December 9, 2025 • 39 mins
What if your business plan actually worked?
In this episode of the Business Roundtable Podcast, host David W. Carr, founder of Steward Your Business, sits down with Michael Stewart, founder of Business Planning PLUS and a member of Success Champion Networking (SCN). Together, they unpack how to turn your business plan from a static document into a living system that drives growth, alignment, and accountability.
Michael shares his powerful football (soccer) analogy — mapping every department to positions on the field — and shows how the best organizations play like high-performing teams, with clarity, rhythm, and trust.
💡 In This Episode You’ll Learn:
🌐 Connect with Michael Stewart
Website: https://www.askmjs.co.uk
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelstewartuk
🎧 Listen, subscribe, and share this episode to help more leaders align strategy, people, and purpose to build teams that win.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/business-roundtable--6049255/support.
Watch more episodes on YouTube and subscribe here:
https://www.youtube.com/@steward_your_business
Connect with Steward Your Business:
Website: https://stewardyourbusiness.com
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidwcarr
In this episode of the Business Roundtable Podcast, host David W. Carr, founder of Steward Your Business, sits down with Michael Stewart, founder of Business Planning PLUS and a member of Success Champion Networking (SCN). Together, they unpack how to turn your business plan from a static document into a living system that drives growth, alignment, and accountability.
Michael shares his powerful football (soccer) analogy — mapping every department to positions on the field — and shows how the best organizations play like high-performing teams, with clarity, rhythm, and trust.
💡 In This Episode You’ll Learn:
- Why most business plans fail and how to create one that lives and breathes.
- The 11 core areas every business needs to manage for success
- How to develop a rhythm of accountability using “disclose, discuss, decide”
- The power of alignment and communication in leadership meetings
- How to plan for growth in uncertain markets and expanding internationally
- Why leadership and culture are two sides of the same coin
🌐 Connect with Michael Stewart
Website: https://www.askmjs.co.uk
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelstewartuk
🎧 Listen, subscribe, and share this episode to help more leaders align strategy, people, and purpose to build teams that win.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/business-roundtable--6049255/support.
Watch more episodes on YouTube and subscribe here:
https://www.youtube.com/@steward_your_business
Connect with Steward Your Business:
Website: https://stewardyourbusiness.com
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidwcarr
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
Welcome back to the Business Roundtable podcast. I'm David Carr
of Stuart Your Business, where we bring people together to
accomplish great things. Here on the Business Roundtable, I'm glad
to have Michael Stewart here, a friend and collaborator, also
another Success Champions Network member and founder of the company
Business Planning Plus. We're going to get into the Plus.
(00:35):
We're getting into business Planning. He really is helping folks
simplify strategy, execute and focus and really build momentum in
their businesses. So I'm excited to have you here on
the podcast. Michael, thank you for joining us.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Great to be here, Really excited to see where this
conversation goes.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
David absolutely absolutely. Now, Michael, you and I have been
talking actually throughout the year, and one of the things
I really liked about our conversations was how do you
get business in alignment? And we're helping them be healthier
overall in all aspects of the company. Talk to us
a little bit about your journey of why you got
(01:15):
to where you're at now with you know, building Business
Planning Plus and the help you know you've helped dozens
of companies now and talk a little bit your journey
about why you got to where you're at now and
you're helping not only you're based in the UK, but
you're helping companies throughout the world.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
Yeah. Absolutely, So we go right back to the start.
My first job was in the bank, and of course
in those days in the late nineteen eighties, that was
join the bank because it will be a job for life,
so that was the way to go, and of course
it never ended up being that way. But I got
involved with business finance and I will shed moment really
(01:54):
for me was in the late nineteen nineties when I
did some business finance on a marketing agency that was
getting involved with multimedia. So back in the nineteen nineties,
even though we were a marketing agency, we shared a
lead to download our email on a dial up connection
within a marketing agency, so it was right back in
(02:14):
the day. I was involved right at the start of
marketing on the Internet. So that was a heck of
a journey up until about fifteen years ago. I ended
up doing digital marketing for some big brands here in
the UK and some national names. But fifteen years ago
got the opportunity to set out on my own and
(02:35):
so yeah, when when freelance, studied doing some consultancy, and
I've never looked back and as I say, totally unemployable. Now,
the last thing anybody would want to do would get
me into a business to work there full time. I
think I'm totally unemployable, as a one of us self
employed people are. David said it up. I started off
(03:03):
by doing a kind of fractional CMO type work, but
had I started to work with SME businesses and I
realized that those were the most successful, the ones that
had a proper plan. So yes, I will be contributing
to that plan. But I realized that lots of businesses.
As a CMO, I knew that I needed to align
(03:24):
what I did with what the business's strategic objectives were,
and in some businesses, they didn't know what the strategic
objectives were. A lot of the time people say well
what are you going to do and they say, well,
we're going to double in size in the next three years,
and they've nothing more than that. Well, for me, that's
not a strategic objective, it's not a direction. It's it's
(03:45):
just keeping score. Really is how big of you got
and how much money are you're making? So how's that
going to come about. So I realized that there was
a gap in the market for what I would call
a business growth plan and looked around what was available
in the marketplace, had been exposed to all sorts of
things working in sme businesses, and so develop my own methodology,
(04:10):
put that together under the business planning plus brand, and
I now have a number of clients that I help
annually to do that. And then I also helped to
project manage, if you're like, the growth through the year,
making sure that that plan isn't just something that gets
written and goes in a draw. It's something that lives
and breathed throughout the year and could deliver that alignment
(04:33):
as we talk about, but also the kind of growth
and results that we want at the end of the year.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
Mm hmmm, yeah, I mean I love that, Michael. You know,
I've I've been able to have business coaches and I think,
you know, having folks like you coming in and giving
them their this perspective of how like I said, I
see people plans that if they're lucky and then they
put it away, they forget about it. In some people,
(04:59):
like you said, Arenie, in planning, it's more of a hope.
You know, it's like, hey, maybe, yeah, yeah, absolutely, Hope
is not a plan, right, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
I actually have a slide that I put up when
I'm talking about this, where I say that most people
spend more time planning their vacations they do planning how
are they going to be successful next year in the business.
And we all know how difficulty is to plan a vacation,
especially if you're bringing two families together. But it's true
most people spend more time planning their vacations that they
do planning their business success. And so there's a couple
(05:33):
of things that an external somebody external facilitating this is
gonna it's gonna help you get out of the weeds,
help you see the wood for the trees, as we say,
help you take a step back. And actually, if there
are three parts to this, the first part is doing
the planning, The second part is creation of the plan.
(05:54):
The third part is then the implementation of the plan.
The creation of the plan itself is probably the least
valuable element of it. The fact that you take a
step back, spend time to be in the moment examining
a whole range of areas in which your business could
be better, not say, and it's broken, but where you
(06:16):
want to improve and what needs to happen to move
your business forward. So that exercise of actually that naval gazing,
that rolling over the rocks and seeing what's underneath, discussing
it and getting the issues out on the table. It
is one of the most valuable elements. And then of course, okay,
we create a plan, but that's absolutely useless if you
(06:37):
don't then not that and have a mechanism for making
sure that month on month progress is being made and
the things that were committed to are actually being done.
So I wanted to be very action orientated in the
way that I do it. So in that way, this
thing doesn't just become a document that goes in a draw.
(06:59):
It's actually at the center of everything week in, week out,
month in month out, and it's the point of reference
that we use in the leadership team meeting.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
Yeah, I love that you brought that up. Is it's
not just like I hear you saying, it's not just
a uh an event, like a one time thing. We
do the plan and that's it. What I heard you say, Michael,
is there's a rhythm to it. Uh And and like
you said, week by week or month by month. You
know that we have to like keep you know, look
at the plan and then adjust. Right You're you're you're
(07:31):
taking action, but it's not we have to understand kind
of our north star. But then what are we doing
on a like you said, where do you see businesses
access in the frequency? And looking at that plan? Michael,
what does that look like? Can you walk us through
a little bit of that rhythm that you have when
you're working with clients.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Yeah, for sure. I think for me it's most exciting.
It's there every day. It drives, it drives what you're
focused on every day. And there's a there's a there's
a great book we have in the UK. It was
about a UK British rowing team for the Olympics, and
it's called will It Make the Boat Go Faster? And
(08:10):
everything they looked at was if I go and eat
this pizza, will it make that boat go faster? If
we go to the party, will it make that boat
go faster? So they're always looking at everything through the
lens of will it make the boat go faster? Now,
if you break a business down, and I break it
down into eleven core areas, Okay, start sales, marketing operations.
