August 12, 2021 • 36 mins
In order to heal from the wounds or wrongdoings of our past they need to be brought up from the basement to the surface where they can be seen and faced head on. Even if the process is painful. This is not done to point fingers, place blame or drag others into the darkness with us. Rather it is so we can look at the experience no matter how painful it may be and move through it in order to be released from the pain
Join Paul and me in this episode of “Get Real”, as we address topics such as, how to connect to our divine truth, the role of fear in life and making choices on how our life unfolds prior to our incarnation.
Dr Friedemann’s Takeaways:
Meet Paul Selig (00:00)
The Action Of The Creator (4:39)
Personality Structure (8:32)
Humanity Is At A Juncture (14:02)
The Action Of Fear (16:48)
I Don’t Get A Free Pass (20:49)
Grateful For The Path (23:34)
One Room Schoolhouse (28:50)
Meet Paul:
Paul Selig is considered to be one of the foremost spiritual channels working today. In his breakthrough works of channeled literature — I Am the Word, The Book of Love and Creation, The Book of Knowing and Worth, The Book of Mastery, The Book of Truth, The Book of Freedom, and the Beyond the Known Trilogy: Realization, Alchemy, and The Kingdom (see books page) — author and medium Paul Selig has recorded an extraordinary program for personal and planetary evolution as humankind awakens to its own divine nature.
Meet Dr Friedemann
Friedemann Schaub, MD, PhD, is the award-winning author of The Fear + Anxiety Solution. Dr. Schaub has helped thousands of people with his Personal Breakthrough and Empowerment program to overcome their fear and anxiety by addressing the deeper, subconscious root causes of these emotional challenges.
Learn more at: https://DrFriedemann.com
FACEBOOK: https://www.facebook.com//DrFriedemann
INSTAGRAM: https://www.instagram.com/dr.friedemannschaub
PINTEREST: https://www.pinterest.com/drfriedemann
TWITTER: https://www.twitter.com/DrFriedemannS
LINKEDIN: https://www.linkedin.com/in/drfriedemannschaub/
Are you looking for more from Dr Friedemann? Check out his “Your Accelerated Breakthrough Program” https://drfriedemann.com/breakthrough-program/.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Unknown (00:09):
Well,
Paul, it's so nice to see youand in your new environment new
your new home in Maui. So I'mreally happy for you to show his
greener pastures. How have youbeen doing?
You know, I've been good. Imean, it's been a crazy year.
And it was a crazy year foreverybody. You know, I was
(00:30):
working in Costa Rica doing aretreat when New York City went
into lockdown last March. And Iended up on Maui by just because
I had a friend who said, Here isa place you can stay and I ended
up loving it here. And now Ilive here. So it was an
interesting year of great.
Wow, that's quitetransformational and changing I
(00:53):
can imagine. Now, you also justpublished the third book of your
beyond the known trilogy, and Ilove them all. But to keep our
listeners up to speed, can you Idon't know if it's possible.
summarize the first two booksbefore we delve into the
(01:16):
kingdom.
I'll try. I think the kingdom isreleased in August, I just did
the audio book. So I just readit through when I was in the
booth, because when I'mchanneling the books, I retain
maybe a third of theinformation. But the first book
of the trilogy was calledrealization. And it was really
(01:38):
the teaching of what the guidescall the upper room, which they
say is a level of consciousnessthat is coexistent to ours, or a
level of vibration that we canalign to. So they're giving us
the instructions on aligning tothe upper room. The second book
was alchemy. And that really isthe Book about lifting things to
(02:02):
the upper room and releasing thethings within us that stop us
from aligning to that level ofvibration or consciousness or as
they like to say, agreement. Andit's really a book about I
think, why we keep going up anddown this spectrum of, of
(02:23):
emotional reality, you know, andnot to judge that. But they say,
Well, if you want to stay in theupper room, there are ways to do
it. And here's the work of doingthat. The kingdom, which is the
third book is really about abinding there, I think and
beginning to align to what theycall the kingdom and they say
the kingdom is the realizationof the inherent divine in all
(02:47):
manifestation. And you know, inall of these books, there have
been these attunements, orclaims that they build on. And
that's been the truth with allthe books that preceded them.
But one of the things they'vebeen saying somewhat incessantly
for a wireless that humanity'sonly real problem is what they
(03:07):
call our denial of the Divine.And that's not about religion,
but they say that denial of thesource of all things, which is
the source of everything theysay, and different levels of, of
tone, or vibration, or, or chordor articulation is their word.
So they're really working withthat now how to move us beyond
(03:30):
what they call the denial of theDivine, to a realization of the
inherent divine, which they sayis in all things.
Now, a lot of people have somebad experiences with religion,
and also with the word God. AndGod was certainly mentioned in
your book, and I think youprobably are one of them. We're
(03:53):
not so religiously attuned inthe past. So how do you see God
differently than the bearded manon the cloud?
You know, I don't know that Ibrought this down. Truthfully. I
mean, I'm, I'm I'm the channel Itake dictation. But what they've
said is, there is one note, orone tone being played in the
(04:18):
entire universe, which they callGod, they say that's the
infrastructure of everythingseen or imagined. And that that
one tone they say is anarticulation or manifestation is
all things. So the substance ofall things is this one sound,
this one tone, they call it theword sometimes. And they say the
(04:40):
word is the action of theCreator. So you know, when they
say things like and when it'sone of the attunements in the
book God is God is God is it'sthe remembrance of the one
source they've never talkedabout an old man on the cloud. I
mean, I was raised an atheist,you know, and My mom would say
(05:01):
an agnostic, maybe that's moretrue. But I was raised to
believe that this stuff was forstupid people. And that was a
very comfortable place for me torest in until a series of events
happened that, you know, beganto open me up to the possibility
of something much more. So I'mnot uncomfortable with the idea.
(05:21):
I think in some ways, you know,you can people can say, the
universe and God, you know, youknow, God is the universe, and
it only matters what you callit, you know. But in some ways,
I think what the guides are alsodoing is reclaiming language
that I think has beenmisappropriated by religion, and
sort of bring it into a placethat I hope is experiential, for
(05:46):
the reader, because the booksare really energetic
transmissions that work with thereader, they're less
intellectual exercises, inpossibilities, then, a way of
sort of tapping in andexperiencing this, I think, if
that hadn't been the case, Iwould have stopped channeling
this time ago.
