November 6, 2023 • 35 mins
In episode 3, Val, Tonia, Keisher & J.R. are back to discuss part 2 of The Chatter. Specifically, the chatter that was revealed after they learned that Val was confirmed as their sister. Also, Keisher has a question for her sibs, and herself, to answer. Enjoy and thanks for listening!
Please send questions to info@godefylife.com or message us on Facebook (Crossroads Pod) or Instagram (@GoDefyLife)
Host: Keisher
Co-hosts: Val, Tonia, J.R.
Please send questions to info@godefylife.com or message us on Facebook (Crossroads Pod) or Instagram (@GoDefyLife)
Host: Keisher
Co-hosts: Val, Tonia, J.R.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hey, welcome to the Crossroads Podcast. We are on episode number three.
This's called the Chatter Part Baby.Yeah, it was so deep last time
we had to come back with thepart too. So we are here.
I welcome my siblings, the beautifulBig Sister, the original Big Sister,
(00:25):
Tanya, the mic drop Valve,Hey, Hey, hey, I'm here,
and then bringing up the rear,my brother the Encore Jr. As
always, what's up y'all? AndI'm your host today the remix Keisha Glen.
So yeah, let's go ahead andcontinue from last time, right.
(00:47):
We got into some of the chatter, some of the background story, and
val you know, share with usher twelve year old experience. We got
to talk a little bit about,you know, some of the rounding noise,
but we didn't get into some ofthe other chaddar that went down so
(01:07):
over the years we have well beforeI even go into that, for those
of you who are joining us forthe very first time, we really decided
to come and share our story.You know, we have a sibling ship
that is unique and it just continuesto blossom, and so we were inspired
(01:27):
to come and share our story withyou, whether you map it on in
your life, or you just usethis for entertainment yourself. So here we
go. Yeah, last time wetalked a bit about the background and how
we got how it all kind ofgot found out. But what I want
to know is what we didn't getto ask is really about some of the
(01:52):
some of the things that were saidover the years. Once we kind of
got it confirmed, right, andthen you know, we start hearing things
that we didn't know, you know, things to start unfolding two in that
unfolding, let's see, what's myquestion? In the unfolding, we found
(02:16):
out what was some of the backgroundthings that you heard, like in your
family vow along the way, andthen you know, once you met some
of our you know, some ofthe family members on this side, right,
like, what what did you hearalong the way along the way?
(02:36):
Excuse me? Once it was confirmedor yeah, because I think last time
we talked, I did ask aboutwhat was the chatter prior to it being
confirmed, And it wasn't really thatmuch that you had heard along the way,
right, It's more so once itwas confirmed, and that was December,
early December of twenty twenty, wegot that confirmation. So what did
(03:00):
you start hearing well, unfortunately,you know, that's what twenty five years,
thirty years later, you know,and I lost a lot of family
members, so it wasn't many thatI can go to and talk to about.
So I do have an uncle,my favorite uncle, my only uncle,
(03:21):
that's life. And he was thesecond person that I felt that it
was important that he knew what Idid. You was the first, and
he was the second. And whenI called him, he wasn't really surprised.
It was more so like, well, yeah, that's about right,
you know, And and I was, and I was really stunned and crazy
(03:49):
enough, he knew exactly what Dadwas going through the latter part of his
life, and I felt kind ofa way, even though it was not
confirmed, but he never shared anyof this with me, you know,
the same things you would tell mewhat he was going through, he pretty
much knew. And I was likewow, Like so I felt I was
(04:12):
really stunned, and I was Iwouldn't say disappointed, but I was very
emotional. And he pretty much waslike he shared things here and there,
and I shared this with Keisha beforethat. I kept back my feelings about
it because I wanted him to sharemore. But Honestly, I was kind
(04:35):
of upset. I was upset thethings he would share with me, and
I would just blow it off onKech's like, oh, he just told
me this, but I would neversay that to him because I wanted him
to be comfortable telling me these things, you know, So like for one,
for instance, he told me thatit was very close with my uncles,
(04:58):
the glimpse it was, you know, he he hung out with them
in Brooklyn, and you know,they knew each other, and he has
pictures of me sitting on a particularuncle's lap and and talk and shared with
me how he brought me an outfitwhen I was younger. So these things,
you know, was shocking because I'venever heard any of this, you
know. So that's some of thechatter I heard, like immediately after it
(05:25):
was confirmed. Yeah, that mademe very emotional, and you was like,
okay, you know, but itwas tough, right, It was
really tough. But yeah, yeah, that was a lot to walk through
and to to kind of deal with, To be confronted really with the fact
that you in your belief right,he didn't know you until later, He
(05:47):
didn't know about you, right,and so to learn that he actually showed
up in your life and then noone, no one shared it. Right,
it's a lot to digest. Yeah, so did you ever did you?
Did you ever talk about it withhim about how you felt? Absolutely
(06:09):
not? And the reason why,the reason why every time I talk to
him, I get a little morethan another nugget, you know, or
if I don't get the nugget,my husband does and we go, you
know, like Honda, that's anotherone, you know. So so I
don't think I'm angry anymore. Ijust don't want him to stop sharing,
(06:30):
because again, he's from that erathat it didn't share, it pitched up
under the rug. So I don'tshare my true feelings or my initial true
feelings because I want him to continueto continue to speak about it. Yeah,
because I think I fear that ifI do, he's gonna shut down,
you know. Yeah, Yeah,I think I think too. There's
(06:53):
a you know, all of itis a process. It's all a process,
right, And so like now thatyour feelings are are shifting and half
shifted, then you know, atsome point maybe you will and it'll be
it'll be a different experience. Butwhat was what was awesome too is some
of the other chatter like you heardthat, but then also once you came
(07:16):
to uh we had an event,a family event, and you came to
that event, and one of ourother uncles, one of the glim uncles,
right, was able to care moreinsight, right, yeah, yes,
so actually it was it was theevent was when I very first met
Jr. And Taya, Right,I came down. I believe it was
(07:41):
in May and I was able andbirthday, Yeah, absolutely, yep.
