October 9, 2025 • 42 mins
Why do victims sometimes bond with their abusers? How can people trapped in emotional or psychological control — in relationships, families, or even institutions — break free? In this enlightening episode of Corsi Nation, Dr. Jerome Corsi speaks with Meredith Miller, author of Becoming Whole: How to Prevent Stockholm Syndrome and Transcend Darkness in Your Life and Relationships, to explore the hidden dynamics of Stockholm Syndrome — and the path toward reclaiming your freedom and sense of self. Meredith and Dr. Corsi discuss:
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- 🧠 What Stockholm Syndrome Really Is — and why victims can become emotionally attached to their captors or abusers.
- 💔 How It Happens — from hostage situations to toxic personal relationships.
- 🪞 Recognizing the Signs — how manipulation, trauma bonding, and fear distort perception.
- 🌱 Healing and Empowerment — how to break free from emotional control and rebuild a healthy, independent mindset.
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📬 Join Dr. Jerome Corsi on Substack: https://jeromecorsiphd.substack.com/
📖 Get your FREE copy of Dr. Corsi's new book with Swiss America CEO Dean Heskin: How the Coming Global Crash Will Create a Historic Gold Rush — Call 800-519-6268
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
More course, This drone course the end.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Today, we've got a really special guest with us. We'll
bring you the first interview on a newly published book.
It's Meredith Miller, who is joining us. Meredith, how are you.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
I'm good. Thank you so much for inviting me.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Well, your book has just come out here, it's becoming whole,
and in fact, it's one that I helped get. I
was a managing editor on this as an acquiring editor
with post Tail Press. I wanted this book to come
into press. And this is your website, I guess right here.
What is your website, Meredith?
Speaker 3 (00:38):
It is its integration dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Inner Integration dot Com. Okay, I find I think it's
a brilliant book. I really like it a lot, and
I want I want to do it as much as
we can to get people to understand and and buy
it and read it. First of all, give us some
of your background, Meredith. Tell us what your career has
(01:02):
been and how you came to write this book.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
So I've been doing holistic healing for about twenty five years.
I've studied a bunch of different modalities, traveled around the world,
studied with different teachers. I started with more hands on
healing initially, and then I moved into coaching and then
working online in twenty twelve, and for several years I
worked in narcissistic abuse recovery, and then in twenty twenty,
I started hearing the calling to dig deeper in my
(01:28):
own inner healing.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
And as I.
Speaker 3 (01:30):
Began to do that, now I'm working with people who
are further along in the trauma healing process, who want
to transmute their trauma into a new sense of purpose.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Okay, So essentially, are you a psychologist or a psychiatrist.
Speaker 3 (01:45):
I am neither of those. I call myself a coach,
but I work in the holistic world. So that's body, mind, spirits,
that's looking at the human being as a whole.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Okay, So it's more of a holistic approach exactly to
I guess wellness, mental wellness, psychological wellness. And you're coming
at it from the disciplines of holistic methodologies or modalities.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
That's correct.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
So you've studied, then, I'm sure a lot of different
both religions and psychological approaches, and it your book certainly
reflects a lot of thought on how human beings are
put together. And I think a really deep understanding of
narcissism and how people become captive and become held in captivity.
(02:38):
And your subtitle is how to prevent Stockholm syndrome and
transcend darkness in your life and relationships. Okay, So now
what is the Stockholm syndrome?
Speaker 3 (02:51):
So this is a concept that's really misunderstood. I believe
even in the fields of psychology and psychiatry.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
I believe they're taking it very literally.
Speaker 3 (03:00):
So they believe, for example, it came from this bank
heist that took place in Stockholm, Sweden, where people were
held as physical captives in a hostage situation. And so
most psychologists and psychiatrists believe that it can only take
place between strangers and it has to involve physical captivity.
But from my perspective, that's not true, because the subconscious,
(03:23):
whatever you're imagining or remembering, is the same as what's
actually happening in your reality. And so what I discovered
through observing so many different cases of abuse and experiencing
this myself, is that when you believe that you're in
a state of captivity, you believe there's no escape, that's
just as real to you as if you were actually
(03:45):
held in a physical hostage situation. So that's why I
renamed it a state of captivity to help people recognize
this is a state of consciousness, not a state of
physical confinement.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
So in Stockholm syndrome, this incident you refer to, which
very important incident in the history of terrorism or violent
action like terrorism, the victims actually sided with the terrorists.
Is that correct?
Speaker 1 (04:14):
That's true, and so they go ahead. So what happens in.
Speaker 3 (04:18):
These abusive situations is the victim tends to become an
accomplice to the abuse. They participate in the abuse without
realizing what's happening. They're doing this as a survival mechanism.
So they're complying with the abuse and the abuser, and
they begin to believe that the abuser actually cares about
them or wants them to be safe, or wants them
(04:40):
to be healthy.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
You say, and you write in the book, the state
of captivity is an inner state. It is psychological, neurological,
and spiritual. Therefore, it is psycho neeural, spiritual state of captivity.
It's a state of consciousness that becomes a re reality
and doc can you say a subconscious mind cannot differentiate
(05:04):
between what's vividly imagined and what's actually happening. Physical confinement
isn't required because there's a perception of no escape and
that's what matters to subconscious which drives our behavior. Well,
the prison bars may be imaginary, they are very real
to those experiencing them. Okay, so you say yourself, you've
(05:25):
experienced being captivity. You want to give us a little
glimpse of that without necessarily going too deeply, but basically,
what did you experience?
Speaker 3 (05:34):
So I came from a family system where the legacy
of abuse was passed on from generation to generation. In
my particular family, it was sexual abuse and emotional abuse.
It wasn't physical abuse. And so when you grow up
in a family system like that, you get programmed for
life to perceive abuse as love and home. So, of course,
(05:55):
emerging into adulthood, I got myself into all kinds of
relationships and work situations and communities and all kinds of
experiences that was very similar. Because my nervous system was
programmed to recognize that as love and home, my psychology
was programmed to recognize that as the same. And I
was locked in that spiritual state of captivity.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
And you say, there's kind of these different stages of
how this You know, you study a lot of domestic
violence as well, is that right?
Speaker 3 (06:26):
Yeah, And so domestic violence can be physical violence, but
it can also be psychological violence, and that's often what's
not spoken about. Typically when people hear the word abuse,
they imagine a battered woman. But abuse is not always physical,
and the victims of abuse are not always women. The
perpetrators are not always men.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
A woman can be narcissistic and abusive to a husband.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
Correct, and a man could be abused.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
And that's that's usually what people think of domestic violence.
But you're saying that's a form of domestic violence, correct.
And you say that there are a state of captivity
is induced through four specific parameters which have always been
used for the control of domestic violence as well as
an abusive families, workplaces, cults, and society at large. So
(07:17):
versus isolation, physical, psychological, or both second acts of perceived kindness.
There are threats, perceived threats to one's life, and perceived
an ability to escape. So you want to elaborate on that,
explain that to us.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
Yeah, So the isolation is where the abuser positions him
or herself as the sole narrative of reality, So they
will isolate the victims psychologically from external perceptions of reality
that could be your family, your friends, things that you
read online. The abuser has to position themselves as the
one who controls reality and so information control as reality can.
(08:00):
That takes place in relationships just as it does in
a society. So we've been seeing this a lot in society,
and that could also involve some physical isolation where the
abuser will either not allow the victim to see other people,
or they will more covertly plant the idea in the
victim's mind that other people don't have their best interests,
that other people are dangerous. So the victim makes their
(08:22):
own decision assuming that this is the truth. And so
then the second parameter, which is the perceived acts of kindness.
This is what we call love bombing or idealization. So
this is when the abuser maybe tells you that they
want your good, it's for your good, They care about you,
they want to protect you, they want to keep you safe.
(08:44):
They can give you glimpses of hope, they can flatter you.
