Will the Epstein Files Be What Unravels Trump's Presidency? (w/ Cliff Schecter)

In this episode, Malcolm Nance speaks with Cliff Schecter about the controversy surrounding Donald Trump's involvement in the Jeffrey Epstein files. They discuss how both QAnon conspiracy theorists and MAGA have responded to the Epstein case and how many consider it "the biggest betrayal."

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
These people invested their entire life being into identifying and
tracking down pedophiles who were leading America's globe and the
global elite. And it's Donald Trump and his staff the
supposed hero. And now I'm seeing the word ultimate betrayal. Yeah,

(00:23):
all over the Q spaces.

Speaker 2 (00:26):
In many polls, ten to fifteen percent of white working
voters who voted for Trump basically hate him now. And
now you're bringing this into it, which is these people
that literally worshiped Trump because they thought he was going
to stop what in their mind was based on, you know,
along the lines of fifteenth century superstition and wired into

(00:46):
their minds about baby, you know, predation and whatever.

Speaker 1 (00:50):
Because now the entire history of Donald Trump now has
to be rehashed and seen through the lens of If
you don't release those damn files, improve your innocence, there
is no your innocent toil proven guilty on this one.

(01:12):
This is black Man's Spy. Welcome to this week's episode
of Black Man's Spy. Yet another interesting, fascinating story that
we're going to be discussing with the Great Cliff Scheckter.
Cliff Scheckter is a Democratic consultant former ad writer for
a Biden twenty twenty campaign, best selling author, former syndicated

(01:36):
cartis columnist for The Daily Beast and The Guardian, and
co founder of the media firm Blue Amp Strategies. Yes,
I am reading it off a piece of paper, because
even I am not that good to remember that. But
I've been on his show several times. He is a
great person to discuss this very serious subject with. And

(01:56):
we throw in a little levity because discussing the Jeffrey
Epstein situation with regards to the Donald Trump White House
was brought me to have to write a sub stack
with the very very frank and adult title of is
a pedophile leading our national security apparatus? Worse than that

(02:22):
scenario because there are nations and intelligence agencies and governments
now actually having to consider this as part of their
foreign policy, their geopolitical standing, their defense standing, and whether
Donald Trump is a compromised asset because of his relationship

(02:43):
to Jeffrey Epstein, and if that relationship is known outside
of a few people inside the White House or Donald
Trump himself, he is liable to be compromised. And that
means nation states like xkgb Aficer Vladimir Putin can make
him dance to their tune if they have access to

(03:06):
any of this information. We are now seeing a complete
scattering of Donald Trump's Maga coalition, the fundamentals of which
are held together by the q Andon ideology, the belief
that Liberals were running some cabal that we're kidnapping three
hundred thousand children a year and scaring them and killing

(03:27):
them in order to gather harvest this drug they call
Adrina clone. In fact, that is the actual scenario from
the kids movie Monster Inc. They and somehow someone, when
the q Andon fraud was perpetrated, said that all the liberals,
liberal presidents, Hillary Clinton, everybody, Barack Obama, newscasters would all

(03:51):
be rounded up and executed for being pedophiles. They are
so beholden to this that now they're seeing the person
and they claimed with secretly exposing these supposed liberal child
molesters may in fact be their hero. And this can

(04:12):
only be but explosive and without any further ado. Here's
Cliff Scheckter. Welcome Cliff Scheckter to black Man's Spy Podcast.
I'm glad to have you on. This is so much
more interesting than doing sub stacks in Twitter spaces because
we can see you or we can hear you on Spotify, Twitter,

(04:34):
apps and Apple and all those great places that we
get it. But this is a very serious week. The
last four podcasts I did, the first one starting with
Michael Steele, was loads of fun. We had a grand
old time as the republic was burning down around and
it got more serious and darker with Joey Reid than

(04:56):
Dolly A Liftwick. Geez, I love Doll.

Speaker 3 (05:00):
It's just brilliant.

Speaker 1 (05:00):
We should we should all have just you know, jumped
out a window at the end of that episode because
as we see these trends in the desecration of democracy,
I personally, as an intelligence professional, as a career military person,
I am very deeply offended by all of this. And
my last conversation was with Jim Acosta. Not one joke

(05:24):
made in the whole hour. And you know, I like
to joke around because we had him.

Speaker 2 (05:28):
Didn't do it because I went on with him and
I got him to actually say fuck, which.

Speaker 3 (05:35):
I pulled it off.

Speaker 2 (05:36):
I got him the one time, you know, I went
on his show, I don't remember a month ago or something,
and I got him.

Speaker 3 (05:40):
A joke a bit. But you're right, he's he's a
news guy.

Speaker 1 (05:43):
So he's using this serious journalist. Yeah. Yeah. And he
enlightened me in a very interesting point where he said,
you know, as a Latino, and I was like, whoa
wait there, buddy, hero Latino. He was such a strict,
down the line news guy, right, professional journalist. I never
considered for a moment what his background was. You don't

(06:05):
even know what compliment I hope.

Speaker 3 (06:07):
I only picked it up.

Speaker 2 (06:08):
To be honest, I never thought about it either, But
I only picked up in that great final send off
from CNN where he said where he said, you know,
probably one of the highlights of my career was being
able to question Fidel Castro as my family on Cuba,
and I said, it reminded me and told me of
one thing. Don't ever bow down to a dictator, ask
questions like you know, we all knew who he was

(06:30):
talking about at that point, but it was so that's
the first time I knew him, like, oh, he's Cuban.

Speaker 3 (06:34):
I had no idea before that.

Speaker 1 (06:36):
Well, we are going to start on a very different
note now that we've recapped all of my last podcast.

Speaker 2 (06:43):
That's all company I'm in there. I feel kind of
you know, I feel thank you.

Speaker 1 (06:47):
Well, listen, I please, for God's sake, help me, Jesus.
Let's get this back to a lighter show. And today's subject, uh, stem,
We're going to riff off of a sub stack that
I just published yesterday, which is very serious, and the
title is is a pedophile leading America's national security? And

(07:13):
it's as slain and as stark as that the United
States government and its apparatus. Maybe, And we're seeing much
more evidence and more people coming to testify it is
led by a pedophile. Maybe, And an in system has

(07:33):
now changed and more and changed and modified itself to
become a series of what could arguably only be said
to be pedophile enablers, and they now control four thousand
and five nitred atomic bombs in all of US intelligence.

Speaker 2 (07:53):
Yeah, and I saw I read your piece, by the way,
and you were right on. I mean, I would think
out of the old mice equation, you know, being a
pedophile would be about just about the most the thing
that you could be the most blackmailed for.

Speaker 1 (08:07):
U M I CE, which is money, ideology, co option, coercion, excitement,
or ego. That's a spies recruiting tool.

Speaker 2 (08:18):
Sorry, but I figure people to watch black man spy.
I'm a white man, non spy. But I figured, uh, if.

Speaker 3 (08:26):
People watched your show, we might might already know that.

Speaker 2 (08:29):
I probably should have laid that out for people because
my background not CIA, but State Department democracy promotion in
Eastern Europe and places where you at. And so I
know a lot of this stuff from not from from
your you know your perspective exactly. But and the thing
about Epstein again is so you know, if you I
want to to, if you want me to read, and

(08:53):
people can ask themselves this question.

Speaker 3 (08:55):
But this was public, right. This is the lawsuit my
thirteen year old Katie john.

