August 14, 2025 • 31 mins
If your pitch needs a decoder, you’re losing the sale 😵💫.
On this episode of The Advisor, Lisa Urbanski sits down with solar-sales pro & coach Luke Jorgenson as he breaks down the worst bad sales tactics—overselling, jargon dumps, and talking past the buyer—and shows you how to win with simplicity, listening, and a clear framework.
Keep it human, keep it short, keep it about the client. 🎯
You’ll learn how to:
🧹 Ditch the info-dump: Say less, mean more; clarity > complexity.
👂 Listen > lecture: Pivot statements into smart questions and embrace silence.
🤝 Stay client-focused: Lead with outcomes, not features; build trust fast.
🧭 Use a framework: Apply Luke’s W Method / Smooth Selling to guide any convo.
🪞 Be authentic: Stop “performing” sales; sell like yourself and close more.
Press PLAY to turn talk into trust—and trust into closed deals—with a simple, client-first sales framework.
🌐 Visit Luke’s site for a free discovery call: lukejorgenson.com
📸 Follow Luke on Instagram: @coach_lukej
👉 Love insightful and life-changing interviews? Tap Follow now so you never miss an inspiring episode of The Advisor with Stacey Chillemi.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/business-growth-mindset-the-advisor--6704784/support.
On this episode of The Advisor, Lisa Urbanski sits down with solar-sales pro & coach Luke Jorgenson as he breaks down the worst bad sales tactics—overselling, jargon dumps, and talking past the buyer—and shows you how to win with simplicity, listening, and a clear framework.
Keep it human, keep it short, keep it about the client. 🎯
You’ll learn how to:
🧹 Ditch the info-dump: Say less, mean more; clarity > complexity.
👂 Listen > lecture: Pivot statements into smart questions and embrace silence.
🤝 Stay client-focused: Lead with outcomes, not features; build trust fast.
🧭 Use a framework: Apply Luke’s W Method / Smooth Selling to guide any convo.
🪞 Be authentic: Stop “performing” sales; sell like yourself and close more.
Press PLAY to turn talk into trust—and trust into closed deals—with a simple, client-first sales framework.
🌐 Visit Luke’s site for a free discovery call: lukejorgenson.com
📸 Follow Luke on Instagram: @coach_lukej
👉 Love insightful and life-changing interviews? Tap Follow now so you never miss an inspiring episode of The Advisor with Stacey Chillemi.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/business-growth-mindset-the-advisor--6704784/support.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
You.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Welcome back to The Advisor. My name is Lisa Urbanski,
co host of the show. Some really exciting news today,
Doctor Bradley Nelson has sponsored the show. If you don't
know him, he is the writer author of Emotion Code,
Body Code, and he's releasing a new code which you
will have to stay tuned for in the meantime.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Welcome Luke Jorgensen back to the show.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
He's got a podcast on our channel and it's all
about sales. He is like the door to door sales alchemist.
He understands sales, how to do them, what not to do,
and he's been in the biz for a long time
and he is providing all of you with all of
(00:49):
his insights to help you with your sales techniques. So
the coach is here ready to talk. Last time we
talked about people's skills and the importance of those, and
today we're going to go into sales mistakes, what those
might look like, how you might be shooting your own
foot when you're trying to make a sale.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
Anyway, it's really good to see you again, Luke.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Yeah, great, see Lisa. Happy to be here talking about sales.
We're talking about sells. Hey, happy to be doing that.
Speaker 1 (01:21):
Yeah, you're the expert, well.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
Been through a lot of situations, but hopefully I know
a little bit.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Yeah, so before before we record, I was telling you
a story about something that happened to me the other
day that was in relation to a sales mistake. And
so I would love for you to get into it
and just maybe start talking about it because there's so
many people out there, especially nowadays, doing online sales. It's
so damn hard to make money, make a living, but
(01:50):
there's all these little tools that we can use. So
what are some of the mistakes that you think people
are making that are harming their sales process?
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Yeah, brought I brought four or four killers of your
cells today, four destroyers of your own cells. So I
hop when we could kind of hit them one at
a time. But yeah, that story you shared with me,
I think, I think honestly is for our first one.
So let's see, let's hear your story about that first.
So our first topic is over selling. So yeah, sometimes
(02:22):
knowing what not to do honestly and getting like you said,
you know, not shooting yourself on the foot, getting out
of your own way. Sometimes knowing what not to do
is just as important as knowing what to do. So
today kind of focusing in a little bit on the
what not to do because you're just, yeah, just gonna
hurt yourself. So anyway, so overselling, what was your experience, Lisa,
(02:46):
I loved it?
Speaker 1 (02:47):
Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
So I was with someone who was just she wouldn't
stop talking, and I just wanted to tell me exactly
what I needed to do because she was giving me
so much information and my brain was like overloaded.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
I didn't understand half the stuff she was talking about.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
And I literally was just like, get me away from
this person because I just I want to know what
to do, like give me directions.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
And look, I'm getting worked up thinking about it. I
wouldn't have given her any money. I'll tell you that
right now.
Speaker 3 (03:20):
I feel your stress, hormal, it's go crazy.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
Yeah, no, I need to go to yoga after this.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
That's not a good sign if you need to go
to yoga after your sales experience, right, Sometimes it can
be like that. But yeah, that's a big one. Right
over talking, like just talking too much? Was she going
into a lot of the the a lot of the
features and just information dump.
Speaker 1 (03:44):
On you and terminology that I have no clue what
it even means.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
So it's like she's and like just all the things,
so terminology, what it's going to do, what it's not
going to do. And literally she could have said three
things to me, I would have handed her my card
and I would have bought it.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
Yeah, yeah, that's those are great. Those are all related
because talking too much you can literally do a lot
of damage, right, Like the information overload. That was one
of them, right, the talking too much, just too much info,
too much lingo, like just that information overload. Right when
when we have a I have a saying that goes
(04:25):
a confused buyer will always say no, yeah, always, like
if you're confused at the answer is always no, because.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
Look what I did. I ran, I literally ran away
from her here.
Speaker 3 (04:41):
Yeah. Yeah, it's better to have two clear points than
ten kind of hazy points, right, or information overload, So
so don't confuse your people. Yeah, And then the talking
too much obviously getting into the features, getting into like
too much technie talk, like and not having to simple
actions to move forward, to move your front because sales
(05:03):
is moving you from A to B and B as
the buy right or B as the next step and
then see as the buy whatever it is that you're
trying to accomplish, but moving people, getting them to act right,
just speaking for speaking purposes is not what we're trying
to do or trying to get people to act. So
that's a big one.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
Yeah, And I'm just going to give impact.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
I needed what I wanted.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
Like, when someone's out to buy something, they're going to
get it. I drove half an hour in a different
direction to find another one because of that experience. So
people want to buy, they just need someone to, like
you said, guide them, tell them what to do. If
she would have said, like this will do this, this
(05:48):
will do that, and now give me your credit card
or this is the charge, I would have been happy
with that.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
Yeah, but it just like threw me off so bad.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
So yeah, I think people maybe it's a nerve thing,
like people just get or they want to come across
that they know everything about it. They think they're being helpful,
but really she just like turned my brain into uh mush.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
Yeah, yeah, that's so true. Half of a lot. Like
and especially like I feel like so in our industry.
