Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
The different images of our Lord Jesus Christ or of
our Holy Mother Virgin Mary, that we are witnessing across
churches houses where sometimes people of faith do worship the
actual pictures. Is this accepted? Firstly, worshiping pictures is a
huge no. You cannot worship pictures. The moment you worship
(00:20):
a picture, you are worshiping a pagan god. You are
worshiping an idol. We do not worship pictures. We venerate them.
We through them remember the True Christ and our Holy
Mother Mary and the rest of the saints. And they
are not pictures. They are icons. There is a huge
(00:42):
difference between a picture and an icon. But an icon
is nothing but symbolic representation of the true person. So
when I put an icon of the Lord Jesus, I
am not saying to that icon, this is Jesus Christ. No,
I'm not worshiping thiscon through this icon. It is not
(01:06):
that icon God. It is the symbolic representation of my
sweetheart Jesus Christ, who went up into heaven and said,
at the right hand of the Father, he is the living.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Messiah, he is the Son of God. He is God
revealed in the flesh.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
In the end of times, as Saint Paul says in
Galatians Fall, and every other icon is nothing but a
symbolic representation.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
I'm not worshiping them. That's number one. Number two.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
When we read in Exodus chapter twenty, verses one to three,
and God spoke all these words saying, I am the
Lord your God, who brought you out of the house
of bondage. You shall have no other gods before me. Now,
when you read in Exodus twenty, chapter twenty, verse four,
I just read the verse three verses before I read
(02:07):
the verse you might be loved. Have quoted so verses
one to three. And God spoke all these words, saying
I am the Lord your God, who brought you out
of the house of bondage. You shall have no other
gods before me. Now, verse four, you shall not make
for yourself a carved image.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Image is not a picture, but anyway.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
You shall not make for yourself a carved image or
any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or
that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
Water under the earth.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
And in verse three, you shall have no other gods before.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
Me but the Lord God.
Speaker 1 (02:52):
The reason why the Lord God gave this commandment to Moses, saying,
you shall have no other false God. Because in the
olden days people used to carve images and say to
those hand carved images, this is my God.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
That's a blasphemy.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
I am not saying to the icon this is my
God and denying my divine Living God.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Who art in heaven. Not at all. All.
Speaker 1 (03:26):
I'm saying, this is symbolically representing my true living Christ,
who went up into heaven and said, at the right
hand of the Father, I am not worshiping the image.
It is reminding me of my worship, true Divine God
who art in heaven, the creator of all that is
(03:48):
visible and invisible. So he was talking about false gods
because people in the Old Testament worship false gods. Actually,
even the Israelites after they were delivered from the bondage
of Pharaoh and Egypt, with all these wonders.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
The Lord God did through Moses ten.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
Strikes against Pharaoh delivered the Israelite nation.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
Around two million.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
People roughly came out of Israel a god of Egypt.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
Sorry. Forty days only later.
Speaker 1 (04:28):
They made a cave out of gold, made by their
own hands, out of gold, and they said to this
cove you are our God who delivered us from Egypt.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
That is a blasphemy.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
And that's what the Lord God was warning Moses by
giving this commandment.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
Do not create an image and say this is God.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
We Christians Apostolic churches, when we have icons, we do
not say to the squans, this is our God, or
this is the Holy Mother, or.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
This is Saint Peter.
Speaker 1 (05:05):
This is symbolically representing the Lord, the Holy Mother, and
Saint Peter. That's all symbolic representation that we are in
their presence. It's a reminder that we are in their presence. Now,
another thing I want to bring to your attention the
very God who commanded Moses and says, do not carve
(05:28):
an image and make it a god before you do
not the very God in Exodus twenty five, verses.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
Seventeen to eighteen, the same God.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
Look what he's saying. You shall make a mercy seat
of pure gold. Two and a half cubits shall be
its length, and a cubit and a half it's width.
And you shall make two cherubim of gold of hammered work.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
What's hammered work? Carved image? Who is commanding this God himself?
Speaker 1 (06:05):
He is saying to Moses, carve me two angels. A
cherub is the highest angelic order in heaven is the
highest rank in the angelic order called the Cherebins. The
Lord God is ordering, commanding Moses to carve me two angels,
(06:30):
carved images of angels and put them on the mercy seed,
where they are faced on either end of the mercy seed,
and their wings facing each other. Those angels and their
wings touching one another.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
These carved images.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
God ordered Moses to do him and put him on
the mercy seed, facing one another, and their wings touching
one another. Well, the Lord God said, do not make
a carved image neither in heaven likened onto heaven and
the angel from heaven. How come God is saying, carve
(07:10):
me an angel, and where to put it on the
mercy seat.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
You know what The mercy seat is the.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
Tomb of the Lord Tavernat because at the tomb of
the Lord, or in the tomb of the Lord, two
angels stood one at his head and the other at
his feet on either side of the mercy seat. Jesus
Christ is the mercy seat, and these angels, being their meaning,
(07:39):
Jesus has brought unity between God and mankind. The gate
way to heaven is reopened for angels to be on earth,
meaning reconciliation has taken place. So if the Lord God says,
do not carve nothing at all, why would he come back?
(07:59):
In Exses twenty five verses seventeen to eighteen, and says
to Moses, you must carve me an image of a Cherian.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Therefore be love it. We are not worshiping.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
I wish I have more time to go into details,
but I'll say this, in the New Testament, did.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
God have an image? If I'm going to ask anyone who.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
Is Jesus Christ, They're going to say, perfect God, perfect man.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
He is God, who is Christ, is God.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
Christ is the person who united divinity and humanity. So
this Jesus Christ, who is God, and every Christian believes
Jesus Christ is God, has in this God in the
New Testament have an image. Are you going to tell
me he has no faith, no image? If you're going
to say he does not have an image, then who
(08:50):
is Jesus Christ to you?
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Isn't he God? Well, God became man.
Speaker 1 (08:57):
Doesn't this man have a face, Doesn't this man have
some sort of a color. Doesn't this man have countenance.
Doesn't this man have an image? Well, God became men,
God accepted on himself to have an image.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
What's our problem? Then there is no problem.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
So you can have an icon in the church, we
definitely don't worship it.
Speaker 2 (09:22):
Now if some people who.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Are simple in their faith and the way they illustrate
their faith by bowing before it and as if they
are worshiping, then we should not build our case based
on people who are simple in their faith. If you
want to find the truth, ask people like myself that
we can tell you what the truth is all about.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
We do not worship icons.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
We are reminded through these icons about our Lord, about
the Holy Mother and all of the saints. Aren't we
all in communion with the saints? Are we all in
the presence of the Lord? And isn't the Holy Mother
pray for all of us? This is a reminder that
we are in their presence and they are definitely with us,
(10:07):
no more, no less, My beloved