The Prophecy

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:28):
Welcome to another horrifying episode of Bill and Ashley's Terror
Theater on the Marquis. This week is nineteen ninety five's
The Prophecy. Join us right after we get back from
figuring out what to do with a box of dehydrated faces.
All that after these ads we have no control over.
Welcome back, I'm Ashley Coffin, joined as always by my

(00:49):
co host and Terror bill Bria Bill Jarling.

Speaker 2 (00:53):
How are we today, little Ashley Coffin? How I loved
listening to your sweet prayers every night and then you
jump in your bed so afraid it was under there,
and I was I.

Speaker 1 (01:03):
Thought you were just going to call me a bitch,
because everybody just calls that little girl in this movie
a bitch for absolutely no reason.

Speaker 2 (01:08):
They're like, that bitch, like the six year old, Yeah,
how dare she get put a soul inside of her
by a rogue agel?

Speaker 3 (01:16):
That little bitch?

Speaker 2 (01:17):
What a bitch? Yeah? I guess they must have seen
a monster squad and they were like, we can beat that,
We could.

Speaker 3 (01:23):
Totally beat that.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
Well. We will be discussing the Prophecy very shortly, but first,
what have you read from the necronomicon of horror news
this week.

Speaker 2 (01:33):
Well, Ashley, I've I've got a little bit of an
update on something I've talked about recently, just because we
happened to do our Leprecaun episode a couple weeks ago
in honor of Saint Patti's Day, and one of those times,
I don't know if it was that episode of the
one after I mentioned that there was a new Leprechaun
movie in the works since June of twenty twenty three
that was going to have Felipe Vargas hired to reimagine

(01:55):
the franchise. Okay, I just wanted to say there is
an update ironically on this which is not anything big,
but just apparently Bloody Disgusting has sources that have learned
that Fleet pap Argus is no longer making them. So
the ninth Leprechaun movie, or I guess this would be

(02:17):
the second reboot after Origins, is still in development. But
you know, no one knows exactly what's going to happen
with it, and and that's something that is apparently a
Lionsgate tradition or becoming one right now, because as I'm
sure you've seen, ash as well as our listeners saw
eleven has kind of died, and I wanted to bring

(02:40):
it up just because, you know, otherwise you would feel
like almost non news where it's like, hey, you know,
Saw X was maybe kind of the end, or at
least the end for a while. And this idea that
they had for Saw eleven, which apparently a lot of
people were excited about, and they were comparing it to
Saw six and how it was going to be tackling
yet another hot button social consciousness issue or something. But apparently, yeah,

(03:04):
there's been irreconcilable differences behind the scenes between I guess
the producers. That's kind of what they're going with right now.
And I know that, you know Kevin Greiter, who directed
Saw X as well as three of the prior Saw
movies or two, he did six, and he did seven.
He might have done five as well, So anyway, he's

(03:27):
directed a couple and I know that he's been posting
online kind of vague things, but generally being unhappy, where
you know, he says, you know, stuff like, oh, it's
really sad that this has happened or something like that.
That's not a direct quote, but just that's kind of
the vibe he's putting out. You know, I'm sad saying
this is from my memory. But the odd thing is

(03:48):
that whoever's behind the marketing arm of the Saw franchise,
and I don't know who would be. I don't know
if that's Twisted Pictures themselves. I don't think it's Lionsgate,
but whoever has acts to like you know, Saw as
official social channels is putting it out there post this
news that Saw eleven is, you know, all but removed

(04:08):
from the release schedule, that you know, Saw isn't quite
dead yet, because they recently made a whole fake LinkedIn
page for Billy the Puppet, okay, and it says that
he's employed because I guess that's a new feature on
LinkedIn to let people know if you're employed or unemployed,
and like there's cute references to all the prior Saw

(04:28):
movies in his like resume, you know. Yeah, but uh yeah,
So clearly something is going on. I don't know if
that means that there's rumor this is just rumor, but
there's rumors that Twisted Pictures, who you know is the
producer and the owner of the rights to the Saw franchise,
they might be taking the franchise away from Lionsgate as
a result of this and maybe shopping to another studio.

(04:50):
I don't know if that's, you know, really a viable thing.
I don't know if that's something that people like Reuter,
you know, is eager to do, or if that's one
of the problems that he had, or I don't know.
Maybe one day we'll find out what exactly went down
behind the scenes, but right now it's kind of a mess,
and I guess all we can say is maybe Saw
will return, maybe not. But yeah, the Strangers Chapter two,

(05:13):
which for anyone who who forgotten, I think it's probably
most people that Strangers chapter one movie that came out
last year that did not do well and was not
well received. That was only one mytory.

Speaker 3 (05:24):
I didn't see it.

Speaker 2 (05:25):
Oh my god. Really yeah, because because I talked to
Rennie as part of Slash Film. I talked to Rennie
Harlan about it when he was announcing it in twenty
twenty three, I think so. And at that time it
was interesting because he was describing it in the same
way that you'd be describing the Dune movies, the Denny
Villeneuve or even Kevin Costner's Horizon, which is this multi movie,

(05:49):
multi part story in the sense that like in an
earlier era, it might have been like a road show
release or something that would have been one movie, but
like Lawrence of Arabia length or something like that, right,
And so his idea with this Stranger's remake, reboot, reimagining
whatever was that, you know, the first act of a
three act movie was this, you know, kind of remake

(06:12):
of the first Strangers movie, which is kind of what
everybody saw when they released it as Strangers Chapter one,
and everybody was like, what was the point of that?
But I guess there's more to come. So yeah, now
The Strangers Chapter two is going to be released on
September twenty sixth of this year, which will continue that
story of Madeleine Pesh's character, who's was the sole survivor.
So we'll see, you know, at least that it might

(06:35):
be new material.

Speaker 1 (06:36):
At least, you know, good luck, I hope you make it.

Speaker 2 (06:42):
And yeah. In more weird franchise news, it was recently
stated because Christopher land And has dropped coming out in
a few weeks. So he's been doing the rounds on
press tour and everything like that, and people have asked
him about Happy Death Day and you know people's you know,
fans interest and A Happy Death Day three, which everybody

(07:02):
involved with the Happy Deathting movies has talked about wanting
to make. But you know, the only people that don't
want to make it is the studio because it didn't
make money, and yeah, or enough money. And apparently at
one point Universal was proposing the idea of turning A
Happy Death Day three into a three part event series

(07:22):
for Peacock, which I'm glad didn't happen because that would
have been awkward, you know, to have two movies and
this random streaming series is like a concluding chapter. And
Landon did say that this is a quote. I didn't
write the script because I never wanted to count my
chickens and get ahead of myself. But I was ready
to go and start running this. But then it was weird.

(07:44):
And at one point they talked about it about becoming
three part event thing for Peacock, which was kind of weird.
So he was, you know, unquote, so he was ready
to do it. But it sounds like, you know, everyone's
kind of happy that it kind of didn't go that way,
because I would have made things, like I said, awkward,
and apparently I know they're having a land In retrospective
out here in LA at the American Cinema Tech, and
they're doing a double feature of the first two Happy

(08:06):
death Days. And so he's hinting on social media that
if they sell that, you know, screening out, it might
show Universal that there's still enough interest to make a
third movie. So here's hoping and it just I wanted
to also mention in terms of another surprising franchise thing,
because we're used to the name the Mummy as being

(08:30):
part of the Universal you know studios, the Universal Monsters.
He's you know, one of the troupe, the group, and
you know, even if you're talking about the Brendan Fraser
Mummy movies, the Steven Summers movies, or if you're talking
about the Tom Cruise Mummy movie, that's still all in
that banner of Universal. Surprisingly, though, the next Mummy movie

(08:51):
is going to be not from Universal and yeah, it's
from Evil Dead Rise director Lee Cronin, and he's said, quote,
this will be unlike any Mummy movie you ever laid
eyeballs on. Before. I'm digging deep into the earth to
raise something very ancient and very frightening unquote, and this
is under the Blumhouse Atomic Monster merger, and Blumhouse does
have a relationship with Universal, but this is apparently being

(09:13):
made for New Line Cinema there, you know, which is
Warner Brothers.

Speaker 1 (09:17):
Was that new Wolfman movie Universal.

Speaker 2 (09:19):
That was Universal? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, So this is this
is gonna be interesting in the sense that I can't
think at the last time a Mummy movie was made
outside of Universal. It certainly was, you know when Hammer
Studios were making their Mummy movies with Christopher Lee and
Peter Cushing, And I gotta believe that sometime in the
sixties and seventies there were like knockoff Mummy movies, right.

Speaker 1 (09:42):
Yeah, there had to be, but Curse of the Sarcophagus
is right, sorry.

Speaker 2 (09:45):
Yeah, and then there was like stuff like in the
early ladies, like the Charlton Heston Won the Awakening, uh
and stuff like that. But but yeah, so this is
going to be interesting just for the fact that it
doesn't have to be either a reimagining of the Universal
Mum or you know, even the Brendan Fraser Mummy or
the Tom Cruise Mummy. It could be a not your
Mummy's Mummy.

Speaker 3 (10:06):
Well, I hope they modernize it. That could be fun.

Speaker 1 (10:08):
Yeah, like you know, going to Egypt or would like
modern day you know, vacation to Egypt. Yeah, and then
you steal the necklace or whatever it is that makes
the man the bracelet or curse.

Speaker 2 (10:23):
Yeah. I don't know if this is going to be
one mummy or lots of mummies or both.

Speaker 3 (10:27):
See you mummies Yeah.

Speaker 2 (10:30):
Old mummies, young mummies, milf mummies.

Speaker 3 (10:33):
Yeah, some as big as your head.