And it was funny because in the door to door industry,
we would bring in a new person and they didn't
know a lot at first, and they always had like
success because they kind of kept it simple and like
did what we taught. And then sure enough a few
(06:35):
months like go by and here they all they get
like more knowledge and more information in their brain. And
now all of a sudden, you're like, what are you doing?
Like they're going out on all these tangents. They're talking
about random stuff just because they know things right now.
So it's like, okay, we could just like turn you
back in time and like like forget everything that you know,
(06:58):
only bring it up if it's important and asked about.
Like there's so much that we know about. We should
know everything about our product or service, like literally front end,
like you know, front cover to back cover, like everything.
But we're not gonna talk about everything. We're not going
to cover every page, right, like we're not going to
(07:19):
cover every feature. We're gonna talk about Well, first, we're
gonna ask them what's important, right, kind of give a
general overview, and that person could have probably asked you
like hey, like what are you looking for, or like
ask some like clarifying questions right with you to see
like what was important to you or what you were
really trying to accomplish or what problem you were really
(07:40):
trying to solve, and then they could have just talked
about that and maybe one other feature and been done. Right.
So yeah, so over talking that's a big one. I
think also along with the over talking is sometimes we
get when we overtalk, we get into this mindset of
like begging, Like you know, we think of cells like
(08:05):
when I talk, I'm giving, giving, giving, giving, right, right,
And so you just and then it's like you become
like a like a beggar because the more you talk,
it's like, Okay, I want, I want, I want, I
want like coming back to me. So I think that
that mentality is sometimes when we overtalk or we kind
of become a little bit begging on our side, and
(08:28):
that mentality will shell through through over talking.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Yeah, and I think you hit the nail on the head.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Though it becomes about them, it comes about if I'm
the salesperson, if I'm over talking and oversharing, it becomes
about me and it's no longer about the client. So
if that woman would have asked me, what are you
specifically looking for, she would know that I had very
little understanding of it. I didn't really care, and I
(08:57):
just needed it for this one thing. So instead of
like real like telling me all the things, she would
have understood that I don't know much about that topic.
She would have asked the clarifying questions. But instead I
felt like I was there like giving her therapy or something.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
So yeah, and it felt.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
Like a desperate move like she's like, so you're leaving,
and I'm like, I'm just out of here.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
I don't even know.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
It's just crazy, yeah, right, yeah, Because a lot of
times that happens, and people need like a direction, like
they wanted they want to go in a direction, but
they might not know like exactly how to start. For instance,
sometimes it's just pointing him like to the first step,
like this is what we're gonna do next, right, like okay,
and then you do that next and then this after that,
(09:44):
this is what we're gonna do. Like they just want
they want someone to trust them and to like guide them.
And there's some products and services that are more like
step by step that are a little bit longer, and
some that are more quick right like they buy it
and they walk out the store. I mean, I get that,
but there's some a lot of things that are more
like step by step and people want to know like
what to do next.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
Yeah, yeah, it makes.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Us feel clarifying question, the clarifying question. That was her
mistake was not asking me what I needed, right, it
was not. It was focused on like that her nerves
or whatever it was. But by not clarifying, then you
lose the say because you have no clue what someone wants.
My pain point was what I needed, but she didn't
(10:30):
hit that pain point, she didn't come close to it,
and so I was like leaving more confused. I'm like,
do I even need this thing? That's how I felt.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
Meanwhile, I went in there so damn clear in my
mind that this is what I needed, and then that
just rattled me. So yeah, I think the clarifying questions
are so important.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
Yeah, that's good. That's a that's a great example for
that first one for sure.
Speaker 1 (10:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
So how do like, how do people learn how to
do that? Like is that a skill in itself? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (11:03):
It is, just like anything it sells, right, it can
be learned, and that's the good news, Like you can
learn to do this. So one thing I you just
constantly got to remind yourself is like instead of talking,
so just a quick little tip for people to apply
this one. So instead of talking using a statement, ask
(11:26):
a question. So instead of statements, pivot to a question. Right,
so you give a little bit and then to follow up, like,
just ask a question and then just be quiet. And
it's amazing what you learn. Amazing, Like you'll find out
about the person. You'll find out what their needs are.
(11:47):
You'll find out like what to say next because of
what they say, right, You'll find out how this is going.
It is going great, this is like you know all
those things, and just by reframing and just ask the question.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
Yes, the listening part because people don't like silence.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
So if you ask a question and then you shut
your mouth, people are the other person's going to talk.
Speaker 1 (12:10):
It's just human nature.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
Yeah, even if you don't ask a question to just
look kind of like they'll start talking.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
They got all nervous. Yeah, totally.
Speaker 3 (12:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
We don't like silence, Yes, we don't.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
We got to get better at it though, especially in sales,
because you're right, if she would have just asked a question,
then I would have told her everything.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
She maybe could have sold me a bunch of other stuff.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
Right, yeah, so what else?
Speaker 1 (12:40):
What else do people mistake like some of the other mistakes.
Speaker 3 (12:44):
Let's go to number two. So number two is kind
of a mentality reframing, and so it's selling only for
your benefit as the salesperson, right, or the business owner
or the entrepreneur. You're only thinking about yourself and what
how this is going to benefit you. So a quick story,
And when I first started selling, so I sold Soul Energy,
(13:07):
and of course I'm just thinking like, Okay, how am
I going to do this? What's in it for me?
And I just constantly was going in it like, Okay,
if I can close this many this week, I can
get this much money kind of thing, you know, which
is totally normal. It's totally typical, right. But as soon
as I realized that the product that I had, because
I talked to some people that had that product for
(13:29):
over a year now and they're like loving it and
it was good for them and they liked it, and
I really saw the benefit. Now, all of a sudden,
I come at it at a little bit different place.
So instead of coming at it what's for me, coming
at it more what's for them? Right, and how does
this benefit them? And what's in it for them? Speaking
(13:51):
of the client, right, speaking of the buyer. So that
reframe of what's in it for them as opposed to
what's in it for you, and so that I think
that's key. That's a that's a big one.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
Yeah, I think that's any rookie in the sales game.