Flattery is actually one of their chief tools that they
use to get you to trust them. So the whole
goal of the perceived kindness is to get you to
trust the abuser. But this is also intermittent re enforcement
because it goes back and forth between the love bombing,
the flattery, the giving of resources or anything that they
(09:08):
know that the victim needs, and then it alternates with
acts of cruelty and devaluation, and as that goes back
and forth, that causes cognitive dissonance. So even though the
person recognizes some things are off and something doesn't feel right,
it's these acts of perceived kindness that cause the person
to keep reverting back to that state of trust. And
(09:29):
then the third one is the perceived life threat, and
so the abuser will either threaten your life or threaten
the lives of your family or loved ones if you
don't comply, or what they'll do is manufacture or take
advantage of something that's occurring in the environment, like a
disease or a war or something external that's a life threat,
(09:53):
and they'll position themselves as your hero as your protector
at the same time. And then the fourth parameter is
where the person believes there's no escape, and so this
is where they begin to comply to fund to participate
in the abuse because they believe there's no sense in leaving.
Even domestic violence victims who leave the house multiple times
(10:15):
a day to go to the grocery store, go to work,
take the kids to school, they keep coming home because
deep down, psychologically and spiritually, neurologically, they're trapped in that
state of captivity and they believe that they can't leave
or they can't survive outside of that relationship, family system,
or community.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
One of the things I found really fascinating about your
book is that you also show this in social settings,
so you are able to analyze the pandemic as a
societal case of abuse in captivity and that it was
engineered in order to hold us captive, to make us
(10:58):
experience this kind of lack of ability to control our
own destiny or to do anything. You want to elaborate
on that, because I think that was one of the
more fascinating parts of your book, your discussions of how
the pandemic and your whole understanding of narcissism and these
(11:19):
captive relationships really are equivalent.
Speaker 3 (11:23):
So it's the same patterns from the micro to the
macro in society, whether we're talking interpersonal relationships, family systems, workplaces,
or society, and what we saw during the COVID campaign
was the setup for the Stockholm syndrome and the state
of captivity. So first they physically isolated people, then they
psychologically isolated people. They made the official narrative the only
(11:47):
acceptable version of reality, which is disseminated via our devices.
So as people were trapped at home, all they had
with their connection to the outside world was their devices.
They would go on social media and they would hear
all of this repeated. There was lots of censorship and
suppression of information so that only certain amounts of information
could come out. And then everyone, even doctors who spoke
(12:09):
against that narrative, were smeared, were ostracized, We're threatened. And
then the perceived acts of kindness. You know, all along
they told us it was for our good, it's because
they cared, it's for our health, they want to keep
us safe. And of course, you know, they offered money,
They offered all kinds of incentives for people to stay home,
to not work, to get the shots. And then the
(12:31):
perceived life threat, of course, was the virus or other
people as vectors of the virus, which they painted as
this very deadly thing. And then for those people who
were more awake about what was happening. That threat of
tyranny was a very real life threat. So everyone experienced
that to some dery or another, and then the perceived
(12:51):
inability to escape the only you know, they set everything
up so that it seemed that there was no end
to this torture, and the one and only escape from
that was to get vaccinated. And then you can get
back to your life. You can see your loved ones again,
you can go to concerts, you can go to restaurants,
you could travel, you could go to school, you could work.
And so they carefully created this environment to make people
(13:14):
believe that there was no escape other than that.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
And the idea is submit, submit to and comply being vaccinated,
and to see a whole narrative in which if you object,
everyone turns on you and the disconnection is intentionally engineered.
(13:38):
Even though the entire campaign is based on lies and
emotional manipulation, that people you know went along with all
of the requirements of compliance to the medical protocol distancing
(13:58):
wearing masks. It felt like there was no choice. And
so it's in a similar way to the pattern of
of us being an abusive relationship. Well the same kinds
of things happen on an individual basis or family basis,
(14:20):
and you're you're seeing the same pattern. Is that correct?
Speaker 1 (14:23):
That's correct.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
That divide and conquer tactic that you mentioned is key
in any abusive situation. The abuser has to get everyone
to direct their all their entire loyalty toward the abuser
and to see each other with distrust. They have to
separate us so that we can't connect and realize that
there's a lot more of us than the abusers.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
Okay, now, so while you're describing the problem and go through,
you know all the first part of the book, the
book is becoming whole. So you're really writing this to
explain to you how you get out of this trap.
You want to explain to that, to us, how what
can you do once you realize you're in this situation?
What did you do when you realize you were in
(15:09):
the situation?
Speaker 3 (15:10):
Yeah, So the trauma of this is very fragmenting, and
that's why I describe becoming whole because that wholeness is
the healing process after trauma. It's reintegrating ourselves after this
incredible damaging experiences happen. So the very first thing is
the truth that we have to accept, and the first
(15:30):
level of that is external, so a person has to
realize what the abuser is doing and what's happening to them,
and that's unfortunate where most people get trapped. Even those
who wake up to that and understand they've been abused
and who the abuser is, they often get stuck there
in that external focus. That's the victimhood, the powerlessness. The
next level of truth is the internal truth, and that's
(15:53):
where we accept our self responsibility and recognize how we
were participating, not that the abuse was our fault, but
that we each are participating in our reality and we
made certain choices. We stayed when we experienced that sense
of something was off. We somehow participated in our own captivity.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
And when we can be.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
Honest with ourselves and start to recognize that, that's the
point of empowerment. That's where we recognize that our choice
is our power and we can start to make new choices.
And the next hurdle that people run into, which I
named as the fifth parameter of the Stockholm syndrome or
state of captivity, which isn't discussed. It's almost like a
tripwire that happens once a person wakes up to the abuse,
(16:34):
they get so focused on the injustice that happened that
they developed this attachment to it. And I lived my
whole life, most of my life like this, where I
just saw all the injustice and all I could think
about was all the injustice that happened to me, and
that kept me in this repetitive loop of more injustices
happening to me. And I see a lot of us
(16:54):
falling into that now in society, where we're so focused
on all the injustices that happened in the crime against
humanity that we aren't able to start the healing process.
So that's an interesting thing that happens once a person
wakes up. And then once we start to dig further
into the wholeness and the restoration of ourselves after the abuse,
(17:15):
we're going to need to look at our self worth.
And that's really our biggest immunity against abuse is rebuilding
our self worth, because the abusers tear down your self worth.
Some people maybe never even knew what having self worth
is because they grow up in family systems like this.
But when we know our worthiness and we have the
boundaries and we know we have the right to set
(17:36):
those boundaries to protect our worthiness.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
We become immune to the abuse.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
We are easily able to say no and to opt
out and to recognize have that spiritual discernment that something
is wrong. So rebuilding self worth is really key. And
another part I describe is the growing up process. And
so each of us has experienced traumas in childhood.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
Even when we think.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
Our child was great, typically when people say that there
was a case of emotional neglect things that were even
normalized as cultures, that's just the way things were, and
we don't recognize how that affects us in our lives.
And so when we go back and we do our
inner child healing work and we start to reintegrate these
soul fragments from childhood from adolescence, we start growing up,
(18:22):
we start becoming responsible adults. And once we become responsible adults,
then we have more access to these higher states of
consciousness like creativity, intuition, insight, imagination, critical thinking, which we
don't have access to when we keep getting triggered into
these trauma responses like the fight flight, freeze and fun.
(18:43):
And so really building resilience is this process of facing
the trauma experiencing the feelings, honoring our experience of what happened,
and then digesting those feelings, so not getting stuck in
the pain, but allowing that pain to be recognized instead
of pushing it away, instead of aaping it, instead of
avoiding it, and allowing it to be digested so that
(19:04):
we can integrate the gifts, because every traumatic experience that happened,
including what's been happening in the world, contains these gems,
these gifts that we can integrate afterward, new levels of strength,
new wisdom that we can integrate. And in doing this process,
we're not only restoring our own wholeness, we're also changing
the future for the next generation so that we don't
(19:27):
pass forward this burden of unresolved trauma like those who
came before us.
Speaker 2 (19:33):
Several passages in the book that I'm really particularly interesting,
and the book we're talking about again is becoming whole,
and it's why Meredith Miller we're interviewing today and some
titles how to Prevent Stockholm Syndrome and Transcend Darkness in
your life and relationships. I really recommended it. I wanted
this book to be published, and I'm very pleased with
(19:55):
how it's come out. I think you did an excellent
job writing this, Meredith. It's very readable.