(08:32):
I could go through them, but the eleven core areas,
somebody is responsible for each one of those areas. It
could be that people are responsible for multiple areas, but
there needs to be a plan for each of those areas.
So what is the people plan? What needs to happen?
If you take an example of if you wanted to
expand overseas, Okay, that's a really you know, there's a
(08:53):
strategic decision. I trust that you've you've you've discussed why
you would do that and why that would be the
best way to expand. But let's say we want to
expand overseas. Obviously sales and marketing, we've got to go
to that market, we've got to create the demand, we've
got to do it. But suddenly operations, customer service people
HR data. How do we hold our data and different
(09:15):
rules in the UK to the US. There's an IT issue,
there's a financial issue. And what we can do is
that if we say, right, we're going to go into
the US and we're going to launch at the end
of Q two, what needs to happen between now and
the end of Q two. What does finance have to do?
What does customer service have to do. What does HR
have to do, sales marketing, what does everybody have to do?
(09:37):
And in that way you can go right. By the
end of Q two, we need to be here. What
are the steps that we need to do, and then
those can be talked about. Are you on target to
be where we need to be at the end of
Q two so that we can launch and everybody can
come back to the Senior Leadership team once a month
and go right. You can red amber green your initiatives
(09:59):
and your project and then the conversation is very much.
I have a framework that I use for the Senior
Leadership Team meetings because you, like me, probably been in
board meetings where probably feel, well, this is the only
chance I get to speak, so I'm going to speak
for half of now. Okay, board report. I love this framework.
(10:20):
What do you need to disclose? So what do you
need to tell us about what's going on? If you've
got something that's behind schedule, how are you going to
get it back on schedule? What do you need to discuss?
What might have changed that you then want to bring
to the table and get some input on. Okay, and
what do you need a decision on? So we've got disclosed, discussed, decide.
(10:41):
So our senior leadership team meeting, board meeting, whatever you
want to call it, revolves around the things that we've
all said are important and are they on track and
what do we need to take decisions on as we
move through And in that way, if everybody's knocking off
all the things that we've agreed and set of important,
(11:02):
that there is a chance that we could have a
better business at the end of the year that we
did at the star of you.
Speaker 1 (11:08):
Yeah, that's that's great. You know you're you're I just
did a conversation a few weeks ago Michael here locally
in southern California to the International International Internal Auditors and
i s ACA group, and we were talking about the
breakdown between well for them, they're looking at security to
the boardroom and and to your point, Michael, what happens
is there's objectives and there's plans, and then people there's
(11:30):
misalignment because well I thought this was important. Well I
thought this was important, and I like how you just
broke it down about when they're coming to speak to
the board, are you looking, are you bringing about are
you asking clarifying questions? Or is this a point of
clarific collaboration. What are we trying to do here? Is
what I hear you saying, Michael, Because if you're coming
into different angles, you're gonna talk past each other and
(11:52):
you're gonna get very frustrated, like, Hey, we want this,
but I'm looking for collaboration or I'm actually looking for
you to ask me some clarifying questions. I'm not. I'm
not collaborating. I'm just going to answer some questions that
you can make it move forward. So what to your
point of like having a clear guy like you're saying, Michael,
so that we're not getting frustrated and walking away from
the meeting feeling like, well that didn't land, that didn't
(12:13):
get me where I wanted to go. You know right,
I'm sure we've all been there.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
Yeah, one hundred Yeah, Bobby is you know there's a
saying as well that there's a saying that no plan
survives the first contact with the enemy. Isn't there as well,
and so part of the discussion could be we thought
this was the case. We've started working towards this, you
know what, Let's say we're going to employ salespeople or
(12:41):
were going to find an agent. If we're going to
go to this foreign country, right, we're going to find
an agent. We cannot find an agent that we're happy with,
so what are we going to do about it? And
we are just the plan, but the strategic goal of
going to a foreign country or moving into a new
market remains the same. We just had to pivot as
well as we go through. But everybody else is still
(13:01):
battling on and going. We're going towards where we need
to get to. When we talk about alignment, though, everybody
is then aligned with those business goals.
Speaker 1 (13:10):
And I think we.
Speaker 2 (13:10):
Always come to me as a CMO and say, why
are you doing pr in there? I would go, well,
that's in line with building a brand in this market,
which is in line with going to this market. I
can then say this is why I'm doing what I'm doing,
and hopefullyly we all see that we are building the
same house, or moving in the same direction, or operating
(13:34):
on the same big project. We just all got different
jobs to do in the project, which is, you know,
moving to a new market. I think this is about
some form of structure. This isn't This isn't rocket science.
If you're like, it's it's just about some form of structure.
And I think part of this is the project management
(13:56):
of this going forward that needs to happen because not
holding people accountable or people realizing that it's okay not
to do what they said they were going to do.
Mm hmm. If there's no structure, they don't realize and
you can't see that they're letting the team down and
the business down. But it's a way to not not
(14:20):
beat people around the head, but just for them to
be aligned and go, I know what I'm trying to
do here, and I know what my role is in
trying to make that happen. It is the same way
as you would in a sports team.
Speaker 1 (14:30):
I support yes, absolutely no. I mean, as you bring
that up, Michael. Number one, I've I've been the end
of this where I wasn't completely clear on alignment. I said, well,
they said here, here, come give me your give me
your sales, your shales plan, or your I said, okay,
I can. But it was abstract, Michael. It wasn't connected
to the larger company vision of market sectors and clients.
(14:53):
And so I was. I was in a group in
a local area and I said, well, how I can
come up with lots of different things, but I don't understand,
Like you said, where does this connect to? So if
I'm not clear on this, then I get pushed back, well,
that's not what we're looking for, but I don't understand.
So depending on where we're at in the in the hierarchy,
if you will, you know, we can get stuck. And then,
you know, I find is especially if you're talking lower
(15:16):
level folks, directors, managed, managers, and then they get frustrated
because they're like, I don't know how to win here,
you know, because I'm not clear on that.
Speaker 2 (15:25):
Absolutely absolutely well. I use an analogy when I'm talking
about businesses and I talk about alignment, and part of
the analogy is that I think some people talk about
getting people on the bus, right, Okay, Now, getting people
on the bus to me suggests that I'm going to
get people on the bus and then I'm going to
(15:46):
take them there because I'm going to drive the bus. Okay.
What I want to think about is that I like
the idea that we're all joined together with a piece
of elastic okay and a bundee cord. Okay, I'm going
this way, okay, but people are going way the further
they go that way, and the more I go this way,
the tighter that elastic needs to get, and the harder
(16:09):
it is for me to continue to push that way.
So the alignment is about bringing them with me. Now,
they may be going in completely the wrong direction, not
because well, they could be what we call in business
terrorists us they're deciding I'm not going with the floor.
I'm gonna go my own way right right, But it
could be that they just don't know that we're supposed
(16:30):
to be going this way. And then the plan, if
it's cascaded correctly, is to say, this is what our
critical success factors are for twenty twenty six, whatever it is,
and this is what we need to focus on and
the things that we need to crack, if you like.
In some systems they call them big rocks. Some people
they call them a big, hairy, orbacious goals. But if
(16:53):
you think of big rocks, I always think of them
because they need to be smashed into the small pieces
and broken up and taken on. So, you know, I
love the analogies. And it's not that all the systems
don't necessarily work. I just I just find that what
I've tried to create is something that's very functional, very living,
(17:14):
very alive, and very relevant to people. And it helps
with that alignment because I think a high performing team
is aligned. Every example I've got of a high performing
team that I see, and I don't just mean sports teams,
high performing teams, they all know exactly what it is
that they're trying to achieve and do.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
Yeah. Absolutely, well, I know we and I were talking
before we you know, earlier before this podcast. I loved
your analogy of the football or soccer here in the US.
But yeah, I played soccer as a young young kid.
And you know, if you watch young kids by soccer,
they all want to get the ball, right they all that's.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
The story everybody. All the kids are running to the ball.
But do you watch a professional football team, socker team,
They're not all running for the ball, right, Michael, I
mean walk us through the I mean I love the analogy.
