Jaws 50th Anniversary

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:27):
Welcome to another horrifying episode of Bill and Ashley's Terror Theater.
Break out the party hats, because we're celebrating the fiftieth
anniversary of the movie that made you questions standing in
knee deep water nineteen seventy fives jaws.

Speaker 2 (00:40):
Smile you, son of a bitch. It's another shark party.
Welcome back.

Speaker 1 (00:45):
I'm Ashley Coffin, joined as always by my co host
and Terror Bill Bria.

Speaker 2 (00:49):
Bill Darling. How are we today?

Speaker 3 (00:51):
I'm okay, I can go slow ahead, come on down
here some some of this shit.

Speaker 2 (00:55):
And we have some very special guests.

Speaker 3 (00:57):
Yes we do.

Speaker 4 (01:00):
Oh.

Speaker 3 (01:00):
We are so honored to be joined by these two
gentlemen today, the first of whom has been may roon
Stay Gone and Elder Scrolls Online. He's been heard throughout
the country as a national voice for Toyota Across the Galaxy,
is a promo voice for the Mandalorian The Book of
Boba Fett, most recently for season two of And Or What.

(01:20):
He was also heard as Malakith in Marvel's What If
Season three, and was the host of the official Unsolved
Mysteries podcast Ladies and Gentlemen and Folks of All Genders
and ages Steve French.

Speaker 5 (01:32):
Yay, here's this woman with bow legged women. Thanks for
having me.

Speaker 3 (01:37):
And we also have audiobook narrator MARKA Kushka, Thank.

Speaker 6 (01:40):
You, thank you.

Speaker 7 (01:41):
Yes, i I'm also I'm also a voiceover person, much
just like Steve, with just as many cool credits as Steve.

Speaker 6 (01:59):
But I I don't need to massage my ego. I
have them by having them to be read out loud.

Speaker 2 (02:06):
Awesome.

Speaker 6 (02:06):
I just have it. I just have it on a
poster behind my head.

Speaker 3 (02:10):
It's a joy to have you again, sir, it's so
great to be here. That it's so great to be
here Steve. Since you are a first timer to Billy
and Ashleys Stare Theater, we have a question for you.

Speaker 5 (02:20):
Please fire away.

Speaker 3 (02:21):
As we ask all of our first timers, what is
your first exposure, your first memory, your first notable moment
in your life with the horror genre.

Speaker 5 (02:31):
I think you know Jaws was probably the earliest horror
movie I saw. I was about nine or ten when
I saw it, But you know what, I'm not even
sure that it sticks with me as a horror movie.
I would say, to answer your question fully, the first
horror horror movie I saw that I can remember sticking
with me and messing me up was the People under
the Stairs. Oh but I saw when I was like

(02:54):
maybe fourteen years old or something, and boy did that
ooh ooh that's a tough one.

Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yeah, that's a good car.

Speaker 3 (03:02):
Excellent. We love Craven. Here Mark. Since you were a
multiple timer, I'll ask you a different question. What have
you seen recently that scared you?

Speaker 6 (03:11):
Yeah? Uh, you know, I watched.

Speaker 3 (03:16):
The wolf Man from huh last year and this year
even was that it was January?

Speaker 6 (03:23):
Oh jay, okay this year? Yeah. Uh.

Speaker 7 (03:26):
And I didn't think I was gonna like it, and
I didn't really, but there was a couple of scary
parts and there was some cool stuff in there.

Speaker 6 (03:35):
There's some cool were wolf stuff in there.

Speaker 1 (03:38):
I remember us talking about it. I was like, you
should watch it. It was different.

Speaker 6 (03:41):
Yeah, yeah, there was some cool stuff.

Speaker 3 (03:43):
I thought. The sound design and it was pretty on
par from me. It was pretty great and the sound
design was yeh yeah, And there was there was moments
in there that I think, you know you're describing that.
I was pretty uh disturbed. I was like, oh yeah,
the primal part of my brain was like, oh no, run.

Speaker 6 (03:57):
Away, run oh and then I was scared. Also when
I watched Jaws last.

Speaker 3 (04:03):
Night, Hey still got the power.

Speaker 6 (04:05):
Still scared.

Speaker 1 (04:07):
I can't even count how many times I've seen this movie.
I've seen Jaws. It has to be in the hundreds,
and it is effective every time. It really is a
perfect film.

Speaker 7 (04:18):
Yeah, I was trying to figure out, like trying to
calculate how many times I've seen it, and I've.

Speaker 6 (04:24):
Seen it like twenty times with Steve.

Speaker 5 (04:26):
With you, I was just going, I was telling them
before we got on, I've seen this movie with you
more than I think I've seen any movie than anybody else.

Speaker 1 (04:32):
Extly, we brought you here because you have this relationship
with the film. So tell the people, tell the people
about why it's so special.

Speaker 7 (04:40):
Well, I mean, I today is my forty fourth birthday, and.

Speaker 2 (04:49):
So much trying to make it about himself, right, and.

Speaker 7 (04:53):
Of those forty four years, I don't really remember a
time where like Jaws wasn't part of my life, you know,
Like I I've told.

Speaker 6 (05:02):
The story before.

Speaker 7 (05:03):
I like the first time I saw it, I uh,
my uncle put it on on like every house or
every house, every TV in the house, so that like
my cousin and I were running from room to room
because it was like, you know, it was too scary,
but then it was on in every room.

Speaker 3 (05:18):
What was your parents, this is your torture?

Speaker 6 (05:21):
Yeah? Growing up?

Speaker 3 (05:22):
Yeah, wow, yeah, well it was a psychological war, yeah,
it was.

Speaker 7 (05:26):
It was a Russian immigrant household.

Speaker 6 (05:28):
There was a lot of psychological warfare going on in general.

Speaker 7 (05:33):
But yeah, and like just like that mix of like
excitement and like fear and yeah, but of like you know,
watching it at you know, five years old or whatever,
and then watching it like last night, you know, on
the eve of my forty fourth birthday.

Speaker 6 (05:54):
Uh, and it's it's it's just as good.

Speaker 7 (05:57):
It's just as wonderful, I think every time, no matter what.

Speaker 5 (06:01):
And I think getting to see it as a as
a kid, there was something about like my parents let
us watch my brother sister and I I think I
was maybe nine years old, and it felt like a
very grown up thing to suddenly get to watch Jaws.
That we've been allowed to watch this finally, and we
were grown up and we were mature enough to handle it.
And the memory and I have actually watching it was
we were renovating our tiny little kitchen in this townhouse

(06:25):
at the time, and we had all of these, uh,
all the cupboards and come in boxes. So we had
all these cardboard boxes that as kids we were playing
with and turning into race cars or whatever. And I
could remember after watching the movie that night going downstairs
and immediately you think, you think, oh, it has a scar.
The children in any way immediately re enacting Quint getting
chopped in half with my first we had like a

(06:46):
red blanket. My sister put this blanket on and was
inside one of these boxes that we turned into the
into the orca and she was like, it looks like
in my head it's a perfect shark with her arms
going out and chomping my legs or zombie. Just you know, immediately,
I grew.

Speaker 1 (07:02):
Up around the Jersey Shore, which is where you know
the book and the original story came from. So watching
this and being someone who summers at you know, k May,
it looks.

Speaker 2 (07:13):
Exactly like it. So it was horrifying.

Speaker 1 (07:16):
And it's hard to think back to like, oh when
what was I'm not afraid of being in the ocean
or in the tub, or in the pool or anywhere
of it that there's water, And I can't remember because
I feel like I saw it at such a young age.
I like to compare this movie to The Exorcist a lot,
because I think that they were very lucky in the
seventies to have these two movies that still to this
day hold up as well as they did and traumatized

(07:38):
people as well as they did. But Jaw is a
different level than The Exorcist because it's just the water.

Speaker 2 (07:45):
You're just it doesn't matter what body of water.

Speaker 1 (07:48):
You could be in the Lake Piranha and that was cute,
But I'm still afraid of the shark, even in the creek.

Speaker 6 (07:51):
You know.

Speaker 3 (07:52):
Yes, it's funny. I have a completely different relationship to
the fear factor of this movie because the way I
was raised, you know, and ashe I've said on this
show many times, as a child, I was a scaredy cat.
You know. I would go through the video store where
the horror section is and scare myself just looking at
the box art, you know sort of stuff. And Indiana

(08:13):
Jones I was scared of. That was a Spielberg and
of course produced by Spielberg. Poltergeist I was scared of
as a kid. But Jaws never gave me a fear
factor because I was raised as a water rat. My
family would vacation in Capeatteris, North Carolina every summer, and
I'd always be dragged along with them, so be in
the ocean, you know, every summer, come hell or high water.

(08:33):
Even at my grandma's place in Connecticut, they were they
built their house on a reservoir, and so they even
had like a swing that, you know, they built like
a wooden platform to swing off of into the water,
and it was like a brite of passage to like
go from the bottom like kittie rung to like the
top adult rung, you know, to fly off into the
water there. And I would always spend a majority of

(08:54):
my time during any vacation where there was water in
the water. And so when I first saw Jaws, I
don't remember for what age I was. I was probably
probably probably pretty young, but I think I identified much
more with the adventurous, you know, Moby Dick spirit of
Brody Quintin Hooper in terms of like, yeah, we're gonna
go find that shark, you know sort of thing. And
so that's what really drew me in more than like

(09:15):
a fear factor of like, oh my god, there's sharks
in the water. But yeah, of course, the more I
watch it every time I watch it. As I grow up,
you know, the more I can just further and further
appreciate the craft of the filmmaking on display.

Speaker 7 (09:27):
I think it's interesting that you said that you were
scared of Indiana Jones, not like that not no, not
the character, but not the bad guys, but you were
scared of the actual archaeologist.

Speaker 3 (09:36):
Yeah, like, I am.

Speaker 2 (09:38):
Really afraid of that.

Speaker 3 (09:41):
Yeah. Yeah, it's not gonna happen to scared around me.
I'm gonna start freaking out. So yeah, that's great, that's great.

Speaker 1 (09:48):
Well, and I guess we can jump into a lot
of this movie is so notorious for the things that
happened in the background, and those things that fucked up
are the reason why we got much psychological kind of
scary movie, because I mean, they wanted to show the
shark in the very first scene when it takes the
girl down, but the shark is not working lewis.

Speaker 2 (10:12):
The very first thing.

Speaker 1 (10:13):
And I think that, you know, because of that, we
got this amazing movie where you don't even see the
shark really for the first fifty five minutes.

Speaker 3 (10:22):
Yeah, well, do we want to start sort of what
do we want to go like through a normal sort
of you know, pre production production sort of structure, just
to keep it structured sort of thing. Yeah. So like
Jaws obviously was a was a famous, you know, very
successful novel by Peter Benchley. And by the way, has
anybody here read Peter Benchley's Jaws?

Speaker 5 (10:39):
I have?

Speaker 6 (10:40):
Yeah, you have?

Speaker 3 (10:41):
What's it like?

Speaker 6 (10:42):
Tell us?

Speaker 2 (10:42):
It's fabulous. Okay, it's kind of like reading The Exorcist.
There's there's more.

Speaker 1 (10:46):
But the thing about the book is the personalities in
the book really do transfer over to screen very well.
It's the same kind of conflicts and the same kind
of things going on, which is great to have, you know,
all of that written out and like for them to
be able to act it out out and not have
to you know, well, I'm not going to say improv
because there was a lot of that going on, but
they had this story that was there and they did

(11:07):
a really good job of putting it into the movie.

Speaker 2 (11:09):
What did you think, Steve?

Speaker 5 (11:12):
I hadn't read it until recently. Mark was always saying, Steve,
you got to read this book. It's very different from
the movie. You gotta read it. So I finally read it,
and boy, is it kind of amazing that the movie
we got came somehow inspired by that book because there
was like, while the basic tenets of the story are true,
there was so little that remains of those actual characters.

(11:34):
The plot of that movie. You know, I think the
famous one that everybody talks about is that in the book,
Hooper meets Missus Brody and as we learn, she has
was used to date Hooper's older brother at some point,
and then present day Hooper younger Hooper and Madame Brody

(11:55):
have a torrid affair in the middle of the book,
just you know, just a random, random one. Yeah, yeah, fandom.

Speaker 3 (12:01):
Yeah, I'm gonna put a flag in that because I'm
going to come back and talked about it later. But
but yeah, that's that's one big change. It's wild that
the producers at Universal, Richard Zanik and David Brown, came
across Jaws simply almost because Brown was reading the literature
section of Cosmopolitan, which was edited by his wife, Helen
Gurley Brown. So you know, if he hadn't been married

(12:23):
to the lifestyle magazine Cosmopolitan editor, you know, why did
not ever seen Jaws? You know sort of thing. And
you know, they read the book and they got very
excited about it, and they wanted to produce a film
right away sort of thing. It does speak to how
this story, the book, even despite its you know, already

(12:43):
in book form like scared, scary content, fear content of
a killer shark, they were already thinking of it in
terms of like an adventury style of movie because they
were first thinking of John Sturges to maybe direct it.
And if you guys know who John Sturges is, He's
the guy behind who made you know, the Escape, Bad
Day at Black Rock, Magnificent seven. I stationed Zebra like

(13:04):
all these very like manly men adventure movies of like
you know, man versus nature sort of thing, very hemingway ish,
which you know you could also compare Jaws to. Yeah,
But then they were like, Okay, we're probably not going
to get him. And I think Sturgis was already old
enough that like he was kind of like you know,
winding down his career at that time, in the mid
seventies anyway, So then they started looking at, like, you know,

(13:26):
smaller directors. I think the Dick Richards was a name
that was bandied about because he had just had his
first movie come out recently. So the thing I wanted
to talk about first and foremost was we always we
now we in twenty twenty five think of Jaws as yeah, Spielberg, Spielberg, Spielberg. Like,
Spielberg begins like, you know, it's not his first movie.

