The Villisca Axe Murders: A Chillworthy x Chambers of the Occult Collaboration

In this special crossover event, Chillworthy's Brent and Talia join forces with Kai and J from Chambers of the Occult to tackle one of the most chilling unsolved cases in American history: the Villisca Axe Murders of 1912.

In the quiet town of Villisca, Iowa, eight people—including six children—were found brutally murdered in their beds. Over a century later, the crime remains steeped in mystery, theories, and whispers of the supernatural. Together, our hosts dive deep into the facts of that horrific night, the strange clues left behind, the prime suspects that law enforcement pursued (and the ones they missed), and the eerie legends that have kept the Moore house a hotspot for paranormal investigators to this day.

Brent and Talia bring their signature deep-dive storytelling and psychological insight, while Kai and J lend their expertise in occult history, lore, and all things that go bump in the night. Expect an intense discussion filled with historical context, true crime analysis, paranormal speculation, and a few chills along the way.

Was it the work of a mad drifter? A spurned lover? A religious zealot?



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DISCLAIMER The content presented on Chillworthy, including all episodes, transcripts, social media posts, and associated materials, is intended for informational and entertainment purposes only. The podcast does not offer legal, medical, psychological, or professional advice of any kind. While the hosts—Brent and Talia—make a good faith effort to ensure that the information shared is based on publicly available sources and is as accurate as possible at the time of recording, Chillworthy does not guarantee the completeness, timeliness, or reliability of any statements made. Listeners should be aware that cases may involve ongoing legal proceedings or developments that evolve over time. The hosts are not licensed attorneys, journalists, law enforcement professionals, or forensic experts. Opinions expressed in the podcast reflect the personal views of the hosts and do not represent factual determinations or official findings. All individuals named or discussed are presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Any resemblance to real individuals or entities, outside of those explicitly named, is purely coincidental. The podcast is not affiliated with or endorsed by any legal authority, news outlet, or investigative body. By listening to Chillworthy, you acknowledge and accept these terms and agree not to hold the hosts or producers liable for any inaccuracies, misstatements, or interpretations derived from the content.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:08):
You're listening to Chillworthy.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
A podcast we're two best friends discuss mysteries, murders, and
anything in between for your enjoyment.

Speaker 1 (00:16):
So if you're ready to hear some chilling and unsettling cases,
you're in the right place, happy listening. Hello, Hello, everybody,
Welcome back to another episode of Chillworthy with Brent and Talia.
Hi everybody, how are you doing today?

Speaker 2 (00:37):
I'm fabulous? How are you?

Speaker 1 (00:40):
I am great? So we have a special episode today.
We have two guests and we are doing another podcast collab.
So yes, so on with us are Kai and Jay.
So say hello to the Chillers please.

Speaker 3 (01:02):
Guys, I'm kind.

Speaker 1 (01:06):
And they are from the podcast Chambers of the Occult.

Speaker 3 (01:10):
Chillers is such a great name for your listeners. By
the way, it's well, thank you off the tongue.

Speaker 4 (01:17):
Did you come up with that or did they name themselves?

Speaker 1 (01:21):
They don't talk to us, Come on, yes's mom will
talk to you. We do have a few people who
like will comment, but honestly, like they're they're not very vocal,
but we love them to audience interaction.

Speaker 2 (01:42):
But they're vocal in the way of like being very
supportive and complimentary, but in terms of like interacting, specifically
when we'll bring up a topic and ask them to
pretty shy in that way.

Speaker 1 (01:54):
Yeah is a very word. Yes, like we believe they're
out there, but you know, like.

Speaker 3 (02:01):
We're getting some downloads, so it must be we are
you are.

Speaker 4 (02:07):
Surveys, but they won't comment.

Speaker 3 (02:11):
Him.

Speaker 1 (02:13):
We just came up with that name after the chill
worthy title came to be so. But speaking of that,
we wanted to ask you guys, like give us a
little bit of you know, what your podcast vibe is
all about? When you started, like what's going on?

Speaker 4 (02:33):
Honestly, I took a piece of paper and I wrote
down name after name after name after name until something
stood out. And Chambers of the Occult was the only
thing that stood out. And I was like, cool, am
I going to be tired of this name? And after

(02:55):
a couple of days, I was like, I'm not tired
of it. I was like, I think that's the name.
That's what it was.

Speaker 1 (03:01):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (03:02):
What I like to tell everybody who asks is that
this is Jay's brainchild. You know, this was his idea
for a long time. He simply plucked me and dragged
me onto the show and it's been a great experience
so far.

Speaker 1 (03:17):
Very nice.

Speaker 4 (03:19):
That is a great way to put it, because I mean,
the only thing I came up with, what was the
name the whole podcast. It's Kay and I, but the
name was just like cool.

Speaker 3 (03:29):
Yeah, So I'd say our vibe is also in sort
of the true crime serious but silly type of realm.
You know, we cover the serious topics, but we've also
got lots of humor, lots of band t there. We
try to keep it lighthearted when we can, and you know,
get a little deeper if we need to. But I

(03:53):
think a way that we differ a little from you
guys is that we're not purely true crime on our podcast.
Shade talking about that.

Speaker 4 (04:00):
Yeah, we do both true crime and paranormal. We actually
met working at a haunted house.

Speaker 3 (04:08):
We've been.

Speaker 4 (04:10):
House as tour guides. Okay, after a while, I was like, hey,
do you want to do a podcast?

Speaker 3 (04:20):
Sure? Yeah, Okay, basically when do we start? Yeah?

Speaker 4 (04:25):
And then we put it off for a while because
we wanted to sert in person. And then twenty twenty
four started and we're just like, might as well start
like remotely.

Speaker 3 (04:35):
And still we did.

Speaker 1 (04:36):
Hell yeah and awesome.

Speaker 4 (04:38):
Yeah, it has been so We're excited to be you today.

Speaker 3 (04:41):
Thank you guys.

Speaker 1 (04:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (04:42):
Yeah, so we have that little passion for paranormal true crime,
but we come with that little like different point of
view because we actually work like in a quote unquote
haunted house, right yeah.

Speaker 3 (04:57):
Right, yeah, which is funny because I'm really skeptical. Yeah
you'll you'll hear it. So I feel like I give
a good balance in lots of ways.

Speaker 4 (05:06):
Yeah, okay, Well, and I'm the type of person that
would die first in a horror movie.

Speaker 2 (05:15):
Are you going up the stairs?

Speaker 4 (05:17):
I am walking deeper into the basement. Yeah, I have
walked deeper into the basement.

Speaker 5 (05:27):
So yeah, yeah, yeah, so that's a little bit about us.

Speaker 1 (05:35):
Yeah, okay, well, I mean awesome, and you know, we're
very happy to have you. So just for the chillers,
how it's gonna work is, you know, Talia and I,
neither one of us are going to be presenting anything.
Kay and j are going to be telling us something.
So this will be nice because now neither Talia nor
I know what the topic is.

Speaker 3 (05:59):
Keeps it interesting.

Speaker 1 (06:00):
So unless Talia has any objections, I say take it
away absolutely.

Speaker 2 (06:06):
Get ready for a million questions and exclamations.

Speaker 4 (06:10):
Great.