They know what the potential of the commissions are and
then they focus on that, right, And it's like those numbers,
I mean they mean a lot, But when you flipped that,
like you said, and focus on how can I satisfy
my client?
Speaker 1 (14:27):
How can I best serve my client?
Speaker 2 (14:29):
That changes the energy even and then that builds that trust.
Speaker 3 (14:34):
I think, Yeah, the energy totally changed and that's all
it really was for me. It was just like an
energy thing and it's you feel it like it's People
were really really good at reading because people have had
lots and lots of interactions over the time, so they
might not have sales interactions, but they had other interactions.
(14:54):
And people are really really good at their BS. Like
the BS meters were really good at like sniffing out
the BS right, Like, So I think when you have
that and they can see that like it's not it's
not BS like it's real, that changes the dynamic and
it doesn't mean that you don't benefit because as a salesperson,
(15:14):
three people are winning. The client's winning, the company's winning,
or you know whoever's kind of behind that that might
even be you. And then the middle person, that salesperson
is winning. So it's a three way win. Everyone's gonna win.
But who are you focused more on. You've got to
be more focused on that client, that person, the buyer.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Yeah, and then they're gonna love you, and then they're
gonna want to buy more stuff from you down the
road or they're gonna refer you.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
So it's like a ripple effect too.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
Yeah. The trust there, Yeah, the trust builds time and
time again, right over time, and it just gets stronger
and stronger. So that's the way to do it, I think.
So if we just think of ourselves. Like another quick example,
like so when we when we would go and we
would we would have like a meeting with the with
the person at first like introduced solar energy, and then
(16:05):
we would usually come back and like show them their
design on their home and kind of what they're savings
were and the more a little bit more in depth
of like how it applied directly to their house. A
little bit more customized at that point, and so right
there we could see we had technology that literally we
could see like what our commission was, and we'd have
(16:27):
to kind of go in and click on a button
and kind of look at it. I never looked at that, Oh,
I never looked at it so well, not never like
my last four or five years. I never looked at
it because I didn't want that to be like the
last thing on my mind going in is like right right.
I wanted to be more focus on what they were doing,
what they were like, what they needed, right. I knew
(16:48):
the product was going to benefit them, like I believed
that frontwards backwards for a long long time. But just
that small little mind shift of like, okay, like what's
in it for them? I think is more. It's just
a refresher to like have that in your mind.
Speaker 1 (17:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
I have like visions of really bad car salesman trying
to sell me my first car and remember being so like,
just like you said that bs meter, it's so obvious
when someone just wants your money and it's you almost
feel gross, Like it's like a really bad feeling. So
that's a really good skill to learn. It is like
(17:29):
be about them. How are you going to benefit them? Yeah,
because that's that's how you're going to make the sale
for sure.
Speaker 3 (17:37):
Yeah, in the long run, I mean you might lose
a couple of deals here and there because of that,
but in the long run, it's going to pay dividends.
Like always selling the right way. I think people are
a little bit short sighted sometimes and they just think
about the here and now. But I think selling the
right way over the long term, it pays dividends. And
(17:58):
because you get more referrals later, you get like more
of a trust factor, Like you don't go down that
slippery slope of like shadiness and like lying and all
that stuff, right, Like you try to try to stay
away from that.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
So, yeah, you want to keep your name in the game,
like in a good way.
Speaker 3 (18:16):
Yeah. Yeah. People are gonna talk and they definitely are
going to talk a lot more if you do a
bad job than if you know you could do You
could do a great job for a hundred times and
people won't say anything. But you do one bad, one
bad thing, people are gonna tell a hundred people.
Speaker 1 (18:29):
So crazy crazy, what else what else can we do?
Speaker 3 (18:35):
Yeah? Yeah, the third one? Yeah, don't do third one
is like our last episode, we talked a lot about this,
so people can refer back to that last episode. But
the lack of people skills, I think it's important to
repeat a little bit here. So just that, like, just
don't be weird.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
What's weird? What what do you mean by that?
Speaker 3 (18:58):
Like, don't say and do weird things, like just be
like a regular person, like right, Like don't try to
be someone else, like don't try to impress, like you
know all those things. Just be a regular person. Sell
like you you would sell to someone that you know, right,
And there's a lot.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
I have a funny story an ex co worker, an
old coworker.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
So in another job, we were selling first DAID.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
Courses and he was teaching a hydro group of corporate people,
like corporate people, and we were trying to get them
to buy the course that we could teach, like their
whole entire corporation. And he told them about his plans
to go do mushrooms. So he was done talking to them,
(19:47):
and like completely it was awful. I can't stop laughing
because it was like what was he thinking, Like He's like, oh,
I'm gonna go do mushrooms now, and I'm a rapper,
and he was like telling a group of corporate people
in suits about this, and we still got them eventually,
(20:07):
but not because of him.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
Let's just say that.
Speaker 3 (20:10):
Yeah, co vir rule, don't be a weirdo.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
Yeah that's a perfect example of someone being a weirdo.
Speaker 3 (20:20):
But it's not like it. And a lot of times
people think about like what personality is great, Like it's
the outgoing person that's just going to be great at sales,
and that's not really it, honestly. So it's actually they've
they've done studies like super extroverted people they don't do
really well it sells, actually they don't, and super introverted
(20:43):
people they actually a little bit worse it sells. But
the people that do the best are in the middle.
They're actually called they're actually called ambroverts. So ambrovert ambervert
is like a mix. It's a balance of extrovert and
introvert because those people they can relate to more people
(21:03):
because there's very very few people that are like super
super extroverted, and there's very very few people that are
like super super introverted. On the other side, everyone else
is kind of in that middle, you know, slightly to
one side. Or the other, which is totally fine, but
the ambroverts actually did the best because they could relate
to more people. So as we think about people skills,
(21:28):
good people's skills, maybe something we didn't talk about last week,
but being flexible enough and being in a lot of
different situations where you can talk to a lot of
bit a lot of different people and you can relate.
And so how do you relate to someone that maybe
in a whole different world than you. Well, guess what,
there's some things that all humans relate to. We all
(21:49):
relate to family, and we all have something we're interested
in something like so family, just think family and interests
if you can like find out a little bit of
that and talk to him about that. And it's really
because people will easily. I mean, they don't want to
(22:09):
usually talk about politics, and I might want to talk
about their deepest, darkest fheares, right, But they'll talk about
you know, they'll talk about their family, they'll talk about
you know, their interests, whatever it is, and you can
kind of do some digging and try to figure out that.
So relating to people and them relating to you, and
they realize that, Okay, well, how do I relate to
(22:30):
someone else, What do we have in common? Right? What
are some commonalities? Finding those commonalities and building those people's
skills off commonalities, and those are the two biggest ones
I think that people can hit on with commonalities.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
Yeah, that's interesting.
