Behind The Wand - Episode 27, Jessie Schroeder

This week I had an amazing conversation with the post-production supervisor Jessie Schroeder.

Episode Transcript

(00:09):
Hello, everyone, Welcome to Behindthe wand I hope you have all had
a brilliant week. For those whoare listening for the first time, my
name is Flick Miles and I wasEmma Watson's double in the Harry Potter movies,
and for this podcast, I speakto other people who worked on the
franchise all about the weird and wonderfultime we spent in the Wizarding World.

(00:29):
There's actually a lot of double usand almost a dumb twister. This week,
my guest is Jesse Schroeder. Jesseworked on Harry Potter one three to
five, first as a post productioncoordinator, then as a post production supervisor
from Chamber of Secrets onwards. Jesseis really fantastic and although a post production
supervisor, she was actually involved inso much of the shoots, especially when

(00:51):
working with Chris Columbus, who she'dworked with before and who was the person
who brought her on to Harry Potterone. And then obviously she had a
huge She'd part in all the elementsof posts, editing, grading, screening,
etc. And I just found thatreally fascinating about how you organize pulling
all those different teams and departments togetherto hit that final deadline that everything needs

(01:14):
to be in to get the filmready to go out to cinemas for millions
of people to watch. So reallylove talking to Jesse. I hope you
do too. And here it is. I came in on Harry Potter one
January, I think it was Januarytwenty first, two thousand and one,
so that we were already into threemonths of the shoot. I mean they

(01:34):
started in September. I had workedwith Chris Columbus's team back in the States,
working closely with Mark Radcliffe, Chris'sproducer, one of Chris's producers,
and Paula Duprie his associate producer,and so I was directly their assistant and
Paula was as an associate producer alsothe post production supervisor of Chris's films.

(01:59):
She unfortunately, over the Christmas heighthas had a family emergency and so they
called me during the Christmas break.I was working on another film for them
in the States, assistant Henry Salekand post coordinating a film for him,
and they said, we need youin London. Can you come in three
days? I said, I don'tknow if I can come that fast,
but so they gave me a weekand I packed up my staff, supplted

(02:22):
my apartment in LA and flew overand so I had really kind of no
idea what I was getting myself into. So I basically filled in, which
were enormous boots to fill in forfor Pola Ducree as the associate producer during
the shoot, which was really youknow, managing Chris's day to day schedule
in coordination with the AD department becausewe were a midshoot and kind of just

(02:46):
everything that needed to get done everyday on set for Chris, just figuring
out kind of all the to dosthat need to happen beyond the shoot,
like whether it was like still sequencesthat needed to be storyboarded, or new
script pages, concept art that stillneeded to be approved, anything to kind
of keep the future shoot going.I was sort of managing that to do

(03:07):
list for Mark Radcliffe and Chris aswe headed into post production. I kind
of worked with Chris closely as thepost coordinator, and then on the Second
Potter, they asked me to stayon because the film the series was just
so enormous, and so they askedme to be the post supervisor on that

(03:29):
one. So is it easier ifwe split those into two separate sort of
things. Then yeah, yeah,so this sort of day to day which
was whilst the shoot was still going, and then did your post production.
You put your post production hat ononce the shoot was sort of coming to
the end, So then when thingsgo into edit and stuff like that.
Yeah, exactly. So traditionally postproduction is the time once the camera stop

(03:50):
rolling, once we finished principals photography. Sometimes on a big shoot like Potter,
the second unit or visual effects unitmight still be going, but that's
really when we start that at whichwe call the director's cut, and it
varies kind of film to film.But back then, I think the first
cut, the first post process onPotter one was like twenty five weeks.

(04:12):
Maybe I think it's kind of greaterwhen we stopped shooting and I hadn't had
a chance to look back at callsheets, but I think it was like
the spring, and then we obviouslyreleased in November, so it's that period.
And in that period Chris was workingreally close with the editor at the
time, Richard Francis Bruce and doinghis cut, and then on top of

(04:33):
that, starting to add working withEddie Joseph and his team on all the
sound sound design fully all the thingsthat I think he probably covered before in
other interviews. And then and alsowith the music. You know, John
Williams had started composing the score whilewe were shooting, but that's really when
we start adding all those elements together. We previewed the film where we take

(04:56):
it to a recruited audience and wejust bring all the elements together. And
then other big thing that happens duringpost production, particularly on The Potter,
was all the visual effects work.So that's when everything, you know,
a lot of the visual effects forthe bigger sequences had to sort of be
turned over as we were shooting,but the final bits are turned over to
the visual effects team and then westart iterating and there's various stages through visual

(05:19):
effects like blocking, animation, dependingon like what you know, if it
was a CGI character, that wasall being made at that time by all
the artists. Yeah, so it'sa very busy. It's a different cadence
than the shoot, but it's areally busy time. And in retrospect,
it was a really short amount oftime for the amount of visual effects we
had. Well, I just thoughtthat when you said twenty five weeks that
sounds like an insanely short amount oftime from So that's like when the principal

(05:45):
photography stops and you actually release thefilm. That is insanely short amount of
time. Yeah, it was crazyfast and even and the time between when
we finished Harry Potter two and torelease was been shorter. It was.
It was all because the kids weregrowing and we had release dates. Yeah,
but yeah, and I learned somuch. I mean it was incredible.