Speaker 2 (09:02):
Where she ended up suing Uh, she ended up suing
Donald Trump and then dropping it suspiciously, and she said
that that he had had raped her.

Speaker 3 (09:17):
And let me make.

Speaker 2 (09:19):
Sure I get to the correct passage here because this
is this will tell you who it is we're dealing with.
This is Katie Johnson versus Donald Trump, District Court d C.
And here it is according to the Johnson lawsuit. Quote,
during the course of this savage sexual attack, plaintiff Johnson
loudly pleaded with Donald Trump to quote please wear a

(09:40):
condom unquote. Defendant responded, sorry, I'll like, I should read
slower and let you jump in.

Speaker 3 (09:46):
Did you say no?

Speaker 1 (09:48):
Just saikes? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (09:50):
Yeah, yikes is right.

Speaker 2 (09:51):
Defendant Trump responded by violently striking plaintiff Johnson in the
face with his open hand and screaming that he quote
would do it ever he wanted, as he refused to
wear protection. I'll say this to his gross. I mean,
I'm gonna try to not keep this gross, but we'll
just say after achieving orgasm, oh you know, Donald Trump.

Speaker 3 (10:11):
The defendant Donald J.

Speaker 2 (10:12):
Trump put his suit back on, and when plaintiff Katie Johnson,
in tears, asked defendant Donald Trump what would happen if
he impregnated her, Defendant Trump grabbed his wallet and threw
some money at her and screamed that she should use
the money.

Speaker 3 (10:24):
To quote get a fucking abortion unquote.

Speaker 2 (10:26):
This is a legal filing, and I hope I'm sorry
if that was too rough language for some people. But
I'm reading from Katie Johnson's legal filing. Like we have
her legal filing. We have the logs that were that
showed up in this lawsuit that were released.

Speaker 3 (10:40):
Do we know what Donald Trump did? Did it? List?

Speaker 2 (10:43):
Donald Trump did this? Donald Trump did that? It didn't,
but it listed. We know he's all over the Epstein files.
We don't know what the reason he is. Here's what
else we know. We know that he admitted bragged about
it on Howard Sterton's show that one of the reasons
he bought these pageants is so he could go sneak
in these locker rooms and peak on these fifteen and
sixteen year old girls while they were changing, which he

(11:04):
apparently didggerlarly. We know that he referred to his own
daughter when she was in her teens as quote, a
piece of ass unquote. I mean it goes on and on.
So I mean you've talked about it, and you talked
about in that Ebstein thing that you, as an intelligence
guy put together.

Speaker 3 (11:22):
You see the.

Speaker 2 (11:23):
Points, right, you're like a beautiful mind. I'm not saying
you're you know whatever, but like you see that chart. Well,
I feel like I'm that way as someone who's a
student of history and international affairs. When I see things
happening again that I know have happened before another cultures
that have led to fascism. Who I see things that
I know we've done before I start, you know, and
it's not that hard to put these these points together

(11:44):
with Trump.

Speaker 3 (11:45):
I mean, I cannot sit here.

Speaker 2 (11:47):
And say without a doubt that he did the things
we're talking about. I can say that a thirteen year
old sued him for it, that he was he referred
to at one point to his good pal Jeffrey Epstein,
and like, oh, and he liked those girls young, thought
that was a great thing. There's pictures of them at
these parties with all these young women around him with him.
There's one in my substack of that piece. We wrote

(12:07):
on the fact that he's all over the Epstein logs.
We know he's all over the Epstein logs. We know
he bought beauty pageants for reasons. He bragged about how
much evidence to do. I mean, how much smoke before
there's a fire, is what I mean.

Speaker 1 (12:18):
You know, I think Trump views this from the perspective
that I beat all these stories in the past, and
once beaten, and once all of you and MAGA excuse me,
once all of you and MAGA buy into my version
of the world. Therefore it no longer has any viability,
it doesn't exist, And that this was brought up years ago.

(12:41):
And of course Donald Trump as a person who is
now suffering as Mary Trump puts it, narcissistic injury. That's
the meta narrative. The story that he has woven using
you know, the using his bold laced magic, you know

(13:02):
spindle all right, which is weaving the Trump story is
now being found out by his followers, right that the
pie Piper's tune doesn't work principally it calls And this
is where I need to give the audience a bit
of a background. Uh. In my last book, they want
to kill Americans. The malicious terrorist and deranged ideology.

Speaker 2 (13:25):
Danced around it, and you don't really go straight to
the point, Malcolm.

Speaker 3 (13:28):
That's what I appreciated about you.

Speaker 1 (13:29):
But no, it's it's a title that we are finding
a validated.

Speaker 2 (13:34):
All of your books are outstanding. I just like to
joke with you too, because you've got a good senseime.

Speaker 1 (13:39):
But yeah, look, when we're in this skiff, right, I
actually do have a skiff in my home, so I'm
not in it right now, but this is my my
I have a man skiff and UH have a man cave.
I'm a man skiff. And the thing is is that

(13:59):
in that book I go through the details of q
Andon ideology and the entirety concept of q Andon, which
was a story like a puzzle game that was done
by this father son duo who lived in the Philippines
that were doing this game theory stuff pretending to be
deep state intelligence operatives from a secret group in northern

(14:24):
Virginia and dropping bread crumbs because there that the Democratic
Party Hollywood Liberals were an elite cabal of child rapist pedophiles.

Speaker 3 (14:40):
Right, that's except for there was no basement there, right, And.

Speaker 1 (14:44):
And look at the characters who did that. What's his name,
Jack Pisobiec, Right, I used Pisoviec because he was kicked
out of the Navy.

Speaker 3 (14:53):
Uh, because use it because of his personality.

Speaker 1 (14:55):
But yeah, I agree, Well no, because he was made
your analysis off, sir, when the Navy was kicking him
out and took his top secret clearance away.

Speaker 3 (15:03):
I did not know that.

Speaker 2 (15:07):
I'm gonna ask if he wants to, if I should
give him some urine that he can look at it
and let me know how I'm doing.

Speaker 1 (15:12):
If you look him up, that's right, and not just
the color. By the way, he needs to fight out
whether you're taking thc And and as we say in
the Navy, UH must have a clear view of the stream.
So Jack Kisobiak was the guy. While on in the Navy,
a cryptologic officer you know, went to comic Ping pong

(15:36):
and created Hezza Gate, saying he was taking videos of
doors leading to underground dungeons where Hillary Clinton was keeping children.
And it led two days later to a old hostage barrack, Yeah,
by a crazy guy who came in to rescue the

(15:56):
children that were in this underground dungeon. Uh. The place
was built on a slab by.

Speaker 3 (16:00):
The way, pizzazz.

Speaker 1 (16:04):
And and this led to I mean q and not
exploded after this story and q Andon's whole theory was
that Democrats were eating children, were scaring them, torturing them
so that at the moment of death. This was the
nuts think the moment of death, they would create a

(16:27):
chemical called adrenochrome in their system. Then you could kill
them take adrenochrome. And this is the story they said.
It were pretty much, but they were saying this was
Hillary Clinton was taking this to stay I should you
not immortal, And they were showing before and after photographs
of herd like Hillary retired, Hillary looking like a twenty

(16:50):
eight year old crazy. These people got Donald Trump elected
and in my book they want to kill Americans. I
talk about how QAnon transition. They are the real nuts,
I mean, really batshit crazy.

Speaker 3 (17:06):
Michael, you tell me this, I mean I didn't.