(06:07):
Now I can imagine that thissound of the Divine is in the
teachings because there is aenergetic transmission that
happens. I mean, you just read apage. And something, even if you
don't really comprehend all thewords, something just changes
inside, which is one of thefascinating things about your
(06:27):
books. But one thing I'mwondering is, you know, the
upper room and the kingdom arethe same. Do I understand this
right, or?
i? Well, I think I think thekingdom is, is is moved into
through the upper room, theupper room is I have the guide
say this, they say everythingexists in octaves, you know, our
(06:52):
reality is an octave high loadsand low notes, everything they
say is tone. And they say theupper room is the octave above
the one that we've beenoperating in. And so the upper
room, Mr. Shift a level ofvibration and consciousness to
be able to align there. But theysay the upper room is also vast.
(07:14):
So I think that the upperthey've used I think, a couple
of times, the ideasinterchangeably, but I think the
kingdom is far more theexperience of the upper room. So
I think that there's adifference, perhaps between
getting off the elevator, the10th floor, and walking in the
vestibule and say, Hey, wow,this is the 10th floor, look out
(07:36):
the window, it's beautiful, thenreally experiencing yourself at
that level of consciousness.
So the kingdom is living throughthe consciousness of the upper
room? Where does the ego come inthere? Because a lot of people
are struggling, especially rightnow with that part of them?
(07:57):
Well, I
am I mean, I think we all are.The guides say they don't talk
about ego much, I think they'veused the word like three times
in their books, but they do talkabout the personality structure.
And the personality structure iswho we think we are. And the
personality structure they sayknows itself in history. That's
(08:17):
all I can know, you know, whatit's been told, what it's been
experienced, what one shouldaspire to, you know, so, so much
of what we think we are what wewant or should want or born out
of this collective structure.And this is all sort of that
tethering to the lower octave,this is the stuff that exists
there. So, when they speak aboutmoving to the upper room, they
(08:41):
talked about, you know, I mean,they do this through a series of
attunements. But, you know, oneof the claims is I am free, I am
free, I am free, and that theysay is spoken by the true self,
not the personality self, theattunements are all spoken at
the level of they say the mon ador the Christ itself or the true
self. Because they say the trueself is always free, in only Oh
(09:06):
itself is less hence the trueself that really is what
expresses in what they call theupper room. So they say that the
personality self is appropriatedthere. It's you know, it's it's
absorbed there. There's a needfor it. If you still like your
coffee, black, you like yourcoffee, black, if you Prefer
Blondes to Burnett's that toyou, you know you can have what
(09:27):
you want. You're not saying wedon't have that, but I do think
we stop experiencing ourselvesas the personality structure,
which is finite, you know, weunderstand it. It's a part of
who we are, but it's not theexpression. So it's kind of like
(09:48):
what they would say and theysaid this, I think it was in
alchemy. You know, we've been ina masquerade and we've mistaken
who we are for the mask we'veworn and they say the masks are
Coming off now, and most ofthat's frightening to everybody,
you know, whether it's happeningat the level of personality or
the level of the collective, youknow, things aren't what they we
(10:10):
thought they were. And so we'rehaving to go through this
experience of releasing themask. And that's a lot of what
the guides are teaching is howthat happens and how to how to
work with it. I don't find it acomfortable process in the least
I wish my guides someday werewriting happy self help books on
how to better apartment orsomething like that, but that's
(10:31):
not what they teach. And I'malong for the ride with this.
You know, I don't I have thisnew book due in November 1. I
had they haven't started thedictation yet. I haven't been
given a title. I know nothing.I'm just saying where I hope to
God, you know, it's happenednine times, I guess it will
happen again, you know, notwould that they'll deliberate.
What's next? Because they hearwe are mind for them.
(10:56):
So what do you finduncomfortable about this
process?
Well, I mean, what the guideshave said is, you know, if
you've got a body buried in thebasement, eventually it's going
to stink up the whole house. Andwe all have parts of ourselves
we prefer not to look at or notto be in confrontation with. And
(11:18):
you know, very simple teachingof the guides is what your damn
dams your back, or who you whoyou put in darkness calls you to
the darkness. And what I thinkwe're having to deal with now
are both of those things, theparts of ourselves that we've
denied, because we have to bringthose parts of ourselves to the
light, or to God or whatever youwant to call it, because that's
(11:40):
how it's healed. And also withinour world. Now, I think people
get confused here. And I thinkit's about dredging stuff up to
point fingers and to blame. AndI think, you know, really,
nothing gets healed until it'sfirst seen, you don't get to
bypass this stuff. You don't getto say, Well, it wasn't so bad.
When I was a kid, maybe it wasreally awful. And that's it, no,
(12:03):
in order to move beyond it, notto get stuck there and not to
drag everybody into the darkwith you with your, your pain.
But I think this is the process.And it was very much the process
of the book of alchemy, and Iwent through it as they were
teaching it. And it's not thatit's over. I suspect this stuff
(12:24):
happens in layers. But I thinkwhat we're going through
individually as people is alsosort of being out pictured in
the hole, I think we can see itin the world, too, you know,
and, you know, it's, it's anopportunity, I think everything
is an opportunity. And then theguides keep stressing this, if
(12:45):
we begin to perceive everythingas opportunity, we can work with
it. Well, if we shift intovictimhood, we don't work with
it very well, we go back intothe old bias and paradigm of
separation, which is how we wereraised, and in fact, sort of
indoctrinated to believe thatwe're separate from one another.
(13:05):
And consequently, the guidesays, you know, we bought that
lie so fully, that we'reseparate from each other, that
we believe ourselves to beseparate from sources as well,
which they say is can never betrue, can be our experience. But
that doesn't make it true.
But this has been going on sincethe existence of human mankind,
or just in the last 2000 years.
(13:27):
I don't know. I mean, they'vesaid that their teaching is
older than what we know. Andit's always been present in
different forms. And that theseed of the teaching can be
found in all religions. And youknow, I don't know if that's
true or not, and it's what theysay. But what they're saying is
that humanity is at a juncturein the very first book, which
(13:50):
was called I Am the word, whichwas dictated in 2009. They said,
humanity is at a time ofreckoning, and a reckoning is a
facing of oneself and all ofone's creations. And everything
that's been created in fearneeds to be re known or
recreated in a higher way. Andthat that's what we're going
through now. And it's what we'vebeen blocked, when we will
(14:12):
continue to go through it. And,you know, I understand this is
how we are preserving humanityby going through this process,
because we really can't continueon the trajectory that we've
been on. without, you know,probably self annihilation. You
know, we build bombs that arebig enough to do that. And, you
know, the guides have said, theidea that you can build bombs,
(14:35):
so that you can feel safe isinsane, because bombs are
actually meant to go off. Imean, that's the purpose of
them. And if you think that oneday, that doesn't happen, you're
probably you know, not tellingyourself the truth.