Speaker 3 (20:00):
I'm very grateful to you, because if it wasn't for you,
this book couldn't have happened.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
Well it's I'm glad it's happening, and now we've got
to make sure people know about it and read it.
I think it's very important you talk about interesting discussion
about Stewart Brand, who is a Stanford trained idealist and
systems thinker. In nineteen sixty six he started saying, you know,
why haven't we seen a photograph of the whole Earth yet?
(20:28):
I made buttons and sold them at college campuses, and
they sent them to scientists, engineers, policymakers at NASA. He
wanted to get a image of the whole earth. We
had never seen the Earth from a perspective outside the Earth.
Well we could. And then, of course, when the Apollo
eight mission took that famous earth rise photograph with one
(20:51):
of the astronauts, William Anders, the world had his first
view of Earth rising as the sun rises above the earth,
or appears to dawn. Well, the Earth rose above the
sun as it were as dawn and the moon, and
so tell us about why that photograph was so important
(21:13):
and what the evolution of that was all about.
Speaker 3 (21:16):
So that chapter is on the liminal spaces, these in
between worlds that we're in when something traumatic happens, for example,
and the world is no longer the same, our life
is no longer the same as it was before that trauma.
But we're not fully in this new world yet, and
so I'm describing where we are as society. We're in
this weird state where lots of people are describing life
(21:37):
as surreal things, so very surreal. The COVID thing happened
and then it just went away as if it never happened,
and people are in this limbo state, and so I
was describing some of the progression and history that took
place in the liminality and how art is often used
as a powerful transformative tool and that can be used
for healing trauma, but it can also be used as
(22:00):
propaganda and weaponization. And there's often this talk about unity
and how you know, unity is the most important thing,
and we just all need to get together and unify
and everything's going to be all right. And that sounds great,
except when you're talking about dealing with abusers, because if
you unite with abusers, that puts you in danger.
Speaker 1 (22:23):
And oftentimes we.
Speaker 3 (22:24):
Are brought together in political campaigns that offer unity that
aren't for our highest good, that have subtle manipulation in
the subtext. And so this earth rise image was really
interesting because you know, they had made sure that so
many people around the world could see this broadcast, so
that everyone was entering this collective awe.
Speaker 1 (22:47):
And there was reason for feeling that awe.
Speaker 3 (22:49):
It was the first time people had seen allegedly this
view of the Earth from a spaceship orbiting the Moon.
But also I believe that was used to manipulate people.
And when we see how that started to create this
progression in the technological developments that took place in the
(23:09):
control grid being created with the technology, I'm urging some
caution because I feel like our earth Rise moment is
coming that perhaps there will be some image or some
form of art or something that involves outer space or
technology in some kind of way that may be used
to manipulate us to open to something that may or
(23:31):
may not have our best interests at hands.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
It's a fascinating to talk about the avant garde art.
You know, the World War One and world War two
era with all the surrealism and how it reframed our
I meant reality one if you discuss how that goes
together with your discussion of the earth rise.
Speaker 1 (23:54):
Yeah, So after.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
World War One and the so called Spanish flu pandemic
that was in the nineteen twenty is when surrealism emerged
as a form of art. And from my perspective, it
seems that they were trying to make sense of the
absurdity and the destruction and the horrific things that had
taken place in the world, which most people were not
able to talk about, were not able to address, much
(24:17):
like what's happening now one hundred years later, what's happened
in the last several years, we're not talking about it.
And so I believe that the artists were trying to
bring out from the subconscious these ideas and help people
to They were trying to help themselves process it, but
also offering this opportunity for people to see this art
and perhaps have a transformative experience and be able to
(24:38):
process what was going on. And so as time went on,
then you know, there was the Depression, and there was
World War Two, and the surrealists were still making art,
and they were persecuted by the Nazis actually as degenerative
art and producing these ideas that were unacceptable at the time.
And so the avant garde that's an interesting military term
because this is like a reconnaissance that goes out ahead
(25:01):
of the main army, and so they're scouting the terrain ahead.
And the avant garde artists their role in society, which
Benjamin Olinde Rodriguez said, the artist has a moral obligation
to be the avant garde of the species, to bring
these these themes into the collective consciousness that people aren't
ready perhaps to see. And so so Andre Bertone came
(25:26):
up with the concept of convulsive beauty, which is like
something contradictory, something that's shocking or surprising, that's so beautiful
that it touches the pain and it makes you cry.
And that's the interesting thing is that grief actually transmutes
through convulsive beauty.
Speaker 1 (25:45):
And so I believe that.
Speaker 3 (25:47):
The artists of our time are being called to create
some kind of avant garde art. It may not be
physical like the paintings and whatnot that we're done one
hundred years ago, because I think nowadays when people are
craving so much is a sense of connection and participation,
and so I believe that the avant garde art of
our time is going to have something to do with
(26:08):
a collective container of people coming together where they can
experience something artistic that allows them to contact that pain
and transmute it so that we can heal from the
trauma that's taken place.
Speaker 2 (26:22):
It kind of fascinating discussion about how humans are creating
technology in the image of our biology, that the binary
code of computers is like our nervous system functions, that
we're getting increasingly dependent on technology, the point where we're
interacting more with our devices than with other human beings.
(26:44):
And so you write this paragraph up. Children nowadays are born,
they're called digital natives.
Speaker 3 (26:52):
You know, a four year.
Speaker 2 (26:52):
Old kid usually knows more about how about using your
smartphone and tablet than you do. That's because she was
born with the upgraded tech package in her nervous system,
which inherited from her parents, who were trained to use
the devices. So you say, h new generation's biology is
becoming more integrated with the technology of vice versa. Well,
(27:15):
many think that transhumanism is something of a far fetched future.
I would assert that the merging of humans and AI
is already underway. That's very interesting. Why don't you elaborate
on that.
Speaker 3 (27:27):
So this is part of what I'm calling the pandemic
of disconnection, and I believe this is the pandemic that's
going to have long lasting generational impacts, not this so
called virus that took place. And what's happening is we're
more disconnected now than ever. This didn't start with COVID.
It started actually with the digital age, and so as
the technology was increasingly being introduced, we've been slowly but
(27:50):
surely socially engineered to coregulate more with our devices than
with humans. As mammals, our nervous systems are meant to
coregulate with one another. We're meant to feel this sense
of safety together when we're not in a state of
defensiveness like fight, flight, freeze, and fun. So when we're
in a state of neurological balance, we're able to have
(28:11):
this healthy connection that actually creates a sense of homeostasis
in our holistic health. And so during COVID, what happened
is we were isolated, we were kept at home, and
there was this social engineering to make us turn more
toward our devices than ever. People became more dependent on
their devices, working from home, everything eat. Children who didn't
(28:33):
go to school were left on their devices. And so
what's happening is we're becoming more disconnected from one another,
and we're being led into this world where we're trained
to coregulate with our devices. If you're standing in line
at Starbucks or somewhere, people aren't talking, everybody's looking at
their device. As soon as people get anxious, they pick
up the phone, they pick up their device. When two
(28:54):
people are sitting at a table, they did a study
a few years ago. If there's a cell phone on
the table, whether it's face up or face down, both
people are hesitant to get into a deep conversation because
both of our nervous systems are anticipating that someone's going
to reach for that phone and interrupt that connection. So
we have these children now who came into the world
having no understanding of what is life or what is
(29:17):
relationship before the devices. You and I come from generations
where we remember life before the Internet and before these devices.
We remember human connection before all of that. They have
no background experience of that. So my calling is for
us to pay attention and recognize what's happening. Because these
children are going to grow up. What is life and
(29:39):
relationships going to be like for them when they have
no background understanding of connection without these devices.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
It's you say, one thing is certain, although paradox, our
human experience is fractured yet interconnected, whether you're aware of
it or not. We are all searching for meaning amidst
the chaos, trauma, and shock. Here the shadow of the
threshold that leads to our future. We are navigating the
liminal spaces together, yet we are more isolated than ever.