(13:48):
We have to put that out there, of course, because
technically his first theatrical film was nineteen seventy four. It's
The Sugarlane Express with Goldie Hawn and William Atherton and
his I would even argue his first movie movie was Dual,
which was made for television, but it did get a
theatrical release abroad. But yeah, it's important in the same
way that like, you know, fans in nineteen eighty nine

(14:11):
were like, Michael Keaton is Batman? What the hell? He's
a comedy actor. I'm sure there was maybe some people
who heard Steven Spielberg directing Jaws, and he's like Steven Spielberg,
the TV director, Like who cares? Like, you know, he
wasn't a name yet, and Xannak and Brown were clearly
thinking of like, oh, who can we get for cheap,
who's already in house, who's working for our company? You
know sort of thing, and Sugarland Express hadn't come out

(14:32):
yet when they hired him for Jaws. So I don't
believe sugar Land was like a hit hit. It wasn't
a flop, but it wasn't like, you know, a massive
hit or anything. So who knows if he if they
had waited, you know and seen the box office receipts
of Sugarland or something, maybe he would have been taken
off Jaws, you know, which would have changed history as
we know it sort of thing. But but yeah, so

(14:54):
you know, this was this was the moment for Spielberg
to prove him prove himself. And I think for the
most part understood it, you know, because he did go
after the job. I know that he was wavering a
little bit, what worried that he was going to become
typecasts like guy who makes movies about people being chased
by things, you know, trucks and trucks and duel and
then sharks in this. But but yeah, no, it's it's

(15:16):
it's kind of wild that, you know. This is yet
another example, as we've talked a lot about on the show,
Ash of Horror being a proving ground for a person
who becomes you know, a celebrated, you know, master of
his craft.

Speaker 1 (15:29):
Well, It's like, I wonder if if you were to
ever meet him and talk to him, if he would
still say this is the most difficult movie he ever filmed, because.

Speaker 2 (15:35):
He's like, let's film in the Atlantic.

Speaker 1 (15:37):
That's a great idea, it's going to be great, but
it wasn't and would it have been the same.

Speaker 3 (15:43):
Right, And part of that is because if you study
the making of Duel, Duel was supposed to be again
made for TV. It was a short story that Richard
Mathson wrote that rat Masen turned into a screenplay about
a guy on the highway who is you know, menaced
by a truck that we never see the driver of.
And the execs ait universal where like this can easily
be made for television with like a really small budget.

(16:04):
We'll shoot like, you know, uh, the driver of the
of the car, the main character, you know, on blue
screen or green screen or something, and he'll just you know,
mix driving and blah blah blah. We can save all
this money. And with Spielberg who insisted on shooting all
of it on location, in real cars, real you know,
traveling shots and everything like that. And to prove himself,
he made sure that he kept that movie like under

(16:26):
budget and on time because he wanted to, you know,
like prove that we can do it this way and
I can do it that it's like fast for you
and I can keep it under budget. D dah dah.
So I'm sure when he was approaching Jaws he was like,
I can do the same thing again on the ocean,
and uh.

Speaker 2 (16:38):
That's twenty seven year old. You're like, I could do it.
And then this went over budget.

Speaker 6 (16:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (16:45):
I think it was the first the first movie ever
shot on location, you know, an ocean movie shot on
the ocean. I think at least they claim to fame. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (16:54):
Yeah, so anyway, so yeah, yeah, we'll get into the cast.
Let's talk about the Yeah.

Speaker 1 (17:01):
It's great and what a like collective to give every day.
They were working on the script together kind of and
just improving, which is really fun for the actors. I
just remember them saying how much they enjoyed being able
to have that input. But then there was also a
lot of background fighting.

Speaker 3 (17:16):
Yeah. Yeah, it's wild too that the writing of this.
You know, obviously Benchley was involved, but they also got
this playwright, Howard Sackler, who did a draft. Spielberg himself
did a draft and then they eventually got Carl Gottlieb,
who was a comedy writer actor. You know, he'd been
working on the Odd Couple sitcom and then after Jaws

(17:38):
he went and co wrote the Jerk Chris Steve Martin.
You know, so I think a lot of the humor
in Jaws, you could obviously point to Gottlieb as being
also just as a side note, I don't know, because
I know Gottlieb, like I think he was from here
in LA. Every time there's a street you know that
I drive on every day, Olympic Boulevard, and I passed
like a car dealership, which is like gottlee boto, and

(18:00):
I'm always like relation, I wonder Jaws.

Speaker 7 (18:04):
I think I think that is like, uh, Gottlieb brings
such an amazing thing, such an amazing uh wit and
humor to the movie because there's so many like you know,
my all of my favorite lines in Jaws are like
said by a no name character randomly, and like like

(18:28):
I just get the impression.

Speaker 6 (18:29):
Like that's that's gott Leeb, that's Gottlieb saying, you.

Speaker 7 (18:33):
Know, try try twenty four hours just like three weeks
or you know, like yeah, I don't find that funny.

Speaker 6 (18:41):
I don't find that funny.

Speaker 5 (18:42):
I don't think that's funny at all.

Speaker 3 (18:44):
No, And even like the just the the awful satire
of Murray Hamilton's mayor. You know, it's just like I
see so much comedy in that already right there, you know.

Speaker 1 (18:53):
Sick blazers though he reminded me of like saltwater taffies
that and like Amity anything that's named amity do just
that word brings evil cool.

Speaker 3 (19:05):
Let's go there. Yeah, I bet, I'll bet the the
failed murders were already in the news when they were
shooting this, right or something like that?

Speaker 2 (19:11):
Oh yeah, probably, yeah.

Speaker 3 (19:13):
So who knows, maybe that was in their head, you know,
they've read a produce paper article or something Amityville, Amity Island,
you know, who knows. But yeah, so let's let's I guess,
let's talk about our leads, like who who they got
to play them? You know, I've always been uh enamored
of all of them, really, but you know, obviously Roy

(19:35):
Scheiter as Chief Brody in a role that, like hmm,
could have been played by a lot of leading men
of the time and would have still come off pretty decently.
It's not like a tough role per se. But I
really appreciate what Schier's able to bring to it because
I know that Spielberg was worried about casting him because
of French connection, which you know, even though Gene Hackman

(19:55):
won the Oscar for that, you know, Shiter was his partner,
Sonny Grosso, and like you know, they were like the
tough guys in New York City, and so he was
worried he was going to be like that again where
it's like it's another cop roll sort of thing. But
Shadow really does bring this sort of more tender, almost
like vulnerable fatherly you know, aspect to this. What do
you guys think?

Speaker 6 (20:15):
I agree with you one hundred percent.

Speaker 5 (20:17):
They really do kind of lean into that that like
phobia of his. He doesn't go in the water, you know,
Harry says, we all know about you, chief, you don't
go in the water.

Speaker 6 (20:27):
Do I mean?

Speaker 5 (20:27):
There is from the get go, there's sort of the
even his first line, right is the sun used to
shine in here, the sun didn't use there's just something
sort of like damaged about him or you know, and
I don't mean this pejority of like weak, you know,
just something that's like he's still in process. He's still
there as kind of a broken man or something. We
can't quite figure out what that would have been.

Speaker 3 (20:48):
No, I love what you just said there, Steve, because
I feel like so much of the key to his
character and also his how greatest performance is in this
And I would also argue Jaws too, But certainly this
is how this is a movie actually about a chizmo
about masculinity and about you know, fighting on the seas
and that sort of thing. And you have somebody on
the one hand, like Dreyfus, who is you would assume

(21:10):
like weak because he's the nerdy guy. But like Dreyfus,
as we were kind of talking about off Mike earlier,
like he's kind of a bastard, right, you know, he's
kind of like, you know, he's a little spitfire. And
then on the other hand, of course, you have Robert Shaw,
who's like, you know, just the living embodiment of classic
masculinity sort of idea. So Shider finding his own wavelength
in between those two is pretty impressive.

Speaker 5 (21:31):
And before I just don't want to miss this point.
It was something I we've been talking about how many
times we've seen this, something that really hit me yesterday
watching it. Was that moment when they're I know, I'm
sort of jumping ahead in the film, but when they're
the big beautiful chase sequence when they're running after him,
and that gorgeous you know music is playing underneath, and
I don't know that I'd ever really clocked it before.

(21:51):
But to talk about what you say, within the craziness
of this movie, that they find this moment where Brody
is smiling as they're chasing after me, It's like, you
see this joy in the midst of all of this
terror and the being on the water where he's smiling
at the beauty of whatever this moment is that he's
caught up in where he forgets all of that other stuff.

(22:13):
For like Spielberg, for whoever to have clocked that throughout
that this whole crazy movie, to give us that little
exactly what you're talking about, where he finds he find
he finally comes into himself and can be his own
person in the world. Was that really after I don't know,
you know, a hundred times, watching this movie really hit
me for the first time last night.

Speaker 2 (22:30):
I love that.

Speaker 1 (22:32):
The music gets me every time with this because it
just to me it doesn't fit, but it makes it
that adventure, like, horrifying things are happening, and it's like.

Speaker 2 (22:43):
And you're like, what the fuck are you.

Speaker 1 (22:44):
Doing, John Williams, because you have this horrifying theme, which
is the simplest you know music notes ever. It's just done, done,
everybody knows it. It's the most famous thing. But then
it's kind of like Poltergeist does it a little bit too,
and the music's just like really happy shit's happening, but
it is not what's happening. But it makes that it
has that adventure thing, and you're kind of like with them,

(23:05):
you're smiling and having a good time, and you're like,
wait a minute, this isn't fun.

Speaker 3 (23:09):
Yeah, well it's not. It's not only counterpoint, but it's
also a very smart choice on their part, because if
your adrenaline is already up from a fear factor, it's
not it's a lateral move to take that adrenaline and
be like you're scared, oh, actually you're excited, you know
sort of thing, and it's pretty smart that way. So
dreyfus So Hooper, what do we think of him?

Speaker 7 (23:28):
I mean, I think in retrospect, looking at it like this,
the cast is perfect, like the everyone you know is perfect,
especially the all the unnamed non actors who play background roles.
But like you were saying, I think uh Shier's like
vulnerability and like not like overly macho take on it is.

Speaker 6 (23:52):
He's like he's the lead of an action.

Speaker 7 (23:53):
He doesn't really like do anything like badass I mean,
really blows the shark up at the end spoiler. But
you know he's not like, you know, a tough, tough guy.
He's just like kind of like a yeah, there's like
that that brokenness and like the scene with the with
his son, I mean, give us a kiss? Why because

(24:14):
I need it. It's like he's something that struck me
on this view is like the masculine tenderness that is
between the three guys, like the scene where you know,
Hooper's going down in the in the cage and uh
Brody like taps him on the head and takes his
glasses and then like holds his glasses in his mouth,

(24:36):
which is like a kind of like a like a
weird thing, you know. But it's also like, oh, they're
like they're they're buddies, you know, they're close. They're like
not afraid to like touch each other and and and
uh show that kind of like affection and and whatever like.

Speaker 5 (24:53):
As men, you know, Quint saying Quint when when he
pulls the wrong rope and the tanks fall over, and
then Quint has but has the beautiful it's really a
beautiful moment of saying, hey, chief, next time, just tell me,
I'll tell you which rope to put. Yeah, like, yeah,
that's an amazing little, just little thing right that that
tells us so much about these guys we need. It's
such a spare, spare, you know, storytelling moment.

Speaker 6 (25:14):
But beautiful. Yeah, it's yeah, I couldn't agree more.

Speaker 7 (25:19):
But and I think you know, they're all like perfect
in their roles as they are on the screen. But like,
you know, going back to the book again, in the book,
Hooper is supposed to be this like Adonis, this like
you know, like ripped muscly like you know, cool guy, which.

Speaker 6 (25:40):
You know, Dreyfus is a cool guy, but he's not like.

Speaker 7 (25:42):
A big blonde haired like abbed like like that's I
think they describe him in the book as like a
like having like a swimmer's physique and stuff like that.
So it is like any you know, Dreyfus is perfect,
but it is like an interesting kind of you know
flip on that uh that that casting choice.

Speaker 5 (26:02):
You're so right, And it reminds me that in the
book Brody, remember from like the Get Go, has it
out for Hooper. Yes, he doesn't trust him the from
the from the Jump, whereas in this the instant he
sees him, he said, oh, I'm Brody, I'm Brody. Thank
you know. It's they completely flip that relationship.

Speaker 3 (26:19):
Yeah, and it serves and we'll get into this later.
I'm sure it serves into the ending of course, where
it's like, you know, you have this more you know,
sort of romance kind of ending than you would have
normally even in the original version of the script. I
think I think Spielberg was certainly inspired by watching Dreyfus
in American Graffiti, because in American Graffiti, Dreyfus is playing

(26:41):
not a jock, but like, you know kind of I mean,
that's an ensemble movie, so there's lots of characters to
identify with, but you know, in contrast to say Harrison
Ford's jock in that movie, Dreyfus is like the every
man sort of like, oh, I hope he gets laid,
sort of sort of guy, you know, the guy that
you you sort of see as almost an alter ego
of male virility or something like that. So I think

(27:02):
Spielberg was seeing a lot of himself in Dreyfus as
a person, as a as a performer, in terms of
the persona he could bring to the screen. And I
know that he's said about making Jaws and casting him
as Hooper, like, oh, this guy's like my alter ego
on you know, if any of these guys are sort
of thing. And I was gonna bring this up later,
but screw it, I'll bring it up now. There has

(27:23):
been such an awakening for me as a film critic,
as a film historian after seeing the Fablements in terms
of looking at Steven Spielberg's career. And it's funny because
every one of his movies not you know, maybe some
more than others, but every one of them has you know,
daddy issues or issues with you know, family relations, sort

(27:44):
of an absentee father or a father figure who's you know,
maybe not the best, or someone who's gonna be taken
away by somebody else sort of thing, or is gonna
leave and the mom's gonna problem all that sort of stuff,
And I think in Jaws, you know, obviously there's a
little bit of strife in terms of the Brodie family
regarding you know, Brodie's safety and protecting his children and
all that sort of thing. But I feel like the

(28:06):
meat of the of the fableman's esque, you know, material
in Jaws is probably a little bit between the three
men where you know, Hooper is the middle child between
Quinn and and Brody. And also because the thing that's
gonna tear their family apart is Jaws. So Seth broken
is Jaws. That's what I'm saying.