(06:08):
And in that time, you know, we were and then we score.
You know, John Williams would comeover towards the end of the post
production period and we would actually scorethe film. We did the first one
at Air Studios, and then wetake that score, we final mix it,
and the final mix I think happenedright, you know, we probably
finished it like maybe six weeks beforerelease. This is this is making me

(06:30):
feel. Yeah, it happened.Yeah, and while we were finishing it,
I mean, it was a crazytime because also nine to eleven happened
when we were scoring and on thefinal mix, and yeah, so that
kind of stopped the world. Andwe uh also had to start shooting Harry

(06:53):
Potter too. We had to startshooting Chamber of secrets in order to hit
that release date. And you know, Chris, we really you know,
after we did one two in onePotter, we were like, even though
we were still on post on thefirst one, we were like, Okay,
we know what we have to doin order to get enough iterations on
the visual effects and sort of Iremember it kind of not like being like
it was a challenge that Chris waslike, Okay, I know this challenge

(07:15):
now, like I know how Iwant to approach it. I want to
start shooting things earlier. And youknow, even though it wasn't officially I
think principal photography, it was likea visual affection unit we started up,
like I think that must have beenSeptember October. Yeah, it was crazy.
I clearly remember one day. Oneof my vivid memories is like I
was with Chris all day. Ithink we went from air studios to score

(07:39):
or maybe we were listening to mixdownsor something, and then we went We
drove all the way to Shepperton,which is like forty five because that's where
we were mixing. That is likethe main place to make So it was
like forty five minutes storece Eather Airportand I think he maybe even we were
shooting that day too, or wehad dailies to look at and we were
on the final mix, and Iremember where it was just him and I

(08:01):
looking at dailies in this little theaterat Shepperton and he finally like said something.
He's like, I'm really tired,and I'm like, oh my gosh,
I'm so glad you're saying that becauseI'm exhausted. Yeah. Yes,
Like what if you had to breakand say like I'm actually feeing died?
Oh my goodness, that just soundsabsolute, just just a mad time.

(08:22):
But if I take you right backto the beginning, had you read the
books? Did you know? What? Did you know about Harry Potter when
they first said, like, weneed you to come over to London for
this Harry Potter shoot. Yeah,I had read the books. I forget
if it was when I was workingwith Chris and the team on Bicentennial Man,
which is his film right before Potter, or if I may have just

(08:43):
started. I was new in thefilm industry and it's all encompassing. I
mean, you lived it, youworked in it, like it's so exhilarating,
but your life kind of goes intolike you know, you're on shoots
like seven in the morning, it'sa seven at night like, and then
there's work to do after that whenyou're in the kind of job that I
was in behind the scenes. Andso I remember, I just I hadn't
read a book in a while,and my one of my friends, Evan,

(09:07):
said, you know what, youshould read this book, like it's
just easy to get into and it'sfun escapism, And so I read it
and it was great and it wasa great escape. So I knew about
the books, and then you know, I was freelance. Although Chris and
his team were great to me interms of like after I worked with Bicentennial
Man, they were like, well, we want to get you on our
next project. But you know,they only they didn't his production company couldn't

(09:30):
just keep me on and the lessthere was a movie so and that's like
standard for the film industry, andso they put me on as Henry Salick's
assistant for another film they were producingat the time, which was a great
experience. I learned a ton workingwith Henry and so they said, you
know, next time we have abig shoot, we'll bring you along.
And then he got Harry Potter,and so they were like, well,

(09:54):
it's we're shooting in the UK andwe just we can't bring that many people.
They were only bringing Paula. Iwas a Chris Mark and then Elizabeth
debeau Bowie, who's Chris's assistant,was Chris's assistant at the time, and
so they said, well, we'llget you on this other project with Henry

(10:15):
and then you know, maybe we'llsee you on the other side. When
we were just finishing Henry's project,they called me and that's when they gave
me the call to come to London. So it was a total surprise.
Were you sort of excited for that, Were you like, did you feel
like it was a good challenge thatyou wanted to get into or were you
a bit arguing this is a lot. Yeah, I mean it was.

(10:37):
It was a mix of emotions becauseI was devastated about Paula and everything that
she was going through with her family. But yeah, but but I was
like, Okay, you know,it was the call, and I knew
that they wanted to bring me backin the fold, and Paula was mentoring
me to start working with them moreregularly, and so I was thrilled for
the challenge, but it was alsoreally weird because I remember I went home

(11:01):
to New Jersey, where I'm from, and I was living in California at
the time, and Christmas, mygrandmother insisted on me getting like a winter
coat, and I was like,I live in California. I don't know,
I think you're really going to needthis. And I was like,
okay, you know, okay,I'll get this beautiful coat, but I
just don't know where I wear it, and then got too Literally a week

(11:22):
later, I got the phone callthat was going to London, so she
somehow knew and you need a wintercoat in London? Yeah, in January
definitely, that was probably like,you know, the best thing you could
you could bring. And we lookat Philosopher's Stone or Sorcery of Stone,
yeah, and like we said,sort of split that into it. So
if we look at when you hadthe role of sort of managing Chris's sort

(11:46):
of day to day in terms oflike outside of being on set and shooting,
what was sort of the biggest challengewhen it came to doing that.
I mean it was I remember thatpart really clearly. Was it was so
overwhelming. I got to lend In. I remember getting picked up by one
of the unit drivers. I wasn'tused to unit drivers and that whole thing.
And Alan Watts, who's the legend? And if you know unit drivers

(12:11):
in the UK and transfer whoever doyour heard for? So just a little
bit about unit drivers, because I'mnot sure if I've actually ever spoken about
this before, but most of thecast, or pretty much all of the
cast, and I think some seniorcrew or maybe heads of department, but
I'm not one hundred percent sure ofthat, are often driven around and picked

(12:33):
up in the morning and dropped homein the evening by the unit drivers.
And the transport team are literally theloveliest team on Harry Potter one. I
had a driver named Brian, whowas literally like a second granddad to me.
But then on the second film heactually got promoted to a more senior
role in the transport department, sohe actually worked in the office more working

(12:54):
in the logistics of which drivers goingwhere and taking who. So then I
had a equally wonderful driver called Tony, and funnily enough, I actually went
to school with his granddaughter. Butthey always greeted us every morning with smiles
and good conversation and obviously good music. So yeah, I have a very

(13:15):
special place in my heart for bothof them. Yeah, he kind of
drove me through learning, gave mea little tour, and then I remember
the next day he said, sothey've asked me to pick you up.
You're not working, but we're goingto take you to set because we're shooting
nine and three quarters at King's Cross. So it was just, you know,
and just I've never been to London. I'd been, I'd studied abroad

(13:35):
and backpacked a little bit, butI never went to London because I thought,
oh, it was just I ranout of money or something, and
I was like, I'll get thereone day. Little did I know that
I would go there for Harry Potterand live there for sixteen years. But
but yeah, so that was justlike kind of the enormity of the shoot
and everything in the scale of itwas just so exciting, you know.