Speaker 3 (06:14):
All right, Well, let me set the tone a bit.
You know, we always like to get right into it.
So you guys know that sounds you know when an
old house settles at night, the creaky floorboards, the wind,
you know, knocking on the glass, distant tick of a

(06:36):
clock in the distance. Now, imagine you're in a small
town in Iowa. It's nineteen twelve. A family of six
and two young house guests are asleep upstairs, and by morning,
every last one of them will be dead. Yikes, bludgeoned, mutilated,

(07:06):
their faces unrecognizable, and their killer completely gone, vanished, no trace.
Now we cover ghost stories on our podcast, but this
isn't a ghost story. This is the veliska Ax murders.

Speaker 6 (07:29):
All right, So if you'd like to go for it, Ja,
So before we talk about the terror that unfolded inside
the house of the corner of Second Street and Josiah Street,
let's talk a little bit about who lived in the house.

Speaker 4 (07:45):
Who they were. It's the more family, and they were
just like any other family. There were a devoted family
that was composed of Josiah B. Moore. He was forty
three years old. He was a respected businessman. He ran
a successful farm that was an equipment store in the town,

(08:08):
and he had made a name for himself, though not
without stepping on a few toes in the process. But
to most people, Josiah was a kind, hard working man
with big laugh and a bigger heart. His wife, Sarah
Montgomery Moore, was thirty nine. She was the image of

(08:28):
community spirit. She was deeply involved in the Presbyterian Church,
especially in the Children's State program, which she helped organize
every year. She was self spoken but strong, and her
love for her family was obvious to anyone that knew her.
And together they had four children. Herman who was eleven.

(08:49):
He was described as smart, curious, and always full of energy. Catherine,
who was ten years old. She was described as sweet, sharp,
and already showing signs of leadership. Boyd who was seven.
He was mischievous in a way that only middle children
can be. And then Paul, the baby, who was just

(09:14):
five years old, always running to keep up with his siblings.

Speaker 3 (09:20):
So they were honestly one of the model families of
this small town in Valliska, Iowa. Well liked, you know,
devoted in their faith, and they had a really good
family going for them. They were involved in the community.
They were involved in their church right and just like
any other Sunday, this Sunday, June ninth, nineteen twelve, it

(09:46):
was supposed to be really just another perfect day. The
morning began like all of the other ones. They got
dressed in their Sunday best. They walked to church, beautiful
service as always. More family by the way, m O
r E. So like more I don't know. So they

(10:12):
go to church. But this wasn't just any ordinary day,
like Jay said, it was Children's Day. It was super
exciting for them. That night there would be a special
children's Day program. It was a beloved tradition in Veliska
where the kids actually took the center stage there at
the church. Sarah, the mother, had worked hard organizing it

(10:38):
and the more children were excited to perform. They sang,
they recited their verses, they smiled as the congregation and
all the audience, you know, clapped and cheered them on.
Also performing that night, though, were two sisters from a
local family as well, Lena and Na Stillinger, ages twelve

(11:01):
and eight respectively. We probably will stumble over the names.
Lena and Na Yeah a lot very similar. And my sisters, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (11:15):
It's like the last episode, Johnny John John Johnny.

Speaker 3 (11:22):
Yes, hopefully we don't have another yell up situation. Oh,
he struggled.

Speaker 2 (11:35):
Man, I love that you just said that.

Speaker 1 (11:44):
You did go. Yeah, it was rock freaking rock and listen.
I mean you I feel like, and I mean tell
you if you disagree with this, but I don't think
you will. I feel like we're both captivated because you
both have very good pacing as you tell a story.
Oh yeah, yeah, I'm like, I'm like, you know, because
we have done a collab before where we were jumping

(12:06):
in and talking and I'm just like, I'm just fixating
like it sounds. I mean, yeah, you have a very
both of you have a very good like narration voice
of just like all right, everybody sit down and listen.

Speaker 3 (12:19):
So cool feeling, think about that. Yeah, you feel free
to jump in at any time. Cut us off, please,
We you know, sometimes we like to hear ourselves talk

(12:40):
a little too much.

Speaker 4 (12:41):
Sometimes each other.

Speaker 3 (12:48):
Anyway, Lena and Nina still injured girls. They were friends
of Catherine the young daughter. They're the more family, like
I said, sweet girls from like a name bring farm family.
They planned to go home after their service, but Sarah
the mom of the more family invited them over to stay.

(13:09):
Last minute decision. You know, their parents agreed under the
condition that, of course they return early Monday morning the
next day to help with their chores. But this decision
would become a central point of heartbreak in the days
to come.

Speaker 4 (13:31):
Yeah, after the service that ended at nine point thirty,
the eight of them would walk home under the dim
light of a warm June evening. The neighbors saw them chatting, smiling,
holding hands, and then they stepped inside their white house
just before ten pm. It was a quiet night, just

(13:54):
a typical sunday, just winding down. Lights flickered off one
by one, the house grew still, And of course, no
one could have known that it would be the last
night that any of them would ever be seen.

Speaker 3 (14:12):
Really the last night that you know, they would ever
get to experience. And of course we'll get right into that,
but that's what made this really heartbreaking. It was simply
a family filled with joy. We're going home to spend
the night to with each other, have a sleepover if
you will, Yeah, oh yeah, wow, check out the club on.

Speaker 2 (14:45):
Some similarities.

Speaker 3 (14:50):
So that night went great. They had a fun night together.
They all settled down for the night and the morning
of June tenth, nineteen twelve. The next day, it began
like any other Mary Peckham. It was the Moor's next
door neighbor. She was up early, you know, she tended

(15:11):
her garden, swept her porch, just like any other day.
But as the morning creeped on, she did notice something
pretty odd. The moor house had not stirred, not a sound,
no sound of children laughing, no clanging of breakfast plates,

(15:31):
no one out to feed the chickens. So by seven
am Mary was pretty concerned. She crossed the yard, knocked
on the front door. No answer. She knocked again, nothing,
and she kept on trying. You know it was it

(15:52):
was locked. It was unusual for the family that had
so that had no reason to keep out their neighbors.
It was a small town. A lot of people left
their doors unlocked. Really, so I'm kill me.

Speaker 2 (16:09):
I don't like the sound.

Speaker 1 (16:10):
She doesn't go for that at all.

Speaker 2 (16:12):
No, I was thinking, okay, nineteen twelve, like that makes sense,
But people still do that today. No, I could.

Speaker 5 (16:21):
Not.

Speaker 1 (16:22):
I mean, I have a first hand account of what
happens when you don't lock the door, because I told
the story on our very first episode okay, thirty five
episodes ago about but when Talia and I were talking
about our phobias, she brought up somebody coming into your house.

(16:42):
And I, of course she already knew this story, but
I retold it about I was sitting on this very
couch I'm on right now, broad daylight, like two PM,
and I live by myself, and I was watching TV,
and all of a sudden I heard the screen door open.

Speaker 3 (17:01):
Oh God.

Speaker 1 (17:03):
And to keep in mind that I get my like,
my mail comes through a slotch so the mailman will
open the screen door to put the mail through the
mail slots. So like, that's not that crazy, but it
did get a little crazier. Or when then the front
door just opens up, okay, and with a random man

(17:28):
just walks in and I looked at him, and he
looked at me, and I I'm laying there on the
couch and I just said hello.

