Surviving the Game (1994) – Ice-T vs Human Hunters in a 90s Action Classic - Do You Even Movie? Exploring Obscure Gems and Cult Classics

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
There's a toast to the hunters and a prayer for
the hunter.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
It was their game, their thrill, their wounds. I might
not be rare. Now he's gonna show them how to
play it, surviving the game in a world where podcasts

(00:30):
reign supreme. Two Friends Dare to Ask, Do You Even? Movie,
hosted by filmmaker Enrique Kuto and movie aficionado David Denyer.

Speaker 3 (00:57):
Spoiler alert, So, David, so, Hen, what's the hardest game
You've ever survived?

Speaker 1 (01:11):
The hardest game I've ever survived? Oh that's a good one.
Oh man. Honestly, if I actually had to answer that question,
it would probably be. There was one time when I
was in soccer when I was a young kid, and
it was literally sleeping and this is this is like

(01:31):
a minor league game, like this is just kids being kids.
Uh soccer, Okay, so kids being kids. It's sleeping out.
They're not canceling the game. And it was my turn
to be goalie. My hands went numb from the gloves
because the gloves were so damp and everything from everybody
playing and picking up a ball and whatnot. My hands
went numb while I was playing goalie. And I did

(01:52):
not think I was going to survive that game. The
ball gets wet, Yeah, when it's on the field from
the snow. You mean, yeah, okay, I got you out. Yeah, well,
think about the grounds completely covered at this point, balls
getting covered and everybody is just miserable, you know, kicking
it as best they can and whatnot, and you're trying
to pick it up with your numb hands, and yeah,
it just was not working out.

Speaker 3 (02:12):
They had a competitive school game.

Speaker 1 (02:14):
This was like this is like rec league like that.
That means like the rec like the the recreation like
for kids, like the little after school programs. Oh okay,
so it's for fun. Yeah, I mean it was. It
was like a season, but yeah it was. It was
just there wasn't like any tournaments or anything. It was
just like, you played this team this week, you played

(02:35):
this team this way.

Speaker 3 (02:37):
Well, I was just it would just be weird if
it was competitive. By like Jesus, They're like, sorry, it's snowing,
doesn't matter, get out there and win.

Speaker 1 (02:42):
Whereas I remember one time, literally there was a tornado watch,
maybe a warning, I can't remember. It wasn't a warning,
but it was at least a watch, and it was
a train of watch and they canceled the games like
we'd already gotten to the field, We're getting ready to
throw the ball down, and they're like, oh up, Tornado
watches all around. Is game's canceled.

Speaker 3 (02:55):
Well, it's gonna start raining eventually. Yeah, ran all the
time any for.

Speaker 1 (02:59):
Long for me?

Speaker 3 (03:01):
Uh see Mind's act saying Russian Roulette yep.

Speaker 1 (03:04):
I mean that's a tough one to survive, especially with
the loaded, you know, entire all chambers loaded.

Speaker 3 (03:10):
I think that's just called suicide the English language, it's
a living language, David, Yeah, it's a living language.

Speaker 1 (03:18):
Now. If you want to talk about video games, the
hardest game I had to survive would be one that
I still have not beat to this day, which is
the suffering The Ties That Bind? Are you failed with
the suffering? Mm hmm. So did you ever play the sequel,
The Ties that Bind? I didn't play either. So the suffering, Yeah,
the suffering is you're an inmate that Goods sent to
a prison. You're trying to figure out who framed you

(03:39):
and got you sent there. All the while there's like
an evil unleash in the prison. First game is awesome
love The first game. Second game basically a little bit
more of the same story. But what they did with
the final boss round of the game is you face
every single fucking boss, You face the entire game in
one go, and you have to stay alive. And that
was awful for me. It was it was brain scan,

(04:01):
brain scan. I mean that's fair too.

Speaker 3 (04:04):
So it was a fun game, though, I mean incredible graphic.

Speaker 1 (04:07):
Incredible graphic.

Speaker 3 (04:08):
And I got to be Edward Furlong.

Speaker 1 (04:11):
It's my favorite line he delivers in that movie. He
just comes to the room.

Speaker 3 (04:16):
Watching pornography and getting an erection and using it to
ripe someone. Oh god, yeah, that's principle, sir. I'm pretty
sure erections don't rape people. People rape people.

Speaker 1 (04:26):
Is that movie called uh? I know, I know, it's
like number four is the is the number at the
end of it, But I can't remember what the movie
is called that he was showing to the Horror Club.
It's it's some ridiculous title.

Speaker 3 (04:37):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, it was made up, because weren't
they actually just showing like h Lewis something like that.

Speaker 1 (04:41):
Yeah. I think it was like color me blood red.

Speaker 3 (04:42):
Or one of those yeah, or blood feast or whatever.

Speaker 1 (04:45):
I think it was colored blood red.

Speaker 3 (04:46):
Yeah, but now I was never I never played a
lot of games because you know, you need friends for that.

Speaker 1 (04:52):
Yeah, so as a kid, not not so much imagining
Millhouse running back and forth with the frisbee.

Speaker 3 (04:58):
Oh yeah, yeah, that was pretty to my childhood.

Speaker 1 (05:00):
You know.

Speaker 3 (05:01):
Hey, well we're coming off of Father's Day.

Speaker 1 (05:03):
Why not? Why not?

Speaker 3 (05:04):
Yeah, let's talk about playing today. Oh man, Father's Day blue.
I mean, like Father's Day normally is not my favorite day,
but that was not a good father Day.

Speaker 1 (05:16):
No, no, no, no, I.

Speaker 3 (05:18):
Don't even want to go into it, like in detail.
I mean, it's a lot, but it's just.

Speaker 1 (05:22):
We we we we.

Speaker 3 (05:24):
Were killing ourselves pulling together a production, and we pulled
it together obscenely fast, and then five minutes till start time,
we're all almost all of us are there, unpacked and
starting to set up. I was literally putting the camera
on the tripod, and then we found out we had
to cancel the whole day.

Speaker 1 (05:42):
Sucks, man, I'm sorry.

Speaker 3 (05:44):
It is what it is. I mean, I tried to
make the best of it. You know, Rachel and I
just looked at us like, well, I guess we'll hang
out have fun because we were, like, we had been
working so long, so hard to get ready, and now.

Speaker 1 (05:57):
It was just nothing. Not going to say the reason
all on the air, but I mean it's a pretty big,
big reason to cancel. I mean there was completely out
of your control. Nothing, nothing could have stopped that.

Speaker 3 (06:07):
As a man of nearly forty who has done many
many low budget films and projects and and and pushed
my way through many challenges, I am old enough now
that when that happened, I told everybody like, we're canceled, yeah,
and why? And then Rachel was like what if we

(06:30):
and and she she had suggested something to try to
solve it, yeah, And I literally was like, it would
make this would be the most miserable day if we
tried to turn it around. I am old enough to
just know when I'm licked.

Speaker 1 (06:46):
When to quit.

Speaker 3 (06:47):
Yeah, yeah, when it's you're better off just cutting the losses.

Speaker 1 (06:50):
I still give you a lot of props for because
I mean we had even tried to push through when
this happened. But I remember when we were on Calamity
James Revenge and or no no it was just James, sorry,
just gyms unchained. Oh we were shooting during that windstorm. Yeah,
And I remember I remember me and I can't remember
who else, but we were holding that door shut because
the wind was blue and Whiting, yeah, me and Whiting,

(07:11):
and it was just like I remember, like I think
an hour passed after that, and you were just like,
we we've got to call this.

Speaker 3 (07:16):
Well, we we had stuff to film in there. Yeah,
So we filmed all of that, and every time we
had it we took a small break. I would open
the door and look at the sky and it wasn't
getting any better. Yeah, And after about an hour, about
an hour of it not improving and we were waiting, Yeah,
I was like, we gotta call it because this is
like really bad weather.

Speaker 2 (07:35):
Well.

Speaker 1 (07:36):
I think you also had read the report that somebody
had actually died. Yeah, somebody got killed in that. Also,
I had had that tree completely uprooted in my in
my front yard that it almost landed on my excess
car at the time. Wouldn't that have been nice? No comment, No,
but uh no.

Speaker 3 (07:50):
There are times when you have to have to do
it and there are times when you don't. Yeah, Like
I guess what I'm trying to say is like you
got to know when to ho no, when to fold them, uh, and.

Speaker 1 (08:03):
When to walk away.

Speaker 3 (08:05):
Ah, kind of yeah, no, when to jog No, when
to jog No? When to open a chicken restaurant?

Speaker 1 (08:11):
There you go. Yeah, but he tried. It was successful
for a bit.

Speaker 3 (08:15):
It's still successful in Asia. Oh oh yeah, that's right.

Speaker 1 (08:18):
I forgot about that.

Speaker 3 (08:19):
Yeah, the Kenny Rogers chicken.

Speaker 1 (08:21):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (08:21):
But yeah, it's it's a it's tough when you have
to kind of admit your licked. Yeah, but there's a
freedom to it too. Like if we had if we
had tried to save the shoot, it would have required
us losing about two hours three hours of the shoot
time in order to rejigger everything. Yeah, and we already

(08:44):
barely had enough time, so we would have been we
would have been stressed to the hilt all day, possibly
getting much worse material because of it. And I just
there was that moment where I was like, you know,
I don't think that's where.

Speaker 1 (09:00):
Oh, And I mean, there's only so much you can
plan for because like even another shoot story that came
to mind is when we were on what was going
to be the longest shooting weekend for Haunt House on
Serre Row, and we had planned to shoot I think
until two am that day, and something had happened with
an effect. There was a shot that went wrong. I
can't remember what it was, and we were still thinking
about pushing forward, and then at the last second, just like,

(09:21):
if we do this, we're just gonna wear ourselves out.
It's gonna make the craft even a little bit probably
questionable at that point too.

Speaker 3 (09:27):
Well, the effect didn't turn out well, yeah it didn't.
And our makeup artist, who was very, very good, Yeah,
he was unhappy with it. I was unhappy with it.
So the thought was I think it was like I
just asked everybody, like, do you guys care if we
go an hour later tomorrow but we all go home
and see right now?

Speaker 1 (09:46):
Yeah, And it was unanimous yes.

Speaker 3 (09:48):
And then I think we came back to set two
hours early to try and do the makeup again. I mean,
when you're making a feature length movie and your time,
your principal schedule is four days, yeah, maybe maybe a
fifth day as pickups, you really can't afford to lose much. No,
I mean you can't really afford to. You know, if
somebody is two hours late, it's gonna be a very

(10:10):
hard day.

Speaker 1 (10:11):
Yeah, if you.

Speaker 3 (10:13):
Run over time.

Speaker 1 (10:15):
You need it.

Speaker 3 (10:16):
Needs to it needs to have a purpose. Yeah, because
if you just every time you film you run long
and everyone's always exhausted and they expect that from you,
you lose a lot of good will and rightfully so well.

Speaker 1 (10:31):
And I think also it had a lot to do
with the fact that we were shooting down on a
cellar and there was was have the shelves toppled over yet?
Was it? Okay, I haven't done that yet. No, that
was that was a year or so late, so later Okay, Yeah,
I couldn't remember if it was that movie or the
next one.

Speaker 3 (10:45):
It was the next one, yeah, and that was about
a year and a half later. Yeah, maybe maybe not
quite a year and a half, but that was a
while later. And but yeah, you don't want to do
that to people. That's what one of my big rules is.
I'll ask people like, do you guys care if we
go late? Usually it's because when that late day ends,
the whole film is over. Yeah, so everybody knows, like,

(11:05):
this is it, this is the last of it?

Speaker 1 (11:08):
YEA.

Speaker 3 (11:10):
One thing I learned early on working with a friend
who he was a very talented filmmaker, but he wasn't
very good with people, is he would he would say
things that I would hear and I'd be like, wow,
I'm never saying that on my set, yeah, because it's
like killed morale. And one of them was like, I

(11:31):
have this rule on movies if you can help it,
you want to front load your first day, whether it's
the first day of five days, or it's the first
day of two days of a weekend and then you're
gonna come back in another weekend or whatever it is.
Whatever it is, you want a front load because no
matter how much work you do in one day with
a group of people working ten, twelve hours, whatever it is,
no matter how much work you do, people are tired

(11:51):
at the end of the day. Like if you sat
at home all day watching Blu rays and eating pizza,
come midnight, you're tired, even though you were like a
sack shit all day you just did nothing. So one
time I remember him saying, because it was at the
end of a long day, he was like, you know, everybody,
just you know, you know, pump it up and like
we'll get back to sleep because tomorrow is the hard day.

(12:12):
And I was like, man, that killed my sense of
excitement because I'm already tired. So I always tried to
Number One never ever say anything like that. Yeah, and
number two, always try to front load that way, even
if it's grueling and it's late. You could be like, remember, guys,
tomorrow we do two thirds as much stuff as today.

Speaker 1 (12:28):
Yeah, like tomorrow is easy. Or one thing I've always
loved about you is you've always made a tough day
also around a really good meal, whether it's something that
your mom has made or whether it's try to do
you always try to like front load a hard day
but then also have a really good meal as like
the halfway point, if not like the or almost there.

Speaker 3 (12:47):
And I think with a few extenuating circumstances, I think
that you know there should be if there are going
to be two meals in a day, one of them
should be hot.

Speaker 1 (12:55):
Yeah. I think that's just nobody. I mean, who doesn't
like a sexy meal.

Speaker 3 (13:00):
Really hot and sexy. Nothing like a hot meal on
an eighty five degree day.

Speaker 1 (13:05):
And I think my favorite was still when we had
gotten pizza from a place. I think it was where
was the where was the house that we shot out
a lot? It was wayns Wayne till thank you. I
wanted to say West Milton, but I knew that wasn't right. No,
we had gotten that Waynsville pizza place and we didn't
realize that they put the pepperoni underneath the cheese. So
when we got our pizzas, it just looked like two

(13:25):
cheese pizzas.

Speaker 3 (13:26):
Yeah, and one was for the vegetarians. So luckily, if
I had to guess in that situation, Eric Whiting was
our Christopher Columbus who explored.

Speaker 1 (13:36):
The mic both of us, Yeah, because I think we
both were just like that pizza looks a little lumpy,
like it looks like pepperoni might be.

Speaker 3 (13:41):
Under I remember pizza being good.

Speaker 1 (13:43):
Though, pizza was great.

Speaker 3 (13:44):
Yeah, that place was not near anything convenient. No, so
it was like a forty minute round trip to get
that damn pizza.

Speaker 1 (13:50):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (13:50):
So but yeah, anyway, I didn't even realize I was
gonna it was gonna lead. I was gonna lead into
something actually had something to say about. I just wanted
to get you going. It worked, but but no, so
I ended up going with Rachel to the We went
to Hunan house and had an HS Chinese buffet to
drown away our tears. Then we went to the cigar

(14:13):
lounge and I got this ridiculous LFD cigar. LFD cigars
are known for being very strong, so strong that a
lot of people leave. That's why people call them LFD
because it stands for laflor dominicana, which sounds beautiful. Yeah,
but they're known for being like all the hero all
like really powerful. So I feel like people that's why

(14:33):
people never call it that. They always call them LFD
because it sounds more intense, more military almost. That's where
you've seen the boxes say double le hero those are
LED's and uh and they're almost always tiny because they're
very strong.

Speaker 1 (14:45):
It's like I remember I had I've had one of
the jfrs and my ex and called it a jafar
cigar and I was like, that's kind of funny. It's
pretty good. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (14:54):
So but but we made the best of it as
best we could. Where we're filming again, I mean, by
the time this airs, it'll be done already. Yeah, and
god willing, nothing could go wrong with that one. Yes, yes, Wood,
we're just knocking on that we are. But it was
a lot, I know, it was.

Speaker 1 (15:13):
It was. It was a lot.

Speaker 3 (15:14):
And uh, yeah, that was just there was a lot
that whole weekend. Yeah, not an easy time.

Speaker 1 (15:19):
Well, the good news is is you got your car back.

Speaker 3 (15:22):
I did, yes, so, which which was a hilarious thing too. Honestly,
that week was kind of a lot of awful, but
one of the funniest things was my car had been
in the shop for almost two full weeks.

Speaker 1 (15:36):
I found out what happened. Yeah, you told me you
have a good please please tell the audience.

Speaker 3 (15:40):
Well, I found out that what happened was my car.
I dropped my car off and on Monday. I dropped
it on a Saturday, and they're not open on Sunday.
So on a Monday, they they called me up and
they were like, okay, we confirmed it's the hybrid inverter.
It's expensive. Are you sure you do you want to
do it? I'm like yeah, So we figure out all
that and they were like, well, the part will be here.
When he was like, I'm hoping we get you on

(16:01):
the road Thursday, maybe Friday at the latest, I'm like,
all right, cool. Wednesday, they confirmed the part arrives and
then I hear nothing. And my mechanic's usually really good.
I think I pitched about this last week too, but
apparently what had happened is their lead mechanic left the
day my part arrived for his vacation, so they were understaffed,

(16:22):
and he was the only person there who'd ever worked
on a hybrid battery system, which is, from what I've understood,
relatively dangerous. It's because it's high amperage, high voltage. I've
heard of people diying it, but I've heard that it's dangerous.
And they actually have gloves specifically. They're specifically for handling
hybrid batteries so that you can't get electrocuted. They had
one pair of those gloves because it's a specialty item,

(16:43):
so they had to order another pair because they realized
they needed like two mechanics minimum to try and do
this thing. Well, the gloves arrived late, and then when
they got there, when they opened the new box of gloves,
they saw a big sign on it that said like
made of latex, and then the other mechanic was like,
I'm allergic lateex. So the car just sat and they
said that basically like every day they tried to put

(17:05):
an hour into doing something with it, and it was
just failing every time. So finally I got mad, you know,
I was just like, you guys didn't tell me what
was going on, and like, and from what I understand now,
a lot of them didn't quite know what was going on.
But so they were like, hey, on a Thursday, like,
if I don't have your car to you tomorrow, you're
gonna go get a rental car and then you'll have
the car until I give you your car back. So

(17:27):
Friday comes, no car. I go to get a rental car.
And this was very funny. They'd scheduled me to pick
up a sedan or like vehicle from an enterprise and
I was already out to lunch with my mom. So
I was like, Mom, just drop me off of the
at the enterprise that they scheduled that.

Speaker 1 (17:43):
I'm early.

Speaker 3 (17:44):
If they don't have anything ready, I'll just wait. So
I get there and I'm like, hey, I know i'm
an hour early, but I'm here for this whatever. I
give my name and they're like okay. So you know,
he was like, bad news. Is the sedan that we
were expecting for you should have been here by now,
so we can clean it up real quick and then
give it to you. It's not here. I can put
it in order for a sedan from another store and

(18:06):
it'll probably be here in about an hour. Yeah, hour
and a half and he was like, or I can
see what we have and just try to get you moving,
and I was like that's fine with me. So he
leaves and five minutes later comes back and he goes,
how's a pickup truck? Would that be all right? And
I'm like, yeah, yeah, pickup truck's fine. I haven't driven
a pickup truck in a long time, but yeah, I
don't care, like sure, So he's like awesome. So three

(18:28):
minutes later, a guy comes out and just has the keys.
He's like, let's go getch your car. So I step outside.
It was a bright red Jeep Gladiator it was, which
is gigantic.

Speaker 1 (18:42):
It is.

Speaker 3 (18:42):
It is a friggin' beast it is. And I burst
into laughter because not only because it couldn't just be
a giant truck, even a truck. Yeah yeah, fire engine red,
which just made it even funnier.

Speaker 1 (18:59):
You just need to the horns.

Speaker 3 (19:00):
Oh my god, I'm shocked they didn't come standard because
that car was crazy.

Speaker 1 (19:05):
I was.

Speaker 3 (19:06):
I was intentionally driving over my curbs and stuff because
I feel it. You can't even feel it. It was awesome.
I drove that thing like I stole it. I was
like I was like, I was, I was gunning the
gas because I drive a Prius, you know, and they
they're not like a lot of people have opinions about
Prius based on like when they first came out eight seven,

(19:27):
and they were really In the words of my friend
Matt Lake, who owned a first generation Prius, he was like,
it has the delightfulness of a golf cart motor combined
with the delightfulness of a riding lawnmower motor. And I
was like, yeah. He was like, not a very good car,
great gas. Literally, not a very good car. Well, I
have an O nine and it's got a little it
can go.

Speaker 1 (19:46):
Yeah, it's fine.

Speaker 3 (19:48):
It's still you know, it's not freaking monster. This was
a V six friggin thing, So that was fun. At
least I got some fun out of it. I drove
it around like crazy. We got to haul some stuff
I'd been meaning to haul because I had this massive truck,
and it was very amusing driving around in that thing.

Speaker 1 (20:05):
It was fun riding with you out of the lounge
on Friday, I'll say that much.

Speaker 3 (20:08):
Yeah, that was the first thing I thought to I
was like, oh, I'm driving the guys to the lounge.
In this frigging beast. And the only the moment that
I realized this really isn't for me, though, was I
was on my way to return it today and I
stopped at.

Speaker 1 (20:21):
The gas station.

Speaker 3 (20:21):
You go, top off the gas tank, Yeah, and it
was half I had a half a tank. I spent
thirty three dollars filling that half of the tank. Holy now, now, David,
I don't spend thirty three dollars in two weeks filling
up my Preus gas tank is nine gallons. It was

(20:43):
almost ten gallons to fill that tank halfwayes And that's
what I was like, Yeah, you know, there's a reason
I never read trucks well. And there's a reason I
never went big trucks ever. I when my Volkswagen died,
which you know, got like twenty eight miles per gallon
on a good day, I was like, I want forty
four to forty eight miles per gallon, which is what

(21:03):
I get on the Prius. And the funny thing is
I told somebody that online because I posted a picture
of that truck on my Facebook and some people were like,
oh it really suits. You're like, oh, you're gonna be hooked,
And I was like it gets eighteen miles per gallon.

Speaker 1 (21:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (21:14):
And a friend of mine had comment and said, like,
you'd be surprised I sacrificed twenty seven miles per gallon
because I realized how much I loved having that like
grip and being able to whatever whatever. And I was like,
I would be sacrificing forty four miles per gallon. She's like,
holy crap, really, And I was like, my Prius is
old too, like the newer Priuses do like fifty one
to fifty two miles.

Speaker 1 (21:33):
I can't imagine you driving that across the country, across
the US, or that matter. I could, I'd have to.
I wouldn't even need roads, yeah, I mean you wouldn't.
Just need a lot of money for the gas. Yeah, yeah,
and the insurance and the insurance. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (21:45):
The shocking thing was I actually looked at the prices
of like getting one. I was curious, it's only like
six thousand dollars more than a brand new Prius.

Speaker 1 (21:52):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (21:52):
Prius are expensive, so they they maintain their their value
pretty well.

Speaker 1 (21:57):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (21:57):
So that's always been my rule is I try to
buy things that maintain value. Macintosh computers, I had a
old swagon. They always hold value pretty well. Prius tend
to hold value pretty well. Everybody wants a used Prius
because that initial price is so high. Everybody wants the
you know, the cheaper one. Yeah, I got it was
a two thousand and nine with forty four thousand miles
on it, and I got it in twenty fourteen. I

(22:18):
had to put money down to see it because the
guy flat out at the Toyota dealership was like, everyone
wants this car. So if you're serious, I'm gonna do
a I'll do a a like sixty dollars, hold on
your credit card and come and look at it in
a week when it because it wasn't even in yet. Yeah,
so and it's sure enough. Like after trying to buy

(22:39):
a used Prius, I noticed how quickly they they went.
I don't know if they're quite that bad now because
there's a lot more hybrids in the market, but Prius
is still kind of like the gold standard hybrids kind of.
I don't know if that's entirely true or not. I
would love to see people get all mad and be like, no, actually,
they do so much better with the hybrids on these. Now,
that's cool, bro. But almost eleven years without a major
repair on that car. So hell, yeah, but I'm not

(23:01):
gonna lie. I got a little depressed because when I
realized it was gonna it had been over two weeks
since I dropped it off. I was like, I literally
had that moment.

