Making The Case For Jaden Ivey Or Shaedon Sharpe, Trading Saddiq Bey? With Josh and Drew

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:07):
Welcome to the Everything Pistons Podcast,where we only talk about the Detroit Pistons.
I'm Lance CAPROSI follow me on Twitterat LANs cap Rosy. Before I
turn it over to my co host, Subscribe to the Everything Pistons Podcast,
drop rating, leave a review,and more importantly, tell a Pistons fan.
Now here's my co host. I'mAndrew Clements, creator of the Everything

(00:29):
Pistons Instagram page. You can followme there on Instagram and Facebook at Everything
Pistons Podcast, on Twitter at ePistons Pod, and always email the show
directly at e Pistons Pod at gmaildot com. Guys, the draft boards
heating up and you'll have to followme across all social media to keep up.

(00:50):
And Lance usually we start the showsaw something lighthearted, but I gotta
pump the brakes to start. Wehaven't done this segment in a while,
and I was thinking, and Iwas uh, scrolling through Twitter and just
more and more these last couple ofdays, and something's got to be said.
Man, And this might rattle somesome Pistons fans, and because he's

(01:15):
a he's a pretty prominent member ofthe Pistons community. But I gotta call
out Ashton du trainer. I gottado it because he's new here, so
he doesn't know what Pistons fans andpeople online have have been through these last

(01:37):
couple of years. This guaranteed playoffspot talk from Ashton. Let's slow that
down, man, Hey, justpump the brakes a little bit. I
love I love the optimism when everybodythought we were going to the playoffs,
when when the second we got kid, you weren't here the year before.
Where listening to all the all thePistons fans saying we should have been a

(01:57):
playing team and fighting with them allyears. So he's gonna he's causing some
uh some high high expectations. Yeah, he's he's putting some high expectations on
this team. And I really don'twant to listen to the people that buy
in right now all year. Idon't want to listen to them complain and
moan when we have twelve wins thirtythirty games into the season. So is

(02:23):
this a pump the brakes more forAshton or for fans that will buy in.
I'm pumping him on Ashton because he'sthe conductor of that train. But
I'm sure sometimes this year I'm gonnahave to pump him on the fans too,
who I kind of think more sopumping the brake, pumping the fans,

(02:43):
pumping the brakes on the fans.I don't want to say anything too
bad about Ashton. I don't knowhim, you know, and I love
I love the guy. He's agreat Detroit personality. But I just what
he's doing to Pistons fans giving himso much hope, like and it's just
going to be crushed. But weneed hope, we need we need a

(03:05):
cheerleader like Ashton, someone that isgoing to support Kade on the sidelines,
be his biggest fan. I wantpom Poms in his hands at every game.
And I want this dude psyching upevery member of the Detroit Pistons and
getting them ready for the playoffs.I think he's crazy. Let me just
say that there's no way the Pistonsmake the playoffs this upcoming season. Would

(03:28):
it be amazing and I will,I will enjoy the ride if that is
the case. There's no way.There is no way the Pistons make the
playoffs. I mean, and I'mtalking even before the draft pick is announced,
before any free agencies, before anyfree agents are signed, saying it
here. First, the Pistons arenot making the playoffs, They're gonna be

(03:50):
better next year. I am excitedabout the development of the young guys,
the core of this team. ButAshton is crazy. He is crazy for
saying that the they will be inthe playoffs for sure. Pookmark the tweet,
whatever he said, save it,screenshot it. I think I did
because I just want to know,you know what I mean. But again,

(04:10):
I do love the optimism from Ashtonto trainer, but he is he
is crazy. Man. He doesknow basketball though, I'll give him that.
So maybe he knows something that wedon't know. Maybe he's in and
I don't know, right, Butthat's the thing, like so many Pistons
fans just hold his word as gold, like uh, he posts a lot
of cryptic things, right, andhe's doing it to get the interactions.

(04:35):
But every time he posts the eyeemoji or something about next year, I
mean, Detroit fans just blow itup. So that's why I'm saying,
like, look, man, you'renot the one talking to Ashton again.
You're not the one that's gonna haveto deal with these fans all season.
Like nobody's gonna be coming at Ashtonto trainer, It's gonna be you and

(04:55):
me, Lance. They have tosit and listened to these fans and go,
no, dog, we told youbefore the draft last season this team
was not going to make the playoffs. Because you thought this team was going
to make the playoffs and be greatdoes not mean this team is taking a
step backwards. To the fans thatlisten to this podcast, that follow Ashton

(05:17):
on Twitter, if the Pistons don'tmake the playoffs, you need to blow
his Twitter up. You need tolet him know he was wrong. You
need to let him know. Andthat is Andrews pumped the brakes. I
don't have a pump the brakes thisweek. Kind of yeah, we haven't
done it in a while. Now, we haven't done it in a while.
Um. One thing I noticed though, is how whiny some Pistons Twitter

(05:39):
fans are. Man, It's unbelievable. You come up with a fake trade
scenario, not even a trade scenario, just an idea, a question,
a question, and you get almostcrucified on Twitter for it because you're posing
a question. It's unbelievable. Sometimes, Like I feel like I'm a realist

(06:00):
when it comes to being a Pistonsfan. I feel like you are too,
and I feel like there's a lotof us out there that are realists.
Dude, you mentioned one Sadiq tradehypothetical, not even a scenario.
If people get all whiny about it, Listen, at some point one of
the young guys, cade Sediq IsaiahKillian, this draft pick coming in.
Some of your other fan favorites likeHamie Diallo and you know, Kelly Olinick

(06:26):
maybe if he's a fan favorite amongstsome. They're eventually going to leave.
Someone is going to leave from thisgroup, and it's gonna be a sad
day. But it is a veryreal thing that is going to happen.
You don't need to shoot the messenger. I'm just letting you know that's what's
going to happen. But yeah,Pistons fans, I mean, I love
engaging with people. Don't get mewrong. I'm not even that big on
Twitter at all, but I lovethe little bit of engagement that I get

(06:50):
on a weekly basis. But Icannot stand whiney Pistons fans. I just
can't. I just can't. Ijust can't stand whiny basketball fans. Really
just whine people in general, eventhough it does something like I'm whining right
now, So if you want tothrow that at me, feel free.
We can get on with this.Man. Let's move on to headlines.
Our next segment is Headlines. Withheadlines, we bring you news, stories,

(07:10):
updates on the team, A quoteor two will sprinkling, some rumors
who We'll share our thoughts if wehave any, and then we'll move on.
The Detroit Pistons fall to number fivein the NBA Draft lottery. If
you haven't heard already, it's oldnews by the time we record this port
talking about it anyways, I'm justgonna say I'm not disappointed. The Pistons
got a top five pick. That'stwo years in a row. You shouldn't

(07:31):
be disappointed on about that. Andit's unbelievable. This year, Troy Weaver
is going to make magic happen withthe fifth pick. Dwayne Wade, Vince
Carter, Walter Fraser, Scottie Pippenall have been drafted at number five.
It's the first time in Pistons historythey will have the fifth pick. Magic
is about to happen. We aregonna be having our fourth rookie on an

(07:55):
all Rookie team next year. SadiqueBay, isaiahs Stewart, Kate Cunningham fifth
pick this year joins that exclusive cluband I cannot wait. I am not
disappointed at all about the fifth pick, did I? And the reason it
is I didn't expect this to get. The Pistons to get are never expected
it. Yeah, I mean anythingover six is a win mathematically, right,

(08:18):
So I was kind of, youknow, initially a little disappointed when
the Pistons came around at five,just simple fact that they weren't four.
And then if they came around atfour, I would have been disappointed they
weren't three. But I'm not upsetabout it. Do you think are you
willing to trust Troy Weaver this much? Is the fifth pick at the end

(08:39):
of next year in the Rookie ofthe Year conversation? We don't even know
who it is yet? But doyou trust Weaver that much? Oh?
Wow? You know I'm not excited. Yeah, I know, but I'm
not trying to get this excited likeI was excited last year for Kid to
get Rookie of the Year. Ican't put myself through that. I have

(09:00):
no comment, heart, I haveno comment on the fifth pick. I
mean, well, we're gonna dosome draft talk later on in the podcast
with our special guests that are comingon. But yeah, I'm not going
to comment on that. I justask me again, is made. Yeah,
I mean, it's just kind oflike a little fun question. I
literally just thought about it, like, do you trust Troy Weaver enough to

(09:22):
say that he will potentially draft atfive one of the three best players in
the rookie class. Oh, Imean that's with this rookie class, Like
you said, we'll get into it. That is very possible. No,
I mean it is, it reallyis. I'm again I'm not gonna get
my hopes up though, like allrookie team, that's reasonable. There's ten

(09:43):
spots for those, so yeah,i'd say that's a real high like a
highly high likely scenario for this fifthpick. But rookie of the year,
Oh, I don't know. Idon't know. I guess I'm not saying
winning. I'm just saying be inthe conversation still same things, the same
thing applies. I have no commentuntil that pick has made, but I
am very excited about hoo Troy Weaverdrafts at number five and social Pistons fans

(10:09):
man like last year was the draftyou wanted to win. We won last
year's draft with the first pick wegot Kde Cunningham. This year, we're
gonna get a solid player. We'regonna get a sky that we are all
gonna get behind and be excited about. We're gonna root for him. The
hype might not be there like itwas for Kade, but man, it
is going to be an exciting time. In two fifth round, two top