I mean, not only bombs, but alsoguns, for sure. But one of those
things that I find sochallenging right now is people
(14:59):
ending cluding myself iscertainly this, you know, this
temptation to go into fear orcontrol? You know, there are
these two temptations that youwant to control all your
circumstances because you onlytrust yourself. And if you can,
then you go into fear place. Oneof the guys saying about it
that,
(15:20):
I don't know. I mean, I knowit's early in the morning where
I am now I'm on my first cup ofcoffee, I know if I'm gonna
channel for you in this on thisbroadcast. But what what the
guides say about beneath I'mgoing to ask anything, you want
to decide what's right for you.And you do it at the level of
personality, which gives you theanswers that you have 65 and the
(15:42):
personalities seeks to surviveat the cost of all other things
at the cost of all other things.It doesn't understand the self
as a turtle, no one's brother isoneself nor no one's brother as
one self, which is in fact ahigher truth, which is in fact,
a higher truth. Higher theability to move to the higher
self in a way to know the selfin a new way as prescribed, is
(16:05):
prescribed, instructed andinstructed in and available to
all of you and available to allof you should you wish or should
you wish to. We don't tellpeople what to do we open door
that no authorization, we open adoor that they may walk through
if they wish or choice, yourchoice. Either I'm in control or
unconscious behind. Either I'min control or going to be harmed
(16:28):
as a template if fear is atemplate of fear and the action
of fear. And the action of fearis and always has been is and
always has been to claim morefear, to claim more fear, any
choice, you're making fear. Anychoice you make. And fear costs
more for you to cause more fearto you're actually aligning,
you're actually aligning to acurrent vibration to a current
(16:49):
of vibration that is thephenomenon that is the denial of
the Divine. That is what fear isthat is what fear is we are
teaching realization, we areteaching you realization to know
who you are to know who you arein the face of change in the
face of change and beyondcircumstances, power to and be
on circumstances that you wouldgive great power to period. Just
(17:11):
sit period.
Makes a lot of sense. Thank you.But you certainly also talk with
the guides talk a lot about loveis the way to the upper room, if
no choice.
Yeah, but you know, they don'ttalk about love as much as I
(17:32):
would think they would. I mean,it's certainly the books. But
they do talk about acceptance.And they say, you know, it's
like they said, Who you put indarkness, what you put in
darkness calls you to thedarkness. So they are teaching
about forgiveness andforgiveness not in Well, that
didn't really matter. It wasokay, you can punch me in the
(17:55):
nose again, if you want to, butin an awareness of how people
act in fear and in a belief inseparation. And so you know,
there's an exercise in one ofthe older books book of mastery,
where they had people go into acave, and in that cave was the
one person they never wanted tosee again. And the exercise was
(18:18):
to walk that person out of thecave and right. And the guides
explained it that said you'rethe one that put them in
darkness and they call you tothat darkness. So if you want to
release yourself, you have torelease them. It's not about
pandering to some idea of beingsanctimonious or forgiving. We
do these things so that we'reuntied from so that we're not
(18:41):
you know, kept in fear, orwhatever you want to call it.
Those that is love. So no justsaid yes. MacKillop. It's an act
of love to divine to reconcilethe divine where the divine has
been ignored, ignored, period,period.
(19:02):
Do you feel that you theteachings have brought you to a
completely different place? Imean, you are I know 30% you
only retained but then you'recertainly going back to the
teachings hasn't changed you.
Yeah, you know, but I don't feelthat I'm if there isn't there.
(19:23):
I'm not gonna say that I'm therethere. But yeah, absolutely. It
has. I'm living in anextraordinarily different life
than I would have ever imaginedI would be living. I was a
college teacher for 25 years.And I assumed I would do that
until I was too old to do that.I'm not a spiritual teacher. I'm
certainly not a guru. I'm a manwho sits in a chair and operates
(19:49):
as a radio and I do this when Iwork as a channel and I do this
when I work as a psychic. Youknow, I am a medium for the
living. So I can't tell you whatyou're good at and claris thing
But if Claire is living in thenext town and you haven't spoken
in two years, I can probablyhear her pretty well and give
you very accurate information.And so that's my audibility. And
(20:12):
I show up for that. But becauseI show up for this, and I show
up for this often when I don'twant to, but I'm committed to
the work, I have to go throughit to, so I don't get the free
pass. So if the guides aresaying, Okay, everybody get
ready to deal with some more ofyour crap. I'm there, you know,
(20:35):
probably, and I'm not going tosay I'm at the front of the
line, I may be hiding at theback, but I'm in line to along
with everybody else. I don'tthink that this is it's not feel
good woowoo stuff. This is sortof mysticism, I suspect if it's
anything. And honestly, youknow, when I question and I just
(20:57):
go, Well, you know what, Paul,no matter how articulate you
might be, you can't sit back ina chair with your eyes closed
and dictate nine books thatdon't require any editing at
all, which is with these things,I think they're in an average
book, there may be three wordschange because I mispronounce
them. Or I was talking so fastthat I overstepped and dropped a
(21:22):
word because you can hear itbecause I whisper in repeats, we
can usually catch them. And thenmore. So wonderful.
transcriptionist has gotten veryadept at that. But that's been
the agreement. And I've beenfortunate to work with
publishers who've agreed tothat, you know, we don't go back
and change things. It's scaryfor me with every book because I
(21:42):
know when I'm in a dictationsession, that's what it's going
to be in the world. I don't getto go back and say, let's just
trim that paragraph or take outthat word, which can't do it.
Okay, now, the guides might say,and this is not in the book, and
then I go, Oh, thank God. Butyou know, the last book, The
kingdom was dictated because Idone maybe the last five books
(22:06):
in front of live audiences, youknow, all of it was done, either
online in front of audiences,mostly in workshops. And because
of COVID, and everybody beinglocked down, the last book was
dictated to some of it online inworkshops, but most of it to a
small group that assembled to bewitness to the teachings because
I can't channel without somebodylistening. I won't do it. First
(22:29):
Book, that was channeled withoutmy having the ability to work
with the attunements in a publicsetting, so that I understood
them personally, myself, whichgives me comfort, I don't think
it makes a difference in thedictation at all. So anyway,
that's that. So has it changedme? Yeah, I'm still doing that.
But I mean, you probably have agood idea of what it is, you
(22:54):
know, to be in the upper room,when you spend probably some
time there,
when I'm channeling Sure. I'vehad periods of it here. I did
not get into this kind of stuff.Because things were so rosy. You
(23:16):
know, I'm not one of thosepeople. And, you know, I am very
grateful for the path that hasled me here don't question that.