(13:56):
And then the next day they youknow, because I didn't even know how
to drive on the opposite side ofthe so they were like they were kind
enough to give me a unit driverfor two weeks. But then I got
to the shoote and it was justyou know, I'd worked with, you
know, Chris and Mark and Paulathrough bi Centennial Man, so I experienced
a big shoot once, but nothingon the scale of Potter. And then

(14:16):
to quickly get to know I mean, it was this huge machine already going,
and like to get to know allthe heads of department to you know,
kind of figure out what exactly,you know. I shadowed Paula and
assisted her, but I just didn'tknow where in this, you know,
and every film it's kind of youknow, there's kind of standard you know,
departments, But I just figure outwhat I had to do and then

(14:37):
you know, Mark kind of quicklyput me to work on everything. But
it was really trying to get toknow everyone and the British system of filming.
There's so many you know, likeeven just like the way you call
it, you know, like dailiesversus Russia's, and like quickly getting up
to speed with all of that.And I have to say the crew was
so welcoming, Like I couldn't believehow generous they were, particularly Chris Carers,

(15:01):
and they kind of quickly took meunder their wing and I think they
you know, they knew I neededthem, and they also I guess knew
they needed me to be this kindof it to kind of keep things running,
you know. And Duncan Henderson andRJ and Todd Arnold, Yeah they
were. Jenny Marter, Yeah itwas. It was a great group.

(15:24):
But I feel like I've said thissome times on the podcast, but I
do think like that kind of camefrom the top down in terms of like
Chris Columbus wanted it to feel lovelyto work on that film. I think,
you know, specifically working with childrenand a lot of people who had
never sort of set foot on afilm set before. I feel like that
really came from him making it givingit that family feel, because I know

(15:46):
that sounds insane if you think abouthow big a film set is, but
it did, like Leaveston had thathomely feel and you sort of knew everyone
and everyone sort of interacted. Yeah, And I feel like he needed it
to be like that for us now. Yes, and David Hayman too,
like Chris was great with that.I mean, I have to say I've
had the pleasure and great fortune towork with some amazing directors. Like I

(16:10):
pinched myself with how the trajectory ofwhat Potter and everyone from that experience has
done for me. But I thinkChris is one of the most genuine directors
I've ever worked for, and justalways his authentic self, like whether his
family was there or not, andthey were often around and visiting, like
he was just he just led withhis heart and just had such a great

(16:33):
energy about him. And that waswhat was so surprising that this story I
told earlier where he was tired,because he was always the most energetic,
on top of it person I've evermet, like, and he read voraciously
like I couldn't. I was like, how do you do all this and
be on top of things like ina way that I'm like, where most
people would just be so fried fromthe amount of focus intention he had to
do on the shoot. Yeah,Like, like you said, working on

(16:57):
a film set is really all incompon thing, you know, working on
a film, it really does taketake over your life. But I think
that sort of attracts people that reallylove that aspect of the fact that it
is all in common thing and thatyou have to throw everything into it.
And I think that's also probably whatbrings everybody closer because everybody's and working towards

(17:17):
that same goal. Like everyone's workinghard, so you're all sort of in
it together. Yeah. No,I mean I think about like I think
of Ethna and who was a lovelywoman, Amanda. Yeah, yeah,
they were, all of them werejust like as soon as I because they
saw me on set and you know, standing extra chrismal, you know,
they you know, before it wasPalla there. So they were just so

(17:37):
welcoming to me and just like ohlove like you know, and like just
bringing me into the world and like, oh, come pop down and visit
us. And the stay was youknow Stuart Craig, who I mean,
such a legend. Yeah, likehe would cut so many I was lucky
because like you know, pre youknow, depending on where we were in
the day and as you know,because of the children's you know, the
restrictions and licensing of or they couldwork like and the setup we had on

(18:03):
Leavesdon, like you know, betweensetups, sometimes Chris would pop up and
we would schedule meetings or at theend of the day and like I my
desk was right outside of Chris's office. We had this sort of pod if
you remember, where like it waslike David and Chris and right at the
end of production Cory Door. Yeah. Yeah, and it was yeah,
myself and David's assistant Ivan, andthen Michelle and then Katie Reynolds. Uh

(18:27):
and so yeah, it was thislittle office and uh and so so many
people. That's where everyone would comein and out to meet with David or
with with Chris and Mark and sothey would sit in my chair writ in
front of me, and so likeI would just have these amazing, you
know conversations, whether it was aboutwhat was happening on the shoot or you
know, what was gonna you know, just whatever was out in the world
and what we wanted to talk about. Yeah. So then if we move

(18:49):
on to sort of the post productionside of that, what was the most
challenging part of that, would yousay, Wow, learning post I Mean,
one fortunate thing from having worked onthe film with Henry Monkeybone was that
I actually like wound up coming inwith a decent amount of experience and visual

(19:11):
effects. I mean only one film. There were visual facts on bi Centennial
Man, but I wasn't involved inthat. But I think we had like
some eight hundred shots on Monkey Bone, and so I was just aware of
kind of the language of visual effectsand the different approval stages for a director
from like walking to animations, ladingto all of that. So I had

(19:32):
that knowledge base and so kind ofunderstood like you know, you cut a
certain sequence and the need to turnit over to that department. It might
have like green screen or blue screenbehind it, or just like a ball
on a stick of that act talkingto and there's supposed to be a cud
character. So I felt like thatwas something I was able to kind of
bring into the Like I just understoodthat process pretty well for the team,

(19:57):
But the sound part of it Ihad never been involved in in terms of
like, you know, I understoodthere. You know, there was the
dialogue recordings from the floor, buteverything else beyond that, Like I knew
the basic stages, but there wasjust you know, learning and understanding that
process and getting to know the differentfolks and that you know from the ADR

(20:18):
which is like the dialogue re recordingwhere we bring back all the actors and
have to schedule that and uh buildingtime for that to everything with a final
mix. So that was a biglearning curve that Eddie and his team and
then you know, on the secondPotter Randy thom and Dennis Leonard taught me
a ton as well, and thenjust all the parts to like the music

(20:41):
experience like and uh and how thatfolds in, and just really the scheduling
and also the budgeting. Like Iwas in charge of the budget for the
post production process, so on thefirst one, you know, as I
mentioned, there was Mark Marshall whopost supervised it, but I assisted him
a lot of that process, soI learned a lot from him as well.