Speaker 5 (28:32):
When do we talk about when do we talk about
the play that Mark and I saw?

Speaker 6 (28:36):
Is that?

Speaker 3 (28:36):
Is this.

Speaker 2 (28:39):
We're getting to to Sean now soon? Now? It would be a.

Speaker 3 (28:42):
Perfect about Saw because yeah, sounds like me or a
heart it off podcast shut And I'm like that that
was fine, right, it came out great, I've nailed it.
Let me tell you what I saw. I feel like
when I saw From Russia with Love and so Rubbershaw
in that movie is Red grayt I was like, that's
the same guy. Ye are you kidding me? Because like

(29:04):
Shaw in Jaws is so quintessential, and I just came
up with that, so thank you very much. Uh, it's
it's it's one of the most superlative characters on screen
maybe ever, you know, just like you can't think of it.
I mean, God bless anybody who's played a fisherman since,
you know, because you have to compete with him.

Speaker 6 (29:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (29:27):
That, and he was learning from the locals, right, there's
the one guy who is like and you see him
in the film and he's like hooked onto him. He's like,
teach me everything, show me what's up. Let's drink a
lot of whiskey.

Speaker 6 (29:37):
Yeah, it's the guy, the guy who plays Ben Gardner.

Speaker 3 (29:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (29:42):
Yeah, he's so good.

Speaker 7 (29:45):
And the accent is so people didn't talk like that
before the movie.

Speaker 6 (29:50):
But afterwards they started talking that way. That was that act.

Speaker 7 (29:55):
He started that accent, and I remember he's so good
and and just like his ability to like just drunkenly
keep talking for for like, I know we've talked to
that before that when they're loading up the boat and
Ellen and Uh and Brody are are talking and he

(30:19):
is just non stop talking shit in the background, he's
just like, you know, working in like what do you
call him? The dirty Poems and Uh, what are those
things called lymericks?

Speaker 6 (30:31):
There you go?

Speaker 7 (30:32):
Uh and just non stop talking. I remember one of
the times when when Steve and I watched it, we were.

Speaker 6 (30:38):
Like, what is he saying? What?

Speaker 2 (30:41):
You can't.

Speaker 7 (30:43):
We turned on the subtitles and like we still even
like with the words there, we couldn't like figure out
what was happening.

Speaker 6 (30:49):
It was just like incredible.

Speaker 1 (30:52):
But I think that's what I noticed a lot this
rewatch is I was really paying attention to what he
was saying and trying to figure I was like, he
didn't say anything, but isn't incredible.

Speaker 5 (31:01):
As as actors, you sometimes you're given that. It just
really separates. Not only would a brilliant, genius actor he
is in every facet, but to be able to do that,
which is improv in character with the idea that you
have to kind of propel this scene, you have to
keep your It creates the world, right, It makes us

(31:21):
understand that there and and not just like a one
liner or a joke. It's this energy that they're going
to that he's going to be carrying off right, Like
she's she's sending her husband off with this lunatic and
has no idea. So he just has to keep this
thing going. To do that without without taking a breath
for like two and a half minutes. It's unbelievable. It

(31:42):
just you know, there's like no bottom to his embodiment
of that character. He is so in that guy that
you could just you could just go for a month
doing that. Unbelievable.

Speaker 2 (31:53):
And so how was his son doing the play?

Speaker 6 (31:56):
Amazing?

Speaker 5 (31:56):
What do we say, Mark, We should so we should
say where if nobody knows we're talking about this play,
The Shark is Broken, written by Robert Shaw's son, Ian Shaw,
and we saw it on Broadway two years ago, I
think twenty twenty three. I think that's when. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
And it was I'll speak for myself. I'll go first.

(32:19):
It was extraordinary. Now you you would you might be
forgiven if the creators and the cast, if it was
simply like a fans service. Oh, we're going to tell
a bunch of jokes that we all know about the
history of Jaws, and that you get into the theater
and kind of a cutaway version of the Orcas on
stage and a very brilliant use of projections. The back

(32:41):
was sort of this psych that had the ocean projected
on it and kind of moved throughout the whole thing.
You know that the image of water moved, so you
really got this sense that the whole time we felt
like we were moving along that unease of being on
the what you know, there's all kids of metaphors here,
but it was a really gripping movie play about we're

(33:01):
talking a lot about masculinity, about fathers and sons, like
a meditation on that, and so what a crazy meta
thing to have Ian Shaw playing who lost his father
to alcohol, playing his father who lost his father to alcohol,
and talking as his father about his relationship with this fight.
It was you know, all of these layers to this

(33:23):
thing that was really incredible.

Speaker 7 (33:25):
Yeah, it was so surprisingly moving. I think even if
you had like have never seen Jaws or don't like
Jaws and you have like something wrong with you, that
play is still like there's still so much there, Like
you know, like you said about like fathers and sons

(33:46):
in masculinity and like like what acting is like and
what like. Yeah, there's so much there, uh in that
in that play is and yeah.

Speaker 5 (33:55):
So Alex Brightman was was unbelievable as Dreyfuss. It was
like you, I mean every breath was something that you know,
I guess it's interesting, right, what we're seeing on stage
is a bit of an amalgam of like the stories
from real life and our images of them in the movies.
So like, when I think back on it, Brightman's portrayal

(34:19):
is very much like it's what we're seeing is all
the stuff behind the scenes. We're rarely ever seeing any
any of the action of the movie. We're just seeing them,
you know. The idea is that it's this long everything
that they were doing while they were waiting for the
shark to get working because the shark was broken, right.

Speaker 3 (34:35):
Which is already such a great like riff on waiting
for goodo or something like that.

Speaker 5 (34:39):
Yes, yes, and that really was. And so like you're saying, Mark,
I mean, one of my favorite parts of it because
I love Harold Pinter and Shaw had worked famously a
lot with Pinter. If I have one, like time Machine
Broadway production would be the original production of The Caretaker
with Robert Shaw, Donald Pleasants, and Alan Bates, which to
me just seems like, oh my god, must have.

Speaker 3 (34:57):
Been By the way, if you haven't seen William Freakin's
The Birthday Party, all right, right, yes, phenomenal.

Speaker 5 (35:03):
But they Yeah, there's the sequence where even if you
don't know who Harold Pinter is, and if you haven't
gotten away, if you didn't go to the hard school
in the early two thousands and didn't get like Mark
and I didn't didn't get to work on pinter plays
and viewpoints class, you know that he's a real hard
ass and you know that. So there's a scene where
Dreyfus is really wants to be a serious actor and

(35:24):
he wants to do theater, and he wants to go
to London. He wants to work with Harold Pinter and
Robert you know, you know Pinter, can't you introduce me
to him? And so then there is this great sequence
where Robert Shaw is telling Dreyfus how to get in
touch with Harold Pinter, and you know that everything that
he's telling to do is going to get him blacklisted
from ever working with Harrold like like he loves to
be called at five in the morning because he's an
early riser. Make sure you call him early, make sure

(35:45):
you interrupt this, blah blah blah.

Speaker 4 (35:46):
Yeah, don't take over an answer, yes, yes, And Colin
Dunnell played Schier yeah, and he had like lost all
this weight and been doing kettlebells like eighteen hours a
day to look you know, that's nwi like stringy, Like
his forearms looked like Roy Scheider's forearms.

Speaker 5 (36:03):
It was crazy. It was crazy.

Speaker 3 (36:05):
Yeah, hell yeah.

Speaker 6 (36:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (36:06):
Well it's fun to see, especially Dreyfus and Shaw's relationship.
They're at characters very much imitated what they were doing,
like they were just torturing each other, especially Cheltta and
Dreyfus was just torturing him the entire time. And I
always hate this scene when he puts the oh yeah
gloves in his mouth.

Speaker 2 (36:24):
It makes me I'm like, what were you doing with those?
But I do because he's got nothing to say.

Speaker 3 (36:29):
Yeah, I just realized. Yeah, the Dreyfus and Shaw conflict
is literally what about Bob totally.

Speaker 2 (36:37):
Yeah, he was prepared for it.

Speaker 3 (36:39):
Yeah, Bob was drunk. Bob was yeah instead of Bill
Murray sarcasm. Yeah, it's it's Rubbertshaw's you know, there was a.

Speaker 2 (36:47):
Shark coming to get you and you know, and Bob
was like, I'm gonna have writ that right out.

Speaker 6 (36:52):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (36:54):
Oh I love the scene when he answers the radio
when Brodie's wife is so good.

Speaker 2 (36:58):
It's just ten seconds. He's like, no, no, no, no, no, I
got this. I can take this call.

Speaker 6 (37:01):
Yeah, got some blue girls. Have them for a dinner time.

Speaker 3 (37:08):
Yeah. So I want to talk about since we're already
talking about Shaw, we're talking about acting, we're talking about
depth and masculinity and just the writing, and it's the
Indianapolis Monologue. I want to talk about that shit right
here because there's a little bit of you know, Hollywood
lore legend about who exactly was responsible for writing this monologue?

(37:33):
Was it Shaw, you know, writing it offset or kind
of improvising? Was it, uh, you know, Gottlieb was it?

Speaker 5 (37:41):
Uh?

Speaker 3 (37:42):
You know the playwright whose name I just literally Scott Tackler?
Was it John Millius h who was friendly with Spielberg
and you know later would have go on to co
write nineteen forty one for him. What do you guys think?
Because I mean, ultimately the answer it doesn't matter because
it's a masterpiece no matter who brought it to life.
But do you guys have a theory? Do you guys

(38:03):
what do you think about that whole business?

Speaker 7 (38:05):
I mean, I think it is kind of just like
what you just said, it's like a child of many
you know parents, Like there was so many rewrites, so
many people, you know, but from Benchley, Gottlieb, you know, Sackler, Milius,
like and and I do think maybe just because I

(38:26):
want to believe that like that, then Shaw kind of
like really took it and made it his own in
those because that's like the story, right that he said
like all right, like let me, let me work on this,
and then he did a bunch of rewrites and that's
how we got it.

Speaker 5 (38:44):
It's like it's like any great Shakespeare thing, right. You know,
there's some schools that say if Shakespeare was a guy
who wrote all these plays, and then there are other
people think, well, no, it was several of these people.

Speaker 6 (38:54):
It was.

Speaker 5 (38:55):
It was a group of people that put all this together.
And at the end of the day, who who gives
a shit? It is so extraordinary in the moment and
could only be delivered in that way by that one
person in that in that moment. Oh, can we talk
about that Indianapolis moment in the play? Do you remember
what happened mark the night that we were there, because
we saw it like the second I think we saw

(39:15):
like the second preview or something. We saw it early on.
Do you remember what happened right before his monologue?

Speaker 6 (39:21):
What happened? What happened?

Speaker 5 (39:22):
Tell them what happened. So Mark probably doesn't actually remember.
He's just lying in that, you know that they clear
it's leading up to that part of the play is like,
we have to get this monologue done. We have to
get this monologue done. So, of course, spoiler alert, the
play ends. I'm getting chills just talking about it because
it was It's one of my favorite moments ever in

(39:43):
a theater. I may start crying talk about this because
it was so incredible to see his son doing this.
But on that second preview is there's still it's fun
to go see shows and previews because they're still working
things out. You can see the actors finding their footing
that you know, and they've got the set the orca
there is like a replica, you know, looks every the
red seats everything, and that lamp. Brightman moved into position

(40:08):
and the lamp came off of its hook. It like bent,
you know, like beyond recognition, and so poor Brightman has
to hold He didn't quite know what to do, so
he couldn't leave it on the table because the light
wouldn't be on his face. So in in live theater,
in the moment, we'll just do it, he had to
kind of hold the lamp for the entire monologue, and

(40:31):
so you could tell everyone there was kind of, you know,
one of those great moments in the theater with the
audience goes like like that, like oh, what are they
gonna do? And then he just did it. And as
soon as Shaw started in on that monologue, everything else
went away and he just it is It was like
a breath for breath recreation of that, like like the
soul of his father coming through to deliver that monologue

(40:52):
as this. Ugh, I'll never forget. It was just so
so beautiful.

Speaker 1 (40:57):
Yeah, it was interesting you bring that up because I've
feel like this time when you watch a movie, when
you're doing a podcast, you're looking at everything. You're like, okay,
I'm one to see things I've never noticed before. I
honest to god, for hundreds of times I've seen this movie.
Never noticed how close they were to shore when they're
pretending to be out to see how often you see
the shoreline when they're filming, Because you don't give a shit.

(41:20):
You're so engaged in what's happening, what they're saying, what's
going on with the barrels in the ocean in this
that you don't even notice that you're like, oh, wait,
the shoreline is literally right there many times because even
if you're looking for it, you don't care because you're
so enthralled with what's going on. And I feel like
that's it's interesting that it's bleeding over into the play
and it's just such good work that the little things,

(41:43):
the flaws, they don't matter, which is kind of like
the whole thing for this movie, Like the barrels wouldn't
even be there if the goddamn shark didn't work right.

Speaker 3 (41:52):
No, yeah, a real bitch, there's a real alchemical magic.

Speaker 6 (41:57):
Two.

Speaker 3 (41:57):
I would argue all of cinema, but certainly lead this
movie in particular. Even to the point where what I
was going to say about the Indianapolis monologue is that
for someone like myself, who just a couple of minutes
ago said this movie doesn't really scare me that much,
it's that monologue that gives me the most chills because
of the concept of you know what, what Point's describing
in terms of his predicament after the sinking of the Indianapolis,

(42:20):
and not only did you just lose your ship, you
lost so many of your crewmates. You're in the midst
of this hectic war, but now you're in this environment
where you're easily could be and probably will be devoured
alive by things you can't even see because it's a
pitch black night out. You know, that scenario in my
mind gives me more you know, not nightmares per se,

(42:40):
but you know, nightmare of fuel than anything else really
because it's it's just so powerful.