I want you to share it because I like, you know.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Okay, So as it happened. When I started to look
at a business, I thought I found that there were
eleven core areas that I needed to identify, and I thought, well,
is there some way that this fits with the with
the football analogy. We're going to say when you know,
I should say soccer, even though it's proper football, the ball,
you know, soccer. Yeah, yeah, you're in California, the big,
(18:37):
the big soccer thing going on in in Los Angeles.
So there we go, right, Okay, so listen, yeah we're
talking about soccer. So in the soccer team we've got
we've got the Glory Boys who were out from They're
the they're the strikers. They're the people that are putting
the ball in the back of the net and scoring
the goals. And of course the Glory Boys and the
fancy bands people in the sharp suits are the sales
and marketing team. So I have them out from, okay,
(19:00):
And what I say is that they're the team that
are They're the people that are making their promise. They
are sitting down with the customer and they're making a
promise about what working with the company will be. Like
the midfield, we have four in the midfield. The four
across the midfield are the people that deliver that promise. Okay.
And so those team members are going to be the
(19:20):
operations team, the service team, the purchasing team, and then
the new product development Those are the four people that
are focused on the customer, so they deliver the promise
that the sales and marketing make. And then the back four,
as we call it, the defenders, the people that are
the foundation at the back are going to be the HR,
(19:42):
the finance it and systems. I make them as separate,
separate things on purpose, but those are the back for
they run the business. They make the business run for
the business. And then leadership and management I take as
being the goalkeeper. And if you've ever watched the a
British soccer team, what you've got is a goalkeeper stood
(20:02):
at the back shouting. So I make the analogy the
fun analogy to say, obviously, as leadership, we don't just
stand there and shout and tell everybody to do. But
that's what the goalkeeper does. So that that's my that's
my framework if you like. Now, in a high performing team,
there are all sorts of characteristics of a high performing
team about you know, continuous improvement that were led things
(20:26):
like this, but a couple of couple of things. Everybody
knows what their job is, so you don't get the
guys at the front of the team running back to
do the defending defending work for and you don't get
the people at the back running forward to say I'm
going to score the goals today. I fancy doing that.
Everybody knows what their job is. The other thing is
that everybody trusts everybody to do their job. That's a
(20:47):
day of it as well. But what we've got is
if you look at growth and you look at business planning,
you're saying, right, I'm going to go from ten million
dollars to twenty million dollars to do that in three years.
That's really just keeping score. The analogy again is that
I bring you back to that team. That's like the
(21:09):
manager going into the dressing room and holding up a
sign that says three nil on it. Okay, that's the
result that I want. But it doesn't tell us how
we're gonna get there, doesn't tell us the strategy of
or we're always going to attack down the right hand
side because we know that the left backs week, we're
gonna the goalkeepers not great. So we're going to put
really high crosses in what are the what's the strategy
(21:30):
and what are we going to do to win and
get the result that we want? And so you know
that's a sports team analogy. But again you could, you could,
you could, you could bring it to the armed forces,
you could bring it to special forces. Again, there's always
a plan and then there's the execution with honesty and integrity.
That's that's crucial. But it is a team and everybody
(21:53):
needs to be aligned in doing the same things. If
the defenders don't want to play, We've seen it in
also supports teams where peop people don't want to play
aligned with it and they just creates a week team,
doesn't it.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
Yeah, well, yeah, absolutely, And what comes to mind? You
talk to me, Michael, because I've been in this journey.
One of the last companies I was working with before
I started to your business, we went I was a
woman on small business and we went from she wanted
to do to a million in revenue. She started the
company in twenty twelve. I came there in twenty eighteen,
which we did and then we went to two million
the next year and then four million and seven million.
(22:27):
What we had was, as you understand that business life cycle,
different challenges, different problems, and so the way that you
play the game, if you will, is a little different,
and you might have to move positions, perhaps too, you
might have been maybe doing one thing. And oftentimes when
we're smaller companies, we're playing a lot of these roles
positions because there aren't enough players, right, we don't have
(22:48):
enough people to cover, you know, we don't have enough.
So but you know, speak a little bit more clone.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, speak.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
A little bit to that. That journey of a business.
It doesn't matter whether you know, like I said, ten
million to twenty million, it's not a one to one,
like your skill like, there's different things and different problems
that come up, right.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
Yeah, And I suppose it's like a team getting promoted
from the second division to the first division. Suddenly we're
playing a different game. We're playing, we're playing in a
different marketplace, we're playing at a different level. And and
and I think one of the one of the areas
that I think it comes home most when we're talking
(23:26):
about people is that you need to think strategically about
your people. Because if you're going to go from ten
million to twenty million, a ten million organization looks like this,
a twenty million organization looks completely different. And what you've
got to look at is you've got to assess your players,
your team members, and you've got to go right when
we're twenty million, we're going to need a head of operations.
(23:49):
Currently that that falls under the managing director, but at
some point we're going to need a head of operation.
Do we need to bring that expertise in or is
there somebody that could step up? And suddenly you're starting
to look strategically at what your people plan it and
whether there's training that needs to be done. But you're
planning forward and thinking forward about about your team. It's
(24:12):
absolutely great if you could give somebody, but if you're
not careful, you could have somebody that was that was
packing boxes and in three years suddenly the head of
operations because the business grows so fast, and have they
been given all the tools that they need to succeed
in that role. It doesn't mean that they can't do it,
but we need to make sure that we're invested in
(24:33):
those and that is whoever's responsible for HR or people
needs to be looking at the people and how we
develop the people and so you know, the seniors learning skills,
et cetera, et cetera a crucial But you're having a
conversation about it that says, operations, where is it going
in the next twelve months, two years, three years, and
(24:55):
what are the challenge is going to be? So what
do we need to do in this quarter, in next quarter?
What will we do in q Q three and two four.
You're consciously having the conversation rather than reactively going, well,
we've promoted, we promoted Phil and he's not up to
(25:15):
the job. And it's not Fiel's fault if he's not
at the training and he was packing boxes six months
ago and he's out of operations, he doesn't know, doesn't
So yeah, that's the that's I've profinitely works for me.
Speaker 1 (25:31):
I've definitely seen that, Michael. And again that's why I
love having you on the podcast or in the business
rounding a podcast. By the way, you guys are listening
to this, Michael, Stuart and I are connected on LinkedIn.
We're going to make sure you can access to his
website and all that good stuff in our show notes
and if you have comments or feedback, please drop it
in there wherever you find us, whether it's YouTube, LinkedIn, Spotify, whatever,
(25:52):
the whatever the podcast platform it is, so Michael can
respond to you. But to your point, Michael, I think
having you on the podcast is again looking at those
things and saying, look, I know you love this particular person.
They've been with your company for so many years and
they do really well at this position, but they're struggling here,
and what is it that they need, whether it's leadership training,
(26:15):
sales training, is it technically need some other technical skill
that they don't have because there's something new in the marketplace.
You know what is that you're looking at that or
you know in helping them, That's what I hear you say,
Michael too. We're in a very interesting market right now.
We're recording this here in the end of twenty twenty five,
where you know, there's been lots of ups and downs
and volatility, and I know you've been exploring some new
(26:37):
places helping entrepreneurs. Look where are their new marketplaces? Where
can I go in the world to reach folks that
need my product or service, and so helping unlock them
and get out of their own way, right Michael of like, hey,
envisioning what could be? But I think sometimes we're our
own works enemies and we need somebody else to help
unpack that for us and say, look, you know, where
(26:59):
are you where are your greatest strengths? Where can you
really help the business grow and thrive and get in
that lane and get out of the position in which
you're really not having that great of impact. But I
think sometimes as good especially we're smaller, or there's you know,
fiefdoms are other things that we're holding onto things and
it's not really it's not helping the business, and we
need somebody to come in and look at that like
(27:20):
a doctor. I feel like Michael, you're diagnosing some things right,
and you're unlocking and then you're saying, look, this is
not work, this is not working. Is this really what
you want? You know, getting clear on where do you
want to go? Right?
Speaker 2 (27:34):
I think there's a couple of things that you raise there.