Speaker 2 (17:08):
I mean some people I've seen have even theorized that
Michael Flynn sort of took Michael Flynn, but he certainly
helped push all that stuff.

Speaker 1 (17:18):
He would he pushed q Yeah, Mike Flynn, Well, I
don't think it's because of what Jim Stewarts and some
of these other guys drafted up. No, because I read
the q drops and it's very clear the person involved
in that had no idea of how intelligence or the
National Security Operatus even spoke, much less would write a

(17:39):
memo or a drop. Mike Flynn did. But Mike Flynn
saw the power of their nuttiness. He's found that they
were the most fervoran Trump supporters. What's Michael Chesley right?
The Qan shaman he hated his face up and wore
horns and you know it stormed the capitol.

Speaker 2 (17:59):
He you can't invent this stuff, like if you wrote
a novel. The guy with the Camp Auschwitz T shirt,
I mean like they they and can I make that
connection for a second, because it's someone they they let
me say quickly, they of course ginned all this off,
this paranoia conspiracy that they knew was there, and Trump
plays into in the far right place. Do I have

(18:21):
the book up there behind me that I always keep
the my touchdown Richard hoffstatters the paranoid style and American
politics they played directly in that. But but I'm going
to go further into history. Okay, my theory always behind
Why you know, when they lost school desegregation is an
issue which was their big issue that they would turn
out the base.

Speaker 3 (18:41):
Do you want blacks going to school with you?

Speaker 2 (18:43):
Jerry Folwell and all of them that when that was
decided Brown versus Bard. After that, you'll see in the
seventies abortion becomes an issue. Before that Evangelical is actually
favored abortion. It was only Catholics who are against it.
And my theory has always been and that this goes
to trans their attacks on trans kids. The other thing
right now, what we're talking about with QAnon and the

(19:04):
pedophilia stuff, is it all sources from successful you know,
like fifteenth Middle Ages, you know, passion plays and blood
libel against Jews, which was the easiest thing to sell,
which is those people that are different, those liberal whatever,
and it's very easy now to be like Jews, liberal

(19:24):
cosmopolitan generalized to all Democrats, right, that we're all like that.
That they would say, if the well would go dry
in the town, this is why a lot of my
family left Odessa and left places like that to come
to this country. The well went dry, it's the devilish
Jews who were drinking the blood of our babies. That
was always what they said. They're killing our babies, they're
poisoning them. And they would go to the couple of

(19:46):
Jewish houses, beat the crap out of people, maybe kill
them still the belongings, and then they might do it
again the next week or the next month. I have
always thought that the baby killer stuff that they started
sing from abortion stemmed from that because they knew it
would play into the psyche of Christians versus liberals who
hate children. Jews this that, you know, blacks who are criminals.

(20:07):
I'm talking about all this from their perspective, obviously. And
and then we also got the pedophilia stuff. They're hurting
you know that they're trying to cut off body parts
from kids with all.

Speaker 3 (20:19):
Them made up.

Speaker 1 (20:20):
You make a good point here, because I note this
in my book that blood libel, the original one, stemmed
from a medieval incident in which a boy was found killed,
and I want to say it was in France or Germany.
A boy was found killed, and then the word it

(20:42):
was out Jews were killing this children for the blood
of Christians, and it burned around Europe arguably the first
Q drop, right. I mean, granted, anti Sevenism had been
going on the Twelve Tribes, there is.

Speaker 2 (20:56):
A word, but it became it became where they as
you know, and you know, I don't supercharged, yes, and
they would hold these passion plays, you know, where they
would show Christ being tortured and dragged through the streets,
and the Jews were there would all be have like
huge noses, you know, put on and all the times
things like that, and they would point out that this

(21:17):
was the fault of Jews, and everybody get riled up
in town and be like, they want to take the
blood from our children, and they go kill I mean,
this is again, this is how so many families like
mine ended up here. And so I really do think
they knew that was in the DNA of a lot
of religious Christians. Uh, and who are the base of
their public guardy who'se we know, damn well, never could

(21:39):
give a crap about about the things they say they
care about, right They Bill Clinton was horrible for his
relationships outside of marriage. But but Donald Trump five kids,
three women, So it was it was this was the
core and Q, go ahead.

Speaker 1 (21:53):
You really flubbed that one. He has three baby mamas,
five children with three baby moms. What did I say,
five kids with three women? No? No, you gotta met
a narrative. This guy, this guy's the ultimate welfare queen, right,
welfare king? Right? So you know, I'm sorry, but on

(22:17):
this show we like to make sure the framework around
our opponents is it's easy to digest.

Speaker 2 (22:24):
And remember you understand as a guy who was an
information officer and understands what I was saying, you know,
earlier off camera to you about various psyops and whatever
and disinformation that what the Democratic Party is finally getting
better at. Gavin Newsom seems to be trolling them and
leading some of the charge. But we've been so terrible
at that I've been screaming about for twenty years. Make

(22:46):
it simple, make it repetitive, have a narrative, frame who
they are, and then every message we'll fit into that.
Look at Nixon's you know, abortion, acid and amnesty.

Speaker 3 (22:57):
As his description of.

Speaker 2 (22:58):
The Republic of the Democratic Party back then, which is
why I now say, you know, I when I talk
about them, I talk about them as you know, as criminal, corrupt,
and incompetent or some sort of combination of things of
that nature, because if you put that all together, you
come out with them.

Speaker 1 (23:16):
So well, I'm leading back onto the blood libel and
and the QAnon thing. Q andn you know, set this
whole chain in motion that the meta narrative would be
liberals were pedophiles, and you all throughout the campaign of
last year you kept hearing it. KEDO's Upedo this, and

(23:38):
then Biden in the shower with like his right and yeah,
and Biden touching children. They would take random photos and
then we would look and you would see on Twitter
there would be these mass uh photo shot, photo shoots
of like the last one hundred days people that were
arrested for pedophilia. Share of church counselors.

Speaker 3 (24:02):
Priests always always related right wing.

Speaker 1 (24:06):
Evangelic goals who were doing all this stuff, and they
literally book that frame of pedophiles hung it around the liberals.
We and the problem is is that people of good faith,
people of goodwill don't fight back against that because they go, oh,
that's just ridiculous.

Speaker 2 (24:26):
Right, It's always hard to have like the And this
is where I think you and I are the same
and we're different, which is I've always said, I mean this,
you know, not the nicest person, but I am. I
will do anything for friends, for whatever. I have a family,
I love you know and all that, and I will
go out of my way and you know and all
this and whatever. But people need to be able to

(24:46):
turn that off when it comes to political warfare. And
when it comes to political warfare, that side of me
disappears and I become the meanest son of a bitch
that you ever want. I will call you out for anything.
I will go after you for anything, because again, this
is this is how they've chosen. They have chosen to
refer to us as pedophiles, as non humans, as others,
as whatever. And if you do not hit back on

(25:08):
that level, if you do the stuff, I'm sorry, I'm
gonna name somebody that Dick Durbin does and said, you know,
which is why I'm so glad he's leaving. And and
he ran the Senate Judiciary Committee. How did Clarence Thomas
never get subpoenaed? You know, I mean, like the stuff work,
we're above that.

Speaker 3 (25:23):
We don't do that.

Speaker 2 (25:24):
No, And I'm sorry, I love Michelle Obama, but when
they go low, we need to go even lower and
kick them in the ankles.

Speaker 3 (25:31):
Like there's if you go high and they go low,
you lose because low wins. I can't, you know.