(30:11):
That's an interesting concept too though, so that you know,
the isolation that's brought on by all these devices is
again when when you go through your cycle of isolation
and you know, occasional acts of kindness and the whole
(30:31):
feeling you're trapped and you can't get out. You know,
we're really trapped in this internet, technical device world. How
do you function if you don't function within that world?
Speaker 3 (30:44):
You know?
Speaker 2 (30:44):
I mean it's like if someone says, you know, to me.
I got to ask the other day what was life
like before we had these devices? And I said, you
mean these surveillance instruments that we're carrying around. You know,
we don't realize that. You know, we are entering into
a world where we are submitting to every action that
(31:06):
we are undertaking being monitored, and that's full. I mean,
that's isolation. It's interconnected, but it's also interconnected isolation, which
is I mean, what a comment on that? What I mean,
I see that as being one of the great threats
of the.
Speaker 3 (31:26):
Future, absolutely, because simulation is replacing connection. It's a false
sense of intimacy, a false sense of connection that we
have through these devices. You and are having this connection now,
which is amazing because of the technology. And at the
same time, we're not connecting in person, which is that
mammalian coregulation piece. Like, there's some degree of that that
(31:49):
happens online, but it's not the same. And so it's
really concerning where this is going because our nervous systems
are being changed by these devices, because it's the same
language that our nervous system speaks. That transhumanism is already
happening right now. The device is external, but it probably
won't be that long before they offer us a solution
(32:11):
where the device is implanted inside of our bodies for
convenience or for your good in some kind of way,
and that's really alarming. And so this is my calling
to humanity to recognize what's happening, because we're losing our
ability to connect. And I'm concerned where this goes for
future generations that they lose this ability to connect, then
(32:32):
they're entirely plugged into this hive mind through the technology,
which is increasing at a rate far faster than we
are able to adapt. In the past, the increase in
technology was quite slow over time, and people had a
chance to adapt slowly. But now we're reaching that vertical
part of the curve where it's exponential growth. It's happening
(32:55):
so fast, and we are so traumatized and shut down
from what has happened in our world that we're just
kind of drifting into this. And so most people aren't
even paying attention because they're barely surviving at this point.
Speaker 2 (33:10):
And you talk a lot about the childhood trauma and
how it gets unresolved and we don't become responsible adults
because we have not handled our wounded inner child. Want
to talk about that, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (33:30):
So these are the childhood experiences that we have, and
you know, we can acknowledge that without blaming our parents.
We can acknowledge that everybody has experienced childhood trauma to
some degree. So what happens is it fragments the soul
and they are like these parts of our soul that
are exiled from us. And so life events happen and
(33:50):
things trigger those inner child parts. So when something happens
that reminds our nervous system of something that happened in
the past that was unresolved, we instantly get triggered into
this inner child state. So when people are reacting as children,
we see this frequently online. All of this it's almost
(34:11):
like toddlers yelling at one another are fighting. It's inner
child that's being triggered. And so unfortunately, nowadays in relationships
when people meet, instead of people meeting, it's more like
trauma meeting trauma and people triggering one another's trauma and
defense mechanisms, and it's very challenging for people to connect
without doing that inner child work, and they don't understand
(34:33):
what's actually happening. So this is why it's so important
to integrate these childlike parts, because we're still living in
this even though we are adults. It's like being a
child in an adult body until we integrate these parts
of ourselves, and the inner adolescent is very similar, but
it's a little bit different. The adolescent is the part
of us that wants to protect us, that rebeld against
(34:56):
whatever was happening. And we were very little children, we
just had to come to survive. Most of us learned
that we can't fight that there's nowhere else to go,
that you either escape in some kind of way through
fantasy or video games or food or something like that.
And then by the time we get into adolescent now,
we start to rebel against that to some degree. And
(35:17):
what happens is it's challenging to hate our parents or
to hate something that's happening in our environment, so we
direct that hatred inward, and a lot of us are
caring self hatred that plays out in our relationships as
hating one another, but it's actually our self hatred. And
so integrating these parts of ourselves and processing what happen
(35:38):
and then envisioning something different happening is what actually changes things,
because our subconscious can't tell the difference between what we're
vividly imagining and what's actually happening. So we can integrate
these parts of ourselves and become responsible adults who don't
get so triggered, who are more capable of being present,
who are more capable of accessing these higher states of
(35:58):
consciousness instead of getting triggered into these defensive primal states.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
We're talking with Meredith Miller and the book is Becoming Whole.
We just recently published and it's one that I wanted
to get published on managing what. We're acquiring editor at
Postal Press, and this is the book we wanted to publish,
how to prevent Stockholm syndrome and transcend darkness in your
(36:26):
life and relationships, And we're going to have you back.
I want to kind of like out last question. When
you're counseling people, where do you start and how does
your counseling sessions go? What do you do with people
to get them to become whole?
Speaker 3 (36:41):
So I don't counsel like coach people, but the work
that I do is holistic and so a person will
come to me with what they're struggling with in their life,
like for example, maybe they feel like they're not speaking up.
They really want to step into their purpose, but they
feel like they don't speak up for themselves. They feel
like they don't honor themselves when they're especially in a
social context. Right. So we'll get the person to talk
(37:03):
about what's happening in their life now, and that activates
this energy packet in their body. And so then I
guide the person into an embodiment practice where I help
them through their breath to bring their awareness further into
their body and identify the sensations that are coming up
as they're thinking about this situation in their life. So
(37:24):
they start toening the sensations, maybe it's a not in
their stomach or tension in their heart, and then we
track the feelings. What does that feel like? Maybe they
describe that they feel like they're carrying this heavy weight
in their stomach that they can't let go of, or
maybe they feel like their chest is going to explode,
and they explain the feelings, and then we get to
the emotional air and once they identify the emotion, maybe
(37:45):
it's fear, maybe it's anger. That emotion is the thread
to the inner child memory that maybe the person doesn't
even remember. So it's not about using their mind to remember,
but we just ask the body and the subconscious to
bring about the memory that's ad with the very first
time the person felt that way, and so instantly they'll
start to see this memory of childhood or this place
(38:08):
or something that's taking place, and as they describe it,
they begin to see their inner child in that situation.
And so what I have them do is recognize the
truth that that little child couldn't fully embrace, couldn't fully
speak of because of the situation, And then what was
the need that was unmeat And so then I have
the person, as the attuned adult that they didn't have
(38:28):
in that moment, enter that scene and begin to meet
the need of that child. And usually it's some form
of reassurance that the child needs some form of safety.
And then I also invite the person to take the
child out of that scene and somewhere else where the
child wants to go, where the child feels safe and
they can explore. So they take them somewhere. Maybe it's
the woods, it's the beach, it's Grandma's house, it's somewhere else.
(38:52):
And then we start to unpack the programming that took place,
so the stories that we tell ourselves about ourselves and
what that meant about us, like it's all my fault
or I don't have the right to exist or something's
wrong with me. These are programs we get that then
repeat through our lifetime. And this actually comes from ancestral trauma.
We inherit these simply by incarnating in certain family lineages
(39:16):
based on the unresolved trauma of that family system. It
gets imprinted on us in the womb and in childhood,
but it's not even ours. It comes from our ancestry.
So I have people then clear these programs and we
download new programs, new experiences from the creator, from God.
So the person begins to have a new experience free
(39:36):
from these old programs. And as we integrate this, they
bring the child into their heart. Then what happens is
their life starts to change. They start to respond differently
to life, they start to feel differently. They start, for example,
in the case of the person who couldn't speak up,
all of a sudden, they start speaking up easier and
without anger and without feeling like they're defensive. They're just
(39:57):
speaking their truth, and their life begins to change. And
so that's the amazing thing about when we integrate these
fragments of our soul, we actually become more whole.
Speaker 2 (40:08):
It's fascinating discussion and we'll have you back even to
talk about things that are happening and how you interpret
them and be fascinating to see your view. So we've
been talking with Meredith Miller. Book Becoming Whole just been published.
I really encourage you to get a copy of It's
a very easy and fast read. I think you'll enjoy it.
(40:29):
It's fascinating and a very interesting perspective which I think
has a lot of merit to it. So thank you Meredith.
We really appreciate it. Again. Your website is.
Speaker 1 (40:40):
Inner Integration dot com.