Speaker 1 (23:09):
I was like, I would have just bought a new car.

Speaker 3 (23:12):
I mean, not that I'm rich, but like I spent
thirty seven hundred dollars fixing that car roughly somewhere in
that neighborhood. Yeah, Like I could have put a nice
fat down payment on a car, traded in that car
to a Toyota dealership, wuld should give me a lot
of trade in.

Speaker 1 (23:24):
Yeah, I could have.

Speaker 3 (23:25):
But the reason I didn't is I was like, well,
I like my car and I want it back soon.
So I did have that moment where I was like,
I really should have just bought it. And my mom
even says she was like, we probably should have just
went and found you a new car, because in two weeks,
we could have found you in the right car.

Speaker 1 (23:37):
And I was like, yeah, learn well.

Speaker 3 (23:40):
It has one hundred and ninety five thousand miles on it,
the engine is in phenomenal shape. Now that the hybrid
inverter has been replaced. Those basically never fail. Yeah, Like
that's one of the reasons they didn't know how to
replace it is it's the most common issue in those
that era of Prius, and it almost never happened, never happens.

Speaker 1 (23:58):
Yeah, so it's one of those things.

Speaker 3 (23:59):
That's how it was explo to be On a message
board where I was trying to learn what was going
on with it, people were like, it's the most common
problem in a car with very few common problems. So
in fact, I think they said it was guaranteed to
one hundred and fifty thousand miles, and on the current
Prius it's guaranteed for the lifetime of the car because
that's how much they've advanced.

Speaker 1 (24:15):
The stuff makes sense.

Speaker 3 (24:16):
So I don't know, I like my Prius and I
have full intention of buying another Prius. Yeah, inevitably makes sense.
But yeah, I just had that moment where I was like, man,
I could have put a two thousand dollars down payment
on a Prius with like fifty five thousand miles. I mean,
I might have to go to Columbus, Ohio or Indianapolis
to get it. Still good, it's worth well, it's worth it.

(24:36):
You know, like I because you drive a SUV yeah, Trailblazer. Yeah,
and like you do not understand when you get like
forty four to forty eight, it really is forty four
to forty eight. That is, I've never gotten much lower
than that, except sometimes in the winter.

Speaker 1 (24:54):
I mean I can get to Wasteland on one take
of gas and not even use the entire tank in
that car.

Speaker 3 (25:00):
I mean I can too. The difference is my tank
is nine gallons. Yes, I know that well because from
what I understand, most car manufacturers their goal is for
a tank of gasoline to get you around three hundred.

Speaker 1 (25:13):
I have a seventeen gallon tank. Yeah that sounds right. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (25:16):
So when I had my Voltswa, my Vocal Voltswa, I
got it like a thirteen gallon tank.

Speaker 1 (25:20):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (25:20):
When I got the Prius, I noticed it would just
click and I was like, it's nine gallons. Part of
me was like I wish, I wish it was thirteen gallons.
So I get like five hundred miles I one tank anyway,
but no, so I am happy to have my car back.
That's something nice. My my micro drama just dropped on Dorian.
Hell yeah, I'm not going to plug it here. It's
not really the audience. But if you're curious to see

(25:43):
my micro drama like ghost soap opera, you can comment
on the video or comment on Spotify and I'll happily
give you the link. But it's on the Dorian app.
You can't miss it. If you download the Dorian app,
you'll find it and type my name in. It'll come
up along with the other series that'll be up in
like two weeks.

Speaker 1 (26:02):
You go.

Speaker 3 (26:03):
So it's been really cool working with the people at Dorian.
I mean, it's been an experience because it's very different.
They're tech people, so they have they're just so different. Honestly,
overall better, that's good.

Speaker 1 (26:16):
Shows.

Speaker 3 (26:16):
Business people are kind of silly. It's like I was
talking to our buddy J Cappy about that, yeah, and
he was talking about Quibi. He was like, I guess,
I guess Quibi just came a little too late. And
I was like, well, and I said, no, No, Quibi
did exactly what they wanted to do. They wanted to
be a short movie studio, so they did what most
studios do. They went bankrupt. Yeah, they nailed it.

Speaker 1 (26:35):
They nailed it. There we go. Anyway, So speaking of
the Adventures. Last week we also went and saw Bring
Her Back.

Speaker 3 (26:42):
We did from the from the directors of Talk to Me,
Talk to Me, the Brother Team.

Speaker 1 (26:47):
Yeah and uh. I liked it.

Speaker 3 (26:50):
Yeah, I didn't adore it, but there was a lot
to enjoy. It was very tense, very creepy at all
of those points, very well. I liked that it was
relatively contained. I liked the blind character. I thought that
was a really cool way to go with it. Yeah,
I had one and I won't spoil it, but I

(27:12):
had They had one huge logic flaw that I can
usually let go of that, but that logic flaw makes
the entire movie happen.

Speaker 1 (27:22):
I need to see it a second time to think
about it because I'm willing to let it go on
this first viewing, mainly because I like to Bring Her
Back a lot more than Talk to Me. I had
no big beef with Talk to Me. I thought it
was good. I thought it was a solid thriller, very unsettling.
There's just one treatment of a character in that movie
that just really bothered me because they just didn't stop.

Speaker 3 (27:42):
I like how that bothered you, that like turns you
toward the other one where like the only problem is
there is just it's a lot of disbelief for a
major point of bring her Back to work.

Speaker 1 (27:57):
In the movie. You and I talked about incredible scene.

Speaker 3 (28:00):
It's just that the inciting element that keeps things going
doesn't quite make sense.

Speaker 1 (28:04):
You and I, You and I talked about that, and
you're and you're not wrong. My My big beef with
Talk to Me was just it just it. I remember
sitting in the theater and just it got to a
point where I was just like, is this what they're
gonna keep doing in this movie to this particular character?
And then when the character didn't really even get a
happy ending by any stretch. Honestly, it just really I

(28:25):
just wasn't a fan of that, Like Talk to Me's
fine as opposed to bring her back, full of happy end,
bring her back, gave gave closure though it did it
did it did, bring her back, gave closure. Talk to
Me left it open because we are getting a sequel.
But yeah, I've been having this conversation with a couple
of people, and I just I really wanted to like

(28:47):
talk to me more about have you rewatched Talk to Me? No,
I haven't. That might be I might need to but
that that fuck it. I'll just say it. There, what
happens to the brother and talk to me really upset me. Sure,
and then it he did it again, It did it again.
And then even by the last action of the movie,
not gonna spoil that, but even by the last action movie,

(29:07):
brother still doesn't really get off on a good hand
and is completely fucked for life.

Speaker 3 (29:14):
And did nothing. Yeah, that's my big key. I mean,
there was a lot of cruelty to people who had
no ye didn't deserve it.

Speaker 1 (29:24):
And bring her back. I think what I liked about
bring her back, and it could have been the supernatural
element was a little bit more explained and talk to me,
and I guess it was a little more left open
and bring her back a little bit. Is is heavy
a lot.

Speaker 3 (29:36):
There's no which is fine, it which work worked fine, Yeah,
but there is no explanation for exactly how we got
to what's going on, whereas talk to.

Speaker 1 (29:45):
Me, you basically get everything in that first ten minutes
that they bring out that hand.

Speaker 3 (29:47):
Yeah, it's it's I think that one builds a universe
in a more traditional way.

Speaker 1 (29:52):
I'm very curious to see what they're gonna do with
the sequel. And I most likely will watch it again
with the sequel coming. But yeah, I I if I
had to pick out of the two so far that
I really liked more, I really did like bring her
back more, and I'm ready to watch it again.

Speaker 3 (30:03):
I will say, I remember your mood being a little
snippy that day.

Speaker 1 (30:07):
For talk to me. Well, when I looked back on
what day it was.

Speaker 3 (30:11):
Yeah, yeah, that wasn't I wasn't saying like so funny
but cool, sweet, all right, let's talk about this don
peppine Garcia, my father Connecticut.

Speaker 1 (30:20):
This is a cigar show now.

Speaker 3 (30:21):
Yeah, but no, no, That's why I was like, maybe
should give it a rewatch because I do remember I
think you were you were in a kind of a
mood and you were that doesn't mean that you'll love
it more and yeah, but uh, and I think you
were really hoping for Like the vibe I got when
we talked about it was that you were kind of
hoping for like simultaneously a teen slasher movie, but also

(30:43):
that would be like not at all what you would expect.

Speaker 1 (30:46):
I don't remember that, but it does sound like me.

Speaker 3 (30:47):
Yeah, well no, and that was And that's what I
mean is it was like It's kind of a little
contradictory because I liked that it went. It did give
you a teen slasher me in a way you hadn't
seen before, but it also skipped some of the tropes well.

Speaker 1 (30:59):
And what's funny to me is Bring Her Back has
more of a terrifying, unsettling scene that I'm not gonna
spoil that kind of up.

Speaker 3 (31:07):
To talk to me like, you're gonna have to be
more specific. I don't know which one you're talking about.

Speaker 1 (31:10):
Nom nom nom, You're still gonna have to be more specifically.
You know, I'm right. You know I'm right.

Speaker 3 (31:15):
No, No, that's me, that's me gassing up bring her back?

Speaker 1 (31:18):
Do you want some food? Oh, don't do that.

Speaker 3 (31:21):
I mean maybe I know what you're talking about.

Speaker 1 (31:23):
Now.

Speaker 3 (31:23):
That movie's got a lot of hard scenes to way.

Speaker 1 (31:25):
I don't want to act it out. No, I don't
want to. I'm just I'm just.

Speaker 3 (31:28):
But my point is just that I'm with you. I
think the movie is even more disturbing. The brother tried
to sony ways and made it worse. I'll put it
that way, I mean, and bring her back, Yeah, I mean,
you're not wrong.

Speaker 1 (31:41):
The brother tried to help one character that we got
a lot of sympathy for, and then something happened where
he was trying to take him.

Speaker 3 (31:48):
I know what, I know what scene you're talking about.
My point is that there is a lot of disturbing.

Speaker 1 (31:52):
There is, but that one, in particular, I just remember
being on my seat being like, holy shit, No, that
one was rough. Yes, that one was rough.

Speaker 3 (31:59):
That was like cringey, like things with fingernails. Not it
wasn't things with fingails, but like things with fingernails or like,
you know that that kind of thing. I'm not disagreeing, Yeah,
that was kind of My point is that, like it's
actually I think they hit that note really well multiple times.

Speaker 1 (32:14):
I probably do, oh, bring her back or bring her back?
Talk to me another watch, so I will, like I said,
I will get to it. But yeah, if I had
to pick right now, bring her back was my favorite.
It could change, but I highly recommend bring her back.

Speaker 3 (32:24):
And bring her back. That's kind of why I'm a
little harsher to bring her back, is because by being
more self contained, that's generally something I like more and
find scarier. But then having to have one of the
conceits to make it all make sense. Yeah, not have
a lot of logic to it.

Speaker 1 (32:41):
It just it just kind of it just.

Speaker 3 (32:42):
Like it's like, you know, an a automatic half star deduction.
It's not it's not enough to make me say, don't
ever see that movie. It's great, it's really a good film.

Speaker 1 (32:51):
Feel like the main character and talk to Me was
really unlikable.

Speaker 3 (32:55):
I think they were all pretty unlikable and talk to men,
I would agree that that. Actually, yeah, they're they're all
pretty hard to like.

Speaker 1 (33:01):
Whereas Bringer Back, I felt sympathy for damn near all
of them.

Speaker 3 (33:05):
Oh, I would agree with that entirely. Yeah, no, no, no,
that's yeah, no, I I it's it's important to state
that I like to bring her back, and it's it's
it's I'm always harder on a movie when it when
it was like close to four stars in my mind,
but then it just isn't.

Speaker 1 (33:21):
It just doesn't.

Speaker 3 (33:21):
I'm gonna be a little harsher because I'm like, it
was so close to everything I could have wanted.

Speaker 1 (33:25):
I totally dropped my rating to talk to me when
we were leaving.

Speaker 3 (33:27):
On Hateful Last Hateful baster See, And unlike David, I'm
this is a hypothetical star rating because I write these things.

Speaker 1 (33:38):
You know.

Speaker 3 (33:39):
Ever, No, I like the idea that based on my
mood and what I had for lunch that day, I
will say, what what star rating? I feel a movie
is in that moment that one of the.

Speaker 1 (33:48):
Most rewarding things of our friendship when it comes to
the to our movie friendship, especially, is that you've had redeems.
I've had redeems, cinematic redeems and everything. We're just like
you were just like, ah, I was never a big,
fatous movie, but I'll give ano shot. And then you
turned around liking it. Same thing with me, but you
had way more on me than I have on you. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (34:05):
Well, I think that my era of I was in
a bad mood or whatever. I think my era was
just the window.

Speaker 1 (34:14):
Was a little shorter. Yeah, that's fair.

Speaker 3 (34:16):
That's all because like, there are a couple of movies
that I like outwardly didn't like when I first saw them. Yeah,
that are bizarre. I mean, like, I didn't like Straight
Into Darkness the first time I watched.

Speaker 1 (34:29):
That's shocking. Yeah, that's really shocking.

Speaker 3 (34:32):
Because Burr the director, when I told him, I was
like it was kind of a little dark for me
or whatever, and he was like a lot of people
felt that way. You know, it's all right. When I
read I rewatched a few months after I knew him,
and literally the moment it ended, I was like I
was texting him. I was like, that movie's fucking genius, dude, Like, no,
it really is. It's a genius film. It really is great.
So I think my window was just a little shorter.

(34:54):
I think, you know, you know, with your time in college,
yeah and stuff like, I think you had a lot
of interesting times to experienced stuff.

Speaker 1 (35:01):
The hardest thing lately has been going back and watching
some of the stuff that I loved when I was
in tailing to high school into college. A lot of
those like Anchor Bay titles, like the original Anchor Bay titles,
and like that dimension extreme and whatnot. And don't be wrong,
I still like them, but they had their time, and
they've kind of moved a little lower on the shelf.

Speaker 3 (35:17):
Give it eight years, yeah, and then they'll be wonderful again,
because right now everybody's really into the nineties, they'll be
into the two thousands and no time. We're already knocking
on it a little bit.

Speaker 1 (35:26):
I mean, laid to Rest definitely did hold up. Laid
to ress too, not so much.

Speaker 3 (35:30):
Yeah, I could see that. Yeah, No, it's funny. I
was watching this video about how nostalgia works and stuff,
and it was talking about how like millennials are obsessed
with the nineties, and I was like, yeah, but only
re Like I thought this out lot, and I was like, yeah,
but only recently, like in twenty ten was all the eighties. Yeah,
And then he even mentions like he even says like
in twenty eleven, it was all about the eighties. It's
always about thirty years. And I was like, it is.

(35:51):
It's at least like about.

Speaker 1 (35:52):
Thirty last three VHS films have been ninety if I'm
not mistaken.

Speaker 3 (35:55):
Oh yeah, no, people are all thinking about the nineties now,
and how I mean, look at the resurgents, So a
resurgence of vinyl and VHS. I feel like that's very
eighties coded, more seventies with vinyl, but you know what
I mean, very eighties coded, especially because in the eighties
you got vinyl releases for like rock music, and so
because a lot of people nowadays not so much. But
like when I was growing up, when you heard vinyl,

(36:17):
you were thinking like, oh, you're really into like Paul
Anka m h, you know that was what you think of.

Speaker 1 (36:22):
Yeah, But then if you think of the eighties, the
eighties is when.

Speaker 3 (36:24):
It's like, oh I got a Cramps record, Oh I
got all these like these things. Now you look at
like Vinyl's still running strong without a doubt, but like
now there's this resurgence of like cassette tapes, and I
see cassette tapes as way more nineties.

Speaker 1 (36:38):
We just watched Jason Goes to Hell the New four
K from Earrow over the weekend, and then our buddy
Ryan at Terror Vision announced that the Jason Goes to
Hell soundtrack for the first time ever on cassette, So
naturally I had to pre order.

Speaker 3 (36:48):
It, and they sold the most cassettes they've ever sold
in one sale.

Speaker 1 (36:51):
Well, they have to give them a picturel quick. As
of right now, they have one through nine, fright thirteenth
soundtracks available on cassette. Oh yeah, that's a big fucking deal.
I would agree. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (37:01):
So, but I'm saying so cassettes to me, being a
kid who was born in eighty six, like my walk
I had, my first Walkman was a cassette Walkman. Cassette
tapes weren't just in the car.

Speaker 1 (37:14):
They were. They were a thing you they were in
the homes they were.

Speaker 3 (37:17):
Yeah, and you would record cassettes off the radio and
stuff like that. I got my first CD player in
like two thousand and one, like personal walkmand CD player
in like two thousand and one. So CDs were at
the end of the nineties, like to where it was
like we'd have a boombox or we had a little
stereo in the living room. We'd listen to CDs and
we'd get them from you know, we we'd scam what's

(37:40):
the house, Columbia house.

Speaker 1 (37:43):
We would do it.

Speaker 3 (37:44):
Oh my mom like would be like, order whatever you
want because when they send the bill, I'm gonna say
my kid did it, because you did. And that's you
always get out. You just said my kid did it,
and they're like, oh shoot, oh man, I guess it
really did. Only cost four cents of CD. So I
remember because I got like Jeff Foxworthy stand up comedy album.

(38:04):
I got the Beavis and butt Head CD. I think
that was the movie soundtrack.

Speaker 1 (38:08):
One of the movie soundtrack, yeah soundtrack, by the way.

Speaker 3 (38:10):
The Mortal Kombat soundtrack, which is one of the best
movie soundtracks. That was that movie and that soundtrack introduced
an entire generation to industrial and techno music that had
never really been around it, because I mean, that's why
I first heard KMFDM type o negative.

Speaker 1 (38:27):
Tracy Lord's had a song on that album, even though
I don't know if it was under her name or not.
It might have been under the mixer and everything, but yeah,
she had a song on that album too, and.

Speaker 3 (38:35):
It had some great stuff on there. And I mean
I remember listening to that CD a bunch and then
going to like best Buy and they had one KMFDM album. Yeah,
and it was KMFDM Sucks, which is a great album,
really fun. I think it was EP actually, but it
was really fun. But I remember like jam and the
KMFDM Sucks and listening to all this, and then eventually
I got Nile or Nihill I think It's How You

(38:57):
Say It, which was the album that juke Jo and
Jezebel which was from Mortal Kombat was on there, and
I would like listen to that all the time. And
then that took me down the road to like Snake
River Conspiracy and Switchblade Symphony.

Speaker 1 (39:08):
You have your Snake Rivers Conspiracy.

Speaker 3 (39:10):
Now that's a great album. That's a that's an album
that's a I.

Speaker 1 (39:14):
On Apple Music. No, you can only listen to on
YouTube or if you actually have a CD.

Speaker 3 (39:17):
I really hope that people that was. That was a
fascinating album, really well produced, thought out. The vocalist was
amazing and she was completely unknown. Yeah, so anyway, I
could talk about Snake River conspiracy.

Speaker 1 (39:34):
You keep going with nineties sostyalgia because our movie Tonight
is a nineties movie.

Speaker 3 (39:38):
And it's a very nostalgic nineties movie to me because
it was on television regular, not HBO either, It was
just on USA, it was on TBS. It was on
TNT all the time when I was a kid.

Speaker 1 (39:50):
Yes, we are wrapping up Listener Request Month with one
of our most requested titles since we started the show,
and that is ninety one of them. Yeah, there was.
There was basically a top three, and that's what we
chose this month, kid Surviving the Game, and uh, oh
shit ready or not?

Speaker 3 (40:04):
Wow, I'm spicy Surviving the Game got requested soon. I'm
happy about it because this is a movie that I
felt like was kind of forgotten for a little while,
and then people would talk about it here and there,
and then when shout factory did their little, their little
blue release, which the movie needed needed because that DVD
was rough to watch, Yeah, and the VHS was impossible.
I mean, yes, we'll talk about when we get to

(40:25):
this big night scene at the end. On DVD, it
was hard to watch. On VHS, it was impossible to watch.
I bet, I bet, I wonder how it looked in
the theater.

Speaker 1 (40:33):
Like I said, when when I sent you that clip
of Ciskel and Eber that they have it up on
the screen and you can barely tell that's F. Murray
Abraham until you hear his voice. F. Murray Abraha. But yes,
we are talking about surviving The game from nineteen ninety four,
one hour and thirty six minutes, rated R for strong
violence and language. EMBE synopsis says, a homeless man is

(40:55):
hired as a survivalist guide for a group of wealthy
businessmen on a hunting trip in the mountains, unaware that
they are killers who hunt humans for sport and he
is their due prey.

Speaker 3 (41:03):
That's a decent that's a decent one. The wording, while
I don't love it, Yeah, like putting words like killers
in there is smart. It makes it sound I mean
it's just an exciting movie. Yeah, but it makes it
more exciting if you were reading that on the tape.

Speaker 1 (41:16):
My synopsis, when a homeless man accepts the job as
this survivless guide for several wealthy businessmen in the mountains,
he will have to use his street smarts and instincts
when he suddenly becomes the hunted. That's not bad.

Speaker 3 (41:26):
I don't want to make this is My only problem
is is like spiritual, Yeah, I don't. And this is
this comes down to a person having watched the movie
so many times. What I get from the movie personally. Yeah,
I don't think it's his street sparks and stuff. I
think it's just his will to live. But that's quibbling.
That is not like be going, David, you're wrong, knock
the mic over, bust your nose.

Speaker 1 (41:48):
You know. Well, I mean we did see him, you know,
making those trees smoke in the beginning of the movie,
so I mean he does carry that over into the forest.

Speaker 3 (41:54):
Those damn those damn city trees always smoking their their
pall mall.

Speaker 1 (41:58):
Taglines include Jack Mason knows he's going to die someday,
but today he's not in the mood.

Speaker 3 (42:05):
I kind of love that one, even though I don't
think that's a good tagline in of itself.

Speaker 1 (42:10):
I love it though, Yeah, how far will you go
to stay alive? That's a good tagline. The rules are simple,
kill or be killed? Solid the Ultimate man Hunt. The
problem with a killer the rules are simple, killer, be killed.
Is that tagline could be a tagline for like a
million movies. Oh yeah, because.

Speaker 3 (42:30):
It's so simple, but it works so well. You could
use that so many, so many action movies.

Speaker 1 (42:36):
Lastly, the thrill is the kill.

Speaker 3 (42:39):
That's good. I like that's a good one.

Speaker 1 (42:41):
Yeah. At this time, Surviving the Game is currently rentable
on Prime and Fandango, rentable with the new HD transfer
that is available now too, and has not been available
for a long time.

Speaker 3 (42:50):
Yes, no, we were waiting forever to get an HD
of this film.

Speaker 1 (42:54):
Director on the film is Ernest R. Dickerson. He gets
his start as a cinematographer, Yes, on some credible films.
So he starts with Joe's bedste Stewie Barbershop, We Cut
Heads in eighty three, goes on to do Grand Master
Flash and mel White Lines Don't do It All Right
in eighty three, The Brother from Another Planet in eighty four,
he shoots I haven't seen that forever. I love that movie.

(43:16):
He shoots Bruce Springsteen's video for Born in the USA
in eighty four.