Speaker 1 (25:37):
And and they but they their lowest point though, was
characterizing all Democrats as pedophiles. Oh, and it was our
our wanting to maintain goodwill and always trying to be
above the fray that allowed them to keep this narrative.
Trump I wrote about this after Theanuary six insurrections. Yes,

(26:02):
q Andon had died or let me put down, Maga
died down. Q Andon was being suppressed by the Trump
camp to the point that Trump rallies, you weren't allowed
to wear a q T shirt, right, You weren't allowed
They were selling it outside, but you weren't.

Speaker 3 (26:16):
Allowed to wear the vendors.

Speaker 1 (26:18):
Right. It took six months. I had predicted in my
book that it would take eighteen months. In fact, it
took by July of twenty twenty one, twenty that QAnon
took for the Republican Party platform, and that platform was

(26:38):
simply this, liberals are pedophiles and we're going to tear
down their world. Hillary Clinton, Bill Bill Gates, Rob Ryder?
Where did they come up with that? Guy? I love Robbie,
he's that.

Speaker 2 (26:51):
But anybody's influence or money on the left, you know,
going after planned parenthood acorn. You know, they've had trial lawyers,
they've had a systematic plan where if there's money organizing
or anything on the left, they go after it.

Speaker 3 (27:06):
So they would they were going to get to those
figures you're talking about.

Speaker 1 (27:10):
And that's why they drafted this meta narrative, which is
the most horrible thing you could call a person. Right,
of course, it's nuclear war and politics. To call someone
a pedophile, it's nuclear war. There's no way to walk
it back. There's no way to discuss it civilly. For me,
if that's a throwdown and fight situation, you.

Speaker 2 (27:31):
Have to it's outside. That's the whole point is that
it's no there. You know at that point that they
are authoritarians. In a democratic society, you have to have
things that you can debate in good faith with either
the other party or if you're a multi party system
other parties. If you're saying about the other party they're
all pedophiles, what's their debate at that point when they're

(27:53):
making that kind of an accusation, that's yeah.

Speaker 1 (27:56):
Well, you know, in the intelligence screunity I come, which
is the nationalist curity the agency, we saw talk like
this preceding genocides. And yes, there's a tech there's a
technical term for this in in an essay in the
intelligence collection signals intelligence world eliminationist rhetoric. Yes, yes, and

(28:18):
that's when we saw last year. We even saw people
like Pam Bondi and others saying that they would they
want the death penalty for pedophiles, right. I mean, there's
anticipation of the storm, right, anticipation of them doing the
day of the rope, which is hanging liberals from from
street lights, and now.

Speaker 2 (28:40):
A part of how they always project what they're doing.
I mean, again, there are a couple of key things
people need to know here, which right away right one
the you know and again this is where I agree
with you, and also just quickly, but the reason I
get so angry and rip the living crap constantly and
write a lot about our corporate media failures. Is they

(29:04):
are the organization, They are the you know, they are
the entity or whatever you want to call them, that
shows up in the First Amendment of our Constitution that
because they are necessary. They're not necessary to tell us
what the hell Kim Kardashian's up to. They're necessary to
root out liars and corruption and let people know truths
and if you're not willing to give people context.

Speaker 3 (29:25):
So think about this for a second.

Speaker 2 (29:26):
And I'll say this stuff quickly, because it's pretty easy
to say, you've got a Republican party and they're base
quan on who's calling all Democrats pedophiles? While we know
the stuff that Donald Trump admitted about going into beauty
pageants and stuff like that. He said that publicly fifteen
year old, sixteen year olds, all this kind of stuff.
The longest serving Republican House Speaker Denny prison for fondling

(29:48):
fifteen and fourteen year old boys.

Speaker 1 (29:50):
Longest sleeping with pages.

Speaker 2 (29:53):
Yes, longer serving Republican House speaker. Okay, and this is
this only this only happened where he went to prison.
A couple of years before Donald Trump ran Jim Jordan,
who was at Ohio State.

Speaker 3 (30:06):
I am right, Naddy.

Speaker 2 (30:07):
An hour and a half from there, a wrestler got up.
If everybody hasn't seen that testimony to this wrestler getting
up and talking about Jim Jordan called me.

Speaker 3 (30:14):
He got up and he testified in the Ohio house.

Speaker 2 (30:16):
Called me, begging, crying, telling me to say my brother
was a liar.

Speaker 3 (30:21):
And he and his actual brother was on the wrestler.

Speaker 1 (30:26):
Staff coach Pete, sorry, staff doctor.

Speaker 3 (30:29):
Yeah, I mean he's been right.

Speaker 2 (30:30):
He's been called out by wrestlers and at least one
referee who saw this stuff going on the shrifs, and
and another wrestling coach was there.

Speaker 3 (30:37):
He said, of course Jim Jordan knew.

Speaker 2 (30:40):
And the third one, Matt Gates, they were gonna make
a g Who's the guy who still, if I'm correct,
is under invested. He's still being investigated for trafficking underage girl.
So the fact that the mainstream media and democratic weakness
and as you said, good you know that were people
of goodwill, but we're failing, then sits there as these
guys call us pedophiles when you know all four of

(31:02):
the things Trump Haster, Jordan and Gates.

Speaker 3 (31:05):
That I just said is a massive failure record scratch.

Speaker 1 (31:10):
Lauren Bobert Luern Bobert today or yesterday said that there
should be an internal investigation, there should be a special counsel,
and she recommended Matt Gates for that job and Trump
it was t was Trump's first pick for attorney general.

(31:31):
Because obviously, when you want to recruit an agent, right,
you want someone who you can do one you have
the goods on them. Two ritualistic self humiliation. They must
debase themselves in front of you and ask forgiveness, and
then you own their souls like Dark Vader, right, you know,

(31:52):
using the force to choke at your compliance out of you.
But Trump generally doesn't have to say a word. They
know that that's going on.

Speaker 3 (32:02):
And have you've seen day TV?

Speaker 2 (32:04):
I I mean I've just seen clips because obviously it's
whatever that stupid channel, even news Max, it's the one
below that. And he's been defending and saying there's nothing there,
defending Bondie like.

Speaker 3 (32:17):
He's one of the ones. He knows where all this
leads to.

Speaker 2 (32:22):
I mean, as a guy son of a prominent real
estate developer in in you know, Pensacola and that whole area.
Us be shocked if Maddy's dad or Matt ended up
on that list. Oh, you know, perfect guy, because we
know he's being investigated for it already. There's a hell
of a chance he's actually on there or his dad is,
so they're you know, there he that's why they Yeah,

(32:43):
he is the independent Council.

Speaker 3 (32:44):
Uh, that's perfect. I'm an astronaut, you know.

Speaker 2 (32:47):
And and I mean, while we're coming there with jokes, Yeah,
in any case, you're exactly right. I mean the Republican
Party and remember was it Mark Foley was hitting on
the congressional male.

Speaker 3 (33:00):
Congression, right, They have been knee deep.

Speaker 2 (33:02):
In this crap for two three decades now, probably more,
but since I've been doing politics, and again, like yet
they are. They're the ones who are trying to project
it onto us, and they always knew.

Speaker 3 (33:17):
And the interesting about.