Speaker 2 (22:45):
I would have thought that a super extroverted person would
have been really great at scales.
Speaker 3 (22:50):
Yeah, people tend that's kind of a common misnomer, right,
Like people think like, oh, this guy's so outgoing, he's
gonna be amazing. But super super outgoing they almost like
can turn off people that are more introverted, Right, So.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
Would it be fair to say then that like we
should almost mirror what our client is giving to us.
So what like like our energy right now, we're mirroring
each other.
Speaker 1 (23:19):
We're just we're super chill and calm in this moment.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
Right.
Speaker 2 (23:23):
So if your clients or potential customers super extroverted, should
we be a little more extroverted or like do we
change our style?
Speaker 1 (23:34):
No?
Speaker 3 (23:35):
No, not at all, not at all, So you can
just be yourself, right, So let that person. You're not
trying to change an expert into an introvert at all
and vice versa, right, you know, trying to make an introvert,
like super talkative because they're they're people are comfortable where
they're like who they are, right, and you want to
(23:55):
be comfortable with who you are. So just kind of
meeting them where they're at, trying to change change them,
but not trying to change yourself either, but just trying
to relate. Right, So, extroverts can relate to introverts some
vice versa, just by commonalities. So that might not be
the thing that they're common like they have in common,
but other commonalities they can relate to. Got it, Okay,
(24:17):
just be yourself? Yeah, I think just be yourself, Like,
be yourself. It's like anytimes you're not yourself, anytimes you're
you're not yourself, it brings your own stress level up.
Speaker 1 (24:28):
Yeah, that turns people into that weirdo that you're talking about.
Speaker 3 (24:31):
Yeah, you look nervous and all of a sudden, if
you look nervous, you look guilty, and all of a sudden,
if you look guilty, like what's this guy? Like, what's
this guy trying to like do to me? Like how's
he like? Right? So, when you're yourself, that's your best
that's your best option.
Speaker 1 (24:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:44):
I don't mean to laugh, but I'm still picturing that
guy talking about the mushrooms.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
It must have been a nerve thing.
Speaker 3 (24:50):
But unless you're trying to But again, don't be weird either,
So I don't know, maybe be yourself if you're weird,
don't be yourself.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
Exactly he was. He was a little too comfortable, I guess.
Speaker 3 (25:03):
So he could. Yeah he can. Yeah, you definitely want
to read the room, that's for sure. But yeah, but
still he can be hisself, like talk the way you talk,
be who you are, all those things.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
Yeah, do you have any more things that we shouldn't
be doing?
Speaker 3 (25:17):
Yeah? Last one I brought today is not having a plan.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
So that's a pain point for me because I remember
when I, like I first started my business, everyone's like,
do you have a plan?
Speaker 1 (25:30):
And it triggered me because I'm like, I don't have
a damn plan. And then yeah, you just gave me
the look like you didn't have a plan.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
But yeah, I didn't have a plan. But now I
understand why that was so important. But why is it
important in sales?
Speaker 3 (25:45):
Well, it sells. I mean having a plan, right, having
a you want to have kind of a method that
you use, and like a plan, and what I what
I teaches a framework. So I teach a sales framework
a little bit more flexible than like a step by
step process because you can kind of mix a match
a little bit, but like a cell's framework. So when
(26:05):
I when I was at someone's doorstep, I knew, I
knew my my framework, I knew my pitch. But it
wasn't like I said this and this and this and
this exactly right. It was, yeah, I I did some
similar things each time, but it was flexible enough to
adjust to the other person. Right, because the cells, typically
(26:26):
you're not giving a speech, you're communicating back and forth, right,
So there's gonna be But a lot of times people, honestly,
they just go in and wing it, and I'm like wow,
like like they just don't have a plan. They don't
have a flow, they don't have anything that like takes
them and your plan should take them to the ultimate goal, right,
(26:49):
the ultimate goals to make the cell. So what are
the steps? What are the planned Like, what's what's going
to move them from here to getting closer to that step?
Maybe they might not be already to close and to
be signed on the dog line, so to speak, but
what's going to move them closer. So having a plan,
having a framework is is vital.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
So what what happens when we don't have a plan
in sales?
Speaker 1 (27:12):
Dude? Like to people forget things?
Speaker 3 (27:17):
Yeah, yeah, that's a good one. That's good to Lisa.
So people forget a lot, right, you get in a situation,
and this will happen a lot with with sales because
you're dealing with another person. Right, they'll say something that
you know, you're having a plan to go this way,
this way, this way, and then they'll kind of throw
you off, so to speak. And and so if you
(27:37):
can know like your framework though, so I reference it
to a freeway, and so you're driving along the freeway, right,
and you're going from you know, this sea to the
next city. But sometimes the customer or the client, they'll
take you off the off ramp, you know, they'll bring
you off the opera off ramp. No, you know, nothing
(27:58):
you did wrong or anything that it's common. Right, So
that random question or the random objection or maybe something
you didn't expect. Your job is to try to get
back on that plan and get back on to on
that on ramp where you were at, right, not to
detour more and going the you know, going down to
the city and make a long detour. Your your job
(28:20):
is to kind of get back on your plan and
move forward. Now, plans can change, right, but you gotta
you gotta, And that's where good sales when they're really
good at adapting and still getting to you know, there's really
good at getting that other route right, getting the detour
and still getting to the destination. So but having a
plan to start is really vital because like you said,
(28:43):
you'll forget things, you'll miss steps, you won't bring up
something that you should have, and now all of a sudden,
it's like, you know, where am I at? I got
to rebuild momentum and kind of get this thing going again.
Speaker 2 (28:55):
Right Yeah, Because customers, they don't have a plan. They're
there to listen to you and so reeling them back in.
So yeah, I like the idea of having a framework
where you can pull from when you get to a
certain point.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
Because if I'm correct, there's steps in sales.
Speaker 2 (29:14):
They're just you know, the furst middle end part and
then the closing, which is a topic for another day.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
Yeah right right, yeah, think of it like a story, right,
there's a beginning, middle, and an end, you know, so
sales is very similar. Kind of have you know an
idea where you want to get to and kind of
what's what the plan is? But I just see a
lot of trial and air stuff. I see a lot
of theories that don't work. And so, yeah, we're pretty
confident with our framework and the way we teach where
(29:45):
we teach sales getting results.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
Right, and that is the W framework correct.
Speaker 3 (29:52):
Yeah. Yeah, W method or smooth selling framework that we
teach so works for literally in any situation. It's pretty amazing. Mmm.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
Where can people find out more about it? And where
can they find you to learn more about your coaching program?
