Fire Walk With Me

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:28):
Welcome to another horrifying episode of Bill and Ashley's Terror
Theater on the Marquee. This week is David Lynch's fire
Walk with Me. Join us right after we get back
from doing insane amounts of cocaine, staying up all night,
having crazy sex with the demon possessing our dad, and
still making it to homeroom like it ain't no thing
all that after these ads we have no control over.

(00:50):
Welcome back. I'm Ashley Coffin, joined as always by my
co host and Terra Bill Bria, Bill Darling. How are
we today?

Speaker 2 (00:58):
I am as blank?

Speaker 3 (00:59):
Is a fart ash of all the quotes.

Speaker 2 (01:04):
Oh and I did hear that Bobby killed the guy?

Speaker 1 (01:08):
Oh my god. The quotes will go on forever. So
we're actually just going to jump right in because this
isn't just a regular episode. We wanted to talk about
David Lynch and bring his passing up, and we wanted
to do it in a whole episode.

Speaker 2 (01:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:25):
Basically, you know, we usually do our tributes in a
new section to the legends that have been passing away recently,
and we thought that because there's such a history between
the two of us and mister Lynch and his work.
It would be appropriate to dedicate a whole episode at
least to one of his films. I mean, there's so
much that we could talk about about, you know, obviously

(01:47):
not just Twin Peaks, but Lynch himself, his entire body
of work. I mean, really, with one exception, you could
make an argument that all of his films have some
connection to the horror genre. And you know, it's something
that although you know, in terms of pure horror, maybe
he never made, you know, he never made a slasher movie,
he never made a demon possession movie, so on and

(02:07):
so forth, but he made variations on a lot of
these themes and tropes and certainly is an artist who
could really get at the stuff of nightmares as well
as dreams. And yeah, I don't know, we should maybe
talk a little bit about how he connected the two
of us hash.

Speaker 1 (02:23):
Yeah, I mean, geez, I watched Twin Peaks young, which
I've felt very lucky about and like to say he's
one of my very favorite directors. As an understatement, but
you and I had met on Facebook through mutual friends,
and we just started talking. They posted something about Twin Peaks,
and then we started talking about Twin Peaks and then
we became friends because of Twin Peaks and because of

(02:44):
David Lanskin. We started talking about his whole body of work.
And honestly, we wouldn't have what's going on now in
our friendship. Maybe, like it's just that's how the cards
were dealt for that specific through line, and maybe our
pass would across a different way. But I love that
this is how it did. It's just very fitting for us.

Speaker 3 (03:02):
Oh yeah, And I think we came to it at
a time when and certainly I don't just mean when
we first watched the show, but also when we first met.
Twin Peaks fandom was still at a time when it
was you know, it was never not popular, but it
was it was maybe not as saturated in internet culture
as it is nowadays. It feels like now so many people,
especially with Lynch's passing recently, it feels like a lot

(03:24):
and a lot more people are discovering the show, discovering
his work, and it's become, you know, so memed to
the point where you know, most have a recognition visually
of like, oh, that's a shot from Twin Peaks, or
that's a character from Twin Peaks, that sort of thing.
So I'm not saying, you know, oh, we have some
sort of like street cred, because you know that's not
what I'm saying, but it's.

Speaker 1 (03:43):
But it's like, you know, I've you and I have read.
I've read all the books. I have three books in there,
you know, the Dossier Book, Kyle McLaughlin's audio book, and
the Diary of Laura Palmer, which I feel like, obviously
is a huge influence on the movie that we are
going to discuss today.

Speaker 2 (04:00):
Was Twin Peaks your first Lynch experience? Actually, I don't
know if that.

Speaker 1 (04:03):
Yeah, it was my mom was watching the show and
I was watching it with her, as like I remember it,
and I remember Laura Palmer, and I remember being like, oh,
I want hair like her. I didn't understand obviously what
was going on until I saw it again older, but
I remember watching the show like everybody did because it
was such a huge deal, like who killed Laura Palmer?
And I remember the name, and I remember somebody killed

(04:24):
this girl? Because I was that was what ninety four,
So I was.

Speaker 2 (04:26):
Like nine, Well, I mean yeah earlier.

Speaker 1 (04:28):
I'm not gonna I was.

Speaker 2 (04:29):
I was.

Speaker 1 (04:29):
I was four.

Speaker 3 (04:31):
No, No, I mean also early nighties. This is earlier
than ninety four. This is like ninety ninety one.

Speaker 1 (04:37):
But my mom's girlfriends would all talk about, like, oh,
we have to get home. We were all watching Twin Peaks.

Speaker 3 (04:43):
Because I think I've told you this before, but my
first Linch experience was Dune.

Speaker 2 (04:48):
You know, we were a dude.

Speaker 3 (04:49):
Oh yeah, Because I don't know what prompted my father
to start talking about it, but it was both a
memory of his and I think my mother's. Maybe they
went together because this was eighty four, so I would
have been and uh, like two years old, so maybe
they got a babysitter for me and saw it in
like December of eighty four when it got released. But
I remember them, you know, uh, blissfully reminiscing about, Oh,

(05:11):
it was so cool because we got to the theater
and instantly they handed us this pamphlet and it was
this glossary of terms that we had to memorize to
understand that.

Speaker 1 (05:18):
The movie's so funny.

Speaker 3 (05:20):
And I was like, you probably are the only Yeah,
you two are probably the only people that loved that.
And everyone else was looking at that and rolling their
eyes and going, oh, no, I have to look at
this scrap because like you know anything. So yeah, that
that just planted the seed in my brain of like, oh,
this movie Dune I have to see. And once I
discovered it was a book, and this was around middle
school for me, so this would have been like ninety
five ish ninety six, and and that's when I read,

(05:43):
you know, I started out the book in my library.
It was the Lynch movie theme, so I had like
the color photos in the middle and everything like that.
And then I you know, made sure to finish the
book and watch the movie with my friend like the
day before we left for our Hawaiian vacation. So yeah,
it's like it was a hugely formative movie for me.
And I remember the visual aspects of that movie being
so it struck a chord within me so deeply that

(06:05):
I was like, I have to see the other stuff
this guy did. And though a few years later I
eventually got into of course, I think Blue Velvet was
my next step into Lynch, and it would have been
somewhere around the early two thousands, so maybe like two
thousand and one or two thousand and two, maybe even
a little bit later when I finally dived into Twin

(06:28):
Peaks in a big way because I'd heard of it,
you know, culturally before, I'd certainly heard the chatter, and
I think and I wanted to bring it up in
particular for this movie because the first memory that I
have in the back of my mind of having some
sort of idea of what twin Peaks might be was
when Fire Walk with Me was already being offered on

(06:49):
pay per view channels.

Speaker 2 (06:50):
If anybody remembers what those are, those were like the box.

Speaker 3 (06:53):
Yeah, you'd have to get a certain box to like,
you know, pay nine to ninety nine or sometimes like
twenty dollars to like rent.

Speaker 1 (07:00):
I had that little chip that my mom's one of
my mom's boyfriends like did something to the back and
then we got them offer free. Yeah, that's the household
we had.

Speaker 3 (07:09):
And what there would be on basic cable or you
know cable packages that you would have you know, your
you know family would pay for it and you'd have
on your TV was there would be certain channels that
would be you know, the pay per view channels, and
if you weren't already subscribing to a certain program or whatever,
it would just run this endless loop of I guess
trailers for like what was on offer for pay per

(07:30):
view that year, and so this was a time like
I must have been somewhere in nineteen ninety three, because
it would have been a window that you know, passed
ninety two when it came out when Firewalk with Me
was being offered on pay per view and they were
running a little sort of I don't know, maybe like
thirty second TV spot or trailer for it, and I
remember it was just a very evocative spot of you know,

(07:52):
certain shots from the movie, certain characters close ups and
everything like that. It was set to Julie Cruise's and
Angelo Lamentes questions in a world of blue, and that
music with that footage just again planted a seed in
my mind of like, you know, I don't know what
this is, but it is so dreamlike and evocative that
I have to just keep watching it. So there was

(08:14):
a time when I was like waiting for the loop
to go around so I could see the trailer again
for Firewall.

Speaker 1 (08:19):
It's so funny. Yeah, I remember being always remembering the
floor of the of the Black Lodge because when you
see that like hounds Tooth or whatever design out in
the world, I always go, oh, it's the Twin Peaks thing.
And I've always done that and I don't remember a
time where I didn't call it that. So they're like,
and that imprinted on me very young. Like it's funny

(08:41):
how this his stuff stays with you because it is
this like dream like world and a nightmare at the
same time, and he makes it set in the suburban area.
I mean, we're going to get into it.

Speaker 3 (08:53):
Yeah, And you know, there's so much esotericness to Twin Peaks.
It is a huge, sprawling narrative. You know, two seasons
of the original show one you know, seventeen hour season
of the return, this movie, the books that Ashley mentioned,
the tie in material, the culture, the fandom, like there's

(09:13):
like it could be its own podcasts. So like, there's
no way we're going to be able to touch upon
every single facet of it, because this is not going
to be a twenty hour episode.

Speaker 1 (09:22):
It could be, but Ken would kill us. Yeah, and
it is follow along, dear listeners, because it is going
to be a little difficult to understand this movie of all,
like David Lynch's movies, you don't understand them. They had
their own mistake. But if you didn't watch Twin Peaks,
that's why this movie kind of got a lot of
hate when it first came out because it is an
actual fever dream nightmare and it gives you no context.

(09:46):
And he is like, you better know or you just
just hang on for.

Speaker 3 (09:50):
The nie years until the return was made. This was effectively,
you know, I will talk about her about this, but
this was effectively both the beginning and the end of
the Twin Peaks saga. You know it was intended. Yeah,
this full circle or a Borrows sort of you know feature,
and I would yeah, I want to say right up
front after you said that, Ash, to any listeners who

(10:11):
have for whatever reason, not seen the show or not
seen the movie, this will spoil some of the show
for you, not everything, but like a good amount.