I don't I accept that fully.But, you know, like everybody
else, I've got my stuff. And mychallenges. And the more I work
(23:37):
with the guides, teaching us toattend to them, the better off I
am. You know, and I'm oftenresistant to doing that. But I
know that it works when I do it.So pretty. So they chose you for
a reason. I'm sure. I see. Yeah.I mean, they've talked some
about that, or I asked, youknow, I think there was a bit of
both happening here. forwhatever reasons, I seem to be
(24:00):
sort of built for this adeptwhere this you know, if I was
six foot five, maybe I'd beadept at being a basketball
player, you know, but this issort of how I seem to be wired.
And I think it's it's a reallyinteresting use of my abilities.
You know, it's not what Ithought I would be doing, you
know, I started opening upspiritually and psychically when
(24:23):
I was 25. And that reallybasically just shattered my
world because it's, you know, Ihad a whole other path that I
expected to be on than the onethat I found myself on. And that
continues to be the case.
But the reason why I'm asking isbecause you as one who gets this
(24:43):
first hand knowledge, probablyknow how to transcend fear, and
how to transcend this small selfbecause you probably have been
vacillating up and down. Manytimes.
Yes and No, but you know, ButI'm radio to think of the Think
of me that like. So when I'mchanneling, I'm just keeping up
(25:08):
with it. I'm keeping up with thedictation it's like reading 1000
fortune cookies, one after theother after the other. Without
even I don't even know what thesentence is going to be I hear
phrase sprays, sprays, sprays,spray, and so I'm just keeping
up. Yeah, I retain about athird, I retain the larger
gestures of the work when Ichannel. But I don't necessarily
(25:32):
or something that's a detailthat was surprising to me. But
I'm most effective when I'mactually just taking the
dictation and not trying tounderstand or listen, because
then I'm really out of the way,you know, and we're out of the
way I am, the more effective Iam. And the more out of the way
I am, the less that I retain. Sothe first time that I generally
really experience a book is whenI'm sitting and doing the audio
(25:56):
book and I have to read italoud, again, read it aloud from
start to finish. And I go Oh,boy. And that's you know how I'm
taught as well. So I'm taught inthe energy of this, there's no
question. And do I have accessto everything I teach?
Absolutely. But honestly, if youwere the channel, it would be
(26:19):
easier. Because I got, let's seewhat he had to say there. I'm
going to do that, Oh, that'sgreat. I'll do that, you know,
and there's still a little pieceof me always that's who the hell
am I doing this. And, and Iaccept that. And maybe that's
also part of the reason I'mdoing this, I really do not have
(26:39):
an ego investment in this rolethat I'm in, you know, I see
myself. If you ever go like tocourt, you see the stenographer,
you know, typing away in thefront. I'm a stenographer for
this. I don't think they'reterribly grand position to be.
But it's kind of takingdictation mouse.
(27:02):
And that's unfiltered. So youdefinitely don't have any
filters around that. You know,you have in your kingdom book,
one beautiful, I don't know whatyou want to call it, if it's an
agreement, or if it's anaffirmation, but it's basically
when you do feel fear coming up,the guide says, or when the
(27:24):
separation consciousness comingup, a guide says, this choose to
say, on this day, I choose toalign every aspect of my being
to the choices before me thatany choice I may make will be
the alignment with my true self.And I just love that. I mean,
this is just something very,very powerful. And I think the
(27:44):
books are full of these reallysimple but very powerful ways of
shifting the energy raising theoctave.
That's what they do. It's anenergetic fusion, I think far
more so than, than intellectualone.
What would you recommend forpeople and how to start, let's
(28:07):
say they are intrigued by theidea of the true self, the upper
room, the kingdom, but theydon't know how to begin?
Well, I think people go to thebook that calls to them, there's
nine of them. But the guides arevery good teachers. And they say
that they teach in a one roomschoolhouse, and you can enter
(28:27):
the teaching anywhere, and theywill teach you and they do they
say sponsor or mentor, thestudents of their work. So you
know, some people enter it atthe most recent book, it happens
frequently, then they findthemselves going back, some
people go back to the very firstbook time, the word or the first
book of a trilogy, whether it'sthe book of mastery or
(28:50):
realization, because thetrilogies are complete, but you
know, there's a lot ofinformation at this point, there
are 1000s and 1000s and 1000s,of pages of channeling. And I
just trust that people go wherethey're LED.
And there is no one way to getthere, to the upper room, the
(29:10):
kingdom there.
They tell you how to do it. Ifyou want to work with the upper
room, two chains, you can startwith realization, catch the
reader up and out to me and thencatch the waiter repping enemy
kingdom. The basis for all ofthe books in some ways, I think
in the upper room. Thepreparatory work for the upper
(29:31):
room teachings are in the booksthat preceded them. They give it
a teaching that is in sequence.And they I think sometimes the
DNA of all of the books are inthe very first book, and that
they've been unpacking thatteaching about the inherent
divine ever since. But I don'tknow that that's true. And
again, I don't know what's nexteither. I mean, again, there's
(29:53):
another book that should becompleted in a few months. I'm
going oh my god, is this goingto happen?
Well, do we all have a choice togo to the kingdom? Or is that
something that? No, we can alsorefuse? Yeah, we have free will.
They honor free will do what youwant, you know, and they've
(30:16):
never said and they say ifanybody ever tells you, it's my
way of the highway, go go go runin the other direction. I don't
think it works that way. But wehave free will, the guides talk
about the braiding of the willthe will of the personality,
self, and Divine Will, and thatthey begin to operate in union
or unison. And then at thatlevel, you begin to move into
(30:38):
what they call knowing or youknow, clear cognizance, you're
just, you're just operating fromknowing you're not trying to
figure it out anymore. Becauseyour choices are made just like
that, quote, that you. In thebook, your choices are made at
that level of awareness. We havechoice, yes. And there are
consequences for the choices.All of us no choice.
(31:03):
But I mean, also choosing tostay with a personality self as
a consequence of possiblygreater suffering.
You're going to learn for thepersonality self, it's what's
here for it's nothing wrong withit. It's not something
necessarily to be overcome, Idon't think I just think the
problem has been that we'veconfused it with who we really
are. But you know, you can learnthat fire is dangerous by
(31:29):
putting your hand in it. But youdon't. You don't have to learn
that way. You understand? Yeah.So we have choice. And we can
learn however, we wish. I dotrust at this point. And it's
not always easy. That, you know,the circumstances that I have in
(31:49):
my life are what are here toteach me. It's really that
simple. You know, it's like it'sall opportunity, if I'm willing
to look at it that way.
And are the guides just as afinal question, are the guides,
hopeful for humanity or theneutral regards,
I've been finding them prettyhelpful. They've actually said
(32:10):
humanity's made a choice. Andthis is going to that's the
Collective Soul of humanity,that collective humanity. And a
higher level is said yes, toprogressing forward. And that
some of what we're dealing withnow is how we have to do that.