(10:31):
five picks, Two top five picksin two years. That is incredible.
That is incredible. My only thingis I wish what the Pistons would do.
Don't ever send a player into thedraft lottery with a number higher than
number. They can't equal out toa higher number than three. You only
can send players that either have thesingle digits or like a Tayshaun Prince two

(10:54):
plus two equals four Rashid Wallace threeplus zero equals three. You can't be
sending in Rip Hamilton whose numbers equalfive the thirty two the three plus two
equals five. That is bad juju. I don't want that in the draft
lottery. Next time the Pistons areup for a top pick, you send
a guy with a single number orsomething that adds up to a yeah,

(11:15):
if he could do it. Imean, I don't know how excited Portland
would be about that, but yeah, bringon Chauncey Billips. Kate Cunningham made
first team All Rookie. This comesfrom Shams Sheer Narnia. I don't think
anybody is surprised. The best rookieseason I've seen from a Detroit Piston in
my lifetime. Wasn't old enough forGrant Hill, Kate Cunningham, I've been
I was so I've been waiting forthis rookie season for so long. I've

(11:41):
gotten hyped up about every rookie thathas been drafted by the Pistons, and
every year I go into the sameexpectations. Probably the best player in the
draft. He's gonna dominate, he'sgonna be one of the best. He's
gonna be a Rookie of the Yearcandidate. He's gonna be on All Rookie
first team. I'm so excited andget disappointed. Thank you, Kate for
having the rookie year that you had. Thank you so much you have made

(12:07):
You have made my life as aPistons fan that much better. For the
rookie year that you have had.Yeah, I mean we talked about it
all season. One of the veryfew bright spots if you're not picking at
silver linings and calling him bright spotsthis season that you can say is is
Kid Cunningham's play and the way KadeCunningham bounced back from from having a very

(12:31):
rough slow start for his first fewweeks of his career too at the end
of the year being a finalist forRookie of the Year and will forever be
debated that that he was not theRookie of the Year verse he should have
been in the Rookie of the Year. That'll that'll be a debate you can

(12:52):
have ten years down the line withScottie Barnes winning that. So man,
that's gonna be a fun debate too. Yeah. Yeah, So that'll be
definitely something we can we can lookback on in time. I know Sadiq
Bay made All Rookie Team All RookieFirst Team his rookie year as well,
but there's just some different about Kaid's, you know, appearance on the team.

(13:13):
It was I think maybe because itwas just a better rookie class.
No offense to any of the otherguys draft through with Sadiq Bay It's a
very solid class in itself. Butthis rookie class like to be one of
the be I think if you're onthe All Rookie first team, you're one
of the five best rookies. Ithink that's what that means. I think
it'd be hard for anybody to arguethat as well. So just to see

(13:33):
him stand amongst the rest of thoseguys that was that was really cool and
honestly, it's it's seriously is oneof the best moments being a Pistons fan
in probably like the last ten years. It was incredible. Mo Bomba is
likely to leave Orlando this offseason.Normally we don't talk about players entering free
agency unless they have been rumored toDetroit. I don't know if Mo Bamba

(13:56):
has been rumored to try didn't seeanything like that. Well we're talking about
it because Pistons fans love Mo Bamba. I mean I love Mo Bamba.
You know, when I went tothe game against Orlando, he was he
was a guy that definitely stands outman his his arm, his wingspan is
incredible. That dude can tie hisshoes standing up. It is amazing.

(14:18):
But mo Bomba. He provides shotblocking, some three points shooting. He
has a lot of size and he'sonly twenty four years old. But what
kind of role would Mobomba have inDetroit if the Pistons do sign him.
Is he is starter? No?I don't think so. I don't.
I don't even want the Pistons tosign him. First off, I'm I'm
no Bomba. No thanks, You'reno Bomba, no bamba, no no

(14:41):
Bomba. I like, okay,go on my bead. No. I
was just gonna explain myself a littlebit like he's a He's another kind of
underperforming, high kind of sought afterand in interesting prospect, but just didn't
have a great star to his career. I'm more all in on on Eyton

(15:03):
over over Bomba. And that iskind of the debate right now on on
Pistons Twitter. Do you want tomax out Aiden or would you want to
save money with with Mo Bomba.I think bringing in mo he he's not
going to become DeAndre Ayton, andAyton is already light years better than Mo

(15:24):
bomb them. So the best casescenario I see for for Mo Bomba coming
in is being a third string maybebackup center, he'll be a he if
he were to come to Troy,he'd be the backup center for sure.
I just don't think you think,so who's so, who's getting bumped who?
Like, obviously we don't know isIsaiah Stewart starting? Is Marvin Bagley

(15:48):
starting next year? But either oneof them has got to get the bump.
Then if he's he's backup, youthink he's gonna start or play over
Isaiah Stewart. Or I think IsaiahStewart's starter. I think Mo bombas a
guy. Yeah, And like that'swhat's confusing about this as well, because
again I don't know what kind ofrole he would have in Detroit. Like,
I'm not running on Mo bomba.I do like his game. I

(16:11):
think it would be fun to havehim in Detroit. But then I also
think that opens up the door fora potential discussion if he has signed that
we could have later. But thingsI'm thinking of, is he the starter?
Does he come off the bench?Is this a move that the Pistons.
Is this a move so that thePistons could ultimately trade Isaiah Stewart?
Like is that what the signing?If that's what the potential is that what

(16:33):
the potential signing to Mobamba brings.And again, Isaiah Stewart is already better
than Mo Bomba, So again Iwould choose to keep Isaiah Stewart over Mo
Bomba. I just I don't know, man. I think if you're bringing
in a big to this team thathas so many young bigs, budding bigs,
and like Isaiah Stewart, a bigthat just has so many just gritty

(17:00):
factors about him that you can overlookhis offense sometimes, Like if you're gonna
bring in a big to that scenario, he has to be a clear cut
role defined. Like I'm bringing inDeAndre Ayton, There's no question is he
gonna be backup or third string?DeAndre Ayton will start on this team and

(17:22):
everybody on this team knows it.Now. Bringing in Mo Bamba that just
creates more of a log jam atthe two or third string center position.
That's why I'm out in Nobamba.Yeah. And also if they do sign
Obama, does that mean Bagley's out? Are they not resigning him? Are
they trading Kelly olan Nick? Likeyou have to create You're right, you

(17:45):
have to do create some room forMo Bamba. But I think his production
even in Orlando. I mean it'sten eight. I think he shot thirty
three percent from three averaged almost Ithink you average close to two blocks team.
I don't have the numbers in frontof me, but he's a he's
a I mean he's a legit shotblocker, Like he can shoot the three.
He can spread the floor. Imean he can he can get you

(18:07):
some buckets. Like he's not Imean, he's not an All Star in
the waiting like that. That's notwhat I'm saying. I think he does
have a clear role. But again, like this Pistons team is so young
and there's already so many other playersthat play in that position up front that
the signing just really want to makesense unless other moves are made. But
it still is fun to discuss.I'm personally out on Mo Bamba again.

(18:30):
I am a fan. I dolike him, but mainly because I just
don't know what he would be inDetroit. I don't know if he comes
here and accepts being the backup center, you know, I don't know that.
I don't know if the Pistons areultimately trying to trade Isaiah Stewart because
they're thinking Isaiah Stewarts near his ceilingmo Bamba dinner. You know there's still

(18:52):
something left there in the tank.He could be better than he is in
Orlando. I just don't know.I don't know what they're thinking. But
if Mobamba is coming into place IsaiahStewart, I don't want that to happen.
I just love Isaiah Stewart too muchto give up one. He just
turned twenty one. You know,there's one center that I would be okay
with him maybe replacing, and thatwould be Kelly Olinik. And the only

(19:14):
reason that would make sense is becauseI believe Kelly isn't gonna make it till
next year. I don't think he'llbe on this team. So I mean,
yeah, the Pistons may need tolook for a center eventually, but
as of right now, as thisteam's constructed, no, yeah, I
don't. I'm good on him.Plus Plus, I don't need to hear
that dumb Check West song that wouldbe That song was garbage when it dropped.