So I came down and my daughterTorri, we both came down and I
met one of the uncles and heshared with me at that time that him
and Tommy dad came to the hospitalwhen I was born. And that was
(08:05):
another shocker, you know, likethis is something that I never knew,
never heard, never was whispered byanyone from the conversations I've had with Dad
over the years, you know,he never shared that with me. I
believe I shared last episode that youknow, I was always under the impression
from him off just from myself makingthis up in my mind that he only
(08:30):
found out about me when I wasthree years old. So to hear that
he was at the hospital the dayI was born was kind of like what
you know. So it's just it'syeah, it just feels like, you
know, I don't know, maybeI would have took the test even quicker
if I just knew these little bitsof chatter going around, you know.
(08:52):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, thatwas a shock or too. Yeah,
And it's it's interesting too, becauseyou know when you think about things in
your life, and we can alwaysbe hypothetical, Well it might look different
if da da da, and itmight have, but then we really won't
go because we also still had thatother component, right, the component of
(09:15):
your mother and her thoughts around itand how she felt about it, amaturity
and maturity. All right. Yeah, there's a lot of information for anyone
that was twelve or twenty to reallyprocess, you know, absolutely, you
know, I think we're all ina different place than we was then.
Yeah. Yeah, in us talkingright now, I'm having thinking about the
(09:41):
first time I met you and Icome to visit New York, New Jersey,
and I came to your job,and I just remember us be sitting
in the lobby and talking, andI don't remember the whole conversation, but
I do remember us trying together,and I remember me asking you, like,
(10:01):
do you think you can go therest of your life not knowing.
And you said, no, Idon't think I could tell I don't think
I can go life. And I'mlike, all right, but we need
to go ahead and get I'm justsad, you know, but it I
mean, And that was I don'tknow how many years that would have been
played. That was in nineteen ninetyeight. I was gonna say eight ninety
(10:22):
eight or ninety nine, right,and so yeah, so it's all just
it's all the process, and thathappened, as we have mentioned in Divine
Time, right, good stuff.Did y'all have anything follow up that y'all
want to ask, because I havea have like a little bonus question for
y'all everyone, right, not justme. Everyone. You're not on the
(10:48):
right everyone, you're not on thehot stand. Matter of fact, you
don't have you don't get to gofirst this time. Well you can rest
for a second, all right.So this is another one of those hypotheticals.
Okay, So put yourself in theshoes of any of the adults that
(11:11):
nu Val was Dad's child, right, and what do you think you would
have done? So you can chooseDad's shoes, Mary's shoes or any other
family member's shoes. What do youthink you would have What do you think
(11:31):
you would have done? What doyou think that? Everybody always want to
go I'll go first. Wow,Like it's so hard to say. Again,
it's hypothetical, so we don't youknow, it's so hard to actually
(11:54):
No, But from Pops perspective andknowing how you have to navigate around you
know, the feelings and your respectfor your wife, that would be it.
(12:15):
That would be tough. And justwe all know how decisions and choices
and actions of our past eventually alwayscome back, right, whether it come
back to bite us or to blessus, right and knowing, So are
(12:39):
you asking me in the perspective ofwhat I think Pop was thinking or what
I would have done? No,what you would have done? And I'm
asking because it is it's hypothetical.And I just said like hypothetical, like
we don't know, Like we reallydon't know, but I'm asking let me
add this tippit. It's more fromlike understanding who you are right right in
(13:01):
that particular situation. Now, ofcourse it's a completely different time and who
you are has a lot to dowith it. Yeah, you know,
And I'm also trying to think ofit from the like me as a twenty
year old. Yeah, yeah,exactly, like so so now, of
(13:22):
course, you know, like myanswer and my actions, I would like
to think it would be more youknow, like dignified and respectful, but
as an eighteen year old like andthat's why I asked that question, because
even more so with Pop because Iknow he avoided confrontation and issues like the
(13:46):
plague and so on top of himbeing eighteen and being who he was,
I know he was like I ain'ttrying to deal with that. So and
like most ten year old boys atthe time and and so including me,
(14:07):
I know I would have when Iwould have been scared out of you know,
and having it come like back uprecurringly throughout your life and never dealing
with it like like geez, likeI thought about it, right, I've
(14:37):
never even thought about it that way, because like I'm thinking of all,
like you know, like all thelittle stuff that I've done throughout my life
that came back to like, ohman, now I gotta deal with it.
Mm hmmm. But the whole person, Yeah, the whole person come
(14:58):
back and and then he's just likeso then there comes the and I'm sure
he had to deal with this aswell. Then there comes the guilt and
like the what ifs and the whatifs moving backwards and the what IF's moving
(15:18):
forward, and then also questioning yourselfas a father, as a husband,
as a man, and just afamily member overall, like what you know,
just questioning those things because you know, Pop was you know, a
great father and an amazing provider,and so I'm sure those questions probably came
(15:43):
in and said, like what doesthis do to me as far as not
only the perception of what people haveof me, but my perception of myself?
And am I really the man Ithought I was? And never having
to deal with it allows you tocomfort and not having to answer those questions,
(16:03):
hey man, yeah right, it'sso deep. Yeah, that's why
I hate hypotheticals, man, right, because it really isn't you know it?