Speaker 3 (30:08):
So on our website Luke Jorgenson dot com is the
best place to find me find all our offerings there
for individuals, teams, companies. We help people there and then
at Instagram at coach Underscore Luke j.
Speaker 1 (30:26):
Beautiful.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
So anything else you want to talk in terms of
what we shouldn't be doing with sales before we say
goodbye today?
Speaker 3 (30:33):
No, that's great. I think we had a good conversation.
I think build on our last one and yeah, we'll
look forward to the next one and keep going.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
Beautiful. Yeah, you just want to get me to yoga
because you triggered me earlier.
Speaker 3 (30:46):
Yog sells people. Don't don't make your clients go to
yoga after.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
Yeah, exactly. Do not be like her. It was really
awesome to you again.
Speaker 2 (31:00):
Thank you so much for being here and for sharing
your knowledge, and yeah, I look forward to the next episode.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
Thanks Lisa, appreciate you awesome.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
I'm into our audience. Don't be like that girl.
Speaker 2 (31:12):
Listen to Luke, follow his methods and his advice, and
don't overshare. I think that's the thing that I took
away from today is like we give too much. Simplify it,
be yourself, and you'll make the sale. Until next time,
See you guys,
You.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Welcome back to The Advisor. My name is Lisa Urbanski,
co host of the show. Some really exciting news today,
Doctor Bradley Nelson has sponsored the show. If you don't
know him, he is the writer author of Emotion Code,
Body Code, and he's releasing a new code which you
will have to stay tuned for in the meantime.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Welcome Luke Jorgensen back to the show.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
He's got a podcast on our channel and it's all
about sales. He is like the door to door sales alchemist.
He understands sales, how to do them, what not to do,
and he's been in the biz for a long time
and he is providing all of you with all of
(00:49):
his insights to help you with your sales techniques. So
the coach is here ready to talk. Last time we
talked about people's skills and the importance of those, and
today we're going to go into sales mistakes, what those
might look like, how you might be shooting your own
foot when you're trying to make a sale.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
Anyway, it's really good to see you again, Luke.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Yeah, great, see Lisa. Happy to be here talking about sales.
We're talking about sells. Hey, happy to be doing that.
Speaker 1 (01:21):
Yeah, you're the expert, well.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
Been through a lot of situations, but hopefully I know
a little bit.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Yeah, so before before we record, I was telling you
a story about something that happened to me the other
day that was in relation to a sales mistake. And
so I would love for you to get into it
and just maybe start talking about it because there's so
many people out there, especially nowadays, doing online sales. It's
so damn hard to make money, make a living, but
(01:50):
there's all these little tools that we can use. So
what are some of the mistakes that you think people
are making that are harming their sales process?
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Yeah, brought I brought four or four killers of your
cells today, four destroyers of your own cells. So I
hop when we could kind of hit them one at
a time. But yeah, that story you shared with me,
I think, I think honestly is for our first one.
So let's see, let's hear your story about that first.
So our first topic is over selling. So yeah, sometimes
(02:22):
knowing what not to do honestly and getting like you said,
you know, not shooting yourself on the foot, getting out
of your own way. Sometimes knowing what not to do
is just as important as knowing what to do. So
today kind of focusing in a little bit on the
what not to do because you're just, yeah, just gonna
hurt yourself. So anyway, so overselling, what was your experience, Lisa,
(02:46):
I loved it?
Speaker 1 (02:47):
Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
So I was with someone who was just she wouldn't
stop talking, and I just wanted to tell me exactly
what I needed to do because she was giving me
so much information and my brain was like overloaded.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
I didn't understand half the stuff she was talking about.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
And I literally was just like, get me away from
this person because I just I want to know what
to do, like give me directions.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
And look, I'm getting worked up thinking about it. I
wouldn't have given her any money. I'll tell you that
right now.
Speaker 3 (03:20):
I feel your stress, hormal, it's go crazy.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
Yeah, no, I need to go to yoga after this.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
That's not a good sign if you need to go
to yoga after your sales experience, right, Sometimes it can
be like that. But yeah, that's a big one. Right
over talking, like just talking too much? Was she going
into a lot of the the a lot of the
features and just information dump.
Speaker 1 (03:44):
On you and terminology that I have no clue what
it even means.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
So it's like she's and like just all the things,
so terminology, what it's going to do, what it's not
going to do. And literally she could have said three
things to me, I would have handed her my card
and I would have bought it.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
Yeah, yeah, that's those are great. Those are all related
because talking too much you can literally do a lot
of damage, right, Like the information overload. That was one
of them, right, the talking too much, just too much info,
too much lingo, like just that information overload. Right when
when we have a I have a saying that goes
(04:25):
a confused buyer will always say no, yeah, always, like
if you're confused at the answer is always no, because.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
Look what I did. I ran, I literally ran away
from her here.
Speaker 3 (04:41):
Yeah. Yeah, it's better to have two clear points than
ten kind of hazy points, right, or information overload, So
so don't confuse your people. Yeah, And then the talking
too much obviously getting into the features, getting into like
too much technie talk, like and not having to simple
actions to move forward, to move your front because sales
(05:03):
is moving you from A to B and B as
the buy right or B as the next step and
then see as the buy whatever it is that you're
trying to accomplish, but moving people, getting them to act right,
just speaking for speaking purposes is not what we're trying
to do or trying to get people to act. So
that's a big one.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
Yeah, And I'm just going to give impact.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
I needed what I wanted.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
Like, when someone's out to buy something, they're going to
get it. I drove half an hour in a different
direction to find another one because of that experience. So
people want to buy, they just need someone to, like
you said, guide them, tell them what to do. If
she would have said, like this will do this, this
(05:48):
will do that, and now give me your credit card
or this is the charge, I would have been happy
with that.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
Yeah, but it just like threw me off so bad.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
So yeah, I think people maybe it's a nerve thing,
like people just get or they want to come across
that they know everything about it. They think they're being helpful,
but really she just like turned my brain into uh mush.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
Yeah, yeah, that's so true. Half of a lot. Like
and especially like I feel like so in our industry.
And it was funny because in the door to door industry,
we would bring in a new person and they didn't
know a lot at first, and they always had like
success because they kind of kept it simple and like
did what we taught. And then sure enough a few
(06:35):
months like go by and here they all they get
like more knowledge and more information in their brain. And
now all of a sudden, you're like, what are you doing?
Like they're going out on all these tangents. They're talking
about random stuff just because they know things right now.
So it's like, okay, we could just like turn you
back in time and like like forget everything that you know,
(06:58):
only bring it up if it's important and asked about.
Like there's so much that we know about. We should
know everything about our product or service, like literally front end,
like you know, front cover to back cover, like everything.