(21:04):
But I say, kind of justmaking sure everything kind of do you
know, like as one of mybosses has said, like all the trains
come into the station at the sametime, and that the director has enough
opportunity to collaborate and give their notesand that's all those different you know,
the editor, you know, allof the sound designer, the composer also

(21:25):
gets all their needs and so thateverything kind of comes together at the right
moment. So it's it's you know, there's kind of you know, basics
of scheduling out the post production ofmy film, but then there's also being
able to read the nuance in theroom and making sure that there's time for
changes and when to go into overtime, and you know, admittedly like going
into overtime on a mixtage isn't asexpensive as shooting an extra hour on set,

(21:49):
but yeah, it is something thatdefinitely any stake consideration, you know.
And then also with the visual facts, like I think there were tens
of learning on visual effects on thefirst one. I kind of became you
know, it was like early daysof the internet had been around, but
like in terms of like, youknow, how we did remote reviews because

(22:11):
rob Logatto was our main visual efectssupervisor and then we had visual effects supervisors
at all the different vendors scheduling allthose reviews and making sure you know,
the visual effects producer would come tome and we'd kind of figure out when
that had to happen in order tolike have the visual effects done in time
and balancing that out with the mixand when we were scoring and where Chris

(22:37):
was in the edit with with Richard. But it was we were also you
know, figuring out the tech ofhow we were like when Roger went back
or sorry, when Robalgatta went backto LA to build Quiddage and in CGI,
like we had to do remote reviewsand so you know it was like,

(22:57):
you know, there was some thingas Doom or anything close to that,
and I think we had like asatellite connection, and so I think
he may have gone back there evenbefore we finished principal photography or just after
while we were still doing the likeI think we were shooting quiddage still and
we had Nick Davis join and hewas sort of overseeing the shoot with like

(23:18):
Rob giving notes or something. Ican't really remember how that all went down,
but yeah, like doing these remotereviews and I would like take notes
and email them, and that waslike new, the fact that I was
like taking remote notes and like emailingthem, which is now like so standard.
I was like high tech in likesuper high tech. Yeah, no,
definitely, But it must be likefor you to talking about post production.

(23:42):
I feel like, especially on HarryPotter, that must be quite like
like a magical using magical Harry Potterseems a bit cliche, but quite a
magical time to be part of thefilm, because you're really seeing it all
come together when you're sort of addingthe sound and the score and the visual
effects. So it must be likea really exciting time when it is tying
up and you're thinking, oh mygoodness, this is this is great and

(24:04):
you know, you're getting close topeople actually seeing it. Yeah, no,
I mean it's so true. Ithink that's why I've moved now into
full time post production. I mean, don't get me wrong. I love
the shoot and the excitement of theshoot, but where I felt like,
I love the intimacy of pre production, like when we were like pre pre
you know, pre producing the pottersand kind of all the concept designs and

(24:25):
storyboards and everything like getting that it'sa very intimate time as well, and
like planning how we're going to shootit. But then I also loved,
you know, like once the shootis rolling, like I would go down
on set and like make sure,you know, see the first shot go
off for the first setup or whatever, and then I'd go back around my
office and start planning the next youknow, whatever the next to do.
Is were and figuring out the priorities, you know, with Mark and David

(24:48):
Hayman, but you know with postsit was like you see it all come
together. One thing though I didreally love during the shoot was also dailies,
Like we would do dailies at lunchand just getting to sit in that
room with all the eight of theseand see everything come together in that way

(25:10):
too, and then like, Imean, I know that we folks don't
do that on shoots anymore. Everyonejust watches on pixlinks or whatever their remote
viewing way is. Like I thinkI couldn't imagine not doing that on Potter.
It was special. Okay, Meand Jesse are laughing in this next
clip, which might feel a bitrandom, but it's because we kept getting
cut off every single time I askedthis question. And I don't mean just

(25:34):
once, it was like four times, and it was like somebody just didn't
want me to ask it. Soyeah, but this final time I finally
got it out on our connection stage. But I think it was worth persevering
with this question. But yeah,that's why we're laughing. That you that
you saw in dailies that you thoughtlike, yeah, this is this is

(25:56):
special. I think Harry Potter isgonna be good. I definitely think some
of the internet so I can't beof a particular scene, but with Hagrid
and the kids, there were somejust scenes like I think in Hagrid's hut
and Norbert, like even though youcouldn't even see Norbert, like there was
something like you could just see thischemistry, and I think like a huge

(26:18):
shout out to I mean the incrediblecast that Chris and David put together for
the film, like the adult kidsand adults, but like the adults were
just the amazing, you know,from you know, from Alan to Maggie
Smith to yeah, Robbie everyone,like it was just unbelievable. So I
think they brought a lot, andthat brought so much for the kids.

(26:41):
So I would say some of thosescenes where there's just you see that chemistry
and it's really working. Yeah,yeah, I would think those more intimate
scenes, you know, even justlike watching I think Richard Harris with Dan.
I think in the hospital room atthe end, there was just something
yeah, yeah, that just butyeah, I can't I can't think of

(27:07):
one particular one standout right now,but just watching the dailies, like at
lunch, you just you really sawit, you just saw it coming together.
And I remember, you know,we had to make some tough calls
about like Peeves and on the firstone, and about you know, like
how many ghosts to integrate because theghosts were just were we were like,
it's not looking much better than nothingagainst the art. It was just Atteck

(27:30):
at the time, like it wasjust it was hard to achieve. We
couldn't find the look that we wantedI think that Chris wanted, and it's
we were like, this just doesn'tlook any better than Ghostbusters, you know
we should. So it was justlike, all right, the tech's not
there yet, we'll figure and eventually, I think in the later ones we
were able to figure it out abit better. And but uh yeah,