Speaker 7 (17:39):
And.

Speaker 1 (17:42):
He just looked at me and then slowly backed out
of the house. And obviously he had the wrong house
because I live on a block of ten homes that
are identical looking. Okay, got it, So, but you know,
I mean, it was a little unsettling for up moment,
but right, so you know, but that's what can happen

(18:05):
if you don't lock your door, you or worse. For
the most part, yeah, for the most part.

Speaker 3 (18:13):
So I I have like on my door there's the
top like turn lock, and there's also the normal door
knob knock right lock. Sometimes I won't lock the top
one and only lock the bottom one. One time I
walked out and I accidentally locked myself out of the house,
and I was like, no, I don't have my keys,
but I had my wallet which had my cards in it,

(18:36):
and I managed to just like shimmy my card in
between the lock, and the door just popped right open.
Ship And I was like, it's that easy. I was like,
it's that easy.

Speaker 2 (18:52):
So absolutely.

Speaker 7 (18:59):
Tomorrow someone else, if there's a big enough gap and
you can get something like stiff in there, it just
pushes open the wedge keeping the door closed.

Speaker 3 (19:12):
She just opens right up.

Speaker 1 (19:13):
That's not good.

Speaker 4 (19:20):
Try.

Speaker 1 (19:27):
But I just thought that would be a good time
to tell that story.

Speaker 3 (19:29):
But oh that was great. But yeah, Mary was concerned.
So she did what any good neighbor would do. Uh,
She'd let out their chickens.

Speaker 2 (19:44):
Business.

Speaker 3 (19:45):
Yeah, She's like, all right, I guess they're sleeping. Let
me let me help them out a little bit. They
had a long night. She did some chores around their house,
you know. She lingered on their porch waiting for some
sign of life, but there wasn't one.

Speaker 4 (20:02):
So that's when she called Ross Moore, who was Josiah's brother,
because something was wrong. She said, something wasn't right. Ross
arrived around eight fifteen am and he tried the door.
Still locked, so he used his own key or a

(20:25):
credit card or credit card. So that's when Ross stepped inside,
but Mary stayed behind. A few moments later, Ross stumbled outside.
His face was pale, and he told Mary to call
the town marshall.

Speaker 3 (20:45):
So Marshall Hank Corton was the primary peace officer of Alliska.
Once again with the alliterative names. I'm sensing a theme,
and Hank Corton primary officer there. He was the first
officer on scene. By eight thirty am, he had arrived

(21:07):
at the more residents greeted by, of course, the obviously
shaken up Ross More. Ross didn't seek much. He simply
pointed toward the parlor. Marshall Horton stepped inside and he
continued through it was quiet. He pushed open the door
to the downstairs guest bedroom and that's when he saw them.

(21:31):
Lena and Nina, still injure the overnight guests. Their bodies
lay on the bed, blankets pulled over their heads, soaked
with blood. A gray coat covered part of the scene,
and beside the bed was an axe, bloodied, abandoned, its

(21:55):
handle slick with dried crimson. It's left behind as if
the killer had no further use for it, or simply
no fear of being found.

Speaker 4 (22:08):
The girls had been bludgeon repeatedly with the blunt side
of the axe. It was so violent, violent in fact,
that the blood had spattered and reached the walls and ceiling.
There were signs that Lena had awakened during the attack.
Maybe she tried to fight back. Yep, she had a

(22:31):
defensive wound on her arm, and worse, she had been
moved positioned even after her death to expose her under arms,
had been.

Speaker 3 (22:45):
Removed, her under garments.

Speaker 4 (22:47):
Under garments, Yeah, thank you, I was.

Speaker 1 (22:49):
Gonna say what.

Speaker 4 (22:51):
Had been removed? Okay, So that's when authorities would speculate
for years on whether she was assaulted or if this
was posted in some twisted ritual. Either way, it was
clear that this was not random because there was rage
behind it.

Speaker 2 (23:09):
Yeah, this is so horrific, and we're only at two people,
like we have a whole family. Yep, this is mind boggling.

Speaker 1 (23:19):
Were the guests right, right?

Speaker 4 (23:22):
They were not even supposed to be there that night?

Speaker 3 (23:24):
They weren't. It's it's really sad because the Stylinger family,
they the two of them, so they had their two
dollars daughters, Lena and Nina. They passed away in nineteen twelve.
Of course because of this, they also had a young boy.
I don't believe he grew to be very old. But

(23:44):
their son also passed away in nineteen twelve, so they
lost their children in the same year. The Cylinger family,
it's really rough.

Speaker 2 (23:55):
Oh yeah, nightmare, complete nightmare.

Speaker 3 (23:58):
Yeah. But Marshall Horton, you know, didn't stop there, right,
There was more to this house. He moved upstairs first
to the master bedroom. There he found Josiah and Sarah Moore,
the parents. Their faces were so disfigured that it was

(24:24):
tough to even identify them, and it was a bastard bedroom.
Their body placement, that's that's really how they figured it out.
Blood was everywhere, and if you were to look up,
you would actually see the gouges in the ceiling from
when the axe was brought up and then swung back down.

(24:44):
There was that much force. Wow, they got raised that
high end of the air that there were holes in
the ceiling.

Speaker 2 (24:51):
It also makes me wonder, like, I don't know obviously
like ceiling distance in homes in nineteen twelve, but you
would think too that the like assailant would have been
on the taller side. Like of course what you're saying
with the force too, but like if it was something
like I'm super super short, I'm nowhere near this, you
know what I mean. Like, I just wonder if it
was someone who was on the taller side, if.

Speaker 4 (25:15):
It could have also been like on the bed as well.

Speaker 1 (25:18):
Oh yeah, I had thought about that, hmm, because I
was going to say, my house was built in the
nineteen twenties, and I mean they're like eight foot or no,
like ten foot tall like ceilings. So so I don't
know what you know, if that if that time period,

(25:39):
what the dimensions exactly were, But but yeah, I mean
standing I could have I could only imagine standing up
on a bed trying to get more like heft into
the swing or something.

Speaker 3 (25:52):
Yeah, like one of the just like the final blow.
Just terrible think about So that was only the master bedroom.
Those were the parents. There was the children's room, Herman, Catherine,
Boyd and Paul. All four murdered in their beds, blankets

(26:13):
drawn over their faces. No one had stirred, no one
had escaped.

Speaker 4 (26:22):
And the investigation into the veliska axe murder murders began
the very same morning. Marshall Horton cleared the house and
he called for the coroner as the As he began,
as he investigated, further more, odd details started to reveal himselves.

(26:42):
The mirrors were covered, untouched food and body and untouched
food and bloody water left in the kitchen.

Speaker 1 (26:53):
Bloody water, Like what do you mean by that?

Speaker 3 (26:56):
Uh? Go ahead, I think it was like there was
food on a plate and there was also just water
from a cup that was like spilled over on its side,
and it was bloody.

Speaker 4 (27:10):
Like the killer was comfortable enough to grab a snack afterwards, okay, yea,
and even.

Speaker 2 (27:15):
Like the stuff like the appetite.

Speaker 3 (27:17):
Ugh, just even think about that after committing this.