Speaker 2 (10:39):
The last thing I wanted to mention is, uh, there's this,
you know, as as as you may have known, there's
a kind of a resurgence in interest, especially on the
part of horror fans of movie novelizations, to the point
where a lot of classic horror is getting you know,
novelizations now that they maybe never got or got but

(11:00):
arn't out of print. So in recent years there's been
stuff like the Silent Knight Deadly Night novelization, which I
think came out last year. There's been the Terrifier novilizations,
which have been more recent. There's been the Pearl X
trilogy novelizations from A twenty four and I think one
of the yeah, one of the I don't know, competitors
the right term. But one of the people on the

(11:22):
playing field of these horror novelizations is a company called
echo On Publications, and they recently announced another novelization that
they were going to I forget which which movie it
was for, but the one that I wanted to talk
about is their novelization of John Carpenter's In the Mouth
of Madness, which is especially fun because if you've seen

(11:45):
In the Mouth of Madness, you know that part of
the story of that movie is that it is very
meta in the sense that ultimately we're watching a movie
that is titled after a fictional book in the story
which gets a movie be made out of it, which
the book itself is also maybe cursed, and there's something
to do with the author, who's also fictional, who you know,

(12:07):
might might be, you know, a puppet of these ancient
love crafting forces that are trying to take over the
world in reality. So this novelization apparently is going to
be a meta novelization, so it's not going to be
necessarily the story of the movie per se, but it
and this is what the press release says. It says
it follows John Trent, an insurance investigator hired to locate

(12:30):
sutter Kane, the author after a sudden disappearance, and what
begins is a missing person case quickly turns into something
far more terrifying. And the author of this meta novelization
his name is Christian Francis, who recently did novelizations of Oh,
this is the one I was trying to think of,
obsession nine.

Speaker 3 (12:48):
Oh, that's a good one to do a book about.

Speaker 2 (12:50):
And also he did wish Master in vamp. He says, quote,
in the Mouth of Mannas is not just a book.
It's an experience, a mix of sanity and delusion. It's
Cain that is most unhinged, darker, hungrier, and far more
dangerous than anything's written before. And while we're proud to
publish it, we must warn people to read with caution
and report any altered perception to a medical professional.

Speaker 1 (13:09):
Of course, it's the inception of math like in the Math. Yeah,
inception of in the Mouth of Madness. Because a book
within a book within a book, right.

Speaker 2 (13:17):
Because even on the cover, it's the cover from the
movie where it says, you know the author is sutter
Kane and not you know this Christian Francis guy who
actually wrote it. So yeah, it could be a really
fun one to read. So we'll see when that happens.
When that comes out, I think later this year.

Speaker 1 (13:30):
That's exciting. I'd read the Session nine one. I have
such a soft spot for Session nine.

Speaker 2 (13:34):
Oh yeah, I love it. Yeah, And that's all the
news that's in the Necrodimicon this week.

Speaker 1 (13:41):
All right, Well, we will take a quick break and
we'll be right back with our feature film after these
mess ups from the grave that we have no control over,
and now it is time for our feature film.

Speaker 3 (13:57):
All right.

Speaker 1 (13:57):
So The Prophecy is a nineteen American fantasy thriller horror,
which is very important point to point out.

Speaker 2 (14:05):
Jesus Christ, I love this new excent you're developing.

Speaker 1 (14:10):
I don't understand what's I just saw Christopher Walkin's name
and I was like, talk.

Speaker 2 (14:13):
Weird, to talk weird then, So like the.

Speaker 1 (14:19):
Prophecy, you know, Eric Stalts is here, go to Morrison's Lucifer.

Speaker 2 (14:26):
Because that's it. If we if we did the rest
of the episode like that, they would be turned off
so fast.

Speaker 3 (14:30):
So fast.

Speaker 1 (14:32):
But yeah, so we have a lot of really good
actors in this very random nineteen ninety five Uh what
was it?

Speaker 2 (14:40):
Mirror X Dimension horror film.

Speaker 1 (14:43):
Yeah, Dimension films back one of my like most memorable
of all the openings. You know, the title cards for
movies is definitely like Dimension. I always knew we're watching
a horror movie when you had seen Dimension.

Speaker 2 (14:55):
I think their their non horror output is very small.
I can't maybe a science fiction movie or t but yeah,
I can't think of too many non horror movies that
have the Dimension film's logo at the start, So yeah,
they're almost pure horror.

Speaker 3 (15:08):
What was funny?

Speaker 1 (15:10):
This is another movie that I always remember having watched
because I know this came out when I was like eleven,
and I probably saw it at like twelve, And it
was one of the ones I would rent over and
over and over again from our video video den in
Brookhaven where it was like five movies, five dollars, five nights,
and it's just from that certain rack, and most of
it was horror. And I was so in love with

(15:30):
Eric Stoltz. I think it was because of his hair,
that gorgeous, ginger, stunning hair. But then they bring Vioo
Mortison as the devil, and I'm like, where's the book?
Where do I sign? I'm very shallow. I was at
eleven and I'm still at twenty eight. But yeah, it
was just my mom used to like this movie and
we used to watch it. I used to watch it

(15:51):
over and over and over again. But sometimes you have
those movies that doesn't matter how many times you've seen them.
When you put them on, sometimes it's like the first
time all over again. That's always been the way with
this movie. I always forget the film, and I have
seen it probably like twenty five thirty times.

Speaker 3 (16:07):
It's very strange.

Speaker 2 (16:08):
Yeah, I have a similarly vague history with this. I
don't actually know if I saw it before this recent
viewing or not. I know i'd never seen any of
the sequels, which I at this point, I've seen the
entire franchise, and I have to say, one of the
things I was really struck with is how consistent this

(16:29):
franchise is as opposed to a lot of Dimension Films franchises,
you know, because they were they love to do their franchises.
Bob Weinstein, you know, if you saw a sequel, he
went for it. And you know, compare this to the
unfortunateness of the Erasers series, where you know the level
of quality of that series as it goes on is
very diminishing returns. And while certainly the Prophecy movies you know,

(16:51):
as they go on to you know, clearly lose more
of their budget, I feel like there's enough of a
correct mixture in this right from the first movie here
of you know, this wack a do lore and this
ability to like pivot wherever it needs to go, so
it doesn't feel so rigid as say, you know, something

(17:12):
like Hell Raiser or something like that, where as soon
as you step outside the bounds of where those earlier
films go, it feels really like what is this? What
am I watching? That's not Hell Razor anymore? This is
something else, you know. Whereas Prophecy has a bit more
leeway in terms of as long as it's stuck in
to sort of Christian mythology or some weird version of
Christian mythology and angels who are maybe good, maybe evil,

(17:35):
we're not sure, kind of in the middle, you know,
it has like a little bit of that leeway. So
I think maybe that's why it has this consistency to it.
But yeah, for this first movie, I you could have
convinced me that I'd seen it before, but I didn't
like like you watching it again, I go was like,
I don't remember this or this part. Oh my gosh,
you know, so yeah, And I think it's because of yeah,
whatever special quality this movie has of it's not so

(17:59):
I conic or like crazy good that like you know,
everybody remembers a certain scene or a certain character a
certain part. But while you're watching it, I'm just loving it.
I'm just like, this is really solid, Like you know,
it's really engaging, and so so much is because of
this deep bench of actors that we have here.

Speaker 1 (18:15):
Yeah, and it was also kind of you can kind
of tell that they gave a lot of thought in
this movie to the story and the script, because even
though the script is really full, you still have those
you know, walk in one liners to kind of make
you chuckle and keep you going. And the film is
filled with a ton of religious ideology and imagery connecting
to the Bible and angels and other things that come

(18:36):
together to create this prophecy and it's repercussions. But there's
also them using it very liberally and creating a whole
new chapter to be able to move the plot forward
to you know, keep the story moving.

Speaker 3 (18:48):
And that makes me laugh a lot. They're like, yeah,
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (18:51):
You know, we're gonna go with Revelations chapter twenty three.

Speaker 2 (18:55):
Oh you didn't read it.

Speaker 3 (18:56):
You didn't read it, but yeah it's there.

Speaker 2 (18:57):
You know. Honestly, it feels like a movie that that
maybe best exemplifies what it is to be in this religion,
you know, where it's like there's there's all these revisions
every you know, corner you turn, there's something new where
it's like, actually, you know, maybe it means this, and
therefore it goes off with this new tangent. You know,
where there is doctrine, there is dogma, there is you know,

(19:20):
the word with capital W. But it feels like it's
never so set in stone that you couldn't see something
completely new just around the corner, right.

Speaker 1 (19:28):
So yeah, yeah, And there's this weird subgenre of the
religious horror movies because they don't get as much love
from like the regular people, like horror fans. We love
it and we accept it and we like it. You know,
the stigma is the end of days of this and that,
blah blah blah.

Speaker 3 (19:41):
But when you.

Speaker 1 (19:42):
Take like The Exorcist, which is technically a religious horror movie,
and you put the two priests against the evil. Everyone's
there for it and they're like all on board. But
when you take you know, angels who are supposed to
be you know, like not subservient or whatever they are
to us helpful and make them the bad guys and
give them weapons and this and that, it kind of

(20:03):
you know, turns people off to like angel violence. This
is it gets my religion blah blah blah. But horror fans,
we love it, which is why. I mean the movie
wasn't a flop in any kind of way. Like it
was only eight million to make and it made sixteen,
so that's pretty good. And it did get its sequels,
and I know it came up against what were the
movies that were out that same week. It was a
Mortal Combat and Dangerous Minds, and it's still got number three.

Speaker 3 (20:25):
But I was like, that's not so bad. That's not
so bad.

Speaker 1 (20:29):
And what that was in what nineteen ninety three is
when Mira Max was bought out by Disney.

Speaker 2 (20:34):
Yeah, right, so there was some.

Speaker 1 (20:35):
Kind of weird holding pattern because the film was done
in ninety three and not released until ninety five.

Speaker 2 (20:39):
Yeah. In fact, all the newspaper clippings in which there's
a few in this movie. If you look at the dates,
it's all ninety three. So yeah, this is a weird
sort of And you know when they talk, you talked
about Eric Stoltz's look in this movie. He's got this
long shoulder length like Lush's hair, and that's the same
look he has in pulp Fiction because he either shot
pulp Fiction just before this or just after it.

Speaker 3 (20:58):
So yeah, two pulp fiction characters.

Speaker 2 (21:02):
A few.

Speaker 1 (21:02):
Yeah, Amanda Honey, Bunny Plumber.

