Mackenzie Hammond, Lena Staropoli, Brianna Pudlo: Passing it Forward: Lessons on the Sidelines

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome back to another episode of the Brown Performance and
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(00:22):
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Mackenzie Lena Brie, Welcome to the podcast. I'm super excited

(00:44):
to work with the three of you today. For people
who aren't familiar with you, your background in soccer and
now obviously your roles from a coaching side, would you
mind fill am in a bit about who you are
and all the amazing things that you've been doing.

Speaker 2 (00:56):
I'm Ray.

Speaker 3 (00:57):
I graduated from Holy Family there for five years, I
ended up doing a fifth year. Since then, I've been
coaching at Huntington Valley. I coached twenty thirteen boys and
twenty twelve boys.

Speaker 2 (01:11):
They're great, They're a lot of fun.

Speaker 3 (01:13):
I also am the assistant coach at Holy Family University
for the women's team. I do a lot of their
goalkeeping training over there. It's a lot of fun, all right.

Speaker 4 (01:23):
My name is Lina Starpoley. I also played at Holy Family.
I was the center back. I had three years where
I got to participate fully. My fourth year I actually
missed because of an acl tair, but then segued right
back into coaching as soon as I could get back
up on my feet. So I've been coaching at Huntington
Valley also for the past five years. Started on the

(01:46):
boy side with Brie and then transitioned over to the
girl side right now, I'm twenty ten and twenty eleven girls.
I've done a number of teams on the girl side
that I've graduated out as well. Hunting Valley also handled
the college recruiting program, so for all high school aged teams,
I helped them get recruited to college and kind of

(02:08):
see that through from eighth grade to senior year.

Speaker 5 (02:10):
I'm McKenzie. I also played a Holy Family for four
years didn't do a fifth year and didn't tear my
ACL my last year, so that's different. But I bid
go back to Maryland for PT school. So I just
started coaching with Lena both girls teams this past summer.
So it's beeneficially a year coaching and then because iited
to do the second season this year, second year this year.

Speaker 1 (02:30):
Yeah, that's absolutely incredible. And obviously you all have that
common trait of having played soccer at a very high
level for a number of years that way and then
being able to turn around and kind of give back
to the next generation of the sport through coaching and
kind of paying it forward that way. And this has
come up a lot on podcasts recently, and big shout

(02:51):
out to my guy text who kind of put me
onto this kind of philosophy of Hey, you know, maybe
it's not the sport alone that's teaching kidsvaluable lessons for life.
Maybe it's the captains and the coaches and the people,
the human element of it that's actually having the big
impact that we all look at coming from the sport.
Maybe it's more the people than just the sport itself.

(03:13):
And obviously I think we can all speak from personal
experience because fun fact about me, I played soccer back
in the day. I wasn't nearly as good as you all.
Mackenzie could probably meg me with her eyes closed right now.
But regardless, we all know what it's like to have
a great coach, an influential coach, someone who you look
up to, who brings out the best in you. And

(03:34):
I'm sure we all know what it's like to have
a coach that is anything but that, unfortunately, and those
experiences can really make or break the relation that the
next generation has with the sport that they're engaging with.
That way, I'm interested to hear from the three of you.
Have you had any kind of experiences with coaches obviously

(03:55):
we don't have the name drop that have been really
really beneficial and just have really helped you in your
journey in relation to the sport of soccer, and any
that have just really deterred you from the sport or
kind of turned you off from it for lack of
a better way to put it. And if so, what
were those experiences like how did you kind of collectively
respond to those and react to those I mean, you.

Speaker 3 (04:17):
Always have like good coaches and not so good coaches
growing up. I mean it's you can always differentiate when
you've played soccer for so long, like which ones you like,
which ones you didn't like, And they really kind of
shaped the way that I decided I wanted to coach.

Speaker 2 (04:35):
I just you know what I mean, I saw what
I didn't like and what I.

Speaker 3 (04:38):
Learned from, and I kind of transitioned to that into
the way that I coach now.

Speaker 4 (04:44):
Growing up, I definitely in the younger years had some
coaches that in this world of like super competitive youth sports,
you know, practice five days a week all year round,
and coaches that put on this pressure and anxiety to
perform maybe more than they should or in the wrong ways.
Definitely had some experience with that which kind of led

(05:07):
me into this mindset of like soccer stopped being something
fun and started being more like a job. Like soccer
was a job, and that was something that I started
experience at probably like an abnormally young age. But then
as time went on, I had other coaches that you know,

(05:28):
made it back into like the sport, the game, the
relationships with their teammates, and still competitive obviously as you
know you would get into Division two and college soccer,
but made it a more enjoyable experience and kind of
let me get the love back for the game. But
coming straight from that my whole life, I really did

(05:50):
not fall back in love with soccer again until I
tore my ACL in college and then that absence from
the sport and not having it in my life coming
back to coaching and seeing it from a totally different perspective,
and it's not a job and it's fun, it's something
to work at, something to be good at, but you know,

(06:11):
having a total different perspective on it, just totally different
coming back as not a kid and as an adult.
And that's my priority for the kids that I coached,
to make them not feel like this is just a task,
a job, something you have to perform at. It's still
a sport with lost of other benefits and you have
to work hard, but it's still a game at the
end of the day.