(19:38):
I kind of want to hear it. I want to hear the bass
bump, and I want to beable to not I shouldn't even I'm not
even gonna say that because I knowshe'll be listening. I was just I'm
just joking. I know you're listeningto the podcast. I was gonna say,
but I can't hear you ask mequestions when that song is playing with
the bass. But I'm kidding.I'm definitely kidding. Any question you have
to ask me at a game,I'm more than happy to answer. Are

(20:00):
more than happy to answer. Ilove seeing all the interactions on the Instagram
page and on Twitter about Mo Bamba, Verse, DeAndrea, and then Mitchell
Robinson's names being brought up. It'sgonna be a fun off season to talk
about these guys. I mean,I would, I would even since you
brought him up. I'd even takeMitchell Robinson over Mo Bamba. Oh dude,
he's my first choice at center.Yeah, of course I would.
I would love Mitchell Robinson. Yeah, I would take Yeah, dude,

(20:22):
he's gonna cost like a third ofthe price he can blocksha. I'm gonna
get nearly the production though. Imean, I don't need a center coming
in and averaging seventeen to nine orfifteen to nine whatever it was for DeAndrea.
And that's a lot of money fora guy that averages fifteen seventeen points
and nine rebounds. I know hedoes other things. Yeah, I know
he does other things defensively, butwe've compared Mitchell Robinson and DeAndrea and on

(20:47):
this podcast before. Defensively, they'revery similar players. I would take Mitchell
Robinson over DeAndrea and On the Pistonsjust because of the costs and what he
brings. And real quick, beforewe move on an invite, our guest
on Ashton, Joe tweeted out,I'm a Pistons fan like everyone else.
Of course why he's also he's alsoa Dallas Cowboys fans. Let's not forget

(21:10):
that. Let's not forget that.But he is a Pistons fan. That
is confirmed by Ashton. And I'mnot I'm not the last thing I'll say
about that. That's funny to mebecause you take it at face value.
Yeah, like yeah, he's justlike us. But like right went to
Cleveland, he would be the biggestCleveland fan, you know, and and
it is just I see that now. I'm just like, come on,

(21:30):
dog, like you just got here. So I hope, man, I
hope your mentions, whether it's onInstagram or Twitter, just blow up with
hell, don't don't come at meon Instagram because I won't see it come
from me on Twitter. I'll behere. No, no, no,
he meant to say he will seeevery message on Instagram, so send a
message. No. I also thinkit's funny that some Pistons fans really simp

(21:56):
over Ashton to train or real hadnot making fun of anybody personally, but
I know some Pistons fans and listenersof this podcast would agree with me if
you were on Twitter and you justsee some of the man crushes. Some
of these dudes half for Ashton,it is unbelievable sometimes so and we're not
trashing him. We love him too. We just want him to bump the

(22:18):
brakes a little. Yeah. No, no, Ashton's great man. I
got no problems with him, man, It's just it's just funny, man,
it really is. All right,man, we're gonna end this segment
and then we're gonna invite our guestson. So I hope you guys enjoy
our guests and hope you enjoy ourdraft talk. All right, join now
our special guest. I'm gonna letAndrew introduce him because he knows them better
than me. Andrew take it away. Yeah, man, these are These

(22:38):
are my guys, and I've beentrying to get him. One's been on
before, I've been trying to getthe other on the podcast here for a
while. These are two guys unfortunatelycouldn't get the third, but two guys
that are a real integral part intocreating what the Everything Pistons Instagram page is.
Two guys that have recently joined Twitter, so I'm super excited to be

(23:02):
able to give him a shout out. We all know we've had Drew on
before, our our ghost producer andhelps with the show, but first time
guest on Josh also helps with theInstagram page. Welcome guys, and I'm
excited to not only have two guyson that don't really necessarily get as much
of the limelight, but two guyson that have been with me for years

(23:27):
now and we've we've developed friendships andreally make the Instagram into what it is.
Excited to have both you guys on, Josh Drew. I don't know
if you guys want to say helloto our listeners, but feel free going
on. I hope the listeners respondback to you guys and say nothing is

(23:48):
going on absolutely and you can followJosh at Josh Arbor Sports, Underscore Sports,
and Drew At based Pistons on Twitter. Let's get into it, guys.
I apologize for having you on thisepisode because we're coming up with some
hypotheticals that are definitely going to makelisteners in Pistons fans upset. I tweeted

(24:11):
something out the other day. I'vealready been through it. I know what's
gonna come of this, but let'sget this started. What if the consequence
of drafting Keegan Murray was ultimately tradingSadiq Bay away. Before I let you
guys answer, I'm just gonna sayKeegan Murray and Jeremy Grant is more of
an interesting fit than Sadiq bay andKeegan Murray. On offense, Jeremy Grant

(24:33):
gives you a three point shooting,He gives you cuts to the basket.
And if you combine that with Isaiah'sstewarts three point shooting that we saw late
last season, it makes sense.With Keegan Murray ability to play in the
post, they're gonna open things up. He's gonna play a little bit of
bullyball. But what do you guysthink if the consequences are trading Sadik Bay
If we draft Kegan Murray. Imean, first and foremost, are we
sure Jeremy Grant's even you know,Keegan Murray excels in in transition offense?

(24:59):
Are we sure Jeremy Grant's even goingto kick him the ball? I mean,
how long did it take for himto give it up to Kate.
Oh, he already knows how topass into a rookie. Now he'll be
able to pass into a rookie andtake it back scene. But Josh,
let me hear your thoughts on KeeganMurray and then trading Bay. I would
if okay, So if we takeKegan and trade Sadik, I would be

(25:21):
kind of upset because I think thefit there is actually pretty decent offensively and
defensively. I think having a guylike Keegan who can occasionally get his own
in the post if you're like inlike a wait clock desperation, like,
oh crap, the play kind offailed, Let's give it to Kegan in
the post. He can do something. Both can space the floor. Keegan's

(25:42):
also a good cutter, and Ithink that could potentially take a little bit
less of Sadik's offensive load. AndI think that would make him because his
defense has honestly not been as goodas it could be. I would say,
so, I think you get Sadikpotentially more defensive attention, and Keegan's

(26:03):
already a very smart overall player butdefender as well. So I mean I
think it's I think they fit welltogether. But if you had to,
if it's like a give you oneor and you have to lose the other,
I wouldn't do it. I don'tthink that would really make sense.
See, yeah, I think I'mthere with you. See I'm a little
lower on Sadiq Bay, Like Ithink he's a lot closer to his ceiling

(26:27):
than a lot of Pistons fans givehim credit to. I kind of want
to. I kind of want topoint out the way you were saying though,
Like if Sadiq Bay has a lesserrole, would he be better defensively?
But Jeremy grant Man, like,he's already played in those lesser roles
and we know what he could bringdefensively taking a back seat to other players.

(26:48):
So I don't know. I personallylove to fit and I'm gonna turn
it over to Drew here in asecond, but I want to hammer this
out real quick. On defense,Keegan and Jeremy they could switch. I
don't worry about it. They're bothpeople of guarding threes and fours. Can
they ultimately give you more positionless basketballif you have those two and they're like,
I just dream of the front courtof Isaiah Stewart, Keegan Murray and

(27:11):
Jeremy Grant. And I'm not worryingabout those guys. I worry more about
Saddi, Keegan Murray and Isaiah Stewartbecause you really are lacking that athlete in
the front court. But Drew,same question, you draft. I don't
think they would be traded because youknow, when you're talking about drafting at
this point, we're just drafting talent. We'll figure out fit later. They

(27:33):
will be given a chance. Iffed it does end up being traded,
it's not this off season you give. You wait until Bay has a perfect
good value because what there's no there'sno reason like they has an upgoing value.
I do agree with what on arookie contract. Yeah, and I
do believe Josh said that, like, you know, it will help take
the lot off they to have KeeganMurray, you know, so Bay,

(27:57):
it will work onto methods goes youknow, defense, which I agree is
not as good as advertised, orjust doing things with the drib yeah,
dribbling um off the dribble. Idon't And for Jeremy Grant, like,
I don't necessarily think I dre it'llbe trade it necessarily unless if it was

(28:21):
for you know, maybe that Blazerspick or some of the other picks I've
you know, some other trade contentsI've discussed. So I don't see that,
but I definitely see why Troy Weaver, and it's behind very apparent to
those who've been following that the interestand the in Keegan Murray as a Troy

(28:44):
Weaver quote unquote guy and as aplayer is sort of undeniable. Whether Pistons
fans are going to be cool withdrafting Keegan Murray. I think it's like
the real question. Yeah, it'sup in the air for sure, because
you definitely got some Pistons fans thatare against the move and some that are
for the move. But I alsolook at it this way. We all

(29:07):
are hoping that Sadiq Bay can turninto that quote unquote three level scorer in
the NBA, Keegan Murray. Iknow it's only college, but he is
a three level scorer. I don'tknow how well he'll do that in the
NBA, but as of right now, that is what he is. He
is pro ready he can do thingsthat Sadiq Bay can't do. I think
it kind of creates some positional redundancywith having Keegan Murray and Sadiq Bay on

(29:30):
the floor together. But more importantly, and I'm just going to reiterate this
thought, if we are hoping,we are all hoping that Sadik Bay reaches
that three level scoring, you know, part to his game. We hope
that he reaches that, But KeeganMurray's already coming in being able to do
it. So why would I notwant to trade the guy that still has
a ton of value? And therehave been a couple of teams that have

(29:52):
been rumored in or I've been interestedin Sadiq Bay. But if I can
get like a better, more completeversion of him on the same age,
why would I not want Why wouldI not pass? Why would I pass
up that opportunity to trade Sadik Bay. So that's kind of my line of
thinking is again, you know,Keegan Murray, he comes with a more
complete offensive game that we're hoping SadikeBay can get to, and along with

(30:17):
that is, if Sadik Bay stillhas value to some of these teams and
you can get a first round pickfor him, why not make that trade?
But if you guys could get afirst round pick for Sidek Bay,
would you make the trade? No, it would. It would really have
to depend on how high that firstround pick is. Okay, Okay,
So let's just look at this fora second. If it's a low first
round pick, are you guys passingor are you guys taking that trade?