Speaker 2 (10:20):
There's still so much to enjoy about it.

Speaker 3 (10:21):
So don't feel like you know once you if you've
heard this by accident or decide to go forward with it,
don't feel like, oh, I've already figured out what it is,
so I don't need to watch it.

Speaker 2 (10:30):
Like you definitely still.

Speaker 3 (10:30):
Want to watch it, just for so many more reasons.
But like, if you're thinking about watching it anyway and
you don't want to be spoiled, you can skip this
episode of wait.

Speaker 1 (10:38):
Yeah, well, and this technically isn't going to spoil too
much besides something that happens in or in what season two?
This is seven days before who the biggest thing? But
they do tell you in the show that's true. That's true. Yeah,
in a horrible way. There's so there, there's so much drama,

(11:00):
but it is funny. But we were supposed to record
this last week, which right when we started recording, I
lost power due to a windstorm, which did feel very fitting,
like I wasn't even mad about it. But what got
me is I started watching it in the morning and
I heard Cooper say, Gordon, it's ten ten am on
February sixteenth, and I was worried about today because of

(11:21):
the dream I told you about that. I said, all right,
that was it, and I like almost follow my chair.
It was ten forty seven, so I was a little off.
And I'm from Philadelphia and they were in Philadelphia. And
it's just like a lot of random tie ins for
me when it comes to David Lynch's work because of
his relationship with Philly.

Speaker 3 (11:39):
Because we've been talking today off Mike about the sort
of parallelism and you know, interesting connections. I was going
to say, because you just brought it up, like where
we both live right now are the two major cities
that are connected to David Lynche.

Speaker 1 (11:52):
It's six degrees of you know, the Kevin Bacon thing.
It is always six degrees of Lynch for us. And
it's very funny and it's it's just weird, and that's
why I love I think that's also why I was
so drawn to him, because I knew the places he
was talking about and where he's taking inspiration from, and
it's just interesting. Oh but so today we're recording and
I was on Facebook and I saw a picture of
Lara Palmer right when I signed on, and it says

(12:16):
February twenty third, nineteen eighty nine is the day that
Laura Palmer died. So we did not plan this and
it just happened to happen twice. And I don't know
about you, but it's like this fun it feels haunting
and spiritual, like David knows kind of what we're doing
and he approves, we hope, well, in a story where
numbers have so much meaning all, it just feels like

(12:36):
we're being pulled into the world between I don't know,
and yesterday was Kyle McLaughlin's birthday.

Speaker 2 (12:41):
So yeah, happy birthday, Kyle, Cale Kaylee.

Speaker 3 (12:45):
Okay, so now that we've given the spoiler warning, do
we want to jump in?

Speaker 1 (12:48):
Yeah? Okay, so firewalk with me. It kind of is
David Lynch's f you to everything that happened during Twin Peaks,
because it is definitely a darker, more surreal tone, exploring
the themes of trauma and abuse and the supernatural. And yeah,
it's funny how much hate this got and now it
trends more on the positive side. But that you know,

(13:10):
there's something about the world of Twin Peaks that really
just pulls you in. It's like that liminal photography. It's
an empty street light with just the light kind of changing.
It's this dream, you know, the sense that evil is lurking,
and there's no reason to feel that other than the
way that David's making you feel. Because I listened to
this for the first time through headphones. I've always just
watched it on TV, and it was a completely different

(13:33):
experience hearing all of the sounds that were really going
on that you kind of miss out while you're watching
it on TV.

Speaker 3 (13:40):
Oh yeah, I want to start out by saying two things.
One is I know that I gave a spoiler warning
of like, hey, you know, like if you're planning or
watching the show, like, don't watch. There are some people
that insist on watching this first.

Speaker 1 (13:53):
I don't agree, but no, I don't agree either.

Speaker 3 (13:56):
Yeah, I mean I think it's cute if you've already
been through the show once you want to do a
different way, like sort of like a Star Wars thing
of like I've already watched it one way a million times.

Speaker 2 (14:04):
Let we watch a different way.

Speaker 3 (14:05):
Sure, you could have fun with it, but if you're
doing a first watch, I feel like that's stupid. But
I will say that, like ironically, my introduction to Twin
Peaks as a whole was goofed for me because I
did not understand that there was two versions of the
pilot episode.

Speaker 2 (14:22):
I don't know if you know.

Speaker 1 (14:22):
This, Oh yeah, yeah, because I rented what was it's
the British one right.

Speaker 3 (14:28):
International version of the pilot in which when they shot
when Lynch and Mark Frost and all of them shot
the pilot in like nineteen eighty eight or eighty nine,
you know they were shooting it as a perspective pick
up for ABC, but they didn't know if ABC was
going to give it the full green light. They ended
up doing that, but you know, there was a chance,
and of course famously, this chance of them saying no

(14:50):
and having to turn it into a closed ended movie
happened later with mahaland Drive.

Speaker 1 (14:54):
But uh oh, yeah, that was supposed to be a
TV show.

Speaker 2 (14:57):
You're right for ABC as well.

Speaker 3 (14:59):
And and so what happened with Twin Peaks's pilot is
that Lynch and Frost did script and shoot a full
quote unquote ending, which obviously didn't wrap up as many
certain you know lot threads, as like they did not
try to close all of the open doors because they
wanted to go to series, but in terms of the
general murder of Laura Palmer and like who did it
and kind of why, they kind of have an ending

(15:20):
and it's a version of it, like it doesn't really
fit in the cannon ultimately, because you know, it doesn't
make too much sense. They tried to fit that ending
into the second episode of the series as Cooper's Dream,
and they do have some footage from that original ending
in that second episode, including the famous red room sequence,
which I knew was a famous sequence, and I knew
that was coming up. So when I first watched the
international version of the pilot, by the time it ended,

(15:40):
I was still in the dark. I had to go
on the internet later and find out I was very disguided,
but I was like, Wow, what a pilot episode. How
could they even continue from that point? It seems like
it's over, And I was like, oh shit. So ultimately
it was kind of good for me anyway. So that's
why I wanted to say in the spoiler warning, even
if you get spoiled for this, there's still so much
to discuss.

Speaker 2 (16:00):
There's still so much.

Speaker 1 (16:01):
To be rested by so many characters.

Speaker 2 (16:03):
Yeah, you're not.

Speaker 1 (16:04):
This movie cuts a whole bunch out. And it's not
that he didn't want them in there, and he did
film parts with a lot of the characters who we
don't see here, and it's on the Missing Pieces DVD
of To Walk with Me. But I agree with Dave
because he was like, these characters paths didn't interact with
Laura's on the last seven days that she would like,
there would be no reason for her to go talk

(16:25):
to Richard Horn or any of these other people. It
made or Harry Truman, you know, and to have her
like it just didn't make sense to the story and
this movie is already pretty long.

Speaker 3 (16:34):
Oh yeah, I wanted to say too, because you said
that this. When this movie was dropped in ninety two,
it was really, you know, kind of met with a
lot of revulsion and negativity.

Speaker 1 (16:44):
What did they they There's a rumor that it was
booed at Sun Dance, right.

Speaker 3 (16:48):
Or can or Cohn or something like that. Con because yeah, Connor,
just the French. Yeah, but also because while at Heart
had become such a weird darling a couple years earlier,
loved that movie and oh it's great, but it won
the Palm d'Or I also at con and I think

(17:08):
that there was just that weird thing that happens to
our tours and artists where if they're riding high one year,
that a couple of years later, for some reason, there's
just this cultural feeling from you know, society, where it's like, okay,
proof that you're still as great as we thought you were,
and if there's some reason why they can't do it,
it's like, oh, actually, no, you're crap.

Speaker 2 (17:27):
You know.

Speaker 3 (17:28):
That's sort of whole sophomore slump idea that you know,
people will ascribe to bands or something where it's like,
you know, oh, it's not as good as the last
one sort of thing, like that's just I feel like
that phenomenon happened with Firewalk with Me, you know, I.

Speaker 1 (17:39):
Mean, I don't know. People say that this is like
his maybe his best movie, and it's like the most
Lynchian and a term we will use, and I almost like,
I kind of agree, But I don't know whether I'm
just more pulled to loving the world of Twin Peaks
more than somebody who hadn't seen it and you know,
loves Mohallan dry More, which I love too, Oh yeah,

(17:59):
but I I am more pulled towards this one. And
I remember seeing it way too young. Oh yeah, way
too young to even really grasp what was going on.
I'm like, oh, our dad did it.

Speaker 2 (18:09):
We should also say that.

Speaker 3 (18:12):
To all the critics of this movie who think, oh,
this isn't like the Twin Peaks I feel in love with,
because it is a markedly different tone ultimately from the show. Yeah,
you know, I don't think it's so different in the
sense that like, oh, it's not even the same, Like
it is like if you watch even just Lynch's episodes
of the show and this, like, you're not going to
see too much difference. It's like, yeah, right, right, Like
the way that the show was structured, the way that

(18:33):
it had been sort of lost its way in the
second season because.

Speaker 1 (18:37):
Yeah, he dramatically stopped, yeah, stopped directing, and they had
different people come in and direct.

Speaker 3 (18:42):
Yeah, so obviously there was like a little bit of
sparity there. But I wanted to say, because you mentioned
the book, Sash, that the entire plot of this film
is dutifully drawn from a tie in book that Lynch's
daughter Jennifer wrote for the series a couple of years earlier,
in September nineteen ninety, The Secret Diary Laura Palmer.

Speaker 1 (18:59):
Except the missing pages, and it always drove me crazy
that they were ripped out of the book too. I
thought I was finally going to get them, and I
thought we were going to get them in the other
books that like the Final Dossier and stuff like that,
we don't.

Speaker 2 (19:12):
Yeah, well, there is one missing page that because.