Speaker 5 (06:32):
Yeah, I would definitely agree with that injury. And then
also when I did in for myself. I was going
into my freshman year high school and since I couldn't
play contact but I could run, I was doing track
and I loved our track coach, great guy, but he
made me realize, like how much I loved soccer because
running and running and running and doing the same thing
over and over and over again. I was like, this
is horrible. So I think too, are just like comparing

(06:54):
like when you lose something and you do a different sport,
or like you go back to the sport that iron
and like, wow, like I really do enjoy going to
soccer practice versus before, Like do I really have to
go to soccer practice? So definitely that same type of coaching, yes,
And then also just the experience of like missing it
and then going back and like what Lena said.

Speaker 1 (07:14):
Yeah, that absence factor playing into things. And it sounds
like the combination of missing the sport that you had
as kind of that hallmark staple in life for so
many years, combined with different coaching experiences helped to kind
of shape your own coaching philosophies now that you use
with the next generation of athletes that you get to
work with day in and day out that way, What

(07:37):
does your own kind of coaching philosophies look like now,
for good, better or worse that way? What's your kind
of like overall framework for coaching soccer athletes that way?
And how do you kind of go about like planning
and preparing for your practices, game days and so on
that way.

Speaker 5 (07:53):
I know, one thing like going back to like not
being able to play and kind of pushing myself with track.
We definitely always put some type of fitness in the beginning,
whether it's just hill sprints for carrying each other up
the hill, of strengthening and like you know, just trying
to find a fun way to but also making sure
they know, especially at the girls age that we're coaching now,
like you have to do things on your own, like

(08:15):
you you are responsible for how you perform on the field,
and if you don't like you're playing time, maybe it's
because you're now fast enough or you're not in shape enough.
So kind of putting that out there, but being like
a it's okay to go out and want like this
summer is your summer to like go and work on
yourself and kind of put it on them, especially at
like this age that you know it's it's okay to

(08:36):
know that you need to improve on things, but what
are you going to do, Like you can't just fix
it at our two hour practice or hour and a
half practice.

Speaker 4 (08:43):
So yeah, accountability I think is the big thing that
we like to harp on trying to just be as
black and white as possible, especially when dealing with teenage girls,
like we lease black and white subgroup of people you
could deal with. We definitely do our best to always say,
you know, here's the things that you need to do

(09:03):
to be successful. If you do them, you have a
high likelihood of being successful in the field, off the field,
whatever it might be. That being said, it's unrealistic to
say that you can perform to perfection one hundred percent
of the time. You're gonna have off days. If you're
having an off day, I'm going to tell you and
tell you what you're doing wrong. And just being as
straightford as possible, I think is pretty much the deal

(09:26):
that we go with.

Speaker 3 (09:27):
And on the other side of it, like when I
coach I have younger boys, accountability is huge, but I
like to focus on everything's a team.

Speaker 2 (09:36):
We win together, we lose together.

Speaker 3 (09:38):
We do our fitness together, we do our punishments together.

Speaker 2 (09:41):
Everything we do is together.

Speaker 3 (09:43):
We hold each other accountable by doing things together. Someone's
not doing what they're supposed to be doing a practice,
everybody's doing burpees. That leads to telling them, hey, maybe
stop talking. We coach breeze talking, and it leads to accountability.
When you put the pressure on everybody and everybody has
to focus on doing the right thing, they start to

(10:05):
hold each other accountable, especially at that young age.

Speaker 1 (10:09):
Absolutely, so it sounds like the emphasis on working together
as a team and doing everything together, the highs, the lows,
the wins, the losses. Just being united in and relentless
in your pursuit of whatever comes your way as a
team and developing those aspects lead to accountability by the sounds,
and accountability sounds like a very hallmark pillar of all

(10:32):
of y'all's coaching philosophies that way, just holding people to
a certain standard and ensuring that they meet the requirements
that they're expected of, making sure those expectations are clearly
articulated to them so that they know what they need
to do right now, but even beyond. And it's so
interesting to me to hear those kind of being your

(10:53):
coaching cornerstones, if you will, because just earlier today I
was having a conversation another podcast recording actually with a
strength coach or we were talking about kind of this
next generation of athletes and how you know, it's very
different than when we were in college or when we
were trying to, you know, play sports. Neither of us

(11:13):
were very good at the time, don't get me wrong,
but it was like, you know, back then, some of
these things like pay for play and this sense of like, well,
I'm not going to play for this university unless they
pay me x amount of money. Some of these different
challenges were not part of the picture that way, and
I think now more than ever, it's essential for us
to drive home some of these character messages in the

(11:35):
next generation of athletes, because if you don't develop them
from a young age, it's very difficult, if not impossible,
to develop them kind of later on in life, if
you will. So, I'm a huge fan of what it
sounds like your coaching philosophies are that way, and i'd
love to hear a little bit more about kind of
how you developed those kind of philosophies over time that way,
and how they've kind of evolved, and some of the

(11:57):
challenges that you might have faced different times and working
with athletes, because it certainly sounds like working with the
teenage and youth groups sometimes can be a little uniquely challenging.

Speaker 4 (12:10):
I think what you just said about the generational difference
in young athletes is super important. We're obviously not that
far I mean, I want to say we're not that
far hour, we're like yearself, but we're like ten to
twelve years, you know, out from some of these high
school girls that we coach. But the reality is like

(12:34):
they're growing up and have always grown up in this
culture of instant gratification where we're almost preaching like to
a dying generation of you know, work hard for a
long time and you'll read through rewards eventually. This is
something that requires, you know, years and hours and all

(12:56):
this time and effort to perfect the craft and get
better at it. And the reality is like that's like
the only thing or very well could be the only
thing in their life that is even remotely close to
that at this point. And then with that, like there's
like a loss of a competitive edge A lot of
times when I think back to how it was, maybe
even when we were in high school and college versus now,

(13:18):
and I think the two are hand in hand with
each other. And trying to just like reignite that that
drive in the younger athletes is something that is difficult,
especially when you get them at sixteen or seventeen. I
think it's salvageable when they're you know, nine, ten, eleven.