Speaker 2 (27:23):
And you're sticking around, like, let me make a freaking
sandwich meanwhile, like not even trying to like scurry out
of there.

Speaker 4 (27:29):
Yeah to that sandwich comment, there was also a slab
of bacon late next axe.

Speaker 2 (27:36):
I'm sorry, next to the axe yep.

Speaker 3 (27:40):
Like it was taken out of the fridge and just
hanging out with Lena and na.

Speaker 4 (27:45):
Yeah, I don't know if he was saving it for
later or he was going to eat.

Speaker 2 (27:53):
Unbelievable. I can't believe he left it behind. I mean,
it is gracious.

Speaker 3 (27:59):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (28:00):
Yeah, Well, I'm also struck by the fact that from
what you have both reported, now, like this man went
into the house is killing people one by one, but
besides one of the two downstairs, nobody like wakes up
to I don't know. I mean, I guess if somebody

(28:21):
is doing it in the way you're talking about, like
probably one blow each is going to do that person in,
so they're not necessarily gonna be yelling or something. But
you would think that there would at least be a
noise of with such force. I don't know. That's crazy.

Speaker 4 (28:41):
It will also later be determined that the murder killed
the parents, Josiah and Sarah, and then kill the kids
and then went back into the master bedroom to deal
even more damage.

Speaker 3 (28:58):
Yeah, so it was with investigation, like the doctors, a
small little detail. So in the master bedroom there was
a shoe that had filled with blood and then it
got knocked over. So the initial attack on the parents
is what dropped that shoe, and then they left for

(29:20):
the kids, came back into the master bedroom, hit them
even more and knocked over that now blood filled shoe
to smell more blood everywhere.

Speaker 4 (29:32):
Yeah, and Sarah was the only victim where the sharp
side of the axe was used.

Speaker 1 (29:40):
M h mm.

Speaker 4 (29:42):
Everyone else was just blood and body.

Speaker 2 (29:45):
Yeah. That stands out to me, like, I feel like
that wasn't a coolin.

Speaker 3 (29:49):
Yes, it does. I don't know how I would explain it,
Like there's I guess almost using the blunt side of
the act would be more aggressive. You know, it's more brutal.

Speaker 1 (30:02):
Right, I think, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (30:05):
So I wanted to give a quicker death to Sarah
or something. I M not sure that's the only.

Speaker 4 (30:11):
Way I see it. The doctors, may I say, I'm
so sorry, No, go ahead.

Speaker 2 (30:18):
I was just I was just gonna say, for nineteen twelve,
I'm so impressed with the level of detail, how quickly
they got on this, Like how much was done right
out of the gate when you think like comparing it
to cases like so many that we've covered at least
where oh yes day, oh my gosh, so disappointing and

(30:39):
like it's just crazy to me the difference and what
era this was, how many years ago? That's just it's
crazy to me. Anyway.

Speaker 4 (30:47):
Yeah, was it the amount of detailed the amount of
records that they were able to like keep, Yeah, yeah, I.

Speaker 3 (30:54):
Think overall it's just like, you know, it was a
small town. They had one police officer their main way,
so he managed to show up. Yeah, showed up in
like fifteen minutes, just sitting there eating his donut, like
got somewhere to do.

Speaker 2 (31:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (31:17):
The doctor is also determined that the murders happened between
midnight and five am, but something worse, something sinister, something chilworthy,
was discovered.

Speaker 1 (31:36):
Ooh there, do let them.

Speaker 4 (31:42):
Know what it was.

Speaker 1 (31:43):
Kai.

Speaker 3 (31:44):
Yeah. So the at a catch of the house showed
signs that had been recently been disturbed. A bit of
the dust was displaced, there were some slight traces of footsteps,
and in the attic there were two cigarette butts smoked cigarettes.

(32:08):
Could that have been where the killer emerged from. Was
the killer inside the house before the family ever returned home?

Speaker 1 (32:17):
Yeah, that's nuts.

Speaker 2 (32:20):
In the attic, and for who knows how long?

Speaker 3 (32:22):
Right exactly? Waiting for hours? Right, who knows. It's pretty
common to leave your doors unlocked back then, So yeah.

Speaker 1 (32:34):
Pretty bold to be smoking up there, though with the smell.

Speaker 2 (32:38):
Maybe yeah one of the more smoked too.

Speaker 1 (32:41):
Well, that's true, that could be, but who knows.

Speaker 2 (32:45):
But like what a vendetta that this guy had or
whoever against this family, like that there was this much
thought put in and premeditation to stay in the house,
sneak up on them, wipe everybody out. Like I just
feel like the amount of effort, it just sounds so personal.

Speaker 3 (33:03):
Yeah, yeah, agreed, one hundred percent. And so a lot
of the theories do revolve around, you know, local people
that had connections. So yeah, we'll get into that in
a bit.

Speaker 4 (33:17):
Yeah, and then the Morse didn't.

Speaker 1 (33:19):
Smoke, okay, so even bolder Oh.

Speaker 2 (33:24):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (33:25):
Now, I do have to note that some descriptions, or
a lot of them, do believe that the cigarette butts
were there, but there are also some recounts out there
that say that that piece of cigarette but information is
not true. Oh, so there's a bit of that inconsistency there, right,

(33:46):
right to be expected.

Speaker 4 (33:48):
Yeah, And as the investigation began, of course they found
evidence like some people say cigarettes, cigarette butts, some people
say that aren't there. But almost immediately it went wrong
because you see, back then, this was nineteen twelve, before

(34:10):
crime scene protocol, before forensic science, before we knew how
to preserve evidence. And by nine am, the more family
home was surrounded because word had travel fast in a
small town like Feliska and with an hour's neighbors, reporters, townspeople,

(34:35):
and even curious children walked through the house. Hundreds of
people would walk through the crime scene before it was
even properly closed off.

Speaker 1 (34:49):
Are you saying with the bodies there?

Speaker 3 (34:51):
Yes? Yeah, wow, everybody got in there.

Speaker 1 (34:56):
Wow much?

Speaker 3 (34:58):
Would you, guys, walk into an active crime if you
had the chance.

Speaker 1 (35:02):
To, No, not like that.

Speaker 3 (35:08):
Once in a lifetime experience, right exactly.

Speaker 2 (35:12):
And if things weren't like yes now, I would be like, oh,
have to preserve things. No, But back then, like I
don't know, if you see.

Speaker 4 (35:21):
A bunch of people walking in there, would you walk
in there as well?

Speaker 3 (35:26):
Oh? What's going on in here? Guys?

Speaker 1 (35:28):
Well, okay, if you put it in that context, if
I didn't know what was in there, that's true. Potentially
I'd be like, oh, okay, well something's in here. Let's see.

Speaker 3 (35:38):
At this point, though, people knew what happened, because now
there's like a county wide like all call that they
did to let people know, so they knew what they
were getting themselves into.

Speaker 1 (35:48):
Yeah, that's I can't even imagine the visuals of that.

Speaker 3 (35:51):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (35:52):
Yeah, it gets worse though, Okay, evidence was trampled, go
ahead it, Talia.