They need to be sort of unmadeor racing in order to be made
(32:33):
new. And that's a lot of theirteaching, how things are made
new, racing rearticulated inwhat they call the upper room,
or the higher octave.
And that also has probably todo, how we deal with nature,
animals,
those things, were responsiblefor what we create that includes
(32:55):
physical planet that we're instewardship of and seem to not
do a very good job ofstewarding.
So the challenge right now, formost of us is just keeping
forward moving forward with thischoice and not getting pulled
into the darkness by beingrighteous or angry or any of
those things
where say self righteousness isalways the small self for the
(33:17):
personality structure. You know,it's it's a convenient trap, and
I fall into it, but I'm prettygood at catching myself when I
do it because it gets more andmore uncomfortable when I
Well, thank you so much, Paul,for this enlightening hour
again, or half an hour. And Iwish you all the best for this
(33:38):
new book and the book inNovember that it all comes
through as it needs to be and Iappreciate so much that you are
letting yourself be that vehiclefor all this wisdom to come
through. Thank you. Thank youfor having me. I appreciate it.
All right. Thank you. Goodbye.
Well,
Paul, it's so nice to see youand in your new environment new
your new home in Maui. So I'mreally happy for you to show his
greener pastures. How have youbeen doing?
You know, I've been good. Imean, it's been a crazy year.
And it was a crazy year foreverybody. You know, I was
(00:30):
working in Costa Rica doing aretreat when New York City went
into lockdown last March. And Iended up on Maui by just because
I had a friend who said, Here isa place you can stay and I ended
up loving it here. And now Ilive here. So it was an
interesting year of great.
Wow, that's quitetransformational and changing I
(00:53):
can imagine. Now, you also justpublished the third book of your
beyond the known trilogy, and Ilove them all. But to keep our
listeners up to speed, can you Idon't know if it's possible.
summarize the first two booksbefore we delve into the
(01:16):
kingdom.
I'll try. I think the kingdom isreleased in August, I just did
the audio book. So I just readit through when I was in the
booth, because when I'mchanneling the books, I retain
maybe a third of theinformation. But the first book
of the trilogy was calledrealization. And it was really
(01:38):
the teaching of what the guidescall the upper room, which they
say is a level of consciousnessthat is coexistent to ours, or a
level of vibration that we canalign to. So they're giving us
the instructions on aligning tothe upper room. The second book
was alchemy. And that really isthe Book about lifting things to
(02:02):
the upper room and releasing thethings within us that stop us
from aligning to that level ofvibration or consciousness or as
they like to say, agreement. Andit's really a book about I
think, why we keep going up anddown this spectrum of, of
(02:23):
emotional reality, you know, andnot to judge that. But they say,
Well, if you want to stay in theupper room, there are ways to do
it. And here's the work of doingthat. The kingdom, which is the
third book is really about abinding there, I think and
beginning to align to what theycall the kingdom and they say
the kingdom is the realizationof the inherent divine in all
(02:47):
manifestation. And you know, inall of these books, there have
been these attunements, orclaims that they build on. And
that's been the truth with allthe books that preceded them.
But one of the things they'vebeen saying somewhat incessantly
for a wireless that humanity'sonly real problem is what they
(03:07):
call our denial of the Divine.And that's not about religion,
but they say that denial of thesource of all things, which is
the source of everything theysay, and different levels of, of
tone, or vibration, or, or chordor articulation is their word.
So they're really working withthat now how to move us beyond
(03:30):
what they call the denial of theDivine, to a realization of the
inherent divine, which they sayis in all things.
Now, a lot of people have somebad experiences with religion,
and also with the word God. AndGod was certainly mentioned in
your book, and I think youprobably are one of them. We're
(03:53):
not so religiously attuned inthe past. So how do you see God
differently than the bearded manon the cloud?
You know, I don't know that Ibrought this down. Truthfully. I
mean, I'm, I'm I'm the channel Itake dictation. But what they've
said is, there is one note, orone tone being played in the
(04:18):
entire universe, which they callGod, they say that's the
infrastructure of everythingseen or imagined. And that that
one tone they say is anarticulation or manifestation is
all things. So the substance ofall things is this one sound,
this one tone, they call it theword sometimes. And they say the
(04:40):
word is the action of theCreator. So you know, when they
say things like and when it'sone of the attunements in the
book God is God is God is it'sthe remembrance of the one
source they've never talkedabout an old man on the cloud. I
mean, I was raised an atheist,you know, and My mom would say
(05:01):
an agnostic, maybe that's moretrue. But I was raised to
believe that this stuff was forstupid people. And that was a
very comfortable place for me torest in until a series of events
happened that, you know, beganto open me up to the possibility
of something much more. So I'mnot uncomfortable with the idea.
(05:21):
I think in some ways, you know,you can people can say, the
universe and God, you know, youknow, God is the universe, and
it only matters what you callit, you know. But in some ways,
I think what the guides are alsodoing is reclaiming language
that I think has beenmisappropriated by religion, and
sort of bring it into a placethat I hope is experiential, for
(05:46):
the reader, because the booksare really energetic
transmissions that work with thereader, they're less
intellectual exercises, inpossibilities, then, a way of
sort of tapping in andexperiencing this, I think, if
that hadn't been the case, Iwould have stopped channeling
this time ago.
(06:07):
Now I can imagine that thissound of the Divine is in the
teachings because there is aenergetic transmission that
happens. I mean, you just read apage. And something, even if you
don't really comprehend all thewords, something just changes
inside, which is one of thefascinating things about your
(06:27):
books. But one thing I'mwondering is, you know, the
upper room and the kingdom arethe same. Do I understand this
right, or?
i? Well, I think I think thekingdom is, is is moved into
through the upper room, theupper room is I have the guide
say this, they say everythingexists in octaves, you know, our
(06:52):
reality is an octave high loadsand low notes, everything they
say is tone. And they say theupper room is the octave above
the one that we've beenoperating in. And so the upper
room, Mr. Shift a level ofvibration and consciousness to
be able to align there. But theysay the upper room is also vast.
(07:14):
So I think that the upperthey've used I think, a couple
of times, the ideasinterchangeably, but I think the
kingdom is far more theexperience of the upper room. So
I think that there's adifference, perhaps between
getting off the elevator, the10th floor, and walking in the
vestibule and say, Hey, wow,this is the 10th floor, look out
(07:36):
the window, it's beautiful, thenreally experiencing yourself at
that level of consciousness.
So the kingdom is living throughthe consciousness of the upper
room? Where does the ego come inthere? Because a lot of people
are struggling, especially rightnow with that part of them?
(07:57):
Well, I
am I mean, I think we all are.The guides say they don't talk
about ego much, I think they'veused the word like three times
in their books, but they do talkabout the personality structure.