Speaker 1 (19:15):
Hawk only found the two and so we'll never know
what was on that last page, Isn't that I kind
of like, I do love it but because it drives
me crazy.

Speaker 2 (19:24):
Maybe it was just like a recipe for cocaine, sure.

Speaker 1 (19:27):
The cocaine recipe, or like meals on wheel schedule. Yeah,
oh my god, I hate Shelley. She's a fugly smut
or whatever my burn book. So yeah, the studios were
forcing him to let to tell people kind of who
killed Laura Palmer.

Speaker 2 (19:48):
Or network network.

Speaker 1 (19:49):
Yeah, I mean, uh, correct me if I'm wrong, But
he didn't never want to, Like, he didn't want to, right.

Speaker 3 (19:55):
So originally Lynching Frost, when they conceived the idea of
the show, they thought, you know, okay, we're gonna have
a show that is essentially a perpetual mystery. It's going
to be something that's going to start with the murder
of this you know, innocent seeming girl, you know, Miss
America herself. When they were casting Laura Palmer, they were thinking,

(20:16):
let's try to get someone who evokes essentially Marilyn Monroe,
right yeah, And you know, and initially one of the
one of the things that they did was in casting
Cheryl Lee for the for the part was you know,
they were given a mandate I think from this from
the network about like, you know, we have to have

(20:36):
certain stars and certain roles or as bigger names as
you can for like recurring parts. And they thought originally
that Laura wasn't going to be that much of a
recurring role. So they thought, oh, this is a part
we can cast with somebody local, you know, in Washington
where they're filming, and you know, pick her out of
what like a drama club or model agency or something,
and it just so happens that Shirley it turns out

(20:57):
to be a fantastic actress.

Speaker 1 (20:58):
Thinking oh, nobody has a scream like, yes, my god.

Speaker 3 (21:01):
But you know, that was something that you know, they
literally went and cast somebody who they thought wasn't going
to show up much, and of course she ended up
becoming such a huge part of the franchise, the show whatever,
you know, Maddie being brought.

Speaker 2 (21:12):
On as the twin sister.

Speaker 3 (21:14):
So yeah, this was something that they thought in their
minds originally, Oh, let's never reveal really who the killer is,
because the point isn't who killed her. The point is
like all these factors in the town, these different you know,
weird sort of soap opera e you know, things that
are going on, are all factors that contributed to the

(21:35):
death of this woman. So essentially, you know, one person
didn't kill her, it's this mood. It's this you know,
perpetual systemic like you know, Evil America. That's you know,
contributing to her, to Miz, which is all still part
and parcel of the of the story. Even though we
do have an actual quote unquote killer. In fact, it's
even more strong because of who it ends up being.

Speaker 1 (21:57):
Yeah, I mean, is it as I'll get into spoilers
because you have to kind of for the movie. So
what episode like seven, season two, not the end of
the show. Nowhere near the end of the show, they
revealed that it was her father, Leland, who has been
going through quite a transformation throughout it, but he is

(22:18):
possessed by this entity Bob, who is from the Black Lodge,
which is a place in the woods.

Speaker 3 (22:24):
It is I guess the way that you could think
about it, I mean, the one way that I've always
you know, been easier for me, giving my Catholic upbringing
is you know, heaven and Hell where it's like if
there is this idea that Major Briggs talks about as
the White Lodge, which I guess you can sort of
assume as a heavenly kind of space. Then the Black
Lodge as hell, you know, it's where the demons live

(22:45):
sort of thing. And I don't think the show ever
wants to make that equation explicit. I don't think they
want us to think literally that it's hell or something
like that, but I do think that they want to
evoke that idea and evoke.

Speaker 2 (22:58):
That yeah mood.

Speaker 1 (22:58):
It's not a good place. The cream corn down there.

Speaker 2 (23:02):
And is awful.

Speaker 3 (23:06):
Yeah, And essentially, you know that episode of the reveal
of Leland is the killer slash, you know, possessed by Bob,
because I feel like early on in the show we're
told at some point that Bob was this being or
this thing that was responsible for her deak.

Speaker 1 (23:22):
We see him throughout the seasons. And the light guy
or whoever got that lucky casting.

Speaker 2 (23:30):
Yeah right, oh, the sat dresser yeah, Frank Silva, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (23:34):
He's like, you look scary, get in here.

Speaker 3 (23:36):
Yeah, because he Lynch's camera just during one shot happened
to capture him behind the bed, hiding because you knew
he was in the shot, but he was trying to
be out of the shot, and once Lynch reviewed the footage,
instead of saying, oh you know, we need to do
another take. He was like, that guy is terrifying, you know,
so and again like it just so happens that he
is very well suited to that part.

Speaker 2 (23:56):
He could have been terrible.

Speaker 3 (23:57):
Great, yeah, and really yeah, there was there was so
much that was set up in the show of Bob
just being like this ultimate. I mean, there's one line
from mcgil fair's agent, well, Albert, what's his last name,
I forget.

Speaker 2 (24:12):
But he says that, oh, maybe Bob is just Albert.
Albert is Albert.

Speaker 3 (24:16):
Maybe Bob is all the evil that men do is
one thing that he, you know, openly wonders about. So
it's that idea of like, you know, essentially just all
of the odious, disgusting, you know, wretched, just pure pure
evil stuff is this thing called Bob and it you know,
for however, you know this would take longer to explain,
but however it happens, it gets inside ly Lyn Palmer

(24:39):
and yeah, Leland, it's it's I guess we could say
this now.

Speaker 1 (24:45):
I mean, if you go all the way back to
or you go to the twenty five years later, what
the return. It started when they were very young, and
it came to them very young, and it's just like
an evil that's kind of with you. And that is
that theme, that white picket fence in the house getting
you know, people coming back to war from war from
World War two and trying to start their families. Is
like where David Lynch grew up, and like that was

(25:07):
the years, like the fifties, and there's all this like
you know, violence and this and that you dealt with
and saw, but then you just hide it behind your
white pig a fence and you can paint your windows
and then on the front you can make it look
like everything's fine, but inside there you still have that
evil and the violence and the stuff that you've seen.
You just hide it better. And I feel like that's
kind of what they were doing in the Return with

(25:28):
like it taking Leland and what's the mom's name, Sarah
as they were children. It actually didn't it go to
Sarah first?

Speaker 3 (25:37):
Yeah, well there was, Yeah, and there's also this idea
of this entity called Judy, which you could sort of
say is the feminine counterpart to the male bob uhi
and it's yeah, right, and it's this Judy thing or
creature that's gotten inside Sarah ultimately, but yeah, I think
that what you were just describing ash is, you know,
if you want to perfect encapsulation of it, all you

(25:59):
need to do is watch the first what two minutes
of Blue Velvet, where it's you know, the footage of
the white picket fences, the beautiful sunshine, the beautiful gardens,
and then underneath all of that is this roiling, disgusting, wretched,
massive life that's just ultimately so you know, what do
I want. It's eating itself, it's you know, it's consumptive.

(26:19):
It's just you know, just all these insects that are
writhing under the ground that are ready to come up
and kill us.

Speaker 1 (26:26):
Yeah. Yeah, well, and that's what so many of his
movies are kind of about that. But I would say, like,
definitely Blue Velvet, but I think Twin peaks more because
the evil that's kind of like lurking around isn't some
like foreign entity. It's literally inside, like we're saying, and
it's the overbearing male figures. And there's always there's just
two of everything. Like if you talk about how this

(26:48):
movie starts, there's this town that we're in, deer Meadow,
which is you could say the total opposite of Twin Peaks.
It's this backwoods, run down looking town where their diner
isn't fun welcoming, like the Double r is, and the
sheriff Department treats Desmond h with total opposite way. Then
Harry treats Cooper when he arrives because they're both the

(27:08):
FBI agents. And this everything about Twin Peaks is this
mirrored world you have, you know, like ron Net and
Laura and all these different people who are the same
but different, you know, Bobby and James. You could even
say the two Mountains, the White Lodge, the Black Lodge,
and they He keeps this going the whole time, and yeah,

(27:29):
and that's really cool about.

Speaker 3 (27:30):
The reality is Yeah, it's huge in Lynch, but it's
especially huge and underlined in Twin Peaks.

Speaker 2 (27:35):
And yeah, that's why I know that. Again, one of the.

Speaker 3 (27:39):
Contemporary reviews of this movie was, like, what's the whole
point about the entire first section of the first twenty minutes.
It doesn't make all that stuff very important? It's so important.
And it's also like it's such a great parody of
the show of like, hey, this is uh, the dark
mirror world that we could have been showing you because
it's like this other, you know, disgusting counter part to

(28:00):
our lovely town that everybody fell in love with, you know,
And it is here in Dear Meadow that arguably a
large portion of the evil that infects the characters and
Twin Peaks begins, you know, because the drugs come from there.

Speaker 1 (28:13):
With the duality stuff, there's also the reoccurring cycle of
violence and the violation of purity and goodness, and it
keeps happening year after year, and it happened to Teresa
Banks and in a way when kind of jumping around,
but when like Laura puts the ring on, she stops
the cycle. And that is why this movie I felt
like was really important to be made, especially after kind

(28:34):
of we don't hear too much about like law. The
whole show is about Lara, but we don't know what happened.
There's the book, but then being able to find out
what happened after you watch the movie or like Jesus Christ,
this point and you forget because nobody everyone looks like
they're forty five. You forget that these are supposed to
be teenagers.

Speaker 3 (28:52):
It also very lovely centers the show's narrative around her
as a character in a way that's valid. It's not
just oh, here's a dead girl. She was hot, she
was cute, like let's be sad about it. It's like, no,
there's a real, fully fledged character with all of her flaws,
with all of her traits, and you know, all of
her struggles, and it really it lends her character. You know,

(29:13):
who was heretofore known as the dead girl wrapped in plastic?

Speaker 2 (29:16):
So much agency.