So the first thing is that ultimately a business owner
needs to make themselves redundant so that they can so
that the business can operate without them all the wise
they're going on holiday and coming back to a pile
of stuff, and stuff doesn't happen if everything needs to
go through them, So that that's part of it. The
(27:55):
other thing that you touched on was when somebody is
falling short, let's say, falling short in their role, but
that may be not necessarily their fault. It could be
that we've promoted them too fast, too soon, and we've
not given them a support. So I think it's important
that we're conscious in the way that we talk about
(28:17):
the people and promote the people. And hence why you know,
somebody thinking strategically about the people's going to be looking
at the transformation of the business and not just the
transactional stuff. Have we got a staff, handbookers, ever, we
have an appraisal, etcetera, etcetera. You've got to be thinking
about how are the people transforming and how do I
(28:37):
transform the people? And literally I was in my SDN
group today and somebody did the three minute teacher and
they were talking about creating a culture of learning in
a business. Not just once a month we're going to
do a piece of learning. You know, how do we
facilitate that in so many ways? You know, and you
used to hear about Google being able empowering people to
(28:58):
go and do their passion project, but also you know,
to learn and whilst they're on the job and to
better themselves because better employees are going to be better
for the business. So there's a support about what do
I need to what do I need to do to
help you thrive in your role. I think if people
are struggling in the role, you're going to work through
(29:18):
how can I help it so you can thrive in
your role. But ultimately, if this isn't the right role
for them, they're probably struggling with it as much as
you are. And I always think that the conversation is
the conversation can often be you know what, that's a
weight off. I didn't want to come to you and
say that I can't do this or not up to this,
(29:41):
or I don't know what I'm doing. But often it
can be a very cathartic thing for them as much
as the business, if you like. And so externally, I
look and I think the benefit of putting somebody external
into your businesses that they're going to ask all those
questions and they're gonna challenge the things that you've got.
(30:04):
I need to deal with that, but I've just got
too much on my plate today, and they're going to
bring them into focus and we're going to go we're
going to deal with that. And and I know the
business owner will hold somebody accountable for dealing with the
issues that that hey, everything's not always about issues and
Sometimes it can be positive where you say we want
to do this, but you know, because I like to
(30:26):
position it, I do a kind of session say where
where I say complete this sentence. Wouldn't it be great
if rather than where are the problems? Wouldn't it be great?
If wouldn't be great if it didn't take us as
long to pick an order from it from the warehouse?
Wouldn't it be great if we didn't have the same
amount staff turnover? The positive way of thinking about it,
(30:47):
and we go, okay, staff turnover plastaghr. The people responsible
for people go, there's a thing that we have. How
are you going to solve that? And when are you
going to come back with what you're going to imploy
meant to make that not be the case anymore? How
are you going to solve it? Report back to us
and again you can see how that could be something.
By the end of Q one, I want a plan
(31:08):
in place. So you've got the first month you're going
to start to do some employee survey, then going to
come back two when you're going to report what what
that comes back and what you think the plan needs
to be by the end of queues, by the end
of not Q two months two. By the end of
month three, we've got that in place, and suddenly there's
an issue that was an issue that is now solved
(31:29):
and we have a better business that we had before
and that could have an impact on profitability, couldn't it?
Speaker 1 (31:35):
Just oh one hundred percent? I love that you said.
You know, the tithes to my philosophy at Stewardi. Your
businesses leadership is stewardship. It's about serving others so that
they can thrive. Like you said, so we're we're if
we're looking at everybody's best interesting mine in the long term,
our clients, we will win in the long long term.
It's like, you know, you know, so I here totally
(31:56):
said what if we could do this? How about have
we thought about that? And turning it on his head
a little bit and saying, oh, yeah, we could. I
didn't think about that, you know. And I love working
with business owners that have that mentality and like they're, oh,
I didn't, I didn't. I didn't even know I can
consider that. And you're you're you're you're opening them to
see possibilities. And I love what you're doing too. In
the international space. Michael of creating a place for folks
(32:20):
that I didn't even know. I didn't even think about
going outside of my home country, you know, and reaching
people and like how could I help? Yeah, And I think,
you know, for those that are listening, it could be intimidating,
but you have an advocate here, somebody that's helping you
and saying, asking the questions, opening up the possibilities of
what could be. And I think that's amazing because you know,
(32:40):
you have a certain skills and abilities and insights that
you're bringing to your clients and helping them. Michael, And
I think that's I hope that as people are listening
to the podcasts are like saying, okay, well, I didn't
know where to start. I didn't even know that there
was a business growth planner or person out there that
would be able to help me in my business. I
don't even know where where.
Speaker 2 (32:59):
We begin, you know.
Speaker 1 (33:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
So I think in the in the times that we've
got oh sorry, sorry, go.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
On, Michael, and the times we got.
Speaker 2 (33:14):
Okay, I think I think the thing for me is
that in the economic times that we've got in UK,
we've got fairly static market at the moment we all
know in the US we've got the tariffs and how
that's affecting it. You know, we had Mark Carney talking
to the UN or doing the press conference after the
UN conference, where he's saying, you know that Canada needs
(33:36):
to start looking east west rather than north south. You know, Okay,
overseas markets could be no risk, they could deem risk
you being only in one market in the same way
as being concentrated in only one client is not great
in a business concentrated in one market and going to
a new market doesn't mean you have to employ twenty people.
(33:59):
In an new market. You could find an agent, you
could find a distributor. You can buy a company that's
already operating in that marketplace that's got some market share already,
and maybe that would be a collaboration. You could just
have a joint venture with somebody that's complemented to you.
So there's ways that you can do it. And I
think certainly I've done some work with a mutual friend.
(34:24):
We've got where we've put together this methodology we call
Passport to Growth, and that really is how can we
bring the expertise that we have. I've got clients that
are selling in fifty countries David partner in this. He's
taking businesses international, multiple businesses international and internew markets, creating
(34:48):
businesses that are more more valuable as a consequence of it.
What we've done is we've looked at it and gone, right, Okay,
if you're an entrepreneur or you're a business owner, you're busy,
you're not sat doing nothing thing right, you may not
have sold internationally. So how can we take you step
by step on a journey to understand whether it's an
(35:09):
opportunity for you. So when we talk about business growth
plans and we talk about well, where's growth is going
to come from? That could be international markets, and we
and we have a way that we kind of take
people on that journey. But I could be a whole
new a the podcasting.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
Have you come back on the podcast, Michael, and maybe
we'll have David David Holman come on too. But you know,
this has been a blast to have you here. I
know we're wrapp getting up toward the end of our
time together today, you know, but what I love that
you bring this approach about how you get a business
really winning with clarity and purpose. Obviously, you know we
have the shared passion of getting the teams aligned and
(35:45):
believing in that. You know, I really feel like culture
and strategy are kind of two sides of us the
same coin. If we get them aligned, we can build
that momentum. That's why I love having on the podcast
as not just a guest, but obnesotly a contributor, a
collaborator with me and how things do with your business
grow and reaching other companies. This is Michael and I are,
you know, looking for ways that we can help more
(36:06):
of you out there our listeners, UH, come alongside you
as trusted advisors, guidance consultants. As we wrap up the podcast,
Michael and we've covered a lot of different things here today,
what would you say to those people that are listening,
whether that's the business owner or maybe as somebody else
in the company that says, I want to help this
company grow and there's maybe there's a breakdown of strategy,
(36:29):
a breakdown of the of the plan of understanding. What
would you say to that person as are listening that
they should take action on what you know? Wh Where
would you direct them?
Speaker 2 (36:41):
I think I think we have talked to a whole
range of things. I've talked about all the eleven areas
you might not be the eleven areas. We've talked about
mission vision values, we've talked about team members, we've talked
about personal development. I think I think the thing for
me is that the the businesses that have been successful
that I've been part of where I've worked as a
(37:04):
consultant or fresnel, they're very willing to have honest conversations
and they're very willing to challenge. And I think that's
a strength of SME, smaller businesses, SME, SMB wherewever you
want to describe them. And I know I have a
friend's that's left the army and gone to work in
(37:24):
a big, big corporate and he is absolutely amazed at
the positioning and the corporate politics that are going on.
You've got a business, get good people around you and
it will be amazed. If you're a business owner, you'd
be amazed what your team can do if you involve
them in the conversation. You don't have to have all
(37:45):
the answers making a training thing, but say I'm interested,
what do you think about? And that's an open question.
Tell me what you think about, Tell me what you
think about, Explain what you mean by this, Tell me
more about that, and you're starting to roll over those rocks.