And the personality structure iswho we think we are. And the
personality structure they sayknows itself in history. That's
(08:17):
all I can know, you know, whatit's been told, what it's been
experienced, what one shouldaspire to, you know, so, so much
of what we think we are what wewant or should want or born out
of this collective structure.And this is all sort of that
tethering to the lower octave,this is the stuff that exists
there. So, when they speak aboutmoving to the upper room, they
(08:41):
talked about, you know, I mean,they do this through a series of
attunements. But, you know, oneof the claims is I am free, I am
free, I am free, and that theysay is spoken by the true self,
not the personality self, theattunements are all spoken at
the level of they say the mon ador the Christ itself or the true
self. Because they say the trueself is always free, in only Oh
(09:06):
itself is less hence the trueself that really is what
expresses in what they call theupper room. So they say that the
personality self is appropriatedthere. It's you know, it's it's
absorbed there. There's a needfor it. If you still like your
coffee, black, you like yourcoffee, black, if you Prefer
Blondes to Burnett's that toyou, you know you can have what
(09:27):
you want. You're not saying wedon't have that, but I do think
we stop experiencing ourselvesas the personality structure,
which is finite, you know, weunderstand it. It's a part of
who we are, but it's not theexpression. So it's kind of like
(09:48):
what they would say and theysaid this, I think it was in
alchemy. You know, we've been ina masquerade and we've mistaken
who we are for the mask we'veworn and they say the masks are
Coming off now, and most ofthat's frightening to everybody,
you know, whether it's happeningat the level of personality or
the level of the collective, youknow, things aren't what they we
(10:10):
thought they were. And so we'rehaving to go through this
experience of releasing themask. And that's a lot of what
the guides are teaching is howthat happens and how to how to
work with it. I don't find it acomfortable process in the least
I wish my guides someday werewriting happy self help books on
how to better apartment orsomething like that, but that's
(10:31):
not what they teach. And I'malong for the ride with this.
You know, I don't I have thisnew book due in November 1. I
had they haven't started thedictation yet. I haven't been
given a title. I know nothing.I'm just saying where I hope to
God, you know, it's happenednine times, I guess it will
happen again, you know, notwould that they'll deliberate.
What's next? Because they hearwe are mind for them.
(10:56):
So what do you finduncomfortable about this
process?
Well, I mean, what the guideshave said is, you know, if
you've got a body buried in thebasement, eventually it's going
to stink up the whole house. Andwe all have parts of ourselves
we prefer not to look at or notto be in confrontation with. And
(11:18):
you know, very simple teachingof the guides is what your damn
dams your back, or who you whoyou put in darkness calls you to
the darkness. And what I thinkwe're having to deal with now
are both of those things, theparts of ourselves that we've
denied, because we have to bringthose parts of ourselves to the
light, or to God or whatever youwant to call it, because that's
(11:40):
how it's healed. And also withinour world. Now, I think people
get confused here. And I thinkit's about dredging stuff up to
point fingers and to blame. AndI think, you know, really,
nothing gets healed until it'sfirst seen, you don't get to
bypass this stuff. You don't getto say, Well, it wasn't so bad.
When I was a kid, maybe it wasreally awful. And that's it, no,
(12:03):
in order to move beyond it, notto get stuck there and not to
drag everybody into the darkwith you with your, your pain.
But I think this is the process.And it was very much the process
of the book of alchemy, and Iwent through it as they were
teaching it. And it's not thatit's over. I suspect this stuff
(12:24):
happens in layers. But I thinkwhat we're going through
individually as people is alsosort of being out pictured in
the hole, I think we can see itin the world, too, you know,
and, you know, it's, it's anopportunity, I think everything
is an opportunity. And then theguides keep stressing this, if
(12:45):
we begin to perceive everythingas opportunity, we can work with
it. Well, if we shift intovictimhood, we don't work with
it very well, we go back intothe old bias and paradigm of
separation, which is how we wereraised, and in fact, sort of
indoctrinated to believe thatwe're separate from one another.
(13:05):
And consequently, the guidesays, you know, we bought that
lie so fully, that we'reseparate from each other, that
we believe ourselves to beseparate from sources as well,
which they say is can never betrue, can be our experience. But
that doesn't make it true.
But this has been going on sincethe existence of human mankind,
or just in the last 2000 years.
(13:27):
I don't know. I mean, they'vesaid that their teaching is
older than what we know. Andit's always been present in
different forms. And that theseed of the teaching can be
found in all religions. And youknow, I don't know if that's
true or not, and it's what theysay. But what they're saying is
that humanity is at a juncturein the very first book, which
(13:50):
was called I Am the word, whichwas dictated in 2009. They said,
humanity is at a time ofreckoning, and a reckoning is a
facing of oneself and all ofone's creations. And everything
that's been created in fearneeds to be re known or
recreated in a higher way. Andthat that's what we're going
through now. And it's what we'vebeen blocked, when we will
(14:12):
continue to go through it. And,you know, I understand this is
how we are preserving humanityby going through this process,
because we really can't continueon the trajectory that we've
been on. without, you know,probably self annihilation. You
know, we build bombs that arebig enough to do that. And, you
know, the guides have said, theidea that you can build bombs,
(14:35):
so that you can feel safe isinsane, because bombs are
actually meant to go off. Imean, that's the purpose of
them. And if you think that oneday, that doesn't happen, you're
probably you know, not tellingyourself the truth.
I mean, not only bombs, but alsoguns, for sure. But one of those
things that I find sochallenging right now is people
(14:59):
ending cluding myself iscertainly this, you know, this
temptation to go into fear orcontrol? You know, there are
these two temptations that youwant to control all your
circumstances because you onlytrust yourself. And if you can,
then you go into fear place. Oneof the guys saying about it
that,
(15:20):
I don't know. I mean, I knowit's early in the morning where
I am now I'm on my first cup ofcoffee, I know if I'm gonna
channel for you in this on thisbroadcast. But what what the
guides say about beneath I'mgoing to ask anything, you want
to decide what's right for you.And you do it at the level of
personality, which gives you theanswers that you have 65 and the
(15:42):
personalities seeks to surviveat the cost of all other things
at the cost of all other things.It doesn't understand the self
as a turtle, no one's brother isoneself nor no one's brother as
one self, which is in fact ahigher truth, which is in fact,
a higher truth. Higher theability to move to the higher
self in a way to know the selfin a new way as prescribed, is
(16:05):
prescribed, instructed andinstructed in and available to
all of you and available to allof you should you wish or should
you wish to. We don't tellpeople what to do we open door
that no authorization, we open adoor that they may walk through
if they wish or choice, yourchoice. Either I'm in control or
unconscious behind. Either I'min control or going to be harmed
(16:28):
as a template if fear is atemplate of fear and the action
of fear. And the action of fearis and always has been is and
always has been to claim morefear, to claim more fear, any
choice, you're making fear. Anychoice you make. And fear costs
more for you to cause more fearto you're actually aligning,
you're actually aligning to acurrent vibration to a current
(16:49):
of vibration that is thephenomenon that is the denial of
the Divine. That is what fear isthat is what fear is we are
teaching realization, we areteaching you realization to know
who you are to know who you arein the face of change in the
face of change and beyondcircumstances, power to and be
on circumstances that you wouldgive great power to period. Just
(17:11):
sit period.