(30:41):
Pass? I'm blocking the caller's number. Thank you, So sorry ask the
question. We'll kind of pick alow first round pick like something higher?
No, I mean, like Ithink they it's definitely worth the talent.
He just sets a show a littlebit of like you know, consistency and

(31:04):
like some other tools that there.But teams are going to trade for him.
I just don't know if it's goingto be. I mean you have
to say, like, which isa bit more valuable because you look at
a similar situation in Sean Hornets andsome people might say, you know,
you have PJ. Washington and MilesBridges, who what's his value in is

(31:25):
a deep Bay more valuable than PJ? Washington? To teams. A good
question, and because I remember therewas a trade deadline proposal that thing goes
through and this is kind of wherewhere it was PJ. Washington, Kai
Jones and I think at first forYaka Purdle of the spurs um it really

(31:49):
I would say that if the Pistonswere training Bay, it would be in
a similar sort of move, maybenot giving one of our picks, but
it would be like to get akind of a quality, higher talent.
I think they would trade Bay foranother pick and push the push the process
around more. I think they wouldtrade they get a better player. I

(32:14):
wouldn't like this, but if itwas like, oh, the picks of
the like Rudy Gobert or they Simondtrade too? Is the guy I see
Sidik Bay in that package. Solet's go around the table again. What
about a pick in the top fourteen? Would you trade Sadiq Bay for a
picking for a pick in the topfourteen top It gets a little interesting now,

(32:37):
Well the reason why because top fourteenis fourteen through one. You know
anything, I think it's a solidifiedyes, anything pick seven and up for
Sadique Bay. I think it hasto be a seven or under pick right
now for Sadique Bay because look,you're getting so much, so much production

(33:02):
on a rookie contract. That aloneis so valuable in the NBA, So
you gotta get some very valuable assetback if you were to trade Sidik like
a top pick or I know Drewjust mentioned Rudy Gobert, but what about

(33:22):
his teammate and Donovan Mitchell. Yeah, yeah, yeah, so it would
have to be something like that.What about you, guys, Josh and
Drew, would you trade Sidike payfor a top for a pick in the
top fourteen? I would kind ofagree with the range that Andrew throughout.
I'd say one through six, andobviously we have five, so he picks

(33:43):
one, two, three, fouror six. I would probably do it.
Seven's kind of pushing it a littlebit, I think, at least
because I think Side might have morevaluable than Jeremy or it might have more
value. But I'd agree with thatat seven, I can. I'm not
gonna throw a fit and then likefrom back from there, I'd have to

(34:04):
get something else back, and Iwouldn't. I wouldn't be looking enough to
trade City Bay too. Really,like, okay, probably take that in
just one or six is I wouldprobably do. And just again for our
listeners, this is only if thePistons draft Kicking Murray. But Drew,
what about you? Top fourteen,pick four? Are we talking about twenty
twenty three? No, we're talkingabout this year's draft. See, like

(34:25):
I like like the preference. Istill think they would not trade just because
they draft to Key murryn till likeKim Murray shout some NBA reps. So
we're talking it would be a nextyear twenty twenty three. So if it
was in next year twenty twenty threething, and it was the lottery again
and the team had let's say aeight or not, they're a slat for

(34:51):
eight or nine, but they havea six or seven percent chance, and
it was like unprotected, I woulddo it. Okay, Well, I'm
only bringing this up because it wouldbe a gamble. That's kind of the
sna here. You draft Keegan Murray, but then you haven't Because I still
I really do think it's positional redundancy. I really do. Between him and
yeahs to me, I just don'tthink predusitional redundancy is something that I think

(35:12):
the Pistons should be concerned about,right, now, I mean that's a
fair point too, but again,it is a gamble in this scenario.
So if you draft geek and murdering, then the phones start ringing and some
team's offering you a pick for SadiqBay, and if it's in the top
fourteen, do you take it?But now I'm going to go around again
to the table and ask, andsome of you guys have already answered it,
but a top five pick? Areyou trading Sadiq Bay for a top

(35:32):
five pick in this year's draft?Yeah? I think we can make this
quick. Yep, next, definitelyOkay, he said, yeah, probably
all right, what about you drewtop five pick? Yeas, Yes,
yes, certainly I don't know whichteam would be, but certainly because people
may who might see me on Twitter, who you know, I've made a

(35:53):
few people mad that I'm not thebiggest Sadiq Bay fan. I like all
pick stint and I'm a fan ofall pissess, but I do not think
of his long term potential to besuper I don't think if I don't think
Sade is a future All Star.And on your I remember that too.

(36:13):
You tweeted something out about Sadik Bayand then he dropped like fifty one point.
It was amazing. It's the magicin a game that maybe we should
have lost. So, okay,here's the trade scenario. Would you trade
Sadiq Bay for the fourth pick ifthe Sacramento Kings offered it. I know
the Sacramento Kings. They've been interestedin Sadiq Bay, I believe, back
until his rookie year. So ifthe Kings offered the fourth pick in this

(36:36):
year's draft for Sadiq Bay, areyou hanging up the phone or are you
answering that phone and agreeing to thattrade? Still? Yep? Okay,
there we go. They're they're theKings. So I would try to get
more, and you know you couldwith the Kings. You know, you
give us the fourth and fifty concessions. I would get Josh Jackson back in

(37:00):
that trade, but I would trade. I'm gonna make it very clear.
I would trade Sadeke Bay for afirst round pick like I would. I
just think there's some other guys thatare in this draft class that I'm really
interested in, whether it's like aWalker Kessler or a Mark Williams had a
duke like those guys I would loveto see in the Detroit uniform and if
the Pistons draft Keegan Murray and hereally is the three level score that everybody

(37:22):
thinks he is, and everything I'veheard about him is true, I would
make one of those trades in aheartbeat for Sadeake Bay. If you offer
me the fourth pick from Sacramento,I'm making I'm taking that trade as well.
Like that would be amazing to hearall this. People be pretty upset
because they don't like the idea.I think it's we kind of know it's

(37:49):
pretty obviously, Like, yeah,Sad Bay, if he traded the Kings
play against the Pistons, he's gonnago nuts on us. I think that's
fine. I think we'll probably getsome player that we want more for him.
I got you. Yeah, No, it makes sense. I mean
I didn't really come up with thepackage. I'm just looking at draft picks.
Well, let's move on to theJeremy Grant trade rumors. I've said

(38:13):
this before that the Pistons will tradeJeremy Grant this offseason, but now I'm
not so sure. I don't thinkI see it happening anymore. Jeremy Grant
to Portland for the seventh pick.This is one of those rumors flown out
there. I personally love it makessense for the Portland Trailblazers, but if
they are shopping the seventh pick,I'm sure they could get more and get
a better return than Jeremy Grant.Anyways, Jeremy Grant gives Portland another veteran

(38:37):
he can spread the floor to createhis own chat plays good to great defense.
I believe his efficiency would go upplaying alongside Dane because his role offensively
would diminish. He no longer wouldbe creating his own chat in Portland.
He would could excel as a cutter, spot shooter, rim roller, and
he could finish around the rim forthe Portland Trailblazers. But thoughts on Jeremy
Grant going to the Portland Trailblazers forthe seventh pick. Yeah, I like

(39:00):
that trade as well, and absolutelythat getting that back for Jeremy Grant would
be a great haul. But yousaid something interesting, and I think the
reason why that is not going tohappen that once a push comes to shove
and the Trailblazers are really shopping thatseventh pick around, I'm talking like pick

(39:23):
six is on the clock, likewhen it when it comes crunch time.
You're right, they probably will geta better offer. So that's why I'm
keeping my eye still on. Maybesome would say the dark horse is a
trade with Atlanta for Jeremy Grant andone maybe John Collins gracing Detroit. We'll

(39:45):
see about that. But the onlycaveat that comes with the seventh pick is
Eric Bledsoe, by the way,like you would be thrown according to the
rumors you would be thrown in there. Yeah, I've seen that. But
Ums and Drew, what are youguys thoughts on Jeremy Grant to Portland for
the s But it would have tobe the trade for the Blazers we have
because if they're training simp pick andtrying to get to me valuable. Eric

(40:06):
Bledsoe has a partially guaranteed contract,but that becomes fully guaranteed on June twenty
nine. So in order to reallymake this trade, because I don't think
many teams are going to want totake Eric bledsoth contract by really viable,
it would have to be done beforea draft night the trade, and I
would say if the Blaze of Guardtrade is a I would say there's like

(40:29):
an ninety percent chance it's done beforeDraft night. It's probably done ahead of
time. I would say that it'snot just the Blazers that I'm interested.
I would say the Spurs could bevery interested. They have the ninth overall
pick, and I could see theSpurs considering Popovich. I'm though he might

(40:53):
not became back coach next year,but he might step involvement. Would want
Jeremy on that team, just likehe wanted him on the u UM the
Olympic team. I think although Jeremyis a good fit, there another fit
I could see because Pistons have theinterest in DeAndre Aiden and I don't,

(41:15):
and a sign in trade. It'sprobably not gonna just be Jeremy because sign
trade Jeremy Grant for DeAndre Aden isabsolutely not a fair thing. But maybe
he calls other assets from other teamsand whatever. I think the Phoenix Suns
could definitely have a very keen interestif they think they're definitely gonna lose DeAndre

(41:37):
Aiden to the Pistons and I wantI want another pick. You know,
I would love him the pick.I definitely would love a love pig.
I would say I posted earlier aboutI would take on Gore and Haywards deal
and James book Night. If wetrade Jeremy Grant, then maybe like Jeremy

(41:59):
goes to the Spurs and Yaka Portogoals to the Hornets, that we get
I posted it on my Twitter,and I think I love that trade idea.
We'd get book Night, a guywe already kind of really admire from
Afar who fits the team, andpick thirteenth's been good, Like I think