(13:38):
You can still kind of get it to them before
society gets a hold of them. You can still kind
of ignite those things in them. But that's that's for sure,
like the biggest hurdle that I see and something that
we actively try to work on, and it's not just soccer,
right like, and helping them to understand that that same

(13:59):
competiti of edge and drive can apply to literally anything
else in their life. With the older girls, it's like,
you know, this is stuff that you can take into college,
whether you play soccer or not, and take into the
workforce after that.

Speaker 2 (14:12):
Yeah, no, I completely agree. I think that's that's definitely
the biggest challenge is.

Speaker 3 (14:18):
Trying to provide them that motivation when you don't get
the rewards right away, Like they're practicing four or five
days a week, playing two games every weekend, and they
don't see anything until the end, and they want the
rewards now, Like they win a game, they want rewards now,
they want games at practice stuff like that. When it's

(14:39):
we have more things to focus on, like we won
this weekend, that's great, and we're gonna, you know, not
work on things that we worked on the previous week
because we improved, but we have other things now that
we have to do.

Speaker 2 (14:51):
We have to keep the ball rolling.

Speaker 3 (14:53):
We have to keep going and not just stopping every
time we want a game, keeping them looking forward all
the time, looking to the next one.

Speaker 5 (15:03):
I said, I definitely agree with the competitiveness. I don't know,
I think us three especially like we're just competitive with everything,
like we would do like pranks as roommates, and if
like you didn't have the best brank, like you'd be mad.
So when I got to coaching and kind of picked
up on a little bit of like in scrimmages and practice,
like I'd be mad if my team lost, like in
college in high school if any small s you know,

(15:25):
like that like made me mad. And I'd like to
see you and girls get mad if like we do
a shooting droll and some girls are like mad that
they're losing, Like I love to see that. And then
some days, like I get people have off days, but
like I'll notice that they just don't care and they're
just kind of walking around, And that's something that like Lena,
especially harps On and I've definitely picked up on, like,
you have to want to be here, and especially at

(15:47):
the level that they're playing in this club, they're paying
for like they're paying a lot of money to play,
and I think especially as they get older, they realize that,
but like they need to be they need to want
to be there, and soon getting into high school and
playing and if some of these girls and we're playing
in college, like, you're going to have to want it
and work for it to get it. And I think
that generational difference, especially it hasn't hit home for some people.

(16:07):
So that's definitely something that we try to portray an
easier way than that, But.

Speaker 1 (16:16):
Yeah, absolutely building off of that. It makes me think
of a lot of the conversations I've had lately with
Rob Nelson from Penn State. That way is he's more
of an ecological dynamics, psychology kind of individual that way,
and a lot of his work and one of the
things we've talked about at length is it seems like
this next generation of athletes is missing this ability to

(16:39):
solve problems independently on their own, and a lot of
times that's related to sport. Ultimately, everything an athlete does
is solving a problem, whether that's dribbling past a defender
or trying to stop the person with the ball in
front of them trying to block a shot. There's always
some kind of problem that's proposed by the sport and

(17:00):
a unique creative solution that is demanded of them. And essentially,
what we found is that learning these tasks and learning
how to solve these problems is not linear in nature.
It's not just a marathon of ups. Instead, it's a constant,
ongoing interaction that involves highs, lows, success as failures. Times when,

(17:22):
as you mentioned, your athletes are really upset and unhappy
about things, and other times when hey, they're really happy
about things. And I think ultimately it just comes back
to this concept of the athletes themselves are highly dynamic.
They're constantly changing, they're very much still learning and still evolving,
and I think for some reason, we start to treat

(17:44):
kind of this next generation of athletes, especially when they
get to the high levels like you all are at
from a travel standpoint, at such a young age, we
start to treat them the same way that we treat
professional athletes, because that's almost the standard that we're holding
them to the amount of time they're investing into their sport. However,
they're still young. They're still ten, twelve, fourteen, fifteen years old,

(18:09):
and we kind of forget that they've got development left
to go, and we forget what it's like sometimes, or
at least I think we forget what it's like sometimes
to literally be in their shoes and being passed with
some of these unique problems that they need to solve
in the level of skill that they have to solve
them against, when in reality there's still a teenager or

(18:30):
they're still just a kid, for lack of a better
way to put it.

Speaker 4 (18:33):
Yeah, we've definitely seen some crazy stuff as far as
that goes with I think Henton Valley, the club that
we coach at, does a really good job of keeping
the balance there and the expectations are high, but they're
they're not too high. That being said, we definitely participate

(18:54):
in play against some clubs where it becomes unrealistic. Right
the time commitment, the travel commitment, there's no way that
that's not impeding the child's overall experience, the school year's experience,
your school. Like if you go up to fifteen years

(19:17):
old and you can never attend your buddy's birthday party
once on a weekend because you have soccer three states away.
Those are the kind of things that it's still important.
It's still important to have the experience of a kid. Otherwise,
that's what going back to what was in the beginning,
that's what turns the sport into a job, and then
that's what ultimately that that's what burns them out. How

(19:40):
can you expect a kid that's been dealing with that
for eighteen years to want to continue that for another
four in college at an even higher level.