And really I asked it more fromthe opportunity to put ourselves in those
shoes. You know what I'm saying, it's not because there really is no
(16:26):
You can never answer that, youknow. It always amazes me sometimes you
hear people been like talking about,you know, slavery, If I was,
if I was the boy. Iwould like, we're completely different beings
and that's why I felt but yeah, right right, so yeah, so
(16:55):
it's it's an opportunity to look andso thank you ja, yeah, because
that just opens up. It helpseven just hearing it, you know,
just the conflict, and not evenfrom everybody else's shoes, like his siblings
and like we talked about last week, the chatter we heard of, oh
they all got kids somewhere, Andthen it's like, well if I help
(17:18):
him acknowledge it, when it's thespotlight gonna be on me now, right,
yep. I always call it likeyou ain't nobody the bear, ain't
poking the bear, like I alwayssay, like you know, when somebody
trying not to be seen, it'slike you know, like you turn on
the lights and the roach just sitsstill. Yeah yeah, you go outside
(17:40):
and the bug stop moving, andlike maybe if I just sit still,
they won't see me, right,But like yeah, so you know,
having so not only would that openup so like that Pandora's box for him,
but for everybody else. It's likeI'm just gonna keep my hands off
of it, because if I touchit, then I got to deal with
my own stuff. Yeah, yeah, so true, so true. Yeah
(18:08):
yeah, thank you, yeah,thank you. Yeah, all right,
all right, Tandiya, I don'tknow if I can answer that question from
back then, So I want toanswer it from my perspective now, And
(18:32):
I'm gonna sit in my mom's shoesmm hmm. Knowing now, if I
had known then what I know now, then I would have encouraged him to
find out if if this is indeedyour child, that is your seed,
what happens between the two of us? I mean, I mean and they
(18:55):
ended up divorcing. There is nolong no, there was no longer a
Timmel in my life, but therewas always av that will forever be your
daughter. Seek to find out orto rule out whatever the case may be.
And so I think now I wouldhave been an encouragure for him to
(19:15):
confirm and should things work out betweenthe two of us, things will work
out between the two of us,and it was meant to be. It
would be very difficult, you know, I think back to when I was
eighteen, it would be very difficultto answer that question, and mom shoes
from back then. You know,when you think that who you think is
(19:37):
the love of your life that youcan't live without. At eighteen years old,
we know, time to get lucky, and they did. They had
a great marriage up until it ended. But I don't know if I could
answer that question from her perspective backthen, so I just chose to answer
it from where I sit now.Yeah. Yeah, No, that's that's
(20:00):
good stuff. I feel you,I feel you, and and that's actually
another piece of chatter that you know, it's not it's interesting, right,
It's like there's a whole other pieceof chatter, but it's from her perspective
(20:22):
and right, right, And solike when she did share and I'm not
going to share, I'm choosing notto share that. But when she did
share more of like what was happeningback then, it was so insightful to
understand, like, oh, becauseit really did align with a lot of
(20:45):
the you know, he knew beforewe thought we do, you know what
I'm saying, And so I wasjust like kind of blown away by all
of what was coming up. Andand so that's a lot to take in,
you know, a lot to dealwith, a lot to deal with.
So I feel like I'm sharing andnot sharing. But anyway, well
maybe that'll come at some later times, O hill y'are well, Kesha.
(21:10):
I was so worried about your question, and I'm like, really, this
is so easy for me, andI seen you guys like tiptoe maneuver.
But for me, I think Ilived that my entire life. I lived
in their shoes. In order tosurvive. I always took myself back to
(21:33):
Wow. They was eighteen, eighteenand nineteen years old, I said,
when my mom found out that Ifirst got in contact with Tommy, that
was one of the things I saidto her. And I was twenty two.
I was like, ma, Idon't even have any children. I
can't even imagine what you went throughat nineteen years old. Remember, I
(21:55):
shared this similar story where I said, so that was my way of giving
both of them and understanding them.But one thing too that we failed to
talk about that the story of usdon't start there. Remember there's a lot
of history that goes beyond that thatthey had to deal with. You know,
(22:15):
my aunt, my great aunt wasmarried or I guess I supposed to
marry one of your uncles here marriedis and then on top of it,
you know my great grandfather right,and you know that whole scenario I don't
know, we want to share allthat, but you know, there's some
(22:36):
history behind this, so they hadto deal with that. So it was
more so like if you have tocompare it to something, it's probably like
the McCoy's and the hate Fields.Hat Fields. That was their names,
those two families. So it wasn'tlike boom they just met. No,
they had some history of generations thatwasn't so favorable to them in a small
(23:02):
town that wasn't the most favorable.And then it's a product come out of
that. So they had to processall that. So yeah, pee peasy,
girl, I got this one.He was like, that's it,
let's go. I've been living atmy whole life right right, And I
think you know you were just recentlytalking about that too, just saying how
(23:23):
like really like who they were atthat time, you know, And I've
said that to myself too, likein my whole journey of healing with you
know, my my daddy daughter stuff. That's one of the that's really one
of the main things I got tois just like parents are people first at
the end of the day. AndI think back to like when when they
(23:45):
had me, they were twenty oneand twenty two and it's like, man,
please you know who I was?And then I don't know what kind
of choices I would have made,you know, like I really you know,
so so yeah, thank you.And then for me answering that question,
I think uh, I would justsay from of course, yeah who
(24:10):
I who I am? So Ithink part part partly I want to talk
about what Jay talked about with Dad, like in Dad's shoes. I can
absolutely see myself being that exact sameway. Actually, I can see that
absolutely because that's something that I've hadto learn to be, is like to
face confrontation, and I'm still notgreat at it right, So like I'd
(24:37):
say the household we were brought upin kind of was like we don't do
confrontation, even though they never setus down and said that that was not
demonstrated to us. And so Ireally think, yeah, if I was
that age, I would have likelylooked to kind of I would say,
(24:57):
like do some of the same stuff, like to push to the side and
like act like it didn't exist orthat that easier way where he may have
known it. But if ain't nobodypressing me, you know, like let
me do the bare mental let mekind of show up, let me offer
this show like, because he isa good he was an excellent father,
(25:18):
and he's not like someone who islike, Okay, I got a child
out there, I'm not going tobe responsible, so what you know,
but just that conflict of what itmeant for how it showed him who he
was or how it showed everyone whohe was, as far as like the
I would take the perspective of theother people, all the other people surrounding
(25:44):
being the encourager to lean in.So I kind of feel like I would
be more like your Auntie Bell,your aunt who kind of told you a
little something, just because the AAin my life now, the favorite role
I have in my life is auntie, and I look to be that gap,
(26:07):
you know, like to kind offill in the gap or be a
space you know, of understanding orlike sharing from a different anglea you know,
or being a confidant and that kindof thing. And so I'd like
to think I would kind of showup. I probably wouldn't be the out
front like all right, now,y'all need to get it together, but
it would but might be able topush like yuh yeah, little something on
(26:33):
the side. So so yeah,so yeah, thank y'all for answering that.