(42:22):
there are a few avenues. Ithink the only reason Jeremy probably wouldn't be
traded is if the Pistons have likesome serious thing like Jeremy might be part
of our future. I think heis, actually, But I'm gonna turn
it over to Josh Man. Whatare your thoughts on Jeremy Grant for the
seventh pick? And Eric Bledsoe,I'd do it, no question. With

(42:43):
Jeremy. Obviously, you've got topay him an extension if you want to
keep him pass this upcoming season.And I think you're getting way too much
value from the seventh pick to notmove Jeremy for it, obviously, if
it's offered. I honestly I don'treally see why Portland would do that,
but I guess I get it.I guess but they should probably they should

(43:06):
probably just blow it up at thispoint. I mean, are we really
thinking that Jeremy Grant moves the needlefor Portland that much to turn him into
a real viable contender for them towant to trade the seven? Yes,
yes, we are, Yes,we are here. We sure are yep.
Well, I don't know if thePortland Trail bis you're going to listen
to this podcast, but I'll sendit to him. Yeah, I just

(43:27):
don't know if like they really lookat Jeremy. I mean, I'm sure
they look at Jeremy Grant, they'relike, you know what, this guy
could be a piece. He couldreally you know, do something for us,
you know, and make maybe andDames on his way. I don't
want to stay on his way outbecause he's still playing at a high level,
but his best years maybe behind himin in his uh longevity and the

(43:47):
NBA. So they're kind of inlike a scramble put something together while we
still have Damian Lillard mode. That'strue, that's true. But here's the
second trade I looked up and seemsto begin thrown around there a lot.
The second trade involves the Sacramento Kings. The Kings would send Rashaun Holmes Justin
Holliday in the fourth pick for JeremyGrant the twenty twenty four first round pick.

(44:12):
I'd like this trade more because thefourth pick. I mean, who
wouldn't want to hire pick in thedraft. But also the added depth the
Pistons would get that cannot be ignoredand overlooked. And I like Rashawn Holmes
as a backup center. I likeJustin Holliday's game too. He knows his
role in the NBA. But thatmove really puts the Pistons chances of being
a play in team, like reallythere, Like if they make that trade,

(44:37):
that's more of we're trying to winright now and trying to get into
the playoffs. But what are yourthoughts on the Sacramento Kings fourth pick,
Rashaun Holmes and Justin Holliday. Iwould take it if the Sacramento Kings just
offered the four, Well, they'regonna offer more, Let's be honest,
They're not just gonna give us thefourth pick, But Josh, I'll turn
it over to you, like youare you in on that trade? Isn't

(44:59):
it just because of the four pick? Or do you like the added depth
that comes with it as well.Obvious obviously I like the added depth.
But I mean the fourth pick isthe fourth pick, and you're getting you're
training Jeremy Grant for the fourth pick. I mean that's ye, Like,
there's no reason to not do that. I would say, like, you
can secure Jade and Ivy unless oneof the top three teams takes him,

(45:20):
and if not, you get oneof the top three, one of the
consensus top three guys. You're gettingone of those, one of those four
at four, and you can takeKegan Murray at five if you want the
more safe win now option, andthen you ever Seawan Holmes as a rotational
center. And I mean, yeah, that that move seems obviously I think
so too. But Drew, whatare your thoughts on that trade? I

(45:45):
just wonder what happened? What aboutHarris and Barnes because so like so where
I think, like would Kings belike, why would they you know,
want about and Jeremy Grant it?Why do they do it? Now?

(46:05):
I know, I guess, Imean, of course I would do it.
Of course I would do it.I actually, but I do think
like and people are gonna say it'scrue do. I do think the Kings
are probably gonna draft one of Ivyor Sharp, because I don't think the
Kings see the Bay beyond Mitchell asthey're as a starting a starter player at
but more of a really good backupdefensive specialists who so like and they want

(46:30):
someone a pair with the bonus andthey probably do that. So yeah,
I will take it, of course, if it's due. It's like I
would take any trade where I thinkthe team, the front office is making
a mistake, but I was likely. I don't think. I don't think
it's likely that they do that.I think they're like the more on the
side of like, if you guyshad to get in a draft, Sorry

(46:55):
I didn't mean to interrupt you,but if you guys had to put,
like, am more likely trade happening? Would you put more stock in the
Portland Trailblazers trade or more stock inthe Sacramento Kings trade more stock in the
Portland Trailblazers. Because that's been rumoredthe longest, we've heard the most about
it. We have verified sources sayingthat Portland was interested in Jeremy Grant before.

(47:22):
We have sources now coming out sayingPortland is open to trading that seventh
round pick, and the dominoes arestarting to take effect. Now will it
happen? That remains to be seen. But dominoes are starting to fall,
and they're leading up to the smoke. And where there's smoke, there's fire.

(47:44):
What about you, Josh, whattrade is more likely to happen?
I also, i'd agree in Portlandfor sure, you have the obviously the
continued interest, and I know theKings are domb but like, I don't
know, I think trading the fourthpick for Jeremy it's a little and that's
a little crazy. I'd say,yeah, I don't think the Kings are

(48:05):
that dumb to trade the fourth pickfor Jeremy Grant, Like yeah, And
again it's no knock on Jeremy Grant. It's just it's his value really that
high. Like I just it's hardfor me to wrap my head around it.
Like I love Jeremy Grant. Ithink he's a solid player, but
we're talking the seventh and potentially thefourth pick either for Jeremy Grant just seems
like it's too much. I lookat it like this, if if you're

(48:28):
making a trade like that, you'reessentially making if you're the Kings or you're
the Trailblazers. Jeremy Grant is yourpick at four or seven, that's fair
too. But Drew, what whattrade do you think is more likely to
partland one. I don't think theKings are training pick. I think like

(48:49):
they they're not so dumb that theywouldn't like if you ask, like you
know, obviously Daron Fox and whoeverthe bonus the players who they want,
they're gonna be like the pick whoeverwe get to pick, and they know
also the business with fan they're gonnawant. They're gonna want to buy tickets
to see the pick, not tosee Jeremy Grant, even if it's right

(49:13):
move, Like they know, hey, the thing that sells the tickets is
this move. And whatever the Kinghas done the mistake in the past,
I don't think they ever did somethingthat deliberately would they would be like make
less of money? All right,Yeah, I know, all fair points
from all of you guys. Iseriously like great points from all of you

(49:36):
guys. We're gonna move on.We're gonna do a little draft talk.
Pistons fans seem to be torn betweentwo players, Jade and Ivy and Shade
and Sharp. We're each gonna goaround the table and make a case for
Jade and Ivy. Then we're gonnamake a case for Shade and Sharp.
I'm gonna start this off. Mybiggest case for Ivy is his creation.
The Pistons desperately need a guy whocan create his own shot. Ivy will

(49:58):
give that to the Pistons, andhe also kind of he'll take pressure off
of Kate Cunningham by being able tobring the ball up by being that second
ball handler. That's why Corey Josephstarted. In my opinion, Frank Jackson
was the second best Piston at creatinghis own shot. That needs to change
if they want to win. Thatneeds a change. Here's what I can't
stand though. I can't stand whenpeople say that the only reason for not

(50:22):
wanting Javi and iv is they thinkhe's a lead guard. He's not a
lead guard. If you watched himat Purdue, yes, he did take
ball handling responsibilities, but there weretwo other guys on the team that handled
those responsibilities. But also, ifyou have a guy that is a legit
NBA talent on your college team,you are going to put the ball in
his hands as much as you can, especially when it's a guy like Jade

(50:45):
and Ivy who can blow by anybody. He also, I've already said this,
but he provides relief for Kade becausehe can create something, whether it
be an isolation, working some dribblehandoff where he can turn the corner and
sling shot to the rim. Youcan put him in isolation, you can
hit him outside where're shown to havethe ability to spot up shoot. I

(51:06):
love Jade and Ivy going to thePistons. It makes the most sense for
me. I'm not going to talkabout Shade and Sharp until I hear all
of you guys make a case forJade and Ivy the fifth pick man,
I'm a big fan of Jade andIvy. Explosive off one or two feet,
probably one of the quickest first stepsin the draft, very job Morant

(51:29):
esque, you know, high flying. He's working better on his three point
shot, and I am a bigfan of Ivy coming to the Pistons.
Hopefully he can clean up. Sometimeshe's he's a little bit too fast for
his own good, and turnovers canbe an issue at times for Jade and
Nivy, but so were they forKade Cunningham last year, So you know,

(51:53):
I kind of overlook that and Ithink he'll adjust to the game.
Look, nobody's you know, notdrafting John Morant because he might have a
turnover game here or there, youknow, a problem in a game.
So I absolutely love what he couldbring to the team. And the small

(52:13):
guard not I mean, Kaide's notsmall, but the small guard lineup alley
you've thrown between Kade and Ivy aregonna be insane. I also want to
point this out though, to people. Let are watching Jade and Ivy and
they say there's no mid range gamefor him. That is true, that's
something he needs to work on.But John Morant didn't have a mid range
game in college either. That guyhad either shooting the ball or taking it

(52:35):
to the rim. Yeah. Ididn't even I didn't even realize the mid
range was still a thing in twentytwenty two basketball. It seems like it's
going away. But also they havea mid range game. Who cares.
I also want to point out theleft hand and right handed finishes and the
drives real quick. So I'm gonnapull up a stat for Jade and Ivy.
This is just in college. Obviously, he had fifty shots with his

(52:58):
left hand complete about forty four percent, one of them right handed finishes.
He had three hundred and twenty threefor about forty eight percent. John Morant
in college left handed finishes one fortyeight percent, right handed finishes three zero
two to forty four. So I'mnot really that concerned about him not using
his left hand because I think thestats point too that he's working on it

(53:20):
and that he's very capable of usinghis left hand. It's just, again,
when you're in college and you're anathlete like Jade and Ivy or even
John Morant, why would you tryto do anything differently other than what is
making you successful in the college game. But we're gonna keep going around the
table, Josh, make a casefor Jade and Ivy with the fifth pick.

