 1 (39:30):
And I want you coming back here, and you know
we're going to get you know, another one in because
there's a lot of dirt that we need to you know.
Speaker 3 (39:36):
There's a lot of stories on pack. But I mean, listen,
I can't thank you, not just for having me Britt,
but throughout the probably three years I've known you now,
you've just been so supportive, you know, whether it's a
text message, you know, like in a Facebook post, or
offering me an opportunity like this. You know, you've been
doing this a lot longer than me. I look up
to you as a respectable member of the community who's
(39:58):
doing outreach and recovery stuff. And I appreciate that.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
Oh man, gonna make me cry.
Speaker 3 (40:04):
I don't baby here.
Speaker 2 (40:05):
That's another thing that sucks about recovery.
Speaker 3 (40:07):
Find you.
Speaker 1 (40:10):
It's bad. Yeah, But thank you for saying soon the
same to you. And I think that's really important to
know that, like you know, the fellowship that is developed
through this that, like I'll be honest with you, the
two of us would never be sitting here if we
didn't have that in common. Probably not it So no offense,
you know, but I'm glad we are, and I'm glad
we are sitting here.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
I'm glad you are.
Speaker 1 (40:29):
People you need to check out James Sherman, check out Shuram,
show up at an outreach, check out some of his trainings.
You want some NARCAN training, anything along those lines. Reach
out to this man. He will show it to you.
There's videos out there that Sharam does that you can
check them out as well. But thank you so much
for showing up today.
Speaker 3 (40:44):
Happy to train. Anybody want to learn about the local
drug supply and what's going on in and how to
use Narcan you want to get involved anything, Happy to.
Speaker 1 (40:52):
Help and that's what we need. Please and thank you
brother beautiful. Thanks, thanks for everybody out there. Remember whatever
is that you stand for, be a voice. This is
carpon On Husula Media.
Speaker 2 (41:01):
Have a great rest of your day.
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