And even if you just yourself ran a session that
(38:08):
was right, here's a piece of paper we're going to
write on here. Wouldn't it be great if and you
complete those things? How would our business be better at
the end of the year that it will be at
the start of the year. We're not doing anything massively strategically,
but at least we're opening up the conversation. And then
when you need somebody to facilitate the business planning, you
(38:28):
know where I come across.
Speaker 1 (38:30):
There you go, there you go, Michael, thank you so
much for being here. I love that. Yeah, go have
those honest conversations. And if you're not having and them,
then yeah, that's definitely should be a warning bell. But
go have those honest conversations. I think if they're powerful,
don't be afraid of them. Lean into them. Like you're saying, Michael,
have the conversations. Bring in somebody like Michael that can
look and have and look at where you're at, give
(38:52):
you real feedback. Make sure you guys connect with Michael
on LinkedIn, reach out to him. I'll make sure, like
I said, you guys can connect with him on our
show notes, thank you so much for being here, Michael,
A real pleasure having you.
Speaker 2 (39:06):
Lovely great, always great to have a conversation. David. We'll
speak again soon, i'm sure.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
Thank you everybody, Thanks for listening to everybody. Until next time,
be well and we'll see you out here. Back on
the Business Round People podcast
Welcome back to the Business Roundtable podcast. I'm David Carr
of Stuart Your Business, where we bring people together to
accomplish great things. Here on the Business Roundtable, I'm glad
to have Michael Stewart here, a friend and collaborator, also
another Success Champions Network member and founder of the company
Business Planning Plus. We're going to get into the Plus.
(00:35):
We're getting into business Planning. He really is helping folks
simplify strategy, execute and focus and really build momentum in
their businesses. So I'm excited to have you here on
the podcast. Michael, thank you for joining us.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Great to be here, Really excited to see where this
conversation goes.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
David absolutely absolutely. Now, Michael, you and I have been
talking actually throughout the year, and one of the things
I really liked about our conversations was how do you
get business in alignment? And we're helping them be healthier
overall in all aspects of the company. Talk to us
a little bit about your journey of why you got
(01:15):
to where you're at now with you know, building Business
Planning Plus and the help you know you've helped dozens
of companies now and talk a little bit your journey
about why you got to where you're at now and
you're helping not only you're based in the UK, but
you're helping companies throughout the world.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
Yeah. Absolutely, So we go right back to the start.
My first job was in the bank, and of course
in those days in the late nineteen eighties, that was
join the bank because it will be a job for life,
so that was the way to go, and of course
it never ended up being that way. But I got
involved with business finance and I will shed moment really
(01:54):
for me was in the late nineteen nineties when I
did some business finance on a marketing agency that was
getting involved with multimedia. So back in the nineteen nineties,
even though we were a marketing agency, we shared a
lead to download our email on a dial up connection
within a marketing agency, so it was right back in
(02:14):
the day. I was involved right at the start of
marketing on the Internet. So that was a heck of
a journey up until about fifteen years ago. I ended
up doing digital marketing for some big brands here in
the UK and some national names. But fifteen years ago
got the opportunity to set out on my own and
(02:35):
so yeah, when when freelance, studied doing some consultancy, and
I've never looked back and as I say, totally unemployable. Now,
the last thing anybody would want to do would get
me into a business to work there full time. I
think I'm totally unemployable, as a one of us self
employed people are. David said it up. I started off
(03:03):
by doing a kind of fractional CMO type work, but
had I started to work with SME businesses and I
realized that those were the most successful, the ones that
had a proper plan. So yes, I will be contributing
to that plan. But I realized that lots of businesses.
As a CMO, I knew that I needed to align
(03:24):
what I did with what the business's strategic objectives were,
and in some businesses, they didn't know what the strategic
objectives were. A lot of the time people say well
what are you going to do and they say, well,
we're going to double in size in the next three years,
and they've nothing more than that. Well, for me, that's
not a strategic objective, it's not a direction. It's it's
(03:45):
just keeping score. Really is how big of you got
and how much money are you're making? So how's that
going to come about. So I realized that there was
a gap in the market for what I would call
a business growth plan and looked around what was available
in the marketplace, had been exposed to all sorts of
things working in sme businesses, and so develop my own methodology,
(04:10):
put that together under the business planning plus brand, and
I now have a number of clients that I help
annually to do that. And then I also helped to
project manage, if you're like, the growth through the year,
making sure that that plan isn't just something that gets
written and goes in a draw. It's something that lives
and breathed throughout the year and could deliver that alignment
(04:33):
as we talk about, but also the kind of growth
and results that we want at the end of the year.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
Mm hmmm, yeah, I mean I love that, Michael. You know,
I've I've been able to have business coaches and I think,
you know, having folks like you coming in and giving
them their this perspective of how like I said, I
see people plans that if they're lucky and then they
put it away, they forget about it. In some people,
(04:59):
like you said, Arenie, in planning, it's more of a hope.
You know, it's like, hey, maybe, yeah, yeah, absolutely, Hope
is not a plan, right, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
I actually have a slide that I put up when
I'm talking about this, where I say that most people
spend more time planning their vacations they do planning how
are they going to be successful next year in the business.
And we all know how difficulty is to plan a vacation,
especially if you're bringing two families together. But it's true
most people spend more time planning their vacations that they
do planning their business success. And so there's a couple
(05:33):
of things that an external somebody external facilitating this is
gonna it's gonna help you get out of the weeds,
help you see the wood for the trees, as we say,
help you take a step back. And actually, if there
are three parts to this, the first part is doing
the planning, The second part is creation of the plan.
(05:54):
The third part is then the implementation of the plan.
The creation of the plan itself is probably the least
valuable element of it. The fact that you take a
step back, spend time to be in the moment examining
a whole range of areas in which your business could
be better, not say, and it's broken, but where you
(06:16):
want to improve and what needs to happen to move
your business forward. So that exercise of actually that naval gazing,
that rolling over the rocks and seeing what's underneath, discussing
it and getting the issues out on the table. It
is one of the most valuable elements. And then of course, okay,
we create a plan, but that's absolutely useless if you
(06:37):
don't then not that and have a mechanism for making
sure that month on month progress is being made and
the things that were committed to are actually being done.
So I wanted to be very action orientated in the
way that I do it. So in that way, this
thing doesn't just become a document that goes in a draw.
(06:59):
It's actually at the center of everything week in, week out,
month in month out, and it's the point of reference
that we use in the leadership team meeting.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
Yeah, I love that you brought that up. Is it's
not just like I hear you saying, it's not just
a uh an event, like a one time thing. We
do the plan and that's it. What I heard you say, Michael,
is there's a rhythm to it. Uh And and like
you said, week by week or month by month. You
know that we have to like keep you know, look
at the plan and then adjust. Right You're you're you're
(07:31):
taking action, but it's not we have to understand kind
of our north star. But then what are we doing
on a like you said, where do you see businesses
access in the frequency? And looking at that plan? Michael,
what does that look like? Can you walk us through
a little bit of that rhythm that you have when
you're working with clients.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Yeah, for sure. I think for me it's most exciting.
It's there every day. It drives, it drives what you're
focused on every day. And there's a there's a there's
a great book we have in the UK. It was
about a UK British rowing team for the Olympics, and
it's called will It Make the Boat Go Faster? And
(08:10):
everything they looked at was if I go and eat
this pizza, will it make that boat go faster? If
we go to the party, will it make that boat
go faster? So they're always looking at everything through the
lens of will it make the boat go faster? Now,
if you break a business down, and I break it
down into eleven core areas, Okay, start sales, marketing operations.
(08:32):
I could go through them, but the eleven core areas,
somebody is responsible for each one of those areas. It
could be that people are responsible for multiple areas, but
there needs to be a plan for each of those areas.
So what is the people plan? What needs to happen?
If you take an example of if you wanted to
expand overseas, Okay, that's a really you know, there's a
(08:53):
strategic decision. I trust that you've you've you've discussed why
you would do that and why that would be the
best way to expand. But let's say we want to
expand overseas. Obviously sales and marketing, we've got to go
to that market, we've got to create the demand, we've
got to do it. But suddenly operations, customer service people
HR data. How do we hold our data and different
(09:15):
rules in the UK to the US. There's an IT issue,
there's a financial issue. And what we can do is
that if we say, right, we're going to go into
the US and we're going to launch at the end
of Q two, what needs to happen between now and
the end of Q two. What does finance have to do?