Speaker 2 (21:04):
Yeah, she isn't there too. I walk in of course.
And I do think that when we were when you
mentioned earlier, ash like how did all these actors get
in here? You know, they talk on the special features,
especially writer director gricor Y Whyden, you know, said that
once Walking was in place, like everybody wanted to come
play and they were all like excited about the prospect
of working with him. And I think that's definitely true.
But I also think that this was a special moment

(21:26):
in really film history. But certainly the company, you know,
mier Max and Dimension's history of you know, they were
just this company that had this heat at that moment
where you know, pulp fiction was not and when it
was being made, not considered to become what it became,
you know, in this huge award winning phenomenon, you know,
cultural moment. And so there was that feeling of like,

(21:47):
you know, because prior to this Dimension and Mirra Max
had been quietly distributing movies that like had done well
or it had a little bit of a blip on
the radar, but it really was definitely the pulp fiction
phenomenon that sort of made Miramax Mirrormax. And and yeah,
I think that it was just just this moment where
like people of this caliber of actor and actors were

(22:10):
just kind of interested in, like, you know, Prophecy could
have popped off. And it's honestly a little sad that
it didn't pop off bigger, Like you said, it did well,
you know, it didn't didn't flop, But like at the
same time, with this many actors in it, it kind
of feels like maybe it should have been even a
bigger hit because they're just there're such there are such
great actors, and also the work they're doing in this
movie I think is really solid. If there's a flaw,

(22:31):
it's probably the premise. It's probably like being so out
there odd for general audiences that like they couldn't easily
glom onto it like they did Exorcist of like, okay,
little girls possessed by the devil. And by the way,
most people get that wrong. Most people are like, oh, yeah,
ray Can gets possessed by the devil. No it's Bazuzu.

Speaker 1 (22:46):
No, yeah, it's not the devil, not that devil, right.

Speaker 2 (22:49):
Right, And even that though, like the general audiences don't care,
like they just think, okay, devil possessed girl. Priests got
to stop at boom, we got it. You know here,
I mean it's hard to give a one line description
of what the plot is.

Speaker 3 (23:01):
Let me try, Let me try. Okay, the plot.

Speaker 1 (23:07):
Evil angel Gabriel has come to Earth to strengthen his
power by claiming the wicked spirit of a psychotic veteran.
The benevolent angel Simon wants to stop that from happening,
so he hides the man's spirit where Gabriel would least
expect to find it in a little girl caught in
a cosmic battle in which even Lucifer plays a part.
A failed priest who is now a cop moves heaven

(23:29):
and earth to try to protect the child.

Speaker 2 (23:31):
You know what, ask you're pro. You're goddamn pro girl.

Speaker 1 (23:37):
Uh yeah, watch your language, he says in little you
know pretty much.

Speaker 2 (23:41):
You can watch that language.

Speaker 1 (23:43):
Yeah, but yeah, it was it was an interesting choice
to was. So the movie was originally called Demons and
God's Army or something.

Speaker 3 (23:55):
During the development.

Speaker 2 (23:56):
God's Army was the title they were really going to
go with until some people tell it the foreign distributors,
for like, if you translate that into different languages, it
could become like Allah's Army and that has a whole
different connotation and then yeah, you know sort of thing.

Speaker 1 (24:10):
So but yeah, it is interesting to have a movie
and story where you're kind of showing the darker side
of angels much kind of like how they were portrayed
in the Old Testament.

Speaker 3 (24:19):
And director what's his name.

Speaker 1 (24:22):
Deess, Yeah, Widen He did write Gabriel's role with Walking
in Mind, so it is kind of great that he,
you know, signed on for it.

Speaker 2 (24:31):
Yeah. I think you know, we're going to talk I
hope about how much you know, stuff we love in
this movie. So just to start off with what I
think er it's flaws. I already mentioned that the plot
is obviously very convoluted. You can't. You can't easily condense
it to like a general audience's level of like, oh,
it's this guy. Because Grigory Widen has talked about, you know,
part of his inspiration if this movie is the Terminator,

(24:53):
and all you need to do is watch the first Terminator.

Speaker 3 (24:55):
Excuse me, Terminator two. I mean Prophecy too. Prophecy Too
is literally Terminator to right.

Speaker 2 (25:01):
Yeah, of course it totally you could put them.

Speaker 3 (25:03):
It's almost like a Wizard of Oz and and.

Speaker 2 (25:05):
And I think Prophecy Too is more easily accessible if
you like, if you started somebody with that one, they'd
be like, oh I get it, yeah sure, yeah, yeah,
you know. But like this one, you know, it doesn't
have that that easy clarity of purpose where it's like, Okay,
these people are trying to do this, and this person's
trying to do this. The end, it's like, this person's
trying to do this, but then they have a different
idea and it goes this way, this person's kind of

(25:26):
trying to do this, but they're not really doing this,
and they're doing this because you know, it's got all
these different facets, which makes it fascinating. But I think
it's really hard for people to sort of get it easy, like, Okay,
here's what the movie is. And also because of its
its budget level. You know, this this is a movie that,
you know, one of the other reasons they decided not
to call it God's Armies because it implies like a

(25:46):
war movie almost of you know, there's battles going on,
and really the battle is more you know, subtle, it's
more psychological, it's more one to one. It's not there's
not an army in this, you know. Or there's one
shot of like bodies on stakes and even yeah, it's
a little gamy.

Speaker 1 (26:01):
Which they try to get to in the Prophecy three
when they're just like we angels hang out in this
jungle gym of justice, you know, and you're just like,
what the hell is going on? You couldn't do any
better than that, Eric Roberts, Okay.

Speaker 2 (26:13):
Yeah, Eric Roberts, you're.

Speaker 1 (26:16):
Building up you want to see a fight, and you
never really kind of get it.

Speaker 2 (26:19):
Yeah, any and the fight in this movie, the climax
is a little bit more exorcisty than not Right, and it's.

Speaker 1 (26:25):
Which, Yeah, I love the the when we get there,
Oh my god, I love the end of this movie.

Speaker 2 (26:29):
So much. But yeah, in terms of like selling it
to a general audience, it's hard and and yeah, certainly
there was a lot of confusion because again of the
cultural thought of what angels are. Culturally, you know, people
were not ready to sort of accept this as an idea.
I think this there's a reason why this movie was
so influential to movies that you said already, like you know,

(26:50):
Legion and Constantine later on, and that sort of thing
where you know, because of this movie, you could make
those movies and have people go, oh, yeah, evil angels, Okay,
I kind of get it. Whereas before this, I think
the only like alternative angel media that had happened just
prior was the famous play in nineteen ninety one's Angels
in America, the Tony Kushner play. And even then, the

(27:13):
angels are more metaphorical there. They're not like, fully, you know,
the way that they're predicted depicted in this movie. But
there's a little bit it feels like a little preparation
for this, but not too much, which.

Speaker 1 (27:23):
Growing up Catholic, it's crazy to me that people would
even say that when you just got to remember, like
Lucifer was an angel and a whole bunch of angels
defected with him, so that was already kind of happening.
So a whole second war like Heaven's War, Civil War,
you know, part two.

Speaker 3 (27:39):
It would make a lot of sense if you.

Speaker 1 (27:41):
Really think about it, because angels are jealous as hell,
and Lucifer's petty boots, especially in this He's petty boots.

Speaker 2 (27:47):
I love that. Is that a real freddy petty boots.

Speaker 3 (27:51):
Steal it from the drag queens?

Speaker 2 (27:52):
Oh that's awesome, I love it. Yeah, And I think
that the other thing for me that keeps this movie
sort of cult movie and on the down low as
opposed to like, oh, if anybody could see this and
totally get it right from the start is you have
this plot, which is, like we said, convoluted and takes
a while to get going. It takes maybe until halfway
through the movie where you're finally like, oh, I get

(28:14):
the stakes, now, I get the goal now, blah blah blah.
I think that Why didn't this is the only I believe,
the only movie he directed I couldn't.

Speaker 1 (28:24):
Yeah, Well, he wrote my favorite movie. Well, like had
a lot to do with writing one of my favorite movie.
In nineteen eighty six, Highlander.

Speaker 2 (28:30):
Yeah, and I was gonna say comparing this movie to Highlander,
which is I think it's closest comparison point in terms
of how crazy the plot is in the in the concept.
You think of Highlander, you think of Russell Mulkay, the
director's work on that movie. That movie is just the
most visual thing could ever think of. It's so watchable
and it's got the musical Queen and Michael Caine and
all that. So even as a first time viewer of Highlander,

(28:53):
even if you're thinking, what the hell is going on,
I don't make this does make any sense? Why would they?

Speaker 1 (28:57):
Hailey just watched it for the first time and that
was pretty much like, this is hilarious.

Speaker 3 (29:01):
This movie is crazy.

Speaker 2 (29:02):
But yeah, Russell really meets the material on its own
level of craziness, where it's just like, let's do these
crazy shots, these awesome vistas, these you know, wild you
know New York City at night landscapes and people getting
their heads cut off by swords and lightning flying everywhere. Sure,
you know it's it's really just one of the most
engrossing movies that you could think of in terms of
on a pure visceral level. And I don't think Widen

(29:24):
brings that quality to the Prophecy, where it is a
pretty movie. Like if you get into oh it's stunning,
Yeah it is, because like the way they shot it,
and I think Arizona, this small town in Arizona, they
get these amazing views of the mountain ranges and all
that sort of thing, cliffs and all that. So when
you get into it, you know you're getting it a
lot back. But I don't think it has that instant
connectivity that Highlander does. And I think that missing both

(29:48):
that and the plot clarity, I think maybe allowed it,
you know, to be too confusing for general audience, you know.

Speaker 1 (29:54):
Well, and it was also kind of like they're making
a movie that's supposed to cater to horror fans, and
then they were making ones that they wanted to cater
towards fantasy fans while also trying to cater towards cinema
fans at the same time, and it kind of all
gets mixed together. And like, not that the movie feels
short in any way, it's what an hour in thirty
seven forty minutes.

Speaker 3 (30:15):
I think two hours.

Speaker 1 (30:16):
Would have really helped a little bit, because a critique
I have is Thomas's character, we don't ever really find
out what those flashes are, like he's having visions, and
I feel like they do kind of like they're like, oh,
it's like this and that, but they're not very specific
until you get to the second movie.

Speaker 3 (30:31):
What the hell that is?

Speaker 1 (30:32):
When you should really let me know in the first movie,
in case I never watched the second movie.

Speaker 2 (30:36):
Okay, Oh, it's so great that you mentioned that. For
two reasons. One is the fact that, yeah, it's it
just doesn't have that instant clarity that it feels like
the deeper you get into the movie, litt alone, the franchise,
like it just becomes clearer in retrospect, which is not
necessarily how it should work in the first place. And
that apparently the original cut of this movie was two hours,

(30:58):
and it was of course Bob Weinstein was like, no
cut that out cut that out cut that out.