Speaker 3 (43:20):
That makes sense too. This is something I try to
point out, especially back in the day. Yeah, there are
if once you start looking at these credits and start
looking at like the side characters and things, you can
very quickly tell like shot near New York and Bruce
Springsteen obviously loves Jersey and he wants to be near Jersey.
Ernie Dickerson hanging out New York because he ends up

(43:40):
falling in very soon we'll be talking about when he
falls in with Spike Lee.

Speaker 1 (43:43):
Yeah, so it makes sense.

Speaker 3 (43:45):
It's kind of like you can watch OZ, and then
after you watch OZ, every movie you watch you'll see
like the guy who's the cab driver.

Speaker 1 (43:52):
And be like, oh, they're shooting near New York.

Speaker 3 (43:54):
Because OZ literally had every single character actor New York
had to offer. Yeah, was in that show. I mean
that's what put JK. Simmons on the map as a
character actor to the whole world, because he was a
Broadway guy almost exclusively.

Speaker 1 (44:09):
Was he the M and M before he got OZ?
I don't know. I think so.

Speaker 3 (44:12):
I think he was doing because that would make sense
because like voice work, it's just a matter of like
they used to did you know back in the day,
do you man, do you know what an ISDN line is? No,
so I don't remember what IDN stands for, and now
I kind of want to ISDN. But IDN Integrated Services
Digital Network. So an DN line was. It was the precursor.

(44:37):
It was like a It was similar to DSL, which
was the precursor to not fiber but to a cable Internet.

Speaker 1 (44:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (44:43):
It was a dedicated high speed line that guaranteed you
one hundred and I think it was one hundred and
twenty eight. It could be like variable, but it was
a high kilobits per second up and down. Yeah, slow
by broadband standards, but it was dedicated, so that meant
that it never slowed down. It was always the same speed. So,
back in the olden days, if you were in New

(45:06):
York City and you wanted to do voice work for
a major brand, they would rent a studio and they
would have an ISDN line going to the whethers, to
the engineer in wherever they are, or just to the
board of people and they would listen as you do,
and they would give you notes because they'd be hearing
you in what was basically CD quality sound instantly. That's

(45:27):
also how like how they used to do radio shows
if people were on remote, like if they did the
radio show in their basement studio, which wasn't very common,
but when they did, the big thing was like I
want to do the show for my home. I have
to get an ISDN line.

Speaker 1 (45:41):
Have you heard the story about JK. Simmons going into
record for there was like a radio thing that they
were doing and they were like, Okay, we want you
to go ahead and like do it like this guy did.
They play a sample and it's JK. Simmons and so
he's like he's like well, He's like I don't mean to,
you know, split hairs here, but that's me, and they're
like okay, well yeah, just go ahead and do it.
They went with somebody else. That's funny.

Speaker 3 (46:02):
That makes me think of when Pendulette told the story
about doing voiceover in Vegas and the icdnline was going
to the people in the studio, and in the studio
in Vegas, he was at rip Taylor was there. I
think this is when he was doing Comedy Central a
voice for because he was the voice for Comedy Central,
and so he grabbed Rip and said, like, help me
do a joke, and he was like okay, so he said, uh.

(46:22):
He was like, hey, guys, real quick, I just wanted
to pitch something to you. I can do a really
good rip tailor, Like what do you think? And then
he had rip and ripped.

Speaker 1 (46:30):
What do you think? What do you think? How does
this sound? How does this sound?

Speaker 3 (46:32):
And they were like, pen, you're not an impressionist, Like,
let's just let's just stick to what works. Oh Taylor, Oh,
he thought it was the funniest thing in the world. Well,
they also didn't ask him to do a rip tailor. Yeah,
it's just that's that's just that just kills me.

Speaker 1 (46:49):
So yeah. He does Born in the USA at eighty four,
then shoots the Patti LaBelle music video for Stirred Up,
then does Crush Groove, shoots Vampires in eighty six.

Speaker 3 (46:56):
He shot Crush Groove, I Love Crush.

Speaker 1 (47:00):
Grow, shot eight episodes of Tales from the Dark Side
in eighty six, shoots She's Got to Have It, Enemy
Territory in eighty seven, Eddie Murphy raw in eighty seven
I believe that, then goes on to do School Days Experiments,
Unlimited de Butt video, The Laser Man, Do the Right
Thing in eighty nine, Public Enemy, Fight the Power Video,
Fright House, Death by Temptation in nineteen ninety and he

(47:24):
also shoots Mobeta, Blues, Law and Order, Jungle Fever, Sex, Drugs,
and Rock and Roll, The Eric Wagozi and Special Malcolm
X in ninety two, which is also the same year
he becomes a director with Juice in ninety.

Speaker 3 (47:35):
Two, phenomenal film, like really, really, a great film. I've
always Ernest Dickerson is one of those directors that I
have admired deeply. I mean, to go from shooting Bruce
Springsteen and you gotta remember, this is just a guy
from New York who was very talented. He went I
forget which film school he went to, or I know
he did. Oh he's from Newark originally New Jersey.

Speaker 1 (47:57):
Man.

Speaker 3 (47:58):
He's seventy three years old, Yes he is. His year's
active years active are three years before was born to
the present. But he uh, I wonder what school. I
was trying to find out what school he went to.
It doesn't matter, but he uh. I mean the fact
that he goes from Springsteen to like four years later
shooting Malcolm X. Yeah, incredible, he was.

Speaker 1 (48:18):
Shooting so he had already directed Juice and he was
shooting Malcolm X in Egypt and reading the reviews from Juice.
That's epic. He talks about that on the commentary. Yeah,
that is sick. So that he directs Surviving the Game
in ninety four, follows that up with Tails from the
crypt Demon Knight follows that up with Bulletproof, then goes
on to the Dude Blind Faith a Bush. That one
with Patrick Patrick. Oh my god, Robert Patrick, who watched

(48:39):
I love that was a solid one.

Speaker 3 (48:40):
Robert Patrick had some great B movies because they just
saw the cool surface for the first time.

Speaker 1 (48:44):
Yeah, which to watch it? You love it? Oh, I'm
sure I will. Robert Patrick. I mean the ones we found,
the few we found, the one of him and Rooker
wrote Rogue Squad or fuck what was it called rogue
Patrol or something like that. That was really good. Uh,
Framed by Deception was really good, But I think the
last gas where he gets possessed by a warrior was

(49:07):
probably the wildest one. Yeah. Rogue Force, Rogue Force. Yeah,
next two, Zero Tolerance where he was, you know, just
a complete fucking badass.

Speaker 3 (49:14):
Oh my god, Zero Tolerance was so much fun.

Speaker 1 (49:17):
So Ambush in ninety eight, follows up The Future Sport,
followed by Strange Justice, Night Visions, then directs Bones in
two thousand and one, Our America, Monday Night Mayhem, Good Fences,
Never Die Alone with DMX he does in two thousand
and four, followed by Third Watch episodes of The l Word,
Crossing Jordan, Criminal Minds, CSI, Miami Heroes, Masters of Horror,
The v Word Er, The forty four Hundred, Weeds, The Wire,

(49:41):
Fear Itself, Medium Bird Notice, Vampire Diaries, The Cape, Low
Winter Sun, Dexter, Sleepy Hollow, Once upon a Time, Under
the Dome, Walking Dead, Damien, The Deuce, I'm Dying up Here,
House of Cards, The Purge, Bosh Parish, and Bosh Legacy
in twenty twenty five.

Speaker 3 (49:56):
Man, he got in the.

Speaker 1 (49:58):
TV and didn't stop.

Speaker 3 (49:59):
But well, but my point is he got into TV
right when it became premium, like he didn't He didn't
have to schlep doing any like cheap shows. He was
doing all the big stuff right away.

Speaker 1 (50:09):
Monday Night Mayhem in two thousand and two. Is that
big TNT movie about Asell. I remember that, yeah, and
that was a very big deal when it came out.
I remember, like they were promoing the hell out of that.

Speaker 3 (50:19):
But I man, I didn't realize he got in so
so early, like right when showtime in HBO and stuff,
we're making these really incredible shows. He was right there
directing episodes. Yeah, it makes sense. I mean he's he's
damn good. And I want to mention Bones is incredibly
I love it was underrated. I think now people appreciate it.

Speaker 1 (50:37):
Ever since that shout to a Stream Factory bluere came out,
it seems like it's getting a little bit more appreciation.
Oh yeah, So we have two writers on the film
because technically this is based off of Richard Connell's short
story from nineteen twenty four to the Most Dangerous Game
Out one of.

Speaker 3 (50:48):
My favorite not my favorite short story. I've read it once. Yeah,
my favorite story to be adapt adapted. I you give
me any adaptation of Most Dangerous Game and I'm excited.

Speaker 1 (51:00):
Well, just just to name a few before we get there.
So we've got the Naked Prey in nineteen sixty six,
We've got the woman hunting seventy two, Turkey Shoot in
eighty two, Let me some Turkey Shoot, Slave Girls from
Beyond Infinity in eighty seven, Deadly Prey in eighty seven,
Hard Target in ninety three, Surviving the Game in ninety four,
The Past in ninety seven.

Speaker 3 (51:17):
You know, I always forget if it's a most dangerous game,
but it totally is?

Speaker 1 (51:21):
It totally is? I mostly just enjoy when he's farting Dracula. Oh,
I mean who doesn't.

Speaker 3 (51:26):
And I don't mean that he's farting out Dracula. I
mean that he is a drafting draft bark in the shower,
and well, where else are you going to be a
farting drafto?

Speaker 1 (51:33):
Then one I forgot about Apocalyptico, the Mel Gibson film
in two thousand and six is technically one. Have you
seen Apocalyptico, Apocalyptole, Apocalypto.

Speaker 3 (51:42):
Yeah, sorry, I saw it for the first time in November.
It's great of last year. No, it's phenomenal film. I
had no idea because it ended up putting Rachel and
I on a NonStop Mel Gibson marathon because she had
never seen the man without a face and she had
never seen Hacksaw Ridge. Oh yeah, pretty much everything else. Yeah,
but I had never seen Apocalypto, so she showed me

(52:03):
Apocalypto and then we just snowballed into like, man, I
haven't seen a man without a face of forever.

Speaker 1 (52:08):
And she was like, what's that? And I was like, oh,
good one, it's a great film. So we also have
last week's episode Ready or Not is technically one, The
Hunt in twenty twenty, Tremor Shrieker Island in twenty twenty,
Apex the Most Dangerous Game remake in twenty twenty two,
and most recently Death Hunt in twenty twenty two, which
is a Canadian version. Yeah, so very polite, very polite.

Speaker 3 (52:27):
Oh hey there, we're gonna hunt you for sport a.

Speaker 1 (52:30):
So the other writer on the film is Eric Burnt.
He gets to start writing the screenplay for Surviving the
Game in ninety four, goes on to write Virtuosity in
ninety five. He follows that up with Romeo mus Die Wow,
followed by Highlander End Game in two thousand, Vegas Baby
in two thousand and six, the Hitcher remake in two
thousand and seven, another Rugger Howard Well original Rugger Howard Yeah, Yeah,

(52:50):
The Echo in two thousand and eight, and z Nation
in twenty fifteen.

Speaker 3 (52:54):
Really yeah, interesting career.

Speaker 1 (52:56):
Our cinematographer is Bojon Bizzelli, who gets his start as
a DP on China Girl in eighty seven, goes on
to shoot tape heads Patty Hurst Pumpkinhead in eighty eight,
follows that up with The Comeback, then shoots Big Man
on Campus in eighty nine, Haunting of Sarah Hardy in
eighty nine, King of New York in eighty nine, The
Christopher Walking movie Okay, a gnome called Norm. Okay.

Speaker 3 (53:20):
Now we're getting into art.

Speaker 1 (53:21):
Mariah Carey Visions of Love music video Mariah Carey Love
Takes Time music video Fever in ninety one, The Rapture
Deep Cover in ninety two with Laurence Fishburne. The Fear
Inside follows that up with boxing Helena in ninety three,
follows that up with one of your favorites in My Favorites,
Body Snatchers in ninety three.

Speaker 3 (53:39):
He shot bodies, he shot, he snatched body shotters. There
we go, Wow, that's it. So speaking of films that
desperately needed a Blu Ray, yeah, that one just got
a simple Warner Archive Blu ray, but looks phenomenal. Finally
seeing that, and I'm not I'm not trying to be

(53:59):
that guy, but I sometimes I can be. Seeing that
film in the original two thirty five super wide aspect
ratio made that movie so much better because when I
watched it in the proper aspect ratio, Because what happens
with these movies when they're shot super wide back in
the day more so than now, is they used to
just crop them into be normal sixty by nine for Cable. Yeah,

(54:21):
that's how I didn't see I didn't see oh gosh,
the Alec Baldwin Bear movie, Oh of the Edge, The Edge.
I didn't see The Edge in its proper aspect ratio
until the Blue, very until I bought the Blu ray
because every at the time, like I watched it on
Stars or whatever, and it was always cropped in a bit.

Speaker 1 (54:38):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (54:39):
So, but Body Snatcher's in particular, every shot tells the story.
So when you see the shots as they're exactly as
they were meant to be seen, that movie becomes way scarier.

Speaker 1 (54:52):
I think, honestly, even though there you know, there is
the there's the history with it about how it was
basically taken away from Able and everything, and the Studio
did interfere with it massively. I still think it is
one of the most underrated adaptations of Body Snatchers in general.

Speaker 3 (55:05):
We should do an underrated adaptation. I'd be down for that,
like because we could.

Speaker 1 (55:09):
Start with that.

Speaker 3 (55:10):
Yeah, and just and you know what, a lot of
them will be from the late eighties in the nineties, Yes,
say would, And I bet you, I bet you almost
all of them would be from like eighty eight to
like two thousand and nine.

Speaker 1 (55:20):
Probably so. His Body Snatches in ninety three, follows that
up with California with a K, the Brad Pitt movie
Love Me Some California, shoots sugar Hill in ninety four,
then shoots Surviving the Game the same year, follows that
up with Dangerous Beauty The Ring in two thousand and two,
then shoots Mister and Missus Smith in two thousand and five,
Hair Spray remake in two thousand and seven, g Fours
in two thousand and nine, Sorceers Apprentice in twenty ten,

(55:42):
Burlesquan twenty ten, Rock of Ages, The Lone Ranger, Petee Dragon,
Spectral Cure for Wellness in twenty sixteen, six Underground for
Netflix in twenty nineteen, Underwater in twenty twenty Oh shit,
Snake Eyes in twenty twenty one, follows that up with
Murder Mystery Too, the Adam Sandlor movie for Netflix in
twenty twenty three, and most recently shot Peter Pan and

(56:02):
Wendy in twenty twenty three for Disney Plus. Wow.

Speaker 3 (56:05):
Yeah, that's a hell of a career. Yeah it is
because I was wondering. I now no longer wonder, but
for a second I was wondering. I was like, I
wonder what would be like to be the DP for
a guy who started as a DP but he was
already his credentials were pretty sick by the time he
got to Surviving the game. Oh yeah, because California is
a great film, very underrated. Yeah, really good film, and
it looks great. It's very Yeah. This dude, this dude

(56:27):
had has chops.

Speaker 1 (56:28):
Boxing Helena is one I really really want to see again.
But getting a copy of it right now is fucking hard. Yep, God,
so mood. Out of our cast, we have mister Rugger Howard,
who plays Thomas Burns in the film one hundred and
seventy four credits on his resume, by the way, not surprised,
not at all so starts with Monjeur Hardwin in sixty eight,
follows it up with Floree in sixty nine, Turkish Delight

(56:49):
in seventy three, Hard to Remember, Willoughby Conspiracy, Cold Blood,
Soldier of Orange Mysteries. Then his first US movie for
the most part is nineteen eighty one Nighthawks with Celevesterilone replaces.

Speaker 3 (57:00):
Terror Hawks a Lot. Yeah, that's a great film.

Speaker 1 (57:03):
Goes on to the Star in Channel Solitaire, follows that
up with Inside the Third Reich, then does Blade Runner
in eighty two. That would put you on the map. Yeah.
Then he follows that up with Eureka, goes on to
the Oasterman Weekend a Breed Apart, Lady Hawk in eighty five,
then does Flesh and Blood, The Hitcher in eighty six,
Wanted Dead or Alive in eighty six, Escape from Sobovore
in eighty seven, Legend of the Holy Drinker in eighty eight,

(57:25):
Blind Fury The Blood of Heroes aka Rise Salute of
the Juggernauts is the other title that goes by. Then
he does Law the Desert, Wedlock Past Midnight, Split Second,
Buffy the Vampire Slayer in ninety two.

Speaker 3 (57:36):
Oh Man he's so good in Buffy the Empire Slayer.

Speaker 1 (57:40):
Blindside in ninety three. Arctic Blue then does survive in
the game in ninety four, Nostre Damis Fatherland, Cross worlds
Omega Doom, The Call of the Wild Blast in ninety seven,
which was that terrorist Olympic swim team movie that we watched.

Speaker 3 (57:53):
Yes, I'd love to watch Call the Wild, Call.

Speaker 1 (57:56):
The Wild's Good Breeders in ninety seven, Merlin Simon Magnus
Partners in Crime, The Tenth Kingdom, Slow Burned, Turbulence three
Heavy Metal in nineteen ninety nine, or Excent two thousand
and one. Then he does The Room, which he directs
in two thousand and one. Not that one? Why Yeah,
I don't think it was that one. Last words of
Dutch sults, followed by Confessions of a Dangerous Mind alias

(58:17):
Dracula two, The Ascension, Smallville Salem's Lot remake in two
thousand and four, Sin City Batman begins Dracula three, Legacy
Beside Adventure remaking five, Hunt for Eagle one, Minotaur, Dead Tone,
Moving McAllister, Bride, Flight, Price of Motor City, Spoon, Hobo
with the Shotgun in twenty eleven. One of my Favorites
follows that up with The Right Then. Unfortunately, in twenty twelve,

(58:39):
he stars as Are. He stars in Daria Ragento's Dracula
three D.

Speaker 3 (58:44):
I think you'd be kinder to that film if you
saw it in the theater in three D.

Speaker 1 (58:48):
Maybe, But that's that praying Manta scene though.

Speaker 3 (58:51):
It's more of a spectacle. Yeah, I lucked out. I
got to see it.

Speaker 1 (58:54):
I will say there is one thing. There is one
thing I really like about the movie, and it's not
really a spoiler, because mean, it's been out over ten
years at this point, but I love the scene where
the townspeople meet in the tavern and you find out
that they've secretly been working with Dracula and covering his tracks. Yeah,
they're going to stop, and that's why he kills them all.
I love that little story element.

Speaker 3 (59:10):
That's a cool element. Yeah, I would agree very much.

Speaker 1 (59:12):
I really like that element. So Wilfrid in twenty fourteen,
True Blood, Scorpion King four, Quest for Power, Gallivant Last Kingdom,
Drawing Home Gangsterdam in twenty seventeen follows that up with
twenty four Hours to Live Channel zero. Corbin Nash, the
sister's brother in twenty eighteen and Iron Mask in twenty nineteen.
We unfortunately lost him in twenty nineteen July nineteenth at

(59:32):
age seventy five due to a short illness that didn't
specify what exactly.

Speaker 3 (59:36):
Man I mean, Rutger Hower is incredible. Oh yeah, And
he's one of those guys who kind of became he
became like Dennis Hopper and a couple of those other
guys who were like the perfect, like heavy, and they'd
be in a smaller movie, they'd be in a bigger movie.

Speaker 1 (59:54):
I remember what a big.

Speaker 3 (59:55):
Deal it was when he got in The Dark Night, Yeah,
because he had kind of been only doing the smaller
most stuff. Yeah, and then all of a sudden he
was in it was the same thing. Uh, they didn't
they put Eric Roberts in one of those, Yeah, in
the Dark Knight, In the Dark Knight, Yeah, Yeah, he's
in The Gangster. That was another one too, where he
was like he had at that point, he was starting
to be mostly just on TV, yeah, and the little

(01:00:16):
B movies, and then all of a sudden he got
his cachet went way up again because he was in.

Speaker 1 (01:00:21):
The Dark Knight. But it's no Halloween Puppy it is
no Halloween puppy.

Speaker 3 (01:00:24):
Hey, I love Eric Roberts and I love it. Have
you heard like when he talks about doing that. Oh yeah,
he's like, I like to work. Shut up. Yeah, I
love that. I need to I have his autobiography. I
need to listen to it.

Speaker 1 (01:00:34):
You also need to see all the stock to one
of my doctors. We need to watch those like we
need to just binge all five one day. I would
love to, honestly. Yeah. So we also have in the
cast iced t who plays Jack Mason. He gets to
start in nineteen eighty three in Fame, then goes on
to do Break It in eighty four, followed by breaking
to Electric Boogloo in eighty four, follows that up with Rappin,
then gets his big start in New Jack City in

(01:00:55):
ninety one, follows that up with future episode Ricochet in
ninety one. Did you ever read?

Speaker 3 (01:01:00):
Ice Opinion is his first book. It's revertally it's really good.
But my favorite thing about that is when he's because
it is New Zek City is the one who plays
a cop. Yeah, yeah, that's what I thought. So I
just want to make sure I remembered it right. So
he talked about how he was worried about playing a cop. Yeah,
because you know his everything. Yeah, you know the cop
killer song, on top of oh we'll talk about cop

(01:01:20):
on top of inventing gangster rap, yeah, which I do
believe he invented gangster rap. I believe six in the
Morning is the first gangster rap song. Come at me,
I don't care. But the way he described it in
the book is he went to some of his friends,
you know, from the hood, and was like, what do
you think about me playing a cop? And they were like, well,
are you gonna play a good Are you playing like

(01:01:40):
a bad cop or you playing a good cop? And
they'd be like, I'm playing like a good cop. Yeah,
like a cop who means well. And he's like, then
I don't see a problem. Can I be in the movie?

Speaker 1 (01:01:49):
That's funny?

Speaker 3 (01:01:50):
Well, then the joke was because then he was like,
so then I contacted my buddies in the penitentiary and
they said, well, is he a bad guy or a
good guy? He's like, no, he's a good guy, and
I'll be able to like do something good with him,
like awesome. Then I say do it? If I got
it released, could I be.

Speaker 1 (01:02:03):
In the movie?

Speaker 3 (01:02:03):
So the joke was that, like nobody cared that he
was going to be a copy, just wanted to be
in the movie because they thought it was so cool
he was going to be in a movie.

Speaker 1 (01:02:09):
So he does Ricochet ninety one, follows that up with
another future episode, Trespass in ninety two, phenomenal film See
Before in ninety three, Who's the Man ninety three? Does
Survive in the Game in ninety four, then Tank Girl,
Johnny Namonic, New York Undercover, Swift, Justice, La Heat, even
his a voice on Duckman in ninety seven. I remember
that Duckman was something below Utopia aka body Count in

(01:02:31):
ninety seven.

Speaker 3 (01:02:32):
Yeah, I'll never let that one go. You picked that
one over me.

Speaker 1 (01:02:35):
Mean Guns in ninety seven, Crazy six, Welcome to Paradox Exile,
Judgment Day in ninety nine, which.

Speaker 3 (01:02:40):
We watched Judgment Day. That's a fun one.

Speaker 1 (01:02:43):
Urban Menace in ninety nine, Batman Beyond Final Voyage, Vip
Fresno Smooth, the Wrecking Crew in two thousand, leppin the
Hood aka leprec On five in two thousand in the
Hood and He's up to no good Luck of the
Draw in two thousand, The Heist, Law and Order SVU
in two thousand, which he is still on I think today, Yeah,
I think you're Then he does three Thousand Miles to
Graceland in two thousand and one. Have you seen that movie?