Speaker 5 (42:46):
I'm sorry, go ahead, no, you go ahead. But you
were talking about like who did it? What do we think?
I mean, there's those little side moments, the little kind
of they feel like improv and you know, there's something
about like, uh, when he says that line baseball player. Both, yeah,
just there is that line baseball player. That detail to
me always sticks out, maybe because I love baseball, but

(43:09):
there's something. And then he says he talks about the pilot,
seeing the pilot and knowing that he's a young man. Yeah,
he says, like not quite as young as mister Hooper here, Yeah,
that little you know, not quite as young as mister
Hooper here about it, James, mister Hooper. Anyway, those little
things are like this is not this is not a
made up thing. This is like a real thing that
happened to this terrifying.

Speaker 1 (43:29):
Yeah, the waiting him being like the scariest part was
waiting to get picked up because you were just waiting
for the shark to come out and get you.

Speaker 2 (43:37):
Dark eyes, dull eyes.

Speaker 8 (43:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (43:39):
Another one of those little details he says when he
talks about like them like forming up and like like
you see and on a calendar with one of them
old Napoleonic battle Like what a like weird cool, like
seemingly random detail that makes it feel so real.

Speaker 3 (44:00):
Yeah. Oh and by the way, Ash, what you just
quoted the dollars bit dollars dollars to donuts. John Carpenter
was taking note when he's like Michael Myers the blackest
eyes the Devil's eyes for true just two years later.

Speaker 1 (44:13):
Yeah, and what an amazing improv line, like one of
the most iconic lines. Everybody knows that line and improv.
They're all sitting in Steven's bungalow just working out the
next day stuff.

Speaker 2 (44:25):
It's that's so fun. It just makes you want.

Speaker 1 (44:27):
To do film like we've all done acting, everybody here
on this little panel, and just that the creativity of
being like, Okay, let's get up in the morning, let's
all figure out how we're going to keep it going
because we can't film right now because the goddamn shark's
not working, so we have to keep figuring things out
to do on land and get everything done.

Speaker 3 (44:46):
But yeah, like it's so funny too, story and let's
just let's bring it back to like the entirety of
you know, the creature feature horror monster movie genre. It
really was conventional wisdom for so many years before Jaws
to show your creature. And that's why, unfortunately, certainly during
the nineteen fifties, when you had man in suit quite

(45:06):
a lot, whether it was you know, the Japanese Godzilla films,
the Kaiju films, or you know, whatever King Kong knockoff
they were making at one ever point, you know, people
used to become a nerd to that where it's like, oh,
it's clearly a man in a suit. Haha, HAA, let's
laugh at it. And you know, for all intents and purposes,
Jaws was intended to be another one of those films,
not a man in suit ever, but you know, we're

(45:27):
going to show the shark as much as possible, blah
blah blah, and the necessity of having to pull way
back on that then suddenly became the industry standard, you know,
for making a creature feature, horror film, whatever, you know,
even you know, just as recently as Alien you know,
would happen in a couple of years later, which we've
talked about on this show before. It's it just became

(45:49):
the conventional wisdom, like just don't show it that much
and it works like Gangbusters.

Speaker 6 (45:53):
You know.

Speaker 5 (45:53):
It's funny when you when you look back on when
you see like everyone talking is Xanak and Brown and
people who were associated with the film, there is this
I mean, nobody has hidden the fact that this thing
was a nightmare and nothing went the way it planned.
But there is also what I love is seeing all
these guys somewhat taking credit for the revolution. You know,
of course they created this thing, but the revolution that

(46:14):
came afterwards. But there's this little bit of like, didn't
we do an amazing job changing the world of cinema?
This thing we did where we made the movie where
you don't see the shark, and I like you're really saying, well,
we got to make sure we take credit for all
the things that happened instead of saying it was just
this accident that anyone could have, you know, anywhere, would
have happened, falling off.

Speaker 1 (46:34):
Of the boats and this and that, and then like
the one day it's working. Everyone's like, the Shark is working.

Speaker 2 (46:38):
Go go, go, go, go everything as fast as you can.

Speaker 5 (46:41):
And I think that they've said that anything that you
see with the Shark is basically every virtually every bit
of footage that they got. They used everything that they could.
You know, I don't think there was too much left
on the table because they had so little that they
could actually work with.

Speaker 1 (46:54):
Well, it's funny to watch the scene where Brodie's throwing
the chum in like the first time we actually really
see the shark out of the water, And if if
you really watch it, you can tell that there's something
weird going on there because not only does it roar,
it's like.

Speaker 2 (47:06):
And you're like, sharks don't do that.

Speaker 7 (47:08):
They didn't before the movie, but after the movie they
started doing it.

Speaker 3 (47:16):
Shout out the work of Ron and Valerie Taylor shooting
the real sharks that they did in Australia because obviously
that lends a little bit more authenticity to the you know,
it's not a ton of footage that they.

Speaker 2 (47:29):
Use others more shark getting stuck.

Speaker 7 (47:31):
Yeah, start getting stuck well, and that that brings up another.

Speaker 6 (47:37):
Difference from the book.

Speaker 8 (47:39):
Uh.

Speaker 7 (47:40):
In the book, the shark goes into the cage and
pulls Hooper out and eats him, uh, going so far
as to come up out of the water with Hooper
in its mouth and taunt the people on the boat.

Speaker 6 (47:55):
And then Brody shoots Hooper in the neck by mistake
a man.

Speaker 2 (48:02):
But I'd be like shooting.

Speaker 7 (48:10):
But because when they when they were filming that scene
in Australia, they had the you know, the the like
half size cage and they had a guy who was
like four foot two in the cage to make the
shark look bigger.

Speaker 8 (48:27):
Uh.

Speaker 7 (48:28):
But when they were trying to film it with the
with the guy in the cage, the shark was just
you know, swimming around being a normal shark. And then
when they when they got the guy out of the cage,
the shark for some reason just went nuts on the cage.
And that incredible footage they had to use, but it
shows the shark, you know, messing with the cage when

(48:49):
the guy's not in there. So then they were like,
all right, uh, Hooper's gonna live. We're gonna have him,
We're gonna have him hide.

Speaker 3 (48:55):
I love this idea that the shark was like, could
this guy get out of my cage? Because I want
to eat the thing? Yeah?

Speaker 6 (49:00):
Right.

Speaker 7 (49:00):
It's also it's also one of those moments where you say,
I don't care.

Speaker 3 (49:05):
Yeah, totally.

Speaker 7 (49:06):
And it's because like, as I was watching it this time,
I was thinking about it that, like the shark that's
busting this cage has no harpoon stuck in it, you know,
And I remember like that when I was a kid
and just being like, just don't worry about it, just
you know, never mind, it's good, it's fine, it's fine.

Speaker 1 (49:26):
Yeah, Well that's Verna right, Verna Fields. I feel like
she was the magician behind all of what made this movie,
you know, cutting she edited the shit out of this
and made.

Speaker 2 (49:36):
It perfect, absolutely perfect.

Speaker 1 (49:39):
Because yeah, there's nothing scarier like the opening sequence when
she's swimming and you know, you know that there's people
under the water just pulling that girl back and forth.
But the way that she goes under the water, just
that silence all of a sudden, and then just the
water stills. That sticks with you forever that it's horrifying,
because yeah, that's it.

Speaker 2 (49:58):
That's it.

Speaker 5 (49:59):
And then the cut, like the next cut to the
guy passed out on the on the beach with that
beautiful like sunrise in the back. It just yeah, all
those all those cuts so perfect.

Speaker 1 (50:08):
Yeah, the dinging of the the booie, it just it's
it's all very nostalgic and real. And then that's what
sets this movie apart from other things like Alien or
you know, the Exorcist, because this could happen, and it
does happen, and it's happened before and it will happen again.
Sharks accidentally be eat people. I say accidentally because I

(50:30):
don't think they like to eat us.

Speaker 2 (50:31):
I don't know. That's what the Discovery Channel says. And
it's always like a mistake.

Speaker 3 (50:36):
They do a week every year on Sharks.

Speaker 2 (50:38):
Yeah, oh my god, who loves shark.

Speaker 1 (50:40):
We I used to watch so we would go diving
in the keys a lot, and I was always terrified.
And that's the thing about this movie is like it
sticks with you for everything, like you're just looking left,
looking right, looking around, looking around. You can't just really
relax and enjoy yourselves because there is this back fear
I had, like the Jaws towel, even just sitting on

(51:00):
the beach and looking at that and then going into
the water, I would freak myself out.

Speaker 3 (51:05):
Yeah, well, yeah, there's there's such a distinct terror too,
Susan Backliney's opening kill being how lonely it is and
you know, isolated and you know no one's around to help,
versus the Kittner boys eaten in the middle of you know,
the height of Fourth of July festivities. Awesome, surrounded by
millions of people.

Speaker 1 (51:25):
Yeah, I'm sure you've all seen the stills of what
that scene looked like when the shark actually did But
now do you think that should have been kept in
the movie, because watching it this time sometimes I'm like,
because you do see the shark turn over a little bit,
But I kind of I feel like that would have
been if it would have worked, or it did work,
I don't know why they didn't keep it in the movie.

Speaker 2 (51:45):
That would have been awesome.

Speaker 6 (51:48):
That that might have that might have gotten them out
of PG.

Speaker 3 (51:52):
Yeah, it might have.

Speaker 6 (51:53):
Like the fact that this movie is PG is ridiculous.

Speaker 2 (51:57):
It's true. Crazy thirteen didn't come around until eighty.

Speaker 3 (52:00):
Four, right, so there was.

Speaker 7 (52:03):
Yeah, but I mean, I don't know, it's it's got
to be one of the scariest PG movies of all time.
But also I think like the way you just see
the shark roll over uh in that scene, I think
it's perfect like that because it's it is it is
that moment, like what is that?

Speaker 6 (52:19):
You know, like like.

Speaker 7 (52:22):
You like you see Brody's reaction, like people like everyone
just kind of stops for a second because it's like
and I've I've seen a shark do that in the water,
and it's just like this completely like alien creature, you know,
so big even like you know, the sharks supposed to
be twenty five feet long. And I do think there

(52:43):
are like diminishing returns with like how scary something is
and how big it get. Like Meg stopped being scary
to me because like the sharks the size of a bus.
Why is it's it'll be like me chasing a sour
patch kid, you know, like why.

Speaker 6 (52:58):
Yeah, you write.

Speaker 5 (53:00):
A record for the record when we both lived in
a story of my wife and I were walking on
the street and we came across Mark as you happen
to do, and he wrapped me in one of his
typical Mark hugs. And then as we as we ended
our conversation walked away, my wife whispered sweetly in my ear.
He makes you look down right, tiny.

Speaker 6 (53:20):
It was very cute.

Speaker 5 (53:22):
It was so cute.

Speaker 2 (53:23):
Mark, cue Tiny. Oh, I'm just a little girl.

Speaker 7 (53:28):
But like, like I I did a dumb like dolphin
swim and dolphins thing.

Speaker 2 (53:34):
You know it's not dumb.

Speaker 1 (53:37):
Well, did it try to have sex with you?

Speaker 6 (53:40):
No, that's why I was dumb.

Speaker 5 (53:41):
That's why I was just wanting you didn't get it.

Speaker 6 (53:43):
None of those dolphins came on to.

Speaker 1 (53:44):
Meeting this water unless you jerk me off.

Speaker 6 (53:50):
Where'd you get a knife?

Speaker 7 (53:52):
But just being next to a dolphin, like there's something
like kind of just scary being next to like something
that big in the water. And these things are you know,
dolphins like what five feet long? That's very big when
you're next to it in the water. So like to
see something that's twenty five.

Speaker 6 (54:13):
Feet long like that, Just I love that scene.

Speaker 2 (54:17):
That's it. When you die like diving, they're like, oh,
nurse sharks, they're so nice, fuck off, I'm out of
the water. And even when you're diving, when all of.

Speaker 1 (54:25):
A sudden you notice that all the fish are gone,
and you're like, wait, wait a minute.

Speaker 2 (54:29):
I'm out of here. I would get out of the
water every time because I don't care. I'm out. I'm out.
It's not what I want.

Speaker 5 (54:36):
I will say watching watching this movie as a dad,
that kinderscene messed me up this time. Oh yeah, that
was in a way that I don't think I've like,
I know this movie, I know what's gonna happen, all right,
I know it's fake. That that that jacked me up.
And maybe maybe I went to the place of because
I'm making everything about me as like a parent, that

(54:57):
that simple thing of like you you're enjoying a day,
you go ahead and play, and then you couldn't protect
your child. You know, there's a there's like a whole
other level of that which you know, as h viewing
of this, you bring something, you bring your different lived
experience to it. I was like, oh my god, that
right nailed me.

Speaker 3 (55:12):
Yeah, am I wrong? Because I don't have a citation
for this, But did did Spielberg say somewhere that you
know that moment in particular, was something he might consider
doing differently if he made it after he became a father.

Speaker 6 (55:23):
You know, I think I remember hearing that.

Speaker 3 (55:25):
Do you remember hear seeing not?

Speaker 2 (55:27):
Because I mean, like you know, I think he went
out for.

Speaker 3 (55:29):
Piven, think right. I think he was saying, like, it's
a good thing he made it when he did, because.

Speaker 2 (55:35):
Because he wouldn't have done it there.

Speaker 3 (55:36):
He probably yeah, probably with.

Speaker 2 (55:38):
That ninety six year old mom.

Speaker 1 (55:39):
And you feel for her and you feel so bad
for Brody because I mean, she takes it all out
on him. And I just know if I was him,
I would have been, like it was him, go smack
his ass. This one right here with the fucking anchors
on his blazer. He did it and he but he
doesn't and you know, he just takes it and he
takes it in and he makes it like I Am
going to stop this shark.

Speaker 2 (56:00):
And he's from New York City. He's from like the city.
He's at the Khakis and Macakey's or whatever practice in
wherever this is supposed to be.

Speaker 3 (56:10):
I'm glad you brought him up because I definitely want
to hit him. Murray Hamilton as the mayor one of
my favorite one of my yeah, one of my favorite
jokes in the twenty sixteen Ghostbusters is when Andy Garcia
is like, never compare me to the Jaws of may Never.
Oh my god, because it's so true that the mayor
from Jaws, played by Murray Hamilton, God bless him, is

(56:31):
one of the most odious caricatures or characters or portrayals
of pure capitalist bureaucracy that you'll ever see, where it's
just it's not the fact that he because you've you've
seen you know, lots of instances of characters in real
life and in movies and television where it's just your ignorance,

(56:51):
you know, where it's like they don't they don't know,
they're not being informed, they're just assuming, they're hoping blah
blah blah. It's it's great that Spielberg and company go
to such great pains to demonstrate no, no, no, this guy's
very well informed. You know, he's very on the he's
definitely up on things about the experts telling him this
is going to happen, this is very likely to happen.
Don't do this and just ignoring it because.