Amn. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Well I don't have any more
official questions. I just I thinkwant to I want to just say that,
(26:53):
you know, moving forward any waysthat do you do you feel like
there's any ways where if you nowsee certain things in your family, in
whatever segment of the family, rightwhether it's our extended family or your immediate
family or whatever, that you bewilling to kind of get some things from
(27:19):
under the rug, that you bewilling to be the voice in times when
it's not really you know, wheremaybe others are looking to keep it quiet.
Do you feel like you be willingto be the one to bring it
out, to expose or to nudgeor any of that. Yeah. I
(27:40):
think generationally, I think we've youknow, we've evolved to where, for
lack of a better word, we'rebetter at that than no. But there
are still people that operate those becauseit's it's it's learned behavior. And so
(28:04):
you know, again, like yousaid, then the household we grew up
and that's how we were raised,is not to deal with it confrontationally because
you don't want to make somebody uncomfortableor you know, you don't want to
disrespect your parents by asking, bystepping out of your land, and especially
somebody like our father who led froma place of fear and intimidation and we
(28:30):
dare not ask questions. And soI had to grow into that too,
even like it, and in particularwith him asking questions and challenging him.
Most of that came from when Irealized, oh, I mean, if
he was trying to fist fight me, he adn't gonna win. So a
(28:52):
lot of that came from my ownMachiesmo, and you know that what we
call manhood. But I think alot of that is, you know,
just what we deal with. Isaid, it's the vad ones that when
we started, like stuff started comingfrom her uncle and she started getting those
nuggets. I feel like everybody wasin on this story and this lie and
(29:19):
we were only forty didn't know.Yeah, the more we hear, like
after the fact, like everybody knewthis, but and it was this this
whole like story and narrative. Andnow it's weird because now everybody's so comfortable
(29:42):
telling us that's so true, like, oh well, let me tell you
about this. Oh well, I'vebeen holding us with it for forty years.
Let me tell you why now,and we yea And we even made
a jokob about when I saw Tayain church nine times out of ten.
(30:03):
You two was there as well,and we said, you know, the
pastor probably changed his whole sermon,you know. And we're sitting there and
don't even know that the sermon isabout us, like whatever you do in
the dark, you know. Andwe're just sitting there eating our little peppermint
cad and there are no eyes onus, you know. And we had
(30:33):
no clue because we come from sucha small town. So you know,
everyone heard it, you know,the chatters, you know. So that's
very interesting. Yeah, and italso makes you wonder like for those not
only like Pop and like Mary,for others who have now passed, Like
(30:56):
what else did they know? Yeah? And what else has been lost due
to just time and and then youknow, and like everything else. Though,
the main solace that I get fromall this is when I think about
l is that's the main point ofthis whole thing, in regardless of what
(31:21):
we knew, what we didn't knowwhen we knew it, when we found
out, what people still ain't tellingus, is we got what we really
absolutely and my disappointment of when Isaid previous about my uncle again put it
myself. Now, I'm going toput myself in his shoes. And my
(31:42):
mom was a year older than him, and they was like twins. They
were so close at the hip.You know, he really loved his sister,
you know, So in that perspective, I understand why, you know,
and now I get the opportunity tolove my brother and my sister.
So, you know, so neveryou know, I think I told you
(32:06):
guys that I don't even call himhis first name. His name always been
to me was uncle, you know, and he walked me down the aisle.
He was my dad, you know, So I knew their relationship so
to keep her secrets because I knowshe kept his. You know, they
just had that serious bond, youknow, So I totally get it.
But he's always been a wonderful uncleto me. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah,
(32:30):
so yeah, because that's a beautifuldynamic, right yeah. It's like
they're all pieces to it. It'snot like that's just a pocket of a
person that's just holding information, youknow, like it's complex, you know,
mm hm, oh, yeah,the other relationships are involved. I
don't think anybody did it maliciously,right, No, not at all.
(32:52):
And I really think everybody really operatedto the best of their capability at that
time, with the awareness they had, with the just who they were at
the time, because like we haveall said here on today about being eighteen
nineteen twenty, like you know,like your kid, you just don't know,
(33:13):
and so you're not necessarily equipped tohandle things the way that you are
you know later in life. Soyeah, yeah, and just knowing,
like decades into a marriage, hownews like that can, like Tanya said,
you never know where that could leadand how it shake up her entire
(33:37):
family or shake up a household.So a lot of people probably thought from
that from that stance, like Iain't rocking that boat regardless of you know,
because you've got to compartmentalize a lotof it, because you can't like
not do this without affecting that.So people just chose, well, I'm
(34:01):
just gonna deal with this part ofit or not deal with this part of
it so I don't wreck everything.And if they find out in twenty years,
they'll find out in twenty years,but so be it. And then
you look at the support structure youknow you look at if that were to
happen in today's time. I knowWayne and I would step into support our
(34:22):
kids. I don't think he hadthat kind of support from his parents or
that kind of guidance to even talkthrough it, you know, right there
was no talking, right yeah yeah, yeah from the city right right yeah
(34:43):
yeah? Well good stuff. Anybodyelse have any final comments before we wrap
it on out. It's been good, it's been real. It's either the
quickest hours ever, right yeah,thanks, yeah, another again, everybody.