(01:03:04):
So his character is one of my all time favorites.
He's he's an assassin. That Kevin not Kevin Klein. Wow,
why am I blinking on his name?

Speaker 3 (01:03:11):
Kevin Bacon cos Coster three Kevin, So he got there.

Speaker 1 (01:03:15):
Kevin Coster hires him tip for this final shootout the
end of the movie, and when he walks up, he's
kidnapped Kurt Russell's it's not his kid, but it's the
kid he's been with the movie. That's Courty Cox's son.
And he's got like a peanut butter and jelly sandwich
and iced tea. Walks up and he's like, you want
a peanut butter and jelly sandwich? And he's like, yeah,
I love that well.

Speaker 3 (01:03:35):
And the late nineties was when he could when he
was a pretty big name for low budget yeah action
and by in this area, low budget was like a
million and a half dollars or two million dollars, because
he did some for Fred Ray, he did some for
Jim Minorski. There's a picture of Fred Ray holding one
of Fred's babies, or picture of Fred Ray with Iced

(01:03:55):
tea yea and Iced. He's holding one of his babies.
Apparently Ice loves kids. Yeah, like loves Louis because he
loved being a dad and everything. So there's a picture
I'm holding the I forget which which which one of
them it was, but holding him on the set of
I can't remember which one was, like Stealth Bomber, Yeah,
and uh. But apparently he said Ice was super fun
because he just he was like he didn't take it.

(01:04:16):
He didn't take it, not seriously, but he was also
just kind of like, this is the fun thing I do.
Like what I what I work hard at is writing
wrap music.

Speaker 1 (01:04:24):
So the best thing about that is so you get
that scene with him, and then we get into the
shootout at the end of the movie and Ice shows
up by spinning on this rope and just twirling machine
guns as he's going through. That's so good. Okay, So
he does Deadly Rhapsody in two thousand and one, Our
Exbus in two thousand and one Air Rage.

Speaker 3 (01:04:42):
I like our X mess.

Speaker 1 (01:04:43):
I watched it a while back and wasn't a big
fan of it. I probably need to revisit it.

Speaker 3 (01:04:46):
I think it's an acquired taste. I think your axmis
is like if you like, he's like liking sardines on
its first it's.

Speaker 1 (01:04:53):
A label label Ferrara later for I can't talk to me,
a later able Ferrara fil Label Ferrara Ladle Ladel Ferrara
speaking of Body Stanchards, which Abel Ferrara directed. So but yeah,
that he does air Range a Blaze, Gangland, Stranded. He
does a voice in Gta s and Andreas two thousand

(01:05:13):
and four. I remember that up in Harlem, Law and Order,
The Other Guys, which he's the narrator of, Yes, Gears
of War three thirty Rock, Once upon a Time in Brooklyn,
Crossed the Line, Chicago, Pde Younger, Unbreakable, Kimmy Schmidt, Blood Runners,
which was basically Boardwalk Empire with vampires and he was
the head Vampire. Sounds a lot cooler than it was.
It was not that good, it was not. I remember

(01:05:34):
Blood Runners, Deadly Class in twenty nineteen, Ugly Dolls, Borderlands three,
SNL paid A three, and most recently was on Rick
and Morty in twenty twenty three. Oh yeah, So also
on our cast we have mister Gary Busey, who plays
Doc Hawkins's one hundred and eighty four credit on his resume.
Not surprised again, Nope, gets his start in nineteen sixty seven.

(01:05:55):
He played a lot of hippies early on in his career. Imagine,
yeah does love nds sixty seven?

Speaker 3 (01:06:00):
Do you think he like got like like do you
think he was playing all these hippies? Then one night
he like fell asleep with chewing gum in his mouth,
and he had to cut all his hair off, and
somebody went, oh, you're a psychopath. Like once you're hairless,
you're like a bear. You're way scarier with no hair.

Speaker 1 (01:06:13):
Yeah. So he does the Lovens in sixty seven, follows
up with Wild in the Streets, Dan August, Angela, Hard
as they Come, The Magnificent, Magnificent seven rides again in
seventy two, Dirty Little Billy Bonanza, Kung Fu, Last American
Hero in seventy three, Thunderbolt and light Foot in seventy four,
which is probably like one of his earliest Like Big
Roles follows that up with the Log, goes on to

(01:06:35):
be in Gunsmoke Barretta The Gumball Rally Star is born
in seventy six, where he plays Chris Roberson's handler.

Speaker 3 (01:06:41):
Well, I don't, I don't. I don't know much about
him pre eighties.

Speaker 1 (01:06:44):
Yeah, he's actually, he's in a a lot of good stuff.
Early on, does Straight Time in seventy eight, The Buddy
Holly Story in seventy eight. Okay, that one I love. Yeah,
very impressive, Big Wednesday in seventy eight, Carney in nineteen eighty,
Fool Around in nineteen eighty, DC Cabin eighty three, The Bear,
and eighty four Insignificance. Then does Silver Bullet in eighty five,
follows that up with an appearance on The Hitchhiker, then

(01:07:05):
does Let's Get Harry in eighty six. Then the same
year he does a little film also future episode I
Have the Tiger in eighty six. That is a motion picture.
It is a motion picture, indeed, And if you're worried,
they're not gonna use the song I Have the Tiger,
Don't worry, Yeah, don't don't worry at all. Leath a
Weapon in eighty seven. So he did that immediately after.

Speaker 3 (01:07:25):
And that's the one that really kind of established him
as a as a character actor.

Speaker 1 (01:07:30):
Yeah, in everything well, because then he follows leath a
weapon up with in the same year Bulletproof, butt Horn.

Speaker 3 (01:07:36):
Watch Out but Horn. That Do I ever tell you
how I saw that movie for the first time.

Speaker 1 (01:07:40):
I just found out recently that Fred Ray was the
one that kind of wrote that movie.

Speaker 3 (01:07:43):
He developed it, Yeah, and it got taken out from
under him, and once they boosted the budget, they just
kind of swapped him out.

Speaker 1 (01:07:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:07:50):
And but I saw that movie back when my TV
was was the broadcast channel was on all the time.
It was on one night when I was getting ready
to go to sleep, and so no, now the moment
he said butt Horn, not only did I start watching it, Yeah,
but I text messaged Andrew Shearer, my buddy, and was like,

(01:08:10):
because he always was up late and this is probably
midnight or so, yeah, and I just said I'm watching
this movie called Bulletproof, and he immediately replies, like just
immediately instantly goes you know, I think they really thought
butt horn was gonna happen, Like everybody was gonna be
saying butt horn.

Speaker 1 (01:08:24):
He says it a lot in that movie.

Speaker 3 (01:08:25):
Yes, he does.

Speaker 1 (01:08:26):
Bt does. By the way, I know we're we're on
the air typically right now. But I just got an
extra copy of that. Do you want it? Because it's
hard to come by and I found it for cheap
because Shout put it out in a four pack. Yeah,
I'll take it. Okay, that'd be grant yours. Dangerous Life
at eighty eight. Hider in the House in eighty nine.

Speaker 3 (01:08:41):
Now, whatever you think about Hyder in the House, hum,
that poster is amazing, excelsior.

Speaker 1 (01:08:47):
This is like the third time we've talked about Hyder
in the House on the.

Speaker 3 (01:08:50):
Poster though, he's just behind a window, all lit with
all the uced and just looking on freaking terrifying.

Speaker 1 (01:08:59):
Follows that up with the on Empire in eighty nine,
then Predator Tow in nineteen ninety, point Break in ninety one,
Wild Texas Win in ninety one, The Player in ninety two,
which I did not remember him in, I mean, how
could you not? Canvas in ninety two, is under Siege
in ninety two, The Firm in ninety three. He is
great in the firm.

Speaker 3 (01:09:16):
He's phenomenal in the front of the no he's highly
rememberable and memorable.

Speaker 1 (01:09:20):
In the firm. Rookie of the Year in ninety three,
which he plays it straight.

Speaker 3 (01:09:26):
I love those little moments where you see is just
an a normal ass, like family movie, Yes, and he
nails it. I mean like even Silver Bullet, he's so normal.
Oh yeah, except he's just like a little kookie.

Speaker 1 (01:09:36):
He's a little cookie.

Speaker 3 (01:09:36):
I love well, he's a little kookie in every role.

Speaker 1 (01:09:38):
I love the Jackass joke and Silver Bullets my all
time favorites. Then he does followed Angels in ninety three,
Breaking Point in ninety four, same year he has survived
in the game. Follows that up with Chasers, followed by
Drop Zone, Man with the Gun, carried Away Black Sheep
in ninety six, which I completely forgot he was in,
even though he's a huge part. Oh shit, Yeah, follows
that up with one clean move, then Lost Highway, Steel Sharks,

(01:09:59):
rough Right, Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas Detour Soldier
in ninety eight. Appears on Walker Texas Ranger, which I've
got to see because I don't remember him ever. On
Walker Texas Ranger.

Speaker 3 (01:10:08):
I don't recall that, but I believe it that he
would pop up.

Speaker 1 (01:10:11):
What if he's not the villain, what if he's just
like a mayor.

Speaker 3 (01:10:14):
Honestly, I bet he's not the villainy. They did a
lot of cool stuff with Walker Texas Ranger on the
sidekicks Blu Ray.

Speaker 1 (01:10:21):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:10:22):
The interview with Aaron Norris, he talks about so much
interesting stuff, including how he never intended to work on
Walker Texas Ranger at all.

Speaker 1 (01:10:30):
Yeah, and took over writing in like the fourths.

Speaker 3 (01:10:33):
No, it was like it was the second I believe,
Oh was it. I think it was that early because
it was it was rating really low. Yeah, And they
had said that they'd give him some obscene I wish
I could remember the exact numbers, but they said they
give him some kind of obscene pay bump if he
could get them in the top fifteen or whatever. And
they were in the top like five.

Speaker 1 (01:10:48):
Because I think he was if I'm not mistaken, he's
the one that's behind the ancestor stories that popped up
throughout the series. I think he wrote all this well,
he was the showrunner. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:10:59):
And what happened was he said that the problem with
Walker was that it didn't have like initially, it didn't
really have like an emotional center. It was just about
Chuck Norris. Yeah, and he said that the problem that
they had and this is what endeared me to Aaron
Norris so much, Chuck Norris's brother, Yeah, was He said that,
he was like, this is the problem is some people

(01:11:19):
don't understand what people like about Chuck.

Speaker 1 (01:11:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:11:22):
They think that what they like about Chuck is he
can fight or whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:11:24):
He's like.

Speaker 3 (01:11:25):
No, what they like is seeing Chuck in these situations
where he's because he's he's America, Yeah, and they want
to see him like right, the wrongs. So he said
that they used to sit down in the writing room
and he would like pull up a newspaper and be
like and be like, oh, this is a scary story
about Roofi's. Yeah, and they did a whole episode about Roofees.

Speaker 1 (01:11:45):
Oh my god. They covered everything. They did the AIDS episode,
they did the one that was the gun Runners, they
did the UFO episode. At one point, like I watched,
Rockert took this Ranger a lot growing up.

Speaker 3 (01:11:54):
According to him, when he took over, that show was
just riding so high. No one had ever thought it
would be that successful. Yeah, And I really can't recommend
enough watch that interview with him on the Sidekicks because
he just goes into this incredible detail and the thing
that I loved about his interviews. Is he didn't sit
there like, yeah, Walker Texas Ranger would have sucked without me. No,

(01:12:17):
it was he was more like, you know, so Chuck
goes and does that. I'm doing my thing and then
he calls me up. He's like, is there any way
you could come on this thing? And I'm like sure,
I've never really done TV, so I just looked at
everything and I was like, oh, no, I know how
to work with I know how to I know how
to use Chuck because I love Chuck.

Speaker 1 (01:12:32):
You know. Well, he actually took over for Nord and
it might have just been that Chuck was too busy,
which is entirely possible. But Delta Force three stars Aaron Norris.

Speaker 3 (01:12:39):
He was testing the waters on being an actor because
he was already a stuntman. Yeah, so that's kind of
what pushed him forward. And I mean people were hiring,
especially in the late eighties. I mean you had like
like Pamela Springsteen and Sleepoy Camp two and stuff. You'd
get like famous relatives. But I think Aaron Norris was
the first one to admit he was like, I did
not have the it like Chuck does, like Carlos because

(01:13:01):
he always calls him Carlos.

Speaker 1 (01:13:02):
Yeah, so he does Walkers X Ranger ninety nine, follows
that up with two Shades of Blue Hot Boys, The
Outer Limits, g Men from Hell, Law and Order, King
of the Hill, Slapshot two, Breaking the Ice is a
voice in GCA Vice City, which I do remember. Then
follows that up with Frost Portrait of a Vampire in
two thousand and three. Remember that movie Red Cover with
a devil face that had fangs. It was everywhere, okay.

(01:13:26):
Then does the Shadowlands site for Sore Eyes The Simpsons
in two thousand and five, Into the West Ginger dead
Man in two thousand and five, move on to site
for Sore Eyes or excuse me, Scrubs Doctor Doolittle three,
which I was really hoping he was the doctor. He's not. No,
he's not.

Speaker 3 (01:13:41):
You know, we unfortunately David did. We didn't manage that timeline.

Speaker 1 (01:13:46):
Do you imagine Garry Fuse just talking to animals.

Speaker 3 (01:13:49):
I don't have to because I originally was in the
Barren Steambar universe, and in that version, not only was
he Doctor Doolittle, he was also the president in the Instay.
Oh jesus, he didn't replace Bill Pullman all the time,
but a lot, a lot than you might think. Oh gosh,
what else did he play?

Speaker 1 (01:14:07):
He was also what's that movie?

Speaker 3 (01:14:11):
No, Oh, Titanic? He was Leo DiCaprio was the boat.
Everybody knows Nick Cage was the boat.

Speaker 1 (01:14:21):
So Doctor Doolittle in two thousand and six follows that
up with Man Eater, followed by Entourage, then Ginger dead
Man two, Passion of the Cruss in two thousand and eight,
Night Tale.

Speaker 3 (01:14:30):
That one's a lot better than the first one.

Speaker 1 (01:14:32):
It's no Saturday Night Cleaver where they bring back Hitler,
Jesus and I can't remember who else they summon at
the very end. Oh yeah, no, I mean they got wild.

Speaker 3 (01:14:41):
That first one is just kind of a slog I was,
but but the other ones are really fun. Night Tail
the series in two thousand and nine, Parana three, Double
D in twenty twelve, Liz Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, Lizzy in
twenty twelve, which is the Christan Stewart Lizzy Bordon movie,
he plays her dad.

Speaker 1 (01:14:54):
I need to watch that Bounty Killer. In twenty thirteen,
Killing Floor, he's two. He's the voice of Santa No shit, Yeah,
that's hilarious. From dustil Down the series Sharknado four, the
Fourth Awakens. He's a voice in most of the Hitman games.
I found out going through his resume, Wow, and most
recently the Gettysburg Address in twenty twenty five.

Speaker 3 (01:15:13):
He doesn't play Lincoln, though he didn't say he played Lincoln.
Then I'm staying in this timeline.

Speaker 1 (01:15:19):
So obviously there's a lot more names in this movie.
We've also got Charles Dunn, and we got John C. McGinley,
we got F. Murray Abraham. This movie is packed with people.
It's gotten.

Speaker 3 (01:15:29):
It's the who's who of character actors, some of them
right at the beginning, some of them like right at
the height, Yeah, like you.

Speaker 1 (01:15:35):
Had Bucy F.

Speaker 3 (01:15:36):
Burray Abraham was at the height of his like movies, Yeah,
becoming American movie because.

Speaker 1 (01:15:40):
I think McGinley does, if I'm not mistaken, he either
did or does on Deadly Ground right before this or
did it right after. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:15:47):
Well, and then of course he ends up hitting in
the way that no one ever would have thought in
a millionaires in Scrubs. Yeah, he becomes like one of
the best things about Scrubs.

Speaker 1 (01:15:54):
Although and Bucy were together in Point Break in ninety one.

Speaker 3 (01:15:58):
Yeah, Noah, baby McGinley.

Speaker 1 (01:15:59):
I remember that.

Speaker 3 (01:16:00):
Yeah, because John C McGinley is. I can't say he's underrated.
I just because he isn't. I just love him. He's
just he's just the best. And in this movie they
use him very very well. Yes, but it is funny
to like to watch him not be the super funny,
sarcastic like kind of tough guy, which is after from
Scrubs on.

Speaker 1 (01:16:18):
Yeah, that's who he is. Well, office Space he's not.
He's not antagonizing all on office Space.

Speaker 3 (01:16:22):
He's just he's just aloof what would you say it
is you do here? What would you say it is
you do here?

Speaker 1 (01:16:27):
I love that.

Speaker 3 (01:16:28):
No, No, John C mcginley's the best. I just like
I mentioned a couple of weeks ago, I just rewatched
Stan Against Evil. Yeah, and he's the best part of
that show bar none, because he's so funny. Every line
he says, he delivers it so perfectly and you really
grow to love him. So For as many shortcomings as
that show has, the biggest one being when it was canceled,
honestly because because it ended on such a great cliffhanger

(01:16:52):
that for it to never come back really hurts. Yeah,
but he was just there's a moment in Stand Against
Evil where he it's to himself that he will be
sad if someone dies, Like he'll be sad, like that
he would that he would sooner die than lose someone else,
because it starts with him losing his wife. Yeah, that moment,

(01:17:13):
which is like about halfway through the first season, it's
like your eyes can't stop. You're glued to him from
then on because he's so good. He's so good.

Speaker 1 (01:17:20):
Oh, he's excellent. So what was your first time watching
Surviving the Game?

Speaker 3 (01:17:24):
I wish I could tell you, because this was a
film that was ubiquitous on USA TNT, TBS when I
was a kid, playing mostly Saturdays. I would it was
very common on a Saturday or a Sunday when I
had nothing going on. Him, kid, what I I didn't
have any meetings that day. It was nine, I I

(01:17:47):
but there were so many weekends that I remember vividly
managing to catch Surviving the Game and Tremors, Yeah, just
because they were on TV and those and Surviving the
Game was one that I saw so many times on TV,
culminating with seeing it on Monster Vision. And I guess
it was ninety eight because I just looked it up
a little bit ago. Seeing it on Monster Vision was

(01:18:07):
a huge treat for me because I saw Surviving the
game over and over on TV. Then you fast forward
to like ninety nine, I got really into maybe it
was ninety eight. I got really into Iced T as
a musician. Actually, I think it was ninety eight ninety
seven somewhere in there. I got really into his music,
especially into body Count. But I was also really into
gangster rap stuff. I had just never heard anybody quite

(01:18:30):
like him. And you got to remember, like when I was,
you know, seven eight years old, I had MC hammer
cassette tapes. Yeah, like we loved Hammer. You love the
Adams Groove brother brother No. I thought that was the
coolest thing ever. When he was involved was for Adam's family,
So I like, I remember that. But I remember when
I was listening to Iced T just going like WHOA,

(01:18:50):
stuff's blowing my mind because he's such a great writer
and he's so intelligent, he's so good at expressing things.
So I remember being I think it was like fourteen
or fifteen when I went and sought out a copy
just to sit down and watch it straight through, unedited, uncensored,
and going Damn, this is a really really solid action movie. Yeah,

(01:19:14):
it's a good movie and it and at that time especially,
it was very underrated. I'm pretty certain, and we'll talk
about it later, but like I'm pretty certain it got
dumped on cable to try and make some money back
because it wasn't a very big hit.

Speaker 1 (01:19:25):
You might think that, and I'll give you some details.

Speaker 3 (01:19:27):
I would love to know that, or you will, because
a lot of that stuff. It seemed like it was
on TV all the time because it wasn't huge at
the box office. Yeah, that wasn't always the case. That
seemed like I'll give you just a little, a little
taste right now.

Speaker 1 (01:19:39):
What would you say if I told you the movie
had made its money back before even a foot of
film had been shot.

Speaker 3 (01:19:44):
I believe that international sales yep. Oh, action movies back then.
That was how That was why there were so many. Yeah,
was that you could literally go to Cohn or the
Berlin Market and you could be like, I have a poster.
It has iced tea on it, or it has treat
Williams on.

Speaker 1 (01:20:00):
Their hower and all these Yeah, I mean they sold
it off the Castle Lett Well.

Speaker 3 (01:20:03):
And this one was a bigger example I mean, I'm
talking like, you know, even you could just in the
late nineties, you can just have Treat Williams on the
poster and they'd buy it.

Speaker 1 (01:20:10):
How many how many fake posters did Manaham and Goland
put together at at Cannon.

Speaker 3 (01:20:15):
They're never happened, They're not fake, they're speculative, speculative.

Speaker 1 (01:20:21):
Have you seen that seventeen minute video they got released
a while back, that's I think from eighty seven. That
is a Cannon It's a Cannon film reel of coming
soon from Cannon, and it's.

Speaker 3 (01:20:31):
A bunch of stuff that never ever happened. Well, and
that's not uncommon at all back then. You really could
because Corman was so good at this, better than anybody else,
because everybody the method was they would be like I
went to Cohn and we sold four you know, we
sold on a let's say a small movie. We sold
a half a million dollars already. Yeah, Like, all we

(01:20:52):
have to do is deliver the movie and the money's ours.
So we're gonna make a million million and a half
or two million or whatever and will nearly be broken
even by the time it's done. And then all the
receipts will be a cake. Corman would be like, they
give us a half a million dollars for these, you know,
for Don the Dragon Wilson movies, So we're gonna make
them for three hundred thousand dollars and I'll be two

(01:21:13):
hundred thousand dollars in profit when the movie's done. That's
why he was at the top of his game in
many ways until the day he died. Because all of
his competitors, including Monacham Golan in Globis, Yeah, they were
all like, we got to be bigger. We gotta go bigger,
we gotta go bigger, you know, Dino de Larentist, gotta
be bigger.

Speaker 1 (01:21:32):
These guys were all obsessed with it.

Speaker 3 (01:21:33):
And Corman would just be like, I could make a
movie and have it be one hundred thousand dollars in
profit before I even license it to showtime. And that's
why he is Roger Corman and everybody else is a
are great. I mean, like those Delarentis movies are great,
but they're they're like a nostalgia kick because we remember,
like it's it's one of those things where you look back,
you go, Man, wasn't it great when when Cannon was

(01:21:54):
able to crank those out until they went bankrupt. Man,
wasn't it great when when New World Pictures after Corman
sold it, When New World pick would make all these
wild movies until they went bankrupt because they didn't actually
do that. Well, there's so many examples like that.

Speaker 1 (01:22:06):
One of my favorite things lately has been anytime Lorenz's
know de Lorenz has been involved in a movie and
going into the trivia, there's a list of actors that
as soon as they heard his name would exit the
project yep.

Speaker 3 (01:22:19):
Or they would get excited because they knew that that
idiot would cash a check yeah, anything if he was
convinced it was good. Yeah, because he paid out the
ass for Stephen King stuff he didn't even read.

Speaker 1 (01:22:27):
Yeah, Oh my god. So my first time watching Surviving
the Game, it had to have been on TNT as
far as like in the background, like not realizing what
it was. But it wasn't until I was in my
seventh grade English class and we were reading Most Dangerous Game.
My teacher, who actually just retired this year, brought up
Surviving the Game. Now, she did say that it start
ice Cube. So when I first found the movie, I

(01:22:49):
was like.

Speaker 3 (01:22:50):
Your little Troy Ohio teacher confused ice Cube and iced Tea.
I'm shocked because I was like, how have I never
heard about this movie. I can also guarantee one of
the reasons you confused was because at the time you
were in school was when ice Cube was in everything everything.