(53:42):
All right, So my case forJade and Ivy. By the way,
I will say he's probably my favoritePistons fit. That's actually possible,
So just keep that in mind.But you want the best athlete in the
class, the best overall athlete,it's Jade and Ivy. Right. You
are getting Jade and Ivy, whohas the half court athleticism and is going
to be amazing and transition from dayone, both at getting to the rim.

(54:05):
He can he's really good at hittingtrailers, which is like a small
detail I noticed with him, andI mean he's he's you cannot prevent some
of the stuff he does because hejust moves so fat like he's going to
be one of the fastest players thatprobably one of the five fastest players in
the league. The second he likesteps on the court. It also has
very high vertical But the thing withIvy is you're pairing the craft and strength

(54:31):
based creation and I manipulation of KateCunningham with the freaky athleticism of Jade and
Ivy that that's tough for defenses tostop. It's tough for them to game
plan. And then you realize,Okay, Ivy does not have to have
the ball in his hands. Wasused a lot in off ball sets at

(54:52):
Purdue. They got him moving around, you know, just not standing there
or jabbing the ball at all times. Can drive left or right. Obviously
he's more right hand dominant, likeas the stats would say and the film
says the same thing. Although Idon't think he's bad at driving with his
left and I think rim pressure isvery very important in NBA offenses. You're

(55:15):
getting Jade and Ivy, who isgoing to get to the rim at almost
whenever he wants right and he's smartenough to kick out a good him out
of the time. Sometimes he'll missit, but he's cleaning it up.
But when you when you consider thatwe're moving into rim pressure being so incredibly
important, it's I mean, it'skind of a no brainer to take Ivy

(55:37):
at five. And in my opinion, out of all the guards that have
been brought up and that have beenrumored to go to the Pistons at the
fifth big he is the best atbeing that secondary playmaker alongside Kid like I
think. I mean, he's notgreat at it by any means, the
only average like three year four assistsper game in college, but like just

(55:57):
the fact that he can actually createfor other people and when he drives to
the lane, how the defenses willcollapse on him. That's gonna open up
a lot for other pistons, whetherit's Sadiq Bay, Jeremy Grant, Isaiah
Livers and you Frank Jackson, Kade, It's going to open up things for
those guys for them to be ableto create as well. I love to
pick for F five with Jade andIvy. I think it's seriously he kind

(56:21):
of gives I said this before Ieven said it on Twitter, that Twitter
that I think Troy Weavers kind ofbuilding the Pistons kind of like how they
did in Oklahoma City when they draftedhard in Russell Westbrook and Kevin Durant.
Like you you have that James Hardentype and Kade Cunningham where you kind of
alluded to Josh with the I manipulationplays a little bit more, not really

(56:42):
bullyball, but like he has aslower pace, tries to feel out the
defense and then create something. Andthen if you get Jade and Ivy,
he's kind of like that Russ typewhere he loves to cut to the hoop
He's gonna make He's gonna try tofinish over and through everybody. He loves
contact, he can push the ballin transition. He gives you that rust
type. I think it's a greatfit in Detroit. I love the pairing

(57:05):
of Jade and Ivy and Kate Cunningham. I know I'm talking a lot,
so I'm gonna turn it over toDrew. Drew, you need to make
a case for Jade and Ivy atthe fifth Big. Honestly, you know,
I am gonna admit that I'm notthe greatest draft effort expert because I'm
not always putting a lot I don'tput a lot of time in watching the

(57:29):
all the clips and the views myself, and you know my experience. I'm
always gonna say this. I'm gonnago by with people who I think are
smarter than me, that I trust, and I could explain it in a
way that makes sense to me,go by it. So Jade and Ivy,
I think he's an incredible athlete.I think he would bring a lot

(57:52):
of athleticism and quickness that we suresorely need. If it's three when shouting
is legit in the NBA, thatwould be great. And you know that
I don't see much. I don'tsee much going terribly wrong with it.

(58:14):
Um, So I will have tosay that like I'm not he's not my
he's not my highest Like I'm notmost excited about Jade and Ivy. I
have questions. I got you,I got you the other thing too.
I want to point out and Joshagain, you mentioned this too about him
playing off the ball. The Pistonswere, i think, on the seventh

(58:35):
worst team when it comes to dribblehandoff plays. And maybe it's just because
of the personnel. Maybe they weretrying to get Isaiah Stewart to work on
that part of his game. Maybethat's why it was as low. But
if you draft a guy like Jadeand Ivy, he loved to do get
those dribble handoffs on the left sideof the court. As I was just
thinking that that DHO game between Kateand Ivy and Ivy's first step as Kaid's

(59:02):
getting double and Trible teamed Ivy cuttingaround him, the DHO happens, Ivy
takes his first step to the basket. We're having highlights and you know what,
the other thing that that all happens, Ivy gets cut off, lobs
it to Bagley, like, whoare you going to stop in this scenario?

(59:22):
And then we put Ivy in inpick and roll situations, like,
man, that is a hard hardthing to game plan. Yeah, that
that first step would be real hardto pass up. And like it it's
very like and again, Josh,you said this too, He's gonna be
one of the fastest players in theNBA. Why would you not want that

(59:43):
on the Pistons. And coming intothe Pistons, he'd probably be the best
athlete on the team as well,by far. Yeah, him and Hommy
they'll be competing for that. Yeah, even better, Yeah, probably probably.
I mean he's more, definitely moreof a complete player than Hommy.
I also I want to point thatout to other Pistons fan too, because
I've seen this a little bit onTwitter and Reddit. Do not be worried

(01:00:06):
about what happens to Hamidu Dialo anddo not let him be the reason.
Not that you don't want to draftJade and Ivy. That is just silly.
Don't fall in love with role players. But now we're gonna flip the
script and we're gonna start talking aboutShade and Sharp. Here's my case on
Shade and Sharp. But I wantto say this first. I've seen a
lot of fans on social media pointingto Darko as a reason not to draft

(01:00:29):
Shade and Sharp, which I thinkis ridiculous. Troy Weaver did not draft
Darker or Seku, and this organizationis different from when those guys were drafted.
I'm not scared to draft a projectplayer like Shade and Sharp. I
think I think it could work out. I really do. I mean,
Shade and Sharp is a ridiculous athlete. He definitely has, from what little

(01:00:49):
we've seen, a nice skill setthat you could pair along with Kade.
But my only case for drafting Shadeand Sharp, and I know a lot
of Pistons fans are honestly gonna dislikethis, but I'm gonna say anyways,
if the Pistons draft Shade and Sharp, they could bring him along slowly with
no pressure, and compete for ahigher draft pick next year in a much
stronger draft class. I know Pistonsfans don't want to hear that, but

(01:01:14):
I do think that's the most realisticand best case scenario for Shade and Sharp,
that if he does come to Detroit, you don't have to make him
a Day one starter. There's noneof that pressure. You can bring him
along, slowly, develop him,get integrated with the team. He'll probably
play a lot of minutes in theG League, and I'm okay with that.
But more importantly, if you draftShade and Sharp, he is the

(01:01:36):
guy that potentially gives you a betteropportunity for a high pick next year.
But Andrew, what's your case forShade and Sharp? Oh? Okay,
Shade and Sharpe is a very interestingprospect. Number one player in the country
in high school, very athletic.I mean, all these guys that we're
talking about today in coming into thegame are gonna be most likely very athletic,

(01:01:58):
but very good down low. Bettershooter than Ivy. He's an absolute
scorer. But I caution Pistons fansto fall in love with this guy.
I'm not saying he's not going tobe good in the league, but where
he dominates. I I was justwatching a lot of his highlights today,

(01:02:19):
And don't get me wrong, theguy is a insane talent, insane athlete.
But a lot of those videos ofhim in high school are him being
the clear cut number one guy onthe floor, like the best talent on
the floor. What happens to hisgame when he's not bad? What happens
to his game when he makes thebiggest jump you could make in a basketball

(01:02:44):
career from playing in high school togoing to the NBA. The jump from
high school to college is insane,but players say themselves that the jump from
college to the league is even moreinsane. So are we willing to put
and I'm supposed to be making acase for him, but I don't know.
If I don't want him over Ivy, I can say that for sure,

(01:03:07):
But are we willing to say thathe's in the same category with Lebron
James coming into the league or isit more likely that he's gonna stumble and
take time to figure it out.So I'd rather go with the guy in
Ivy that played a high level incollege and you saw his flaws and you

(01:03:30):
know what he needs to work oncoming into the team, versus throwing a
guy in that yes, was thenumber one player in high school, and
yes played at a very high level, but have zero clue what he looks
like up against higher competition. I'mgonna be very disappointed if the Pistons draft
Shade and Sharp and he turns outto be Gerald Green. I'm just gonna

(01:03:51):
say that, like, Gerald Greenwas the top of his class, he
came straight out of high school,and he ended up being a journeyman,
solid player, But many would argueif he was even worth the pick that
he was drafted at. So Ijust that's kind of what I'm kind of
afraid of that as well. AndI like that you pointed out Jade and
Ivy like how we could see hisgrowth from his freshman to a sophomore year.