Speaker 1 (31:01):
They ravaged this movie, which I you know, as we know,
they've done to so many other movies, which is another
reason it didn't come out for two years.

Speaker 2 (31:09):
Yep, yeap, Which is why I think the reason this
movie works as well as it does is because they
did have that extended period of post so they were
able to refine the you know, one hour thirty seven
minute cut to the fact to the point where like,
it never feels to me like a bosched movie does,
where you can sort of feel it as you're watching it, like, well,
those cuts don't make any sense, and how come this

(31:30):
is happening here and all that you know, this does
feel at least considered enough that you know, it doesn't
ever take me out of it, but it definitely also
at the same time feels like, yeah, there could have
been easily twenty more minutes of this and maybe it
would have helped. But I wanted to specifically bring this
up to you as since we're in the flaws section
right now, because they even mentioned it on one of
the commentary tracks I listened to, I think the one

(31:52):
with Widen and producer Joel Swason or Sweat Sweat Song
I'm not sure how to pronounce his last name, where
they both are making they both are making fun of
Elias Koteis's hair piece.

Speaker 3 (32:05):
Oh my god, that will They have a lot of
hair to.

Speaker 2 (32:08):
Make fun of in this act, I will tell you though,
because apparently Eliskoteas hated it. He was like his existence on.

Speaker 3 (32:14):
The whole movie only handsome.

Speaker 2 (32:16):
The only well he does look handsome. The only reason
he had to wear it is because one of the producers,
probably Einstein, they didn't say, uh, insisted that he have
it because they were like, he doesn't have a classic
leading man look. We want him to have like the
classic leading man look. Wow.

Speaker 1 (32:30):
And that middle thing like that thing, that piece is ridiculous.
It doesn't even like it doesn't even move. But speaking
of hair, since we brought it up, when we get
because Christopher Walken doesn't come in for I would say,
what like twenty minutes, twenty minutes or so, because like
Eric Stultz kind of goes out and you have this

(32:51):
gorgeous you know, hair coming through, and then in comes
Christopher walkin looking like little miss lady clarel, she lac
black shoe, polished hair like you have never seen, sharp
eyed in and this like I call it, you know,
pussy popin red lip with so much kicked up makeup
on because he was what like forty, I don't even know. Yeah,

(33:12):
he looks young in it, but they have him caked
up and just black box dye hair and I don't
know I was It makes me laugh every time, but
he looked great.

Speaker 3 (33:24):
I thought his costume was amazing.

Speaker 2 (33:26):
And what makes me think of part of the reason Weinstein,
you know, Bob in this case was so bullish on
acquiring this movie was they had just had the year before,
which you and I discussed very eagerly the success with
The Crow, and I'm thinking that they must have seen
this as like, oh, this is our next Crow, you know.

Speaker 1 (33:44):
Oh yes, slay you little gough angel. You know, he's
mad and daddy, you know.

Speaker 2 (33:50):
Yeah, totally and like not to take anything away from
either actor, with Brandon Lee and Christopher Walking are not
the same type.

Speaker 3 (33:57):
So no, that's true. That's true.

Speaker 2 (34:00):
So I get what they were kind of thinking. But
that is very like studio exect think where it's like, yeah,
the same thing, and I was like, the same thing.

Speaker 1 (34:07):
Not really well, And then they even kind of go
against their own story because we have Eric Stoltz tries
to give us a quick little synopsis in the beginning
about what's going on, and he's like, now that we're
on Earth, we're human, but then they still have powers,
and I'm like, you're not human if you can sniff
another angel.

Speaker 3 (34:23):
Out like Wolverine, you know, like, oh, danger's coming.

Speaker 1 (34:25):
They're sniffing and licking everything, They're doing all this weird shit,
their mouth to mouthing everybody, which.

Speaker 2 (34:32):
Yeah, we'll talk about that, okay, But I wanted to say,
as we're still on the topic of different cuts, apparently
there is a very different cut of this movie that exists,
which we here in the Western territories don't have access to.
And I don't know why they couldn't find it. When
I say they, I mean producers of these Blu rays
and four k's, because the only thing that I saw

(34:54):
of it was a little snippet of a deleted scene
on the Australian Blu ray release of the Prophecy collection
which I have, which is an alternate opening or I
don't know if it's alternate or additional opening, but it's
a shot of a child playing a young Thomas, you know,
Elias Cotaez's character, like on a swing set, and because
they referenced throughout the movie, Thomas like talking to his

(35:16):
angels or talking to people, you know, in his childhood,
that sort of thing, and in this instance it's literally
him on a swing set talking to an off screen
you don't see, but you hear. Vigo Mortensen as the Devil,
where Vigo's devil is talking about Hey, Tommy, like, you know,
why do you believe in angels or something? And Little

(35:36):
Tommy's like, oh, because my angel Simon told me that
I'm going to be important someday. And he's like, why
do you believe that what's going to happen in the
future that's going to be important? You know?

Speaker 3 (35:44):
So I love that.

Speaker 2 (35:45):
It's kind of cute, and it gives the movie right
off the bat feeling. You know. I think which would
have been a better vibe to Chase. I think it's
I think it's in the movie. But I think this movie,
as we just said, it was trying to maybe be Highlander,
maybe be a Terminator, maybe be a crow, when really
the closest analog that I feel is maybe the best

(36:06):
for this movie is X Files, you know, yeause it
has that procedural vibe. It has that you know, hey,
could there really be these supernatural creatures in reality? Like
would that be?

Speaker 1 (36:15):
Like you you know, That's why I was like, that's
why they had to get a defective from the church
priest to be the cop, because nobody else would just
like he.

Speaker 3 (36:24):
Was like, oh my god, it's the look of revolutions.
This is exactly what's happening.

Speaker 1 (36:27):
It's the angels. And then the corner's like, Okay, man,
I agree with you. I guess, but I guess after
you see something that crazy, you would. But just telling
me my name back, like Christopher Walking does to every character,
and this would not convince me immediately that you're a
little angel or something.

Speaker 3 (36:43):
When he's like, get out of here, Catherine, she's like.

Speaker 1 (36:45):
Oh, okay, I'm just gonna copy that, you know, and
leave you up here while I'm downstairs with my classroom
of twenty five children.

Speaker 2 (36:53):
Yeah, right, that's fine. Maybe the horn would do it
for me. I don't know, the horn that blows out
of windows.

Speaker 3 (36:58):
The horn is the best.

Speaker 1 (36:59):
Honestly, that's probably my favorite scene, getting the little kids
to actually be the ones that do it too, so funny.

Speaker 2 (37:05):
Yeah, that's a really good bit. Yeah, since we brought
it up and we don't want to forget it. The
whole passing souls back and forth, kissing.

Speaker 1 (37:13):
On the mouth, well, even those kids sitting on Christopher
watkins lap isn't as cringey as Eric Stolt's entire interaction
with that little girl. And I know in a way,
I watched it this time and noticed it completely.

Speaker 3 (37:27):
Different than any other time.

Speaker 1 (37:28):
And I was making that joke to you that I
always was into him, So I was like, oh, look,
he's into girls my age when I was like eleven.
So maybe that's why it wasn't creepy, because he flirts
with this little kid the like I don't eat like
a first time.

Speaker 3 (37:40):
Look was going on here? What's gone on here? And
like maybe I'm just reading into it?

Speaker 1 (37:44):
And then it cuts back to them again and they're
sharing a soda out of two straws out of one soda,
and she's sitting on his lap, and I was like,
what the fuck is going on here?

Speaker 2 (37:52):
You know, when was the whole scandal of the Catholic
church and young boys pedophilia? Well, was that around this nineties?

Speaker 3 (38:00):
I would think, So what was that movie?

Speaker 2 (38:02):
Yeah? No, yeah, the movie Redarkfulow would be later. But
I wonder if like the first you know, big scandal
stories had broken.

Speaker 1 (38:11):
Our No, I mean what year was that most have
taken place?

Speaker 2 (38:14):
Yeah, I don't remember, but it feels like it could
be around this time anyway. Maybe it's maybe Stultz was thinking,
you know, hey, I gotta I gotta shout out for
the headero.

Speaker 3 (38:26):
Listen.

Speaker 2 (38:27):
But I will say that apparently this was like fully
part of Stultz's uh incomplete like thought about his character
and what they should be doing, because as the one
of the special features, the one of the cinematographers there
were two because one unfortunately got fired during production, but
I think it was Bruce Douglas Johnson. I could be

(38:51):
I hope I'm not wrong about that, but I think
he was the one that that was the final DP,
and he was talking about how the way that this
schedule worked out, they shot most of the exteriors in
the Arizona town first, and then they went back to
La for like interiors and set work and all that.
And so the scene where Stultz's character sucks out the

(39:11):
soul of the general in the church and the you know,
the coffin was done later in a studio in La
or a church in La like an actual abandoned church
that Joel Swassan had once worked at. It was abandoned hospital, sorry,
because Joel Swassan used it for a lot of other productions,
including Maniac Cop three. It was the City of Angels

(39:32):
or the Something of Angels, hospital ironically something angels so
that you know, that was just serendipitous. But anyway, so
they shot the scene of Stults walking out of the
church in Arizona way before that, like months before, and
you know this dop tells a story of watching Stults
do that, you know, kind of just average establishing a shot,

(39:53):
just you know, seeing him walk out of the thing,
and in that shot he licks his lips and at
the time, the cinematograph remembers, you know, filming that shot
and going, what the hell he's looking his lives for?
That's weird. And then later when they did you know,
the sucking the soul out scene, he was like, oh,
because it was a kiss and because he was sucking
the solout and because he'd already thought about that in advance.
So you know, this is I'm trying to say, this

(40:15):
is not fully just Eric Stults being a creepy right now,
you thought, like.

Speaker 3 (40:19):
He's very different.

Speaker 1 (40:20):
Well, you know what they did that I think is
it made it wrong and made it creepy.

Speaker 3 (40:25):
Is Eric Stolts.

Speaker 1 (40:26):
They have him when he's talking to the little girl,
he's talking directly into the camera. So there's this different
kind of connection because you're looking into his eyes and
he's being like, ah, have a gift for you, little girl.

Speaker 3 (40:37):
And I want to give it to you.

Speaker 1 (40:39):
And he's like you're a very clever, clever girl, and
like touching her face and then he opens her mouth
and you're like what is he doing?