Speaker 2 (35:58):
I was just gonna say thank you, I'm so sorry
the pillow or thank you, not the pillowcases, but the
blanket's just like thinking of like what it looked like
in there, and people were in there and what they saw.
It stood out to me how you said that. I
think you said for all of them that their faces
were covered with the blankets. Don't you find that like
an interesting detail? I don't know why you like almost

(36:21):
like was it I don't know, like you couldn't see
what you did to them, Like you freaking mutilated these
poor people and then you needed to cover them.

Speaker 7 (36:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (36:30):
I keep getting I keep getting a like and you know,
not trying to offend anybody here, but a like religious
aspect of of you're covering them up, but you're also
covering the mirrors, which I know, yes, means something which
I'm not feeling anybody's thunder, but you know, like stealing
of stealing, covering mirrors is something, so I feel like,

(36:52):
you know, it's not completely just uh, there's no rhyme
or reason. I feel like there is something happening, but
go ahead.

Speaker 4 (37:00):
Times that would also cover mirrors during morning periods.

Speaker 3 (37:04):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean the classic, like the classic
I guess behavioral profile for covering up your victims, right
is feelings of grief or remorse for killing these people.
So it's just so interesting to kind of think from
that perspective to see how that ties in with this all.

Speaker 8 (37:23):
Yeah, yeah, right, exactly, sorry, go ahead, thanks.

Speaker 4 (37:29):
Fine, But yeah, people were walking through the house like
an active crime scene that had just happened the night before.
Fingerprints were smudged, evidence trampled, and whatever trace of the
killer might have remained was likely swept away with the
dust of like the townspeople's boots. And this is where
it gets interesting, because some people took things, some people

(37:52):
moved things, people touched the axe.

Speaker 2 (38:00):
That same word.

Speaker 4 (38:02):
Yep, some people took part of a skull.

Speaker 5 (38:05):
Oh my god, they would take the little fragm are
these neighbors.

Speaker 1 (38:11):
So at this point the scene for all, the killer
could have been one of these people.

Speaker 3 (38:16):
Yeah, yeah, this.

Speaker 4 (38:19):
Point it wasn't. It was just a blear blurri obliriated, wow, obliterated.

Speaker 2 (38:27):
We knew what she meant. We knew what she meant.

Speaker 4 (38:31):
But yeah, so they still had to search for the killer,
even with the whole crime scene just you know gone.
And there was a lot of suspects, a lot of
potential suspects, but we'll be focusing on the main three.

Speaker 3 (38:49):
Mm hmm. So, like you guys mentioned, it could have
been anyone, right, anybody who went inside of this house.
So there was so many potential suspects, so many potential
witnesses that they interviewed, and so there was probably about,
I want to say, around ten total suspects that were

(39:12):
suspected here in this case. But yeah, like Jay said,
there's there's three main ones I guess that we'll talk about.
First was a man named Frank F. Jones. So Frank Jones,
he was a prominent local businessman. He was also a

(39:32):
state senator for Iowa. There he was Josiah's former employer.
They had some history, right, You mentioned something about being
a personal attack, and this is where some personal history
sort of comes into play. Years before the murder, Josiah

(39:53):
had quit Jones's company in sort of a battle of business,
and he opened up his own farmer quick mint store,
and so he took a lucrative like John Deere contract
with him as well, So he took that away from
Frank Jones. So there was a bit of animosity. It
caused a rift between the two. Some people said it

(40:14):
was as bad as a vendetta. So of course there
were the rumors, right had Josiah been having an affair
with Jones's daughter in law, something that was explored. So
of course the question was did Frank Jones kill out

(40:34):
of revenge? The investigators they looked into him, there was
this personal motive, but they didn't really see him as
maybe himself being a violent man, and no direct evidence
ever tied him to the scene, so people thought that
maybe he hired someone to do the job. And that

(40:57):
brings us into our second suspect, which his name was Uh.
If you want to get to go ahead.

Speaker 4 (41:04):
Sure, Yeah, which was William Blackie Mansfield.

Speaker 3 (41:09):
Mm hmmm.

Speaker 4 (41:10):
So Blackie Mansfield was known. He was a known criminal
and suspect for the axe murder. He was believed to
have killed his own wife, child and in loss with
an axe in Blue Island Sounds in Illinois and Blue Island, Illinois,
just two years after Veliska.

Speaker 3 (41:32):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (41:33):
And the crime scene was disturbingly similar because at that
crime scene in Blue Island, Illinois, there was also meares
covered and an axe left behind at the crime scene,
and the victims also had their faces bludgeon beyond recognition.

Speaker 1 (41:51):
Okay, mm hm.

Speaker 4 (41:53):
He also hit the timeline. Blackie was reportedly in the
area when the Veliska murders happened, and then he was gone.
He was arrested, investigated, but no surprise, he was released
for lack of evidence.

Speaker 3 (42:11):
M Yeah, So it's pretty interesting. When I was looking
at info from this case, I realized there's a lot
of axe murders that happened. Unfortunately, who knew an axe
would be a great murder weapon.

Speaker 4 (42:33):
Easily accessible?

Speaker 1 (42:36):
A little Yeah, I just keep thinking about that guy
from American horror story, the axe Man from Yeah, the
jazz Man or whatever.

Speaker 4 (42:45):
New Orleans.

Speaker 3 (42:47):
Yeah, there's actually been some like vague theories that they
could have been the same person.

Speaker 1 (42:53):
Yet.

Speaker 3 (42:54):
Yeah, so you know, lots of different intertwined ax stories.
But of course with this guy William Blackie Mansfield, it
just it didn't really fit eventually. But these two were investigated.
Alongside them, a man named Reverend George Kelly was also investigated,

(43:15):
and he ended up being the main suspect here, the
most plausible person that they did investigate. So I find
it really interesting that you guys mentioned there was almost
this religious or guilt sort of basis behind it at
some points, you know, with covering up the faces, covering

(43:35):
up the mirrors, and of course we have a reverend
who is one of the main Yeah, he was a
traveling preacher. Actually he was from England, so he wasn't
even from the States. He was a smaller man actually,
as opposed to the taller person that we sort of

(43:56):
talked a little bit about earlier. Oh okay, yeah, but
he was small. He's peculiar. He's described as having a
high pitched voice and eyes that never seemed to blink enough.
So kind of just take a second to imagine, you
know that.

Speaker 2 (44:14):
Already imagining like an unblinking elf.

Speaker 3 (44:26):
Okay, look out the window. It's just.

Speaker 1 (44:32):
It's not what people now referred to as like a
short king. What's that, you know, like short king spring
or you know, like they basically say, like guys who
are short they call them short.

Speaker 3 (44:46):
You're a king too. You don't need to be worried
about your height. You' short king.

Speaker 2 (44:50):
Yeah, I didn't know about this.

Speaker 3 (44:58):
What it is anyway, Reverend Kelly was an odd man.
He was not an elf, but he was. He was
kind of worse than that. As as an adult, he

(45:19):
was accused of peeping on girls, even asking them to
pose a nude for him. So he was he was
not a good guy.

Speaker 2 (45:29):
Weirdo.

Speaker 3 (45:31):
Yeah yeah, So if you want to talk a little
more about him, jay, uh.

Speaker 1 (45:37):
Sure.