Speaker 1 (29:17):
Well that's why, you know, knowing what we know about
the show, the film is heartbreaking in a way, but
Laura saves herself from a much worse like fate. You know,
in the show, we only see her as a victim. Yes,
of course she's a victim, but in this we see
her kind of take control of her own story. Like
she dies uncorrupted by the evil, and you know, her

(29:38):
life was so tainted by evil and death and the
only escape from it, which isn't her winning, but her
death is the only way to make sure that the
evil didn't get her. And you know that's why she
has that whole beautiful scene at the end where she's
crying and laughing because she did beat them technically and
stopped this cycle. But she had to die to do it,

(29:58):
so she's like a martyr, and you know it was
a pretty horrible death too, but you know, it's better
than what would have happened to her, which we don't
actually know, but I guess I believe we don't know
what would have happened if yea, if.

Speaker 3 (30:11):
I always taken her right, I always took it as
like Bob was going to you know, jump into her
and use her inherent goodness, you know, youth whatever to
just continue to spread his discord and seeds of evil. Yeah,
and it really is, like you just said, corruption, Her
avoiding corruption is the ultimate victory for her in terms

(30:33):
of like, you know that that was its ultimate goal
and it failed at that goal, which is a very
intriguing and very bittersweet, you know, repositioning of you know,
what we've known from the narrative of the show, which
is that, oh, this is a show about the untiming
demise of a beautiful young girl and you know, oh,
it's so sad that you know, she could have had

(30:53):
this long and lovely life and didn't have it. But
this recontextualize it in a way that at least feels
like it's some sort of victory, like you were.

Speaker 1 (31:01):
Saying with that, we'll be right back with our feature
film after these miss ups from the grave that we
have no control over, and we are back continue.

Speaker 3 (31:17):
So let's because you know we are coming at this
from a horror lens, let's talk about some of the
stuff in this that really excuwed us, that really made
I think that one of the one of the most
consistent elements in the movie really you know, all of
Twin Peaks, but I think it's certainly on display of
this movie is just the encroaching feeling of ominous dread

(31:41):
that's happening.

Speaker 2 (31:42):
I think, you know, we already kind of alluded to
it earlier.

Speaker 3 (31:45):
But one of the most powerful scenes for me in
that way is, you know, the FBI scene with David Bowie.

Speaker 1 (31:50):
In the beginning, David Bowie and his fabulous scream.

Speaker 3 (31:53):
Yeah, Phil Jeffries, who we've never seen before in the show,
and we never see subsequently as David Bowie.

Speaker 2 (32:00):
We see something.

Speaker 1 (32:01):
He's a little tea.

Speaker 3 (32:05):
But but yeah, it's it's the It's an ingenious bit
of casting because the incongruity of like, oh my god,
it's David Bowie as this character who literally jumps in
and then jumps out.

Speaker 1 (32:18):
Again, comes out of absolutely nowhere.

Speaker 3 (32:21):
Yeah, and it's this unsettlingness of you know, it's the
first time we see Cooper in the movie, I believe, right, yeah.

Speaker 1 (32:28):
Because that's right before that happens. That's why it's called
Philip Jeffrey's Day. The sixteenth is because that's the day
he shows up at the office in Philadelphia, because Cooper
had just walked in and Alburt's there.

Speaker 3 (32:37):
Yeah, And it's funny how I Again, one of the
complaints about this movie, which I ends up being a
complained about the return too, from so many people is
that there was a desire on a certain subset of
the Twin Peaks fandom of I just want to see
my favorite characters goofing around and palin around because you know,
the way that the show was, because it was like
twenty two episodes for the second season only seven or

(32:59):
eight for the first, is that there was a lot
of time for characters to goof around, you know, and
there was a lot of lovely goofiness in the show
in terms of you know, there's entire scenes where some
people are eating sandwiches or some people are playing the kazoo,
or some people.

Speaker 1 (33:12):
Are shows up at a whorehouse and Noma's has sex
with her dad, you know, just fun downtime. Maybe not
that one, but yeah, there was some wild shit going on,
but like.

Speaker 2 (33:23):
There was also a lot of kooky, you know, fun stuff.

Speaker 3 (33:26):
And I feel like people came to this movie hoping
that it was going to be a lot of that,
and it was a lot of just misery and harrowing,
you know, suspense and all that. So I think that
there's such a delicious, like I don't like, I'm a
little scamp sort of thing on Lynch's part. To the
second he introduces Cooper, it's not, oh, we're having fun haha,
joking around with Gordon Cole and you know Albert. It's like, no,

(33:48):
there's something really freaking scary going on, and David Bowie's
here and that he's not.

Speaker 1 (33:52):
You know, well that's even thirty minutes into the movie.
I mean it starts with uh, my dad, I mean
keeper suther Lan there with Chris Isaac's who love to
see him love is I'm a big I was always
a fan of him. I liked his show, and just
seeing I'm like, well, you got all my favorite people

(34:12):
in this who did a great job as an actor.
We see them at that at Deerwood Town or whatever,
this creepy little town, and he just he finds the
ring and disappears and we never really talk about it again.

Speaker 2 (34:26):
Yeah, No, it's great.

Speaker 3 (34:27):
It's Chris Isaac being just completely bumbling around this town,
like this town kind of sucks.

Speaker 2 (34:32):
I'm cool, but this town sucks.

Speaker 1 (34:34):
I'm super cool.

Speaker 2 (34:35):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (34:36):
Keefer just being a little weirdo, which is still great
at and Harry Dean Stanton being so sad, like this
poor guy in his trailer, just like I've already gone places,
and it's like, where have you gone.

Speaker 1 (34:48):
Harry, That's where you get numbers you don't want to
don't want to go to you don't want to go. Yeah,
thats just you know, he's looking for the killer of
Teresa Banks, who we find and this takes place a
year before Laura Palmer is murdered, so it's kind of
like it was almost like very similar murders, but this

(35:09):
was the first one. And then he disappears when he
finds her ring, and then we boom jumped to the
Philadelphia office and Cooper comes in and David Bowie and
David Bowie. This is the first time that we see
the the little garage at the where do we see that?
Do we see them at the garage place?

Speaker 3 (35:28):
In Twin Peaks, the book the the like the Monsters,
the convenience store, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, is the first
time we see the yeah wherever.

Speaker 2 (35:39):
Supposedly it's above a convenience.

Speaker 1 (35:40):
Store, which we see again later in the return. But
that sequence is very creepy, and I remember being like,
that kid looks exactly like David Lancheon. It's because it's
his son's son.

Speaker 3 (35:50):
Yeah, yeah, Michael j Anderson's man from other places there
and Jurgen proc Now is there as a I think
he's credited as like a lumberjack or woodsman or something,
and he's talking about electricity backwards, you know.

Speaker 1 (36:04):
And that stuff is weird. But if you don't experienced
something cool on Twin Peaks, it's the way he films
people talking backwards and then forwards and then backwards.

Speaker 2 (36:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (36:13):
I think they called it backmasking because the way that
it was filmed is that the actors would all have
to phonetically learn their lines backwards, so they would speak
you know.

Speaker 2 (36:21):
Obviously you can't move backwards. That's a that's a trick.

Speaker 3 (36:24):
So like you would act everything the way that you
would ultimately want it to be seen backwards. So yeah,
so the people that were supposed to be moving backwards
in those scenes or talking backwards in those scenes would
have to phonetically learn things and obviously like move different
ways and all that. So that's why it has such
an uncanny Valley look to it and sound to it,
because when it's when the film itself is run backwards,

(36:47):
then it appears to be forwards, but of course it
was shot backwards, so it's like it looks, you know, bizarre.
But yeah, so so there's all of that, and then
there's just you know, this unc Anni valleynus too, of
finally getting to spend a lot of time with Laura alive,
you know, all the different things she's doing and seeing

(37:08):
her even just interacting with I mean, there's there's also
an on Kelly Valley because we do have to mention
that the character of Donna was recast for the movie.
Lara Flyn Boyle was replaced by Mara Kelly.

Speaker 1 (37:19):
Was that really because she didn't want to take her
top off?

Speaker 2 (37:21):
Right? I don't know. I feel like that's the official answer.

Speaker 3 (37:24):
But if you get into the Twin Peaks behind the
scenes lore, you will find out that there was some
drama going on during the making of that show between
larfln Boyle and and Charly.

Speaker 1 (37:34):
And Flynn Yeah, because they were dating, yeah.

Speaker 3 (37:37):
And something the drama, right, So it may have been
a little bit of this, a little bit of that.
It may have been like there was that drama and
also she didn't want to take her top off, or
maybe it was just the drama wanting them wanting to
distance themselves from her, you know, completely, and being like
using that as an excuse to be like, actually, if
she wouldn't.

Speaker 1 (37:54):
Do the nudity, yeah, because there's shocking amounts of humidity
in this This is very it's the show but rated MA,
which I loved, but two people who were not expecting
it back in the nineties were probably like, oh my.

Speaker 2 (38:08):
God, and you know, also boo to them because the
show tits right. Well. Also, but this show was like.

Speaker 3 (38:15):
It was not subtle even if it was on network
and it was, there wasn't any nudity. It was not
subtle about the themes that was going to get you.

Speaker 1 (38:21):
Know, yeah, and all these kids were doing drugs.

Speaker 2 (38:23):
Yeah, doing drugs and hanging out of a brothel whatever,
right over the border. You're over the border right.

Speaker 1 (38:31):
In Dangerous Canada.

Speaker 2 (38:33):
Evil Canada.

Speaker 3 (38:35):
So yeah, so it's like this only paid off what
was been what I had been set up. It wasn't like,
you know, uh, they made a friend's movie where suddenly
everybody was getting naked, you know.