Speaker 2 (33:18):
Thing about this is, I'll admit it to you, Malcolm,
I didn't think I thought they'd all let them off
the hook here too. But I think all these nuts,
these these that we've talked about, some of them already
from the other ones who came out against him on
this so far, like Laura Ingram and Musk who's been
fighting with and Alex Jones. They have have either weaved

(33:39):
such conspiracies themselves, they've trapped themselves in their own conspiracies
and realized they can't exonerate Trump or their shows. Notice,
they're all entertainers for the most part. They'll be destroyed
because they'll lose their base because they've trained them that
there are all these pedophiles and that the Epstein files,
I mean, Don Junior was saying, release the pedal, release
the the files and jdvs. All these guys are on

(34:01):
video from a year ago. Release the file.

Speaker 1 (34:03):
So look, guys like Cash Fattel and and and Dan Bongino,
these guys were making bank. Okay, let me tell you something.
You and I don't make a fraction uh in subscriptions.
That hash Fattel when he had his three letter symbol
ks H with the S being a dollar sign. That

(34:27):
that cash cash money, right.

Speaker 2 (34:31):
Ridiculous, Like cowboy boots and look like, oh my god,
that power power bottom costume that he wore.

Speaker 1 (34:39):
It's all my Twitter guys. Don't ask us about it.
It's terrible, but you know, and you know Dan Bungino,
these guys were brought on because they made millions millions
as podcasters swearing that they would dismantle the Democratic had

(35:00):
a file machine that they invented in their own linch.
These guys are the living definition of grifters. They saw
what people wanted to hear. They jumped onto the bandwagon,
led the bandwagon, got put into positions of power and
now America and and QAnon is at an oh shit,

(35:23):
muddy right.

Speaker 3 (35:23):
And Dan was there too. That's why he won't give
up on Bondie.

Speaker 2 (35:27):
He he You know, Bongino is still like he's fighting
it because he realizes too. He's trained all his people's
listeners that this is an absolute truth. This is it
ye with the Da Vinci Code of democratic pedophilia.

Speaker 3 (35:41):
You have to see it.

Speaker 2 (35:43):
You know, Bill Hiary Clinton's in there, and hell, they
probably have like Grover Cleveland in there. They're going every
Democrat you know, like like uh, I mean, if you
look back over Cleveland did have a weird younger relationship.
But in any case, that's my weird history knowledge here.
He has been dead through that doesn't stop them from
putting him in there, because they've probably got everybody they

(36:04):
can call a liberal or a Democrat or anything. And
that's the thing is, I never thought I thought they
might be able to get out of this too. But
it seems they sow that this was the uniting issue.
They so got like frothed up the craziest of their
base members on that they're trapped.

Speaker 1 (36:20):
But you recall that Qanons. The thing the q andon
wanted the most, and they thought January sixth was was
their philosophy of the storm. The storm which was really
a takeoff from the old book, you know, the Turner Diaries.

Speaker 3 (36:37):
I'm gonna say that's from the neo Nazi.

Speaker 1 (36:40):
From the neo Nazi ideology, the Turner Diaries of the
Day of the Lamp in which the Storm de Shurm
was supposed, which, by the way, name of the neo
Nazi American newspaper, the Stormer just she Shermer, right, the
old Nazi brown Shirts newspaper. And now these guys, the

(37:03):
q Andons, took the storm to be the day that
the Republicans, led by Donald Trump. By the way, q
Andon ideology believe Donald Trump was the white hat who
had taken over government to root out the deep state
pedophiles the exposed. Yeah, well, didn't. They call him a

(37:25):
ge otis Geo t Us god Emperor of the United States.
That was an official QAnon phrase. There's the shirts you
can buy on Etsy with that on it. But these
people also believe that we're moving three hundred thousand children
underground every year by and facilities called deep Underground Military

(37:47):
bunkers dice and.

Speaker 2 (37:51):
You know this, Malcolm, the way the right is it's
so much better than we are about coordinating all this stuff.

Speaker 3 (37:56):
So it's cultural, it's political.

Speaker 2 (37:58):
They had that jackass guy who's an lunatic make the
movie Save the Children or whatever.

Speaker 1 (38:03):
Oh yeah, the guy that turned out to be a pedophile.

Speaker 2 (38:05):
The one that played Yeah, the one they played Jesus
in Passion of the Christ because Mel Gibson's crazy. I
can't think of his name right now, but he was
in that. He helped produce it. He was in that
movie and like all the producers of that moviees it
turned out were trafficking kids like they like, yes, just
it's insane.

Speaker 1 (38:20):
The project the guy it was based on who was
running that organization in Latin America. The charge against him
was they have video of him massaging an underage girl
like thirteen year old girls, chess Jesus and he and
his admission that he watched thousands of hours of child
porn to get boned up on Oh my god part.

Speaker 3 (38:41):
Yeah, he probably. I don't know if we want to
talk about that.

Speaker 1 (38:44):
My point being this, I want to bring this QAnon
thing full circle.

Speaker 3 (38:50):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (38:50):
These people invested their entire life being into identifying and
tracking down pedophiles who were leading America's globe and the
global elite. And it's Donald Trump and his staff the
supposed hero. And now I'm seeing the word ultimate betrayal.

(39:14):
Oh yeah, all over the Q spaces.

Speaker 3 (39:16):
They're burning the MAGA hats there. I mean, you've seen
these videos. They're not they're not.

Speaker 2 (39:21):
I mean, I wish that the left were better at
creating sort of stuff like that, a false flag, not
in a violent way.

Speaker 1 (39:28):
But committee would still be meeting eight years later.

Speaker 3 (39:33):
We're too nice to do that.

Speaker 2 (39:34):
So these things are legit, and they're they're I mean, yeah,
I mean, they finally found something. Look, they've been losing
various other members of their base. The tariffs which have
killed you know on my show that I do at
two pm on the Substack today, which I've had you
on we're gonna have the candidate who's running against Tom
Cotton in Arkansas. She said to be talking about all
these farmers who have lost, you know, their their farms

(39:56):
because of Trump.

Speaker 3 (39:57):
Trump.

Speaker 2 (39:57):
Oh, we're only going to deport criminals. They've deported everybod
these antonies. Farms are empty. You know, we saw what
they did at that farm in California the other day.
People aren't going to work, and so they've already destroyed farmers,
they've destroyed ranchers. They've fired all these government workers, not
just in DC like all these people thought, because of
course they think DC. They think themselves blacks, Jews, whatever, No,
around the country where they are different. It's crazy, right,

(40:20):
but in national parks, the people that work for them
actually live around the country.

Speaker 3 (40:23):
They've fired all of them. So you've all these people already.

Speaker 2 (40:26):
From their base angry at them about that, about that,
who have turned on them. Right, in many polls, ten
to fifteen percent of white working voters who voted for
Trump basically hate him now. And now you're bringing this
into it, which is these people that literally worshiped Trump
because they thought he was going to stop what in
their mind was based on you know, along the lines

(40:47):
of fifteenth century superstition and wired into their minds about baby,
you know, predation and whatever that never wasn't going on
on the Democratic I mean, I'm sure there's some individual
Democrats mass conspiracy, know whatever. If there's a conspiracy, it
seems too much more be on the Republican side when
you start recounting the guys that have done this stuff.

Speaker 3 (41:07):
And now, well I'm exposed.

Speaker 1 (41:09):
But now that we've gotten to this controversy, I don't
want to say controversy. This is this is existential for
Donald Trump, and which is why I wrote in that article,
is a pedophile leading the national security apparatus, not just
leading it right, enabling this thing to where now if

(41:32):
any truth comes out of us, because now the entire
history of Donald Trump now has to be rehashed and
seen through the lens of If you don't release those
damn files, improve your innocence, there is no your innocent
to approven guilty on this one. Now. Trump is guilty
firing Maureen Comy, the woman who successfully prosecuted Jeffrey Epstein,

(41:57):
by saying, oh, well, she's with Jim Comy's daughter or so,
and he did he right? Two of the biggest molesters
out there. It's like the Trump is either panicked or
he is so and he is so inured with the
belief that he is a god, and that the words

(42:18):
that he says, like he said, what do you call
his followers this week?