Speaker 4 (45:39):
So he had arrived at Veliska the day of the
murders to attend the very same children's day service that
the More family had been involved in, and he left
town early the next morning, hours before the bodies were discovered.
So later he began writing bizarre letters to authorities. He

(46:04):
had a weird fascination and obsession with the case. He
would respond with his own details of the case, even
claiming to have possibly witnessed the murders himself. Okay, yeah,
there was like a great detail of suspicion, but nothing
ever came of it, especially because of Kelly's known mental illness.

(46:28):
Like the authorities questioned the reality of what he was describing,
because two years later Kelly was arrested not for the
Veliska murders, but for sexually harassing a woman that applied
to be his secretary. Oh and then three years later
came the confession, the Veliska confession.

Speaker 3 (46:54):
Okay, wow, yeah, so at this point it is nineteen seventeen,
it's five years after the Veliska murders happened. Now we
mentioned he had correspondence, He wrote letters to authorities, increasingly

(47:14):
getting more bizarre. He did have known mental illness. He
suffered from mental breakdowns as a child, and a lot
of people believed he had some type of schizophrenia in
a way because in his confession, which did come, he
claimed he heard voices in his head, you know, telling
him to slay utterly. He said he couldn't resist that

(47:39):
God had chosen him. Yeah, and I think that in
a way it sort of ties into once again, maybe
covering up these the victims, like he was told to
do it, maybe he didn't want to do it in
a way he made this confession. I'm not sure. At

(48:04):
this point, I couldn't find like a birthday for him.
I don't know if you could, Jay, I couldn't.

Speaker 1 (48:09):
Find Listen, she loves to ask these questions that are
gonna are gonna be like, oh, I wish I knew that,
but I don't. I'm surprised she didn't act statistics on
axe murderers yet.

Speaker 3 (48:28):
Or.

Speaker 2 (48:32):
Just trying to get an image. Sorry, continue, you're fine,
You're fine.

Speaker 1 (48:40):
I would like to ask something now, it's my I
would like to ask something. Okay, with the covering of
the mirrors, Am I making this up? Or is there
some type of connotation to they would cover the mirrors
so that the spirit would not get trapped or lost
in the house.

Speaker 3 (48:59):
Okay, all right, yeah, and actually ascend to the right.

Speaker 1 (49:04):
Okay, That's what I was because I was thinking, like,
if going off of what you were saying, if he
if he was doing this, let's say in God's name,
I mean, he would want them to go to heaven.

Speaker 3 (49:14):
One assume.

Speaker 1 (49:15):
So it's kind of like I feel like if he
was if he was doing it for those reasons, it
makes sense to be covering the mirrors because you're basically
making it more efficient for their souls to ascend.

Speaker 3 (49:28):
You're sending them sooner.

Speaker 1 (49:30):
Yes, okay, and I think, yeah.

Speaker 3 (49:35):
Of course, you know he's acting in God's word right.

Speaker 4 (49:38):
Absolutely, during the murders, he was thirty three or thirty
four years old.

Speaker 1 (49:43):
Gotcha, thank you, there you go, tell you, there you go.

Speaker 2 (49:48):
I can have an accurate image of this little elf.

Speaker 4 (49:51):
Thank you, thirty three or thirty four year old, right,
thank you.

Speaker 3 (50:01):
I think the investigators also had a similar line of thinking. Right,
you know, there was so much that lined up with
this reverend being the murderer, with the mirrors, with his
weird behavior, with his confession. But as all good stories go,

(50:22):
that confession didn't stick. This charge didn't stick because Reverend
Kelly he recanted it. He said that he was coerced
by the authorities, that they forced him into saying this confession.
It didn't fully match the crime scene, and so because

(50:42):
of these inconsistencies, in his first trial it ended with
a hung jury. It was eleven to one, I believe,
and then for his second trial he had a full
acquittal of all of the charges. Oh wow, yeah, so
yeah he was. He was never actually formally charged.

Speaker 4 (51:04):
And that was pattern suspect after suspect, and it was
just theory after theory. But there was just no justice
for this family because the trail just went.

Speaker 3 (51:15):
Cold until about twenty seventeen, pretty recently.

Speaker 4 (51:25):
Huh oh yeah, not what I.

Speaker 2 (51:29):
Thought right to be like twenty years ago.

Speaker 3 (51:36):
Now twenty seventeen. Okay, don't get your hopes up too high.
This case wasn't cracked open, but there were new some
new developments sort of that happened in twenty seventeen. A
new suspect was actually proposed by a man named Bill

(51:56):
James and his daughter Rachel McCarthy James. They wrote a
novel title or called The Man from the Train. So
they wrote this book, and in this book they detail
how they believed a man named Paul Mueller was responsible
for the Velliska axe murders. So what initially started out

(52:18):
as sort of an obsession with trying to figure out
who was the killer and the Velliska axe murders sort
of turned into a whole journey of researching this man
named Paul Mueller. For these authors and They put it
all in their book, which is pretty cool. According to them,
Mueller was a serial killer active from eighteen ninety eight

(52:42):
to nineteen twelve, and believed by them to have killed
at least fifty nine people, possibly over one hundred people
in at least fourteen separate incidents over the years that
were all believed to just be standalone occurrences by the

(53:03):
local authorities.

Speaker 6 (53:06):
So, yeah, you have something to say, you have something?

Speaker 2 (53:17):
I don't know you guys could see my face that
I wanted to ask them.

Speaker 1 (53:21):
Yes, thought you had something to say.

Speaker 2 (53:24):
Ten minutes. Oh okay, yes, thank you. So why do
they think then, So like, if these happened in nineteen twelve,
and that's what they that's when they think the span
stopped or his spree stopped. Why do they think it stopped? Like,
what do they think happened to him? Are you getting
to that? Am I jumping the gun?

Speaker 3 (53:43):
No? So I think that what it was is that
he sort of just faded off. I think that's where
they think the trail ended. They couldn't really connect any
other ax murders past that.

Speaker 2 (53:56):
Oh good call, good call, okay, yeah, okay.

Speaker 3 (53:59):
So yeah, there were lots of axe murders like I mentioned,
and a lot of the times the local police just
thought it was a one time thing someone local. They
never considered that they might be connected in some way.
But the authors of this book did. Their book was
called The Man from the Train because they believed that

(54:20):
he did travel by train. A lot of the victims
were actually very close to railroad tracks.

Speaker 1 (54:26):
Oh wow, that was one of those connections.

Speaker 4 (54:29):
H m hm.

Speaker 3 (54:31):
He struck at night, and he used the blunt side
of an axe to kill his victims. He would cover
the victims, cover the windows, leave the acts behind, and
lock the doors before he left. So in all these
cases there was those similarities. Some people believe this theory,

(54:54):
others say there's a lack of evidence to truly connect
him to the Veliska murders. At some point, the FBI
actually sort of considered this theory as well with Paul Mueller,
but nothing ever came of it. There was just no
actual evidence. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (55:10):
Yeah, And as of now of twenty twenty five, the
Valiska House still stands, a white, two story home at
five oh eight East Second Street. To some it's just
another old house, but to others, it's the most haunted home.
In America because what happened in that house didn't stay

(55:33):
in nineteen twelve. And this is where our little paranormal
side comes into the.

Speaker 3 (55:41):
True crime and Paranormal Pods feature exactly.