Speaker 3 (40:46):
What is he doing?

Speaker 1 (40:47):
Because it's just very different, Like you could have done
this scene where their like mouths almost touched and you
have like the ball go through kind of like they
did with the other scene. Like sure he put his
mouth on that guy, but it wasn't very like.

Speaker 3 (41:02):
Sensual in a way. And then he's like grabbing her face.

Speaker 1 (41:04):
I'm like, man, they're really going for this here when
they've made some choices they didn't have to go fully
and like that.

Speaker 3 (41:11):
You know, I wonder if that little actress is great.

Speaker 2 (41:14):
Yeah, she's great. I wonder if the thought was, you know, hey,
this is a movie that's approaching Exorcist material, so like
should we be really like transgressive shocking? Yeah, oking, yeah,
because you know everything's been done before she masturbated with
the crucial fix in that movie, so we can't yeah,
you know sort of thing. But yeah, her her name
because she's actual native American.

Speaker 1 (41:34):
Uh Moira's Shining.

Speaker 2 (41:36):
Dust Moira Shining Deve Snider A.

Speaker 1 (41:38):
Yeah, she is so stunningly beautiful in the third one
when she pops up, I'm like, oh, hey.

Speaker 2 (41:43):
Girl, apparently they just like find her for that one
for the third one. Really, yeah, she'd already like kind
of left the business by that point.

Speaker 1 (41:49):
She does so well in this movie because in the
beginning she's like, Hi, basy guy, Hi see I Bangy
Simfoo will be friends, and then later she's.

Speaker 3 (41:57):
Like, I caught the faces off all those Chinese and.

Speaker 1 (42:00):
I was like, holy shit, she has some levels and
like she's like the best scene is when she's like
when they're standing on the cliff and she's telling him,
you know, how to little tidbuts on how to stop
what's happening, and she's just got that monotone. She's crushing it.
She doesn't even sound like a little kid anymore. And
I was just like, Wow, for your age, you crushed

(42:22):
this role.

Speaker 2 (42:23):
Yeah. Well, apparently she had a small screen career, but
she had a fairly extensive stage career. I was learning,
oh good, But just before this was shot, she was
in a production on Broadway or almost on Broadway of
like a sequel to Annie, which I think did get
played at like the Kennedy Center or the Link or something,
Lincoln Center maybe, but it never made it quite to

(42:45):
Broadway or something. But yeah, so she I think that
it must have been something where she and her parents
thought like she was going to be like a big
child actor, you know sort of thing, and I you know,
maybe it was because of this movie not taking off
in a big way that they sort of pulled back
on that. I don't know, but but yeah, I know
it's too bad that she didn't do more stuff because
she's very, very good.

Speaker 3 (43:03):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (43:04):
My one little fun little tidbit, it was during production
there was like a huge lightning storm with one hundred
and twenty mile per hour winds, like godly storm that
destroyed their little Indian village set and it blew it
all the way off.

Speaker 2 (43:18):
Yeah. I was on the top of a bet or
a clifford. Yeah, clearly high up there. Yeah. Do you
know the story that Widen loves to tell about that
is they were working with the real Native American actors
and folks who were going to be part of the
scene on that set, and they were really on location.
They were really up there, and Widen saw that cloud

(43:42):
starting to form and got a little worried, and he
went over to one of the Native American men. I
think you might have been a medicine man or a
chief or something like that. But he asked him, like, hey,
should I worry about that cloud? And the guy was like,
you know, normally I would say no, but I did
happen to see a dead coyote on the way here today. However,

(44:05):
that's not as bad as say, hitting an owl or
you know, having an owl die, and so you don't worry.
And then literally like fifteen minutes later, Widen learned that
the car that was driving a man of plumber to
the set had hit an owl. So, oh my god,
here comes the storm and uh yeah, and they had

(44:26):
a time getting their set back together after it's been
destroyed and all that.

Speaker 3 (44:30):
That's pretty fun though.

Speaker 1 (44:31):
That's one of those little like the Omen or like
all the bird things that happened in the Exorcist, like
don't mess around with the god stuff.

Speaker 2 (44:38):
Yeah, knowing that the guy he's going to come visit.

Speaker 1 (44:39):
Your set, yeah, and lay waste to your Native American village.
Speaking of the devil, can we pivot to Vigo.

Speaker 2 (44:47):
Now there's differing stories on who was going to play
this role originally because Vigo was a replacement.

Speaker 1 (44:53):
Yeah, yet again another film where Vigo Mortisen has one
day to get ready.

Speaker 2 (44:58):
Yeah. So, uh. The story that I believe, which is
the one Whyden tells, which is that it was supposed
to be Sean Penn, and that Sean Penn was committed
to do it, but it was because of I think
dead Man Walking going along that he could no longer
do it. However, the DP for some reason was believing
that Malcolm McDowell was the guy that was going to

(45:20):
do it.

Speaker 1 (45:21):
Oh, I went, don't like that as much. I think
Vigo is the best choice of all those gentlemen.

Speaker 2 (45:25):
But yeah, so it was it was probably going to
be Sean Penn. But yeah, so this was another like
you said, Vigo last minute, and like, man does he
come in and kill it?

Speaker 3 (45:34):
Listen?

Speaker 1 (45:34):
So you have Christopher Walking eating up every scene he's in.

Speaker 3 (45:38):
And I don't know when Vigo comes.

Speaker 1 (45:40):
I feel like they're pretty equal for who was like
really taking the screen time because man, he steals the show.
Everybody with their perfect one liners, and then Vigo just
has that voice he's like, God, God is love. I
don't love you. And then you know when he talks
about putting shit in her mouth or whatever her mom's shit,
he's like, I'll lay you out and fill your mouth

(46:00):
with your mom's vcs or we can talk. And he
kind was like, what do you say. I was like, yeah,
he said exactly what you think he said.

Speaker 2 (46:09):
And they love telling the story of that. Like one
of the first things that Vego brought to Widen and
the other producer and everything was, hey, guys, so during
my first monologue scene with Virginia Madsen, I really want
to pull a flower out of my ass and thorns
and all, he said. And they were like, okay, Vego, Uh, well,
you know we have to shoot this tomorrow and like

(46:31):
how are we going to safely do that? And like
do we just show that pull.

Speaker 3 (46:35):
A yellow rose out my cask?

Speaker 2 (46:36):
So their compromise was like, okay, we'll shoot it, but
like only from the chest up or something, and so.

Speaker 3 (46:41):
Yeah, then he eats it, which makes no sense.

Speaker 1 (46:44):
But yeah, like I was saying, the devil is petty boots,
Like I can't have anyone stepping in my daisies. And
if you know, what like, you know what I mean,
It's like, late, lady, can you help me out? And
I would be like, what the fuck do you need
my help with? You're literally the devil and I'm a
third to seventh grade teacher. Because we're you know again,
these characters just not asking enough realistic questions.

Speaker 2 (47:05):
Yeah, yeah, I know. There's a lot of like, uh,
the suspension of disbelief on the audience's part, but also
on the character's part of like, Okay, we really want
to get to the next cool idea or thing, so
we kind of have to not ask the obvious, you know,
down to earth questions like what the hell's going on.
In fact, Widen loves to tell a story about how

(47:26):
that introductory scene between Elias Ktaas was Thomas right, Thomas
and Simon you know Eric Stoltz where they're talking together
and I think Thomas's apartment, I think it is. He
said that that was the heart one of the hardest
scenes to film in the whole movie, because Koteas like
couldn't wrap his mind around what was going on. He
was like, wait, there's a freaking angel standing right in

(47:46):
front of me, like and I you know, I lost
my faith you know, but I used to be really
religious and now this is happening. It's confirmation, Like shouldn't
I be freaking the hell out about the freaking out? Yeah?
And Widen was like, you know what, like at a
certain point, you just have to play the costume, you know,
thing where it's like otherwise we'll ever like we'll ever
move on, you know. And yeah, I think that speaks
to what we were saying earlier about how the one

(48:08):
of the the flaws in the movie is the fact
that it just is a lot to ask, you know,
where you do have to sort of get over these
hurdles of you know, what would really happen if this happened.

Speaker 1 (48:18):
Yeah, well, the more you think about it, the way
that Vigo Mortis plays the devil, it's like he could
come up and do whatever he wanted and like fight
Christopher Walkin, but like, why do it when I can
influence these stupid humans to kind of do it for
me and like I don't really have to do anything
until the end, which is very lucifer of him.

Speaker 2 (48:36):
Well, I mean one of the one of the I
guess spiritual influences on the movie is you know, John
Milton's Paradise Lost, which is that epic poem about you know,
I love it.

Speaker 3 (48:45):
I have that book.

Speaker 2 (48:45):
Yeah, in the in the Fall of Lucifer and the
Creation of Hell and all that, And I think Vigo
clearly is just keyed in or locked into that idea
of the devil, the conception of the character. You know, yes,
this very erudite and tell jin clearly evil, but in
a way that's not so base, you know, it's not
so aggressive like I'm gonna beat you up and to

(49:06):
kill you sort of thing. It's more just this insidiousness
of you know, manipulation and yeah, like.

Speaker 1 (49:12):
Well even at the end, he's like, so, who's coming
with me? And they're like no, no, no, no no no.

Speaker 3 (49:16):
He's like, are you sure? I might see you later?
And then he bursts into a thing of pigeons.

Speaker 1 (49:22):
That's what they look like to me, And I thought
that was hilarious.

Speaker 2 (49:25):
Clearly, if there's one shot that's so clearly like, let's
do another.

Speaker 1 (49:30):
Thomas, right, the anime ghost is gone, his house is clean.

Speaker 2 (49:39):
But yeah, and apparently you know when they when Walking
and Vigo were doing their climactic scene together, uh, you know,
Widen and Swassan, Uh, love to talk about how Walkin
was like the biggest professional on set, like super even
when he like apparently chewed out Joel Swassan for some
condition that he wasn't happy with, he like deliber led

(50:00):
him away from everybody else in the set just to
yell at him and then like walked all the way
back so that they wouldn't create a scene, you know,
so it wouldn't be like a gossip ye kind of
like ooh, the stars getting mad at the producer sort
of thing. It was more of a just hey, I
want to let you know, and then also we'll walk back.
But apparently the one of Watkins' things is he's exactly

(50:20):
what you might think he might be where it's like
he loved chewing garlic for some reason. He just had
garlic in his mouth all the time unless it was
during a scene, and that he was very creatively competitive,
so anybody, any other actor who he was in the
scene with, he would either dominate or like you know,

(50:42):
try to like you know, instigate or something. And so
apparently his scene with Vigo like was according to Widen
and Swassan, who you know, worked with him through the
whole movie, that was like that was the one time
we could tell that Chris was like legitimately nervous where
it's like, oh, this guy's really good, like you know,
he's you know this, this is not somebody I'm gonna
easily blow out of the water, Like I'm gonna have
to work hard to like, you know, get to his level.