Speaker 2 (19:49):
That especially especially at Huntington Alley.

Speaker 3 (19:52):
We at least all of my players, they all at
least play another sport. They all play baseball, they all
play basketball, and they love it. They love playing those
other sports. And some people disagree, but I think those
are necessary in kids development, and I think it makes
them better in soccer and in their other sports. There's

(20:14):
so many times that practices where I'm like talking to them,
like when you guys are in basketball and we're low
and we're shuffling, that's what we need to be doing
when we're defending. And I use other sports as analogies
in mind, and they should be able to play other
sports and get out of soccer and do other other
things and experience the world a little bit, even though

(20:37):
they're young, like they deserve to experience the world just
as much as everybody else. And like Lena said, when
you're traveling three states away every weekend, it gets pretty
exhausting and you get sick of it. You miss your
friends at home and all that other stuff. You get
to miss out on that stuff.

Speaker 1 (20:54):
I think that's absolutely amazing. And I think the other
thing that it makes me think of, as y'all we're talking,
is this concept of the difference between being an athlete
on a team, being a member of the team in
the sense that you're playing on the field, you're competing
and so on that way, to competing as a coach,

(21:14):
and the transition that it must take to go from
athlete to coach. And this is one that I know
a lot of athletes express interest into me in the
sense that they love the sport that they've gotten to
play and they want to continue to be involved in
some standpoint, but they've never coached before, or they don't
really know what it's like to be involved in the sport,
but not necessarily the one playing the sport that way.

(21:37):
I'd love to hear a bit about how you all
transition from being an athlete and being on the field
to now being on the coach the coaching side of
things and being at the games right on the sideline,
still kind of leading the charge, but leading it in
maybe a different sense than you once did.

Speaker 3 (21:56):
I mean, I think for me at least, it was
definitely a little challenging in the beginning, especially coming from
being on the field to like you said, not being
on the fields. It was hard having to be there
from the sideline and like thinking in my head like
how I would do things differently and if I was
on the field, and then I had to learn how

(22:16):
to coach what I was feeling and express that to
my players and get them to do the things that
I was thinking from the sideline. I think that was
my biggest challenge, was understanding, Okay, I can't be the
one to do it now.

Speaker 4 (22:31):
Yeah, it's definitely a quick reality and humility check. Sometimes
we deal with some kids and like you can only
the ultimate goal, right is that, like that I hope
to make this kid better than I ever was, and
as them to make good decisions on the field and

(22:53):
execute well. And that definitely comes with like just because
that would play this way, and what I would decide
in this situation as a player is the realization that
like that does not actually mean it's the best thing
to do about it, And so like sometimes like the
knee jerk reaction to some things, I have to take
a second to process and realize, like that's what I

(23:17):
would do as a player. I'm a bonehead player, like
make the better choice in the coaching situation.

Speaker 5 (23:25):
Yeah, I definitely agree with both of them. It's been
nice because I'm assistant coach Underlina, so I kind of
get to see how like she like bites her lip
and when she says something, and for the most part,
we always agree on like anything that either of us say.
But it's also cool to like see if she thinks
something differently than I do, or if we say something
like what are we doing next? It's like nice to
be able to bounce ideas off each other because, like

(23:47):
they said, like the first thing that's coming to our
heads is like what we would be doing on the field,
or what we would be doing on the goal, or
how we would play, or like what we think would
happen next. But like switching it to the other way
is I mean, we all we also play, so that's
also hard because we play on women's league and like
it definitely is hard to switch. I'm definitely not there.
I don't know how they can head coach, but I'll

(24:08):
be there one day.

Speaker 1 (24:08):
Maybe, And y'all play on the same women's league team. Yeah,
so what's the dynamic like for you all? As you know,
obviously playing together for several years in college that way
now still playing together, but maybe different level of competition
than maybe was.

Speaker 2 (24:26):
Yeah, it's a lot of fun.

Speaker 3 (24:27):
We have a lot more land for sure, a lot
more mistakes happened, but that's all right.

Speaker 4 (24:34):
But that's but that's what we talked about like earlier,
that like the fact that we are this far out
of college and we still willingly give up multiple week
we yeah, we obviously like that. We give up Sunday
mornings and have been giving up Sunday mornings since we
were twenty So it's obviously because we like, we love

(24:57):
the sport. Otherwise, never if you asked me this question
seven years ago, like my sophomore year of college, IBO,
I would be doing this now. Probably said, are you
out of your mind.

Speaker 1 (25:09):
Now, Yeah, no, for sure, And it sounds like, at
least to me that way, that that's one of the
other cornerstones to your coaching philosophies is ensuring that the
athletes that you work with have that kind of love
or develop that kind of love for the sport long term,
so that when they are in their mid to late

(25:30):
twenties and they don't have to get up early and
don't have to give up their Sunday mornings when maybe
they could have just stayed out a little bit later
that last Saturday night and had a good little time
there drinking espresso Martiniz. I know no one likes those,
but you know, it's like that concept of just giving
up time that you don't have to give up for

(25:51):
something because of how much you enjoy and because how
much you love it, And those are the kind of
things that you don't just get by going through the
motions playing a sport. Those are the things that you
only get when you're surrounded by the right coaches, the
right athletes, and the overall positive team environment and atmosphere
that all of us are trying to develop for the

(26:12):
athletes that way. But as we've mentioned, it's so difficult
to do sometimes. And you even mentioned earlier about the
focus of how you develop that team mindset and how
that you develop the we kind of thinking that way
instead of just the self centered approach that a lot
of people tend to have, and I'm probably guilty of
it myself sometimes about how we just we think about

(26:33):
ourselves before others. Sometimes I'm interested to hear more about
that kind of process for you all that way, because
obviously it seems like you all kind of live that
and embody that concept of team over myself, putting others first,
and so on that way outside of you know, just
keeping everyone accountable in practice that way. Has there been

(26:54):
anything that you've done or anything you've liked from a
practice dynamics and just team building and team development side
of saying that you feel really pays dividends with that
kind of like setting the cultural standard and helping athletes
to see that sport is more than just the sport
at hand.