Speaker 1 (38:44):
So it's like, yeah, well, we have some stuff to
deal with in the show because I mean trigger warning
for people. Sorry, but we are going to talk about
sexual assault. Pretty much throw out the rest of this.
We're at the point now because when you're asking me
what the scariest part is, I could only imagine coming

(39:05):
to and realizing that you were being sexually assaulted by
your dad when you thought it was not that you
should be having sex with the demon either at eighteen,
but it's not your father. And then finding out that
all the times that this has been happening, it's been
your father possessed but still your father.

Speaker 3 (39:23):
And again, I feel like there were a lot of
people that watched the show that didn't internalize the themes
that was getting at until it was too late, in
the sense that when this movie came out, they were like, oh, actually,
how dare you? This is terrible because really this is
a very thinly veiled story about yeah, sexual abuse and
assault from within a incestuous right.

Speaker 2 (39:45):
With a father a daughter.

Speaker 3 (39:47):
And that is maybe some of the harshest subject matter
you can tackle in any fiction. And the fact that
this does so with such tape and resonance in artistry
and never feels it never feels like an exploitation film,
you know, it never feels like, oh, you know, this

(40:08):
is like we're getting into the nitty gritty of ooh,
what happens when a daddy goes bad?

Speaker 2 (40:13):
Like it's not no, it's not that.

Speaker 1 (40:15):
I feel like he plays it so well that when
Leland is Bob, he comes off as a as a
possessed person. It's not like because Leland is like so happy,
go lucky and nice, and when he's Bob, he changes
his whole facial features, and you know, good on the
actor for being able to do that so well.

Speaker 3 (40:32):
I don't see a lot of people speaking about this
movie in terms that I'm about to say, but I
do think that you could put it on par with
the Exorcist, the First Exorcist in terms of attacking a
very heavy, very dark theme in a way that doesn't
feel ever too heavy for its own good. You know,
it doesn't feel like, oh, this is really upsetting and

(40:53):
I can't watch this anymore.

Speaker 2 (40:55):
You know, it strikes right up to that line.

Speaker 3 (40:57):
You know, it really does in terms of, like, you know,
but I think that there's an enough of a genre
you know, bend to it that you know, it makes
it feel compelling still even though it's awful of course,
and you know, it feels at the end ultimately cathartic,
you know, as opposed to, Hey, I just got you know,

(41:17):
pupped through the ringer for no reason, Like you know,
it's it's there for a reason.

Speaker 1 (41:21):
And that's why Laura is kind of the through line
between this. She is the line between good and evil
where you know, you have Donna, who's the more wholesome character,
and like Leo would be the evil, but Lara lives
in both worlds as this homecoming queen and putting up
this front that everything's fine while doing all these drugs
and having crazy teenage sex worker jobs at night. But
she's doing all this and using drugs to escape the

(41:42):
evil that's being done to her nightly or we're not
really sure, but it all goes round and round, because
this really shows us why she's doing all the things
that she's doing. It's not just because she's wildly crazy
in this and for good reason, because she's just having
this breakdown. And it's funny because everybody around her, except
for kind of Donna, was very dismissive of how crazy

(42:04):
she's acting, because everybody else has their own thing, like
her mom is dismissive and not really there emotionally for her.
Bobby really loves Shelley, James has this thing, but Donna.
I don't know that there was something before or not,
but there's tons of love triangles going on, and yeah,
like Donna is the only person who really cares about her.
And she actually does care about Donna, because we see
at the Canadian Roadhouse where she sees Donna being corrupted

(42:26):
while she's like wearing Lara's clothes and going into Lara's world,
and she freaks the fuck out and stops it from happening,
and she stops the corruption because it's the only thing
that she can really do to show how much she
actually cares for this person.

Speaker 2 (42:40):
And you know, ultimately it's so touching.

Speaker 3 (42:43):
I'm going to try not to cry here that like,
the only people that can see Laura for who she
really is while she's going through this are like, I
guess future Cooper, you know, if you want to put
it in that way, because we're not quite sure which
Cooper is coming from where. But also certainly the log
Lady when you mentioned Margaret, see when Margaret talks to
her for just I think two lines or something.

Speaker 1 (43:02):
Well, that's my favorite scene in the whole movie.

Speaker 2 (43:04):
It's so great. I mean, it's a shot so.

Speaker 1 (43:07):
Well, well, not only this movie has a lot of
intense close up shots because it's a whole film, like
intimately looking at Laura Palmer, but the cinematography is like
really in everybody's faces. And when Margaret meets the log Lady,
she puts her hand on her head and starts like
I don't know, when she's talking about fire and like
red lighting and what does she say?

Speaker 3 (43:28):
So, yeah, Margaret says, when this kind of fire starts,
it is very hard to put out. The tender boughs
of innocence burned first, and the wind rises, and then
all goodness is in jeopardy.

Speaker 1 (43:39):
And it's just lit in this red lighting and she's
pretty much warning her of her death. And then Laura
turns to go into the roadhouse, but she sees herself
in a like a reflection and just black, and then
she walks into that black and then we come into
the shot of Julie Cruz in this like blue blue
light and everything's still black, and goes in and she

(44:01):
just sits down and she's crying because you know, it's
pretty emotional, and it's like, there's so many scenes in
Firewalk with Me that are like everybody can see that
she's self destructing and nobody's doing anything about it. She's
literally sitting there crying at the table and Jock is like,
these two dudes wanna meet, Yeah, and they just sit
down there, like, hey baby, No one acknowledges that she's

(44:22):
crying nothing.

Speaker 3 (44:24):
And you know, we talked a lot about the twinning
of the show in the movie, and you know how
many parallels there are, And I love that that moment
parallels the revelation moment that Cooper has in the episode
where Laura's killer is revealed, where they're at the roadhouse
and watching Julie Cruz sing, and you know, it is
happening again, that that moment of you know, cyclical recurrence,

(44:47):
you know all that stuff that is just when you're
just catching that whatever that you could call it, like
you know that that sort of you know, cosmic vibe
of something is off, something is wrong, something is gonna
whether it's ha now, whether it's going to happen in
the future where it happened in the past, or you know,
you're just catching that wave and it's it's affecting you.
So yeah, it's a really powerful, powerful stuff.

Speaker 1 (45:09):
It's it's Leland who killed Teresa Banks too, right, Yeah,
so he's just and that was like a whole year ago,
so the timeline sucks for miss poor Laura.

Speaker 2 (45:19):
Yeah, oh yeah.

Speaker 3 (45:22):
And it's just this theme of corruption of it's it's
funny because the show obviously was meant to evoke a
sort of you know, very tawdrey is not the right word,
but like in the first season they have that that
fake soap opera that they'll use as a parallel joke
called Invitation to Love, and people rightfully pointed it out

(45:45):
as being a clever touch of like, you know, okay,
here's like the hokey, silly version of what's you know,
happening in quote unquote reality in twin Peaks, where it's
like there's just as many love triangles and twists and
crazy you know schemes, and you know behind the closed doors,
you know, back room dealings and and you know.

Speaker 2 (46:02):
Corporate stuff whatever.

Speaker 3 (46:05):
And I think what's really interesting about fire Walk with
Me is how it takes the soap opera ninus of
soap opera enus of the show and then further brings
it down to earth of like, you know, okay, here's
how sad it would be, and how how bleak it
is and dark it is to you know, have this
happening in your town where I'm just even thinking of,

(46:26):
Like there's that extended scene where Bobby you know, seemingly
or does kills Yeah, he kills that guy.

Speaker 2 (46:34):
Yeah yeah. And Laura's and you know, Laura's slash.

Speaker 3 (46:37):
Cheryl Lee's reaction to it is so upsettingly oh my god,
yeah off key where it's like, you know, they're not
standing there, you know, freaking Bobby's freaking out, but but
she thinks it's absolutely hilarious, and yeah it is. It's
a really dark joke, you know, because it's like here's
this poor.

Speaker 1 (46:55):
Kid who's and they're eighteen seventeen eighteen.

Speaker 2 (46:58):
Right, who just accidentally, you know, did murder.

Speaker 1 (47:02):
But he got a lot of cocaine out of it.

Speaker 2 (47:03):
I had a lot of cocaine.

Speaker 3 (47:04):
And I love that it recontect because you know, at
the beginning of the show, Bobby was positioned as a
very like antagonistic character of like, oh maybe he's the killer,
you know, even because you know, he was presented initially
as like, you.

Speaker 1 (47:15):
Know, Bobby's an asshole.

Speaker 2 (47:17):
Yeah, oh, he's an asshole, but like he's he gets better.

Speaker 1 (47:20):
By the but he was pretty bad in the beginning.

Speaker 3 (47:23):
Right, But it's the idea of like, you know, here's
his corruption, right, you know, here's.

Speaker 1 (47:27):
Right, Oh yeah, he has his own Yeah. Well that's
why it all goes back to David Lynch's obsession with
the blue collar life, like the white pick offenses. Laura
is the epitome of you know, like the American girl dream.
She's young, she's beautiful, she's blonde, she's the homecoming queen.
The symbol of innocence is something that he's big into,
which is why I feel like we see the angel
and stuff at the end. But underneath it all, she's

(47:47):
being horribly corrupted. And what does Dale say. He's like, oh,
the blonde homecoming queen with a drug problem. And Albert
is like, well, you just described you know, fifty percent
of the girls in America and that's one hundred percent accurate.
Is like, you're not sure what's going on with all
of these teens in Twin Peaks. It's extremely exaggerated, but
it's also like there are small towns where this stuff

(48:10):
does happen. Like every small town in America has its
own little bad area and its own little folklore town
and like the Dark Woods, and it does like it
reminds you a lot of Blue Velvet. But the characters,
it's kind of like the cops in Blue Velvet, how
they're just everybody is ignoring what's going on because they
refuse to accept that evil exists, and even when they're

(48:30):
faced with it, they're still like denying, denying, denying, and
they just ignore it. And I think that's what Twin
Peaks is. And the movie is even more and it
really breaks down the whole white fence fantasy. It's like
the ultimate social commentary on that bullshit.