What does customer service have to do. What does HR
have to do, sales marketing, what does everybody have to do?
(09:37):
And in that way you can go right. By the
end of Q two, we need to be here. What
are the steps that we need to do, and then
those can be talked about. Are you on target to
be where we need to be at the end of
Q two so that we can launch and everybody can
come back to the Senior Leadership team once a month
and go right. You can red amber green your initiatives
(09:59):
and your project and then the conversation is very much.
I have a framework that I use for the Senior
Leadership Team meetings because you, like me, probably been in
board meetings where probably feel, well, this is the only
chance I get to speak, so I'm going to speak
for half of now. Okay, board report. I love this framework.
(10:20):
What do you need to disclose? So what do you
need to tell us about what's going on? If you've
got something that's behind schedule, how are you going to
get it back on schedule? What do you need to discuss?
What might have changed that you then want to bring
to the table and get some input on. Okay, and
what do you need a decision on? So we've got disclosed, discussed, decide.
(10:41):
So our senior leadership team meeting, board meeting, whatever you
want to call it, revolves around the things that we've
all said are important and are they on track and
what do we need to take decisions on as we
move through And in that way, if everybody's knocking off
all the things that we've agreed and set of important,
(11:02):
that there is a chance that we could have a
better business at the end of the year that we
did at the star of you.
Speaker 1 (11:08):
Yeah, that's that's great. You know you're you're I just
did a conversation a few weeks ago Michael here locally
in southern California to the International International Internal Auditors and
i s ACA group, and we were talking about the
breakdown between well for them, they're looking at security to
the boardroom and and to your point, Michael, what happens
is there's objectives and there's plans, and then people there's
(11:30):
misalignment because well I thought this was important. Well I
thought this was important, and I like how you just
broke it down about when they're coming to speak to
the board, are you looking, are you bringing about are
you asking clarifying questions? Or is this a point of
clarific collaboration. What are we trying to do here? Is
what I hear you saying, Michael, Because if you're coming
into different angles, you're gonna talk past each other and
(11:52):
you're gonna get very frustrated, like, Hey, we want this,
but I'm looking for collaboration or I'm actually looking for
you to ask me some clarifying questions. I'm not. I'm
not collaborating. I'm just going to answer some questions that
you can make it move forward. So what to your
point of like having a clear guy like you're saying, Michael,
so that we're not getting frustrated and walking away from
the meeting feeling like, well that didn't land, that didn't
(12:13):
get me where I wanted to go. You know right,
I'm sure we've all been there.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
Yeah, one hundred Yeah, Bobby is you know there's a
saying as well that there's a saying that no plan
survives the first contact with the enemy. Isn't there as well,
and so part of the discussion could be we thought
this was the case. We've started working towards this, you
know what, Let's say we're going to employ salespeople or
(12:41):
were going to find an agent. If we're going to
go to this foreign country, right, we're going to find
an agent. We cannot find an agent that we're happy with,
so what are we going to do about it? And
we are just the plan, but the strategic goal of
going to a foreign country or moving into a new
market remains the same. We just had to pivot as
well as we go through. But everybody else is still
(13:01):
battling on and going. We're going towards where we need
to get to. When we talk about alignment, though, everybody
is then aligned with those business goals.
Speaker 1 (13:10):
And I think we.
Speaker 2 (13:10):
Always come to me as a CMO and say, why
are you doing pr in there? I would go, well,
that's in line with building a brand in this market,
which is in line with going to this market. I
can then say this is why I'm doing what I'm doing,
and hopefullyly we all see that we are building the
same house, or moving in the same direction, or operating
(13:34):
on the same big project. We just all got different
jobs to do in the project, which is, you know,
moving to a new market. I think this is about
some form of structure. This isn't This isn't rocket science.
If you're like, it's it's just about some form of structure.
And I think part of this is the project management
(13:56):
of this going forward that needs to happen because not
holding people accountable or people realizing that it's okay not
to do what they said they were going to do.
Mm hmm. If there's no structure, they don't realize and
you can't see that they're letting the team down and
the business down. But it's a way to not not
(14:20):
beat people around the head, but just for them to
be aligned and go, I know what I'm trying to
do here, and I know what my role is in
trying to make that happen. It is the same way
as you would in a sports team.
Speaker 1 (14:30):
I support yes, absolutely no. I mean, as you bring
that up, Michael. Number one, I've I've been the end
of this where I wasn't completely clear on alignment. I said, well,
they said here, here, come give me your give me
your sales, your shales plan, or your I said, okay,
I can. But it was abstract, Michael. It wasn't connected
to the larger company vision of market sectors and clients.
(14:53):
And so I was. I was in a group in
a local area and I said, well, how I can
come up with lots of different things, but I don't understand,
Like you said, where does this connect to? So if
I'm not clear on this, then I get pushed back, well,
that's not what we're looking for, but I don't understand.
So depending on where we're at in the in the hierarchy,
if you will, you know, we can get stuck. And then,
you know, I find is especially if you're talking lower
(15:16):
level folks, directors, managed, managers, and then they get frustrated
because they're like, I don't know how to win here,
you know, because I'm not clear on that.
Speaker 2 (15:25):
Absolutely absolutely well. I use an analogy when I'm talking
about businesses and I talk about alignment, and part of
the analogy is that I think some people talk about
getting people on the bus, right, Okay, Now, getting people
on the bus to me suggests that I'm going to
get people on the bus and then I'm going to
(15:46):
take them there because I'm going to drive the bus. Okay.
What I want to think about is that I like
the idea that we're all joined together with a piece
of elastic okay and a bundee cord. Okay, I'm going
this way, okay, but people are going way the further
they go that way, and the more I go this way,
the tighter that elastic needs to get, and the harder
(16:09):
it is for me to continue to push that way.
So the alignment is about bringing them with me. Now,
they may be going in completely the wrong direction, not
because well, they could be what we call in business
terrorists us they're deciding I'm not going with the floor.
I'm gonna go my own way right right, But it
could be that they just don't know that we're supposed
(16:30):
to be going this way. And then the plan, if
it's cascaded correctly, is to say, this is what our
critical success factors are for twenty twenty six, whatever it is,
and this is what we need to focus on and
the things that we need to crack, if you like.
In some systems they call them big rocks. Some people
they call them a big, hairy, orbacious goals. But if
(16:53):
you think of big rocks, I always think of them
because they need to be smashed into the small pieces
and broken up and taken on. So, you know, I
love the analogies. And it's not that all the systems
don't necessarily work. I just I just find that what
I've tried to create is something that's very functional, very living,
(17:14):
very alive, and very relevant to people. And it helps
with that alignment because I think a high performing team
is aligned. Every example I've got of a high performing
team that I see, and I don't just mean sports teams,
high performing teams, they all know exactly what it is
that they're trying to achieve and do.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
Yeah. Absolutely, well, I know we and I were talking
before we you know, earlier before this podcast. I loved
your analogy of the football or soccer here in the US.
But yeah, I played soccer as a young young kid.
And you know, if you watch young kids by soccer,
they all want to get the ball, right they all that's.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
The story everybody. All the kids are running to the ball.
But do you watch a professional football team, socker team,
They're not all running for the ball, right, Michael, I
mean walk us through the I mean I love the analogy.
I want you to share it because I like, you know.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Okay, So as it happened. When I started to look
at a business, I thought I found that there were
eleven core areas that I needed to identify, and I thought, well,
is there some way that this fits with the with
the football analogy. We're going to say when you know,
I should say soccer, even though it's proper football, the ball,
you know, soccer. Yeah, yeah, you're in California, the big,
(18:37):
the big soccer thing going on in in Los Angeles.
So there we go, right, Okay, so listen, yeah we're
talking about soccer. So in the soccer team we've got
we've got the Glory Boys who were out from They're
the they're the strikers. They're the people that are putting
the ball in the back of the net and scoring
the goals. And of course the Glory Boys and the
fancy bands people in the sharp suits are the sales
and marketing team. So I have them out from, okay,
(19:00):
And what I say is that they're the team that
are They're the people that are making their promise. They
are sitting down with the customer and they're making a
promise about what working with the company will be. Like
the midfield, we have four in the midfield. The four
across the midfield are the people that deliver that promise. Okay.