Speaker 2 (57:14):
They getting the corner to lie. I love watching the
corner's face.

Speaker 1 (57:18):
When Hooper comes in for the first time and looks
at that I don't know, like tray of the remains,
He's like, this is not a goddamn boat accident.

Speaker 2 (57:25):
And the guy's like, shit, the whole town.

Speaker 1 (57:29):
But you do also kind of feel for the town,
because I do understand, like a seaside town. If you
shut down the beach, you shut down their money and
their livelihood. And they're like, well, what's a couple of kids.
You know, I need to keep my bed and breakfast
growing three weeks.

Speaker 6 (57:44):
It's like three weeks murray him.

Speaker 7 (57:47):
It is that pure, yeah, beautiful portrayal of the you know,
surplus killing horrible animal that is capitalism. But he also
has like you know the scene in the hospital. Yeah, yeah,
And one thing I noticed this time that.

Speaker 6 (58:08):
I never the hospital.

Speaker 2 (58:09):
I love the seventies.

Speaker 7 (58:10):
I never noticed this before in the scene before that,
when in the paint Happy Bastard scene he's holding a
fake cigarette.

Speaker 6 (58:19):
Is it yeah again right, yeah, yeah, He's.

Speaker 7 (58:21):
Like I think maybe it was like you know, I remember,
like I think they like made them for like quitting
back in the day, to like help you quit. So
he's like holding the stakes cigarette, like putting in his mouth,
and then in the next scene he's just fucking smoking
in the hospital.

Speaker 5 (58:38):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (58:38):
Yeah, so you see that. He's like.

Speaker 3 (58:41):
I also am a huge fan, unlike some people, of
Spielberg's forty one, mostly because I appreciate the full length
extended version that was originally shot and created, because the
theatrical version is a mess. But it's great to watch
Murray Hamilton in that movie be a completely different character,
be so comedic in his uh you know, straight man

(59:02):
to Eddie de'son way that it just makes me appreciate
him in this movie even more, just to see his range.
And you know, I've seen him in another he's been
He was like a he was like a suave spy
in a William Castle film. You know.

Speaker 5 (59:16):
So also one of the best Twilight Zone episodes ever
called Yea the Stars Death And then there's a little
girl gets hit by a car, and so there's an
old guy on the street, amazing character, actor famous, so
I can't think of his name right now. But then
so he's always pitching, and so death shows up and
he's gonna take the girl. But then the pitchman can
see death, I guess because he's getting you the end

(59:37):
of his life, and he says, you know, if I can,
if I can pitch you, if I can sell you,
then he'll take me instead. And by the end of
that episode, you know, Hamilton, I think maybe he's smoking
in that one too, but he's you know, he goes
from this super swave, super you know, in control to
like completely out of his mind.

Speaker 3 (59:52):
Oh great actor, great, great, great actor. And I totally
agree with you Mark what you said in terms of, like,
I think part of what makes him such a consummate,
you know, for me an example of you know, the
worst of capitalism is because he's still demonstrably human. You know,
he's not a robot and he's not you know, some
just completely devoid of a soul person. It's yeah, it's

(01:00:14):
it's you can see the wheels turning in him, even
on that beautiful you know wonder on the ferry where
it's like, oh, you know, you yell Barracuda. Everybody goes, huh, well,
you yell shark. We got a problem on the fourth
to light you know that whole thing.

Speaker 1 (01:00:25):
Yeah, gave you the authority. I'm like, I am the
police chief.

Speaker 3 (01:00:29):
Right, and even just yeah, the way. He just wants
to manipulate the language, you know, which is something we
see a lot of today in terms of like this
word is maybe not so great, but this word's fine.
You know, It's okay. It's still the same meaning, isn't it.
And it's like, well, actually maybe not.

Speaker 9 (01:00:43):
But yeah, since we're we're since we're talking about other folks,
can we can we talk about Lorrange Gerry for a minute.

Speaker 5 (01:00:55):
Can we have a can have a moment for Lorrange Gary.
We're just talking about I've heard her talk about and
maybe Spielberg too, saying that about her improv skills, about
how just as an actor, she has this kind of
natural improt she goes so hard every second that she's
in the the opening, her opening scene, when she's tired

(01:01:16):
and laying on the bed. It's just that this time
captivated me so much. I was like this, there was
not a false breath from this woman the entire movie.

Speaker 2 (01:01:26):
She is trying to get drunk and fool around.

Speaker 5 (01:01:28):
Made up line, made up line. Yeah, and the great
line when Hooper comes in, I'd like to I'd like
to talk to your husband, So would I like those
little things? Oh my god, she is We're talking about
like everybody is perfect and there's nobody. I suppose you know,
there'd be a lot of a lot of actresses back
in the day that you could have been cast in
that role and could have done something, but nobody. This

(01:01:51):
movie isn't what it is without her, that sort of
fierce loyalty to Brody, her sort of like clearly they
like they love to go at it whenever. You know,
she's got a vitality to her, her fierce protection of
her children. Although, can we just bring up one little thing.
She's walking around when the shark goes into the pond.

(01:02:12):
In one second, she's going Michael, Michael, Michael, and then
like thirty seconds later, when Brody's back on there, she goes,
Michael's in the pond, Like, lady, you knew where he was.
Why you're yelling at for that's the entire thing.

Speaker 3 (01:02:24):
I just want to go back to the Fableman's and
say it's it's Isn't it great that young Spielberg very
easily could have put the onus of his family's strife
on his mother and could have used that as any
excuse to be maybe not a full misogynist, but certainly
blame women for you know, behaving a certain way or

(01:02:44):
something like that. But you look at lorink Aery and this,
you look at Terry Garr and Close Encounters, you have
such empathy for these women even though our ostensible protagonists
are still a protagonist, you know, Dreyfus and Close Encounters
and wrote and shied her in this, And we the
audience still fully understandabhre those men are coming from. Why
they have to go off to not war but war
with the shark, or why they have to go off

(01:03:05):
with the aliens, you know. And yet we're still in
the in the mindset enough to appreciate where these women
are coming from, where it's like, no, you're destroying our family,
Like what are you doing? Like like, please take a
step back, because look at what you're doing to us
and what you're doing to me. And yeah, it would
have been very easy to make those women, you know, Oh,
it's it's not fun that when they're around, let's get

(01:03:26):
to the bros like hanging out on the boat, Like
let's let's do that. And yet yeah, to the point
where you know, we're not going to get into it,
but to the point where I'm happy that she comes
back for Jaw's revenge.

Speaker 2 (01:03:38):
Oh my god, listen, I'll give her that problem. The
shark was really fucking pissed at that family.

Speaker 3 (01:03:46):
I get it. Well, this time it was personal.

Speaker 2 (01:03:48):
It's totally personal.

Speaker 1 (01:03:50):
Yeah, my goodness. But my favorite scene with her is,
you know, when she sees the book and the shark,
she's like.

Speaker 2 (01:03:56):
Why are you yelling at him? You just bought him
that little boat.

Speaker 1 (01:03:58):
And he's just sitting in it and he sees it's
just like, Gallowater, just let your.

Speaker 7 (01:04:02):
Father, Michael, I want to know, yes, And and Michael's
accent in that scene is so wild.

Speaker 6 (01:04:11):
He's like, oh, come on, Mark.

Speaker 3 (01:04:13):
Can I say.

Speaker 2 (01:04:15):
From New York?

Speaker 7 (01:04:17):
Kind of like he doesn't sound like that in the
rest of the movie, but he's just that one mind.

Speaker 5 (01:04:25):
Is like I got bit by a vampire?

Speaker 1 (01:04:27):
Like like, did he say he got bit by a vampire?
That's literally in my notes. I never noticed that's what
he's done before.

Speaker 6 (01:04:35):
You know what.

Speaker 3 (01:04:35):
That's my problem with Am of the Island is all
the goddamn vampires.

Speaker 2 (01:04:38):
God damn vampires.

Speaker 3 (01:04:43):
That should have been the ending of the judge totally.

Speaker 6 (01:04:46):
And then the sharks a vampire.

Speaker 3 (01:04:51):
Yeah, that's asylum Blacklister.

Speaker 1 (01:04:53):
I'm sure that kid does that scene so well where
we finally do see the shark for the first time
in the pond, and it is very impactful, and it
it's that I'm always telling at that guy, like leave
those kids alone, dude, that kid didn't those kids didn't
ask for your help, weren't. They didn't like talk to
you at all. And you're like, hey, what's going on
over there? Like you kind of deserved it.

Speaker 7 (01:05:13):
Mind your own business, your fishing price rowboat and get
out the smallest robot.

Speaker 2 (01:05:21):
That's what you're taking the pond.

Speaker 5 (01:05:23):
And I love I love that maybe they fed him
just like one line of sailing terminology, you know, like
pull the cheets, make it fast, Like all right, I
got the word fast, I've got sheets.

Speaker 6 (01:05:36):
All right, there's about to give you guys, okay, And.

Speaker 2 (01:05:39):
Like nobody said that they weren't okay.

Speaker 1 (01:05:42):
You deserve to die and that you just see that
leg go down, Oh my.

Speaker 7 (01:05:46):
God, the first glimpse, first glimpse of the shark and
then that disturbingly realistic looking leg, amazing leg so good.

Speaker 1 (01:05:58):
I would have been afraid to be in the water
with fake shark with Bruce Bruce was very scary.

Speaker 3 (01:06:02):
Yeah, yeah, in Bruce's mouth.

Speaker 1 (01:06:08):
Think so when he was visiting the set because the
thing never worked. He got in there and they were
like taking a picture and it closed down and then
they were like, bye, George, she's like getty high.

Speaker 3 (01:06:17):
George Lucas and seventies was fit as a rail. He
would have gotten stuck in the tree.

Speaker 7 (01:06:22):
That was actually uh that scene too, is another one
that they shot more gruesome.

Speaker 2 (01:06:30):
Yes, they didn't the kid get in the the guy
and then the kid.

Speaker 7 (01:06:35):
Yeah, the shark was supposed to be like coming with
the guy in his mouth and the guy like pushes
a little brodie out of the way, and they shot
it and everything, but they're.

Speaker 6 (01:06:48):
Like, it is a little bit much. We're just gonna
we're gonna do a fly drone shot.

Speaker 5 (01:06:53):
Before the really noticed that. I mean, I've always loved
that that drone shot, whatever that is. But it's such
an interesting choice, isn't it. Usually we're seeing everything, the
shark moving past people in the water, but suddenly it's
this right above, you know, eye level move, which seems
to make like, I don't know, there's something different about
that choice, which maybe was a remnant of something else.

(01:07:15):
But it really works. Whatever it is, it really really
works well.

Speaker 1 (01:07:19):
Knowing that makes that scene make a little bit more
sense because you're like, Okay, all of those kids fell
in the water. Why are you having a little meltdown, Michael,
Why aren't you, like, why are you more shell shocked
than all your friends? You had to get pulled in,
So that scene would have made more sense for why
he had to go to the hospital, But you don't
even think about it because you're like, I would be
the same, I'd probably be my one of my friends,

(01:07:40):
Like you know.

Speaker 7 (01:07:41):
Yeah, oh, I know why he needed to go to
the hospital when his mother is such an incredible diagnoser.

Speaker 3 (01:07:47):
He's dead, Yeah, he's dead. He's dead.

Speaker 1 (01:07:51):
Rub his face in the sand. That was what bothered
me the most, all that sand on his face. That
is so funny. So he just goes right to he's dead.

Speaker 6 (01:07:58):
Yeah. While we're talking about that, that this the hospital
scene too a little bit. I got it. I got
a shout out. One of my.

Speaker 7 (01:08:05):
Favorite favorite things and Steve Doo one of our favorite
things to do in this movie.

Speaker 6 (01:08:10):
Is in that scene.

Speaker 7 (01:08:11):
Count how many times the guy pushing the gurney looks
directly into the camera and I.

Speaker 2 (01:08:18):
Didn't look for that. That's so fun.

Speaker 5 (01:08:20):
It's one of our favorite games. It's our favorite game.

Speaker 7 (01:08:22):
He does it like a like a dozen times, just
like directly.

Speaker 6 (01:08:25):
Into the camera.

Speaker 5 (01:08:26):
And the last one, but.

Speaker 6 (01:08:29):
That's what he actually turns his head to do. It's
it's so good.

Speaker 5 (01:08:32):
Let me get one least one.

Speaker 7 (01:08:33):
He's like, there's no way he's gonna look at the
camera one more time, and then he does it, and
it's like, hell, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:08:39):
That's so awesome.

Speaker 1 (01:08:40):
And that just goes to show like even the little
things in the movie, the little scenes, you're so into
it that you're not noticing all that little stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:08:47):
I've never noticed that. Now I can't wait to go
look for it.

Speaker 6 (01:08:50):
Yeah, it's so fun.

Speaker 5 (01:08:51):
Oh, it's classic.

Speaker 1 (01:08:52):
I actually just watched it with Mystery Science Theater or
with rifftrock. God, I love them and it is a funny.
They do a great job.

Speaker 3 (01:08:59):
It is very I'd love to talk a little bit
another about another scene or a moment that I feel
is impacted not just cinema, but like everyone's kind of lives,
or at least if it hasn't impacted their lives. It's
one that like is such a reflection of life that
everyone before and since have done it, which is the
comparing of scars, you know, where whether it's actual scars

(01:09:22):
that you may have on your body, or if it's tattoos,
if it's some sort of permanent mark, birthmark, what have you.
I mean, the intimacy of that, but the camaraderie of it, right,
the bonding moment, you know, that's a moment where it
doesn't matter. And any friendship that I've ever had, relationship,
what have you? I feel every time there's like a

(01:09:42):
comparison moment, even if it's just verbal, even if it's
just here's what happened to me, Like, it just brings
me right back to on the Orca.