(27:51):
so we were worried about like,you know, are there going to be
I think of our Chris saying like, O Kaid's gonna be picketing at my
front yard that I've messed this allup, you know, like he just
took you know, like felt suchresponsibility to bring you know, JK.
Rowlings book to life that no one, no one to go for granted,
like we just felt. But Ithink also, like going back to what

(28:12):
you said about the environment and thecrews, I mean, were I think
the best. I felt like that. I felt like I just got the
most the master class of filmmaking fromyou know, every head of department,
you know, like you know,uh, John Richardson, you know,
from special effects and Nick Dudman fromCreature Effects, I mean and you know,

(28:37):
whole visual Efects team. I mean, everyone across the board was,
you know, the costume team.They were the kind of the A A
A list at the time. Somestill are John cl too, Like,
I mean, I learned so muchfrom John c l And that's another part
sort of segueing back to post production, but also kind of related to Russia's
dailies depending on what you call it. Uh. John was just so gracious,

(29:00):
like as a cinematographer and like mademe feel so welcome on that too,
and would also kind of like belike come over here, like check
it out, see what it lookslike through the camera, and don't worry,
you can stand over here, likewe're just really incredible teachers and sharers
of the craft. Yeah. Soobviously I don't like being negative about Harry

(29:22):
Potter at all, because I thinklike the overriding feeling everyone has is like
immense pride over what we what wesort of created, and how hard everybody
worked, and like you said,the sort of pressure on already having a
story with such love character to dothose justice. But I think like the
main things that come up that peoplesay was were really challenging and something that

(29:45):
felt had to improve from like thefirst film to the second film, Like
was things like quidditch. Is thatsort of how you remember that being sort
of quite a big challenge and somethingthat not I don't want to say people
were disappointed because I actually watched thefilms and everyone says, oh, you
can tell the quidditch might have beenyou know in the first one. It
got better, definitely got better inthe second one. And I actually don't
notice that at all. I thinkit all has really stood the test of

(30:07):
time of being a really enjoyable filmto watch and not feel dated at all.
And I'm talking about like Philosopher's Stone. Yeah, but do you remember
it like that as well as quidditchbeing a big child or was there something
else that you that you remember,was, you know, specifically in your
role, something that you felt Icould do this better second film or third
film. No, I definitely rememberrecqudded as being a challenge. And I

(30:29):
remember some late nights after the shoot, uh, like one in particular in
David Haymon's Afice, where there wasa group of us just trying to figure
out the game of quidditch, likebecause you know, JK. Came up
with a great you know, greatideas of great concepts, so I don't
think we really had walls of engagementof the game. And I was,
I think I have a box summer. Probably I saved on my notebooks,

(30:52):
probably with some chicken scratch of thenotes from that night, but I was
just like, how are we goingto shoot it? You know so,
and I think that's when it wasdecided that you know, we're you know,
Nick Davis came on board and hewas going to help run the shoot,
and I think it must have beensecond unit Peter McDonald. I don't
really remember, uh, because therewas that green screen stage where we had

(31:17):
all the gimbals and everything set upfor the quiddit shoot, and you'd go
down there and it would just slowpasses someone looking like the rotting out of
horse. It was. It wasreally hard to see. I mean,
they were doing a great job,really hard work, but then we'd have
to bring it into edit and cutit together and then turn over to visual
effects and then Rob went back toto Sony in la uh to just get

(31:38):
that going with the team there.But the clock was I remember we were
feeling the pressure of the clock tickingand how are we going to pull this
off? That was definitely the hardestpart, and one of the funniest parts
is like when we took the filmto preview, which we did, by
the way. Fun fact, Ithink all the Potter previews took place in

(31:59):
Chicago, and I think all ofthem in the same theater, which no
longer exists. So I don't knowif any major Potter fans ever figured that
out, but we were all likethere almost the same time, like a
year later for Harry Potter too,And I forget when in the shoot that
was. But usually like that,there's when you finish principal photography, there's

(32:21):
a ten to twelve week period wherethe director, and this is like standard
industry standard, gets to cut thefilm and then you present. You know,
then he would share it with thestudio. So at the time I
think it was Lorenzo and I thinkAlan Horne, and then you know,
they might give notes, but Chrishad final cut, director's crut director's cut,

(32:42):
meaning that he could take their notesbut not take them. And then
then I think we had maybe acouple more weeks and then we took it
to a recruited audience, and Ithink they wanted to take it to the
States to make sure it translated forAmerican audiences even though we were making it
for worldwide audio dances, and obviouslyreally wanted, you know, the British
audience to love it. Yeah,UK audience still love it. But so

(33:08):
we decided I think because Chris,you know, his family, his family
from Chicago, so they're like,let's do Chicago because it's kind of kind
of halfway between LA and and andthe UK sort of, So that's where
we took it. And then theyyou know, they hire a company to
recruit audiences, and you know,we I think we did two films,
two screenings. We did one inthe morning for like younger families, you

(33:30):
know, kids, adults with theirkids families, and then one in the
afternoon, which was more like adultsonly kind of audience to get their feedback.
And that was and my story aboutQuiddage there is that we were so
worried about showing Quiddage because literally itlooked like a really bad video game,
Like it looked terrible, and yougive out cards that the audiences fill out,

(33:52):
and then there's also they hold backmaybe like twenty thirty people for a
focus group. Everyone's favorite scene handdown quiddage. Oh my god, that's
so funny. I think like likethe things like quidditch that there was nothing
like before that you were going offlike Harry Potter was, like the Blueprint
was so many things, I feelwell. And the length of the film

(34:14):
too, like it was I rememberthat was a big debate or you know,
because historically like family films, youknow, this was a you know,
all age film, but traditionally it'slike I think you don't want it
more than ninety minutes, like twohours next I think we were over two
hours. And Chris felt really stronglyand he's like, I think kids are
going to have the attention span.I remember him talking about that. And

(34:36):
I remember in the preview, Isat there and I purposely sat like you
know, we all kind of scatteredourselves around the audiences, and I was
just staring. I would here,I was just staring at the kids next
to me. And I remember thisone little kid, his feet couldn't even
touch the floor, engrossed the wholetime, like not, you know,
and it was long. I meanoccasionally there'd be the bathroom break for some
but like yeah, and they wouldrace back in. They would run back