And so those team members are going to be the
(19:20):
operations team, the service team, the purchasing team, and then
the new product development Those are the four people that
are focused on the customer, so they deliver the promise
that the sales and marketing make. And then the back four,
as we call it, the defenders, the people that are
the foundation at the back are going to be the HR,
(19:42):
the finance it and systems. I make them as separate,
separate things on purpose, but those are the back for
they run the business. They make the business run for
the business. And then leadership and management I take as
being the goalkeeper. And if you've ever watched the a
British soccer team, what you've got is a goalkeeper stood
(20:02):
at the back shouting. So I make the analogy the
fun analogy to say, obviously, as leadership, we don't just
stand there and shout and tell everybody to do. But
that's what the goalkeeper does. So that that's my that's
my framework if you like. Now, in a high performing team,
there are all sorts of characteristics of a high performing
team about you know, continuous improvement that were led things
(20:26):
like this, but a couple of couple of things. Everybody
knows what their job is, so you don't get the
guys at the front of the team running back to
do the defending defending work for and you don't get
the people at the back running forward to say I'm
going to score the goals today. I fancy doing that.
Everybody knows what their job is. The other thing is
that everybody trusts everybody to do their job. That's a
(20:47):
day of it as well. But what we've got is
if you look at growth and you look at business planning,
you're saying, right, I'm going to go from ten million
dollars to twenty million dollars to do that in three years.
That's really just keeping score. The analogy again is that
I bring you back to that team. That's like the
(21:09):
manager going into the dressing room and holding up a
sign that says three nil on it. Okay, that's the
result that I want. But it doesn't tell us how
we're gonna get there, doesn't tell us the strategy of
or we're always going to attack down the right hand
side because we know that the left backs week, we're
gonna the goalkeepers not great. So we're going to put
really high crosses in what are the what's the strategy
(21:30):
and what are we going to do to win and
get the result that we want? And so you know
that's a sports team analogy. But again you could, you could,
you could, you could bring it to the armed forces,
you could bring it to special forces. Again, there's always
a plan and then there's the execution with honesty and integrity.
That's that's crucial. But it is a team and everybody
(21:53):
needs to be aligned in doing the same things. If
the defenders don't want to play, We've seen it in
also supports teams where peop people don't want to play
aligned with it and they just creates a week team,
doesn't it.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
Yeah, well, yeah, absolutely, And what comes to mind? You
talk to me, Michael, because I've been in this journey.
One of the last companies I was working with before
I started to your business, we went I was a
woman on small business and we went from she wanted
to do to a million in revenue. She started the
company in twenty twelve. I came there in twenty eighteen,
which we did and then we went to two million
the next year and then four million and seven million.
(22:27):
What we had was, as you understand that business life cycle,
different challenges, different problems, and so the way that you
play the game, if you will, is a little different,
and you might have to move positions, perhaps too, you
might have been maybe doing one thing. And oftentimes when
we're smaller companies, we're playing a lot of these roles
positions because there aren't enough players, right, we don't have
(22:48):
enough people to cover, you know, we don't have enough.
So but you know, speak a little bit more clone.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, speak.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
A little bit to that. That journey of a business.
It doesn't matter whether you know, like I said, ten
million to twenty million, it's not a one to one,
like your skill like, there's different things and different problems
that come up, right.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
Yeah, And I suppose it's like a team getting promoted
from the second division to the first division. Suddenly we're
playing a different game. We're playing, we're playing in a
different marketplace, we're playing at a different level. And and
and I think one of the one of the areas
that I think it comes home most when we're talking
(23:26):
about people is that you need to think strategically about
your people. Because if you're going to go from ten
million to twenty million, a ten million organization looks like this,
a twenty million organization looks completely different. And what you've
got to look at is you've got to assess your players,
your team members, and you've got to go right when
we're twenty million, we're going to need a head of operations.
(23:49):
Currently that that falls under the managing director, but at
some point we're going to need a head of operation.
Do we need to bring that expertise in or is
there somebody that could step up? And suddenly you're starting
to look strategically at what your people plan it and
whether there's training that needs to be done. But you're
planning forward and thinking forward about about your team. It's
(24:12):
absolutely great if you could give somebody, but if you're
not careful, you could have somebody that was that was
packing boxes and in three years suddenly the head of
operations because the business grows so fast, and have they
been given all the tools that they need to succeed
in that role. It doesn't mean that they can't do it,
but we need to make sure that we're invested in
(24:33):
those and that is whoever's responsible for HR or people
needs to be looking at the people and how we
develop the people and so you know, the seniors learning skills,
et cetera, et cetera a crucial But you're having a
conversation about it that says, operations, where is it going
in the next twelve months, two years, three years, and
(24:55):
what are the challenge is going to be? So what
do we need to do in this quarter, in next quarter?
What will we do in q Q three and two four.
You're consciously having the conversation rather than reactively going, well,
we've promoted, we promoted Phil and he's not up to
(25:15):
the job. And it's not Fiel's fault if he's not
at the training and he was packing boxes six months
ago and he's out of operations, he doesn't know, doesn't
So yeah, that's the that's I've profinitely works for me.
Speaker 1 (25:31):
I've definitely seen that, Michael. And again that's why I
love having you on the podcast or in the business
rounding a podcast. By the way, you guys are listening
to this, Michael, Stuart and I are connected on LinkedIn.
We're going to make sure you can access to his
website and all that good stuff in our show notes
and if you have comments or feedback, please drop it
in there wherever you find us, whether it's YouTube, LinkedIn, Spotify, whatever,
(25:52):
the whatever the podcast platform it is, so Michael can
respond to you. But to your point, Michael, I think
having you on the podcast is again looking at those
things and saying, look, I know you love this particular person.
They've been with your company for so many years and
they do really well at this position, but they're struggling here,
and what is it that they need, whether it's leadership training,
(26:15):
sales training, is it technically need some other technical skill
that they don't have because there's something new in the marketplace.
You know what is that you're looking at that or
you know in helping them, That's what I hear you say,
Michael too. We're in a very interesting market right now.
We're recording this here in the end of twenty twenty five,
where you know, there's been lots of ups and downs
and volatility, and I know you've been exploring some new
(26:37):
places helping entrepreneurs. Look where are their new marketplaces? Where
can I go in the world to reach folks that
need my product or service, and so helping unlock them
and get out of their own way, right Michael of like, hey,
envisioning what could be? But I think sometimes we're our
own works enemies and we need somebody else to help
unpack that for us and say, look, you know, where
(26:59):
are you where are your greatest strengths? Where can you
really help the business grow and thrive and get in
that lane and get out of the position in which
you're really not having that great of impact. But I
think sometimes as good especially we're smaller, or there's you know,
fiefdoms are other things that we're holding onto things and
it's not really it's not helping the business, and we
need somebody to come in and look at that like
(27:20):
a doctor. I feel like Michael, you're diagnosing some things right,
and you're unlocking and then you're saying, look, this is
not work, this is not working. Is this really what
you want? You know, getting clear on where do you
want to go? Right?
Speaker 2 (27:34):
I think there's a couple of things that you raise there.
So the first thing is that ultimately a business owner
needs to make themselves redundant so that they can so
that the business can operate without them all the wise
they're going on holiday and coming back to a pile
of stuff, and stuff doesn't happen if everything needs to
go through them, So that that's part of it. The
(27:55):
other thing that you touched on was when somebody is
falling short, let's say, falling short in their role, but
that may be not necessarily their fault. It could be
that we've promoted them too fast, too soon, and we've
not given them a support. So I think it's important
that we're conscious in the way that we talk about
(28:17):
the people and promote the people. And hence why you know,
somebody thinking strategically about the people's going to be looking
at the transformation of the business and not just the
transactional stuff. Have we got a staff, handbookers, ever, we
have an appraisal, etcetera, etcetera. You've got to be thinking
about how are the people transforming and how do I
(28:37):
transform the people? And literally I was in my SDN
group today and somebody did the three minute teacher and
they were talking about creating a culture of learning in
a business. Not just once a month we're going to
do a piece of learning. You know, how do we
facilitate that in so many ways? You know, and you
used to hear about Google being able empowering people to
(28:58):
go and do their passion project, but also you know,
to learn and whilst they're on the job and to
better themselves because better employees are going to be better
for the business. So there's a support about what do
I need to what do I need to do to
help you thrive in your role. I think if people
are struggling in the role, you're going to work through
(29:18):
how can I help it so you can thrive in
your role. But ultimately, if this isn't the right role
for them, they're probably struggling with it as much as
you are. And I always think that the conversation is
the conversation can often be you know what, that's a
weight off. I didn't want to come to you and
say that I can't do this or not up to this,
(29:41):
or I don't know what I'm doing. But often it
can be a very cathartic thing for them as much
as the business, if you like. And so externally, I
look and I think the benefit of putting somebody external
into your businesses that they're going to ask all those
questions and they're gonna challenge the things that you've got.