Speaker 4 (55:54):
So after the murders, the house has changed hands multiple times.
For years it was just another rental. No one stayed
there too long. Tenants reported unexplained cold spots, disin bodied voices,
doors that slam shut on their own, and objects moving
without warnings. Children claim to see shadow figures and foots

(56:18):
by their beds. One woman said that she saw a bloodied, bloody,
bloodied little boy standing in the kitchen who vanished. The
lights got turned on, and it wasn't until the nineteen
nineties that the house got national attention again. That's when
it was purchased by Darwin and Martha Lynn, who were

(56:41):
storted back to look exactly as it did in nineteen twelve,
which means no electricity, no plumbing, just lanterns and period furniture.

Speaker 3 (56:52):
Wow, so we won't take up too much time with this,
but but yeah it is now it's a National Historic Landmark.
It's also open for tours, so you can take towards
the place. You can do overnight stays you can sleep God.

(57:13):
So lots of paranoia investigators have gone through over the years,
and lots of things people visitors will say that footsteps
happen upstairs when no one's there, doors open, creek open slowly,
lights flicker, and there are actually some quite a bit
of reports of people being sort of touched or even

(57:35):
like softly pushed while they're inside of the house. The
hard thing about paranormal cases is that there's never any
concrete fact about them, right, It's all just like anecdotes
from people, So it's really hard to ever confirm these things.
But in its current state, you know, the Veliska is

(57:57):
sort of known as the home of the axe murders
but also a paranormal hotspot. Now it is yep.

Speaker 1 (58:07):
Wow.

Speaker 4 (58:07):
So people have claimed to like I said here, children's whispers,
there's EVPs like electronic voice phenomena that says get out
or he's still here, and investigators allegedly feel like they're
being like stabbed in the chest. So there's different things

(58:31):
happening in the house depending on who you talk to
who goes there. By the day, there's tours offered for
about twenty dollars pretty cheap.

Speaker 3 (58:44):
Yeah, actually, yeah, it's a good good price.

Speaker 4 (58:48):
They'll walk in through the house where the more family lived,
where they prayed, and where they died. You get to
see the still cylingers girls bedroom, the attic, the bloodstained
mirror that was covered. You also get to see the closet,
the closet where the children may have tried to hide,
but at night, that's where the lanterns flicker. The house

(59:10):
goes quiet. And then some say that the spirits of
the victims try to be or tried to be heard.
And then we have a couple of stories. So if
you guys have time for those stories of people.

Speaker 3 (59:26):
Like there's like like reddit acount that we found of
someone who didn't say.

Speaker 1 (59:31):
I mean all of that. That description that you just gave,
not being funny, just it does give me chills. That
sounds just not my cup of tea.

Speaker 2 (59:42):
Can I ask a question, yeah, yeah, can you ever
would the three of you stay in this house overnight?
Not like alone necessarily, but like however you'd like to
be with a group of people.

Speaker 1 (01:00:01):
Or one of the first Yeah, how about No, No.

Speaker 2 (01:00:10):
I don't think I don't I told you I don't
like the adult slumber parties.

Speaker 8 (01:00:15):
But maybe, oh right, but I would definitely go, like
for a day trip, like I would step foot in there.

Speaker 2 (01:00:27):
Hell yeah, but I would.

Speaker 4 (01:00:28):
Not sleep over do the overnight stay. Okay, so we'll
let you know what happens that night.

Speaker 1 (01:00:33):
Yeah. Yeah, I'm not necessarily saying I wouldn't go on
a tour, but that would have to be like a
two pm you know.

Speaker 4 (01:00:45):
And they do those, they do the tours, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:00:49):
For twenty dollars.

Speaker 1 (01:00:52):
But yeah, I mean I have a coworker who she
she travels like to go to like all of those
places and stays overnight, like the Conjuring House and shit,
And I'm like, oh my god, I can't even I
can't imagine. I cannot imagine.

Speaker 3 (01:01:10):
So yeah, do you know, tell one of those stories?

Speaker 1 (01:01:13):
Ja?

Speaker 4 (01:01:13):
Yeah? Yeah, So I had a quick story from Reddit
and this one just says stayed at the Villiska Axe
Murder House. And now I'm in tears and it says title. Yeah,
so it says, so I'm one a believer in ghosts
until tonight my family and a couple of friends decided

(01:01:33):
to spend the night at the Veliska Axe Murder House.
Quick History, June tenth, nineteen twelve. Eight people, six of
which our children, were tragically murdered by an unknown ax
World murderer a month ago. My mother has has the
idea of visiting the place overnight. I was esthetic. I
did not believe in ghosts, but like pretending they're real.

(01:01:57):
So fast forward to today. We packed our things, and
we packed our things and rode with our friends to
the house. Yeah, we lasted from three pm to one
thirty am to start to start the house, to start,
the house just felt off. Later at ten ish, three

(01:02:18):
of us, three of us in the kids room and
one of us in the closet trying to get one
of the kids to open the door. We were able
to get ida. We tried going through the names to
open the door twice. Later, around one we were using
the EVP to get the kid's room and try to
ask them questions, questions how do I up quite? And

(01:02:41):
then that's where the ends, and they said, question how
woul do I upload video footage because we got both
of them on tape. And then there's a replant there
from someone else that says my brother and I stayed
here the night. I love the whole idea of ghosts,
but I admit I'm skeptical. At one point I scared
my brother. He fell asleep and I said it took up
stairs and sit in the kids room. As I sat there,

(01:03:02):
I heard my brother sneaking up the stairs, and I
assume he was trying to scare me. So I scooted
it into a corner I sat. But after about fifteen
minutes I got up and looked around the corner. No
one was there. I didn't hear him go back down.
I don't know if it was a ghost or not,
but it was definitely freaky.

Speaker 1 (01:03:21):
Who the hell?

Speaker 2 (01:03:26):
And Ina?

Speaker 3 (01:03:29):
I think, honestly, I'd have like a I'd have a
morbid curiosity of like hiding up in the attic and
just spending time out there to know like what it
was like if the if the murderer was like actually
waiting up there.

Speaker 2 (01:03:43):
I don't know, very brave of you.

Speaker 4 (01:03:47):
What the house sounds like when it settles down.

Speaker 3 (01:03:50):
Yeah, but yeah, other than that, you know, it's been
covered over the years on different channels. I don't know
if you guys so much about BuzzFeed Solved Factory at
a time, Ryan and Shane so BuzzFeed and Solved. It's
two guys, Ryan Bergara and Shane Maday super great duo.

(01:04:11):
Ryan is like the total scaredy cat believer. Shane is
complete skeptic. He's like completely composed. He literally insults the
ghosts because he does not believe them.

Speaker 1 (01:04:21):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (01:04:25):
And so one of their early episodes they actually did
it on the Vealiska house. And so they go in,
they do it, you know, their investigations. So they walked
the halls, they asked the spirits questions. They even did
spend some time in the attic. Of course, Ryan was terrified,
Shane was unbothered as always, but even both of them

(01:04:49):
agreed that the house definitely had a vibe. You know,
a lot of places do, yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:04:57):
And that brings us to the end of this. So
it brings us to the question was the murder conducted
by a preacher with the twisted mind? Was it a
hit job gone wrong or was it a stranger in
the attic just listening for hours? Whatever? The truth is,

(01:05:17):
the Liska doesn't rest easy, and if you ever spend
the night there, don't be surprised if a toy rolls
on its own, or if the voice just whispers Mommy
when no one's in the room, so be sure to
check your closets, double lock your doors, and maybe skip

(01:05:39):
the attic.