Makes a lot of sense. Thank you.But you certainly also talk with
the guides talk a lot about loveis the way to the upper room, if
no choice.
Yeah, but you know, they don'ttalk about love as much as I
(17:32):
would think they would. I mean,it's certainly the books. But
they do talk about acceptance.And they say, you know, it's
like they said, Who you put indarkness, what you put in
darkness calls you to thedarkness. So they are teaching
about forgiveness andforgiveness not in Well, that
didn't really matter. It wasokay, you can punch me in the
(17:55):
nose again, if you want to, butin an awareness of how people
act in fear and in a belief inseparation. And so you know,
there's an exercise in one ofthe older books book of mastery,
where they had people go into acave, and in that cave was the
one person they never wanted tosee again. And the exercise was
(18:18):
to walk that person out of thecave and right. And the guides
explained it that said you'rethe one that put them in
darkness and they call you tothat darkness. So if you want to
release yourself, you have torelease them. It's not about
pandering to some idea of beingsanctimonious or forgiving. We
do these things so that we'reuntied from so that we're not
(18:41):
you know, kept in fear, orwhatever you want to call it.
Those that is love. So no justsaid yes. MacKillop. It's an act
of love to divine to reconcilethe divine where the divine has
been ignored, ignored, period,period.
(19:02):
Do you feel that you theteachings have brought you to a
completely different place? Imean, you are I know 30% you
only retained but then you'recertainly going back to the
teachings hasn't changed you.
Yeah, you know, but I don't feelthat I'm if there isn't there.
(19:23):
I'm not gonna say that I'm therethere. But yeah, absolutely. It
has. I'm living in anextraordinarily different life
than I would have ever imaginedI would be living. I was a
college teacher for 25 years.And I assumed I would do that
until I was too old to do that.I'm not a spiritual teacher. I'm
certainly not a guru. I'm a manwho sits in a chair and operates
(19:49):
as a radio and I do this when Iwork as a channel and I do this
when I work as a psychic. Youknow, I am a medium for the
living. So I can't tell you whatyou're good at and claris thing
But if Claire is living in thenext town and you haven't spoken
in two years, I can probablyhear her pretty well and give
you very accurate information.And so that's my audibility. And
(20:12):
I show up for that. But becauseI show up for this, and I show
up for this often when I don'twant to, but I'm committed to
the work, I have to go throughit to, so I don't get the free
pass. So if the guides aresaying, Okay, everybody get
ready to deal with some more ofyour crap. I'm there, you know,
(20:35):
probably, and I'm not going tosay I'm at the front of the
line, I may be hiding at theback, but I'm in line to along
with everybody else. I don'tthink that this is it's not feel
good woowoo stuff. This is sortof mysticism, I suspect if it's
anything. And honestly, youknow, when I question and I just
(20:57):
go, Well, you know what, Paul,no matter how articulate you
might be, you can't sit back ina chair with your eyes closed
and dictate nine books thatdon't require any editing at
all, which is with these things,I think they're in an average
book, there may be three wordschange because I mispronounce
them. Or I was talking so fastthat I overstepped and dropped a
(21:22):
word because you can hear itbecause I whisper in repeats, we
can usually catch them. And thenmore. So wonderful.
transcriptionist has gotten veryadept at that. But that's been
the agreement. And I've beenfortunate to work with
publishers who've agreed tothat, you know, we don't go back
and change things. It's scaryfor me with every book because I
(21:42):
know when I'm in a dictationsession, that's what it's going
to be in the world. I don't getto go back and say, let's just
trim that paragraph or take outthat word, which can't do it.
Okay, now, the guides might say,and this is not in the book, and
then I go, Oh, thank God. Butyou know, the last book, The
kingdom was dictated because Idone maybe the last five books
(22:06):
in front of live audiences, youknow, all of it was done, either
online in front of audiences,mostly in workshops. And because
of COVID, and everybody beinglocked down, the last book was
dictated to some of it online inworkshops, but most of it to a
small group that assembled to bewitness to the teachings because
I can't channel without somebodylistening. I won't do it. First
(22:29):
Book, that was channeled withoutmy having the ability to work
with the attunements in a publicsetting, so that I understood
them personally, myself, whichgives me comfort, I don't think
it makes a difference in thedictation at all. So anyway,
that's that. So has it changedme? Yeah, I'm still doing that.
But I mean, you probably have agood idea of what it is, you
(22:54):
know, to be in the upper room,when you spend probably some
time there,
when I'm channeling Sure. I'vehad periods of it here. I did
not get into this kind of stuff.Because things were so rosy. You
(23:16):
know, I'm not one of thosepeople. And, you know, I am very
grateful for the path that hasled me here don't question that.
I don't I accept that fully.But, you know, like everybody
else, I've got my stuff. And mychallenges. And the more I work
(23:37):
with the guides, teaching us toattend to them, the better off I
am. You know, and I'm oftenresistant to doing that. But I
know that it works when I do it.So pretty. So they chose you for
a reason. I'm sure. I see. Yeah.I mean, they've talked some
about that, or I asked, youknow, I think there was a bit of
both happening here. forwhatever reasons, I seem to be
(24:00):
sort of built for this adeptwhere this you know, if I was
six foot five, maybe I'd beadept at being a basketball
player, you know, but this issort of how I seem to be wired.
And I think it's it's a reallyinteresting use of my abilities.
You know, it's not what Ithought I would be doing, you
know, I started opening upspiritually and psychically when
(24:23):
I was 25. And that reallybasically just shattered my
world because it's, you know, Ihad a whole other path that I
expected to be on than the onethat I found myself on. And that
continues to be the case.
But the reason why I'm asking isbecause you as one who gets this
(24:43):
first hand knowledge, probablyknow how to transcend fear, and
how to transcend this small selfbecause you probably have been
vacillating up and down. Manytimes.