Speaker 5 (27:10):
I think something that comes from like college too, that
we definitely do, Like coaching is like team bonding is
so important, like at college that there'd be times where
like I can't believe our coach is like making us
eat lunch together. I can't believe our coaches making us
cycle during like preseason together, But it is those days
that we go back, like I was more sore from
that day of cycling that was supposed to be like

(27:31):
a fun morning than I was that whole week of preseason.
Like those are things you don't forget, and I think
it's really cool, especially with Archie teams, Like we do
team dinners and we go to the girls' houses and
they have fun together and they do dance dance revolutions,
Like those things matter, and I think it's important. They
have friends from school and different things, but they are
friends from soccer too, and it's okay to have fun

(27:54):
and it's not always serious. So that's something I feel
like is really important.

Speaker 3 (27:59):
I know my my younger team, they make it a point,
like at least me and the parents, we make it
a point to do one overnight tournament at least a season,
one in the fall, one in the spring. It's something
that we like work into our schedule every year. We
plan it ahead of time and we do the overnight.
They stay Friday and Saturday and the boys get the hotel,

(28:19):
they swim in the pool and they get to spend
the whole weekend together. It's one of their favorite weekends
of the year. So they don't even care about the
soccer part. They couldn't care less about our games. They're
just worried about what we're doing at the hotel that night,
and where we're.

Speaker 2 (28:33):
All going to go eat lunch in between, and where
we're gonna go have fun that night.

Speaker 3 (28:37):
That's all they care about, and that's something that we
make sure that we do every year twice a year,
just to get them out and get them together.

Speaker 4 (28:47):
Yeah, the team meals is definitely I think the best one.
Like Mackenzie said, we get a good mix of girls
that don't go to school together, so it's nice for
them to kind of have those relationships and friendships that
are side of their school friends and benefits. Also kind
of keeps all the middle school and high school girl
drama away and it just lets to be like these

(29:10):
are these are my my soccer friends. And it translates
well into the practice dynamic and the field dynamic.

Speaker 3 (29:19):
They get excited to come to practice after they get
excited to see each other. That's all that's all you
ever want is from to be happy to come to
practice and to see each other and enjoy their time together.

Speaker 1 (29:31):
Do you all feel like there's any difference in how
you approach the coaching for maybe the boy athletes versus
the girls that way.

Speaker 4 (29:40):
Yes, yeah, yes, yeah, Like we don't.

Speaker 3 (29:45):
Do your team dinners, like they get excited to go
out to eat together, like when we're stuck at the
soccer field, but like they don't want to be with
me on the weekend, like when we're away, like they
want to go play Dang dang ditch and run around
the hotel and do their thing. Kind of let them
go in that aspect and let them have their fun

(30:05):
at soccer. We just play like we end every practice
at least with like one shooting game.

Speaker 2 (30:10):
It really is a shooting drill.

Speaker 3 (30:11):
But when you tell them it's a game and you
put them on teams, they have a blast. And then
you let them pick teams and run around and have fun.
The team dinners for them not so much. They just
kind of like.

Speaker 2 (30:21):
To to run around.

Speaker 4 (30:25):
Yeah, with girls, it was definitely like a little bit.
It's psychological. If a girl feels like she's being excluded
socially from the team, she she's not gonna perform well.
She doesn't like being there. So like that inclusivity with
the team and with the coaches. Right, So, same girls
are the same way with coaches. They think their coach

(30:47):
hates them, they're not. They're not gonna play well, that's
gonna run through their head the whole game. Or if
they think so and so is mad at them, that's
play next to them, especially with teenage girls. Like, it's
a thing that I'm always have been aware of because
I was in that situation. And that's the point of

(31:07):
why we're so black and white, Like I need you
to take the feelings out of this and you know,
just focus on what you're doing and don't get distracted
by sometimes made up, sometimes legitimately valid things that are
happening socially among the team. But yeah, it's definitely a
stark difference from the boys. Definitely not my favorite part

(31:29):
about coaching girls. But but it's the reality. It's the
reality of coaching them. It's so much worse when high
school season part. It's bad. But I strive to make
the teams that I coach an outlet for them to
not feel that social pressure that they might feel at

(31:53):
high school soccer or at school or for all. Honestly,
like any other time that their phone is all, which
is twenty four to seven. So this two hour practice
or two hour game, this is the two hours where
you're not gonna worry about any of that. And if
I ever noticed, I have it because every role coach knows.
I feel strongly about this. But if I did ever

(32:15):
know that a practice, it would be squashed pretty quick.