(34:59):
in. It was so cute.And then the screams of the audience when
we told them what they were seeing, because they didn't know what they were
seeing, they were just like,you're going to see yeah, yeah,
because otherwise I think it would havebeen, you know, a mass mob
at the theater. Yeah. Yeah, that's so true. Oh my gosh.
They must still tell that story toeverybody. That's like your thing that
you tell people about yourselves. Yeah. So how did you feel like the

(35:23):
film changed from the first to sortof when you got to the fifth?
Oh wow, well, I meanthat's the second one. I'd say that,
you know, we kind of reallywere like we know how to you
know, we learned a lot onthe first one, so we you know,
from just like how we you know, even I think the sizes of
different departments, like you know,the production office I think got a little

(35:45):
bit bigger and a little bit more, you know, they knew how many
coordinators they needed and everything. Andthen and we had a different line producer
on the second one. David Barroncame in who was also did several of
the later ones well, so likehis crew brought some new life to it.
But then with the visual effects team, we kind of really knew how
to schedule it out, and wealso knew how we had a you know,

(36:08):
very short post schedule, so wehad to be really strategic on that.
Uh. But and so I thinkand then Chris brought on Randy Tom
as well, uh for sound designand so that you know, those things,
those areas kind of you know,grew in different ways, and I

(36:30):
think there was like costume changes andthings like that. But then we took
like a big, you know,i'd say, darker turn with alphon.
You know this this stories got kindof more serious and scarier with Alfonso joining,
which, by the way, Ihave a story there like that was
an incredible experience working with Alfonso aswell. But like I mean, I

(36:52):
remember really clearly the day that Christold us he wasn't going to direct the
second one we were shooting. Wewere shooting in Oxford, and we all
knew, I mean, he couldhave kept going, he could have directed
three, but he just wasn't.I think it was just it's a lot,
you know, it's non stop,and I think, you know,
with having kids and everything at sucha young age, it was like he

(37:13):
was never putting them to bed,and so so I remember we were in
Oxford and we knew that day hewas going to make that decision, and
he came back and uh, thenext day, we were all waiting in
the trailer because we're shooting in Oxfordin the morning, and he came into
the trailer and I think Mark andPaula and I were there, and he
said, so, you know,he told us he wasn't he decided to

(37:35):
make this decision, but he wouldstay on as producer for the next one.
But he had gone to Dan firstuntil Dan, which I thought was
really cool. That's the right thingto do. Yeah, yeah, But
going back to your question, So, yeah, with Alfonso, I think
we took a little bit more ofa break, you know, between posts
and shoot. I think I hadlike two months off and took much need

(37:57):
to vacation talk. He just needsa little bit of like Harry Potter not
being in your brain, the wholeHarry Potter fatigue, Like I love it,
but even I can sometimes. Yeah, And I think we went from
then The next one was like aMay release rather than the first two November,
so we had a little bit ofrespite to give Alfonso kind of time
to get up just being in theworld. And that's remember the big thing

(38:19):
was the costume changes, and youknow, I mean, and you know,
he he knew there was this greatworld that Chris had established, and
Chris was a partner and producer onthat film with him, but there were
little areas where he can make changestoo. And I think even even with
John Williams, you know, uhkind of worked with John to steer the
score in a different direction, whichI thought was really cool too. Uh.

(38:44):
And then with the visual effects,I mean, I think he took
the concepts to a new level.And that scheduling was different with Alfonso too,
Like with a storyboard artist like Chrisboarded, you know, a fair
amount on Harry Potter one, butI think they were sort of like a
loose guide or for Harry Potter oneinto but on three Alphonso. I remember,
like Paul and I were like,oh my gosh, like what we

(39:05):
would normally schedule for like I don'tknow, an hour with a normal with
a with a storyboard artists Alphons itwould take four hours. So we're like,
yeah, they're like really conceive likethe how we're gonna like do all
that. Can I just make afew adjustments to the schedules. But that
was, like, you know,every director has their process, and like
I remember, I think it wasNick Collin telling me, like, wow,

(39:27):
so much of what we boarded islike shot for shot and some of
the sequences. Yeah, so thatyou know, it's just his process.
Uh yeah, so I think youknow, you definitely saw. And then
a big change like technically that wehad in post production was it was just
in the beginning. It was thechangeover from a fully photochemical process to digital

(39:52):
grading because on a part of anotherpart of the process in post is the
grading of a movie and on HarryPotter on Into we did that at Technicolor
in the labs, and so theDP would come back and you know,
you really could only you only hadso many parameters it was, so it
was all photochemical, so you couldreally change like the uh y cm but

(40:14):
colors yellows am agenda. But anyway, I'm getting to tech technical, but
I love a deep dive jesty,so I'm with you. I find it
so fascinating these sort of side ofthings and what you can and can't do
and how that's changed. Yeah.So and that's you know, there's you
know, there's a beautiful thing aboutthat process, but a very laborious and

(40:36):
timely part of that process. Andwith our Fonzo he digital grading was becoming
a thing where you could, youknow, you would take the negative the
film that you shot and you woulddigitize it. And we were already doing
that to bring it into the Abbot, but at a lower rest for the
editors to cut. But we alwayshad film editors working at the behind them
with the work print. But anyways, deep dive on technical but but with

(41:00):
Alfonso, he wanted to do thedigital cinema grade and at the time I
think there were only a few placesin the world that were doing that.
A Claire in Paris and then uhPeter Doyle who was a greater working with
Peter Jackson on The Lord of theRings. And Alfonso knew about this and

(41:21):
was always great with new tech,as you can see with gravity and other
things he's done. Yeah, thatI had a pleasure of working with him
on. But so when I metwith him, you know, Chris said
and the team said, listen,you know, we can't just say it's
a slam dunk that you're on thefilm, we should at least have you
know, they wanted me to stay, but like they're like, we want
you to meet Alfonso at a courtesyand c if you also want to not

(41:44):
only to support during the shoot butalso be his post production supervisor. So
I met with him and we hada great chat and he said, I
want Digital Intermediate grade and I waslike, okay, I'll go figure that
out. Absolutely yeah, and he'slike, and I want an e in
our look, which is like akind of sort of more black and white