Speaker 1 (51:04):
So yeah, and I mean he just has some of
the coolest scenes, like when we first see him walk
into that morgue and the guy's like, hey, do you
have a pass and he's just like sh and he
passes out.

Speaker 3 (51:15):
I we still do that, like I do it all
the time.

Speaker 2 (51:18):
Yeah, Oh dude. Even the moment in when he's talking
to Thomas and the church and he's like, you know,
when you were young, I told you a secret and
then I told you.

Speaker 1 (51:26):
You know how you got that? And I told you
a secret put my finger there and I said.

Speaker 2 (51:31):
That was not that was Watkins's idea good for him,
which is so cool. And his whole interaction with Adam
Goldberg and then later Amanda Plumber just like the way
that I mean Goldberg being Goldberg, he plays it, you know,
very He's so funny. He's very funny.

Speaker 1 (51:46):
They get the best little Gargoyle or whatever, like the
Renfields pretty much.

Speaker 2 (51:51):
The Renfield's total Renfield type character, which is so great.
But when Plumber's character comes in, it just she emphasizes
the tragedy and the sadness of this situation. Yeah, he's
just like not letting up. He's just sort of like, uh,
you any breakfast?

Speaker 3 (52:05):
Once your ice cream?

Speaker 2 (52:06):
Ice cream?

Speaker 1 (52:07):
You can eat all the ice creamy win. Yeah, And
it's and I love that waitress at the diner. He's like,
we're probably not going to meet again, and she's like
thank god, or she says something really subtle.

Speaker 3 (52:17):
But guess what they do in three? And I love
them all the.

Speaker 1 (52:20):
Cameos later in three, Like cameos that come up are
just people that you've already met throughout the series.

Speaker 3 (52:25):
And I really like that they did that.

Speaker 2 (52:27):
It is really fun. Yeah. And again, like where Gabriel's
character goes in the next couple of sequels, it's just
it's so cool too. I Mean, even if the impetus
was like, let's just give Chris some some room to
play or some different things to play, Hey, whoa, it's fun, man,
It's really fun. And I think that's why those sequels

(52:47):
are of the caliber that they are as opposed to.
You know, yeah, I love Doug Bradley, but you know,
doing Terrible hell Raiser after Terrible hell Raiser, you know,
it's like, buddy, get out, come on.

Speaker 1 (52:58):
I want to bring up some moral things that I
thought were really funny in this movie that's supposed to
be about religious this and that. First and foremost, obviously
is Eric Sultz's Simon giving this soul to this poor
innocent little girl like he's doing something nice for her.

Speaker 3 (53:14):
It is so wrong.

Speaker 1 (53:15):
It is so messed up, and it's like, I don't know,
you could have figured something else out, but like morally,
the way he did it, and knowing what he was doing,
like you don't know what was going to happen after that.
He knew he was going to die, so he's like,
good luck, little girl. I hope he's you know, he
sells it to her like this is very special. It's horrible.
It's horrible. That guy was a piece of shit. He
was a nasty bitch and he kept everybody's faces. And

(53:37):
the thing that's funny is like back then, you didn't
have the internet, so nobody.

Speaker 3 (53:40):
Was googling, you know, Captain fuckface and what he.

Speaker 1 (53:43):
Did in the war are getting like kicked out in
this town of twelve people, but he had his own
reels and stuff, like there was obviously video of it
on that.

Speaker 3 (53:52):
Whole stuff side. Stuff is just it's fun and weird.

Speaker 2 (53:55):
By the way, that little like that fake you know,
that faux newsreel or reel of like war footage for
the general's character. That that, to me is the creepiest
stuff in the movie. That really just.

Speaker 1 (54:04):
Sort of it's weird.

Speaker 2 (54:05):
Yeah, have to chill up my spine because of yeah.

Speaker 1 (54:07):
How i'd love human sacrifices.

Speaker 2 (54:09):
Yeah, and I love the idea that, like again the
twist on the Demonic Possession movie here where you know,
we're not talking about being possessed by a demon but
just another human person who's just like is freaking evil,
just super dark and awful. So yeah, that to me
is I guess because it's a little bit more tangible,
you know, when I think of demons or the devil
or something that's more esoteric or hard to nail down

(54:32):
because of my agnosticism. But yes, if you say, like,
you know, hey, that person's going to be posessed by
the soul of Donald Trump, I'd be like, oh my god,
that's fucking terrific, terrible.

Speaker 1 (54:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (54:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (54:44):
Number two.

Speaker 1 (54:46):
At the end when the when Thomas and Catherine are
trying to tell the cops, who are obviously like friends buddies, hey,
you need to.

Speaker 3 (54:56):
Cuff him because he's probably not dead.

Speaker 1 (54:58):
They did not emphasize that, and Thomas literally sees walking
open his eye and wink at him, and then he
just lets them.

Speaker 3 (55:05):
Go to get murdered, like you didn't help your cop.

Speaker 1 (55:08):
Buddies, and you let's let them get slaughtered, like you
knew what were you doing there? Okay, fine, I mean
you hit your head. Okay, I guess that's enough to
let your friends get murdered. Trauma and then the third
ones not morality. Just thought it was funny that Catherine exploded,
uh the little girl in Grandma's house.

Speaker 3 (55:26):
Yeah, with the guns. Yeah we had.

Speaker 1 (55:28):
It's the nineties. You have to have a big, big explosion.
And when she's shooting at them, she blows up their
entire trailer and the only things that they own in
this world, which is not a lot. And I was like,
way to go, Catherine, you just blew up grandma's house.

Speaker 3 (55:40):
Can't she for shit? So don't.

Speaker 1 (55:42):
And you just saw that he shot that not he
I'm sorry, I take that back.

Speaker 3 (55:46):
That Mary clocked that gun and.

Speaker 1 (55:48):
Blam blam blammed Gabriel like three times in his chest,
which was great.

Speaker 3 (55:53):
I was like, I don't know how you know how.

Speaker 1 (55:54):
To do that, girl, but you fucking crush it. But yeah,
then she doesn't even shoot him, shoots all around him
and explodes their home and I just thought that that
was wild. There's a lot of stuff like that, like
him driving the car into the yar where they're performing
the exorcism. Also that's some wild bitch moments.

Speaker 3 (56:15):
Like what are you doing?

Speaker 2 (56:16):
Yeah, apparently killed everybody, like genuinely pissed. It widened about
that because he did like a naughty director thing and
shook the car over her body when he didn't tell
her he was going to do that, and so it
got an actual look of fear out of her. But
like apparently like it. It did not it pissed her off.

Speaker 3 (56:32):
I love that shit. Yeah, do it to me, so
my stuff looks real.

Speaker 2 (56:37):
And yeah, there were I know the DP was talking
on one point about the scene with Uziel that early
angel oh the glasses the glasses guy about him being
thrown out the window of Eric Stultz's place and uh,
you know, falling out of the building onto the car.
Then another car is coming up and hits him, and
it drives right into the wall, but it hits this

(56:58):
post because they couldn't hit the wall, because you can't
drive a car into the wall without damaging the building,
and the building didn't want that to happen, and blah
blah blah. So you know, there's a lot of you
when you watch these movies, you know, it becomes you
watch a lot of movies like we do, it becomes
a little bit inured to like, oh, yeah, it's another
car hit, it's another stunt, it's another of this sort
of washes over you. And it's only when you break

(57:19):
it down and think of the logistics of like each
different piece of this sequence where it's like, Okay, that
takes a lot, you know, and that's not not something
you just do in the snap necessarily. So yeah, I
think this is it's a good example. What I'm trying
to say is it's a good example of how this
movie is very well constructed. And yeah, even if it's
not like the flashiest, you know sort of.

Speaker 1 (57:38):
Thing, well, if you start to pay attention to the
attention to detail. All of the angels have not fully
black nails, but blackish nails, which I really think is cool.

Speaker 3 (57:49):
You know, I don't know, there's.

Speaker 2 (57:51):
Blacked out ice is a cool effect. I mean, it's
clearly a possible.

Speaker 3 (57:54):
Oh you've never had eyes, You're like, what, But.

Speaker 2 (57:57):
It's it's a neat looking effect for sure. Uh. What
else do we want to talk about? I feel like
we do.

Speaker 1 (58:04):
Although speaking of attention to details, they keep one shot
in that I really hope to god was just something happening.
It's when Catherine and Thomas are talking outside at recess.
This one little kid nails this other kid in the
face with the ball so hard, and I'm glad that
they kept it in there because he was like, hey, Bill, bam,
And Bill looked at me and he's like, oh, And

(58:24):
that's the only scene that they show of the kids
like playing in the yard. And I was like, I
just hope that they were doing b roll and that
actually happened and they just kept it in.

Speaker 2 (58:33):
Yeah. But yeah, I think ultimately it's it's uh, it
feels to me like the biggest appeal of the film
is probably the actors, the characters, the dialogue. You know,
it's just seeing these people deliver this stuff with such
conviction and interest. I don't know if any of the
actors when they were making this we're like looking down

(58:54):
on the material, But from what I could gather, they weren't,
you know. Yeah, the only issues that Kotaas had was
like his hair and the fact that he wasn't constantly
freaking out in every scene.

Speaker 1 (59:04):
Yeah. I remember him being like, oh I didn't give
more to the role or this, and that I wasn't
like where I was supposed to be. And they definitely
recast him in the second one when.

Speaker 2 (59:12):
He gets murdered, yeah with guy.

Speaker 3 (59:15):
Yeah, Oh my god, the sequels get.