Speaker 5 (32:17):
Yeah, I definitely agree with what Lena just said. I
think it's good. She always says it at the beginning
of a game or at the beginning of practice, like
this is this is like your mind free time, Like
this is when you just think about soccer. You play soccer,
you have fun, and like literally anything else that's going
on right now doesn't matter. And it's so important because
there'd be so many times, especially in college, for like

(32:40):
things are going on at home or family that like
you're not around, or you know, a boyfriend or girlfriend issue,
and like those things definitely impact how you play. So
I think that's so important, especially for the teenage girls.
Age like to emphasize that, like let's just play. You
don't have your phone on you, your boyfriend's not next year,
your parents aren't here it's important, so and.

Speaker 3 (33:03):
I definitely try to like model that as well.

Speaker 2 (33:05):
And I know Kens and Lena do. Like we're not
on our phones at practice.

Speaker 3 (33:09):
We're the same way, Like as soon as we get
to practices, as soon as we get to games, it's
the same for us, Like the rest of it doesn't matter.
Like we're here, we're playing soccer. I'm focused on the team.
I'm focused on what's happening, and my phone's in my bag.

Speaker 2 (33:22):
I don't look at it. I know they're the same way,
and it's it's just an.

Speaker 3 (33:26):
Outlet from the rest of the world for a couple
hours of the day. It's really something I know that
we all try to emphasize.

Speaker 1 (33:33):
For them too, absolutely, and I think that kind of
creates the sport becoming almost like an escape for sometimes
the harsh realities of the world that we live in today,
in today's day and age that way. And obviously, as
you all were talking, I was thinking, and I think
Lena you even brought it up. It's like you all
have also experienced great successes but also immense struggles in

(33:57):
relation to sport or things off the field that may
somehow find their way into impacting your sport that way
one way or another that way. It's crazy to think that,
as you mentioned, you know, just tenish years ago, you
all were kind of in their shoes, believe it or not.
So how did your own struggles and successes when you

(34:18):
were playing soccer yourself that way, whether that be on
the field or off the field, impact and influence the
way that you support the athletes that are going through
some of those trying times and adversity that way in
today's day and age with your coaching roles.

Speaker 3 (34:33):
I mean, I always just try to like stay positive
with them. Constructive criticism everybody hears it all the time,
but a lot of the times it seems like it's
just criticism and most of the time that's all they hear.
You can say one good thing and one bad thing,
and they're only going to hear the bad thing. So like,

(34:54):
most of the time, I've been pretty good with it. Obviously,
sometimes I slip, but it's always one good thing, when
bad thing, one good thing. When I'm trying to say
something to one of my athletes, one of my players,
I always end on a good thing.

Speaker 2 (35:06):
Especially at the end of practice.

Speaker 3 (35:08):
I always highlight what everybody did great that day and
what we did great that week. It's always sending them
off on a good note.

Speaker 4 (35:17):
Yeah, that's a good one. Just making sure that they're
feeling like positively reinforced is a big one. Another thing,
like not even necessarily related to on the field directly,
but I really like to stress with the athletes and
the parents of the athletes that I coach that like,

(35:39):
I'm here as a person that's been in your shoes
fairly recently to offer you advice, you know, on or
off the field.

Speaker 2 (35:48):
College.

Speaker 4 (35:49):
Like with the college recruiting program, I do a lot
of one on one counseling with the athletes and their families,
trying to help them make a decision that's going to
impact our life. And I'm very brutally honest with them,
you know, is this really the best decision for you?
What is it that you need to succeed in college?

(36:09):
Like it's it's all just a matter of being honest,
and but also being there as kind of a sounding
board for the athlete when you can offer a perspective
that they likely can't get the same thing from from
their parents who probably didn't play at this level. Ever,
they definitely didn't experience it this way they did. Like

(36:31):
I might be flattering myself, but kind of like an
older sister type of situation, like I want to be
I've been there, I've done that. I can offer you
some some wise words, but also it wasn't so long
ago that I'm completely out of touch. One of my
favorite things is the girls that I've coached recently then

(36:52):
graduated and or playing college soccer. Now, I say in
pretty pretty constant contact with hearing all out their college experience,
and in the early days it can be rough. I
think my phone was off the hook during a pre season.
But nothing actually like makes me happier than being able

(37:12):
to be that person for them. Yeah.

Speaker 5 (37:14):
I think back to not that I was exactly their age,
but I was similar age when I tore my ACL.
And we have some girls on our team that unfortunately
are going through like not just ACL but other long
term surgeries, and I just try to like not stress
and be like, you know, I'm a pt and try
to get on them like do your own thing, obviously,
but I'm here to just talk to you about like

(37:35):
this sucks, and I know it sucks, and it's not
like and the girls come to the games, they don't
come to every practice, but they come to the games.
And I know how much eight twelve months of sitting
and watching is not fun. So I just try to
like stress that, like I'm here, text me, like if
you need to talk about anything, I think now more
so I get to like a lot more text from
parents than I do. The girls just like she hurt

(37:57):
this and she didn't want to tell you, and like
what can she do? You know? And I think that's
good on the parents aspect, but it's good also when
they can feel comfortable enough to text and be like
what can I do in this circumstance? Which was really
cool that we did like an injury prevention day where
I kind of just went through like super easy body
weight and like bandit exercises. Dan, I know I talked
to you before we before I did that, but just

(38:19):
like a quick forty five minutes of like one page
just for them to take home, like they're going into
high school and they're gonna need to drink training, and
it was a good way to just kind of introduce that.
And a lot of the girls were like very enjoy
Like we had parents that were like they love that,
Like where can we get a band, and it's good
to introduce that. Like this Friday, I'm meeting with a
track team and before they're like cross country and track

(38:41):
practice and like just talking to them about stuff, And
it's good to see that peak of interest of like
nutrition and rest is just as important as you going
and getting your miles in or like you you working out.
So I think that's cool too.