(42:05):
sort of look. It's like atraditional look, but that you could achieve
photochemically in a very laborious and expensiveway. But he's like, we can
do this with the Digital Intermediate andI want this richness with the blacks.
So the three looks darker like itis a lot. Okay, that's really
interesting. So that's done in postproduction. That was done, you know,

(42:25):
part with with Michael Saras, AndI mean, I'll give him,
Michael Saras some great DP and andhe was the DP on that androt shout
out to Roger Pratt who was theDP on Harry Potter too. Uh But
but yeah, so Michael and Alfonsoreally wanted to go down this path,
and I think it was more Alphonsobecause it was still very new. So

(42:46):
so I did a lot of researchand then eventually Peter, you know,
we brought Peter Doyle over and webuilt our own mini little grating suite and
and that was the first Potter.Like all the other Potters, we had
taken to Shepperton for post production forthe final mix, but because of all
the visual facts, we really decidedit was great to do it all in

(43:09):
so Ho, which is really funtoo. It was just fun to be
and so yeah, nothing against likebeing out in Shepperton. And that was
also as you know, more ofthe visual effects houses were moving into central
London, so it was just timewise, like we were under as always,
I'm all the Putters under a bigtime crunch, so it was just
easier to get off on so toall the different visual effects houses and look

(43:31):
at you know, the work therewith the artists, like it was really
important for the directors to be nearthe artists and seeing them working in all
the visual effects after the shoot.So yeah, so that's how you know,
that was the first digital intermediate grade. And then it was a big
gamble for Warner Brothers too, becausethey were we've never done this, and

(43:52):
yeah, I mean, this isn'tlike a Harden Fostoral. But if you
think about Chris Columbus, I thinkhe is really like, in my eyes,
like king of these gorgeous, glossy, beautiful children's films. So I
think, actually, you know,like Alphonso coming on board, even though
I know he did do a littlePrincess, but obviously other films that he
was known for, you wouldn't necessarilystraight away think like oh, Alfonso Harry

(44:14):
Potter, like Hands in Hand.But actually I think he was a great
person to come in and sort oftake that shift into like it becoming not
such an innocent film in terms ofwhat Hogwarts was and how the story developed.
So sort of yeah, no,it was. It was, you
know, and I don't know everyonewho was involved, but I'd give a
lot of credit to David Haman foryou know, David has great taste,

(44:35):
and I think he saw that potentialand our farm's out. But it's funny.
When I was watching Harry Potter onethe other night, I was I
was like, gosh, Chris wassuch a great choice because not only is
he so you know, that sortof classic you know, building a classic
world and classic look but with children. But also it's scary, like I
forgot how scary it is. AndAlvanta Pictures to the next level. But

(44:59):
you know, if you think aboutChris's you know, earlier projects with you
know, go writing goonies and Gremlinslike kind of like it was they were,
you know, they saw that potentialthere too. But but kind of
going back to your question of likeother big changes, I think also with
I mean with Harry Potter four andMike Newell coming on, I think that

(45:22):
brought like another level of freshness andI think, you know, I think
brought Mike brought so much to alsothe kids' performances too. I mean,
I think with each director, butI think Mike brought them kind of to
the next level and the world buildingthat he did with the Triwizard Tournament and
yeah, and he brought with himMick Oudsley, the pictuhutter, who's fantastic

(45:45):
as well, and he you know, I think that their collaboration I think
was really good to the storytelling becauseI remember on that one, I remember
we had atis Mick called me andhe in his cutting roums and he said,
you know what, I think.I think we still have to fure
out a few of these beats.There was this whole like underwater sequence and
he said, I don't you know, I think we need to spend a

(46:06):
little extra time. Do you thinkwe could work over Christmas? And I
was like, yeah, you canget everyone to come in and we didn't
shoot. It was just like working, you know, like yeah, cutting
with some of the h ods tojust kind of figure out those beats,
and you know, like because it'sa fast moving train, you know,
we were always chasing release dates andthe kids growing up, so it was

(46:29):
like we couldn't you know. Andit's just like once you start principal photography,
it's like you just got to goyes. So I really have two
more questions, Which one is dodo you have a standout favorite memory from
your time on PATA? So manyI mean I have to say, like
one is so so hard, butI'm going to try and twist d On

(46:50):
to do it. Yeah, Imean, I think, you know,
kind of going back to some ofthe Great Hall probably one of the Great
Hall sequences. I don't remember exactlywhat scene we were shooting, but being
there with all the casts and Iremember like standing mind Maggie Smith at one
point. I don't know why Iwas standing mi owner, but just sitting
there and looking. I think allthe cast was like coming in and the
kids were coming in and loading himin and just being like, Wow,

(47:12):
pinch yourself, Jesse, this isreally special. Yeah, that was pretty
phenomenal. I think going on locationon Harry Potter three, yeah, was
really great. Going up to glenCoe that was really like beautiful up there
and yeah, yeah, and allthe prew bonding and everything that happened,

(47:34):
and you know, even though wehad like three restaurants to go, that
was the beauty of it. Though. Like I always say, like thinking
about filming going up to Scotland islike really up there and it's actually like
the Times, Like you said,it's almost like the Times offset That really
makes that time special because I thinkwe'd all sort of got to know each
other quite well and it was thatfamily feel, so it did feel like

(47:55):
a big family vacation. After Scotland, I said, like, we got
really into fishing at our hotel onthe weekend. Tweet like fishing and it's
just like the on the water.I forget that. Yeah, yeah,
I think also the friendships. Imean I made some my closest friends.
I'm Potter, and like I think, you know, you know, I

(48:15):
work in animation now I work atPixar, and I'd love it. But
I like, I think it wasso special because when I talk to friends
who still are making big films,like the amount of sets that were built,
like the detail that went into everything, and I love visual facts,
like I think, you know,but you need the balance of both,
Like I don't think there's anything likethat anymore, and like that we were

(48:37):
all together that like you know,some of my closest friends are from the
art department, you know, andand you know, you know, I'm
still really close touch with you know, Katie and Michelle from the producer's office.
Like there's you know, all them, Like it's just yeah, it's
it's the family that we built fromit, and like there's a real fondness