Yes and No, but you know, ButI'm radio to think of the Think
of me that like. So when I'mchanneling, I'm just keeping up
(25:08):
with it. I'm keeping up with thedictation it's like reading 1000
fortune cookies, one after theother after the other. Without
even I don't even know what thesentence is going to be I hear
phrase sprays, sprays, sprays,spray, and so I'm just keeping
up. Yeah, I retain about athird, I retain the larger
gestures of the work when Ichannel. But I don't necessarily
(25:32):
or something that's a detailthat was surprising to me. But
I'm most effective when I'mactually just taking the
dictation and not trying tounderstand or listen, because
then I'm really out of the way,you know, and we're out of the
way I am, the more effective Iam. And the more out of the way
I am, the less that I retain. Sothe first time that I generally
really experience a book is whenI'm sitting and doing the audio
(25:56):
book and I have to read italoud, again, read it aloud from
start to finish. And I go Oh,boy. And that's you know how I'm
taught as well. So I'm taught inthe energy of this, there's no
question. And do I have accessto everything I teach?
Absolutely. But honestly, if youwere the channel, it would be
(26:19):
easier. Because I got, let's seewhat he had to say there. I'm
going to do that, Oh, that'sgreat. I'll do that, you know,
and there's still a little pieceof me always that's who the hell
am I doing this. And, and Iaccept that. And maybe that's
also part of the reason I'mdoing this, I really do not have
(26:39):
an ego investment in this rolethat I'm in, you know, I see
myself. If you ever go like tocourt, you see the stenographer,
you know, typing away in thefront. I'm a stenographer for
this. I don't think they'reterribly grand position to be.
But it's kind of takingdictation mouse.
(27:02):
And that's unfiltered. So youdefinitely don't have any
filters around that. You know,you have in your kingdom book,
one beautiful, I don't know whatyou want to call it, if it's an
agreement, or if it's anaffirmation, but it's basically
when you do feel fear coming up,the guide says, or when the
(27:24):
separation consciousness comingup, a guide says, this choose to
say, on this day, I choose toalign every aspect of my being
to the choices before me thatany choice I may make will be
the alignment with my true self.And I just love that. I mean,
this is just something very,very powerful. And I think the
(27:44):
books are full of these reallysimple but very powerful ways of
shifting the energy raising theoctave.
That's what they do. It's anenergetic fusion, I think far
more so than, than intellectualone.
What would you recommend forpeople and how to start, let's
(28:07):
say they are intrigued by theidea of the true self, the upper
room, the kingdom, but theydon't know how to begin?
Well, I think people go to thebook that calls to them, there's
nine of them. But the guides arevery good teachers. And they say
that they teach in a one roomschoolhouse, and you can enter
(28:27):
the teaching anywhere, and theywill teach you and they do they
say sponsor or mentor, thestudents of their work. So you
know, some people enter it atthe most recent book, it happens
frequently, then they findthemselves going back, some
people go back to the very firstbook time, the word or the first
book of a trilogy, whether it'sthe book of mastery or
(28:50):
realization, because thetrilogies are complete, but you
know, there's a lot ofinformation at this point, there
are 1000s and 1000s and 1000s,of pages of channeling. And I
just trust that people go wherethey're LED.
And there is no one way to getthere, to the upper room, the
(29:10):
kingdom there.
They tell you how to do it. Ifyou want to work with the upper
room, two chains, you can startwith realization, catch the
reader up and out to me and thencatch the waiter repping enemy
kingdom. The basis for all ofthe books in some ways, I think
in the upper room. Thepreparatory work for the upper
(29:31):
room teachings are in the booksthat preceded them. They give it
a teaching that is in sequence.And they I think sometimes the
DNA of all of the books are inthe very first book, and that
they've been unpacking thatteaching about the inherent
divine ever since. But I don'tknow that that's true. And
again, I don't know what's nexteither. I mean, again, there's
(29:53):
another book that should becompleted in a few months. I'm
going oh my god, is this goingto happen?
Well, do we all have a choice togo to the kingdom? Or is that
something that? No, we can alsorefuse? Yeah, we have free will.
They honor free will do what youwant, you know, and they've
(30:16):
never said and they say ifanybody ever tells you, it's my
way of the highway, go go go runin the other direction. I don't
think it works that way. But wehave free will, the guides talk
about the braiding of the willthe will of the personality,
self, and Divine Will, and thatthey begin to operate in union
or unison. And then at thatlevel, you begin to move into
(30:38):
what they call knowing or youknow, clear cognizance, you're
just, you're just operating fromknowing you're not trying to
figure it out anymore. Becauseyour choices are made just like
that, quote, that you. In thebook, your choices are made at
that level of awareness. We havechoice, yes. And there are
consequences for the choices.All of us no choice.
(31:03):
But I mean, also choosing tostay with a personality self as
a consequence of possiblygreater suffering.
You're going to learn for thepersonality self, it's what's
here for it's nothing wrong withit. It's not something
necessarily to be overcome, Idon't think I just think the
problem has been that we'veconfused it with who we really
are. But you know, you can learnthat fire is dangerous by
(31:29):
putting your hand in it. But youdon't. You don't have to learn
that way. You understand? Yeah.So we have choice. And we can
learn however, we wish. I dotrust at this point. And it's
not always easy. That, you know,the circumstances that I have in
(31:49):
my life are what are here toteach me. It's really that
simple. You know, it's like it'sall opportunity, if I'm willing
to look at it that way.
And are the guides just as afinal question, are the guides,
hopeful for humanity or theneutral regards,
I've been finding them prettyhelpful. They've actually said
(32:10):
humanity's made a choice. Andthis is going to that's the
Collective Soul of humanity,that collective humanity. And a
higher level is said yes, toprogressing forward. And that
some of what we're dealing withnow is how we have to do that.
They need to be sort of unmadeor racing in order to be made
(32:33):
new. And that's a lot of theirteaching, how things are made
new, racing rearticulated inwhat they call the upper room,
or the higher octave.
And that also has probably todo, how we deal with nature,
animals,
those things, were responsiblefor what we create that includes
(32:55):
physical planet that we're instewardship of and seem to not
do a very good job ofstewarding.
So the challenge right now, formost of us is just keeping
forward moving forward with thischoice and not getting pulled
into the darkness by beingrighteous or angry or any of
those things
where say self righteousness isalways the small self for the
(33:17):
personality structure. You know,it's it's a convenient trap, and
I fall into it, but I'm prettygood at catching myself when I
do it because it gets more andmore uncomfortable when I
Well, thank you so much, Paul,for this enlightening hour
again, or half an hour. And Iwish you all the best for this
(33:38):
new book and the book inNovember that it all comes
through as it needs to be and Iappreciate so much that you are
letting yourself be that vehiclefor all this wisdom to come
through. Thank you. Thank youfor having me. I appreciate it.
All right. Thank you. Goodbye.
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