Speaker 1 (38:55):
Yeah, absolutely, I think to your point, all of those
other factors and variables that you mentioned, whether that be
the sleep, the nutrition, and so on that way, do
impact the overall athlete that way. And you know you
brought it up there, Mackenzie, and obviously Lena you brought
it up earlier that you both underwent acl injuries that
way and just how debilitating and dark that can be,

(39:16):
and just that entire process and that entire time nine
to twelve month window that way demands a lot out
of you psychologically obviously, but also just from a work
ethic standpoint in order to rebuild what you lost, Like
you're literally having to relearn how to walk, relearn how
to use the muscles of your leg that you've never
had to think about learning how to use before. It

(39:38):
just sort of naturally happened on its own, and it
makes me think of this famous quote that keeps getting
brought up by my friend Ak who basically says, you know,
hard work beats talent. When talent doesn't work hard is
the biggest lie ever, because there's been so many instances
where athletes are busting their butt and where the team

(39:58):
that's putting in more time and more effort and more energy,
or you know, I'm the athlete that was out for
nine to twelve months and I still put in all
this time. Throughout that time, I worked like a dog
to try and get back. But even all of that
work that I put in wasn't enough. Because sometimes there's
athletes that are a little bit more gifted at the

(40:18):
sport than I am that you know, yeah, maybe they
don't have to work as hard for some of these
different skills and they just come quicker to them and
come more natural to them. However, that doesn't make the
concept of avoiding hard work irrelevant. I think, if anything,
it should be motivation for us or those that are
kind of like me and just not naturally good at
pretty much anything motor related, a little bit of a

(40:42):
motor moron for lack of a better way to put it,
It should just incentivize us to put a little bit
more time in and work even harder to get to
that level. You know. Unfortunately we weren't all given the
same level of talent, and unfortunately some of those recoveries
following injuries go a lot easier than others. You know,
I can have one kid back in seven months and

(41:02):
another back in twelve months, and some of those kids
that were there for twelve months worked way harder than
the kids that were only there for seven months. I
can't quite tell you what that differentiating factor is and
why some occurred just so much faster than others. But
I think that concept of knowing that, you know, it's
not going to be all fair and equitable in this

(41:24):
skilled development side of sport, but that doesn't mean that
we shouldn't shy away from the hard work and the
dirty work that it takes to get there is also
a super essential takeaway, at least for me, just kind
of drawing that conclusion from y'all's experience is thus far
that way.

Speaker 4 (41:41):
A big thing that we talk about with our teams is,
you know, control the controllabulls. You can't control if your
opponent is twice your size, twice your speed, or twice
as good as soccer. In that moment, you can control
the decision making on the pitch, and you can control

(42:02):
your preparation for the game, and you can control your
your drive and your heart in the moment and long
term leading up to it. And those are the things
that like, we're not we're not getting the although we're
very competitive and very good, we're not getting the cream
up the crop kids here, but we are competing against them.

(42:22):
So the key success there is to control those controllable
things before and during the game.

Speaker 2 (42:31):
I love that. I'm gonna take that. Thanks, that's awesome.

Speaker 4 (42:35):
Yeah, it's my next pep.

Speaker 2 (42:37):
Talk to the same boys. No, but it's she's right,
like we were not.

Speaker 3 (42:44):
Getting the best players in the Tri State area Huntington Valley,
but we are competing against him. She's completely right, And
having the drive to compete against the best of the
best is all we're looking for, and do your best
to compete against them is all we're looking for out

(43:04):
of our players at least.

Speaker 4 (43:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (43:07):
No, absolutely, I love that point. And again it's it's
just knowing that you can do it. And I mean
there's so many instances of you know, the athlete who
maybe not is not as skilled as someone else absolutely
shutting them down and like absolutely wrecking them in a
game that way. I mean, I just think back to

(43:28):
you know, this past year. I know y'all are in Philly,
so Eagle Super Bowl win that way, right, Like, obviously
Patrick Mahomes is touted as this great generational talent quarterback
and yet your Eagles defense absolutely shut him down and
made him look kind of like Cam Newton did against
the Broncos years ago. Right, It's the concept of knowing

(43:50):
that you know, you might be going up against someone
that has more talent and more skill, but your willingness
to show up and put in the work and the
time and effort and energy can still get you to
a level where as you mentioned, you can compete with them,
you can hang with them, and you can play ball
with them all day long. And I think that that's
the kind of concept that is not tall enough because

(44:11):
everyone is just so much just they're just hit with
this phrase that well, you know, if talent is working,
you can't hang with them, but if talent doesn't work,
oh then you can beat them. I just I think
the quote tends to be a little misleading in my
opinion that way, And as I was talking about that too,
that was something that I didn't really come to the

(44:34):
conclusion of until recently that way, And it's something that
I almost had to like challenge and change my own
belief system to get to where I'm at and kind
of my own thoughts around some of these different concepts
that I didn't have those thoughts five years ago. I'm interested.
Was there any kind of habits or beliefs that you
had when you were playing soccer that changed or maybe

(44:56):
you had to unlearn or relearn so speak, when your
role shifted from primary role as a player to primary
role as a coach.