(35:07):
If you got any questions or anycomments about this show or previous shows,
feel free to reach out to us. Everybody, listen, I'm sure
y'all know how to reach us individually, but you can reach yourself so via
email at info at goldfirelife dot com, or you can reach us on our
Facebook page cross Roads the Crossroads Pod. But yeah, y'all know how to
(35:30):
reach us, so send us questions, send us any comments you have.
All right, we're out pace pace
Hey, welcome to the Crossroads Podcast. We are on episode number three.
This's called the Chatter Part Baby.Yeah, it was so deep last time
we had to come back with thepart too. So we are here.
I welcome my siblings, the beautifulBig Sister, the original Big Sister,
(00:25):
Tanya, the mic drop Valve,Hey, Hey, hey, I'm here,
and then bringing up the rear,my brother the Encore Jr. As
always, what's up y'all? AndI'm your host today the remix Keisha Glen.
So yeah, let's go ahead andcontinue from last time, right.
(00:47):
We got into some of the chatter, some of the background story, and
val you know, share with usher twelve year old experience. We got
to talk a little bit about,you know, some of the rounding noise,
but we didn't get into some ofthe other chaddar that went down so
(01:07):
over the years we have well beforeI even go into that, for those
of you who are joining us forthe very first time, we really decided
to come and share our story.You know, we have a sibling ship
that is unique and it just continuesto blossom, and so we were inspired
(01:27):
to come and share our story withyou, whether you map it on in
your life, or you just usethis for entertainment yourself. So here we
go. Yeah, last time wetalked a bit about the background and how
we got how it all kind ofgot found out. But what I want
to know is what we didn't getto ask is really about some of the
(01:52):
some of the things that were saidover the years. Once we kind of
got it confirmed, right, andthen you know, we start hearing things
that we didn't know, you know, things to start unfolding two in that
unfolding, let's see, what's myquestion? In the unfolding, we found
(02:16):
out what was some of the backgroundthings that you heard, like in your
family vow along the way, andthen you know, once you met some
of our you know, some ofthe family members on this side, right,
like, what what did you hearalong the way along the way?
(02:36):
Excuse me? Once it was confirmedor yeah, because I think last time
we talked, I did ask aboutwhat was the chatter prior to it being
confirmed, And it wasn't really thatmuch that you had heard along the way,
right, It's more so once itwas confirmed, and that was December,
early December of twenty twenty, wegot that confirmation. So what did
(03:00):
you start hearing well, unfortunately,you know, that's what twenty five years,
thirty years later, you know,and I lost a lot of family
members, so it wasn't many thatI can go to and talk to about.
So I do have an uncle,my favorite uncle, my only uncle,
(03:21):
that's life. And he was thesecond person that I felt that it
was important that he knew what Idid. You was the first, and
he was the second. And whenI called him, he wasn't really surprised.
It was more so like, well, yeah, that's about right,
you know, And and I was, and I was really stunned and crazy
(03:49):
enough, he knew exactly what Dadwas going through the latter part of his
life, and I felt kind ofa way, even though it was not
confirmed, but he never shared anyof this with me, you know,
the same things you would tell mewhat he was going through, he pretty
much knew. And I was likewow, Like so I felt I was
(04:12):
really stunned, and I was Iwouldn't say disappointed, but I was very
emotional. And he pretty much waslike he shared things here and there,
and I shared this with Keisha beforethat. I kept back my feelings about
it because I wanted him to sharemore. But Honestly, I was kind
(04:35):
of upset. I was upset thethings he would share with me, and
I would just blow it off onKech's like, oh, he just told
me this, but I would neversay that to him because I wanted him
to be comfortable telling me these things, you know, So like for one,
for instance, he told me thatit was very close with my uncles,
(04:58):
the glimpse it was, you know, he he hung out with them
in Brooklyn, and you know,they knew each other, and he has
pictures of me sitting on a particularuncle's lap and and talk and shared with
me how he brought me an outfitwhen I was younger. So these things,
you know, was shocking because I'venever heard any of this, you
know. So that's some of thechatter I heard, like immediately after it
(05:25):
was confirmed. Yeah, that mademe very emotional, and you was like,
okay, you know, but itwas tough, right, It was
really tough. But yeah, yeah, that was a lot to walk through
and to to kind of deal with, To be confronted really with the fact
that you in your belief right,he didn't know you until later, He
(05:47):
didn't know about you, right,and so to learn that he actually showed
up in your life and then noone, no one shared it. Right,
it's a lot to digest. Yeah, so did you ever did you?
Did you ever talk about it withhim about how you felt? Absolutely
(06:09):
not? And the reason why,the reason why every time I talk to
him, I get a little morethan another nugget, you know, or
if I don't get the nugget,my husband does and we go, you
know, like Honda, that's anotherone, you know. So so I
don't think I'm angry anymore. Ijust don't want him to stop sharing,
(06:30):
because again, he's from that erathat it didn't share, it pitched up
under the rug. So I don'tshare my true feelings or my initial true
feelings because I want him to continueto continue to speak about it. Yeah,
because I think I fear that ifI do, he's gonna shut down,
you know. Yeah, Yeah,I think I think too. There's
(06:53):
a you know, all of itis a process. It's all a process,
right, And so like now thatyour feelings are are shifting and half
shifted, then you know, atsome point maybe you will and it'll be
it'll be a different experience. Butwhat was what was awesome too is some
of the other chatter like you heardthat, but then also once you came
(07:16):
to uh we had an event,a family event, and you came to
that event, and one of ourother uncles, one of the glim uncles,
right, was able to care moreinsight, right, yeah, yes,
so actually it was it was theevent was when I very first met
Jr. And Taya, Right,I came down. I believe it was
(07:41):
in May and I was able andbirthday, Yeah, absolutely, yep.