But we're not gonna talk about everything. We're not going
to cover every page, right, like we're not going to
(07:19):
cover every feature. We're gonna talk about Well, first, we're
gonna ask them what's important, right, kind of give a
general overview, and that person could have probably asked you
like hey, like what are you looking for, or like
ask some like clarifying questions right with you to see
like what was important to you or what you were
really trying to accomplish or what problem you were really
(07:40):
trying to solve, and then they could have just talked
about that and maybe one other feature and been done. Right.
So yeah, so over talking that's a big one. I
think also along with the over talking is sometimes we
get when we overtalk, we get into this mindset of
like begging, Like you know, we think of cells like
(08:05):
when I talk, I'm giving, giving, giving, giving, right, right,
And so you just and then it's like you become
like a like a beggar because the more you talk,
it's like, Okay, I want, I want, I want, I
want like coming back to me. So I think that
that mentality is sometimes when we overtalk or we kind
of become a little bit begging on our side, and
(08:28):
that mentality will shell through through over talking.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Yeah, and I think you hit the nail on the head.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Though it becomes about them, it comes about if I'm
the salesperson, if I'm over talking and oversharing, it becomes
about me and it's no longer about the client. So
if that woman would have asked me, what are you
specifically looking for, she would know that I had very
little understanding of it. I didn't really care, and I
(08:57):
just needed it for this one thing. So instead of
like real like telling me all the things, she would
have understood that I don't know much about that topic.
She would have asked the clarifying questions. But instead I
felt like I was there like giving her therapy or something.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
So yeah, and it felt.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
Like a desperate move like she's like, so you're leaving,
and I'm like, I'm just out of here.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
I don't even know.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
It's just crazy, yeah, right, yeah, Because a lot of
times that happens, and people need like a direction, like
they wanted they want to go in a direction, but
they might not know like exactly how to start. For instance,
sometimes it's just pointing him like to the first step,
like this is what we're gonna do next, right, like okay,
and then you do that next and then this after that,
(09:44):
this is what we're gonna do. Like they just want
they want someone to trust them and to like guide them.
And there's some products and services that are more like
step by step that are a little bit longer, and
some that are more quick right like they buy it
and they walk out the store. I mean, I get that,
but there's some a lot of things that are more
like step by step and people want to know like
what to do next.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
Yeah, yeah, it makes.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Us feel clarifying question, the clarifying question. That was her
mistake was not asking me what I needed, right, it
was not. It was focused on like that her nerves
or whatever it was. But by not clarifying, then you
lose the say because you have no clue what someone wants.
My pain point was what I needed, but she didn't
(10:30):
hit that pain point, she didn't come close to it,
and so I was like leaving more confused. I'm like,
do I even need this thing? That's how I felt.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
Meanwhile, I went in there so damn clear in my
mind that this is what I needed, and then that
just rattled me. So yeah, I think the clarifying questions
are so important.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
Yeah, that's good. That's a that's a great example for
that first one for sure.
Speaker 1 (10:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
So how do like, how do people learn how to
do that? Like is that a skill in itself? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (11:03):
It is, just like anything it sells, right, it can
be learned, and that's the good news, Like you can
learn to do this. So one thing I you just
constantly got to remind yourself is like instead of talking,
so just a quick little tip for people to apply
this one. So instead of talking using a statement, ask
(11:26):
a question. So instead of statements, pivot to a question. Right,
so you give a little bit and then to follow up, like,
just ask a question and then just be quiet. And
it's amazing what you learn. Amazing, Like you'll find out
about the person. You'll find out what their needs are.
(11:47):
You'll find out like what to say next because of
what they say, right, You'll find out how this is going.
It is going great, this is like you know all
those things, and just by reframing and just ask the question.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
Yes, the listening part because people don't like silence.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
So if you ask a question and then you shut
your mouth, people are the other person's going to talk.
Speaker 1 (12:10):
It's just human nature.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
Yeah, even if you don't ask a question to just
look kind of like they'll start talking.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
They got all nervous. Yeah, totally.
Speaker 3 (12:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
We don't like silence, Yes, we don't.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
We got to get better at it though, especially in sales,
because you're right, if she would have just asked a question,
then I would have told her everything.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
She maybe could have sold me a bunch of other stuff.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
Right, yeah, so what else?
Speaker 1 (12:40):
What else do people mistake like some of the other mistakes.
Speaker 3 (12:44):
Let's go to number two. So number two is kind
of a mentality reframing, and so it's selling only for
your benefit as the salesperson, right, or the business owner
or the entrepreneur. You're only thinking about yourself and what
how this is going to benefit you. So a quick story,
And when I first started selling, so I sold Soul Energy,
(13:07):
and of course I'm just thinking like, Okay, how am
I going to do this? What's in it for me?
And I just constantly was going in it like, Okay,
if I can close this many this week, I can
get this much money kind of thing, you know, which
is totally normal. It's totally typical, right. But as soon
as I realized that the product that I had, because
I talked to some people that had that product for
(13:29):
over a year now and they're like loving it and
it was good for them and they liked it, and
I really saw the benefit. Now, all of a sudden,
I come at it at a little bit different place.
So instead of coming at it what's for me, coming
at it more what's for them? Right, and how does
this benefit them? And what's in it for them? Speaking
(13:51):
of the client, right, speaking of the buyer. So that
reframe of what's in it for them as opposed to
what's in it for you, and so that I think
that's key. That's a that's a big one.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
Yeah, I think that's any rookie in the sales game.
They know what the potential of the commissions are and
then they focus on that, right, And it's like those numbers,
I mean they mean a lot, But when you flipped that,
like you said, and focus on how can I satisfy
my client?
Speaker 1 (14:27):
How can I best serve my client?
Speaker 2 (14:29):
That changes the energy even and then that builds that trust.
Speaker 3 (14:34):
I think, Yeah, the energy totally changed and that's all
it really was for me. It was just like an
energy thing and it's you feel it like it's People
were really really good at reading because people have had
lots and lots of interactions over the time, so they
might not have sales interactions, but they had other interactions.
(14:54):
And people are really really good at their BS. Like
the BS meters were really good at like sniffing out
the BS right, Like, So I think when you have
that and they can see that like it's not it's
not BS like it's real, that changes the dynamic and
it doesn't mean that you don't benefit because as a salesperson,
(15:14):
three people are winning. The client's winning, the company's winning,
or you know whoever's kind of behind that that might
even be you. And then the middle person, that salesperson
is winning. So it's a three way win. Everyone's gonna win.