Speaker 2 (59:18):
But yeah, I mean, but even despite his reservations, which
I think are founded, but just the quality of his
voice even is just a great addition to the movie.
You know, there's a line because he has his like
voiceover narration in the movie. There's a line that he
has where he's quoting I don't know if this actual scripture,
actual Bible quotation or not, but he said I think

(59:41):
it says even now in heaven there are angels carrying
savage weapons, and that little snippet is the sample on
one of my favorite Uncle tracks called Eye for an
Eye Oh Wow album from like two thousand and three
or something. And so every time I hear him say that,
I'm like ready to start jamming, you know, because I'm

(01:00:04):
just like, yeah, let's go.

Speaker 3 (01:00:06):
You know, that's so funny.

Speaker 2 (01:00:08):
And I do think, yeah, this is a movie that
like really appeals to audiences that are a bit more
imaginative and intellectual in the sense that like, you're not
getting a visual delivery system of here's what God's army
looks like, or here's what even even angels like. You
get that great opening shot of the bones in the

(01:00:28):
sand or the whatever, yeah, the angel and and the
wing you know, bones too, and it's like, you know,
we never see.

Speaker 3 (01:00:35):
You don't see any wings in this movie besides the movie.

Speaker 2 (01:00:38):
But having that in your imagination, if you're an imaginative
person or you know, intellectual, it allows that to carry
through the rest of the movie and you're thinking, oh,
maybe these people have wings somewhere, you know, where they
hiding them? Or how what do they look like?

Speaker 1 (01:00:50):
You know, sort of do you think speaking of Highland
or you think that Eric Stultz is going to pull
a katana or something out of that big jacket. But
then you're like, oh no, wait, this is angels. They're
probably hiding their way there.

Speaker 3 (01:01:00):
But then you never.

Speaker 1 (01:01:01):
See it because unlike other movies in the nineties, there's
no sexy sexy time in this no sex. Nobody's making out,
no one's taking their clothes off. Even though at the
end they're like Thomas and Catherine have their arms around
each other.

Speaker 3 (01:01:13):
I'm like, okay, I guess they're like a couple nour
you know or whatever, but they don't. There's no kissing.

Speaker 1 (01:01:18):
There's it's it's very rare for the movies made around
that time to have no nudity or anything like that.

Speaker 2 (01:01:24):
Oh yeah, especially for exploitation or a you know, genre film.

Speaker 1 (01:01:27):
Yeah, especially a religious film, which they remedy in the
next one.

Speaker 2 (01:01:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:01:34):
But yeah, no, we never take the we never.

Speaker 1 (01:01:36):
Take off the uh the huge trench coats that they're
all wearing a La hall under and uh.

Speaker 3 (01:01:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:01:42):
It's it's funny because you want to see wings, but
then you never see it. They perch on things like
little birds.

Speaker 2 (01:01:47):
Like as like some sort of wire. I love it.

Speaker 3 (01:01:51):
I love it so much.

Speaker 2 (01:01:53):
Yeah, and again this is I'm just recounting all the
stories that I heard in the commentary. But Widen, uh,
you know, was telling all the actors playing angels that
they were going to do this perching thing, and they
were you know, asking them because I guess the way
that the rig worked is that the actor would choose
how they were going to perch before that rig could
be manipulated to or like molded to them. So okay,

(01:02:16):
So when the crow right when he approached Walking with
this walking and said, I'm gonna do my own perching,
you know, not necessarily meaning like he was going to
do it all himself without wires. Of course he was
the wires, but like he meant like he wanted to
research it first. And so apparently, you know Widen, who
at the time was living in the Hollywood Hills and Walking,
who was staying in the Chateau Marmont, which is just

(01:02:36):
down on Sunset. At like two in the morning, Uh,
Widen gets a call and he's like, yeah, who is it?
You know, why are you calling me at two am?
It's like, Greg, it's Chris. And I was like, yes,
what do we want Chris? And Chris is like, I'm perching.

Speaker 3 (01:02:52):
I nailed it. I know what I'm gonna do.

Speaker 2 (01:02:54):
I'm talking to you right now. I'm perching. He's like, Okay,
that's great, Chris, that's so funny.

Speaker 1 (01:03:00):
So but yeah, I mean, if you like this one,
venture into the next ones. I mean little Britney Murphy
is his ren Field in the second market what's her name?
Like is And let me tell you something. I haven't
seen those two in years. It's all just kind of
been coming back to me as we've been watching, like
talking about it more so than the first one, which
I think is funny.

Speaker 2 (01:03:19):
It is funny, and I do think it really does
speak to how you know. You could say that the
sequels are a bit more conventional, but I don't think
shorter that's a detriment. I don't think it's a Yeah,
it's a diss to say that they are. Because Brad
Dorif is an opening of the third one, I think it.

Speaker 1 (01:03:34):
Is, yeah, for very little what but like his character
just kind of just But when we want to talk
about the Terminator comparisons, that's where like Christopher Walken even
like shows up naked in the middle of a parking
lot after not Vigo Mortison like brings kicks him out
of hell because he's like, get it, it's not you
can't be down here. Well, I'm really mad at you.
Still get the hell out of here. There can only

(01:03:55):
be one kind of I get back to Highlander.

Speaker 2 (01:03:57):
Yeah, but you know, I was surprised that I even
enjoyed the fourth and fifth movie, which were the other
directive video sequels that have no Christopher walking. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:04:07):
No, I only remember one, two, and three.

Speaker 2 (01:04:08):
Which which Joel Swassan wrote and directed. Both of those. Wow,
they're the only ones that have like a continuity because
even though Thomas's character is in the second one, it's
a different actor. Even though Gabriel's in the first three, Like,
Gabriel's constantly being reinvented, you know in terms of like, yeah,
where he's at and what he's trying to do.

Speaker 1 (01:04:28):
So there is this whole Nephelins or whatever they're called, yeah,
which is an angel human crossover baby that everyone's like,
oh no, they're going to stop all the evil in
the world, so they become the mcguffin.

Speaker 2 (01:04:41):
Yeah. And then the fourth and fifth one, it's a
woman who can is the only one who could read
a certain passage of this book that's just been written
by the gods or god, you know, like that it
takes place in like mostly in like Russis that's where
they had to shoot it or something. So okay, and yeah,
but I think all of the movies have a really

(01:05:01):
pleasing continuity of tone, you know, they never there's not
one that feels like so goofy or so ridiculously changed
from the first one or whatever. And I do think
it was because of this X filey kind of approach
of like, you know, keeping it down to earth quote unquote,
but still allowing these little crazy little bits to pop

(01:05:22):
here and there. Let's talk about the ending, because we
don't want to forget that because you talk about.

Speaker 3 (01:05:26):
It well it does.

Speaker 1 (01:05:26):
Speaking in the ending, the movie feels like a did
you ever see Cigarette Burns? By Clive Barker. It feels
very filmed or not Clive Barker, Carpenter, John Carpenter. It
feels the film very John Carpenter Clive Barker kind of
movie way. When we get to the end, and I
will say, when they pull that demon out or not
the demon, when they pull the shitty spirit out of

(01:05:48):
the girl, that makeup effect that they do on hair
that practical big face.

Speaker 3 (01:05:52):
I don't know what the hell it was. Looks so good,
it just really looks.

Speaker 2 (01:05:55):
It's only for the one shot too, so yeah, it
doesn't let you get used to it or anything like that.
It's just like, whoa, he's.

Speaker 1 (01:06:01):
Not doing demon face. She's not like freaking out. She's
the scene when they show like the general put his
hand on her while they're standing in like the uh cemetery, Yeah, cemetery.
That it's really good imagery. And let me tell you something,
if anybody's going to pull one of those nasty monsters
out of me, I would leave it to the Native
Americans to be able to be the ones that could
do it, because they don't take them to the church.

(01:06:23):
They don't do this or that. They go to her
people to get it out. And they were very confident and.

Speaker 3 (01:06:28):
They did it.

Speaker 2 (01:06:29):
Yeah, they held out. They did it. And I love
too that that this movie, you know, starts with this
basis of you know, rooting in Christian mythology and it
ends in this Native American mythology and tradition. So it
has a feeling of you know, it's not it's not
like a Disney movie. These days of trying to like
appeal to every single demographic it can, but it does
feel diverse in a natural way of like, you know,

(01:06:51):
let's really trying to introduce the rest of the natural
world into this story as opposed to ignoring it, you know,
and being like, no, this is the only this is
the one true God and blow up. You know. It
has that.

Speaker 1 (01:07:01):
Very poltric ice too a lot of other movies that
you know, I.

Speaker 3 (01:07:06):
Have to do with it.

Speaker 2 (01:07:07):
Yeah, that really that sort of tried to encapsulate the
totality of the natural world and other human beliefs and
systems and all that.

Speaker 1 (01:07:16):
No, I you know, it has that classic nineties ending
where like the helicopters taking off and you're just getting
everybody standing a little too close to the cliff's edge
for my comfort. I'm not afraid of heights, but I
was like, yeah, are a little too close.

Speaker 2 (01:07:35):
And this being a Dimension film from nineteen ninety five,
it has to have a pop song at the end.

Speaker 3 (01:07:40):
Oh my god. I was like, this does not go well.

Speaker 1 (01:07:45):
And I will honestly say, I mean the music by
David C. Williams and this is fantastic. It kind of
reminds me of the score from interview with the vampire
just a little bit, but that might just be all
the like ooh, you know, like godly stuff.

Speaker 3 (01:08:00):
But I thought that they crushed They did a really
good job.

Speaker 2 (01:08:03):
Oh totally. Yeah, so it really Yeah, this is a
movie that I feel I don't want to say it
hasn't been given its due because I feel like it's
generally well regarded, you know. Yeah, But at the same time,
I'm glad we're sort of putting a spotlight on it
for its anniversary year just because.

Speaker 3 (01:08:20):
What is this thirty is thirty thirty? Okay?

Speaker 2 (01:08:23):
Yeah? Yeah, and yeah, because it feels like, yeah, it's
not one that's talked about as much as others, And
it's like, yeah, if you want a solid religious horror thriller, fantasy,
you know you can do it.

Speaker 1 (01:08:36):
We're stunning cast, incredible cast, great acting. Eric Stults, I
don't know what the hell he's doing. He's doing something weird,
but everybody else is doing a great job. No, he's
very birdlike in it, like his like and then he's
the only character giving his dialogue right to the camera,
so I'll give him a pass, okay, And he's dying,

(01:08:57):
I guess, And they don't explain it. I like, the
angels are just like us and they need to just
shut it down and sleep.