So I came down and my daughterTorri, we both came down and I
met one of the uncles and heshared with me at that time that him
and Tommy dad came to the hospitalwhen I was born. And that was
(08:05):
another shocker, you know, likethis is something that I never knew,
never heard, never was whispered byanyone from the conversations I've had with Dad
over the years, you know,he never shared that with me. I
believe I shared last episode that youknow, I was always under the impression
from him off just from myself makingthis up in my mind that he only
(08:30):
found out about me when I wasthree years old. So to hear that
he was at the hospital the dayI was born was kind of like what
you know. So it's just it'syeah, it just feels like, you
know, I don't know, maybeI would have took the test even quicker
if I just knew these little bitsof chatter going around, you know.
(08:52):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, thatwas a shock or too. Yeah,
And it's it's interesting too, becauseyou know when you think about things in
your life, and we can alwaysbe hypothetical, Well it might look different
if da da da, and itmight have, but then we really won't
go because we also still had thatother component, right, the component of
(09:15):
your mother and her thoughts around itand how she felt about it, amaturity
and maturity. All right. Yeah, there's a lot of information for anyone
that was twelve or twenty to reallyprocess, you know, absolutely, you
know, I think we're all ina different place than we was then.
Yeah. Yeah, in us talkingright now, I'm having thinking about the
(09:41):
first time I met you and Icome to visit New York, New Jersey,
and I came to your job,and I just remember us be sitting
in the lobby and talking, andI don't remember the whole conversation, but
I do remember us trying together,and I remember me asking you, like,
(10:01):
do you think you can go therest of your life not knowing.
And you said, no, Idon't think I could tell I don't think
I can go life. And I'mlike, all right, but we need
to go ahead and get I'm justsad, you know, but it I
mean, And that was I don'tknow how many years that would have been
played. That was in nineteen ninetyeight. I was gonna say eight ninety
(10:22):
eight or ninety nine, right,and so yeah, so it's all just
it's all the process, and thathappened, as we have mentioned in Divine
Time, right, good stuff.Did y'all have anything follow up that y'all
want to ask, because I havea have like a little bonus question for
y'all everyone, right, not justme. Everyone. You're not on the
(10:48):
right everyone, you're not on thehot stand. Matter of fact, you
don't have you don't get to gofirst this time. Well you can rest
for a second, all right.So this is another one of those hypotheticals.
Okay, So put yourself in theshoes of any of the adults that
(11:11):
nu Val was Dad's child, right, and what do you think you would
have done? So you can chooseDad's shoes, Mary's shoes or any other
family member's shoes. What do youthink you would have What do you think
(11:31):
you would have done? What doyou think that? Everybody always want to
go I'll go first. Wow,Like it's so hard to say. Again,
it's hypothetical, so we don't youknow, it's so hard to actually
(11:54):
No, But from Pops perspective andknowing how you have to navigate around you
know, the feelings and your respectfor your wife, that would be it.
(12:15):
That would be tough. And justwe all know how decisions and choices
and actions of our past eventually alwayscome back, right, whether it come
back to bite us or to blessus, right and knowing, So are
(12:39):
you asking me in the perspective ofwhat I think Pop was thinking or what
I would have done? No,what you would have done? And I'm
asking because it is it's hypothetical.And I just said like hypothetical, like
we don't know, Like we reallydon't know, but I'm asking let me
add this tippit. It's more fromlike understanding who you are right right in
(13:01):
that particular situation. Now, ofcourse it's a completely different time and who
you are has a lot to dowith it. Yeah, you know,
And I'm also trying to think ofit from the like me as a twenty
year old. Yeah, yeah,exactly, like so so now, of
(13:22):
course, you know, like myanswer and my actions, I would like
to think it would be more youknow, like dignified and respectful, but
as an eighteen year old like andthat's why I asked that question, because
even more so with Pop because Iknow he avoided confrontation and issues like the
(13:46):
plague and so on top of himbeing eighteen and being who he was,
I know he was like I ain'ttrying to deal with that. So and
like most ten year old boys atthe time and and so including me,
(14:07):
I know I would have when Iwould have been scared out of you know,
and having it come like back uprecurringly throughout your life and never dealing
with it like like geez, likeI thought about it, right, I've
(14:37):
never even thought about it that way, because like I'm thinking of all,
like you know, like all thelittle stuff that I've done throughout my life
that came back to like, ohman, now I gotta deal with it.
Mm hmmm. But the whole person, Yeah, the whole person come
(14:58):
back and and then he's just likeso then there comes the and I'm sure
he had to deal with this aswell. Then there comes the guilt and
like the what ifs and the whatifs moving backwards and the what IF's moving
(15:18):
forward, and then also questioning yourselfas a father, as a husband,
as a man, and just afamily member overall, like what you know,
just questioning those things because you know, Pop was you know, a
great father and an amazing provider,and so I'm sure those questions probably came
(15:43):
in and said, like what doesthis do to me as far as not
only the perception of what people haveof me, but my perception of myself?
And am I really the man Ithought I was? And never having
to deal with it allows you tocomfort and not having to answer those questions,
(16:03):
hey man, yeah right, it'sso deep. Yeah, that's why
I hate hypotheticals, man, right, because it really isn't you know it?