Speaker 2 (42:22):
Right, it's yeah, it was some of the morons, you know,
something like that. But I mean, I think it's a
combination of he may believe that that he's a god.
I mean, he clearly always has had a huge, huge
problem in terms of like I think I don't even
think the latest you know, D. S. M Book has

(42:45):
can outline the level of narcissism that Trump reaches. You know,
it's probably never happened in almost in recorded history, so
you look at that. I mean, I'm exaggerating, but okay,
he's such a narcisist, you know, and and and so
he could be doing it and saying I'm a god.
And we have to remember, clearly there's dementia going on
there and people could deny.

Speaker 3 (43:07):
It on whatever. It's clear.

Speaker 1 (43:10):
It's clear.

Speaker 2 (43:11):
So there's that or as you said, he's panicking. I
think it could be some of both. I think he
can have moments he seems to swing back and forth.
He thinks, you know, I'm a god, nothing can happen
to me, and that then he seems to freak out
and go fire somebody.

Speaker 1 (43:24):
You know, right, yeah, I'm not to himself. I'm not
a god. I had better do something to distract. And
you know, this whole Rosi O'Donnell thing, the firing of Komi,
all of these things. But now I've got we have
a I throw this in air quotes every time an
Attorney general who is now a theoretically a pedophile enabler,

(43:45):
who is an enabler of his whatever is going on
here his and this carks back to his original taste,
every scrap of everything he has ever said about Epstein,
all the photos, all the videos, all the testimony, what
you read at the beginning of this. I would never

(44:07):
ever have allowed that on this show until this week,
right I the suit was withdrawn. But now within the context,
right everything's going on, it lends. Don't tell me people
aren't gonna hunt that person down and get the inside.

Speaker 2 (44:25):
That's the only reason again that I would read that,
because I'm not reading it like it's a case going
on right now.

Speaker 3 (44:31):
It is in the context.

Speaker 2 (44:32):
If you if you're trying to explain, do we think
Donald Trump did the worst of the worst things. Uh,
you know, when it came to Ebstein, you need to
look at all the evidence. You need to look at
how much time he was around Epstein and young women.
You need to look at that lawsuit. You need to
look at comments he made about about change women changing
at these pageants. You need to make a look at
comments he made about his young daughter. You need to

(44:54):
look at like, you know, these that he admired Epstein
because Epstein liked young women like the It's all relevant
and I wouldn't have read that frankly that I mean,
I had hard time even reading it because it's so
disgusting and so it just it's it makes you angry
and sickened and everything of this.

Speaker 3 (45:12):
But I mean, like, you know, it just goes back
to it also puts it.

Speaker 1 (45:15):
I think what it does here is that it reframes
Donald Trump's sexual predation, that he was such a sexual
predator twenty five credible lawsuits. He's been adjudicated as a rapist.
He is a rapistep as far as the law is concerned.
He's not to mention his other insatiable appetite for felonies, fraud. Again,

(45:39):
the most documented liar in American history. Donald is documented
thus far, and we still don't know what happened. And
that was only the first four years. There's been six
other years where you live.

Speaker 3 (45:51):
I don't think we know the half of what Donald
Trump has done.

Speaker 2 (45:54):
I mean, and he's already right the worst person probably
to ever live in America outside of Donald Trump.

Speaker 3 (46:00):
Killers.

Speaker 1 (46:00):
Maybe You're right is being reframed and the meta narrative
is not coming from liberal America. The meta narrative amongst
liberal America, which I'm seeing now amongst the Democrats is
q andon ideology. Let it all out, let it all out,
Let us see who was doing this. This is what

(46:22):
QAnon was saying for years, hoping, praying it was Hillary Clinton,
Bill Clinton, that they'd be taking to Guantanamo and given
summary executions. That's what q Andon set. Now we are
being straight and honest and fair and saying we don't
care who it is.

Speaker 2 (46:37):
Right off to them is we may have a party
we prefer and obviously the one that stands up for
democracy right now, but we actually believe in democracy, in
our republican right, in the rule of law, so if
there are democrats in there, and I know that these
drones and the right just can't understand the concept. But
the concept, it's a simple concept. If you believe in democracy,

(47:00):
I don't want to protect. If they're Democrats and they
did horrible things, I want them in prison. Like sorry,
this isn't partisan, Like everything is for them.

Speaker 1 (47:08):
You know.

Speaker 2 (47:08):
Right.

Speaker 1 (47:08):
But then again, Donald Trump, now the reframing of every
word he's ever said is now going to come out
as a lot. The reframing of everything that he said
about Hillary Clinton and Bill Clinton is you know, and
all these things, you know, the lock them up, hang
him is now going to be put around his neck
as a noose, not by us, but by the q

(47:32):
Andon people who have you know, over those years it
became whoever right, you know, the global cabal. And now
they feel as if Trump was the pedophile they were
always looking for, and he's lying to us. And you know,
I suspect that maga's going to break down. Thirty seventy right,

(47:54):
thirty percent are going to be going to get Adam
with Hammer and Tom because they're just q Andon crazies.
Seventy percent will comply, They will flip on the narrative.
We saw what's his name of Charlie Kirk and others
doing this if you support Trump, the most amazing six
months that's ever happened, Ye, the most the greatest economy

(48:16):
in American history, just superlative, insane lies just today in
the last twenty four hours. Now, I mean, yeah, oh yeah,
oh yeah, Laura and Bobert coming out and saying she
wants Matt gets to do this. Now, we're in the
world of controlled opposition right where somebody has said, you
need to gain control of this right now. And the

(48:40):
way we do it is we control the investigation and
find that lawfully and legally you are, you know, clearly,
most sincerely, dead right that this story is not true.
And a child molestor himself who's been indicted or has
been implicated by this has clear Donald Trump, Matt Gates.

(49:02):
And to Republicans that'll be like, okay, good enough.

Speaker 2 (49:05):
Yeah, no, I mean the vast majority of them, that's
exactly right. We need every lever of power. I mean,
I think I think it's worth shutting the Senate down over.
I think it's worth every state that's the I mean,
state attorneys general can do a lot, can can can
prosecute a lot, and we have we have attorneys general
in some of the biggest states with the largest populations

(49:27):
in the country. Get out there, get working, get talking
to people, get investing.

Speaker 1 (49:32):
You know that's that brings me this this last question. Okay,
endgame here. Okay, this is Fliff's war fighting strategy. Law fair.
You know, democracy defense, the strategy for dealing with this.
And you say step one is what's that again, attorney generals?

Speaker 3 (49:52):
I would say attorneys general.

Speaker 2 (49:54):
I would have them from from a number of states
joining a joint lawsuit to get this relief, can also
investigate their own states. I would have whatever levers of
power we control in the federal government, which aren't many,
but we do have the ability in the Senate to
shut things down, even in the House to a degree
because they have such a small majority, and to pressure

(50:17):
Republicans who are in some of these swing districts there
are a couple left enough to change the majority in
the House.

Speaker 3 (50:23):
I think we needed to go.