Speaker 1 (01:23:06):
I mean the Friday movies were out and all all time.

Speaker 3 (01:23:09):
Uh yeah, yeah, so yeah he was. He was very
much a name in movies.

Speaker 1 (01:23:13):
So she had told me. She told the class about
surviving the game and like gave us like a synopsis
of like like described the scene of like the pig's
head and like them showing him out the door and everything,
and I was like, holy shit, Like I gotta see
this movie. So immediately after I got out of school,
this is when I was walking to my parents' workplace,
I walked over to the library, found a copy of it,
took it home, watched it that night. Realized I had

(01:23:34):
seen bits and pieces of it growing up, and I
was like, oh shit, this is that movie because yeah,
it was usually around the same time as Tremors and
stuff being on, so I had never seen it and
had never heard of it. Watched it that night and
was just like, this is really good. And then I
like proceeded to watch it, I think like three times
while I had it loaded.

Speaker 3 (01:23:50):
Out, so funny thing. So I was like, Wow, this
movie's awesome. Then later found out that Ernest Dickerson had
directed another film that I had been obsessed with since
I was really young. I had it's probably still in
my closet somewhere or one of my closets. I had
a VHS of Demon Knight, oh yeah, and that was
a favorite of my sister's because she loved Billy's Ain

(01:24:12):
so and then I inherited a lot of her tapes
because she'd become too cool or something. And then it's
mine now because she was like nine years older than me,
so she's a teenager. She'd be like, yeah, you can
have my stupid Demon Night tape. You have my stupid
parts one through five nightmre on Elm Street tapes.

Speaker 1 (01:24:27):
I don't need those anywhere, And I'm like, yeah, yeah,
give them here. Oh well.

Speaker 3 (01:24:30):
She also gave me all our ral steinbooks, like The
Fear Street and earlier not the Goosebump stuff. Yeah, so
I was like, yeah, So when I found out he
had made Demon Night, that was another movie that I
didn't know other people appreciated it until it came out
on DVD away later, because I just always had a
tape around.

Speaker 1 (01:24:48):
Yeah, but I didn't know if it was just kind
of a movie I love. I had not caught Demon
Knight like I would usually catch it right around the
same part, which was usually when he was tormenting Dick
Miller's character. I would usually catch it from there, and
then why the rest. I remember the first time I
actually was like, oh my god, Demon Night's gonna be on.
I'm gonna watch it from start to finish on TV.
I was so amped.

Speaker 3 (01:25:06):
Well, see you, this is a reminder that you're a baby,
because I remember when they started showing it on regular TV. Yeah,
but I never really I never really caught it on
Sci Fi Channel or whatever. Yeah, because by then I
was I was up there and I was, you know,
I was buying you.

Speaker 1 (01:25:19):
You could watch it uncut?

Speaker 3 (01:25:20):
Yeah, Well, I and I'd seen it a ton becaueah,
I had. We had the tape, man, I remember so clearly,
because I would dig it out every now and then
and be like, what's Demon Night again.

Speaker 1 (01:25:29):
First time I ever saw it uncut was because my
uncle had burned me copies of Bordello and Demon Night
because there was a time where those DVDs were actually
kind of hard to find. Yeah, and he had burned
them for me, and that's how I saw him finally
uncut and then never stopped watching them.

Speaker 3 (01:25:40):
Obviously, I would say clearly, I'll never forget that Halloween
at Midnight movie at my house where I was like,
how about Demon Night? Yeah, freaking one of the best
calls ever made.

Speaker 1 (01:25:50):
It was a good one. A midnight movie. So Surviving
the Game opens, we are in a back alley and Seattle, Washington,
and we're seeing a guy take out some trash. He's
throwing throwing it away, and we the ice iced Tea
as Jack Mason come out from behind and he starts
going through the trash. We see that he's also feeding
a dog that he has with them that he calls
mego I believe oh man, it was. It was.

Speaker 3 (01:26:08):
It was a weirder name than that. It was like, yeah,
the name is escaping me right now. But it was
kind an odd name. And I want to mention this
iced Tea. A lot of people hated on this movie
because they gave ice Ta dreads. I don't know if
you about that because they hated it because they they
he had been the ponytail guy for foreverever.

Speaker 1 (01:26:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:26:30):
So I remember even Andy copp my like my movie
mentor growing up, he just he was like, I like that,
but like those those dreadlocks, like and in the IMDb
message boards used to be ripping about the dreadlock. They
just hated that elean imagine And it was funny because
some people were just like, he looks lame in them,
and some people were like, what are they trying to
make him look more black? Yeah, like they were saying

(01:26:51):
that it was it was an offensive thing to give
him like a stereotypical homeless guy look.

Speaker 1 (01:26:56):
Probably also the same people that said Mark for Death
with Stig All was two racism a movie because of
the way that they portrayed the villain in that.

Speaker 3 (01:27:02):
Oh well, thank goodness, we rectified that with Oh the
way you see does Native Americans in this very movie.

Speaker 1 (01:27:08):
Oh my god.

Speaker 3 (01:27:10):
So so yeah, he's feeding the dog and all while
this is intercutting with these guys, these hunters in the forest,
and we see that a guy is running from them.

Speaker 1 (01:27:18):
They are hunting this guy down in the forest. This
is all intercut with ice cube or ice cube wow
iced tea chasing after the dog, and the dog unfortunately
gets hit by a car right at the same time
that the guy that they're hunting in the forest gets
hit through the heart with an arrow through a crossbow. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:27:32):
Yeah, it's the juxtaposition is really cool because they fake
you out and make you think these guys are hunting
a deer.

Speaker 1 (01:27:38):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:27:39):
They even do a really cool shot where you just
see the shadow of his head and it really looks
like because you were watching the deer. Yeah, it really
looks like it's the shadow of the deer.

Speaker 1 (01:27:47):
Well. I also love you do not see the hunters
at all. You don't see their faces, you don't see
who they are. You see their weapons, and you see
them in a cluster.

Speaker 3 (01:27:53):
And their outfits and their outfits which I'm I'm pretty
positive that those were all body doubles. Yeah, of the
characters and was and because why would you spend the
money putting those guys in those costumes and hide their faces,
especially when they're all expensive anyway, But the but it
also establishes that the hunting group isn't just these people necessarily.
There are people who go on these hunts different times

(01:28:14):
because there was a slightly bigger crew, and the way
they establish him getting get that they're hunting the guy
is the dog gets hit and then we just see
this guy who we noticed he was running away. Yeah,
and he just the arrow pops out of his chest
and then.

Speaker 1 (01:28:25):
Just to survive the game. That's so memorable. Yeah, well,
it's like it's it's exactly like another one that came
out a previous year, Hard Target. Heard Target does the
same thing that arrow flies in that guy Heard Target.

Speaker 3 (01:28:38):
Except your your you just if you didn't know that
this is a most dangerous game concept, and a lot
of people probably didn't because we're talking Internet's barely a
thing when this movie's coming out. That's a shock. You say,
guy's clearly hunting and then all of a sudden you
notice that this that they're hunting this guy and then
he gets killed gruesomely.

Speaker 1 (01:28:57):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:28:57):
Yeah, it's a great moment.

Speaker 1 (01:28:59):
Definitely remember that. So by this point now Mason is
seen burying the dog along with his fellow buddy Hank,
who is one of the homeless guys that he hangs
out with or in this little field or this in
this little lot that they all live in, and we
see that he's burying the dog and actually puts up
like a little marker as well.

Speaker 3 (01:29:15):
Yeah, and and Hank is much older than him. Yes,
he's wearing I think I think it was like a
Korea War.

Speaker 1 (01:29:20):
Veteran, I believe so.

Speaker 3 (01:29:21):
Yeah, so he's a lot older and kind of feeding
into the I don't want to say trope, because it's
not a trope, the reality that many homeless people in
America are veterans. And if you want to know how
that happens, just watch The War at Home, which which
is a painful movie because you don't realize when you're
watching it until the very end that it's really just

(01:29:43):
the story of how vets end up displaced. Yeah, and
it's it's important because especially because of Vietnam, where so
many people were conscripted, were drafted, so many people were drafted,
You had so many people come home who were in
no way prepared for what they would have to.

Speaker 1 (01:30:02):
Do able to resume their lives. Well, yeah, and they
were told like, all right, it's overcome.

Speaker 3 (01:30:06):
And and you know that's why Rambo, although Rambo that
example is more that he wanted to be a soldier,
but it's still it's still hard. But those people that
like they just joined up because they were either afraid
they were already gonna get drafted, or they did get drafted.
They came home to a world where people were just like, well,
not up, dude, you got to get a job now,

(01:30:26):
like the economy's booming, not.

Speaker 1 (01:30:27):
Taking into account what they have been through and what
they were still harbor.

Speaker 3 (01:30:30):
They can't even imagine. You know, you know, you're talking
to your boss about, like, you know, your headaches all
the time, and he's like, he's like, this is a bank,
please show up on time.

Speaker 1 (01:30:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:30:41):
And from their perspective, like I'm not asking for the world,
come here nine to five, five days a week.

Speaker 1 (01:30:44):
Yeah, that's it. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:30:46):
But in reality, it's like they're fighting. They never get
to stop fighting the battle. And I'm not like, I'm
not trying to act like I'm some kind of incredible
like veterans rights person. But I love that they they
made sure to do that to have that or that
had that, and and and he has like these little
moments where he starts talking a little bit about like
what he did in Korea and stuff. But uh, one

(01:31:08):
of my favorite things is when he's burying the dog.
He he mentions like.

Speaker 1 (01:31:12):
Do you have to dig so deep?

Speaker 3 (01:31:13):
Because he's been digging for a really long time, and
he just says, man, I just hope when I'm gone,
somebody digs a hole this deep from me.

Speaker 1 (01:31:19):
And it really.

Speaker 3 (01:31:22):
It's important because the juxtaposition is that Mason is a
stray dog. Yeah, Like that's why Mason that like when
when the taxiicab guy hits the dog, he's he's like,
is this your dog? He's like, it's friend of mine,
because it's like because it's like, he's not my dog,
he's nobody's dog, just like I'm nobody's friend, I'm nobody's father,
I'm nobody's husband.

Speaker 1 (01:31:42):
Well, and there's the whole confrontation with the taxi driver too,
where we see that Mason really just doesn't care like
the taxi drivers like wailing on the guy. Well.

Speaker 3 (01:31:49):
That's the interesting thing is that first when he swings,
Mason like pushes his arm away and like ducks. So
you can tell like, oh, this guy he's he's got
some like he's got some toughness. Yeah, you know, he's
been he's lived on the streets or whatever, and he's
and before that he lived in the ghetto. And he
probably to fight, but once the guy hits him, he
just doesn't care.

Speaker 1 (01:32:04):
He's done. Yeah, he's just.

Speaker 3 (01:32:05):
Finished because to him, he's like because for his perspective,
the guy's like, what about my money? Because he lost
a fifteen dollars fare because he had to hit his
brakes hard.

Speaker 1 (01:32:13):
And Ernest Dickerson's mother, Yeah, and I love the way
she's just like what happened because she gets out of
the car and her nose is bleeding she bumped the
seat and she's wearing like a really nice suit.

Speaker 3 (01:32:23):
So it's clear she's not going to pay that fair
because she's offended by the fact that this guy hit
a dog that was chasing a cat across the street.

Speaker 1 (01:32:29):
But that that.

Speaker 3 (01:32:30):
Moment always stuck with me of when he punches him,
he just says, you finished, because he's like he's literally like, look,
I know what you want. You want you want to
pay back or whatever. So he's like, well, I ain't
got no money, so do I guess?

Speaker 1 (01:32:43):
You know?

Speaker 3 (01:32:43):
Like he's just like, are you done punching me? Do
you beat me up some more so you'll feel all right? Yeah,
because I just want to pick up this dog and
bury him. It's a great moment, and because this movie
I love so much, but it is not the it's
cheesy at times. Oh yeah, and this scene where, which
is coming up really soon, where he's just like, you
can't blame yourself forever. He literally just expositions the hell

(01:33:06):
out of him, and the music cues even kind of
make it sound like they know.

Speaker 1 (01:33:10):
In the very beginning, the music cues are very cheesy
and they get a lot more serious. I feel like
as the movie goes well, when.

Speaker 3 (01:33:17):
He's in the city, they're all about this the synthesizer
kind of jazz horn, which I do think works most
of the time. Yeah, but yeah, there are those moments.
So after he buries the dog, they're out in the
rain and they're trying to get some food. They're digging
in the garbage and one of the first things we
see of Icedy's characters him eating out of the track. Yeah,

(01:33:38):
So they're digging through the garbage, and at first it
seems I mean, the pouring rain makes it kind of
sad and stressful. Yeah, but then what makes it worse
is they're just kind of talking, kind of friendly.

Speaker 1 (01:33:47):
You know. He's like when we were in Japan and
we had this and this and this.

Speaker 3 (01:33:50):
He's saying all this stuff, and then all of a sudden,
it just he just kind of Hank just kind of
his voice drops and he goes, I'm hungry, God damn it. Yeah,
and then Iced tease, the character literally says like, man,
we gotta eat soon. We gotta eat soon, man, And
you're like, these guys are starving. Yeah, they're starving. But
then Ice finds something other than food in.

Speaker 1 (01:34:09):
The trash can, finds a gun in the trash can, pistol.
He can't he can't figure out what what the name is.
He's even asking a Hank about it. But the number
one thing that Hank tells him as he's looking at
the gun always checked the barrel. Yeah, He's like, what
are you doing.

Speaker 3 (01:34:19):
You gotta check the barrel otherwise blow up in your
hand when you shoot it. And he's like put that
thing away. Like he's like, it's a gun man. He's like,
I know, what's a gun? They kill people. He's like,
I get twenty bucks from this thing with it without bullets. Yeah,
it's a it's a really awesome moment. Also, as a
as a you know, mild gun enthusiast, I would say,
like he's like, it's a takers.

Speaker 1 (01:34:40):
It was a taker ren. Yeah, So it was also
funny that he was like he was he almost knew
what it was. So he decides that they're going to
break into a meat housing place. They go and steal
what is it? Is it like a half a cow? Yeah,
it's like a side of beef. Yeah, it's a side
of beef. And right as they're doing this, Hank gets
caught by a guard. Yeah, the guard starts wailing on Hank.
So Ice drops the meat the fence.

Speaker 3 (01:35:00):
Well real quick though. The reason they're able to steal
the beef is because there's a mean dog and Ice
is like friend of mine, you know, like and and
the dog it's like and that's one of the things
I love is it's like he just dogs get him
and he gets them, you know. So he's walking out
with the side of beef and he's just like like
kind of giving the dog a little bit and like
petting it as they're walking up. But yeah, this so

(01:35:22):
this this security guard cop it's not quite clear security guard,
I think. So starts beating on on Hank and he
basically says like, look, we'll give it back and He's like,
it's already been contaminated with your filth, which which I
thought was a really great Like they're trying to show
how hostile life can be to the homeless. Now, granted
they are stealing, Yeah, they are stealing. Yeah, but they've

(01:35:43):
established they're extremely desperate.

Speaker 1 (01:35:45):
And this cop is kind of looking for an excuse
now to beat them up. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:35:47):
Well apparently they've done this before because he says, like,
so you're the ones who've been stealing the meat or whatever,
and this cop is or this security guards clearly like
amped up like a motherfucker. He starts wailing on Hank
and and right before he does, Hank even says when
he sees how the side of beat he says, oh, no,
we got enough.

Speaker 1 (01:36:02):
For a lot of folks.

Speaker 3 (01:36:03):
Yeah, they're not even going to keep it for themselves,
they're gonna share it. So now he's wailing on Hank,
Ice comes up to fight him. Yep, tries to pull
the gun to I guess scare it.

Speaker 1 (01:36:14):
Yeah, like I would say, he's trying to scare him,
but then that completely backfires because he gets the gun
knocked out of his hand. He picks the gun up
and the guard's literally about ready to blow his head off,
even pulls the trigger.

Speaker 3 (01:36:23):
He says, somebody's going to die to night. Yeah, I'm
gonna kill somebody. And he pulls the trigger and it clicks,
there's no bullets. Ice kicks him in the nuts, takes
his night stick and goes on a very iced tea
improvised thing.

Speaker 1 (01:36:36):
Very reminiscent to Doyle in Dutch. But you just start
saying like, how about how about some I go to that?
How about we all die tonight? You think about that?

Speaker 3 (01:36:42):
And he says like, how about I stick this up
your ass, make a copsicle out of you?

Speaker 1 (01:36:45):
Yeah, copsicle.

Speaker 3 (01:36:47):
I love that line. But one of the things that
happens as this is going on is we see that
guy who was watching him. Early we may not have
mentioned that yet, there was a guy kind of watching him. Yes,
this guy, this guy you kind of see a silhouette
of like a heavy set black guy.

Speaker 1 (01:36:58):
Yeah, we don't even we don't who know who he
is yet. The next scene, but we see him kind
of watching on with what's happening. And after they've beaten
up the security guard and they're leaving, he just drives off,
drives off. So the next day or that that same night,
they're cooking the beef. Everybody's grateful for it.

Speaker 3 (01:37:12):
And there's a whole bunch of homeless people and it's
it's families and stuff like that, and and they're cooking
it on a shopping cart turned on its side, filled
with fire with wood and they've set it on fire.

Speaker 1 (01:37:23):
And the guy even asked, is you need help with
the fire, and he's like no. Man walks away, and
the guys like did we say something wrong? And Hank's like, no,
just leave him, there's nothing to do with you. Yeah.
So then the next day we wake up with ice
and he looks over at Hank. Hank's not moving.

Speaker 3 (01:37:37):
No, Hank died peacefully in his sleep. And the way
he reacts to it too, he just goes Hank man
And when he doesn't react, he doesn't even shake him,
he just texts his pulse.

Speaker 1 (01:37:45):
Yeah. And then he's like, ah, shit, man, damn it, Hank.
So then he buries Hank next to the dog.

Speaker 3 (01:37:50):
And it's an incredible shot. We get this like crane
pull up and you see the little grave next to
a bigger grave.

Speaker 1 (01:37:55):
So he's buried the two bodies. Now he's walking past
the character that we saw previously, which is Walter Cole,
who is a soup kitchen worker, and he even tells us,
you know, don't you want a free meal? And Ice goes,
there's no such thing.

Speaker 3 (01:38:06):
Oh, he says, don't you want to free lunch? And
he just under his mouth says, no such thing. That
was a line I loved even as a kid, because
my mom, maybe it was her mom, there was somebody
in my family who would always say, there's no such
thing as a free lunch. There's no such thing as
a free lunch. So I love that don't you want
a free lunch?

Speaker 1 (01:38:22):
No such thing?

Speaker 3 (01:38:23):
Because he's there handing out sack lunches to homeless and
and he's wearing a shirt that says Seventh Street Mission.

Speaker 1 (01:38:28):
Yeah, seventh Street mension. So he starts observing him, and
he's watching him walk across the street and finally sees
that he's about to have his life taking because he's
standing right in front of the semi that's coming right out.

Speaker 3 (01:38:37):
He's not even standing, he's waiting, waiting, watching, He's watching
the semi come up, and right when it's getting close enough,
he just stands right in front of it. He's like
really trying to kill him. Oh yeah, so luckily, I
guess how you look at Cole tackles him from there
and and Ice immediately Mason is just livid with it.

Speaker 1 (01:38:54):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:38:54):
He's just telling him like, you know, what are you doing?
He's like, do you really want to die? He's like, yeah,
I do. He's like, I find and he gives this
whole thing about like you have nobody that cares about
you want I find that hard to believe. And he's like,
he says, like I've had hard times. Another great line.
He says, I've had hard times, says what your chacuzzie die?
So good, I've had hard times to what your chacuzie broke.

Speaker 1 (01:39:13):
So he basically tells him, you know, you've got to
be the one that makes your life better. And you know,
all this gives and gives him, gives him some words,
and at the very end, Ice is walking away because
he's like, you know what, I got a job where
you He's like, I'm not interested.

Speaker 3 (01:39:24):
Would you would you take a job a great opportunity
if somebody would give it to you.

Speaker 1 (01:39:28):
Yeah, And so he's like I'm not interested, walks away
and he's like well, wait, what's the job. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:39:32):
He stops after a few steps and just says, what
kind of job are we talking about?

Speaker 1 (01:39:35):
So then he gives him a card for Thomas Burns,
who is the owner of Hell's Canyon Outfitters, and tells
him to go meet him and see if he's good
for the job. Yes, the interview for it. So we
cut over to this little office spit or not office space,
like a house that has an office in it.

Speaker 3 (01:39:49):
But what's business business business? Yeah, it's it's just that
it's so ornately decorated. Yeah, it looks like a home.
It's it's super fancy.

Speaker 1 (01:39:57):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:39:57):
And he walks in and sees Rutger Howerd who is groomed,
his hair is quaffed, and he's literally clipping his fingernails
and like checking them yep.

Speaker 1 (01:40:06):
As he's talking to him, and he sees that Mason
is struggling with a cigarette. So we asked him, you know,
how how often do you spoke and or how you
have a day? And he's like as many as I
can get. And so he's just like, well, you know,
I don't think you're gonna be fit for the job,
because you know, it requires a lot of running and
you probably can't deal with it. Durance, Yeah, you need endurance.
So then Ice sees that he has a treadmill and
he goes, wait, put me on that run thing. I

(01:40:26):
bet I can show you.

Speaker 3 (01:40:28):
Yeah, He's like, put me on that running thing. Man,
see how fast I run? So he puts him on
the thing going full speed. He says, do that for
thirty minutes on could be twenty bucks and another I
have so many moments I love in this movie. Yeah,
of lines, and I says, for twenty bucks, I'll run
to fucking Alaska.

Speaker 1 (01:40:42):
Yes. So he ends up making the goal, and that's
when Mason tells him that you know he's he might
be fit for the job, but he's not sure yet.
Where can you reach him at? He gives him a
matchbook for a hotel, and we see Ice go to
that hotel tell in town, and he gets his bottle
of wine, he gets a sandwich, and he also gets
some shaving stuff or.

Speaker 3 (01:40:59):
Gets razor blades, and that's a moment that they didn't
play it as a super fake out, but there is
a moment where you wonder if he's gonna split his wrist,
and then we realize he's just cutting his hair. He's
cutting his dreads short because they were well passed almost
to his elbows, so he's cutting him up to about
his chin.

Speaker 1 (01:41:14):
And this is also where we get a first shot
of ICE's body and we see that he has a
very bad set of burns on.

Speaker 3 (01:41:20):
The back and massive, massive amount of burn scars on
his back.

Speaker 1 (01:41:23):
Yeah. So the next morning he gets a knock at
his door and it's Mason, and that's when Mason is
actually offering him the job. Burns, Yeah, sorry, Burns is
offering him the job. And we see next that they're
flying out to a remote cabin.

Speaker 3 (01:41:37):
Yeah, to Devil's Canyon.

Speaker 1 (01:41:39):
Devil's Canyon, indeed.

Speaker 3 (01:41:40):
And so they basically told him like, you'll be a
survival guy. Yeah, And and there's a part where when
Cole had said that to him, he's like, I don't
really think about surviving and stuff like that. And he's like,
with my recommendation, you'll have a good shot to get
in the job. And it pays super well. So now
he's in an airplane flying with these guys. There's a
pig on the plane with them, and he asks, you know,
who is this? I thought you guys, you know I
thought you guys were gonna hunt He's like, oh, we're
not hunting him.

Speaker 1 (01:42:01):
He's dinner. Yeah, well he's our guest of our guest
of honor.