(01:04:14):
We got to see him improve hisgame, just like we did with
Keegan Murray. I'd rather take achance on guys that work hard, that
developed their games and work their wayinto being a top pick. But um,
Josh, make a case for Shadeand Sharp, all right. So
I'm gonna make my case first andthen say what I'm a little bit lower
on. All right. So thecase for him is you want him in

(01:04:38):
an off ball scoring role and youhave amazing verticality. I'm lower on his
general athleticism because I don't know ifhe necessarily has the quick twitch, the
downhill burst that a guy like that, another scoring guard prospect like Jalen Green
had, like Anthony Edwards kind ofhad, although Anthony Edwards also had like

(01:05:00):
the ridiculous strength. Yeah. Um, so with that you also get a
legitimate shooter. And Shannon Sharpe ison a really interesting development curve because he
hasn't always been this really incredible,highly touted prospect. He's worked his way

(01:05:20):
up from I believe younger in hiscareer, in his high school career specifically,
he was like, he did nothave any spot at all. He
was not Yeah, he wasn't inthis big role at all. And people
who have watched him from year onyear on year on have said, I
mean, his progression has been prettyridiculous. And so you get a guy

(01:05:45):
with forty plus inch vertical. I'mnot gonna say he has a forty nine
inch vertical because I don't know that'strue, but like, I mean,
you're getting him with a legitimate outsideshot and the ability to hit really,
really, really difficult shots, whichis a part of the process of developing
a score that's kind of like theincredibly incredibly difficult part. But there's another

(01:06:05):
incredibly incredibly difficult part of generating easybuckets that opens up counters and it just
it makes it easier to score.It easier for you to score. You
don't have to work so hard andshoot a step back off of between the
legs cross and Shaddown's kind of behind. In the easy bucket creation, he

(01:06:27):
doesn't get enough to get to therim enough, I would say, But
in the difficult shot creation, he'sabsolutely there already. And if you get
him in an off ball roll,have him cutting because he is a fairly
intelligent cutter, can catch lobs,have him come off of screens. I
mean, there's a lot to likethere with shade on, and you'd see

(01:06:48):
that he is he is young,he is currently eighteen. That would be
my picture shadow shop. I wouldnot take him over Ivy, however,
I would take him over most otherplayers there. I got you, I
got you. No. And theother thing that's kind of concerning is,
again I've already said this, butlike it's only high school tape that we're

(01:07:10):
seeing, and he did look likethe clear cut best athlete on the floor,
like and go on, sorry,no, I just I just wanted
to make another point and asked youguys, have you guys ever played in
the AAU circuit like he did?No, Okay, so I played in
both coached in in I won't sayhigh level, but higher level a AU

(01:07:33):
circuits, and obviously nothing close towhat he played with like the eyeball tournaments
and all that, But in inAU there's almost always a shade and sharp
at the tournament, all right,there's always that one guy that his games

(01:07:53):
are packed and all the scouts arecoming to see him, and I just
saw that guy, and I'm gonnasay this, and I'm no way making
a comparison or saying that they're thesame type of player. I don't want
to hear nothing come back to meabout this. But Thon Maker was that
guy before, and he was anabsolute beast. Everybody that saw him knew

(01:08:18):
he was a surefire lock for theleague. And then he gets in the
league and what happened. His gamedidn't translate. His game didn't evolve from
the Detroit Pistons to what I sawhim playing and coached against him in that
AAU tournament in Virginia Beach. Hisgame didn't change. So it's just again,

(01:08:42):
I'm not saying they're the same player. I think Sharp will have a
much better career, but it's justsuch a hard thing to look at him
dominating every game but not know whathe looks like at a higher level.
Yeah, I just want to seehim compete with athletes that are on his

(01:09:03):
level, you know, That's whatI want to see. And I mean,
I'm not gonna be mad at thePistons draft him, but there's just
so much mystery to his game.But I'm gonna turn it over to Drew.
Drew make a case for Shadon sharp. Um. I like Shane Sharpe.
UM. I know he's not astall as he said everybody. He's

(01:09:24):
lengthy, he's um, he's athletic. I have way more confidence in him
as a three level score than Jayand ivy Um because I think Jay and
I I think Sharpe is going tocome in and probably be a better shooter.

(01:09:45):
I think from what I've read andNerd, I think a little bit
off the ball. I think hecould definitely show that. I know that,
and I get everything about oh themystery about oh he's in high school
or rights like that, but likeI'm so someone who's cool with a keep
going another year, but also like, hey, I want to trade for

(01:10:09):
another pick. So if my thingis that we are trading for another pick,
if Shandon Sharps on the board,I think you have to take him.
If we have a second pick,absolutely I would say take shape.
That makes sense tho if they havea second first round pick, but aren't
I don't know. I just again, I mean, I'm just repeating myself.

(01:10:30):
The biggest mystery to me is justseeing what he can do against better
athletes. That's all I want tosee. And I'm a little concerned that
he doesn't want to, like showwhat he can do at the NBA draft
combine. You know what I'm saying. I mean, I get it.
A lot of tops, a lotof potential top five picks don't. But
man, when you're right there inthe top five and you have a chance

(01:10:54):
to maybe even maneuver up to bea potentially top three pick, I think
a player would want to take advantageof that. And for Shaden Sharp,
again, just too much mystery aroundhim for me to really be sold on
him at the fifth pick. Yeah. Can I expand on some points I
made earlier? Yeah? Absolutely,go ahead. Okay. So I mean,
which I actually believe that there's alot of defensive upside there. There.

(01:11:17):
There have been motor questions, andI saw it. I saw it
on tape, especially in YBL specificallyhe would occasionally fall asleep off the ball.
But you're getting a guy with Ibelieve a plus seven wingspan is at
like six foot eleven and a reallyhigh vertical. You get him in film
rooms seeing the different rotations he needsto make and help defense. I mean

(01:11:40):
you're you're getting a guy who's you'regetting a wing who's probably going to put
up pretty high steel block numbers atthe very least. And he's long enough
and has decent enough lateral movement tobe a real on the ball perimeter defender,
So you can definitely develop that partof his game. And if he's
playing in that off ball scoring rolethat I've kind of said that he should
play in US, he's not gonnahave the ball all the time, so

(01:12:03):
he's probably gonna have more energy.He's gonna put it more into defense,
and I think that's pretty important.And a someone on Twitter pd Web,
he's he does a lot of draftwork and prospect work and all that.
He wrote about a lot of thethings I said about Shade on Sharpe,

(01:12:23):
specifically with like the difficult bucket creationversus easy bucket creation, and with Shade
on the thing I always take awayis you have a guy with ridiculous vertical
ridiculous vertical athleticism and some really reallyamazing body control in air. I don't

(01:12:43):
know if it's Jalen Green esque,but his body control, his ability to
control his entire body when he's inthe air as high as he is,
it's it's pretty unique. But whenyou have that guy and I don't even
know if I mentioned yet his handle, I would say his average. I
think it's good enough for him toget to HISS, but it's not really.
He's not breaking down defenders and creatingadvantages like I wish he would.

(01:13:05):
But but when when you have aguy with those athletic tools, you would
like him to get to the rima lot more. And if he if
he ever figures that out, whichis kind of difficult to figure out,
to handle the mad treation all that, it's I mean, he's got special
scoring potential. Yeah, I wantto real quick to say something about Jade

(01:13:26):
and Ivy because I know there's alot of fans that have questions about him.
Defensively. He had a I mean, he he did a lot for
Purdue offensively, So like you,there's an almost go on. No I
was, I was agreeing with you. I was just trying to jump in
there. I would just say thatit almost cancels it out right, Yeah,
exactly. And I think, likeyou know, you can point to
plays where Jade and Ivy looked likehe was napping on defense and everything.

(01:13:49):
But if he's in a lesser roleoffensively, that means he'll be able to
have a bigger role defensively. AndI think a lot of those problems,
those question marks about him defensively willbe answered when he's playing a more diminished
role offensively. So I have noworries about Jade and Ivy. Again,
I just got more worries about Shadeand Sharp. But I love that you
guys made a case for Shade onSo but we're gonna move on because I

(01:14:12):
know, I know Drew's gonna hatethis topic because he's already told me he
will. But Russ or John Wall, we're bringing these guys up. I
see a lot of people on Twittertalking about these two, especially Russ.
Vegas odds I believe are six toone for Russell Westbrook. If the Pistons
were drafting outside of the top fiveand we were ready to compete, I
would take a gamble on Russ.But in all honesty, I hate to

(01:14:34):
fit I do. I hate tofit for John Wall as well. I
just it's kind of dumb in myopinion. I don't want to add a
guard coming in and taking away fromKade. I definitely see that happening with
Russ. They don't think he willbuy into being the second guy, especially
on the Pistons, who are asof right now still a rebuilding team and
you know they're not really ready tocompete for the playoffs. But if you

(01:14:57):
had to pick between John waller RussellWestbrook, who are you taking? I'm
going John Wall all day, everyday. I'm I'm not a fan of
Russell Westbrook. I don't He's gotto be very ball dominant. That,
like you alluded to, is gonnatake away from Kie, gonna take away
from the pick we bring in Sadiq, all of that. I don't like