Speaker 3 (48:44):
Really interesting, what you just said it made me think
that so much a big recurring theme in all of
Lynch's work that he really brings out here in Twin
Peaks is this idea of denial, because as we know
from his personal life, Lynch was a big component of
transcendental meditation, which you know, was such a key element

(49:04):
to his creativity and his process. And you know, I
don't know. I'm certainly not an expert on TM, I
don't practice, I'm not you know, interested in that. But
from what I understand, it is something that supposedly connects you,
or can connect you to a deeper understanding of the
world surrounding you, and a deeper understanding of yourself and
just sort of connecting with yourself and all that. And

(49:24):
I think that it does come out in Lynch's work
as this idea of or this theme of denial or
you know, having the wool pull over your eyes, whether
you know, willingly or apathetically. You know, because what you
just said about, you know, these people denying, I mean
you could say that I wish I could remember his name,
but the lead character of Lost Highway, he's very much

(49:45):
in denial. Yeah, the lead uh you know, Betty h
Slash Diane in mohand Drive very much in Denial, Laura
dirdan an Inland Empire. You know, she doesn't know herself
and that's part of her trauma of like why she's
so insane. And yeah, and so so many people in
the town of Twin Peaks and the characters that live
there are thinking of Twin Peaks as like this nice,

(50:07):
normal American you know, every day everybody's grit, you know town.
And there is what I love about the show too,
is that it does go out of its way to
demonstrate that there is a high level of goodness that
exists there. I mean the Book House Boys, you know,
something like that, where it's like there's people that dedicate
their lives to the highest calling of you know, the
log Lady Hawk, you know, all these people who are

(50:29):
there fighting for the side of good and Cooper of course,
and then there's just obviously this deep well of just
unmitigated evil. So yeah, Twin Peaks as biblical sight of
the apocalypse, I don't know, well, and.

Speaker 1 (50:43):
That is why Lauren knows that she has to die
to break this cycle. And that's where the purity comes
from at the end is literally the form of an
angel like she's a martyr, but she accomplishes breaking the
cycle in her death and it stops Spot from inhabiting
her body. And that's why it's also beautiful and tragic.

Speaker 3 (51:02):
Yeah, I don't know, it says we're talking about how
much symbolism there is in Lynch's work. We should mention
because we haven't yet the whole early scene with lil
and oh yeah, because you said earlier that Ash that
this is a little bit of Lynch's fuck you h
and at that scene in particular, it feels like a
real come on to the audience, the critics, the fans whoever, Yeah, like,

(51:25):
you know, okay, a dear you to decode this movie.

Speaker 1 (51:28):
Then Desmond does it for us right right, And I
was like, oh, I get how do I understand all
this now?

Speaker 3 (51:35):
Yeah, he's explaining to Keifer, like, okay, well, the forefingers
mean this, you know, the blue rose means.

Speaker 1 (51:41):
This, This sour face means that we're gonna have problems
with the police station. And then walking back and forth
means a lot of footwork. And then you're like, oh,
I totally get it.

Speaker 3 (51:51):
But I love that even including that scene is just
such a it's such air like a jape, you know,
it's such a jab at the audience of like, Okay,
I know that you like your little puzzles, so here's
a puzzle for you.

Speaker 2 (52:02):
But also here's a solution.

Speaker 3 (52:04):
And it's almost like yeah, it's almost like giving the
audience a sort of wake and a nod and a
Dacoder ring all at once, you know, the Coder ring.

Speaker 1 (52:12):
We get Mike in this one. He pops up speaking
the ring. But I mean, once we get I guess
we should kind of talk about the end now because
it does get a little rough. The end is it's
not great. So there's James, a rich recurring character, and
he's just so cool.

Speaker 2 (52:28):
Uh, I have.

Speaker 1 (52:30):
Problems with but James. You know, James is like, I
love you, Laura, I love you. But he just lets
her run off into the woods alone in her high
heels in the middle of the night and just you know,
drives off in his motorcycle. So he should feel bad
about what happens. She meets up with Leo and Jack
or Jacques, and they meet up with Ronnette and they

(52:51):
have a one hel hell of a cocaine time and
this little cabin which but then things start having like
Jack ties Laura up for whatever reason. I'm like, they
are already doing the thing with you. What is this?
You know, Leland shows up, the dad is watching, you know, Bob,
it's not Leland. Bob is watching from the window. He

(53:12):
beats up Jock and Leo runs away, and that's when
Leland takes Laura and we're not to a abandoned train
car and pretty much murders Laura and run out falls that.
I don't know how Renot survived, to be.

Speaker 3 (53:24):
Honest, well, there's that moment with the Angel and Rennette
of you know, there's a little bit of almost like
you can call it like a moment of uh, divine
intervention or great.

Speaker 1 (53:35):
Yeah, like, girl, you better change your ways.

Speaker 3 (53:37):
Like you know, I'm giving you an out here sort
of thing. And you know, obviously I know that you
could use that as a Okay, well why did it
happen for her but not Laura? And I think it
pertains to what we've been discussing, which is that Laura
had this weird sort of destiny to have to have
this moment of like rejecting the devil essentially, you know,
because she's like.

Speaker 1 (53:57):
Are you going to kill me? And He's like, I
want to be all but he Bob does knock Renette
out pretty good. She's she's lucky. Yeah, Mike didn't do
a goddamn thing to help anybody.

Speaker 2 (54:11):
Yeah, he's just running and let's see the forest, right.

Speaker 1 (54:13):
Yeah, he sees Hernette, He's like, good luck girl, and
then just keeps going.

Speaker 2 (54:16):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (54:18):
And this is this idea of you know, whether you
could decide what garment Bosia is.

Speaker 2 (54:25):
I know that they give.

Speaker 1 (54:26):
A pain and sorrow.

Speaker 3 (54:28):
Pain sorrow, so it's I always took it as like, okay,
it's it's some sort of.

Speaker 2 (54:34):
Soul element.

Speaker 3 (54:35):
It's not the soul, but it's like something taken from
the soul or something like that. Yeah, they that they
consume that they that they want, and Bob is forced
to give it to h the Black Lodge, you know.

Speaker 1 (54:46):
Yeah, because he they kind of got him because of
what Laura did. So he you know, he's so mad
that Laura refused him and put the ring on that
he kills her and you know he's wraps her body
and plastic sens her floating down the river. And then
he goes to the Black Lodge and is separated from
Leland and I do love that shot so much where
we see Leland in the white makeup, oh yeah, with

(55:07):
the black lipstick, just like screaming and sorrow because he's
in there like a possessed person and he sees what's
happening and it's really sad.

Speaker 3 (55:15):
Yeah, and you know this, this whole ending also has
an invocation of something happens earlier in the movie with
the David Bowie scene where David Bowie's Phil Jeffrey says
that we're not going to talk about Judy. Uh and
you know, there is a shot of a monkey during
this end.

Speaker 1 (55:31):
We know what you did, Jack.

Speaker 3 (55:34):
That's old Jack who seems to say the word or
the name Judy. And ultimately, I think past our post
the return, we've all kind of decided we being Twin
Peaks fans have all kind of assumed that Judy is
like I was saying earlier, this female counterparty, the.

Speaker 1 (55:52):
Evil Laura, the Black Lodge.

Speaker 3 (55:53):
See this this entity that you know is part of
the Black Lodge, And.

Speaker 2 (56:03):
Oh shoot, what was I gonna say?

Speaker 3 (56:05):
Oh yeah, we should mention too that the ring that
we've been talking about, that's such a large part of
the story in this movie.

Speaker 1 (56:14):
The owls are not what they seem.

Speaker 3 (56:16):
So it connects to a part of the show in
the show's mythology known as the Owl Cave, which was
introduced late in the second season, and it is a
part of Twin Peak's mythology that even I in all
of my rewatches, I still haven't quite calmed down on
solidified for myself yet in terms of like what.

Speaker 2 (56:35):
It is and what it represents.

Speaker 3 (56:37):
I guess you could say that owl Cave is or
it's the symbol and the ring is some sort of
I mean, there's there's there's a wedding imagery to it,
right obviously in terms of putting on the ring on
a woman, you know, and wearing it and saying that
you're accepting it as some part of yourself or something
like that. But clearly the putting of it on key

(57:00):
Bob from entering her.

Speaker 1 (57:03):
So, but it's weird when Desmon finds it, he disappears
like there's.

Speaker 3 (57:07):
No I'm trying to say, like, I think in some
way you could you could interpret it as like an
emblem or a an artifact from the White Lodge, but
maybe not necessarily.

Speaker 2 (57:18):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (57:18):
There's Native American symbolism the way that there's kind of
like it in the Shining, like that, you know, the
thing that's just kind of in the background that we
should be paying attention to that gets ignored and they
use you know, the symbolism between what was happening with
them to you know, just you know, pushing it away
and not paying attention to it. I always saw the
Owls is kind of like the Watchers, you know. That's

(57:40):
why I like the owls. But are they for good
or for evil? I would? I guess this they kind
of lean more for good, kind of like the log Like,
what the hell is that log?

Speaker 2 (57:48):
Right? Exactly?

Speaker 3 (57:49):
Well, yeah, this idea that of nature as the being
its own force, and that there are just these elemental
things and they're seeing.

Speaker 1 (57:56):
What every like all they see the supernatural and they
see you know, the natural side. I don't know what
do you call it?

Speaker 2 (58:06):
Yeah, and I know that.

Speaker 3 (58:07):
Yeah, there's a there's a map in l Cave in
the show that gives a location to where the Black
Lodge is, you know, where in the Black Lodge is, uh,
and when it can be entered or.

Speaker 2 (58:17):
Exited or something like that.