Speaker 2 (50:24):
We should be advertising having you know, protesters show up
at everything in those districts.

Speaker 3 (50:29):
Same thing with the Senate. I would on top of that,
we need to be one.

Speaker 2 (50:34):
I know it is hard for Democrats, coordinated on message,
your show, my show, other people shows. We need to
be talking about this constantly, talking about what it is
in the way that you and I just laid it out,
because it's a simple story if people, you know, if
you can lay it out easily, and and we you know,
I we had a no King today. You helped promote
the hell out of that. Maybe we should maybe we
should have a no Pedophile President's Day. It's even a

(51:00):
literative and you know, I don't know, but we should
do something to to show the massive protests that this
needs to be a real investigation. But you're an intelligence guy,
so I'd love to hear if you have other ideas
on that.

Speaker 1 (51:14):
Oh well, I have a whole slew of ideas, but
this is your this is your day to do that.
As you know, I'm associated with a new political action
committee called f a f O pack right, Yes, I
know which which does does not actually stand for f
around and find out it stands for Focused Action with
Focused Objectives.

Speaker 3 (51:35):
And I love it because it still sounds like it
does sound for you know, well done with the brand, so.

Speaker 1 (51:42):
You know, but we have some ideas, right, I'm a
big fan as an information warfare person of meta narrative seizure,
seizing the big framework that's been drafted thus far. Their
framework was liberal elite pedophiles. Ye, our framework should be.
We have now exposed, with your assistance, that there was

(52:05):
a conservative Donald trump Ola gark elite pedophiles that are everywhere.
And now you know what this will do if it
turns out to be a fraction troop, just a fraction
true global news media is going to start going around.
They're going to start hiding down oligark ships, the girls
that are going on them. I mean, you know, at

(52:26):
one point there was a great x CIA officer and
it's turned novelist who was tracking the Russian oligarch yachts. Right,
and it's nothing to take pictures of who's on these things, right,
drones over them, and you know, and we need to
expose that. There is my substack article talks about a
fourteen year oldgo the first person I ever saw trafficked

(52:49):
in the Italy. I read a Soviet right. They were
from a cruise ship, the first cruise ship that ever
left the Soviet Union and went to Italy. And they
were selling trikets. They were selling teenage girls too on
the pier, and only if it wasn't for the intervention
of the carabinari, the old guy who bought her from

(53:11):
her grandmother would have taken her onto the ship, had
sex with her, and it would have gone on till
they left part. So these things are real.

Speaker 2 (53:20):
They are real, and they tend to be in you know,
like cloistered, oligarchic, you know, wealthy, And I would tell
you there's also again, a lot the proof has not
come out, so I'll just say it's it has been
accused that Peter Teal likes the young.

Speaker 1 (53:40):
Wait wait, I believe it's Peter Teel's gay. If I'm
not mistaken, he is.

Speaker 2 (53:44):
But he likes his men as Let's just say he
likes his men not to have become men yet, is
what the accusation is.

Speaker 3 (53:52):
And there is at least.

Speaker 2 (53:54):
One young guy in Miami who came out and said
that So so who moved away to get apparently away
from him. So my point is is that in these
types of areas with no transparency, it's why authoritarian governments
it happens whatever no transparency, wealthy guys.

Speaker 3 (54:11):
So I would say the.

Speaker 2 (54:12):
Men an era needs to be turned and when you
look into every single trumper at the top there, and
I bet we'll find some things that we didn't even
know we're going on that would horrify us, honestly.

Speaker 1 (54:22):
You know what. And because as I like I wrote
in one of my books, pot to Destroy Democracy, there
is what I call a global garky, a global oligarchy.
There's a level of money out there. I always give
this litmus test about twenty five thirty years ago, there
was a small port in Spain, still a relatively small

(54:45):
place called Perto Banus. And if you've never heard of it,
you don't have money. You've never heard of it.

Speaker 3 (54:51):
And I don't have either money nor the interest in
what they're doing.

Speaker 1 (54:56):
If you don't have a helicopter pad on your ship,
you were allowed to. And so there are other secret
ports in Majorca, Palador, all these other places where if
you don't have a mega yacht with a hellopad and
a permanently assigned helicopter crew, you just aren't. At that point.
This is a space where you never carry your passport.

(55:21):
Your staff does all that for you. You don't go
through customs, Your staff goes through customs for you. You
may have to walk past the customs officer. But that
money can move anything, weapons, drugs, people, and look, Democrats
are too poor to be involved in that world. Let's

(55:41):
just be honest. But also we're not in these traditional
roles where you have people of trust, school teachers, youth
pastors is like youth pastor and sheriff this year sheriff
deputy and youth pastor in twenty twenty five is almost

(56:02):
it's like being a Catholic priest twenty years.

Speaker 4 (56:04):
Ago, Scout leader back in the day. Yeah, you know
you're getting molested because it's about access to those people.
So amongst the global oligarchy, the global garchy, if we
were really a serious sincere nation, the intelligence community would
be tracking oligarch vessels.

Speaker 1 (56:26):
We did at one point, we would track some vessels
which were associated with drug smuggling and things like that.
But if you really wanted to go after the global
pedophile rings that are out there, we know they're out there,
you'd be hitting the richest ports in the world, and
you'd be taking down Russian, French, Italian, whoever the oligarchs

(56:47):
are that are now marionetteing Donald Trump. But see, he
isn't of that oligarchy. The problem with Trump is he
never had enough money to join that set when he.

Speaker 3 (57:01):
Had the debt. He never was them. He always dreamt
of being them, but he never was.

Speaker 1 (57:06):
Right. But now he does. He's making a billion illicit
dollars a month as president of the United States, and
so this now is turning the spotlight. Thank you, QAnon,
and really Elon Musk, right, the richest man in the
world dropped the dime on Hissk is now turned the
spotlight on his entire history and bottom line, what do

(57:29):
you you know? I think that I think this is
a black hole up to which there is no escape.
What do you think the end game is going to be?
He got three options, resignation, twenty fifth Amendment, impeachment, a
heroic hamburger that causes his sudden and most timely.

Speaker 3 (57:49):
Death amburger of all time. It's the greatest, the best. Okay,
I'll stop.

Speaker 2 (57:56):
I think I don't see him ever resign because of
who he is. You know, we know what his personality
is like. I think it's going to get to the
point where it's either going to be one of the
other two options, and I think impeachment is the more
likely one because the folks he's put in the cabinet
are loyal to him to a large degree, whereas the
folks who are in Congress are loyal to him as

(58:18):
long as voters.

Speaker 3 (58:19):
As long as he has the voters.

Speaker 2 (58:21):
And if MAGA folks start breaking away and hating him,
and they have an opening to break from HM because
most of them can't stand him, like get stand him,
I think it ends up being impeachment.

Speaker 1 (58:32):
There's sixty percent now, yeah, sixty seven percent said that
they won't thus file and released at all called no.
I think it's eighty percent when it released it all
called sixty seven percent feel that no one should be
allowed to serve if they're implicated in this.

Speaker 3 (58:47):
I a majority of Republicans, if I'm correct, we're in that.

Speaker 2 (58:50):
I think in the end this takes away enough of
the MAGA base that they've massively turned him. He's already
lost others from other things we've talked about. I think
that it ends up being impeachment because McConnell came very close,
and he screwed us by not doing it after the insurrection,
because he was going back and forth whether it would
benefit Republicans or not. And then you're going to see
here clearly with how much Trump's going to lose people

(59:12):
because when this comes out that they're going to have
to dump him.