(01:15:18):
Russell Westbrook's demeanor. Um, I'mthe court. I just he couldn't make
it work with some of the NBA'sbest, so he's gonna make it work
in Detroit. Yeah, like,like come on now, like, And
I just I don't see him beingthe answer and not necessarily saying I see

(01:15:40):
John Wall be the answer for Detroit, but I see Wall being a guy
that is in a really bad situationwhere he hasn't played in how long and
he's coming to a team where heknows he's gonna gonna play. He's more
likely to buy in to what thePistons are doing more than Westbrook. And

(01:16:00):
I'm honestly I'm more of a fanof John Wall's game over Russell Westbrooks.
Yeah, and the other thing aboutthe one thing about John Wall is if
he were I don't think he comesto Detroit. But no, no,
absolutely not. If he were tocome to Detroit, you might get like
the best version of him because he'strying to play for the next contract or
something. You might get a moremotivated John Wall. But Josh turn it

(01:16:23):
over to you. Which makes mostsense. Russell Westbrook or John Wall,
Well, I'm buying either one ofthem out if we trade for them,
I would probably take a Wall dealover Westbrook deal because I think they have
I think Houston has better assets thatthey would attach to John Wall to move
him. The fits are, it'ssimilar enough at this point. Russ is

(01:16:45):
probably a better player than Wall,but like I would, I would prefer
that either one of them runs thesecond unit, and I don't I don't
know how that's going to go overwith Russ and with Wall, especially with
Westbrook, Like I mean, thatwould be fun, though with Killian Hayes
and like John Wall, it couldbe Also, we also haven't seen Wall

(01:17:10):
in a minute because of the injuriesand like holding out for a while like
kids. Yeah, I mean itwould depend on what assets we're getting back,
Like it would really depend on ourpoint. That's a good point too,
And yeah, I mean I knowwe're all like we all kind of
basically hate this topic, but wegotta bring it up anyways. But Drew,
I'm gonna turn it over to youif you have anything to say about

(01:17:32):
Russ or John Wall. If it'sabout I agree with Josh, Like if
it's about like what we'll get thefar to buy out and the attitude come
of course he hits more. Butif we had a play one, I'm
actually gonna go for us. Ithink that the care atization John Wall is
sort of not great of one.John Wall is way more injured too.

(01:17:58):
He's not He wanted to be tradedfrom the Wizards, and that's why I
got traded for the West Book becausehe didn't want to be He didn't like
that Brelly Beale kind of usurped hisposition and now was just a couple of
a while ago. John Wall isnot the like say whatever you want by
wrestle or rust Book. But everybodywho's played with Wrestle rust Book, whether

(01:18:23):
Victor or Depot, except for RogieJackson, but most and maybe Durant,
they generally hate thing of higher guards. But there are players who've played of
John Wall who hate John Wall.And John Wall is also a guy who's
got pretty bad habits off the courtthat I don't think is great for Pistons

(01:18:48):
young guys. Yeah, I thinkyou know he habits. We know he's
also not the most And I'm notgonna say like, oh I know john
Wall better than anyone else or shotpeople who actually know them. But I
just know there is reasons why heliked that, there are reasons why he

(01:19:08):
doesn't really you know, care aboutplaying and as much as what you know
rest of rest Brook where evers likethat, But like rest Brook is still
someone who had as if we wantto be like gives work ethic, it's
rest of Westbrook, it gives goodlike cares about the game, It's rest
Brook. Rest Brook may make baddecisions, he may be able take too

(01:19:30):
much Detroit, but he still isa better a better love for the game
than John Wall. Really someone Iwould want it to culture wise, I
wouldn't want it all right? Finalquestion before we go, We're all gonna
keep this short. Are you maxingout DeAndrea in this offseason to come to
Detroit? Yes? Please? Whatabout you, Josh? You maxing out

(01:19:56):
DeAndrea and to come to Detroit?It would so I'd assume it would be
a signing trade. Yeah, itwould depend on what we're moving back.
But yes, is my answer.I'm hiring on eating than a lot of
Pistons fans seem to be You're wayhigher on him than me, So that's
two. Yes is Drew? Whatabout you? No, No, I

(01:20:18):
don't think so. I I justdon't like it. I I can elaborate,
but you want to be quick?No? No, yeah, if
if you want to elaborate real quick, feel free. I'm sure. I
don't think Aiden is as good heis young, But we know so firmly.
Who are the top five of asend visit the league? Like you

(01:20:40):
know, you know, we couldsay what everyone or you have towns,
you know you have joke, youhave MBID, I think bands up there
and Anthony Davis Davis or even likehey, like you put Jannis he's still
or you know, even Rudy Iwould say still gobet so better, but
like so looking at though like theleague, theod chart, Allen was an

(01:21:03):
All Star this year and he's practicallyin all the defense player didnt even though
he was snubbed by it, buthe's still very pivotal. Robert Williams is
a better defender Sabonis. You know, he could pay making pass and he
could score a little bit. AndI look at the contracts that they're making.
They're not making Max. I don'tthink Ayden's worth Max. I don't

(01:21:26):
I think he's good enough to bea one time All Star. I just
don't think he exactly, because likethe bottom ten of a guard is still
more valuable than a bottom ten ofa center, even though we were at
a center res insance, because theonly thing that the center renaissance has is
that they're centers that people are valuebecause they could do things like shoot and

(01:21:47):
playmak and pass. Aiden is notas traditional of a center. But it's
a lot of money to put ona guy that I do not think is
a second place as a second playoffensive option on a championship team. And
if I put him on the teamthat he's gonna go get embed or he's
gonna go when we probably would begoing against Nis. DeAndre Aiden is like

(01:22:11):
had a good seasons, but he'slike kind of like to buys harrass of
his position or it will be likepaints the bonus and Max. It doesn't
make sense to me, No,I mean I feel it though I don't
want to pay. Don't feel likewe because we have the money. I
don't think we should pay it,like if it's like getting a taking some

(01:22:34):
big contract just to get another pickor like I don't know, it's not
the center position, like because it'sthe only thing people I hear Pistons fans
to say, and I'm sorry,I'm ranting, and like k needs lob
threats and whatever. I'm like,yeah, yeah, lob threads are great,
but we're not gonna win playoff seriesalf of running continuinging lob threats.

(01:22:57):
It's like, well, Aidon alsoprovide as an anchor down low on offense
to where Kade won't be able.You're gonna have to respect him as a
defender and not cheat on off ofhim as much as you would in Isaiah
Stewart and help towards Kade with aDeAndre at and on this team. Yeah,
but I think you could find adefensive center for like a third of

(01:23:17):
the price that gives you. That'swhat I'm saying. Yeah, Like you
look a look at like Robert Williams. He's paid much less. Jared Allen's
like paid much less, and youdon't really need that much. Like I
don't think an even much And Iknow never maybe it'll be like, well,
who you want to piss aside instead? I don't know. It doesn't
have to be right now that wehave to pick that option if it sets

(01:23:39):
the whole point of like, justbecause we have a lot of money doesn't
mean we have to pick somebody rightnow. But I would say I would
be more comfortable with going Jalen Durhanin a set if we got another pick.
In another pick, we could draftJayalen Durhan then throwing money in Aiden.
Would you rather have paying Max toAiden or a chance to chance Jalen

(01:23:59):
Durham with a second first. I'lltake any day Jayleen during many day take
him. Yeah. I do likethe idea of Aiden being like the great
play finishing big for Kade. Oneof Kaide's best passing skills is throwing wobs,
so like maximizing that it is.It is like legitimately important because like

(01:24:20):
we didn't have a lot for itthat was actually taller than six foot five
until we got Bagley and we sawwhat it did for him for a lot
of the season. Aiden's that.Plus he's going to provide defense, of
course, and he's going to providean occasional interior scoring more than occasionally he's

(01:24:41):
got. He's going to provide interiorscoring. Uh, And I like,
I like the idea there. Now, if if we were to like draft
Jade and Ivy and then trade Jeremyfor the seventh pick and take Jayleen dur
and I'm doing that over getting Aiden, no question, because you get a
guy on the timeline, you geta guy with one of the biggest catch
ratises for a guy who's like sixfoot ten I've ever seen. I mean,

(01:25:04):
he's like just freak athlete showing somepassion passing flashes that I've liked a
lot of special late in the season, and the legitimate defensive anchor. In
my opinion, I would I wouldabsolutely do that oversigning Aten. However,
if we're not doing that, thenI'm not against paying eton question. Yeah,
I like the Jalen Duran Dalen Duranscenario way more. Guys, thank

(01:25:28):
you for coming on the podcast.We really do appreciate it. You guys
do great work on the Instagram page. Listeners. You can follow me on
Twitter Atlant's Caprosy Andrew where can theyfollow you Instagram? Everything Pistons Podcast on
Twitter E Pistons Pod check us outon Facebook. You can always email this
show directly at E Pistons Pod atgmail dot com, Drew where they can

(01:25:51):
Where can they check you out?Oh? The pace Pistons at Twitter?
Of course they could check me outthere, Josh, you can follow you.
You can follow me on Twitter atJosh Abbert Underscore Sports. Uh.
I post Pistons stuff, NBA stuff. I should post a little bit,

(01:26:14):
uh, like you know it's andyou can follow me there uh and obviously
follow the follow the ig uh asAndrew already said, um, and that's
the podcast. Guys, don't forgetto subscribe, drop a comment, rate
us, and more importantly, tella Pistons fan

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