(30:04):
I need to deal with that, but I've just got
too much on my plate today, and they're going to
bring them into focus and we're going to go we're
going to deal with that. And and I know the
business owner will hold somebody accountable for dealing with the
issues that that hey, everything's not always about issues and
Sometimes it can be positive where you say we want
to do this, but you know, because I like to
(30:26):
position it, I do a kind of session say where
where I say complete this sentence. Wouldn't it be great
if rather than where are the problems? Wouldn't it be great?
If wouldn't be great if it didn't take us as
long to pick an order from it from the warehouse?
Wouldn't it be great if we didn't have the same
amount staff turnover? The positive way of thinking about it,
(30:47):
and we go, okay, staff turnover plastaghr. The people responsible
for people go, there's a thing that we have. How
are you going to solve that? And when are you
going to come back with what you're going to imploy
meant to make that not be the case anymore? How
are you going to solve it? Report back to us
and again you can see how that could be something.
By the end of Q one, I want a plan
(31:08):
in place. So you've got the first month you're going
to start to do some employee survey, then going to
come back two when you're going to report what what
that comes back and what you think the plan needs
to be by the end of queues, by the end
of not Q two months two. By the end of
month three, we've got that in place, and suddenly there's
an issue that was an issue that is now solved
(31:29):
and we have a better business that we had before
and that could have an impact on profitability, couldn't it?
Speaker 1 (31:35):
Just oh one hundred percent? I love that you said.
You know, the tithes to my philosophy at Stewardi. Your
businesses leadership is stewardship. It's about serving others so that
they can thrive. Like you said, so we're we're if
we're looking at everybody's best interesting mine in the long term,
our clients, we will win in the long long term.
It's like, you know, you know, so I here totally
(31:56):
said what if we could do this? How about have
we thought about that? And turning it on his head
a little bit and saying, oh, yeah, we could. I
didn't think about that, you know. And I love working
with business owners that have that mentality and like they're, oh,
I didn't, I didn't. I didn't even know I can
consider that. And you're you're you're you're opening them to
see possibilities. And I love what you're doing too. In
the international space. Michael of creating a place for folks
(32:20):
that I didn't even know. I didn't even think about
going outside of my home country, you know, and reaching
people and like how could I help? Yeah, And I think,
you know, for those that are listening, it could be intimidating,
but you have an advocate here, somebody that's helping you
and saying, asking the questions, opening up the possibilities of
what could be. And I think that's amazing because you know,
(32:40):
you have a certain skills and abilities and insights that
you're bringing to your clients and helping them. Michael, And
I think that's I hope that as people are listening
to the podcasts are like saying, okay, well, I didn't
know where to start. I didn't even know that there
was a business growth planner or person out there that
would be able to help me in my business. I
don't even know where where.
Speaker 2 (32:59):
We begin, you know.
Speaker 1 (33:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
So I think in the in the times that we've
got oh sorry, sorry, go.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
On, Michael, and the times we got.
Speaker 2 (33:14):
Okay, I think I think the thing for me is
that in the economic times that we've got in UK,
we've got fairly static market at the moment we all
know in the US we've got the tariffs and how
that's affecting it. You know, we had Mark Carney talking
to the UN or doing the press conference after the
UN conference, where he's saying, you know that Canada needs
(33:36):
to start looking east west rather than north south. You know, Okay,
overseas markets could be no risk, they could deem risk
you being only in one market in the same way
as being concentrated in only one client is not great
in a business concentrated in one market and going to
a new market doesn't mean you have to employ twenty people.
(33:59):
In an new market. You could find an agent, you
could find a distributor. You can buy a company that's
already operating in that marketplace that's got some market share already,
and maybe that would be a collaboration. You could just
have a joint venture with somebody that's complemented to you.
So there's ways that you can do it. And I
think certainly I've done some work with a mutual friend.
(34:24):
We've got where we've put together this methodology we call
Passport to Growth, and that really is how can we
bring the expertise that we have. I've got clients that
are selling in fifty countries David partner in this. He's
taking businesses international, multiple businesses international and internew markets, creating
(34:48):
businesses that are more more valuable as a consequence of it.
What we've done is we've looked at it and gone, right, Okay,
if you're an entrepreneur or you're a business owner, you're busy,
you're not sat doing nothing thing right, you may not
have sold internationally. So how can we take you step
by step on a journey to understand whether it's an
(35:09):
opportunity for you. So when we talk about business growth
plans and we talk about well, where's growth is going
to come from? That could be international markets, and we
and we have a way that we kind of take
people on that journey. But I could be a whole
new a the podcasting.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
Have you come back on the podcast, Michael, and maybe
we'll have David David Holman come on too. But you know,
this has been a blast to have you here. I
know we're wrapp getting up toward the end of our
time together today, you know, but what I love that
you bring this approach about how you get a business
really winning with clarity and purpose. Obviously, you know we
have the shared passion of getting the teams aligned and
(35:45):
believing in that. You know, I really feel like culture
and strategy are kind of two sides of us the
same coin. If we get them aligned, we can build
that momentum. That's why I love having on the podcast
as not just a guest, but obnesotly a contributor, a
collaborator with me and how things do with your business
grow and reaching other companies. This is Michael and I are,
you know, looking for ways that we can help more
(36:06):
of you out there our listeners, UH, come alongside you
as trusted advisors, guidance consultants. As we wrap up the podcast,
Michael and we've covered a lot of different things here today,
what would you say to those people that are listening,
whether that's the business owner or maybe as somebody else
in the company that says, I want to help this
company grow and there's maybe there's a breakdown of strategy,
(36:29):
a breakdown of the of the plan of understanding. What
would you say to that person as are listening that
they should take action on what you know? Wh Where
would you direct them?
Speaker 2 (36:41):
I think I think we have talked to a whole
range of things. I've talked about all the eleven areas
you might not be the eleven areas. We've talked about
mission vision values, we've talked about team members, we've talked
about personal development. I think I think the thing for
me is that the the businesses that have been successful
that I've been part of where I've worked as a
(37:04):
consultant or fresnel, they're very willing to have honest conversations
and they're very willing to challenge. And I think that's
a strength of SME, smaller businesses, SME, SMB wherewever you
want to describe them. And I know I have a
friend's that's left the army and gone to work in
(37:24):
a big, big corporate and he is absolutely amazed at
the positioning and the corporate politics that are going on.
You've got a business, get good people around you and
it will be amazed. If you're a business owner, you'd
be amazed what your team can do if you involve
them in the conversation. You don't have to have all
(37:45):
the answers making a training thing, but say I'm interested,
what do you think about? And that's an open question.
Tell me what you think about, Tell me what you
think about, Explain what you mean by this, Tell me
more about that, and you're starting to roll over those rocks.
And even if you just yourself ran a session that
(38:08):
was right, here's a piece of paper we're going to
write on here. Wouldn't it be great if and you
complete those things? How would our business be better at
the end of the year that it will be at
the start of the year. We're not doing anything massively strategically,
but at least we're opening up the conversation. And then
when you need somebody to facilitate the business planning, you
(38:28):
know where I come across.
Speaker 1 (38:30):
There you go, there you go, Michael, thank you so
much for being here. I love that. Yeah, go have
those honest conversations. And if you're not having and them,
then yeah, that's definitely should be a warning bell. But
go have those honest conversations. I think if they're powerful,
don't be afraid of them. Lean into them. Like you're saying, Michael,
have the conversations. Bring in somebody like Michael that can
look and have and look at where you're at, give
(38:52):
you real feedback. Make sure you guys connect with Michael
on LinkedIn, reach out to him. I'll make sure, like
I said, you guys can connect with him on our
show notes, thank you so much for being here, Michael,
A real pleasure having you.
Speaker 2 (39:06):
Lovely great, always great to have a conversation. David. We'll
speak again soon, i'm sure.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
Thank you everybody, Thanks for listening to everybody. Until next time,
be well and we'll see you out here. Back on
the Business Round People podcast
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