Speaker 1 (59:16):
You know now that I talk to you. There are
actually two more scenarios that would be end state scenarios,
as crazy as they sound.

Speaker 3 (59:25):
One would a fifth floor hotel room in Moscow.

Speaker 1 (59:29):
No, No, that's not even viable. Now. One that is
viable is that Trump dives headfirst into full scale authoritarianism
and dictatorship where he goes that's it, screw you, dissolving Congress, right,
dissolving this. These will not be investigated. I am now

(59:50):
in charge. I starts acting as a paramilitary force right
where they become the Prietorian Guard.

Speaker 2 (01:00:00):
Which I can see you know, mean, but what right?
But what does the c I A and what like
regular folks there? And what do the military do if
he does that?

Speaker 1 (01:00:11):
Yeah? See the problem with that that that brings up.
That's the the lost Last Resort. If you've ever seen
there was an old TV show called called Last Resort
with with Kenneth What's what's the name Brianna, the black
guy who instantly he plays a submarine captain and if

(01:00:33):
you watch the news stories in the back. The president
is about to be overthrown the chairman of the Joint
Chiefs of Staff, the Joint Chiefs have no confidence in him,
impeachment is coming, and he orders the submarine to New Karachi, Pakistan,
And you're like, whoa, whoa, Andre browna and and that's

(01:00:55):
the last resort scenario. So that's a fifth scenario is
the Trump goes full dictator and just decides he's gonna
he will redesign power, he will become NERA sixth scenario
is a little more fun and apocryphal, is that Trump
grabs the service weapon of a secret service and does
a hostage barricade with jd Vance in the Oval Office

(01:01:16):
until he can get free passages from Moscow.

Speaker 3 (01:01:18):
So Jdi van stressed up like a baby in this
or no, well.

Speaker 1 (01:01:22):
I don't know what goes on in the Oval Office.
You never know. So okay, those scenarios aside, but three
of them are viable.

Speaker 2 (01:01:31):
I mean, you say impeachments, one impeachment, and I can
see twenty fifth. I don't think the twenty fifth happens
because I think they're cowards and they're scared of him,
and he's appointed them. I do think impeachment is very viable,
and I do think sadly his calling a full dictatorship,
but I actually do not. I mean, you know this
stuff better than me, So.

Speaker 3 (01:01:49):
You can tell me that. I'm I do not believe
military generals will go along with it.

Speaker 1 (01:01:53):
I don't know they won't, they won't, but that that
would take us to a new place in American history.

Speaker 2 (01:01:57):
Well, and I don't want to be at that place.
But I mean again, you know, we've I've wrote in
my piece on Rome having been there, all about if
people you know, use the term crossing the rubicon and
didn't know what that meant. You know, if Trump started
bringing soldiers into cities over immigration also comicatis, that was,
you know, Caesar crossing the rubicon and ending democracy in Rome. Well,

(01:02:21):
I don't want to be in that place. But this
guy locks himself up with his praetorian guard protecting him.
I don't really know what the hell else we can do,
you know what I mean? I mean, So, so I
hope that's not where this ends.

Speaker 1 (01:02:32):
Well, you know, there is one last scenario before we
leave the skiff here today, and that's the possibility which
falls undergoing full dictatorship. But which is the last resort
scenario where he orders US to Natan's nuclear enrichment facility,
because we're finding out now this week that US intelligence
has assessed that two of the three facilities are not

(01:02:55):
destroyed and feedback in operations shortly. And that's it's Fahan,
which is dper underground than the Dance was, and the Tance.
So uh, this is I mean Ford Ford the Tance
I believe is destroyed. But this is one of those
scenarios where he could do that. You'll go, oh, for

(01:03:16):
the first time since World War Two, you know, we
the only way we could guarantee to rush around is
not going to do it. And Trump will say, we've
determined they were at breakthrough. They were about to decimate
an atomic bomb for test purposes, and I was forced
to nuke.

Speaker 2 (01:03:32):
And then sadly, you know, for all the idiots out there,
I know, and there's too many of them, people who
like come into contact with Like, you know, I didn't
like Trump, but I don't like it, but he was
the lesser of two evils or whatever I'm like about democracy.
I mean, you've met these people before, right, Well, sadly,
for them, there's no doubt in my mind Trump would
try to do that because he has no concept of

(01:03:53):
human life. Uh, the issue is again, will will these
guys carry that order out? And I'm gonna go that
they won't.

Speaker 1 (01:04:01):
You know, well, in fact that is go watch the
TV show The Last Resort. That's what Andre Brona as
the Black Submarine Ballistic Missile Submarine Captain refuses to nuke Karachi,
Pakistan right because the message system he's getting his orders
on means the United States is destroyed. And then he

(01:04:22):
goes he calls the Secretary of Defense and he says,
this network's not supposed to be here. You're not supposed
to be alive. And I'm watching Hannah Montana on television
and you're ordering it the NUCA city of six million people.
And then they relieve him of his command and he
refuses and takes the submarine and becomes his own independence.

Speaker 2 (01:04:41):
Well, I have to hope for Remember, it was one
courageous and I know you know this better. You know
Russian who was to launch when there were some seagulls
or whatever the hell it was. It was making them
think that one two eighty three, that one nuke singular
nuke had been launched at them, and of course he
being willing to stand up to his commanders and also

(01:05:02):
being smart, was like the United States wouldn't launch one
nuke at us. They launched, they'd launch, and he refused
to do it. And that's why we're all still alive. So, yeah,
there's somebody there with that kind of you know wherewithal
and strength.

Speaker 1 (01:05:17):
Well, we are certainly in a bizarre world. I would
have preferred House of Cards level, you know, just the
guy murdering somebody, just straight up. But you know, we
have to answer this, this tough question. Is our national
security in the hands of someone who may be a
pedophile or and surrounded by enablers who will try to

(01:05:37):
wash through this?

Speaker 3 (01:05:38):
And I sadly the answer to that question is very likely,
and we're going to know.

Speaker 2 (01:05:42):
With all the other points we discussed him, we're going
to know for sure, probably relatively soon.

Speaker 1 (01:05:47):
This is so ridiculous. We did get some laughs out
of it, Thank you.

Speaker 3 (01:05:51):
Could we have to, you know, like if we don't laugh,
I'll just cry all the time. I can't believe that
this is where we are, So thank you Malcolm for
having me.

Speaker 1 (01:06:01):
Yeah, Well, black Man's spy is the place to come.
You know, I'm going to open the skiff door now
you can go out and have a coffee and recover
your phone. So thanks again, and I will see you
on yours show.

Speaker 2 (01:06:12):
Yeah, we'll have you on again soon, like maybe in
the next week or two, when you're when you when
you're back home. All right, Okay, thanks a lot, buddy.

Speaker 1 (01:06:23):
Well that ends this week's episode of Black Man's Spy.
I'm sorry we even had to bring it to you,
but we did because we do need to have these
adult conversations, even within the context of geopolitics, spionage, and government.
So with that, please subscribe to Malcolm Nance at substack
dot com if you'd like to read that article. It's

(01:06:45):
free to subscribe. You can become a paid subscriber. If
you want to join in on the conversation. You can
find me also black Man Spy on YouTube. On your
YouTube channel, you can subscribe to watch my videos discussing
that and watching this video if you're listening to it
on Apple, Stitcher or other places fine podcasts are served.

(01:07:06):
So thank you for coming to this week's Black Man Spy.
I will see you on the beach