Speaker 7 (01:09:49):
Yeah, and there is also in that scene again there's
that like masculine tenderness between them two, like the way
you know, like they're both just like sitting there like
with their legs on top of each other.

Speaker 2 (01:10:02):
It's like, yeah, yeah, Dy doesn't show his right he
we see.

Speaker 6 (01:10:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (01:10:10):
But you know, like if you if you saw like
two guys sitting like that, you would be like, oh,
those are two like macho guys, Like that's not like
but like they don't care and like that's what makes
them like these macho you know. Yeah, yeah, it's like
that time.

Speaker 5 (01:10:23):
It's like that time in college when I was asleep
on the floor in a dorm room and my buddy
Mark came in, uh, completely ship faced and for some
reason decided to get down on the floor and with
his gorilla legs wrap them around me like a crab
and actually nearly strangled the breath out of me completely.
This is not a joke. I actually started to see

(01:10:45):
spots and couldn't say the words get off of me.
I had to sort of like with my last dying
move my arm like this. This is a true story,
but it was very tender, very.

Speaker 7 (01:10:56):
It was going from the place of love. It.

Speaker 5 (01:11:01):
Yeah, I love the way that that Shaw does that
little tap on the leg when he does that little
like what any of those whatever that moment is, it's
just so you know, it's just so real. You're wearing
a sweater that yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:11:15):
Mm hmm, yeah, there's there's It really does feel like
such a conflation or a blurring of the lines between
the characters and the actors in that moment too. For sure.

Speaker 1 (01:11:25):
Well, that's the cool thing about all these artists being
pushed to their limits in this kind of filming environment
is like something perfect happens. It's like a perfect creative
storm kind of which gives it.

Speaker 2 (01:11:36):
Like gives us all the thing.

Speaker 1 (01:11:37):
Because even Dreyfuss was talking NonStop ship after the movie
came out about how he could only focus on the
bad and then the movie was huge and he was like,
oh shit, I need to like backtrack.

Speaker 7 (01:11:49):
Yeah, I think when people talk about like it's a
you know, pretty famous like story of how you know,
how Shaw was was torturing him.

Speaker 6 (01:11:58):
But I think, you know, Dreyfus is itself admittedly an asshole.

Speaker 8 (01:12:06):
Like he he like had a a technique, an audition technique,
which was to like when he would walk out of
the audition and see everybody else there, just be like,
I totally nailed it.

Speaker 6 (01:12:20):
I just booked this.

Speaker 3 (01:12:22):
You guys, that's a Maxine.

Speaker 6 (01:12:23):
You guys should go home.

Speaker 7 (01:12:24):
Oh yeah, like that like that's like his advice to
like that's what you should do. So like he's not
like a some like easygoing nice guy, you know. Like
so I'm sure there were they were they were coming
at each other, you know.

Speaker 6 (01:12:40):
Yeah, Well, I.

Speaker 1 (01:12:41):
Like the story about how Steven Spielberg doesn't film the
end the last scenes of his movies because he's afraid
that the crew is gonna like do something to him, which.

Speaker 2 (01:12:49):
Is really weird.

Speaker 1 (01:12:50):
And he was on the plane with Dreyfus going back
to LA and he's like, wait a minute, when are
they filming the shark exploding scene?

Speaker 2 (01:12:55):
Which you would think you would want to film that shot.
That's the coolest shot on the you know, in the movie.
And he was just like, they're gonna push me in
the water. I'm not doing it.

Speaker 3 (01:13:06):
What by the way, I don't know if he's kept
up that tradition to this day. I feel like he
dropped it sometime, but yeah, certainly I think that for
this movie he was like, I'm getting out of there
because they're probably gonna kill me.

Speaker 6 (01:13:16):
Yeah, it could be a shark in the water.

Speaker 3 (01:13:18):
There could be a shark in the water. And yeah,
just in just the lovely tenderness that since we're talking
about male tenderness of the ending of those final moments
of like sharing a raft back to shore and letting
that play out throughout the end credits, you know, is
such a great Danu mom for this in terms of, yeah,
if you want to talk about it as an elemental

(01:13:41):
uh philosophical structure, you know. It's man goes out to
the the oblivious oblivion of the ocean and then has
to return eventually. It changed the new sort of thing.
So yeah, and.

Speaker 7 (01:13:51):
It's another one of those like seemingly like throwaway lines.
Well it's like what what what day is it? When no,
I think it's it's Tuesday. I think like that's the
that's the last line of the movie.

Speaker 6 (01:14:04):
Like that.

Speaker 2 (01:14:04):
What it's such a with that happy score.

Speaker 6 (01:14:07):
Yeah, yeah, we got to talk about the music.

Speaker 3 (01:14:11):
Yeah we Yeah, I actually mentioned it before for sure,
but like obviously this was Williams's moment to shine as
good as the score in Sugarland express Is. I feel like, again,
had he and and Spielbrick not hooked up on this movie,
it's entirely possible that Williams would not have become his
guy from then on, you know, because this was I

(01:14:31):
think the one that proved to each other where it's like, oh,
we get each other for sure. Like I think they
had a good experience on sugar Land, but I feel
like this was the movie that they were like so
in sync that it was like, oh perfect, we got it,
and uh yeah, even even I mean much has been
said about, of course the main theme and how simple
it is, but.

Speaker 2 (01:14:50):
But everybody knows it more than any other movie.

Speaker 1 (01:14:53):
I would say, like you can throw his other scores
like Star Wars and this and that, but everybody can
do like when you go to a piano, you go
boom boom.

Speaker 2 (01:15:01):
You know, because you're good at like I can play
that song.

Speaker 3 (01:15:04):
Yeah, yeah, of course. I think the fact that it
even mimics you know, whether you want to say it's
breathing or like a heartbeat, or even just a metronome,
you know, just some sort of rhythm, the rhythmic nature,
but the ominous increasing of its repetition, and the fact
that the repetition is so connected with just the presence

(01:15:25):
of the shark that you know it's out there. You
can't see it, but you know it's out.

Speaker 6 (01:15:27):
There, right. Yeah, I think I keep keep going back
to this.

Speaker 7 (01:15:32):
What really stood out to me in this rewatch, but
this time the similarity two of the score to Peter
and the Wolf, like you know, like the even like
the Wolf, that it's kind of that like low droning,

(01:15:55):
you know, not unlike.

Speaker 6 (01:15:57):
The Sharks theme.

Speaker 7 (01:15:58):
And but then like you know, Peter's song is so
much like the song when they're you know, it's just
like the the great cut c Shots of amity, you know,
like that that upbeat like.

Speaker 2 (01:16:14):
It in juxtaposition is really great.

Speaker 6 (01:16:16):
It's it's perfect and just like in Peter and the.

Speaker 5 (01:16:18):
Wolf, that great when when things are really starting to
spiral for Quinn, do you notice how there's the there's
sort of the shark theme, but then also the orchestral
farewell and to do do you fair Spanish Ladies? Yeah,
like yeah, in there it's kind of like send sending
him off, like this is him And I really noticed
it how it sort of like wraps into the ominous
theme and takes it.

Speaker 3 (01:16:39):
Oh perfect, Yeah, no, there's And that's the thing is
that everyone's so remembering the horror of the main theme
is that there's such a delightful lyricism to a lot
of the score as well.

Speaker 1 (01:16:49):
Yeah, that's all putting too, Like it just brings your
levels up and down because you're feeling something.

Speaker 2 (01:16:56):
It's unforgettable.

Speaker 1 (01:16:57):
You're happy one second, but you know, like I'm like,
wait a minute, this isn't a happy scene. That shark
is trying to kill them, and then the shark literally
jumps out of the water and it's like.

Speaker 2 (01:17:05):
Boo boo boom, like Jesus Christ. I don't know how
I feel.

Speaker 3 (01:17:11):
And it's perfectly spotted, perfectly paced. I mean, I can't
tell you how roused I get when you know the
Orc is coming about to chase Jaws and you know
they're just whipping that wheel around. I mean, everything's working
in conjunction there for sure.

Speaker 1 (01:17:27):
Well, it's also perfect marketing because this movie was marketed
around the first time that they were starting to put
trailers on TV. It wasn't a huge thing like it was,
and the trailer's perfect. They got that guy, they were like,
do an up voice. He's like, I want to talk
like this.

Speaker 3 (01:17:41):
No, no, okay, So I wanted to talk about him, Steve.
I don't know if you know his name, Percy Rodriguez, Rodriguez,
I'm dudes, one of my dudes, because I even read
a whole article on him one time because a Canadian actor.
He was of Afro Portuguese heritage, born in Montreal, and
he did some TV you know, guest roles. I guess

(01:18:03):
he you know. I saw him on Star Trek in
the original Star Trek series. He was also on Peyton Place.
He was I think a recurring role on that. But
during the seventies and eighties and into the nineties, he
was such an incredible presence in trailers and TV spots.
And I do think ash kind of what you were

(01:18:25):
saying a little bit a bit about, you know, this
movie's connection to the Exorcist. I think because he was
hired to do the voiceover narration for the Exorcist campaign,
that they brought him into this and so then you
have him doing that.

Speaker 6 (01:18:36):
It is if God created the Devil.

Speaker 2 (01:18:38):
That's the scariest trailer of all.

Speaker 1 (01:18:41):
I love flashing Like, there's nothing like that Exorcist trailer.

Speaker 2 (01:18:44):
It scares me to this day.

Speaker 3 (01:18:45):
But yeah, No, his his intonations, his rhythms, his his
cadence is just so perfect for horror especially, and that's
why you know, he's just we were talking about phantasm
Off Off came earlier. He did the trailers for fantast
him too, he did he did several of the Latter
of a Day Friday at thirteenths. You know, like, he's
just he's so great and I love him well.

Speaker 5 (01:19:08):
I love that they that that you wanted to talk
about him. And that, like in the documentary they talk
about him and because the trailers were like TV, advertising
for films was not a huge deal up until that point.
And so then they said, well, we're gonna we're gonna
market the hell out of this thing. And it's funny,
right Mark, you can attest to this too, Like as
a voiceover person sometimes it's a little funny to think

(01:19:30):
of like a trailer or promo guy, like where why
am I here? What do I what? What? What is
my purpose in doing this thing? And that trailer to
sonically tell us a story that when we're not going
to see any of the movie, that we know what
we're getting into. I mean, it's that is as like
iconic and long lasting. I mean, I cannot tell you

(01:19:50):
how many times I've had auditions for things where they're
either parodying that or they want that that sort of
idea that you get the link to the Jaws trailer
where they say, you know, this is the sound the
sound we want. Of course you're never going to match
that exact sound, but it just it becomes as iconic
as the movie itself.

Speaker 3 (01:20:07):
And you know, people love to talk about because of
I think the documentary that I think Seinfeld was involved
with Don Lafontaine, you know, the inner World guy, as
he became known to the general public. And yeah, Don
did some great stuff obviously during his career, but I
do wish more people knew Percy by name, just because
he feels like the unsung despite his amazing track record,

(01:20:29):
he still feels a little bit under under the radar
in terms of his his work as a voiceover artist.

Speaker 1 (01:20:33):
Well, we're giving him that space now, and I love
that just hearing being voice you know, voiceover actors, it's
very interesting to like hear your perspectives on that.

Speaker 3 (01:20:42):
It's cool. Yeah, yeah, we obviously we're already on the
topic like the fact that Jaws and its release changed
so much about the industry.

Speaker 1 (01:20:51):
Well, what was cool is them being like, no, we're
only putting it in six hundred theaters because I want
people in Palm Strings to have to drive to LA
to see this movie.

Speaker 2 (01:20:59):
That's unheard of.

Speaker 3 (01:21:01):
It's crazy, But.

Speaker 1 (01:21:02):
The best advertising is it's diabolical. It's people standing in line.

Speaker 3 (01:21:06):
Yeah. The fact that, like you know, for the majority
of cinema's history up until the mid seventies, and really,
when you study cinema history, obviously there's there's a lot
of to say about style form, what have you, in
terms of the New Hollywood movement, in terms of the
French New Wave you know, a decade earlier, and how
much great you know, fruitfulness there was in this you know,

(01:21:29):
sort of twenty year period in cinema worldly but also
in this ten year period during the seventies for American cinema,
there was just so many changes to the point where
like all of us because I think all of us
are either eighties or nineties babies, right, so, you know,
we were all born into a world where these changes
had already become a commonplace. In terms of the fact

(01:21:49):
that literally just the idea of a summer blockbuster movie,
you know, did not exist before this film, right, it
was it was the winter season where most studios were like,
this is where we're to make our money summers for
dumping crap that we don't care about because the common
sense in their minds, which does kind of make sense,
is people are gonna want to be outside. They're gonna
want to go swim, they're gonna want to go on vacation.

(01:22:11):
They're not gonna want to go into an air conditioned
theater and watch some crap, you know, and.

Speaker 7 (01:22:15):
That that's a thing and not to jump in real quick,
now go ahead. That was like the year that they
started air conditioning theaters.

Speaker 3 (01:22:23):
Ah, so like before.

Speaker 7 (01:22:25):
That, you wouldn't want to go to a movie in
the in the summertime because it's gonna be hot in there,
you know, yeah, you might as well.

Speaker 6 (01:22:31):
You're gonna be hot, might as well be outside.

Speaker 7 (01:22:33):
But then they started refrigerating the refrigerating, conditioning the air
the theaters.

Speaker 6 (01:22:39):
It was refrigerated air.

Speaker 7 (01:22:42):
So that was, you know, why you could really have
a summer blockbuster.

Speaker 3 (01:22:47):
Sure, And the fact that they're there their typical release
schedule and everyone complains about, you know, limited releases these days.
That used to be the norm, and it used to
be just like a couple of cities and that's it.
And then like a you know, play or something thing
of a similar nature, they would travel it. It would
either be a literal road show, which they did with
a lot of prestige releases during the sixties, of course,

(01:23:08):
or you know, a sensible road show where it wouldn't
be you know, overturning intermission and all that jazz, but
it would still you have to wait for it to
come to your city. And so that's why, you know,
from The Exorcist on over, like there's all these vintage
ad campaigns where it's like now you can see it,
like it's in your city. Don't worry, like you've heard
about it. We know, like here's you know, here it is.