But who are you focused more on. You've got to
be more focused on that client, that person, the buyer.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Yeah, and then they're gonna love you, and then they're
gonna want to buy more stuff from you down the
road or they're gonna refer you.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
So it's like a ripple effect too.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
Yeah. The trust there, Yeah, the trust builds time and
time again, right over time, and it just gets stronger
and stronger. So that's the way to do it, I think.
So if we just think of ourselves. Like another quick example,
like so when we when we would go and we
would we would have like a meeting with the with
the person at first like introduced solar energy, and then
(16:05):
we would usually come back and like show them their
design on their home and kind of what they're savings
were and the more a little bit more in depth
of like how it applied directly to their house. A
little bit more customized at that point, and so right
there we could see we had technology that literally we
could see like what our commission was, and we'd have
(16:27):
to kind of go in and click on a button
and kind of look at it. I never looked at that, Oh,
I never looked at it so well, not never like
my last four or five years. I never looked at
it because I didn't want that to be like the
last thing on my mind going in is like right right.
I wanted to be more focus on what they were doing,
what they were like, what they needed, right. I knew
(16:48):
the product was going to benefit them, like I believed
that frontwards backwards for a long long time. But just
that small little mind shift of like, okay, like what's
in it for them? I think is more. It's just
a refresher to like have that in your mind.
Speaker 1 (17:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
I have like visions of really bad car salesman trying
to sell me my first car and remember being so like,
just like you said that bs meter, it's so obvious
when someone just wants your money and it's you almost
feel gross, Like it's like a really bad feeling. So
that's a really good skill to learn. It is like
(17:29):
be about them. How are you going to benefit them? Yeah,
because that's that's how you're going to make the sale
for sure.
Speaker 3 (17:37):
Yeah, in the long run, I mean you might lose
a couple of deals here and there because of that,
but in the long run, it's going to pay dividends.
Like always selling the right way. I think people are
a little bit short sighted sometimes and they just think
about the here and now. But I think selling the
right way over the long term, it pays dividends. And
(17:58):
because you get more referrals later, you get like more
of a trust factor, Like you don't go down that
slippery slope of like shadiness and like lying and all
that stuff, right, Like you try to try to stay
away from that.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
So, yeah, you want to keep your name in the game,
like in a good way.
Speaker 3 (18:16):
Yeah. Yeah. People are gonna talk and they definitely are
going to talk a lot more if you do a
bad job than if you know you could do You
could do a great job for a hundred times and
people won't say anything. But you do one bad, one
bad thing, people are gonna tell a hundred people.
Speaker 1 (18:29):
So crazy crazy, what else what else can we do?
Speaker 3 (18:35):
Yeah? Yeah, the third one? Yeah, don't do third one
is like our last episode, we talked a lot about this,
so people can refer back to that last episode. But
the lack of people skills, I think it's important to
repeat a little bit here. So just that, like, just
don't be weird.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
What's weird? What what do you mean by that?
Speaker 3 (18:58):
Like, don't say and do weird things, like just be
like a regular person, like right, Like don't try to
be someone else, like don't try to impress, like you
know all those things. Just be a regular person. Sell
like you you would sell to someone that you know, right,
And there's a lot.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
I have a funny story an ex co worker, an
old coworker.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
So in another job, we were selling first DAID.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
Courses and he was teaching a hydro group of corporate people,
like corporate people, and we were trying to get them
to buy the course that we could teach, like their
whole entire corporation. And he told them about his plans
to go do mushrooms. So he was done talking to them,
(19:47):
and like completely it was awful. I can't stop laughing
because it was like what was he thinking, Like He's like, oh,
I'm gonna go do mushrooms now, and I'm a rapper,
and he was like telling a group of corporate people
in suits about this, and we still got them eventually,
(20:07):
but not because of him.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
Let's just say that.
Speaker 3 (20:10):
Yeah, co vir rule, don't be a weirdo.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
Yeah that's a perfect example of someone being a weirdo.
Speaker 3 (20:20):
But it's not like it. And a lot of times
people think about like what personality is great, Like it's
the outgoing person that's just going to be great at sales,
and that's not really it, honestly. So it's actually they've
they've done studies like super extroverted people they don't do
really well it sells, actually they don't, and super introverted
(20:43):
people they actually a little bit worse it sells. But
the people that do the best are in the middle.
They're actually called they're actually called ambroverts. So ambrovert ambervert
is like a mix. It's a balance of extrovert and
introvert because those people they can relate to more people
(21:03):
because there's very very few people that are like super
super extroverted, and there's very very few people that are
like super super introverted. On the other side, everyone else
is kind of in that middle, you know, slightly to
one side. Or the other, which is totally fine, but
the ambroverts actually did the best because they could relate
to more people. So as we think about people skills,
(21:28):
good people's skills, maybe something we didn't talk about last week,
but being flexible enough and being in a lot of
different situations where you can talk to a lot of
bit a lot of different people and you can relate.
And so how do you relate to someone that maybe
in a whole different world than you. Well, guess what,
there's some things that all humans relate to. We all
(21:49):
relate to family, and we all have something we're interested
in something like so family, just think family and interests
if you can like find out a little bit of
that and talk to him about that. And it's really
because people will easily. I mean, they don't want to
(22:09):
usually talk about politics, and I might want to talk
about their deepest, darkest fheares, right, But they'll talk about
you know, they'll talk about their family, they'll talk about
you know, their interests, whatever it is, and you can
kind of do some digging and try to figure out that.
So relating to people and them relating to you, and
they realize that, Okay, well, how do I relate to
(22:30):
someone else, What do we have in common? Right? What
are some commonalities? Finding those commonalities and building those people's
skills off commonalities, and those are the two biggest ones
I think that people can hit on with commonalities.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
Yeah, that's interesting.
Speaker 2 (22:45):
I would have thought that a super extroverted person would
have been really great at scales.
Speaker 3 (22:50):
Yeah, people tend that's kind of a common misnomer, right,
Like people think like, oh, this guy's so outgoing, he's
gonna be amazing. But super super outgoing they almost like
can turn off people that are more introverted, Right, So.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
Would it be fair to say then that like we
should almost mirror what our client is giving to us.
So what like like our energy right now, we're mirroring
each other.
Speaker 1 (23:19):
We're just we're super chill and calm in this moment.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
Right.
Speaker 2 (23:23):
So if your clients or potential customers super extroverted, should
we be a little more extroverted or like do we
change our style?
Speaker 1 (23:34):
No?