Speaker 3 (58:20):
So yeah, I guess you could say that the ring
could represent just the general supernatural forces that are in
Twin Peaks or that are involved with both lodges, and
that by giving herself to that willingly it you know,
it condemns her in terms of it means that she's
going to die, which is why Cooper, you know, initially

(58:41):
says he don't take the ring because you know, he
doesn't want her to die. And there's so much of
Cooper's arc in the show as a whole of you know,
he is the consummate like hero type of like, you know,
I'm gonna save the girl. I'm gonna do whatever I
can to you know, make sure this is going to.

Speaker 2 (58:57):
Be put right.

Speaker 3 (58:58):
And even Cooper doesn't seem to fully grasp that some
tragedies just have to happen sort of thing where it's
like there's there's not there's some instances where like you
can't make it all better, like you.

Speaker 1 (59:10):
Can, well look at where he ends.

Speaker 2 (59:11):
Up, I know, I mean.

Speaker 1 (59:13):
And we get a very important line from Heather Graham
in this movie when Laura wakes up, wakes up from
a dreamer isn't dream and she says, you know, good
Coop is in the lodge.

Speaker 3 (59:23):
Yeah, the good Cooper is stuck in the Lodge and
he can't get out write it in your diary, right,
and she does and she does and that's one of
the missing pages, right and yeah, Heather Graham her character
being Annie Blackburn, who was normous sister or right, Yeah,
and yeah, the Cooper and her begin a relationship in

(59:45):
the show. She was essentially a replacement relationship for Audrey, Yeah,
because the whole behind the scenes.

Speaker 2 (59:51):
Yeah, but yeah, so so was that.

Speaker 3 (59:53):
Sort of professional Laura. But yeah, so essentially that's what's
important to know about her.

Speaker 2 (59:59):
Where it's like, yeah, she's but at least we.

Speaker 1 (01:00:00):
Got Billy Zane because of that.

Speaker 2 (01:00:02):
That's true.

Speaker 1 (01:00:03):
There's so many random people in those guys. You gotta
go watch a show. He's such a pilot. She should
have run off with him.

Speaker 2 (01:00:10):
Yeah. Oh man, God, have we even covered everything in
the movie.

Speaker 1 (01:00:19):
I'm just it's kind of hard.

Speaker 2 (01:00:21):
I might just going with the series and everything, but
I'm like, uh.

Speaker 1 (01:00:24):
Just I think we've we've gotten a lot there. I mean,
you know, Laura Lara gets a painting, and that's kind
of what brings the the Black Lodge, I guess enter
or is that more of like the White Lodge, And
there's the Red Room, and there's is the Red Room
that is kind of the.

Speaker 2 (01:00:41):
In between, right.

Speaker 3 (01:00:42):
I guess you could say that maybe the Red Room
is almost a waiting room or or limbo space, you know,
between lodges. But it does feel like it becomes essentially
shorthand visually for the Black Lodge. So I don't know
if we I thought about this during one rewatch of
the show or the series, and I thought, maybe we've
never actually seen the White Lodge depict it, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:01:03):
I don't think so. Yeah, so we'll do like we
see like white horses around, which is a symbol of
death in like, you know, angels. We've seen angels, Sarah's
and angels. And then oh, oh the tall the tall guys,
Oh the giant, Yes, the giants from the White Lodge.

Speaker 3 (01:01:20):
Giant slash the hotel waiter.

Speaker 2 (01:01:24):
Yeah, because they're connected.

Speaker 1 (01:01:27):
And but no, he doesn't show up in this.

Speaker 2 (01:01:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:01:30):
Well what about the old lady and the little boy?

Speaker 3 (01:01:32):
They're right, you could say that they are also representatives
of the White Lodge, which is funny because that actress
I think her name is frances b. Let me just
make sure Francis Bay sorry as missus Tremont also known
as missus Chelfont. It's funny because right around the same time,
I think, in like two years later, when John Carpenter

(01:01:53):
made in the Mouth of Manis, she plays a hotel
owner who turns out.

Speaker 2 (01:01:56):
To be not so savory.

Speaker 3 (01:01:59):
So yeah, whenever I see her, I'm like, oh, should
I be creeped out? Like no, wait, maybe she's good.

Speaker 1 (01:02:03):
You know, maybe she's good.

Speaker 2 (01:02:05):
In this one, she just tentacles.

Speaker 1 (01:02:07):
It's hard to keep this movie in order because there's
so many little things like little I'm looking at my
notes now, I'm like, this starts with a school bus
of screaming children and it just goes on, and the
weardness of the first scene, and you know, Gordon Cole,
I love that he puts himself in it, modus operandi,
you know, the whole thing. There's little like I don't know,

(01:02:27):
if you just stop fighting it and just enjoy the movies,
it's so goddamn enjoyable. If you're just going into his
movies being like I need to understand everything and blah
blah blah blah blah, you're just gonna have a terrible time.

Speaker 2 (01:02:38):
Yeah, I do think that.

Speaker 3 (01:02:39):
Yeah, Lynch's work is endlessly frustrating for the type of
person who only consumes art expecting to get like a
pert succinct story beginning, middle end, and that's it. Like
they just want to come away and say, Okay, it
was this and it was about this, and that's the end.
If that's what you're looking for out of art, I
don't think you should be consuming art at all. But
I think that you're definitely gonna have a hard time

(01:03:01):
with David Lynch, so maybe don't bother.

Speaker 1 (01:03:03):
I don't know, it's like right off the bat that
kind of smack him in the face with it. When
they're at the diner and you know, the waitress is
just that full slice of Americana smoking in their faces.
But then there's this random girl in a black dress
with pearls, speaking French, and you're just like, what where
are we? What is happening? Little things like that, that's fun.

(01:03:24):
Her arm went completely Dad what what?

Speaker 3 (01:03:29):
I also do think that, I mean, he always did
his best work with Lynch in general, but I think
this is one of my favorite Pedlimente scores as well.

Speaker 1 (01:03:37):
Oh it's so good Lar's theme alone.

Speaker 3 (01:03:41):
Yeah, Like I said, the questions in the world of
Blue Song is maybe the most beautiful other than The
World Spins. I think the World Spins always you know,
gets to me from the show, but this is a
close second. And yeah, the way that he uses his
synthpads to be so evocative but also can do that jazzy,
you know groove things stand up for you. And the

(01:04:04):
fact that there's something that they are continually putting. I
don't know if it's a musical element or a sound
design element that they use musically, but there's this constant
drone or a whine that happens that it contributes to
the dread and the ominousness of this.

Speaker 1 (01:04:19):
I think it's a racerhead stuff. It's just like that
Ratty the Radiator radiator noise that you hear throughout the
whole thing. And I could really really hear it when
I was listening through my headphones, and it's through a
lot more than you realize. I heard it. When I
first noticed it is in the scene when they're at
the police station and they're talking where the body is
just in like a barn, and there's a door off

(01:04:40):
to the side that's slightly open and there's a flashing
light back there for no reason whatsoever, the sound coming
out of there. I never noticed it before, and it
is loud and it's distractable in a good way because
you're like, what is going on in that back room?
We don't know, we never find out.

Speaker 3 (01:04:57):
Yeah, yeah, and yeah, it's just this thing that's that's
operating in the background and you're like, what is that?

Speaker 2 (01:05:02):
And you know, oh god.

Speaker 1 (01:05:03):
You know he was big into like industrial stuff, industrial sounds.
That's why I like Nine Inch Nails started doing it
in their music and you can just see his influences
through everything, and I like it. I like the way
that sounds like that make me feel, you know, like
it makes you feel a little on edge and you
don't know why because nothing's happening. You're like, oh wait,

(01:05:26):
there's this weird rumbling tone that is very uncomfortable. That
like liminal spit, like when you're just he just will
have you sit at a shot underneath the traffic light.
And I'm a big fan of like liminal space photography
and stuff like that, and that's where this comes from.
Because it just dissed the wind blowing through the trees
and just kind of moving the thing a little bit
and let's hang out there for thirty seconds, which is

(01:05:47):
weird to do during a show, but he does it
and it makes you feel things and I think it's cool.

Speaker 3 (01:05:52):
Oh yeah, there is something that I wanted to mention
in terms of this could be illustrative about we keep
talking about the duality of Lynch, but also this film
in particular, how some of it's, you know, so painful
and dark and bleak, and then some of it is
very light hearted and goofy and weird.

Speaker 2 (01:06:13):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (01:06:13):
And apparently according to his book, or one of his books,
because he wrote several books during his lifetime, Lynch confessed
that he was dealing with a hernia during the entire
shoot because because this is why, though he had injured
himself while laughing too hard at something funny that Angelo
bed lament he did.

Speaker 2 (01:06:33):
It isn't that I'm.

Speaker 1 (01:06:35):
Going to get a hernia. I hope it's that way.

Speaker 3 (01:06:37):
If you're gonna give yourself a hernia, it's because that
that crafty Angelo did a.

Speaker 1 (01:06:41):
Fun Angelo battle Lamenti.

Speaker 2 (01:06:44):
He's a jokester. That guy.

Speaker 1 (01:06:46):
What a magoon? Not the word?

Speaker 2 (01:06:50):
Yeah, right, so.

Speaker 3 (01:06:53):
It really, yeah, there's there's a there's no better indication
of light and dark really in art with then some
of Lynch's work, because and I think that's what it's
you know, because if you're again, if you're somebody who's
not familiar with his work that much, you're listening to
us talk about it, you may be thinking, gosh, this
sounds so miserable to watch, Like it sounds like really,

(01:07:15):
you know, just harrowing and upsetting.

Speaker 1 (01:07:18):
And you know, we're leaving out we've been getting in
a little bit of like the jokes, so let's rock
of it all, like there is humor in here.

Speaker 3 (01:07:27):
Yeah, or even just yeah, just just odd, offbeat sort
of intriguing moments right.

Speaker 1 (01:07:36):
The Pacific Northwest.

Speaker 2 (01:07:38):
Yeah, just the.

Speaker 1 (01:07:39):
Wach I love. I love that. I'm like I could
live there immediately if I won the lottery. That's exactly
where I buy big oh yeah uh.