Speaker 3 (01:42:04):
Yeah, there's a lot of them foreshadowing Mason to the pig,
oh that they brought just to slaughter.

Speaker 1 (01:42:12):
Yeah. So that is when they land outside of this
out of this cabin, surrounded by acres of woods, and
that's when they also meet the rest of the party,
who have all paid fifty thousand dollars a piece.

Speaker 3 (01:42:21):
We assume for this. We know for sure that f.
Murray Abraham paid for him and the sun fifty grand apiece. Yeah,
we don't know what they you know, if they had
other deals going on or what, but we do know
that they're paying good money to go on this hunt.

Speaker 1 (01:42:34):
So we've got Gary Busey who plays Doc Hawkins. We've
got f. Murray Abraham who plays Wolf Senior, with his
son William McNamara who's Derek Wolf Junior. And we also
have John Griffin who's played by John C. McGinley. So
we've got a group of well, well adjusted character actors
in this movie.

Speaker 3 (01:42:49):
Now, they're excellent, and we get little tastes of things
like John C. Mcginley's character is very very aggressive and quiet. Yeah,
we see that McNamara's character is very young, and he's
very soft, and.

Speaker 1 (01:43:03):
We may not have the best relationship with his father.

Speaker 3 (01:43:05):
No, well, well, his father tells him like, I need
you need to learn to be tough. You're soft like
I want to. I want you to have the toughness
to be able to do this to make it in
this world.

Speaker 1 (01:43:14):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:43:15):
We find out that he's considered the most quote unquote
feared man in Wall Street.

Speaker 1 (01:43:19):
And Ted Doc Hawkins is a retired Central Intelligence agent
and a psychiatrist now.

Speaker 3 (01:43:24):
Well retired psychiatrist Yeah for the CIA.

Speaker 1 (01:43:26):
Yes, who's also the founder of h CO, says Wikipedia.
Oh so we also have Texas Oil magnet John Griffin
and wealthy father and son Wall Street executives Derek and Junior.

Speaker 3 (01:43:38):
Yes, and and and it's that's another element of this
that works really well, is you know McNamara's character is
a gen xer. Yeah, and his dad is saying like,
you're soft like your mother, and I want you to
be tough like you have to be to make it
in this world, which is a very common thing, especially
with very successful people as you know, like, I'm worried
my kids because they grew up with everything aren't going

(01:43:59):
to be able to take over for me or whatever.
So he's basically kind of berating this poor kid who
is just a kid. Yeah, and he comes off as
like nineteen, Yeah, I would say probably maybe even younger,
maybe even just out of high school.

Speaker 1 (01:44:11):
So Mason is also exploring the cabin before he meets
all of them, and we see that the cabin's really
ducked out. Nice. There's a granite table for Christ's sake,
there's like every possible like dead animal is decorated at
some point too.

Speaker 3 (01:44:23):
Oh yeah, there's there's tons of elk heads and stuff
like that.

Speaker 1 (01:44:25):
But he also finds that there's one door in particular
that has a lock on it a paddle.

Speaker 3 (01:44:30):
Yeah you're not getting in that room.

Speaker 1 (01:44:31):
Yeah. So he goes out meets the guys. We cut
over to dinner as they were having the pig that
was flying over yes, which rugger Howerd has prepared for them,
and his chef's hat. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:44:39):
No, it's so fancy. Yeah, like that's the thing is
like the So he hands the head is out on
a silt literally a silverlver bladder. And that was one
thing I noticed, especially rewatching this with you, is I
was like, Dave, they're eating off silver at a cabin,
like they're supposed to be roughing it, and they're eating
off of silver. The pig is it's not like a
rough and dirty roast. The head is on a platter

(01:45:00):
with all these roasted potatoes and things like that, and
they're all sitting down to eat.

Speaker 1 (01:45:05):
And this is where the movie really just takes off.

Speaker 3 (01:45:08):
It just it's this is such a memorable moment because
the head is put right in front of Mason, so
the pig is like looking at him, and Mason just
kind of turns the head away from him. And then
Bucy's like, wow, she's making these pig sounds like if
you look at the pig as you eat it, you
devour it.

Speaker 1 (01:45:24):
So they have this whole exchange about appreciating the food.
Rugger Hower has a whole thing where he's just like,
you know, you have to enjoy these things, you know,
you have to look at it, smell it, and experience
it finally assuming it slowly.

Speaker 3 (01:45:38):
And then and then Ice is just like, you have
your way out of mine. He's just wolfing it down.

Speaker 1 (01:45:42):
And we've got him drinking wine. He's like, oh man,
this is really good wine, and f. R. Abraham's like, yeah,
for four to fifty a bottle, it.

Speaker 3 (01:45:47):
Should be He's like, four dollars and fifty cents a bttle.
I should been drinking this a long time ago. It's
like four hundred and fifty dollars a bottle. And he's like,
offs on it. He's like, don't waste it.

Speaker 1 (01:45:54):
Yeah. So they get through dinner and that's when we
see that Mason is sit with Hawkins and he sees
that he's smoking. He asks me, you and have a cigarette
and he's like, oh, no, go ahead and take the
whole pack. Oh.

Speaker 3 (01:46:05):
And it's such a psychological game. Yeah, He's like, I'm
offering you the whole pack. Yes, I have another one
right here.

Speaker 1 (01:46:10):
I only want one. He's like, not only one.

Speaker 3 (01:46:11):
He's like, well, then the rest will have to go
to waste because I got a pack right here.

Speaker 1 (01:46:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:46:14):
And that's totally a psychological mind game to see how
how suggestible a person is. That's a really like a
total mind game, and that tells you everything you need
to know about Hawkins.

Speaker 1 (01:46:25):
But then we find out further so much more.

Speaker 3 (01:46:28):
And this is probably the most memorable moment of the
film is this monologue. Now, does McGinley get pissed before this
or is he there for this? Because I think he
know this was this was he got mad first? Yeah,
and it can happen.

Speaker 1 (01:46:38):
Because basically he sees that he McGinley is just eyeing,
is eyeing Mason, and Mason goes to have but you
got a problem me, and he's just like, ask him
some things.

Speaker 3 (01:46:46):
But the weird thing is he's he's eyeing them all
mean yeah, and then he says like you got a
problem with or somebody goes, where are you from? Yeah,
and it's so soft, Yeah, where are you from? Like
it's so weird. It's like it's like he's trying not
to spook a deer.

Speaker 1 (01:46:58):
Yeah, and he's and he basically it's still a point
where he, you know, asked him has he ever killed anybody?
And he's just killed any killed anything, and he's just like, yeah,
my wife and kid and McGinley fucking loses it.

Speaker 3 (01:47:08):
Yeah, And they grab him and throw him out to
cool down. And as he's being thrown out, he's almost
giving it away. He's like, oh, mine, Namara and They're like,
gut outside, cool off. H It's a great moment, and
but it just blew my mind as I realized that
he was trying not to spook him. Yeah, when he's like,
where are you from? Yeah, Like it was so weird.

Speaker 1 (01:47:24):
And so they asked he asked, He's like, you know,
what was his problem? He's like, oh, well, his daughter
was just killed. Like he lost his daughter a couple
of weeks ago. I think it was it was later
earlier this year or something. It wasn't like it was recent. Yeah,
very well, and it could have been five years ago
he'd still be he And I mean, we can go
ahead and say it. Now. We find out that his
daughter was literally stalked by somebody and then killed and
like fought for her life.

Speaker 3 (01:47:43):
And likely by somebody who looks like Mace like him, Yeah,
probably a homeless black man.

Speaker 1 (01:47:49):
Yeah. So that's when we get to do you want
to take it? Uh? The the infamous Beaucy portion.

Speaker 3 (01:47:54):
I mean, I I could almost I feel like I
could almost tell it, but I won't. But he decides
him about his scar, yeah, because he says, like, Mason.

Speaker 1 (01:48:02):
You know you should you know, ask me anything? Yeah,
where'd you get this car.

Speaker 3 (01:48:04):
He's like, oh this, I call this a birthmark. And
he goes into the story that I'll nobody could do
it justice because Bucy does it so magnificently, where he
just tells the story about when he was a kid,
he got a bulldog named Prince Henry Stout, and his
father taught him to make it an attack dog, so
they trained it with firecrackers to get aggressive and attack things.
Then one day his dad's like, you're gonna be a man.

Speaker 1 (01:48:26):
Yeah, because he's thirteen, because he got the dog when
he was eight thirteen, You're going to learn to be
a man.

Speaker 3 (01:48:30):
You're gonna learn to do things that other men are
unwilling and unable to do.

Speaker 1 (01:48:32):
Gets his first shotgun and.

Speaker 3 (01:48:34):
He basically tells him like, you're gonna go out there.
He hands me with him a bunch of cherry bombs.
You're gonna throw these at the Prince. He's gonna attack you.
He's gonna kill you, or you're gonna kill him.

Speaker 1 (01:48:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:48:44):
So he tells this incredible story about fighting the dog
and rolling over breaking its neck and that scar was
in the fight with Prince Henry Stout. Ye, and it's
an I cannot I mean, like talk about a great way.
One of the reasons I think this movie was so
successful on cable was once that monologue was over, Yeah
you are in.

Speaker 1 (01:49:03):
I mean, that's basically like I told you it's Dickerson
said on the commentary that he wanted that to be
Quin's uss Indianapolis speech from Jaws basically for this movie. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:49:11):
And and the best part is after all of that,
it cuts to Mason. He's just like, do you tell
your patients about this story? Patients though about that, No,
but you do. It's such a great it's such a
great moment. And that's when he also, you know, and
just before that, I think, is when we found out,
you know, you worked at the CIA, the company, the CIA,

(01:49:32):
And then he says like that's where I'm at these
two yep.

Speaker 1 (01:49:34):
And you're like, oh, well, while all this is happening
to you, you've got William Knakna that's been handed a
feather by Rugger that wants him to tell him where
it came from. You've got his dad on the couch
like playing chess with Rugger, and everybody's just kind of
chilling out.

Speaker 3 (01:49:45):
Yeah, they're relaxing, having cigars, but not actually smoking them.
There's a lot of having a cigar in your mouth
and then maybe starting to light it and then nothing else.

Speaker 1 (01:49:53):
I mean, Dunton basically just carries his in his mouth
most of the movies.

Speaker 3 (01:49:56):
Oh when he has like a ton of them in there,
and they're really long Churchill cigars too, and he's just
always chewing on one.

Speaker 1 (01:50:00):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:50:01):
But yeah, and McNamara says, a Turkey vulture and they're like,
good job, you know, because he's trying to be a
good hunter.

Speaker 1 (01:50:06):
And so this all leads to Rugger Howard taking him
up to his room. He says, tomorrow, I'll go over
the job with you, but for now, go ahead and
get yourself a good rest.

Speaker 3 (01:50:13):
Get a good night's sleep. Yeah, and and this is yeah,
and this is where the movie literally never ever stops,
because he wakes up in the morning to a desert
eagle handgun by coal, which is up against his face,
and he hears and and and before he cocks the handle,
which is what wakes up Mason. Yeah, he says they
were was little hunters.

Speaker 1 (01:50:33):
Yep. So he wakes up.

Speaker 3 (01:50:34):
He's like, yo, what the shit Cole And he basically
knocks him around and says like, you know, you're the
you're the hunt You're the who we're hunting. Mason, like
you're the whatever. Opens the door and they go through,
and it's almost like a hazing ritual. They're all like
clapping and making loud noise and and while they're all
like laughing as at McGinley is grabbing him like spitting
on and saying like I could taste you already.

Speaker 1 (01:50:52):
And and then we also have Ruggers. One of my
favorite lines, He's gonna He tells him that he's like
you're the hunted, or you're you're you're what's gonna be hunted?
Were the hunters? After we eat a nice leisure breakfast,
you get a ten.

Speaker 3 (01:51:03):
However, get a head start for as long as it
takes for us to eat a nice, ye leisurely breakfast.
And I want to mention because there's so many great
moments that the the the crazy great lines are about
to ease up now that the action has started. But
the other thing that I loved that I never fully
caught before was when they're eating the pig right at
the at the beginning of dinner.

Speaker 1 (01:51:21):
Yeah, John C.

Speaker 3 (01:51:22):
McGinley asks Cole, Oh yeah, he says like, because they
say Cole picked the pig, because Cole's really good at
picking the pigs. And he's like, now, did you know
the pig was going to be this delicious? While the
pig was still breathing, He's like, I'm pretty sure about it.
He's literally he did that to Mason. Yeah, he picked
Mason out and was like, I have a good feeling
about this guy, because that's what you say when he

(01:51:43):
when he heads off. He keeps saying every time Mason
out smarts and he goes, I told you this guy
was going to be amazing.

Speaker 1 (01:51:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:51:49):
So now we've got Mason running for the woods, heart racing,
trying to, you know, figure out what to do. They
they give him nothing but the clothes on his back.
They give him like a vess. Yeah, he has to
have a special like hunt like a prey bess basically, and.

Speaker 1 (01:52:03):
He had his boots and stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:52:04):
Like.

Speaker 3 (01:52:04):
They didn't send him out with nothing. They sent him
out just basically. I kind of wondered because he was
like ready to go right then. I wonder if they
like dressed him while he was a sleeper.

Speaker 1 (01:52:13):
Something possible. I mean, yeah, because.

Speaker 3 (01:52:17):
There's also a line when when he's drinking the wine
where they say like, you don't want to have too
much mine anyway, because you don't want to be slow tomorrow.
And he's like laughing and you're like, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:52:24):
So he's running out in the woods. We cut back
to them having breakfast and Bucy's just rare in to go.
I'm ready, and Ruggers like, no, no, we're going to
give him the time. We're gonna give him more time
to ye and we're gonna enjoy ourselves, and they Prince
Henry stout.

Speaker 3 (01:52:38):
It's such a but they're literally they're not just eating like,
they're like looking at at like artwork, and he's and
and and Readyger has this whole line about like I
like beautiful things, and he's looking at like a butter
butterfly that's been framed. Now will William McNamara isn't touching
his food.

Speaker 1 (01:52:54):
He doesn't have an appetite, and Rugger even tells him,
he's like, you know, you should eat some eggs, you
know he'll feel better. And then McGinley just takes his
place like.

Speaker 3 (01:53:00):
He's like, I'm not hungry. He's like, what was that, Well,
let's do a little switcherony. Yeah, Baginley is shoveling food
down his mouth because he's so excited, yeah, to go
and do this thing.

Speaker 1 (01:53:08):
So they finally finished their meal and they go after him,
and this is when they are on their ATVs going
through the woods.

Speaker 3 (01:53:14):
Which is the first moment, by the way, that I
think it's a real good commentary on hunting. Is like
they're like, you have a ten minute headstart to run
into the woods and.

Speaker 1 (01:53:21):
There's any TV. Yeah, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:53:24):
It's like because I've always heard those people, Like I
had a friend years and years ago who used to
always say, like I hate hunting. I just hate the
concept of it. Like if you want to be a hunter,
you should go into the woods naked with a fork.
That's all you get. You used to always say that
it killed me. I thought that was the funniest, the
funniest thing.

Speaker 1 (01:53:39):
So they they eventually catch up to Mason, so they
think like Johnson McGinley thinks he has sight of them,
shoots a bunch of trees, which causes all the guys
to laugh at him.

Speaker 3 (01:53:47):
And he has this massive hot shit spasky. So because
everybody's weapons are kind of representative, yea, like Bucy has
a crossbow, and he's wearing like a fringed kind of
Native American jacket and he has like an and a holster.

Speaker 1 (01:54:00):
He got some paint down his side too.

Speaker 3 (01:54:02):
Yeah, he's very he's very It's very clear that this
is some ritual for him.

Speaker 1 (01:54:06):
Yeah. Yeah, it's for him. So you got that. You've
got Rugger's got a really nice rifle, and Dutton I
think basically has the Desert Eagle. He has a Desert
Eagle and he has got a rifle too. Yeah, and
then and then F.

Speaker 3 (01:54:18):
Murray Abraham has like just a standard hunting riflesfle It's
it's very interesting. And the way that they're if you
look at the way they're dressed, that's another really interesting thing. Yeah,
because Rugger Howard looks put together, like he looks like
he wants to look good.

Speaker 1 (01:54:33):
Yeah. Then you look at like F.

Speaker 3 (01:54:34):
Murray Abraham and his son, and they're just wearing like
the most expensive hunting stuff. Yeah, like they kind of
look out of place. They do, because they're just it
looks like they just went on ll Bean and just
picked the most expensive thing.

Speaker 1 (01:54:45):
And the thing with mc namara is he's hesitant throughout
most of this movie with the hunt to where f
Murray Abraham has to pull him aside multiple times and
keep telling him like, no, you're gonna do this, to
even where they issue a bet to where I bet
my son's the first one to catch him.

Speaker 3 (01:54:58):
Yeah, I bet my son gets draws first blood. Ye,
who's in.

Speaker 1 (01:55:01):
Yeah. So they eventually catch up to Mason, but he
outwits them, and so they're tracking them. They're tracking them,
and then suddenly we see Mason's also resting by a
tree and he gets an idea and he doubles back,
so he gets back to the cabin. And that's also
when we catch back up to our hunters and they
stop and they're.

Speaker 3 (01:55:16):
Like you smell that, and he's like he wouldn't. What
an idiot? Yeah, And then they.

Speaker 1 (01:55:20):
They've never done that before.

Speaker 3 (01:55:21):
Well, no, no, before that the smoking tree. Oh yeah,
they're just like, what an idiot he's smoking? He's smoking? Yeah,
And then they they shoot and realize it's a tree
and he had he had put a couple of cigarettes
and lit them on the tree to load them off.
But that's when they figure out like he went back
to the cabin and then and then Cole says, like
none of them has ever done that before, Yes, which
is such a brilliant move too.

Speaker 1 (01:55:42):
He gets back to the cabin, he's looking for guns.
He keeps saying that there's gotta be guns. Here's got
to be guns in here. So he goes first to
that lock door, gets something to break the lock off,
breaks the lock. It's just a dark room with a
bunch of jars until he turns on the light and
then we see all the heads of the pass hunted.

Speaker 3 (01:55:57):
And they're not just heads and jars, they have little
plaques with the names. Yeah, and then they find he
finds the one jar in there that's empty.

Speaker 1 (01:56:05):
Yeah, a mason jar, mace.

Speaker 3 (01:56:06):
I was so funny. I said that when we were
watching it too. Hey, it's a mason jar.

Speaker 1 (01:56:10):
So the first thing he does immediately is he starts
laying waste of this room, throwing everything over. He gets
some gasoline outside, pours it inside the cabin. Right does
he hears them start to come back to the cabin. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:56:20):
He grabs all the gas for the generator because earlier
they showed him like they had him rock and fuel
over to.

Speaker 1 (01:56:24):
The propane and everything. Yeah, so it starts a fire
right as they pull up and as they're walking up
f Bray, Abraham goes upstairs and rugger Howard's like, you
smell that? And so they're like, oh my god, it's
trap right as this fire kicks up. Yeah, but then
out back Mason has just lit the fire, and who
comes right through that door, crazy as.

Speaker 3 (01:56:42):
All get out, Gary Buse pretty much the only jump
scare in his film because he it's effective. He bursts
through the door, knife in his hands, going yeah yeah,
just screaming, attacks Mason and at first he holds him
up against the wall of the cabin which is hot, yeah,
and then pulls up. I goes like my meat medium rare, yeah,
And then he knocks him over and then he says,

(01:57:04):
try well done, bitch, and he throws it through there.
So now he's gone back into the fiery building. And
then Mason runs away as the building finally gives a
boom blows up because all the heads are stored in
some kind of a flammable liquid. Yeah, so it's a
and he made sure to put most of the gasoline
in that.

Speaker 1 (01:57:20):
I love that.

Speaker 3 (01:57:21):
His reaction is like, fuck these motherfuckers, Like, I don't
even think it was really a trap. No, I think
he was just he was mad. He was like so
mortified and mad.

Speaker 1 (01:57:31):
Yeah, the while that's happening to you, f Mary, Abraham's
gone upstairs to try and find him. The explosion knocks
him out, so his son ends up saving him, pulling
him towards a window, which all the guys helped him
get out. So he's very happy with the son, which
is like the one moment that we have and that's.

Speaker 3 (01:57:45):
The one where Abraham where he's starting to think like,
my son isn't like nothing, and me, he saved my life.
And the guys even when he starts to doubt himself
but even say like he was gonna kill your father,
like if it weren't for you.

Speaker 1 (01:57:56):
Well, because he sees Mason run off as the explosion
and he's just grabbing a canteen, doesn't say anything, but rugger,
Howard's right on his ass and he's just like, what
did you see?

Speaker 3 (01:58:05):
And he just went that way, like just immediately. This
is such a great Ah. I love this movie so much, and.

Speaker 1 (01:58:13):
You were a little ahead. This is the cigarettes. Yeah,
and also the dog. Oh yeah, it's like a wolf
and he does but he does the same thing he
did with the security doog. He just goes yo, man,
I'm sorry, I'll get out of youd have it. In
my notes, Dickerson the Wolf. Dickerson said the wolf was
a way bigger part of the original screenplay.

Speaker 3 (01:58:28):
I believe that. Yeah, but it would be impossible. I mean,
like it would be so expensive, yea, working with animals
all the time.

Speaker 1 (01:58:34):
So yeah, he gets back into the woods, does the
thing that we said in regards to lighting the cigarettes
and putting them in the trees. So they're immediate like
that that he's smoking. So they take binoculars they see
the tree smoking and all while this is happening, John
C McGinley has gone off by himself to go ambush him,
ends up getting ambushed himself.

Speaker 3 (01:58:50):
Yeah, he basically rambos him. He he drops out of
the tree, lands right on top of him. Yep. And
now the tables are really starting to turn. The day
is getting to the end. It's to soon become nighttime.
He's carrying Johnson McGinley through the woods, which is one
of my favorites, because they're all wearing these headsets that
you talk to each other. They're trying to reach him
and trying to reach him, and he starts going like
while he's being Fireman's carried by iced t he's.

Speaker 1 (01:59:11):
Like, all right, he's like, shut the fuck up.

Speaker 3 (01:59:13):
He hits his head twice into a tree and then
keeps walking through.

Speaker 1 (01:59:17):
So he ends up finding shelter in a cave and
that's when he's got McGinley tied up. And McGinley is
just also asthmatic. We've got to mention, So, yeah, an Hailer.

Speaker 3 (01:59:26):
One of the best parts, because one of the best
parts because he's he's this big, tough cowboy, but every
now and that he gets too excited and he has to.

Speaker 1 (01:59:34):
Yeah. So he's tied up by Mason and he's just like,
you know, why don't you fucking kill me, Why don't
you go ahead and be a hunter use that trigger
and everything, And Mason basically tells him he's not going
to do it because he's the marketing chip.

Speaker 3 (01:59:44):
And he thinks about it for a second and he's
like no, yeah, no.

Speaker 1 (01:59:47):
So this all leads to an extended scene with McGinley
basically like calling Mason out and saying that he's the
he's one of the reasons that his daughter got attacked
and killed and you know, blames him.

Speaker 3 (01:59:58):
There's an amazing moment where he says like, I don't
know who did it, like, and he was like, for
all I know, you did it.

Speaker 1 (02:00:03):
You did it.

Speaker 3 (02:00:03):
Yeah, And that's an incredible moment where you realize that
this guy is just he's just desperate.