Speaker 2 (40:42):
And people can reach you through your website. Correct, there's
a way to interact with you so that they can.
We discussed transformative experiences and counseling and how I think
it's a fascinating website, fascinating book, and thank you for
joining us. Thank you so much so doctor Trone Corsi
(41:06):
Coursenation dot com. And in the end, God always wins,
and I think Meredith's work is part of God winning.
So God bless everybody for listening. We are doing podcasts
every weekday. Thank you for joining us, and please take
a look at this book or you won't be disappointed.
You did. God bless thank you for joining us. We're
(41:27):
back tomorrow.
More course, This drone course the end.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Today, we've got a really special guest with us. We'll
bring you the first interview on a newly published book.
It's Meredith Miller, who is joining us. Meredith, how are you.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
I'm good. Thank you so much for inviting me.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Well, your book has just come out here, it's becoming whole,
and in fact, it's one that I helped get. I
was a managing editor on this as an acquiring editor
with post Tail Press. I wanted this book to come
into press. And this is your website, I guess right here.
What is your website, Meredith?
Speaker 3 (00:38):
It is its integration dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Inner Integration dot Com. Okay, I find I think it's
a brilliant book. I really like it a lot, and
I want I want to do it as much as
we can to get people to understand and and buy
it and read it. First of all, give us some
of your background, Meredith. Tell us what your career has
(01:02):
been and how you came to write this book.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
So I've been doing holistic healing for about twenty five years.
I've studied a bunch of different modalities, traveled around the world,
studied with different teachers. I started with more hands on
healing initially, and then I moved into coaching and then
working online in twenty twelve, and for several years I
worked in narcissistic abuse recovery, and then in twenty twenty,
I started hearing the calling to dig deeper in my
(01:28):
own inner healing.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
And as I.
Speaker 3 (01:30):
Began to do that, now I'm working with people who
are further along in the trauma healing process, who want
to transmute their trauma into a new sense of purpose.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Okay, So essentially, are you a psychologist or a psychiatrist.
Speaker 3 (01:45):
I am neither of those. I call myself a coach,
but I work in the holistic world. So that's body, mind, spirits,
that's looking at the human being as a whole.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Okay, So it's more of a holistic approach exactly to
I guess wellness, mental wellness, psychological wellness. And you're coming
at it from the disciplines of holistic methodologies or modalities.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
That's correct.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
So you've studied, then, I'm sure a lot of different
both religions and psychological approaches, and it your book certainly
reflects a lot of thought on how human beings are
put together. And I think a really deep understanding of
narcissism and how people become captive and become held in captivity.
(02:38):
And your subtitle is how to prevent Stockholm syndrome and
transcend darkness in your life and relationships. Okay, So now
what is the Stockholm syndrome?
Speaker 3 (02:51):
So this is a concept that's really misunderstood. I believe
even in the fields of psychology and psychiatry.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
I believe they're taking it very literally.
Speaker 3 (03:00):
So they believe, for example, it came from this bank
heist that took place in Stockholm, Sweden, where people were
held as physical captives in a hostage situation. And so
most psychologists and psychiatrists believe that it can only take
place between strangers and it has to involve physical captivity.
But from my perspective, that's not true, because the subconscious,
(03:23):
whatever you're imagining or remembering, is the same as what's
actually happening in your reality. And so what I discovered
through observing so many different cases of abuse and experiencing
this myself, is that when you believe that you're in
a state of captivity, you believe there's no escape, that's
just as real to you as if you were actually
(03:45):
held in a physical hostage situation. So that's why I
renamed it a state of captivity to help people recognize
this is a state of consciousness, not a state of
physical confinement.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
So in Stockholm syndrome, this incident you refer to, which
very important incident in the history of terrorism or violent
action like terrorism, the victims actually sided with the terrorists.
Is that correct?
Speaker 1 (04:14):
That's true, and so they go ahead. So what happens in.
Speaker 3 (04:18):
These abusive situations is the victim tends to become an
accomplice to the abuse. They participate in the abuse without
realizing what's happening. They're doing this as a survival mechanism.
So they're complying with the abuse and the abuser, and
they begin to believe that the abuser actually cares about
them or wants them to be safe, or wants them
(04:40):
to be healthy.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
You say, and you write in the book, the state
of captivity is an inner state. It is psychological, neurological,
and spiritual. Therefore, it is psycho neeural, spiritual state of captivity.
It's a state of consciousness that becomes a re reality
and doc can you say a subconscious mind cannot differentiate
(05:04):
between what's vividly imagined and what's actually happening. Physical confinement
isn't required because there's a perception of no escape and
that's what matters to subconscious which drives our behavior. Well,
the prison bars may be imaginary, they are very real
to those experiencing them. Okay, so you say yourself, you've
(05:25):
experienced being captivity. You want to give us a little
glimpse of that without necessarily going too deeply, but basically,
what did you experience?
Speaker 3 (05:34):
So I came from a family system where the legacy
of abuse was passed on from generation to generation. In
my particular family, it was sexual abuse and emotional abuse.
It wasn't physical abuse. And so when you grow up
in a family system like that, you get programmed for
life to perceive abuse as love and home. So, of course,
(05:55):
emerging into adulthood, I got myself into all kinds of
relationships and work situations and communities and all kinds of
experiences that was very similar. Because my nervous system was
programmed to recognize that as love and home, my psychology
was programmed to recognize that as the same. And I
was locked in that spiritual state of captivity.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
And you say, there's kind of these different stages of
how this You know, you study a lot of domestic
violence as well, is that right?
Speaker 3 (06:26):
Yeah, And so domestic violence can be physical violence, but
it can also be psychological violence, and that's often what's
not spoken about. Typically when people hear the word abuse,
they imagine a battered woman. But abuse is not always physical,
and the victims of abuse are not always women. The
perpetrators are not always men.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
A woman can be narcissistic and abusive to a husband.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
Correct, and a man could be abused.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
And that's that's usually what people think of domestic violence.
But you're saying that's a form of domestic violence, correct.
And you say that there are a state of captivity
is induced through four specific parameters which have always been
used for the control of domestic violence as well as
an abusive families, workplaces, cults, and society at large. So
(07:17):
versus isolation, physical, psychological, or both second acts of perceived kindness.
There are threats, perceived threats to one's life, and perceived
an ability to escape. So you want to elaborate on that,
explain that to us.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
Yeah, So the isolation is where the abuser positions him
or herself as the sole narrative of reality, So they
will isolate the victims psychologically from external perceptions of reality
that could be your family, your friends, things that you
read online. The abuser has to position themselves as the
one who controls reality and so information control as reality can.
(08:00):
That takes place in relationships just as it does in
a society. So we've been seeing this a lot in society,
and that could also involve some physical isolation where the
abuser will either not allow the victim to see other people,
or they will more covertly plant the idea in the
victim's mind that other people don't have their best interests,
that other people are dangerous. So the victim makes their
(08:22):
own decision assuming that this is the truth. And so
then the second parameter, which is the perceived acts of kindness.
This is what we call love bombing or idealization. So
this is when the abuser maybe tells you that they
want your good, it's for your good, They care about you,
they want to protect you, they want to keep you safe.
(08:44):
They can give you glimpses of hope, they can flatter you.
Flattery is actually one of their chief tools that they
use to get you to trust them. So the whole
goal of the perceived kindness is to get you to
trust the abuser. But this is also intermittent re enforcement
because it goes back and forth between the love bombing,
the flattery, the giving of resources or anything that they
(09:08):
know that the victim needs, and then it alternates with
acts of cruelty and devaluation, and as that goes back
and forth, that causes cognitive dissonance. So even though the
person recognizes some things are off and something doesn't feel right,
it's these acts of perceived kindness that cause the person
to keep reverting back to that state of trust. And
(09:29):
then the third one is the perceived life threat, and
so the abuser will either threaten your life or threaten
the lives of your family or loved ones if you
don't comply, or what they'll do is manufacture or take
advantage of something that's occurring in the environment, like a
disease or a war or something external that's a life threat,
(09:53):
and they'll position themselves as your hero as your protector
at the same time. And then the fourth parameter is
where the person believes there's no escape, and so this
is where they begin to comply to fund to participate
in the abuse because they believe there's no sense in leaving.