(01:23:29):
And Jaws was a, yeah, a big turning point moment
in terms of like, well, what if we just gave
it to as many people as possible at the same time,
you know.

Speaker 1 (01:23:37):
And then the whole they're like, we don't want to
take the weekend, I want to take the entire summer,
and then it just ran for months.

Speaker 3 (01:23:43):
Mm hmm. It's cool.

Speaker 1 (01:23:45):
It's disgusting that Stephen didn't get nominated for an Oscar
for Best Director for this.

Speaker 3 (01:23:50):
Have we all seen that the video of Joe Spinell
being angry that Steven Spilbrig didn't get Yeah.

Speaker 6 (01:23:57):
I'd love that.

Speaker 3 (01:23:58):
At a certain point in time Joe Spanell was friends
and Steven. That's just delightful to me because Asha, i mean,
I'm sure we know him from Maniac and yeah, the
Last Horror Show and all that. But yeah, it's.

Speaker 2 (01:24:09):
Just it did win.

Speaker 1 (01:24:11):
It won sound editing and score, which is pretty great
for you know, a horror but it's it's a travesty
like that should this should have I'm just being biased,
but he should have won for Best Director and that
should have won for Best Film. It is like a
perfectly paced, perfect movie. Merchandising too, Jesus Christ.

Speaker 3 (01:24:34):
Well yeah, and also, let's just say, I mean, ashly,
we've kind of already said it. But the fact that, like,
you know, this is maybe the best example or clearest example,
let's say, of a horror film changing the game immensely,
you know, from then on out, which again, you know,
people to this day in the industry in entertainment do

(01:24:56):
not like to give the genre its flowers, you know, still,
despite the fact that it's the backbone of so much
of cinema. But but they really need to. And that's
partially what this podcast is about. And it's really, you know,
it's it's this. If you need look no further than
Jaws in terms of how impactful a horror movie can
be and not just successful, but just you know, so

(01:25:17):
influential forever throughout time.

Speaker 6 (01:25:20):
It's hard for me to think of Jaws as a
horror movie.

Speaker 5 (01:25:23):
Like me too, I have to say me too.

Speaker 2 (01:25:25):
Yeah, really, oh no, it's scared.

Speaker 6 (01:25:28):
Scared me for sure, and it is you know, horrifying.

Speaker 3 (01:25:34):
Well, you know, that probably speaks to how the general
public doth consider horror distinct from you know, if they
look at say like a you know, a slasher movie,
they're like, yeah, that's a horror movie. But if they
look at something like a creature feature or even something
more psychological like Science of the Lambs, you know, they
might go, oh, well that's not horror.

Speaker 6 (01:25:51):
You know.

Speaker 3 (01:25:52):
But I feel like there's been some headway in cultural circles,
in critical circles to sort of bring the blanket back
around and be like, no, it's still part of our family.
It's definitely a distinct difference from you know, you can
never compare Jaws to Friday thirteenth in terms of like
the same movie, Like, no, they're not. But but yeah, no,
I get what you're saying.

Speaker 5 (01:26:11):
Yeah, it checks off all the boxes, right, And some
sort of element is stalking a town and one by
one people are being kicked off. I mean, you know, absolutely,
of course.

Speaker 2 (01:26:21):
And not Shark's wearing a hockey mask.

Speaker 3 (01:26:27):
I think this Stark might be evil decided and he.

Speaker 6 (01:26:30):
Goes and.

Speaker 7 (01:26:35):
I have I've trained multiple algorithms to like only show
me horrible things, uh, you know. And and because of that,
I have like seen some footage of like actual shark
attacks and they are brutal to watch.

Speaker 6 (01:26:53):
And but I you know.

Speaker 2 (01:26:55):
I watch a lot of shark we yeah, yeah.

Speaker 7 (01:26:58):
Yeah, and like that's something like that. It makes me
wonder because the Kittener scene looks exactly like what it
looks like, like there is that much blood.

Speaker 2 (01:27:10):
Well, they almost killed that kid. Yeah, some of that
was his left They drowned him.

Speaker 1 (01:27:15):
They had that twelve year old under the water, like Jesus,
guys in wetsuits pulling him up and down. Yeah, and
so I think that's why it looks so realistic, as
you could do that stuff back.

Speaker 2 (01:27:23):
Then with the kids.

Speaker 6 (01:27:24):
Yeah, just get another kid, yeah, like just.

Speaker 1 (01:27:27):
So the raft is going to explode and one it does,
just go under water and.

Speaker 2 (01:27:31):
Hold your breath for as long as possible. Grab his legs.

Speaker 3 (01:27:35):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (01:27:36):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (01:27:37):
You know.

Speaker 7 (01:27:37):
There's a really cool story about the kid who played
Alex Kittner.

Speaker 6 (01:27:45):
Uh.

Speaker 7 (01:27:45):
Well, years later, the woman who played his mother went
into a restaurant and there was a sandwich on the
menu called the Alex Kittner sandwich, and she was like, oh,
this is crazy, Like I played his mother in the
movie and it was the kid the actor's restaurant he had,
you know, it's so awesome and pursue a career in film.

(01:28:08):
But he opened a restaurant, so they re met, you know,
years later.

Speaker 1 (01:28:12):
What she was saying is she slaps she so many
people were like, slap me. And then she finally had
to retire from slapping people because she was like tired
of doing it.

Speaker 2 (01:28:20):
But yeah, so many people would be like, hit me. Okay.

Speaker 5 (01:28:25):
She has one of the great this this as we're
doing during this rewatch, she has one of the great
lines in the whole movie. When she she's of course
blaming Brodie, she says, and there's nothing you can do.
My boy is dead and there's nothing you can do.
It really sets it. It changes the whole course of
his journey, right because he's trying to find some way
that he can do it. I mean, I love that

(01:28:46):
you're that we're picking out all these things that like
some of the minor characters say and do, and they
get some of the best bangers in the whole movie.
There's nothing you can do oh so good?

Speaker 2 (01:28:55):
Did the goddamn kids karate chopping the fucking fences?

Speaker 6 (01:28:59):
Yeah, we're talking about Kidner.

Speaker 7 (01:29:05):
I want to I want to talk about that scene that,
like the beach scene leading up to Kittner's uh chomping, like.

Speaker 6 (01:29:16):
Yeah, yes, And just like the the.

Speaker 7 (01:29:19):
The cuts of like every it's always like the person
walking by and that's the cut back to Brody, back
to the that Like, the visual storytelling.

Speaker 6 (01:29:28):
Going on in that scene is just so like pitch perfect.

Speaker 7 (01:29:36):
The music, everything, it shiters, reactions like all the like
the little interactions between the people on the beach. You
know that's a bad hat, Harry, Like, everything about that
scene is so perfect. And it leads up to that
that trombone shot that the dolly zoom, Like.

Speaker 6 (01:29:58):
Was there was it? That wasn't the first time it
was ever done?

Speaker 3 (01:30:02):
No, the first time. No, it was famously Spielberg riffing
on Alfred Hitchcock, specifically a moment from Vertigo, and which yeah, yeah,
But to what you're saying, Mark, I think that that scene,
more than any other maybe in the in this movie,
is proof positive of Spielberg's mastery of Most people will
give him timing, but I feel like it's not just timing.

(01:30:25):
I feel like it's timing and composition. This guy just
has an innate sense of choreography for the camera. And
if you you know, extrapolate from this all the way
to you know, obviously he's in the end of Jones
movies Raiders. You know just how pitch perfect those are
with their set pieces. But even just something is much
smaller than you know, all the way to West Side Story.

(01:30:46):
You know, the fact that he was able to pull
that off so brilliantly in terms of just making those
musical numbers sing visually, not just saying literally. You know,
So I think that, yeah, absolutely, that sequence is one
where you can just pluck it out of the movie
show it, so we'd be like, this guy could direct
a movie.

Speaker 1 (01:31:02):
Well, speaking of scenes, I think the Ben Garner scene
which they filmed in a pool, oh yeah, for three
thousand dollars, Is that not the best jump scene?

Speaker 2 (01:31:12):
Like jump scare?

Speaker 1 (01:31:13):
Ever, I feel like jump scares get so ridiculous now
where it's it's the whole your whole horror movie is
just jump scares. That was one of the best timed,
filmed and done, and that's verna jump scares ever, and
that was her favorite shot in the movie because of
how everyone would react. That scene got the most reaction
than any other scene throughout the entire film, and well deserved,

(01:31:35):
because yeah, you don't expect it.

Speaker 3 (01:31:36):
Yeah, it's Vernon and Stephen Becau, Stephen's It was Stephen's
idea to shoot the shot in terms of like he
was looking at test s greetings and he was like,
I really need them to jump one more time. So
he's a he's got that master planner sort of thing
behind the camera as well.

Speaker 2 (01:31:48):
I guess he's just corded milk in that pool.

Speaker 5 (01:31:51):
Yeah, it says to his legacy. I've read the other
jump scare that I remember. The best is, of course,
in Jurassic Park, an other Spielberg masterpiece. I was at
opening weekend of Jurassic Park, and I can remember being
in the theater towards the back with my uncle. He
took me to see it and when the hand, the
hand comes out, oh gosh, and then the raptor's head
comes through, and I can still remember several hundred people

(01:32:11):
all in one motion coming back. I've never ever forgotten
that moment. Yeah, he know, he knows how to direct
direct the movie.

Speaker 3 (01:32:19):
I guess I've gotten older and so and so, you know,
obviously I'll have moments where I'll exert myself too much
and I can, you know, feel my heart almost leap
out of my chest. That was when I was what nine,
ten years old, and that's when I felt my heart
was going to leap out of my chest. Or Jurassic Yeah.

Speaker 6 (01:32:35):
I also I also saw a Jurassic Park in the
theater opening day, and I remember that first scene with
the with the you know, you don't even see the raptor,
but you just see like the guy getting like moved,
not unlike how Chrissy buys it, right, you know, Christy.

Speaker 7 (01:32:53):
Yeah, yeah, he's just getting like jerked up and down
and all around and screaming.

Speaker 6 (01:32:57):
And I remember sitting there and being like this my
be too scary for me. This And like I had
already read the book, like I but I was just
I was like this, this is gonna be really scary.

Speaker 3 (01:33:09):
I had to run out of the room when the
government agents enter Elliott's house and et like that's how
scary that was to me at.

Speaker 6 (01:33:16):
That age, you know, like Spielberg, man.

Speaker 5 (01:33:18):
Yeah, man, I just I just saw a thing. The
other day, I forgot that there's there's one of those
dolly zooms in e T. Do you remember that where
they're up on the hill the first time I see
the engines coming in and it's just the city. It's this,
it's like this overview from the hill of the city.
So he's using to the exact same effect, like they're
going to descend on this town. Everything is going to change.

(01:33:39):
But like sucking the.

Speaker 6 (01:33:40):
Soul out of that, well, a well done dolly zoom, I.

Speaker 3 (01:33:45):
Mean means the world.

Speaker 7 (01:33:48):
I think a lot of our other favorite movie, I know,
for Steve and I speaking of seeing movies in the theater,
h that the dolly shot in Fellowship of the Ring,
you know, that's that's another just.

Speaker 2 (01:34:00):
We need to get off this road.

Speaker 7 (01:34:02):
Yeah, but anyway, back to Jaws.

Speaker 3 (01:34:06):
So I recently because we have a homage movie to
Jaws coming out this month or yeah, this month, Dangerous Animals,
I wrote an article about it recently, comparing it to
Jaws because of its relationship there. I won't spoil the
movie for anyone hasn't seen it, but I won't say that.
But what I did do is a little bit of research.

(01:34:27):
We're writing that article. And really it wasn't until Jaws
that this genre or subgenre that whatever you want to
call it, began in earnest that now we're, you know,
fifty years later also used to that it's just become
a staple of our cinematic diet. But the idea of
an animal's attack or a you know, a man versus
nature of people versus nature movie where the animal, a

(01:34:50):
real life animal, is a creature in a creature feature
sort of mode. Because prior to Jaws, if you had
a killer shark or a killer tiger or a killer bear,
you know, most of those movies would still be in
a mode of like adventure, you know stuff, which Jaws
still has. You know, Jaws still has that that Melville hemingway,
you know, element to it. But because of the cultural

(01:35:12):
impact of Jaws, like obviously, we got stuff immediately after
like Orca Tentacles, h all, the Italian rip off movies,
Prophecy with the mutant bear, Grizzly with a regular bear,
you know, alligator, you know, just like and then all
the way to our our other shark movies like you know,

(01:35:34):
Deep Bluecy and you know, Shark Attack only I love
that shallows. The shallows. Yeah, twenty however many meters down. Yeah,
And really it's just it's become such a staple that

(01:35:55):
like now it's like, oh, what's this year's shark movie? Like,
you know, it feels like we at least have one
every year.

Speaker 2 (01:35:59):
Yeah, arks in the friggin scene, Like this movie is wild.

Speaker 6 (01:36:03):
Yeah, it was right.

Speaker 1 (01:36:05):
Before the Olympics, Like, get scared. Everybody jump in that water.
It's not just the bacteria that's going to get you,
it's the sharks.

Speaker 3 (01:36:11):
And really like it. It's fun to study the horror
genre to point to these watershed films, you know, uh
in the way that like George Romero invented the zombie
and led the Living Dead, and you know, of course
Exorcists started this possession craze and Halloween started the slasher craze,
even though there's you know, precursors to all of these
but ye have blood we'll talk about in a minute.

(01:36:33):
But but yeah, so it's like it's it's just so
great to mark Jaws is like, you know, this not
just how it changed, you know, the industry and and
summer blockbusters and marketing, but but even just the genre itself,
Like you know, yeah, well.

Speaker 1 (01:36:46):
We just went into it doing ghosts in the darkness,
and that was another it was a true story, which
is the true story, and it's Impoor went out for
the Alligator from Alligator he.