And really I asked it more fromthe opportunity to put ourselves in those
shoes. You know what I'm saying, it's not because there really is no
(16:26):
You can never answer that, youknow. It always amazes me sometimes you
hear people been like talking about,you know, slavery, If I was,
if I was the boy. Iwould like, we're completely different beings
and that's why I felt but yeah, right right, so yeah, so
(16:55):
it's it's an opportunity to look andso thank you ja, yeah, because
that just opens up. It helpseven just hearing it, you know,
just the conflict, and not evenfrom everybody else's shoes, like his siblings
and like we talked about last week, the chatter we heard of, oh
they all got kids somewhere, Andthen it's like, well if I help
(17:18):
him acknowledge it, when it's thespotlight gonna be on me now, right,
yep. I always call it likeyou ain't nobody the bear, ain't
poking the bear, like I alwayssay, like you know, when somebody
trying not to be seen, it'slike you know, like you turn on
the lights and the roach just sitsstill. Yeah yeah, you go outside
(17:40):
and the bug stop moving, andlike maybe if I just sit still,
they won't see me, right,But like yeah, so you know,
having so not only would that openup so like that Pandora's box for him,
but for everybody else. It's likeI'm just gonna keep my hands off
of it, because if I touchit, then I got to deal with
my own stuff. Yeah, yeah, so true, so true. Yeah
(18:08):
yeah, thank you, yeah,thank you. Yeah, all right,
all right, Tandiya, I don'tknow if I can answer that question from
back then, So I want toanswer it from my perspective now, And
(18:32):
I'm gonna sit in my mom's shoesmm hmm. Knowing now, if I
had known then what I know now, then I would have encouraged him to
find out if if this is indeedyour child, that is your seed,
what happens between the two of us? I mean, I mean and they
(18:55):
ended up divorcing. There is nolong no, there was no longer a
Timmel in my life, but therewas always av that will forever be your
daughter. Seek to find out orto rule out whatever the case may be.
And so I think now I wouldhave been an encouragure for him to
(19:15):
confirm and should things work out betweenthe two of us, things will work
out between the two of us,and it was meant to be. It
would be very difficult, you know, I think back to when I was
eighteen, it would be very difficultto answer that question, and mom shoes
from back then. You know,when you think that who you think is
(19:37):
the love of your life that youcan't live without. At eighteen years old,
we know, time to get lucky, and they did. They had
a great marriage up until it ended. But I don't know if I could
answer that question from her perspective backthen, so I just chose to answer
it from where I sit now.Yeah. Yeah, No, that's that's
(20:00):
good stuff. I feel you,I feel you, and and that's actually
another piece of chatter that you know, it's not it's interesting, right,
It's like there's a whole other pieceof chatter, but it's from her perspective
(20:22):
and right, right, And solike when she did share and I'm not
going to share, I'm choosing notto share that. But when she did
share more of like what was happeningback then, it was so insightful to
understand, like, oh, becauseit really did align with a lot of
(20:45):
the you know, he knew beforewe thought we do, you know what
I'm saying, And so I wasjust like kind of blown away by all
of what was coming up. Andand so that's a lot to take in,
you know, a lot to dealwith, a lot to deal with.
So I feel like I'm sharing andnot sharing. But anyway, well
maybe that'll come at some later times, O hill y'are well, Kesha.
(21:10):
I was so worried about your question, and I'm like, really, this
is so easy for me, andI seen you guys like tiptoe maneuver.
But for me, I think Ilived that my entire life. I lived
in their shoes. In order tosurvive. I always took myself back to
(21:33):
Wow. They was eighteen, eighteenand nineteen years old, I said,
when my mom found out that Ifirst got in contact with Tommy, that
was one of the things I saidto her. And I was twenty two.
I was like, ma, Idon't even have any children. I
can't even imagine what you went throughat nineteen years old. Remember, I
(21:55):
shared this similar story where I said, so that was my way of giving
both of them and understanding them.But one thing too that we failed to
talk about that the story of usdon't start there. Remember there's a lot
of history that goes beyond that thatthey had to deal with. You know,
(22:15):
my aunt, my great aunt wasmarried or I guess I supposed to
marry one of your uncles here marriedis and then on top of it,
you know my great grandfather right,and you know that whole scenario I don't
know, we want to share allthat, but you know, there's some
(22:36):
history behind this, so they hadto deal with that. So it was
more so like if you have tocompare it to something, it's probably like
the McCoy's and the hate Fields.Hat Fields. That was their names,
those two families. So it wasn'tlike boom they just met. No,
they had some history of generations thatwasn't so favorable to them in a small
(23:02):
town that wasn't the most favorable.And then it's a product come out of
that. So they had to processall that. So yeah, pee peasy,
girl, I got this one.He was like, that's it,
let's go. I've been living atmy whole life right right, And I
think you know you were just recentlytalking about that too, just saying how
(23:23):
like really like who they were atthat time, you know, And I've
said that to myself too, likein my whole journey of healing with you
know, my my daddy daughter stuff. That's one of the that's really one
of the main things I got tois just like parents are people first at
the end of the day. AndI think back to like when when they
(23:45):
had me, they were twenty oneand twenty two and it's like, man,
please you know who I was?And then I don't know what kind
of choices I would have made,you know, like I really you know,
so so yeah, thank you.And then for me answering that question,
I think uh, I would justsay from of course, yeah who
(24:10):
I who I am? So Ithink part part partly I want to talk
about what Jay talked about with Dad, like in Dad's shoes. I can
absolutely see myself being that exact sameway. Actually, I can see that
absolutely because that's something that I've hadto learn to be, is like to
face confrontation, and I'm still notgreat at it right, So like I'd
(24:37):
say the household we were brought upin kind of was like we don't do
confrontation, even though they never setus down and said that that was not
demonstrated to us. And so Ireally think, yeah, if I was
that age, I would have likelylooked to kind of I would say,
(24:57):
like do some of the same stuff, like to push to the side and
like act like it didn't exist orthat that easier way where he may have
known it. But if ain't nobodypressing me, you know, like let
me do the bare mental let mekind of show up, let me offer
this show like, because he isa good he was an excellent father,
(25:18):
and he's not like someone who islike, Okay, I got a child
out there, I'm not going tobe responsible, so what you know,
but just that conflict of what itmeant for how it showed him who he
was or how it showed everyone whohe was, as far as like the
I would take the perspective of theother people, all the other people surrounding
(25:44):
being the encourager to lean in.So I kind of feel like I would
be more like your Auntie Bell,your aunt who kind of told you a
little something, just because the AAin my life now, the favorite role
I have in my life is auntie, and I look to be that gap,
(26:07):
you know, like to kind offill in the gap or be a
space you know, of understanding orlike sharing from a different anglea you know,
or being a confidant and that kindof thing. And so I'd like
to think I would kind of showup. I probably wouldn't be the out
front like all right, now,y'all need to get it together, but
it would but might be able topush like yuh yeah, little something on
(26:33):
the side. So so yeah,so yeah, thank y'all for answering that.