Even domestic violence victims who leave the house multiple times
(10:15):
a day to go to the grocery store, go to work,
take the kids to school, they keep coming home because
deep down, psychologically and spiritually, neurologically, they're trapped in that
state of captivity and they believe that they can't leave
or they can't survive outside of that relationship, family system,
or community.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
One of the things I found really fascinating about your
book is that you also show this in social settings,
so you are able to analyze the pandemic as a
societal case of abuse in captivity and that it was
engineered in order to hold us captive, to make us
(10:58):
experience this kind of lack of ability to control our
own destiny or to do anything. You want to elaborate
on that, because I think that was one of the
more fascinating parts of your book, your discussions of how
the pandemic and your whole understanding of narcissism and these
(11:19):
captive relationships really are equivalent.
Speaker 3 (11:23):
So it's the same patterns from the micro to the
macro in society, whether we're talking interpersonal relationships, family systems, workplaces,
or society, and what we saw during the COVID campaign
was the setup for the Stockholm syndrome and the state
of captivity. So first they physically isolated people, then they
psychologically isolated people. They made the official narrative the only
(11:47):
acceptable version of reality, which is disseminated via our devices.
So as people were trapped at home, all they had
with their connection to the outside world was their devices.
They would go on social media and they would hear
all of this repeated. There was lots of censorship and
suppression of information so that only certain amounts of information
could come out. And then everyone, even doctors who spoke
(12:09):
against that narrative, were smeared, were ostracized, We're threatened. And
then the perceived acts of kindness. You know, all along
they told us it was for our good, it's because
they cared, it's for our health, they want to keep
us safe. And of course, you know, they offered money,
They offered all kinds of incentives for people to stay home,
to not work, to get the shots. And then the
(12:31):
perceived life threat, of course, was the virus or other
people as vectors of the virus, which they painted as
this very deadly thing. And then for those people who
were more awake about what was happening. That threat of
tyranny was a very real life threat. So everyone experienced
that to some dery or another, and then the perceived
(12:51):
inability to escape the only you know, they set everything
up so that it seemed that there was no end
to this torture, and the one and only escape from
that was to get vaccinated. And then you can get
back to your life. You can see your loved ones again,
you can go to concerts, you can go to restaurants,
you could travel, you could go to school, you could work.
And so they carefully created this environment to make people
(13:14):
believe that there was no escape other than that.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
And the idea is submit, submit to and comply being vaccinated,
and to see a whole narrative in which if you object,
everyone turns on you and the disconnection is intentionally engineered.
(13:38):
Even though the entire campaign is based on lies and
emotional manipulation, that people you know went along with all
of the requirements of compliance to the medical protocol distancing
(13:58):
wearing masks. It felt like there was no choice. And
so it's in a similar way to the pattern of
of us being an abusive relationship. Well the same kinds
of things happen on an individual basis or family basis,
(14:20):
and you're you're seeing the same pattern. Is that correct?
Speaker 1 (14:23):
That's correct.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
That divide and conquer tactic that you mentioned is key
in any abusive situation. The abuser has to get everyone
to direct their all their entire loyalty toward the abuser
and to see each other with distrust. They have to
separate us so that we can't connect and realize that
there's a lot more of us than the abusers.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
Okay, now, so while you're describing the problem and go through,
you know all the first part of the book, the
book is becoming whole. So you're really writing this to
explain to you how you get out of this trap.
You want to explain to that, to us, how what
can you do once you realize you're in this situation?
What did you do when you realize you were in
(15:09):
the situation?
Speaker 3 (15:10):
Yeah, So the trauma of this is very fragmenting, and
that's why I describe becoming whole because that wholeness is
the healing process after trauma. It's reintegrating ourselves after this
incredible damaging experiences happen. So the very first thing is
the truth that we have to accept, and the first
(15:30):
level of that is external, so a person has to
realize what the abuser is doing and what's happening to them,
and that's unfortunate where most people get trapped. Even those
who wake up to that and understand they've been abused
and who the abuser is, they often get stuck there
in that external focus. That's the victimhood, the powerlessness. The
next level of truth is the internal truth, and that's
(15:53):
where we accept our self responsibility and recognize how we
were participating, not that the abuse was our fault, but
that we each are participating in our reality and we
made certain choices. We stayed when we experienced that sense
of something was off. We somehow participated in our own captivity.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
And when we can be.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
Honest with ourselves and start to recognize that, that's the
point of empowerment. That's where we recognize that our choice
is our power and we can start to make new choices.
And the next hurdle that people run into, which I
named as the fifth parameter of the Stockholm syndrome or
state of captivity, which isn't discussed. It's almost like a
tripwire that happens once a person wakes up to the abuse,
(16:34):
they get so focused on the injustice that happened that
they developed this attachment to it. And I lived my
whole life, most of my life like this, where I
just saw all the injustice and all I could think
about was all the injustice that happened to me, and
that kept me in this repetitive loop of more injustices
happening to me. And I see a lot of us
(16:54):
falling into that now in society, where we're so focused
on all the injustices that happened in the crime against
humanity that we aren't able to start the healing process.
So that's an interesting thing that happens once a person
wakes up. And then once we start to dig further
into the wholeness and the restoration of ourselves after the abuse,
(17:15):
we're going to need to look at our self worth.
And that's really our biggest immunity against abuse is rebuilding
our self worth, because the abusers tear down your self worth.
Some people maybe never even knew what having self worth
is because they grow up in family systems like this.
But when we know our worthiness and we have the
boundaries and we know we have the right to set
(17:36):
those boundaries to protect our worthiness.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
We become immune to the abuse.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
We are easily able to say no and to opt
out and to recognize have that spiritual discernment that something
is wrong. So rebuilding self worth is really key. And
another part I describe is the growing up process. And
so each of us has experienced traumas in childhood.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
Even when we think.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
Our child was great, typically when people say that there
was a case of emotional neglect things that were even
normalized as cultures, that's just the way things were, and
we don't recognize how that affects us in our lives.
And so when we go back and we do our
inner child healing work and we start to reintegrate these
soul fragments from childhood from adolescence, we start growing up,
(18:22):
we start becoming responsible adults. And once we become responsible adults,
then we have more access to these higher states of
consciousness like creativity, intuition, insight, imagination, critical thinking, which we
don't have access to when we keep getting triggered into
these trauma responses like the fight flight, freeze and fun.
(18:43):
And so really building resilience is this process of facing
the trauma experiencing the feelings, honoring our experience of what happened,
and then digesting those feelings, so not getting stuck in
the pain, but allowing that pain to be recognized instead
of pushing it away, instead of aaping it, instead of
avoiding it, and allowing it to be digested so that
(19:04):
we can integrate the gifts, because every traumatic experience that happened,
including what's been happening in the world, contains these gems,
these gifts that we can integrate afterward, new levels of strength,
new wisdom that we can integrate. And in doing this process,
we're not only restoring our own wholeness, we're also changing
the future for the next generation so that we don't
(19:27):
pass forward this burden of unresolved trauma like those who
came before us.
Speaker 2 (19:33):
Several passages in the book that I'm really particularly interesting,
and the book we're talking about again is becoming whole,
and it's why Meredith Miller we're interviewing today and some
titles how to Prevent Stockholm Syndrome and Transcend Darkness in
your life and relationships. I really recommended it. I wanted
this book to be published, and I'm very pleased with
(19:55):
how it's come out. I think you did an excellent
job writing this, Meredith. It's very readable.
Speaker 3 (20:00):
I'm very grateful to you, because if it wasn't for you,
this book couldn't have happened.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
Well it's I'm glad it's happening, and now we've got
to make sure people know about it and read it.
I think it's very important you talk about interesting discussion
about Stewart Brand, who is a Stanford trained idealist and
systems thinker. In nineteen sixty six he started saying, you know,
why haven't we seen a photograph of the whole Earth yet?
(20:28):
I made buttons and sold them at college campuses, and
they sent them to scientists, engineers, policymakers at NASA. He
wanted to get a image of the whole earth. We
had never seen the Earth from a perspective outside the Earth.