Speaker 3 (01:05:43):
Under there.

Speaker 2 (01:05:50):
You guys did an amazing job that they tell of
a story.

Speaker 3 (01:05:55):
Yeah, any questions anything you guys are have on your mind, Yeah,
just get out there.

Speaker 1 (01:06:01):
I don't know, I mean, my only thing, it's not
about the story, more so about like obviously as being
tour guides. I mean, have you experienced something of this nature?

Speaker 2 (01:06:15):
Good question?

Speaker 5 (01:06:16):
Murder, Oh, not murder, but like yes.

Speaker 4 (01:06:28):
Yes, something that happened very early on when I started
working there. It's something I haven't shared in a while.

Speaker 3 (01:06:37):
Actually, I think I know where you're going.

Speaker 4 (01:06:40):
When you first start, they put you on people's tours,
so you get an idea of how every tour guide
does their tour a little bit different. And in one
of the first rooms, they play a video with like
a quick maybe like a minute story of like who
Sarah was. And I was standing next to a tour guide.
I was standing on her right hand side, right hand side,

(01:07:02):
and we're watching the group like right in front of us.
The videos planed on the left side of the room,
and there's nothing on the right side of me. There's
just like a wall and there's like a picture there,
and as the video's plane and we're just watching the people.
It's probably like maybe like thirty seconds forty seconds into
the video or something like that. And that's when I

(01:07:25):
heard someone whisper in my ear Winchester. Not the entire word,
not the whole word. It was more of like when
chest and then it faded like it like they they
got tired, they didn't have energy to say the whole word.
They got bored or something. It's like, I don't know,

(01:07:46):
like breath exactly, like they went out of breath. I
turned to the right hand side. There's like five feet
of like nothing, and then there's a wall. I'm a
new tour guide. I don't see anything. I'm like cool,
maybe sound carries easy through the house. Maybe I heard
something else. For an entire hour, I don't say anything

(01:08:11):
because I'm like shadowing this tour again, like I'm still
learning the ropes. After the tour, I talked to the
tour gut that I was there with and I'm like, hey,
I was like, did you say anything in that room
while you were playing the video? And she looks at me,
She's like no, why And then I told her why
to her and she's like no, She's like, I didn't
say anything in that room, Like I just stay quiet

(01:08:32):
during the video. That is the only time that I've
like actually had something or someone whisper in my ear.
And you know when someone whispers in your ear, it's
very a very distinct sound.

Speaker 1 (01:08:45):
Mm hmmm.

Speaker 4 (01:08:48):
That was like my first experience at the Winchester.

Speaker 3 (01:08:51):
I would say, Wow.

Speaker 6 (01:08:54):
I don't know if you've ever heard Yeah, Oh, that's
the thing.

Speaker 3 (01:09:01):
Like when it comes to ghost stories at the Winchester
Mystery House, you can ask anyone and nobody's really going
to have like a big experience. You know, nothing's going
to like jump out at you or like huge shadow figures.
It's always the small thing. It's like, yeah, you know,
you walk into a room the chandeliers swinging, and as
soon as you like acknowledge it, it stops or something like that. Yeah,

(01:09:25):
We've had tour guides who literally have had like shouting
matches with like chandeliers because they won't stop swinging and
stuff like that. So it's it's small things. One time
I was coming out of the basement. There's pretty big,
kind of creepy basement there of course, and there's these big,
like rectangular double doors that we have to guide close

(01:09:48):
so that they can latch together. And it's one of
the smoothest doors to open and close in the house.
There's like no resistance. They just sort of go with
where you direct them. But one time I was coming
out of the basement and as I was going to
close them, they completely slammed shut on me, and I
actually had to rip my hands out in order to
stop them from being like completely like smashed the door closing. Yeah,

(01:10:13):
so the doors like rattled shut, and like I said,
I'm a skeptic, So my first thought wasn't like, oh
my god, a ghost just tried to shut me out
of the basement. It was it was where's the breeze
coming from? You know? It was what pushed this door
closed right right. I literally, to this day, I have
zero explanation for it, and sort of I downplay it

(01:10:35):
to myself because maybe I don't want to believe that
that happened. But truly, it did feel like something win
in me out of the basement and it like shut
the doors closed on me.

Speaker 4 (01:10:45):
So I am in the same boat. When I play
the video for the guests, I will stand in different
areas in that carrots entrance carriage house just to see
if I can hear something else. Again, I'm like, was it?

Speaker 6 (01:10:59):
Was it?

Speaker 4 (01:10:59):
Standing? Is there something else? And it's never happened again.
So once again, it's not like I can like debunk
it or explain it. It's just one of those weird
things that happens.

Speaker 1 (01:11:09):
Yeah, well, thank you for those experiences of course.

Speaker 3 (01:11:14):
Thanks for having us on. This has been awesome. Yes, thanks.

Speaker 2 (01:11:19):
So fun.

Speaker 8 (01:11:22):
Man.

Speaker 1 (01:11:22):
Before we let you go, could you tell the chillers
where they can find you great name?

Speaker 3 (01:11:27):
Yeah, hi, yeah, so we are. You can find us
at Chambers of the Occult everywhere on every stream website, Spotify,
Apple Music, wherever you listen to your podcasts. We are
on Instagram as Chambers of the Occult. We are on
Twitter as c O t O podcast. We don't really

(01:11:49):
post too much, but you can also just find us
through our website Chambers of the Occult dot com.

Speaker 1 (01:11:58):
Damn well, quite a fish that everything.

Speaker 3 (01:12:01):
Yeah yeah, that's all thanks to Jay.

Speaker 4 (01:12:04):
Okay, but yeah, reach out and we'll reach back out.

Speaker 3 (01:12:14):
Once again. Thanks for having us. This was awesome.

Speaker 1 (01:12:16):
Yeah, well you're well.

Speaker 2 (01:12:18):
Much for coming on it. Was so fun. Loved meeting
you guys and just I think we vibed very nicely.

Speaker 3 (01:12:24):
This was fun yea, even with the delay.

Speaker 1 (01:12:29):
Yeah, I'm so good.

Speaker 4 (01:12:36):
Yeah yes.

Speaker 1 (01:12:41):
So as always, stay safe and stay chill and thank
you everybody you've just listened to Chillworthy. Thank you for
joining us on this latest episode. While we strive to

(01:13:03):
keep our discussions engaging and lighthearted, we also wanted to
take a moment to acknowledge the real lives and events
that are at the heart of these stories.

Speaker 2 (01:13:12):
We try to approach each topic with a sense of
curiosity and respect fully aware of the impact these events
have had on the individuals and their reloved ones. Our
goal is to honor their memories by keeping their stories
alive and shedding light on the mysteries that surround them.

Speaker 1 (01:13:28):
If you enjoyed this episode, please remember to subscribe, rate,
and leave a review, and don't forget to join us
on the next episode of Chilworthy.