Speaker 3 (01:36:55):
Just away, buddy, you love to eat rich people.

Speaker 2 (01:36:59):
He was the best.

Speaker 3 (01:37:03):
And you know, one of my favorite. And it's not
like it's not like all of those are are lesser
to Jaws. They are, but in terms of like, you know,
just starting the sub genre in the way that like
Halloween is maybe one of my favorite Slashers, but I
love so many other slashers too.

Speaker 8 (01:37:16):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (01:37:16):
You know, Joe Dante's piranh is one of my favorite films,
you know, and and how and how connected it is
to this movie and uh, you know Deep Blue c
we'll we'll hopefully talk about that soon too, you know,
that sort of thing. So it's great when you have
a thing that starts a genre and it's not like,
even if it may be the best example of that
genre or subgenre, there's still like it's begets so many
great children as well.

Speaker 6 (01:37:37):
Not not the actual sequels to Jaws so much.

Speaker 3 (01:37:42):
I fuck with Jazz two, Yeah, yeah, I fuck with
Jazz Jows two.

Speaker 7 (01:37:46):
Definitely feels like a slasher movie. Mm hma, like the
shark gets a scar in the beginning. Yeah, a lot
more horny teenagers and really brutal horny teenagers.

Speaker 3 (01:37:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (01:37:56):
Uh.

Speaker 7 (01:37:57):
My My favorite thing about the sequels, though, well two
favorites is what Michael Caine missing the Oscars because he
was filming Jaws the Revenge and when asked about when
asked about Jaws three D, H Dennis claim is being
interviewed next, So you were in Jaws three D and
he was like, I was in Jaws.

Speaker 1 (01:38:18):
What I will say, every time I go to some
kind of SeaWorld or something or an aquarium, you always
think about that scene. No matter how corny that shark
looks coming in, it doesn't matter. That will stick in
your mind and it is horrifying and it scares me

(01:38:38):
to this day.

Speaker 2 (01:38:39):
I'm like, he's coming.

Speaker 6 (01:38:40):
The mother is gonna get it.

Speaker 5 (01:38:41):
Is amazing how that like Sea World movie feels like
it was made thirty years before Jaws, like that there
is something so two thousand leagues under the sea about
it that Yeah, yeah, how did this happen?

Speaker 6 (01:38:53):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:38:54):
It also is the origin of one of my favorite
uh forever unmade titles to a sequel, which is Jaws
three People zero. Oh yeah, yeah, good lord, what what
perfection that is?

Speaker 6 (01:39:07):
Oh god?

Speaker 3 (01:39:11):
Do we want to get into recommendations now?

Speaker 6 (01:39:14):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:39:14):
Yeah, we can start wrapping.

Speaker 3 (01:39:15):
Up Steven, Mark, do you I mean Mark? I know
you know this, but but Steve, just so you know,
are are aware, we like to end our episodes with
a genre accompanying recommendation. I believe that's what you call it.
Ash Uh and uh see I listen and uh and
so yeah, we're just kind of go around and say

(01:39:35):
which movie you might pick to to sort of pair
with Jaws. Uh, if you were to recommend to our listeners,
do you want me to go first?

Speaker 1 (01:39:44):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:39:44):
Sure, yeah, I'll say both the movie that I'm currently
wearing a T shirt for, which is Razorback, directed by
Russell Malkay, which is one of the one of the
i'd say, like handful of Jaws on Land movies slash,
Oh my, just let's ripoffs. But I also want to
give a shout out to a movie that Ash and

(01:40:05):
I discussed a few years ago, which was Jordan Peel's.

Speaker 2 (01:40:08):
Nope, oh that's a good one.

Speaker 3 (01:40:10):
If you want to hear us talk more about that
Gilds in that episode.

Speaker 5 (01:40:14):
I like that I can I can I jump in
because I don't know that I could, that I could
jump to something that's perfectly appropriate. But in the way
that the wrong recommendation to not focus on what the
algorithm is trying to spit out at you. I rented
this movie last night so I could watch it on
my iPad from Amazon, and the as the credit started

(01:40:37):
to roll, their recommendation for something to watch next was
the Goldie Hawn Kurt Russell rom com Overboard, He which
I thought was it was so amazing and so stupid
that it actually completely works, And I think, yeah, so
so folks go out and watch which, by the way,
one of those movies that was on in our house
constantly Overboard a great number of times, so you'll.

Speaker 3 (01:41:01):
Never forget Kurt in that tank top right or Jaws
Tank top right now.

Speaker 2 (01:41:06):
Show those colors bones.

Speaker 3 (01:41:08):
I love that.

Speaker 5 (01:41:09):
So yeah, go out and watch Overboard, do you want.

Speaker 7 (01:41:13):
There's a lot of parallels. We didn't think about it
at first. There's a lot of parallels between Overboard and Jaws.

Speaker 1 (01:41:20):
I'll go with nineteen sixty three of the Birds because
the birds scared the shit out of me. And it's like,
if you really think about it, if the birds did
decide to come for us.

Speaker 2 (01:41:29):
We are done.

Speaker 3 (01:41:31):
Yep, we're done.

Speaker 2 (01:41:32):
And I like how much Tippy smokes.

Speaker 7 (01:41:34):
Yeah, that that leads perfectly into my recommendation if you
know in jokes that only Steve and I know, one
of the last times I went up to see Steve,
I drank. I drank pretty much old bottle of tequila.

Speaker 2 (01:41:55):
That's my guy.

Speaker 6 (01:41:56):
And when you.

Speaker 3 (01:41:58):
Try to choke about with your thick gorilla, it's right.

Speaker 7 (01:42:01):
And then we got on the topic of killer whales,
and it was it was when you know, the killer
whales were attacking people's boats and stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:42:09):
Yeah, yeah, I love that.

Speaker 6 (01:42:11):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (01:42:11):
And and at that time I became fascinated with, like
why don't killer whales eat people? And like I decided
to do some research. Uh, and basically it's nobody knows.
Nobody knows why. But like apparently the Orcas are very

(01:42:33):
big on like learned behavior, like they teach their children
what to do, and then that's how things go.

Speaker 6 (01:42:40):
So you have like different pods who do things differently.

Speaker 7 (01:42:43):
And over the course of this evening of talking about this,
I kept coming back to the fact that if orcas
start eating people, it's over for us in the water.
That was that was the phrase. I kept saying, it's
over for us in the water.

Speaker 3 (01:42:58):
Just when you thought it was safe to go back
in the water.

Speaker 6 (01:43:00):
Dude, those things are super duper smart.

Speaker 7 (01:43:02):
They're huge, and if they decide start eating us, nothing
we can do.

Speaker 5 (01:43:06):
And to show you how much how much this movie
means to us, and how we always have to feel
like we we know everything there is to know about
this movie, a year or two ago, Mark sent me
a a desperate text which you could see his head
hung in shame, and he said, Steve, I can't fucking
believe it's taken me this long to realize the name

(01:43:28):
of the boat is Orca. The only predator larger than
the Great White is the Orca. The only the Great
White's only natural enemy is the Orca. Why didn't I
think of this already? And that's what this movie means
to us. If we if we miss a detail like.

Speaker 2 (01:43:45):
That, Steve, that is a perfect little ending that was
a great point.

Speaker 7 (01:43:50):
But then my recommendation is Orca.

Speaker 6 (01:43:56):
You can see is it? Is it? Bo?

Speaker 7 (01:43:58):
Derek Bo? Derek gets her leg bit enough by a
killer whale. Uh the guy from David David Carrett. No,
which Carridine is it?

Speaker 3 (01:44:07):
That's one of Thebert Cady Robert. Yeah, okay, I.

Speaker 7 (01:44:10):
Just get snatched off the side of a boat and eaten.
It's it's I.

Speaker 5 (01:44:15):
Wish everyone could see Ash's face.

Speaker 6 (01:44:16):
That it's such a it's such a fun movie.

Speaker 3 (01:44:20):
Well, it's so great.

Speaker 5 (01:44:23):
That tequila fueled monologue was going on for so long
that at one point I just hit record on my
notes app. I just hit dictation on my notes app,
and so I've got it somewhere. It's about five pages
and there's some decent stuff in there.

Speaker 2 (01:44:36):
I love that.

Speaker 3 (01:44:37):
That's good. That'll be for the the you know, sixtieth anniversary.

Speaker 7 (01:44:40):
Well, so if you if you have never seen Orca
without spoiling it too much, I mean I already said
that people which people get killed?

Speaker 6 (01:44:48):
Uh the the Orca destroys a house.

Speaker 3 (01:44:52):
So oh yeah, hell fucking yeah. I'd like to end
on a note of how happy I am that we're
fifty years into Jaws, fifty years into loving Jaws or
some of us you know, forty two forty four, whoever
old you guys are into loving Jaws and we're still
learning more about it. There is a brand new four

(01:45:15):
K fiftieth anvertisary edition of the movie being released on
June seventeenth, which I've already pre ordered, which is going
to include a brand new documentary, Jaws at fifty The
Definitive Inside Story, which Spielberg's longtime, lifelong biographer, Laurento Bozerrou
is behind. He's the one that behind you know, Shark
still working and all that sort of stuff from the

(01:45:36):
earlier releases, and National Geographic co produced this documentary too.
If you don't want to buy the disc you could
wait until July tenth, which is going to be when
it streams at Disney Plus and Hulu. So I just
wanted to say that to our listeners as well, because
I'm excited to see that and learn more about Jaws.

Speaker 6 (01:45:53):
You know.

Speaker 3 (01:45:53):
There's just it's such an important film, and there's so
much to still revel in about it, And yeah, if
you're lucky enough to to be near somewhere like I
happen to live in la where Universal Studios Hollywood is uh,
they've turned one of the cafes into an animey Emity
Island cafe themed for Jaws. For the for the summer.

Speaker 2 (01:46:11):
Yeah, you guys still have the Jaws ride.

Speaker 3 (01:46:13):
We don't because we don't in Orlando, right, yeah, we
don't ever. We never Hollywood never had a ride, I think.

Speaker 2 (01:46:18):
But I want to propose to her when Jaws pops
out of.

Speaker 3 (01:46:20):
The They do still have Jaws on the tour. So
if you come to take the champ tour, you can
be just like, uh, was that Brodie or Quint who
said that in Malreads? I think it was.

Speaker 6 (01:46:34):
It was yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, quaint quaint Clintquint.

Speaker 3 (01:46:37):
Yeah it was Quint because it was Jeremy London and
not Jason. Yeah. Yeah, okay, I was just the other day.

Speaker 6 (01:46:43):
I love that movie.

Speaker 2 (01:46:44):
I love it so much. Damn kids, Escalator.

Speaker 3 (01:46:50):
Back. So, Trisha Dish, we have a we have an
announcement to make. MM should I make that?

Speaker 6 (01:46:58):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:46:58):
Go ahead tell the people.

Speaker 3 (01:46:59):
Yeah. So so, Ash and I are proud to announce
that we are included on a brand new Blu ray
box set as commentators. And this is the Mario Bava Collection,
the limited Deluxe Edition, which you can only buy on
shout factory dot com exclusively. It comes with It's a

(01:47:21):
twelve disc set with about twelve of Mariobaba the Maestro's films.
Who if you don't know who Mario Bava is, he's
the guy behind Black Sunday, The Girl Knew Too Much,
Black Sabbath, Kill Baby, Kill, Five Dollars for an August Moon,
and a Bay of Blood just name a few titles,

(01:47:42):
and Ash and I got to speak and talk about
both Five Dollars for an August Moon and a Bay
of Blood on this release, and I got to speak
on The Girl Knew Too Much in Black Sabbath as well.
So if you go preetor that now you can hear
some of our thoughts on these movies and listen to
our commentary tracks, which are pretty excited about.

Speaker 2 (01:48:04):
It was really fun. It was very different.

Speaker 1 (01:48:07):
It was also like to try to reel yourself in
and not make it like a mystery science stated or
three thousand episode is very hard, but I think we
crushed it. We were very knowledgeable, and those movies are
very fun, like they're cool, their original kind of slashers.
You can see you know where the bones of these
things started. And you know, Mario Baba is just a genius.
So with very working with very little.

Speaker 3 (01:48:28):
Working with very little definitely. Oh hell yeah, thank you guys.
And also we may have some more things doing ounce
in the future, so we'll give you a little give
a little tease right there. But Mark Steve let us
thank you from the bottom of our hearts. Thank you
for joining us in the water. Thank you for joining
us on our boat.

Speaker 5 (01:48:48):
Thanks for having me we didn't sink. Thank you for
having us. Can the audience will hear it was even
though it's his birthday, I was the one that got presents.
Mark yesterday sent me my very own Hooper and Quint
action figure. They are so detailed, multiple heads, multiple props,

(01:49:12):
multiple weapons. I mean, it's it's unbelievable. I'm dropping them
over here. Don't worry.

Speaker 2 (01:49:16):
I'm also wearing a shark shark Mark shirt that he
sent me.

Speaker 6 (01:49:21):
Yeah, will be there on Thursday.

Speaker 3 (01:49:25):
That Mark sent me.

Speaker 5 (01:49:26):
That's true. Yes, and we should say I did send
marks Marks present. Was I finally when the Lego Orca
and Uh and Bruce came back in stock he got
one in the mail and he put.

Speaker 2 (01:49:40):
Yeah, I got you for Christmas. That was I got
you that little Uh.

Speaker 1 (01:49:43):
We're going to need a bigger glass Scotch glass when
we when you love something. It's so easy to get,
you know, gifts, they're so meaningful. Happy Birthday, Mark, Thank you.

Speaker 6 (01:49:56):
Birthday, Thanks, Happy Birthday. Spend it with you guys.

Speaker 3 (01:49:59):
Thanks for us to way to go home and we're
tired of time. Then, thank you all for joining us
for this episode of Bill and Ashley's part of the
Stranded Pinna Network. You can find my work in the
show notes links below. Check us out on social media.
You can find this show at Strandedpanna dot com and

(01:50:21):
everywhere else you get your podcasts. If you have questions
or comments, please feel free to write to us at
Bill and ash Terror Theater at gmail dot com. We're
dying to hear from you, seeing you in your nightmares

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