Amn. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Well I don't have any more
official questions. I just I thinkwant to I want to just say that,
(26:53):
you know, moving forward any waysthat do you do you feel like
there's any ways where if you nowsee certain things in your family, in
whatever segment of the family, rightwhether it's our extended family or your immediate
family or whatever, that you bewilling to kind of get some things from
(27:19):
under the rug, that you bewilling to be the voice in times when
it's not really you know, wheremaybe others are looking to keep it quiet.
Do you feel like you be willingto be the one to bring it
out, to expose or to nudgeor any of that. Yeah. I
(27:40):
think generationally, I think we've youknow, we've evolved to where, for
lack of a better word, we'rebetter at that than no. But there
are still people that operate those becauseit's it's it's learned behavior. And so
(28:04):
you know, again, like yousaid, then the household we grew up
and that's how we were raised,is not to deal with it confrontationally because
you don't want to make somebody uncomfortableor you know, you don't want to
disrespect your parents by asking, bystepping out of your land, and especially
somebody like our father who led froma place of fear and intimidation and we
(28:30):
dare not ask questions. And soI had to grow into that too,
even like it, and in particularwith him asking questions and challenging him.
Most of that came from when Irealized, oh, I mean, if
he was trying to fist fight me, he adn't gonna win. So a
(28:52):
lot of that came from my ownMachiesmo, and you know that what we
call manhood. But I think alot of that is, you know,
just what we deal with. Isaid, it's the vad ones that when
we started, like stuff started comingfrom her uncle and she started getting those
nuggets. I feel like everybody wasin on this story and this lie and
(29:19):
we were only forty didn't know.Yeah, the more we hear, like
after the fact, like everybody knewthis, but and it was this this
whole like story and narrative. Andnow it's weird because now everybody's so comfortable
(29:42):
telling us that's so true, like, oh well, let me tell you
about this. Oh well, I'vebeen holding us with it for forty years.
Let me tell you why now,and we yea And we even made
a jokob about when I saw Tayain church nine times out of ten.
(30:03):
You two was there as well,and we said, you know, the
pastor probably changed his whole sermon,you know. And we're sitting there and
don't even know that the sermon isabout us, like whatever you do in
the dark, you know. Andwe're just sitting there eating our little peppermint
cad and there are no eyes onus, you know. And we had
(30:33):
no clue because we come from sucha small town. So you know,
everyone heard it, you know,the chatters, you know. So that's
very interesting. Yeah, and italso makes you wonder like for those not
only like Pop and like Mary,for others who have now passed, Like
(30:56):
what else did they know? Yeah? And what else has been lost due
to just time and and then youknow, and like everything else. Though,
the main solace that I get fromall this is when I think about
l is that's the main point ofthis whole thing, in regardless of what
(31:21):
we knew, what we didn't knowwhen we knew it, when we found
out, what people still ain't tellingus, is we got what we really
absolutely and my disappointment of when Isaid previous about my uncle again put it
myself. Now, I'm going toput myself in his shoes. And my
(31:42):
mom was a year older than him, and they was like twins. They
were so close at the hip.You know, he really loved his sister,
you know, So in that perspective, I understand why, you know,
and now I get the opportunity tolove my brother and my sister.
So, you know, so neveryou know, I think I told you
(32:06):
guys that I don't even call himhis first name. His name always been
to me was uncle, you know, and he walked me down the aisle.
He was my dad, you know, So I knew their relationship so
to keep her secrets because I knowshe kept his. You know, they
just had that serious bond, youknow, So I totally get it.
But he's always been a wonderful uncleto me. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah,
(32:30):
so yeah, because that's a beautifuldynamic, right yeah. It's like
they're all pieces to it. It'snot like that's just a pocket of a
person that's just holding information, youknow, like it's complex, you know,
mm hm, oh, yeah,the other relationships are involved. I
don't think anybody did it maliciously,right, No, not at all.
(32:52):
And I really think everybody really operatedto the best of their capability at that
time, with the awareness they had, with the just who they were at
the time, because like we haveall said here on today about being eighteen
nineteen twenty, like you know,like your kid, you just don't know,
(33:13):
and so you're not necessarily equipped tohandle things the way that you are
you know later in life. Soyeah, yeah, and just knowing,
like decades into a marriage, hownews like that can, like Tanya said,
you never know where that could leadand how it shake up her entire
(33:37):
family or shake up a household.So a lot of people probably thought from
that from that stance, like Iain't rocking that boat regardless of you know,
because you've got to compartmentalize a lotof it, because you can't like
not do this without affecting that.So people just chose, well, I'm
(34:01):
just gonna deal with this part ofit or not deal with this part of
it so I don't wreck everything.And if they find out in twenty years,
they'll find out in twenty years,but so be it. And then
you look at the support structure youknow you look at if that were to
happen in today's time. I knowWayne and I would step into support our
(34:22):
kids. I don't think he hadthat kind of support from his parents or
that kind of guidance to even talkthrough it, you know, right there
was no talking, right yeah yeah, yeah from the city right right yeah
(34:43):
yeah? Well good stuff. Anybodyelse have any final comments before we wrap
it on out. It's been good, it's been real. It's either the
quickest hours ever, right yeah,thanks, yeah, another again, everybody.
(35:07):
If you got any questions or anycomments about this show or previous shows,
feel free to reach out to us. Everybody, listen, I'm sure
y'all know how to reach us individually, but you can reach yourself so via
email at info at goldfirelife dot com, or you can reach us on our
Facebook page cross Roads the Crossroads Pod. But yeah, y'all know how to
(35:30):
reach us, so send us questions, send us any comments you have.
All right, we're out pace pace
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