Well we could. And then, of course, when the Apollo
eight mission took that famous earth rise photograph with one
(20:51):
of the astronauts, William Anders, the world had his first
view of Earth rising as the sun rises above the earth,
or appears to dawn. Well, the Earth rose above the
sun as it were as dawn and the moon, and
so tell us about why that photograph was so important
(21:13):
and what the evolution of that was all about.
Speaker 3 (21:16):
So that chapter is on the liminal spaces, these in
between worlds that we're in when something traumatic happens, for example,
and the world is no longer the same, our life
is no longer the same as it was before that trauma.
But we're not fully in this new world yet, and
so I'm describing where we are as society. We're in
this weird state where lots of people are describing life
(21:37):
as surreal things, so very surreal. The COVID thing happened
and then it just went away as if it never happened,
and people are in this limbo state, and so I
was describing some of the progression and history that took
place in the liminality and how art is often used
as a powerful transformative tool and that can be used
for healing trauma, but it can also be used as
(22:00):
propaganda and weaponization. And there's often this talk about unity
and how you know, unity is the most important thing,
and we just all need to get together and unify
and everything's going to be all right. And that sounds great,
except when you're talking about dealing with abusers, because if
you unite with abusers, that puts you in danger.
Speaker 1 (22:23):
And oftentimes we.
Speaker 3 (22:24):
Are brought together in political campaigns that offer unity that
aren't for our highest good, that have subtle manipulation in
the subtext. And so this earth rise image was really
interesting because you know, they had made sure that so
many people around the world could see this broadcast, so
that everyone was entering this collective awe.
Speaker 1 (22:47):
And there was reason for feeling that awe.
Speaker 3 (22:49):
It was the first time people had seen allegedly this
view of the Earth from a spaceship orbiting the Moon.
But also I believe that was used to manipulate people.
And when we see how that started to create this
progression in the technological developments that took place in the
(23:09):
control grid being created with the technology, I'm urging some
caution because I feel like our earth Rise moment is
coming that perhaps there will be some image or some
form of art or something that involves outer space or
technology in some kind of way that may be used
to manipulate us to open to something that may or
(23:31):
may not have our best interests at hands.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
It's a fascinating to talk about the avant garde art.
You know, the World War One and world War two
era with all the surrealism and how it reframed our
I meant reality one if you discuss how that goes
together with your discussion of the earth rise.
Speaker 1 (23:54):
Yeah, So after.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
World War One and the so called Spanish flu pandemic
that was in the nineteen twenty is when surrealism emerged
as a form of art. And from my perspective, it
seems that they were trying to make sense of the
absurdity and the destruction and the horrific things that had
taken place in the world, which most people were not
able to talk about, were not able to address, much
(24:17):
like what's happening now one hundred years later, what's happened
in the last several years, we're not talking about it.
And so I believe that the artists were trying to
bring out from the subconscious these ideas and help people
to They were trying to help themselves process it, but
also offering this opportunity for people to see this art
and perhaps have a transformative experience and be able to
(24:38):
process what was going on. And so as time went on,
then you know, there was the Depression, and there was
World War Two, and the surrealists were still making art,
and they were persecuted by the Nazis actually as degenerative
art and producing these ideas that were unacceptable at the time.
And so the avant garde that's an interesting military term
because this is like a reconnaissance that goes out ahead
(25:01):
of the main army, and so they're scouting the terrain ahead.
And the avant garde artists their role in society, which
Benjamin Olinde Rodriguez said, the artist has a moral obligation
to be the avant garde of the species, to bring
these these themes into the collective consciousness that people aren't
ready perhaps to see. And so so Andre Bertone came
(25:26):
up with the concept of convulsive beauty, which is like
something contradictory, something that's shocking or surprising, that's so beautiful
that it touches the pain and it makes you cry.
And that's the interesting thing is that grief actually transmutes
through convulsive beauty.
Speaker 1 (25:45):
And so I believe that.
Speaker 3 (25:47):
The artists of our time are being called to create
some kind of avant garde art. It may not be
physical like the paintings and whatnot that we're done one
hundred years ago, because I think nowadays when people are
craving so much is a sense of connection and participation,
and so I believe that the avant garde art of
our time is going to have something to do with
(26:08):
a collective container of people coming together where they can
experience something artistic that allows them to contact that pain
and transmute it so that we can heal from the
trauma that's taken place.
Speaker 2 (26:22):
It kind of fascinating discussion about how humans are creating
technology in the image of our biology, that the binary
code of computers is like our nervous system functions, that
we're getting increasingly dependent on technology, the point where we're
interacting more with our devices than with other human beings.
(26:44):
And so you write this paragraph up. Children nowadays are born,
they're called digital natives.
Speaker 3 (26:52):
You know, a four year.
Speaker 2 (26:52):
Old kid usually knows more about how about using your
smartphone and tablet than you do. That's because she was
born with the upgraded tech package in her nervous system,
which inherited from her parents, who were trained to use
the devices. So you say, h new generation's biology is
becoming more integrated with the technology of vice versa. Well,
(27:15):
many think that transhumanism is something of a far fetched future.
I would assert that the merging of humans and AI
is already underway. That's very interesting. Why don't you elaborate
on that.
Speaker 3 (27:27):
So this is part of what I'm calling the pandemic
of disconnection, and I believe this is the pandemic that's
going to have long lasting generational impacts, not this so
called virus that took place. And what's happening is we're
more disconnected now than ever. This didn't start with COVID.
It started actually with the digital age, and so as
the technology was increasingly being introduced, we've been slowly but
(27:50):
surely socially engineered to coregulate more with our devices than
with humans. As mammals, our nervous systems are meant to
coregulate with one another. We're meant to feel this sense
of safety together when we're not in a state of
defensiveness like fight, flight, freeze, and fun. So when we're
in a state of neurological balance, we're able to have
(28:11):
this healthy connection that actually creates a sense of homeostasis
in our holistic health. And so during COVID, what happened
is we were isolated, we were kept at home, and
there was this social engineering to make us turn more
toward our devices than ever. People became more dependent on
their devices, working from home, everything eat. Children who didn't
(28:33):
go to school were left on their devices. And so
what's happening is we're becoming more disconnected from one another,
and we're being led into this world where we're trained
to coregulate with our devices. If you're standing in line
at Starbucks or somewhere, people aren't talking, everybody's looking at
their device. As soon as people get anxious, they pick
up the phone, they pick up their device. When two
(28:54):
people are sitting at a table, they did a study
a few years ago. If there's a cell phone on
the table, whether it's face up or face down, both
people are hesitant to get into a deep conversation because
both of our nervous systems are anticipating that someone's going
to reach for that phone and interrupt that connection. So
we have these children now who came into the world
having no understanding of what is life or what is
(29:17):
relationship before the devices. You and I come from generations
where we remember life before the Internet and before these devices.
We remember human connection before all of that. They have
no background experience of that. So my calling is for
us to pay attention and recognize what's happening. Because these
children are going to grow up. What is life and
(29:39):
relationships going to be like for them when they have
no background understanding of connection without these devices.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
It's you say, one thing is certain, although paradox, our
human experience is fractured yet interconnected, whether you're aware of
it or not. We are all searching for meaning amidst
the chaos, trauma, and shock. Here the shadow of the
threshold that leads to our future. We are navigating the
liminal spaces together, yet we are more isolated than ever.
(30:11):
That's an interesting concept too though, so that you know,
the isolation that's brought on by all these devices is
again when when you go through your cycle of isolation
and you know, occasional acts of kindness and the whole
(30:31):
feeling you're trapped and you can't get out. You know,
we're really trapped in this internet, technical device world. How
do you function if you don't function within that world?
Speaker 3 (30:44):
You know?
Speaker 2 (30:44):
I mean it's like if someone says, you know, to me.
I got to ask the other day what was life
like before we had these devices? And I said, you
mean these surveillance instruments that we're carrying around. You know,
we don't realize that. You know, we are entering into
a world where we are submitting to every action that
(31:06):
we are undertaking being monitored, and that's full. I mean,
that's isolation. It's interconnected, but it's also interconnected isolation, which
is I mean, what a comment on that? What I mean,
I see that as being one of the great threats
of the.