Speaker 4 (45:06):
I think kind of what you just mentioned. As a player,
I was always sort of the type to be like,
I can just out hustle them. I can out hustle them,
and and that'll get me far enough. As coach, you
come to realize that, like, that's not a realistic way

(45:28):
to coach kids. You're not gonna be able to out
hustle them every time. So it comes more to like
a tactical kind of aspect where we have to adjust
our tactics because we know we're gonna get out tactic
and out hustled, so we have to take a more
tactical approach to how we do things.

Speaker 5 (45:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (45:48):
No, I definitely agree that, especially with the boys like that.
A lot of them think that they can just out
hustle everybody, and.

Speaker 2 (45:57):
I love it. I'm never going to shut that down.

Speaker 3 (46:00):
But I have to try to turn that hustle into
technical work at practices and tactical work in the classroom
and making that hustle look a little bit different for
them for it to show on the field in a
different way, because in their minds, they're just gonna run, run, run,
and run run, and sometimes the other person's gonna run

(46:22):
a lot faster, like Lena said, And when you take
that hustle and you show them just how to defend
that someone faster, then that hustle changes on the field.
It becomes more physical and strength than it is just running.

Speaker 5 (46:37):
Yeah, I definitely agree with what they said, the physical
aspect of it, of like you're not the same player
as everyone that you're coaching. And also like I guess,
like I try to think of some of the girls
that like don't get a lot of playing time, and
like I didn't get a lot of playing time in college,
and like how they react to it, and how I
would have react to it, and to try to like

(46:58):
get through their heads that like you might not play
and like, yeah, it sucks, but figure out how you
can help the team. And that is just something that's
not in like a younger population's head, especially when their
parents are like, why aren't my kids playing? Like at
this level, you shouldn't expect playing time, especially when we're
going far in the season. And if your daughter is

(47:20):
gonna sit there and move and not ever ask what
she can do to play, like, she's probably never gonna play.
And if she's gonna figure out how to like get
extra prep in or if she asks how she can
improve on something, you know, stuff like that, that's kind
of hard to like step back and realize that they
need to do that on their own. It's not something
that we should be telling them to do. Was definitely
something that you pick up on going from player to coach.

Speaker 1 (47:43):
So yeah, yeah, no, absolutely, And I feel like that's
probably a conversation that we could probably continue for the
rest of the night that way, because there is a
lot different when you're playing the sport versus coaching the sport,
and obviously being a coach and a player, I'll be
a slightly different level. A competition player is also like

(48:04):
really fascinating to me as well, And I think that
there's a lot more to unpack about this that way,
and we could talk about it all night long. Like
I mentioned that way, I'm interested. Is there anything that
we missed as we were chatting so far that you
really wanted to bring up, or any kind of thoughts
or remarks that y'all had around this concept of, you know,
athlete to coach.

Speaker 3 (48:26):
No, definitely, it definitely changed my perspective of the game.
I definitely learned, I think a lot more on my
first year of coaching than I did in my twenty
two years of playing, especially as a goalie. Coming and
being a head coach for a full team. I'm not
just coaching my one position that I know. I definitely

(48:48):
completely learned the game on a different level. I understand
it differently, and I think my IQ definitely jumped just
in one year of coaching.

Speaker 4 (48:58):
I think really just the only thing over years of
successful career playing soccer, I can confidently say that the
rewards with coaching are like tenfold. It is very rewarding
to see this younger generation and a team that you

(49:19):
lead succeed. I've felt more fulfilled in the past three
four years of coaching kids than well. It was also
a very fulfilling and long soccer career myself. But it's
definitely a rewarding I agree. I'm only one year into it,
but I had a lot of fun this year.

Speaker 5 (49:41):
We also did really good, so that was plus.

Speaker 1 (49:44):
Yeah. No, I think that's an interesting pick too, is
like it's easy for things to you know, be good
when things are going good. It's like, you know, when
the record's good, when the teams win tournaments and games
and stuff. It's easy for like all the highs to
feel ridiculously high that way. And I'm certainly interested to

(50:04):
hear how that continues to evolve for you as you
kind of face some different coaching challenges and unique situations
that kind of pop up that way, because I'm sure
that there's not really anything that can fully prepare you
for the stresses that coaching throws at you sometimes. I mean,
I'm sure you've all got crazy stories of stuff that
has happened, or like athletes have brought up and just

(50:27):
experiences when you're kind of traveling away for competition and
stuff that happens and it's just like, you know, nothing
could have ever prepared you for that. So I can't
wait to hear more about how that continues to evolve
for you all that way throughout your coaching career. That way,
for people who want to reach out to y'all with
questions or maybe find out more about y'all online that way,

(50:48):
where can they find you all or y'all Instagram people.
TikTok people, Definitely TikTok people. Definitely. I can see this
trio crushing some TikTok dances right now.

Speaker 6 (51:00):
I'll give my PTP talk. Actually, McKenzie dot PT dot DPT,
it's no longer SPT you love that no TikTok.

Speaker 4 (51:12):
I don't have a TikTok Sorry, I had no TikTok
for me either. Just first in last name on Instagram.

Speaker 2 (51:20):
Yeah, mine's just pret puddlo on Instagram.

Speaker 1 (51:23):
That's awesome. We'll link to all that in the description
below too. That way, if you didn't quite catch it,
you can just click there and see everything that Lena,
Bree and Mackenzie are up to. This was awesome really
appreciate y'all's time.

Speaker 5 (51:36):
Yeah, thank you, Yeah, thank you for your time.

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