Speaker 3 (23:35):
No, not at all, not at all, So you can
just be yourself, right, So let that person. You're not
trying to change an expert into an introvert at all
and vice versa, right, you know, trying to make an introvert,
like super talkative because they're they're people are comfortable where
they're like who they are, right, and you want to
(23:55):
be comfortable with who you are. So just kind of
meeting them where they're at, trying to change change them,
but not trying to change yourself either, but just trying
to relate. Right, So, extroverts can relate to introverts some
vice versa, just by commonalities. So that might not be
the thing that they're common like they have in common,
but other commonalities they can relate to. Got it, Okay,
(24:17):
just be yourself? Yeah, I think just be yourself, Like,
be yourself. It's like anytimes you're not yourself, anytimes you're
you're not yourself, it brings your own stress level up.
Speaker 1 (24:28):
Yeah, that turns people into that weirdo that you're talking about.
Speaker 3 (24:31):
Yeah, you look nervous and all of a sudden, if
you look nervous, you look guilty, and all of a sudden,
if you look guilty, like what's this guy? Like, what's
this guy trying to like do to me? Like how's
he like? Right? So, when you're yourself, that's your best
that's your best option.
Speaker 1 (24:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:44):
I don't mean to laugh, but I'm still picturing that
guy talking about the mushrooms.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
It must have been a nerve thing.
Speaker 3 (24:50):
But unless you're trying to But again, don't be weird either,
So I don't know, maybe be yourself if you're weird,
don't be yourself.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
Exactly he was. He was a little too comfortable, I guess.
Speaker 3 (25:03):
So he could. Yeah he can. Yeah, you definitely want
to read the room, that's for sure. But yeah, but
still he can be hisself, like talk the way you talk,
be who you are, all those things.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
Yeah, do you have any more things that we shouldn't
be doing?
Speaker 3 (25:17):
Yeah? Last one I brought today is not having a plan.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
So that's a pain point for me because I remember
when I, like I first started my business, everyone's like,
do you have a plan?
Speaker 1 (25:30):
And it triggered me because I'm like, I don't have
a damn plan. And then yeah, you just gave me
the look like you didn't have a plan.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
But yeah, I didn't have a plan. But now I
understand why that was so important. But why is it
important in sales?
Speaker 3 (25:45):
Well, it sells. I mean having a plan, right, having
a you want to have kind of a method that
you use, and like a plan, and what I what
I teaches a framework. So I teach a sales framework
a little bit more flexible than like a step by
step process because you can kind of mix a match
a little bit, but like a cell's framework. So when
(26:05):
I when I was at someone's doorstep, I knew, I
knew my my framework, I knew my pitch. But it
wasn't like I said this and this and this and
this exactly right. It was, yeah, I I did some
similar things each time, but it was flexible enough to
adjust to the other person. Right, because the cells, typically
(26:26):
you're not giving a speech, you're communicating back and forth, right,
So there's gonna be But a lot of times people, honestly,
they just go in and wing it, and I'm like wow,
like like they just don't have a plan. They don't
have a flow, they don't have anything that like takes
them and your plan should take them to the ultimate goal, right,
(26:49):
the ultimate goals to make the cell. So what are
the steps? What are the planned Like, what's what's going
to move them from here to getting closer to that step?
Maybe they might not be already to close and to
be signed on the dog line, so to speak, but
what's going to move them closer. So having a plan,
having a framework is is vital.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
So what what happens when we don't have a plan
in sales?
Speaker 1 (27:12):
Dude? Like to people forget things?
Speaker 3 (27:17):
Yeah, yeah, that's a good one. That's good to Lisa.
So people forget a lot, right, you get in a situation,
and this will happen a lot with with sales because
you're dealing with another person. Right, they'll say something that
you know, you're having a plan to go this way,
this way, this way, and then they'll kind of throw
you off, so to speak. And and so if you
(27:37):
can know like your framework though, so I reference it
to a freeway, and so you're driving along the freeway, right,
and you're going from you know, this sea to the
next city. But sometimes the customer or the client, they'll
take you off the off ramp, you know, they'll bring
you off the opera off ramp. No, you know, nothing
(27:58):
you did wrong or anything that it's common. Right, So
that random question or the random objection or maybe something
you didn't expect. Your job is to try to get
back on that plan and get back on to on
that on ramp where you were at, right, not to
detour more and going the you know, going down to
the city and make a long detour. Your your job
(28:20):
is to kind of get back on your plan and
move forward. Now, plans can change, right, but you gotta
you gotta, And that's where good sales when they're really
good at adapting and still getting to you know, there's really
good at getting that other route right, getting the detour
and still getting to the destination. So but having a
plan to start is really vital because like you said,
(28:43):
you'll forget things, you'll miss steps, you won't bring up
something that you should have, and now all of a sudden,
it's like, you know, where am I at? I got
to rebuild momentum and kind of get this thing going again.
Speaker 2 (28:55):
Right Yeah, Because customers, they don't have a plan. They're
there to listen to you and so reeling them back in.
So yeah, I like the idea of having a framework
where you can pull from when you get to a
certain point.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
Because if I'm correct, there's steps in sales.
Speaker 2 (29:14):
They're just you know, the furst middle end part and
then the closing, which is a topic for another day.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
Yeah right right, yeah, think of it like a story, right,
there's a beginning, middle, and an end, you know, so
sales is very similar. Kind of have you know an
idea where you want to get to and kind of
what's what the plan is? But I just see a
lot of trial and air stuff. I see a lot
of theories that don't work. And so, yeah, we're pretty
confident with our framework and the way we teach where
(29:45):
we teach sales getting results.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
Right, and that is the W framework correct.
Speaker 3 (29:52):
Yeah. Yeah, W method or smooth selling framework that we
teach so works for literally in any situation. It's pretty amazing. Mmm.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
Where can people find out more about it? And where
can they find you to learn more about your coaching program?
Speaker 3 (30:08):
So on our website Luke Jorgenson dot com is the
best place to find me find all our offerings there
for individuals, teams, companies. We help people there and then
at Instagram at coach Underscore Luke j.
Speaker 1 (30:26):
Beautiful.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
So anything else you want to talk in terms of
what we shouldn't be doing with sales before we say
goodbye today?
Speaker 3 (30:33):
No, that's great. I think we had a good conversation.
I think build on our last one and yeah, we'll
look forward to the next one and keep going.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
Beautiful. Yeah, you just want to get me to yoga
because you triggered me earlier.
Speaker 3 (30:46):
Yog sells people. Don't don't make your clients go to
yoga after.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
Yeah, exactly. Do not be like her. It was really
awesome to you again.
Speaker 2 (31:00):
Thank you so much for being here and for sharing
your knowledge, and yeah, I look forward to the next episode.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
Thanks Lisa, appreciate you awesome.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
I'm into our audience. Don't be like that girl.
Speaker 2 (31:12):
Listen to Luke, follow his methods and his advice, and
don't overshare. I think that's the thing that I took
away from today is like we give too much. Simplify it,
be yourself, and you'll make the sale. Until next time,
See you guys,
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