Speaker 2 (01:09:02):
Yeah, and they're just tired, man, who're so tired? Gosh
darn it. Yeah, and I think that it just Yeah,
there's there's a uniqueness to this movie that it's not
something you're going to, you know, gravitate towards immediately of
like I gotta watch that right now. But after you've
watched it, you're gonna just feel like, oh that was man,
that was really solid.

Speaker 1 (01:09:20):
You know, it was all And even if you're not
into it, when Christopher Walking comes in and starts doing
like he has mannerisms, his little power moves, his powals,
they're really fun and he's having a good time.

Speaker 3 (01:09:31):
And then they have some comedy in there.

Speaker 1 (01:09:33):
So even if it gets to Heaven you're like, I
just can't follow what's going on. They know when to
bring Christopher Walkin's fun dial up and like hanging out
with the kids, having fun with the guy from Days
and Confused, just kind of and you know, the one
liners just keep everything kind of going and it makes
you laugh so that you can't really ask for much more.
From an Hour and thirty seven, minute movie.

Speaker 2 (01:09:54):
Yeah, and I guess this isn't really a parting thought.
I just don't know where else it could fit in
the discus ession. But I know that listening to the
commentaries and the special features, uh, they were discussing Christopher
Walkin in in genre movies or in horror, because he
hasn't done that many. It was really this and the
Dead Zone, Zone Sleepy Hollow and obviously the sequels to

(01:10:16):
this and other than that, it's it's really a maybe
kind of community.

Speaker 1 (01:10:20):
It's pretty evil in Batman Returns, which is not a
horror movie.

Speaker 2 (01:10:24):
But it does have more adjacent stuff. Yeah, definitely murders.
But I just wanted to shout out, uh, Christopher Walkin's
nineties work because it just feels like, uh, he was
just having this weird fun time doing a really interesting
mix of different levels of movies because you know, after

(01:10:47):
his nineteen eighties he was in no like maybe maybe
not like any huge you know, blockbusters or anything like that,
but you know, it was stuff like Brainstorm and Dead
Zone and View to a Kill.

Speaker 1 (01:11:00):
A romance came out the same year that this movie
was made.

Speaker 2 (01:11:04):
Yeah, and obviously Bamian Returns had been the year before
you know, he turned up in Wayne's World two you know,
the same years, you know, and then but range, but like,
he was also making movies like Freaking All American Murder Yea,
which is one of my favorite walking performances in anything,
because he's just he's delivering the goofiest lines of possible

(01:11:24):
in a way that's just so fun. He plays like
a cop in it, where he's like investigating a serial
killer on a campus and he's very suspicious of like
the lead guy because the lead guy's being framed by
the murderer and all that stuff. So he's a lot
of fun in that. And then he was doing stuff like,
you know, these full motion video video game like when

(01:11:47):
interactive movies and video games were like kind of new,
and they were kind of like, oh, maybe this is
the future of video gaming. You know, we're gonna have
actors doing the cut scenes and then you can play,
you know, and and do these. So he was in
not only Privateer two The Darkening, which was the first
time I ever saw Clive Owen by the way, because
Clive Owen plays the player character in that movie, but
also infamously this video game about Jack the Ripper in

(01:12:11):
a modern context called Ripper, not even modern context. It's
set in twenty forty, so it's a cyber serial killer.
But this video game, man, I mean, it's not just
freaking walking' it's Burgess Meredith, it's Karen Allen, David Patrick,
Kelly Ossi, Davis, John Rehys, Davies, Paul Giamatti. Like this

(01:12:33):
was just an era in the nineties of just where
you would have insane casts for like the goofiest projects.
And I think that that's what reminded me of Prophecy
in the sense that, like you know, today, a movie
like The Prophecy would either have to be like a
multimillion dollar theatrical release blockbuster or.

Speaker 3 (01:12:51):
Like some like a three million dollar indie film.

Speaker 2 (01:12:54):
Which is kind of or or like or like a
Netflix original where it's like, oh, look at who.

Speaker 1 (01:12:58):
We got original baby, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:13:03):
So yeah, I just wanted to shout that out.

Speaker 1 (01:13:05):
Yeah, And I liked that every once in a while
we throw one of these obscure I mean, maybe this
one's not so obscure, but like a different kind of
go check it out kind of movie because it's a
great time.

Speaker 3 (01:13:17):
What do you got for your recommendations?

Speaker 2 (01:13:19):
So I got one you mentioned already, but it's something
that just I was thinking about a lot in terms
of it clearly took its cue from this movie.

Speaker 1 (01:13:26):
I wonder if we have the same one for the
first time in history. But let's see.

Speaker 2 (01:13:29):
You want to say it on three?

Speaker 1 (01:13:30):
Yeah, okay, let's just try it ready three two one,
Stigma End of Days.

Speaker 2 (01:13:34):
Okay, but I think right, yeah, so yeah. This was Stigmata,
directed by Rupert Wainwright.

Speaker 3 (01:13:43):
And screen by Billy.

Speaker 2 (01:13:46):
Billy Corgan, who also worked with Elliotts.

Speaker 1 (01:13:49):
I was like, Connelly, that's not it, Colin, goddamn it, I.

Speaker 2 (01:13:52):
Did score for didah? No, it was.

Speaker 3 (01:14:02):
Gabriel Burne. We have a cross ever character.

Speaker 2 (01:14:04):
Yes we do, uh, the first of his two nineteen
ninety nine kind of demonic or you know, possession.

Speaker 1 (01:14:12):
I fucking love Stigmata, so say what you're gonna I
love it so much.

Speaker 2 (01:14:16):
So this I really wanted to bring up because it
feels to me like the next step in a conversation.
I think that should have continued, which it kind of didn't.
As you get into like the two thousands with movies
like The Last Exorcism and Exorcism of Emily Rose and
taking a double Logan and all of those which to
me always felt like, oh, let's try and do Exorcist again,
but crazier or better, even the conjuring. You know, as

(01:14:39):
much as I like it, I really appreciate in Stigmata
it's not a demon, it's not the devil. It's some
other weird approach to the possession of an innocent young
woman in this case, and what the intentions are behind that,
and how.

Speaker 3 (01:14:56):
Please just trying to get his book out.

Speaker 2 (01:15:00):
Like I love that. Yeah, there's creepy scenes in it.
There's like, you know, these scenes that you might expect
in a movie, uh, you know, of a demon or
a demonic possesion or a possession movie. But there's also
other stuff in there, like all these discussions like in
Prophecy of theology of scripture of you.

Speaker 1 (01:15:16):
Know, I think Stigmata does it a little better.

Speaker 2 (01:15:18):
Yeah, and it definitely, you know, it's trying to go
for something which is a little bit more conceptual and
intellectual while still keeping it in a very like, you know,
genre context. Ironically, I only saw this movie for the
first time in the last you know, several years, but
I've been listening to the soundtrack since the movie came
out because.

Speaker 1 (01:15:37):
See, I saw the movie and immediately bought the soundtrack
because the soundtrack that, oh god, what was that afro
sound or whatever? That sound system, but it's it's uh,
it's what's her face? Who sings nothing compared to it?

Speaker 2 (01:15:52):
Yes, And the score is good and.

Speaker 1 (01:15:54):
The soundtrack it's good because it's got the Tombo Wampa
song or whatever, Mary.

Speaker 2 (01:15:58):
Very very and zero in. This is one of the
massive techs best. Yeah. So, like whether you're into like
this type of movie or whether you're just into great tunes,
like you're gonna have a good time.

Speaker 1 (01:16:09):
It's like what was the one the Vampire plus stat
or no, that's not what it was called Queen of
the Dan, like these movies that had just bang in soundtracks.

Speaker 2 (01:16:18):
Yeah. Absolutely, man, all right, so talk about End of
Days because okay, so.

Speaker 1 (01:16:22):
I did nineteen ninety nine's End of Days starting Arnold Schwarzenegger,
Gabriel Byrne and Robin Tooney. You know, it's like one
of those other ones at the end of the Centuries,
Satan visits New York to find a bride and that's
just you know what we do, and it's up to
an ex cop Arnold who now runs an elite security
outfit to stop him. And I picked this one because

(01:16:42):
of Walking getting a bit wild with his dialogue and
making it kind of funny, and it's also heavy and
kind of crazy. That's kind of what Arnold brings to
the movies. And he isn't an ex priest, but he's
an ex cop who's trying to stop the Devil, So
there's some similar ish plots in there.

Speaker 3 (01:16:56):
So it's just this kind of.

Speaker 1 (01:16:57):
One like one off, fun weird ride that gets out
of control by the end.

Speaker 3 (01:17:03):
So there's a lot of similarities.

Speaker 1 (01:17:06):
But I also wanted to not say it's a recommendation,
but if you're doing a double feature, I think that
the Prophecy goes really well with Fallen. If you watch
both of those in the same night, it's just like
a really cool look at the two different kind of world.
Like those movies feel to me like they could even
be in the same world. Oh sure, and it's fun

(01:17:26):
to look at like what the angel sides kind of doing,
but what also like the Demonic side's kind of doing,
and everybody getting involved in different things. And I just
feel like, if you're going to do a fun nineties
double feature. The Prophecy and Fallen is pretty fun if
you're going like religious horror the night.

Speaker 2 (01:17:42):
Yeah, you know what, I might even add an extra
one to mine too, I might say Bill Paxson's Frailty.

Speaker 3 (01:17:46):
Yeah, Frailty is good.

Speaker 1 (01:17:47):
So is Jacob's Ladder if you want to get into
crazy visions and stuff like that.

Speaker 2 (01:17:51):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:17:52):
So there's definitely a genre there, and it's good.

Speaker 2 (01:17:54):
It's good, it's good. So, yeah, you got lots to watch,
so get to it.

Speaker 3 (01:18:00):
Yeah, I get to it.

Speaker 2 (01:18:01):
Shoot, I'm sorry I didn't have this ready And yes,
I know I say it every time? Are you? Thank
you all for joining us for this episode of Bill
and Ashley's part of the Stranded Panda Network. You can
find my work in the show notes links below. Check
us out on social media. You can find this show

(01:18:23):
at strandedpana dot com and everwhere else you get your podcasts.
If you have questions or comments, please feel free to
write to us at Bill and ash Terror Theater at
gmail dot com. We're dying to hear from See you
in Les.

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