Speaker 1 (02:00:08):
Yeah, for an answer. He wants revenge. He does, doesn't
he'll never get it. He'll never see that, or he's
not going to get it. Yeah. And this leads to
Mason basically explaining how he didn't technically kill his wife
or his wife and son. What happened was he was
working at this building and he became the manager of
it where they were living, so they could live there
for free. Yep. And it was a rundown place at

(02:00:28):
a bunch of fire hazards. One night, he had worked
too late, came back and found that the building was
burning down the way.

Speaker 3 (02:00:33):
He said, it affects me so much, because he says,
I'm all the way back and I see my building.
Only it's not my my building, but it is my
building because it was on fire. And sure enough, his
wife and kid die in that fire.

Speaker 1 (02:00:47):
And McGinley has the great lineup, I thought you said
you killed them.

Speaker 3 (02:00:50):
They're dead, aren't they yes.

Speaker 1 (02:00:52):
So by this point McGinley and Mason have kind of
just chilled out. But also we see that Rugger Howard
and f Maury Abraham have seen exactly where they are.
They're planning to ambush the cave in the morning, which
they do. They find John C. McGinley there and he
is rescued. He gets his little his little power bar
and he's like, all I know is I'm done. Like
you guys can keep doing this. I gotta let him go.

Speaker 3 (02:01:12):
He spared me. Gotta let him go. Yeah, And they're like,
you know, we can't do it. He's like, I'm not.
I can't stop you. Yeah, but I'm done. Yeah, Like
I'm going home.

Speaker 1 (02:01:20):
So he starts walking and that's when Rugger Howerd's like,
you know, turn around and he's like, what are you
gonna do? Shoot me in the back, yes.

Speaker 3 (02:01:27):
And he turns around with this crazy look in his
face too, like he was about to fucking whoop the
shit out of Rugger Howard. Because the reality isn't there
that these guys are killer killers, because I don't think
John C. McGinley, his character is a killer No, at
least not yet. No, Because these guys are training people
to be killers. Basically, so he looks at him with

(02:01:47):
this crazy look because he's just like, I'm gonna beat
the shit out of you. Because from his perspective, he's like,
I'll just beat the shit out of him. He'll wipe
the blood out of his nose. We'll all laugh about
it and I'll be like, yeah, I get to go
home now.

Speaker 1 (02:01:56):
Yeah, but no, no, So he turns around and Rugger
Howard just with this like peach apple whatever it is
that yeah, he and Charles Dunton just takes out his degal,
shooting him right in the head.

Speaker 3 (02:02:07):
And the first thing that happens is billing that McNamara's
going dad dead dead, and they knock him in the
stunner and then he pulls his gun right on Rudger
Howard and they're like.

Speaker 1 (02:02:17):
Wolf, yeah, oh my god. So they talk him down
and basically mc namara is just like, you know, I'll
continue this hunt, but when this is done, like you
and I are done.

Speaker 3 (02:02:27):
Well, he says, I will never forget this.

Speaker 1 (02:02:29):
I will never forget that. He was like, I'll help
you hunt him, and I might even have to help him.
You help me kill him.

Speaker 3 (02:02:33):
Yeah, but when this is over, I'm not gonna forget this, Yeah,
which is an incredible moment too, because f Murray Abraham
is realizing like maybe this wasn't a good idea.

Speaker 1 (02:02:42):
Yeah. Well, and they've killed They've now killed Griffin to
prevent any legal action because he was he was even
saying like, you know, you, you guys can do whatever you want.
You know, I'm gonna go home. And he's like, you know,
what are you gonna do? So they've eliminated it time
gives that whole speech rare.

Speaker 3 (02:02:54):
He's like, you think he's gonna go to the police,
Chances are you'll never see him again if he gets
out of here. A lot and and well, and even
Rudger Howard even says like he's right, maybe he's right, Like,
oh my god, and they're just setting him.

Speaker 1 (02:03:07):
Up, setting it up further and further. So by this point,
now Mason knows that he's been killed, and now they're
back on the hunt again. They end up following him
to this river where they find one footprint. As they
start walking through the river, we see that Mason's hiding
out in a hollowed out tree. He climbs out, goes
back to their ATVs doesn't steal one right away because
he sees Coles. And what he does is he cuts
the wire for the ignition, test it and then sticks

(02:03:29):
it right in the gas.

Speaker 3 (02:03:30):
Yeah. When he presses the ignition, it sparks, ye, So
he sticks it in the gas tank.

Speaker 1 (02:03:33):
Oh man. So they end up realizing like, okay, that
he didn't go this way. So they're doubling back right
as he's driving off. So that's when Rugger Howard takes
aim with his rifle. Cole gets on his starts it up.
Rugger Howard shoots out the tire and right as that happens,
Cole's ATV blows up.

Speaker 3 (02:03:49):
Yeah, which causes him to basically miss his chance to
shoot Mason dead from a distance too, because his ATV explodes.
And this is a moment that stuck with me forever. Yeah,
because he because as they walk over to him, his
his leger gone and he and he's in shock.

Speaker 1 (02:04:07):
This won't be last pick. Sain't the last pig.

Speaker 3 (02:04:10):
He keeps saying that saint the last pig. Yeah, you
you you deserve to tell this part. Because I get
too excited and start getting ahead.

Speaker 1 (02:04:16):
So he's he's frantic, and that's when a mason has
crashed because the tire got shot out. So he's off
to the side, and you know he's not hearing any
of this. So we see Rugger Howard walk up and
he's just like, hey, hey, calm down. He's like, you know,
I'm gonna have to put you to bed. It's time.
And he has his hands like this, he's got like
he's got his finger guns almost, and he puts them
right under his chin and presses to where he basically.

Speaker 3 (02:04:37):
He collapses his his lung, well, he collapses his esophagush.

Speaker 1 (02:04:41):
Yeah. So and all while this is happening too, he's
just going through the motions, takes his headband off that
he's been wearing, and it's just like he's just straught.

Speaker 3 (02:04:49):
And this is the part where I'll bring up what
I was telling you, which is I think there's a
subtext that that they were lovers. I think so because
there are a lot of moments where they're touching each
other and kind of doting on each other. Just puts
a mint in his mouth. There's also the whole thing
where it's like he's very like he makes the house
a home.

Speaker 1 (02:05:09):
It's frames the This is the butterfly, the butterfly because
it looks like a heart. Yeah, and then the camera
and then the camera pulls focus from the butterfly two
Cole's face smiling at him. But the big thing is
when he tells him, like, it's time to put you
to bed and he puts his fingers on him. He
doesn't fight, he puts his hands on him gently and
like lets him kill him, Yeah, and then not I'm

(02:05:30):
trying to think of the symbolism. After Rugger lets him die,
he goes over and he has that like incredible moment
of not a full cry, but that's the moment where
he's just kind of looking off and he's like the
tears are happening, his hair's fallen down, he's looking and again,
maybe I'm overreading this, but he's looking very feminine in
that moment. And the reason I started to go like,
these guys seem really intimate was that the more it goes,

(02:05:52):
the more you realize they're really only in it with
each other. Everybody else could be killed because they're a problem,
but they are the tea. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:06:01):
And it started making me see just more and more
of like how they were so so familiar with each
other in like a really and I don't know, I
think it was subtext. I don't Ernest Dickerson didn't mention
on the commentary you mentioned, So it made me wonder
if maybe, like if Rugger Hower and and Charles Dutton
had like talked about it kind of and kind of

(02:06:23):
like put that subtext in by the way they interacted
with each other, because it's it's it's it's everything they
do is so interesting. Because that's kind of my point
is we're watching this ridiculous, low budget ish action movie
with hunters hunting a man for sport, and they're so
the Hunters are so interesting to watch and listen to,
and that's my point of like, I love the idea

(02:06:45):
that like that's the subtext that doesn't that matters because
it makes them more interesting because they could just be
drooling mad men, or they could just be cold calculating sociopathy.
But there's something else.

Speaker 1 (02:06:56):
There's something else, because we even missed one scene which
isn't a huge one, but Mason ends up getting Griffin's gun.
He has the spats, he has the shotgun, so he
actually fires on them, which is what alerts them to
go after him. To the water and whatnot. So he's
got a gun now. So Mason's back on the run
and he finds that he's on this cliff side. But
there's this giant tree that he can shoot down, which

(02:07:17):
he does to walk across the cliffs, but of course
shoots like six or seven shots, alerting.

Speaker 3 (02:07:21):
Them towards the bullets too. But he knocks down this
log so he can go across this big canyon. Yeah,
but of course alerts them to where he is, and
also gives them because this tree is too he's not
gonna be able to shove it over when it gets across.

Speaker 1 (02:07:34):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:07:35):
Yeah, it's a really cool moment. Although I don't know
that gun would actually be able to do that.

Speaker 1 (02:07:40):
Maybe that would be the only unrealistic thing in this
whole thing. So shoots the tree down, climbs across it. Meanwhile,
the three of them catch up to it, and of
course rugger Hower's first to go across, and then mc
namara is getting ready to go, and you can see
that he's already kind of afraid of heights. So his
Fburry Abraham even pulls him back. He's like, you know,
you stay here. He's like, no, fuck you, I'm gonna
do no, fuck you dad.

Speaker 3 (02:07:59):
Yeah, and then he just goes and did you notice
that Abraham seems proud of him. Yeah, he does. There's
like that moment where he looks at him like he
steps back.

Speaker 1 (02:08:06):
Good. Yeah, good, No, that's fair. So Rugger Howard is
almost across and we see Mason on the other side
start throwing rocks at him, trying to knock him off,
which makes McNamara lose his balance. He slips over the
side of the rock while Rugger tries to take a
shot log of the log. Yeah, so he's like, you know, Dad,
help me out, I'm slipping. Murray gets across, Rugger gets across.
They do not get to him in time and make
Damara falls.

Speaker 3 (02:08:26):
Rugger doesn't go to help at all. No, that's why
Abraham blame.

Speaker 1 (02:08:30):
He takes the shot at Mason, he gets on the shoulder.
That's right exactly.

Speaker 3 (02:08:33):
That's why that's what starts the full blown I'm blaming
you is that he didn't turn around to try and
help his son. He was like, no, I'm gonna kill
this guy. Yep, And and McNamara falls straight down to
a big pile of rocks.

Speaker 1 (02:08:45):
Yeah, he's gone. He's gone yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:08:47):
And then the first thing Rugger Howard does when he's
mad at him is he tells him like, well, we
have to kill him. He killed your son. Yep, he
did this, Like he's just he's such a manipulator.

Speaker 1 (02:08:55):
Yeah, And I mean they're they're going at it, and
he's just like, listen to me, it's gonna be night soon.
All we have to do is hunker down, listen for
the sound act like fucking hunters.

Speaker 3 (02:09:05):
Yeah, and then he and then great moment where f
Mary Abraham tells him like, Okay, but when this is over,
you and I'll set it up. And the way Rudger
Howard responds, he just has this like this oddly charming smirk.

Speaker 1 (02:09:18):
Wray gooes, that'll be nice.

Speaker 3 (02:09:20):
Yeah, And I like, I'm saying, like it's it's what
makes this movie. You remember it forever. I don't know
that I in a million years. I've I mean, I've
directed a couple movies. You know you can. I'm fine
if people to be like, yeah, but they were cheap,
that's totally fine. That's fair point. I've never made a
movie that costs millions of dollars and had a month
to film. Yeah, but I don't know as a performer

(02:09:42):
or as a director, if I ever would have thought
to be like just kind of have this little joyful
playing moment. I don't know if I would ever thought
of that. I think I just don't.

Speaker 1 (02:09:52):
Like.

Speaker 3 (02:09:52):
That's why Rudger Howard elevated anything he was in. I
mean even he was even good in fucking Turbulence three. Yeah,
he was in it very long. He was great. He's
just ah, yet he had it. I'm gonna tell you
a really short rud Gerhower story.

Speaker 1 (02:10:09):
That's mine.

Speaker 3 (02:10:10):
I never met Rudgarhwer, but years ago, I think I
was eighteen years old, I worked on a treatment for
a movie that was supposed to be big, and I
was very proud of the treatment. It was based on
a concept I was told I busted my ass writing
this really detailed treatment, and one of the main characters
was a priest who secretly raised like this child monster thing.

(02:10:33):
And when they were talking about developing it further, he
was like, do you have anybody in mind as the guy?
And I was like, rud Gerhwer like absolutely, And this
was when I knew that the entire project was totally fucked.
I said, rud Gerhauer and the guy didn't know he
was whatever. So he looks him up and then he goes,
I just don't know because I just imagined him as

(02:10:53):
like as like having dark hair, and I literally said,
if only there were a way to change a man's
hair color one day, science one day, and then I
emotionally stepped completely out of the project. Lually it went
nowhere anyway. Yeah, I would have made a lot of
money if I'd gotten to the well, I forget, I forget.
It was some of those ridiculous things where it was
like if it went to screenplay, I got five percent, Yeah,

(02:11:14):
which would have been stupid if it had happened. But
it did, never did. But but that was I literally
was like, Rudgor Howard be perfect blonde? Was the problem anyway?

Speaker 1 (02:11:23):
Please? So we are now at the climax of the film.
So they are now in this little collection of branches
all around. I mean it basically looks like the end
of Predator in my opinion.

Speaker 3 (02:11:32):
Yeah, oh totally so. But which is I think on purpose.

Speaker 1 (02:11:35):
Not intentional, not necessarily to rip off predators, but because
standoff and they are predators, yes, they are hunting. Yeah,
So we are now just inside of this little little enclosure,
and we see that Wolf is losing it basically because
he keeps hearing these twig stapping. He's calling out to Mason.
He's like, I don't have a gun. Bang bang bang
bang bangs.

Speaker 3 (02:11:56):
The message says, I don't even have a gun, Mason.
And then the moment hears us how he starts shooting
his gun and I was like, I love that. He's
not even a good liar anymore. So he ends up
getting circled by Mason. Mason charges him, they get into
a huge fight. It's a great reveal that he says,
just face me, Mason, and then Mason's right there. And
because it's dark and I and we've mentioned this before,
but like I don't know if you mentioned on the show,

(02:12:16):
but like on the VHS you couldn't see anything so dark,
and on the DVD barely you could kind of on
this blu ray, you see it. I really want this
to have an HDR.

Speaker 1 (02:12:27):
Well, it's just like that the shot that you and
I both are thinking of. I think when we think
about this is rugger. Howard is hiding in this log
watching all this happen, and the only thing you can
see are his eyes. You couldn't see that before.

Speaker 3 (02:12:38):
But it's the same thing with Mason. Mason has put
black goop all over his face. So when he's there
and he's baring his teeth, he's an animal. That's kind
of my point is like they're two different animals. Mason
is the actual apex predator showing his teeth, and then
we just see eyes peering out from the brush because

(02:12:59):
he's a.

Speaker 1 (02:12:59):
Different and that's actually the blue right too. Yeah, which
the original post looks really weird. I wish it was
cooler looking. I liked I like the simple ones of
like just iced tea running with the target, the target
on him.

Speaker 3 (02:13:12):
I think that's and that wasn't the best poster in
the world, but because the other were like, we gotta
put Bucy on this cover.

Speaker 1 (02:13:19):
So so yeah, he ends up defeating uh Fburry Abraham
and that's when he goes after Burns. Burns is now
riding off towards the airspace, trying to get to a
plane coming up. Sun's coming up, so Mason gets out
of the brush. He sees the planes getting ready to leave,
goes up to it, and we also see a shot
of Burns in the plane. So we get faked out
along with Mason because as he approaches, he sees no

(02:13:40):
one's inside. But he also sees that this is all
obviously a trap because explode. Yeah, because rugger Hower immediately
just starts firing shots into the fuel tank. The plane
blows up, and he thinks he's got Mason, and Mason's dead,
and he even says, father, please forgive me, Please forgive me.

Speaker 3 (02:13:56):
And then these and I don't know how you do that
effect because they did this effect in Sinners, but they
made it so his eyes are shining red.

Speaker 1 (02:14:03):
He's got like a red nest, you though.

Speaker 3 (02:14:04):
And that's a predator symbol. Predator animals. That's like the
one thing that can give them the way. And you
know why their I like why dogs eyes and stuff
glow like that, right? Why it's they're seeing better in
the dark that we do. It's that's what my understanding is.
I'm not an expert animal cats and dogs both will
do that. You know, you'll be like, WHOA, I can
kind of see a glow in your eye.

Speaker 1 (02:14:22):
So burns flies out and we think that, you know,
Mason's possibly dead, except he rises from the ashes and
he looks out and watches him fly away.

Speaker 3 (02:14:30):
Yeah, and it's and it's epic, it's super built up.
He stands up from the dirt and you realize that
he just barely survived. And the best part is we
don't even see this, but now he has to survive
escaping the canyon.

Speaker 1 (02:14:43):
That's yeah, that is one thing that I do have
issue with. I wish we could see how he got back,
even though we kind of do get a hint.

Speaker 3 (02:14:49):
But I don't think we need to because we've established
that this motherfucker has a will to live.

Speaker 1 (02:14:55):
He's gonna do it. And this is.

Speaker 3 (02:14:57):
Something that I love about this movie, and that I
about when a like survival kind of movie is done
really well, which is I love stories about how a
person's will to live can be so far beyond what
anyone could imagine. Yeah, like The Revenant, Yeah, that's a
really good example. He just keeps living. And that was

(02:15:17):
based on a true story.

Speaker 1 (02:15:18):
Yes, he just keeps living.

Speaker 3 (02:15:19):
Or like Gravity with Sandra Bullock, she just keeps living.

Speaker 1 (02:15:24):
It's so good, so good. So now we are back
in Seattle. It's a few days later. We see that
Rugger Howard is changing his appearance to look like a priest.

Speaker 3 (02:15:32):
He's dyeing his hair black. Imagine, imagine, how did they
get the technology? It was only nineteen ninety four, David,
how did you make his hair and up blonde?

Speaker 1 (02:15:39):
I want to know. He's got various military uniforms laid out,
various passports, which you gave me the impression that it
was probably him and DNT we're gonna fly out together. Well,
and they both and there were two Army ranger uniforms yep,
which suggests that that's how they met. What I also
love is he's listening to his messages before he leaves,
and Wolfe's wife calls and she's just.

Speaker 3 (02:15:58):
Like, hey, my husband and my on never return. It's
been three days or four days or whatever since they
were supposed to return. I'd really appreciate it.

Speaker 1 (02:16:06):
Call back. So he puts on this fake mustache. He's
got this priest out that on, and he is walking
out to his car.

Speaker 3 (02:16:11):
He's dressed like a an Orthodox priest. Yes, he's got
a hat, which is smart because that changes his appearance
the most. So he has his hair cued in a
in a in a braid. It's all black. He's dyed
his eyebrows and his facial hair, and he and he
goes to this car. It like beat up car that
I'm guessing he'd stashed had for an emergency inside. Yeah,

(02:16:32):
it's really bad and it won't start like it does
it clicks, it doesn't even it doesn't even remember at all.

Speaker 1 (02:16:37):
So he decides he's going to get out and go
do the next location he's gonna go.

Speaker 3 (02:16:42):
I'm assuming because it's in Seattle, that he's heading to Canada.
And I had mentioned to you, because I'm old enough
to remember, you could go to Canada with just a
driver's license back that if you were in a car,
because I the first time I went to Canada it was,
if I'm remember correctly, it was one year before the
instituted passport at the border on car five car man,
because it used to be you could go there with

(02:17:02):
just a driver's license. You just had to have a
state I d yeah, And I remember going up there
and it being so in hindsight, because I've crossed the
border many times since. In hindsight, I'm just like, man,
they just took my They just took me, and my
friend's IDs looked at him, asked us like fifteen questions
and then said, all right, all right, you know I
got in Canada. Ye, so I assume he was probably

(02:17:22):
making his way to either an airport or a bus. Yeah,
and and yeah, it's it's it's so great seeing how
he had like a complete plan of escape he did.
But also again it feeds into that thing. He had
a complete plan of escape for him and Coal and
Cold even referenced briefly that he had a wife and daughters. Yeah,

(02:17:43):
so they were both totally ready to bug out, and they.

Speaker 1 (02:17:46):
Were ready to go together. So by this point he's walking,
he runs into a woman and he's and she's like,
you know, and he's blessed you, and she's like, do
you have anything to spare it out of my way?

Speaker 3 (02:17:55):
Well, I'm homeless, ye, out of my way. Yeah, And
it's a great it's a great moment to show like
he's still a jerk. He's that that just is him.

Speaker 1 (02:18:03):
Yeah. So he immediately sees a motorcycle off to the side.

Speaker 3 (02:18:07):
And it's the dirt bike he had been driving. So
now he knows that Mason.

Speaker 1 (02:18:10):
Mason is near, so he starts hearing Mason's voice. He
goes around a corner, pulls out his little rifle, that
he's had the entire film.

Speaker 3 (02:18:17):
It was in this case that was pretty sure. It
was like a flute case. It was like an oboe
case or something musical instrument case.

Speaker 1 (02:18:23):
Yeah. So Mason ends ambushing him Dave into a fight.
There's a whole thing that happens where he gets thrown
into an electrical panel. At one point, Mason gets the
gun and ruggers like, you know, shoot me.

Speaker 3 (02:18:32):
And during this fight, Rugger is talking like it's person
Oh yeah for the first time.

Speaker 1 (02:18:37):
Oh yeah, He's just like no Mercyson's like.

Speaker 3 (02:18:41):
Freaking out of his gore y and Mason totally gets
the better room, gets the gun, has it to his face,
and again he's trying to manipulate. Yeah, he's like do it,
do it?

Speaker 1 (02:18:52):
He does this thing.

Speaker 3 (02:18:53):
It's like a it's like a director. Yeah, he just
like he has this moment he's like do it.

Speaker 1 (02:18:57):
Do it.

Speaker 3 (02:18:58):
He like gives him a cue. Yeah, now end the game.

Speaker 1 (02:19:01):
And so he doesn't do it. He walks off a
little bit with the gun still in his hand, unloads it,
empties the chamber, takes the clip out, even throws it,
and then that's when Rugger scurries to the gun grabs
the one bullet on the ground.

Speaker 3 (02:19:12):
The one that popped out of the chamber, gets the.

Speaker 1 (02:19:14):
Gun, goes around the corner and he's like, hey, Mason,
And that's when you hear Mason go hey, Burns, something
you should always do? And he don't, you know what
you should always do when you find a gun? And
he goes say cheese, that's what I love. He goes,
sage cheese, cheese because he's looking through the scope. Yeah,
and he goes, always check the barrel and we zoom inside.

Speaker 3 (02:19:31):
Well, it explodes first, and then he says, always checked
the barrel. What did he put in the barrel? Because
I feel like he just he just just trash. Okay,
well it was it was firearm stuff. Okay, I don't
I'm guessing that he just stuffed because he doesn't so
quick obviously when he pops the barrel, I had, for
some reason.

Speaker 1 (02:19:50):
I had memory that the business card was in there.

Speaker 3 (02:19:52):
It could have been there was like there was like
text on there, but it looked like it was like
firearm related. I'm not sure exactly what.

Speaker 1 (02:19:58):
Yeah, the gun explodes, the credits come up, and that
is nineteen ninety four's Surviving.

Speaker 3 (02:20:04):
The Game the most nineties part of the ending is
he says, always check the barrel, and then there's a
guitar course one.

Speaker 1 (02:20:10):
I also love it because he throws away the cigarettes.
He throws away everything from the hunt.

Speaker 3 (02:20:14):
Yeah, he just doesn't want well, but getting rid of
the cigarettes I think was a symbol not only of
his rejection of them, but maybe his rejection of not
valuing life anymore. That could be it, yes, because that's
really like I said, this is all about the idea
that there was a man with nothing to lose yep,
who had no will to live anymore, and he didn't

(02:20:34):
realize that in reality he had so much more to
him than even they imagine. They thought he would be
a just a really spelt turkey that could run quickly yep,
and he was way beier.