Speaker 3 (31:26):
Future, absolutely, because simulation is replacing connection. It's a false
sense of intimacy, a false sense of connection that we
have through these devices. You and are having this connection now,
which is amazing because of the technology. And at the
same time, we're not connecting in person, which is that
mammalian coregulation piece. Like, there's some degree of that that
(31:49):
happens online, but it's not the same. And so it's
really concerning where this is going because our nervous systems
are being changed by these devices, because it's the same
language that our nervous system speaks. That transhumanism is already
happening right now. The device is external, but it probably
won't be that long before they offer us a solution
(32:11):
where the device is implanted inside of our bodies for
convenience or for your good in some kind of way,
and that's really alarming. And so this is my calling
to humanity to recognize what's happening, because we're losing our
ability to connect. And I'm concerned where this goes for
future generations that they lose this ability to connect, then
(32:32):
they're entirely plugged into this hive mind through the technology,
which is increasing at a rate far faster than we
are able to adapt. In the past, the increase in
technology was quite slow over time, and people had a
chance to adapt slowly. But now we're reaching that vertical
part of the curve where it's exponential growth. It's happening
(32:55):
so fast, and we are so traumatized and shut down
from what has happened in our world that we're just
kind of drifting into this. And so most people aren't
even paying attention because they're barely surviving at this point.
Speaker 2 (33:10):
And you talk a lot about the childhood trauma and
how it gets unresolved and we don't become responsible adults
because we have not handled our wounded inner child. Want
to talk about that, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (33:30):
So these are the childhood experiences that we have, and
you know, we can acknowledge that without blaming our parents.
We can acknowledge that everybody has experienced childhood trauma to
some degree. So what happens is it fragments the soul
and they are like these parts of our soul that
are exiled from us. And so life events happen and
(33:50):
things trigger those inner child parts. So when something happens
that reminds our nervous system of something that happened in
the past that was unresolved, we instantly get triggered into
this inner child state. So when people are reacting as children,
we see this frequently online. All of this it's almost
(34:11):
like toddlers yelling at one another are fighting. It's inner
child that's being triggered. And so unfortunately, nowadays in relationships
when people meet, instead of people meeting, it's more like
trauma meeting trauma and people triggering one another's trauma and
defense mechanisms, and it's very challenging for people to connect
without doing that inner child work, and they don't understand
(34:33):
what's actually happening. So this is why it's so important
to integrate these childlike parts, because we're still living in
this even though we are adults. It's like being a
child in an adult body until we integrate these parts
of ourselves, and the inner adolescent is very similar, but
it's a little bit different. The adolescent is the part
of us that wants to protect us, that rebeld against
(34:56):
whatever was happening. And we were very little children, we
just had to come to survive. Most of us learned
that we can't fight that there's nowhere else to go,
that you either escape in some kind of way through
fantasy or video games or food or something like that.
And then by the time we get into adolescent now,
we start to rebel against that to some degree. And
(35:17):
what happens is it's challenging to hate our parents or
to hate something that's happening in our environment, so we
direct that hatred inward, and a lot of us are
caring self hatred that plays out in our relationships as
hating one another, but it's actually our self hatred. And
so integrating these parts of ourselves and processing what happen
(35:38):
and then envisioning something different happening is what actually changes things,
because our subconscious can't tell the difference between what we're
vividly imagining and what's actually happening. So we can integrate
these parts of ourselves and become responsible adults who don't
get so triggered, who are more capable of being present,
who are more capable of accessing these higher states of
(35:58):
consciousness instead of getting triggered into these defensive primal states.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
We're talking with Meredith Miller and the book is Becoming Whole.
We just recently published and it's one that I wanted
to get published on managing what. We're acquiring editor at
Postal Press, and this is the book we wanted to publish,
how to prevent Stockholm syndrome and transcend darkness in your
(36:26):
life and relationships, And we're going to have you back.
I want to kind of like out last question. When
you're counseling people, where do you start and how does
your counseling sessions go? What do you do with people
to get them to become whole?
Speaker 3 (36:41):
So I don't counsel like coach people, but the work
that I do is holistic and so a person will
come to me with what they're struggling with in their life,
like for example, maybe they feel like they're not speaking up.
They really want to step into their purpose, but they
feel like they don't speak up for themselves. They feel
like they don't honor themselves when they're especially in a
social context. Right. So we'll get the person to talk
(37:03):
about what's happening in their life now, and that activates
this energy packet in their body. And so then I
guide the person into an embodiment practice where I help
them through their breath to bring their awareness further into
their body and identify the sensations that are coming up
as they're thinking about this situation in their life. So
(37:24):
they start toening the sensations, maybe it's a not in
their stomach or tension in their heart, and then we
track the feelings. What does that feel like? Maybe they
describe that they feel like they're carrying this heavy weight
in their stomach that they can't let go of, or
maybe they feel like their chest is going to explode,
and they explain the feelings, and then we get to
the emotional air and once they identify the emotion, maybe
(37:45):
it's fear, maybe it's anger. That emotion is the thread
to the inner child memory that maybe the person doesn't
even remember. So it's not about using their mind to remember,
but we just ask the body and the subconscious to
bring about the memory that's ad with the very first
time the person felt that way, and so instantly they'll
start to see this memory of childhood or this place
(38:08):
or something that's taking place, and as they describe it,
they begin to see their inner child in that situation.
And so what I have them do is recognize the
truth that that little child couldn't fully embrace, couldn't fully
speak of because of the situation, And then what was
the need that was unmeat And so then I have
the person, as the attuned adult that they didn't have
(38:28):
in that moment, enter that scene and begin to meet
the need of that child. And usually it's some form
of reassurance that the child needs some form of safety.
And then I also invite the person to take the
child out of that scene and somewhere else where the
child wants to go, where the child feels safe and
they can explore. So they take them somewhere. Maybe it's
the woods, it's the beach, it's Grandma's house, it's somewhere else.
(38:52):
And then we start to unpack the programming that took place,
so the stories that we tell ourselves about ourselves and
what that meant about us, like it's all my fault
or I don't have the right to exist or something's
wrong with me. These are programs we get that then
repeat through our lifetime. And this actually comes from ancestral trauma.
We inherit these simply by incarnating in certain family lineages
(39:16):
based on the unresolved trauma of that family system. It
gets imprinted on us in the womb and in childhood,
but it's not even ours. It comes from our ancestry.
So I have people then clear these programs and we
download new programs, new experiences from the creator, from God.
So the person begins to have a new experience free
(39:36):
from these old programs. And as we integrate this, they
bring the child into their heart. Then what happens is
their life starts to change. They start to respond differently
to life, they start to feel differently. They start, for example,
in the case of the person who couldn't speak up,
all of a sudden, they start speaking up easier and
without anger and without feeling like they're defensive. They're just
(39:57):
speaking their truth, and their life begins to change. And
so that's the amazing thing about when we integrate these
fragments of our soul, we actually become more whole.
Speaker 2 (40:08):
It's fascinating discussion and we'll have you back even to
talk about things that are happening and how you interpret
them and be fascinating to see your view. So we've
been talking with Meredith Miller. Book Becoming Whole just been published.
I really encourage you to get a copy of It's
a very easy and fast read. I think you'll enjoy it.
(40:29):
It's fascinating and a very interesting perspective which I think
has a lot of merit to it. So thank you Meredith.
We really appreciate it. Again. Your website is.
Speaker 1 (40:40):
Inner Integration dot com.
Speaker 2 (40:42):
And people can reach you through your website. Correct, there's
a way to interact with you so that they can.
We discussed transformative experiences and counseling and how I think
it's a fascinating website, fascinating book, and thank you for
joining us. Thank you so much so doctor Trone Corsi
(41:06):
Coursenation dot com. And in the end, God always wins,
and I think Meredith's work is part of God winning.
So God bless everybody for listening. We are doing podcasts
every weekday. Thank you for joining us, and please take
a look at this book or you won't be disappointed.
You did. God bless thank you for joining us. We're
(41:27):
back tomorrow.
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