(48:57):
and closeness and it's kind of gettingsad as we get old during you know,
like a dunkin past. Different peoplehave passed away already years. Yeah,
Stephanie McMillan, she would helped throwmy baby shower, you know.
So yeah, just like really specialpeople in your lives. It's such like,
yeah, I don't know, it'ssuch a big part of your life,
and working on something like that issuch a big part of your life
even for mes ten to thirteen.But it's still like a really defining moment

(49:20):
in my life, even though youknow, I was so young when I
was filming. But you know,it's just one of these. Oh and
I actually mentioned I met my husbandon Harry Bartter, Like I mean it
like defined my life, you know, yeah, like I became not only
like you know, it defined mycareer trajectory, but it defined my whole
life, like I met my husbandwhen my kids and my kids were born

(49:42):
on the leader Partter is like it'syeah, really special. I don't think
we've actually mentioned this yet in theepisode, so the next question might seem
a bit left field, But Iasked Jessie about Pixar because she is vice
president of post production at Pixels Studios. So using your Pixar head, I

(50:04):
feel like there is a lot ofwant for an animated Harry Potter. Do
you feel like that could ever happen? Do you think Pixar would ever want
to take on that challenge? Yeah, I could know. I don't think
so. I mean, I personallydon't want to see the Potters recreated,
And you know, I think someonealready did that with AI, Like it
was a little not a whole one, but I saw something shared with me,

(50:24):
like an AI Pixar version of HarryPotter, which was fun to see.
But you know, we all ofour you know films are kind of
original and born in house, soyou know, I think, you know,
everyone here has that most respect forwhat we did on Potter, so
they never wouldn't want to. It'sjust sort of like making a live action
toy story, so true. That'sso true. I'm deep, like my

(50:47):
son's too, so I'm like deepin the Pixar world at the moment,
Like toy story is his absolute everything. He cannot go to bed without his
bottom woody, so I'm like deep, fantastic. I'm like loving getting to
watch all my pix Our favorites again, you know, even though you're never
too old, but it's just givenme an excuse to sit down and watch
them with him. So he's lovingthat. So that's kind of everything I

(51:12):
wanted to ask. I guess,sorry, can I just actually ask one
more question. Yeah, please,I'm good for a little bit. Okay.
So obviously you've had an incredible careerin the film industry and now at
Pixar, which sounds like an absolutelyincredible job. What advice would you give
to somebody who was looking to sortof follow in the similar path to you

(51:34):
career wise? Great question and onethat I get up asked after and lately.
Uh, you know, I meanI didn't study film, you know.
I was an English Lit major witha visual arts minor and took some
you know, I took French cinema, and I was like, well that's
cool, you know. I onething led to another, and I you
know, sort of went down kindof the unscripted documentary path for a moment,

(51:57):
and then I was very serendip forthis. But I think, you
know, whether you know you wantto get into film or you start find
yourself falling into it like it's it'sI think, just keep working hard and
follow your passion, follow something thatyou love like no one, you know.
I joke with other people who've fallin the post particularly post supervising or
post producing. It's not something thatyou're like, wake up one day and

(52:17):
I want to do that because it'skind of a very behind the scene niche
job. A lot of people cometo it as an editor or maybe they
were a producer line producer, andit was something that I was just so
fortunate that it kind of fell intomy lap. But I think I was
just working really hard towards I justknew I loved film. I like,
as soon as I started working withChris and Paul and Mark, I was

(52:40):
like, I just the parts ofthe job, particularly the producing side of
like you know, helping the artistsfulfill their vision. But I also understood
like the budget and scheduling side.I think it's just the two sides of
my brain. I was like,I want to I don't necessarily have that
talent to be that artist like adirector, but I had the appreciation understanding
to read artists, so I wantto help them fulfill their vision. And

(53:02):
I think just keeping keeping that focusand keeping you know, I think it
takes a really strong work ethic,like I work my you know, butt
off, and I think everyone whowho does you know who is at that
level, like everyone that you knowChris like was you know, when he
wasn't working, he was and notwith his family. He was watching films

(53:23):
and reading voraciously and listening to musictime. Like you've got to be passionate
about it and so but also havea right balance of a work ethic,
you know, and every opportunity,Like I say to folks, like just
if you can get your foot inthe door, like and be willing to
do you know, anything to getthe job done, well, it'll lead

(53:43):
you to different things, like youknow, I know, like for instance,
David Haymes' assistant Michelle, who Ithink joined him on Harry Potter too,
Like she's now a production designer orsorry, costume designer, but like
you know, she was in Dave'soffice for you know, and was one
of the best assistants I've ever met. But a certain point she's like,
this is not where I want togrow anymore. And so then you know,
she asked that she could become anassistant and costume and then worked her

(54:07):
way up. And I think ifyou just have that you know, passion
for something and that work ethic,yeah, definitely, yeah, it'll find
you. I you know, Ithink I've gotten some very serendipitous sort of
you know, like that crossroads oflike okay, you know, you know,
because like once Chris and the teamwent back to the States, there
was that crossroads moment for me oflike do I stay in London because they

(54:29):
said, you know, it mightbe another year or two and then we'll
bring you on to the next project. And I was like, you know,
I love London, and maybe I'llkeep going Potter and then do the
posting, and that sent me inanother direction. I just kept following where
my passion was. Jesse was actuallythe first interview I recorded when recording this

(54:52):
new series, and it brought backso many great memories of just daily life
in Leifstone, like the production,the transport team, sneaking in to watch
the dailies, the rushes, youknow, ask kids would come in and
we'd sit sort of cross legged acrossthe front of the screening room. So
yeah, I just love thinking aboutall those things. And I hope you

(55:13):
enjoyed that chat. Two. Movingon to next week and we have Tim
Burke. Tim was the visual effectssupervisor from Chamber of Secrets onwards and he
also did Fantastic Beasts, so thereis nothing he does not know about the
world of visual effects and Harry Potter, so sending big love to you all,
have a fab week, and I'llsee you back here, same place,

(55:34):
same time, Baye