Speaker 1 (02:20:47):
Yeah yeah, yeah, So what do you want to guess?
The budget was like eight seven million, four hundred thousand
opening weekend. It takes in two million, nine hundred thousand dollars,
which is April seventeenth of nineteen ninety four, gross worldwide
seven million, seven hundred and twenty seven thousand dollars. So
it didn't do great, didn't do great, but again had
already made its money before it even shot. Sure Sure

(02:21:07):
a shot in Wnachie, Washington, as well as Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
forty day shoot.

Speaker 3 (02:21:13):
I don't believe they actually ever filmed in Philadelphia. I
think that that got one shot. I think, well, well,
there's the establishing shot of Seattle. For some reason, they
use a very obvious shot of Philadelphia. I think that's
I think that's where they shot some in Philadelpia. I
think it really was just that establishing shot, which I'm
guessing was just something they had laying around in the
edit bay or something.

Speaker 1 (02:21:32):
Ernist Dickerson was working with new Line when he found
the screenplay for Surviving the Game. Having been a fan
of Most Dangerous Game short story and the nineteen thirty
four film of the same name, he instantly pictured an
African lead for the film, originally suggesting Laurence Fishburne, who
had just made waves of his performance in Deep Cover
two years prior. New Line unfortunately blamed Fishburne for the
failure of Deep Cover and passed on the suggestion. Having

(02:21:53):
recently seen Trespass and been wild with Iced Tea's performance,
Dickerson suggested ic t to new Line, who agreed to
offer him at.

Speaker 3 (02:22:00):
Well, and I'm sure Dickerson had to be familiar with
Ice even though Ice was and you know, Ice was
also a Jersey He was from Jersey although he grew
up in La Yeah, and he was a West Coast guy.
One thousand percent. There's no way with how plugged into
that world Ernest Dickerson was, because you got to remember it, like,
he didn't just do Spike Lee movies and stuff. I
mean he made Juice with Tupac and he shot Crush.

Speaker 1 (02:22:21):
Groove, Yeah, which was fat Boys. Oh you can eat.
Dickerson recalled on the commentary that he had taken Ice
to He had taken Iced Tea and Jeff Corey, who
played Hank in the film, to dinner early in production stages.
Ice Tea was under scrutiny at the time due to
his band body Count, having stirred controversy with their song
cop Killer. Due to cop Killer, Dickerson commented that the

(02:22:42):
production had to hire private security as local law enforcement
was not interested in helping them since Ice was involved
with the project.

Speaker 3 (02:22:48):
Yeah, I mean it was. That was a controversial move.

Speaker 1 (02:22:51):
Yeah. At the dinner, Corey and Ice hit iceed t
Hit off a conversation easy, as Corey was a former
actor who'd been involved in the Red Scare, and, like Ice,
had been black listed from Hollywood as a result of
not providing any names.

Speaker 3 (02:23:03):
No way, Yeah, that's fascinating.

Speaker 1 (02:23:06):
Yeah. A meeting had been set up with Dickerson and
Rugger Howard to go over the project. Dickerson had been
warned that Howard could be an very intense guy and
to be careful with him. His anxiousness soon went away
within the first few minutes of the meeting, and the
meeting ended up lasting over four hours, where at the
end Rugger agreed to join the film. Damn yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:23:24):
I mean, I can't imagine Rugger Howard read that script
and not want to do it.

Speaker 1 (02:23:27):
Oh yeah. According to Dickerson, Bob Shay and his production
partner Robert Perma had become bitter enemies by the time
production rolled around on the film, as the movie had
already been pre sold overseas due to the cast. New
Line saw it as they had already made their money
back before the film had been shot, and therefore offered
very little assistance or extra money on the production. Dickerson
attributes the experience to why the film turned out to

(02:23:48):
be fifty percent of the film he wanted to make,
but in the end, he is ultimately happy with the
performances in the film more than anything. Also, why the
film did not have a marketing campaign.

Speaker 3 (02:23:57):
I believe that, and I do believe that the movie
is a bit uneven. Yeah, once you get about an
hour in, it definitely feels truncated.

Speaker 1 (02:24:05):
Yeah, very much. While Stuart Copeland, a former member of
the band The Police, provided the incredible score for the film,
Dickerson's original choice was musician Ry Cooter, whom Dickerson had
shown a rough edit of the film too without the
score and enjoyed it. However, New Line did not want
to pay his asking price, and Dickerson then moved on
to offer the job to Copeland, who accepted. I.

Speaker 3 (02:24:24):
Yeah, I it definitely seemed that way to me, Like
they were just kind of like, we have this little
action thing and we don't have to really worry about
it too much. And politics always plays a big part
in those big studio things. New Line was the biggest
little studio in the world.

Speaker 1 (02:24:37):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:24:38):
And Bob Shea was Bob Shay in his great moments,
and he has rough moments.

Speaker 1 (02:24:41):
Copeland had done the music for Wall Street as well
as Rumblefish at this point too. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:24:45):
I mean, if he wasn't nobody for it. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:24:48):
When it came to the design of the Hunter's cabin
in the Woods, Dickerson gave only one direction to his
set designer. Everything in the cabin must be made of
something that was once alive.

Speaker 3 (02:24:56):
God, that's so smart. It would it the decorator. Oh yeah, yeah,
that's so smart.

Speaker 1 (02:25:02):
When ic T discovers the heads of the previous humans
hunting for Sport, one of the name plates reads s Pollard.
This was done as a nod to the film's editor,
Sam Pollard, who is no relation to the film critic
Ryan Pollard. No sets or sound stages were used. The
entire movie was shot in real locations.

Speaker 3 (02:25:19):
That surprises me. Yeah a lot.

Speaker 1 (02:25:22):
The landing strip in the cabin see in the movie
are at Lake Weinachi State Airport, Washington, which is very
close to civilization. The cabin has since been torn down
and replaced with larger buildings a few yards of the southeast.
Almost all of the city scenes were filmed in downtown Wnachi, Washington.
Most of the scenes were filmed in the two block
perimeter of Mission Ornando, Palehouse, and Columbia Streets, plus the

(02:25:44):
alley behind Liberty Theater off to the Mission Street. The
area includes the infamous Bruce Hotel, which became Bruce Transitional
Housing for the homeless in the early two thousands.

Speaker 3 (02:25:52):
Yeah, I've heard a lot of stories. When I used
to read IMDb message boards about surviving the game, people
used to talk a lot about like, I can't believe
I'm from Winachi. One day, I'm just watching this movie
on cable and there's the Bruce, the legendary flophouse, the
Bruce Hotel.

Speaker 1 (02:26:06):
It was Rugger Howard's idea that Thomas Burns rides a
Kawasaki twin cylinder six to fifty motorcycle. Howard owned one
of these bikes and felt that by riding one in
the movie, his character would stand out as a leader
of the hunting pack. He also claimed that the bike
had the appearance of an iron horse, giving Thomas Burns
the look of a warrior knight.

Speaker 3 (02:26:21):
I do always remember it stuck out that he was
on a bike and everybody else we on AGTVS.

Speaker 1 (02:26:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:26:26):
When Gary Busey arrived on set, he questioned his character
with Dickerson, wondering how he was supposed to play him
up as a comedic or serious. Busey was enthused to
learn that Hawkins had been based on an article Dickerson
had read about a white supremacist who'd had a dog
that had been missing for two weeks, only to discover
his father had locked the dog in a shed and
told his son one day that he was to enter
the shed and fight the dog to see who would
emerge from the shed one or the other. It was

(02:26:48):
price starving the dog to make it vicious.

Speaker 1 (02:26:50):
Upon hearing this, Dickerson recalls, Busey did a little excited
dance around the set, coming back to Dickerson stating, Ernest,
you really watered my garden.

Speaker 3 (02:26:57):
That that's such a beausy thing to hear, Yeah, that
sounds like beaucy.

Speaker 1 (02:27:01):
F Murray Abraham suffered a serious accident while leaving set
one night. The cabin was an hour away from the
hotel where the cast and crew were staying. Murray decided
to drive himself and ended up in a bad car
accident when a driver ran a stop sign an intersection,
smashing into his car, causing Murray to fracture his risk
break three ribs, along with facial lacerations. This caused the
production to need to shoot around Murray's injuries, which is

(02:27:22):
why his character is seen wearing gloves and goggles predominantly
the second half of the film. Oh man, that makes
so much sense. Murray's agent told him to quit the production,
but Murray pushed through, often being on drugs to deal
with the pain. There's actually one incident too where the
walk in the river, he actually fell and the bone
came out of his hand. Oh my god. Ah. While
shooting in the mountains offered great shots on location and

(02:27:44):
also limited operational hours for daylight, which quickly started putting
the production behind. Dickerson recalls they began ripping pages out
of the screenplay and increased the speed for shooting, limiting
the number of takes that they could do on scenes.
This led to a large portion invasions backstory being cut out,
linking his street smarts to his survival in the woods
to beat the hunters. Also why there is only one
take of Bucy's death scene. Despite Ucy offering to pay

(02:28:06):
out a pocket for another take, Dickerson had to decline
to the decline the offer for fear of production being
shut down. Yeah, yeah, that could cause trouble. Yeah. One day,
while working with the Dolly Track Entertainment, Tonight was visiting
the set to shoot behind the scenes piece for the show.
The show crew watched as the production used the Dolly
set up four times. However, on the fourth time, an
error occurred and the camera went off the track, crashing.

(02:28:28):
Dickerson was embarrassed, but not surprised to see this exact
shot ended up on their piece about the film when
the story premiered.

Speaker 3 (02:28:33):
Of course, it's the most interesting thing, because that's like
when I work on projects sometimes, Like I'm shooting at
a friend's really awesome house and they were like, oh,
we're hoping we'll be home enough to watch you work,
and I'm like, it's not exciting when it goes well, yeah,
it's exciting for me.

Speaker 1 (02:28:50):
Charles Dunton improvised the line he ain't the last pig,
shortly before his character dies. Scenes involving the river chase
were cut together with shots of four different bodies of water,
as when production had reached what Dickerson referred to as
the raging waters, a drought had occurred, slowing down the streams.
Of course, of course, despite the ending of the movie
taking place in Seattle, Washington. For some reason, production filmed

(02:29:10):
and used as an established shot of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania from
the vantage point of the South Street Bridge. Several key
identifiable landmarks are visible in the shot, obviously the nothing
resembling a space needle to even vaguely pass it on
as the intended location.

Speaker 3 (02:29:22):
Yeah, so I've spent a decent amount of time in Philadelphia,
and it is so painfully obvious that it's Philadelphia.

Speaker 1 (02:29:30):
In the same year this movie was released, Ice Tea's
metal band body Count recorded an unrelated song with the
title Surviving the Game, which appeared on their second album,
Born Dead.

Speaker 3 (02:29:38):
It's actually not a bad song. People didn't like Born
Dead that much. I think I think it aged well,
it's a lot of moshpits.

Speaker 1 (02:29:44):
It was an odd one. Yeah, well, I.

Speaker 3 (02:29:46):
Think that the Moshpits songs kind of they're not as
lyrically dense, So I think some people kind of like
got turned off to it. Maybe, But I love that
Born Dead album. Nothing can beat the body Count self
titled Oh No, It's incredible.

Speaker 1 (02:29:58):
So good. A screenwriter Eric Burnt later expressed regret by
killing off doc Hawkins, who was Gary Busey so early,
and have given the chance to go back and change things.
He would have killed off Wolf Senior at Murray Abraham
first and have Hawkins take over the role of a
father figure to Wolf Junior. It has speculated that Abraham's
oscar win guaranteed him a more prolific character in the movie.
In Busey's experience, that could make sense.

Speaker 3 (02:30:19):
Man, that would be a really fascinating thing if you
started just like shrinking that kid's head.

Speaker 1 (02:30:24):
About his dad dying. Oh, that's a whole other movie.

Speaker 3 (02:30:26):
Yeah, that would have been fascinating.

Speaker 1 (02:30:27):
The deer scene running through the woods at the start
of the hunt was provided via an animal wrangler and
made Dickerson laugh at its arrival, as the deer only
had one antler, causing them to shoot wide shots versus
close up. Although it is clear and one shot the
deer does in fact only have one antler.

Speaker 3 (02:30:40):
Sometimes deers only have one antler because they shed them. Yeah,
so I mean it is what it is.

Speaker 1 (02:30:45):
The scene where Mason uses a shotgun to shoot down
a tree to cross over the cliff was done on
an actual cliff side that Dickerson chose solely for the
real background shot it provided the scene. This required a
fake tree trunk to be constructed, along with a fake
cliff side that iced Tea and the Hunters would eventually
cross two.

Speaker 3 (02:30:59):
Wow, well it's gorgeous. The whole movie is so gorgeous.

Speaker 1 (02:31:02):
Oh yeah. Dickerson's first time working with green screen occurred
in the scene where McNamara's meets his demise. While McNamara
did the stunt himself, the green screen was used below
him to simulate the high fall his character experience to
the ground. Ah, Very Hans Gruber as Very hanscrew Usk.
While Dickerson still has disappointment with the final product, he
credits Surviving the Game as the film that scored him
demon night, as he brought in producers Gil Adler and

(02:31:23):
Al Katz check out the film upon completing the sound mix.
Dickerson also says he's tickled every time he needs a
fan who brings up their love for the film, as
it's clear it has a larger fan base than expected,
one of which is Snoop Dogg.

Speaker 3 (02:31:34):
I mean that movie kicks ass. Oh, this movie kicks ass.
That's all that's all there is to it, Dickerson.

Speaker 1 (02:31:39):
Dickerson credits many of the gun choices, stealth moves and
execution tactics, and more to a technical advisor on the film,
he simply named Bob, who was a retired seal with
combat experience. The first meeting occurred as Bob recommended that
the rifle Howard's character use by inviting Dickerson out to
and his assistant out to his car, where he produced
a bag of guns, pulling out the rifle that would
eventually agree for his character. And Lastly, Dickerson's own mother

(02:32:03):
has a cameo in the film as the woman with
the bloody nose and the taxi when the dog gets
run over at the beginning. I love that. I love that.
That's his mom. That makes me. That makes me happy.
What are your final thoughts on surviving the game? Look?

Speaker 3 (02:32:15):
Uh, own it and fuck yourself if you don't agree. Yeah,
it's a it's a it's a nineties time capsule, but
it's a it's a time capsule of really great things. Yes,
the actors are all at their peak of everything. I mean,
everybody is so fucking good. Yeah, And I really do
think that, you know, this was very early in ic

(02:32:36):
tving in movies. I think that working with those actors
may elevated him. I think that being able to bounce
off of people like Rudger Howard and John C. McGinley,
all these people, I think it made him better. Yeah,
and I just I I have so much fucking hederation
for how fun this movie is and how much it
has to say, even with all of the you know,

(02:32:57):
the drawbacks they had to deal with.

Speaker 1 (02:32:59):
Yeah, it's an otif me as well. I think it's
simply one of the best adaptations of the Most Dangerous Game,
next to the nineteen thirty four movie, which I do
also recommend. But this is a time capsule, like you said,
of the nineties. It has a lot of great action,
it's under ninety five minutes and you're in and out.

Speaker 3 (02:33:13):
I mean it even takes place near the birth of grunge. Yeah,
you know, Seattle. It's it's a movie that really hits
nineties and nineties was just starting really because you know,
the decades don't really end where they end on the calendar. Yeah,
it's everything that was great about the nineties mentality in

(02:33:34):
a classic story.

Speaker 1 (02:33:35):
Yeah, I mean, there's really no reason not to own it.
With that Blu Ray release now too, it's gorgeous, it's amazing.
So we als like in the show with a couple
of recommendations. The first one I have this week is
nineteen ninety two's Death Ring, currently available on Roku and
rentable on Prime and Fandango. When X Special Forces Agent
Matt Collins wins the Survivalist competition, he becomes the toughest
man alive, perfect fodder for perverse millionaire Donald Box, who

(02:33:58):
is an annual manhunt attracts the most vicious killers. And
if you need more reason to here's just here's just
a few names. We have Norris, Billy Drego, McQueen, don
Swayzey because that's Mike Norris, Chad McQueen, don Swayzey, along
with Billy.

Speaker 3 (02:34:14):
Draco golf clapping on that solid, solid one.

Speaker 1 (02:34:17):
And the next one I'm gonna do is nineteen eighty
six is Avenging Force, currently on Prime Video, MGM plus
and two by A Senator is targeted by the Pentangle,
a right wing paramilitary group. His pow, former CIA agent
Martial Artist, tries to help him. The group kidnaps the
agent's sister and tries to hunt him down. Most dangerous
game style Michael Dudokof's one of his best movies. Avenging

(02:34:38):
Force cannot recommend this movie enough. It is insane and
also child peril to a t Yeah, what's your recommend ding?

Speaker 3 (02:34:45):
So I decided not to go most dangerous gameways and
I decided to go ic tea ways instead, and also
rectify by saying below you told me a non kick.

Speaker 1 (02:34:56):
No, I'm gonna go with it.

Speaker 3 (02:34:58):
We've mentioned a few times before, but nineteen eighty two Trespasses,
because that is another great nineties I mean, you got
Bill Paxton iced Tea, Bill Sadler ice Cube. It's a
great film. And it's also a retelling of the Treasure
of Tiera Madra That's True, which is a great story
as well, about people who are out of place, out
of the place they know and hoping to get rich,

(02:35:20):
but they don't really understand where they're at. This is
the Rundown from IMDb. Two firemen in a burning building
get a treasure map. Stolen gold Church items are hidden
in a closed down factory in Saint Louis. Once they're
they're trapped in by a black gang considering it their territory.
Yes they do, and it's a great film. It's dorcted
by Walter Hill. It's written by Bob Gail and Robert Zemeckis,

(02:35:41):
the team who brought you Back to the Future and
Well and tailsorm crypt Demon Night, of course, so I
can't recommend Trespass enough. It is available right now only
to rent on Prime Video, but it is totally worth
the four dollars.

Speaker 1 (02:35:54):
It also has one of the best performances by r Evans,
the guy from Diehard to Yeah Fright Night. He's so good.

Speaker 3 (02:36:00):
No, it's a phenomenal film.

Speaker 1 (02:36:01):
So do we have any emails this week? Last I checked?

Speaker 3 (02:36:04):
No, but let me check one more time before we
call it a night.

Speaker 1 (02:36:07):
All right, No, nobody full.

Speaker 3 (02:36:11):
But if you guys want to email us, you can
at do you even movie pod at gmail dot com? Yes,
or you can go to dooevenmovie dot com and send
us an email through there. We'd love to hear from
you recommendations, suggestions, critiques. But if one of them is
like I didn't really like surviving the game, just cut
off the middleman and stick the email so far up
your ass you can taste.

Speaker 1 (02:36:31):
It fair enough. Would you like to know, since this
is us wrapping up June, would you like to know
what we are doing as we kick off July next week. Well,
I mean sure, okay, so as I'm sure some of
you know, there is a big film anniversary coming up.
Its celebrating fifty years next week. Actually, so by the
time you're hearing this, it's actually going to be turning

(02:36:52):
fifty this week, and that is Jaws. So naturally we
are going to be covering nineteen eighty seven's Jaws the Revenge.

Speaker 3 (02:37:00):
The best Jaws movie in my opinion for sheer entertainment value,
and another that has so much history with me as
a kid because I taped that off of HBO. Oh yeah,
and uh it's actually was the opening is really scary,
it used to be until we you know, frame by frame, Well,

(02:37:22):
well yeah, it's not as bad as the beginning, I'm sorry,
is the scary? Oh well yeah yeah, but if you
frame by frame that it's not read not that great either.
This is a movie that if you dissect it, it's
like it's like an onion. There's just more and more
layers to go. So expect that one to be four
and a half hours of us talking about Jaws the Revenge.

Speaker 1 (02:37:39):
Also Christmas in July. Technically, yeah, The Revenge. The reves
The Jaws the Revenge currently available on Peacock along with
all of the Jaws movies and sequels right now, also
rentable on Prime and Fandango. It did just get a
Blu Ray release as well as a four K So
if you are a masochist, there you go. Hey. But yes,
we're gonna be talking about Jaws the Revenge next week

(02:38:00):
on the show. I cannot wait.

Speaker 3 (02:38:02):
You thought I was passionate on this episode, Just wait
till we're talking about hot, sexy love after steel work.

Speaker 1 (02:38:08):
Oh yeah, this is gonna be kicking off our our
July theme of Life's of Beach, So all of our
movies for the month of July are going to have
beach tie ends along with them. Oh hell yes, so
that is going to be next week.

Speaker 3 (02:38:20):
Yes it will. So make sure you're subscribed on your
favorite podcasting app or on YouTube, because if you Missjaws
the Revenge, I mean, at that point, I don't even
think you're an adult anymore.

Speaker 1 (02:38:31):
I can't believe we're doing this. I'm so exciting. I'm
so fucking ready. I'm so ready for Jaws the Revenge.
So that is gonna do it for us. This week
on the show.

Speaker 3 (02:38:40):
Yeah, we're gonna we were gonna talk about Ciskel and
Ebert a little bit. But you know what, since they
didn't love it, they can well they're both dead.

Speaker 1 (02:38:47):
I mean, Ciscle like that Roger was the one that
had bad beef with it. But yeah, you can find
you can find the clip. The full episode is on
is on YouTube, so we had to chop into it.
But yeah, but yeah, check that out because it's definitely
worth it.

Speaker 3 (02:38:57):
That's bizarre that Ciscle like, because Ebert, I do like
how Ebert's like I wrote, you know, frigging for russ Meyer.
But but this is a little too, a little too
low low brow for me.

Speaker 1 (02:39:07):
He satable.

Speaker 3 (02:39:10):
It's based on a freaking Yeah, I'm so sorry they
didn't kill the black guy like you wanted.

Speaker 1 (02:39:15):
Ebert.

Speaker 3 (02:39:18):
No, I mean, I Roger Ebert. I mean, I hope
nobody ever comes at me for my forty year old opinions.
And there's something year old opinions about movies. But yeah,
so it just cuts to somebody doing a video podcast,
you know, and like three D via VR, and they're like, well,
let's see what those two chuckle focks in Ohio thought
about this movie. Wow, you hope hope they're dead? Oh wait,

(02:39:39):
they are, they are, and then it just cuts to
our graves like like they fade up like him back
to the future too, but we've.

Speaker 1 (02:39:45):
Been buried like the dog in The Homeless Man at
the beginning.

Speaker 3 (02:39:47):
Oh yeah, yeah, I hope somebody digs that deep when
I'm dead and people are judging my mood Jesus. So
I guess all that's left to say as we head
out is a Again, remember subscribing your favorite podcasting app
if you're listening, and leave us a five star rating
on Spotify or Apple Podcasts. If you're watching us on YouTube,
please make sure you're subscribed so you don't miss the

(02:40:09):
next episode, and leave us a comment on Spotify or YouTube.
We always respond to them, or at least I do
at the very least email us. Do you the movie
pod at gmail dot com. So, I guess all that's
really left to say is see you next, hon The Revenge.
It's so dangerous that you want us to do your

(02:40:29):
Jaws the Revenge.

Speaker 1 (02:40:31):
We're gonna lose everybody and I'll be happy with that
and we'll see what happens.

Speaker 3 (02:40:34):
The best Jaws movie ever made, Next Week Kids

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Surviving the Game (1994) – Ice-T vs Human Hunters in a 90s Action Classic

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Surviving the Game (1994) – Ice-T vs Human Hunters in a 90s Action Classic