Speaker 3 (01:07:47):
And it's something that is such a special, unique, distinct
mixture that you can't really get anywhere else. It's certainly
not in the same way. And it's something that ultimately, yeah,
I think that it depends on your mindset, It depends
on your own personal history, depends on your taste as

(01:08:08):
a person. You know, what you take out of this
and take out of his work, whether and I think
it could change too. It could change on your mood
if you watch it in a particularly bad mood, like yeah,
you could really vibe in a heavy way with all
the heaviness. But if you're coming into it, you know,
having a pretty damn good day and he had damn
fine coffee beforehand or whatever, you know, like you you

(01:08:29):
still might come out of it going ill, Wow, that
was sad. But I feel so much. I feel so
you know, purged or you know, gosh, you know that
that beautiful woman she made it, you know sort of
thing like so it's that, it's it's it's got multitudes.

Speaker 1 (01:08:42):
Everyone is camp and over the top, but it's in
the best way. And this is how you do it,
because you go one hundred percent or none of it works.
It makes you know none of it works at all.
And like Sarah and during the show specifically, like when
they get the call that Lara's dead, just the screaming
and he holds the shots to There is a scene
in this movie when they're at the roadhouse where I

(01:09:04):
don't know, it's maybe twelve thirteen minutes of this movie
and you can kind of hear everybody, but he subtitles
the whole thing and they're just standing around, not talking
about fucking anything, and it is very long, and the
same song is just playing on a loop and a
loop and a loop, and you just keep kind of
waiting for something to happen, and it just kind of doesn't,

(01:09:25):
and I don't know. When stuff does start happening, you're like,
what the hell is that?

Speaker 2 (01:09:31):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:09:31):
I love that they did dub that scene and that
space the Pink Room, because it is a twin to
the Red Room, right, and that hence the subtitling.

Speaker 2 (01:09:43):
Yeah, and I love that.

Speaker 3 (01:09:44):
Yeah, this is like and it's not quite oh this
is hell on Earth, because it's not as obvious as that.
It's just more there's a relationship here between these spaces
and one is ultimately in the same way that Dear
Meadow is darker, but it's also very funny than Twin Peaks.
The Pinky is, you know, darker than Twin Peaks and

(01:10:07):
the niceness of it, but it's not as dark as
the Red Room. It's just you know, it's kind of
as in between space, like you said, liminal space too,
and that's part of it as well. Uh, all right,
is there anything we haven't.

Speaker 1 (01:10:22):
I mean, we could go on and on. I think
we should just just right now laugh that sadness away, Laura.
You laugh it away, and you know what, see you
in twenty five years.

Speaker 2 (01:10:31):
In twenty five years, baby.

Speaker 1 (01:10:33):
How crazy that they did do that, though.

Speaker 3 (01:10:35):
And that's why, and I'll say this as a as
a summation, that's why if you're going to dive into
David Lynch, not just twin Peaks. If you're just going
to go twin Peaks only, then do you know you
do your thing? But I think if you're going to
dive into David Lynch ultimately as a as a whole,
you know, as his whole body work, which is not
that much like it's very easily doable. I think it's

(01:10:58):
only what ten films is that?

Speaker 1 (01:11:02):
Yeah, right somewhere around maybe some are run there.

Speaker 3 (01:11:04):
It's in the low double digits. And uh and then
of course the two seasons of this, uh o, three
seasons of this, and you know that's not counting all
of his short films and internet projects and all that.

Speaker 2 (01:11:18):
Just the feature and.

Speaker 1 (01:11:19):
Miss his weather reports and me and Ken used to
play that. He used to do a number of the
day and me and Ken were really into it. We
would always try to guess what it was, and we
did it every day.

Speaker 3 (01:11:30):
Oh yeah, Now there was there was a time when
he was very Internet friendly and it was beautiful because
you just get a little he's just.

Speaker 1 (01:11:37):
Having a good time. Yeah, it's blue skies.

Speaker 3 (01:11:39):
Here in La Blue, beautiful blue skies, golden sunshine.

Speaker 2 (01:11:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:11:47):
And uh so I think that, yeah, if you're going
to dive into Lynch and you you, you know, want
to sort of have this experience, that I would recommend.

Speaker 2 (01:11:57):
I guess this is kind of a recommendation. It's not
really but uh.

Speaker 3 (01:12:01):
Time, Yeah, it's this idea that I think it works
best to watch his stuff as it was made chronologically
because Twin Peaks, the return now that he's passed away,
is it doubles for me as of great summation of
the man's work, his life, and his career. It does
feel like a full circle moment, you know, in a

(01:12:22):
way that it certainly was intended to, because you know,
like we've said, there's so much twinning, there's so much cyclicalness,
there's so much you know, recurrence. That's part of the
Twin Peaks narrative, you know. But I think that even
more than that, you know, you can see so many
of the themes and the parallels there was. I know
there's fans out there. I don't necessarily buy into this,
but there's fans that believe that Mulholland Drive and Lost

(01:12:44):
Highway are also in the Twin Peaks universe, and they
have their reasons for that.

Speaker 1 (01:12:48):
You know, I don't hate that.

Speaker 3 (01:12:50):
I don't I don't hate I don't think it's true
in the sense that like there's not like unumpeachable evidence
that that's the case. But you can, I can certainly
understand why people make that argument because they missed a call.
There's there's a lot of parallels, and there's a lot
of connections, and so yeah, if you if you take
his career as a whole, you know, I can't think
of too many other filmmakers who are lucky enough to

(01:13:12):
have such a great body of work that feels so consistent,
you know, because you'll have a lot of filmmakers unfortunately,
who you know, will do for higher jobs and you know,
we'll we'll make, you know, a sequel to something or
a remake of something, and it'll still be theirs, but
it'll feel like, you know, somehow not fully theirs right,
And yeah, Lynch was lucky in the sense that he

(01:13:35):
was able to make so many things that he made
without ever really compromising, and Dune is the biggest compromise
he made.

Speaker 2 (01:13:41):
And even Dune is yeah, how much is you know?

Speaker 1 (01:13:42):
I like you and I still like it, and I
think it's because I like David Lynch, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:13:46):
Yeah, so, yeah, he's he's very gift. He's very blessed
in the sense that like we and we are blessed too,
in the sense that we are able to get, uh,
what feels like a concise body of work from a
singular art.

Speaker 1 (01:14:00):
My recommendation is just go watch mohaland Drive. It's one
of my favorites and I really love it. And of
course it was going to be a David Lynch movie.
But if you're going to start with one, start with
mohaland Drive and then work your way to you know,
start from the beginning and go through it again, but
to really get an idea of what could be Like
I'm disappointed with how this ended, but I'm going to talk.

(01:14:21):
I can't get this movie out of my head for days,
you know, is kind of what is the power of
the movie working. You may hate it, you may be
angry at it, you may be completely done with this
style of blah blah blah. But if it stays with
you for days and days and you find yourself still
talking about it, then that's exactly what that movie was
meant to do, and you don't need it explained.

Speaker 3 (01:14:41):
I love that you said that because one of my
best friends I got into Lynch and ultimately twin Peaks
when I made him watch Blue Velvet.

Speaker 2 (01:14:48):
He watched on his own.

Speaker 3 (01:14:49):
I didn't watch it with him, and he came to
me the next day after watching He's like, you know, Bill,
that Blue Velvet movie terrible, hated it, not cool, so gross,
spoil ever. And I was like, I guess it's not
for you. And then literally every day for the next
two weeks he was like so about Blue Velvet and
I was like, you're still talking about it, and he
can't get the end of the two weeks he was like, actually,
you know what, that is pretty cool, don't don't you know?

(01:15:15):
Give him a try, but don't necessarily trust your first simpulse,
because sometimes it takes a little bit for Lynch to
get into your skin, and once he does, he's there
to stay.

Speaker 2 (01:15:24):
Man.

Speaker 1 (01:15:24):
Lost Highway is a difficult watch it.

Speaker 3 (01:15:28):
It is great, great freaking soundtrack though, Oh yeah, that
was my first. I think I even owned the soundtrack
before I watched the movie.

Speaker 1 (01:15:36):
No way interesting. That's nine inch nails, right.

Speaker 2 (01:15:39):
Yeah, Trent. Trent was the executive producer of that album
and all that. So, but yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:15:46):
And if you're in the move for some Nicholas Cage
being crazy wild at heart.

Speaker 2 (01:15:51):
Yeah. If you want to see a great before tailor,
Oh Sailor and Lula.

Speaker 3 (01:15:59):
If you want to see on hurt, just blow the
doors off of theatrical performance, watch The Elephant Man.

Speaker 1 (01:16:03):
Oh my god.

Speaker 3 (01:16:04):
If you want to see just a bizarre that maybe
the best student film ever made, watch a Razorhead.

Speaker 2 (01:16:11):
If you.

Speaker 1 (01:16:14):
Here for a three hour cam movie, watch Inland.

Speaker 3 (01:16:18):
And if you want to watch just the most like
heart wrenching, like tender Lynch, it is tenderest, watch the
Straight Story.

Speaker 2 (01:16:24):
You know it is. It is so sweet and heartfelt.

Speaker 1 (01:16:27):
I didn't know that you could drive a tractor across country.

Speaker 3 (01:16:30):
Yeah. And if you want to see big giant worms,
watch Dune totally. Thank you all for joining us for
this episode of Bill and Ashley's part of the Stranded
Pana network. You could find my work in the show.

Speaker 2 (01:16:49):
Notes links below. Check us out on social media.

Speaker 3 (01:16:51):
You can find this show at strandedpinda dot com and
everywhere else you get your podcasts. If you have questions
or comments, please feel free to write to us at
Bill and Ash Tira Theater at gmail dot com.

Speaker 2 (01:17:01):
We're dying to hear see you don't take the ring
or a

Speaker 3 (01:17:10):
H

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